🌱│gardening

[neat vortex]

Maybe we can help troubleshoot and/or determine what to send a ticket about if needed?

(My main's two harvest-boosted apple trees are giving the correct number of apples since the update)

[long crown]

You need to have all your plots pushed together for this to work right?

[neat vortex]

Yep, the apple trees are straddling two soil plots and I suspect it also relies on cross-soil-plot companion planting buffs, which don't work if there is even a small gap (which can be covered by the dirt border, sometimes)

[nocturne island]

yep that's right, all plots put together in a 9x9 for it to work, and yes it uses companion planting buff that work across soil plots

[amber sapphire]

Sometimes I notice that plants that can only be harvested once, will have fertilizer wear off before the plant if fully grown and can be harvested. Is there a benefit to fertilizing the same plant multiple times (for ones that cannot regrow)

[floral talon]

if it gets the buff from fert it iwll use 1xtilesize of plant per growhttick that it grows

[fringe owl]

anyone else not seeing the garden buff from crops besides the fertilizers?

[drifting violet]

Hey @neat vortex, do you happen to have a version of your bean layout for people that do The Cube? I realised that I can’t actually do the linear layout because it won't fit in a courtyard ;0;

[neat vortex]

I have a 4-bush Garden Cube version, yeah, lemme find it

There are other layouts cleverer than mine on that front, though

[drifting violet]

Oh, the only layout I found when searching beans was Ilyeana’s Everything Garden and DS’s MAXIMUM BEANS post 🤭

[neat vortex]

#🌱│gardening message

[drifting violet]

Thank you! 💕

(also @glad heart pspspsps I summon you to the channel of the gardeners)

[glad heart]

garden is life

[trim coral]

Newb question... I read that tomatoes should be jarred, but the pickled tomatoes sell for the same as the seeds. Is there another step I'm missing?

[neat vortex]

Are you comparing starred and unstarred, by any chance?

[trim coral]

Ah, probably. The starred tomatoes will make starred pickled tomatoes?

[neat vortex]

Yep, and vanishingly rare - so rare it could be a myth - bonus unstarred pickled tomatoes

[trim coral]

Extraordinarily newb question then! Thank you kindly. 🙂

[clear kindle]

they should, there is still a small, rare chance that you'll get non-starred processed foods

[neat vortex]

An extra, bonus one! XD like with the seeds

[viscid socket]

has the "examine" option been not showing any of the boosts for anyone else? I used to see the crop boosts when I held the button. now I don't. has it been like t his for awhile, or just since the recent patch?

[cobalt gate]

its a newish bug

[viscid socket]

thanks, glad I wasn't just completely oblivious for the last little while 😅

[sacred ferry]

Should you harvest and replant as you go, or just do all of it once everything has grown?

[iron quail]

Depends on your play style and if you want to keep up with it. I tend to replant as I go so I have more crops to sell but I have to go back and check it every in-game day.

[mystic skiff]

I took down all my apple tree 🪓🪓

Fighting the camera made me dizzy 😵 I'm going back to beans or berries. Or both.

[toxic arch]

what are the best crobs to grow for moeny?

[drifting violet]

Beans, from what I understand 😄

Per this post:

#🌱│gardening message

[short palm]

Hello, is there a bug on gardening at the moment? my gardening has no active bonuses indication to them (e.g harvest boost, weed etc)

there should be 2 or more active bonuses on them right?

[floral talon]

the bonusses are there just not visible

[short palm]

oh isee just a visual bug then?

[floral talon]

yes my layout kept being water retained and weedrfee so i assume thats hte case

[short palm]

i see isee thanks! feels bad to those who hasnt setup their crops yet

[worthy rock]

Hi, is this an ok layout in order to make a decent amount of gold? I’m planning to swap the carrots to onions when I get more worm farms.

[slow flame]

Do you mind if I copy this layout? I've been looking for something exactly like this.

[worthy rock]

I don’t mind at all! Feel free to use it

[winter pasture]

hey, i can't move crops cause i have 2x2s, is there any way to go around that?

[clear kindle]

if the 2x2s are crossing over plots then nothing can be done unless you destroy the crop

[cobalt gate]

or wait until they serve their lifespan

[winter pasture]

is that something i can do?

[clear kindle]

not sure about all of the buttons for the other consoles or pc, but i do know on the switch it's x while using your hoe. but do keep in mind that you will lose the plant doing this

[winter pasture]

thank u!

[dim knot]

hi guys, possibly noob question but. when trying to make gold, should i always use my star crops to get star seeds or is it worth more to preserve those and get seeds from normal crops?

for reference, in case it makes a difference, i currently have 2 seed collectors and 1 preserves jar

[clear kindle]

always use your star crops to make enough star seeds (unless it's a crop like bok choy that wants to be turned to seeds for profit) for replanting, but always turn everything you harvest into a processed good

[ivory pond]

My new layout has forced me to make more preserve jars

[clear kindle]

yeah, that'll happen. i've got 8 jars for my apples

[ivory pond]

I've got 12 now

[dim knot]

got it 🫡 thanks! <3

[clear kindle]

and so you know, gardening is i think the only skill that actually helps you the higher you are (up to level 50), around level 15-25, all of your star seeds will start making nothing but star crops, around level 38-50, even non-star seeds will give you star crops

[floral talon]

this is 3 different choices u should be asking instead
1 should i make me own seeds answer hell yes with some maybe nos for hardcore farmers id oubt ur one of htose
2 what hsould i process stuff into aside from reseeding or actual using of hte produce
jar everything u can but bokchoi potatoe beans
seeds
maybe fabric for cotton
3 should i use starred or unstarred seeds (it depends on ur level at higher levels u get always starred produce first from star seeds at 25 at 38 from unstarred seeds chance rises per level of gardening and stsrred seed sor not and quality up buff)
so till ur like way past 25 starred seeds is the way

[dim knot]

oh that is good info to have!

[ivory pond]

I read that buying fabric is better than planting it because in the time it takes to grow and process it into fabric yourself you could've earned more from other seeds

[floral talon]

well unles ur lower level cuz then u need cotton to provide its buff still

though fabric making is less crafter time but since cotttons buff becoems so useless id avoid it in my layout if i can

[ripe valley]

Looks like my everything farm I posted a few days ago 🙂

[floral talon]

i personally do some only cotton and harvy buff plants layouts when i run low on cotton and then i dont have to have the headache if incorporating cotton into my layouts
i could be better of farming bokchoi but i dont wanna bother thinkign about it plus it gives me the chance to not always run the same layouts which gets boring

[dim knot]

alr thank you! atm i'm processing everything except star crops which i use for seeds. but currently sitting at lv9 so i still have a long way to go

[floral talon]

ulget there take all the time in the world its a cozy game after all
id personally only would rush lv10

[clear kindle]

if i'm low on fabric, i just wait until my garden is done with the apples and plant all of my plots with cotton to fill up my loom with 3 stacks of fabric and a stack of cotton

[worthy rock]

I actually just started playing again recently and your everything farm was what I decided to first use! After scouring this channel more I just swapped some things around cause I’m not really doing any cooking and really need gold.

[ripe valley]

Glad you liked it! Your variation does look good 👍🏻

[zealous socket]

where does one get pumpkin seeds?

[cobalt gate]

the EW store

[hexed sentinel]

Is anyone else having issues with adjacency bonuses not appearing over crops since the update?

[clear kindle]

known bug

[stuck quarry]

Came here to post about exactly this!

[floral talon]

buffs arent displayed but still there

[safe fossil]

Hello!!! could someone pass me some farm layout with the updated crops? i only have the basics, without apples, blueberries or peppers. thanks!

[floral talon]

u want everything besides cotton dont bother to farm cotton in an everyhting farm layouts?

[safe fossil]

mmmm idk.. hahha

[sleek pasture]

What's the current best way to farm gold?

I was growing tomatoes and selling but I'm sure there's a better way.

[floral talon]

tryhard beans

[sleek pasture]

Grow all beans then jar them?

[night cobalt]

Is there any way to get more than 8 garden/farm plots? Or is that just the limit? 🥲

[clear kindle]

9 is the limit

do we have an updated worm farm for grilled fish, yet? or are we still waiting for the results of it?

[spare tendon]

does anyone know if u get seeds from the new plant from elderwood? when u have planted them

[floral talon]

no clue i dont do flowers/trees only layouts

[winged vine]

I’ve heard you do not get seeds from the Elderwood plants you plant in your home.

[floral talon]

oh so then the new ngiht event will keep having replay value

[spare tendon]

oh okey :), tnx for letting me know 😄

[winged vine]

I’ve been pickling cabbage and making apple jams for my money

I still plant lots of tomatoes but it’s cause they are good at keeping other things hydrated and I dont have to plant them often. Use first harvest for seeds, keep some of the 2nd and sell the rest

[spare tendon]

but how do i know when they are done?

[sleek pasture]

I'll do this! I need to remap my garden but this sounds like a good idea

[long crown]

Anyone know if beans can replace any 4 spot bushes in the crop set up?

[neat vortex]

Yes, they can; they give harvest boost, so they can replace blueberries in any layout and the buffs will still work the same. They can also swap in for pumpkins or peppers, unless the quality up buff from those is load-bearing for some reason. (QU is unnecessary past level 25 if using starred seeds)

[tropic orchid]

Do fully grown crops stop giving there bonuses to other crops?

[iron quail]

Yes, they loose bonuses once the neighboring crops fully grow. Its so player don't have fully grown plants do things like permanent hydration.

[tropic orchid]

@iron quail Thank you!

[abstract barn]

Is watering crops on a timer once they are watered? I just hoed, planted, and watered and literally went far enough for my crops to be out of view and turned around and they all had the empty water icon above it. It was like 30 seconds 🤔

Its actually been happening a bunch on this plot, and having harvest boost not increase number of harvested crops... but im also super bad at keeping track of things like that and have horrible time blindness so I never trust my judgement

[iron quail]

That's odd, It should be once a day. I have time blindness cause of my adhd so I feel like that all the time. Try reloading the plot and see if it fixes it.

[abstract barn]

I already watered it again like a dummy 🫠🫠🫠🫠 I was just wondering if anyone with less severe time blindness might have some insight 😅🤣🤣🤣 gang gang 🤣🤣

But like, I know its bad, but I feel like im taking crazy pills fr

I harvest boosted one pumpkin like 90 times and still got 2 pumpkins from it 😑

[clear kindle]

fully grown crops still give their bonuses. i only harvest my apples and everything else is fully grown and i've replanted my apples multiple times from this last update

[abstract barn]

I have faith im probably misunderstanding the system tho 😁

[clear kindle]

well, if it just happened, i know here in est time zone, the palian day just restarted about 15 minutes ago. if you don't have hydration retention on your crops, then that's probably why you had to rewater

[abstract barn]

Ok so its based on time of day! Tysm for that, I knew it was most likely user error 😅

I watered like right at the rollover 🤣

[clear kindle]

yep. 6am in game is the roll over time and start of new day for gardening crops

[ivory pond]

Is that correct @neat vortex

[abstract barn]

So wait I sort of cheated a day then? It thinks it's been growing one extra day? (Not literally cheated, but you could water 3 seconds before rollover and have a whole day clocked?)

[ivory pond]

Yeah as long as you water/harvest/replant/whatever before 6am it counts

[iron quail]

I looked it up to check if I'm wrong and I see both so I would like to know too

[abstract barn]

Thank yall for the info!

[neat vortex]

Nope, having a crop that gives a buff on a tile in any form/at any stage grants the buff to its neighbors. Even an unwatered seed will do it.

Like sylvablade said, this enables leaving some tiles with full-grown crops unharvested indefinitely to let them buff other crops.

The lack of visible buff labels (known issue from this patch) is making things really unnecessarily difficult for newer gardeners :(

HOWEVER. There is one thing that may be causing confusion:

If a multi-harvest crop is left unharvested for longer than one growth tick after it becomes ready, it will need watering again, even if it's getting water retain from its neighbors.

It's suspected that this is to avoid harvestable plants consuming water retain fertilizer when they aren't growing/don't need it.

(It's also why single-harvest crops have their soil go "dry" after one growth tick past being harvestable.)

[ivory pond]

Thank youuuu for clarification

[neat vortex]

Would you mind pointing me to wherever you saw the "harvestable crops don't provide buffs" info? If it's fixable, I'd like to fix it.

(I basically can't watch YT videos saying anything about gardening in Palia anymore. Most of them I've seen have had at least one misapprehension and some of them are just flat wrong. A more cynical part of me suspects it's because people commenting with "well actually" type info is good for the algorithm....)

[tropic orchid]

I thought maybe it was changed which is why i asked cause when i hit G none of my crops have anything but i scrolled up and saw it was a current bug

[neat vortex]

I feel like a lot of players who just started the game are going to end up with a late start on understanding the gardening system precisely because of that lack of labels. (Badruu mentions it, but who ever reads anything the villagers say? /s )

Apologies, I'm apparently feeling grumpy today and should stop making snide comments

[safe badger]

Apple seeds sell for a ridiculous price. Holy heck

[neat vortex]

Sure do. They're one of the more value-dense items in the game — though that's less of an issue now with fish being worth so much, and fish dishes also.

Jam is still better if you're going to sell them immediately, though (105g per apple as seeds vs. 144g per apple as jam)

[safe badger]

Oh wow

[neat vortex]

And despite the amazing per-crop numbers, apples are still in the middle of the pack when it comes to wringing value out of your garden lol

[sacred ferry]

How many star seeds should I keep? I didnt realize that I have over a 100 also using normal vegetables for cooking is a pain

[neat vortex]

I generally keep 30 seeds + enough to plant my garden layout once or twice (depending on how fast it's cycling, since that way I won't be caught flat-footed if the seedmaking gets delayed).

If you are below level 38, I would prioritize always planting starred seeds any time you can.

(And yes, your rate of getting unstarred produce will gradually drop to 0, so get used to checking that "use starred ingredients" option, lol)

Did that answer your question? I feel like I may have missed part of why you were asking it

[sacred ferry]

No, youre good. I think have a pack rat problem and I dont have enough to get the better chest recipe yet. I dont want to just sell it when I can cook to make it more and to use it for focus but it only uses like one vegetable at a time

[neat vortex]

Do you have access to seedmakers or preserves jars yet? Or would you be willing to go to cooking parties?

[mystic skiff]

Min max plot idea but it's all preserves?

[compact remnant]

Anyone have luck getting a black pearl?

[sullen sky]

does anyone also have a bug with the plant bonuses? (water retain, weed prevention, etc) i planted mine with a layout from a garden planner and i got nothing. only fertilizer will show up.

[cobalt gate]

they're still getting the bonuses its just not showing up

[sullen sky]

hmmm. okay. then maybe i got the layout wrong. because i have to water them every day, even if i planted potatos and cabbage

[floral talon]

Just open oystershrooms

[rich temple]

Hello, fairly new player and was curious what a layout would look like for max profit? Can anyone help? Thank you.

[cunning ledge]

Anyone got an image how an optimal crop garden for money farming would be?

[merry spear]

I'm not a garden expert but this is my setup to get as many gold star pumpkins on a 6x6 square-- the cotton and corn in the middle boosts both gold star and quantity as one of each is touching a pumpkin.

Though I think pumpkins already boost star quality now that I think about it,

[cunning ledge]

Ohhh gonna check it!

[merry spear]

maybe next time I will set it up with tomatoes insteads of cotton so the pumpkins stay watered?

[cobalt gate]

pumpkins are apparently really bad for profit if thats your aim

[merry spear]

You've seen my plot you know why im growing pumpkins 😛

[cobalt gate]

i mean. yes.
but i thought it should be mentioned 😛

[merry spear]

But also the canned pumpkin is 101 gold each and I feel like thatr's not bad if you're willing to wait

[rich temple]

I have pumpkins but don’t see canned pumpkin ?

[cobalt gate]

you need to harvest a bunch before you get the recipe

[merry spear]

You need to put them in a preserves jar

[cobalt gate]

man... my garden makes around 66 corn
which means its 60 to pickle then put into the worm farm
meaning i'm only banking 6 per harvest

[rich temple]

Ohh ok, I’m close to harvesting 100 star quality pumpkins. I just started planting them a day ago

[merry spear]

Also... the canned pumpkin is not only worth more than the blueberry or apple jam, its faster to make than the jams. 31 minutes versus 47 minutes and 1 hour
Seems in terms of passive profit from a preserves jar, pumpkins are the way to go

[cobalt gate]

i think the biggest problem is that they're a low harvest compared to blueberries

[merry spear]

unless one of the other preserves thats fast accumulates really well

Either way for context im gathering lots of gold star pumpkins for pumpkin themed cooking parties because I'm insufferable about autumn and halloween aesthetic so I guess I may as well can the non gold star ones

[cobalt gate]

at least until you hit lvl 25 😛

[merry spear]

5 more levels to go!

There my cotton is replaced with tomatoes maybe this will be the ideal pumpkin patch

[cobalt gate]

i wont lie... i kinda wish you could turn off the boosts from crops.
i dont actually want to get the auto watered crops other then in one location

[merry spear]

Also... if you get gold star crops all the time from being level 25... that quality boost bonus from some crops is kinda useless huh

[cobalt gate]

YUP lol

i would love the ability to 'breed' new crops
to change the seeds to give you a different boost

like that would be so cool... it would give ||the gardener|| a cool use too!

[merry spear]

Ye I just finished the oneness quest for them, and I assume they will be relevant in new future features which is exciting

[cobalt gate]

i hope so i love the idea lol

[merry spear]

Actually my first idea was that you exchange certain things for new seeds exclusive to their "store" so yes exchanging x amount of two kinds of crops resulting in a seed of some hybrid would be very viable

[cobalt gate]

that would be super fun xD

[merry spear]

Are blueberries considered the most profitable crop?

or maybe apples?

"Boosts amount harvested from other nearby crop types."
Oh 👀 I should have multiple apple trees together

[marsh cypress]

Whats your go to max beans farm? I fooled around with the garden planner and got something like this:
https://palia-garden-planner.vercel.app/?layout=v0.4_D-111-111-111_CR-POCCbBtBtCBtBt-POCCbBtBtCBtBt-POCCbPCbCBtBt-OBtBtPBtBtCbBtBt-OBtBtPBtBtCbBtBt-OBtBtPBtBtCbBtBt-OBtBtCCbPCbPC-OBtBtCCbPOPC-OCOCCbPOPN_L50Cr0.BtP6
Important is water retain, weed prevention and no use of fertilizer. Which crops should I use for max value?

[floral talon]

They arent harvest boosted at all

[marsh cypress]

How would I cram that also into the layout? Honest question 😅

[mystic skiff]

The Bean Industrial Complex.. Where's there's a license, there's a bean.

[cobalt gate]

Amazing lol

[mystic skiff]

I use the windmill method. And just hydro the beans.

[marsh cypress]

Whats the windmill method?

[finite patrol]

What crop should I use for glow worms?

[mystic skiff]

Credit to @stable ginkgo .

Im gonna do some experimenting with a build where I use watering crops like tomatoes instead since I need those for cooking. And just chug everything I don't need for harvest boost.

[floral talon]

Though i doubt the point of “afk” with beans since their reharvedt is once every 2 growthticks so its nevee that afk

[neat vortex]

there's one of these listed in the minmax layout list, I'm pretty sure

[neat vortex]

Fortunately, if you're away from home at the growth tick, multiharvest crops keep going even if they would normally be harvestable.

and if you're home, then just harvest them? ?_?

[unique ermine]

Im growing tons of tomatos im wondering whats the best crop lay out for money along with other crops so I can also gather other things for cooking rather than just tomatos lol? Im focusing on turning stared tomatos into seeds and selling normals until im able to jar stuff.

[eternal ruin]

Generally speaking the 'best' layout is whatever benefits you most. For virtually everyone having at least two plants allows taking advantage of their traits to spread between the two if you alternate plants, but you can make it more more complex to gain more.

Quality and harvest boosts increase overall money. Weed and hydration decrease overall maintenace. Emphasizing maintenace means less worry about it as you go around doing stuff (potentially making up profit loss in other activities).

So depending what tools you already have and other tasks, passive income from gardening varies.

And then there is seed collectors and preserve jars and worm farms. XD people usually count those as passive profit augmentation.

[unique ermine]

I was just wondering because all i have are tomatos, way too many tomatos...

along with prioritiezing star crops

At least i never have to worry about tomatos.

[eternal ruin]

Well, you will still need to weed it but...

Tomato wheat tomato
Potato rice potato
Tomato wheat tomato

That should hydrate and harvest boost all, giving you a little variety and boosted income.

Or close to it anyways. Edges may be edge cases.

And now work beckons.

[unique ermine]

be safe and thank you

[neat vortex]

I'm sorry I can't provide more detailed info today, not feeling well, but if you search in this channel for keywords like "minmax" and "everything garden" or even just links and images, there are a bunch of AFK layouts (i.e., layouts that are 100% self-weeding/watering) posted in this channel that may meet your needs. AFK layouts typically can grow lots of different things since they cover all 3 basic buffs (water, weed, harvest boost). Then there are ones that also work in bushes and trees.

[clear kindle]

sorry you don't feel well today, ren. hope you get better soon

[pastel cloak]

Would anyone be willing to explain fertilizers to me as if I'm in kindergarten? I am struggling to understand how many and how often to apply, and what exactly the expected the result is. Specifically for the harvest boost, but I think I'm just confused in general.

[clear kindle]

Each farming square can have one type fertilizer applied at a time, but you can stack up to 99 fertilizers of the same type on a single square. Each square will consume 1 fertilizer per growth cycle. In order to achieve full benefit of fertilizer, it needs to be consumed every day. E.g. fertilizing a potato (5 day crop) only 4 times with harvest boost fertilizer will give 4/5 chance of getting bonus yield. ~ palia wiki

fertilizers will not work if neighboring crops have it as a buff, so for example, if you have a potato planted next to a carrot, putting weed block on the potato is a waste because it will never be used as the carrot gives weed block buff

[neat vortex]

(good way to store your extra Weedblock fertilizer, though 😁 since it just sits in the soil and is never used up)

[floral talon]

i finally got time to do weeklys yey busy day and week dang

[neat vortex]

...ah crap. weeklies.

I. Seem to have done most of them by accident?

[open river]

So whats the new strat now that we have new plants? Regarding the beans and pumpkins-

[neat vortex]

Beans: good for gold once you unlock seedmakers, particularly for players who have their playtime in scattered bursts (like mostly playing on weekends) since they process slowly but don't stall in a seedmaker for a LONG time. It's nice that you can forage the seeds (i.e., for replanting) too, if you're gardening level 38+.

Pumpkins: decorative crop. I guess you could grow them for the accomplishment? Terrible for money compared to everything else, even for cooking, despite their high per-crop value, because they add zero value to dishes -_-

So the current cash crops are beans, bok choy, potatoes, rice, and tomatoes.

[pastel cloak]

thank you SO MUCH! this is really helpful 🙂

[open river]

Wait really, about the pumpkins? I've seen people recommend pumpkins over beans and apples! The gardening simulator thingy even says good yeild for gold...?

So should I just keep on with my apples then(preserves)?

[neat vortex]

Plant that same number of tiles of potatoes and see what it says

(make sure the number of harvest days are the same)

There was a YT video floating around saying that pumpkins were good for gold, but the creator had done the math wrong on the yield on pumpkins. They give max 3 pumpkins per harvest, 4 harvests over a 15-day grow time. That is extremely slow considering how many tiles they sit on.

[neat vortex]

Apples are middling for gold. Their main advantage is that if you buff them so they're self-watering/weeding, they are very low labor.

But if you're happy with your income from your apples, then yeah, stick with it! No reason to change what you're doing if it's meeting your needs/doing what you want it to do

[open river]

So pumpkins yeild about the same as potatoes as Im gathering, just takes longer :((

[eternal ruin]

Yeah, apples arent that cash happy, but the fact everything around them gets harvest buff can be useful, so consider that with math and other crop choices.

No they yield less.

[open river]

I have alot of worms going that give me harvest boost fert., so I rarely worry about harvest boosting with other crops... I usually just do all star apples, and harvest boost fert for their entire cycle

now I gotta figure how to use beans... I've been finding apples slow lately

[eternal ruin]

I am away from computer but i did mayh per tile and such and they are... 2nd to last in profit margins i think?

You may have fertilizer, but i dont want to spend all day applying each and every single one one at a time. @_@ XD

[winged vine]

Tbh my two preserve makers are nearly always full in normal and star apples with three trees. Thus far my money makers even if it is a bit of a process. I have a 3rd one for Star Cabbage.

[eternal ruin]

Sell excess bean seeds and eat canned beans. It isnt most profitable crop but it is versatile.

[long crown]

How do you get alot of quality up fert?

[winged vine]

I do need to make a pepper farm for a bit cause I have a lot of recipes that call for it lol

[winged vine]

Glow worm farms give a ton

[neat vortex]

Feed high-value sweet things (cakes, maybe apple jam) to your worms/glow worms

Both farm types give the same amount of fertilizer for the same value of input

[long crown]

I only ever get the harvest boost though

[neat vortex]

Glow worm farms jam less frequently, though (because they put out fewer worms)

[eternal ruin]

Worm or glow farm can do it, it just has to be a sweet item processed, like honey, candy, etc.

[neat vortex]

^

[eternal ruin]

Ack ninja'd. XD sorry

[neat vortex]

(but piksii berries are coded as a savory thing, for some reason)

[open river]

Comparison on how I'd do beans(idk what crop I'd do between them honestly), and how I do my apples now

[eternal ruin]

Berry only sounds sweet cause that is what we are used to.

[neat vortex]

12 days vs 30 days :)
Also, not processed

Beans go 34 -> 135g in a seed maker in 2 hrs

[open river]

huh!

[neat vortex]

and stack to 50/one seed per bean, so they never jam (unlike bok choy and potatoes, which stop after 16 rounds)

[open river]

I guess I need to start working on starred beans! And put away the preserves jars and bust out the seed makers

[neat vortex]

check out Aqajj's windmill layout in this channel for one possibility for how to do the beans; could also use a water retain crop (tomatoes?) instead of the rice if you wanna keep with the HB fert

beans are very prolific, though (VERY), so unless your playtime is low/sporadic, you might end up running out of crafter room to process them

well, depending how well you stay on top of tending them, I guess

[open river]

Thats fine, Im ok with them chilling on the vine often :3

also where do I find that lol

[neat vortex]

Personally, I'm really happy with my two 4 bean/3 bean layouts

You can search for it in this channel

[open river]

OOHHH I see that now!! Huh!! Well, whats the recommended plant to do in the 1 crop sections? :3

Tomatoes?

[neat vortex]

Depends what you care about, tbh. Tomatoes are the water retain crop that is reharvestable, and they're best (and easily) processed in jars. Potatoes give more gold, but they take a lot of seedmakers to keep up, so that might cause a processor traffic jam.

If you'd rather save the HB fertilizer but keep the preserves jar processing/longer grow time, corn is an option. Aqajj uses rice because it's the highest revenue per tile per tick, but it's, again, seedmakers, and it can be annoying to push through since it has a fairly low max unattended run time.

If you put a Super Soaker to my head and made me plant the windmill layout, I'd use tomatoes, because the beans having a fighting chance of growing even if I get distracted and lose track of time appeals to me.

(but I never plant anything that isn't 100% water/weed, because of aforementioned losing-track-of-time, and I hate dealing with desynced crops)

[open river]

See that'd be my problem too... now idk about tomatoes! augh but they do seem like the better option!

If my crops desynced I think I'd flip out honestly I dont have the brain power for that LOL

[eternal ruin]

important thing to keep in mind with desyncing crops: you never lose a crop, you just delay finishing it off. Finished crops likewise keep giving their benefit until you harvest them, so if you know something needs an extra day AND you're going to change the layout, you could wait a day for it to catch up, then harvest. If this desync happened before you're heading off and you know you're getting one or two extra cycles from logging off you wouldn't be growing stuff anyways, you can potentially gain that lost time back depending on if you're clever. If you're not sure you want to be that clever, you couldo also leave that one crop there for the next batch and NOT pick it once it's done. Just let it exist for the rest of the other crops cycle. You don't lose a seed, you still get crop perks to the other crops, and you're only out one plant's worth of profits technically, but it lets you squeeze a bit extra out of it for the trouble from the crop perks.

But depending on what you're doing fertilizer wise, it may cause other random problems. I feel like complete crops have eaten fertilizer on me before, but I rarely use it so I could be recalling wrong.

[neat vortex]

Yes, but lost growth ticks are lost gold when you're calculating gold comparisons in revenue per tile per tick and not per seed

so it irks me XD

[eternal ruin]

yes but you only gain 2 ticks when you log off at best which means no more ticks while you're sleeping, hence potentially resyncing.

[neat vortex]

Aren't you already dealing with that with your apples? if you don't have them weedblocked?

[eternal ruin]

it depends on the timing of your plot at the time of logging off.

[open river]

My apples never desync! They're always watered at the same time and unwatered at the same time, and the weeds dont seem to matter at all, I always pick them all and they dont bother the growth at all

[neat vortex]

You must be better at getting the weeds off them on time than I am :D

(In which case the tomatoes wouldn't be an issue, either)

[open river]

Yes, I always de-weed them before I water them and fertilize them, and make sure its before 6am before I touch them any for any reason, or after, so its all evenly either touched or untouched before I go for em :3

It's literally just all apples btw, no other crops, just 9 crops of apples lol

[eternal ruin]

...You're making my math brain worry. XD

[open river]

LOL SORRY, like I dont disturb them if its going to turn 6am soon so I dont accidentally water 1 crop before another or anything(so they dont desync), and I typically gather all weeds every day :3

[eternal ruin]

What fertilizer do you use on your apple trees again? I wasn't following them until now.

[open river]

9 plots of apples, and all use harvest boost fertilizer :3

But, I will be switching over to beans(mostly) and tomatoes(between the gaps), after this group of apples are done, and I'll be using harvest boost fertilzer on them all still :3

[eternal ruin]

If you can, slip some rice or wheat in there too to try and make up for the harvest booster. As a suggestion anyways. Harvestboosting apples is.... expensive. >_>; It's expensive on any crop really but if you're aiming for gold swapping that would would be beneficial to you. Use quality+, weed blocker or even hydrate if you want to switch for a reason.

in the case of hydrate you can focus it just on the tomato's so it hydrates itself and the other crops won't need it.

[open river]

this will be how my setup goes :3

all starred btw just fyi :3

[open river]

Honestly, I dont mind expending on harvest boost fertilizer at all, I have 4 worms going constantly, always making me at least 200 fertilizer a day typically! So its no biggie!

I use a stack of 81 fertilizers every time I redo my crops(watering, weeding)

I dont think my fertilizer use will change, through switching crop types

[eternal ruin]

case in point example: a full apple yield without harvest is worth 4096 gold. fertilizing it with harvest+ costs 1350 gold over the 30 days.
6144 gold instead, but only gained a fraction of that extra profit.

If you were still doing apples and replaced the center tree with a mix of rice/wheat, 4 of your other trees would be harvest boosted at no expense to you (gain 5.4k). The wheat/rice would replace the lost tree in profit and gain a little extra from self, meaning tree profit isn't lost and you save another bit on fertilizer, boosting that from 5.4k to 6.75k.

Over 30 days anyways. Since you're watering by hand and don't ahve to fertilize the rice/wheat for harvest, it's less hassle in that respect.

Nothing wrong with having fertilizer, cause it still sells well itself to boot.

Sorry. I had to get the math out. ^^;

And of course, anything that comes out star is free extra profit regardless.

[open river]

https://tenor.com/view/cummins-gif-12535975135255283466

[eternal ruin]

replace 1 tree = profits.

https://tenor.com/view/the-mask-cash-register-smoke-gif-13658902

[open river]

Idk if the gif sent but omg thats so confusing but I get what you mean I believe LOLLL thank you for the advice! When this set of apples are through... I mayhaps experiments...

I'm not exactly hurting for money, I'd just love a consistent cash flow! So I think I can afford to experiment a bit with the advice I've received today

[eternal ruin]

If you're basically planning to weed/water by hand regardless it makes things generally easier to figure out. In the case of the bean sample you got, if you alternate the tomatoes with potatoes, They'll basically self hydrate and become independent I think. The middle tomato may be entirely redundant so you could probably leave it out.

beans basically give 552 gold per full harvest, but fertilizing them with harvest boost costs 240... You basically gain pennies fertilizing them because of how the math works, though you might still earn some extra profit from the star crops, you might actually gain more not fertilizing them in this scenario. >.>

The reason? fertilizer prices are janky. ^^: The math changes from plant to plant, but usually most of the value gained gets eaten up from the cost.
well, harvest boost price is janky. >_>;

[neat vortex]

9 trees without HB: 82,944g raw revenue after jamming (not counting reseeding costs)

9 plants x 9 fert x 30 days x 5g per fertilizer = -12,150g in fertilizer costs
9 trees with HB: 124,416g as apple jam (not counting reseeding)

Gain from using fertilizer = 41,472, about 3.4x what you spent in fertilizer

4 trees with HB from wheat (and 9 lost tiles): 55,296g as apple jam
4 trees with HB fertilizer: 55,296g as apple jam
4 trees x 9 fert x 30 days x 5g/fert: -5,400g fertilizer costs
total net revenue from all 8 trees: 105,192g
So, assuming I didn't mess up the calculations somewhere, you save 6,750g in fertilizer but lose a whole tree.

But that assumes that you ignore the wheat's value/leave it alone and never replant it, of course. If you actually plant rice and keep on top of replanting it and seeding it, those 9 tiles of rice will actually make you MORE gold than an apple tree on the same amount of space. They're just a lot more labor.

[eternal ruin]

I think most of the values I used included reseeding costs. Among other details. I'll compare after I pick up everyone's dinner. >_>

The labor on replanting wheat and rice is pretty small in my opinion. If one is already watering and weeding stuff anyways.

[neat vortex]

I mean, this would be easier to just plug into the garden planner, probably... XD let me just do that.

[eternal ruin]

especially when you're only replanting 6 or so times over 30 sessions.

[neat vortex]

Wouldn't it be 10 times for rice?

[eternal ruin]

yes. I accidentally used 6 and 5 days over 4 and 3.
Still small time thing when you're talking 9 tiles. XD

[clear kindle]

beans give harvest boost, yeah?

[neat vortex]

Hm yeah the reseeding does change the numbers a lot for apples.
From garden planner...

• 9 apple trees, no harvest boost, as jam: 69,984

• 9 apple trees with harvest boost, as jam: 111,456

• 81 HB fert per day x 30 days @ 5g/fert: 12,150 fertilizer cost
  (Difference: 41,472g gain from harvest boosting, or 3.4x what you spent in fertilizer)
  Net revenue for 9 trees with HB: 99,306g

8 trees with HB (4 from companion planting, 4 from fertilizer), as jam: 99,072g
36 HB fert per day x 30 days @ 5g/fert: 5,400g fertilizer cost
Net revenue for 8 trees, half with natural HB (and 9 lost tiles): 93,672g

So you save 6,750g in fertilizer but your overall net revenue still goes down by 5,634g, after factoring in the lower fertilizer costs.

...of course, if those center tiles aren't "lost," but rather are actually growing you rice (sold as seeds, with 1 measly additional HB fert per growth tick), then your total revenue goes up to 120,816g for 30 days, minus 5,550g for fertilizer, or 115,266g...

but then you gotta keep on top of your rice, you see 😜

In my calculations, it was always better to use HB fertilizer that you already have on crops that already need it than to sell the fertilizer directly, usually by a factor of 3-5 times increase vs. direct sell. It's not true that most of the value gets eaten up by the cost.

However, that's not necessarily to say that you should purposefully create a layout that needs more fertilizer.

That rice math really comes back to the fact that there are multiple crops that are more gold per tile per growth tick than apples are, with or without HB. A layout with all beans/bok choy/potato/tomato/rice (with some onion or carrot in there to round out the weedblock pair) will make you more gold in the same amount of growth ticks as a 9-apple farm, and with less tending labor compared to the apples (but more replanting labor)

[eternal ruin]

Have food, shall review and respond shortly~

Also using the planner on the side to potentially compare numbers. I don't know if you're tweaking settings or similar, but I'm getting odd numbers because of it.

[neat vortex]

Diamond layout (4 apples with supporting weed/water/harvest boost modules) clocks in at 134,921g over 30 days (averaged) after processing, minus 9 fertilizer per day, for a net revenue of 133,571g after processing:
https://palia-garden-planner.vercel.app/?layout=v0.4_D-111-111-111_CR-R.HBkOPT.HPOBkR-AAAAAAAAA-RPO.HBkT.HBkOPR-AAAAAAAAA-RPTBkO.HBkTPR-AAAAAAAAA-RPOBkT.HBkO.HPR-AAAAAAAAA-RBkOPT.HPOBkR.H_L25Cr0.AP-OP-RS-TP-PS-BkS

Bean diamond comes in at 168,009k after processing for 30 days (averaged), minus 29 fertilizer, net 163,659g
https://palia-garden-planner.vercel.app/?layout=v0.4_D-111-111-111_CR-R.HBkO.HPT.HPO.HBkR-BkPTBtBtOBtBtBk-R.HBkT.HPO.HPT.HBkR.H-Bk.HBtBtT.HBtBtPO.HBk.H-RBkT.HPO.HPT.HBkR-Bk.HO.HPBtBtT.HBtBtBk.H-R.HBkT.HPO.HPT.HBkR.H-BkBtBtOBtBtTPBk-RBkO.HPT.HPO.HBkR.H_L25Cr0.BkS-OP-TP-PS-BtS-RS

(I say "averaged" because the minimum full cycle for these layouts is 60 days; otherwise harvests get cut off, so I took those numbers divided by 2 to make 30 days, in order to compare apples to apples... so to speak.)

[neat vortex]

I'm setting the planner to level 25, starred seeds, plus the typical recommended crop processing algorithm (seeds for beans/bok choy/potatoes and everything that can only be seeded, jar for everything else).

Honestly I should have preemptively set the harvest days to 180, but I was halfway through before I thought to do that

[eternal ruin]

So I don't use jamming prices because basically any leftover material is going to get seeded or jammed 99 times out of 100, and usually the result is about 1.5 value value. Makes it easier to compare ups and downs at the final go for me.

9 trees at 4096 each is 36864 (accordingly to my excel chart). The Planner is showing me 37440.
I have 16 apples a harvest, which should be 64 applies total per tree. x9 should be 576 apples total. Planner shows 486 applies total, which is 54 apples per tree, at 12 per harvest??? It does this weird -18 applies thing at the end of the cycle, which I don't know if it's somehow meant for 'reseeding' math or something, but it's annoying. XD The only reason it's showering a higher value to mine is half the apples are star quality, making up for the deficit.

Okay so it is possible to set some other things. I never found those controls apart from the level part, which is annoying.
and the days part.

So part of our math variables here is because of extra steps being included. That answers a bit.

[neat vortex]

That 1.5x is... a very, very loose approximation. Roughly true for preserves, yes (...with exceptions, most notably pumpkins 😒 ) but bok choy nearly doubles in a seed maker, and beans almost quadruple. Potatoes also skew high as seeds; I think they're close to double? 1.8x or something like that.

So, since you're 99% of the time processing your crops after subtracting stuff to make replanting seeds, it only makes sense to me to compare processed values.

(tbh I should probably rejigger my revenue per tile per tick spreadsheet to account for replanting costs... but it gets a little hinky when you start figuring in the random bonus seeds you get from harvesting and seeding stuff.)

[eternal ruin]

I did say usually. XD And it's because of those varying factors I *don't use them in the basic math, cause you'll generally take the best approach from there.

It makes sense to process and see results after replanting if you're looking at the final value, yes, but if you're trying to compare basic maths to see where your profit kicks in, you can do it before processing too. Given I was also giving numbers to ARcanine Girl and the brain was breaking, I didn't want to break it harder. >_>

It's simple: if you get random bonus seeds, they're a perk. It's always gonna throw off math so don't worry about that unless you really want to math in what it's 'worth.' Is there actually a flat formula or a scaling formula for free seed chance?

[neat vortex]

Yes, somewhere

I'd have to go digging for it, but it's basically a fixed drop chance from harvesting from most crops (except trees and bushes)

[eternal ruin]

And if you do want that math, percentage it off how many crop it takes to create the seed (and divide based on how many seeds are produced).

So if it's 10% chance, and we're talking apple seed, 10 apples to 1 seed is 640, then it's 10% of that (or the value of that single seed which is 700). So you gained 64 or 70 gp worth of apple hassle.

[neat vortex]

Is that in unstarred numbers?

[eternal ruin]

yes.

I tend to stick to the basic numbers because anything getting starred or boosted or whatnot is always going to improve your numbers. The only downside to star is a different topic I'll save for another day.

[neat vortex]

Because after a certain point you no longer get unstarred stuff. Like by level 10 it's 45% before the 25% from starred seeds.

[eternal ruin]

You can still figure out the best crop values and such off the nonstarred, so it saves some headache for the less mathematically crunchy.

Stars give me a special kind of headache that makes me wish our safe storage was considerably larger.

[neat vortex]

My ideal situation would be the ability to divide my storage into safe and general storage like partitioning a hard drive.

Maybe only be able to change it once a week, like with Jel's mirror XD

[eternal ruin]

Maybe so!

I'm gonna scroll back to the actual math debate we were having before other distractions. XD

[golden yacht]

Hey friends, I apologize if this has been covered somewhere previously (I did a quick search but didn't see anything). I know that every irl hour = one 24 hour day in the game, but is (and if so how is) gardening affected whether I'm either in or out of the game? So for example, if I plant tomatoes and get out of the game for 3+ hours, are they ready to harvest when I get back in or does the "grow clock" stop and only run while I'm actually in the game? Or perhaps it's more complex that just that, like perhaps the hours/days count but the final day to harvest doesn't occur until I'm in the game when the in game clock rolls past 06:00.

[eternal ruin]

as I understand it, 2 cycles will pass when you're offline: the one you were approaching before you signed off, and one extra after that. Then it won't grow further until you get back online.

[neat vortex]

Yeah, it finishes your current cycle and starts the next when you log in (as long as you're offline for the changeover)

[golden yacht]

That's not too bad, so as long as I hop on at least ever 2 hours then I should be able to maximize my gardening.

[eternal ruin]

9 apple trees. Raw unstarred values: 4096x9 over 30 days: 36,864
each new tree costs 640 (10 applies) so x9 replant costs -5,760
Net profit: 31,104. requires weeding and watering.

Add harvest+ to the trees. it costs 1350 gp total per tree over 30 days (-12,150)
Tree profit changes to 55,296 (50% boost)
Still have to pay for new seeds: -5760
Net profit: 37,386 (20% increase). requires weeding, watering, and adding harvest+ 270 times (which can be done all at once, but still 270 clicks).

Swap middle tree out for 8 rice, (ignore middle It adds a tiny bit more but keeping it simple). Lose 4096 from nonharvest version. the rice are 432 per harvest and can be picked 10 times (4320).
8 trees: 32768. 8 rice: 4320. replant costs: -5120 and -540 (-5660)
plant synergy means 4 trees and all the rice get harvest+ already.
16384x1.5: 24576. 4320x1.5: 6480. 4 regular trees: 16384
net profit: 41780 (34% increase involving no fertilizer). requires weeding and watering. We also know that even before the harvest+ bit, we had slightly more value swapping the 1 tree in. You have to harvest and replant rice 80 times over 30 sessions (10 every 3 sessions)

If you apply harvest+ to the 4 remaining trees, it'll cost -5400, but changes the math this way:
Net profit: 44572 (43% increase from the base). weeding, watering, 80 rice plucks, and 120 clicks to apply fertilizer.

....gaaaah this took forever. @_@

My moral of story: replanting some rice is infinitely less tedious than slapping harvest fertilizer over things, gives more net gain overall, and you can STILL get the extra profit of selling the fertilizer anyways, maximizing laziness. XD If you don't mind applying it, then yes, all the more profits to you, but you can gain better profit ratios doing the other steps before using the fertilizer.

Otherwise, only other thing bring reminds me is that if you switch to smaller crops, the amount of clicks increases significantly in regards to fertilizer, unless there's a secret technique I don't know about for mass applying.

[golden yacht]

Another question, after a certain gardening level (I'm currently at 52), does it no longer matter whether I plant regular or star quality crops to result in 100% (or at least the same as "best chance" either way) star quality produce? So like if that's true, then it might make more sense financially to simply buy all of my seeds for planting which are not star quality and sell/process all of my star quality produce.

[eternal ruin]

I think some of the math is shown in the garden planner thingy, but You definitely have high odds of star quality at the very least. I want to say it's 50ish% at that point. Don't hard quote me though. I think it's 100% with star quality and 50ish% regular. You can either then use quality+ fertilizer on the regulars if you want or something like that.

[neat vortex]

the initial setup is more tedious, but I find it less stressful to keep them topped up as (unlike apples) they won't come anywhere close to running out of fertilizer before they become harvestable

[eternal ruin]

It would seem you have all the powah.

Depending on what the actual exchange on side prices are it might still be more cost effective to make your own seeds, but you certainly won't lose as much buying regular.

[neat vortex]

I think it still works out to be cheaper to make your seeds, at least on a per-seed cost basis. (The reckoning gets a little more complicated for crops where you have to set aside a separate seed collector/run the risk of having it sit idle after processing just a few sets of seeds.)

For me, I'm a homebody and dislike having to remember to go buy things/being caught flatfooted and having to make an unplanned detour to town in the middle of a task. So that's my ultimate reasoning for continuing to make my seeds. lol

[eternal ruin]

at least seeds can be planted even if you overseed!

[neat vortex]

(It's also the reason I firmly avoid layouts that use weedblock and water retain fertilizers)

[eternal ruin]

water retain can be useful for when you're logging off to kinda cover for those few times you're not around, but weedblock is kinda limited, aye. At least they're cheaper.

[neat vortex]

All of my layouts are 100% weed/water and 100% HB (albeit with HB fertilizer), so there's generally nothing to cover, lol

[eternal ruin]

Just to check there is no trick to applying fertilizer more easily or quckly, right? XD

[rugged fable]

how is this possible

[neat vortex]

It's not, unless there's shenanigans happening

[rugged fable]

ok thats what i thought LMAO

[eternal ruin]

Is that a screenshot you found elsewhere or are you actually on that lot?

[south night]

our friend is on that lot and was really amazed with the fish, but then we saw the garden

[neat vortex]

Yeah, there is and has always been a hard purchase limit of 9 soil plots (3x3 tiles, so a total of 81 garden tiles) per account, and they aren't transferrable

[eternal ruin]

If it's just a visual glitch and they're not all useable crops, I don't mind that creativity. But if they can actually get past the 9 plots I am annoyed. XD

[rugged fable]

if u wanna check it out

[south night]

they very much seem like very useable crops which im kind of baffled lol

[eternal ruin]

and it's at the top of my house list currently. XD convenient.

[neat vortex]

...huh. They finally implemented the thing they had mentioned too early (being able to mouseover items to see what they are)

[eternal ruin]

There's definitely weirdness going on. I'm looking at a 4x space on the plot. They must have found a way to shift crops planted from the actual plots. But I don't think the actual gardne plot is beneath any of these spots. It's just the visuals the plants provide.

[dreamy harbor]

i JUST came here to ask this LOL took a screenshot too

[south night]

LMFAOOOO

[dreamy harbor]

also, the giant sprinklers ???

nvm they bamboozled me LOL its decor

[eternal ruin]

found a weed. gasp

[neat vortex]

Yeah I call shenanigans on this

[eternal ruin]

two weeds!

[rugged fable]

LMAOOO he was showing us how cool the arched aquarium thing and then he went below and I was like "wait a minute go look at the plots"

[neat vortex]

This is a very cool build, conceptually, but the garden plots are fishy in the extreme. I don't know of any legitimate housing glitch that can do this, and they are varied enough that they seem to be functional

[eternal ruin]

They're full grown, but that doesn't guarantee they pick up. What is odd is they're mostly watered: usually a complete crop will go dry (but be unharmed). If they were still actually growing in theory they would have.

But if there is no known glitch for this, that is certainly suspect in itself. >_> Guess it depends if they're actually viable.

[south night]

someone in decor said theyre using unreleased color tints, its def not a glitch LOLLL

[eternal ruin]

So several things broken.

They're the One.

https://tenor.com/view/neo-the-matrix-bruh-taking-glassess-off-matrix-gif-5931061463820897890

I also just got loaded into their world again doing tours and fell through the ground. XD

[rugged fable]

need a mod to come into this channel and insta go to their plot and ban them and then come back here and let us know so I can feel cool

[eternal ruin]

I do not know the mod summoning ritual: Does it involve veggie chili?

[neat vortex]

You can report cheating - there's a hotkey/command for it (flag) on the lower right of the interface

[rugged fable]

ye i did i just think itd be funny if a mod was lurking in the channel and just hammer him for us to see LMAO

[eternal ruin]

If the crops aren't actually viable It might still just fall under creativeness. I imagine a lot of folks would like extra visual crops. Or a decor farm aside from actual farm.

[neat vortex]

lol the Discord mods are only for the Discord; they aren't related to the team that handles in-game reports.

[eternal ruin]

Ahh. fair enough there!
More veggie chili for me.

[golden yacht]

Not except the Windows macro that I created to left-click my mouse 99 times really fast!

[golden yacht]

https://palia-garden-planner.vercel.app/?layout=v0.2_DIM-111-111-111_CROPS-P.HBkRTCWRBkP-PBkRTCWRBkP-PBkR.HpTCWRBkP-WBkTPCRTBkW-WBkTPCRTBkW-WBkTPCRTBkW-RBkPWCTP.HpBkR.H-RBkPWCTP.HpBkR.H-RBkPWCTP.HpBkR.H

[eternal ruin]

...Windows has that as a feature!? O_O making macros I mean?

[golden yacht]

No, I use a free app called AutoHotKey. It's VERY useful!!! For example, say you needed to do multiple tasks in certain order at certain timed intervals - you just script it (it's got a tool called window spy to help you dee what's happening, screen positions, etc.), and then set it to a hot key and BAM!

[neat vortex]

That's Lucas Dylan's layout, ain't it?

[golden yacht]

Let's also assume for arguments sake that in order to remain active on a server and not be kicked for inactivity, I suppose that you could say create a macro to momentarily press the w and s keys every few minutes.

[golden yacht]

I believe so, I got it from in here.

[proven scaffold]

I’m trying to make this pumpkin self sufficient. Ik 2x2 need more than one of a crop to gain the affect but does it need to be the same type?

[golden yacht]

It's SUPER easy once planted initially. You just harvest one crop at a time and then hoe, replant and water as necessary and then move onto the next crop. This is my crafter setup

[neat vortex]

Let's not get too wild, now... have you seen that graph from the blog post S6 put up about their software architecture? Keeping the servers "alive" for too long is basically torturing them with memory leaks 🤣

That AFK timeout has a FUNCTION lmao

[neat vortex]

I do really like that layout, though the mandatory bought fertilizer makes it Not For Ren (but many people have no problem with it)

[golden yacht]

Oh for sure, I mean I personally would never dream of doing that... I'm just saying

[neat vortex]

You'd never dream of rubberbanding your controller stick, either, I'm sure

[golden yacht]

Hey now, you're talking to a guy who use to suction cup the original Atari joystick rubber pieces onto his forhead for laughs...

[eternal ruin]

using it to fertilize is probably fine. anti-afk is probably less fine.

[neat vortex]

(but for real, be careful with "auto" anything, as automating gameplay is against ToS; macros fall into iffy territory. It's one thing if it's saving you RSIs from 99 clicks of fertilizer; that's an accessibility issue, if you ask me. But other things definitely toe the line.)

That's not necessarily aimed directly at present company, but I felt it needed to be said aloud for posterity/anybody new to games who might not have that context.

[golden yacht]

True, I don't want to adversely affect the servers and other players. That's why I asked about growing times. I'm retired so I can easily hop on every few hours. Especially while I'm on other games and such.

Besides, that kind of thing is fun for geeks to think about, but it really has no practical purpose once you reach $1,000,000

[neat vortex]

And the money really stacks up quick once you run through all the initial one-time purchases

[golden yacht]

Exactly right, not only is it bad for the servers and probably against some "rules", but it greatly reduces the actual fun of playing the game. I admin for other games and although you can choose to not use GOD mode and spawn whatever you want, it totally destroys ALL fun in playing the game! Just ask the person who has everything that they could ever want - they're bored to death...

[neat vortex]

lol yep. I was reading a thing about the function of games, and one of them was that they are a set of rules that artificially restrict your choices to create a challenge (iirc, might be paraphrasing that badly)

[golden yacht]

Well yeah, I mean if it's not challenging then it's not fun. Everyone doesn't necessarily deserve a trophy, otherwise they're pointless to those who work hard to actually earn them by becoming great.

[neat vortex]

I mean, that's not what motivates me in games lol

[eternal ruin]

making jam is your jam.

[neat vortex]

Investigating systems is a big one (I want to know everything!), and another is social interaction/being able to meet new people without prearranging anything.

(Single player and even co-op games don't tend to hold my attention; they're not as interesting to me, socially speaking)

(This is a little hilarious if you know that I'm an firm introvert who gets overstimulated pretty easily, but, well. In the online world you can always just bail, and then you are instantly home and with space to yourself :P)

[golden yacht]

Yeah, as far as I know of, it's the closest (easiest) that you can come to getting 100% water ret & weed prev. I usually buy 500 hydrate fert at Zeki's and use a single glow worm farm loaded up with bok choy for a few days to generate my harvest boost fert.

[neat vortex]

...eh? There are plenty of layouts with are 100% weed/water with zero bought fertilizer

[golden yacht]

Yeah?

[neat vortex]

Sure, you can even do it on a single soil plot

https://palia-garden-planner.vercel.app/?layout=v0.2_DIM-1_CROPS-RBkPTOTPBkR

[golden yacht]

As you can tell, I min/max'd all of the produce values down to profit per minute, and I just sell everything straight out except for pickled tomatoes and carrot seeds.

[neat vortex]

What makes Lucas Dylan's layout clever is that it's very close to 100% weed/water/harvest boost while still having a very simple pattern and accommodating cash crops well

But the bullseye does it with zero water retain fertilizer (original concept layout by Khan the Windseeker) - the pattern just throws some people
https://palia-garden-planner.vercel.app/?layout=v0.2_DIM-111-111-111_CROPS-P.HTOBkRCrOCrP-BkPTRCrRTOBk-OBkP.HCrRTPCrO-TRBkPCrOBkRT-RCrRPTBkRCrR-TRBkOCrPBkRT-OCrPTRCrP.HBkO-BkOTRCrRTPBk-PCrOCrRBkOTP.H

(there are multiple variations of it, too, some more minmaxed than others; this is just the one I happen to have bookmarked)

[neat vortex]

All you process is the tomatoes? (and carrots as seeds?)

[golden yacht]

True, carrots, tomatoes and potatoes are the winners.

[neat vortex]

Where does pickled carrots fall?

[golden yacht]

It's easy to keep straight as long as you strictly harvest one crop at a time.

[neat vortex]

Oh, there it is

[golden yacht]

At first, tomato seeds appeared to be a clear winner, until I got the formulas correct to account for the weird input/output ratio

Those are all star quality values of course.

[neat vortex]

Wait, hang on, how are you reckoning 2.2g per minute for carrot seeds? 4 carrot seeds per carrot at 10g each is 40g, or only 6g more than selling the carrots straight (which has a crafting time of 0 minutes of course), so in 18 minutes you add 6g, isn't that 0.33g/min?

Because the base value of the carrot was already there; it isn't created by the processing time

Meanwhile, pickled carrots are 51g, so 17g value added over 27 minutes, or .63g/minute... I think? 🤔

though tbh value added per time is a bit of an illusion if you can't keep your crafters running without stopping; most of us don't log enough playtime to manage that (especially not for carrots, which are lightning-fast, so they usually sit idle a lot).

[golden yacht]

You may be right. tbh, I've edited that thing several times to the point that I forgot my own name...

Oh, it's because 1 carrot yields 4 bags of seed in less time.

Whereas pickled stuff is a 1:1 ratio and takes longer.

[neat vortex]

Yes, but you're dividing the total output by the time

but the initial value of the carrot was already there pre-processing; you could instantly get 34g per carrot if you just dump them straight in the bin

So either you take 18 minutes to get 6 gold or you take 27 minutes to get 17 gold (more than what you had before in raw-carrot form)

[eternal ruin]

now i'm pulling my sheet back out to see my numbers. XD

[golden yacht]

Right, that's one of the things that I toyed with in the garden layout generator - is profit to processing time. Somehow I found that tomatoes the carrots were the two best options to process. Mainly because they had the quickest processing times.

[eternal ruin]

To be fair, carrots and tomatos do rate high in the net gain per tile math. They're not the highest, but they're still pretty high (particularly tomato).

[golden yacht]

I had to (and I simply guessed - I'm no genius) set 60 minutes to the produce that I planned to sell outright. It may very well be wrong.

[neat vortex]

60 minutes?

[golden yacht]

Basically my goal was 1) easy garden maintenance, 2) simplest processing effort & time, and 3) most & quickest profit turnaround.

[golden yacht]

Ikr, it seemed weird to me to at first, but otherwise those numbers were ridiculously high.

[neat vortex]

I mean. The "processing time" for an unprocessed crop is... ...?

[golden yacht]

I really enjoy and appreciate you guys discussing this with me, hopefully you enjoy doing so. I certainly don't mean to stress anyone.

[neat vortex]

If you set it to 60 minutes that implies that you set down a crate of raw carrots somewhere, tell it "sit, stay," and then come back in an hour to finish toting it to the bin, no? in which time it has gained exactly 0 value.

[eternal ruin]

I imagine we're not stressed. Should be good. XD

[golden yacht]

Right

[eternal ruin]

processors will work even when offline, so if you don't have an immediate need for it, tis handy to process it in some fashion. It's not always time efficient, but if you don't need it, it's extra gp gain while you're growing more stuff.

actually, I should recheck a math on a carrot...

[golden yacht]

So then if we simply sell everything immediately after harvesting, then it would look like this?

[neat vortex]

The crafting time is, unfortunately, 0

[golden yacht]

I mean it's obvious that processing produce yields higher profits, but at a cost of time (which really doesn't matter to me). So which is actually better, sell or process?

[eternal ruin]

crafting time for regular crops is basically how long it takes to grow the thing, so it's hours. XD but you have to start from somewhere.

[neat vortex]

Yes, the grow time is the part that generates that initial 34g of value per carrot

So it's 34g per 3 growth ticks

(on one tile, which is important because we only get 81 tiles to work with)

(I like to keep it to growth ticks, because it isn't 1:1 with playtime due to 20 minutes of active playtime netting you 2 growth ticks if you time it right)

[eternal ruin]

True, but you still have to wait the time, even if you're not playing.

[neat vortex]

True

[eternal ruin]

handy for multi-tasking though!

[neat vortex]

Yes - that's gardening's real power, is that it accumulates value while you are off doing other things (including active play that generates gold, like cooking parties, hunting, fishing, etc.)

So even though the per-hour may be slow, the passive nature of it means it doesn't preclude you from doing other things the way that active labor activities do

[golden yacht]

So if you were aiming for merely the most profit, then plant 81 potato plants and then check them every single growth tick (30 minutes irl), to weed and water, and then sell them straight out?

[neat vortex]

Let me just ask... what do you mean by "profit"?

[golden yacht]

Exactly, it's the only passive income stream in the game, right?

[neat vortex]

because that term to me means revenue minus costs (or inputs), and I think that might not be how you're using it...

[golden yacht]

You're right, I mean gold once sold.

[neat vortex]

There are some other options from things like processing forageables/meat in the glow worm farm, or processing wood and ore and stuff into materials. The materials crafting doesn't run nearly as long unattended as gardening does, though, and obviously requires active play to accumulate.

[neat vortex]

Okay, revenue then

[eternal ruin]

81 potatoes will get you quite a bit, but you could augment the profit mixing it with another honestly.

[golden yacht]

I wanted to get to 1,000,000 as quickly as possible by just farming alone.

[eternal ruin]

if you're wanting it with minimal effort, the earlier thing with the weed/hydrate/harvest boost is probably the easiest method. After that's it's the waiting game (and periodically blipping on to reset and/or replant/grow.

but it will take awhile regardless.

anything else you add on processing wise makes that faster, but isn't strictly gardening alone.

[neat vortex]

Right now, if you're willing to put in active work to tending your garden (that's the tradeoff), and you prefer to sell your stuff unprocessed (which imo is leaving gold on the table), then it's probably bok choy, harvest boosted with rice. Beans unfortunately gain most of their value through processing, and aren't that great sold raw.

[golden yacht]

True, I was using the profit tracker site at first to see which crafter generated optimal revenue for each crop, but that got to complicated, so I simplified it by just focusing on one or two crops and processed them according to their highest revenue.

[neat vortex]

Lemme check, I have a spreadsheet for this...

[eternal ruin]

cooking generally gives minimal returns UNLESS you star a recipe or you do group cooking. The maw recipe is a fluke in that you're taking an incredibly expensive fish and getting a fraction of it from cooking, but it requires catching an incredibly expensive fish.

[neat vortex]

Yes, and then you have 20 people bring 5 maws XD

and then another 10 people show up to chop whatever else and don't bring any fish at all (that time)

[eternal ruin]

In regards to the carrot example: the seed collector is fastest processor, but the preserve jar gets you better results via ratio (but you still in theory want to seed some carrots for replanting to save some money). You can then use a worm farm on the preserve carrot to squeeze another 20ish gold by selling the worms AND fertilizer, but technically you could use the fertilizer to augment the crops... but I think on carrots you actually lose money, so not an ideal logic.

[neat vortex]

In order, for selling raw crops only, it's bok choy, tomato, cotton (lol), potato, rice (lettuce doesn't fully exist yet)

[eternal ruin]

This assumes that at some point, you go to bed and let the processors like preserves and worm farms catch up as you sleep.

[golden yacht]

I'm NOT a joiner, and I want to stick with something that is consistent and guaranteed (not dependent upon chance like finding legendary stones while mining).

[neat vortex]

Yeah, I hear that; that's my preferred approach, too

[eternal ruin]

bok choy feels off on that chart. Granted if you have time to seed it, I think it does rate pretty high. >_>

[golden yacht]

I mean if I could consistently find platinum ore to make bars and then a few rubys once in a while, well then...

[eternal ruin]

most people that mine cash flow rate off the general farming and the variable is the plat ore. XD You're also working off gemstone drops.

[neat vortex]

bok choy goes from being worth 45g raw to being worth 88g as seeds, it's wild - especially since it grows so fast

[eternal ruin]

takes a bit over an hour per bok choy, but this is true.

[neat vortex]

But you can run into a processing bottleneck if you get too many growth ticks of bok choy per RL day

so it's powerful, but limited in how far you can deploy it, practically speaking

[eternal ruin]

I think rice still beats bok choy based on other variables, but as far as spreading the love around still an approach. Especially since it's a weeding crop so extra use.

[neat vortex]

It has a ceiling, in essence, past which planting more or getting more growth ticks will not appreciably increase your revenue (because you won't be able to process it all, so it won't meet its potential)

[eternal ruin]

that's part of where you get more business machine writs for more processing! :D

[neat vortex]

Rice is very good in multiple respects. It's a harvest boost crop, and it's also used in both sushi and sashimi parties. It has multiple uses in focus foods as well.

lol but crafter licenses have a limit of 30...

There comes a point at which even 30 seedmakers won't keep up with a garden full of bok choy

[golden yacht]

Yeah, but the processing time is nuts! Wheat on the other hand is much better for seeds, yes?

[eternal ruin]

Indeed. bok choy has a low base value, but seeding basically doubles it. That said, rice is about 1.5 times more valuable (via faster growth), and when seeded comes out slightly higher higher in overall values compared to the seeded bok choy. It's about twice as fast to process.

Basically the values are in different spots of their processes but they're still pretty close in final profits.

[neat vortex]

Keep in mind also that all seed recipes that produce 4 seeds will jam after 16 items have been processed

[eternal ruin]

Although if you are gonna get cooking involved, you can slap bokchoy into kimchi and cook it and see if you can star it..... oh crap I needed to test tha recipe and I think I just sold those brb!

[neat vortex]

So wheat has a max unattended runtime of 11 hours, while for bok choy it's 19 (long enough to go to bed, go to work, and come home to empty the bins)

[abstract barn]

It doesng matter what you feed the glow worm farm, glow worms are 25g when sold?

[eternal ruin]

Clean out your machines regularly. XD

it does matter technically, but essentially very cheap items exploit the logic process and give you a little extra profit.

[neat vortex]

Yes, glow worms are 25g each and it's minimum 1 glow worm per item (and otherwise scales up with item sell value)

9g mushroom -> 25g glow worm + 15g in fertilizer is pretty nice XD

[eternal ruin]

I sold my testing ingredients. drat. ;_;

[golden yacht]

Oh man, that reminds me, I need to just sell my 1,000's of glow worms...

[neat vortex]

31g per crafter slot hour is quite respectable

[neat vortex]

do you have the dish sell value formula to hand? though the LNY ingredients behave very oddly; like pumpkins, they count 0 toward the dish sell value when chopped.

[abstract barn]

Yes, I was reading people saying they're feeding their high quality/high gold crops into the gwf

[golden yacht]

So true, precisely why you need all iron storage to hold 10,000 items. Can you say stockpile?

[abstract barn]

And was like what whyyyyy

[neat vortex]

tbh the high-value stuff doesn't gain nearly as much in value as the cheap stuff does, and because it jams relatively fast, it's not great for passive income even when it's as good as it gets

[eternal ruin]

per item so long as you sell an item of the right value, you will almost ALWAYS earn roughly 20 gp on average per item, regardless of if expensive or cheap. So it's technically more efficient to use cheap items. But if you want any and all profit anything works.

[neat vortex]

But what it IS good for is when you're ripping through glow worms or fertilizer and need to produce a lot per hour

[abstract barn]

Yeah it seemed like a loss of profit to me but im not a math brain i just go off vibes

[neat vortex]

Some items lose gold in a glow worm farm 😬 because of how the breakpoints and rounding fall

[abstract barn]

Oh wow yeah I wouldnt have guessed

[eternal ruin]

the lost profit is traded at speed time. Basically same question of 'Do you need the gold now, or can it wait?' if it can wait, process it.

[neat vortex]

(pickled spicy peppers are one such example)

[abstract barn]

Gotcha, ty for this

[eternal ruin]

This is why I wanted to test the kimchi fried rice recipe. From what i can gather it's not bugged, but since not everything is up to date I wanted to confirm it.

[neat vortex]

After a point, you do have to consider whether the tradeoff of keeping your crafter slots busy with something that's earning you 15g/hr (at least until it jams after a few hours, at which point it of course earns 0g/hr until you empty it) is worth it, if you have other things in the queue to be processed that could gain more value in a machine

[abstract barn]

So what im hearing is that you can feed jams/pickles to gwf and gain a profit from the worms/fertilizer over just selling pickles jams (except for something like pickled spicy pepper

[eternal ruin]

Generally yes, you can.

[neat vortex]

The chopped green onion value gets left out, unfortunately, and beyond that it's subject to the same math as all other solo cooking :(

[eternal ruin]

the math is fine, but if the onion is getting screwed over that is bad. :/ Hmm...

[neat vortex]

Since you're starting with starred kimchi and starred rice and bought egg and oil.... oof

[eternal ruin]

I'm not started with starred, but that is a reason why I dislike the star quality math.

[neat vortex]

Your days of cooking with unstarred anything are, unfortunately, numbered

literally numbered, counted in tile-growth ticks

[eternal ruin]

I know!!!!!!!! D:

It's dumb, but technically it's logistical. It's only a loss if I mark it purely about it being starred. >_> I still get the unstarred value if nothing else, and if lucky it keeps its star value.

(but it's still so dumb)

Minus the green onion bug.

[abstract barn]

Would you prefer to cook non sq items

[eternal ruin]

Ideally you always should, because using star ingredients uses backwards logic currently: their non-star value is used to determine dish value. meaning unless you star the recipe, you lose profit using star ingredients.

[abstract barn]

Oh man thats crazy

[eternal ruin]

yup so basically cooking has a profit ceiling, and star ingredients smash nose-first into it.

they improve the odds of making a star recipe, but you still lose out, at least in solo. group cooking is probably still mostly safe.

[abstract barn]

Oof, heard as a solo player.. look for cooking party 🥳

[eternal ruin]

Nevah!

I work too much to want to do more work in that way currently XD I take satisfaction in self accomplishment too. Helping out is fine, but sometimes you want to sit back with a nice bowl, mix some batter, and then stare at the oven as it counts down and tries to burn my meat.

[abstract barn]

😅👉👉

[eternal ruin]

Also technically one of the ways you test out a beta game: see where the limits are, look for quirks, and question if something is intentional.

[abstract barn]

Is to play solo

[eternal ruin]

Well you won't always be in a party. If you like groups that is fine and dandy, but if you're afraid of being solo because everything becomes impossible, that can have a negative impact too.

it doesn't have to be better or the same as group stuff, but it should at least be plausible.

[abstract barn]

I see i see

[eternal ruin]

and now I shall proceed to terrify this mantis with this spudding potato!

[abstract barn]

😅🥳

[neat vortex]

group cooking is almost always profitable even over and above what you get from solo processing (seeds/preserves/worms), with some notable exceptions being the bean role for EVERY bean recipe except bean burgers. I've taken to calling them "bean donors" because truly we are asking them to bring over 400g per round in could-have-been-bean-seeds so we can make tofu

[eternal ruin]

Being Tof on Tofu!

That being said, so long as you're at least making use of things like crop synergy, even if you aren't using the cashiest of crops, I think the final difference in the big numbers is only in the margin of a few thousand (going from absolute lowest to highest games). Since you kinda have a mix by default, that means the margin is smaller to boot, so long as you're processing smartly.

[neat vortex]

Yepyep, that sounds about right to me

Though you can stack the deck a bit by concentrating on cash crops instead of utility crops

But tbh I think consistency and just keeping things rolling is a very big factor, bigger than many people realize

Folks tend to go "I need gold immediately!" but gardening doesn't really work that way; it works as a steady flow that adds up gradually, instead of big numbers at irregular intervals.

[eternal ruin]

indeedy.

Fairly solid support to fishing though if it doesn't drive you nuts though! Worm it, sell/use the fertilizer, fish with the worms!

[neat vortex]

lol yeah, nice recycling loop. You do end up with net positive glow worms from glow worm fish, and some even gain value in the process (max of +20g per grilled fish item, mostly less, some in the negatives...)

[eternal ruin]

Even if you make a minor negative somewhere, teh value of new fish fished up helps.

[neat vortex]

Oh yeah, always

1000% always better to fish with your glow worms than straight sell them, even just catching common fish

(...well. technically minimum 380%, but you know.)

[eternal ruin]

True, but you can only fish so many fish at a time in a certain time, and your ammo pouch is getting might full, and squirmy, and damp.

Surely Zeki will be happy to buy all those extra wigglers from you? :D
(by which I mean regular worms. But if you're not fishing fast enough with the glow ones you can do that too).

[neat vortex]

lol yeah, there's no way I could spend the time to fish with all of the glow worms I produce

I can barely make it through a stack in an evening, and that's if I try really hard (and then I'm not doing any more fishing for a day or two, lmao... and meanwhile the glow worms keep eating)

[south night]

so bean burger is profitable for the person bringing beans correct? just making sure

[neat vortex]

Correct. It yields 117% more gold than turning your beans into seeds to sell. This is quite low improvement over opportunity cost for a profit party role*, and it basically only manages to scrape up even that much because the recipe requires 3 vinegar.

However, if you want to process your beans quickly, it is basically the only option to improve their value beyond what seeding them will accomplish. (Veggie chili and soon tofu both make less money than seeding your beans.)

* for comparison, fruit froster at a cake party - the most expensive role - yields a +354% improvement over jamming your apples

[south night]

ok cool, i just did a 100 with my 300 beans and was wondering if it was better than cake parties. i love cake parties but whenever i joined a cake party there was always a fruit froster using berries and i had to play detective on who it was >.>

[neat vortex]

XD

Yeah the sneaky blueberries like to pop in when people don't understand how the ingredient selector prioritizes things

(starred first, bags first, cheapest first)

that "cheapest first" will bite you in the butt with starred ogopuu meat at a fish dish party

[neat vortex]

"better" is kind of subjective - the numbers don't have the whole story; for example, fun and novelty are also part of the equation

If you look at it in terms of gold per tile per growth tick - as is relevant when you only have so many garden plot tiles to deploy, and only so many growth ticks in a week to progress them - then both apples at cake parties and blueberries at cake parties beat beans at burger parties.

But tomato and onion at bean burger parties beat both fruits. (Tomato and onion at epic (or, gosh, legendary) poke parties are, of course, leagues better, but those are limited by how many fishers a community has/can sustain. Cake parties are only rate-limited by the fruit and maybe how many people are out picking sweet leaf.)

[mystic skiff]

I'm chugging everything in the preserve

https://palia-garden-planner.vercel.app/?layout=v0.4_D-111-111-111_CR-Cb.HP.HP.HCb.HCb.HCb.HP.HCb.HCb.H-Cb.HCb.HCb.HCb.HP.HCb.HCb.HP.HCb.H-P.HP.HCb.HCb.HCb.HCb.HCb.HCb.HP.H-P.HCb.HP.HCb.HCb.HP.HCb.HCb.HP.H-Cb.HCb.HCb.HCb.HCb.HCb.HCb.HP.HCb.H-P.HCb.HP.HP.HCb.HCb.HP.HCb.HCb.H-P.HCb.HCb.HP.HCb.HCb.HCb.HCb.HP.H-Cb.HP.HCb.HCb.HCb.HCb.HP.HCb.HP.H-Cb.HCb.HP.HCb.HCb.HP.HP.HCb.HCb.H_L50Cr0.Cb.P-CbP20-PP10-T.P-TP

[neat vortex]

Why cabbage?

[mystic skiff]

Ajjaq sheet showed they're ok per tile and they process without clogging or blocking my view like apples. 😂

[tame flicker]

i was just looking for garden layouts, that looks amazing

[neat vortex]

Have you considered.... tomatoes?
https://palia-garden-planner.vercel.app/?layout=v0.4_D-111-111-111_CR-T.HP.HP.HT.HT.HT.HP.HT.HT.H-T.HT.HT.HT.HP.HT.HT.HP.HT.H-P.HP.HT.HT.HT.HT.HT.HT.HP.H-P.HT.HP.HT.HT.HP.HT.HT.HP.H-T.HT.HT.HT.HT.HT.HT.HP.HT.H-P.HT.HP.HP.HT.HT.HP.HT.HT.H-P.HT.HT.HP.HT.HT.HT.HT.HP.H-T.HP.HT.HT.HT.HT.HP.HT.HP.H-T.HT.HP.HT.HT.HP.HP.HT.HT.H_D180L50Cr0.Cb.P-CbP20-PP6-T.P-TP23
(same throughput per hour, no clogging still, 64.5k gold more in total over 180d, and you still have a crafter slot free to make HB fertilizer. You're gonna need some bean burger or poke parties...)

[tame flicker]

i'm trying to get max profits for the shortest timespan bc i need the palium storage

[neat vortex]

Have a look at this list and see if any might suit you: #🌱│gardening message

[mystic skiff]

I tried tomatoes and Bean burger party is nice. But the every 2 day harvest kinda annoying. 😭

[eternal ruin]

If you can keep track of the 'days' that pass so you don't overshoot, you can gather them all on the last day of that particular plant if I recall correctly?

[neat vortex]

However, I'd strongly suggest that you consider attending some cooking parties. 100k is about 135 rounds of celebration cake or rare fish stew/sashimi, or about 35 rounds of epic poke.

(Sushi is somewhere in the middle, depends on the fish.)

[neat vortex]

Yeah, as long as you don't go home

Once you go home you're committed to harvesting them, if they're ready. lol

[eternal ruin]

Ahh, so it freezes the growth if you show up and they process?

I blame the glowy lights around my plots (comically speaking)!

[neat vortex]

Yeah, when you go home it seems to run the "is it ready?" check

— and it appears that it runs the "how many growth ticks has it been?" check and the "how many fertilizer has it eaten?" check before it runs the "hm is this done growing yet?" check 😂 so it'll be like, "wow, six growth ticks! that's two harvests! here you go" but then until you harvest them, it won't gain any more

[eternal ruin]

magic smart plants are smart!

[tame flicker]

the lists confuse me just a bit

[mystic skiff]

But thanks I'll try it out for a few days and see if I like it

[floral talon]

Dont tell me ur gonna do that thing with beans now xd

[clear kindle]

i'm trying your 4 apple with blueberry (still harvesting the apples) but i changed out 2 blueberries for beans (might harvest them since i have 2 seeders that just sit on my plot for fun)

[floral talon]

omg that will be the ultymate fertles lazy money farm

[ivory pond]

smart people from gardening, is there any better way to optimize this? basically i want my apples and whatever crops i put in the corners to have non weed/water+hb (i dont mind using fertilizer on the corners, its not much). from the crops that give boosts i want a variety cause i use them sometimes for cooking thats why i put rice/wheat/corn for example. the corners are random it could as well be 4 beans, but i need the pumpkin achievement

[ivory pond]

and just to make sure, weeds do not break boosts yes? even if something has weeds on them it still provides whatever boost it has?

[clear kindle]

duhscape's layout. i swapped to 2 blueberries and 2 beans

[ivory pond]

YOINK, that one only has hb in the center no

[clear kindle]

and what duhscape said that you can have 8 weeds on the plot with no problems

[ivory pond]

oy ill have to count

[ivory pond]

ahhh this doesnt work with pumpkins

one of my applers has no harvest boost, guess ill use hb for apples

idk if theres much diff between this and the one in corners only tho, apples and corners both have all boosts in both versions. maybe ill try out both and see what i prefer

DS has less weeds tho

ok its exactly 8 weeds

yeah no i dont think i can change the corners one to have 8 weeds lmfao

[floral talon]

Xonya a quality up plant always ensures u need more hb on waterretain weedblock hb layouts

[ivory pond]

mfw 9 weeds

they had to make the pumpkins quality up smh

[ivory pond]

whats the purpose of the tiny cotton in the center btw? can i swap it for whatever?

water for example?

[uncut gyro]

I didn't spend much time for farming until now. I start pumpkin farm. this harvest boost fertilizer from the glow worm farms etc. which products give the most out? is it just like fish bait with grilled fish. or something about crops ?

And can you use too much fertilizer that somehow stress plants like in other games?

[floral talon]

Example any plant can go there the purpose of that layout is to have 4 afk apples and blueberrys/beans without using fertilisers

[ivory pond]

tanks ill change it to a tomttoooo

adjusted

[floral talon]

As a layout maker thats the same layout in my eyes xd

[ivory pond]

yeah same boosts i just changed some veggies hehe

[floral talon]

It can bug that the fert vanishes if u place to much so dont place 991 per soil

[floral talon]

Output is based on items gold value
With a minimum output and a rounding up or down at some other point i forgot the formula

So stuff to worm excess meats shrooms cookingdishes
Or grill ur fish but gril it smart dont wanna accidentally gril ur starred ment for display maws for example

[abstract barn]

Ok this is a numbers brain chat... is it possible to talk rng rq

A true rng isnt gonna give you a percentage chance of getting anything.... its just gonna be random every time, so there's no guarantee you can ever get something. Or maybe im confused how rng works at all

[floral talon]

Of course its gives u a CHANCE
But 50% chance for example does not mean i always get precisely one every 2 dicerolls it just means it averages out on infinite dicerolls half landing on that

For knowing how many got something after x tries lookup probability calculators

[abstract barn]

So its an rng of percentages not just a rng

[floral talon]

Tbf in farming we can make everything 100% chance anyways

[abstract barn]

Tybfor the info

[ivory pond]

Til you can stack fertilizer. Whole new world

[floral talon]

Rng is how computers implement randomnes unles u want to run it of cosmic background noices or lavalamps ..,

[abstract barn]

Ill do a Google search to educate myself, i think im woefully misunderstanding this lol thank u!

[abstract barn]

Rng is an algorithm application that makes us think its random when its actually not 😅

[floral talon]

In practicality it is xd theoritically nope

[abstract barn]

😅😭😭😭 cuz I fished for hours on patch day and didnt get a duck or prism plush, but gained 40 levels in fishing 🫠🫠🫠

[floral talon]

Dang unlucky i got 2 in 30min of just chilling

[abstract barn]

Im epically unlucky in terms of drops dude it's... weird.

[floral talon]

That was 100 catches though with glowing worms at lakeside

[abstract barn]

Yeah it was hundreds of glow worms

[floral talon]

Starred ruby grrr

[abstract barn]

I am level 20 in everything... now level 70 in fishing 😅

[floral talon]

But this is gardening we should take this to dishing mining

[abstract barn]

Yes sorry! I just wanted to understand rng, and you guys have great math brain here

But im getting into gardening more cuz of yall, i dont like how tedious hoeing and watering is for some reason

Like other grinds are just as tedious but somehow it just rubs my brain wrong 😅

[floral talon]

Take it cozy

[abstract barn]

But im loving doing bok choy and peppers now cuz its a faster turnover, I tend to forget things unless its in my face like hi hi do something lol

The fact that you can still make money off the worms no matter what you feed them is breaking my non number oriented brain lol

[eternal ruin]

It's a handy feature of them. really! There's the rare exception of course.

[abstract barn]

Gardening is reliable and I like that

[eternal ruin]

It's good passive money. Most of the skills have some reasonably reliable methods that are more active (just that risk of repetitiveness).

[abstract barn]

I put a bunch of peppers in the jammer, and only one is ready after putting it in overnight

🫠 what did i do lol

[eternal ruin]

SCIENCE!

...oh wait it's not that kind of channel.

I mean if one is read and the others aren't then you didn't put in as many or you forgot to clean them out first. My money is on the first idea.

[abstract barn]

I guess so. I didnt just put them in. I put them in last night. So any I put in should be ready because its like a 40m turnover rate

It was like 15 max in there

[eternal ruin]

15 peppers still takes 8 hours to process. Are you sure it was 15 max? How many were actually left?

[abstract barn]

Ok, that's my confusion! I put in 13 peppers. I had one jar available when I woke up. Now 12 peppers are still processing

[eternal ruin]

...How long did you actually sleep? Cause that math is now more concerning. XD

[abstract barn]

I slept for 6 hours about

Like I haven't touched the game in 8 hours for sure. I put the peppers in then. They didnt magically get put in there 😅

[eternal ruin]

9 peppers should have processed in that 6 hours of sleep though, so now I'm concerned why you only progressed through 1. O_O;;;

[abstract barn]

Me too... cuz i didnt put peppers in my thing 40 mins ago... I was asleep lol

[eternal ruin]

either game burped or somehow jam machines and friends got changed to not run when you're offline, which is... gonna be a problem.

but I feel like that would have come up by now, so I'm leaning on a burp.

[abstract barn]

Since only one was ready. It would appear I put them in when I was asleep 😅
I guess ill shut the game for a bit and test if it pauses the peppers. All my pumpkins were done

30 of them

[eternal ruin]

....so you put in 30 pumpkins before you slept, and they were done?

just one machine or split up?

[abstract barn]

No, i had been running pumpkins all day, so idk what was in there running, but some had been running already for sure. I dont know how many I put in before bed

[eternal ruin]

Okay. less worried there then.
it's roughly 2 pumpkins per hour, so that would have hit 12 of them in the same sleep logic. Guess we'll see how stuff goes. It could be just peppers are bugged if it wasn't a fluke.

[abstract barn]

Right right. OK, well ill close my game for a bit and see where we land with the peppers

Its 3m til the next jar is done im gonna close my game now

I did spawn in bahari when I logged back in, not my plot, but I just logged out when I was at my plot so it does introduce a variable into the experiment

The pepper jar processed, and the next one started so either im confused about how I left the game last night or it was a fluke. Ill try again tonight if I remember 😅

[eternal ruin]

Make a post-it or something and attach to screen or door or something. XD

[floral talon]

seeders and jarrers cannot use hteir last slots stack fo rmore hten 1 item

[abstract barn]

I had nothing in it

It had 12 or 13 peppers in it, and one was ready when I woke up. Nothing else in any slot. Just one pepper.

[floral talon]

wut weird bug

[eternal ruin]

https://tenor.com/view/pirates-caribbean-accord-then-we-have-an-accord-we-have-an-accord-gif-17737979

Mind you, given the plot issues lately for stuff getting moved around and people having to relog in. It's loosely possible one of those bugs somehow struck, but it's only a theory

I should probably make up my mind on next garden setup and plant it. >_>

[eternal ruin]

Hmm, interesting... suddenly none of my crops talk about their boosted features. except for the ones I put some hydrate fertilizer on. Hopefully just a visual bug. >_>;

[fiery radish]

hii just wanna ask...how many seed collectors, preserves jars, and glow worm farms do i need to get most profit from a pure tomato farm?

[mystic skiff]

Beaner cleared today so I tried the tomato layout you suggested.

[eternal ruin]

Tomatoes run 10 days (hours) total and give 8 tomatoes if not boosted in some way.

81 tomato plants means 648 tomatoes.

You need 3 tomatoes to reseed 2 plants, so you need 243 tomatoes for that, which leaves 405 tomatoes (you technically have an extra half plant in math, so it'll alternate having one extra or so if you do it repeatedly). 30 minutes a run means you get 4 seeds per hour.

jarring a tomato takes 27 minutes, so slightly more than 2 per hour.

Worming then takes another hour to convert to whatever worms/fert you're going for. jarred tomato is worth 34 and star tomato 51, so for pure profit you might be better with regular worms over glow, but still works for glow if you're putting the worms to another use.

...I ran out of time and have to rush off to work, but the incomplete answer is: a lot. You basically have '10 hours' to at least get your seeds ready for the next planting. A single seeder makes it to 40 seeds, so in theory you need 2 seeders and then a third to get that last seed if you want it exact, but if you just use 3 seeders you should at least have the seeds ready in time in general.

for jarring, it's 2/hour so 405/2=202.5 hours. If you want them all done at same time as next harvest then you need 21 machines to do so safely, but there's ways to squeeze the time down if you transfer them as they're processing here and there.

Worming is off singles so 405 hours. You'd need 40 machines if you somehow can afford it, but realistically I'm not sure that's happening. >_>;

If I made a big mistake, the good news is it'll reduce the time you need! If I didn't make a mistake... I'm sorry!

(don't ask how I still had time to do that while rushing off to work. I'm rambling)

[bronze steppe]

you are using the harvest boost fertilizer right?

[bronze steppe]

idk how you did this but my brain had an extra large coffee and im still just like trying to comprehend what i read, idk how you did that while rushing to work....your like a superhero or something xD

[eternal ruin]

I did refer to a couple charts. XD

An important aspect of all this though: most processing strategies require time away from the game to help catch up (since the garden pauses). If you plan with this in mind, you wont need as many machines, but if you can't... just sell excess tomatoes once you have your seeds. It is still gained profit, it just isnt maximized profit.

[ivory pond]

only on apples and bok choy touching pumpkins, u can see the hb icons. and the single crop in the center

[blazing jetty]

Do you think they will release the lettuce again? I didn’t know about it when it came out, I would love to have it one day.

[idle depot]

does anybody know how to get pumpkin seeds? this is driving me crazy 😩

[cobalt gate]

tamala's essence store in the EW

[timid burrow]

Is anyone else’s garden broken? Mine has no buffs anymore (water retention, weed protection etc.)

[floral talon]

it does have htem the tooltiop showing what has which buffs is broken

[timid burrow]

?

[floral talon]

buffs completely work

[timid burrow]

I haven’t changed anything but my garden has no buffs 🤷‍♂️

[floral talon]

it does have buffs the thing that shows what has which buffs is broken

[timid burrow]

Oh but I had to water my tomatoes again after picking

[floral talon]

unles ur layout is buffless somehow monoculture

[floral talon]

did u not pick them for a while cuz whne stuff is harvestable and not picked in one growthtick it unwaters for some reason

[timid burrow]

Ohhhh okay so it’s a combo of things. The buff menu being busted and me leaving my tomatoes too long. Okay understood

[eternal ruin]

You also get some pumpkin seeds from quests if patient.

[floral talon]

wth for quest gives pumpkins seeds probs one id idnt do yet if onyl i didnt need the pumpkins asap to data mine for hte layout planner rip 500 essence my precious

[eternal ruin]

I suspect you can get most of your pumpkin data from everyone else and their sheets. >.> but yeah either a tamala or elderwood quest or possible a treasure chest.

It is not a popular crop. It has bad processing value and a low growth value

[floral talon]

i was the first one to get all info on growht ticks xp starred jar starred seed value and such so i shared it so the layotu planner will hold the info for me XD

[eternal ruin]

XD then what else do you need to use them for and how did you not have leftover seeds i am confused!

[floral talon]

i do but i had to spend 500 to get me first seed

[eternal ruin]

So what you need is the unstarred seed cause you somehow got a star seed first?

[floral talon]

u cannot get a starred seed first u can only buy the unstarred one

at my level all my produce is only starred anyways

[eternal ruin]

So you mined virtual virtual pumpkins and now need real pumpkins?

[neat vortex]

DS no longer needs the pumpkin seeds; it sounds like he is annoyed that he bought one initially for essence if he could have gotten one for free later. lol

[floral talon]

ren whatever poeple say about u at least u know how to understand what someone writes very well

[neat vortex]

unless you're just yanking his chain :p

[eternal ruin]

Ren i must return to work mock throttle a pumpkin in Duh's place for me please. Thank ye!

[floral talon]

tbf i wouldnt mind irl pumpkins to grow sounds more fun then random decorative plants imagine having actual crops instead of a garden so much more productive so muhc more meta

[floral talon]

ah ic this guy is british explains

[neat vortex]

My sole talent 😔

[floral talon]

nah u found ur true calling in this game btw

[opal sentinel]

Is it wrong of me to want to dig up my entire garden because some of the crops dried out when others didn't and now crops of the same type are not on the same grow schedule?

[cobalt gate]

when this happens i just wait to harvest all of them until they're all ready lol

or dont replant until all are harvested

[neat vortex]

Yes, this also drives me up the wall and is part of why I strongly prefer 100 percent water/weed layouts sans bought fertilizer

[opal sentinel]

My garden is supposed to be self-watering but I was on for a long time yesterday and didn't go back every in-game day to harvest/weed so stuff dried out irregularly. Alas.

[floral talon]

This is why i use full weedblock and wTer retain gues my ocd beats my effort efficiency obsession

[opal sentinel]

I probably should use water retain but I have a money garden layout and I use harvest boost on the crops that don't get it from what's around it.

[floral talon]

Yeay hb and water retain so worth it i do weedblock cuz i cant stand getting desynced

[neat vortex]

Yeah, that'll do it :(

[clear kindle]

2 hours for beans to seeds? what are they doing over there at s6

[opal sentinel]

The ROI on the two new crops is so poor. 3 pumpkins from one plant WITH harvest boost is so bad.

[clear kindle]

i'm trying to decide if i want to pick up 2 of my preserve jars and place down two more seeders for the beans or if i should just leave it as is

[cobalt gate]

have you unlocked all your crafter slots?
i forgot you could upgrade that lol

[clear kindle]

oh yeah, loooooong time ago. but i have a peculiar way of playing where i have a crafter down for each of the items that can be crafted (i.e. i have now 4 sawmills, one for each type of wood, 4 looms, 8 furnaces, 2 glass makers, etc) that i use for extra storage along with not having to stop another process to start something else. that way i always have the items ready and out of my storage for other things.

[neat vortex]

Giving the folks who only play on weekends a way to have something run for up to 62 hours uninterrupted while gaining 50g per crafter slot hour, is what 🤩

[clear kindle]

i currently am running 2 seeders and 8 preserve jars. i'm trying out a new layout that has beans in it and since i rarely ever used my seeders thought that maybe i can make use of them by becoming an apple and bean farmer.

[neat vortex]

Lets you leverage your idle time really well, it's nice

[opal sentinel]

I've got 8 preserve jars. Sometimes I have enough product built up to have them all going on the same thing (which is always satisfying when they end at the same time) but right now I've got 3 running tomatoes, some on apples, some on blueberries.

[neat vortex]

Oh, I thought you were on a money garden layout - is it for cake parties?

[clear kindle]

change of scenery on my part. don't worry, it's duhscapes apple blueberry layout. i just substituted 2 blueberry for 2 beans

still only harvesting apples (and now possibly beans for fun)

[opal sentinel]

Probably not the best money layout but my layout:

Right now I'm running pumpkin in place of the peppers to get the achievement.

[fiery radish]

thank you so much for this thorough answer, really appreciate it !!

[neat vortex]

This reminds me of that one quote: "I would have written a shorter letter, but I hadn't the time"

Keep in mind also that the cap on crafter licenses is 30

[eternal ruin]

I haven't hit that yet so good to know!

[neat vortex]

The garden planner also will help calculate the number of crafters needed to keep up with a layout, but it requires a little extra math.

(and it doesn't include worm/glow worm farms)

[raw berry]

the pumpkin make quite a bit of cash if canned, if you feel like switching out the blueberries/peppers

[eternal ruin]

Did they update it's values in one of the recent updates?

[opal sentinel]

I’ve got pumpkin going in place of the pepper rn because they have the same buff. Pumpkins probably only worth it if you’re planting more than one crop because with harvest boost you’re only getting 12 per plant across the four harvests. Just growing it for the achievement rn.

[neat vortex]

Unfortunately, they grow so slowly that they are much worse than even the other utility crops (blueberry, pepper, cabbage)

Current cash crops (reckoned by processed gold per tile per growth tick, not raw crops) are: beans, bok choy, potatoes, rice, tomatoes

[fickle pasture]

Do crops have to grow before they apply boosts?

[eternal ruin]

No. Once you plant them the boosts are immediately available. However, for the boost to affect the other plant it has to exist when a growth tick occurs. Meaning It has to basically be there by the 6 AM mark.

I don't think it has to actually be watered or weeded or the like, but don't quote me on that part, and it sounds like too many weeds lock up the whole plot regardless (but that could be misunderstanding nuance).

[fickle pasture]

Oh so it kicks in at 6

[eternal ruin]

That said, some are useless without some prep: hydration boost won't work if the plant isn't already watered to keep it that way.

[fickle pasture]

I'm trying to boost apples with beans

[eternal ruin]

So long as you have them both present it works, though apples need 3 applications of a boost to work, so a single beans (two spots at most) won't work.

[fickle pasture]

I have two beans hitting a total of 4 squares on each tree

[eternal ruin]

Then they should be boosting each other! the Viewing plants button (G on computer) is bugged at the moment, but they should be getting it.

[fickle pasture]

I'm on Xbox but I'll check at 6 and see! Thank you!

[raw berry]

oh so, even with 3 pumpkins on plot, would you still recommend switching them out to make more money?

[neat vortex]

Absolutely, unless you still need to plant them for the accomplishment. But if your goal is money, pumpkins are not the way.

Because with 3 pumpkins on plot, that's 12 (at least) tiles that aren't growing something that makes more gold per tile per tick

You only get 81 tiles to work with, so you have to choose :D

[raw berry]

yeah I'm done with that already, alr, I'll do that, it seemed like good money to me because I don't tend to the plots that much, so picking some pumpkins every 1-2 hours seemed okay 😅

[neat vortex]

It's frankly a bit baffling that canned pumpkin only gains 14% in value, too. For almost all crops, it's +50% or so. I actually have a hard time understanding the pumpkin logic, tbh.

[raw berry]

they didn't want another economy crash like with the glow worms and fertilizers haha

[neat vortex]

When was this?

It's just odd that they are so hard to get and then so far under par

and useless for cooking profit, as well

[raw berry]

sometime last year before they nerfed cake parties and how much output worm farms gave, we got the speedy gro fertilizer too, which sold for quite a sum

[neat vortex]

Wasn't the cake party nerf in 2023?

[raw berry]

don't tell me it's been that long

[neat vortex]

I won't tell you, then 😉

[raw berry]

[neat vortex]

It's ancient history to me; I only learned about it from digging around in chat logs and wiki page histories, lol

[cobalt gate]

the nerf to cooking parties makes me not want to sell food anymore lol

[neat vortex]

wild that cooking used to give... what was it, +50% value over the sell values of the ingredients?

[raw berry]

yeah seems a bit odd, just a decor plant for now

[neat vortex]

Have you been wanting not to sell food anymore since Nov 2023, then...?

[raw berry]

yeah, I got cooking lvl 100 just from spamming cake parties... great times

[cobalt gate]

i stopped playing for a few years... so yes!

[neat vortex]

tbh it mostly affected solo cooking profits, unfortunately

[cobalt gate]

when i stopping playing it was still absolutely in the HEIGHT of stressful cakeparties for money lol

[neat vortex]

Cooking parties are still quite profitable with the right strategy, just not off-the-charts for easy materials like they were before the adjustment

I can't even imagine trying to do a cake party with as buggy as the cooking UI was at the time. It was already bad enough when I started, and it's only gotten better since (if gradually)

[raw berry]

I now prefer to just hunt or sell my canned/pickled/seed stuff instead of spending hours on someone's plot

[raw berry]

oh yeah, the amount of times someone bugged out 😅

we all had to hold tools so we wouldn't get stuck at the work stations

[neat vortex]

The 0.180 economic changes did a lot to make non-cooking-party gold and non-gardening gold much more viable

[cobalt gate]

i remember i joined a couple cakeparties, and one time someone's game crashed and everyone went absolutely balistic

it made me never touch cake parties again 🤣

[neat vortex]

but also catapulted cooking party gold into the stratosphere due to fish prices going up lol

[raw berry]

The oven spaces always were fought over because you didn't have to buy any materials or plant apples/blueberries for jams 😅

[raw berry]

also ty for the gardening knowledge, I'll send my pumpkins into storage hiatus

[cobalt gate]

my farm is suboptimal because i'm wanting to grow one of everything 😆

[raw berry]

gotta save a bit for cooking

[cobalt gate]

exactly!

i still need to figure out what i'm doign with my stock of wheat... i started just using it in my worm farms because i had saved up like 1k back before i stopped playing for awhile
[i think i'm down to about 350?]

[raw berry]

I think I'll go for this layout for now, since I'm constantly running out of food, gives me a bit of gold too

(I hate watering)

[cobalt gate]

i have a weird layout due to weird crop placement [becausei think it looks nicer on my plot]
and because my eyes would glaze over too much trying to maximize the bonuses

[raw berry]

😂 that's valid, I always just put them so everything is always hydrated

[cobalt gate]

this is what i'm working with atm
though tbh i'm starting to run into the annoyance of the fact my potatos are watering my corn but the corn isnt protected from weeds

i will once again say:
i wish there was a way to change the bonuses different plants give you 😆

let me crossbreed for bonuses!

[raw berry]

that would be so nice
surely if they keep giving us crops we'll get a few new soil plots as well?

[cobalt gate]

god that'd be nice too

[raw berry]

I'm hoping the same for decor limit because I'm really struggling haha 😅

[eternal ruin]

They are not going to give a highly complex plant breeding system before optimizing things a bit more, consider the bugs that already exist and need fixing. XD Not to mention how fast that'd scare people away when most are already afraid of math.

[cobalt gate]

i just want to swap potatos from 'watering' to 'weed prevention' or something like that

[raw berry]

here's to hoping

[eternal ruin]

That'd just lead to extreme meta-growing strategies and possibly a potato famine.

But I imagine we'll get a few more crops first before they really retackle garden system.

[cobalt gate]

ultimately i just want more crop space

[eternal ruin]

understandable, but that probably is low priority too, given how often people run out of storage space it seems like. >_> Though we'll see what the palium chests do once they fix the other hiccup.

[neat vortex]

Shouldn't change the total available storage space once they fix it

14k is the new max; even being able to place down 8 chests per housing plot before didn't alter the 10k limit.

[eternal ruin]

What I mean is you can overfill yourself very quickly with gardening already. adding more plots would make that happen MUCH faster, and unless they increase machine count to boot, it'll just take all the longer to process (or folks will just sell it directly at that point).

[limpid cypress]

I haven’t seen someone post that they tried it, but you can add beans to the bullseye design without any crop bonus change or fertilizer cost increase. I did it as 3 because I can’t process 4 crops with my daily online time. https://palia-garden-planner.vercel.app/?layout=v0.4_D-111-111-111_CR-P.HTOBkBtBtOBtBt-BkPTRCrRTOBk-OBkP.HBtBtTBtBtO-TRBkPCrOBkRT-PRPTCrBkPRP-TRBkOCrPBkRT-OCrPTRCrP.HBkO-BkOTRCrRTPBk-BtBtOBtBtBkOTP.H_D180L50

[neat vortex]

Ooooh nice work!

Much more elegant than my 4-bean design, saving that immediately

This will allow new players to start with the bullseye and transition to the 4-bean version as soon as they unlock the seed maker

Or, actually, nevermind, even sold raw beans are better than 2 corn + rice + potato oops, one was level 50 and the other was level 0

[limpid cypress]

Yeah, it can definitely be tweaked a bit to preference since there is so many one spot crops. That 2x2 is just awkward in so many designs.

[neat vortex]

Tell me about it lol

[cobalt gate]

2x2s will kill me 😆

[neat vortex]

I was so jazzed that I finally managed a 3-bush linear layout that actually accommodated grain tiles, too

[cobalt gate]

i'm proud i was able to fit all this garbage
even if its a lame layout

[neat vortex]

If it makes you happy and does what you need, then it's a good garden layout :)

[cobalt gate]

i might give up and buy some weed killer fertilizer
cause bleh

[neat vortex]

That is why it exists, I reckon

[cobalt gate]

i'm just trying to save for the stupid palium chests so i dont want to spend any money lol

[neat vortex]

hm. how much garlic do you have

[cobalt gate]

not a lot, why?

i'm lacking on the foraging stuff because i've been lazy about picking them up lol

[neat vortex]

because I've been on a fishing kick and I need to get these angelfish and eels out of my inventory

I've just not been feeling well so I've been putting off hosting my periodic Late Nite Fish

[cobalt gate]

lol fair

[ivory pond]

What time do u normally host them btw

[neat vortex]

Whenever I have too many random rare fish, lol

[ivory pond]

I mean what's late night for you in your time zone I believe we're from different continents

[neat vortex]

Oh... anywhere from 3 hours before the current time to an hour past the current time.

[ivory pond]

Yeahhhh makes sense why I've never seen your parties posted LMAO. I'm usually asleep at this time

[neat vortex]

lol

I'm just a night owl tbh, it's 3:30 AM for me

and I am vaguely maybe perhaps considering going to bed already

[ivory pond]

I'm a night owl too but it's forced upon me because I often finish work anywhere between midnight and 3 but your parties would happen 7-11am for me so I'd be still asleep after work most of the time

[neat vortex]

That'll do it

[ivory pond]

Missing out on the NA parties forever

[south night]

anyone have a plot that uses apple, beans, blueberry, bokchoy, carrot, corn, cabbage, onion, potato, rice, pepper, wheat, tomato but is kinda beginner friendly? like im talking got apple and blueberry seeds from zeki coin at gardening lvl 3 beginner 😭

[cobalt gate]

You could try a modification of my farm?
It's a bit weird but it had everything and doesn't use fertilizer

[cobalt gate]

This is my farm

[neat vortex]

So, you aren't going to be able to make any more blueberry, apple, or pepper seeds until you unlock the seed collector at level 5 - those can't be purchased (or, can't buy pepper seeds until level 6, at least), as I'm sure you have discovered.

I personally might hold off on planting apples, blueberries, and peppers until your need for gold is lower and your options for getting more gold out of your garden are higher. None of those make a ton of money, especially before you can process them.

That said, I'm digging around to see what I can recommend you :)

Do you want a layout that already includes all of those things at once, or would you be okay with swapping things in and out as you complete the accomplishments and have enough stocked up for cooking?

[south night]

They actually are level 6 now! but they have a SINGULAR seed collector and i was like hm they want everything (besides pumpkin and cotton cause we drag them through cooking parties lol) but im not sure how LOL

[neat vortex]

Aha, very good! Do they need a bunch of rice or anything for cooking parties?

[south night]

kinda just anything? they like having everything

[neat vortex]

Yeah, there are just some everything layouts that have more grain tiles than others lol

[south night]

i tried using the very popular one with everything on it, but trying to fix that pumpkin slot was a lil too much for my head at 4 am in the morning @_@

[neat vortex]

Which one?

[south night]

this one! i tried including onions, wheat and tomatoes but i quickly realized i am not built for making set ups, just copying others 😭

[neat vortex]

Ah, DuhScape's QR code layout... egh that one uses bought fertilizer, rough when you're new

(but I have a well-known bias against bought fertilizer)

[south night]

omg i didn’t even realize that ..

i do too you’re good lol, i personally hate buying materials when i know i can gather/craft it myself (but i still do it anyways when im lazy)

[neat vortex]

So... there are three four-bush + apple layouts I have saved

And I can't decide among them, lol - they each have pros and cons

so I'm just gonna link them all

[south night]

oh wow thank you! honestly after i sat there trying to figure out how to replace a pumpkin they can pick their own poison lol

[neat vortex]

XD

Pumpkins and peppers are direct substitutes, incidentally

but two peppers plants is... a lot, so I would probably shove a bean plant in there and send your friend off to buy more crafter licenses lol

[south night]

i was thinking of two beans too, esp since we do bean parties a lot so maybe it won’t be too bad on him? it’s fine ill tell him to stop doing hotpot and get to work on those crafter licenses 😭

[neat vortex]

This one is by @pearl oasis (subbed out the pumpkin)
It doesn't have many grain tiles because it uses the bushes to buff each other, but it has a pretty even spread otherwise.
It also has relatively few tiles that need HB fertilizer.
https://palia-garden-planner.vercel.app/?layout=v0.4_D-111-111-111_CR-O.HTWC.HCb.HOT.HP.HC-AAAAAAAAA-PTR.HOCBkBtBtCb-Bk.HSSO.HSSTBtBt-CbPCrBkO.HBkCrPCb-BtBtTBBOBBBk-CbBtBtBkCOR.HTP-AAAAAAAAA-CPT.HOCb.HC.HWTO.H_D180L6

[south night]

oh wow i actually use this one but i subbed out pumpkin the wrong way i just have two beans side by side…

well today i learned lol

[neat vortex]

Here's a nice symmetrical/patternful one by @ripe valley
https://palia-garden-planner.vercel.app/?layout=v0.4_D-111-111-111_CR-Bt.HBt.HCBt.HBt.HPCPC.H-ORTTCrOOWT-P.HS.HS.HBk.HS.HS.HP.HBk.HP.H-OCbORCrWCbOCb-AAAAAAAAA-CbOCbWCrROCbO-PCP.HB.HB.HCB.HB.HP-TWOOCrTTRO-Bk.HPBkPBt.HBt.HBkBt.HBt.H_D180L6
More grain tiles, but does require more HB fertilizer.

And one by @mint sandal that leans hard on the cash crops, but needs more fertilizer, again
https://palia-garden-planner.vercel.app/?layout=v0.4_D-111-111-111_CR-R.HTPBkO.HBkPTR-A.HA.HA.HA.HA.HA.HA.HA.HA.H-PTR.HBkO.HBkRTP-Bt.HBt.HTBt.HBt.HBkBkCbR-PCPCBk.HCCrPCr-TBt.HBt.HBkBt.HBt.HRCbBk-O.HTRB.HB.HBkB.HB.HT.H-WCbWCBkCPR.HP-RTO.HBkS.HS.HT.HS.HS.H_D180L6

sorry, had to tweak all those to use the same number of harvest days and same gardener level

If y'all do a lot of bean parties (burgers?) then HB fertilizer probably won't be a problem for your friend with at least one worm/glow worm farm

[south night]

yup burgers! thank you! i’ll send these to him and tell him to pick his poison!! lol

[autumn turret]

So for apples these 9tiles can u put 9trees or is it just 1?

[safe badger]

I do 9 cause I'm trying to stock up on apples

[autumn turret]

So it is 9 trees?

[safe badger]

Once I'm done with that it's either going to be blueberries or beans

[graceful mulch]

Hello! I just want to share the layout I spent time cracking my head on for.

It's an Apple and Rice -focused farm layout with 100 water retention and weed prevention and 82 harvest boost on the garden planner! Really happy with this and I think there's room for improvement

It also has onions, bok choy, tomatoes and potatoes :D

https://palia-garden-planner.vercel.app/?layout=v0.4_D-111-111-111_CR-TOBkPRAOTA-PTOAARAAR-BkPTPROTWBk-BkPARTOBkPA-AAOBkPTAAO-BkRPOBkTBkRP-OTAPRATOBk-AARAARPTO-TWOPRBkBkPT

[autumn turret]

Jesus bunni lol

[autumn turret]

Ty

[safe badger]

Woah 🤯🤯🤯

[safe badger]

No problem

[graceful mulch]

hahah

I was doing a layout for all crops but it got super tedious planting

[autumn turret]

Im in that predicament rn

I have one apple tree open to the garden ways i want all crops i have em all unlocked and starred

[graceful mulch]

I think this was taken from an old post and I just added in the new crops where possible!

[safe badger]

What's the difference between planting with starred seeds vs regular seeds?

[graceful mulch]

especially with converting seeds... just too much

[autumn turret]

More chanxe of gold stars? Maybe

[graceful mulch]

I'm not 100% sure but I think starred seeds gives more starred crops, though not all are starred still

[autumn turret]

Ya

[safe badger]

Hmm okay.

[graceful mulch]

from my understanding, you can put cottonnext to and quality fertlizer on a starred seed and it'd boost the starred outcome

[safe badger]

I didn't know this

[autumn turret]

Im needing cotton atm

[safe badger]

Same.i only have like 30 cotton left

[graceful mulch]

thats screenshotd from Arenvanya's guide to gardening in Palia v1.5

[safe badger]

Thank youuuuu

Where do I get quality up fertilizer though

[graceful mulch]

oh! you can craft them with a recipe

[autumn turret]

That the worm bin obe aint it?

[graceful mulch]

i think so too

[safe badger]

Do you know how to get the recipe?

[graceful mulch]

should just be from Badruu's shop

[floral talon]

Gj and yes it can be better

Id like to announce that milkibunny is definitly not dumb
That means u got my seal of approval bun

[graceful mulch]

hahahah thanks! I would love to know how to improve it too!

[floral talon]

Full weedblock waterretain and harvestboost without fertiliser(aside from the corners cuz those can only get 2 buffs from plants) is possible

[floral talon]

Corner theory dont like putting 2x2 at corners xd

[autumn turret]

Can i get a setup for all crops pls 🙏🏽

[floral talon]

Anna made ^ that one

[autumn turret]

Is this with preserves?

@floral talon

How do u put 9 apple trees in?

Anyone. 👀

[floral talon]

Uhm just one per soil but then u got no harvestboost without fertiliser and no waterretain or weedblock

[floral talon]

Layouts cropschoice and processing arent the same thing

[autumn turret]

I dont understand it lol

It shows 9apples but cant put in 9

Doesnt make sense lol

[ionic stream]

One apple tree takes up an entire plot sp will show as 9 apples per soil plot

[neat vortex]

Yep, it's not saying "put in 9 apples," it's saying that when you plant an apple tree there, the apple tree will take up those 9 tiles

[floral talon]

Oh tgat was the misunderstanding

[autumn turret]

🙏🏽

[safe badger]

I hope in the future they let us have more than 9 soil plots at once

I'd be willing to pay irl money for that.
At first I hated gardening in the game, but now it's one of my favorite things

[civic anchor]

On perserve jarring, do you only use star quality crops and then only use normal crops for seeds?

[next sequoia]

Is anyone else getting a glitch where it doesn't show what effects your crops have?

[neat vortex]

Yes, known issue, it's in the patch notes - and very unfortunate for new players

[neat vortex]

I would recommend using starred crops to make your replanting seeds

[next sequoia]

I should read those that's on me lmao

[neat vortex]

Then you get starred seeds, which have a higher chance of yielding starred crops :D

[civic anchor]

Ah okay that makes sense too me. Thank you!

[floral talon]

Need to be like lv 38 or maybe only a little bit lower for it to make more sense with unstarred seeds due to levels giving higher star quelity chance

[fluid sun]

Hi guys, i have just started playing Palia.. Gardening got me hooked so i spent a few hours today to create a Garden Tracker https://palia-garden-tracker.vercel.app/ to remind me what time i should water/plan my crops.

Its still a work in progress and full of bugs but u can import v4 Garden Planner code/url .. give it a try! looking forward to hear your thoughts 🙂

[long crown]

With the crop boosts, what can i swap tomatoes with?

[clear kindle]

potatoes or cabbage

[long crown]

Thank you !

[amber sapphire]

So its always more profitable instead of selling raw vegetables to instead turn them into seeds and sell them as seeds?

[floral talon]

It doesnt fully work for me on phone but i wanna point out just incase ya didnt know:
growthticks ingametime 0600 when ur online and one time afterwards at 0600

[fluid sun]

cool tips! may i ask what error are u getting on mobile?

[clear kindle]

yes, always process your crops to either seed or preserves. the only time i would say that you don't have to is if you are just in need of a quick gold to get an item, or you have a massive overstock of crops that will never get processed anyways

[fluid fractal]

hi there
can anyone explain me pls what happened to these gardening buffs?
I remember you could see all the buffs that crops can give, not just fertilizer stuff

[clear kindle]

there's a known bug that's not showing the buffs

[fluid fractal]

ah, thank you

[floral talon]

wiht not being show being the key word it does SHOW fertiliser

[grim fulcrum]

7\

[frail escarp]

Garden Planner Minor Update:

• Old method of calculating average via growth ticks now available as a setting (General Settings). It's also now part of the saveable and sharable codes + I've increased clarity on which method is being used for averaging to mitigate confusion when discussing layout gold output
• Re-addition of configuring default settings + other old functionalities still pending, getting to it when I can

[floral talon]

gj aisen

[worldly yew]

i use multiple days of weed blocker for my entire farm. i noticed that they do not reduce equally anymore. when i return home, some plot would use up 1 tick but some would use up 3. has there been a change recently?

[cobalt gate]

i believe its a chance every tick to use the fertilizer up

[abstract barn]

The pepper thing was a glitch/ very probably user error, I got 11 pepper jars when I woke up this time

[floral talon]

probs not putting in equal amounts some spots having weedblock while being weedblocked by other plants if not this and conmsumption is unequal idk either man maybe it dont consume when fully grown but i doubt it

[clear kindle]

i sometimes got that with apple trees and harvest boost fert before i went with different layouts that used crops to cover

[floral talon]

u really do love the ultra lazy layout huh

[clear kindle]

YES!!!!

in particular, like i'm doing right now, it frees me up to actually afk while i do diamond art painting with my switch right next to me by my garden. all i have to do is mess with the control stick every so often to make the game think that i'm still playing, which allows my garden to grow for however long i'm doing the diamond art (which can be up to 8-9 hours on a good day)

[floral talon]

imagine if u did industrial fertiliser production then u coudl do that with SIX apple trees

[floral talon]

let me know if u got any layout request and il whip one right up for ya

[safe fossil]

hi guys, i made this planner but i dont know if its great. So, could you improve it? taking into account that I don't have apple trees or blueberries or pumpkins or anything else hahaha.

[clear kindle]

so far, i'm trying out your apple/blueberry (bean) layout, seems to work well

[floral talon]

yeay i think thats the most perfect one for oyu unles ur using alot of fertiliser

[midnight rock]

Hi gardeners 🙂 Im new. Im wondering, with all these layouts giving benefits... Im slightly confused, some crops are done earlier then others, do i wait? ttill everything is done to harvest? I assume i loose certain " benefits/boost" if i harvest the tile.. ?

[floral talon]

the plant has to be there on a growthtick to give the buff so if u harvest it and u replant its fine otherwise for exmaple
i doa layout with 5 growhttick plants and 4 growthtick plants and when i wanna run something else i leave the 4 ticks on for one full tick of harvestable and harvest everything at once

oh and when a plant is one away from its last growhttsgae u dont need to have water retain or weedblock buff on it since ur gonna harvest it onetick later anyways

[midnight rock]

ahhh, that makes sense

[cobalt gate]

if you're not wanting to be super midmaxy about it you can just harvest then replant instantly and you might lose a tick or two but its overall fine

[midnight rock]

and some layouts will say 9% water retain, meaning one tile might need watering? can i put harvest boost on all the others to increase crop amount?

[verbal bridge]

I found a great garden layout that always gives star quality crops from here with every single crop (which is good because I look to cook and achievement chase) but it doesn't have any cotton which is frustrating because I find myself needing cotton semi often. I know I can buy it from Tish's but is there a way I can modify the map I got on here to also have some cotton?

[floral talon]

9% water retain means only 9 percent of the plants have it

[midnight rock]

*90 i meant, sorry

[verbal bridge]

I only harvest when everything is fully grown myself. Probably not min/maxed but I dont garden much. I mostly fish, hunt, mine and bug catch and I make random foods for focus

[floral talon]

star crops have a base chance of 25% +25percentpoint from starred seeds +something from quality up and + 2% per level
i may have messed up my numbders here thjough that layout is not the reason ur getting starred stuff

[floral talon]

well yeay only 10% needs watering then which u may chose to not care about

[verbal bridge]

I use quality up or more produce per harvest fertilizer too

And I only use starred seeds. I basically quit getting normal seeds and normal produce