flamethrower units

[meager topaz]

Flamethrower units would be a unit that would be able to shoot flames from a shorter range then most infantry while having very high damage. Flamers would have about a cost in between commandos and heavies, having more health then most units. Would be a last or 2nd last tech upgrade unit. Would apply a short burning effect that would do a 4th of its regular damage over 2-3 seconds.”only good bug is a good bug!”

[vague bluff]

I would love flamethrowers but Dram is iffy on providing them. I could see it becoming a weapon option for Heavies (the quad-tube rocket launcher, minigun, and Stinger missile being other options).

If Aliens can take over and occupy human factories I would love to see flamethrowers moving through it and burning the growths back.

[meager topaz]

Possibly it would replace the commando for the centari, and would work well if secondary’s get approved

[gritty violet]

Idk I think Dram Liked the Firetruck Idea, or At least enjoyed the Reference.

The issue is however that Baltarus is a Hot Place to begin with. And Humans are Already wearing Environment suits to protect from heat and Aliens are perfectly adapted thus flamethrowers won't do that much damage

[meager topaz]

I still think it would majorly damage things like crabs and sutch

[vague bluff]

The adaptability argument does nkt convince me to think flamethrowers aren't viable anti-alien weapons.

They can survive the surface of Baltarus, which is hot but still below the point water boils iirc.

Flamethrower can burn so much hotter. Especially if we do a thermite mix. Combine it with a 50m range like the real ones and we have a very viable, very deadly weapon

[meager topaz]

I think that if it had the ability to put fire on the ground it would be over powered

[gritty violet]

The Surface of Baltarus is above the boiling point of Water. At 140°C in the day a full 40° above that boiling point.

Also performance issues to be considered if we have fire actually, ya know, Burn.

[meager topaz]

what do you mean

[gritty violet]

If I set you on Fire should it deal damage in a single instant and be gone?

[meager topaz]

no i was just wondering if you ment fire on the ground

[gritty violet]

Also yes

You'll notice firebug has no lasting burning area either.

Imo if your going to add Incendiaries then you should add burning ground and burning DOTs on affected target, do fire right or not at all.

[meager topaz]

i think that fire on the ground in silica would be broken

like imagin you get like 10 flamers

the only way you could do anything would be flying units

[vague bluff]

eh, depends on how "realistic" the fire is.

could just make it function like an autoshotgun with a tighter spread and super high rate of fire.

Its not great but it can closely resemble and feel like a flamethrower. Im willing to sacrifice some realism in the name of fun and performance

[gritty violet]

it probably wouldn't stack, and still wouldn't be effective vs many units

[gritty violet]

wasn't talking about the fire having an Cone, we already have that reference Pulse truck, its the fact that fire does its damage over time rather than in a single instant

[vague bluff]

well I meant to suggest sacrificing the damage over time aspect if necessary to save performance. Firebug does this fine. It would be nice to get damage over time but its not a critical thing to me.

Although I want to say I've heard Dram mentioning damage over time could be a thing with the scorpion acid attack since its supposed to be corrosive. Would be cool but unnecessary if it kills performance. Silica has enough to run anyway

[gritty violet]

firebug not having a DOT componenet really ruins it for me

[vague bluff]

well it feels fine to me. DOT would be nice but Im willing to sacrifice it in the name of performance

[gritty violet]

i mean its a shotgun at that point, so just add a shotgun and forget the flamethrower

[limber portal]

On the would bugs be flammable note- I’d say they are flame resistant not flame retardant- meaning they would be able to be lit on fire it just won’t be easy, so you could put in a system where to take damage you need 1 or 2 seconds to light them ablaze only problem there is that you need DOT to be able to do pretty much anything

[vague bluff]

DOT mechanics are something Dram has been deliberately avoiding. Too much of a hassle to implement easily.

Any flamethrowers will probably have to do immediate heat damage but can't continue to do damage when the fire stops

[limber portal]

What about the shotgun idea but it’s incindeary rounds that don’t do dots - best of both worlds it could weaken armour and create weakspots or something?

[meager topaz]

i feel like they can both coexist after all flamers woudl be useful to replace commandos as centrie have less tech

[limber portal]

We can’t have flamers because no dots

[vague bluff]

Shotguns will be a thing eventually.

DOT mechanics are something Dram wants to avoid.

Dram isn't huge on flamethrowers but hasn't explicitly said no. More of a reluctance. May not fit well in his vision for the game.

Personally, if the flamethrower functioned like a nonstop, mini gun shot gun with a short range flame effect then I would be fine.

[meager topaz]

yea it woulf have the range that is eather a 1/3 or a 1/4 of most infantry

[gritty violet]

https://silica.fandom.com/wiki/Damage_Types i copied these off of Dram, which one of these is fire damage, Explosive? Penetration? just do normal shotgun

[meager topaz]

why does he want to avoid DOT? is it just too hard to code?

[vague bluff]

A flamethrower would have a range of about 50m as that is the range of historical examples.

[gritty violet]

that has been his explanation

[vague bluff]

Pretty much. It can be done but it's a pain and he has other things to do with regards to development. Only so much time in a day

[gritty violet]

i think dram will eventually have to adds status effects like DOT if he wants a complete game, Aliens are even more dependant on it relying on Acids and buffs from the Hive mind.

[vague bluff]

I would save it for post 1.0. I would like the status effects and DOT but I get that he has enough on his plate.

Granted if the game ends Early Access, gets a lot of attention, and has masked/false DOT people online will b$tch and moan endlessly

[meager topaz]

i do agree after all balance is already off because of scorps and ai needs fixes before this is added this is just something i would like to see

[gritty violet]

its a big enough thing that post 1.0 just wouldn't work. the scope would be limited because he would have already achieved balance, if aliens have a movespeed aura after they already got balanced now they are too strong, a Dot added to a weapon now has to be balanced all over again.

[vague bluff]

Oh yeah for sure. Most of the ideas forum is for that

[vague bluff]

Fair point. In any case DOT mechanics, should they be implemented, have to wait a while

[gritty violet]

agreed, i would rather Dram make it right than not at all

[meager topaz]

true

[floral gulch]

Sir, the flame resistant bugs are attacking!

‘Those bastards. Deploy the flamethrowers!’

Some shit my leadership would try to pull I bet.

[vague bluff]

Surely the leadership isn't that bad.... right?

[gritty violet]

Surely you Jest?

[brave moss]

What he showed was an enum list which can be expanded upon, it's not hard-coded to just have what he showed. I would add "dot" so it can be interchanged with other similar ish damage systems