🗒｜pronunciation

[distant steeple]

Dude it’s in the name

Ethnically irish

[cunning mica]

And it's part of the UK (it shouldn't be)

[cunning mica]

Yeah, it shouldn't be part of the UK

[distant steeple]

Well it is so that’s nothing to debate

[cunning mica]

But their accent is very different

[distant steeple]

Not necessarily

He lives at the border

[cunning mica]

Maybe I am just bad at accents

[distant steeple]

it is not an irish accent itself, but LEANING towards one, as i said

[sage glen]

Bro, like could you record yourself saying it?

[distant steeple]

I would’ve if I wasn’t on a bus. Gimme a minute

[unborn drum]

Hey how are you guys doing,
Can u guys judge my accent real quick?
Im an English learner

[ancient ravine]

Arguing over Irish accents is crazy

[ancient ravine]

I would, but I’m not able to open mp3 files on iOS

[unborn drum]

Omg

How do u want it ?

[ancient ravine]

I guess vocaroo or discord voice notes

[cunning mica]

I can hear slight hints of Asian, but overall, I'd guess you are a Canadian or an American with Asian background. It sounds pretty good and natural to me

[timber void]

hi

[rapid garnet]

https://www.reddit.com/r/EnglishLearning/s/6GHzxpowdF

[tacit quartz]

i cannot pronounce infrasctuture.

[stone pendant]

Could you please send your voice saying that word?

[flat elk]

It's really good. I didn't notice any mistakes, but the r in perceived (both instances) was not easily distinguishable.

[stone pendant]

It’s good, but it feels a bit monotone and robotic. It’s hard for me to understand without looking at the text. My suggestion is that if you slow down a bit, it would be better

The other one in different server is much easier to understand. Perhaps you spoke clearer I guess

[river lance]

Chinese accent 👍🏻😁

[flat elk]

Excellent.

[ember hatch]

Do you all notice anything about the way this kid says the t's in 'about it'? I've always felt that posher accents had a thing going on with their t's, what exactly is it? I'd appreciate a phonetic IPA transcription of that sound if possible

[river lance]

I think its just that posh british accents pronounce the t's clearly

[ember hatch]

Yeah but that's not just clear. It feels liek they're letting out extra air or fricativiseing it to some extent? I'm not sure. Maybe it is just me mishearing the emphasis on the t as extra aspiration/fricativising

[river lance]

possibly, I just hear an emphasis on the 't' sound

[stone pendant]

I agree about the extra air. I’ve checked Jonathan Bailey too, and his accent seems to carry a lot of it.

i’ve tried to copy but its so exhausted. Out of breath.

[worthy pelican]

Feedbacks ?

[quick ermine]

It's infrastructure

[river lance]

That was great , all you have to do is to work on your accent

[river lance]

Huh

[river lance]

https://tenor.com/view/smooth-criminal-cat-dance-gif-2379887230739132874

[pure karma]

Daint that funny

[river lance]

Daint

[pure karma]

Daint in the mood mate

[river lance]

Aight mustard

[pure karma]

Got a cheer out of me mate even made my mom laugh love from the 😂😂uk🇬🇧💌

@river lance

[river lance]

Hahahaha love from algeria

Nice to meet you 💖

[river lance]

Guys, is it just me or the words "know/now" and "find/fine", they have the same pronunciation?

[ember hatch]

@stone pendant @river lance, hey you two, I've got an answer in another server if you're curious. It is indeed slightly affricated (not fricativised ['spirantised' is the proper term, apparently], as I had assumed it to be)

[tiny arrow]

NOPE

[hot needle]

no

not even close

know is know and now is now

there u go

hoped it helped

[ember hatch]

Fine and find I sort of see it

But know and now are pretty different

[ancient ravine]

Not at all

Fine and find are similar but the -d in find is pronounced in contrast to the final -e which is not pronounced.

Know and now have completely different vowels, where the “o” in know is a longer “o” sound(ow), the same vowel in go, so, low, flow, etc. The latter however, has a shorter “o” sound to it which is closer to /aw/ in words like cow, allow, etc.

https://youtu.be/3_xxzG72v7Q?si=cFZ6UuC_nL8Kh7XS

https://youtu.be/IpuhH8qD1hM?si=X4n40fiRuBtVfeaK

https://youtu.be/aS9m889D3tU?si=cS-7fDz1k0SJZ7n2

[cobalt egret]

someone know how can i pronounce this or words with "th"?

this are very difficult

[tough shore]

hi - this is a really good wesbsite: https://youglish.com/pronounce/this/english/uk

[cobalt egret]

ah thanks you bro, this will save my life

[ancient ravine]

The th sound is one of the hardest sounds to pronounce, alongside the English r. These are the two sounds that children typically learn last, there are even natives incapable of saying them.

Penguin linked a good resource as well

I’ll see if they’re any more resources regarding the th sound

[tight dome]

British thug accent

Lmao

[stone pendant]

What did you say?

[tight dome]

He said skibidi

It’s a meme

Skibidi toilet

[ember hatch]

I did not know no Nordic nerd nears non-nordic names nor knew nigh nine knitters knit nets nightly

[stone pendant]

Ah ic thx

[ember hatch]

could someone try pronouncing that?

[ember hatch]

yo youre getting better at this British accent thing

[ember hatch]

only comments would be 'no' needed more emphasis and 'knew' is said like 'nyoo' not 'noo'

[ember hatch]

It's a lol tongue twister I came up with myself lol

[ember hatch]

'knew' sound exactly like 'new' if that helps. This is better than the last one, though

[ember hatch]

that's a bit too much stress tho

[ember hatch]

By the way, the way you're saying it is fine for American

It's just Brits say a y there

You could try saying 'an'you'

then drop the first vowel

'an'' short for 'and'

[tough shore]

im on the path to success

[river lance]

what is the name of the app?

[sage glen]

Literally says it right there

BoldVoice

[river lance]

ah

[river lance]

Thanks

[stone pendant]

Guys, please be aware that when you upload your information, such as pictures or voice recordings, to any platform, that information no longer belongs to you. It becomes their property permanently.

This information could lead to security exploits in the future, such as identity theft, for example.

Potentially, it could lead to SIM swaps, phone hacks, cloud breaches, and, worst of all, bank account hacks. There are even more risks you might not have considered.

So, please be careful

[river lance]

thanks for the advice

[river lance]

nyoo
In the British Isles, “nyoo” is the more common pronunciation, but there are dialects there that have “noo” as well (and even some that retain the older “nih-oo” pronunciation).
@tight dome
I saw some examples of people saying it like that "/nuː/", not a mistake, but not the most common way British English Speakers say it : D

[distant steeple]

nyoo?

do u have audio

because from what i read, that is INCREDIBLY uncommon to happen with most british accents

[tough shore]

the only thing I can think of is the North where its like nerr

but it doesnt sound right to match with nyoo

[distant steeple]

I’m thinking they’re referring to an extremely strong rp accent

[tough shore]

oh i see i see yeah i get you

i dont wanna do it because its cringe af

[distant steeple]

Which I hate to see being used as “british” 😔

[tough shore]

but i understand

[tough shore]

haha right

[distant steeple]

most english accents (im talking about the south) say it like the “noh” sound in noah or know

[tight dome]

He was talking about the pronunciation of “new”

[river lance]

What are you talking about?

[ember hatch]

What

You say 'knew' and 'new' like noah??

How does it make sense to say knew like know

It's either nyoo or noo

There are probably others but yea it's never like 'know'?

[tame pasture]

Hi everyone ☺️

Who knows petrichor meaning

Who can explain

[versed raptor]

It means ‘the smell of rain’. ☔️
Afaik, scientists believe we smell it because different chemicals are released from the ground and rocks when raindrops hit them.

[tame pasture]

@versed raptor thanks

[clear seal]

holy shit i just did an ielts mock test

[hollow acorn]

how did it went?

[ember hatch]

How was it?

[clear seal]

im exhausted now cuz i gave all my energy to it

hope i did good

[ember hatch]

hopefully

[clear seal]

thanks

[pure karma]

YOur knew is not right, i say like it is"new" add less stress

[pure karma]

yorkshire has them

[pure karma]

I dont reaily know, im, from the black country (wolvahampton) i think and i say it like new

[pure karma]

Yeah cause of all ush are very posh people who drink tea right isnt it

[pure karma]

Defo at the rp thing, but i would easily know hes not one mf own cause of the poshess in it

[pure karma]

what word are we even talking about anyway

is it knew

i say it like "new"

[ember hatch]

does your new sound like 'nuu' or 'nyuu' though

or smth else

[ember hatch]

yea

[pure karma]

let me record myself saying

[ember hatch]

cuz telling 'I say it like "new"' doesn't tell us much yk?

[ember hatch]

oh alright

[pure karma]

cant send recordigns and not on my phone

let me get on my phone

[pure karma]

we westioda;ls do drop the y sound quite a bit

and were baso in the midlde

so lots of influnce from south and north

let me charge my phone tho

[pure karma]

have to send it to your dms yo ucan ypload it in the chat

i cant upload recoding files

[pure karma]

send it to you

[ember hatch]

everytime I send it the message is deleted

no idea why

[pure karma]

you cant send it

anyways do you know what way i say it

even i dont know

its picking some spanish, which might be cause my Spanish teacherr was spanish i had her for 4 years

[pure karma]

same happens to me

[pure karma]

Areny yoy native spekaer also, how it is hard

Native speaker

[river lance]

I wanna try

[final nebula]

Freelancers are needed
With good salary
And Christmas bonus 🥰

[tough shore]

im from north korea

learning english for the first time

[tough shore]

do it

[river lance]

💀

[river lance]

...

[river lance]

same thing ig

guess I sound more English than you lol

that’s funny

[tough shore]

well i grew up in wales soooo

i guess its based on the rp accent ??

[river lance]

omds

you did not just call me posh

I’m actually fuming

[tough shore]

yes

[river lance]

stupid ai bot

I want a penguin bar now

[ancient ravine]

I took the same test and it’s heavily inaccurate

It got it right the first time, but gave me completely different answers the second and third time

[ember hatch]

yea same here. It's like it gets worse the more you try 😭

[river lance]

Um.. it’s nearly 4am for you??

girl-

are you okay 😭

[ember hatch]

lmaoo

my eep schedule is a mess

[river lance]

ffs

fix it then lmao

[ember hatch]

I dont feeel likee ittt

[river lance]

idk I give shit advice

[ember hatch]

l;nmfao

[ember hatch]

Your advice has inspired me

To go get another can of Monster

[river lance]

I could use a red bull tbf

[ember hatch]

real

[tight dome]

Ueah,just wondering if you can do a rp accent

[tight dome]

Daily practice

[clear seal]

what is this app

bold voice?

[pure karma]

Nah defo cant but if I defo use my ts more it can be seen as posh

[tight dome]

Can I hear it

[median birch]

I love the sound and tongue movement of ''throw'' , It's just on point

[ember hatch]

put the tongue at a dental place, quickly pull back into a retroflex, pull back into the back vowel, then push the vowel forward

^ are you talkig about how saying 'throw' is kinda like throwing the sound lol?

[cunning mica]

I tried doing an American accent wtf

I think it’s more accurate than BoldVoice because I actually live in Ireland, and it says I have an Irish accent

[red cliff]

you can't escape the accent

[cunning mica]

🤣

[cyan jewel]

hahahahaha

[cyan jewel]

that's not working for me, I'm trying to use russian accent, but it still says that I've american accent lol

[frosty rose]

Hi guys

Sorry the interrumption i have a question

[distant steeple]

this sucks

i’m apparently jamaican

WHAT!!!!

this SUCKS

[sage glen]

It's not accurate

Gave me scottish, irish, chinese and jamaican

And I'm none of the above

[finite sapphire]

gave me french while my accent is kinda slavic irl

actually, it does detect my real accent, but I have to exaggerate it a lot and really put my heart into sounding like the most stereotypical way

then it identifies that am slavic

[river lance]

this app is horrible 😭

[crisp mica]

🤔cool

[fair grove]

can u tell me the name of this website?

[cunning mica]

I think it's called Vocal Image

[distant steeple]

it’s the top result on google if u search accent test

it sucks though use the second one

https://start.boldvoice.com/accent-guesser

[fair grove]

thx

[cunning mica]

yeah, it's a bit more accurate

[distant steeple]

the first says im jamaican and chinese

not quite true

[fair grove]

that's right first says im arabic
right answers
but then
he's said i'm japanese

[cyan jewel]

ahahdayhdaha, that's seems to be true

[sudden kindle]

Bro the app tries to randomly choose between the country that has more population. When it cannot find any accent

[cyan jewel]

hahaahha lol

[pure karma]

I’m English and it gave me Jamaican

[pure karma]

I first got Jamaican like you

This is what I said

https://voca.ro/1gZ4ztx7aFJe

Some weather report by chatgpt

[ancient ravine]

It gave me Chinese and then Spanish

For the record I’m also a native English speaker that can speak at least two other languages(not Spanish or Chinese)

[tight dome]

More like British roadman accent

[full crystal]

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DD_Td0rxjq3/?igsh=MTdydGk5bXBhdHFlaA==

realromanvice

#comedy #accents #languages #english

Likes

88708

Instagram

[cyan kindle]

Hello. Nice to meet you. I want to have a chat with you. Plz accept me

[river lance]

So true 😭

[river lance]

Oh

[stone pendant]

too late i guess hehehe

[river lance]

Tooooooo late

[tawny quest]

it was sort of concise: I always got good percentage of italian...despite having russian and japanese. I might go study either japanes and russian since apparently my accent is close to them

[analog nymph]

i got russian then arabic then french

[river lance]

Lmaooo

Ill try it again later

[neat escarp]

hello

[river lance]

Hi

[neat escarp]

what are you form fatima

[nimble violet]

Hello everyone

[neat escarp]

HELLO

[ember hatch]

flesh and bones likely, unless they're a robot or something of the like

[drifting tree]

woah thats interesting

is it far from what u expected?

[drifting tree]

ok now im tempted to try this

i genuinely hope its british

Whens my spy assignment tho xD

TRIED FOUR TIMES I WAS SUPPOSED TO BE LEARNING THE BRITICH ONE DANG IT!

[stone pendant]

Why I got like these. Is it the bold voice app?

I got it. Just use the website

[real geyser]

objectionable™

[river lance]

Hehehe

[jaunty maple]

Client satisfaction our Greatest Goal:
DM for:
✔ #Essay
✔#Computer science, high school & University

[umbral mountain]

Heyy guys where can I practice my pronunciation

[stone pendant]

Bold voice website

[ancient ravine]

33.33% accurate

[zinc robin]

I've tried it 6 times for the same result …

[opaque citrus]

how cam i do that

n

[zinc robin]

be french, but isn't the accent that I want to perform

[drifting tree]

lol 100%? thats smooth i never reached it in my four times

[drifting tree]

i can relate fr

SSBE? Never heard it clearly, but anyways this is chill i like it

noted =D

[zinc robin]

The first wasn't 100%, but I was so angry that I retried. And now I have only 100%. I tried on my phone and I get again the same result…

[cunning mica]

I wouldn’t think you’re British, but you sound like someone with great English and maybe you've studied or lived in the UK. Though, I'm not an expert, and I'm not British either

It does sound a bit American to me, so it really depends on what you're saying. I might think you’re Canadian or American (or someone who's lived there) trying to imitate a British accent

So you might come across as a native speaker, depending on what you're saying

[zinc robin]

I've now a 1% english accent 🔥

[obsidian lake]

Wasssup everybody

Where are you from guys?

[steady kernel]

Not sure where the 6% Chinese is coming from, but pretty cool I guess

[river lance]

Why is that funny ?

[drifting tree]

lmao thats a progress ig

[pseudo escarp]

What a cute pfp 🥔

[steady kernel]

Thank you

[ember hatch]

You have two issues I noticed. You replace the j-sound (also known as the soft g and the voiced postalveolar affricate) with zh (voiced postalveolar fricative), the same sound as in the middle of 'pleasure'. You see, those are different sounds, though they are similar.

An example where this made it hard to understand you was the first time you said 'just'. You said the 'j' like French people pronounce it, but it's different in English. You also didn't say the 's', and the vowel was a bit off. In 'just', you may drop the final 't' in casual speech, but you have to pronounce the 's'.

The second issue would be your 'th' sounds. You say the voiced dental fricative, the th in 'the', like /v/ or /z/. This is not correct for most people.

Your voiceless dental fricative, th in 'think', also was wrong. You said it like /f/.

Some British people do do this thing called th-fronting, where in the middle and at the end of a word, the voiced dental fricative (th in 'the') becomes /v/ and at the start of a word stays the same or, for some, becomes /d/, while the voiceless dental fricative (th in 'think') becomes /f/ everywhere, but this is stigmatised, unfortunately, and many who do it have to avoid it in more formal settings (code-switching)

Overall you're doing good, but you need to improve your soft g and your th sounds

The vowels could have some work too, but focus on one thing at a time

[ember hatch]

And no, it doesn't sound funny. It's good

[ember hatch]

Note, I think you want to use 'kick out of' and 'kick out', not 'kick off'

[river lance]

Tysm

[river lance]

Someone reacted with an emoji which laughs

[river lance]

Got it

[ember hatch]

np

[ember hatch]

I see, that's pretty rude :/

[river lance]

yes

[gray breach]

how much does this cost ?

the subscription for 1 year

[zinc robin]

No, 30 minutes of my life

[gray breach]

Oh okay

[hot mist]

now that's mindset right there

[agile sonnet]

Hi all,
Would be glad to have some feedback on this

[analog nymph]

Nice , understandable
Encouraging

I like the accent

[willow juniper]

Nicely done! A few comments:

1. Since this is a technical speech/topic, I would recommend slowing down to pronounce all of the short prepositions like "of" and "to" with clarity. In "set of rules" your "of" was fast and sounded like "uh". Likewise, your "to"s sounded like "tuh"s. This is very common in casual speech, but in technical or formal speech, try to hit all of them clearly.
2. Likewise, slow down on "A way to picture it". This ended up all melding together until the hard it, and I had trouble understanding. Pronouncing the "to" more clearly here will help!
3. Some of your "s" sounds are a bit long, resulting in a "ssss" coming out in the middle of some words. If you naturally have a lisp, this is ok and expected! There isn't anything wrong with having a lisp. But if this long "s" sound something you only experience when speaking English, you can try slowing down on words with "s" sounds, focusing on keeping the sound sharp and short.

[agile sonnet]

Thank you
Would you have maybe some ideas for me to improve?

[willow juniper]

Hi Trost, nicely done! A few comments:

• The "r" sound in the first "New Year" is important to pronounce clearly. Try adding more emphasis, really focusing on the ear sound. Without a strong 'r', it ends up sounding like "yee-uh". I had trouble understanding until a few words later. Since this is the opening statement, try to start with strong vowels.
• Slow down on "Forget about whatever happened". The "forget about" part was nice and clear, but "whatever happened" ended up merging into one word! The "wh" sound might be a place for you to focus on in your practice. Your pronunciation of "who" in "who you are" also stood out to me; it had a long exhaling breath on the "wh" sound, like you were whistling through your teeth. To help slow down, maybe you can imagine these words as "wat-ever" and "hoo", not focusing to hard on a "wh" sound!
• It's important to hit a clear "t" sound at the end of "most" ("It's time to make the most of it"). Really focus on a sharp t there. After all, the purpose of the word "most" is to emphasize the words around it ("most important", "most special", "do the most you can"). Pronouncing it with a confident, sharp sound helps convey that very meaning of the word!
• Funny enough, the second time you said "New Year" (in new year's resolution), you did have a nice and strong R, but this time the eer sound was too strong! English is so difficult. This time, tone down the long ee and make sure to round it out at the end with just a little bit of a sound. It is the difference between "ear" and "eer" sounds.
• Pronounce "achieve" with a longer ee after the ch. You can pretend it is written as "acheeve"!
• Slow down a bit on "cost is". Your "t" came out clearly, but the "is" was quiet. Make sure to always finish a speech with a strong, clear voice! :)

[cunning mica]

Some words, like 'that,' sound more like 'tha', while 'end' sounds more like 'en' to me. But honestly, it's not bad

you are doing a great job

To me, it kinda sounds like a mix of accents, so I wouldn't be able to guess where you're from (unless you told me, and then I’d probably be like, oh yeah, you do sound like someone from there)

but it sounds good

I’m not great with accents, so I can't really say if you're pronouncing some words wrong

they might actually be right, just how they are pronounced in that particular accent

so I can't give you detailed feedback, but you are doing well!

[river lance]

Hi Lounys, how to check this could you please let me know

[river lance]

I think it's almost perfect...

[zinc robin]

I'm on a computer, the display could be different on a smartphone

[thick spruce]

You’re French that’s obvious

[spring galleon]

hey !! can anyone help me

??

how to improve english from intermidiate to advance level ??

[obsidian lake]

You already understand movie?

[lost kindle]

Hey guys I'd like to take a bit of an advise on how to fix my pronunciation for the TH and the B-P sounds

[river lance]

I'm not a teacher but for the 'th' sound it was hard for me to sound it correctly.
But I suggest you to fake it till make it and practice about how it sounds, well we all know not every time we have a perfect pronunciation so try make it sound right. (You could say what?)
For example in the word empathetic, I make it sound like 'th' with the sound 'f' when I was practicing a bit.
I don't know if those are true ways to do it but just advice.
Or I'm pretty sure there must be practice videos on YouTube.

[drowsy terrace]

I'm brazilian, and for me "th" sounds like "dê"

[lost kindle]

Thank you for your advice

[lost kindle]

For me it sounds like an F or a Z

[cunning mica]

Place the tip of your tongue lightly between your top and bottom front teeth, so it sticks out just a little. Then, blow air through your mouth while keeping your tongue in that position to create the th sound

[river lance]

That actually works, lol

[river lance]

Anytime if I could.

[cunning mica]

For B you close your lips, make a sound and let it out; for P do the same but without any sound from your throat

That's the simplest way I can explain it

I can't make it any simpler

[restive pecan]

Hey hi

[ember hatch]

Hi hey

[agile sonnet]

Thank you very much for your remarks

[river lance]

I would appreciate if someone gave me feedbacks about my accent

[restive pecan]

Hru

[sage glen]

@river lance You sound synthetic

@river lance

[cunning mica]

Most people in Ireland say 'appreciate' instead of 'appreshiate.' It’s not really a mistake, but it might sound unusual in other places

At least in Galway, a lot people I've met say 'appreciate'

[cunning mica]

It's 'feedback,' not 'feedbacks.' The way you say 'appreciate' is correct in some places but might sound a bit unusual outside of Ireland. (I'm not sure if British people pronounce 'appreciate' with a 'ciate' rather than 'shiate' sound at the end.) The way you say 'about' sounds like 'aboot.' Your 'hello' sounds like 'helleur,' almost like you're trying to imitate an Australian accent. Overall, your accent seems like you're mixing multiple accents into different words, which makes it sound unusual. You might want to focus on improving your vowel sounds to make it smoother, but your English is clear and understandable, so you're doing well!

[river lance]

Ty

[brazen frigate]

Hi people! Can I post my reading some sentences, paragraphs in English here regularly for feedback on my pronunciation? Are there rules I need to follow? Thanks!

[spring yoke]

Hi everyone, I'm here to learn English because my English is not good, my friend suggested the first step to start English through this application.

[sage glen]

Go for it

[sage glen]

Discord can be useful for resources and all

But what do you want to work on exactly?

[fast stream]

I want improve speaking skills

What should I do?

[fast stream]

I do this but the people was in silence

[sage glen]

Shadow

[stone pendant]

i agree with shadow technique

i did it and had a great result

[ember hatch]

I'm curious, does it help with speaking skills, or just accent?

@stone pendant, you seem to have used it

Did it help you in becoming able to properly speak the language or did it only help you in improving your accent?

Shadowing, I mean

[stone pendant]

for me i would say accent

[ember hatch]

Oh got it, thanks

[stone pendant]

ur welcome

[ember hatch]

[calm adder]

Konichiwa

Hello

[fast stream]

Okay I do this but when I need to speak I forget everything 🙁

[sage glen]

You don't have to remember anything, just do it frequently till it becomes passive

[river lance]

@bitter skiff

@analog nymph

[cunning mica]

Not bad, but you need to emphasize the 'th' sound more

Place the tip of your tongue lightly between your top and bottom front teeth, so it sticks out just a little. Then, blow air through your mouth while keeping your tongue in that position to create the th sound

[river lance]

...

[river lance]

What about me

[cunning mica]

I couldn't understand what you were saying at first, but when I listened carefully, it sounded a bit like 'thoroughly.' It was kind of unclear, though. If you work on the 'th' sound, it should be much clearer. Right now, it sounds more like oroughly

[cunning mica]

way better

try emphasizing the 'th' sound more

[cunning mica]

It sounds more like 'thorooly'

[cunning mica]

thorooly again

[river lance]

It's prounounced like that

[cunning mica]

try thur - ow - lee

[cunning mica]

where are you from, if you don’t mind me asking?

[river lance]

France wbt u

[cunning mica]

I thought you are from Korea

[cunning mica]

Ireland

[river lance]

Oh ok

I didn't know you were a native

[spring yoke]

i want to learn English:)

[sage glen]

You need to be more specific

[next linden]

Hi guys could someone tell me how can I improve my pronunciation

[little gazelle]

Maybe just learn the lyrics of any song and pronounce it the way the singer's doing :)

[bitter skiff]

holy crap

i just realized its spelled pronunciation

and not pronounciation

[bitter skiff]

After all these years

[haughty flicker]

Yup, and its said pro-nun-see-ay-shon. Not pro-nown-see-ay-shon like in the word pronounce.

[ember hatch]

Well, some people do say it the second way

even some natives

But yea, typically it's the first

It's a bit awkward on phone lol, but that IPA says 'noun'. As is written, it's a proscribed pronunciation of pronunciation, but it's common

/pɹəˌnaʊn.siˈeɪ.ʃən/

[brazen ermine]

With magic tomb in hand
With magic tome in hand

@ember hatch i wanted to add that these aren't just spelled different, they're also said different out loud (tomb rhymes with room and tome rhymes with home)

the last time i brought up a spelling correction like this it turned out the person was saying it wrong out loud too

[ember hatch]

Oh my, I have always said them the same

I can't belive it

Thank you so much for correcting me

[brazen ermine]

it's not wholly your fault since comb rhymes with home too

tomb just has a weird spelling, even compared to normal english spelling

[ember hatch]

Funny thing is, I've been saying both as 'tomb' (rhyming with 'room')

Not the other way around

[brazen ermine]

at least you can shift your idea of 'the weird one' from tome (which is 100% what you'd expect from kindergarten phonics) to tomb

tome home bone lone rope, etc all the same 'o sound'

[ember hatch]

I mean, all I know it that the final 'e' makes the vowel long. Whether that elongation is making it a diphthong or just a long /u:/ I do not know

[brazen ermine]

the long version of o is the one in home, bone, rope (IPA /oʊ/ or /o:/)

if you use Merriam Webster as your dictionary they actually write it exactly like the kindergarten way, \hōm\

it's really only in a handful of words that o by itself makes the 'oo' sound /u:/ (just tomb, two, do & who?)

[ember hatch]

Oh, understood, thank you!

[ember hatch]

Are 'masturbate' and 'master' both pronounced with an open back unrounded vowel in British English? That is, are they both BATH-lexical-set words, or is one of them a TRAP word?

[ember hatch]

What's a hick exactly?

idk abt that. Some people just use it. I don't think any of them would like you calling them that :/ It's just a way to say the word

[brazen ermine]

Yeah, pronounciation doesn't make me think of rural at all (and i plenty of family that talk rural)

[ember hatch]

^ question

[brazen ermine]

Going on Youglish I hear trap/bath (= they have different vowels if possible) from basically everybody

the only exception was 1 person, which could just mean he learned the word weirdly

& just to clarify 'master' is the bath word, = you can say it with a short or long vowel depending on how southern you want to sound

[ember hatch]

I see, I have this bad this habit of saying the other word with BATH. I'll try to stop that

Thank you!

[cunning mica]

wanna sound like hillbilly 🤘

oh

[sage glen]

Wish I was american

[ember hatch]

They meant southern British, I believe

My question was about the BATH-TRAP split of Southern Standard British English

Specifically regarding the words 'Master' and 'Masturbate'

[stone pendant]

U r back

Long time no c

[stone pendant]

I’m done

Full

[cunning mica]

I’m having a little trouble understanding some of your words

[stone pendant]

i'm in thailand right now. it's winter season and the cold this year last longer than last year and probably i think that the summer season is not gonna be as hot as last year

[stone pendant]

there u go

i spoke a bit fast. thick accent.

[cunning mica]

Try 'I'm in Thailand right now, and it's the winter season. The cold this year is lasting longer than last year. I think the summer might not be as hot as it was last year'

you are speaking so fast, it sounds like there's no punctuation, and it's hard to understand

[cunning mica]

way better

[stone pendant]

[tight dome]

My thick korean accent

My British accent is way better

[haughty flicker]

The first one just sounds straight American.

[tulip remnant]

That just sounds like a mockery but you're trying at least

[cunning mica]

yeah it sounds a bit American

[ember hatch]

a bit?

the only misstake I heard was 'sheason' for 'season'

[cunning mica]

yeah

I wouldn't be able to tell he's Korean from his accent. The only thing that stands out is the way he pronounces the 'th' sound. Honestly, his accent sounds more Canadian than American to me

[cunning mica]

it sounds so forced

[ember hatch]

Oh, I wasn't able to notice anythig off with his Th sounds even though my native language has both of them

maybe I do them weird too lol

[cunning mica]

it's not off

the way he said winter sounds American

I've never heard Americans say 'winner' instead of 'winter,' though

maybe the guy's just here to troll Brits

[ember hatch]

He always does this very stereotypical bad British imitation, and calls his normal accent 'a thick korean one'. I think he's just looking for attention

[tight dome]

I have been trying

and it is korean accent its easy to tell,or foreign accent

I am from korea,and ppl around me do sound like that when They are speaking English.

[tight dome]

Cause thats how koreans say winter,don’t think any Americans will say it like that

[ember hatch]

I'm pretty sure Americcans do say it like that

As they do with 'internet' and 'introduce'

where the 't' is dropped

[cunning mica]

I wouldn't have guessed you're Korean from your normal accent, but your british accent sounds really strange. It sounds really forced and kind of like you're mocking people. And honestly it makes you foreign. I'm not trying to be rude, but if you want to sound more natural, you're better off sticking with your usual accent

the way you're doing the british accent feels like trolling, and maybe that's not what you mean to do

but it just comes across that way

[tight dome]

I will try my best and make it better

[cunning mica]

your british accent?

[tight dome]

Yeah

[cunning mica]

Your normal accent has a slight hint of asian, but it's very subtle. If I had to guess where you are from, I'd say you're from Canada, considering how many Asians live there. I would also assume English is your first language since it sounds mostly natural

Your normal accent

The accent you don't want to have

But the British accent sounds foreign

[tight dome]

I don’t think my normal accent sounds Asian canadian

Not even in the ballpark

Just straight up asian

[stone pendant]

I agree with your normal accent. Much better than British

It’s more natural

Your British one was too forced

[tight dome]

We will make it less forced

We are in this together

[tight dome]

Less forced now?

[stone pendant]

yeap, better

but not british

[tight dome]

II wil work on it

[stone pendant]

Try British girl with expensive ice cream on YouTube

She was pissed though

I think my “so” was a bit too drawn out. I listened to your “so,” and then I don’t know what happened to me—my accent shifted a bit.

[ember hatch]

https://youtu.be/SEAIQ62rydI?t=869

^ yea, found few examples of 'inernet' pretty quickly when I checked on YouGlish but I can't find any for 'inroduce'. I don't study American English, so my two examples were based off of wha tsome Youtube vid said. Maybe it's regional or they were mistaken

Oh, found an example of it. It seems to be much rarer than 'inernet' though
https://youtu.be/UsccvWvHgyQ?t=77

Had to go through 14 examples on YouGlish to find 1

I think this is becuase 'introduce' is much more likely to be emphasised than 'internet' is, and so when it's emphasised you'd pronounce all the letters clearly too, but I can't be sure

But yea I can find no examples of 'winer' for 'winter'. Odd, becuase that's one I really thought I've heard from Americans

There seems to be some habit of dropping t's around n's, but I have no idea when lol

Oh, nasalised flap. I haven't heard of those

I have no idea how I'd nasalise a flap lol

Idk, maybe it doesn't happen with 'winter' :p I mean, from the examples I went through on YouGlish, I couldn't find any that didn't have an obvious t

this random article says it ocurs before unstressed syllables

I do want to ask, as you seem to like to use the term, is it not insulting? Wouldn't this be considered stereotyping accents or calling people unintelegent based on accent alone?
/genq

I have no idea how to find proper stuff. I would like to but idk :/

yea I check wikipedia ofc, but they don't always go in depth into some specific stuff :p

ohh actually they have a little thing here

that arrow is bad damn

lmao

[stone pendant]

https://youtu.be/AgGtGORPHcM?si=_-Aw9j0b1mwbN4dv

What’s his accent on this one?

[stone pendant]

I mean what’s the accent

[cunning mica]

It's still forced

[cunning mica]

it sounds a bit better, but it's still forced

[cunning mica]

Look, I'm not saying you sound good just to be polite. If I say it sounds good, it's because it actually does. But if I say your British accent sounds forced, I mean it

it does sound forced and weird

it really does

[tight dome]

You didnt say it was good

they are both trash tbh

but at least i have a feeling my "british" accent can be better

[cunning mica]

It can be better, but it's not better than your normal accent

Honestly, you should be proud of yourself. If people think your second language sounds like you're a native speaker or really fluent, that's a huge compliment. You don't sound overly Asian at all. The more you practice, the less noticeable it'll be that it's not your first language. To be honest, you sound like you could be from the U.S. or Canada, or like you've lived there for a while. You're doing a great job with your accent. Your normal accent sounds really natural.

That said, and I don't mean this to be rude, but let's face it: a lot of people are just dumb, and some people like to make fun of others for any reason they can find. The more natural you sound, the less likely anyone is to make fun of you because of your accent. I'm not trying to be harsh, but it's just how some people are. But honestly, you're doing awesome. Keep at it!

You speak both Korean and English, two completely different languages, and you hardly have a noticeable accent. Honestly, I wouldn't have even picked up on the slight hint of an Asian accent if I didn't already know you were Korean or if you weren't trying to sound British

[tight dome]

not true, when i spoke with my normal accent, ppl would immediately assume i was from china or something and started to mock me,calling me ching-chong(i am from korea btw but they ar pretty close) thtas why i try to learn the british accent so that no one would make fun of me, you are being sweet for saying "just be yourself" but we dont live in an ideal world, ppl would respect or think little of u based on ur accent.

[cunning mica]

Yeah, but you're the one who sounds like you're mocking the Brits

[tight dome]

thats why i wanna learn the british accent cause ppl would think less of me bc they might think i am from eruope o

thats why i keep trying

[tight dome]

i am not i have been trying rlly hard

[cunning mica]

I've told you many times that I'm being honest with you

🤦‍♂️

[tight dome]

.

i have been watching lots of british shows and it didnt pay off i guess

dang

english is impossible

[cunning mica]

Yeah, but you don't look or sound like you're from Europe

[tight dome]

i wanna show u something funny,i had never thought romantic could be pronounced this way

[tight dome]

i will keep learning it till i sound like one

harry has been helpful recently

[tight dome]

i think you are looking for this

[stone pendant]

never heard of romanic before

it's weird

it's like romance with a D

[cunning mica]

Are you sure they are talking about winter?

[tight dome]

Yeah

[jovial oar]

Why do you want ppl to think you from EU?

Just be yourself

[ember hatch]

Yea some Americans drop t's after n's when they're unstressed

It's normal for winter, romantic, internet, introduce

wanted

But iss less common for some words

[sage glen]

True

Like hunter

Also in winter is less common

[ember hatch]

Yea, I couldn't really find an example of it for winter but I was sure I'd heard it before

The one they provided is perfect

[sage glen]

I heard of it too

Also enter is less common

But I do say it without the t

[ember hatch]

Yea I've heard enter without it

Pronunciation is cool

[sage glen]

Yeah, but the fact that it's uncommon increases the chance of miscommunication

[ember hatch]

I guess

I mean, ppl are used to ppl having accents

I say 'luh boo ruh tri' and 'cuhn tro vuh si' for laboratory and controversy lmao, that could cause misunderstandings :p

[cunning mica]

we don't really have many Asians here in Europe, and Europeans rarely move to live in Korea

your accent gives away that you're a foreigner, but your normal accent doesn't do that. Who told you that you sound Chinese?

it's not that people judge you for your accent, but they might judge you for trying to imitate theirs. Sometimes, an imitated accent can come across as mocking, like you're making fun of the way they speak

I get that you're trying your best to practice a British accent, and that's great effort! I find it a bit odd that you want to sound British just so people in Korea will think you're European, especially since you clearly look Asian

[ember hatch]

It's done by some. Stop telling people off for regional pronunciations

I don't get what your issue is with telling people about regional pronunciations that are used by some lol

It's normal for some, yeah. It's not the standard but some people do it, especially informally

'5 speakers in Kentucky in 1950' is a metric you pulled out of nowhere. And if a learner wants to emulate it, that's not bad at all.
If you'd like to note it's non-standard, sure, but don't act like these pronunciations don't exist, or like they're 'bad'

It's not a mistake lol. There is some difference between 'winner' and 'winter' when the t is elided from the latter, and some Americans say it that way. It's odd that you care this much about some pronunciation used by some people. Calling it a mistake is stupid when it's used by actual native speakers around north America. Not everyone speaks 'proper' English, 'proNounciation' is a thing, 'axe' for 'ask' is a thing, 'free' for 'three' is a (British) thing, and 'winner' for 'winter' is a thing too. Learners should be aware of these pronunciations used by actual natives, and if they wish to imitate them, then they should be free to do so. You can't outright tell a learner that something is a mistake when it's actually used by natives. That's not how language works.

Telling people about possible pronunciations of a word in the pronunciation channel is normal lol. If your issue is with it being nonstandard, I can add 'some but not all natives use this pronunciation, you probably won't hear it in formal settings, but it's not a mistake'

[red cliff]

From my own experience, I would say that the percentage of natives who pronounce "winter" without the "t" is much larger than you indicate. I would say it is much larger than 1% of Americans at least, but I dare not attempt to be more precise than that without more care in paying attention. It's very well understood among the American population, I would say.

Perhaps we are bickering over regional variations

I've lived in Texas over 30 years. I've heard it plenty of times

I think I've used this type of pronunciation many times myself

It's not considered proper, ofc, but it is quite common

Both ironically and unironically

I've almost never been to a farm

I teach classes here on the server

You are welcome to join and listen

I also join vcs from time to time

[ember hatch]

1. You decided that 99.999% out of nowhere. There's evidence of its existence, and if you look around online some people explain they pronounce the words the same. It's not a majority but it's present. That's my entire point. I mean, there's even a short explaining that you can tell the two apart from context, if truly only a dozen Americans used the pronunciation, this would not exist (https://youtu.be/hJ7MtqPWOrY?si=K097qEeKZMjV8oOT). If it was a 99.999% amount that thinks it's a mistake, these IPA transcriptions wouldn't be present on Wiktionary (pic 1). If it were truly rare at all, I wouldn't be able to find people who say they pronounce it like that so easily (pics 2–4).

2. If there was a phenomenon of calling toasters 'pineapples', a learner should be aware of it. If a learner unconsciously picks it up from some speakers, the learner should be made aware of the fact it's nonstandard, but not told it's a mistake. Cuz if it's actually used, it's not a mistake.

3. Wikipedia having a section in the nadalised flap and these screenshots of speakers saying they use the 'winner' pronunciation and how it's a 'North of the USA' thing show it's an established thing.

4. You wouldn't get weird looks, cuz most people understand that words are pronounced differently in different areas. The only ones giving you weird looks would be people like you, who are too concerned with the 'one and only proper way to pronounce words'. A Northerner would say it like that and no one save for you would bat an eye (unless it's a learner who wasn't made aware of the existence of the pronunciation).

5. When I say normal, I intend to mean 'not abnormal'. When you say something isn't normal, that has quite a negative connotation. I'm not talking about it in terms of 'the most prevalent pronunciation' or 'the standard Oxford dictionary transcription' or whatever else, I'm simply saying it's not an abnormal pronunciation. It's not weird. It's not wrong. And for some speakers, it's the normal, whether it is normal internationally or across all of the USA is irrelevant. You seem to think I'm talking statistically, I'm not. I just don't want people's valid pronunciations being called 'not normal' since that's not okay. I did note 'some Americans' and 'it's more common for some words than others'.

6. I didn't mislead anyone and see no reason to apologise.

@left geode

[sage glen]

I did tell 'em it was uncommon to drop the t in winter

But I do it myself

[tulip remnant]

Only one thing but free for "three" isn't a British thing, it's an English thing

[sage glen]

I've heard native say it like that

[red cliff]

Oh my grandfather definitely says free instead of three. He's from Virginia

[ember hatch]

Thanks for the note. I wasn't sure whether non-English Brits did it. Thank you

[tulip remnant]

In the UK I mean, not the US. Welsh, Irish and Scottish people don't say it like that

[sage glen]

It'd sound like this

[red cliff]

Yeah I know you weren't saying anything about Americans. I just wanted to throw my bit of info in there

[tulip remnant]

Ah interesting

[tulip remnant]

You're welcome

[sage glen]

I'm sorry you talking to me?

Ohh

Sorry

[ember hatch]

Oh, he Virginia accent does th-fronting too? That's interesting

[red cliff]

Perhaps in rural Virginia, idk honestly

[ember hatch]

What do the contractions stand for?

[red cliff]

NOrthern VirginiA

[ember hatch]

'OVA' = something Virginia something

[red cliff]

SOuthern VirginiA

[ember hatch]

Ohhh

Lmao I see

[red cliff]

VA is the postal abbreviation for Virginia

[ember hatch]

Oh yea each state has a 2-letter abbreviation right?

[red cliff]

Yes exactly

[ember hatch]

Is the spelling just messing around? I think ive only seen 'aussie'

[red cliff]

She was spelling it phonetically

[sage glen]

I'm literally here waiting for one of ya to say west virginia so I can say mountain mama

[red cliff]

Keep waiting

[sage glen]

Nah I can barely keep my eyes open

[ember hatch]

Didn't mean a singular speaker. I did say if it's a phenomenon. I doubt one speaker makes a phenomenon.

Either way, without getting into what makes a mistake and what doesn't. 'winner' for 'winter' is very much used. I explained everything in my message earlier so I'm done with this back and forth

[ember hatch]

Ah I see

[ember hatch]

Good night!

[sage glen]

Night night!

[red cliff]

Honestly, at this point, enough has been said that when someone comes along to read this, they will be able to judge for themselves which side they want to take

That's when the conversation can safely end

[ember hatch]

Yea. Im tired of always arguing

[red cliff]

No need to convince the person you are debating with. Just say enough that your audience may be convinced

[ember hatch]

Yeah it probably would be an endless back and forth if neither party at some point decided 'I've said enough' lol

[red cliff]

There's nothing else left to say. Evidence was given that the phenomenon exists, is documented, and is accepted by many people.

From my experience, those who engage as interlocutors in debates don't easily admit they are wrong. And in many cases, the interlocutors of a debate aren't really interested in changing the mind of the other, but to convince the general public who may be watching.

Scella never said this, to my knowledge

I do remember that, though it didn't strike me as one of the main points of the conversation. It certainly wasn't one that I wanted to comment on. But I generally agree with scella's point when she was saying that

Slang is a great example of one of these anomalies

It's worth learning depending on who you converse with

If there was a regional slang creeping up in Ohio where many of the youth were calling toasters pineapples, and you wanted to go there to speak with them, it would be a good idea to know about that usage.

If one person says it, then yes it's a mistake

I know you bring up the toaster pineapple thing because you are trying to draw an analogy to the t dropping phenomenon. But comparing one person saying pineapple versus a whole dialect who drop the t sound in certain words, that's not a fair analogy. This is why scella extended your analogy. Instead of one person saying pineapple, it's a whole demographic of people saying it. Then it becomes a noteworthy usage to talk about. It's still improper, but can be useful to know.

No it's making a correction to improve the analogy

Your original analogy doesn't work

I've basically said that by this point

No thanks I need to go to bed soon

Good night

[ember hatch]

I didn't say that. 1 person doing it would mean they're making a mistake. But a whole phenomenon wouldn't be 'a mistake'.

You seem to be more concerned about what constitutes a mistake, while I'm more focused on the fact dropping t's before n's is an accepted phenomenon

I did give more than 1 example of people who say they use it

I feel this clears things up

Yes, 1 or 2 people calling toasters pineapples is 'a mistake', a bunch of people calling toasters pineapples is 'a thing' or 'a trend', 'a phenomenon'

The analogy is faulty because it isn't 1 person who says 'winner' and the like

If you'd like me to concede in this hypothetical universe where there's only one person who says 'winner' for 'winter', then yeah, it's a mistake then. But not in this universe, where a bunch of people do it

[mellow spire]

Well I'd consider 1 person saying it that way a part of their idiolect rather than a mistake tbh

[ember hatch]

Yea, I suppose that would count as part of their idiolect. An idiosyncrasy they have
If it were between friends it's probably an inside joke, within a family would just be a familect. It's hard to define what counts as a mistake in language :p

[mellow spire]

If someone's constantly using something (or even if not) it's kinda a part of a language now, it might not be a big one or documented one, but it still is. Language isn't a static thing after all, yk

[ember hatch]

Yea iss always changing

[mellow spire]

Isn't that a bit different thing tho? Like about disorders where one is literally unable to do smth

E.g. when top and bottom teeth don't align with closed mouth

[tight dome]

No ppl will find out that i am from Asia when i am chatting on the internet

[stone pendant]

dude, caz you are asian. If you don;t want people to find out, chanf your picture too.

whats worng with asian though im curious

im asian

[tight dome]

II have extreme inferiority complex

I am sick

[stone pendant]

By the way, if you’re trying to use a British accent like that, it won’t work. People will know you’re not British and that you’re Asian. Instead, use your natural accent. You might be surprised that people won’t notice at all because you sound more natural than when you try to use a British accent.

[stone pendant]

thats because you think you are. All you need to do is just don;t cars about peiple think. You can;t control what they think but you can control yours right?

i don;t care at all what people say, its me that i love and its me that i care the most

[tight dome]

Nonono we are supposed to be in this together you should teach me British accent and I should learn it from you

[celest finch]

Hello.

[stone pendant]

All I did was use the shadowing technique. Perhaps my language has more tones, which is why I can adapt to any accent easily.

[stone pendant]

dude, i suggest u to use the natural accent. People won’t mock you. If you try the british one, people will mock you more.

your natural accent is way way better trust me

[tight dome]

My British accent will be better in the future

Trust me

[red cliff]

I'm on a rampage now to find examples of people dropping t's in speech. I've found a few so far, which includes words like "winter", "twenty", "center", and "Atlanta". I didn't have to look through thousands of videos to find these, maybe a couple dozen or so. I'll stand by what I said about this happening for more than 1% of speakers in america. I've found that it is actually very very common for people to say "twenny" instead of "twenty" especially when speaking about what year it is.

in fact, from my observations, I wouldn't really be surprised if we find a majority of native speakers saying "twenny" in rapid speech

[sage glen]

Who said it was 1% lol

It's way higher than that

[red cliff]

i did, earlier

i used that as a lower bound of my estimate

[sage glen]

Nah brother, those you mentioned are very very common to drop except winter

Winter isn't very common

[tight dome]

Omg you guys are still on this?

[sage glen]

How do I know, well I've been listening to americans for a loooooooooooooooooong time

[red cliff]

yes i agree that the "winter" example is far less common than the others

but it does happen

[sage glen]

It does

I know one guy from north carolina that drops the t's in words like enter and hunter

Which is very uncommon and make it hard to communicate

But it is what it is

[red cliff]

yeah, I imagine that such encounters with this speech pattern can be frustrating to deal with at first for those just learning english

[tight dome]

Intermittent

interminnent

flappin t

[sage glen]

Yeah and it might cause miscommunications between americans too that are not familiar with some words with dropped t's

[red cliff]

perhaps i'm just too used to it to think of it as strange or difficult to understand

i find it fairly natural to understand, to be honest

honestly, i think the biggest difficulty for me to find examples of people saying "winter" this way is that most videos that talk about winter are emphasizing the term winter, and so most people would slow down and say it properly. But I feel like when speaking about it rapidly, it's probably more common than most of us realize to say "winner"

[sage glen]

Yeah that too, there should be a dialect for rapid english, cuz a lot of letters could be dropped not just the t's

[red cliff]

yeah, lots of letters get softened or omitted completely in rapid speech

like, "and" becomes "n"

of becomes o'

[sage glen]

I was gonna say the of becoming o

You beat me to it

[red cliff]

have becomes 'a

[sage glen]

Yup

And "are" is completely omitted

[red cliff]

oh, what example is there for "are" being omitted completely?

[sage glen]

How are you doing

[red cliff]

oh right i see

[sage glen]

How ya doin'

[red cliff]

yeah, i guess it goes from "how are" to "how're" to "how"

[sage glen]

Yeah

One thing I know for sure y'all love to drop and use acronyms

[red cliff]

ASAP

[sage glen]

rn

abt

smt

[red cliff]

most of these are for text only

[sage glen]

True

[red cliff]

in speech, you would say those in completion

but i've heard people say "asap" in speech

[sage glen]

TRUE

Can't think of any other

Maybe lol

[red cliff]

i guess i've heard a few others, like "FYI"

BYOB

[sage glen]

For your info

good one

byob?

OHOH I know

Brb

[red cliff]

byob = bring your own beer, it's a label for a type of party/gathering where drinking is welcome but is not provided

[sage glen]

Never heard that one before, interesting

B&B

[red cliff]

like, i've heard people say "B-Y-O-B", spelling it out

R&R

[sage glen]

Now what's R&R

[red cliff]

rest and relaxation

[sage glen]

Interesting

[red cliff]

some of these terms are from an older generation

maybe the youth of today don't talk like this lol

[sage glen]

Yeah probably only your uncle once removed would speak like that

I've a feeling I messed that up

[red cliff]

yeah, i think it's normal to use a phrase like "once removed" for talking about some distant relation to a cousin, but not so much for an uncle

[sage glen]

But how do you talk about a generation back not forward like cousin once removed could be back or forward so how to clarify?

[red cliff]

that's a very good question, and i don't have the answer

[sage glen]

Interesting more controversial topics

[red cliff]

distinctions are not being made lol

so following this pattern, uncles and nephews are just 0th cousins once removed

parents and children are (-1)th cousins once removed

[sage glen]

I'm so confused rn

[red cliff]

oh i have a typo in there

"uncles and nephews"

i'm just being funny trying to label them as 0th cousins once removed

brothers and sisters are 0th cousins lol

you are your own (-1)th cousin

[sage glen]

Family trees always hurt my brain even in my own lang

[red cliff]

yeah i would be surprised if some language out there really nailed the naming patterns for these consanguinity tables

in english, it's hard enough to follow

most people don't use some of these "cousin" terms correctly, they understand up to "first cousin" and then get lost after that

[sage glen]

Oh trust me there's harder and more diverse consanguinity tables

[red cliff]

yeah, this one doesn't get into "in-laws" or "half-siblings" and other types of relationships

i guess "in-laws" don't count as consanguinity tho

[sage glen]

Nah I meant in different languages, can be more complex

[sage glen]

I agree

Since it's not blood related

But what about step?

Half related?

[red cliff]

step is related by marriage

much like in-law

half is related by blood

[sage glen]

But your siblings could be from your mother/father

So yeah I think it should be in the table

[red cliff]

so if my dad and your mom got married, i would be your "step-brother" since we are not blood related

but if your mom married another person and then had me, i would be your "half-brother" since we share the same mother by blood

[sage glen]

See I'm confused now

So can we agree that we're half blood related?

If you're my step?

[red cliff]

no like, right now i'm not blood related to you

so if my dad and your mom got married right now

we would still not be blood related

that makes us "step-siblings"

[sage glen]

Okay but if my mom had you

[red cliff]

in that scenario, we would be blood related, and we don't use the word "step" in this situation

[cobalt pollen]

In that case, they would be blood-related

[red cliff]

so we are "half-siblings" there

[sage glen]

OHHHHH

Okay it's adding up

Yeah shouldn't that be in the table?

[cobalt pollen]

How would the two of you be half-siblings if that were the situation?

[sage glen]

Because we're both from the same mother

[red cliff]

we are hypothetically imagining that we have the same mother

[cobalt pollen]

Then you are complete siblings

[sage glen]

No

[red cliff]

but separate fathers

[sage glen]

Different fathers

[cobalt pollen]

oh I see

[sage glen]

I hate family trees ong

[cobalt pollen]

But sibling is defined as they that are born from the same mother

I suppose?

[red cliff]

yeah we are referring back to an older message where i mentioned the father being different

[sage glen]

Idk about that chief

[red cliff]

it could also work the other way, same father but different mother, still "half-siblings"

[cobalt pollen]

So that's not half-sibling, that's pure sibling

[cobalt pollen]

yea, it eould work

but not the other way around

i guess

[red cliff]

my understanding is that if one out of two parents are shared ,then it is "half-sibling"

doesn't matter if it's the mother or father

[sage glen]

I'm flustered, I digress

[cobalt pollen]

Yea, I think that's how it is used

bit

but

yet

[sage glen]

2 things I can never understand in life, consanguinity table and bernoulli's principle

[red cliff]

lol

now you can understand both

[sage glen]

Alright what if you had a shape of Y pipes, which one will work as pressure differential

[red cliff]

i don't understand the question

and even when i do, i probably still won't be able to answer

i'm not an expert on this subject lol

[ember hatch]

Oh, 'twnny' is like the one example that's almost surely the more common way to say it. It's so common I don't even think of it as 'dropping the t', just as the t being silent lmao. Im surprised you haven't noticed it before :0
Im not here to argue anymore tbh, I just found it interesting you didn't notice 'tweny' before

[red cliff]

oh i surely have noticed it before, i just didn't think about how common it was before

the proper pronunciation is supposed to say the "t"

[ember hatch]

That I imagine would be like 'innermident' where 'd' is a flapped t not an actual d

[red cliff]

the first t gets dropped while the second is flapped, i would say

[ember hatch]

But it's such a formal word I doubt people wouldn't enunciate it :p

[ember hatch]

Ooh I see. Yeah, I guess as a learner I was more aware of it cuz like: 'wth are these Americans dropping the t there confused sounds '

[red cliff]

after a few failed attempts finding a "winter" example, i searched specifically for a "twenty" example because i knew i would be more successful there

i actually rarely heard anyone say the second "t" during my search there

[sage glen]

Yeah the water is coming through the bottom of the Y shape to the fork which one will carry out the water and which will play as pressure differential

[red cliff]

i need a diagram or something, i'm still lost

i think maybe there is some confusion about the image i posted, i think the air is what is flowing and the water is used to see the pressure differential

bernouli principle is acting on the air

[sage glen]

Oh I didn't see that

[red cliff]

rapidly speaking the word "twenty" is so common, i think it just eventually became normal to say "twenny" even when slowing down

[ember hatch]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero_copula#In_English

@sage glen ^ about the 'to be' dropping thing

The 'In English' section

[ember hatch]

YOLO is one they say out loud

[red cliff]

good one!

[ember hatch]

That would make sense

[tight dome]

there u go

[red cliff]

perfect, thank you so much!

[red cliff]

and i found another one
https://www.instagram.com/marvel/reel/Cywmtexvbzk/

and i found this one earlier this morning
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZXQsOMWjk8

[tight dome]

Interesting

I guess we just found 3 of the 5 people in Kentucky in 1950 who say winter like that then

Which is very impressive cause it’s literally like finding a needle in the haystack

Right?

[haughty flicker]

Unrelated but hey I've made one of those apparatuses before haha

[haughty flicker]

@tight dome @ember hatch @red cliff good video explaining the phenomenon
https://youtu.be/v_0VY17Ufz4?si=4--Ji4ud1ysWyECJ

[ember hatch]

wait, the plural of apparatus isn't apparati? :0

[haughty flicker]

Correct haha or maybe it's like octopus where octopi and octopuses are both acceptable plurals but I've not heard apparati myself

[cunning mica]

Do they say 'understand' like they're under someone named Stan?

[haughty flicker]

People do sometimes, yes, it's a very lazy pronunciation but it happens.

[ember hatch]

Jus looked it up, iss apparently a hypercorrect one, cuz ppl associate the '-us' ending with pairs 'focus-foci' and 'radius-radii'

but etymologically they would be 'incorrect'

'octopi' and 'apparati' are just people applying patterns to words they shouldnt be applied to

very interesting

[sage glen]

There's no logic or rule to it really

Some people do it and some don't

[ember hatch]

I think the former is much more accapted than the latter, though, so I'll stick with apparatuses

[haughty flicker]

Yeah, and technically the plural for octopus should be octopodes, to follow the etymological trends but that suffix is so rare that so many people have assumed it to be -i or -es, making them acceptable by now.

Kind of like how the word centrifugal is accepted now, because of a song. The word centripetal contains the definition of centrifugal and the other part of the force acting on spinning objects, but because of that song and the existence of centrifuges, people did not realize they were using a made up word.

[red cliff]

Yeah, trying to follow all these confusing rules of forming the plural of words derived or borrowed from another language is just a bit too much for me. I say it's perfectly fine to apply the usual rules of English plurals to any noun.

I prefer octopuses, radiuses, millenniums, etc

[red cliff]

I never knew this. I've been using the word centrifugal all this time

[ember hatch]

Yea that makes sense. I think it's nice to know the 'proper way', but over all it doesnt matter

[ember hatch]

I mean, the '-en' plural is germanic as far as I know, not from any other language

'oxen', 'brothren', and 'children'

[red cliff]

Let's ditch these as well, lol

At some point, it would be a bit weird to wipe out all of these irregular rules,I suppose

I mean, we use brothers these days rather than brethren

We can do the same for the other irregulars

But I suppose this isn't the place to be starting a linguistic revolution

[ember hatch]

'wolf' becomes 'wolves' but 'waif' becomes 'waifs' not 'waives'. Thas one of my fav irregulars lol

[ember hatch]

we need a spelling reform and complete regularisation of all English words

[red cliff]

I don't even know the word waif

[ember hatch]

(idk if 'regularisation' is a word)

[ember hatch]

ive only heard it twice

[red cliff]

I understand your meaning, regardless

[red cliff]

You probably mean standardisation, maybe

[ember hatch]

I like this example cuz it shows like, how English is so ireggular cuz of how it evolved over time. In Old English you'd add '-as' (or '-es'?) to form some plurals, and between two vowels/between voiced sounds, /s/, /f/, and /θ/ became [z], [v], and [ð] (which weren't their own sounds back then, but only allophones of the aforementioned phonemes). So 'wulf' became 'wulfas' in the plural, but it was pronounced 'wulvas', and then when /v/ became its own phoneme instead of an allophone of /f/, it started to be written with <v>. But this intervocalic fricative voicing only happened up to Middle English, so 'waif' didn't undergo it cuz it came into the language during Middle English.

It's just a very interesting way to show how English borrowing stuff at different times and solidifying its spelling of words at different times is what makes it so irregular. That's why it's my favourite irregular form

[ember hatch]

Oh, that would have been a better word yea

Apparently 'regularisation' is a word, but I didn't even know that lol

[haughty flicker]

Yeah, really the most important thing is just that people understand what you mean c:

[haughty flicker]

Maybe normalization too, that's very common, especially lately

[restive meteor]

English spelling is already standardized (= there's one 'accepted' way of spelling things) and normalized (= spelling things that way is normal), so regularization is what they wanted

[junior sundial]

What's "octopuses" mean?

[ember hatch]

Yea, like I formed it on the spot so I wasn't sure if it was a word. I know Americans use '-ize' while Brits use '-ise'

cool

I'll stick to my 'ise' spelling lol

[ember hatch]

Well, I'm pretty sure 'gotten' is an Americanism that's started to be used in the UK as of late

In the past, and still now in older speakers, 'I've got [x] could mean both 'I have [x]' and 'I've received [x]', but now younger people are using 'gotten' for that second meaning, as people do in the USA

There are other use cases too, 'I've gotten turned around' (American), 'I've got turned around' (British), but now Brits would say the former too.

I find that interesting, but I try to stick with 'got' anyway

[haughty flicker]

it means more than 1 🐙

saying someone sounds like a high school dropout or a hick is EXTREMELY RUDE. please refrain from doing these things, you might not mean it as insultingly as youre saying it but it is EXTREMELY INSULTING. please please, be respectful, everyones here for the sake of knowledge so no one should be judged on where they are lacking in it.

just please try to be nicer @left geode

[ember hatch]

I think singular they predates the US

[red cliff]

Probably for AAVE more so, but I find quite a diverse group of people saying it this way. I tried searching Common Voice. Are you referring to the voice recording collection project?

Pretty common for "asap"? If so, I agree with you. That's what I was saying.

It's a neat database, but why do you bring it up?

It actually really is, lol

Yeah, thinking about it more, I can agree with this

That's a good point

[red cliff]

It does predate the US, but when resistance came along in the 1800s/1900s to call this wrong, it was the Americans that pushed back the most to make this more acceptable, from what I gather.

I can't understand what this 3rd one is saying

[red cliff]

The American heritage dictionary, the Collins dictionary, the Merriam Webster dictionary, and dictionary. com all include the word "millenniums" as an actual word. Weird? Probably so. Confusing? It follows the most elementary rules of constructing plurals. I would hope most people aren't confused by this.

I honestly don't mind being a bit weird.

But if I'm wrong about some things, I'd love to make corrections.

If I sound like a high school dropout, so be it. I learned the "normal" plurals for these words a long time ago, and I was a long time user of them as well. It was a later, conscious decision I made to accept the words I accept today, despite what some academics tell me.

[ember hatch]

interesting

thas good

[red cliff]

Yeah I understand that. Most people probably are. It is the more common way to express the word. And that's why I accept that I may be a bit weird for accepting another form of the word.

Oh we can get an idea about that. Let's check. I'm curious honestly

I find it almost amusing just how big the spike is around the year 2000

But not surprising

What is surprising is just how high it leveled off to afterwards

Also, it looks like millenniums was actually more common than millennia prior to about 1940

let's zoom in a bit

[red cliff]

clearly, people talked about it more because that year marked the turn of the "millennium"

so yes, it was mostly gen x and boomers that were publishing works that include this term since they are most active in publishing works at the time

it has more to do with the year rather than the generation

i think you have a typo up there, but i think i understand what you are saying

do you belong to the gen z group?

i'm just curious if you are speaking about this out of personal experience, or you have data that suggests this to be true

i wouldn't know if gen z encounters the term millennium less frequently compared to the other generations

my brain is working hard atm to make sense of what you just said, wait a moment

when you say non "new millennium" senses, are you referring to this? the difference between "millennium" and "new millennium"

okay i think i see your reasoning

if we compare about 1980 to about 2020, the ratio between "millennium" to "millennia" drops from roughly 2.5:1 to roughly 1.5:1, so there's some substance to what you are saying. There could be a generational divide between the frequency of word usage here, especially accounting for the increased usage of terms like "new millennium" and other related uses of the term "millennium".

i remember the days growing up around that moment when everyone was excited for the new millennium. i was a kid, but i still retain memory of it and so my experience with the word will inevitably be different from how most people of gen z experience it

[red cliff]

ummm, no i wrote this from my own brain

well, i agree about the generational divide, but i am unsure about whether it would actually flatline back to pre-2000 levels accounting for the "new millennium" sense