envy's dual tribe runs!

[sacred gale]

Ohhh we have to make her red because she has fire powers...

[spare pollen]

what mana is spongebob

[sacred gale]

And then she's not red as a person.

[sour birch]

meanwhile when they put colors on universes beyond cards my tumblr dash gets posts about how they did a misogynistic character assassination

[quiet plaza]

THAT POST ABT KATARA IS SO TRUE THEY DID HER SO DIRTY

[sacred gale]

Spongebob's carefree nature suggests green, and his penchant for antics red.

What happened with katara???

She better be red.

[spare pollen]

actually he contains multitudes it seems

[sour birch]

she's fucking bant mothbomb

[sacred gale]

WHAT???

[spare pollen]

bant ??

[sacred gale]

NO SHE ISN'T.

green white blue

[spare pollen]

why

[quiet plaza]

they made katara bant. fucking bant.

[sour birch]

this is why i'm talking about a tumblr post about a misogynistic character assassination

[sacred gale]

No that's so fucking shit.

[sour birch]

because they made her bant

[sacred gale]

Katara is the most impulsive person in the show. Edit this is wrong I exaggerated.

She gets mad.

And it's fucking great.

[quiet plaza]

its fucking great!!!!

[spare pollen]

if they need color coding so much just do red katara with a picture of her blood bending or something .....

[sacred gale]

I could see like. Boros.

BANT?

[sacred gale]

She does not give a shit about trees.

[sour birch]

god i forgot about the part about the fucking quote

not the quote on the card

[sacred gale]

Universes beyond flavor text always feels weak honestly.

[sour birch]

they posted this when they advertised it

[sacred gale]

???????????/

[quiet plaza]

she would not fucking say that,

[sacred gale]

Bant...

[quiet plaza]

she did not fucking say that. even.

[sacred gale]

Anyway dia context, bant is such a stereotypical good guy set of colors, it's like the most conflict averse one missing both red and black.

[spare pollen]

omg ...

[sacred gale]

They're portraying katara as a kind healer who always helps and not as the very angry person she is.

[quiet plaza]

bant is specifically. the inuniverse bant faction is a fucking order of knights with angels on top

[sacred gale]

And both sides are there, but come on where is the red?

[spare pollen]

theyre washing our goat ..

[sour birch]

and mangled her fucking death threat quote for this

[sacred gale]

See this is the issue with universes beyond. It breaks the color pie every time.

Because avatar has its own color pie.

And it doesn't match up.

But people will get confused if firebender not red I guess.

Is azula red?

She shouldn't be imo.

Dimir, blue/black for dia.

[sour birch]

she's uh. grixis

[sacred gale]

Okay I'll take it.

[quiet plaza]

to their credit they did do black + blue/black azula for the first two books

and then grixis for the last, which is where she gets the red folded in

[sacred gale]

Omg wait that's great.

[quiet plaza]

yeah its really peak

[warm venture]

For the record all of these wacky names for colour combos come from like. Notable factions that stick to that colour combo

[sacred gale]

The red isn't in her cost, it's in her abilities, that's very well done.

[quiet plaza]

universe beyond sets r infuriating bc theyll do some things so well and then other things. katara bant.

[sacred gale]

Kinda bant out of shape about this one.

[sacred gale]

I was about to try and explain every one but that's so much.

That's so so much.

[spare pollen]

that would be quite a few ..

[sacred gale]

Where's that one tumblr post about ravnica guild's and how they'd offer gender affirming care. That post has great analysis of the guilds.

[spare pollen]

how do you even memorize so many lskdhgj

[quiet plaza]

[assigning tectonic characters color combos for funsies]

candy: i mean. red mana. i think i could see candy as red/white, if you dont just want monored - shes very justice-motivated, which is nominally red/white, but i think its up to individual interpretation the extent to which she actually chases justice as like, moral philosophy, or shes in it first and foremost bc the Emotions. personally im leaning towards monored

tamarind: classic blue/black. a nice rich vintage. tamarind loves knowledge and insight and she loves getting what she wants

mavis: monoblack all the way babeyyyyy. my children, fight each other to prove yourselves to me. to become my favorite piece of property

yezera is really hard bc i think her colors have drifted a Lot. tbh opening the floor up on this one because i do think she drifts closer to monoblack as the story progresses, and theres a pretty big internal conflict between her nominally green goal ("a world where pokemon rule, and are free") and her black motivation ("i want to make a world where i can be happy.")

[sacred gale]

(The ravnica guilds are a set of 10 guilds, each a 2 color combo.)

[sour birch]

this is not what you mean but i found it trying to see if i could find it (i have never seen the post you refer to)

[sacred gale]

Yes this is all spot on.

[warm venture]

It's only like. 20 really. 10 2c and 10 3c. Compared to memorising Pokemon type matchups. It's like. Just comes with practice

[quiet plaza]

:3 :3 :3

[sour birch]

"how the guilds would react to a member being trans"

[quiet plaza]

ajsdlkfJKSDLFLKD

[sacred gale]

Gun to my head I could not name all the nephilim color combos.

[spare pollen]

what is alessa.... what color is it when youre purely motivated by being ride or die for the gal whos ending the world ...

[warm venture]

They should give me some claws

[sacred gale]

Uhhh. Witch maw??? Ink brood?

[warm venture]

I just say like greenless

[spare pollen]

what about 4 color combos ...

[sacred gale]

That's the nephilim ones with weird names.

[spare pollen]

ohhh

[sacred gale]

Named after cards no one gave a shit about.

[warm venture]

They're pretty uncommon

[sacred gale]

I love how black is usually very assured and confident, and yezera is not but still fits the color so well.

Also I love when color identity changes to show how a character changes.

[quiet plaza]

alessa is... i want to say, red/black almost? she has her feelings, and she has the things she personally cares about (notably yezera), and shes notably Not invested in green+white's whole greater vision stuff nor in blue's logically-deduced world framework stuff

[sacred gale]

Nahiri going from mono white, selflessly giving her entire life and her home to protect the multiverse, to boros (white/red) after Sorin betrayed her to show the sheer fucking rage inside her now... Peak.

Sorry I like nahiri lmao.

[spare pollen]

omg i love it

[sour birch]

yeah i could see alessa pure red or pure black too but... alessa is Not any of the other colors

[quiet plaza]

yeahyeah

[sacred gale]

We need purple this isn't enough colors.

[warm venture]

Anti bant. Banti

[sour birch]

is skyler red/green

[quiet plaza]

tbh thats kind of perfect also with alessa's chasm grunt backstory. she goes from [some red/black combo, villainous connotations] to [some red/black combo, chill connotations]

[warm venture]

I feel like Skyler might have some white? With his like reverence for power, avatars and yezera

[quiet plaza]

oooh i can super see that yeah. and skyler's, like, Religiousness abt it in particular

[sacred gale]

Yeah skyler feels almost religious in his reverence of things. Put him in white.

I'm too slow...

[sour birch]

this makes sense...

[warm venture]

One brain cell

[sacred gale]

Ninjask'd.

[quiet plaza]

omg... dwdw we're just both cooking with max gas

unlike skyler

[spare pollen]

my val is black/white ... shes cutthroat, but has mommy issues,

[sour birch]

sorry i said "is" skyler
i meant "was" skyler these colors before getting savagely mauled by nidorino

as is canon

[quiet plaza]

asdjflkSJDFKLJ

[warm venture]

The only gas Skyler is cooking with is the poison gas from Nidorino

[sacred gale]

Are mommy issues white???

Actually mommy issues are 100% white.

You're right.

[spare pollen]

see ive got this

[sour birch]

keoni is easy mono blue

[spare pollen]

the need for approval from an unapproachable authority figure who lends structure to your life

[warm venture]

The longest thread in the history of the forums, closed after 40000 posts of heated debate

[quiet plaza]

god yeah absolutely

[sour birch]

imogene is... probably blue/green?

black and red don't really seem to make any sense

white is still wrong

but both blue and green feel like pretty important parts of her questline

[sacred gale]

If I had mtg colors I'd be uhhh red blue but that implies I'm doing so much more than I am.

[sour birch]

im les confident in the blue

[spare pollen]

what would a quest for identity fall under ..

[warm venture]

Imogene quest ||I feel like BG also fits Mew on a mechanical level so that fits||

Er, UG

Fuckin

[quiet plaza]

yeah imogene blue/green fits i think. she's blue in that she analyzes - she's green in that she believes in a greater world order unshackled from civilization, in signs and symbols with spiritual significance

[warm venture]

(blue is abbreviated U to avoid conflict with black)

[sacred gale]

Btw dia blue is shortened to U.

[spare pollen]

i swear i remember seeing personality tests for mtg colors as a kid

people would have them like in their forum signatures

[sour birch]

then there's uh. eifion

[spare pollen]

thank you my friends you have educated me ..

[sacred gale]

Replace zodiac with color pie.

Omg you're SUCH a rakdos lol.

[quiet plaza]

"eifion is white" <- sentence i had to restrain myself from sending unmodified

[sour birch]

eifion is (mono) white

every other color has nothing to do with him

[sacred gale]

It's true...

[quiet plaza]

i think i could see eifion as black/white - hes very concerned with redemption and with being a cough cough capital letters Good Person, but in a very self-focused way where hes concerned with specifically his own moral standing on the scales

[sacred gale]

Eifion is monowhite, you can tell this because he's lame and I don't like him.

[spare pollen]

what is a rakdos ..

[quiet plaza]

like he believes in morality but specifically he cares about it because hes realized that hes a shitlord, and that he was a shitlord to his pokemon. and his quest is to not be that, and its not to like. change other people or to change the world, its just to patch up his own boat

[sour birch]

red black

[spare pollen]

omg ... me fr ...

[sour birch]

though the rakdos guild specifically is a cult known for violent revelry

[quiet plaza]

hell he can literally be a masked villain bc he decides that destroying the entire world is how hes gonna earn his personal moral absolution

[sour birch]

i haven't talked to masked villain eifion i. does he really say that wow

[spare pollen]

ok i took a two minute quiz is this my whole personality what do you think ...

[sacred gale]

Rakdos is also canonically where all the maids and other cleaning staff and stuff are in ravnica.

[warm venture]

Tamarind... Blue White Black?
Like professor = blue is kinda surface level but
White for Chasm's authority (taken any political science classes lately?)
Black for Chasm's tyranny

[quiet plaza]

its along the lines of "i want to atone for what ive done wrong to pokemon [and this is how i do it]"

[spare pollen]

you ..

[sacred gale]

BANT.

[spare pollen]

omg im just like katara

[quiet plaza]

HELP

NO

[quiet plaza]

SCREAMS.

[sour birch]

i kinda. see it but i struggle to ascribe a motivation that's explicitly like
serving an ideal as black

even if the serving of the ideal is clearly self-serving subconsciously

[spare pollen]

all the questions about black were literally just "do you do bad things"

[sacred gale]

Yes.

[warm venture]

Black gets a bad rap a lot of the time. Even Magic's own designers forget frustratingly often that it's not black==evil

[quiet plaza]

yeah i could definitely see tamarind blue/white/black. especially present tamarind where like, she Is demonstrably on-board with the whole "keeping things in order is important" deal in a way thats more than lip service

[quiet plaza]

this is extremely fair also

[sour birch]

tamarind blue/white/black seems solid yeah

what is zain...

[quiet plaza]

tbh yeah i wouldnt trust mtg color personality quiz for this reason... ppl dont understand color philosophy <- biased speaker

[spare pollen]

white (mommy issues), red (annoyed by kid sibling)

actually turning from white to black as he starts pursuing his wants instead of being mavis's puppet

[sacred gale]

Why is everything so low???

[spare pollen]

maybe just white and black from the start idk, or white black -> black red

[sacred gale]

Y'all I think I might be colorless.

[spare pollen]

moth youre color anemic ??

[sacred gale]

I'm emrakulpilled.

[warm venture]

I subscribe to this just because I like the idea of going from white to black as a positive character development

[quiet plaza]

yeah hard agree with this analysis tbh. esp bc like, zain Is extremely consistently emotionally-motivated throughout the story, in a way that shifts from "fuck my holier-than-thou kid sibling" to "youre alright actually, fuck mavis for putting us in this situation"

[spare pollen]

just an emrakul looking for your nahiri ...

[warm venture]

Also link quiz if we're all gonna do it

[sacred gale]

https://www.idrlabs.com/magic-color/test.php

[warm venture]

Oh of course it's idrlabs lol

[sacred gale]

I just clicked a link...

[quiet plaza]

does this quiz while chanting in my mind "i dont believe in the authors of this quiz and i dont trust its results"

[spare pollen]

thats the same one i did ..

[spare pollen]

bant ..

[quiet plaza]

NO

bant scary.. bant scary....

the worst part is when u can tell that the quiz author thinks bant is the moral color trio

[spare pollen]

val is bant because theyre the protagonist 😌

[sour birch]

i don't trust the results of a quiz where every answer i know what color it leads to

[spare pollen]

yeah a;lskdhg;lskdhg

[quiet plaza]

abstaining from the quiz on moral grounds.... ....

[spare pollen]

its literally just "are you logical?" "do you like nature?" "are you a bad person?"

[sour birch]

i'm still going to do it

[sour birch]

but the results have no validity

[spare pollen]

omg ...

shadow bant ...

[warm venture]

This is of course biased because I already know what I consider myself and it's obvious what the questions correspond to so

[spare pollen]

omg ...

i dont know what colors i'd actually consider myself ..

[quiet plaza]

okay i know i was just ragging on this quiz but. this question is kind of hitting me where it hurts given tonight's context

[sacred gale]

How are y'all getting numbers above 50!

[spare pollen]

you have to like strongly agree or disagree sometimes !!

[sacred gale]

Answer the question...

[quiet plaza]

fine.

[sacred gale]

No nuance, max agree or disagree.

[quiet plaza]

fine.

oh

[quiet plaza]

[sacred gale]

Nuance isn't even real.

[spare pollen]

girl you cant let ppl bully you into changing your answer !!

[sacred gale]

I believe that one day, this shall be green...

[sacred gale]

I mean if you think about it, letting someone bully you to put it lower proves it should be lower.

[spare pollen]

so true !! 😭

sorry envy 😭 💖

[quiet plaza]

im being bullied into answering honestly dw........

[spare pollen]

if it asks if metagross is the best pokemon ever you better put max agree ...

[sacred gale]

What fucking color would that be.

[spare pollen]

blue because you care about the truth

[quiet plaza]

im gonna commit perennial payload normal gem explosion

[sour birch]

well metagross is a timmy pokemon so probably green

or a spike pokemon....

but i don't think that's relevant in this case...

[spare pollen]

see you in 6 turns ..

[warm venture]

Oh god now we have to explain psychographics too

[spare pollen]

wtf are psychographics

[sour birch]

mtg has three Player Profiles

[sacred gale]

We haven't even explained what simic is this can wait.

God there's so much mtg in mtg.

[sour birch]

timmy/tammy
johnny/jenny
and spike

sorry i started so i can't wait now

[spare pollen]

ah yes simic ... the language of the sims ..

[sacred gale]

Real.

Spike is nonbinary...

[sour birch]

timmy/tammy likes spells and stuff to be Big
they want to make Big Flashy Plays with giant dinos and spells that cost a lot of mana and stuff

[warm venture]

The card does kinda have nb swag tbh

[sour birch]

(they originally had just the first listed names but because male-defaulting is bad at some point they made a Good Decision to add the feminine names as alternative, except to spike owing to the androgyny)

johnny/jenny likes decks that are complex and have lots of parts. like complicated combos even when the deck could be made Better if you made the combo simpler

they want to make their Bit tbh

[sacred gale]

You're so right?

[sour birch]

spike absolutely has nb swag

[spare pollen]

omg ..

[sour birch]

anyway spike is a meta slave

there's no need for more elaboration really

[spare pollen]

me fr ...

[sacred gale]

This is maybe one of the funniest abilities of all time.

[quiet plaza]

lmao my jeskai ass

thats fair actually i can live with this. thats pretty accurate

color quiz: redeemed

[sacred gale]

2/3rds bant.

[quiet plaza]

😭

[spare pollen]

moth arent you 2/3 bant ...

[sacred gale]

Wow, red white and blue, so you uncritically support america? Kinda problematic.

[quiet plaza]

😭 😭

[sacred gale]

I had like nothing.

I wasn't even izzet and those were my two highest.

Nothing above 50%

[warm venture]

Jeskai is a good colour combo. Izzet+ gang

[quiet plaza]

having nothing is bant if you think about it, because bant is onto nothing,

[spare pollen]

two of your highest numbers are blue and white .......

[quiet plaza]

izzet+ gang!!

[spare pollen]

wait if you have to be above 50% im not bant ... im just blue white ..

[quiet plaza]

FREED

FROM BANT

[sacred gale]

Yeah and if your pancake batter has more eggs than anything else it doesn't mean you're making an omelette.

[sour birch]

i know How i got 57% green but it's Strange

[sacred gale]

You're the police state colors now.

[sour birch]

well

[spare pollen]

wtf ..

[sacred gale]

Sorry!

[spare pollen]

so you hate waffles

[sacred gale]

Yeah for sure yeah.

[sour birch]

i got 57% green because i answered all of the "you believe the world is interlocking parts" questions with high scores

but i mean that in like

the most blue way possible

[spare pollen]

retaking the quiz and answering all the personal ambition questions more ambitionly so i can be cool blue black instead

[quiet plaza]

tbh my least defensible mtg opinion is that i dont like bant but i do like azorius. this is like half bc my first starter deck was rtr azorius, but i do like the color combo and think its not restricted to being cops forever even if wotc really desperately wants it to be

[spare pollen]

or white black like val ..

[warm venture]

N voice: I must discover the formula underlying everything

[sour birch]

okay, well, yes,

[sacred gale]

If there's no red its a bad color combo.

[spare pollen]

wow so you hate emrakul

[sour birch]

tbh my color self-identification is like

[sacred gale]

I'm sorry women.

[sour birch]

primary blue
not white

any of the other colors inclusion or exclusion is not too important

[quiet plaza]

as a jeskai girlie i agree with this on principle (having internally-inconsistent opinions is red, so this is Good and Correct of me)

[sacred gale]

REAL!

[spare pollen]

i have moral ocd so i have to have white probably

[sacred gale]

No, moral ocd is red.

[spare pollen]

omg...

i can see that ..

fascinating ..

[sacred gale]

-2 special attack...

[spare pollen]

omg ...

[quiet plaza]

-2 special attack... (fascinate is spread effect, it hits me too)

[sacred gale]

We're teammates...

[spare pollen]

thats why the enterprise always survived their wacky hijinks .. whenever spock said fascinating the enemy lost special attack ..

[sour birch]

0 special attack (on the same side of the field as dia..)

[spare pollen]

omg thank you ai ...

[sacred gale]

Anyway dia as someone who doesn't play mtg, thoughts on this card?

[spare pollen]

omg simurgh ... also just like me fr ..

is this card good ...

[sour birch]

deck based entirely on keeping platinum angel out with no win condition

[sacred gale]

Me when I was 10.

[sour birch]

yeah that checks out

[quiet plaza]

oh circling allll the way back around to player psychographics theres also vorthos and mel

vorthos is here for the cards' flavor - the universe, the characters, the worldbuilding. (incidentally vorthoses are generally speaking the least happy about universes beyond)

mel is here for the... im not sure i have the best explanation for this one. the "beauty of mechanics" is i think a decent way to put it? when cards have mechanics that intersect in pleasing ways, and when individual cards have very nice and good designs

(and ofc all these psychographics can overlap, and are functionally speaking moreso just different ways of enjoying the game)

[sacred gale]

Actually my wincon was phage the untouchable.

[spare pollen]

what does "you cant lose the game" mean ... like can your hp not drop below 1 ..

[sour birch]

your hp can drop below 1 but you don't lose

[sacred gale]

It means you can't lose the game.

[spare pollen]

i want to go melmode ..

[quiet plaza]

melmode is so fun so cool... holdon i have a rlly good mel card to show u

[sacred gale]

Okay dia what about this card.

[sacred gale]

Mel is so real.

[spare pollen]

omg... is this card bad ...?

[sacred gale]

I loooove when a card tells a story.

[quiet plaza]

waiting politely for dia to give her thoughts on abyssal persecutor (also a very mel card imo, incidentally) before poasting my cool mel card show&tell

[spare pollen]

i actually can see this being better than platinum angel right ..? because its cheaper and has higher stats and flying and trample. i forget what trample is but i know flyings good

[sacred gale]

Ding ding ding yes Dia smart.

[quiet plaza]

you are wiseful and have good judgement. abyssal persecutor the bestie

[spare pollen]

are you able to like intentionally choose to delete a card when youre ready

[sacred gale]

Well black loves shoving its own creatures in the grinder.

[quiet plaza]

notably, its also way way harder to keep your opponent from killing one of your things than it is for. your opponent to stop you from killing one of your own things

[sour birch]

trample lets you hit the enemy even when they block your creatures

[spare pollen]

omg...

[sour birch]

overkill hits the enemy player basically

[spare pollen]

right that sounds really good

[quiet plaza]

yeah its busted on a big thing like abyssal persecutor, especially with flying

[spare pollen]

i dont remember enough to know if 4 mana is like actually cheap or mid price or what but its definitely better than 7

[sacred gale]

4 is less than 7 this is true.

[quiet plaza]

its pretty cheap. like middle-of-the-range (which equates to cheap in formats like commander where games go long)

[sacred gale]

This is why you're blue.

[spare pollen]

thank you im a math genius ...

[sour birch]

for 7 mana platinum angel really needs to just say you win the game

it shouldn't say that and its good that it doesn't

[sacred gale]

Um but you can't lose.

That's like winning.

[quiet plaza]

taking my turn on show and tell... this one doesnt fit with the theme of the last two but it Is topically similar to both in different ways

wurmcoil engine :] the friend

[sour birch]

its like winning except for the part with

[spare pollen]

is lifelink the one that heals you for the damage it does

[sour birch]

you know, the winning

yes

[quiet plaza]

yeahyeah

[spare pollen]

i dont know deathtouch

[sacred gale]

Inside of you are two wurms.

[quiet plaza]

it kills anything it does damage to

[sacred gale]

Deathtouch means you death when touch.

[spare pollen]

my friend who used the vampire deck used a lot of lifelink so she had like 140 hp at one point

[sour birch]

what keywords do your personal worms have mothbomg

[quiet plaza]

mothcoil engine sounds rlly fun&cool tbh

[spare pollen]

does that include like a player ...

[quiet plaza]

oh just creatures yeah (there have been some very fun instances of "player-deathtouch" though :3)

[sacred gale]

Cumulative upkeep and echo.

[spare pollen]

also i think this was the commander i used my first game i found her

[quiet plaza]

oooooo omgomg

yeah thats a classic monowhite commander (makes a lot of things, gets big if you have a lot of things)

(is implicitly a religious crusader who crusades against everyone in sight indiscriminately. so like, a normal crusader)

[sour birch]

i see.. when you perish you will spawn an endlessly replenishing army of creatures who manifest their own scarcity by their very nature...

[spare pollen]

mothcore ...

[sacred gale]

Is that not the goal of life?

[spare pollen]

woah ...

worming ..

[sacred gale]

Anyway envy do you have more show and tell cards?

[quiet plaza]

if u have one u can go... i just had wurmcoil engine bc like. i like it. its a big wurm that splits into two smaller wurms

[sacred gale]

Oh no I was just curious to see more.

I don't have shit.

[quiet plaza]

oh! i can find some then yeah

[spare pollen]

yeah show us the mel cards ...

[sacred gale]

No rush or like, don't if you don't wanna.

Twas curiouse.

Tis all.

[quiet plaza]

oh ive got a good mel one, one sec need to find it

[spare pollen]

you actually have to ... we're tyrannically trapping you in the mel mines like we're abyssal persecutors ..

[quiet plaza]

this is a bit word salad actually so im not sure if it reads well, but. figure of destiny was pretty notable when it was printed

really really cool card. captures the flavor of this random level 1 kithkin going on a big quest and ascending into level 8 kithkin spirit warrior avatar

[spare pollen]

omg ... does it like level up as you spend mana on it ?

[quiet plaza]

yeah!!

[sacred gale]

Yeah! This even spawned a mechanic literally called level up.

[sour birch]

tries to level your figure of destiny up to level 4 while it's level 1

spends five mana accomplishes nothing

sorry i mean six

[quiet plaza]

</3 went on the quest too soon..... wasnt prepared for it

[spare pollen]

are there like other cards that add "warrior" or "spirit" descriptors to things you have, that you could use to skip levels ...

[quiet plaza]

:3 youve just figured out smth very very fun about this card, yeah

you can skip steps if youre clever

[spare pollen]

omg ...

yeah ig if you add the warrior tag you can skip to the end ..

is 1 + 6 mana for an 8/8 flying first strike creature good

[sacred gale]

Dia you're a natural at figuring bullshit out.

[spare pollen]

omg thank you i do my best ...

[sacred gale]

That's why you're blue...

[spare pollen]

omg exactly ....

[sacred gale]

Anyway cool card.

[quiet plaza]

it's like... only marginally gamebreaking? slightly above rate for the cost. the real draw here is that figure of destiny can be multiple cards depending on what stage of the game you're in - a small body on the field when you need one, a 4/4 when you need decent board presence, and then an 8/8 when you want to close out games

[sacred gale]

I gotta sleep now it's almost 4:30.

[quiet plaza]

oh shit same

[sour birch]

good night

[spare pollen]

i should sleep too 😭 😭 😭

goodnight yall this was fun 🥺

[sour birch]

unfortunately poor decisions mean i shall continue awake

[quiet plaza]

this was super fun!! gnnnnnn

[sour birch]

despite it also being 4:30 here

[sacred gale]

Twas lovely!!!!

[sour birch]

good night all...

[sacred gale]

Fare thee well.

[quiet plaza]

is it 4:30 for all of us..... 4:30 dimension

[spare pollen]

i hope you can rest well when you get a chance ai!!

[warm venture]

it was 8pm for me in the 4:30 dimension but i was asleep for a nap lmao

[wanton notch]

i read some of this conversation and failed to follow it but then i saw vriska and uh

i am told i am a vriska

[quiet plaza]

<- girl whos intentionally taking a break from tectonic (from being active in here by extension) as she sorts though irl stuff of various varieties, but. ouh i rlly wanna play tectonic…

[wanton notch]

fuck irl stuff

it sucks

[quiet plaza]

irl stuff suuuuuucks

i got the hard interpersonal conversation i needed to get done last night, now i just need to. force myself to get back on top of my uni assignments
(also i. hm. screams. some guy hit me in the legs with a trash bag on the way to class this morning and i think it was an accident but i didnt put up any resistance or reaction or anything to it anyways out of fear of conflict/retaliation so. aouhgh. “at least” the bag didnt burst open so i didnt, like, get covered in trash)

[wanton notch]

I had to watch a guy badly do a thing I am very good at last night. Exhausting

My plan for having more energy for stuff is to eat better and exercise more and get lots of vitamin C and D

[quiet plaza]

ahhh thats a good plan…. ive just gotta like, lock myself back in emotionally, i think

[quiet plaza]

IM FREE

no more assignments this week.... i got the last stuff done today
i. i Am running on three (3) hours of sleep. but like

i wanna see my team i miss them. its tectonic time

[warm venture]

WOOO

[quiet plaza]

okay okay makes a little mission objectives list in here. since i do Not have the brain function rn to keep track of it all in my head

• final funny leaf stone gauntlet trainer (lvl 35)

• two trainers in nebula ruins (lvl 35)

• keldeo avatar (lvl 30, two dynamite sticks to unlock but i probably do want to unlock)

• helena underleveled

• rafael underleveled (requires doing the velenz digit slip fights first)

• eko ig but like. lets be real here about what is likely to happen

[then like… theres also the other stone gauntlets and dog avatars ofc. id need to double back and figure out how much value/use i get out of each stone pair though]

[plus im already deep in the kilna gauntlet so. first things first]

waiting for my puter to update… at some point i need to do final fantasy naming convention dualtribe
(admittedly i think my naming conventions are going to like, steadily decrease in Adherence to the Bit as time goes on. so its more like “at some point im gonna do a dualtribe with a lot of final fantasy character names”)

burglar keith... #myenemy

starts setting down thoughts in no particular order. like entry hazards

• sandslash probably(?) loses to rocky helmet turtonator. actually turtonator is a rlly solid mon here, his only answer is golem
• its like. fine if i dont perfect this fight. im here for the Stones. more than avoiding golem clicking galvanize selfdestruct, im worried about making sure that it doesnt click selfdestruct on anything too important
• snom into exeggutor seems rlly solid at first glance? hypereffective infestation cant be Bad
• i might need to find a dedicated answer to primeape. that moveset is scary and if it gets momentum going, dominating (buffs atk/def on scoring kills) means it might just sweep my whole team

what does a primeape answer look like... smth that can burn it, maybe? turtonator should be able to live a neutral brick break or two, im moreso worried about using turtonator up on anything that isnt sandslash though
puzzle room bronzor swaps its base 95 atk with its base 50 spa... thats basically cutting its atk in half, but. tbh it's still level 35, and it has coverage against bronzor so itd basically just be in to set the room

laying out my counters,

sandslash <- turtonator (rocky helmet, def style)
exeggutor <- snom
a. golem <- [something... ground type, presumably?? or just find a way to bait it into exploding, im not picky]
mandibuzz <- probopass and stonjourner. hopefully

primeape <- jesus christ what do i do against this evil fucking ape

debating if theres a timeline where i just. crystal veil probopass into something that gets hit by primeape for neutral non-stab. and then lead with m vullaby with a ghost-resist berry for first turn burn inflict and hope for the best

oh my god binah solos primeape

like. full stop

this is literally so winnable

[spare pollen]

binah sweep!!

[quiet plaza]

okay new plan

• binah solos primeape
• keith goes into exeggutor
• if i go into snom here he just switches into golem. i think i want to try CV dark probopass here? extremely specially tanky, nulls a psychic on the switch-in, sets rocks

i think i need rocks here specifically bc so much of my strategy revolves around specific mon counters, and if he switches around too much he just nulls that plan

. FUCK i cant give turtonator the rocky helmet bc. wild card. ofc

[warm venture]

wah i've been there

[quiet plaza]

okay ig i just. try and scare sandslash away with turtonator for the time being. and see what happens

[digital plaza]

ferroseed is animated, right? Wondering if you can bait sandslash into a multihit and iron barbs rocky helmet it to death

[quiet plaza]

wait omg true

[digital plaza]

I have exactly one gameplan versus skill link but that's because it almost always works

note that a physically tanky ground-type should solo a. golem too; galvanize means that self-destruct is electric

[quiet plaza]

nodsnodsnods <- has graveler in her team for this purpose. actually holdon i should post a snapshot at this point

probably move the wildcard to graveler, swap in rocky helmet ferroseed

[digital plaza]

okay I see yes

[quiet plaza]

oh my god the alolan sandslash clicked icicle spear into ferroseed of its own volition. after having seen rocky helmet + iron barbs. entirely unforced error, burglar keith is Not making it to the tournament

[digital plaza]

Yeah I don't think the AI understands the consequences of rocky helmet lol

[sudden roost]

Not even a bit

[digital plaza]

running calcs on the side and this team should 100% have this

biggest problem is plant doubt tbh, but you can probably work around that

[spare pollen]

i think the AI understands rocky helmet at least with single hits ... i remember during samorn her reavor understood not to attack my rocky helmet maractus while at super low health, even though it had a good attack

[quiet plaza]

yeah hes down to just mandibuzz, unfortunately he got stonjourner with plant doubt at a weird time so im not sure if this attempt is the one

[digital plaza]

thought
itemful snom switches easily into plant doubt or cull, and that gives you a turn to chill while it probably goes for knock over drill peck?

[quiet plaza]

GOT IT

PERFECT

stonjourner's just that goated

[digital plaza]

or that could happen lol

[quiet plaza]

soloed while leeched and while out of shore up pp

berserk is insaaaaane

[digital plaza]

yeah berserk is like that lol

[quiet plaza]

keith..... ive surpassed you. your stones are Mine

i didnt even have to resort to chemical warfare about it

the burglar. has been Burgled

[sudden roost]

🍔

[quiet plaza]

the burgerler. has been Burgerled

and now... i claim the powers of exeggutor and [probably mismagius? maybe g. darmanitan or m. polteageist?] for myself...

[sudden roost]

[quiet plaza]

[warm venture]

burglar Keith is not making it to the tournament
Maximilian Pegasus when he disqualifies Bandit Keith from Duelist Kingdom. Can't even be bothered to remember his title smh

[quiet plaza]

sjoidfjLSFJLKDSJKL HELPPPPP

its kind of fun how like
that fight was way less strenuous than the previous 5-mon lvl35 trainer. but it might also just be bc i learned things from that fight...

[quiet plaza]

. tbh with my current dualtribes combo i might as well be collecting the millennium items animated mystic...

oh god the ice stone is actually rlly hard to decide

g. darmanitan, mismagius, and m. sinistea each have one of my two tribes, so theyre the obvious picks for team usage. of them, g. darmanitan is probably best against rafael just going by type matchups (then again, g. darmanitan doesn't go up well against dhelmise or alolan marowak) - i Do also have access to choice scarf, which like. probably(?) makes g. darmanitan very very scary

on the other hand you have alolan ninetales which unlocks. ice beam. on evolve. which is genuinely insane mentor value for like, a nonzero amount of my mons, and alolan ninetales itself is a solid candidate for the wild card

[digital plaza]

tbf the optimal solution here is to simply not use any stones until forced lol

[quiet plaza]

oh true

[digital plaza]

especially with the amount of hot girl shit you're planning, best not to use the resources before absolutely necessary lol

[quiet plaza]

HELPPP okay... yeah... thats true...

[digital plaza]

this is where the damage calculator becomes your best friend lol

[quiet plaza]

somehow this challenge run has turned into me getting mentored in the ways of hot girl shit. this is unambiguously a positive i think

[digital plaza]

very true lol

[quiet plaza]

hmmmm okay. reposts the checklist so i can look at it (and cross off my achievement)

final funny leaf stone gauntlet trainer (lvl 35)

• other funny evo item gauntlets (lvl 35)

• two trainers in nebula ruins (lvl 35)

• keldeo avatar (lvl 30, two dynamite sticks to unlock but i probably do want to unlock)

• helena underleveled

• rafael underleveled (requires doing the velenz digit slip fights first)

• eko ig but like. lets be real here about what is likely to happen

oh the formatting does weird things when u bullet point and strike through smth at once

AH before i forget

victory screenshot, more for posterity than anything (nearly identical to the one above save for ferroseed being here)

okay. i think of the things i have listed, keldeo is like. the most achievable? like, in the sense that i just bring back my eclipse makyan munna sweeper setup and probably win at some point. im testing the waters in nebula ruins first though bc like, if i cant get the other sigil half at lvl 20 then theres not Really a point in prioritizing keldeo right now

[digital plaza]

yeah, keldeo should be fairly simple

it's easier than the legendary dogs and also five levels lower (these things are only semi-related I think)

[quiet plaza]

nodsnodsnods

okay ive discovered that binah can theoretically solo the first nebula trainer's gogoat. the problem being that this thing has a metric ton of hp And leftovers And milk drink so for once im gonna have to spec binah marginally more towards damage instead of just wearing the enemy down through attrition (id still win eventually, but like, it takes wayyyy too long)

peck acquired. back i go

. actually. makes the wise&informed decision of checking if i can get a flying move stronger than peck, first. peck is kinda not all that

[wanton notch]

nor is it a bag of chips

[quiet plaza]

when i sent this message i was admittedly not expecting the answer to be "peck is, in fact, the only flying-type coverage m vullaby gets". so it goes, i suppose

[wanton notch]

wait really

does it at least get drill peck later on

[quiet plaza]

yeah i checked masterdex and its the only flying-type move for both m vullaby and m mandibuzz

[wanton notch]

holy shit

[digital plaza]

tbf that does make sense
it's the kind of thing we'd typically clear to differentiate between regionals etc

but uh, mistakes are made

[sacred gale]

The nefarious stall snom...

[quiet plaza]

the devious stall snom...! (tysm again for your snomful recommendation, ardor has been a vital member of the team)

wait actually. omg. i should show u ardor's namesake

[sacred gale]

Ooh! Yes I'm interested.

[quiet plaza]

its also moth...!

[sacred gale]

Whoa!!!!

[quiet plaza]

https://limbuscompany.wiki.gg/wiki/Ardor_Blossom_Moth

[sacred gale]

I would expect that for volcarona but that's so sick...

I love cool fantasy moths.

[quiet plaza]

theres one other cool image for this moth, btw

[spare pollen]

omg spooky ...

[quiet plaza]

(long story short) in lobotomy corporation, abnos like ardor blossom moth can have EGO - coolswag fantasy equipment - extracted from them

which gives us. ardor blossom star EGO

https://limbuscompany.wiki.gg/wiki/Ardor_Blossom_Star_Ishmael

[quiet plaza]

i thought it was a lil whimsical to name an ice moth after a fire moth. that and the lobcorp naming scheme is more restrictive than id anticipated. im kinda low on names for ice types

[spare pollen]

omg ...

[sacred gale]

This boldly asks, what if a moth was a woman, a question with a beautiful answer each time.

[sacred gale]

I've got no good recommendations, I named my Frosmoth something edgy like Last Dance.

Very good dialogue.

[quiet plaza]

omg last dance... kinda really good <- unbiased fan of edgy names

[sacred gale]

I love doing edgy names.

Sang was actually so real.

[quiet plaza]

YEAH im like
(abbreviating my thoughts so as to not infodump abt unrelated franchise for 1000years) i have Mixed Feelings about limbus being a live service gacha, but the writing still goes hard

[spare pollen]

woah i dont know if we can go that far ....

[sacred gale]

I still need to formally apologize for my Milotic, Drown Envy...

[quiet plaza]

blrblblblblbblbl 😭

[spare pollen]

also i love edgy names too 😔 🙏

[sacred gale]

Getting attached to a gacha story is a fate worse than death, I'm so sorry.

[spare pollen]

this is how i felt about arknights for a while ...

[quiet plaza]

the worst part is that its. the latest game in a series. and the only game in the series thats gacha

[sacred gale]

That's so cruel oh my god.

[quiet plaza]

theres two whole entire real&good games stapled to this awful gachaslop

*mostly awful gachaslop. youll be pleased to know that girl who is a moth is also (in my unbiased, objective opinion) the best character in the game, and has an excellent self-contained story arc

[spare pollen]

i still am proud of my team from pokemon emerald seaglass ..

[quiet plaza]

PEAK

PEAK

SINTHIRST... GUTMULCHER... TURBO SINNER

[sacred gale]

Stopppp I'm gonna wanna play gacha.

TURBO SINNER

[spare pollen]

some of my other good names there were Killblaster the sentret, Organ Failer the spearow, Burier Reef the corsola, and Screamfarmer the dustox

[quiet plaza]

moth im so sorry she has a canonical doomed yuri love interest. shes girl ishmael (like, from moby dick) and she was in yuri with girl queequeg (also from moby dick)

[spare pollen]

i remember seeing tweets and art about these two 😭

[sacred gale]

ENVY STOP PLEASE MY STRENGTH WANES.

[quiet plaza]

and (stray bullet arcs across the room and hits dia) she also has an awful evil toxic yuri thing going on with girl captain ahab (also from moby dick)

[spare pollen]

omg ....

[sacred gale]

I do love evil toxic yuri...

Loooove it when two characters are like a moth and a flame.

[sudden roost]

Oh geez now 3 friends of mine play Limbus XD

[spare pollen]

i cant believe ive been typecast as toxic yuri fan ...

[sudden roost]

Doomed Yuri good

[spare pollen]

say that again ...?

[quiet plaza]

pictured: old woman whos been living inside the belly of an awful horrid whale for like. years and years on end. and is still gaslight gatekeep girlbossing her way through life despite it all. within .3 seconds of meeting ishmael again she manages to get her thorns into her like they were never even apart

[spare pollen]

i remember seeing ishamel art with huhuhhh. faust ?

[sacred gale]

Whoa and she's sick as fuck.

[wanton notch]

my favorite tectonic character

[spare pollen]

i love when evil women can instantly get their thorns back into each other even after so long apart ...

[quiet plaza]

omg... probably like. 2.5 tbh, im not actively playing but i Did play enough that i cant fully say i dont count (and like. i am recounting bits of the plot rn off rip, which has to count for something)

[quiet plaza]

dwdw it was specifically bc its toxic yuri thats also very val mavis esque

[quiet plaza]

. wait oh my god ORGAN FAILER??

holdon holdon reversing the conversation back to dia's edgy names i. oh my god. really really good????

[sacred gale]

I failed my organs, I let them down...

[spare pollen]

ASDKHLCG thank you i was proud of that one ....

me when i forget to exercise 😔

[quiet plaza]

me every day of my life tbh

[spare pollen]

i will never hit the edgy name peaks like i did in emerald seaglass for some reason

[sacred gale]

I can't believe pokemon fans don't exercise.

[warm venture]

Organ failer gang

[sacred gale]

I wish this game had longer nicknames so organ failer could return.

[spare pollen]

i named my totodile Totaldieall ...

[warm venture]

There's a mod for that

[quiet plaza]

theres a longer nicknames mod, right- T

TOTALDIEALL???

[sacred gale]

Oh fun.

[quiet plaza]

dia your brain is so fucking huge what the hell. what the hell

[sacred gale]

I've been too scared to try modding because what if I bungle it.

[quiet plaza]

its like you have four brains. and theyre like... supercomputer mega brains of some sort. like

[spare pollen]

omg youre so right ....

[sacred gale]

Like I do want infinite exp candy for my nuzlocke but what if I somehow click the "delete save file and explode your computer" button.

[spare pollen]

im sorry i invaded your channel to recount my edgy name glory days

[spare pollen]

literally ...

[wanton notch]

isnt this just a feature on dev

[quiet plaza]

never apologize for anything you and your edgy name glory days are always welcome in my channel. especially nostrildamus. especially nostrildamus

[spare pollen]

thank you ..... nostrildamus thanks you as well ...

[quiet plaza]

shes perfect. her name is so beautiful. looking upon your works and despairing /pos rn

[warm venture]

Maybe?? I know Riptide's mod like. Expands it to a ridiculous degree that's too janky to support

[spare pollen]

kind of shit sang is on

[quiet plaza]

NO

OH MY GOD

[spare pollen]

forgive me lkshdgjcsg

[arctic timber]

I'm a fan

[quiet plaza]

im so sorry pokemon tectonic, my favorite pokemon game is quickly becoming looking at dias emerald seaglass nicknames

[spare pollen]

this one was cooking lskjdgh sorry i always crack myself up

[sacred gale]

Perldition goes crazy.

[quiet plaza]

really. really really good

[spare pollen]

;alskdhgg thank you ...

i love pokemon ... 😌

[quiet plaza]

sitting here staring at her sprite imagining im an enemy trainer and i see this thing pop out of a pokeball and tell me to "WEEP IN HELL". i think id be setting my xp candies on the ground and running

[sacred gale]

Even probopass?

[spare pollen]

probopass is steel type be nice to her ........

[quiet plaza]

🥺 what do u have against probopass... my animated/mystic bestie probopass.....

[spare pollen]

ugly people have human rights !!! 💯

[sacred gale]

Your self love is inspiring <3

[spare pollen]

forgive me i was mean to probopass 😭

ASCDKLHASDG HELP

this is why youre my foe .. 😔

[quiet plaza]

OH MY GOD..... chat if a murder takes place in my playthrough thread can i be held legally responsible /silly

[sacred gale]

Imagine someone insults you and someone else steps up to defend you, and they say "ugly people have human rights!!!"

[spare pollen]

JAKLCSDHGALSG

im a probopass ally

[quiet plaza]

youve stunlocked me with this hypothetical i just keep imagining it and going

[warm venture]

His pronouns are they them

[quiet plaza]

nonbinary probopass...

[spare pollen]

if probopass would just lose the mustache they would be perfectly respectable 😔

[wanton notch]

i have come around on the mustache

[warm venture]

The stach is the entire point! Have you never played with iron filings in a science class

[quiet plaza]

my confession at this point is that i do think probopass is cutestyle. admittedly. like the funny historically-accurate hat, and the big aaa nose. and yeah the iron filings stache

[sacred gale]

I dislike the triangle guy.

[warm venture]

Triangles menacingly at you
https://youtu.be/qIZL5qeEKj0

[quiet plaza]

the classics...

[sacred gale]

I will cry.

[warm venture]

Cryangle

[spare pollen]

omg ...

[quiet plaza]

after a few more fruitless first nebula trainer attempts, ive gone off to roam around a bit and. god its kind of insane how relatively doable everything is in comparison to the lvl 35s

[quiet plaza]

oh shell bell shields down minior is Really fun

especially with mystic active. click calm mind (and a rock polish if necessary) while above half health, click attacks when you fall below half health, get a bunch of 25% mystic boosts, sweep

[quiet plaza]

okay i think it’s time to start planning gyms

[come to think of it i don’t actually know if it’s possible to skip gyms. but] i want to do helena at 20, i think

thankfully i have a really strong reason to not do rafael at 20 (i want to use porygon-z) so i dont feel compelled to do hot girl shit there. and i have good options against helena

i used maractus against her last time, and even if maractus is rlly Good against her itd be a bit boring to repeat strategies, so. i might abandon resource conservation and get exeggutor. i rlly rlly want to try out radiate exeggutor at lvl20, ive gotta see how much damage it does

i might check frostflow farms mons and see if theres like… smth really compelling? if there is its entirely possible that i detour to stink bombs for sigil + sequencebreak at level 20

[digital plaza]

you can do gyms in whatever order within the stages of the game (so 1; 2-3-4; 5-6; 7-8)

[quiet plaza]

oooo hellyeah

…admittedly the weird thing abt planning for gyms now is that. the kilna turf trainers kinda scratched my itch for hard fights already

like im not feeling Super motivated to maximize the level of rafael difficulty im gonna suffer through. burglar keith and his crew were basically a cursed gym fight in and of themselves

[digital plaza]

um uh
there are no mystic/animated mons in frostflow????? huh

[quiet plaza]

omg fr??

[digital plaza]

yeah I just looked through the list

[quiet plaza]

huh

[digital plaza]

we don't pay that much attention to tribes with this sort of thing, I think, so it's not that surprising
but I just assumed that there would be one or two at least

[quiet plaza]

yeah nodsnods. frostflow also just vibewise doesnt match up Super well with mystic/animated, so this makes sense

[digital plaza]

I just assumed that like oranguru or girafarig or castform or something would be one oof them lol

but no

only one is flabebe in carnation tower and you can already catch that

[quiet plaza]

nodsnods

in that case ig my path is even clearer

• figure out if theres any more super useful and/or super fun stone evos i want to grab pre-helena. if so, bust out anti-avatar eclipse strats and/or stink bombs to grab them
• gyms… at long last…

(ill probably still do the sequence break at some point pre-yez 3 for the novelty value / bc i want the achievement, but like. since theres nothing in frostflow for this run it can wait)

[digital plaza]

yeah it makes sense to do so at the 25 or 30 cap I think

especially since the frostflow hot girl shit trainers are at the 40 cap

[quiet plaza]

[digital plaza]

That's typically when I do the optional stuff; 20 is real hot girl shit

IMO the "correct" timing is 25 for the avatars and 30 for the stones

[warm venture]

25 is nice because like. Eko is right there. It's free battle report. But it makes doing anything at 20 all the more powerful

[quiet plaza]

i think whats made doing things at 20 feel really satisfying to me is like. the amount of really useful evos that are gated behind the 25 cap in particular. like, theres only a few things that are intended to evolve at 20 - it makes getting single-stages and stone evos feel really, like, “i am Not supposed to have this rn”

[warm venture]

Yeagh!

25 is quite the breakpoint. For example it lets zubat evolve into golbat so a team of 6 can suck Suicune to death fjajfjsj

[quiet plaza]

akdjfjfkFKDKDDKDK

ancient dog with primordial strength vs. 6 hungry bats

[warm venture]

A strat I've done multiple times because 6 of a good matchup and 3 tribes is easier than cooking a real line

[digital plaza]

a strat that we're killing on dev I think

[warm venture]

Probably

It's on earlier Dev builds that I've done it, mind. But yeah

[digital plaza]

we also just made some changes to make Suicune less of a pushover rn lol

(right now on live you can basically stop it with a bunch of special defenders because its movespread is all special and not great into resistances)

[quiet plaza]

a plan is taking shape for rafael <- girl whos realized that. with its signature, porygon-z can freely stack -spa debuff on itself without consequence. and then... topsy-turvy can be available for mentoring via malamar water stone... and ive got access to stuff that can learn it (notably probopass, also turtonator + some other animated mons)

okay so i think the dream is now. level 25 rafael with porygon-z eventually getting topsy-turvied up to +8/+12 spa and critical error'ing all over his team

honestly probably this means that the eventual team comp is just. lead porygon-z and [smth that either clicks follow me or clicks protect while baiting both enemies into attacking a type weakness]. and then find a line that gets porygon-z at -12 spa and smth with topsy-turvy on the field

[quiet plaza]

(tangentially related to the suicune conversation bc i Did go hmm lets start by checking the water stone evos bc of it)

.
. hm bellossom is actually a rlly notable mystic pick from sun stone. choreography bellossom with smolder rave from evo seems like a really, really good way to sweep

[digital plaza]

dawn stone is probably more interesting lol
water stone does have malamar for topsy turvy but unfortunately water mons are not amazing into Raf lol

Shouldn't be that bad though given he's secretly fire type

[quiet plaza]

dawn stone... gigachu is. rlly funny, for one. and also gargantuan + ghost immunity probably has usage in rafael as a bulky support
froslass is the only thing in my tribes but froslass is awesome (if not particularly well-suited against either helena or rafael. or eko tbh. unless im missing smth which is entirely possible)

musharna

sugar ball on evo, which is presumably quite strong when clicked by musharna
solid tank stats plus dreamy haze... and calm mind...

(and like, mystic, so doesnt need wild card)

wait lmao and if i go exeggutor then it has. sugar ball / psychic stabs setup

at level 20

theoretically its competing against above it all delcatty for stone utility, which from what ive heard abt delcatty is a losing battle, but
its a mystic/animated run so like. musharna gets points for thematic cohesion

[warm venture]

i love delcatty but finding something cool to do that isn't falling back on Above It All is real gamer shit

[quiet plaza]

shiny stone is pretty solid too, nothing i can use immediately but (in terms of on-tribe mons) florges at 25 and aegislash if i wait until 30

time to velenz gauntlet it up. this time im just aiming for beating the first trainer, ill test the waters with the second but im fine with just stink bombing this one

[sacred gale]

You can't skip gyms, but you can do them in the order of 1-4-3-2-6-5-8-7 if you want.

[sacred gale]

Mayhaps I should have scrolled a single message down.

[digital plaza]

gigachu is really good into raf, can confirm

follow me is actually much more important than gargantuan believe it or not
follow me + wish to restore HP

[quiet plaza]

oooooo nodsnodsnods

gigachu follow me/wish/volt switch to pivot into a topsy-turvy user when porygon-z needs the boost... it Does have to be holding wild card, so no item slot, but it has moveslot healing so thats not too much of an issue

[digital plaza]

it doesn't actually get volt switch lol

probably doesn't need it though tbh; you get a lot of mileage out of a bulky support in doubles I've found

[wanton notch]

bro just sits there

and eats spread moves like they aint shit

[digital plaza]

this is my most recent raf, for reference to what it does
(dev but there's nothing special here)

[digital plaza]

weirdly enough, follow me + gargantuan to protect a partner entirely doesn't come up nearly as much as you'd think. I did an entire run where I leaned hard on gigachu for basically every doubles fight and I think it came up like three times, max?
(this is for envy's reference; jess has heard this several times by now lol)

[quiet plaza]

oooo nodsnods

[wanton notch]

qa testing be like

[quiet plaza]

hmm..... sitting here staring at probopass going. what to do with you

[sacred gale]

Donation box <3

[sour birch]

so true

it wishes it was m jellicent so bad

donation box for inferior attacking stat trappers

[quiet plaza]

u cant kick me when im down like this......

[quiet plaza]

i thought it was gonna be way better than it has been tbh. i didnt inspect its movepool closely enough

[sour birch]

rock/steel type having an ability that wants to be defensive...

not getting recovery....

what does this thing even do when it traps things

[sacred gale]

They die from how ugly it is...

[spare pollen]

sorry she'll never be her ...

[quiet plaza]

[quiet plaza]

i love her... dia u know i love her... but surely probopass can be a little usable too... she deserves to be a little usable too...

[spare pollen]

maybe .... maybe ..

[sacred gale]

Envy if you find a way to use probopass please tell me I'm desperate.

(Stuck with one in my nuzlocke)

[quiet plaza]

moth im actively typing up a post in #🗣-player-feedback rn bc this is the first mon where ive actively gone "i think this movepool needs Something desperately"

[spare pollen]

theyre killing passive trapping soon right ... probopass rebalance is on its way ..

[sacred gale]

Oh I've got that feeling with Makyan Mantine, I should make a callout post for it too.

[sudden roost]

[spare pollen]

all these callout posts ... the left is tearing itself apart ...

[sacred gale]

Steel type
Defensive
Ability focused on weather
Doesn't get take shelter

[spare pollen]

purity testing smh ...

[sacred gale]

If you complete a bounty you get to make one request for the game. Gonna claim one and request probopass remain unviable.

[quiet plaza]

redoing this run and recording all my clears so i can race u to the finish line and request that [remembers my existing allegiances] steel types become immune to ground moves,

[sacred gale]

You dare side with Dia instead of I...

This shan't be forgotten.

Dia, my age old enemy.

[spare pollen]

im just never wrong im afraid ... especially about the glory of steel ...

[quiet plaza]

i'll take up my blade in service of a just cause... for the honor of steel types...!

[sacred gale]

Then die surrounded by molten slag and the failures of the future.

[wanton notch]

sorry the request has to be within reason

[wanton notch]

the only valid requests in this vein would be making steel type worse

[sudden roost]

[sacred gale]

To argue against the doomed future of steel, you point to a pokemon of the past? How shortsighted...

[wanton notch]

like you could wish for psychic to resist steel or something

[spare pollen]

what if ... i wish for psychic to resist ground and fire ....

[wanton notch]

sorry that doesn't make steel type worse

[spare pollen]

😱

[sacred gale]

It buffs a counter to steel!

That's worse by increased viability of a counter!

[spare pollen]

exactlyyyy

[quiet plaza]

the logic checks out...

[sacred gale]

Wait I don't wanna side with you two fools. Nvm ignore that.

[spare pollen]

moth, my age old ally ..

😭

[sacred gale]

Oh yeah my ally!

[spare pollen]

moth , my enemy ..

[sacred gale]

For sure!

[quiet plaza]

[sacred gale]

Oh :(

[spare pollen]

omg the whiplash ..

moth my ally again ..

[quiet plaza]

okay returns from the realm of player-feedback. to once more ponder what the hell im gonna do with this probopass

[sudden roost]

Pat it on the heads

[quiet plaza]

TRUE

[wanton notch]

use him as a doubles trapper for someone else to leverage

[quiet plaza]

ALSO TRUE

[sudden roost]

Also. Ion storm

[wanton notch]

also ||[REDACTED]||

[quiet plaza]

yeah im thinking abt it and. iron storm is probably my best bet at the moment. click sandstorm, click some combo of protect + embrittle, have leftovers for an amount of recovery

[quiet plaza]

okay yeah iron storm feels significantly better immediately. doesnt work on mons with recovery (the lvl 35 ampharos i tested it on), and it could still rlly use a good healing option, but the passive damage is there

[quiet plaza]

yeah okay i think this marks the end of my eschewing level-cap increases. im so, so very excited to devour a battle report and watch the gap between my mons' damage and survivability and every single enemy's damage and survivability finally start to decrease

helena's days are numbered. i Am detouring to pick up a third stink bomb for the velenz gauntlet first though, i want that musharna

turning my back on the dual blessing/curse of unlimited hot girl shit... its time for. chemical warfare

me and the bestie :]

💀 sleep talk hit rest two times in a row. okay sleepyhead we're switching you to a different set

discoveries:

• sugar ball's base power is highly variable
• it kinda doesnt matter because musharna hits like an absolute truck after a few calm minds, and dreamy haze is rlly rlly good

• okay yeah iron storm probopass is the way to go. i dont think i was like, off the mark with my disappointment (not having a recovery move on this thing is sad), but iron storm + active trapping move feels so much better than whatever i was doing before

like even without a dedicated sand team clicking sandstorm is basically just amnesia + passive damage. and from there, passive trapping moves is good, protect with leftovers and passive damage is good

okay. the biggest threat on helena's team is kingler, because kingler has u-turn and both of the things i want to be making use of in this fight are critically weak to bug
corollary: i just need to find a route through this fight that kills the shit out of kingler the instant it hits the field. and thankfully its wearing (i think?) the vest that buffs def, aka the vest that doesnt help stop it from getting killed the instant it hits the field

[quiet plaza]

DONE

finally... ive earned it... my second battle report

as a bonus, as per the rules im still loosely following this means my run is now ✨ officially locked in ✨ as animated/mystic dualtribe

making good progress in the field of maximizing helena humiliation also. considering i beat her at a five-level disadvantage And with a team full of illicitly acquired stone evos

finally... porygon-z

fucked up in the club on Dubious Disc i mean on Dusk Stone

oh my god she does. so much damage now. holy shit

like i mean... a large part of this is that ive been fighting lvl 35 trainers for so long that it feels ridiculous to see normal damage numbers

but also. 113 damage critical error on random neutral-resist wild pokemon feels good as hell

the new walking-around team... finally taking advantage of animated life orb synergies now that it isnt entirely unreasonable to run things that are fast and do damage

[spare pollen]

hell yea !!!

animated life orb is really neat

[quiet plaza]

next door suitemate's nightly phonecall with his long distance girlfriend is fueling my existing sleeping difficulties tonight and keeping me awake. instead of. expressing this anger. i am going to play tectonic, and take solace in the knowledge that i have finally ordered earplugs and they will arrive monday

[wanton notch]

hell yeah

[quiet plaza]

surely clicking critical error on some hapless enemy pokemon will soothe my inflamed-by-sensory-issues soul

[wanton notch]

just listen to some loud beep boop music

[quiet plaza]

thankfully tectonic contains both engaging/distracting gameplay and pleasant beep boop music

</3 avatar of suicune did not fare. exceptionally well. against sleepyhead and tough

(and special guest star CV psychic chesed the baltoy, here to click eclipse and light screen every so often)

beautiful creature...... welcome to the team slothtiger

(a solid handful of the lobcorp employee names are backer-submitted. theres some good ones in there)
(im not sure if ill be adhering to the lobcorp naming scheme for the Entire run but like. when im in the mood for it ill take a glance through the various name lists available to me)

okay entei was way more touch-and-go but we got there in the end. much thanks to slothtiger

its time to weigh options

water stone

on-tribe: politoed and slowking. neither are... super attractive against rafael, at first glance? realist slowking is a nice spdef tank at least, and selective memory is a funny move

mentoring: malamar gives topsy-turvy which has obvious option value vs rafael. on the other hand, unclear whether malamar will see literally any use beyond that

others: vaporeon, floatzel, mantine. technician floatzel hits hard, matches up horribly into rafael; mantine is a speed buffer in doubles and a spdef tank, which does sound useful. vaporeon... ehhhhh. not against rafael and im not sure if it sees use against anything else, even

[sacred gale]

Noise is so evil. The world should be silent.

[quiet plaza]

FR..... pleasepleaseplease silent world forever&ever. too many noises. its bad design

[sacred gale]

Supervillain origin story where people are just too fucking loud (chewing near me).

[sacred gale]

Mantine seems super nice for raf. It can hit grass, and it resists the many fire moves. Also raf tends towards special attacks so mantine tanks even more.

Not weak to anything except whichever mon has adapress.

[quiet plaza]

ooooo nodsnodsnods... noted noted. tbh i Do like the idea of being able to buff porygon-z's speed without spending a moveslot on agility, also

admittedly i. kind of do also like the idea of topsy-turvying porygon-z up to +12 spa, though. the dream calls to me. ill see what im feeling come rafael though

[sacred gale]

I think that sounds evil and devious.

And also super fun.

But my rec is still mantine because it does so well for raf imo.

Gets grey mist too I think?

But you seem set on a funkier way to deal with the curse.

[quiet plaza]

- oh shit grey mist... thats kinda huge yeah. tbh its entirely possible that when im actually testing against rafael, i go "okay porygon-z doesnt need any spa buffs, its mantine time"

like critical error with lorb and adaptive boosts is. a lot, even at a five-level disadvantage. fitting a way to go past +0 in my line might not even be necessary

fire stone

on-tribe: ninetales, drifblim, chandelure. ninetales is what my eye's immediately drawn to, it's a rlly solid spdef tank and also like. feedback + hi-vis is a classic. but on the other hand chandelure is literally chandelure so. it might have to be chandelure time once again. drifblim also looks cool, it gets grey mist setting for funky strats or unburden for hyperspeed, but like. idk ninetales and chandelure are really strong competition to be up against

im not really feeling arcanine, magmortar, or flareon rn tbh. like the on-tribe options for this stone are just So Good

sun stone

on-tribe: its bellossom gaming time!! 50 bp fire special attack thats also lightning dance...... we are so fucking back

uhhh theres also whimsicott. if i really want cotton decoy strats. but like... bellossom gaming time...

like im not even expecting to run bellossom into rafael necessarily, i just want bellossom gaming. i want it

[sacred gale]

Bell is so cool.

Whimsi is my baby but bell does so much work it seems nuts.

I vote chandelure for the ninetales vs chandy fire stone, but they're both so cool...

[quiet plaza]

yeah i think im also voting chandelure just bc. i mean. royal majesty and bonkers spa. (also you Have won me over on mantine, on the basis of "the more i think abt it the more i want to actually be using my stone evos in the team" which means i have a spdef tank already in the pipeline)

shiny stone is weird bc like

superseding basically all else, theres the bit where. i have the possibility to run ampharos-with-held item if i [4x mystic/animated dualtribe mons] [1x wildcard mon] [ampharos]. which seems incredibly valuable moreso than with like, any other mon, just bc. it's ampharos. it even benefits meaningfully from mystic being active

...that said, florges is a really really good on-tribe spdef tank, even if its also yet another 4x bug weakness. and if i save the shiny stone until 30 cap (which is looking likely), i get to mess around with aegislash. who benefits Immensely from mystic being active, id assume, just bc of how aegislash works

ill probably save until 30 and then aegislash bc like. ive already made this call once with musharna vs delcatty - all else aside, this is a funny theme challenge run, i should be using funny themed mons

but im leaving florges on the table in case i decide that i really want another spdef tank with florges's specific stuff for whatever reason

[sacred gale]

Yeah! I say give aegi a whirl, such a uniquely mystic benefitting mon.

Florges has so many weaknesses, not sure it'll do much for you in raf.

Like look at every mon, who does it actually wall? Whimsi? Is that it?

[quiet plaza]

holy shit youre right this is so. funny

[sacred gale]

Bell is a fire type, ori has flying moves, dhel is steel, alolawak fire, minetales steel.

She cannot do shit.

[quiet plaza]

if it helps im moreso considering it for like, after-raf use (but like. by that point im well on the way to having unlimited stones anyways)

[sacred gale]

Yeah, these should primarily be considered for raf imo.

[sour birch]

pre-raf stones are for raf, yez 3 i guess, and pubstomping

[sacred gale]

Even without infinite stones surf gives you another of each.

[quiet plaza]

the surf-ful stones...

yeah in terms of raf usage alone. titanix togekiss ampharos rubarior. and functionally theyre competing with mantine for a wild card slot

. OH WAIT LMAO i forgot

gigachu wild card already

yeah sorry mantine </3 i nearly forgot abt the hyperspecific run condition im under

[sacred gale]

Maybe next run 😔

[quiet plaza]

okay so the team rn is

porygon-z critical error sweeper
gigachu wildcard bulky support, follow me + wish + some other shit (protect and nuzzle rn)
probopass (presumably, since its a premium animated/mystic mon. probably CVed to an appropriate defensive typing. CV flying probopass back-to-back victories letsgooooooo-)
stonjourner (presumably, since its a premium animated/mystic mon. probably swap it to a power spot set for this)
chandelure aux sweeper, animated slot
[mystic mon?]

[sour birch]

porygon-z the fairest and balancedest rafael mon

exciting..

[sacred gale]

You should slot grey mist in somewhere because pory cannot do all the work.

[sour birch]

balancing it yourself by not beating eko

[quiet plaza]

ah shit right the curse is still a thing. ive been thinking abt porygon-z so much i nearly forgot

[quiet plaza]

tbf if im not mantine-ing it up i can absolutely slot topsy-turvy in on probopass for some hyperboost action

which probably also helps like. things that arent porygon-z, divinely blessed with autocrit,

[sacred gale]

Look what you've done...

[quiet plaza]

ahoisfjOSJFKLSJFKLSDJKLFD

this is karmic justice for ur probopass slander earlier. mantine's water stone is being used to make probopass stronger + more valuable

[sacred gale]

Mantine should be used to make probopass feel bad and worthless.

Probopass should see a being of such immense joy and go :(

[quiet plaza]

idk moth i really dont think mantyke's statline is gonna cut it against raf... 365 bst is pretty low for this stage of the game...

[sour birch]

one day i will click grey mist on rafael

i have not done so yet...

[quiet plaza]

if only there was a way to evolve mantyke somehow. sadly whenever i tab over to that bit of the masterdex it redirects me to malamar's moveset

[sour birch]

you can evolve mantyke with the water stones that are only accessible post-surf

[sacred gale]

I have a massive soft spot for running mantyke when you really shouldn't (I tried it in ou when I was like 12) so I support this.

[sour birch]

secret mechanic says you can't use the pre-surf one

[quiet plaza]

ohhh ic ic thanks ai! i guess i have no choice then. no mantine against raf... what a shame...

[sacred gale]

Envy what if... hear me out... you used mantine?

Pros:

• Cute
• Friendly
• Huggable
• Will cry otherwise

Cons:

• None

[quiet plaza]

.
. wait is mantyke even accessible pre-surf

<- girl who forgets what the ??? location is

[sacred gale]

Oh uh.

Lmao.

[quiet plaza]

oh my god.

[sacred gale]

Just use mantyke cmon.

[quiet plaza]

ahsoifjLSDKJFLKDFLDJK

i think

this is

the funniest shit

that has happened in recent memory

[sacred gale]

Just use mantyke??? It's really good for this gym. Idk why no one else has tried it.

I am so smart.

[quiet plaza]

WAIT AI WAS RIGHT

OH MY GOD

SECRET MECHANIC....

[sacred gale]

WHOA....

[quiet plaza]

the secret mechanic that prevents u from using ur pre-surf water stone on mantyke.... it was real all along........

[sour birch]

oh right mantyke isn't accessible pre-surf i forgot

i have reason to know this....

< girl who stared at list of mons not accessible pre-surf recently

[quiet plaza]

god im like. a little sad now. the mantine strat was so real in my mind by that point in the conversation

[wistfully staring out the nearest window] we could have had it all, you and i... imaginary mantine... i could have given u the wild card. u could have buffed porygon-z's speed

[sacred gale]

You weren't even gonna use mantine!!!

You had kicked her to the curb!

[quiet plaza]

post-surf mantyke: i would have loved to fight rafael with you

[sacred gale]

Mantyke you never gave the water stone: I would have given all your pokemon speed boosts...

[quiet plaza]

nonzero chance that i run a wild card mantine at some point entirely bc of this conversation. like how can i not by this point

that or i name a mantyke WaterStone and leave her in the box forever. it could go either way really

[sacred gale]

That would be MEAN.

[quiet plaza]

it would be evil of me... i dont think ill actually do it. but i Do think she might wind up being named WaterStone

[sacred gale]

Name her... womantine...

She transitioned.

[quiet plaza]

WAIT TRUE

ill do this. because im a #feminist

[sacred gale]

You wanted to put her in a box.

#feminism

[quiet plaza]

I WAS LYING 😭 I SAID IT AS AN EVIL JOKE... A VILE&VICIOUS JEST...

[sacred gale]

It can't be undone.

[quiet plaza]

wild card mantine: i would have stayed a mantyke and roamed around your pokestate...

[sacred gale]

Okay to clarify we're both riffing on the aborted baby meme right?

[quiet plaza]

yeahyeah

im glad u got the riff i was worried it wouldnt come across bc of missing the main identifying factor

[sacred gale]

You aborted your mantyke... you really are a feminist.

[quiet plaza]

HELP

JELP

HLEP

HELP

#FEMINISM

aborted mantyke: i would have been catchable pre-surf...

[sacred gale]

#FEMINISM

#feminism has always been one of my favorite stupid things to tack onto a sentence.

It's so good.

[quiet plaza]

its so good. its everything to me

[sacred gale]

Wow, that's everything to you?

Personally to me my everything is women but y'know. You do you.

#feminism

[quiet plaza]

i would never call women "my" everything... women are independent and free #feminism

[sacred gale]

Fuck.

You're right.

I'm sorry women.

[quiet plaza]

i'm also sorry women.

[sacred gale]

Anyway this convo distracted me from my nuzlocke where I was gonna try to fight a level 48 team at level 40, and now it has been long enough that I realize that is a terrible terrible idea even with my perfect counter team.

Thank you for saving me. #feminism

[quiet plaza]

youre welcome... i would do anything for women #feminism

also i think the mantine's name has to be #feminism now. its essential. holdon im gonna test if u can put # in a name

[sacred gale]

I think ya can.

[quiet plaza]

yeah the dream is alive

[quiet plaza]

the temptation to do hot girl shit is so real...

[spare pollen]

this conversation is so enlightening i love feminism #feminism

[sacred gale]

This hot girl shit has hot girl consequences.

[quiet plaza]

i dont think girls should ever face consequences. regardless of how hot they are #feminism

[sacred gale]

You're so right.

Volcarona won't QD on me because she's a feminist.

[quiet plaza]

tbh beyond the usual reasons ive never finished a nuzlocke (i play messy, + permaconsequences makes me anxious and play worse) tectonic nuzlocke would probably go especially disastrously for me bc. especially after the shit ive done this run, the hot girl shit is just too tempting

[warm venture]

I thought I remembered a good joke with #feminism in another server and realised that due to discord's... "generous" search it was including "feminize" lmao

[quiet plaza]

omg

[sacred gale]

Feminize is feminism.

[sacred gale]

Tectonic is pretty easy early game, I think it's a nice one to get into even if you don't nuzlocke.

Gives you time to get attached to your pokemon and build up a stockpile.

Before the reckoning (lategame difficulty spike).

[quiet plaza]

nodsnodsnods... ill take this into consideration <- girl who trusts your opinions on things

tentatively adding nuzlocke to the pile of "runs that might be fun as breaks from dualtribes"

[sour birch]

discord fuzzy matching......

[warm venture]

It's such a pain

[wanton notch]

LISTEN WE ARE WORKING ON IT

do you have any idea how many godforsaken saltwater creatures there are in pokemon

[sudden roost]

Too many XD

[wanton notch]

and makya is not an island in the pacific like japan is so it is hard to find room for all of them

[sudden roost]

We have plans though!

12 more saltwater fish trades

[wanton notch]

so we got Archie on the dev team and he told us we just need to sink Velenz all the way into the ocean

[sudden roost]

I support this

[quiet plaza]

okay yeah porygon-z is. oh my god. the amount of sauce on this thing

[sudden roost]

Its so beepo

@distant rock beepo love here

Be autistic

https://tenor.com/view/porygon-z-pokémon-dancing-lock-on-headbanging-gif-87593109394661149

[sacred gale]

I love malware duck.

[quiet plaza]

its so swagful... porygon-z instantly carrying my team to the point where im like, okay, i was correct to structure like 75% of my rafael plan around it. and shes literally cute too

[distant rock]

porygon z is my favourite pokemon!

iu can give you many silly movesets if you want

[quiet plaza]

omg... id love to see silly movesets

[distant rock]

my favourite is probably
adapted
held item exhaust herb

• hyper beam
• last resort
• no 3rd or 4th move

[quiet plaza]

oh my god

thats so. peak

[distant rock]

nuclear bomb

phantom gate + critical error is also a good combo, as the always-crit of error bypasses the spatk down

[sudden roost]

https://tenor.com/view/porygon-porygon-z-pokemon-glitter-gif-14180210282381971352

[wanton notch]

baha blas

[quiet plaza]

ooooo nodsnodsnods <- girl whos planning on making good use of critical error's spa-debuff bypass against raf

alright, path to raf cleared. now to assemble the team

[sudden roost]

The Raf Path?

[quiet plaza]

the Raf Path

okay slowking is. not a terrible option, actually, as i think about it

realist slowking is a spdef tank with two weaknesses that gets psyche switch to pivot, follow me bc. its follow me, slack off for healing, and. a fourth move of some kind

so im basically weighing slowking against topsy-turvy. the main issue i see is that i have two sweepers (chandelure and porygon-z) and a whole bunch of support mons. porygon-z doesnt rlly Need topsy-turvy but chandelure would really like it

on the other hand, probopass is the only thing that learns follow me in the mystic tribe (aside from post-surf spinda), so its one move on one mon, and thatd necessitate me getting probopass on the field when it doesnt rlly have other utility than topsy-turvy and. helping hand? baiting ground-type attacks into protect?

my concern is that if i commit to slowking and then realize midway through that the gameplan isnt coming together with just two sweepers, i cant go back and get follow me
with this in mind, i think im gonna enter the testing phase now, and just. see how this setup feels so far. how much mileage i can get

[sacred gale]

Make a separate save before using the stones?

[quiet plaza]

OH true...

[sacred gale]

My genius is unparalleled and unperpendiculared.

[quiet plaza]

wait omg chandelure can learn grey mist. also

okay we might be in business...

[sacred gale]

Lots of ghosts can iirc.

[quiet plaza]

nodsnodsnods

[sacred gale]

Wait burning jealousy chandelier might go crazy for raf damn.

So many boosts.

[quiet plaza]

wait omg true... i was gonna click white flame but. burning jealousy
i might stick with white flame to start though just bc. raf's fire types dont get burned, and the rest dont have much burn value unless i use light trick (and... royal majesty...)

[spare pollen]

Burning jealousy is a spread move too I believe ..

[quiet plaza]

oh yeah ik, im. how do i put this. im taking the spread move damage penalty into account when thinking abt it

like, that burning jealousy is functionally 52.5bp (if ive done my math right) against any individual target vs white flame's 90 bp (and then plus stab for both, etc etc)

[sacred gale]

That's true that's true.

And actually BJ only burns ninetales and oricorio.

Hm that is perhaps not a great abbreviation.

[quiet plaza]

omg

[wanton notch]

rafael's secret fire typing

[quiet plaza]

okay so. current gameplan: lead with chandelure and gigachu, bc porygon-z is a really really solid switch-in for chandelure - ideally i switch porygon-z in and it nulls a ghost-type attack or two

fire gem-boosted white flame only barely fails to OHKO bellossom. this is where the 5-level disadvantage really starts to make itself known, i think

[sacred gale]

Just crit?

[quiet plaza]

oh true