implement ebay-style proxy bidding so people cant just snipe in the last second

[analog cloud]

make it fair for everyone, especially for those who cant just sit around to watch the last minute because of irl stuff or simply different timezone

for late discussion joiner: its a one-time max bid statement that says "i will bid 1mi past any bid up until this point"

or allow a maximum counteract past auction time so the second to last bidder has the time to react

[twin torrent]

Maybe the sniping is the fun of it

[winged pelican]

explain what an ebay style proxy bidding is

[fervent badge]

pretty sure it’s if someone bids at the last second, a minute or something is added to end time

and then if someone bids again, another minute is added

[winged pelican]

ahh

is there a limit to that

[fervent badge]

don’t think so

[winged pelican]

like what are the chances of someone abusing this and just bidding over and over again

[fervent badge]

i think it goes until no one bids anymore

[winged pelican]

so that the auction never ends

[fervent badge]

I mean it would have to end at some point

but I don’t even see how this can be implemented

there might not be anyone to keep track of it and it just adds unnecessary work for mods

[dusky cedar]

wouldn't negotiating a buyout price negate this

[south thunder]

this would just make auctions boring

the fun of it is sniping

https://tenor.com/view/sniper-stewie-griffin-gif-23481779

[twin oriole]

10 trillion wp for remos gx

[south thunder]

bo

lol

[analog cloud]

its people indicating a maximum fund they are willing to automatically outbid back when someone outbid them

[analog cloud]

some auction doesnt have bo price or is way too much higher than market price

[fervent badge]

was this before or after this suggestion was made

[stoic cove]

Surprisingly this suggestion came up before vro got tradebanned

I mean im personally divided by this suggestion

[analog cloud]

bro took 8.5hrs to go online after auction ended and never said when theyre on until i spent it

im not the only one to blame in that💀

it was only 350k either so

[stoic cove]

On one hand you, as the bidder, have an easier time getting that stuff.

On the other hand, for auctioneers nowadays you cant leave a listing sitting at "Auction Ongoing" anymore after the auction enda

Now you gotta pay attention to a dynamic auction end time as well if this were to go through

#MakeAuctionPostingsCapitalisticAgain

[analog cloud]

i just feel like having to sit til last minute is very unfair for those who got irl stuff going on at the end time or is simply asleep cuz they in a different timezone

[stoic cove]

equal oppprtunities for free of charge is socialism

But then again if this were to be implemented itd add more headache to auctioneers

[analog cloud]

i mean in this economy socialism aint that bad anymore

[stoic cove]

Thats for irl not in aero

We aint fighting big corpos with soviet systems in here

We fighting for the 7e7 or seastar

[analog cloud]

well auctioneer would get net more from the trade no? if someone snipes then autobid kick in and auctioner gets more, if not then just original pay

[stoic cove]

well auctioneer would get net more from the trade no?
I mean of course, but this would go so far right itd be capitalistic underneath, which ironically means less oppprtunities because a lot of new traders are broke & the veterans have lots of WP to blow away at an ESd Remos that ballooned up to 10 million WP

A dynamic time limit (i.e. extends after a bid within a certain time gets placed. But had a cap) would just mean a typical auction end time extension

[analog cloud]

auction is fundamentally against new trader cuz they broke and cant bid more; autobid just makes it fairer among the rich

what about a one chance for the 2nd last bidder to counter a snipe with no further bid placeable?

thats much simpler

[stoic cove]

And what if that 2nd last bidder is a veteran bidder & that last bidder is a newbie trader giving all the WP they got?

Itd backfire anyway

[analog cloud]

what does it have to do with that

this isnt a suggestion catering broke ppl

[stoic cove]

make it fair for everyone

[dusky cedar]

The vet will win regardless

[stoic cove]

[dusky cedar]

Since they'd just be bidding whatever high ass amount if they really wanted it

[analog cloud]

everyone that can reasonably bid

how about that

[stoic cove]

Thatd limit that to the veteran bidders

[dusky cedar]

I think this is kinda just a pain for everyone involved

[stoic cove]

Bc a newbie bidder cant "reasonably bid"

[dusky cedar]

Also highkey aeronautica is not that serious

[stoic cove]

Hell, someone had a troll bid in a priv livery listing before & tried to pass it as a serious bid

[stoic cove]

Exactly

Again, for the second time, the auctioneer had to pay attention to bids past the scheduled end time. Even if its not the auctioneer, the mods have to.

And then once again this system would drive the CB so far up itd effectively lock new, broke bidders. And "veteran bidders" in different timezones (if the auction gets dragged into the bidder's inactivity time)

[dusky cedar]

this system would also end up making you sit around counterbidding for longer which defeats the whole point of saving you from watching auctions till they close

[analog cloud]

wdym, autobid is exactly the opposite, it makes you not have to sit around til last minute

cuz the autobid would automatically bid for u

[dusky cedar]

autobid???

[stoic cove]

This makes the problem much worse

[dusky cedar]

isn't this suggestion asking for extensions to the auction end when a new bid is cast?

[stoic cove]

Once again, veteran bidders with a shitton of WP can set a huge amount of WP theyre willing to bid up to

[analog cloud]

and?

thats the whole point of auction isnt it

whoever the richest win

[dusky cedar]

what if multiple people have the same max fund

[analog cloud]

then first highest bidder win

[stoic cove]

make it fair for everyone

Your point being is making it fair for everyone, stop beating around the bush

[dusky cedar]

doesn't this then discriminate people who aren't sitting on discord the entire day for an auction then

[stoic cove]

I dont think thats the point. What he means is that everyone gets autobid

But then again new bidders with barely an WP would be left in the dust

[dusky cedar]

i know but late auction joiners would also basically have no chance

[analog cloud]

fair as in time accessibility not money affordability

[analog cloud]

if they poor they got no chance to begin with

if they rich enough and join late they can just set up a higher max bid

[dusky cedar]

no even if they have the same amount of money prioritizing the first bidder would still be discriminating late joiners

also would people be able to edit their max bid during the auction?

and who's going to keep track of all of the max bids

[analog cloud]

then they can all go for a round 2 idk

[analog cloud]

the channel

[analog cloud]

no

[dusky cedar]

but the point was to let bidders not have to constantly check the channel no?

[analog cloud]

they dont??

why are we keep getting back to this

[stoic cove]

At the very least could you explain how this could benefit #1091059598842150972 in its entirety, in detail?

Im getting lost on how you define this

[dusky cedar]

i feel like this would just be an overcomplication and would send all the guys in the trade den into a frenzy

[stoic cove]

Bc now its moving towards autobidding territory rather than "accessibility improvement"

[analog cloud]

well discussion understanding evolves thru debate

[stoic cove]

Yet you cant make a concrete stance on your idea here

At first it was a dynamic end time typa thing

[analog cloud]

its just dutch style auction, different sure but not necessarily complicate imo

[stoic cove]

Now its a literal autobidding bot

[analog cloud]

that was only an alternative offered not the sole argument

autobid/maxbid isnt all that different fundamentally but in specific form

[dusky cedar]

idk what that's like

[analog cloud]

one can simply say "ill do 1 mi above any bid up until this point"

is that hard to grasp

[stoic cove]

Dutch style auctions are bidding downwards.

Most commonly, it means an auction in which the auctioneer begins with a high offer price in the case of selling, and lowers it until some participant accepts the price, or it reaches a set reserve price.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_auction

Entirely different shit

[analog cloud]

wait sorry

vickery auction was what i had in mind

[dusky cedar]

interesting

[analog cloud]

but that could also work

[stoic cove]

Dutch auctions are not allowed here

[analog cloud]

for what reason

[stoic cove]

Yk thats bidding downwards

[analog cloud]

if its simply not the existing form then we can just advocate for an extra form

yea

[dusky cedar]

ehhhh

[analog cloud]

everyone submit a max bid they are willing to do

and by the time ends highest max bid win

[dusky cedar]

i feel like the vickery auction puts too much guessing into the valuation of the item

[dusky cedar]

the wikipedia article says the highest bid also only pays the second highest price?

[analog cloud]

there is no guessing but each persons personal valuation

yea

well i guess theyd need to have the highest bid money

or just sealed bid instead of vickery

[stoic cove]

Okay okay so your point being,

• Each bidder gets a bot or smth, setva max bid, then let it go for a bot battle-style autobid war
• While the auction end time extends if a new bid is made within a certain time??

How does this connect with each other?

[analog cloud]

then they pay highest bid without having to precheck if they got the bid money

[analog cloud]

they dont, second point is an alternative as i already said earlier

[dusky cedar]

-# i think you should put your original/current main idea in the original post so people don't get confused

[stoic cove]

So your point being is the first one. You want an autobidding bot to be added to this server.

[stoic cove]

[analog cloud]

it doesnt have to be a bot?

just say what ur max bid is

[stoic cove]

How are you gonna place a bid automatically if theres no bot?

[stoic cove]

People can just say their entire WP savings just as usual, cant they?

[dusky cedar]

if there's too many people bidding i think some bids might be overlooked due to human error as well

[analog cloud]

then they can pay just their entire wp saving?

[analog cloud]

you can just read what everyone had in their bid message?

[stoic cove]

Thats literally what the rule says rn. You cant bid with the amount of WP you dont have rn.

[analog cloud]

yea and? dont make a max bid u cant afford

whats ur point

[stoic cove]

Whats the point of putting a max bid at that point, if the "max bid" is your entire WP savings? Like we have now?

[analog cloud]

so if you are the richest in the auction u dont have to keep bidding up urself but let the statement do its work; and it eliminates uncomfortablenes from being sniped cuz any sniping past the max bid u had would be out of ur comfort zone anyways

[stoic cove]

[analog cloud]

rn the highest bid isnt necessarily the max bid someone willing to pay

and if they get sniped theyd want to bid back if they have the chance

but if they arent looking then it wont be possible

[stoic cove]

cuz any sniping past the max bid u had would be out of ur comfort zone anyways
This is literally what Auction Rule 7 have rn

[dusky cedar]

you could bid the max you want to pay though

unless the auction specifies a max increase

[stoic cove]

Your legal max bid is how many WP u have rn

[analog cloud]

yea but if existing bid and sb is low wont u want to start low so u dont have to pay as much

legal max bid isnt always what ppl bid at cuz theyd want to save some for something else if possible

if u have the chance to buy something at 50% discount wont u want to try

the max bid system sure would eliminate that uncertainty but it makes sure whatever u bid is what ur comfortable with and gives u highest chance of winning under ur capacity

[stoic cove]

So your point being is automated bidding?

[analog cloud]

max bid automatically bids up when competing bid shows up through mathematical calculation

does not have to use a bot

but is automated for the bidders concern

[stoic cove]

So just autobidding.

[stoic cove]

Yet another hassle

[analog cloud]

how is it a hassel with one sentence from each bidder

[stoic cove]

Having to use mental calculations to figure shit out

[analog cloud]

💀

if u cant handle middle school number comparison

then sure

[stoic cove]

As if people saying "1500 thousand" to imply 1,500,000 isnt a problem already

[analog cloud]

first who even say that💀 second is that really a problem when u can clearly tell what it is

all you have to track is the highest max anyways

in sealed bid u wont be allowed to edit ur max bid

so u dont have to keep checking each one

[dusky cedar]

it is actually a current problem

you can't expect people in a children lego game to work with numbers

[analog cloud]

i guess i overestimated average intelligence of people here then

[dusky cedar]

there's probably like 12 and 13 year olds here

[stoic cove]

Okay so for example,

Su-57 Private Livery Auction

SB: 1,000 WP
MI: 1,000 WP
BO: 5,000,000 WP
End Time: 6 days from now; extended up to 2 more days if bid placed less than 1 hour before End Time

---

Bidder 1:

My max bid: 6,000,000 WP
My MI from previous bid: 50,000 WP
I automatically place bid: After 30 minutes of previous bidder

Bidder 2:

My max bid: 8,000,000 WP
My MI from previous bid: 70,000 WP
I automatically place bid: After 40 minutes of previous bidder

Like this?

[analog cloud]

mi is whatever the original post indiicates, buyer cannot nominate higher mi

and you take the time part out

[stoic cove]

No what i mean is bidder's MI is the increase from previous bidder

[analog cloud]

for the fourth time thats an irrelavent alternative

uh

why would you want to do different mi when one is enough to outbid

Okay so for example,

Su-57 Private Livery Auction

SB: 1,000 WP
MI: 1,000 WP
BO: 5,000,000 WP
End Time: 6 days from now

---

Bidder 1:

My max bid: 6,000,000 WP (auto one mi up than new bids til this point)

Bidder 2:

My max bid: 8,000,000 WP (auto one mi up than new bids til this point)

its just this

so bidder two clearly wins

[stoic cove]

Say I wanna bid on a Miku liveried Su-57 & tge CB was 100k WP. I wanna bid 200k WP, but the MI (which by your explanation had become Maximum Increase), I cant effectively bid 200k bc the maximum increade is capped to 50k

[analog cloud]

?

no

its minimal increase

thats stated in auction

which is the one mi up from the srcond highest than yours

[analog cloud]

bidder 2 wins with 6001000wp

1mi above second highest

thats it

and if third bidder show up with 10mil max bid then itd be 8001000

1mi above second highest

[stoic cove]

So a sealed auction (Vickery auction), not an automated auction

Thatd just be more hassle. Might as well go for the traditional auction then. If you cant stay up for a Seastar, then thats your problem.

I (and a bunch if #trade-den folks) would rather check the channel from time to time (and/or actually setting the notif to "All Messages" & turning on Push Notif) instead of making a sealed bid

@dusky cedar wdyt?

||anyway toilet time holy fuck weve gone so far||

[analog cloud]

it doesnt have to be a replacement but a seperate auction section

for other people who dont want to deal with that

both can exist at the same time

[stoic cove]

but a separate auction section
Can we just not add more burden to mods by adding a second type of auctions section

[analog cloud]

isnt mods job to be burdened

[dusky cedar]

[analog cloud]

they even have different mod team to different section in the server

[dusky cedar]

i don't think the mods are getting paid gang

[stoic cove]

Yeah try applying for the mod apps & be a trial mod & i can bet 100k WP youd want to retract your words

[analog cloud]

i am a mod in different server, why would you be a mod if u cant handle that

social worker is a thing gang

[stoic cove]

So a new mod apps for a separate type of auction we all have doubts will ever work

Fair

[stoic cove]

Real life is a thing & you implied that with your suggestion here

[dusky cedar]

considering aeronautica's playerbase it'd end up as bad of a cesspool that current trade auctions are

[analog cloud]

people still have doubt in ai and yet its market going strong

[stoic cove]

AI is driven by corpos

Not consumers

[dusky cedar]

OFFTOPIC TIME WHOOOOOO

[analog cloud]

the point is not all new things bad just bc people havent used it

[stoic cove]

Doubt is doubt, you are delusional

[stoic cove]

Then tell me what AI had made to consumer electronics if you meam "new things arent always bad"

Can you buy a new stick of 16GB DDR5 RAM rn with your money?

[dusky cedar]

[stoic cove]

And how many AI slop have you come across rn?

[analog cloud]

what are you even on right now

[stoic cove]

Youre trying to drive ts offtopic by comparing a new type of auction in a separate channel to a controversial tech

Back onto the topic.

[analog cloud]

ai increase text based production and information gathering output

[dusky cedar]

i don't mind the sealed auction thing but i dunno how you'd integrate it into here

you'd probably need a separate ticket bot or something

[stoic cove]

Ts sucks, is

[stoic cove]

And this.

[analog cloud]

for the third time u dont need ticket bot

ykw

[stoic cove]

AI also increases misinformation

[analog cloud]

im tired of arguing

[stoic cove]

Again, back onto the main topic

There you go

@cold wolf XP Farming here was good.

[dusky cedar]

idk how you'd do a sealed auction without one

unless you want the auctioneer to get a bunch of DMs

which ig isn't too bad of an idea but it would mean we have more off aero discord things that we can't moderate

[copper knot]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6z_gy6IPEZY

[copper knot]

Why not just… bid that amount to begin with

The risk associated with bidding a low price on an auction is that you could lose said auction

if you dont want to lose then bid higher