Purist Ping Channel

[dapper radish]

I saw someone request a ping channel, only for the bot, and was shut down by a mod. But, honestly, I think it makes sense. There's is so much damn spam going on in the ping channel and for people who want to mute every other channel to only hear pings, it very much makes sense to have a bot only channel parallel with the other channel.

[ruby hare]

Why not just add the bot to your own private server? I have… Garlic breads server has it too.

I don’t even use the ping channel here anymore, let them have their fun yk 😛 we have alternate options.

[dapper radish]

I'm not saying they shouldn't have their fun, we should have both. Alternatively with all new ping roles for the purist channel so you don't get pinged in 2 channels.

It's the same with a lot of update changes that should've been toggles instead of just hard changes.

[fallen widget]

Why can't they have fun in the discussion channel? What makes the ping channel more fun than the other channels?

[drifting ocean]

Hey, could you explain why it is a problem in your opinion, if the ping channel has some other messages? Imo people who don't want those messages could just ignore them / only active notifs for pings.

I also don't feel like it's a lot of spam, sure you get some messages in there if something good / something people have been waiting for is in the shop or guys doing rituals, but ultimately I think it's not that bad when I was scrolling through just now.

[fallen widget]

It's easier to scroll back and see what I've missed if I don't have to look through other discussions.

I still would like to know why the posters can't have their fun in the discussion channel or why the ping channel is more fun than the discussion channel.

[drifting ocean]

I see, you also use it as a log channel... hmm I don't know how many people would need that, as they can't change that they missed stuff regardless xD and in the end you can always just add the bot to your own server if you really need logs.

As for the other thing, the difference is that they can directly react to the stock messages or say stock/weather related prayers etc. in there. Like another channel which doesn't really involve the pings might not feel like the correct place i guess?

[fallen widget]

Then why not merge the ping channel into the discussion channel? Anyone who gets upset can just just turn off notifications besides pings or make their own server and add the bot there.

[drifting ocean]

Why merge them now, they still have different purposes? That would be the complete opposite of this forum posts intention too xD

[fallen widget]

That was rhetorical xD

There is a reason the channels are separate, allowing people to use the channel for non-ping purposes defeats that point. They can still react to the pings with the discord built in reaction feature, but asking the bot to stock something specific or spamming !snowritual doesn't actually do anything (as far as I know). It's also somewhat apparent that this channel isn't intended for non-pings based on other mods asking people to stop talking there.
#ping message

My preference is to lock down that channel, but I'd happily accept the OP suggestion to create a separate channel with only pings so others can continue to beg a bot for starweavers, spam king mod, and have their discussions.

[drifting ocean]

Oh I see, other mods seem to have a different understanding of the ping channel than I do.

When the bot was introduced to the server there was also a discussion about how to handle the ping channel (on phone rn cuz heading to bed soon, so sorry I can't search for the messages 😔). The conclusion I got from that discussion: people like the interaction in ping channel with stock relevant stuff like reacting to rare crops or doing their rituals. That's why it wasn't locked iirc. Maybe this philosophy changed without my knowledge. If that were the case I personally agree with you, that there is no reason to keep the channel open for chats.
Only problem is the Ping Spam roles cuz you can't set a channel to only be able to send messages pinging roles AFAIK. So disabling chat would also mean people can't ping PINGSPAM role in #ping anymore (and I don't think it would be good in #discuss )

Creating a new channel also seems redundant and would clutter the server unnecessarily imo, so idk if that's the best solution to this

[fallen widget]

Should be enforceable with a bot that removes posts without mentions

[dapper radish]

Get rituals out of both chats

[dapper radish]

My suggestion was the ping channel remains exactly as it is, business as usual and then add another channel purely for bot pings, adding 1 extra channel for giving people the choice is hardly clutter..

[rocky axle]

okay so i have a suggestion that i believe may offer a middle ground. personally, i don’t rlly care what we do either way as long as everyone can come to a mutual consensus. how about keeping the main ping channel for the bot only, but then adding a thread within that channel for ping/shop-related discussion ?

[hidden locust]

upvote on the "add the bot to your own private server" or simply join a server that offers a ping channel too

rituals and reactions are sooo in deep in #ping, it feels like its already a part of it. at some point we all had our moments where we also had fun doing it. its just the negative/arguments/loooong conversation in there pisses most of us.

so either we adapt and lessen the negative/arguments/loooong conversations
OR
give no access to @/everyone in sending messages (and even reacting to chats) on the ping channel

and just do the pingspam on discuss

best option imo

i have this on mine look..isnt it so clean? world peace

[ruby hare]

lol why is your bot pregnant man 🫃 🤣

[hidden locust]

he "delivers" the goods to me

[rocky axle]

the thing is that ping-spamming in discuss may clog the discuss channel and i think it’s a bit counterproductive (imo). i agree that it would be nice if everyone could just adapt and lessen the negativity/long conversations in there, and just move the discussion to the discuss channel when asked to by a mod or any other member without arguing. i personally don’t find the snow rituals and a few messages to be an issue, and i also think it’s quite futile and pointless to need to have to go back and look at what had previously been in the shop (which is why a lot of ppl tend to have issues with messages there), bc as aforementioned you can’t bring back what’s already gone lol

i also agree with the adding the bot to your own server, i think it’s the most viable thing personally

and to reiterate, although sometimes we may get caught in the moment/accidentally stray off topic, we obviously should try our best to avoid long discussions/conversations in the ping channel. i think everyone should just try to be mindful with the messages they send in there, but also were anyone ever to go off track with the conversations and someone asked them to take it to discuss, just do it without arguing. there wouldn’t be any issues in there if we all just worked together.

[hidden locust]

tbf when something big happens, both ping and discuss go crazy. it clogs both channel and we love seeing that. being united as one no? so maybe ping spam on discuss wont be a foreign adjustment for everyone

[fallen widget]

I still haven't heard a compelling reason for not making a channel for only bot pings like the OP suggested

[hidden locust]

no need to make a new one, just remove the message access and the spam is gone

[rocky axle]

yess you have a point, but since discuss is mainly for discussing the game, redirecting the ping spamming to the discuss channel specifically will only clog genuine discussions/questions regarding the game, since we do get a lot of those there. that’s honestly my main concern, and why i said that

we would not want ppl’s, especially newcomer’s questions/concerns to be overlooked

[rocky axle]

i mean.. i don’t think either of us are necessarily arguing against it is the thing lol, just trying to find a middle ground

and you did also suggest locking the channel, which i agree could be an option. personally, i don’t care either way. i’m mainly trying to find a middle ground among everyone

it has been discussed that the ping channel should probably be restricted to mods only, or like more “trusted” members so to speak. and i’ve seen others suggest this as well. i think this could be a viable option

[hidden locust]

if we take a closer look to whats happening in discuss everyday, almost every queries are being answered. if some of us cannot answer it by ourselves, we ask them to proceed to forum. i guess the server has enough manpower to address the concerns on discuss, and it won't be that clogged and ignored if ping spam ever happened in it. members in here always love to help.

also, if the chat gets sooo crazy with the hype of the drops/events, maybe it is a Moderators' job to finally step up and help address/answer the said questions from new players/members? be more hands on, it is also your teams task to make sure no concerns are being overlooked. not just the calling out on rule breakers

[rocky axle]

yes i understand, but that’s exactly my point. discuss is fine as is, but specifically redirecting ping spams to discuss, on top of what is already going on there, may only further clog the chat under the assumption that discuss is also used for the purpose of ping spamming. i hope this makes sense. and you’re right, it is our job to make sure that no concerns are being overlooked, hence my dilemma; i am trying to avoid that happening as much as possible

at the end of the day, it’s 16,000 ppl in here and this server is constantly growing, and only a couple of us. we’re doing our best.

[hidden locust]

first step would be help address/answer the said questions from new players/members in both offtopic and discuss channels. i rarely see green colored users assist new players in those chat, i can only name a few.

in regards of the ping problem, 1 or 2 mods will suffice. the whole team being on ping, calling out rule breakers, makes it more clogged.

maybe assign certain tasks to certain mods to utilize your teams number

hoping a decision will be made soon regarding the #ping in the next days, i feel like it should be a priority atp

[rocky axle]

you say you don’t rlly see all the mods helping others in the chats, but in a previous message you said that almost every query is being answered. so ultimately, i feel like this is hardly an issue rlly.

also, just a friendly reminder that we’re all humans with lives just like the rest of the members here and that we definitely aren’t robots. we are non-paid volunteers who take time out of our day bc we care about keeping this server a friendly and supportive place. some of us may have work, school, chronic illnesses or other personal issues that we have to tend to. i truly believe the mods and devs have been doing a wonderful job so far, and we rlly appreciate everyone who helps make this community what it is as well. that said, i think the mods here have been handling issues quite fine. we only act in the best interest of the community and that includes my suggestions here as well. as aforementioned, ultimately i don’t rlly care in the grand scheme of things, but i am offering what i personally think are the most viable suggestions. and yes i agree with it being made a priority, and we have been discussing it, so don’t worry.

[ruby hare]

For the record, I’m not against your idea at all. I was just offering an easier and quicker alternative in case you weren’t aware, and you could do what many of us already have. However it goes I’m good with, I hope it works out in the best way for everyone, truly.

[rocky axle]

same here, i’m not against any ideas at all. i’m personally just trying to figure out the most viable option for everyone here, but at the end of the day you can’t rlly please everyone. i’m okay with whatever. some of the mods and i just had a long discussion about this and we’re just waiting for the general consensus from everyone now

[fallen widget]

I didn't mind how it's implemented as long as there is a channel with pings and no random messages or that snow ritual spam.

[dapper radish]

I feel like this is getting a bit derailed, I'm not suggesting any change to current #ping or #discuss because I think they're fine as they are (Except for the rituals but that's just me being old n' grumpy). All I suggest is a new channel, only for the bots ping, with roles that aren't pinged in the current ping channel so we don't get pinged in 2 channels depending on our choices. And to be completely honest with you, the argument earlier for not adding a new channel "because clutter" is kinda ridiculous with 40 play text channels. Name suggestion for new channel: OnlyPings.

[dapper radish]

I appreciate that I can add the bot to whatever I want right, but THIS is the community channel. And if you're making something, why not make it the best that it can be, so people don't have to do the extra steps?

[rocky axle]

i don’t think it’s getting derailed at all, suggesting a new channel related to the ping channel is still ping channel related. to reiterate, i’m fine with whatever we do, but others may find two separate ping channels confusing or unnecessary. so from there we were simply talking about other options

[dense inlet]

If I can add my opinion to the conversation,
I understand the basic idea because I'm also one of the people who use the ping channel for logs, just to get some context/some references for the discuss channel
When I joined the server (which is not long ago at all) I had the impression that there were fewer messages in the ping channel, and I particularly appreciate having the reactions of people to the Shop's stock (especially when there are rare items) and I find it better in the ping channel because I can follow the reactions with the Shop's stock, which I can't do in the discuss channel, where I could never read the entire conversation that happened for a whole night and know the Shop content at the same time
But I admit that I appreciate it less and less (that's my feeling) because there is more and more "slippage" (idk how to say it) (i mean by it: bad ping, non-respect of the rules etc...) and that the conversation tend to end more often with a reminder of the rules by moderators (which, imo is not the best to read when we roll back the chat)
I think, the fact that there are more and more of us also plays a role and adds this "chaotic" effect
I've already seen this idea in the discuss channel (it's even said a little above) so it doesn't come from me but why not allow only people who have been there for x amount of time to talk? We will have fewer "false pings" (maybe) and people who have already been hanging out on the server for a while know that you have to restrict the chat in the ping channel, so it will make fewer messages, and it will also give new people time to understand and reproduce rules that they see put in place and respected ? I don't know if it's a good idea but personally I think it can at least be tried to see ? (Sorry if it doesn't add more than that to the discussion)

And for people who use ping channel for logs, there is always the possibility to sort the messages you see in the search to see only the bot's announcement messages:

[fallen widget]

I really don't want to have to see anyone have discussions in that channel because it's always the thing over and over. Why do you like seeing people's reactions to the shop stock? It's going to be the same reaction for the items. Everyone is happy the rarer the item and sometimes someone will make the same joke about being super common stuff. Otherwise it's going to be people begging the bot to stock a certain item because they think the bot can do that for some reason.

I also don't think having to filter every time I want to glance in that channel is a good work compromise from the OP suggestion.

Why are you against having a separate channel for people to use without having to deal with the discussions in the ping channel?

[ruby hare]

So what is your suggestion that makes everyone happy?

[fallen widget]

The OP suggestion?

No one seems to have a reason to not create a second channel that only has the bot posting in it.

[ruby hare]

Ok fair enough

Yea ok why not, after reading all of this I guess there’s no reason not to do so. In the mean time there’s alternative solutions which is good. Maybe we’ll get a response soon.

[dense inlet]

Yeah, i understand your opinion
I like seeing people’s reactions because i usually share the same feeling, I enjoy watching everyone get super happy when snow finally arrives after three hours of nonstop rain (and making jokes about it), or when we get two starweavers in such a short amount of time and everyone goes wild as soon as the starweaver appears. To me, it feels like we’re sharing our emotions about the game, which i think is a big part of it, waiting around and then getting excited about a good shop, being able to celebrate that together just feels natural to me
I get that reactions have been easier to spot lately, there are more snow rituals, more requests toward the bot (even though i don’t really think people believe the bot can actually influence anything), more rule-breaking, and more abuse in general. But it hasn’t always been like this. From my perspective, it’s happening because the community has grown really fast in a short time, and things are moving too quickly for the team (mods&devs) to set clear foundations (and I really think that on this side of things, the whole team is doing their really best)
It’s not that i’m against it, if this is what the community wants, then i'm totally fine with it. It’s not really a problem, i just personally liked how things worked before, so i suggested an alternative, that doesn’t mean my idea is necessarily the best solution, and i understand that with so many new people joining the server, rules and habits are bound to change, I mean, that’s pretty normal so far
The only part I wonder about is the practical side: as far as I know, the bot can’t send alerts in two different places in the server at the same time

[dense inlet]

And, as far as I know, the bot can’t really ‘split’ to send different pings roles in two channels on the same server
So if we create another channel just for reactions, that would mean no pings there, and that kind of brings us back to the same issue we have with reactions in the discuss channel: we wouldn’t really be able to scroll back and see what happened in the game at the same time as following conversations and reactions, and I feel like it wouldn’t really help to add another channel if it’s going to end up serving the same purpose as the discuss channel, might as well just restrict discussion to the bot in ping channel, and let everyone else chat/react in discuss
I’m not really "against" one system or the other. If we can find one that works for everyone, then I think that would honestly be the best solution for us all :)

Sorry for the long post

We can always ask @/corny_muesli for details about the bot and how it works

[fallen widget]

The OP suggestion is to create another channel that only has pings, not a new channel for reactions; the current ping channel remains as is so you can happily spam snow ritual all day long.

(Also wouldn't the reactions tell you what was happening in the game at the same time?)

[dense inlet]

Yeah, that's the same, either we leave the current ping channel to make reactions and add another channel for ping, or we restrict the current ping channel and create a reaction channel
(well, It's still much more complicated to guess the drops to the reactions than just to read the bot's pings, I don't think many people would really want to try to guess the drops to understand the reactions)