🧠｜serious-chat

[crystal kayak]

I don't think so

[little dagger]

how old is he

[crystal kayak]

Early 20s maybe

[little dagger]

damm this will be a lil hard

unless hes not expierineced

[crystal kayak]

Why 🧐

[crystal kayak]

He dedicates 10hrs of his life trying to prove Islam is false he fails everytime

[little dagger]

im a minor still

[little dagger]

oh ez then

are u muslim?

[crystal kayak]

Alhamdulilah

[cobalt comet]

i'm 25 btw

[little dagger]

mashallah join vc

[little dagger]

join vc

[crystal kayak]

It is not easy he will not listen to you he will only push his own agenda

[cobalt comet]

which channel? i'd have to set up mic and all, which takes time and is boring anyway.

[little dagger]

join vc we will debunk

[little dagger]

in my profile

u can just join

[crystal kayak]

No I don't do that and I will advise you not to do it too

[cobalt comet]

where to click, dude? i rarely get on discord.

[little dagger]

on my pfp

[little dagger]

i just do it sometimes

[cobalt comet]

gotcha, gimme 2 minutes to set up voicemeeter

[crystal kayak]

Yes if you are well knowledge about Islam like you studied in Egypt or Saudi Arabia

[little dagger]

i wanna do one more debate for today

[crystal kayak]

I will listen if the other guy joins on mute

[little dagger]

hes in

he is on mute tho

[crystal kayak]

I think he is a witch

@cobalt comet I am disgusted

[cobalt comet]

lol

idk, voice call is so weird and uncomfy

[crystal kayak]

He is trolling

[plain ruin]

what happened

[little dagger]

ik

[cobalt comet]

i resolved his doubts. He's becoming christian now.

[little dagger]

nah i dont believe in three gods

[plain ruin]

Quiet, satanist

[crystal kayak]

Basically the guy is ashamed of his indian accent that he is using a voice changer to sound like a baby

[azure saddle]

People are crazy

[plain ruin]

Dawg💀💀💀😭

[crystal kayak]

This is why I wanted to listen so nobody would lie like this

[crystal kayak]

I think this is nobu

[azure saddle]

Youre trying to convert the people to another religion?

[crystal kayak]

Have a nice day

[little dagger]

u too

[plain ruin]

Nobu hasn't insulted Christianity
This guy has.

[crystal kayak]

Are you a flat earther

[crystal kayak]

Nobu does it with his actions that is why real christians like Sanna blocked him

[plain ruin]

#🧠｜serious-chat message
#🧠｜serious-chat message
#🧠｜serious-chat message

A complete mockery of Christianity

Never forgetting this, screenshotting it for safekeeping

[plain ruin]

That's the thing, this guy cannot even try to claim Christianity is good, he believes in americans/brits being chosen by God now

[cobalt comet]

all i know is I was blind and now i can see.

[winter echo]

When did that happen, is this for real?

[wary oak]

25, unemployed, drug of choice: meth

[cobalt comet]

nah, it's from the bible.
I was spiritually blind.
Now Jesus has saved me.

[frail nexus]

"#serious chat"

[plain ruin]

Easily accessible too

[plain ruin]

Not at all

[winter echo]

C'mon bro that's a pathetic response 😭

[cobalt comet]

actually, i got banned from the mathemathics server for sharing about Jesus's signature in pi and phi digits, so came here lol.

[plain ruin]

You're not disproving @wary oak' claim at all...

[wary oak]

LMAO

[crystal kayak]

Are you serious 🤣

[cobalt comet]

why did only one prophet, a christian, predict the Trump bullet ear assassination?
Why no islamic prophet predicted that?

[wary oak]

Bro is actually on his 5th day in a row on his bender

[wary oak]

Theres debates that it was faked

No one knows whats going on w the shooter and a professional photographer, same guy that took a pic of JFK was ready on scene to take that pic

[plain ruin]

Even a broken clock is right twice a day!

[crystal kayak]

Does the king James bible say that or

[cobalt comet]

why only our christian clock happened to be right that day?

[plain ruin]

No, he's just a druggie that's insulting Christianity

[crystal kayak]

Ohh noted

[winter echo]

That makes sense, coz I was kind of dumbfounded when I saw that

[plain ruin]

Oh boy, you seriously need to learn figures of speech...

[winter echo]

By the way, are you interested in VC debate?

[plain ruin]

I'd explain it but you're 25 and can't get a job in India, you have all the time in the world

[plain ruin]

He is, record his crap if you do engage with him and his voice changer though

[winter echo]

Cut him some slack, as the gentleman you are

[cobalt comet]

nah i just got humiliated over VC, like over this txt channel, so i'm prolly done...
If anyone needs proofs for Jesus being the CHrist the Son of God, dm me and i'll share my txt file i wrote myself.

[plain ruin]

He made Nobu look intelligent and rational
This guy isn't right in the head

[winter echo]

He even use a voice changer? 😂

[crystal kayak]

@cobalt comet ngl I Feel bad for you hope you get your life together

[plain ruin]

I'm no gentleman for anyone who justifies slavery and crazy talks about genes and falling for fake "prophets"

[winter echo]

You too, are you rubbing salt on his wounds? 😂

[winter echo]

Be the bigger guy

[plain ruin]

Not for people who justify slavery and race purity🙏

I can't give any less of a fuck if someone's choosing to stay unemployed and disgusting
That's on them

[winter echo]

I hear you

[crystal kayak]

He is not in his senses I am just feeling pitty for him

[crystal kayak]

[shell hemlock]

loool

i was feeling silly 😆

[crystal kayak]

[winter echo]

That was when I thought you're the real ruslan, coz I've never seen him here

[crystal kayak]

Was it because a lot of people were hitting on you, there is a lot of creeps on this server

Plus how has your day been

[shell hemlock]

ahahaha

[shell hemlock]

i don’t get hit on cuz i ignore advances

[shell hemlock]

good tho alhamdulila how u been

[neon sierra]

ive played it now for two hours and it is already amazing. It is my first time bringing myself to listen to all those tiny details as well

[rich thorn]

🐮 lee

[turbid dome]

Yup, it’s awesome

[neon sierra]

[crystal kayak]

Alhamdulilah I am doing well

[turbid dome]

Bad troll attempt

[winter echo]

There's one time when one weirdo sent me some stupid messages, I don't why, maybe he thinks I'm gay,
By the way he's some from this server

[crystal kayak]

Well the channel just got worse

[shell hemlock]

i might take break for maybe a few days from discord to strengthen my deen (i missed a prayer)

[turbid dome]

2nd grade math class will teach me how to form opinions on rise of the tomb raider, you’re so right.

[shell hemlock]

i disabled my message n friend request😁

[winter echo]

Hey, i didn't see your crush today

[turbid dome]

What crush lmao

[winter echo]

He get those too?

[turbid dome]

Bingo

Can we get Nobu here

[shell hemlock]

i used to but people would say i’m enabling creeps so i disabled it forever

[formal pilot]

[winter echo]

Oh c'mon, I caught you in 4k

[formal pilot]

He has a crush on Nale 🌈

[turbid dome]

#🧠｜serious-chat message

totally

[crystal kayak]

As long as you learn from your mistakes and make tawba you are doing good.

[turbid dome]

Nah he’s got an ego

[wary oak]

I liked Hasan up until the shock thing

[turbid dome]

The shock thing was fake 😭

[wary oak]

Either way someone pointed out on LSF a lot about him and IK LSF is super right wing pilled but

They did bring up points about Hasan never admitting he’s ever wrong

Which is valid

[turbid dome]

Its fake

[turbid dome]

Yeah he has an insane ego

[wary oak]

I mean he has that big dog sitting in place for like 8 hours

Even if he isnt shocking her its still bad

[formal pilot]

He's illinformed yapper

[turbid dome]

Nah there’s plenty of instances of the dog off stream lmao

[shell hemlock]

i have been rlly busy lately :( i’m trying to do smth everyday to keep myself productive and social with people, so i had some volunteers n events happening, then couple days ago i applied n got into uni, i don’t know it’s just been hard inshaAllah i figure it out

[wary oak]

But yeah he IS probably a narcissist

[true lark]

Sorry what

[turbid dome]

Nah, he’s not ill informed, he just has material interest in forgetting certain things

[shell hemlock]

i obviously feel very guilt when i miss prayers

[winter echo]

Gooemd for you 😄.
For me I just blocked and reported him, but I kind of regretted not threatening to spread it across all social media platforms tho

[wary oak]

Dude his rhetoric is good it’s just he’s a bad guy now …

[true lark]

They are left?

[wary oak]

his rhetoric and opinions are largely progressive

[true lark]

Progressive ≠ left

[wary oak]

Right but the wrong side

[formal pilot]

Wow, Mericans are so smart in printing money

[true lark]

Only in the US do they say that

[crystal kayak]

Walah you don't make any sense plus when did I tag you

[true lark]

Literally isn't

[wary oak]

No one says that

[true lark]

That's just so wrong I can't even begin

No, I'm not even from the US anyways

[winter echo]

You're even better Muslim than me, who's born and raised in Muslims community

[true lark]

I do, hopefully just not as much

[shell hemlock]

i rarely report people bc i lost hope that moderators on discord servers have any sense of justice or accountability (no hate tho to those who do)

[true lark]

I didn't???? I said left isn't the same as progressive

You do realise left isn't a US exclusive term, I specifically mentioned people from the US say it is

[turbid dome]

Btw they’re trolling. They replied to a comment of me talking about tomb raider talking about 2nd grade math

[true lark]

A≠b ≠ b≠a

[crystal kayak]

Mashaallah a hardworking woman, I am rooting for you and may Allah make it easier for you

[true lark]

Please buy glasses

Anyways, I'm here to talk about my country's politics since our elections just finished

[turbid dome]

Which country is that

[wary oak]

Yeah I remember you said my math skills are probably shit yesterday

[true lark]

Like 18 minutes ago just finished

[winter echo]

I didn't know things were This bad

[true lark]

Netherlands

[crystal kayak]

They are biased

[turbid dome]

Oh fun.

I don’t know much about this election cycle there but let me guess it will be a right wing shift

[shell hemlock]

i try my best i still slip up astagfirullah, but to me salat is when i am able to repent for sins n make dua so when i miss that chance i feel ‘unclean’ if u understand

[true lark]

Actually

[true lark]

So it's quite complicated, our cabinet fell so we're having snap elections

Not even close, it's been decades since the last left party led

[turbid dome]

Oh cool. That’s either really good or bad depending on results

[shell hemlock]

idk how good muslims manage work, study and 5 prayers in a day 😭 i rly need help

[true lark]

But this time there's a chance

[turbid dome]

Actually wait no, it’s Europe so it’s mid or bad

[fallow shard]

[turbid dome]

Duckard

[fallow shard]

Heooo

[turbid dome]

How’s it going

[winter echo]

C'mon bro im trying to be a Cupid here, since you guys are both single.
Trust me you're gonna make a terrific couple 😉

[fallow shard]

I'm little tired

And nervous

[turbid dome]

I’d prefer you don’t

[high rapids]

https://tenor.com/view/dancing-happy-dance-happy-birthday-happy-birthday-to-you-gif-14641296808833921829

[turbid dome]

Upcoming interview still?

[fallow shard]

YEA IT'S TOMORROW

[true lark]

The people who fucked it were right wing, but the most extreme right (openly against Muslims etc.) Was the one who collapsed it, though they didn't really get blamed for it by their voters that does mean that other parties likely won't want to rule with him even if he wins

Definitely not

[turbid dome]

Yeah classic

You’re probably still fucked then

[true lark]

Preliminary polling Actually places them second, which is a surprise since they were projected to win again

[turbid dome]

Well, you should be fine

[true lark]

Surprisingly, there's like a 70% chance Preliminary polling is right

[fallow shard]

I hope so but wbu

[turbid dome]

I mean unless you get an LFI style party in power there I sort of doubt it’ll get better but idk

[true lark]

Lfi, don't know that acronym

[turbid dome]

Not much

[turbid dome]

It’s a French party

[true lark]

What are their opinions

[winter echo]

I hear you, but cut yourself some slack

[turbid dome]

Eco socialist

Anti imperialist, anti eu, internationalist

[true lark]

The greenleft Labour party fucked it this election season

[true lark]

Uhh

Anti EU is crazy

[winter echo]

I insist

[fallow shard]

That's better than bad

[turbid dome]

No

[turbid dome]

Yup

[true lark]

It's the far right that wants to exit the EU here

[crystal kayak]

I am in a majority Muslim city so like when prayer time reaches everyone leaves their work to go pray, the only tip I have for you is the missed salahs make them up before you sleep

[true lark]

No, that's not even a point of debate here

[crystal kayak]

@winter echo can you help lils

[turbid dome]

EU is capitalist at the end of the day, they want to completely refound it as a non-capitalist bloc or they’ll leave and create their own treaties, that way they don’t have capitalist oversight

[true lark]

Well

I respectfully disagree

[winter echo]

Why tho?

[true lark]

I like capitalism for now

[turbid dome]

I don’t care to explain to you.

Just don’t

[winter echo]

What do you mean?

[true lark]

Honestly, I don't think they have a set opinion on it, it's not something anyone discusses, I think they're probably pro nuclear in general but it's not relevant to the elections

[winter echo]

💔💔😭

[true lark]

There just isn't a better alternative that's reasonably achievable

Not always

[crystal kayak]

@winter echo if you can relate you can drop some advice that will help her

[manic juniper]

We aren't doing that well in capitalism past 2008

[true lark]

You'll be glad to know that none of the parties that got like more than one seat in parliament here have other ideas

[true lark]

Yeah but give me an alternative that works with roughly 40% voting right wing, 35% left and rest center

Nobody will accept anything else, it requires like 75%+ to agree

[winter echo]

I'm not sure, I was born and raised in a Muslim household, so praying is kind of natural for me

[true lark]

Actually unemployment went up to 4% here

[manic juniper]

I'm not that big in economics but there must be a way to restrict it even past the restrictions we already have in place

[true lark]

If there is a way not even the left wing parties have found it

[manic juniper]

Stock markets aren't a big thing outside of USA, you must be American

[turbid dome]

||breaking the law to arrest CEO’s for crimes against humanity||

[true lark]

cough Actually it's pretty big here in the Netherlands

Mightve invented it but

Well

[manic juniper]

Maybe because two world wars barely affected them?

I guess he truly is American at this point

[true lark]

I find myself not agreeing with anyone here

[shell hemlock]

my asr time is occupied by classes ;-; i would have to miss asr like every weekday

[manic juniper]

How involved is the average person and how big is it compared to USA or Taiwan

Madagascar had no industry compared to most European countries, pointless comparison

[true lark]

Stock markets are popular here but its not a good thing, however getting a majority to do away with it is impossible

[true lark]

Anyone with savings is indirectly involved

Certainly don't think it's the best country, its probably a pretty fast rising country though

[manic juniper]

Why is Portugal so bad despite capitalism

[crystal kayak]

No problem make it up after your Maghrib prayer or when you are free

[true lark]

Uhh

America = big

America = secluded

[manic juniper]

Those countries had no economy compared to USA

[true lark]

America = british funded

[turbid dome]

It was also under control of France at the time

[manic juniper]

So yeah it was affected by WW2, didn't know but not surprising

[plain ruin]

And it worked to fight the drug problem😭
Atleast know what you're talking about

[turbid dome]

Yup, it was affected pretty badly, despite being capitalist

Crazy how that works

[true lark]

Obviously the US sucks like come on let's go school shooting, economically it might be alright bit I still don't want to be there longer than I have to

[manic juniper]

Be a big country with few people and a lot of resources, be barely affected by wars, the secret of USA, Canada and Australia's success

[shell hemlock]

that’s a relief

[manic juniper]

Germany would live in the year 2500 if it was its own continent during WW1 and WW2

[plain ruin]

The Portuguese economy has been slow at growth since they relinquished their territories, the drug thing is very recent
That has no link to why the Portuguese economy sucks

[winter echo]

The US dollar, military might, HB1 program?

[true lark]

Capitalism isn't the best but without a big big majority dedicated to changing it its the only damn option that won't make people's lives worse (even if it might get better from that long term, people won't keep voting for it)

[turbid dome]

Germany was by far the most advanced in the world until WW1

[true lark]

I disagree

[turbid dome]

Who was more advanced?

[true lark]

Depends on what aspect

[turbid dome]

Overall?

[true lark]

I think Britain has a shot if we count it together

[winter echo]

Glory to AIPAC

[true lark]

What's that now

[manic juniper]

Those who make policies in the EU to set up standards are doing well, I think they need to be more lax when it comes to start-ups just so we could compete on the world stage but then it needs to apply to big companies again

[wary oak]

America would take their talent in a day

[manic juniper]

China isn't even a free market yet USA lost ground to technological monopolies thanks to Tik Tok

[wary oak]

Geologically perfect placement as well

[manic juniper]

It's just about being competitive

[crisp igloo]

Hey what's up

[wary oak]

Because we’d pay them fuck you money

[winter echo]

Preferably some minutes before maghrib prayers

[wary oak]

Capitalism

[true lark]

99% of you lot are either insane or overly optimistic about possibilities

[turbid dome]

Certainly was successful but it was losing ground to Germany in many ways before ww1, once Prussia became an empire. It had an insane amount of domestic industry and railroads, whereas the UK had a lot but also colonies. It’s why Marx predicted the socialist revolution would happen in Germany, it was widely considered the most technologically advanced at the time

[manic juniper]

I don't think it's impossible to create a new system

[crystal kayak]

Or she can combine dhur and asr

[winter echo]

It contributes hugely to all the problems the US is having now

[manic juniper]

People thought it was impossible to get a better performance out of some technologies until they found out the key to break through those limits. Economy can't be that much harder

[crystal kayak]

Can't you like ask for permission to go pray

[manic juniper]

But it's not, if it was going well China wouldn't be needed in the world, USA would do fine without it and still being far away from any other country

[wary oak]

Largely

[turbid dome]

We don’t need any more economic output, we have enough for everyone already. It’s a logistics and distribution issue

[manic juniper]

If it was going well the EU would've surpassed USA like it was projected to go after 2008

[wary oak]

No we absolutely do need it

We cannot be beat in that that’d look really bad

[manic juniper]

Same bullshit Soviet commies said, that their economy was projected to outgrow USA's but it didn't

[turbid dome]

Prominent Israeli lobbying group. Not even the biggest (which is CUFI).

[winter echo]

She can do that, but it's kind frowned upon

[true lark]

I think it's very possible to theoretically create one that works, I think it's very impossible to get people to cooperate and implement it without it being reversed due to losing popular vote over temporary losses

[crisp igloo]

I think the hype around China isn't that realistic, yes they are messing up with the manufacturers in the world but they china is at it's peak today, it sucks there, people are aging, life is not affordable, they are against the government and more

[turbid dome]

Why?

[wary oak]

Propaganda and patriotism reasons largely

[winter echo]

Ikr

[manic juniper]

I'm not saying it's peak or that powerful, but it's true that too many countries lost ground to China and if capitalism and free markets were the solution to success then how come this happened?

[turbid dome]

We need to get rid of patriotism, it’s a cancerous force

It creates divisions which ultimately lead to dehumanization

[crystal kayak]

@shell hemlock don't pray after Maghrib,pray before magrib

[crisp igloo]

They are slavering people there

[turbid dome]

Not really

[winter echo]

So you're a globalist?

[turbid dome]

No, globalism is terrible. I’m an internationalist

I don’t want countries

[manic juniper]

If "be capitalist […]???[…] profit" was true then how come is China's economy growing to this extent lol
Or how did Nordic countries do better than more capitalist countries up until recently

Maybe because it doesn't have to do with the economic system but rather the corruption involved

[turbid dome]

I mean China is state capitalist, all they’ve done is regulate it and it turns out that unregulated business is terrible for society

Cool

[winter echo]

What's their difference, mind telling?

[manic juniper]

Pretty much

[crystal kayak]

In her case I think is permissible because her classes start in ASR making her not able to pray the ASR prayer

[wary oak]

Every country needs it though

[manic juniper]

Well that's extra bad, if countries are losing ground to a country with slaves

[turbid dome]

Globalism would be the permeation of capital interests internationally. Internationalism is about the people

[manic juniper]

I thought capitalism was supposed to replace this

[turbid dome]

The US has slavery

[winter echo]

Yes

[crisp igloo]

Yep when I read the GDP of Egypt for example it was very realistic even though its bad but realistic and that's actually what people make, but in Germany for example it's totally different

[wary oak]

We have proxy slavery which ISNT AS BAD

[turbid dome]

We don’t need countries

[turbid dome]

China does the same

[manic juniper]

EU doesn't to the same extent and it lost past 2008, but capitalists told me this wasn't supposed to happen

[wary oak]

China is defacto what i meant

But youre right

[turbid dome]

It’s literally the same system of locking people up and using them as slave labor

[crystal kayak]

Don't just say yes Come up with a better solution😂😂

[wary oak]

You mean prisons?

[turbid dome]

Yes

[wary oak]

I meant we outsource products from countries with sketchy labor markets

[crisp igloo]

That is why automation is important so you can slaver robots instead

[turbid dome]

Yup, we created those sketchy labor markets

[wary oak]

I think Mao played a role not us

Lol

[manic juniper]

Does USA have free markets to you

[turbid dome]

China under Mao was entirely different, it was Deng who opened the markets

[wary oak]

Either way, we didnt make them build all those factories

They did it to advance

[turbid dome]

No, but they only have as many factories as they do because of foreign corporations who decided to use cheap labor

[crisp igloo]

But then you just run a branch or a production line in India or China, this is called comfort zone, and here we are complaining about China taking our jobs

[manic juniper]

Untrue, China and USA are the exact opposite of free markets

[wary oak]

How’s that our fault they took the deals

[manic juniper]

Not advantaging certain companies over others with subsidies

[wary oak]

Either way, China does the same we did to them to other countries now, Indonesia, Thailand, etc

[turbid dome]

And in many countries (not China) we have taken advantage of the post colonial gap for Neo colonial purposes

[turbid dome]

I’m talking more broadly than China here but in China’s case it’s not

[crisp igloo]

@manic juniper

[winter echo]

Let me tell some of the globalist agendas.
1 countries without borders
2 ban religious organizations
3 forceful assimilation.
4 digital ID like the one EU is pushing for
5 one single central authority.
We're all able to avoid that thanks to patriotism to a large extent

Hahahah

[manic juniper]

EU isn't pushing for digital ID, it's completely different. Some EU countries already have digital ID

[wary oak]

I feel like youre more closer describing ‘ alliances ‘

[turbid dome]

Lmao.

Globalists only care about markets being free for exploitation.

The dog whistle is obvious tho lol

[crisp igloo]

No no no no this is the key to hell, They did this in Egypt and it turned miserable

[manic juniper]

You should get informed before speaking. Italy has SPID and CieID for example, Ireland and Austria too have their own. They had it for almost 20 years

[crystal kayak]

@shell hemlock here are the options lils 1:ask you professor if you can be a little late to his class because of prayers, option 2:miss ASR but pray it before sunset, option 3: you can merge dhur and asr but that is in extreme cases

[turbid dome]

They’re coercive, African countries as an example are pretty much stuck in their poverty because of us

[wary oak]

Hold on hold on

[manic juniper]

EU is pushing for chat control
Saying they are pushing for digital ID is like saying car companies are pushing for rideable lightning bolts

[wary oak]

You mean white colonizers in general or the US

[crisp igloo]

I live in it

[wary oak]

Cause Portugal , Spain, France and Belgium did waaay more of a number on Africa than us

[turbid dome]

Yes, but they all had to leave because they exhausted their empires.

The US and British discovered that instead of doing a colonial occupation you can simply leave your companies there and coup the government when anyone challenges them

[hybrid herald]

Others crimes doesn't Justify

[hybrid herald]

Other's crimes doesn't Justify

[winter echo]

It wasn't explicitly prohibited, it's kind of discouraged, however if it's something out of your control, you're excused,
That's the good news 😁

[crisp igloo]

I get it If you mean under the table

[shell hemlock]

okiee i get it i have to pray asap

[wary oak]

I thought the British did occupy though

Wait nvm

[winter echo]

Lily cut yourself some slack

[wary oak]

Thinking of somewhere else

[crystal kayak]

May Allah make it easier for you goodnight

[turbid dome]

Yes but they stopped most of their occupations now, same as France. All the ex-colonial empires now engage in this practice as a Neo-colonial system

[wary oak]

Minus the big China who are actively winning the proxy war there

[turbid dome]

China’s history is different regarding Africa but yeah, they’re offering loans to develop markets so they can sell more

Not a good practice, it’s super predatory, but better than IMF/world bank structural adjustments

[crisp igloo]

It is not good by the way, you wouldn't want to street fight a gorilla, same with business, your startup wont survive a competition with the government

[winter echo]

In a nutshell they just virtually want to control all aspects of our life

[wary oak]

Idk if it’s better but it’s something

[true lark]

The first is good though, it's very nice to not have to have my passport with me if I'm just hopping next-door

[manic juniper]

And shared currency is great, no need to exchange it anywhere or anything like that

I can bring my Euros to Spain and buy just as I would in Finland

[turbid dome]

You have to be insane not to, the IMF structural adjustments allow foreign capital to Pillage countries and create famines, such as in Somalia where it destroyed the domestic grain market causing Somalia to be perma fucked

China, while predatory, doesn’t tamper with governments like that

[true lark]

Yeah

Screw the brexit such a pain when I go there by train now

[manic juniper]

99% of elements of the EU are great, whoever thinks other systems we already have could be better is just delusional

Euros still have their own identity in every country and no one stops them from making it more varied

People aren't speaking the same language, everyone would hate that

[true lark]

Not everyone

[manic juniper]

Why

[true lark]

Economics, political division

[manic juniper]

It's not the EU's as a concept that is at fault

[true lark]

Most Dutch people don't give a fuck

[manic juniper]

Is it because everyone in Amsterdam speaks English now

[turbid dome]

That was a different governing philosophy, the incompetence of Mao vs the neoliberalism of Deng

[turbid dome]

I mean it could be hypothetically if it wasn’t for the fact it requires the countries to be capitalist

[manic juniper]

How tf are the shared currency and Schengen to blame for lack of innovation?

[turbid dome]

Yes

[true lark]

Not just Amsterdam

[manic juniper]

It's good because they are capitalist and it's the best capitalism at the moment

But even if it was all socialism, which countries would be better? Those where you need a passport to travel every two steps, to exchange currencies, or just wherever you wish and buy with the same coins everywhere

[turbid dome]

It’s part of the reason Europe is moving towards parties like the AfD

[manic juniper]

It's never "we leave and become better" it's always "we leave and stay miserable"

• UK

[turbid dome]

I only supplied one example of where it went wrong therefore it didn’t go wrong anywhere else? Are you slow?

[manic juniper]

Yes because it's not in their best interests after all, and there are too many left wing tendencies in the larger EU Parliament Vs the single countries

[turbid dome]

All those could be done under a socialist EU bloc. The issue with countries leaving the EU is doing so and taking right wing policy instead of left wing ones

[turbid dome]

There’s not much left wing tendency in the EU

[manic juniper]

I'm not saying it's impossible, just that it's the best at the moment and anyone who thinks that dropping those elements (one currency, Schengen...) is just delusional

Also because they got nothing to do with capitalism, it always was a thing that certain countries would use another country's currency

[manic juniper]

It has a big presence in the Parliament last time I checked

[turbid dome]

I mean I would rather a large country like France leave and drop it and then negotiate into Schengen again. It would be much better as it would create an example

[true lark]

Nearly everyone speaks English and the Dutch language isn't apart of the culture

[turbid dome]

They’re mostly Soc Dems willing to shift right and they love engaging in their Neo colonial practices. I don’t count anyone who is a capitalist or imperialist as left wing

And tons of socialists are just branding exercises

[true lark]

That's changing with these dutch elections I hope

[turbid dome]

I would hope too

[true lark]

I mean left wing, not extreme left

[manic juniper]

"It leads to inefficiencies"
Saying that about shared borders and currency is laughable

[true lark]

I dont think we even have extreme left right now

[winter echo]

I'm not sure about that, anyway, take look at this video https://x.com/newstart_2024/status/1980584376397189547?s=19
Although it's exaggerated

Camus (@newstart_2024)

Digital ID is the gateway to this life. This will 100% be our world if we don’t stand up and resist now!

This is not a drill. This is a clip from the chillingly brilliant sci-fi short, Utopia.

The film exposes a "paradise" where citizens use a government app to surveil and fine

X · Oct 21, 2025, 10:38 AM

[turbid dome]

One is badly needed

[manic juniper]

Because it'd better if Liechtenstein had its own currency instead of just using the Swiss Franc I guess. Liechtenstein's currency independence is so important and efficient to keep

[turbid dome]

No you don’t understand. Liechtenstein will be a superpower soon

[true lark]

It is not

Nobody is voting for them

[turbid dome]

If you want a counterbalance to the far right crowd then yeah

[manic juniper]

Yes, Sweden has its own currency that is pegged to the Euro in value, so having another currency if anything is what leads to more bureaucracy

[turbid dome]

They’ll at least keep the permissible rhetoric competitive

[true lark]

Say that to our election results

[manic juniper]

What's even the point of Sweden and Denmark having the crowns still

[turbid dome]

It’s not going to be a long term solution unless the root causes are fixed

[uncut pike]

The most advanced country in the Maghreb is Tunisia, right ?

[manic juniper]

I don't have X, I can't see it

[true lark]

We don't need more irrational extremism, it doesn't balance things out, just leads to more convincing arguments about either side against the other

[turbid dome]

The liberal parties in Europe are going to beat the right wing parties by going to the far right themselves 😭

[true lark]

It's a movie clip

[manic juniper]

Why did he share something that got nothing to do with chat control. I guess because he doesn't even know the difference between digital ID and chat control

[true lark]

Liberal ≠ left so maybe

[manic juniper]

Most British people don't have a digital ID but they are still subjected to chat control

[turbid dome]

That’s what politics is.

It’s the exact same attitude that gave us Trump

[winter echo]

You gotta have X, it has one of the least censorship

[turbid dome]

Unless you’re not a Nazi

[manic juniper]

Having a digital ID just makes it less tedious, digital IDs is what you use to sign a contract without being present in person. It has nothing to do with chat control

[true lark]

Yesnt

[manic juniper]

No thanks, I don't like porn

[true lark]

It is maniac filled

[turbid dome]

X is just Nazi heaven

[true lark]

It's also called twitter

[turbid dome]

This explains why you’re wrong

[true lark]

This explains a lot

[turbid dome]

Almost every word you’ve said

[true lark]

It has no fact checking obligations

Period

[manic juniper]

@true lark do you like not needing a passport and not having to exchange currency?

[turbid dome]

Defending this graph is a great example

[true lark]

Fuck yea, best thing ever

[winter echo]

That's what they want everyone to believe, but it's just a tool to control our lives.
Have you heard of people being debanked for critizing their government policies?

[manic juniper]

Then yes, I guess we care

We could ask other Europeans and find out

[turbid dome]

Already gave you an example

[true lark]

Holy shit, far right, conspiracy theorists, what's up with this bunch

[manic juniper]

Digital IDs were introduced over 20 years ago, you guys have no idea about how they work somehow

[bitter anchor]

Hi people

[fresh flower]

Salam walakum chat

[turbid dome]

@abstract night

[true lark]

Digital ID is nice

[manic juniper]

If they wanted to control us why the fuck did they expect me to become 25?

[true lark]

Wish it wasn't broken though

[bitter anchor]

Aze?

[fresh flower]

Takbir ☝🏻

[true lark]

English please

[fresh flower]

Idk what this means

[bitter anchor]

Harası?

[winter echo]

Now that you mentioned, I don't think I've ever come across x rated content on X.
Are you sure you're talking about the same X?

[manic juniper]

I used to work in customer care for the government to fix issues with the digital ID 😔

[fresh flower]

Oh, I don't speak Turkish bro

[bitter anchor]

Tm knk

[manic juniper]

Yes, Twitter and Tumblr were porn cesspools, ever since they banned porn on Tumblr all degenerates moved to Twitter

[true lark]

Can you help me fix mine lol, mine expired and the system literally won't let them issue a new number

[turbid dome]

Lmao it’s an example of a concept and there are labels

[fresh flower]

Go here bro #💭｜general everyone is Turkish

[bitter anchor]

Okay

[manic juniper]

Lmao I think it's a different system perhaps, also I don't know if they'd hire someone who isn't Dutch or doesn't know Dutch but you said they don't care as much anymore

[true lark]

They definitely would still hire you haha, but yeah

Especially if you have experience

[manic juniper]

I have plenty, I worked there for years

At some point they gave me new products to help people with

[true lark]

A|_
B

[turbid dome]

Ok you’re getting blocked because you can’t read and we went over this yesterday😭

It’s not real data, it’s me demonstrating the concept of definitions and the changes in them making biased statistics and charts

[fresh flower]

ALL of you will be kicked out of Europe

[winter echo]

We might not be talking about the same thing.
The digital ID I'm talking about is a system or tool the global wants to put in place,
That is tied to all our personal informations.

[manic juniper]

I'm ok with that, just kick Russians out of Siberia so I can go back there

[fresh flower]

I LOVE BANKID I LOVE BANKID I LOVE BANKID

[weary belfry]

Who's bankid

[manic juniper]

There is no such thing in the EU tho, anywhere

[fresh flower]

I'd never ever ever worry about being cutoff from the world if the government cancels my bankid

[weary belfry]

Ban kid?

[manic juniper]

Probably not on any country even outside of the EU

[true lark]

They would definitely take you haha

[true lark]

China has that no?

[fresh flower]

It's a uhhhhhh it's a hmmmm

[manic juniper]

There could be government records but not something people have any choice on

[fresh flower]

It's a digital signature software

You need it here or else you don't exist as a person

[winter echo]

That's a news to me, by the way, how do you know that?

[true lark]

[fresh flower]

Self incrimination

[fresh flower]

Are you a furry bro (Respectfully)

[winter echo]

😂

[true lark]

I'm not, I just do horse riding

[manic juniper]

How does he not know, he's probably on X for those reasons

[fresh flower]

Actual horse or hobby-horse

[true lark]

Actual horse

Hobby horsing is... weird, I'm sorry

[manic juniper]

I bet but it wouldn't even fit the definition of digital ID since it's not accessible to most people

[true lark]

That's what I did when I was three

[true lark]

Probably so

[manic juniper]

You would be surprised that there are probably remote signatures made in your name out there

[fresh flower]

I reinstall instagram once a month for that exact reason, every now and then my entire algorithm switches from Bosnian estates and Chinese memes to onlyfans despite me not engaging with it

For some reason it fixes my feed, for a short while

[winter echo]

For now fortunately, but they are actively trying to sale the idea to people under some pretext.
Seriously, you gotta have X account

[true lark]

Pff

[manic juniper]

I saw remote signatures in my name, because I signed contracts in real life long ago. They converted them to remote signatures without even telling me

[hybrid herald]

This chat is more alive than general 😿
Ts pmo ❤️‍🩹🥀

[fresh flower]

X is unnecessary why do you need it

[high rapids]

https://tenor.com/view/putin-nato-russia-vladimir-vladimir-putin-gif-13707825506315371638

[true lark]

I prefer not being fed conspiracy theories without sufficient proof in a feedback loop

[manic juniper]

I only ever got Australian animals in my Instagram feed

[winter echo]

Uncensored info

[high rapids]

That´s a fact

[fresh flower]

I get my news from a tiktok account that turns them into Minecraft content

[manic juniper]

Where

[turbid dome]

Someone would say this unironically

[manic juniper]

I want a single example of what you're talking about

Like I said if there is such system it's already in place and not accessible to the average person

They don't even need to have propaganda about it because it already exists

[dry wigeon]

What type of personal information

[true lark]

I dont want uncensored info, I get my info from places that censor falsities, be they right wing or left wing oriented

[winter echo]

Have X account first, we'll talk about it when you do

[true lark]

MrSheen, you have fallen for a few of said theories without even noticing

[manic juniper]

There is a technology called screenshot, it was created over 20 years ago as well. No one is stopping you from using it

[true lark]

You are practically quoting Facebook mom's who only get their news from Facebook, just replacing it with twitter

[fresh flower]

The daily emerald is a trusted and unbiased source of information

[thorny steeple]

Hi ppl

[winter echo]

Everything about you, from your health records, bank details, driving license, social media accounts, and so on

[thorny steeple]

[manic juniper]

That's not digital ID tho

You don't need to propagandise digital ID to people to get those info on them

[fresh flower]

Digital id is just signature though

[manic juniper]

This is like saying mass surveillance is home security propaganda

[dry wigeon]

Except for social media accounts, many countries already have databases of such information
What the hell💀

[fresh flower]

Wait health records can't even be accessed by anyone except you and the hospital

(Here)

[dry wigeon]

What's a digital id gonna do to stop governments from having information they already have...

[dry wigeon]

Some places there's a centralised health system, requests have to be made for pulling the records if any

[manic juniper]

Yes lmao digital IDs don't store much about you, I worked in the sector

You have to be afraid of remote signatures, I don't even know how some companies are allowed to produce them without even informing you or asking for permissions

[fresh flower]

No one can do that except you and doctors here afaik

[dry wigeon]

It's literally aggregating data they already have about you😭

[fresh flower]

I remember asking my optometrist for my results as an email and bro said fuck off no because of GDPR

[true lark]

French politics are a much bigger mess tbh

[winter echo]

They want to connect everything together and give access to globalist,
You don't seem to understand the gravity of the situation

[manic juniper]

The most they care about is you changing your birthday, name or place of birth. If you change any of these the digital ID becomes invalid

[high crater]

This chat is serious chat

[manic juniper]

Since changing those would change your TIN and most European digital IDs use your TIN as main pillar

[winter echo]

I think it's part of it

[true lark]

Yes, congrats. You have achieved eyesight

[dry wigeon]

It still doesn't matter
What're they gonna do with your birthday, email, phone number, bank accounts, etc. that they don't already do

[manic juniper]

Even if it doesn't change your TIN it would break your ID

[true lark]

Kewl

[dry wigeon]

Give access to the globalists
Okay what will they do with it💀

[manic juniper]

Remote signatures are scary because they will sign a contract in your name

Idk how they get away with this shit

[dry wigeon]

Share me a slice of the profit and we're good bro
That's how credit cards offer rewards while you don't pay extra

[manic juniper]

I saw people with countless remote signatures, many of them weren't even deactivated by the company that produced them. They lasted for 3 years after the contract was signed which is scary

Imagine someone with access to the database, they could sign contracts with someone else's inactive credentials

[winter echo]

Now if I tell you your government is spying on you, you won't believe me

[dry wigeon]

Again, what privacy?
You already have a goverment issued ID basically everywhere, with which your goverment can already pull up your financial and criminal records along with your PII

[manic juniper]

I get producing a temporary signature for three days but jeez some of these companies are lazy and leave it up for three years

[true lark]

America is, doubt mine is

My government can't keep itself together

[fresh flower]

Abdul would you ever move to a European country

[true lark]

Nevermind launch a conspiracy

[dry wigeon]

Data breaches that we're already vulnerable to since you know... There's already... Databases...

Potential authoritarian government... That.. you know... Can just fucking pull the same data out anyway

[manic juniper]

He should move to Russia or Ukraine

[fresh flower]

Ukraine are Nazis no 👎🏻

[winter echo]

Nah, I might get arrested for saying somethings

[fresh flower]

Russia defeat Nazism 🙏🏻👍🏻

[dry wigeon]

It doesn't make a difference, your ID gets leaked, then what? You think such things are just stored in plaintext in 2025?

[fresh flower]

What things💀

[thorny steeple]

Are you racist?

[winter echo]

Which country are you from?

[manic juniper]

Yes, he will fight alongside other brave, consenting Africans who certainly wanted to fight on Great Russia's side

[winter echo]

Do racist even gets arrested in the EU?

[dry wigeon]

For the benefit of the citizens, less things to carry and process and worship about
A simpler and easier procedure in case of lost documents or devices

[true lark]

Netherlands

[dry wigeon]

I do know, but they're not that dumb in the big 2025 either, especially nowadays

[thorny steeple]

Mhm. If you draw swastika on a wall you will be fined.

Maybe jail

[manic juniper]

Yes
https://tvpworld.com/89541691/latvian-arrested-after-abusing-ukrainian-family-on-swiss-train

[thorny steeple]

One time my classmates made a swastika out of bricks in front of the school and nothing much happened to them other than a slap on the wrist. This was of course in America though.

[winter echo]

Isn't that supporting Nazis?
We're talking about racism here

[dry wigeon]

No that's the thing, it would be more of a waste of energy to have different IDs for different documents
Simplify it and have a single document that can fulfill on purposes

[true lark]

Yes, they might even be more strict on it (HIGHLY dependant on the country and current government)

[dry wigeon]

If this is this an argument you're going to make you're looking at a team of 20 people taking over the world

[thorny steeple]

Yeah and they would even yell white supremacy in the hallway at a school with majority of hispanics.

They were loco

[winter echo]

Do you have another source, it's asking for consent to track my data

[thorny steeple]

I am glad they don’t allow this violence to spill to other countries. I hate violence.

[dry wigeon]

The point is that it would be more demanding, you have to maintain more databases that have a copy of the same data,
Ex. Name, birth date, address
And then different data
Ex. Bank info, tax/credit info, medical info

It's redundant
Not to mention the health information data would have another government issued ID linked too... And then your banks would also require you to... You know... Show ID
Multiple systems that they already have

[manic juniper]

There are videos on YouTube with translation but I don't think there are videos about his arrest, only articles

[thorny steeple]

I wish everyone can have a safe place to sleep at night.

[manic juniper]

https://youtu.be/7M7FaHjXbFs

[manic juniper]

Swiss police seems effective

[dry wigeon]

It's insanely unnecessary
In your TIN they more than likely also have a column that has another government ID anyway

It's just unifying databases and reducing redundant data

[fresh flower]

Yooo I've seen this

[manic juniper]

I saw with original dub, it's even worse

[fresh flower]

Mfs live in the comfort of a foreign nation and still bring their issues

[manic juniper]

He is a Russian from Latvia, basically a proto-Israeli

They tried to turn Latvia and other Baltic countries into other Israels for Russians but they failed

[fresh flower]

I blame my ancestors for losing control of Latvia

[manic juniper]

Losing Latvia and Estonia was a big mistake

[winter echo]

Have Tommy Robbins ever been arrested for racism ?

[manic juniper]

Also Poland betrayed Lithuania pretty much condemning it to the same fate of the other two

[fresh flower]

It's sadly true

[manic juniper]

It's not, they deported hundreds of thousands of Baltic people while importing hundreds of thousands of Russians

[high rapids]

https://tenor.com/view/lithuania-poland-hetalia-gif-11236833853714930267

[manic juniper]

Who is Sweden's Israel, is it Finland

[winter echo]

what's his name?
Can I find it if I search 🔍?

[high rapids]

Lets invade finland

[fresh flower]

Huh💀

[manic juniper]

No, his name is protected by privacy, you can look up "Russian man arrested in Switzerland" or "Latvian man arrested in Switzerland"

[dry wigeon]

That's... The whole point of what the proposal is

If you mean just linking all IDs into a single already existing ID, then it would cause issues of its own, the idea is also to improve transparency on how the person shares data with the entity requesting data from the ID

For example you give your bank your ID to make an account, you get a message on your phone's ID app saying that the bank has requested your name, phone number, financial information

That's a whole other system that needs to be built with a unified ID, but ultimately will be less resource consuming than having multiple databases

[manic juniper]

I found it, it's Alexander Vabik

[winter echo]

I'm talking about that specific incident of racism

[manic juniper]

This is one

He threatened to kill the parents because they were Ukrainians (or so he thought)

[wary oak]

I was at an airport in my city once and watched a russian guy scream at a latino waiter for his poor english

In broken english

It was actually insane to witness

[manic juniper]

In reality they were speaking Ukrainian and Belarusian, the guy he threatened is Swiss of Belarusian descent with Ukrainian wife

[dry wigeon]

If you wanna go you go hell and go down

[manic juniper]

https://en.bb.lv/article/world-news/2025/10/19/latvian-citizen-detained-in-switzerland-for-aggression-against-ukrainian-family-73882

It's Austria but depressed

[dry wigeon]

That's like
The whole point of democracy
They have to gauge the reaction to something they wanna get done, even if the involved public are pretty fucking dumb

[manic juniper]

They do

[dry wigeon]

They do
That's the point
The public are fucking dumb

[manic juniper]

They don't need digital IDs to track you more

Especially since getting a digital ID relies on cross checking with records that the government already has

[dry wigeon]

Because they know that people are stupid 😭
And its turned into something political by their opponents

[manic juniper]

It's why those digital IDs are difficult to get if you're not a citizen. They can't as easily check the validity of your documents

[dry wigeon]

LITERALLY
It makes forgery HARDER

[manic juniper]

The safety standards are high, if they mess up they often find and fix the mistake sooner or later

I worked there for years and I've only seen one instance of those in charge of cross checking who fucked up
And even then, they fixed it after a day

I don't know how they did it since the ID was already approved

Not really, it's more difficult if protections are in place

It's a lot easier to forge a document

To give you an idea, I never saw a forged digital ID, but I saw users with forged documents trying to get a digital ID

If the system detects that the ID doesn't correspond it simply doesn't allow it to work

[hybrid herald]

Looks like Dm

[dry wigeon]

I don't know if that's really the case, if you have your phone number linked to any social media account, then if you say dumb shit, the platform gets a subpoena, you're linked to your email and IP and therefore your phone number, which is linked to ID

It's still the same thing at the end of the day
You're already trackable

[manic juniper]

Finland and some other countries had them for years, I don't think I ever heard about any such system

That I have no idea because I didn't work on the technical level, but it's safe enough that I never saw any instance of forgery occur

[weary zealot]

Guys what's the goodness of afk in discord?

[dry wigeon]

Explain what you mean by this...

[winter echo]

He's Latvian citizen, plus his ethnicity is not stated on public records

[manic juniper]

I can guarantee that if it wasn't safer the government wouldn't even employ them, since it relies on info they already have

[manic juniper]

In the video he says "I am Russian" lol, and yes he is a Latvian citizen same as some Arabs being Israeli citizens

Does that make them Jews?

[dry wigeon]

Wait... Do you think a digital ID is just an app that shows a picture of you and some details...?

[winter echo]

How about identity theft, ever heard of that?

[manic juniper]

A lot more common with standard IDs

It's not impossible with digital IDs, just more difficult

There isn't just a photograph, you need a video in real time with an operator most of the times

You can also use an NFC recognition system with an app on your phone

There is also another method that uses a remote signature or a device with remote TIN

Yeah I guess so, I never was involved in that part of the job but one of my colleagues in the same office was

[dry wigeon]

Noting down the information wouldn't be enough

You'd have to have physical access to the phone, go to the appropriate place such as a bank

You'd have to show the digital ID like normal,
Now the main thing would be having to also do some sort of extra verification, only on that device with the ID

You wanna open an account? Okay, the bank has to send a request to your digital ID linked number, you gotta verify with an OTP

So noting down your details alone, wouldn't help the criminals

[manic juniper]

I guess it'll get easier to falsify digital IDs in the future thanks to AI but they'll be safer than physical IDs, those are already more easily falsifiable

But then you need to have the call with the operator

[dry wigeon]

For use virtually, maybe

If it's in person processes then it's more safer than regular IDs

[manic juniper]

And yes, of course it can be falsified. Take for example two twins, one of them does the video call in the place of the other twin

She can perfectly activate the digital ID in place of the person who's actually requesting it

But this shit can happen with physical IDs too, it's nothing special

[true lark]

Atheism is dumb, A.M.A.

[dry wigeon]

But... That would already be a problem with existing IDs...

[manic juniper]

I bet that this happened before, heck I know two twins who inverted their classes on purpose just to see if anyone would notice
Spoiler: no one did

[winter echo]

Good,
Take a look at this
https://www.ojp.gov/ncjrs/virtual-library/abstracts/child-identity-theft?utm_source=chatgpt.com

[winter echo]

Are they identical twins?

[manic juniper]

They don't, but yeah that would require an extra layer and more info on the digital ID which the government may request

[dry wigeon]

Yes the US has a system where with someone's social security number alone you can do anything you want to

Compare that to a system where you'd require an ID linked to a phone number and a fingerprint

Having the ID wouldn't be enough to do anything useful

[manic juniper]

Isn't that a type of physical ID

[dry wigeon]

Literally 😭

[winter echo]

Probably, but they are very vulnerable to hacks, and exploitation

[turbid dome]

Social security is physical paper card.

[winter echo]

Yes, but identity theft also happens online, how frequently? I don't know

[dry wigeon]

Data breaches and what?
You'd require the ID card to get authenticated everytime you use it;
I.e. if someone "has your ID information through a data breach", they'd still need to be able to authenticate using your device

Authoritarianism? They can be authoritarian with physical IDs and ballsack hair IDs that are still linked to databases too

[winter echo]

Tell Lazarus that

[dry wigeon]

The other guy has just shown you that physical IDs are vulnerable to data breaches anyway...😭

[winter echo]

I don't understand what you're saying

[manic juniper]

Much less often

[winter echo]

Not really season hackers can easily find a way to bypass it

[manic juniper]

When I began working there I also had the feeling that getting the digital ID falsified couldn't be that difficult

But they have enough security measures in place that it's safer than physical IDs

[dry wigeon]

A device, and that's an example
your device is lost or stolen, your were already issued a digital ID before? Great
You can take your new phone, to a kiosk, biometrics, voila, your new device has everything you need
Your old one is useless

[manic juniper]

Every escamotage I could think of could be prevented or counteracted in a way or another

[winter echo]

Maybe malicious actors are not interested in doing that

[manic juniper]

https://tenor.com/view/star-wars-yoda-how-embarassing-thats-so-embarrassing-embarassing-gif-17362984

[winter echo]

Tell the NIS that

[dry wigeon]

They don't need digital IDs to do that
Whose networks are you connecting to? Is the fibre optic running to your house connected directly to China?
Are the 4g/5g towers coming from China? Not at all, you're being tracked right now

[manic juniper]

This guy only survives off MCU type of quotes

[dry wigeon]

...

Again, you're being tracked by companies and the government in real time, already

[winter echo]

Do you know that all the computer systems in the US have been breached at least once by malicious actors?

[dry wigeon]

If people put as much time into learning what they have in their hands as they did on discord

[manic juniper]

I don't think you get it, getting s digital ID relies on info the government already has about you

If they wanted to falsify or forge it, the person whose identity is being stolen doesn't even need to have a digital ID

[dry wigeon]

They do, the problem is more of an identification issue rather than tracking

And I'm not saying that they have a database that stores everywhere you've been

If the government wants to know where you are right now, they more likely than not, can find out where you are right now

[winter echo]

The problem is they is too much data to analyze

[winter echo]

How did we digressed this far?

[dry wigeon]

Guess what your phone number and internet bill are linked to... A fucking ID

[manic juniper]

Please text without using AI

[winter echo]

How sure are you they can keep that data safe?

[dry wigeon]

You're at a hotel? ID

[dry wigeon]

Can they keep your data safe already...?

[turbid dome]

You can tell they did because it’s grammatically incorrect

[manic juniper]

Don't know if it's bad English or he used AI to understand what I just explained

[winter echo]

I didn't use AI, because this is a topic I'm well versed on

[manic juniper]

I just explained how digital IDs aren't a tool created by the Jews to make Europeans speak German and eat bugs

And how it relies on info the government already has about you and thus people should focus on that rather than digital IDs per se

[winter echo]

Not really they've been subjected to so many attacks, which they couldn't stop

[manic juniper]

Like yeah I'm also against the government owning those info
Digital IDs rely on those info, without them you simply keep them stored somewhere

[dry wigeon]

Because you have to know who you're tracking... For one

I have more to say, but I'm curious, how are you suggesting that being able to track anyone on demand means being able to catch criminals

[dry wigeon]

Who's been subjected to many attacks?

[ancient silo]

https://tenor.com/view/d9luxe-wolf-gif-8308069160251473616

[winter echo]

The thing is I don't even remember what we were arguing about.
We were talking about digital IDs but I don't know how we got to this

[dry wigeon]

Okay, what I understand from this argument is:
You think being what I mean by tracking is that:

• They have all data of where you have been and are

I'm saying that all governments know where you are, not keeping track of where everyone in the country has been

[winter echo]

All the companies that have the responsibility of keeping your data safe

[wary oak]

What

[dry wigeon]

They are able to track you on demand, they're not going to keep track of every place on the planet you've been and store it, that would be hard to maintain

No, I mean, they can track your position in real-time if they request

[winter echo]

Is that what you think?

You can simply bypass that by using cash, crypto and so on

Why weren't they able to stop 9/11 before it happens?

Third party accounts?

[dry wigeon]

Huh😭

[wary oak]

Because that was before the internet was so widespread

And technology was in its infancy

[winter echo]

you see the reality, the US was basically spying on every individual who have access to the Internet but the didn't notice 9/11 before it happened

You never know

[dry wigeon]

Oh lord... Maybe it was because no one anywhere including ATC and anti highjacker teams thought that terrorists would crash a plane into a fucking building...

Idk tho

Not to mention, when it came to 9/11, security was very less compared to nowadays

Airport security got tightened because of the attacks

Then you have to count people speaking English and Arabic and in code

Knowing what someone is saying doesn't mean knowing that you know what they're doing

[wary oak]

Plus they were basically sleeper cell agents

They laid low and took classes here

[winter echo]

Not really necessary, because they have too much information to analyze, it might also be because they failed to anticipate it, which makes it every worse

[dry wigeon]

Yup
No amount of spying would've changed that

[wary oak]

9/11 is shrouded in mystery

You cannot 100% deny there was no conspiracy

No matter what if you look at the evidence

The owner of the building took out insurance right before the attack, and was known to ALWAYS be in his office at a certain time, and on that day he wasnt

Theres much more but its certainly plausible

[dry wigeon]

I remember watching a video about what air traffic control was going through and the process was crazily stupid

[fresh flower]

They did know that Al Qaida were going to hijack a plane though

They were just 3 years too early

[winter echo]

I recently read a book titled, this is how they tell me the world ends.
It's a book about cyber war
And the vulnerabilities the Internets have and so on

[wary oak]

Justify invasion in the middle east

Profit off of arms sales and oil

[winter echo]

I have a conspiracy for that?

[wary oak]

Not that hard to understand why we’d benefit

[fresh flower]

3 years too early

[dry wigeon]

2004😭

Oh mb

1998

[wary oak]

What do you mean which group ? Like which government org?

[fresh flower]

The US 100% knew that a plane hijacking would happen they were just too cocky and thought no one would be that insane

[winter echo]

You also believe digital IDs are to put in place to control our lives?

[dry wigeon]

You're arguing with someone studying cybersecurity and another who's training to be a pilot and set up her own home servers

[winter echo]

They can track you but there are some blind spots

[winter echo]

What's the source of that paper?
Edward Snowdens, WikiLeaks?

[dry wigeon]

Blind spots in 2025 in a city are essentially 0

[manic juniper]

I share birthday with Al Qaeda

[dry wigeon]

It says it right there... Declassified and approved for release
It's the government itself

[winter echo]

That's what they all claimed publicly

[dry wigeon]

Oh boy

[winter echo]

They have reputation for falsifying information, they could have made it up to save some face, because that's a terrible oversight

[dry wigeon]

Why would they save face
This was information they had in 1998 about attacks happening in 2001

Releasing this information is not saving face, it shows that they had knowledge and didn't act enough upon it

All risks already exist
None of the benefits already exist

[winter echo]

The government and globalist.
To you it's not necessary but keep in mind that those so called government that you voted for are constantly spying on you, heck even my government does it to some degree

[winter echo]

Those info were made public After it happened, they just made it up to cover their oversight

[fresh flower]

Don't trust anyone here bro

[winter echo]

Did you know anyone who has been debanked for simple criticism of government policies?

[dry wigeon]

Huh? This information shows that there was an oversight, if anything

If they had no knowledge of the attacks, no amount of spying in the US would've helped them since planning the attacks didn't place there

You self hating jew!

[fresh flower]

There are NO backdoors on your processor, do NOT ask why Siri responds immediately if you say "Hey Siri"

[dry wigeon]

No interest free loans for you

[winter echo]

Hahaha 😂

[dry wigeon]

No, Intel ME is not a backdoor! When did you say Intel ME? You just did!

[fresh flower]

I'd never ever ever ever link all devides to the internet which I have no control over

[dry wigeon]

You and your little plex server sitting in a tree
K-I-S-S-I-N-G

[winter echo]

The thing is they are spying on all individuals who have access to the Internet.
I don't believe they don't have data for the info,
Maybe it's because they focud too much of their effort somewhere like Russia for example and fail to analyze the data for the devastating attack

[dry wigeon]

People who don't already have 3 copies of Wikipedia and an LLM downloaded along with a solar setup and backup drives shouldn't be talking about government and digital security imo

[fresh flower]

Bro that reminds me

[dry wigeon]

They CAN spy and they ARE spying are two different things

They can spy all of us
They aren't spying all of us right now

[fresh flower]

Usually the movies I torrent have a bitrate of 20mb/s

[dry wigeon]

Did you get nerfed by the y*****s

[fresh flower]

I downloaded the new fantastic four and that shit was 70mb/s💀💀💀

[dry wigeon]

Whaaaaat

[fresh flower]

It gotta have some malware or something why tf is it 70

[dry wigeon]

Bro got buffed instead

[winter echo]

For your peace of mind, keep believing what you believed

[dry wigeon]

Must be because it did shit at the box office

[winter echo]

As the say ignorance is bliss

[fresh flower]

No government is spying on any of us btw

We not that interesting

[dry wigeon]

No, it's just not possible for them to be able to physically store the amount of data you're implying

[fresh flower]

Only person I know being spied on is @summer sphinx by Modi

[wary oak]

uhh yeah they are

edward snowden ?

[winter echo]

It's a common occurrence in the US

[wary oak]

whistleblower that the NSA is spying on literally everyone

[winter echo]

Try contacting Edwards Snowdens

[fresh flower]

The Snowden files weren't citizen data though

It was DOD files

He snitched on his government and its capabilities he didn't leak citizen data itself

[wary oak]

He leaked that the NSA was doing it

[winter echo]

yeah, he just leaked the tip of the iceberg

[wary oak]

Why would he leak the data…no one would like him if he did

[fresh flower]

Exactly but the NSA doesn't store it, it would be MASSIVE amounts of data

They'd only store it if you raised flags otherwise it's stupid

[wary oak]

They do store it

They have giant data warehouses bruh

Look up the nsa building in nyc

[winter echo]

To you it's stupid, but to them it's a potential leverage

[wary oak]

They probably run scans through everyones shit looking for keywords

[dry wigeon]

That had to do with an attempt of the government to have direct access to various social media servers without public knowledge

Now there are systems the government has to go through in order to retrieve individual data from those servers

Instead of watching YouTube videos, read the source

[wary oak]

I trust my government!

Fyi nsa and cia operate with no government overhead or insight

Dont report to congress either

But they still get funded by our tax dollars

[fresh flower]

They don't store them there though, they'd use their own servers like the Utah data center and that one "only" has between 3-12 exabytes of storage capacity, it's not nearly enough to keep data and keep tracking everyone

[dry wigeon]

Ong y'all have the worst security agencies though in terms of procedure and oversight

[fresh flower]

Either way though I don't want the US to spy on me or have my data

China can, I love China, long live China

[dry wigeon]

There's more procedures nowadays for warrants and subpoenas though, rather than direct access to servers, thanks to snowden, lol

[wary oak]

Surely theres more locations that are classified , probably hundreds

Probably off shore too

[fresh flower]

Everyone forgot that the Danish fucks were spying on EU countries too with the help of the NSA

[dry wigeon]

Having a data warehouse seperately... To store data that's already stored somewhere that's already accessible. Makes no sense

[fresh flower]

I can't speak more on my hatred for Denmark I got warned yesterday

[wary oak]

I mean i didnt say it had to be stored in 2 places

[winter echo]

That's what they admit publicly, you never know what they are doing secretly

[fresh flower]

By the grace of Allah we will corrupt the data in these servers stored by the corrupt Americans amen ☝🏻🤲🏻

[winter echo]

Have you heard of notpetya?

[fresh flower]

We must make Jihad

[fresh flower]

No bro idk who that is

[dry wigeon]

No
The idea is that data is already with Google, Verizon, Microsoft, AT&T, etc.

What was planned was for unfiltered access to the data all these companies have, this was stopped due to Snowden

Now they don't have direct access. However, if they issue a warrant or a subpoena for an individual's data, the companies have to comply.

The security agencies don't have to have their own warehouse for data

[winter echo]

It was one devastating Cyber attack Russia carried out on Ukraine that crippled it entire energy sector and everything that is connected to the Internet.
It happened some years ago, can't remember the exact date

[winter echo]

Did you believe them?

[fresh flower]

Hope Ukraine starts producing more Flamingo missiles to take out all Russian sectors

[winter echo]

Is that the new wonder weapon?

[dry wigeon]

Them? This was from the Snowden leaks
Not youtube videos
If you knew anything about storage costs you'd know that storing data is a pain in the ass

Storage being cheaper doesn't make it easier to run such a system at scale

You have the data already stored on the system of companies that already pay to maintain them

Maintaining an equal number of servers to store data already with those companies is literally a waste

You can just get a warrant, request data from the said companies, instead

[winter echo]

Snowden was just a contractor, he have limited access, and are you telling me the government that's spending over 1 trillion dollars annually doesn't have the resources to store those data?
Are you sure you even know how valuable data is?

[dry wigeon]

To make a carbon copy of Microsoft, Google, Verizon, etc. servers by the government is literally melting money

[dry wigeon]

I'm sure that I know, I actually work and study in the field, instead of promoting half baked conspiracy theories online using an AI echo chamber that... Wait... Also spies on you...

[dry wigeon]

The government making replicas of those servers etc. is a waste of money for them, when they can make a request instead

[winter echo]

You don't know, if you know you wouldn't be spitting this garbages

[winter echo]

We're no longer in the 2000s many companies offer unlimited storage practically for pennies

[dry wigeon]

Collude is a heavy word, there are legal processes nowadays by which companies provide limited data to governments nowadays

If you're not upto speed, you should read about how companies have also denied requests to the government, over and over and over again

[winter echo]

By the way,what do you know about stuxnet?

[dry wigeon]

Which companies would these be💀💀💀 I'd like to know

[dry wigeon]

You're talking about a 2010 attack in 2025...

[winter echo]

Answer this question first, I'll see if it's worth it to keep arguing with you.
Namely what do you know about stuxnet and notpetya?
@dry wigeon
Here first

[winter echo]

I just mentioned because of how sophisticated it was

[dry wigeon]

Seems you have no idea how the legal system works
Agencies are required to maintain a chain of evidence

Purchasing data from data brokers, that's limited data, you'd get some keywords, a name, a username, a birthday, at most
Not chat logs, posts in a private instagram account, comments, etc.

You want to convict a criminal, you have to show evidence such as the above.
The defense has the right to question the authority of said evidence and the prosecutor has to present it, and show it was obtained using legal methods, which would be, a warrant/subpoena

[winter echo]

Answer my damned questions

[dry wigeon]

Sophisticated...? Explain how it was sophisticated

It replied on zero day exploits...

[winter echo]

Here first

[dry wigeon]

To conduct their investigations... When they have reasonable suspicion. Once they get to concluding someone's a criminal, they have to be able to back up the trail of evidence.

Wait nevermind, you misread what I wrote

I said that the defense has the right to claim a mistral if the prosecutor does not prove that the data requests etc. were not obtained in the proper manner

I didn't use those exact words, but that's what I meant.

Evidence has to be presented, with its chain

[winter echo]

#🧠｜serious-chat message
Here first

[dry wigeon]

Again, what do you know? You claim they're sophisticated; explain how

Securing evidence is one thing, they have to also show that the evidence was done by legal means!

If done illegally... Mistrial!

Purchasing data...
Data from purchases is very limited
And even if they "purchased data" that wouldn't make it legal just because of payments

[winter echo]

You won't escape that easily, I asked first you should answer it if you know what you're talking about

You believe that garbage?
What's Google's source of revenue?

[dry wigeon]

Here's a simple fact, you're talking about a work that worked on zero day exploits
It's hardly sophisticated
It involves the Iranians running multiply systems that had software that had weaknesses
The worm looked for various softwares and versions to look for known older vulnerabilities by which it could infiltrate

Google wouldn't have the right to sell personal chat logs, prove that they do

[winter echo]

This oversimplification shows you know very little about what you're talking about

[dry wigeon]

Which ToS, identify the line

[dry wigeon]

Great, explain it to me then

For use in prosecution... That wouldn't be allowed

I pointed out how Edward Snowden led to the system of legal requests, quite a bit earlier while you left

ToS aren't legally binding by simply being a ToS, who lied to you? Perhaps you should verify this first

ToS' are constantly challenged all the time for not being in line with regulations

[winter echo]

I'll check my notes, meanwhile, tell me what you know about notpetya.
I'll be back in a minute

[dry wigeon]

There are laws in place to determine what type of data is legal to purchase

There are laws that dictate how data such as chat logs should be sourced by federal agencies

The fact that you said this, means you simply don't know enough
If I opened a bank and wrote on the ToS and made a customer agree to something that isn't legally permitted, it's not enforceable

[winter echo]

I'm waiting for your reply.
I got my data ready

Where's that girl I'm awaiting her response

Tell that to Lazarus

Even you and i

[dry wigeon]

ToS are basically agreement between a company and the end user, and would also necessitate the company mentioning the jurisdiction of the company.
They come under... Agreement laws and laws in general.

If google puts "Private photographs of the user including and not limited to sexual may be sold by us" in their ToS
It's not legally binding... There's no "law" that says this, in regards to ToS

It's known and shown over and over that ToS have been challenged, if they are not found to be legally binding

[winter echo]

Cyber security is a myth

[dry wigeon]

https://www.internetlibrary.com/cases/lib_case302.cfm

A case example

A judge denied an arbitration agreement that was in ToS, on the basis that the request was not lawful

[winter echo]

Answer my question and I'll tell you why I think stuxnet is a very sophisticated attack.
I've checked my notes

What do you think about China and Russia in this context?

[dry wigeon]

Did your notes show you the fairly outdated Microsoft windows systems that were attacked, along with other software responsible for controlling the machines that was attacked?

[winter echo]

Actually I've read about 5 books that talked about stuxnet in a detailed way

I didn't even bother to read, coz she couldn't say anything about notpetya

[thorny steeple]

hello

define bad

defne good

[winter echo]

1Targeted attack on Iran’s Natanz Siemens SCADA systems.
2
Used multiple zero‑day exploits.
Spread via USB and networks, even air‑gapped systems.
3
Manipulated PLCs to physically damage centrifuges while hiding the changes.
4
Highly stealthy stolen digital certificates, concealed payloads.
5
Implied state sponsorship. huge resources and coordination.
6

[thorny steeple]

define them both without using that

[dry wigeon]

You asked for a "law that states this" replying to my message that said ToS aren't necessarily legally binding
#🧠｜serious-chat message

That case was an example of how a ToS can be ruled as non binding

[thorny steeple]

you say the opposite of but define in their respective feuldsfuck you die

my computer froze

just define bad without saying the word good or any synonyms

deal with what?

What makes a non-justified act bad?

What does that look like?

but what makes that bad?

why is that bad just because you say so

[dry wigeon]

I'd love to continue with you on this, if we're talking about the US and laws regarding the sale of data, iirc this is more of a state level thing than a federal level thing
The only federal level laws/orders are for regulating the sale of data to foreign entities
So it's an answer that'll vary and also take line to address each law
To get you the details on how agencies are restricted to retrieve data and those laws, is much easier though
Though I'll follow it up later on tomorrow, with both combined

[cerulean pivot]

you mean what is the basis of the sources of legislation

[thorny steeple]

its your words you say that its bad but I dont think its bad nor good it just is

[cerulean pivot]

Mostly religious reasons

[thorny steeple]

we are talking about inharnets

[dry wigeon]

It doesn't, there is still a limit on what data can be sold and how, with respect to TOS, chat logs are basically never included in TOS under selling data. It takes one person to link to such a TOS to find out fast.

[cerulean pivot]

Ohh

I took it war far then

[dry wigeon]

Great, share the titles, I'll search for copies online and see what these are, given the fact that the US and Israel deny the virus being their doing and Iran is usually also very quiet

[thorny steeple]

good and evil dont exist inherently and you cant prove me wrong

[dry wigeon]

Sorry, worm, not virus
Quite different

[winter echo]

Hey I'm still waiting for your to tell me what you know about notpetya

[frozen cape]

ToS is there to scare laypeople into inaction 🫢

[cerulean pivot]

Don't shout at me i just woke up 😭😔💔

[thorny steeple]

you need to go deep. You say something that is not justified is bad, so define justified

[winter echo]

I'll tell you the titles on one condition, tell me what you know about notpetya

[dry wigeon]

Oh sorry, that was quite a while ago, I got engrossed with the legal argument since that's more of my thing, data forensics and legal uses

[thorny steeple]

explain that

[dry wigeon]

Notpetya wasn't as talked about as stuxnet was, so I can't tell you about a situation I didn't study about. There are lots of branches within cybersecurity.

[winter echo]

No worries

[thorny steeple]

Language is made up just a bunch of sounds and symbols

[frozen cape]

no. - not yes
yes. - not no
BOOM

[dry wigeon]

Never said there wasn't a law, just said that it's more complicated, please check what you're replying to
And while you're doing that, also checked out what I replied to as well!

[frozen cape]

not - no
BOOM

[dry wigeon]

And at the end of the day, if a company was caught selling chat logs, with no law preventing it, and also a ToS not saying chat logs would be sold, it would probably be considered as illegitimately sourced data too, by virtue of the relationship of the end user and his use of the website/app in line with ToS

[frozen cape]

no. - not yes

[dry wigeon]

Correct but you also claimed that a site has provided a ToS that claims all data may be sold, I asked you to source the ToS and which line number, you haven't done that

[frozen cape]

yes i was proving your point

[winter echo]

In that case
Here's the titles.
1 this is how they tell me the world ends.
2 the perfect weapon.
3count down to zero.
These will do for now

[dry wigeon]

I'll get back to you after reading more case studies and laws @abstract night , I'll catch some rest

Fair
Any sites come to mind, ping me with them

Then by that virtue of buying data from criminals... It could be sketchy for governments to use for prosecution
They could use it to start an investigation but probably not enough to obtain a warrant or even subpoena

[winter echo]

You'll be surprised if I tell you government still buy data from data brokers

What makes you think they are acquired legally?

[dry wigeon]

It could still be criminally sources
And here as a leak, they'd also have to be able to verify the leak as being genuine in order to ensure it can be used as evidence

In order for that to be investigated, whole can of worms there

[winter echo]

Those so called brokers buys from hackers and script kiddies, who acquired them illegally

[frozen cape]

plausible deniability

[winter echo]

Hey those data aren't meant to be used legally

[dry wigeon]

Buying data from data brokers isn't inherently illegal
It depends on what data is bought and how the broker sourced it's data

If a government says it bought chat logs from a data broker, the defense can question how the broker got these chats and whether the chats are genuine, then the broker would have to prove the way the data was sourced from the platform for it to be admissible

Then the court will have to judge the legality of using evidence obtained from, say, a hack, that was done by a data broker or bought from a criminal, and being sold

Chain of evidence is important

[winter echo]

Exactly

[dry wigeon]

The chain of evidence would still be important lol, he'd still have to prove it, his name may be redacted from the court case
Just like they do for minors who appear in court cases

[winter echo]

What if the data was acquired through illegal means, will they still be admissible?

[dry wigeon]

If it was a whistleblower in the group of the defendant, they'd still have to prove it

[winter echo]

Hahaha

[dry wigeon]

Usually no, in can depend though, if the data was obtained illegally and verified as genuine, and the charge is high enough, it could be admissible

Then the reliability of the data comes into the picture again
Defence claims that and it's a rocky road of getting that to be used as evidence

[winter echo]

That makes sense, but it have might the opposite effect,
Just like a cobra effect

That's basically encouraging anyone with the means to get data illegally

[dry wigeon]

It would depend on the chat message itself too

For example if someone said they killed 5 people, it was verified as a real message and sourced illegally, it wouldn't be admissible

But if the message said he killed 5 people, where someone was hit, how, where, why, that would be admissible