🧠｜serious-chat

[manic juniper]

Poland is cheap too but far from Russia's economy

[dapper laurel]

But at this point it is worth staying in Vietnam, the education in Russia is not the best

[manic juniper]

Maybe, I don't know much about the education systems of both tbh

[mint pebble]

Majapahit empire was in today's South East Asia.
Not in India. I've searched it now

[manic juniper]

The Romanian one is decent enough at least when it comes to tertiary education, the others suck unless you are a genius

[waxen shale]

Yeah, but before the time these empire arise they colonize the island of java, and they came from indian empires

[dapper laurel]

Maybe on the same level, Russia is spending too much on the military, reasonably less state funds go to education and healthcare

The only thing I know for sure is that education in Italy is quite messed up

They want to introduce Bible reading in elementary schools, like a real third world country 👌🏻☝🏻

[manic juniper]

We should have those but with the Kalevala since it's beautifully composed

[dapper laurel]

School should be a secular environment, they managed to ruin that too

[dapper laurel]

Here they could do it with many masterpieces of Italian or Latin literature, but they do it with the Bible

It's delusional

[mint pebble]

I didn't know about it really.
But some of Indian empires had invaded South East Asia in those times. But most of them wanted to trade with the native empires. When they refused it,they invaded their country.

[manic juniper]

It should be that case only in Greece since the original Greek translation was well written

Not the greatest achievement in semi-modern Greek I guess but it's good

[dapper laurel]

The Greeks are always one step ahead

Two steps ahead

[waxen shale]

The java island was inhabited. But theres others empires at that time. Not just majapahit.

[manic juniper]

Was it inhabited by parrots

[mint pebble]

I see.Where are you from?
I'm very much interested in history.

[dapper laurel]

He's aryan from AliExpress

[mint pebble]

Hey guys,do anyone knew or heard about Tamil.

[manic juniper]

Yes

They are a Dravidian people

[mint pebble]

What do you mean?

[mint pebble]

You are right

[tender vessel]

it's not the result of stating facts about how oppressive and violent Islam is.
It largely is. You're simply desperately attempting to distort the image of Islam. I've responded to many of your complaints before, and although you didn't respond back with a valid argument that truly addresses my responses, you've never changed your behaviors and position.
You're basically loaded with prejudice and preconceived beliefs. There are only few things that I despise more than an Islamophobe attempting to spread their agenda, honestly.

I know it's shocking for you to see people talking negatively about Islam, but believe me, it's normal for people to have negative views on religion even when they don't have truama related to it and express them.
You don't know anything about me. I've heard almost every single complaint you've presented before way back, and I've responded to tons. You're basically bringing recycled garbage, with all honestly.
If you've truly researched enough about Islam, you wouldn't really come up with the same statements I've been hearing for a very long time. I really suspect you're one of those who watch Quasi Bitar, Ahmed Harqan, and other Islamophobes filling your head with all types of hatred and prejudice and later vomit those in the chat. It's obvious given that there has been instances in which you quoted books without actually reading them and understanding their context, such as cherry-picking "humiliation" from Ahkam Ahlul-Dhimah. It took me about 5 minutes to reach the point in the same book that refutes your complaint.

Again, I'd advise you present your issues to the Muslim Lantern, he is more qualified to answer those (he probably answered all of them already). Otherwise, I don't know why would someone keep posting his opinions all of a sudden about a religion they left, especially when their opinions aren't arguments that remotely disprove that religion. Go live your life and touch some grass.

[dapper laurel]

Difficult to explain

[mint pebble]

You cannot tell a person whether they are aryan or not.
Because India is a very diverse country.

[dapper laurel]

I was joking

[mint pebble]

Do you have any idea about what Indianisation of South East Asia is?

[manic juniper]

What's that

[waxen shale]

Well the majapahit has a big a clue to where im from

[mint pebble]

Okay.

[crude widget]

You know what. I'm inclined to agree that we can't dismiss the Islamic religion on the basis of having problems with this apostasy issue. Any attempt in arguing against the religion should be based in something else more fundamental.

[mint pebble]

I too didn't know about that much. But I'm asking whether anyone knew about it?

[waxen shale]

Obviously. Ahaha, still carried some aryan blood tho

[stuck estuary]

Всем привет! Тут есть русские,которые учат английский (16+)? Hello! Are there any russian guys (16+) that guys lean English (A1-A2)?

[mint pebble]

There is no ethnicity called aryan or Dravidian.They just mean linguistic groups..
Every person in India will carry both AASI and AANI y-DNA.

[waxen shale]

Yeah, i agree with you brother. The only one who proudly claimed they were "aryan" is the white nationalists Nazi.

[thorny steeple]

Fresh orange juice beats apple juice any day of the week but if both are from the supermarket then apple juice clears honestly

[mint pebble]

Some of politicians in India are taking this myth as an advantage just for vote bank along with casteism and religion.
They are truely the unwanted pests for India.

[lethal sparrow]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=knGOusAz2As

[manic juniper]

Because ethnicities are made up

[manic juniper]

Iranian has the same meaning as Aryan lmfao

[mystic bay]

[manic juniper]

Are you saying Iranians are Nazis?

[mint pebble]

How it could be? Where people of iran supported Nazism?

[manic juniper]

no, Nazis simply appropriated the name from them

[mint pebble]

I see.
What do you think about the symbol Swastik?
It's quite common here in India to see that symbol everyone as religious aesthetics by various religions.

[manic juniper]

It used to be the same in some European countries but unfortunately had its reputation ruined by inhuman people

Hopefully one day there won't be a stigma on it anymore since it's part of some cultures

[rose eagle]

but they are quite expensive

with citizens of a third world country

[waxen shale]

I don't like nature its stinks.

[sleek epoch]

One week goal of not watching reels .
Day 1
Watched reels : 0

[dapper laurel]

I would advise you to stay in Vietnam, but going to Russia wouldn't be a bad option if you want to leave

[cloud moat]

Hi

[sleek epoch]

Hmm

[feral river]

population is a good resource

[plush pilot]

Here slowmode is enabled

[mystic bay]

https://tenor.com/view/roll-slowpoke-pokemon-rolling-gif-7525170

[shy summit]

They don’t have the support for this

[feral river]

gosh

he can't be serious that was a trump depicted by a typical roman

and Third Term was like Third Reich ? is there any relevance who knows

and that's definitely out of the line

[shy summit]

Bro these trump and elon glazers are so fucking retarded, look at this shit.

[feral river]

I think that exist in both sidees

[shy summit]

Yeah but only one side is THIS retarded to think Trump wasn’t going to do all the things he said he was gonna do

The buyer’s regret is insane

[feral river]

cult of personality dude

we have that shit for all the time

didn't surprise me about it

[shy summit]

What in the fuck

[feral river]

goin back to the past

let's see what judges would say

[mystic bay]

term limits always seemed rather undemocratic to me

[shy summit]

They ensure no one can hold onto power forever

[mystic bay]

I understand

But, from a democratic point of view, why would that be objectionable?

Perhaps the demos wants the person or party in power forever

by which I mean, again and again

[shy summit]

Are you familiar with the concept of a tyranny by majority?

[mystic bay]

Yes

It is the central reason why I am not a democrat

[shy summit]

It ensure continual progress.

[mystic bay]

I wouldn't go so far as that

[shy summit]

The founders were not entirely trusting of the masses

[mystic bay]

It might guarantee change

Whether it secures progress is another matter

[shy summit]

So they put checks in place like a bicameral congress

[mystic bay]

Right

There may well be good reason for it

[shy summit]

Granted the bicameral is dumb

[mystic bay]

But I still think it is undemocratic

Since the justification for it seems to recognise the dangers of democracy

[shy summit]

It ensures that borders have power not people

Cali vs rhode island

2 sens each

[mystic bay]

My point is that term limits seem to exist in spite of democracy

not because of it

[shy summit]

They just garuntee you can’t end up with a king in all but name

Which is why what trump is doing is so disgusting

[mystic bay]

Yes

I'm not objecting to it

I was just pointing out that it is undemocratic

[manic juniper]

Slowpoke

[open plover]

Yeah, for sure

[slender coral]

@mystic bay what do you think about this?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omnipotence_paradox

[mystic bay]

To cut a long story short, I think that paradoxes of omnipotence rest on a kind of fallacy of equivocation, where they involve reifying ('thingifying') contradictions. Can God create a stone that he can't lift? Well, for one thing, there could be no such thing as a stone which an omnipotent being cannot lift. God can no more create a stone that an omnipotent being cannot lift than he can create a square circle.

So, there is something that God cannot do. Only, there is a problem: a square circle is not a 'thing' at all. It's not just that a square circle isn't actual, since unicorns aren't actual and yet an omnipotent being could create them. It's that it is not even potential. There could not be a square circle.

To put the point semi-technically, peddlers of omnipotence paradoxes require the 'set of things God cannot do' to be populated, i.e., non-empty. But the only way to populate a set is with things, even if they are only possible or potential things. But a contradiction is not a thing in any sense.

It may be objected: Isn't 'contradiction' a noun? And don't nouns signify things? This, I think, is just a limitation of language. When we speak, we have to speak about contradictions as though they were things, even if they are not (I actually just did it there, unavoidably).

[slender coral]

What the paradox does is showing us that the existence of an omnipotent being is impossible, and therefore god's existence is impossible. That's how I understand at least.

[manic juniper]

The Pope is dying and I'm already seeing articles on how Popes are elected

[mystic bay]

Yes, that is the claim

[urban swift]

Interesting

[crude widget]

A truly omnipotent being should be able to transcend logic and populate the 'set of things which an omnipotent being cannot do'. If this is the definition we choose to define omnipotence, and if God cannot do this, then it follows that God is not omnipotent. This is where someone comes in to say that we are just understanding the word omnipotent incorrectly. That's the thing, we get to define what we mean by this. If something can be labelled as omnipotent despite one restriction that such a thing cannot transcend logic itself, then we can restore to God the label of omnipotent.

[mystic bay]

That really wouldn't help you. If God could 'transcend logic' (which I believe is a senseless proposition), then there is no reason why God should not be able to create a stone that he cannot lift, and lift it. No problem.

[crude widget]

That's exactly my point

It is a senseless proposition

[mystic bay]

Right

But that is why paradoxes of omnipotence fail

[crude widget]

That is also exactly my point

[mystic bay]

Good

[crude widget]

We are on the same page

[mystic bay]

Now here is the real question

What do you call it when you have brunch for dinner?

[crude widget]

My meal

Is this one of those nonsense questions? Lol

[mystic bay]

It's just something that was on my mind

I missed brunch because I was feeling sick but then I had what I was planning to have for brunch but for my dinner

[crude widget]

Eh, not everything needs to have a special name

Especially if it's not common enough of a thing

It's your dinner, which included items that are normally included in your brunch

[mystic bay]

Is soup eaten or drunk?

[crude widget]

Contradictions arise from nowhere when we start labelling things. So we ought to be careful

[crude widget]

I normally say that I eat soup, no matter how watery it is

[mystic bay]

Would you still say that if you used a straw?

[crude widget]

Probably, yeah, though I may be a bit hesitant to do so

[mystic bay]

https://tenor.com/view/agitatedcunt-gif-18871935

[crude widget]

I'd probably settle on "eat"

I always say that I "read" an audiobook, even though I'm just listening to the recording

[mystic bay]

Oh

I would never do that

[crude widget]

Some people object to that, but I ignore them

[mystic bay]

I wouldn't object to it

But I wouldn't dream of saying it myself

[main bison]

Zelensky is a dictator

[crude widget]

I appreciate that

[main bison]

He doesn't care about Ukrainian people

[mystic bay]

I think that is half-true

As I understand it, the Ukrainian state does practice military conscription

But evidently not on a par with Putin

[keen moon]

wait, weren't you a Trump fan? What happens reality hits you?

[slender coral]

Isn't that normal with paradoxes? They show us how flawed our assumptions are as they lead to contradictory or absurd results. In the case of this one, saying that god can do anything lands us in a situation where god is supposed to transcend logic, which normally doesn't make sense and that's why atheists use it in the first place.

[mystic bay]

No, that isn't the case. The classical doctrine of divine omnipotence does not say that God transcends logic.

[keen moon]

yes, it is true, a free democratic country isn't it? sarcasm

[mystic bay]

God cannot create a stone that he cannot lift, not because of any limitation intrinsic to God, but because there could be no stone that an omnipotent being could not lift

[slender coral]

What defines that doctrine exactly? Scriptures?

[prisma cipher]

There are no contradictions because there are no rules for God. You have contradictions and limitations and that is why you cannot understand anything.

[crude widget]

I think the objection here is that religious people often say things like. "My god can do anything. There is nothing he cannot do." And then this idea gets extrapolated and straw manned into this paradox.

[urban swift]

So god is unable to create such stone 🪨

[crude widget]

Like, okay, technically there is something he cannot do, but I think he's still powerful enough to warrant being called omnipotent

[urban swift]

Question: can god create a human more kinder than him ?

[slender coral]

This is an argument that could be used to prove anything. I could bring you a book and claim it's from god, and when you object to illogical stuff in it I can respond with "oh you just can't understand it because you have limitations and cannot understand anything".

[urban swift]

Or a human smarter than itself ?

[mystic bay]

It depends. Of course, the Christian scriptures are the final authority for Christians (especially for Protestants). But the Bible is not a textbook. It is not a manual of theology.

Omnipotence is an article of classical theism, which pre-dates the NT, and is articulated most famously by Plato and by Aristotle. Both were (by Christian standards) Pagans, and had no particular theological axe to grind. And I am sure that they would not consider God's 'inability' (so to speak) to create a logically contradictory state of affairs as a denigration of his omnipotence.

[main bison]

No

[slender coral]

How does religion define omnipotence then?

[prisma cipher]

It prove you not smart.

[urban swift]

So god has a limitation

[mystic bay]

Right, because there could be no such stone. Just as there could be no such thing as a square circle, or a married bachelor.

[urban swift]

"God knows better" the classic one

[vapid tundra]

Serious

[prisma cipher]

quantum physics contradicts the laws of logic, but it exists. this argument alone destroys your entire theory.

[main bison]

At least believing in god calms you irl

[urban swift]

So god has a limitation.
(Not talking about circle, square and bachelor)

[mystic bay]

What is the limitation?

[prisma cipher]

Oh god can't exist because it contradict my logic how he can do everything and can't do everything

It god

[crude widget]

There are too many religions out there for me to answer that question comprehensively

[main bison]

He can't create something greater than him

[prisma cipher]

If you start to understand God, it definitely not God

[mystic bay]

Right, because the notion of an entity greater than God is incoherent, like the square circle

[slender coral]

I assumed you follow one, so I wanted your answer for it.

[urban swift]

Unable to create such a stone is its limitation

[crude widget]

I don't follow one, actually. I'm an atheist.

[slender coral]

Mhm

[urban swift]

Can god create a human more adorable than itself ?

[mystic bay]

The point is that there is no such stone, even in potentiality. The argument requires treating nothing (which is what a contradiction is) as a thing. Creating a contradictory state of affairs is not a thing that God cannot do, because it is not a thing in any sense.

[urban swift]

Pick anyone

[main bison]

Ehhh
No? Cause adorable is a good adj

[urban swift]

So god will become jealous?

[main bison]

Even Elon musk believes in higher power

[keen moon]

there is actually square circle, it is called a squircle

[mystic bay]

Then pick your favourite flavour of contradiction

[urban swift]

There was no human either right?
But god made it happen and created one.
So god can create stuff.

Coming back to the limitation of god's potential. God can't create a stone that it can't lift

[mystic bay]

Right, because there is nothing contradictory about the idea of a human being.

[urban swift]

Sleep time 😴

[crude widget]

This whole thing about "disproving God is omnipotent" is just a misdirection. It's pointless. It doesn't matter the outcome of that debate. It won't convince anyone to believe in God and it won't convince anyone to disbelieve. Why is this even an argument we are having?

[thorny steeple]

@dapper laurel it's 4 PM now

[crude widget]

It's merely an argument about the definition of the word itself

[urban swift]

Conclusion:
God has the potential to create humans.
God doesn't have the potential to create a stone it can't lift

[verbal torrent]

https://tenor.com/view/pind-tmf3-gif-16410707625369761850

I hope god is smth like that

[mystic bay]

Yes, God cannot create logical contradictions.

[urban swift]

Lacks potential

[mystic bay]

Yes, indeed! There is not potentiality in God. This has always been a commitment of classical theists.

[thorny steeple]

Are you any kind of theist/deist or it's just appreciation of metaphyisics?

[mystic bay]

I am a philosopher, not a theologian. Metaphysics is one of my specialisms (in addition to ethics). But I also happen to be a Christian.

Specifically, I am a classical theist

[slender coral]

I'm thinking about this and I can't make sense of it. It seems like you don't solve the paradox but sidestep it by excluding problematic cases from the definition of omnipotence.

[urban swift]

So not omnipotent anymore

[mystic bay]

No, that doesn't follow.

[thorny steeple]

And the next pope will be black

[urban swift]

It's fine. Take a break and think again you just contradict yourself but want to play with words

[crude widget]

Honestly, I think a better way to define omnipotence would be "power over all things" rather than "power to do anything and everything"

[slender coral]

I believe the whole idea of the paradox when it emerged was to understand the concept of god more rather than disprove it.

[shy summit]

Why don’t we ask Claude

[slender coral]

But I think about this and ask myself why the Abrahamic god didn't address this. He really seemed to like talking much about himself.

[mystic bay]

I don't agree with your characterisation of what's going on. It's like I said at the beginning: the paradox of omnipotence is trying to show that, whichever horn of the dilemma you embrace, there is something that God cannot do. In other words, it is trying to show that the 'set of things cannot do' is populated with at least one thing. If God cannot create a stone he cannot lift, then that goes in the set. If God can create it, then there is a stone he cannot lift. And that goes in the set.

The problem, from a logical point of view, is that sets are populated with things, and contradictions are not things. The set of all even prime numbers greater than 2, for example, is an empty set. Why? Because the notion of an even prime number greater than 2 is contradictory. In the same way, if you are relying on logical contradictions to populate the set of 'things God cannot do', then you face the problem that contradictions are not things, and therefore cannot populate sets. The 'set of things God cannot do' remains empty. Contra @urban swift, the word game is in fact treating no-things (contradictions) as though they were things.

[crude widget]

The book is intended for common people, not philosophers

[slender coral]

Aren't all of us philosophers in one way or another?

I don't think philosophy is execlusive for one set of people.

[crude widget]

That's true

[shy summit]

From Claude AI:

Let me think through this step by step.

The Omnipotence Paradox is typically formulated as: "Can an omnipotent being create a stone so heavy that they cannot lift it?"

Let's analyze the logical structure:

1. If the being can't create such a stone, they're not omnipotent (limited in creation)
2. If the being can create it but can't lift it, they're not omnipotent (limited in strength)
3. If the being can both create and lift it, then it wasn't truly "unliftable" to begin with

The core issue is that the paradox relies on self-reference and contains a logical contradiction in its very formulation. It's essentially asking: "Can omnipotence exceed itself?" or "Can unlimited power limit itself?"

I see a few key problems with the paradox:

1. It assumes omnipotence must include the ability to do logically impossible things. But many philosophers argue omnipotence only requires the ability to do all logically possible things.

2. The paradox creates an internal contradiction - an "unliftable" stone that must be both liftable and unliftable simultaneously. This violates the law of non-contradiction.

3. It's similar to asking "Can God create a square circle?" - the question itself is meaningless because it contains mutually exclusive conditions.

So while the paradox is rhetorically clever, I don't think it successfully demonstrates a logical problem with the concept of omnipotence when omnipotence is properly understood as the ability to do all logically possible things. The paradox instead reveals the problems with trying to apply omnipotence to logically impossible scenarios.​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​

[urban swift]

Not AI please

[slender coral]

[crude widget]

Yeah Claude is on point here, I think

[mystic bay]

The answer seems to be what most philosophers of religion who have written on this subject have concluded

[shy summit]

Ya’ll scoff but it’s the best tool out there for surmising issues of scholarly works since most of us aren’t philosophy majors ourselves

[mystic bay]

The paradox essentially rests on an equivocation: treating a contradiction as something

[urban swift]

Do you like mathematics?

Actually contradictory assumptions really prove stuff.
Converse of Basic proportionality theoram is proved that way.

You seem like having problems with contradictory assumptions shouldn't even be there in the first place. But they good.

[shy summit]

The issue with omnipotence is more the argument of free will in my opinion.

Rather, the two are incompatible

[main bison]

Guyzzooo
Today was election day in Germany
It's either afd or cdu

[slender coral]

Hey I know this one. The Euthyphro dilemma could lead to the omnipotence paradox.

[mystic bay]

I do. I tutor in maths sometimes.

It's not like I'm allergic to contradictions. I was just pointing out that contradictions do not populate sets. The reason why the set of even prime number greater than 2 is empty is that the notion of an even prime number greater than 2 is a contradiction. There could be no such thing.

[shy summit]

Exit polls suggest otherwise

[mystic bay]

Assuming an incompatibilist account of free will, of course

[shy summit]

The issue is if an outcome is known then it is determined

Or at least implied a determined outcome

[mystic bay]

Yes, but many philosophers who believe in free will are compatibilists. Compatibilism is the view that determinism (whether divine or physical) is compatible with free will.

[crude widget]

Well, I like to focus on the self referential part of the logical statements to demonstrate the problem with this paradox. I personally don't see a problem with regarding contradictions as things.

[mystic bay]

Self-referentiality can be a problem because it sometimes leaves things underdetermined, and therefore logically malformed. I am not convinced that is the case here. I personally think that the bigger problem is treating contradictions as things. Expressing a contradiction is, in effect, assigning sense to non-sense, which is a kind of linguistic chicanery.

But I won't fight you on it.

[shy summit]

Why is he white as hell

[crude widget]

Yeah I'm re-reading what you said earlier about contradictions. I think I was misunderstanding you. I apologize. Now, I believe the contradiction idea you expressed as well as the self-reference idea I expressed are both valid and distinct approaches in showing the problems with this paradox.

[mystic bay]

Okay

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-patrick-thinking-confused-gif-13712693

[crude widget]

My concept of contradiction was the set of rules that, together, produce an empty set. While your concept was the resulting empty set of things from applying those rules.

But taking your concept, I do agree with what you are saying

[torpid dirge]

Ohh mathematical argument

[crude widget]

But mathematically speaking, an empty set is a thing. That is, an empty set can be an element of another set.

[mystic bay]

Sure, that's fine. So applying it to the case at hand, let's say that there is a 'set of things God cannot do', and that it is empty. That is enough for omnipotence to be coherent.

[crude widget]

Right I can agree with this

Well.. Unless of course you go for the self referential route. Can God create something more powerful than himself?

[verbal torrent]

If he was black people would not respect him

[mystic bay]

I believe this is a very similar case. There is no coherent notion of a being more powerful than an omnipotent being.

[crude widget]

Does this not still present a problem that the square circle doesn't?

[mystic bay]

I don't see how it's any different

[crude widget]

Maybe you are right

I can see it

[crude widget]

But this lack of coherent notion is derived from ideas of self-reference, but your point is still made, I suppose.

[mystic bay]

I don't think the problem is one of self-reference. A metallurgist can fabricate a substance denser than himself. Here, too, there is self-reference, but it doesn't look like a problem.

[shy summit]

Most of the world isn’t white bro

[mystic bay]

The problem is that the locution 'more powerful than an omnipotent being' is senseless

[torpid dirge]

But the statement of the contradiction can be false ...? Is that true ?

[verbal torrent]

Yes i know that but do you think that if God were black, would all people respect him
You are aware of the high racism, right
Or who knows how racist it would be if he were white🧌
If God were white, I can imagine that people would treat black people as if they were being punished by God or stmh like that
Oooor vice versa

[mystic bay]

everyone knows God is korean

common knowledge

[verbal torrent]

Ahhahsha

[kind finch]

What do u mean by "God is Korean" ?

[mystic bay]

I have no idea

[uneven citrus]

If I had to believe in a god , it'll be korean

[mystic bay]

lol

[uneven citrus]

follow the rage bait buddy

[torpid dirge]

That mean if there's god exist so it would definately be the korean otherwise he doesn't exist .....

[tender vessel]

Exactly!
As Thomas Aquinas and Ibn Rushed have explained it, omnipotence is the ability to do everything, but since a logical contradiction is not a thing, the question then becomes meaningless.
I'd also like to add that the question is inherently fallacious. It begs the question. Meaning that it assumes the conclusion.

[thorny steeple]

[mystic bay]

Who is the cat

[thorny steeple]

you

[mystic bay]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-hum-humcat-cathum-suspicious-gif-17002926898630238188

[thorny steeple]

[torpid dirge]

Looks similar both of these....

[thorny steeple]

[torpid dirge]

[prisma garden]

[thorny steeple]

[mystic bay]

Serious

[dense agate]

Chat not so serious

[torpid dirge]

Dexter give me murder information

[crude widget]

Well, okay. I'm not being specific enough. self-reference isn't always a problem in every logical statement. It is typically accompanied with other features such as negation before we see paradoxes arise. "The set of all sets that don't contain themselves" is one such paradox. This is Russell's paradox.

[crude widget]

I'm not sure what you are asking. Can you rephrase?

[mystic bay]

Right, self-reference is a problem when it comes to sets of sets. But that doesn't have anything to do with the paradox of the stone, does it?

Unless I'm not seeing it

[torpid dirge]

Sry for asking but what kind of contradiction do you guys talking about? Dialectical or paradoxical?

[mystic bay]

Formal? Logical?

As in, p and not p

[thorny steeple]

Yet the people they look up to the most are the whites, always

Take Brazil for instance, one of the most racist countries in the world, yet only Nigeria e Ethiopia has more people of African descent in the world than us

[amber pivot]

[lethal sparrow]

https://theonion.com/brutality-desensitization-process-nearly-complete-1819565152/

[lavish charm]

💀

[silk bane]

Hi guys

I just land here. What are you talking about

[urban swift]

Even prime number ain't supposed to be omnipotent.
No person/religion/belief system claim it to be omnipotent

[thorny steeple]

[cedar cobalt]

People have realized that it is a very stupid idea to advocate omnipotence for imperfect beings such as ourselves.

[slender coral]

I know about these laws but talking about them like this while living in a non Muslim country is crazy.
https://youtu.be/i0o48PNMs2I?si=CzXK8hJDLa9kyYSF

[urban swift]

Advocate or impose an imaginary friend?

[cedar cobalt]

Depending on the people
If something is real to you, you want to teach it to others, that's pretty normal behavior

[waxen shale]

Classic case of taking out of context and spreading rumours is crazy.

Couldn't give a flying fuck about british, but its wrong to say that muslim force to convert people

even if EU becomes far right nest i might ended up agreeing with them.

[urban swift]

Do* You learn everything you are being told to

[cedar cobalt]

Most of the things I consider important, I consider it my duty to pass on my knowledge.
It's human behavior, if everyone teaches their way of seeing the world, it's normal that they end up contradicting each other.

[slender coral]

How is it taking it out of context?

[waxen shale]

Can you recommend good books to learn about these things ? Please

[slender coral]

Well, that's Sharia law. And honestly Muslims do this sometimes in their countries.

[waxen shale]

The video is cutted. The topic to What he was discussing or probably teach was not clear. Even, then I dont see him as a famous prominent figures or teachers. Calling him scholars also wrong

I would recommend you taking the teaching of prominent figures like syekh assim al hakim.

[waxen shale]

Honestly why you so care about islamic state when you live in british.? Do you live in British?

[cedar cobalt]

Geopo fans

[slender coral]

So you are claiming that it's taken out of context when you don't know the context? Don't you think it isn't good to throw such baseless accusations around?

[slender coral]

You can find the humiliating rules he mentioned in the book أحكام أهل الذمة the rules of ahlul-dhimma by ibn al-Qayim.

[slender coral]

Why shouldn't I care? What you are doing here is an attempt to distract, that's how I see it at least.
Anyway, I may immigrate to the UK one day. I hope you give me permission to talk about it for this reason

[urban swift]

https://youtube.com/shorts/0ssjYxXniDk?si=Zkbwme3h0gkiYIZB

Which animal/insect amaze you guys the most ?

[urban swift]

Some people find corruption real and normal and want to teach it to their kids and encourage other people around them to do the same.

Should we speculate and raise a brow ? Should we critically think about the subject matter? Should we counter question it or not ?
Or just accept it as 'normal'

[hexed kettle]

In India, corruption is normal for people and even if you know they are corrupt, you can't do much as they will brief other officials.

There is a saying "If you can't fight them, join them."

[cedar cobalt]

We must always try to have a critical mind, the truth is not something sensitive, it is only a rational thing that must be reached through logic

[mystic bay]

That's . . . not the point. The point is that contradictions do not populate sets. The reason is that a set has to be defined, and if the definition is internally contradictory then nothing falls under it. The reason why the set of even prime numbers larger than 2 is empty is because it would require a number to be both even and not even.

The reason this matters is that omnipotence paradoxes are trying to populate what I have called the 'set of things God cannot do' with contradictions, and this is a logical mis-step. I am simply giving a formal reason for the point I made at the beginning, that the paradox of omnipotence rests on an equivocation, where it is trying to treat a contradiction as something, where really it is nothing.

[mystic bay]

Do you mean logic?

[feral river]

May I ask, are you white

[cedar cobalt]

The answer to this question does not change the fact that he has just stated a fact

[main bison]

Hey hey Chinese mate
Wanna know my fun word? 🤭 Hehe

[crisp wraith]

Lmao, why are creating FAKE history? It's been always Persian Gulf, the reason that arabs still couldn't prove that is arabian gulf is not mentioned in any VALID historical map, and it's always written as Persian Gulf.

Even in Oman which it's an arabic country, you can visit nizwa fort, a museum, all the historical maps show that it's Persian Gulf, even in المسالک الممالک book which this book is written in arabic! It's mentioned that it's Persian Gulf

[main bison]

A map from 1721

A country which is 30 times younger than iran claims Iran faking history?

[crisp wraith]

LMAOOO

[crisp wraith]

Even in Arabic countries, if you visit museum, all the historical maps show that it's Persian Gulf

About the name of Iran, i need to tell you all that the name of Iran was always been IRAN, it should be mentioned that the EXONYM name of Iran was Persia, it means Iranians, and the kings of Iran, been always calling themselves as the king Of Iran, but actually the foreigners were calling Iran as Persia, which is exonym (external name)

In Reza Shah era, he said that all the people should call Iran the same as Iranians call their country, and that's why he put Iran name even as exonym name

[kind finch]

Why on earth would it be like that

[crisp wraith]

On the coin of the emperor of Ardeshir Babakan, the head of Farahmand Sassanid, more than 1800 years ago, the name of Iran mentioned
I have even more historical proofs

[kind finch]

we all know Iran was existed before saudia arabia

I mean idk why saudi people hate Iran

[crisp wraith]

Well, there's many historical reasons, i can mention many things which i don't think here is the right place cuz it makes a lot dramas

[main bison]

They used to call red sea the Arabian gulf and Persian gulf , Persian gulf

[kind finch]

I mean it is about religion ig

[main bison]

It's even said in a hadith from prophet Muhammad the name of Persian gulf by

[kind finch]

Wait where r u from?

Iran?

[main bison]

Iran

[crisp wraith]

Hby

[main bison]

😂

[kind finch]

Gazan displaced to Egypt

[main bison]

[crisp wraith]

Even Egypt wasn't an arabic country, even their language wasn't arabic, still all the people of Egypt isn't arab, but after the invasion of arabs, they lost their culture and language over time

[crisp wraith]

The coin refers to Nadir shah which the name of Iran, (ایران) is mentioned

The thing is the same for Japan, Japanese call their country as nihun or nipun if im not mistaken, but foreigners call their country as japan

Okay, other history lessons for later, enough for now

[feral river]

https://youtube.com/shorts/CVNGAmxZ7UQ?si=X6Rw8DUefp1OJMbX

Make Greater German Great Again

[wintry temple]

Does anyone here read self development books

[waxen shale]

Yeah

[waxen shale]

Did you even know the context because i sure know the context?

[waxen shale]

Did you mean hadist. ?

[waxen shale]

theres no rules sharia applies if it comes to UK. Nor did we have the obligation to establish sharia law in UK. but then ofc that video implies the otherwise. What you do here is spreading false rumors.

[slender coral]

Dude what's the damn context?

[waxen shale]

Omg it's talking about Qur'an at tawbah 29 where theres war against roman empire.

[slender coral]

No. The Rules of Ahlul-Dhimma is a book by the scholar ibn al-Qayim that talks about the rules non-Muslims should follow under an Islamic rule, which are set with the purpose of humiliating them and pressuring them into conversion.

[slender coral]

I don't understand any of what you are saying.

[slender coral]

That's a weak ass execuse.

[waxen shale]

What? What tf are you ?

Its not an excuse. Its fact did you know what excuse is???

[waxen shale]

The guy on the video doesn't even talk about specific book. Hes teaching about the tafsir of quran in at tawbah 29. By ibn kathir

[slender coral]

Read the book I mentioned many times before, it says nothing about how these rules need to only be applied on those who fought Muslims and it emphasizes that the whole point of them isn't to punish them for fighting but to pressure them into conversion.

[slender coral]

I know, he is talking about scholarly views which you could find detailed explaination of them in that book.

[waxen shale]

No he didn't talk about that specific book nor scholar view. He talks about the translation about ibn Kathir.

The fact that you just put some cutted video, doesn't even know the context. And in that video it implies that muslim in British wanna establish the sharia, is a false rumors.

That alone is wrong

[slender coral]

The video implies that because the shiekh implied that 😂

I didn't mention anything regarding the establishment of Islamic caliphate in Britain, I just it's crazy he is saying this among non Muslims

[mystic bay]

This is a good introduction

[waxen shale]

I mean sure if you wanna argue about sharia law is wrong. You can but, not this disgusting method to gain some right voters.

[slender coral]

What method dude?

[waxen shale]

He's not even sheikh what do you yapping about?

[slender coral]

What is he?

[waxen shale]

Figured out yourself

[slender coral]

[waxen shale]

Just a teacher. Not even a scholar

[waxen shale]

Okay prove me !

[slender coral]

Now we are going to argue about his position instead of proving/disproving whether the disgusting things he said are Islamic or not.

[waxen shale]

Yeah you cant! Waste of time

[slender coral]

It's certainly a waste of time

[crisp wraith]

You two discussing if the UK is turning to Islamic country or not? (I didn't read the conversation from the beginning just asking)

[urban swift]

Mass population yet to learn what's ok and what's not.

[slender coral]

Anyway, regarding ibn Kathir interpretation (tafsir) of 9:29, it doesn't say that the non-believers who should "feel themselves subdued" are strictly the ones who would go to war with Muslims.

(Fight against those who believe not in Allah, nor in the Last Day, nor forbid that which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, and those who acknowledge not the religion of truth among the People of the Scripture, until they pay the Jizyah with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.)
Therefore, when People of the Scriptures disbelieved in Muhammad , they had no beneficial faith in any Messenger or what the Messengers brought. Rather, they followed their religions because this conformed with their ideas, lusts and the ways of their forefathers, not because they are Allah's Law and religion. Had they been true believers in their religions, that faith would have directed them to believe in Muhammad , because all Prophets gave the good news of Muhammad's advent and commanded them to obey and follow him. Yet when he was sent, they disbelieved in him, even though he is the mightiest of all Messengers. Therefore, they do not follow the religion of earlier Prophets because these religions came from Allah, but because these suit their desires and lusts. Therefore, their claimed faith in an earlier Prophet will not benefit them because they disbelieved in the master, the mightiest, the last and most perfect of all Prophets . Hence Allah's statement,
https://quran.com/9:29/tafsirs/en-tafisr-ibn-kathir

Allah said,
حَتَّى يُعْطُواْ الْجِزْيَةَ
(until they pay the Jizyah), if they do not choose to embrace Islam,
عَن يَدٍ
(with willing submission), in defeat and subservience,
وَهُمْ صَـغِرُونَ
(and feel themselves subdued.), disgraced, humiliated and belittled. Therefore, Muslims are not allowed to honor the people of Dhimmah or elevate them above Muslims, for they are miserable, disgraced and humiliated. Muslim recorded from Abu Hurayrah that the Prophet said,
«لَا تَبْدَءُوا الْيَهُودَ وَالنَّصَارَى بِالسَّلَامِ، وَإِذَا لَقِيتُمْ أَحَدَهُمْ فِي طَرِيقٍ فَاضْطَرُّوهُ إِلَى أَضْيَقِه»
(Do not initiate the Salam to the Jews and Christians, and if you meet any of them in a road, force them to its narrowest alley.)

[urban swift]

Yes, critical thinking and rational analysis is important when somebody pops up and claims something/ someone is omnipotent.
That person should be ready for cross questioning.

[slender coral]

It's about this video
https://youtu.be/i0o48PNMs2I?si=CzXK8hJDLa9kyYSF

[urban swift]

We are going back in full circle now.
You put forth even prime number example and it failed you, just accept it.
If none other even prime number exists except 2 because yes it's possible there is definitely no other even prime number other than 2.

So when somebody above in chat asked can god create a stone he can't lift, answer should be either yes or no.

Can you make it simple and answer in yes or no ?

(I think you did say no earlier right?)

[cedar cobalt]

If we look at things from a pragmatic point of view, without worrying about conformity with reality, but about the logic of reasoning, the idea of something omnipotent is not absurd in the sense that it is a logical element structuring a system of thought.
It is as important for this person as anyone else to have critical thinking because we are all trying to form a metaphysical construct of the world in our heads and none of them can pretend to be true to reality.

[mystic bay]

It's odd to say that the prime number example has failed, since no one has raised an objection to it. What exactly is the objection? I used the example to illustrate the general principle that contradictions do not populate sets. Therefore, it is illegitimate to put contradictions (such as 'creating a stone that an omnipotent being cannot lift') in the set of things God cannot do. The set of things God cannot do is empty. That is what 'omnipotence' means.

Do you think that contradictions can populate sets? If you say 'Yes', then you must explain why the set of even prime numbers larger than 2 is empty. If you say 'No', then you admit that you cannot put 'creating a stone that an omnipotent being cannot lift' in the set of things God cannot do. Pick your poison.

[urban swift]

I can say No, there is no other even prime number than 2.

Now your turn, make it simple, answer in yes or no. Can god create a stone that God can't lift?

[mystic bay]

That wasn't my question. I didn't ask if you believe there is an even prime number greater than 2. I asked if contradictions can populate sets. Yes or No?

I answered your question yesterday. On classical theism, divine omnipotence does not entail being able to do the logically impossible. Not because of any limitation on potential, but because there is no thing, even a potential thing, as a contradiction. Laws of logic do not constrain God, because they do not 'constrain' anything. They are just formal ways of giving expression to what makes sense and what doesn't. Contradictions are not things. What you need to do is populate the set of things God cannot do with something. But there is nothing with which to do that.

[cedar cobalt]

Actually, if God is omnipotent, that doesn't mean that you are, therefore that you have the answers to the questions

It's ok not to know

And this is not proof of the non-existence of this or that thing

[dapper laurel]

Some cultures are simply incompatible

[slender coral]

I agree with that

[manic juniper]

You can be omnipotent and quite stupid, it's not confirmed that god even knows about it. Just like Azathoth is omnipotent but doesn't know much

[dense agate]

i wonder which cultures are in question hmm

[dense agate]

I'd say Azathoth is fictional, but that would be ironic

[manic juniper]

No we are fictional, Azathoth is real

[dense agate]

there is probably more proof backing Azathoth lel

[keen moon]

is it fair to apply math logic to something as abstract as omnipotence?

[manic juniper]

It's way more realistic

Why would this being have a central intelligence or consciousness of sort instead of being incomprehensible

[keen moon]

I don't think so, you are using math to dodge the paradox

[dapper laurel]

Well well well moment

[dense agate]

or even better

[dense agate]

Isn't Italy making a U turn on their support to Ukraine ?

[dapper laurel]

Our government simply sucks

[dapper laurel]

The far right sovereignist takes a step back once again to please the overseas powers

It's a real mess

At least illegal landings have decreased

[lucid estuary]

Does anyone here know how to use LinkedIn professionally?

[manic juniper]

This feels like Fallout

[mystic bay]

War

War changes sometimes

[dense agate]

until they solve their welfare state situation, it's still bad

[dapper laurel]

The non-italian part

[dense agate]

New Vegas though, it has something similar to it

[dense agate]

War... War never changes...

[main bison]

Switzerland?

[dapper laurel]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Tyrol

[main bison]

Huh
What's that country above you

[dapper laurel]

I see it as difficult to sustain a welfare system similar to the one we have adopted in the past

[dapper laurel]

Avstria

[dense agate]

what should've been part of Austria but somehow isn't

[dapper laurel]

I'm happy with Italy for now

[elder seal]

@crisp wraith H Halzy 👋🏻

[dense agate]

as it currently stands, it sucks for young folks

[dapper laurel]

Everyone feels Italian here anyways

[dense agate]

a tax on the youth basically

[dapper laurel]

With the exception of a small minority

[dense agate]

Even the immigrants 😊

[dapper laurel]

Especially them

[main bison]

Pizza🤌

[dapper laurel]

Which is not a problem, the important thing is that they assimilate

[prisma cipher]

hypocrite

[slender coral]

Why?

[prisma cipher]

because when there was a vague chance to join NATO he didn't say such words

[dense agate]

y'all better do something king

[dapper laurel]

No, nothing ever happens

[manic juniper]

As it should be

[dapper laurel]

Few but good

[manic juniper]

Aren't they over 80 millions in UK, why do they want more people there

[prisma cipher]

Nice but I prefer in %

[dapper laurel]

To have greater economic influence on Europe

[elder seal]

No shit? When there was a vague chance of joining NATO, there was a chance of survival and having stronger bargaining power

[dense agate]

https://tenor.com/view/copium-meme-pepe-frog-gif-26117735

[dense agate]

rent prices have to keep going higher somehow

[manic juniper]

The rest of Ireland won't settle itself after all

[prisma cipher]

Where is overpopulation Africa or something?

[main bison]

I clicked on a random street view and it was
It's sooo prettyyy

[manic juniper]

South Asia

[amber pivot]

Ma France

[cedar cobalt]

Are you french?

[verbal torrent]

Seems like algerian

Maybe egypt

But not french definitely

[amber pivot]

Yes

[verbal torrent]

😱

[cedar cobalt]

Your username doesn't make any sense

Like brioche ange, what does that even mean

[amber pivot]

I put it like this

[cedar cobalt]

It seems like a non French pseudonym

[amber pivot]

It's French

It's just that I chose anything for my nickname

@cedar cobalt I'm writing to you in French?

[cedar cobalt]

Go ahead

I'm not even French anyway

[amber pivot]

@cedar cobalt tu crois pas que je suis français apparemment

[cedar cobalt]

I just translated and it looks French to me, but maybe you used a translation tool

[amber pivot]

Mdrrrr ça c'est la meilleure

[cedar cobalt]

There is no way to be really sure

[amber pivot]

Voc?

[cedar cobalt]

Je m'avoue vaincu, je ne peux rien dire contre ça

[amber pivot]

Alors ?

[cedar cobalt]

T'as gagné, gg mon reuf, mais ce plot twist tu l'as pas vu venir

[amber pivot]

tu viens d'où toi?

[cedar cobalt]

De France, à tout hasard

[amber pivot]

@cedar cobalt tu me sors des dingueries

[cedar cobalt]

Le plot twist à la française 🗣️ ‼️ 🐓

[amber pivot]

[visual folio]

hi

[shy summit]

https://x.com/repgreglandsman/status/1892973577038688351?s=46&t=_4te3tAT61vk9Mlvl0m7cw

Congressman Greg Landsman (@RepGregLandsman) on X

Non-citizen voting is already illegal. Non-citizens cannot vote, and if they try, they will be deported. They know that.

X · Feb 21, 2025, 4:24 PM

[elder seal]

Well, duh?

[shy summit]

Good luck voting as a married woman

[elder seal]

I'm commenting on non-citizens voting is illegal - In what caliber would it otherwise matter? That's the staple in all western democracies

Unless you think tourists should be allowed to vote

I mean - I personally would love voting on Kanye West's birthday party in 2028 as a non-US citizen exclusively to make fun of your politics just to have none of the consequences of my vote

[shy summit]

No thats ALREADY a thing

[elder seal]

I know - That's why I said "duh"

[shy summit]

The save act makes it ridiculously hard for citizens

[elder seal]

Do illuminate. I only commented on the tweet itself. I refuse to log into twitter

(I refuse to make a twitter - actually, but that's another subject matter)

What, it just requires you to prove your citizenship - You guys don't have that there?

That's the norm in Europe anywho. I have to prove myself with an identity and social security number to get to vote

[shy summit]

Basically unless you didn’t change your name when you married its an entirely different process to be able to vote

Most of the time women change their last name

Since it no longer matches their birth certificate they can’t vote using legal id

[elder seal]

That sounds less like an issue with the act, and more like an issue with the U.S management and administration of their own database. Can't relate here, we have register-data, meaning my government have my exact income; social security; recidency; date of birth etc.,

basically has information on everyone at any time

[shy summit]

The point is to make it harder

Women overwhelmingly vote liberal

This is meant to dissuade them

[elder seal]

I don't know if that's necessarily true - I think the point was to make it harder for immigrants, sure. But it's a postulate to make it 'harder' on its own basis. It assumes intention outside the obvious reasoning, and at least so far as we assume occam's razor, I don't see why we'd assume beyond that

[shy summit]

Its already impossible

[crisp wraith]

oh you here?

[shy summit]

If you do it, you get caught and arrested

Thats how secure voting is

[elder seal]

If it's impossible, then the act wouldn't do much - If anything then, the act is merely symbolic, likely due to some stories of illegal immigrants voting in US elections causing anxieties

[shy summit]

It makes it harder to vote if you changed your name

[elder seal]

I don't think we should suppose it's meant to 'stop people from voting,' I'd arther see the act in light of things like the Rwanda plan used for immigrants in Europe, as a merely 'symbolic gesture' to alleviate anxieties. Not everything has utilitarian motives

[shy summit]

It’s literally a goal of the party

We have recordings and the opinions on record of the people who wrote it

They think married women voting ‘undermines’ their subservience to their husbands

[elder seal]

Assuming that to b etrue. But to suppose that's the intention as opposed to a latent consequence does change the subject. But your statement is the intention is to make a demographic less likely to vote, 'married women,' who are more likely to vote republican. So if anything, this just hurts the gop

[shy summit]

I didn’t say they were smart

They are trying to cancel benefits almost exclusively targeting their own party states

Such as fema

Medicaid

[elder seal]

Well - You're supposing a utilitarian motive here. I'm just saying, we've no reason to suppose a utilitarian motive given the latent consequence of the act hurts the people supporting it. I think there's far more reason to suppose it's a symbolic gesture, and the latent aftermath is just due to lack of consideration and further thought on it beyond the symbolic.

Also, they don't have to be smart. Most policy makers got analysts who are smart helping them. They likely assume that the symbolic gesture would outmatch the adverse outcomes themselves

[elder seal]

I am! I'm surprised you're here too 🙂‍↕️ How are you Halzy?

[shy summit]

They literally propose cutting medical care programs that are mostly used by their own constituency Nils

I don’t think they care about hurting their own people

[elder seal]

Don't know why that's relevant to voting. Though, I'd probably caution here, because you're assuming that most of them are republican in this instance. If most are democrats, for instance, whic hi honestly don't know, they can use the reserve itself to finance and priorities things that benefit their base

It's a cost-benefit analysis, that's what democratic poltiics are

[shy summit]

They literally aren’t democratic

[feral river]

Lol

[shy summit]

They are going against the law trying to cut programs

[elder seal]

So acting on the mandate people voted them in for is undemocratic?

Interesting definition of democracy

[crisp wraith]

I'm doing alright, thank you nils
Actually I've been here for a long time but never been that much active

[shy summit]

People wanted cheaper groceries not to pay more for their medicine

[feral river]

I don’t think the state need cheaper groceries

[elder seal]

Sure - And they still voted for the party that analysts said wouldn't do that. You vote and reap the consequences of your vote. That's democracy for you

[shy summit]

Yes

[elder seal]

Nothing undemocratic here, lmao

[shy summit]

They were retardedly voting

“I didn’t think The Leopards would eat my face when I voted for the leopards eating faces party!” Lookin ass mfs

[elder seal]

People vote on basis of the current fad and feeling. That's how democracy works. There's no "smart" or "stupid" about it, it's just how the current zeitgeist is. Again - Not undemocratic, just how democracy works

[feral river]

The party which supported by riches will have a little chance to participate in elections in that typical western democratic state

In US it’s democratic vs republican

[elder seal]

I think it's a caricature to reduce it simply to 'rich' vs 'non-rich,' if you look at what wealthy base they support, you'll find that they work in industries their own supporters do too

[shy summit]

Idk this seems pretty fucking dumb not to see

[feral river]

Not that bad dude

Have you ever heard of Laissez Faire ?

[shy summit]

Blind as a bat

[elder seal]

That conflates policy with voting behaviour - I said voting behaviour is a product of the zeitghist. Nothing more, nothing less.

[shy summit]

Thermostatic voting behavior while true does not change the issues at hand however

[elder seal]

Democratic parties function like a redistributive coalition in the sense of M. Olson's narrow-interest organization; they're structurally and functionally coaition of industrial parties; a quick look at composition of voter base tells you everything you need to know about how a policy direction will take. Republican's lower income base are often working in industries that are being outsourced; protectionism obviously follows. Protectionism primarily hurt workers in service industries, who do you think works in those? Democratic voters.

[feral river]

Not for socialist

But for capitalist bro

The invisible hand of market will handle everything

We will see how people would survive under this

[shy summit]

Given the fact that insulin has gone up from 30 to 80 bucks I’ll say that some won’t

[feral river]

Once everyone knows a business is lucrative, it isnt anymore

[elder seal]

I love novo nordisk

[feral river]

Unless, there’s monopoly

[elder seal]

I'm here from time to time - mostly jumping servers and being inactive occassionally while reading. Currently finishing up Deleuze's "difference and repetition"

[feral river]

I think he will crack down on monopoly in this industry if he’s not doing that, he’s just killing patients

[shy summit]

There literally is

[shy summit]

Well

[elder seal]

Problem in medicien is nonreductive to monopolies but due to inelasticity of Demand. Stay in school, kids

[tidal thorn]

Heyyy

[elder seal]

👋🏻

Heeeyo

[shy summit]

Medicine is one of the few things we SHOULDN’T allow monopolies to control pricing for

[feral river]

stay in the school bud

[shy summit]

Since you can’t just not take needed medication if its too expensive

[feral river]

I don't wanna count how much time you waste in school or will you proud of it ?

[tidal thorn]

Long timee

[elder seal]

It doesn't matter if there's a monopoly or not. Medicien pricing is a function of disposable income.

[mystic bay]

and patents

[shy summit]

And the whims of whomever produces the product

[mystic bay]

whoever

[elder seal]

Even patents wouldn't matter 🤷🏻‍♂️ Inelasticity of demand means that pricing increases irrespective of competitive pressures, exactly because the item is a necessity item

[shy summit]

I literally am proud of my work thank you

[elder seal]

Not really - Even in socialized systems costs are just internalized in government through taxation

[mystic bay]

Of course patents affect pricing

A patent is a government-granted monopoly licence

[shy summit]

Patents influence negotiation power of consumers

[elder seal]

It's true it affect pricing in terms of elastic goods, but I find it doubtful to believe it'd have meaningful analytical applications in terms of inelastic goods

Also - The specific point of patents is to raise profit-margins to increase investment into new products. In this sense, it functions fairly decently. A benefit of monopoly is that higher return on investment means it has more reason to invest in innovation

[feral river]

I don't discriminate scholars or collage students, I just think it was a bad business

[shy summit]

If a medication is controlled by only one or even a few entities the ability of the consumer to find a cheaper alternative (since they LITERALLY need the med to continue living) is marginal at best

[feral river]

and I was not being scammed about it

[shy summit]

Scam?

Tf you on about

[feral river]

count how much money did you spent for that degree

[shy summit]

Nothing

It was paid for by scholarship dumbass

[feral river]

cool you are the winner in this industry me too

I spend almost nothing for vacation all the time

[shy summit]

Not the same

[feral river]

not everyone can got that piece of shit

and you sure did some effort on it

[shy summit]

I worked my ass off to get a scholarship and am continuing to work my ass off in higher ed and in my internship

[elder seal]

To expand on what i said earlier - Glasses are a good example of how monopoly is a trivial explanatory factor in determining pricing. Glasses are expensive with heavy markup in spite of competitive pressures, this is largely because of the fact that they are inelastic on the demand curve. If you get glasses, you'll probably pay regardless of it being 1k or 10k grand, because you're

1. Not planning on throwing them out anytime soon,
2. Need them

[shy summit]

Please shut the fuck up Mine

[feral river]

bro

[shy summit]

Don’t downplay the hard work of others for your own stupidity

[feral river]

you know what you have paid for that I don't really need to say that much

but you have to know that, you won't get much from that

or luckily you will

[shy summit]

Except I think education shouldn’t come out of the student pocket so it doesn’t matter

Shut up

[elder seal]

Also - fyi, the "glass monopoly" myth is a meme. Euromonitor has already put that myth proposed by a forbes journalist to rest

[mystic bay]

But it's a relative issue. What you'd need to do is compare their pricing with how expensive they would be in a monopolistic situation.

Say, if one firm had a patent on glasses.

[feral river]

will you jealous about if I have relation with my collage staff to have a vacation with full scholarship ?

[crisp wraith]

Honestly it's good being inactive for a while, || some ppl just get on your nerves ||

[shy summit]

Mine really bouta come at me with some L ass take

[feral river]

sorry being a shit man bro but that's the reality

[shy summit]

The reality is that you’re a dumbass CCP ass pill biter

[feral river]

unnecessary cuz I win before I start

[shy summit]

Nah

Fuck outa here with your bullshit

[elder seal]

Well, that's the thing - Inelasticity of demand functionally service like that - Pricing is exclusively determined by supply, in another word, by the industry, not by consumers. That's the point of inelasticity of demand

[feral river]

I can even steal poor subsidies, I have that power

and that's totally legal

[shy summit]

Bro thinks he’s cool, cute

[feral river]

that's the society irl

bro

irl

[shy summit]

Okay nepo baby

[feral river]

so, good luck with your work

[elder seal]

You could argue, and I'd grant you this under some circumstances, that a monopoly in an inelastic demand would likely have higher markups. But my counter-critique would be that in most, if not all circumstances, inelasticity of demand occurs because of informational assymetry that makes "competition" effectively nonexistent

[feral river]

hope you will receive what you have worked for

[shy summit]

I literally have but thanks

[feral river]

then nice

[shy summit]

Don’t downplay the hard work of others

Its a surefire way of making it onto my shitlist

[feral river]

I really don't want to, I even think that's out of the line

but somebody just instigate me to say that

I'm very sorry

[mystic bay]

I don't see at all how it follows that prices remain constant in the case of inelastic demand. I agree that inelasticity creates an effective price floor, given the nature of the demand for healthcare: you simply need what you need, and don't need any more for stockpiling.

On the other hand, I don't see how inelasticity of demand creates a price ceiling. Surely, in a monopolistic situation, the opposite is the case. If the demand is constant regardless of pricing, then a monopolistic supplier is at liberty to hike the prices right up to the limits of affordability (and, for many people, perhaps even beyond it).

[elder seal]

Obviously it does not remain 'constant.' That's why I said it was primarily a function of disposable income. As disposable income increases, whether due to a growth in relative nominal income or due to tax cuts, we can expect pricing to increase in proportion to the increase in disposable income. Specifically, in medicine, we see that healthcare-cost correspond near perfect (R^2 = 0,7-0,8 depending on specifications) to disposable income and consumption. It effectively can only 'grow' as much as there's money for it to grow for.
In reality, there's always a "price ceiling," people can only buy as much as they have money to buy with. In a theoretical context, thre's none. And that's why it functions as a monopoly, as stated above

It induces a monopoly effect. And, this is largely due to what i mentioned before. Information assymetry. Why these are produced, whether it be due to obfuscation of different medicine brands or simply because of consumer culture is trivial here. When people buy glasses, they often time go for what's more immediate; cross-product substitution service here as a mathematic medium. We see this especially with diamonds, diamonds are expensive and have monopoly pricing, even though substitutions exists. That's largely due to consumer culture surrounding diamonds as opposed to any intrinsic quality of the diamond itself.

To extent to Diamonds; it's true that there is a producer monopoly, but it's not meaningful to call it a practical one. Specifically, if i buy a diamond in the 1950s and sell it on auction, that diamond is now in competition with the producer that sold it in 1950s. The monopoly produces its own competitors, essentially

[prisma cipher]

[elder seal]

My latter point here being more so that informational assymetry produces monopoly pricing, irrespective of any potential or virtual competition that could have existed under different contexts.

[thorny steeple]

English 🫘 🥶 ❌

MERICAN🦅 🇺🇸💪 ✅

[elder seal]

https://randomcriticalanalysis.com/2018/11/19/why-everything-you-know-about-healthcare-is-wrong-in-one-million-charts-a-response-to-noah-smith/#rcatoc-health-spending-is-eating-all-oecd-countries (Why everything you have said about the determinants of health expenditure is wrong in one million charts: a response to Noah Smith.)

Also, as a citation on the specific claim on medical care

[prisma cipher]

Looks like beginning of COVID-19🦠😷

Before it the same like Obama, lil more than bush

[mystic bay]

All of that is fine. I don't dispute that the average market price of such inelastic goods is coordinated with disposable income. But the fact remains that a monopolist (I am talking about a compulsory monopoly, like a government, a protection racket or a patent holder, not an efficiency monopoly) is at liberty to raise prices to the limits of affordability and beyond. And a competitive, non-monopolistic situation will cause those prices to fall. There is nothing about the definition of 'inelasticity' which rules this out.

Surely, it is the elastic goods--that is to say, dispensable goods that people can choose to do without when they are too expensive--that are less liable to monopolistic exploitation

[elder seal]

See - This is something I'd disagree with as well. For instance, we need to consider several types of monopolies. A transport monoly is never a functional monopoly; it always at the mercy of substitution effects. However, even if we are to remove this dimension, they can never truly raise prices as they please any more than an industry composed of producers of an inelastic good. Why? Simply because of the income cap. We can only buy as much as our income permit us to; that does not change in any field or specialty as such. There's a practical cap, though not a theoretical one, to be considered here.

There is nothing about the definition of 'inelasticity' which rules this out.

Correct in a theoretical sense, yes. Though, this is why I am nonconcerned about the theoretical dimension and is talking about the practical situation itself. Most inelastic goods are not inelastic because of lacking competition, but because of informational assymetry producing effective monopoly pricing. It's not that people can't "choose," it's that pricing is high because people don't choose

[elder seal]

I'd agree and concede on theoretical grounds to this. Though, on practical dimensions, I think it's far more complicated than this exactly due to how people act in markets - I.e., what "determines markets" (yay to praxeology).

[mystic bay]

Well, I understood you to be making a theoretical point, since you seemed to be basing your argument on the meaning of 'inelasticity of demand'.

But, attending to the particularities of the specific case, I still don't see how the compulsory monopoly which providers of medicine have (through patents) won't have a significant effect on pricing. I simply think you have got things backwards: it is the inelastic goods where monopolies are most impactful, since those are the ones in which providers have consumers over a barrel (you pay whatever it takes for life-saving medicine).

Why wouldn't the elimination of the patent, and the introduction of competition, reduce the price? I understand that patents are supposedly motivated by the need for innovation, but I regard that as a separate issue.

[elder seal]

Yes and no - In the sense I am working with theoretics to explain practicality; though the subject was on why pricing is so high on medicine, which I don't think is reductable to monopoly. There's in practice alternatives, it's just that most consumers are unaware of them. That's why Biden proposed a webpage which is composed of substitute products in medicine to help alleviate information asymmetries involved in healthcare.

The reason why is that most providers already function like a monopoly. The only thing that changes is the profit they can repeat from monopoly pricing. Specifically, if I know of 1 provider, i wont know of another, if they were to lower prices, it wont raise consumption, just lower their profits. So in effect, they keep pricing at monopoly prices. They have no other choice, basically. Why it's an oddity to blame providers, who merely function within a market system

So - In the case here, the reason why is as stated. Patents may function as a barrier to entry, but in the case of medicine, it's not that there aren't entrance of competitor, it's that people only know of 1 provider over another. You could, in theory, have 5000 producers, and if every part of the market only knew of 1, the others lowering prices to compete with the '1' other consumers know of wouldn't raise knowledge of their more competitive prices

[zealous sigil]

anyone wanna be friends?

[mystic bay]

But how do you know that the price of medicine is high because of asymmetrical information? Of course people only know of one provider if there is only one provider (the patent holder). But if the patent were abolished, and competitors could enter the market, then consumers can know about them. Maybe they wouldn't, but maybe they would.

Suppose that the patent is abolished, competitors enter the market, and people are unaware of them. Then you would have a point. But it still doesn't follow that patents don't have a significant effect on pricing: they still do, it's just that a better job needs to be done of making consumers aware of competitors. It's still the case that eliminating patents is necessary to reduce prices from where they are. It just might not be sufficient.

I have not claimed that the price of medicine can be reductively explained by the existence of patents; only that it is a non-trivial factor. The reason this is important is because critics of American healthcare (of which there are rightly many) criticise it on the grounds of its being a 'Wild West' unregulated free market in healthcare, which is assuredly isn't. It might be privatised, but the private actors are beneficiaries of enormous governmental privilege.

[elder seal]

Specifically, at least in economic classes I've attended, it's always an axiom that healthcare itself suffers from problem of informational assymetries. In the sense of an empirical dimension, there are a few studies, but one could easily pinpoint problem of methodology. If you want, you can check out Fabes et. al. (2022) study "Information Asymmetry in Hospitals: Evidence of the Lack of Cost Awareness in Clinicians." - This study does look at hospitals, but i suppose that's close enough. However, I think the prime reason for why we can suspect, intuitively, informational assymetry is exactly because of the fact that in a lot of cases, even with patents, we do have substitution who do practically the same as the medicine in question. Patent holders don't have a monopoly on antidepressants; just this specific antidepressants. And even when the patent expire, we don't really 'return to' the happy-go-lucky competition that's so often touted.

Here's my problem with your reasoning - It's that you're theoretically right that, without patent, we could make people aware. The problem is, even when we don't have an issue with patent, making people aware is a non-obvious game. Same way that healthcare cost being a function of income is not necessarily an iron law - The UK having one of the most cost-effective healthcare provisions 10 years ago due to a rationing system being an example - we can expect that these systems might fall short for a variety of reasons. In case of healthcare costs generally, whether medicine and what-not, the degree of competitive pressure is at the mercy of the consumers and the government (depending on country), without consumer will, you shouldn't have high hopes. Without government will, you shouldn't have high hopes. And I've seen very little to suggest a will from either

You're right to say that America's healthcare system isn't exclusively a problem of the free-market wild-west. And in a way, that's sort of what my argument also suggests. If healthcare is exclusively a product of income, it doesn't matter whether it's for-profit or non-profit, the problem remains identical. This is a pessimistic take that suggests that there's no solution. That healthcare cost will always be expensive, and you can't solve it at all. Of course, in reality, it's more nuanced, a government of action has proven capable of solving it; but in these cases, as rare as they are, we always see a return to the norm

[mystic bay]

I quite see how, even in a patent-less free-market situation, asymmetry of information would remain as an independent problem to be overcome (though I do think hospital or clinician costs are quite a different case from medication costs, which are what I'm talking about). But the fact remains: if lack of information about competitors is the problem, and if we are interested in solving this problem, then at the very least there must actually be competitors. And that requires the abolition of patents, and whatever other regulatory captures facilitate state-bestowed privilege in a market.

It may be the case that people are largely ignorant about alternative providers. There may be abundant empirical support for this. But this does not represent some sort of immutable timeless truth. It may simply be a call for a change, a change which begins by creating the conditions for (removing the impediments to) competition.

What you say about anti-depressants does raise an important methodological issue: what does or does not count as a 'monopoly' is determined by whether or not there is an alternative available, and whether or not something counts as an 'alternative' is subjective; i.e., it's determined by whether the consumer is prepared to substitute one for another. Now, maybe this is the case when it comes to anti-depressants, but in many cases this is not so. If a new wonder drug or a piece of medical technology were produced which had an unprecedented and categorically novel power to cure cancer, then the patent on that product would belong to one firm. There may be other, inferior products availbale, but they would not be perceived as being the same.

[elder seal]

I don't necessarily think we can conceive of it as independent - At least in hospital and medical care, it's the largest problem currently. Patents are only a more formalized scapegoat to avoid the problem of informational assymetry; largely produced by, ironically, even more information asymmetry. In a sense you're correct in saying that patents can be problematic; though given the way we're posing the problem here, we've already supposed the solution is its removal. The specific character of patent however I'd argue is a secondary problem, or at least a tertiary problem, behind of course high cost of entrance - which arguably patents can contribute to. In removing informational asymmetries, we've already reproduced competitive pressure; in removing patent, we my create more competition, but in the absence of the first, we can't achieve the second. However, in posting the problem in this way, we also avoid the fact that patents were themselves a solution to a problem. I've mentioned above how high profit-margins incentivizes innovation, as the benefit of innovation increased by reduction in risk

See - This is specifically why I am more-so concerned with the object of inquiry itself here. You're correct in saying it's not a vest which may cling to us for all time; but you're incorrect in positioning the virtual as the actual, merely because it may one day become actual. Point is, it isn't. And point remains, we've no reason to suppose it will.

You're correct in noting that patents are, practically, down to a interpersonal awareness scheme. But, in the case you're giving, I think your hypothetical falls into the trap I mentioned above. You've already supposed this conclusion through the problem as you've stated it to yourself. I might in fact raise the question that maybe this medicine would never have been produced in the first place in the absence of patents - This is what i meant above that patents were themselves a solution to a problem.

[cinder wind]

What y'all yapping bout

[elder seal]

Markets

https://tenor.com/view/bobo-bobo-the-bear-bear-bear-market-stock-market-gif-6294795975158327744

[cinder wind]

Dude how the hell u typed all that man

😫

[elder seal]

Think both @mystic bay and I have a private interest in economics - So uhm, I'd suppose that's why 🙂‍↕️

[cinder wind]

Well that's amazing. U had everything u can share

[elder seal]

Uhm - A lot of it is disconnected. I'd suppose I'd recommend any book on basic microeconomics though - Did post an article above from a blogpost that has influenced me a lot, though I don't think you'd like reading that

[cinder wind]

Whoa
Did it have in online

[elder seal]

Nah - only offline. Though i forgot where i placed it

[cinder wind]

Dayum 💀

Good then

[slender coral]

I'd like to

[shy summit]

Measles is back….

[slender coral]

Is it possible to live a healthy life without animal products?

[dapper laurel]

It's the best place in Italy

[main bison]

Are people from there not Italian?

[dapper laurel]

Even though the landscape around my city seems a bit barren lately

[shy summit]

Not for everyone

[dapper laurel]

They are Italian

[main bison]

You said you're from non Italian part

[shy summit]

Money is a factor same with access to alternatives and supplementation

[main bison]

Is it snowy

[dapper laurel]

Well, ethnically they are Austrian, but they speak Italian and have Italian citizenship

They can speak German too

[main bison]

Ur German too

[dapper laurel]

This year it snowed incredibly little in the city, but in many other areas it did

[dapper laurel]

Half

I know Italian better than German to be honest

[main bison]

Do u and Italian people like muselini ?

[dapper laurel]

Most people don't appreciate him, especially here

[main bison]

Hmmm
I've seen Nazi gathering videos from Italy

[dapper laurel]

Because he tried to assimilate the German majority

[dapper laurel]

Fascist rallies, well, especially in Rome, but it's not something new

[main bison]

By here u mean ur province? They're German why they don't like this idea

[dapper laurel]

Our government does nothing to limit them, on the other hand

[verbal torrent]

Yeah ofc with a balanced diet u can thrive without consuming animal products

[dapper laurel]

Yes, here people hate him because he tried to assimilate them during the fascist regime

However, he is very popular in the south

[main bison]

It's not illegal to do Nazi salute?

[dapper laurel]

Not illegal

It's illegal in Germany

[main bison]

Interesting

[main bison]

What's ur political ideology

[dapper laurel]

here people do it normally

[thorny steeple]

Natanyahu's son beats him and thus is expelled

[dapper laurel]

Center left

[main bison]

So u don't like the prime minister

[dapper laurel]

Even though I don't have any particular political affiliation

[dapper laurel]

Not really

But that's what we have and we're "happy" with her

[main bison]

Hmm

[main bison]

Do u like tourists in Italy
Do u have overtoursim problem

[dapper laurel]

Yes
Yes

They bring money here, so I can't be against them, but in Venice the situation has gotten out of hand

[main bison]

That city which its streets are river?

Do u call the river even by street or alley ?

[dapper laurel]

There are too many of them, this also fucks their experience in Italy

[main bison]

I heard the gayest city in italy is milan

This emoji is so cute

[dapper laurel]

Well, I've been there once and I don't remember how it works, but there are also internal roads, not just canals

[dapper laurel]

True

But also the richest

[main bison]

Is it the richest because it's gay or is it gay because it's the richest

[dapper laurel]

I'd say the second option

[main bison]

Do u have a pet?

[dapper laurel]

Yessir

A cat

Eine schwarze Katze

[main bison]

Kittyy

[thorny steeple]

hi

[golden brook]

https://temu.to/k/ecqj1q7kq2f

[slender coral]

How can I start?

[shy summit]

In some places it literally is

[verbal torrent]

I think forcing yourself into this lifestyle all of a sudden can make you feel cold and pressured so you can start by taking small steps at first and gradually you can increase those steps and you can fully embrace this lifestyle by changing some things in your life for example you can start shopping for your kitchen by filling your shopping cart with non-animal products there are many options for this and then you can reduce your animal consumption from three to two in a day like
Breakfast (non-animal food)
Lunch and dinner (animal products)
Once you get used to it you can apply it to other meals as well

[keen patio]

Hii

What's up ??

[feral river]

have watched a vid of a stupid guy doing nazi salute in front of a old ww2 soviet soldier

nazis are just terrible at everything besides conquer

[sonic ferry]

We always live in chaos and all you can decide is where you gone end up at the end

[lethal sparrow]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2VejzsRNaeI

[prisma cipher]

What do you mean by animals product? Meat?

[verbal torrent]

Meat egg milk etc

[feral river]

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/iOn63ShZp_c

LMAO this got me hard

[prisma cipher]

Yes but why?

[stoic cedar]

Knock Knock

[full epoch]

why yall so serious??

[prisma cipher]

And you can you eat shawarma with falafel

[stoic cedar]

Because This is a f...ing serious chat

[prisma cipher]

[full epoch]

dont be so serious bro

[verbal torrent]

Yeaaah i saw shawarma falafel version
Tbh i cant be vegetarian😖

[prisma cipher]

[verbal torrent]

https://tenor.com/view/chill-guy-chill-guy-just-a-chill-guy-relax-gif-1579445140409713118

[stoic cedar]

I'll try

[manic juniper]

Isn't that Italian

The pfp

It says "How I feel when I pour[…]" in Italian

Unless that's Swiss language

I know a bit of Italian

Tu madre

[native mango]

[native mango]

Died chat

.

[slender coral]

Try to guess

I want to become vegan

Don't like how the food industry treat animals

[prisma cipher]

Why

It make 0 influence on animals treat.

[slender coral]

Maybe. I just don't wanna be a part of it at least.

[prisma cipher]

Ok

[shy summit]

Low key wtf

[slender coral]

How filthy can US leaders get?

[amber pivot]

Hi

[prisma cipher]

This is a very interesting move by Putin, he has has his own risks here. But the main thing is that it motivates Trump not to help Zelensky, and also puts Zelensky in a difficult position, in order to outplay Putin, he must sign a agreement that is not beneficial for him.

[main bison]

Y'all being played by matix

The same shit would've happened if Harris won

Worlds politics is more likely a cirque
It's just to entertain people

[amber pivot]

[main bison]

And distract them

[shy summit]

Harris campaigned on a 25k tax credit bro not the same

[noble shore]

Hello everyone

[lethal sparrow]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGPHGTSIQDc

[vestal marten]

Hello everyone

[manic juniper]

Israel, USA, Russia and Eritrea finally agree on something

[vestal marten]

Ohh can I know more about that

[tulip zenith]

at least they could get an agreement, even if that wasn't what we expected

it's interesting the high amount of abstentions

[vestal marten]

Hmm yeah

getting started with an online business is a easy task just try to focus and believe in what you are doing.....
I'm into it and is working for me, I'm making More than $2k every week from it so far....
If you want to get started, you can dm me to share some possible ideas together on how to get success

[tulip zenith]

bro sounds like a scam

💀

[vestal marten]

Ohhh don't say that anymore

Who is a scammer

[tulip zenith]

and the speed in which you wrote it seems like you just pasted the message, but idk

[vestal marten]

Haha 🤣🤣

[tulip zenith]

no ones 👁️

[vestal marten]

I don't get you don't just trying to be a caterpillar

Try to be a Pillar

If you are not interested then fine, don't just bad mouth any thing you see

[tulip zenith]

wdym with that?

[vestal marten]

Abeg leave the fuck here

[tulip zenith]

btw earning $2 per week sounds really bad

[vestal marten]

As how bro

Can you emphasize

[tulip zenith]

at least a person needs 100

[tulip zenith]

well you said "I'm making More than $2 every week from it so far.." 2.5 is more than 2

isn't it?

[vestal marten]

I mean 2k

[tulip zenith]

i'm just kidding, i already knew what you mean

[vestal marten]

Every week from the business

[vestal marten]

Yeah haha

Are you now okay with it?

[formal pilot]

Aren't they supposed to be the good guys

[manic juniper]

Yes

[urban swift]

USA and Russia on the same side yayyy!

[quaint dune]

Finland: 💀

[urban swift]

1. I am less active therefore have to catch up all past messages again and again to go through word play and extract subject matter, it's tiring.

2. omnipotence paradox topic is fairly new to me, I just found it interesting. I gotta dive deep for a proper counter argument.

3. perhaps I need an atheist PoV. I Gotta understand atheist people better to keep up.

4. but I still don't like the fact that you adhered to only your example (set of even prime) to justify the significance of contradictions but completely neglected the way contradictions comes handy and play a significant role in drawing a concrete conclusion in the case of converse of BPT theoram.

[urban swift]

Wdym ? Finland is cooked ?

[quaint dune]

Exactly

[urban swift]

What will happen

[quaint dune]

Only the gods know

[urban swift]

You don't have anything concrete to say ?

[quaint dune]

I do but I don't want to say

I don't want to start a fight or smth like that

https://tenor.com/view/rockon-gif-8383736499434398347

[urban swift]

This is serious chat

[quaint dune]

Oh, really?

😱😱😱

Js chill lil bro nobody gon hurt u

[urban swift]

#🧊｜chill-chat

[fallen dust]

Can one have a serious chat about US politics right now when it's literally watching a bunch of clowns try to fit into a tiny car?

[crimson patio]

Can anyone reccomend me some scholarship for international students?

[fallen dust]

generic or a particular field of study?

https://www.iefa.org/scholarships

https://www.internationalstudent.com/scholarships/search/

https://www.edupass.org/paying-for-college/scholarships/databases/

https://www.nafsa.org/about/about-international-education/financial-aid-undergraduate-international-students

[feral river]

It is possible to live a healthy life with only animal products

For produce non-animal products, you have to kill all of single being around that fucking plant

Wait extra seasons waste more water and other shit to make it

[verbal torrent]

Fair point but In my opinion both have an equally detrimental impact on the environment comparing crop and animal food production, the latter requires more land water and resources due to deforestation overgrazing and higher greenhouse gas emissions damaging the ecosystem

[dense agate]

huh, "have an equally detrimental impact on environment", then you list why animal agriculture has greater negative impact

[dense agate]

you know we already produce a lot of crops to sustain animal agriculture, around 77% of the world's total farmland is dedicated to livestock.

[verbal torrent]

Yeah tru my point wasn’t that they are exactly the same both have an equal impact on environment but the level of damage is different

[urban swift]

@verbal torrent
You support misogyny ?

[dense agate]

still a contradiction.

[verbal torrent]

Ofc no it is written ant -anti misogynists an ironic or sarcastic tone

[urban swift]

You mean Anti² ?

[verbal torrent]

Ye

[urban swift]

[verbal torrent]

[urban swift]

Some People will draw wrong conclusions don't you think?

[verbal torrent]

Its oke i can explain

[feral river]

Come on that’s not vic3 bro

If you wanna talk about production and consumption, I can tell you the people who want to eat fake meat comprises less than 1% of the total population

And about the production, what makes you think a vegan shit is competitive than meat ?

That’s not the case

Ofc there was some organizations trying to invent some super veges all good for that, but throughout the history did you see there’s any moment that meat production or consumption is disrupted by more veges ?

Even in today’s world leftism was more being suppressed around the world, that’s not possible

The last true leftism revolution shit was suppressed a century ago, and the last true leftism regime was died because of the death of lenin

https://x.com/realdonaldtrump/status/1894126415932526802?s=46

I got trump text addiction 💀

[mystic bay]

I haven't neglected anything. You just haven't made an argument. It's not for me to make your argument for you. If you think that the usefulness of contradictions in mathematics has some philosophical significance here, then make your case, and we'll see where it goes.

[urban swift]

https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/russell-paradox/

Is this your basis of argument?

[mystic bay]

No. Russell's paradox is concerned with paradoxes which arise from sets being members of themselves. That has nothing to do with what I have argued. Everything you need is contained in what I have said.

[slender coral]

Ramadan is coming

[flat elbow]

what s that name

[slender coral]

You mean Ramadan Devil?

[flat elbow]

yes

[slender coral]

They say the devils get locked up in Ramadan and not released until its end.

But I'll be out there.

[flat elbow]

get some sleep

[slender coral]

Lol

[flat elbow]

lol

[slender coral]

May Allah curse y'all, infidels.

[flat elbow]

wauta

[slender coral]

Something interesting I realize during this month is that people get angry easily during it. I, someone who is forced to fast and doesn't believe in Islam, would be trying to calm people who are trying to start fights and yell at each other in transportation. And they are likely Muslims who believe that Ramadan is the peak of their spiritual peace.

It's an absurd situation I find myself dealing with often during Ramadan.

[hexed kettle]

Try devil's train

Will make u feel good defo

[manic juniper]

Could be because they are hungry and tired

[slender coral]

I also be hungry and tired as well but I don't act like them. And you'd expect me to especially be easily irritated since I'm forced to fast but I be not.

[naive bramble]

It mostly changes to people

[thorny steeple]

You could try to eat sneakily

Pork preferentially

[mystic bay]

https://tenor.com/view/pig-snout-attention-looking-watching-gif-2789457055918708080

[manic juniper]

https://www.turkishminute.com/2025/02/24/no-brics-invitation-for-turkey-as-fm-blames-eus-islamophobic-stance-for-frozen-talks2/

[manic juniper]

There are people who behave like cavemen

[feral river]

appreciate that every sec

[tender vessel]

OMG! You'll disprove Islam! How dare you.

The 3 different interpretations of that can go out of the window.

[tender vessel]

Egyptian Christians are forced to fast during Ramadan as well. Except some of my Christian friends who like to tease me as I'm fasting.

[verbal torrent]

Lmao why are they forced to fast?

[tender vessel]

I'm trolling. They don't fast. Lol.

[flat elbow]

LİFE İS HARD

[slender coral]

Don't take it seriously lol

[slender coral]

It's not the case in every place in Egypt and at every time. Watch this vid, it has some funny and interesting stories. He talked about fasting Ramadan at some point but I don't remember when he started talking about it.
https://youtu.be/ruvTher0ljk?si=ci1XV4ugrlNBojWg

[thorny steeple]

BRICS is just an acronym for underdeveloped countries, no one takes it seriously. It invited Saudi Arabia and Iran. To top it off, they sent an invite to Namibia as well in spite of their intrigues with South Africa

[shy summit]

BRICS is an informal group of emerging market countries that aims to deepen ties between members and cooperate on economic growth. The acronym stands for Brazil, Russia, India, China, and South Africa. In 2014, the BRICS countries established the New Development Bank (NDB) to provide developmental funds and rival the World Bank and International Monetary Fund. The BRICS group has no charter, funds, or fixed secretariat, and is sustained by political will.

So

First off

These are not ‘underdeveloped’ countries

At least three of these are considered developed

I would recommend you be VERY careful with the verbiage there

[thorny steeple]

Which are the three? I'm really curious

By which standards?

[shy summit]

Russia China brazil

[thorny steeple]

Lolllllllllll BRAZIL

China? China is developing country. Look at its HDI

[shy summit]

India too actually

Contrary to racist belief

[thorny steeple]

Oh yeah the hyper-developed India, got you

[shy summit]

Its considered developing

[thorny steeple]

All countries in the list are developing. How come they are developed when the living standards are that low?

[shy summit]

Sorry developing

Which is STILL higher than underdeveloped

[naive bramble]

Aha Türk

[thorny steeple]

Trve, India is a third world country, but somehow it doesn't fall under the underdeveloped umbrella

Underdeveloped and developing aren't excluding categories

They can be both

Even China has low living standards, the development is uneven across the country

[mystic bay]

Sometimes I feel like an underdeveloped country

[thorny steeple]

Why?

[shy summit]

We don’t use the term third world anymore

We have’t in years

[thorny steeple]

TIL that Brazil is a developed country despite having 50k homicides per year and having half of its population fitting the UN hunger map

[sonic hazel]

Brazil is being imploded by a useless government.
And being in BRICS doesn't help at all.

[feral river]

we use that

[thorny steeple]

The BRICS itself doesn't help at all, it's useless

[feral river]

besides the US, China, Russia, UK and France, rest of them are third world states

lmao

[shy summit]

Yeah but you guys aren’t exactly the pinnacle of political science so

[feral river]

I'm kidding that's not the real third world states

that's just what we are saying

[thorny steeple]

Of course we do, there's a political view called Thirdworldism that is largely adhered nowadays. Also sometimes they replace it with "Global South" which is basically the same thing

[shy summit]

Incorrect

[feral river]

I'm surprised we had this subject in major schools

[thorny steeple]

starts to frantically search things up on Google

[feral river]

you know our best school are public schools unlike the west or other states

including universities

[manic juniper]

The West isn't just USA

Public schools are better in most European countries

[thorny steeple]

Well the third world countries themselves use it, your country did everything to maintain us poor, doesn't matter at all

[feral river]

it is ?

I mean western puppet states, well are they considered west ?

I don't think so

[manic juniper]

Why do you use two names to describe USA then

[shy summit]

Who is us in this statement

[feral river]

one ever had europeans because they are the typical old superpowers

and now it was the United States alone

[manic juniper]

But they never were superpowers after WW2

[feral river]

yeah

buuuuut

[manic juniper]

So what's the point of calling USA with two names

[shy summit]

I’m curious because chances are we subsidize or flat out send assloads of money to whatever country man’s is talking about

[feral river]

some people in other puppet state or proxy states call europeans west because they are more powerful than them and they project their power in their region

[manic juniper]

I will call China "the BRICS" from now on

[feral river]

we don't call that shit because they are nothing and we are a superpower/great power

[manic juniper]

West isn't about being powerful, Slovenia isn't powerful for example

[shy summit]

China ‘bricced’ up

🤣

[feral river]

that make sense, but not making much sense do you consider eastern europe "west" ?

[thorny steeple]

I said Brazil itself

[manic juniper]

https://tenor.com/view/reiayanami-slovenia-flag-rei-ayanami-gif-9772593318468692857