Maybe take a look at Dino tamer?!

[heady narwhal]

Can we talk about how Dino Tamer is basically left behind and outclassed by everything?

The pets hit like they’re throwing pillows, the basic attack might as well be a nerf gun, and your damage outside of ult is so bad you start questioning your life choices. And when you finally pop the ult? Congrats you get 15 seconds of pretending you’re doing something... until the cooldown hits and you’re back to sad cowboy mode.

Did the devs just forget this class exists? Because it feels like it got left in 2018 and never looked back.

[zinc stag]

And worst part is u can’t vac on Dino in delves either. Yes why are you using DT in delves but it’s just a stab in the back. The second u swap it kicks you off ult and u gotta spam flasks to get it back.

[heady narwhal]

Like man, its such a struggle without the ult you are basically useless. And lets not forget the ult cooldown you basically have to use the cooldown ally and a flask just to be able to do damage again.

[zinc stag]

Tbh the flask and cooldown ain’t bad even without cd ally. I’m usually popping 2 flasks per ult with trailblazing and chrono. So it ain’t horrible but the ult breaking when u go into build mode or geode mode sucks

[heady narwhal]

I would agree with you but a whole class relying entirely on his ult to become somewhat useful for 15 seconds while STILL being outdamaged by most speed farmers just seems insane to me like imagine being totally useless until you ult to be a DECENT speedfarmer just to go back to being the weakest of them all

[zinc stag]

Ye should just up the damage fix the ult bug and fix the minion Dino’s and DT would be useful lol

[heady narwhal]

Exactly, perfect explanation of what this class needs

[zinc stag]

Ohh and make the net spawn when u throw minions cause we never use that net cause when we throw it we have to wind it up for a bigger area net not more dmg

Pluss the net is just bad anyway

[urban basin]

Giving me ideas to main him tbh

[heady narwhal]

Yesss truee

[modest hawk]

Charging it up only applies outside the ult

Ult net however is quite good

Also the damage dino tamer deals isn't as low as you think

2280% MD/s on the spit compared to SH's 2400% PD/s

And the net adds an extra 950% MD/s

Dino Tamer deals more consistent dps than SH on top of dealing area damage

Buffing the dino minions from the 1 Ability and possibly making enemies who are affected by the net DoT reduce the ult cooldown when defeated

[heady narwhal]

You forgot to mention you have to hit the net and it only lasts for 5 seconds

[modest hawk]

yeah but the net itself doesn't deal any direct damage

and directly hitting enemies with your basic attack resets the DoT timer

so for bosses, you only need to cast the net once

[heady narwhal]

So if you cast your net once on bosses you keep doing the increased damage if its not there?

[modest hawk]

the net simply applies damage over time

i'm guessing the duration is 6 seconds, but if you hit them with the spit, the duration gets reset

there's also a ring effect that increases damage dealt to enemies by 15%(?)

if you really want some extra damage

[winged dune]

Wrong

[modest hawk]

tell me how i'm wrong then

[winged dune]

DT deals 4.75x from the basic attack if you hit the target directly (2.75x direct hit + 2.00x splash damage). DT Attack per second at max AS is 1.6 so 4.75 at 1.6 APS. SH deals 2.00x damage per basic attack at 12.00 APS. If you want to count the passive which gives you a 1x damage explosion as you shoot and gives one seeker stack as well which can adds up to 5 stacks which deals 45x damage!! as far as i know this is the highest damage ability in the game even higher than BR's meteorite which deals 35x.

So if both DT and SH are at 20m coeff:
DT: 20 x 4.75 x 1.6 = 152m DPS
SH: 20 x 2 x 12 = 480m DPS
If you add the DT net which does 4.75x damage every half a second for 4.5 seconds so it does 9.5x damage in the first 4 seconds then a 4.75x damage in the last half a second which adds up to
DT: 20 x 4.75 x 1.6 x 9.5 = 1444m DPS
Now yes the DPS of the DT with the net is higher than the DPS of the SH but consider that the net does take the animation time to put it down, plus the small throwing range which won't let you throw the nets regularly while you farming and you need to be on top of the enemy to put the net down and it has small AOE so it won't be affecting every enemy specially at skulls and i did not count SH's passive and seekers which out burst DT's DPS. So i won't call DT a more consistent damage dealer than SH.

[modest hawk]

uuuh could you explain this part

the 4.75 x 1.6

[winged dune]

just adding up the damage numbers + APS

[modest hawk]

but that's with the base 100% AS though

[winged dune]

is it

[modest hawk]

yeah

1.6 is the base attackspeed

[winged dune]

sh won't be affected

[modest hawk]

so it should be 456m dps

[winged dune]

no it does not

it is at max attack speed

[modest hawk]

it shoots 4.8 times per second at 300% attackspeed

[winged dune]

im not sure tbh

but from where you get that number

[modest hawk]

and the net DoT lasts pretty much forever as long as you keep landing basic attacks

this isn't 1.6 per second

[winged dune]

yeah you are right

it is 1.6 at 100%

so times 3 which will be 4.8 APS at 300% AS

[modest hawk]

also DoT duration being refreshed on basic attack hit

[winged dune]

even on ult?

[modest hawk]

yup

[winged dune]

was it always like this

[modest hawk]

always has been

[winged dune]

i did not know

[modest hawk]

7 ticks of damage over 3 seconds

refreshed when hit

[winged dune]

i see

DT's dps is better than what i thought then

[modest hawk]

the net seems to roughly have a 2.5-block radius

and the basic attack explosion is surprisingly huge

[winged dune]

splash is just 2x damage

[modest hawk]

5-block radius on basic attack explosion

9.6x per second in such a large area is quite good for a farming class

[winged dune]

they won't nerf other classes so i dont mind a buff to DT even if his DPS is good currently

[winged dune]

yeah the radius is huge

[modest hawk]

only real issue are the dino minions and the usual overreliance on chrono emblem

other than that, the class is fine

the taunt dino is kind of nice but a little annoying to make use of

[heady narwhal]

Which one?

Also i recently swapped all my stuff to my gunslinger and i literally do so much more damage with him which seems pretty insane considering that gs is one of the weakest of the bunch nowadays

[heady narwhal]

Exactly, just a small push to get him back and updated

[pseudo steppe]

i love the concept of DT, its my favorite MD class, but i wish he wasnt so clunky, its already such a nerf to not be able to switch to a mount during his ult,

for example i wish ult duration would extend, maybe by 1sec everytime your pets hit something, or you kill something, then he would at least be more viable for farming.

And you could even combine that with your ult auto summuning your pets when you first activate it.

[modest hawk]

Deep Wounds or something

a little unsure of what the exact damage increase is, but i believe it is either 10% or 15%

[heady narwhal]

i thought that effect was for its pets

[heady narwhal]

yess that would be a great buff tbh

[modest hawk]

basically any damage applies it

[heady narwhal]

ooo woww i did not know that

[vital cobalt]

Imagine debating with Gutt over damage

You guys do not know what you have brought upon yourselves

[modest hawk]

you underestimate my autism

nearly 13 years of trove is maybe not a good thing

[vital cobalt]

[modest hawk]

12 years and 4 months

[heady narwhal]

we just want a buff man

[eager yew]

DT is super fine, the only real issue is dinos being useless

[winged dune]

it is 5%

from all sources so even other players will get +5% damage

since it is a debuff to the mob

[modest hawk]

doesn't seem worth it then if it is only 5%

oh that reminds me of the t-rex ring effect

it could use a damage tweak

it deals 2 different amounts of damage, one being really strong when further away from enemies, the other being incredibly weak when right next to enemies

would like to see the lower damage one be bumped up to be equal to the higher damage attack

also it spawns a t-rex when you manually end the ult too, which is weird

could be remembering wrong, but i think the damage multipliers were 1x or 12x respectively

[heady narwhal]

And the damage too

[modest hawk]

damage is fine

[heady narwhal]

Thats the problem

Why fine when good exists?

[modest hawk]

fine as in it doesn't need to be adjusted

[eager yew]

Dino Tamer's damage is among the "highest" on magical damage ngl

the real low ones on damage are CB, Neon Ninja and Bard

Dino is on par with like Fae but he is MUCH faster than fae

[quick oar]

cb is not low on damage lmao

[eager yew]

it EXTREMELY is xD

[quick oar]

he has a base 1.3x class damage buff

the highest coeff in the game

[eager yew]

Coef yes but abilities hit low

multipliers are very low on CB

[modest hawk]

if i remember correctly, candy bard (with the candy buff from being hit) makes it deal about the same dps as SH's basic attack

[quick oar]

yeah but

succ

[eager yew]

that's all it has

spin to win & succ

[quick oar]

all it needs

[eager yew]

Legit, damage chart of Lunar shows Candy being last

[quick oar]

makes it top 5 class for d15 5*

[eager yew]

with neon

[modest hawk]

candy barb has a bit of a dated kit and is slightly undertuned for being a "bruiser" type of class

[eager yew]

no longer needed for d15 5*, only good for deep delves :D

he's just EXTREMELY fast and cool for Ice sages in delves

[quick oar]

delb

[eager yew]

ye mb

[modest hawk]

lunar lancer also has a passive 1.3x damage increase

[eager yew]

yes and btw Lunar Lancer does MUCH more dmg (:

[modest hawk]

real

[eager yew]

it's just ability multiplier that is very low on CB

[modest hawk]

but the uptime on LL's damage is a problem

[eager yew]

which is tragic cus...

S p e e d

[modest hawk]

the speeeeed

[heady narwhal]

Maybe just time to swap to ice sage i guess

[heady narwhal]

If meta equals damage and damage equals fun i do not see a problem

[eager yew]

Tbh when it comes to damage, if you skip the "infinitely scaling" part of IS's class gem...
Draco is huge, Pirate is huge although R.I.P doubloons, Chloro is still insane on bosses, DT is cool, TR is meh but okay, GS does nice dmg

Bard bad and fae literally does not exist in the game

[heady narwhal]

I see

Sounds amazing tbh

[eager yew]

Legit chloro is CRAZY on bosses still

still super fun to play imo

Pirate would be too without the...doubloon situation

[modest hawk]

you could drag enemies from the last room into the boss room and upgrade the turrets before spawning the boss

[eager yew]

Real you're a genius - but OH WAIT A BOOMERANGER HAS STARTED AND ONE SHOTTED BOSS

Surprised Pikachu face

[modest hawk]

boomeranger has started and COULD instakill the boss

🎰

[eager yew]

ye ofc but you get my point

Insanely slow to setup where boom can just

[modest hawk]

remove urn and boomeranger would be balanced

more precisely, the special cluster bombs

[eager yew]

I say remove the double urn proc that can proc off itself

and then yes

real af

[modest hawk]

one of the two things that makes boomer broken

[eager yew]

Bringing back pre nerfed bow would be sweet too 👉 👈
So we have less cyclones & less overstuffed urn

[modest hawk]

bow was nerfed?

[eager yew]

The ring effect

[modest hawk]

oh right it got nerfed because they "optimized" vfx

or whatever

[eager yew]

ye but...IS still does the same

[modest hawk]

yeah they really should just add the explosion to the attack itself and not on enemy hits

[eager yew]

W takes from Gutt

[tacit tendon]

eh, so many other classes need worked on way before DT. Hes still top 5 farmer

[heady narwhal]

But could definetly have some quality of life improvements

[modest hawk]

a simple change would be to make the dino minions attack in a 2-block radius and have the "damage" minion apply a 10% damage vulnerability debuff for 5 seconds

so they are more utility rather than damage

the stun and taunt is good but hard to apply due to how narrow their attacks are

also make it so only 1 of each minion can be active at once