#Software Beta for Nanoleaf Essentials Matter

1 messages · Page 5 of 1

wraith bear
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Sweet, looking forward to contributing:D

plain kettle
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you use home assistant?

wraith bear
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Yeah, I'm currently building this project for my NGO facility, the goal is to fully automated everything, lights, speakers, curtains. The facility is on a 10 acres land, and new construction is happening soon to increase the size of the building as well

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In terms of technical stuff, infrastructure is up and running, I just need to watch for nanoleaf updates now and wait for things to improve before I start scaling Iot devices

plain kettle
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yeah, good lucky standing near every bulb to update them 🤣

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you can only do 3 at a time

wraith bear
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Haaa yeah, I wonder how it's going to work out

main matrix
plain kettle
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yep

wraith bear
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Atm I don't have many nanoleaf bulbs, total of 7, 4 of them are the downlights and the 3 of them are the e27 matter bulbs

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Hahaha I realised that, that's why I'm holding off on the scaling part

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I was looking at placing a bulk order of 200 before I started encountering issues

plain kettle
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you are super trusting in them

main matrix
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200? phwoar, I think the most someone has in here is ~60?

wraith bear
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I spent like a week research, not much is available on the internet, until I saw a video of the developers at home assistant mentioning that there is a discord group, and then I ended up here

main matrix
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full send or no send

wraith bear
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Thank god

plain kettle
wraith bear
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Haha yeah, so no one has tested matter over thread at this scale before?

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I think I found 1 person on the home assistant forum with 160 devices

plain kettle
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but you would need a few good and stable border routers lmao

wraith bear
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Do software updates get pushed over Bluetooth? If so do you think that will change to being pushed over Thread?

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So currently I just run openthread on a raspberry pi 5, I've attached and nvme ssd with and put it in a pc case to keep it extra extra cool, along with some other machines. I'm trying my best with limited knowledge

plain kettle
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i doubt any time soon, issue is they they run their own stack as well as the matter stack

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so pushing over BLE is what they know works, especally when their thread/matter is barley working atm in the first place

wraith bear
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But theoretically it's possible right?

eternal hill
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But they dont run their own stack besides matter.

plain kettle
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apple are currently the only ones that support OTA updates via matter, home assistant very well could but it isnt the easiest to add, especally with only 1 vendor officially supporting it

eternal hill
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But that limits them to only being fully functional on apples ecosystem.

eternal hill
plain kettle
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i havent seen any gui that would indicate it can? maybe thats changed recently tho

eternal hill
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But also googles border routers disconnect from your wifi when you loose internet connectivity

plain kettle
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not good for matter 🙃

eternal hill
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nope, they will get kicked out of my home soon 😅

plain kettle
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i mean, google seems to be killing fuchsia, so thats maybe not a bad idea 🤣

wraith bear
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Any experience with Aqara matter products?

plain kettle
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hmm yeah. what ones

wraith bear
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Just the door sensors, I think those are the only matter over thread products they have

plain kettle
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they are a bit rocky

wraith bear
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Pretty reliable I hope? I need some sensors that's why I ask lol

plain kettle
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look it up in the HA discord, its okish

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just has a shitty soc from some random chinese vendor

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forgot the name

wraith bear
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I see

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Any recommended matter sensors? I guess Eve ones sound fine

plain kettle
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So seems Aqara Door and Window Sensor P2 is using a NXP K32W041AM

plain kettle
brazen canyon
# plain kettle they are a bit rocky

Idk where you get this from but aqara has very solid devices. I've never seen anyone complain about them. While EVE is good I think they are overpriced

plain kettle
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early fw versions of them suffered from the same issues as the eve ones did, could of changes since i left them at the old house i was at. but could very well have changed

brazen canyon
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I've got several P2s and they've been reliable. Their ZigBee stuff also works great

wraith bear
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Will have to test the response time for these, I was originally leaning towards zigbee ones cuz they are a lot zappy, do we know what soc the philips hue bulbs/downlights use? I know philips have made there hub matter over thread compatible, but I guess the end devices itself won't be because of hardware limitations, at least that's what I've heard from someone

brazen canyon
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No they're matter over zigbee compatible

wraith bear
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Ohhh got that totally wrong then 😆

brazen canyon
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Nanoleaf is the only matter over thread bulb, with the exception of one Chinese mfg who hasn't sold their product in months

wraith bear
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I see

bitter compass
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The thing is - I understand that Marcel from HA has found a possible issue, but what is Google doing differently to Home Assistant? Because I almost never lose my nanoleaf bulbs in Google Home, it's only ever Home Assistant that they go unavailable in. If this was a general bug in matter or even in Nanoleaf firmware, it should be affecting all ecosystems right?

wraith bear
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I mean, would we be able to see anything in the logs? I haven't seen the loggs yet, I'll spend a good³ few hours tomorrow connecting and testing them out

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Do you think marcel has tried chat gpt for a solution 😆

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I did some of my home assistant automations on chat gpt

plain kettle
wraith bear
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Hahaha, for a personal who doesn't know yaml, it helped me a lot lol

brazen canyon
bitter compass
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Yeah just updated to .165 on one bulb and that bulb has now gone from Google Home and Home Assistant.

stark crystal
brazen canyon
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I think further up someone linked to the actual CHIP issue Marcel opened that describes the issue

bitter compass
brazen canyon
eternal hill
brazen canyon
bitter compass
eternal hill
bitter compass
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See this is what is so confusing about the whole thing. I updated my second bulb to .165 not only is it still available in Google and Home Assistant it never went unavailable at all in either of them. It is still controllable from both too. It's so bloody inconsistent

bitter compass
# eternal hill Exactly, so it’s completely useless once the internet goes

I'll actually have to test that in a bit - I am not convinced it disconnects from the main WiFi, because if it did it would never know when the internet comes back. I suspect it just broadcasts a WiFi network to connect to. Because if you use any decent WiFi scanner you will see that it is in fact always broadcasting that network for you to connect to, but when it has an internet connection, the network it is broadcasting is "hidden"

plain kettle
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yeah, but without any connection i doubt it even "reports" to the lan, rather just spreads its own ssid so you can connect

main matrix
plain kettle
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yeah, it sucks

bitter compass
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Like I say I will test it - bear in mind how many YouTube reviewers testing matter stuff pull their internet connection to demonstrate it working without the internet - and that matter is supposed to work completely offline - then Google would need to have addressed that

eternal hill
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So i might be wrong, but to me it seemed like they just disconnected from my wifi.

bitter compass
# eternal hill last time when i lost internet, my whole thread network started to act up and th...

bear in mind one of the issues could well be that the IPv6 address that the hubs get are provided by the router, so if you have IPv6 on your network properly working, then the Hubs (like mine) will have a publicly routable IPv6 address. If the internet goes down then the IPv6 address will be dropped. Leaving only the locally routable IPv6 addresses - which might take time for other devices to start using - they are probably just retrying the primary IPv6 address and getting timeouts

eternal hill
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My ISP is too lazy to setup ipv6

bitter compass
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Right OK so here's the final results of my update attempt. 2 bulbs updated and are now unavailable. 1 Bulb updated and still working in both Google and Home Assistant. Essentials strip played the game again of getting right to 100% on the update but not actually updating. @boreal surge

frozen crystal
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Has something significant changed about how the mesh builds? Since the 152, initial impressions are that it has become very slow and unstable again

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I’m aiming to get all of my matter devices to 165 so that it’s a fair test (mix of 152 and 159 too, currently)… hopefully it’s the mixed estate which is causing issues

plain kettle
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update all to the new version if you can

frozen crystal
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If only it were that easy 🤣

main matrix
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only thing I'm noticing consistently is HA shooting itself in the foot when the updates complete from the NL app. There is ALWAYS one light offline for an extended period, never the same light..

dull dagger
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2024-03-08 06:01:35 (MainThread) ERROR [matter_server.server.device_controller.node_67] 

ATTENTION: Node 67 (Essentials A19/A60) did not complete setup in 570 minutes.
This is an indication of a (connectivity) issue with this device. 
IP-address in use for this device: unknown
Try powercycling this device and/or relocate it closer to a Border Router or 
WiFi Access Point. If this issue persists, please create an issue report on 
the Matter channel of the Home Assistant Discord server or on Github:
https://github.com/home-assistant/core/issues/new?assignees=&labels=integration%3A%20matter&projects=&template=bug_report.yml
frozen crystal
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62 of 63 updated to .165
Let’s see what happens now

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One bulb refuses to do anything so I suspect it’s facing a hard reset later today

main matrix
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curiously the log can't ID A19 IP addresses, but can ID GU10s :\

dull dagger
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Yeah, I'm not sure. I've posted in HA matter, as the instructions say to do. Hopefully Marcel sees it.

main matrix
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yep just noticed as well 😁

dull dagger
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Something broke either on 5.4.1 or the last 2 firmwares here because they were working decently well before that now they're completely unavailable in HA.

opal sparrow
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fwiw, the availability problems i've had in HA recently were associated with multi-admin. unfortunately, if ha's not talking to the bulb, other ways of removing fabrics from the bulb are a fair bit more complex :(

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it is kind of annoying that the subscriptions failing in HA causes the bulb to be completely unavailable, even tho HA can talk to the bulb and potentially run other commands on it or administer it.

wild oracle
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i'll DM. there are 2 possible reasons

dull dagger
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#1049765219565576234 message

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So if you find anything that would be great too

dull dagger
pulsar rock
opal sparrow
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fwiw, i've already provided more information (full chip-tool logs of the subscription failing) to nanoleaf in a jira.

dull dagger
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Thanks all there's so many helpful people here it's hard to keep track and that's a good thing

pulsar rock
frozen crystal
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@boreal surge the scalability of 165 is poor, sadly. Under 152 I had all 63 Matter bulbs available alongside the rest of my thread devices. With 165 it’s back to around 23 unavailable, which was the case with the pre 152 builds

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152 also healed quickly when it hiccuped

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All Apple ecosystem

frozen crystal
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*make that 24 unavailable 🤦‍♂️

bitter compass
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For what it's worth - without having to power cycle the bulbs, the google hubs or restart the matter server - the 2 unavailable bulbs reappeared in Home Assistant (and Google Home) after 1hr and 28 mins

main matrix
bitter compass
main matrix
bitter compass
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right but can you get their IP address from am mDNS browser (I use Service Browser on Android) and then ping them with a normal command line terminal

main matrix
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I could, it's just a matter of whether I can be bothered as I've seen this all before. Power of at the mains for an hour usually brings them back.

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Having said that

bitter compass
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step 1 get last part of default device name

share_4453058888426845465.png
main matrix
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All the offline ones have lost their records

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Yeah have done it before, dw

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I'll look into more when I'm a little less dejected.

frozen crystal
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My device unavailable count seems to keep ticking up…

wild oracle
frozen crystal
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I think that NL needs to add some more bulbs to its test rig. This is an obvious regression which really should have been caught in Alpha

boreal surge
bitter compass
# boreal surge Thanks

there is an update I sent to nathan. 2nd attempt updated the light strip and it came back online immediately in Google and HA

frozen crystal
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@boreal surge what’s the chance of another build this week which reinstates the previously fixed scalability issue, please?

lyric panther
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My one matter A19 bulb started randomly turning on after updating to 3.6.161. In other news, after updating, I could finally get it installed to HomeKit, but once connected, it always shows as offline in Home.

wild oracle
frozen crystal
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Ok thanks. That’s very strange then as 152 was immediately very scalable and stable, unlike all previous builds. I put it down to Matter 1.2

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The builds since then have immediately felt bad again

frozen crystal
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Credit to @boreal surge and his colleague for persuading me as I thought it was hopeless. Restarting all of my border routers seems to have caused the mesh to fully rebuild. Wow 🥳

main matrix
main matrix
swift phoenix
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2024-03-08 20:17:53 (Dummy-2) CHIP_ERROR [chip.native.CTL] Failed to perform commissioning step 18
2024-03-08 20:17:53 (Dummy-2) CHIP_ERROR [chip.native.EM] Failed to send Solitary ack for MessageCounter:83150102 on exchange 11465i:src/messaging/ExchangeContext.cpp:103: CHIP Error 0x00000002: Connection aborted
2024-03-08 20:17:58 (MainThread) INFO [matter_server.server.device_controller] Starting Matter commissioning with code using Node ID 111 (attempt 3/3).
2024-03-08 20:17:59 (MainThread) ERROR [matter_server.server.client_handler] [140737221705936] Error while handling: commission_with_code: Commission with code failed for node 111

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When trying to share from Apple Home to HA I get this message

swift phoenix
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Also this as well:

2024-03-08 22:17:07 (MainThread) INFO [matter_server.server.device_controller] Interviewing node: 115
2024-03-08 22:17:09 (MainThread) WARNING [matter_server.server.device_controller] Unable to interview Node 115: Failed to interview node 115
2024-03-08 22:17:14 (MainThread) ERROR [matter_server.server.client_handler] [140737221705936] Error while handling: commission_with_code: Node 115 does not exist.

swift phoenix
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Some of my bulbs will not reset no matter how many times I do the 3 sec on off 5x

frozen crystal
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Do they never emit any light? I have some like that which I must exchange. They work fine on the network. Weird

wraith bear
main matrix
wraith bear
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I see

main matrix
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I'm now down to 2 lights being stubborn and not rejoining the fabric, with a third rejoining for all of 4 minutes and now showing 'unavailable'.

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problem is if I restart HA for any reason, ALL lights will drop off the fabric and I'll be back to square one. Seems to be a fairly common trend for me, not sure why.

wraith bear
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That's interesting 🤔

main matrix
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One way to put it 🙃

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for context, by 'dropping off the fabric', the HA Matter integration shows this:

image.png
wraith bear
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I thought that the lights would be connected to your Google hubs at all times as it's a border router,

main matrix
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if it's on the fabric but become unavailable* again, it'll show this:

image.png
wraith bear
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Ohh it only drops form your home assistant, but still connected to your border routers right?

main matrix
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based on an mDNS browser, the records are all there for the light (have had issues where the records do disappear, but not in this specific example).

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The NL app registers the light is on thread, and can be communicated with, but that's using NLs own Matter stack with the bulbs is my understanding

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so for all intents and purposes, it should "just work", but not that simple it seems 🤷‍♂️

plain kettle
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Hmm yeah

wraith bear
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Aaaa that's no good 😦

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I'm hopeful that nanoleaf will fix these issues, I guess because I haven't been here as long as u guys have 😆

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Do the bulbs automatically send data to nanoleaf when problems occure?

main matrix
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I'm hopeful too, but doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result is the definition of insanity

main matrix
wraith bear
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Hahaha, so it's up to us I guess to provide logs and stuff?

main matrix
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welcome to beta testing

wraith bear
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Hahahaha

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So if we look at strictly in the last 6 months, have nanoleaf fixed a lot of issues? I know there are tons but have they made progress?

main matrix
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progress has been made, for sure, and all in the right direction

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but when some of the reported issues we report they can't replicate, it makes it more difficult to resolve

wraith bear
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I see, but what if we give them remote access? I would be happy to do that

main matrix
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wouldn't help I wouldn't think

wraith bear
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Right

main matrix
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it's not like a software application where remote access could be provided

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best we can do is provide logs of when things go kaput in a manner that Nanoleaf can interpret

wraith bear
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Like if we SSH them in or something

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Is the logs from home assistant enough? I want to contribute but not sure how to

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The app doesn't have any logs I think

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Referring to the nanoleaf app

main matrix
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#1184371187464290344 message would probably be a good starting point

wraith bear
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So I can just provide logs here with as much details as possible?

brazen canyon
# wraith bear I see, but what if we give them remote access? I would be happy to do that

The bulbs in production don't have the capability to provide debug logging on the device itself so there's a few things that are done to track issues

  1. you report things you see qualitatively (my lights are unavailable)

  2. report HA logs

  3. if you have programming experience, you can do more in depth testing.

That said, NL is tracking multiple issues that are probably causing your problems so there isn't much more you can provide at the moment. They have a bug tracker here, PW CHIP00001

https://research.nanoleaf.me/upcoming-quests/chip0001-3-xx-thread-beta-software/

Nanoleaf
Nanoleaf Research
Protected: CHIP0001 : 3.XX Thread Beta (Software)
main matrix
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ie. the same thing I posted above.

wraith bear
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Oh sweet, thanks for sharing that. I'll surely submit things as I see them

main matrix
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🤣 so the front door light of mine finally recovered... after 37 hours:

no other changes to network, mains power, pressing buttons and hoping for best. Just decided to appear now. Think that's a new record 😕

image.png
swift phoenix
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Is anyone able to successfully share from apple home to HA?

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I always get errors

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And it never successfully happens

craggy plaza
# swift phoenix And it never successfully happens

I was in that situation with firmware 3.6.159, too. It was not possible to pair to HA directly and also not possible to share from Apple Home to HA. Did you try to pair the bulbs to HA directly?

At the moment I am on a holiday trip. So, I can’t do any further tests for more than a week. I am enjoying the time without resetting/readding bulbs. 😃👍

swift phoenix
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I do the 5 off on for 3 seconds and nothing

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They won’t flash red on the 5th time

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Ok I’m getting a couple to connect this morning

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Man this is such a crap shoot. Like last night nothing no matter how long and this morning some of them share fine

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Makes no sense

craggy plaza
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Did you try it very fast? Onoffonoffonoffonoffonoff…

swift phoenix
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lol yes

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That’s the frustration attempt

main matrix
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what about offonoffonoffonoffon? (sorry)

swift phoenix
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You yell at the bulb and cry at the same time

craggy plaza
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That always worked for me. I also recognized that it doesn’t work, if I wait 2 or 3 seconds between the on/off switches.

main matrix
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I've had the 'something went wrong' error from GH to HA or to HA directly in the current firmware, but I don't use iOS (short of Flame for mDNS) when trying to share*

craggy plaza
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I had some instabilities in my Thread mesh. There was one EVE device that was defective. The new HA logs with the node id included, helped Marcel and me to figure it out. Now where this device and all Nanoleafs are not powered on, I do not have any timeouts in my logs. At least they are very seldom now.

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But my holiday trip started, before I was able to complete my tests.

wraith bear
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Would the new downlights get the same beta updates as the bulbs?

safe ice
# wraith bear Would the new downlights get the same beta updates as the bulbs?

I think so, I have received 3.6.165 few days ago, it finally made my downlights connect to HA... Well, except one who worked once and then it stopped working, I can't even factory reset it by disconnecting the power 5 times. Fortunately, I can control the light through the NL app, just can't get that light back on HA, nor I can factory reset it. Big improvement though from the stock firmware.

wraith bear
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Right, I hope that resetting issue gets fixed quickly lol

safe ice
wraith bear
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Is it just that 1 light or you can't reset any of them?

safe ice
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I have only tried to reset that one as the other three are working. But, I could reset that light previously with other firmware versions, seems to be since .165 that either it's more finicky or it just doesn't work.

wraith bear
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I see, I'm keen on updating my ones later this morning, I was going to sign up for beta and do it today but couldn't find time

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It's actually 35 mins away from my house lol, so it's a hassel

safe ice
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It's night and day, on stock firmware it just doesn't want to work with Matter (at least for me), but with .165 it unlocked it. Encourage you, it's so much less of a pain to use your HA automation than to get your phone out, wait for the NL app to sync with BT and then open the lights.

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lol, yeah, not something I would want to do on a saturday if it was away from home 😄

wraith bear
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Just to confirm, how far is the official release away from the .165?

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Like for beta it's 3.165, is the latest version availble to everyone other then beta 3. Something too?

safe ice
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I don't remember what version it was, it's pretty far 3.4 or 3.5 or something like this. Right now, I have 3.6.165 in the beta.

wraith bear
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If I look in the app does it tell you the current version it's on? I'ma check later

safe ice
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Yes, in More -> My devices

main matrix
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so the beta is a fair way ahead

wraith bear
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Wow, let's see what to next 6 months hold, nice to connect with you all!

safe ice
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Matter evolves very quickly, which is good, I hope to move most of my smart stuff to it. I was on the brink of just removing the downlight because of all the frustration it was creating when I found the beta program. Good that NL listen to feedback and fix their products.

wraith bear
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Yeah I found the home assistant discord by chance, watching one of the update videos, where they mentioned to join them and ask any question u may have, after that I ended up here, im happy because I would have probably returned the products also

brazen canyon
# wraith bear Guys just to confirm I just gotta fill details here to join? https://nanoleaf.me...

No that's for the hardware beta

https://helpdesk.nanoleaf.me/en-US/how-do-i-sign-up-for-beta-software-updates-for-my-nanoleaf-lights-341522

How do I sign up for beta software updates for my Nanoleaf lights?

Anyone with a Nanoleaf account can opt-in to our public beta firmware programs through our forum. This allows your Nanoleaf lights to get access to new features and fixes available in the beta firmware updates, and helps us to gain valuable insights

wraith bear
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Sweet thank you, do I need to do this everytime I reset the devices and add it to the app/account?

brazen canyon
feral steeple
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@boreal surge fyi, flickering with gu10 is much much worse with the be 165 firmware compared to 159.
Sometimes get like 6 or so flickers on power on now before it settles

wraith bear
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Ok so I updated all lights today, seems to be a lot more stable on my openthread network, however I still can't connect any of them to my home assistant

peak belfry
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Did that just now. 👍 (BTW Discord is terrible. A forum would be much better. Discord keeps losing track of where you were and has terrible search. Plus it even scrolls forward when a new message arrives. This makes participating in this beta much more painful than it should be.)

plain kettle
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A thread like this is a terrible idea for over 3000 messages

peak belfry
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I'm not complaining about threads. I'm saying it's impossible to just catch up on what's been said in the past few days if Discord keeps auto-scrolling to the last message … like your message just did for example! 😄

What a user-hostile UX 🤪

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Aha, so this is similar to what I reported on March 4 and which Paul asked me to file a bug report for, which I just did. Does it happen for all bulbs for you? For me it's 3 out of my 9 EU GU10 bulbs. They're still on 3.5.41 (i.e. non-beta).

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Ah … lucky you. I tried All The Things, no luck. (Except for factory reset. Don't want to do that, so that Nanoleaf engineers can ask me to test things to narrow down the root cause.)

robust kernel
peak belfry
shell vigil
bitter compass
#

Regarding questions about how far behind production firmware is. Production firmware is running matter v1.0 in the beta we have gone through v1.1 (which was frankly terrible) and are now on v1.2 (matter v1.3 - the spec, not just NL stuff - arrives in June the last I heard).

plain kettle
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are you sure this is matter 1.3? i swore it was on 1.2?

bitter compass
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yup this is matter v1.2 - I said matter v1.3 - the actual spec - arrives in June

plain kettle
#

oh right, my bad

bitter compass
# plain kettle oh right, my bad

It's my fault really, I probably shouldn't have mentioned matter v1.3 - I'm just excited because - hopefully energy monitoring lol

plain kettle
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hahaha yeah, will be nice to see vendors finally have a universial way of doing it

#

and HA wont have to use custom clusters (looking at you eve 👀 )

bitter compass
plain kettle
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eh, i expect them to. atleast a few months after the spec releases

wraith bear
#

So I've gone through some trouble shooting stuff, mdns definitely works within my network, ipv 6 is enabled. When I looked at logs in the home assistant matter server here is what I got:

  1. Discovery time out

  2. Secure Pairing Failed

3.mDNS Resolution Failures

bitter compass
wraith bear
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So in the logs where it says 2024-03-10 19:23:53 (Dummy-2) CHIP_ERROR [chip.native.DIS] Timeout waiting for mDNS resolution.

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I interpretate that as the server couldn't resolve device address using mDNS

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[matter_server.server.device_controller] Starting Matter commissioning with code using Node ID 2 (attempt 3/3).
2024-03-10 19:23:52 (Dummy-2) CHIP_ERROR [chip.native.CTL] Discovery timed out
2024-03-10 19:23:52 (Dummy-2) CHIP_ERROR [chip.native.ZCL] Secure Pairing Failed
2024-03-10 19:23:52 (MainThread) ERROR [matter_server.server.client_handler] [549277322448] Error while handling: commission_with_code: Commission with code failed for node 2.
2024-03-10 19:23:53 (Dummy-2) CHIP_ERROR [chip.native.DIS] Timeout waiting for mDNS resolution.

bitter compass
#

OK do you have any lines like -

wraith bear
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Thats the full error log when trying to commission

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In order

bitter compass
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2024-03-10 06:15:35 (MainThread) INFO [matter_server.server.device_controller.mdns] Node 2 re-discovered on MDNS

wraith bear
bitter compass
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do you have an mDNS browser - Flame for iOS, Service Browser for Android

wraith bear
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You mean the avahi-browse? I used to make sure that my otbr is using mDNS

bitter compass
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whatever you are comfortable using - you need to see if the Nanoleaf bulb is publishing an mDNS record - both on the ltpdu and the matter records

wraith bear
#

Ok let me see, what is ltpdu again?

#

Sorry im still very new to this stuff, learning as I go

main matrix
#

its NLs propietary protocol

#

but it should be visible in an mDNS discovery

#

something like this:

Screenshot_2024-03-09_at_5.26.57_pm.png
wraith bear
#

Ok let me check it out!

#

Yeah it doesn't look like it 😕

bitter compass
#

OK are you trying to pair directly to Home Assistant or do you have it paired to another ecosystem first which you are then sharing to Home Assistant?

wraith bear
#

No just paired it to nanoleaf first then tried pairing it to home assistant directly, I used the connect matter through the app as well, let me see if that has any different logs one sec

bitter compass
#

ok Nanoleaf isn't a matter ecosystem - that's their proprietary thing. When you connect from Nanoleaf to somewhere else you are connecting your FIRST matter ecosystem

main matrix
#

I would skip pairing to Nanoleaf app and go direct to HA after a reset. Can be added to NL app later

bitter compass
#

If you have a Google or Apple system - pair to that first.

main matrix
#

or that

bitter compass
#

While some people have luck pairing directly to Home Assistant - the HA devs still advise against that.

main matrix
#

true, but there are more people than not that have issues with the multi-admin functionality

#

to each their own, though

bitter compass
#

yes - but the HA devs say that OTBR is fully working for Thread devices, but they don't recommend OTBR with matter - until it exits beta

wraith bear
#

Ok, so you recommend, resetting it, adding to Google home first, then to home assistant, then to nl?

plain kettle
#

Yes

main matrix
#

yeah that

#

once you add it to GH, you won't need the matter code again - you can just share the existing pairing to HA and the HA Matter integration will do the rest

bitter compass
#

they advise pairing it to Google / Apple - so it's on their thread router - and if you want after sharing to Home Assistant from Google or Apple, you can then remove Google / Apple from the matter fabrics if you want, which will not stop the device using Apple / Google for the actual Thread connection

wraith bear
#

How do I remove it from Google, just delete device?

main matrix
#

yep

bitter compass
#

no you go in to the device - linked apps and services and remove it from in there

main matrix
#

eh, not how it's worked for me 🤷‍♂️

wraith bear
#

Okie dokie

#

But the bulbs wills till be managed by the otbr and the matter sever?

#

Nothing got to do with google after that point right?

bitter compass
#

you don't remove it from in here? @main matrix

Screenshot_20240310-130513.png
plain kettle
#

Yeah, I just like to delete it from everything possible, then factory reset it

#

Or unlink it from other vendors through Apple home

main matrix
bitter compass
#

I didn't know if that would remove the thread connection too? So I just remove from inside the fabrics

main matrix
#

removing just the 6006 vendor caused GH to complain that it wasn't paired to a Google ecosystem and refused to remove

#

which is why I deleted the bulb

#

YMMV

bitter compass
#

in which case just delete the bulb from Google after you have shared it to Home Assistant @wraith bear

main matrix
#

idk, it's also quite possible my experiences have been outliers and not the general consensus

wraith bear
#

Do you guys do this every time there is a new beta update?

#

😅

bitter compass
#

no just the once

wraith bear
#

Oh good lol

bitter compass
#

unless you have to factory reset the bulb

main matrix
#

only when a bulb decides to go AWOL after an update 🙃

bitter compass
#

though I have never once had to factory reset anything other than the light strip up to now

main matrix
wraith bear
#

So do we know what the issue is at this point? Is the matter server on home assistant or NL? Like the commissioning part

#

Or both?

bitter compass
#

both

wraith bear
#

I think both right?

main matrix
#

that's a loaded question

wraith bear
#

Haahhaha

bitter compass
#

and possibly also OTBR too right? Going on the opened issue that was posted the other day?

wraith bear
#

Ohh, forgot to ask, is there a otbr discord group as well, and beta program?

bitter compass
#

if there is, I'm not in it

wraith bear
#

Lol

#

I checked the last few updates on otbr, no bug fixes or anything, they just add stuff to it which isn't promising

#

I could be wrong

main matrix
wraith bear
#

Jeez, are all of these developers in contact with each other to actively re establish these broken chains?

main matrix
wraith bear
#

Stupid question, different companies probably not

bitter compass
#

Matter is a minor miracle. It's already come so far in such a short time - especially considering how many developers from different organisations are involved. It's pretty much unheard of for competing companies to get together and push out an interoperability spec in just 2 years.

#

The matter github has developers from all those different companies communicating with each other

wraith bear
bitter compass
#

that specific error is one I got after the last beta update - some lights Home Assistant just could not speak to because there were numerous errors that the device was busy

main matrix
#

yeah I also get them as well, usually after a HA restart

bitter compass
#

it took almost 2 hours to recover

main matrix
wraith bear
#

So it basically keeps re retrying?

bitter compass
# wraith bear So it basically keeps re retrying?

Well it does anyway - it's just that there is a backoff delay that constantly increases each time there is an error - so you very quickly get to the won't retry for like 6 hours territory. This change would give an indication of when to retry - instead of relying on the backoff timer

wraith bear
#

Ohhh

#

Thanks guys, I'll try this tomorrow and see how it goes

bitter compass
# 
2024-03-10 10:07:13 (MainThread) INFO [matter_server.server.device_controller.node_4] Node could not be discovered on the network, returning cached IP's
2024-03-10 10:07:16 (MainThread) INFO [matter_server.server.device_controller.node_8] Node could not be discovered on the network, returning cached IP's
2024-03-10 10:37:19 (MainThread) INFO [matter_server.server.device_controller.node_4] Node could not be discovered on the network, returning cached IP's
2024-03-10 10:37:22 (MainThread) INFO [matter_server.server.device_controller.node_8] Node could not be discovered on the network, returning cached IP's
2024-03-10 11:07:25 (MainThread) INFO [matter_server.server.device_controller.node_4] Node could not be discovered on the network, returning cached IP's
2024-03-10 11:07:28 (MainThread) INFO [matter_server.server.device_controller.node_8] Node could not be discovered on the network, returning cached IP's
2024-03-10 11:37:31 (MainThread) INFO [matter_server.server.device_controller.node_4] Node could not be discovered on the network, returning cached IP's
2024-03-10 11:37:34 (MainThread) INFO [matter_server.server.device_controller.node_8] Node could not be discovered on the network, returning cached IP's
2024-03-10 12:07:37 (MainThread) INFO [matter_server.server.device_controller.node_4] Node could not be discovered on the network, returning cached IP's
2024-03-10 12:07:40 (MainThread) INFO [matter_server.server.device_controller.node_8] Node could not be discovered on the network, returning cached IP's

Now HA need to fix this

#

4 and 8 are nodes that were factory reset over Christmas when that very very bad firmware dropped

brazen canyon
# wraith bear So do we know what the issue is at this point? Is the matter server on home assi...

The current issue is understood thanks to someone in the HA community.

There's two principle issues

  1. sometimes the bulbs straight up stop broadcasting that they're available

  2. sometimes the bulbs straight up don't respond to the subscription request from HA but don't error out and it gets hung.

I'd say most current stability issues are understood but the solution is still TBD. Issue is mostly on NL not HA

wraith bear
brazen canyon
wraith bear
#

Does home assistant advice against using an otbr?, If there are issues with otbr, I feel like there are a lack of updates for it, I don't see much happening in there, I could be wrong

brazen canyon
wraith bear
#

Has anyone tried to use andriod emulator to update nanoleaf firmwares, im thinking of trying that, only because I live away from the facility

brazen canyon
#

Can't see I've seen anyone try that before 😅

#

FWIW very few (if any) matter devices support updates via matter, most require update via Bluetooth and proprietary app

wraith bear
#

So I planned on just running the nanoleaf app on the emulator and using the onboard Bluetooth, im going to try that later 🙃

#

Itl just be convenient, until I have to hard reset the devices to resolve issues lol, then I'd have to go in

feral steeple
brazen canyon
wraith bear
brazen canyon
#

You could always put a relay in front. One person here does that

wraith bear
#

Wonder if I can add a remote switch to the circuit bord to hard reset lol

feral steeple
#

sometimes its been enough to remove from GH and HA and connect it from nanoleaf app again, but some times i have had to reset them

dull dagger
#

Since 161 and 165 all my devices unavailable in home assistant. However, interestingly, I can ping the unavailable devices from home assistant successfully

#

Does that make any sense?

#

The log said that there could be a connectivity issue with the device but I don't know if that's true

feral steeple
#

165 has been a step back from 159. Delays with turn on, more unavailable than there was (also on newer matter server so could be part to blame)

opal sparrow
#

fwiw, the nanoleaf bulbs do have the matter ota firmware update clusters present, but no idea if they work - NL isn't providing firmware to use with them :)

#

that's probably a "down the road once other issues are solved" sort of thing.

wraith bear
opal sparrow
#

"over the air" - just refers do doing firmware update over the same network interface you're communicating to the device with.

wraith bear
#

Ohh that would be amazing!!!

#

I cant imagine trying to update over 200 devices....

#

Since you can only do 3 at a time with Bluetooth, that would take 66 attempts...

stark crystal
#

That's optimistic assuming the first attempt works. For me, Nanoleaf devices always take multiple attempts to update (but it eventually works).

wraith bear
#

Yeah that's an issue for sure...I've been lucky, I can update in the first try, but honestly I haven't had the chance to test the system as long as you guys have

#

I still can't figure out why nanoleaf wants to join a pre determined thread network instead of a custom one you would make...

brazen canyon
wraith bear
#

I had to change the thread network details to exactly what's on the nanoleaf app for it join

#

That's before I joined beta though

brazen canyon
#

Change the details where?

wraith bear
#

If you have a look at the screenshot, the 259 tower hill drive was the thread network I made on my otbr, and the bulbs wanted to join NEST-PAN-E88F

#

So I changed my networks name, channel, pan ids and other things to exactly match NEST-PAN-E88F, then it suddenly joined

#

This was the network it was actively trying to join

Screenshot_20240311_074736_Gallery.jpg
brazen canyon
#

I see you're on a Samsung. Android always tries to commission to it's own network if one exists (in your case nest pan). I actually saw someone else have an issue with this recently but it's not like NL or HA can do anything (until HA does it's own commissioning but that's down the line)

#

Both the NL app and HA use built in services to commission / add to network

wraith bear
#

Ohh so this is an issue only on Samsung's?

brazen canyon
#

No you'll see that behavior for all android phones with thread devices.

#

Your use case is pretty atypical from what was imagined I think hence you have some headaches. Most people are using deviceswhere they live

wraith bear
#

I started the build at my home to begin with, I almost gave up on fixing it, until I saw a reddit post, the guy just joined this network instead of using his own, which was pretty confusing because nest-pan-e88f didn't exist, so I figured just to copy the details from the above screenshot, and it suddenly joined

#

I think for people who have tbrs, it will just let you make whatever network like nest pan, but for people who use otbrs it's different

#

If this issue is an andriod one, I suppose the same behaviour will apply to other products like aqara, evee?

brazen canyon
wraith bear
#

I see 👀

brazen canyon
#

The easiest way would to be have the sky connect just join that network

wraith bear
#

I mean to say that itl make it automatically with whatever details the andriod/nanoleaf likes, but with otbr that's not the case

brazen canyon
#

The issue here isn't the settings or something with the thread network, it's that, if Google has created a thread network, then android will try to always use those regardless of it not having any border routers

wraith bear
brazen canyon
#

Sorry what's your OTBR there?

#

I just assumed it was a sky connect

wraith bear
#

I run it on a raspberry pi 5

#

Installed open thread on it

#

With NRF52840 dongle

brazen canyon
#

Ah I think I see and you just extracted the thread credentials using the NL app and set your dongle to use those

#

Sounds like it worked out okay

wraith bear
#

Yes! Sorry im very bad at explaining I see

brazen canyon
#

The short is then that fix should work for all your thread devices and that problem wasn't NL specific

#

It's just how android works under the hood for thread devices for now

wraith bear
#

Yeah that's good to know, I thought it was nanoleaf before speaking to you on here. Though if I use an evee door sensor and andriod decides it wants it to join a different network then I'm screwed 😆😅

#

I only have nanoleaf products as of now

brazen canyon
#

I think it should work the same

bitter compass
#

for what it's worth - in future -

#

go in to the bulb settings page when connected to it over bluetooth

#

scroll down to "Thread Network" and tap it - it will list thread networks available and you can join the bulb to a different thread network

#

no need to faff about changing all your thread details @wraith bear

brazen canyon
plain kettle
#

Huh right, neither

wraith bear
#

Oh it doesn't let you join the different network

#

Trust me I tried like a thousand times

#

Before crying, then I changed the credentials, and cried again 😂

bitter compass
#

huh maybe the app has changed - you could still do it last week. @boreal surge - comments?

wraith bear
#

If you could do it, that means NL probably fixed it and it wasn't an andriod issue as me and @brazen canyon thought

#

I'll test it today hopefully and share with you all 🙂

brazen canyon
wraith bear
#

Sorry im confused, is ajm saying to change the thread details after nanoleaf joins?

bitter compass
#

I assume it is a feature to cope with situations where for example you might have factory reset the Google Hub which would obviously change the name of the Thread network. This feature lets you change the network a bulb is connected to, without having to factory reset them all

brazen canyon
wraith bear
#

Oh damn, @brazen canyon I just read that link you sent, so apparently I have 11 google audio speakers, so as longnas I have them on my network, andriod will always prefer to join Nest pan networks, even if it doesn't exist

feral steeple
wraith bear
#

That's shady as hell 🤣

bitter compass
#

theres an update all button?!

wraith bear
#

Update all button? I didn't see that yesterday when I was updating for the first time in beta

feral steeple
#

on the my devices page I have an update all button for available firmware updates

#

it just queued them all up and processed through

#

Yea on the play store you can opt into beta

wraith bear
#

Ohhh

#

One sec let me do that

feral steeple
# wraith bear One sec let me do that

it will usually take a little while till the play store offers the update to switch it to the beta. You can try killing play store and app, and opening and checking for updates

brazen canyon
bitter compass
#

I usually give it 15 minutes and then go to the app info page on Android and then tap the app version at the bottom of the screen to take you to play store and the open button will have changed to an update button

bitter compass
wraith bear
#

@brazen canyon they don't, but I guess andriod will still try to join one unless delete other google stuff? Like Google wallet, the app itself that's what I understood from the link you sent me

brazen canyon
wraith bear
#

Yeah, let's see how things go

feral steeple
#

On positive news, i reset a bulb and could add it direct to HA without doing NL or google home first. Strangely it completed in HA, but android kept saying connecting to home assistant even though logs showed completed and it was showing up. Then it went to something went wrong. but it did complete

main matrix
brazen canyon
feral steeple
#

So 2 in a row, ends with the something went wrong, 3rd one completed successfully. All show the same logs in matter server and all added.
Im just happy they are adding first go now 😄

feral steeple
#

Well after giving it a couple days there was 4 out of 24 that were annoying with their connection, so reset them and added again and currently everything is up. so see how it goes for the next few days

main matrix
#

will be interested to see if you start to get what I am experiencing over time; lights in HA "look" like they're available, but manually toggling doesn't do anything as it times out. Yet the same lights on automations (motion sensors in my example) will trigger without issue.

feral steeple
#

Will let you know, seem to get a mix of lights nicely turning on and other just doing an instant change :S, nice if they all faded on haha (im asking too much, ill start with everything just being stable and consistent connections)

feral steeple
main matrix
#

problem is if I restart the HA integration or HA itself, they'll all fall off and take upwards of 12 hours to rejoin

#

but the same "non-working" lights work when you move past the motion sensors that are tied to them

feral steeple
#

yea im scared to restart HA at all 😛

eager frigate
#

When?!

IMG_1703.png
plain kettle
#

I think they got bigger issues to fix at the moment rather than new features 😅

opal sparrow
#

I wouldn't be surprised if that syncing support will be coming as part of the work that's being done on the "Nala" hub. (Which is supposed to be enabled on NL devices with thread border router capabilities in a future firmware update).

boreal surge
boreal surge
opal sparrow
#

There already is a forum: https://forum.nanoleaf.me/forum/ but it doesn't have a section that seems appropriate for public beta stuff. It also seems to have some moderation issues - there's quite a lot of spam present (and no way i can find to report it)

#

whoops, thought i'd run into a new and exciting matter failure, but turns out that I just accidentally turned off the switch that controls an outlet one of my lamps was plugged in to ;)

#

had me confused since the MDNS entries were still there - but i guess the thing about those is that they're cached by the thread border router for a while.

wild oracle
#

#1184371187464290344 quick update for you, especially those that are facing home assistant unreachable issues. we have at least 2 known causes:

  1. Matter services disappearing
  2. Subscription timeouts

For 1, we tested a fix over the weekend with select beta testers who had high degrees of reproducibility. We'll look to release that to the rest of beta ASAP.

For 2, we dont have definitive reproducibility with Home Assistant where we can routinely develop a fix for, but we've identified what we expect is equivalent steps with chip-tool (thanks @opal sparrow ). Hoping to zero in on a resolution on that ASAP and subsequently release.

Thanks to all for your patience and input.

pulsar rock
wild oracle
# pulsar rock yeah, they time out after 30 minutes (which is the default TTL)

@pulsar rock @opal sparrow this is a feature of SRP, which allows a (thread) device to register an entry with a server with a timed lease. The server then is responsible for multicast portions of mDNS. The default lease time in matter SDK is 2 hours. For HomeKit over Thread, we previously used 60 minutes. there are IETF efforts to take SRP beyond thread. there are camps that wish they had never build the "m" part of DNS - i'm not an expert on all the places it really kills networks (perhaps our head office dev network has excessive amounts of devices between thread and wifi), but I can definitely appreciate there's a ton of overhead when every wifi device is multicasting its identity willy nilly (ttl for wifi is order of 120s typically)

opal sparrow
#

Indeed. getting mdns working well in larger office networks usually requires separating things into vlans and putting mdns repeaters between vlans to reduce the amount of multicast/broadcast traffic. took a bit for me to figure that out when setting up my office lan so people on wifi could use mdns to find the wired printers :)

#

getting thread border router stuff working with that sort of network would be a pain tho, need to convince your inter-vlan router to accept RAs sent by the TBR and add routes for those. (or just manually configure the routes).

#

Anyways, good to hear you seem to be able to reproduce the subscription issue with chip-tool. I just provided some logs of when I noticed the issue, and helped a dev out with a hint on how to do multi-admin matter with chip-tool :)

bitter compass
#

Today - I am reconsidering my decision to have smart lights.......
Underground power cable failure overnight - multiple attempts by the electric company to reconnect power. Nanoleaf bulbs very unhappy.... Was going to factory reset them, but Nanoleaf app claims they are still connected to Thread - and after a few hours of everything being offline, everywhere - a few popped up online in Google.

feral steeple
bitter compass
peak belfry
plain kettle
#

I don’t think the bulbs can just change networks freely within the matter spec, there would be a reason behind it not working

peak belfry
wraith bear
plain kettle
#

A ton of border routers, for stability

#

More routes that go through a bulb, more chance of it crashing and nuking most of your bulbs

wraith bear
#

So far I have 4 rcp with 4 raspberry pi 3's I initially planned on running open thread on all and make it join the existing network

#

Is that a good number?

plain kettle
#

Hard to tell, only way is really to just go for it and find out, but at 200 mesh routers within the network, placement of the border routers matters

wraith bear
#

Yeah, I'd distribute it as best as possible

#

I think i will wait a couple more months before I scale this up 😅

plain kettle
#

🙈

blazing meadow
#

…just thinking about the updating process for so many devices makes me dizzy.

plain kettle
#

You can only do max 3 at a time, it’s kinda annoying

wraith bear
#

Apparently in the beta software u can do all of them?

#

Maybe queue

plain kettle
#

I’m in the TestFlight beta for the app, and the last beta I couldn’t

#

Max 3 at once

#

And the rest would be unable to update/queue

wraith bear
grim obsidian
#

I don't know if this is a HA bug or a nanoleaf issue but I can't control my A19 bulbs via HA anymore. The lights show as connected in HA and the nanoleaf app but anytime I try to change the state in HA nothing happens.
I see this in my HA logs.

2024-03-12 06:58:54 (MainThread) ERROR [matter_server.server.device_controller.node_2] 

ATTENTION: Node 2 (Essentials A19/A60) did not complete setup in 450 minutes.
This is an indication of a (connectivity) issue with this device. 
IP-address in use for this device: unknown
Try powercycling this device and/or relocate it closer to a Border Router or 
WiFi Access Point. If this issue persists, please create an issue report on 
the Matter channel of the Home Assistant Discord server or on Github:
https://github.com/home-assistant/core/issues/new?assignees=&labels=integration%3A%20matter&projects=&template=bug_report.yml

This bulb is the closest to my border router so I'm not sure what else to do. I have tried power cycling a few times with no luck.

plain kettle
#

You are doing something wrong

#

Is the bulb already in another ecosystem?

#

Or you pairing it fresh to HA?

grim obsidian
#

It's in both Google home and home assistant. I paired to Google first. This was working fine before

plain kettle
#

Yes, so share the pairing code from google home to HA, don’t rescan the code

#

To add it to HA

grim obsidian
#

Yeah I did all that a long time ago. I was able to control the lights in home assistant without problem. This issue is new

plain kettle
#

Hmm, you on the beta firmware?

#

I wouldn’t remove it from HA, just update the matter server add-on and enable the beta toggle (then restart the add-on) and see if it fixes it

#

They all on the same thread network? The skyconnect and google nest displays?

grim obsidian
#

Yes. I only have the one thread network

#

Oh I also have the nanoleaf lines that act as a border router as well. Those are on the same thread network. I did just update those last night

#

I haven't restarted anything besides the light yet in case there are logs I should be getting

#

I can control some of my other lights. It seems the issue is only with specific bulbs

plain kettle
#

Hmm, I would try restarting those bulbs

#

Like power cycle

grim obsidian
#

Yeah I'm doing that now. I've been doing that the past couple days and the issue keeps coming back.

#

I'm guessing the only logs I can get for the light is from the home assistant matter logs?

plain kettle
#

Yes

grim obsidian
#

After restarting the matter server I can control that problematic light now

bitter compass
#

Right EVERYTHING was factory reset and everything is talking now.

shell vigil
#

Anybody has 0.0.0 firmwear

#

And 19.83.9 ?

plain kettle
shell vigil
#

I reinstalled the app it works

#

But then I turned off my lights at night and it happened to all disconnected bulbs

wraith bear
#

Hey guys, does aqara p2 door sensor support over the thread software updates like evee?

plain kettle
#

Not that I know of

#

Also, I would ask in home assistant discord, not here

wraith bear
wild oracle
#

3.6.170 Release Notes

Thanks again for your patience #1184371187464290344

  1. Expected solution for disappearing Matter services, which should enhance reliability when using multiple fabrics
  2. Removed custom cluster temporarily, which should resolve subscription timeouts and errors. We'll look to add this back in before going to prod, just need a bit more time to find a true solution. This won't affect any features you currently use.

We're hoping this build lifts any major reliability with Matter connectivity that many of you have reported. But if you continue to see things, please reach out to Paul

GU10 flickering update: we've sent affected bulbs to our China team for in depth hardware investigation. If anyone knows for sure whether they've seen this before coming to 3.6 beta, that would be much appreciated (DM or mention Paul)

main matrix
#

oooh, a wild Update All button appears. 😁

opal sparrow
#

any chance of a hint about what that custom cluster was for anyways? whenever i looked, it always had one empty attribute, and one attribute containing 256 bytes of 0s, which doesn't explain a whole lot :)

wild oracle
dull dagger
wild oracle
#

better setup UX, triggering certain modes that don't fit in a (boring) box, etc.

dull dagger
#

🎉

main matrix
plain kettle
#

Have to say, best firmware update yet

main matrix
#

Agreed. All lights are reachable and communicable in HA, and for funsies I spammed my wallpanel with a bunch of on/off commands, and they all responded!

main matrix
#

Recovery in HA after unavailability is markedly improved too (spamming on/off for 25 lights ~20 times triggered 3 timeouts on 3 lights, but they recovered within 60 seconds).

#

opposed to 37 hours 🙃

wraith bear
#

That is exciting!! Do we still have to add to Google before home asisstant?

plain kettle
#

Nope

main matrix
#

Hasn't skipped a beat for me so far. Half tempted to swap from the ghubs to full otbr and retest. Only have the hubs because they were the "supported" ones from a HA dev perspective.

plain kettle
#

i would slowly do it, but honestly seems like it has a strong chance of working

main matrix
#

Agreed.

#

Though I'd try and avoid mixing the two environments, so not sure slowly is an option.

#

Tomorrow job though.

lone iris
#

this new firmware update allowed me to commission all my devices into HASS without any issue - thank you so much!!

swift phoenix
wild oracle
grand pilot
#

Just updated and everything instantly came back to HA, that part usually takes a bit so that's awesome 😎👍🏻

opal sparrow
#

well, no problems with the update for me, guess I'll try the multi admin stuff again just to confirm :)

scenic grove
#

Did the update last night and my 6 bulbs seem solid still with Apple Home - no regressions so far.

wraith bear
#

I wont get to try it out till tomorrow

opal sparrow
# wraith bear Multi admin stuff?

multi admin refers to when a matter device is simultaneously joined to and can be controlled by multiple separate matter fabrics, e.g. both google and apple - or in my case, home assistant and chip-tool (a debugging tool).

wraith bear
#

Ohh, Theoretically would multi admin put load on the light bulbs hardware itself?

opal sparrow
#

yes, the light bulb has to manage separate secure connections for each fabric, and some of the attributes need to be stored separately for each fabric too. As well, the bulb needs to separately send updates for subscribed state changes or events to the coordinator for each fabric.

steep iris
#

Ps: lately almost none of my bulbs appear connected in the app, even though i can control them through GH and ST. The 3 that are showing as connecting wont update either

WhatsApp_Image_2024-03-14_at_19.24.47.jpeg
craggy plaza
#

I have a lot of rooms. Does the ’update all‘ work over Bluetooth or over Thread?

In my understanding Nanoleaf Essentials get their updates through Bluetooth. So, I think that some bulbs aren’t reachable for Bluetooth and I have to go into the room with the respective bulbs. Is this correct?

It is a nice addition, if you have a lot of bulbs in one room and you do not have the 3 bulbs barrier.

scenic grove
#

I've managed to be a good 20-30 feet away from a bulb and have it update no problem even through walls It's just slower for further away ones and sometimes they have to try a few times if they time out or what not. I say go for it and see what happens.

craggy plaza
swift phoenix
#

@boreal surge Im not sure why but since the last update I have not been able to reset my bulbs. I turn them off/on 3 sec 5x and nothing. I have 1 bulb that sais it needs to be reset to add to apple home and I just cannot get that to happen, hence im stuck.

craggy plaza
swift phoenix
craggy plaza
#

Why is it so red?

swift phoenix
#

Idk I just made it red

craggy plaza
#

It's really hard to tell what's happening. But I think the second video shows really fast on/off switches, which always worked for me.

swift phoenix
#

Yeah it doesn’t blink red after the 5th one

#

Ok one second I got it

opal sparrow
#

if your light is set to red, it might be hard to notice it blinking red after the reset sequence tho :)

swift phoenix
#

I think it was stuck in the power state mode for some reason? I had to turn that on and off.

craggy plaza
swift phoenix
#

Sorry "Power Loss Recovery"

#

You can see my bulb remained red every time I turned it back on. I had the option turned off in the settings of the nanolead app. However, the bulb was not abiding to that setting. Turning the setting on and off again I saw the bulb had switched its natural warm white when turned on again

wind finch
craggy plaza
swift phoenix
wind finch
#

But why…

craggy plaza
swift phoenix
craggy plaza
wind finch
#

Oh, is that what you’re trying to do 🫠

dense maple
#

What would be a good spot to ask about two homes showing as Currently on Cloud? I only have one showing in Apple Home and the second one in the NL shows no devices

shell vigil
wraith bear
main matrix
opal sparrow
#

i'm honestly kinda surprised at that, openthread was released by google so I assumed they were using at least some of the same code in their own devices.

#

(fwiw, seems fine in the single border router and it's running otbr case)

main matrix
#

Yeah, I am also, but that said the OTBR in my case is a GL-iNet GL-S200 (https://www.gl-inet.com/products/gl-s200/). I do have a Skyconnect with OTBR flashed somewhere, but have misplaced the USB. The second Skyconnect I have has Zigbee only on it, and that's working fine so not touching it.

#

I'd have thought the device shouldn't have mattered given OTBR should be an open standard, but I could be wrong 🤷‍♂️

opal sparrow
#

hmm, you've been making sure to keep the firmware on that updated, right? if it's running an outdated otbr that could be a source of issues :/

main matrix
#

of course; it's on the latest FW available

opal sparrow
#

also, they're running a "proprietary firmware based on OpenWrt" which sounds like a GPL violation to me :/

main matrix
# opal sparrow also, they're running a "proprietary firmware based on OpenWrt" which sounds lik...

seems like it's a point of contention, but to me they are running a fork of OpenWRT with their own closed source spec on top: https://forum.gl-inet.com/t/gl-inet-false-advertising-not-really-using-openwrt/39143/28

GL.iNet
GL-iNet false advertising, not really using OpenWrt?

The problem here it’s the “marketing” wording used by GL-iNet on the description pages of their products, read again…

opal sparrow
#

yeah, google's allergic to gpl, so openthread (and anything based on it) doesn't have to be open sourced when used in a product like this. but at a minimum they need to be providing the kernel they're using and a few other parts of openwrt. It's a really old openwrt too :(

#

it actually would be neat to see a thread border router package available for running on stock openwrt tho, i wonder if anyone's been working on that. A lot of wifi routers have usb ports which could be used to connect thread radios, and we'll probably start seeing them builtin soon.

#

running the thread border router on your main router makes dealing with setting up the ipv6 routing quite a bit easier :)

main matrix
#

yeah, for sure it would.

#

in any case, removing the OTBR from the mix and leaving it GHub only has brought the lights back into the fold without the need for reboots, so I'm happy the recovery side of things for lights that fall away is much better.

opal sparrow
#

anyways, since you can't see anything about the OTBR version which is on that device, you might as well call it a "closed" thread border router ;)

#

need to complain to them about any network instability, not to the nanoleaf or openthread folks.

main matrix
#

wasn't a complaint, just a general observation

#

and there was an OTBR version on the S200, but it's unplugged now

brazen canyon
#

A lot of that stuff was remedied in gpl3

edgy tusk
#

Where is the link to add devices to the beta?

#

I got a new lightbulb, but I want to add it under the beta

plain kettle
wraith bear
main matrix
wraith bear
#

No, so initially I was trying to get the Nl to join Gl-iNets thread network, but I kept encountering the Nest-Pan issue. I thought it was the device itself so I decided to do it on a raspberry pi with open thread

#

Encountered the same issue, long story short its an andriod problem as mentioned previously 😅

main matrix
#

I see. The issue I had initially was getting the S200 to join the existing Thread network that HA generated, as there was no indication of what the PSK was. Turns out from the OTBR doco, the HA Thread network uses the generic PSK as noted in the documentation...

wraith bear
#

I've got 2 of the GL-iNets...not sure what to do with it now

wraith bear
wind finch
#

Oh dang, I was thinking of getting the (new) S20

wraith bear
main matrix
#

I've got 2 S20s and an S200. I'll keep experimenting with them, just not in an prod environment per se

#

had to email their Sales team to allow me to buy the new ones though :\ as at the time they weren't publicly available (at least not through their store or Aliexpress etc)

#

that was ~2 months ago though. things could have changed since

wind finch
#

I see they still only ship from China

#

Will wait until they ship from the EU, who knows what surprises customs will add on to the price 🫠

#

Latest beta looking good FYI, devices in HA have been online 100% of the time since installing, more than a day already.
💪🏼💪🏼💪🏼

main matrix
wraith bear
#

Im in AU 😄

plain kettle
#

i doubt we will ever see it, but it was said to be a 4-6 weeks wait time

#
  • 2 or more weeks coz we all know how fast aus post are 🤣
main matrix
#

also same 🙃

wraith bear
#

Do we pay for the products? I have no idea how it works lol

plain kettle
boreal surge
#

Afraid that the registration is closed for this one, sorry! But there are quite a few more for the same and other products happening over the next few months. If your device and home profile is a match, you'll see an invitation by email 🙂

opal sparrow
#

hmm, all my bulbs appear to have gone unresponsive over thread about an hour ago, that's weird. no time to debug it right now, i'll have to take a look later.

#

might be my border router rather than the bulbs

boreal surge
#

Will start in 3-4 weeks

plain kettle
#

Cheers mate 👍

finite vale
#

I haven't been able to do much/any digging into it but this .170 firmware started strong (was able to upgrade most of my lights without needing to retry) and the bulbs were seeming solid in HA. Then they started to drop off. I went through and repaired a lot of them (by removing bulbs from HA and NL, and resetting through powering on and off repeatedly). That seemed to restore connectivity for a while but now I'm at a point where zero of 15 bulbs are available in HA.

dull dagger
#

170 so far is doing well since it was installerd here. Have you tried rebooting the HA matter server and your TBRs? I did this just after updating to 170 to get a fresh start. I keep telling myself this is the last time to do this...so now, I hope this is the last time 🙂

remote goblet
#

I just updated from the production version to .170 yesterday. All lights were available the whole day. This morning a lot dropped of. Had to restart the tbr and ha matter server, since then all came back again

wind finch
#

Mine have been running for 2 days straight now with zero issues in HA and Apple Home, 100% availability.

opal sparrow
indigo mason
#

I upgraded 2 bulbs and 3 light strips to 170. All upgraded successfully but Thread network is not working.

Currently in the NL app 3 bulbs are only visible over Bluetooth.Only 2 are showing on Thread. I can control all 5 via the NL app but not via Apple Home; all show as "no response". The upgrade seems to have affected the broader Thread network as my Onvis switch is not available in HomeKit either (shows as "updating" then "no response". Also, Eve Home app's Thread Network view normally shows lots of end-points which I think represent the NL devices; they appeared briefly then disappeared again.

I've tried power-cycling the bulbs and both border routers (HomePod mini, Apple TV); one or two NL devices appeared briefly in Apple Home then disappeared. I won't try any more troubleshooting tonight but I guess next step would be resetting the bulbs and re-adding.

indigo mason
dull dagger
#

On 3.6.170, commissioning fully reset devices to home assistant has never been better! It works all the time every time.

shell vigil
#

Hey everyone, did anybody lost all the devices from Apple home ? Now they are only available in NL app only :/ I am not talking about 1 or 2 devices … my 35 devices are out of Apple home

#

Do you think resetting NL devices and pairing them again would help ?

main matrix
#

sure it's not just Apple Home having a moment? seems odd to have them all go walkabout

shell vigil
#

But only NL

#

All other devices are there

main matrix
#

I don't know enough about the Apple ecosystem (only have an iPhone specifically for Flame), but if you try and add a new accessory and go to more options, do any lights appear there? Seems Homekit devices apparently disappeared in a similar way (from the quick Google search on it) and the devices were just "hidden", but bringing one back brought them all back.

#

failing that, not really sure. sorry.

shell vigil
#

Nope.. there is nothing

#

😩😩😩😩😩

main matrix
#

sounds like a @boreal surge / @wild oracle query then.

shell vigil
#

I have mentioned to Nathan previously.. just checking if someone else had it

main matrix
#

do you see any of the lights in Flame?

shell vigil
#

It started with couple@of devices

main matrix
#

makes me think the services have disappeared

shell vigil
#

They went to default room

#

And now everything

#

Now it’s too late

#

Already removed them all and going to reset before the night … to ensure I’ll sleep .. I have the switches everywhere

#

Mess

main matrix
#

before you go nuclear

#

do they appear in Flame?

shell vigil
shell vigil
main matrix
#

Flame is the mDNS browser to check if lights have lost their .matter or .ltpdu services

#

for iOS*

#

install the app, tie your phone to the same WiFi network as your Apple TBRs and see if anything Nanoleaf appears

#

example:

Screenshot_2024-03-09_at_5.26.57_pm.png
shell vigil
#

They are all there

#

Nothing has left the whole thread

main matrix
#

if you drill down into one of the lights, do you see the same number of records as above?

shell vigil
#

They were available in NL app@

#

But not@in Apple home@

main matrix
#

NL app uses the ltpdu protocol, Apple Home uses the .matter

shell vigil
main matrix
#

seems normal, though that IPv6 address looks a bit odd

#

I don't know enough about your network topology though so that could be fine, but from my testing most of the IPv6 addresses used for thread communication usually start with f xxx, as it's a local address. 2a02 suggests a public IPv6 address, but some routers do assign public IPv6 as private, so again could be normal.

shell vigil
#

Well.. one thing I know

#

I need to reset and set up everything again

main matrix
#

have you tried rebooting the TBRs first?

#

or even your router?

shell vigil
#

Before yes

main matrix
#

your call to go nuclear, but I think other things could be tried first 🤷‍♂️

#

personally, I'd wait to see whether it's something others have seen/Paul or Nathan's input, but that's me

#

dang it; after 3 days of solid connectivity, one light has fallen off my HA Matter integration 😦 curiously though, that light is reachable by BLE only and there are zero entries for it in Flame...

grim obsidian
#

Is anyone using the ESP Thread BR-Zigbee GW as their border router? I was thinking of picking one up to extend my thread network to my garage

brazen canyon
grim obsidian
#

If I run into issues setting it up later do you mind if I bother you?

brazen canyon
#

Just get a project box to stick it in, after you config it runs fine.

Only issue I had was I couldn't load the thread creds during setup, had to do it after using the web-ui

#

Yeah sure it's been a few weeks since I set mine up so might be a bit rusty on details though

grim obsidian
#

Sounds good! It should get here Monday so we'll see when I have time. I might have to 3d print a box of for it too. I've been trying to learn 3d modeling

shell vigil
#

I was still loosing the bulbs from Apple home@

#

I deleted the Nanoleaf app

#

So far so good

#

🙈

main matrix
#

... deleting the Nanoleaf app added the bulbs back into Apple Home?

brazen canyon
shell vigil
#

No I reset the bulbs to factory settings and continued adding them only in Apple home@

main matrix
#

oh

#

well if it works, it works 🤷‍♂️

shell vigil
#

Hopefully will not loose them anymore

feral steeple
#

Certainly seems like we are getting close to a stable world!
Going to be away for the next 4 days, so nothing should be happening in the house, hopefully all 24 bulbs will keep connected 🙂

#

@boreal surge Still getting some flickering (seems to be the same bulbs). 1 flickered then the light went off, the other flickered and ended up on the correct colour and brightness still, so this is an improvement

shell vigil
plain kettle
#

Ah you fixed it, nice!

craggy plaza
#

After the update to 3.6.159 it was not possible for me to pair any Nanoleaf Essentials bulb to HA and I also had problems with my Thread network one week ago. I removed all currently installed Nanoleaf bulbs from power, but the Thread network with 32 EVE devices was still unstable. With the new HA logs, where the node id is also logged, we found out that one of my EVE devices had a defect. After removing it from current, my network was stable since one week. Today I updated HA, Matter server (5.9.0 BETA 0), tvOS, homepodOS, iOS, ipadOS and macOS to the latest and greatest. I rebooted my 7 Apple Thread Border Routers and the HA Yellow. After that I waited until everything was connected again.

Then I did the firmware update to 3.6.170, I paired one of my (unpaired) bulbs to HA directly and shared it with Apple Home Home. It worked at the first attempt. Great!

Now I updated one of my bulbs, that was already paired to HA and Apple Home, to 3.6.170. Update procedure was smooth and without issues. But when it was ready, the bulb was removed from Apple Home. It was still controllable from HA. I opened the Nanoleaf app, went to the bulb settings, disconnected it from Apple Home and connected it again. Now I see and can control the bulb in HA, Apple Home and in the Nanoleaf app. Maybe it’s the same issue that @shell vigil had.

If it stays stable I am going to add more bulbs.

wind finch
# shell vigil Hopefully will not loose them anymore

In a previous firmware, that happened to 3x of my devices. The _matter service for AppleHome was no longer on the device. Still in HomeAssistant though. I fixed it via the NL app, and just selecting the “Connect to Matter” button for those 3 lights.

As of this morning though, all my lights disappeared out of the NL app on my iPhone, in that they are still seen but they need to be “setup” again, and can therefore no longer see the thread details etc. But I think that’s more of an issue with the app that lost all the information, rather than an issue with the lights or this firmware. Also, I checked the NL app on my iPad, and everything is shown correctly there still. So definitely just an issue with the app.

They are still connected via AppleHome and HomeAssistant without any problems.

shell vigil
#

I have deleted the app, the night passed and didn’t loose any of the bulbs in Apple home

#

And works great

wraith bear
manic plover
#

An update on 5.6.170:

I updated 51 lights yesterday. Many were updated with the use of the new "update all" functionality, although I had to use it 4 times in various places of the house (Bluetooth range) and, then I was left with 12 lights which I had to update manually (restart, turn off the circuit breakers of other lights, ...). It's definitely an improvement, but I wonder - with understanding of Bluetooth discovery limits - there should be a possibility to connect to a specific device if Bluetooth address is known. Can the app save it and reuse, so that discovery is not needed?

Regarding Thread connectivity, it's better than the previous beta, but after 10 hours since the update I have only 31/51 lights connected. Unfortunately, they seem unresponsive - I can't turn them on or off even with multiple retries. I was able to control them right after the update though.

plain kettle
#

How many BR's do you have, seems like you have way too much traffic going through a few and its constantly crashing those

manic plover
#

There's a pattern to this though - it's mostly bulbs distant to the border router which are offline. Seems like meshing might not work too well. I'm also not able to display the Thread network in the Nanoleaf app, to check which devices were elected as leaders/routers.

plain kettle
manic plover
manic plover
plain kettle
manic plover
plain kettle
#

yeah, i didnt mean that

manic plover
#

I mean this page used to display the entire network with these details.

plain kettle
#

yeah, that doesnt show the mesh and and all the details around it tho

#

which is why i suggested adding that ability to their border routers (shapes/BR) for beta users but hasnt seem to gone anywhere

brazen canyon
plain kettle
#

most of the bulbs would just show mesh extender? no?

brazen canyon
#

Maybe 🙃 I used to have some as "child" which is basically end device

plain kettle
#

huh, yeah right

brazen canyon
#

Presumably if you had enough BRs strategically placed you'd minimize mesh extender roles

craggy plaza
#

I have 7 bulbs connected. 6 of them are a child.

craggy plaza
# manic plover 1, Nest Hub gen 2. There was a previous beta which has worked well for me, I had...

Do I understand it right, that you have only one TBR for 51 bulbs? Theoretically it shouldn’t be a problem. But in the past I had 35 EVE devices connected to one hardwired AppleTV 4K 3rd Gen. Everything worked, but the most distant devices were slow. So I bought a second AppleTV for the other floor of my house. Immediately everything got faster. After that I decided to exchange some of my Sonos speakers (without TBR) to HomePod Minis (with TBR). That was a great decision.

manic plover
craggy plaza
#

Ok, maybe you want to buy a used one as a workaround. But yeah, you said, that everything was fine with an older firmware, if I remember right. Too many posts… 🤔😃

manic plover
#

Yes, there was a build where I had 100% connected at all times, no disconnects. They were sometimes slow to respond, and sometimes I had to retry commands 2-3 times. Not ideal, but not too bad either 🙂

craggy plaza
manic plover
#

I think it was 3.6.94. I posted about it Jan 19th, from what I can see this was the latest version back then.

craggy plaza
#

Ok, that’s long ago. Matter 1.2 was implemented with 3.6.152…

wraith bear
#

I read somewhere that the Theoretically limit on thread devices with one RCP is 32, and I'm assuming that will be lower on the Br's. I think for a large network like that, your probably better off useing otbr. It's really inexpensive compared to a Br device. I can send you some Linux commands to install and get it up and running if you need

plain kettle
#

Just need a good Nordic based dongle, and you’ll be set

main matrix
wraith bear
#

@main matrix your probably right, I haven't had the chance to test mine, I had to move my system to the other side of the building, and I did something stupid, upgraded some kernals on the Linux machine that was running my otbr, had to reset everything, hopefully I'll get it up and running today though

craggy plaza
remote goblet
haughty crow
#

This beta release is just fantastic. All of my 32 nanoleaf bulbs stayed connected 99% of the time. It's huge improvement comparing to the previous releases. Well done team!

grim obsidian
#

Agreed that this is the best firmware yet. ALL 9 of my lights are controllable in home assistant and Google home. That has never happened before. And they've been connected all weekend long.
I only have my Google nest hub Gen 2 and 2x nanoleaf lines as border routers

grim obsidian
plain kettle
grim obsidian
plain kettle
#

Ah dope, should be good!

grim obsidian
#

They're finally in stock on Amazon so I figured why not

wraith bear
opal sparrow
#

Hmm. so there is definitely some sort of issue with service registration on OTBR. I've seen a few times that the bulbs are correctly sending srp requests for all of the services, but that OTBR is reporting an error and fails to register a service. Seems to happen most often when quickly pairing several devices over matter (pairing a single NL device via android to HA requires creating as many as 4 registered services, then deleting all but 2 of them). I'm thinking it might be a resource exhaustion issue in OTBR especially on small or memory limited devices.

I (76620409) OPENTHREAD: update host 1A35D748C486FA6D
I (76620409) OPENTHREAD: Set addr of host to FDA9:D862:9078:1:AF32:18BA:BA46:26AD
I (76620409) OPENTHREAD: Service 23BB6362BF69F1B5-0000000000000012._matter._tcp
I (76620409) OPENTHREAD: Add new service
E (76620409) OPENTHREAD: Failed to add service
W(76620409) OPENTHREAD:[W] SrpServer-----: Send fail response: 5
#

tho i haven't ruled out a malformed request being a possible cause either, i should see if i can use one of my spare esp32-h2 boards as a thread traffic sniffer :)

still pawn
#

I’ve upgraded my two A19 bulbs I have online and the light strip. Since the upgrade the flood of CHIP ERRORS in my Home Assistant Matter logs have disappeared. This looks promising.

I’m relatively low key right now, waiting on some Inovelli White switches to ship. Hardware is two AppleTvs and one HomePod mini as boarder routers, and two Echo Dots waiting for the next release that allows easier thread network merging. Right now they are just dots. 🙂

wraith bear
wild oracle
#

3.6.173 RC Release Notes

A few minor fixes you likely haven't run into. Almost otherwise the same as 3.6.170.

#1184371187464290344 This is our release candidate, so if you haven't already upgraded to 3.6.170, we'd love to get your feedback here. And for those that have, we'd love to get any verification you can spare.

Thanks for all your input so far!

wild oracle
wind finch
#

Has anyone shared a device yet from AppleHome to HomeAssistant on 3.6.173?

I’m setting up a new device, but the light doesn’t show up under “Nearby Devices” after copying the code and trying to add it in HA.

Also, the power loss recovery doesn’t seem to work for the same light.

plain kettle
#

you can manually add the code

wind finch
#

Yes, but it needs to show up as a nearby device, then you select it, and you paste the code.

plain kettle
#

Click on that, then click on enter code

craggy plaza
# wind finch Has anyone shared a device yet from AppleHome to HomeAssistant on 3.6.173? I’m...

Nowadays I usually do it the other way around. First pair with HA and then share with Apple Home. Worked great with 3.6.170. Always right on the first try. I didn’t try it with 3.6.173.

After a good experience with 3.6.170, I updated all my 16 bulbs from 3.6.170 to 3.6.173 this morning. The update process was smooth. All bulbs disconnected briefly after the update, but became available again after a few seconds to a minute. They were then connected in HA, Apple Home and in the Nanoleaf app and can be controlled. It's too early to say anything about stability. But so far everything looks good.

#

I will check my HA logs later today.

wind finch
# plain kettle

This has not worked for me whenever I tried it. Granted, it was on the older firmwares. Anyway, it's not working now either, just spins round and round looking for the device

#

Ah, the other way around worked without issues: HomeAssistant --> Apple Home

craggy plaza
# wind finch Ah, the other way around worked without issues: HomeAssistant --> Apple Home

Yeah, I also had this issue with 3.6.165. but it works great since 3.6.170.

#1184371187464290344 message

Under known issues the following is documented:

3.6.165 Release Notes

Known Issues:
3. HA subscription error can block pairing or connectivity: https://github.com/project-chip/connectedhomeip/issues/32493

This GitHub issue is still open.

GitHub
SDK Loop/trip on CHIP Error 0x00000021: End of TLV · Issue #32493 ·...

Reproduction steps What is supposed to happen if the connection to a device is lost right at the moment when doing a (wildcard) Read subscription request ? We got multiple reports from Nanoleaf dev...

lone iris
#

The only issue I had updating was that some of the devices dropped off of my Apple home matter connection, but were fine in HASS

dull dagger
#

new FW release going well so far

#

thanks

eager frigate
#

Three of my devices completely disappeared from HomeKit somehow after I updated last night.

plain kettle
#

Reconnect them from the Nanoleaf app

shell vigil
#

I lost all my devices once

#

Or eventually you can install an older build of NL app from test flight

plain kettle
#

The new update on TestFlight has addressed the issue

#

Came out today

brazen heart
#

I can’t reconnect them in the Nanoleaf app, it says they are already in another Home.

brazen heart
#

Had to reset the bulbs to get them to reconnect

eager frigate
boreal surge
neon rain
opal sparrow
#

that's the expressif OTBR. I should try the openthread posix border router at some point to see if it has the same behaviour

neon rain
#

Yeah would be interesting. Also there have been some mDNS/SRP related fixes/improvements recent weeks in ot-br-posix at least.

#

From the logs it seems that the platform mDNS API refused to register the service.

#

Not sure what Espressif is using there. The HA add-on is using the Apple mDNS implementation, aka mDNSResponder

bitter compass
#

@boreal surge almost everything went smoothly in the upgrade, the only hiccup was that the nanoleaf app claimed that the essentials light strip was only on bluetooth despite all the A19 bulbs immediately reconnecting to thread. I thought I was going to have problems, but checked Home Assistant which was still able to speak matter to the light strip despite the app claiming it was bluetooth only. So functionality everything was immediately back on matter and controllable - the app was just slow to recognise that - but only for the light strip. Which incidentally is a bug I have seen before. All lights were still available in Google after the update too.

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the RC is stable enough that I feel comfortable spending £36 in the Amazon spring deal to get another nanoleaf essentials light strip - put it that way 😉

boreal surge
craggy plaza
#

@boreal surge Yeah I am also happy with that firmware. My 32 EVE Matter over Thread and 15 of my 16 paired Nanoleaf bulbs are rock stable. No unavailable messages for the 15 bulbs in HA for round about 30 hours. But there is one bulb that became unavailable 4 times in HA. Don’t know what’s wrong. The bulb always gets available by itself within seconds.

I can have a look at my HA logs, if that helps.

The device is surrounded by 4 EVE Energies (1-5m away), a hardwired Apple TV 4K 3rd Gen (4m away) and 7 Nanoleaf bulbs (2-4m away). All these devices are in the same room, my living room. WiFi Channel 11 is not used in my setup anymore to avoid interference to Thread channel 25, used by Apple Thread networks. My ZigBee network is on channel 20.

craggy plaza
#

Before this latest firmware update all bulbs were disconnected from power. I wanted to sort out issues in my Thread network. I already wrote about that above. However, I reconnected and updated one bulb after the other, always with the HA log in the view.

In the first round I updated 7 of my bulbs and in the second round 9 bulbs. In the first round I also had some devices that were disconnected from Apple Home after the update, some showed that they were connected via Bluetooth in the Nanoleaf app, while they worked fine in HA and AH. The Bluetooth issue sorted itself. For some bulbs it was enough to connect them to Apple Home via the Nanoleaf app. Some bulbs had to be resetted and readded to Home Assistant > Apple Home > Nanoleaf app.

The second round was absolutely smooth. No need to reset or reconnect to Apple Home. All bulbs came back to HA immediately.

So Multi-admin also seems to work now. At least it got better.

eternal hill
#

Mine also disappeared from Apple home (12 out of 14 bulbs)

craggy plaza
#

@boreal surge Here is the HA Matter server log for the Nanoleaf Essentials A19-E27 bulb (Node 213) that has 4 unavailable logs in the HA logbook. Its not my complete log file, only the parts, where HA logged that it became unavailable:

https://dpaste.org/g25SP

As already said it always became available in HA 'immediately'.

manic plover
#

An update from my end - the situation is relatively stable with 34/51 lights connected.

Thread network menu in the Nanoleaf app works again for me. With that, it's pretty clear why some lights/rooms remain disconnected - lights which should be mesh extenders are children. At the same time, I have a room with 12 lights where 8 of them are extenders, one leader, three children.

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Is there an option (planned?) to force a bulb to be an extender?

wind finch
#

A map would be useful. The Eve app shows you which devices are connected to each other (if you have some Eve plugs in the mix), but of course the names are all weird so it doesn’t say much in the end.

wild oracle
#

#1184371187464290344 we've released 3.6.173 to production. Thanks to you all for your patient testing, as this has definitely been rockier than we would have liked.

We'll keep you posted via email about upcoming tests we've got bubbling. And of course, we love your feedback and help to always keep improving.

wild oracle
shell vigil
craggy plaza
#

Yeah!!! Even though the testing phase was too short in my opinion, I understand the decision to launch it now. There are a lot of people out there with unreliable Nanoleaf bulbs. This is definitely the best firmware for the Matter Essentials we ever had. But what do we do with our free time now? 😂 Well done, thanks

scenic grove
#

Congrats for shipping the new firmware. I think a lot of folks will be quite happy with the results.

craggy plaza
#

How can I get rid of these ghosts in the Nanoleaf app? This is my problematic light bulb. Maybe it's a coincidence. I only see this bulb once in Apple Home and HA.

dull dagger
craggy plaza
# dull dagger Probably cache

What do you mean by cache? Where can I delete this cache?

When I disable the cloud sync, the 2 devices can be deleted. But as soon as I enable the cloud sync again, the devices come back.

I used the beta Nanoleaf app and went to the stable app. It’s the same situation. The devices come back after deleting them. So, it’s definitely a cloud sync issue.

@boreal surge What can I do? Thanks

dull dagger
craggy plaza
plain kettle
#

app settings?

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in settings?

craggy plaza
plain kettle
#

nah, in settings

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apple settings

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and then look up the app

craggy plaza
#

Yeah, I also looked there.

#

Does it look different on your phone?

dull dagger
#

This is Android I'm sure Apple has it somewhere

craggy plaza
main matrix
#

Correct; in Apple land, everything just works and nothing ever breaks. /s

craggy plaza
#

However… I think, it has something to do with the cloud sync.

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If I delete them local, they get synced from the cloud to local immediately.

dull dagger
main matrix
craggy plaza
#

Ha! Went into settings of the 3 dot menu for these 2 bulbs and there I pressed the delete button 3 times. After that I went back to the device overview and now the devices are deleted. 🤔😂

eternal hill
boreal surge
feral steeple
#

after 4 days, 1 out of my 24 GU10's has dropped off and gone unavailable from home assistant.
Best result so far

opal sparrow
#

ah, figured out what was going wrong with service registration on my esp thread br. it turns out that when you build the firmware, it gets configured with a static maximum number of services that can be registered… which defaults to only 10. Which isn't very many :)

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10 is lots for one device, but the thread border router needs to hold services for all of the thread devices; and with nanoleaf matter devices, you could hit as many as 5 services per device (which would occur during the process of commissioning a 3rd matter fabric)

feral steeple
#

So after 5 days every single one of my nanoleaf gu10's have dropped offline. Restarting ha to see if they come back or if i have up flick the power switch on then

dull dagger
#

some things I do (and do less offten now-awadys) is reboot not only the TBRs but also your router and/or access points. If that does not solve the issue, then roboot the devices, if that does no work then I report it.

feral steeple
craggy plaza
# dull dagger some things I do (and do less offten now-awadys) is reboot not only the TBRs but...

I typically restarted the Matter server, when I had issues. If that doesn’t solve the issue, I rebooted all my TBRs. That typically solves my issues. In 1 or maybe 2 very crazy situations I rebooted my router. But typically I don’t do this. Nowadays where HA Matter server log file is very communicative and shows the node ids, it’s a must to have a look at the log file. My problem is that I do not always understand the messages or error codes in the logfile and some log lines do not include a node id. 😃

feral steeple
#

Has the reliability poll been shut down?

I have 5/24 GU10's on .173 that are unavailable for over 6 hours now 😦

feral steeple
#

Seems like they lost nanoleaf app and HA. adding htem again fixed the issue :S hopefuly something just weird and one off

craggy plaza
#

My lights are all connected.

But tonight my wife noticed that one of my bulbs was glowing very dimly. She pressed the smart light switch (Hue Dimmer Switch), but it stayed on. This appears to be less than 1%. In the Nanoleaf app, in Apple Home and in Home Assistant, this bulb is in the off status.

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Here is a photo:

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And here is another photo with 3 seconds exposure time:

main matrix
wraith bear
#

Oh damn, I was going to buy some gu10s

#

I bet nanoleaf is on it for sure

main matrix
#

I have 4 in total so I've only lost 2, FWIW

wraith bear
#

Though it must be hard replicating issues

main matrix
#

the HA matter logs are... weird though..

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the HA matter docker container has been up for the last week, but the logs only go back for the last 40 minutes?

wraith bear
#

Can you control them through nanoleaf app?

main matrix
#

yeah they can be controlled through the NL app

#

in my case they are 4 lights fixed to the front of the house outside that turn on and off* with a HA automation at sunrise and sunset, so it's not a huge issue per se

#

but this is all I have in the logs, which is basically nothing: https://www.dpaste.org/OH4Hw

the services are still there (both ltpdu and matter), NL can see the lights in the* app, and it's only caused 2 of my 25 lights to go all weird. not really a lot to go on :\

main matrix
wraith bear
#

But your not useing home asisstant os right?

main matrix
#

not tied to Google Home anymore

wraith bear
#

Aaa damn

#

So there are no logs to check pretty much

main matrix
#

restarting HA didn't fix it, so I'll restart the addon and give it a few minutes

#

other than what is in the dpaste above, no

wraith bear
#

Just the ones you provided

main matrix
#

none of the A19s were affected, so... idk

wraith bear
#

I wonder if nanolead has its own logs that we can access?

main matrix
#

based on previous conversations in this thread, it's unlikely

#

ok, have gone from losing 2x GU10s to 3x GU10s

#

all are reporting node busy

#

sigh

plain kettle
main matrix
plain kettle
#

As you might know, we think it’s so prevalent to HA users because we use google/apple home API to commission devices, which technically turns them into multi-admin and hence these issues

main matrix
#

it only turns them into multi-admin if you commission them to one ecosystem then share the same device

wraith bear
wraith bear
plain kettle
#

Unless you do it VIA websockets, which isn’t recommended

wraith bear
#

Websockets?

#

So there is another way to commission without involving andriod or iphone?

main matrix
main matrix
plain kettle
#

yep. and it will be undocumented for a long while, thre is a reason its not meant to be used by anyone 😉

wraith bear
#

So currently if we only use HA directly to commision we are still using iPhone or andriod right?

wraith bear
main matrix
plain kettle
wraith bear
#

I'm interested to try this websocket thingo out

plain kettle
wraith bear
plain kettle
#

you running a bluetooth adapter on your HA instance?

wraith bear
#

Or another year or so

main matrix
#

I've done the websocket method before, but it was hit and miss and quite a while ago

plain kettle
wraith bear
#

Well not for this, I wanted to run andriod emulator on the otbr so I can commission it remotly and manage the devices like updating and stuff through the NL app

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Still haven't been able to run the emulator though which is annoying, but I have an adapter I can use

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@plain kettle are you a developer?

plain kettle
#

as in what way? dev for HA?

wraith bear
#

Just any dev

plain kettle
#

just a uni student 😛

wraith bear
#

Cool

main matrix
#

@wraith bear https://community.home-assistant.io/t/power-plugs-cant-connect-to-thread-network-skyconnect-thread-matter/638332 - if you're still keen on the websocket of things

Home Assistant Community
Power plugs can't connect to Thread network (SkyConnect + Thread + ...

Hello, I am struggling to get the SkyConnect stick running with Thread + Matter power plugs (both ONVIS and EVE) and I would be very thankful if someone could help me figuring out what the issue is. I tested this with two systems (an AMD mini pc and a Pi 3) and each time I setup a fresh install of HA and have the same result. The following in...

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but don't expect any support from the HA matter devs 🙂

plain kettle
#

you need your BLE dongle to be connected, but not set up

#

even with the bluetooth intergration

wraith bear
main matrix
wraith bear
#

But they advertise it

main matrix
#

so it's unsupported on unsupported on undocumented

plain kettle
#

not "officially"

plain kettle
main matrix
#

people like to poke around though

wraith bear
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Ohhhh

main matrix
#

so you can "try" it, and if it fails, well 🤷‍♂️

wraith bear
#

So good thing I'm running an otbr then

main matrix
#

I've misplaced my second Skyconnect, lol

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otherwise I'd test it as well

wraith bear
#

@plain kettle so your saying running skyconnect will solve a lot of issues (in the future when its supported)

plain kettle
#

no

#

well

#

maybe

#

hard to tell

#

if its in a single network yeah maybe

main matrix
plain kettle
#

but every network is different

wraith bear
#

I believe in the home assistant gods 🙏

#

They will fix matter server at least

plain kettle
#

its upstream issues mostly

wraith bear
#

😄

main matrix
wraith bear
#

That's weird, 5 mins. The normal cycle is like 10 seconds isn't it?

craggy plaza
main matrix
main matrix
plain kettle
#

I don’t think the logs are wiped that often?

main matrix
#

and I've been running the integration in debug mode

plain kettle
#

Did you look in the CLI using the line above?

main matrix
#

so would have expected a LOT more traffic

#

bit late now; the previous logs are gone

#

they're non-persistent on a restart of the integration

plain kettle
#

Hmm right

main matrix
#

yeah, just run it - nothing prior to the restart (first entry is the client_handler connecting to my HA instance, which is consistent with a restart)

plain kettle
#

Huh right

craggy plaza
main matrix
craggy plaza
main matrix
#

I tried it in both

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it's all good; might be something to do with my log retention, I don't know

craggy plaza
#

Ok, that’s strange.

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Move the discussion to the HA Matter discord channel. Maybe someone else can help you.

plain kettle
#

🙈

brazen canyon
#

Didn't see that in the 8b messages 😣

wraith bear
#

Your trying to access matter logs on ha right?

main matrix
wraith bear
#

Yeah

#

I tried a few things didn't work sorry 😅

main matrix
#

lol all good.

#

seems the same GU10s that fell out of sync yesterday, continue to fall out of sync every 24 hours or so. workaround is a physical off/on at the switch (after 2 mins of being off). Annoying, but oh well.

craggy plaza
#

What is the problem with the command line command above? What exactly does not work?

craggy plaza
#

Install the community addon ‘Advanced SSH & Web Terminal‘.

https://community.home-assistant.io/t/home-assistant-community-add-on-ssh-web-terminal/33820

Read the warning in the info tab. 😉

  1. Configure your username/password and authorized_keys (it also works without the keys) and set the compatibilty_mode: false in the configuration tab.
  2. Start the addon
  3. SSH into your HAOS ssh username@password
  4. type the following command

ha host logs --identifier addon_core_matter_server -n 10000

You can also modify the value 10000 to set the lines your Matter server log should show.

That’s it. 😃

Home Assistant Community
Home Assistant Community Add-on: SSH & Web Terminal

This add-on is provided by the Home Assistant Community Add-ons project. About This add-on allows you to log in to your Home Assistant instance using SSH or a Web Terminal, giving you to access your folders and also includes a command-line tool to do things like restart, update, and check your instance. This is an enhanced versi...

main matrix
steep iris
#

they consistently keep dropping - a few for days and still not been able to reconntect them after restting

verbal drift
#

Whilst .173 is great improvement I don’t think it fixes all woes?

feral steeple
#

Is anyone else getting delays with HA and turning hte lights on? My automations are regularly taking about 5 seconds to turn them on with this firmware.
Motion detected > Turn light group on, 3-5 seconds, bulbs turning on.
Which sucks when you walk into a dark kitchen and then have to wait for them to turn on. (Wondering if its more a nanoleaf issue or HA issue, and given all the dramas we have had to get to this point, im figuring NL :P)

Same automation with zigbee bulbs and the automation is completing in <1 sec

main matrix
plain kettle
#

Ah that, we it hasnt been shipped out to anyone outside of the US yet

dense maple
plain kettle
deep notch
main matrix
#

for those running a GL-S200 (from GL-iNet), looks like they just released an update to improve Thread performance and update their SDKs to more recent ones, as well as update the topology map for Thread devices. It actually looks accurate now for the Nanoleaf lights on my network (vs what the OTBR addon seems to think is "accurate" in HA):

image.png image.png
plain kettle
#

Oh wow

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They both use the same API, so I wonder what Glnet is doing differently

main matrix
#

not sure, but I'm all for it

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in terms of their SDK updates:

image.png
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fairly sure the previous version was using ~9 month old SDKs

plain kettle
#

I assume they are just using the API with a custom wrapper, might be worth buying one

#

How much AUD was it from them? They don’t seem to have it on Amazon yet (so will have to contact them)

main matrix
#

na, the contact one was for the GL-S20 (this one is the S200)

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hmm, no longer there... I'll find my receipt, 2 secs

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ah right, I bought it directly off the Gl-iNet store

plain kettle
#

Didn’t SL20 not get an update as well?

main matrix
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https://store.gl-inet.com/products/gl-s200-multi-protocol-iot-gateway-thread-border-router?_pos=1&_sid=0b305c36d&_ss=r - $69AU (nice - looks like they're on special at the moment) + postage via DHL.

GL.iNet
GL-S200 Thread Border Router

GL-S200 is a Thread Border Router designed for users to host and manage low-power and reliable IoT mesh networks. The device supports both THREAD and BLE protocols, and it comes with an optional pre-configured THREAD development board for a simplified integration process to IoT devices.

main matrix
plain kettle
#

Sl200 isn’t Poe tho? That’s the good part about the SL20

#

Eh, might contact them and see jf they plan to keep both the 20 and 200 on the same thread SDK versions

#

It do trel?

main matrix
#

it doesn't do TREL, no

#

I had asked them about it when I purchased the S20s from their Sales team direct, didn't get an answer

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that was December last year