🧠｜serious-chat

[feral river]

you can access west websites by VPN also as you mentioned the Tor but the VPN is also from the government or regulated by government

[dense agate]

the chinese firewall

[rotund light]

but why are they even permitting VPNs. For what official reason??

[lavish creek]

First one is not racist but true

[manic juniper]

He was a British conservative even for his times

[feral river]

just for lawful standards to average VPN server

[manic juniper]

Yeah I agree with that too

[feral river]

you need to fill a form if you even open a website in our internet

to be backed by the law

that won't charge you any fee but you need to fill it

[rotund light]

what's the difference between using a non-permitted VPN to bypass the Great Firewall and a permitted VPN to bypass it. Can the goverment see the traffic on permitted VPNs?

[feral river]

non-permitted VPN will probably shut down by government and the VPN provider will under arrest

[rotund light]

No the whatsapp example is just an analogy to websites

[feral river]

permitted VPN is okay to bypass it features are the same but non-permitted may not censored by government and permitted one is censored as usual but you can use that to access west websites

[rotund light]

makes partly sense

[west pivot]

#📷｜selfie @west pivot

[feral river]

they won't do anything even if you are looking some videos that is anti-government anti-party or something

don't be worry about it

[rotund light]

this is weird

[west pivot]

What 🙀

[rotund light]

i think it's more strict in north korea

[feral river]

they just need to control the source of information

[west pivot]

[feral river]

that's what they need, no need to block all the stuff

[west pivot]

Me

[feral river]

and for domestic uses, I mean the general great firewall that blocks every western links have 2 major concerns: one is for stability and national security, another one is for developing own internet industry and protect our market

we don't need a bunch of american shit occupy our internet sovereignty

[rotund light]

if they wouldn't censor services while still redirecting everything through their firewall like a MITM, you wouldn't need a VPN

[plush raft]

Sorry to interrupt your discussion,
But I think North Korea is very serious even you can see the president is not fun with country's employes

[feral river]

they need that for sure, as I explained one used for protect stability and national security, one is used for protect our internet industry and market

[rotund light]

Yes

[feral river]

that means generally you can not access western stuff, but if you use a VPN then you can access it and they don't care

[rotund light]

ok

[smoky pagoda]

Coffee ☕

[rotund light]

if they don't care why they make an effort to maintain the firewall?

[feral river]

I think it's even more dangrous when everything is from the US

[feral river]

protect domestic industries and maintain the stabiltity and protect the national security

you know most people in China don't even know there is a wall

they don't need to use VPN to access western stuff and our internet is pretty nice

we have everything that west has

[rotund light]

ok i get it

[dense agate]

umm, more or less, the encryption helps with stopping a third member from going through your messages which can be used in scamming, you don't see a lot of scams this way because it works, it's like normalcy bias it's working well so we take it for granted

[plush raft]

North Korea's president if he was knew any weak in his country, he will punish the officials.
This may making them afraid of his punishments and they have to solve it without any mistakes

[turbid ivy]

Any Muslims?

[rotund light]

Ok, lets switch conversation

[lavish creek]

Yes, @feral river

[plush raft]

I'm Muslim

[dense agate]

about time

[feral river]

ah yes

[young sand]

Hey, is Snapdeal good to purchase books?

[rotund light]

are you a programmer

[turbid ivy]

I have got a question

[plush raft]

Sure

[lavish creek]

Are you Shia or Sunni? I don't remember

[turbid ivy]

How adult sucklings is Halal

[feral river]

I'm a aShiniSun

[prisma cipher]

I will explain why China blocked Western Internet resources. When the owners of these sites are your potential enemies, they can regulate the information that is released on these resources. You can pessimize views or simply block people.

[rotund light]

yes

[prisma cipher]

How it happens in Russia.

[rotund light]

its happening in many countries

[cinder quartz]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1074670102231924747/1276978142531289171/Leva_classic.gif

[prisma cipher]

But we don't have firewall. And everyone use YouTube no matter what.

[prisma cipher]

If you aren't us potential enemies you are safe.

[plush raft]

The doctrine of the majority, the four imams and others is that breastfeeding an adult does not make a person forbidden. Aisha and her statement, Ibn Hazm said: that breastfeeding an adult makes a person forbidden, based on the fact that the Prophet, may God bless him and grant him peace, ordered the wife of Abu Hudhaifah to breastfeed Salim, the freed slave of Abu Hudhaifah, and said: (Breastfeed him and you will make him forbidden to you). In another narration: (Breastfeed him until he enters upon you). In another narration, she said to him: (How can I breastfeed him when he is an adult? The Messenger of God, may God bless him and grant him peace, smiled and said: (I know that he is an adult). The hadith is in Sahih Muslim and others. In Al-Muwatta’, Al-Musnad and Sunan Abi Dawud, it is stated that Aisha, may God be pleased with her, used to order her sisters and nieces to breastfeed any man she wanted to have intercourse with. The hadith is long and contains benefits and is authentic. The majority used as evidence the statement of God Almighty: “Mothers may breastfeed their children for two complete years for whoever wishes to complete the nursing” (Al-Baqarah). And what is in the two Sahihs and others from the hadith of Aisha that the Prophet, may God bless him and grant him peace, said: (Breastfeeding is only for hunger) and breastfeeding does not satisfy the hunger of an adult.

[prisma cipher]

It mean not China or Russia, and couple small countries

[plush raft]

They said that the story that Aisha used it specifically for the wife of Abu Hudhayfah, who used to say: “All the wives of the Prophet, may God bless him and grant him peace, refused to have anyone enter upon them through that breastfeeding, and they said to Aisha, ‘By God, we do not see this except as a concession that the Messenger of God, may God bless him and grant him peace, granted to Salim in particular. No one entered upon us through that breastfeeding, nor did we see it.’ Ibn Taymiyyah mentioned in Fatawa, vol. 34, p. 60, an explanation of Aisha’s doctrine that combines these pieces of evidence, saying: Aisha took this hadith, and the rest of the wives of the Prophet, may God bless him and grant him peace, refused to take it, even though Aisha narrated from him that he said: ‘Breastfeeding is for famine.’ But she saw the difference between intending breastfeeding or nourishment. When the second intention was intended, nothing was forbidden except what was before weaning, and this is the breastfeeding of the general public. As for the first, it is permissible if it is necessary to make him a mahram, and what is not permissible for others may be permissible due to need, and this is a valid statement. End quote from it. From what I have mentioned to you, you know that this issue is disputed, and there is no doubt that the most correct opinion is the opinion of the majority, so no one should deviate from it, especially since some scholars have reported consensus on it. The incident of Salim was a solution to a circumstance that existed before Islam, which is adoption, and Islam has put an end to it, so it is not conceivable that it would be repeated except in those who have recently converted to Islam and this circumstance existed among them. And God Almighty knows best.

[dense agate]

https://tenor.com/view/lotta-words-wow-thats-a-lot-of-words-not-reading-that-not-reading-wow-gif-26878516

[dense agate]

huh are you talking about the censorship in Russia ?

[plush raft]

Conclusion :

Breastfeeding an adult has no effect and no ruling. Rather, breastfeeding during the first two years has an effect, based on the hadith: “Look at your brothers, for breastfeeding is only for famine.” Narrated by al-Bukhari and Muslim in their Sahihs. And based on the hadith: “There is no breastfeeding except during the first two years.” And based on another hadith: “There is no breastfeeding except that which opens the intestines and is before weaning.” So the correct view is that breastfeeding only prohibits if it occurs during the first two years.

[prisma cipher]

No.

I'm talking about safety

[cinder quartz]

https://tenor.com/view/чо-комару-комаругиф-komaru-komarugif-gif-6945394585593000201

[prisma cipher]

you need to understand something about youtube. no video hosting can compete with youtube. if your country does not have access to such a resource, and the one who has access is your potential enemy, access to such a resource should be limited, for security reasons

[dense agate]

what threat does youtube pose on a country's security ?

large amounts of muckbang videos ?

[rotund light]

civil disobedience

[dense agate]

how would youtube cause civil disobedience ?

do you mean like when Russians like Alexei Navalny use the platform to showcase how corruption is deeply rooted in Russia which can cause protests

[prisma cipher]

I'm living in Russia, not in Ukrainian

Should I explain?

Can I see Russia media? Try to guess

[rotund light]

If people receive clarification through youtube videos about history and your whole country the people may not want to fight for their country and question the government more

[dense agate]

are you getting triggered by a Ukranian flag ?

[rotund light]

yes, exactly

[prisma cipher]

You don't understand or pretending?

[dense agate]

so you're against transparency and even journalism ?

[rotund light]

i am not against it

[manic juniper]

It makes more sense for government to block it

[dense agate]

there is nothing to understand, seeing a ukranian flag (or any flag of a country you're in conflict wiht) is not a valid reason to censor the internet

[rotund light]

yeah

[prisma cipher]

There is nothing to understand

[rotund light]

But this is a video, not just a flag.

[dense agate]

in authoritarian regimes where they care about nothing except the survival of said regime ofc it would make sense

[manic juniper]

Even in less authoritarian countries, I once lived in a EU country where they blocked videos about their own history

It felt kinda strange to witness

But obviously certain countries censor on another level completely

[dense agate]

even if it's just a video, you said it would make the people question their government and protest against it

[grizzled arrow]

hello! sorry for dropping in, im actually here for a research paper and whatnot? mind if i ask one or two of you a controversial question?? might be best if youre the race this question rightfully belongs to. do take it with honest curiosity

[rotund light]

Every country does something like that. In Germany if you question the holocaust you will face legal problems.

[dense agate]

yes there is somewhat similar regulation in some EU countries like Germany and Austria for historical reasons, but it's not of this scale

[prisma cipher]

what i want to say is that youtube is not about freedom of speech. it is about western freedom of speech. and china was right when it blocked these resources.

[manic juniper]

YouTube has plenty of YouTubers that are anti-western

[prisma cipher]

Not Russian

[dense agate]

yes, would you go to jail if you question the government in germany ? or if you show valid proof of corruption and power abuse in the country ? meanwhile the folks who do the same in Russia won't be breathing our air anymore

[grizzled arrow]

can i ask smth? sorry for buttin in, in for a research paper

[rotund light]

every country has some interests they need to defend. Imagine the german government would allow that kind of information, that would cause many problems and damage the international reputation

[dense agate]

"western freedom of speech" are you indicating some parallel freedom of speech in eastern countries like china ? it's more like the lack of

[manic juniper]

There is Hakim that isn't censored and he has countless videos that are pro-USSR, anti-USA, it even justifies Molotov-Ribbentrop, and I once saw a video from a YouTuber that justified Srebrenica but I can't manage to find that one again

[rotund light]

No, here you don't go to jail ideally

[prisma cipher]

yes, foreign

[dense agate]

oh yeaa, i don't think they would admit to their Namibian genocide , oh wait they did

[manic juniper]

Most of them are Americans

I don't watch Russian YouTube so I cannot know

[prisma cipher]

they don't influence what happens in Russia, they broadcast to the West.

[rotund light]

maybe. The government has propaganda for a reason. And this propaganda gets useless if the people collect their own sources

[dense agate]

in Russia you do, many in fact have already went to jail and lost their lives

[rotund light]

yep, i know

[grizzled arrow]

in yalls individual views and opinion, whats your take on filipinos, or any other race for that matter, using the n word not to demean but to use it as a word, between friends and people familiar to one another?

[manic juniper]

Aren't most Russians anti-West already? I think their main goal is to convince westerners rather than Russians

[dense agate]

the amount of rightwingers simping over Russia is insane, maybe don't get too distracted on ukranian flags and you'll see them

[prisma cipher]

They ban everyone big pro Russian. I watch a lot and today I can't on YouTube

[dense agate]

if you acknowledge this and understand the importance of free press, why are you agreeing to such censorship ?

[dense agate]

omegalel

[prisma cipher]

And they all were banned after 2022 in one year, even before they posted the same video for many years

[dense agate]

they love Russia so much that it's even paying them to keep talking, literally

[dense agate]

?? on youtube ? on twitter ??

[manic juniper]

I don't know how justified they'd be, there are some Filipino indigenous people like the Aetas that used to be called Negritos by Spaniards. I guess those would be justified in using the N word since they already owned it

[rotund light]

This is a misunderstanding. When did I agree censorship?

We currently discuss the reasons of censorship from a government perspective and I never said this was cool

[dense agate]

huh you were rallying on what Neyro said

[grizzled arrow]

I was beginning to believe noone would answer me, thank you

[dense agate]

and this, which gave the impression

[manic juniper]

About others using the N word it doesn't matter much to me, I don't use it but I understand why some find it offensive. I believe it's more important to respect those people that may get offended

[dense agate]

why are we talking about n word ?

[grizzled arrow]

Yes, I believe so too. And this is a good belief, to respect those who are offended. It is rightfully so.

[grizzled arrow]

Well this is #🧠｜serious-chat isnt it?

[manic juniper]

I guess he's from Philippines trying to do a research for school and asking foreigners about it

[rotund light]

You asked, I answered.

My answer was just descriptive

[grizzled arrow]

Right on the money.

[manic juniper]

Wasn't pinoy a slur originally? I think it was created by Americans to mock how Filipinos speak, but Filipinos eventually adopted the term

[dense agate]

yea i meant like what's the context

[dense agate]

i see

[grizzled arrow]

research papers

[manic juniper]

Kinda like how the N word is used in rap by black people

[dense agate]

sure

[grizzled arrow]

Yes, we owned the word. Engraved it to our culture for ourselves

[dense agate]

it should be fine to be said , especially if it's not use with the intent to offend someone, not that someone being offended means such words can't be said

i believe for a large part the problematic use of the N-word is mostly imported from the States, there are many cultures where such words or it's alternatives are being commonly used without problems

[prisma cipher]

@manic juniper this dude blocked from YouTube https://t.me/dmitrynikotin

[grizzled arrow]

I see. I'll take note of your belief.

Thank you, saimon

[manic juniper]

In an ideal world people would be free to say whichever offensive word without inherently racist intentions

But it often gets abused by actual racists

[manic juniper]

Why is that

[prisma cipher]

@manic juniper and him https://t.me/ikakprosto

[grizzled arrow]

Oh yes it does.

[manic juniper]

Are they anti-Ukraine or something?

[grizzled arrow]

Happens a lot in youtube nowadays, they somehow develop a block feature silently over these few years

[prisma cipher]

@manic juniper him https://t.me/SolovievLive did you see how big they are in telegram

They all banned on YouTube

https://t.me/oper_goblin

Also this

[manic juniper]

Interesting

Don't they operate on VK?

[dense agate]

the potential of it being abused isn't enough to totally ban in the name of fighting hate speech, nor if it's usage offended people, there would always be someone who'd get offended from a racial joke but that doesn't justify stopping them from saying it

[prisma cipher]

Now try to find them on YouTube all of them have channels more than one million sub

[manic juniper]

The issue with certain slurs is that they're often not part of any joke, they're just spammed for the sake of it. Like on 4chan

[grizzled arrow]

With no context backing it yep

No emotion, fashion nada

[manic juniper]

On Reddit (when they used to be allowed) they were rare on average but there still were subs that used them frequently

[prisma cipher]

They have millions views on VK.

Also this dude https://t.me/temalebedev

[manic juniper]

What is their content

[prisma cipher]

I'm showing direct person who were banned not just random

[grizzled arrow]

How come i never heard of em before, whats youtube doin to em

[prisma cipher]

News, pro Russian

[dense agate]

this can be said about almost any slur and it would be true, large portions of their usage are spam or trying to bait people online, here sites should be able to free themselves from associating with these kinds of communities by banning them.
but when the government does this it gets messy , just like that case of UK police arresting a woman for saying the N-word online (she's black)

[prisma cipher]

They all banned in one year

[grizzled arrow]

Thats smth.. and youtube just silences the hell out of anyone who tries to talk about this I bet?

[dense agate]

is reason of banning them mentioned ? there are many who praise russia and what it's doing in Ukraine still not banned

[manic juniper]

They're mostly in Russian language and about Russia

[grizzled arrow]

And I have to be biased here but that woman had a right to be looked on as an individual of said race, not as a political figure. If they said it on stand, then sure they can be penalized as they are a public figure, but off duty? Nahh.

[prisma cipher]

You can translate their random posts in telegram and watch what they are talking about

[manic juniper]

Yeah I don't like the government policing that unless it's harassment

[grizzled arrow]

To be fair international content is pretty common on youtube recommendations if it aint filled with nonsense with the things we watch

[manic juniper]

What's why I don't see almost anything in my own language

[prisma cipher]

Nothing like kill everyone or something, just pro Russian. Not sure about soloviev he might say something extra about Ukrainian, not others were just pro Russian

[dense agate]

if she's a public figure saying such things sure there should be retaliations and damages to reputation, but a private citizen ?? no

[grizzled arrow]

Funny the algorithm workings in the shadows ( ;｀Д´)

[prisma cipher]

They got banned when they try make new acc

Even if they don't post there

[dense agate]

Based, but many other regulations (social&economical) are good

[dense agate]

i don't think youtube would ban someone for no reason tho

justified or not, there must be something

they won't be randomly banning russian content makers

[prisma cipher]

I post their links, translate their content.

[dense agate]

can't, don't use telegram

[prisma cipher]

I have seen western channels that say the same thing and they are not banned, these are big channels. We are only talking about those who are in Russia

[dense agate]

biased content exists for both sides

[manic juniper]

It's funny because Russia Today and practically any English speaking commentator that is pro-Russia isn't censored much or at all

There was a scandal about this recently

Tim Pool was being paid by Russia Today and he didn't declare it, which is illegal

[grizzled arrow]

Im already getting started on my paper, thank you both ^^

[dense agate]

yea that's exactly what i wanted to show, millions of dollars, they've funded multiple rightwingers online

and there's plenty more who are doing it for free lel

[prisma cipher]

Where rt channel on YouTube

[manic juniper]

I'm talking about their articles, I don't know if they are on YouTube or not

[manic juniper]

Hasan is coping right now

[prisma cipher]

But still thy have channel on YouTube

Where is it

Lol

[dense agate]

hahahaha that's the one i meant

[manic juniper]

He was being pro-Russia without getting paid

[prisma cipher]

Give me link on Russian today on YouTube

[manic juniper]

Don't you have YouTube

[prisma cipher]

They don't censored so much

[prisma cipher]

Freedom life, Ukrainian.

The same, first time I type it wrong

It shows me freedom life, Ukrainian

[manic juniper]

They removed it from Play Store

It was there last time I checked

[prisma cipher]

Damn no censored rt

So not censored

[manic juniper]

I'm not complaining

[dense agate]

HamasPiker with his usual unhinged views

[prisma cipher]

Yeah

[manic juniper]

It's removed from Google Search too

[dense agate]

they're kinda swinging both ways

[rotund light]

RT is censored in EU but ridiculously easy to bypass.

[manic juniper]

Doesn't Russia have over 120k content removal requests a year

Finland has around 100 and Italy has around 2000

[dense agate]

omegalel

[rotund light]

i love these specific statistics

[manic juniper]

It was 120k in 2021, I wonder what happened in 2022

[rotund light]

i think many removal requests are because of copyright

[manic juniper]

It is because of copyright and national security

Turkey second

[rotund light]

I see

[rotund light]

the question is if every removal request is succesful

[dense agate]

not always

there are many cases like this

[rotund light]

Okay

[thorny steeple]

It should work like this, but actually this resources are very often used for propaganda

[prisma cipher]

this may be one of the reasons, but it does not change what I wrote above.

[feral river]

I wonder why you think Chinese is going to give a shit about it ?

[prisma cipher]

logic. China can't control YouTube. But the West can control the information on YouTube.

Simple as f

[willow aurora]

That's why they use Bilibili

[prisma cipher]

They avoided the problem that Russia has now.

[thorny steeple]

Hey chat

[willow aurora]

wassup

[willow aurora]

Which problem?

[thorny steeple]

doin pretty good, hbu?

[willow aurora]

fine I guess

[prisma cipher]

Scroll up my messages if you curious

[willow aurora]

ok

[thorny steeple]

How to curb lust

[rotund light]

This discussion is nonsense lol

[manic juniper]

YouTube is a private company, why would they let China control it

[prisma cipher]

They shouldn't.

[main bison]

has anyone ever researched if immigrants r eating the dogs in america?

[feral river]

Idk if you ever reached Chinese internet and see the contents that almost includes anything you have said

Just in Chinese version

And I still don’t know why we need some propaganda from enemies

[shy summit]

Its not happening

Like at all

Its a racist rant of a desperate old man trying to cling to power by means of his racist constituency

And such racism is not tolerated anywhere

[noble niche]

It's a possibility. People are not sane nowadays. But I don't think there is an official report on that.

But how could they eat cats? They are agile.

[main bison]

chinese mate already doing it

@feral river

he recommended me to eat dogs meat if i visited china

[manic juniper]

He doesn't like cats

[dapper laurel]

It's propaganda, but it works great

[feral river]

you must try that I swear that's one of the most delicious food in the world

that's luxury in food only cost you around $20-30 in China

[main bison]

chat...Trump is right...

[feral river]

Donald J. trump will win the White House back

[dapper laurel]

Indeed

[dapper laurel]

ENJOYING FUCKING LIFE

[feral river]

Yeah my life is bad man

[dapper laurel]

Good

[feral river]

I’m not a rich guy fucking alone over here

Temporarily live in a country where I can’t understand their language

[dapper laurel]

Well, I'm not rich either, at least you're not alone in this

[dapper laurel]

Do they know English?

[feral river]

They can’t speak English at all 😭

Even do some basic conversations

Like where is the toilet

[dapper laurel]

How is this possible 🤣?

[feral river]

It is…..

[dapper laurel]

Too much time spent saying oioioi baka at school

[dapper laurel]

Can they speak with gestures? Can they make themselves understood?

[feral river]

Nah not available

Even I approached a stranger in rdr2

He’s an American, conservative trump supporter we have a good talk

[dapper laurel]

MAGA

He must be from Texas

[feral river]

He said where he live but I don’t know what is that state so

Anyway I feel like, that’s my life when I get older

I have never such feeling before

[dapper laurel]

What do you mean? Do you think you'll still play video games when you're old?

[feral river]

Nah I just enjoyed a lot, I played games, hang on with friends, tried girls, travel around, have some fucking money and spend it

[dapper laurel]

I don't want to think about when I'll be old, it brings bad luck, I could die tonight too, so there's no point in thinking about the future

[feral river]

I can’t find something more enjoyable for me

I just feel like I just reached out a point I can’t find anything enjoyable

[dapper laurel]

THIS IS LIFE

[feral river]

Yeah unfortunately

So fucked I can’t just

Ah gosh

Maybe I just need some care or attention

Idk if that works

[dapper laurel]

You need this

[main bison]

pick up some korean gurls

[dapper laurel]

China edit

[feral river]

Cool

[feral river]

Already done one

[main bison]

chin chan chon

[feral river]

Not interesting

[feral river]

This is pretty racist

[main bison]

theyre cute

[dapper laurel]

Anyway, whenever you need me, I'm here

[main bison]

someone told me this means great wall of china

[feral river]

Thank you bro ❤️

I think I just need to sleep right now

[dapper laurel]

🫂

[feral river]

Here‘s 4pm

Have fun guys

[dapper laurel]

Here 21:21

[dapper laurel]

Good night

[feral river]

Cool good evening

See ya tomorrow

[prisma cipher]

You build your own life, your life is your decisions, your choice.

[shy summit]

Haitian migrants to the US are not stealing and eating pets its a complete fabrication

[dense agate]

noooo, Trump would never lie

[verbal torrent]

Agree

[prisma cipher]

Don't belong

[verbal torrent]

Shutt up

[prisma cipher]

Belong here

[verbal torrent]

Yeah now you can speak

Confirmed by me

[lavish creek]

True

But I agree with critics

Like if you are saying fuck passports and border control let's do things as we did 200 years ago I would cherish this dude

[floral thistle]

Can anyone help me with English learning step by step ? 🩷

[lavish creek]

But whitewashing people who commit crime no matter how justifiable it's still here and meanwhile having millions of people just waiting for getting visa for YEARS

[dense agate]

from all the things people criticize Trump for, border control is what comes to your mind first ?

[knotty pine]

Please help me. What's it called when someone like

Moves their hair out of their face without using their hands

[shy summit]

Hairflip

[knotty pine]

Thanks.

How can you describe a sigh which is like “Alright, you asked for it. I don't wanna have to do this but I warned you”

Like a mom walking over to discipline her rowdy son

How does she walk? Not with much passion, more routine

[shy summit]

Exasperation maybe?

[knotty pine]

Hmm. Maybe I can write around it

[thorny steeple]

strictly? hi where is the problem ?

https://youtu.be/QONezPd9K9E?feature=shared

Bangladesh = Afganistan

[knotty pine]

Sort of, but more playful than that.
The problem is here: If I knew how to explain to you what I want to describe, then I wouldn't need help describing it

[thorny steeple]

... maybe more cheeky?

ok it's hard how would you say it in your native language?

[knotty pine]

Well, English is my native language. It's just a very specific thing

It is kind of cheeky

It's kind of teasy too

[thorny steeple]

tsundere like how in a anime?

@dapper laurel "I think you ultimately, become who ever saved you that time no did" poem

what are you working on ?

[knotty pine]

It's a poem about a little brother, who smugly declines to do his older sister's homework, and her majesty offended, rather than resolving matters patiently and diplomatically, she gives him a wedgie, which persuades him to agree

It's the way in which she walks over that I'm attempting to describe

[thorny steeple]

it sounds manipulative or stubborn sry it's not my area i tried to help

[knotty pine]

I appreciate your help

[thorny steeple]

why ru so serious

[lavish creek]

It's just general criticism I suppose

[thorny steeple]

Why so serious

[lavish creek]

Hey good morning John

I suppose for you it's soon will be goodnight right ?

[thorny steeple]

Ye

12:39 am

In the night

Just visiting the topic channels

[feral river]

I just awake guys

[thorny steeple]

Gm

How's life being a developer

[feral river]

well I'm still a student now lol

I just able to be a developer, be a server manager, be a blockchain expert or something etc.

and I have authentic experience so

[thorny steeple]

That's good how's college

[feral river]

like vacation

[thorny steeple]

Of easiness

[main bison]

whatvu studying

[feral river]

idk if it's the case you can justify to block them into your country or not but obviously the decision of let immigrants come into your country has huge benefit for your society and drawbacks at the same time\

imagine at today world's main source of production, capitalist market, economy cycling is still based on population, it was a huge benefit that you can just let some people come into your country and pay taxes, build their homes, contribute the economy to your state

[thorny steeple]

Okey yet it turned to be a rumor

God damn

[feral river]

idk if you don't like those immigrants that's okay, in here we don't have that amount of immigrants too, but it doesn't mean you can get nothing from them

they pay taxes, they build homes, they become the cheapest labor ever

[thorny steeple]

I'm okey with them

What I don't like is fake rumors f*cking over people of different cultures

[feral river]

well if they fuck people for reason based on race or something

[lavish creek]

Well better make visa policy easier then

[feral river]

yeah you can do that I think

[thorny steeple]

Just because they are immigrants ofc they would do that

[lavish creek]

If you are looking at that way those people are not the best example of high human capital, education and work capacity

[lavish creek]

Aren't Dominican people kinda hostile towards Haitians themselves?

[thorny steeple]

They are, it's the true

I myself got nothing against them

[lavish creek]

You are living on the same island but I don't see the same amount of illegal immigrants in your country

🤔

I mean, it's obviously the same case as it was in Germany in 2015

[feral river]

well for us we just built some walls and machine guns

[thorny steeple]

Well it's because we got a better start

Than Haitians

[feral river]

we don't accept any refugee

any

[lavish creek]

Mb, but we are not talking about that rn

[thorny steeple]

It's part of the problem

[lavish creek]

What problem

[thorny steeple]

The land controlled by the Spanish didn't become haiti

[lavish creek]

That they all choose US instead of any other Latin America countries?

[lavish creek]

https://www.unhcr.org/countries/china

[thorny steeple]

No you see

Back when Spain controlled the whole island life was good, sure with the native population decided not good but you get my point

After Spain sold the area that would become haiti

the french module of colony for haiti

Was for resource extraction

While the same the Spanish had in mind

But they settled the land

Instead of trying to dry it up

[lavish creek]

Okay they are not culturally similar to Latin America I see, but neither were Lebanese who easily integrated all across Latin America

[thorny steeple]

Well Haiti is more connected to french

While the DR is more connected to Spain

[lavish creek]

Btw francofone culture ig still more similar to Latin than Anglosphere

[thorny steeple]

There are Franco culture in the Americas

Gayana

Quebec

Louisiana

Haiti

And some Caribbean islands

[lavish creek]

And even so why the US should bear the burden

[lavish creek]

I know

[lavish creek]

U see

[feral river]

that's what they have done not what we have done

[lavish creek]

It's how the French managed their colonies

[thorny steeple]

To prevent chaos

A world without the US would be bad

[feral river]

what we are doing is pervent any possibility to let some refugee come into our country and we have literally no lawful ways to seek asylum in China

[thorny steeple]

Or to prevent squatters

In homes

[lavish creek]

Asians...

[thorny steeple]

The fall of Myanmar to war

Damn I ready wish I could go to Vietnam

[dense agate]

they have taken some small amounts of refugees from places like Myanmar, and ethic Chinese fleeing from vietnam/Loas back in the 70-80s, but they don't grant them formal refugee status like the Myanmar ones and just puts them in camps near the border

they did sign the 1951 refugee convention tho

[lavish creek]

Asians too based...

[feral river]

well a piece of toilet paper ?

[thorny steeple]

It's important obviously

[feral river]

not important for us

[dense agate]

lel it's a bounding law

[feral river]

how many troops of this enforcement on this law ?

as many as Chinese military ?

I don't think so

[dense agate]

so if we don't send military toward China we can expect to break international laws and guidelines like human rights on their own people ?

[feral river]

law/rule without enforcement is a toilet paper

[lavish creek]

Say yes Minecraft

[lavish creek]

It means yes

[dense agate]

just because breaching it doesn't cause a military intrevention that doesn't mean there are no consequences

[feral river]

well the truth is, no consequences

that's what happened lol

[lavish creek]

Sad to admit, but Minecraft is right

Hungry violated convention a lot of times

[dense agate]

are sanctions, loss of treaty benefits and so on not consequences ?

[lavish creek]

There is nothing like that

[feral river]

I didn't see there's any sanctions upon us

lmao

[lavish creek]

And sanctions are unilateral reactions from countries, not international institutions

There could be, but not again china

[feral river]

and btw we are permanent member of the UN security concil if there is a resolution against us, we can just veto it

veto power u know ?

[dense agate]

im talking about international law in general which you said can't have consequences because of lack of military intervention, not just china

[lavish creek]

It's a military part of the UN BTW

[dense agate]

not when it comes from a state level or from non state actors

[lavish creek]

but even among Secretariat all African countries would support China

So there are indeed no consequences

[feral river]

I'm talking about our policy on asylum not other countries

[dense agate]

yes yes, but the breaching of international treaties can be the reason for countries to form coalitions and sanction/embargo a country

[feral river]

if you gonna say some small countries they have to care about international law otherwise they may face sanction due violation of the law

but for us, we don't just give a shit

[lavish creek]

Can they do that to the second word economy?

[dense agate]

China is already being sanctioned by the US

[feral river]

try that on the world's factory

[feral river]

because of ayslum ?

[dense agate]

not asylum but for other reasons, some of them due to human rights

[feral river]

btw we both have high-tech so I don't really care about their sanctions

and nothing really happened after they sanctioned some of our industry

even Huawei released their new phone

[dense agate]

how does that even correlate

China is behind in semiconductors

[feral river]

it is correlate cuz you said sanctions

[dense agate]

im talking about what you wrote "we both have high tech so we don't care" this is meaningless

[feral river]

u mean we are gonna be cut off of conductors producing cuz they sanction us ?

we have our own industry bro

it's not only the US dominating this market

[feral river]

not really

[dense agate]

why do you like to interpret what im saying in the most extreme ways

[feral river]

that's what you have said not me

[dense agate]

China has semiconductor industry, it pours billions into it, but that doesn't mean it's up to Taiwan's level or their processing units can compete with American ones

[feral river]

so ?

[dense agate]

what i said is something else

[feral river]

does that related to sanctions ?

I don't get it

[dense agate]

sanctions stops them from accessing them ????

[feral river]

huh ?

[dense agate]

what do you think sanctions are ?

[feral river]

I didn't see we stopped accessing them

actually we literally just got everything we need

the only thing it worked in sanctions upon us is the freaking tiktok

and in recent years, our graphic cards and cpus have started massive production

even they didn't throw into the global/domestic market but they can produce it now

cuz its low performance compared to current products

[dense agate]

what ? maybe you're just not looking, but they placed sanctions on the export of advanced semiconductor chips and equipment to manufacture similar cutting edge chips to china, before it was only on Huawei

[feral river]

https://en.mthreads.com/

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/chinese-gpus-made-by-moore-threads-get-a-big-performance-boost-from-latest-driver

[dense agate]

yea why do you think that ? it's because they China is pomping into them since they are being cut off accessing the American made ones, but they are still behind the US

[feral river]

bro from we got cut off to the behind

[dense agate]

i don't think they have a groudn to compete on, or at least yet

[feral river]

I don't see your sanction is working lmao

[dense agate]

what do you expect from these sanctions to do ?

i feel like you think they're gonna break a country's economy into half

[feral river]

so why talking like they are working and hit hard on us ?

that was nothing to us dude

[dense agate]

just answer my point

what do you think sanctions are meant to do ?

[feral river]

idk how to answer this question because sanction can be used in various ways included not limited to put pressure on one state, strategic cut off or something

[thorny steeple]

Cripple economy and etc

[feral river]

but your sanction isn't working

sanctioned us, we breakthrough, that's what happened

[dense agate]

you can't state what are sanctions supposed to do but you can say they are not working

wow

[feral river]

it's you are talking in a sanctions way tell me what to do ?

wtf bro thought you invented the sanction

wtf

[thorny steeple]

Yea sure that was in the past

[dense agate]

wtf are you even saying ? you barking they don't work or have any effect, but what do they do idk

[feral river]

yeah they dont work that's what I said

[dense agate]

bruh they were invited to WTO

[feral river]

you invited us

don't regret that

or challenge our interest will see you on the ground or water

[thorny steeple]

True, sanctions haven't been used against China as far as I know

[feral river]

don't be silly about this

we are not China in the past

[dense agate]

jeez, these sanctions concerning semiconductors are aimed to hinder China's growth when it comes to advanced technologies that are reliant on high-end semiconductors (like AI) so any China based company that needs to do a lot of computing on such technologies would love access to them, would probably have to pay a high price for the remaining ones that are still circulating the market and start using the domestically produced ones that are not as good as the ones they used before

[magic olive]

Chikki is typing

[thorny steeple]

True since china's been growing so fast in the technology sector

[dense agate]

there are some sanctions from US and to a lower scale from EU,

[thorny steeple]

World trade organization?

[dense agate]

yep yep, that's how China took off

[thorny steeple]

Being poor after close of a century then becomes a powerhouse

[thorny steeple]

How effective are they?

[feral river]

yeah so the truth is we did breakthrough on technologies you sanctioned, we have our own AI model, software and company, and about the price of advance chips and processors and cards literally dropped around 30-50% in these years

[jade iris]

@thorny steeple
Okey so the name INDIA comes from the Indus River, and has been used in Greek since along time back It was used in Old English by the 9th century and in Modern English in the 17th century. ( Acc to what i have known by several sources) During British colonial rule, India became the official name for the subcontinent.
Whereas the word BHARAT
This name is mentioned in Constitution of India. It's a modern rendering of the historical name Bharatavarsha which originally referred to North India.
And the word HINDUSTAN comes from Middle Persian and became popular during the Mughal Empire. It was used to refer to the northern Indian subcontinent, or sometimes the entire subcontinent Today, it's used occasionally in informal and poetic contexts.
The Constitution of India recognizes both India and Bharat as official names, acknowledging the historical and cultural significance of both. The choice between the names depends on the context and language of communication

[dense agate]

i mean with all the cons that communism comes with, fast industrialization is one it's main pros, although don't mind the famines

[feral river]

what's wrong with it was not working ?

it is not working.

you think you can hinder the growth of our industry but we did breakthrough

ah huh

and chips becoming cheap not expensive

[feral river]

or you just see the price if you curious I can send you the screenshot and you will see our product 100% cheap than yours

[jade iris]

APPRECIATE MY EFFORTS DUHHHHH

[feral river]

make it affordable to everyone

[magic olive]

You turned on ur serious mode duh

[dense agate]

okay let me try to explain this again somehow even simpler, US sanctions are to slow Chinese growth on these technologies and hinder them from matching the US.
due to these sanctions China has started investing heavily in their own semiconductor industry which has been growing for the past years, but it is still no where close to the US.
can you see it now ?

[jade iris]

I did ||kinda||

[tulip drift]

What type of product do you sell ?

[thorny steeple]

Okey, how did Bharat made it's way to the Indian constitution

[jade iris]

Read it again

[lavish creek]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bixi

[thorny steeple]

You can't call china truly communist and you know that

[dense agate]

can you see that the goal of these specific sanctions is not the destroy chinese semiconductor industry and halt growth completely (which is not realistic even if it was the goal) but to simply hinder it

[dense agate]

i was talking about the heavy industrialization they were doing before liberalizing some areas

[thorny steeple]

To hinder it to the point of not bypassing the American industry

[thorny steeple]

Fully read

[feral river]

no idea on how we are not close to the US

you can't find another country besides us even closer to the US

Russia chips ?

[upbeat pawn]

Bharat made it's way to the Indian constitution through various ancients roots mentions in the vedas and other hindu scriptures and by the Indian leaders in the independence movement they used "bharat" to emphasize India's cultural and national indentity

[thorny steeple]

Yea thanks to the Soviet model

[thorny steeple]

What's the Vedas?

[dense agate]

well if there is any country to reach that level it would be China, hence why they are sanctioned, you can see it now nice

[feral river]

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/chinese-gpus-made-by-moore-threads-get-a-big-performance-boost-from-latest-driver

see this

[thorny steeple]

Thanks to it's geography

[feral river]

I already know that

[dense agate]

i used to check Chinese GPUs a while ago, they made good progress but they are still not a replacement

[thorny steeple]

Not as bad as Russia

[jade iris]

Cool if you still don't understand how bharat made its way to the indian constitution
So it was added to the Indian Constitution through an amendment to Article 1, moved by Dr. BR Ambedkar, the chairman of the drafting committee, in 1949. The amendment states "India, that is, Bharat shall be a Union of States"
Well from this i guess you're doubt is clear

[feral river]

for gaming purposes ? not so bad

[thorny steeple]

It is cleared.

[feral river]

maybe on some crucial high-computing usages scenario still need US chips

[magic olive]

Good job 👍

[thorny steeple]

They need tsmc

[upbeat pawn]

The ancient indian texts that's are considered the foundation of Hinduism nd the one of oldest sacred texts in the world they are the collections hymens, prayers and rituals and philosophical discussion

[magic olive]

My doubts are also cleared

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[thorny steeple]

Okey

[upbeat pawn]

Yepp

[dense agate]

yea even for that, but if you're outside of China (have access to other GPUs) there are better options when it comes to cost per performance

[jade iris]

Me in serious chat is the biggest doubt

[magic olive]

Lmfao

[thorny steeple]

Very much

[feral river]

well in China not all american chips are banned but only some high-computing chips contained products for instance the RTX 4090

[thorny steeple]

That stills stumps China

[feral river]

but nvidia still released RTX 4090D for Chinese user to ingratiate the american export regulations

and other products, like 4080 series, 70 series are not limited

[dense agate]

oh yea i saw about that one, they made a slower version of the 4090 to sell in china while complying with sanctions

[upbeat pawn]

Can someone suggests me some good intrsting graduation courses after 12th ? Bcz I'm cooked

[feral river]

but I don't care that now I'm in South Korea if I need a 4090 I just buy one and go back lol

[dense agate]

yea it makes sense to be loose on these mostly civilian used GPUs, but the high tech industry when the real game is

[dense agate]

maybe time to start a smuggling business, i read one some group was buying GPUs from vietnam and taking them to China

[thorny steeple]

They love to bypass the regulations

[thorny steeple]

Like in supercomputers AI

Etc

[feral river]

you can still get the normal version of 4090 but a little bit pricey compared to 4090D

[feral river]

see this

[thorny steeple]

do you hate refugee

[thorny steeple]

AliExpress?

[crystal bough]

China fakes Everything

[feral river]

taobao.com

Yeah it belongs to alibaba

[thorny steeple]

Chinese eBay

[feral river]

No but don’t come here

Or they wanna learn how machine guns is going to work ?

[dense agate]

don't trust Nvidia's labeling, they give same names to gpus that have many differences in all the world not just China

[dense agate]

this is like 2k$ i think, not that pricy from other makets

[thorny steeple]

Why so hostile against refugees

[feral river]

Just different proxies producing their chips made slight difference among them

We got a lot of proxy company’s producing Nvidia cards and all of them have differences between them

We even got a lot of people to test their performance

[dense agate]

no no, im talking about Nvidia creating different variants of same chip which causes different perfromance and still giving them the exact name

[feral river]

Well that was I never heard about

Maybe yeah

[thorny steeple]

God damn that's not good is it

[thorny steeple]

but that begins with your government because it creates many problems in the world

[dense agate]

yea they've been doing it recently again with RTX 4070, releasing them with different memory type and memory bandwidth speed, they do be scumy

[thorny steeple]

It needs to be abolished

To a democratic one

[dense agate]

lel we do be talking about what matters indeed

[thorny steeple]

Either being good or bad

[turbid harbor]

but yall do yall, have fun guys

[thorny steeple]

Well it's the rules, always abiding to them

[feral river]

This is funny fr

Even Israeli rather have trump than communist

[prisma cipher]

It's funny because Israel doesn't vote in us

[dense agate]

yea this is the right stand

[dense agate]

Trump has always been good for Israel, but Harris ain't communist tho

[thorny steeple]

That's true

[mental peak]

https://us9.list-manage.com/survey?u=179990c4eca162f731535d352&id=0e8879e748&attribution=false

Hi, being serious here. I need to collect at least 20 responses for this survey in order to proceed at my university assignment. It won't take more than a minute.

[main bison]

Trump is peace keeper

he said if harris win israel would not exsit within 2 years
No wonder why they want Trump

i would also vote for Uncle Trump

[thorny steeple]

Why Hitler lost world war 2

[main bison]

dont remind me

https://tenor.com/view/cat-cats-cat-meme-cat-orange-cat-white-gif-350540403598945603

If he could just bring back the armies who were fighting in africa maybe it could go in a different way

I wouldnt countuie the war after invading poland at least for a few years for recovery

[mental peak]

harris says tupac is best black rapper alive

[prisma cipher]

Because fighting to many countries at the same time

[feral river]

idc he wants peace but he knows how to benefit americans at most

harris is just a liberal progressive don't really care their citizens

and the interest of american nation/state

my trump baby knows how to do business

[main bison]

Harris is a Marxist

[feral river]

I fall in love with my trump baby

[turbid harbor]

of course the guy with 2024 maga in his user would believe harris is a marxist without a shred of irony

[main bison]

the most handsome president of century

god bless him

GOD BLESS US

[manic juniper]

She's a Marxist-Bidenist

[lavish creek]

What is that

[manic juniper]

A joke

[lavish creek]

No no no you should be deadly serious .

So explain.

See marxist love dead men (Lenin, Mao, Kim, all those guys are still In mausoleums)

[manic juniper]

That's just Marxist-Leninists and Maoists

[lavish creek]

So maybe that's Marxism-Bidenism

[manic juniper]

99% of people that love those are one of these two

[lavish creek]

We need Biden in mausoleum

[manic juniper]

There are normal Marxists too like Slavoj Zizek that don't worship people with moustaches or funny haircuts

[lavish creek]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marxism–Leninism–Maoism

• Bidenism

[lavish creek]

"normal"
Zizek

U must be joking

[manic juniper]

I said that he's a normal Marxist, not that he's normal himself

But relatively to those people he's still normal, most of them believe that Stalin was playing 5D chess with nazi Germany

[lavish creek]

You know the story about operation bagration and offence to east Prussia ?

[feral river]

what the heck is Marxism-Leninism-Maoism ?

[lavish creek]

Boi was a bad student

[feral river]

i know about Maoism, Leninism, Marxism, Marxism-Leninism

But it’s the first time I see there’s a Marxism-Leninism-Maoism

[lavish creek]

It was Marxism-Leninism-Stalinism in the USSR during Stalin's rule

Just an average cult of person thing

Marx actually was a kinda really smart guy actually so everyone of those "thinkers" cling to his legacy

[manic juniper]

No it's different

[lavish creek]

I know

[lavish creek]

That's the point

There are huge Soviets books where all those three guys are together

It was a mandatory subject in Soviet unies

[grand jolt]

what are the odds of starting a successful business / startup?

my friends are about to run one

it got me thinking if I could do the same

cuz yk we gotta think of it as if we could fuck the system and not to be fucked by it

[manic juniper]

Are they playing poker

[lavish creek]

No why are you asking lol

[main bison]

Do u like ur government ?

[manic juniper]

Why are they together then, what do they do there

[manic juniper]

I do not

[main bison]

Even the happiest nation on earth dont like their government ?
Dang

btw how cold is it in finland? was it any hot this summer?

[manic juniper]

It's warm, about 22 C even in the North

[manic juniper]

Most people liked the previous government, they like centre-left/left governments and social democracy

[main bison]

then why did they vote for this

[manic juniper]

This one is still a social democracy but it's centrist or centre-right, I think it's incompetent and I don't like this system

[manic juniper]

Their popularity decreased after 2020 and they wanted to experiment new things

The previous government has been in power since 1980 if not earlier

[main bison]

when is the next election

[manic juniper]

2027

[main bison]

huh
I hope finland gets free

[manic juniper]

Our president and our prime minister almost look like they're brothers

[manic juniper]

The president looks like the more thin version of the prime minister

And they say all East Asians look the same

[main bison]

i heard in finland Women r more in politics than other countries

[manic juniper]

I think that's Iceland where they have a mandatory 50% of women in politics, here there isn't such rule but many participate yes

[thorny steeple]

Considering that Finland is, in comparison to the USA, a glorified village-city, it is no surprise that her inhabitants are more interested with political matters.

[main bison]

I searched prime minster and president of finland
Prime minster is a woman and president is a ugly old man they do not look similar at all

[manic juniper]

Our prime minister is a man, he is Petteri Orpo

Google could be showing you the wrong results

Wtf I googled it, it's showing Sanna Marin. Why

[manic juniper]

This is them

[thorny steeple]

Maybe one will find both? Mine shows both, at least, due solely for recency's sake - Petteri Orpo (as the currrent) and Sanna Marin (as the previous).

[manic juniper]

People care about politics less than they do in USA, unless it's social welfare, in that case many younger people care

[thorny steeple]

A complete inversion of how it is down here in Eastern Europe, then. I'm surprised.

The youth here have surrendered any notions of change and simply moved abroad, as their needs are addressed more immediately in places like Germany.

[manic juniper]

As a matter of fact people cared so little that one of our parties stayed in power for over 40 years and it's not the first time this happens

[thorny steeple]

I'm not surprised. In small countries like ours, political dynasties maintain power for much longer.

The Americans had political dynasties vying for power for some decades on end as well, last I remember. This current election is the first in a handful of decades without one of them on the ticket.

[main bison]

they dont look similar

[manic juniper]

Not even like brothers?

[manic juniper]

Where is that

[main bison]

no?

[manic juniper]

I guess it's just me

[thorny steeple]

Eastern Europe.

[main bison]

they have different colours of hair ans skin

[main bison]

Do u call finland's people finish?

[thorny steeple]

I could see them being brothers. Wouldn't be surprised, at least.

[manic juniper]

I mean the faces more than those

[manic juniper]

Finnish

[manic juniper]

No specific country? Moldova?

[main bison]

their fave shape is different

[main bison]

r finnish girls blonde?

[manic juniper]

About 80% of them

[main bison]

i want a blonde girlfriend

[manic juniper]

You could get one here if you treat them well and go to sauna with them

[thorny steeple]

It's not something specific to a nation. Unless that nation isn't in the EU, all of us have been moving to Germany, working, then returning for the past few decades.

[main bison]

why sauna

[manic juniper]

I was more asking about your country since I was curious

[thorny steeple]

Ah. I'm from Greece.

[manic juniper]

Most people enjoy going to sauna at least once a week or more

[manic juniper]

Did you move to Germany or do you still live there?

[main bison]

Im gonna build a home sauna so

[manic juniper]

Also yes I get the feeling, my mum's family was from Eastern Europe and most of them moved elsewhere, be it because of war or better economic opportunities

[main bison]

I love kos island

[manic juniper]

That's great, I have one

[thorny steeple]

For me, neither. I currently work in Greece (albeit, online). Teacher and all. My family here moved to Germany for work and most of them stayed behind.

[main bison]

studies say swedish girls r the most beautiful ones wat do u think?

[thorny steeple]

The islands are okay.

Not very fun if you're a local, worrisome in winter.

[main bison]

is greece in EU?

[manic juniper]

I don't know, beauty could be subjective, I believe they are beautiful but I prefer Estonians and Romanians

[manic juniper]

Yes

[thorny steeple]

Yes. We were practically forced to remain after Tsipras held that vote to leave the Zone.

[main bison]

hmm
How about men?

[manic juniper]

Was this after the mess with the Greek economic debt?

[main bison]

so u have no problem moving to germany

[thorny steeple]

Regarding our debt, we've always been in a bit of a mess, lol. From founding to modernity.

[manic juniper]

Estonians are good too, and Ukrainians. I think it depends on your tastes

[thorny steeple]

It's not difficult to move, just annoying and costly. I've no interest to uproot my life to live somewhere else.

[main bison]

have u played ac odyssey?

[thorny steeple]

What is that?

[manic juniper]

A game set in Greece

[main bison]

a game

[thorny steeple]

No.

[manic juniper]

Does Greece have few opportunities or is it more a matter of low salaries?

[main bison]

so all estonians r beautiful

[manic juniper]

Yes maybe the women slightly more to me, but I've met few that I didn't like

[thorny steeple]

But, yes, this was back in ~2015. The reason we stayed was mostly because we were "politely told" to remain, else the EU would practically collapse overnight.

[main bison]

i searched
Its like they still wear their traditional cloths

but its not their the prettiest

[thorny steeple]

Both. If one doesn't live in Athens, then he is fine, but most of the country is stuck there. Minimum wage, ~930 euro per month, is pretty good in places like Western Macedonia/Epirus, but not in the city centres of Salonica or anywhere in Athens.

It's funny. Our poorest places generate the most goods.

[main bison]

arent u gonna make more money in germany?

[thorny steeple]

If I did, likely. I'd make even more if I left for Canton.

[main bison]

and u already said all of ur family livs in germany So its must not be a big deal

[thorny steeple]

You would be surprised what estranged relations do to a family.

[ruby mauve]

i wanna debat

[thorny steeple]

Aside from needing to uproot my life, and others, here, it's simply not worth it.

[thorny steeple]

About..?

[main bison]

i think it does

[manic juniper]

Average Estonians

They seem polite

[main bison]

all slavic people r like this

[manic juniper]

They're Finnic like us

[main bison]

i cant tell the difference

[manic juniper]

Well all 3 of us live close together, so many look similar

Our closest Slavs are Russians

[main bison]

the girl is cute
However she aint blonde

[manic juniper]

She dyed her hair black

I don't think many ethnic Estonians have natural black hair or at all

[main bison]

bruh
Black hair girls dye their hair blonde
Why no one is pleased with their hair?

[thorny steeple]

Many like to rebel their local norms.

[manic juniper]

I think people are bored of things that are commonplace

In my country too many blondes dye their hair in different colours, I did too when I was little

But I realised that I look horrible without my natural hair

[main bison]

owo cry

it doesnt work

[main bison]

why did u add those weird animals to ur photo
I think they have gone extinct

[manic juniper]

They're still alive, they are there

[main bison]

its obvious u photoshopped it

[manic juniper]

Yes but I did the opposite, the background is fake too so I photoshopped myself instead

[main bison]

i doubt those animal exist

[manic juniper]

A long time ago

[feral river]

what is animals ?

[smoky pagoda]

Oi wth you guyz talking about

[feral river]

source to produce a hot pot ?

[smoky pagoda]

@torpid edge

[feral river]

named dog ?

[main bison]

a living being

[torpid edge]

As yall should!!! ☺️

[main bison]

i hate kpop

[feral river]

do u like eat animals

[torpid edge]

Oh 😅😅

[main bison]

Only 4 species

[main bison]

which britain country r u from?

[feral river]

dog, cat, donkey, and ?

[main bison]

Nooo

[torpid edge]

Huh? 🤨

[main bison]

which British country are you from?

[torpid edge]

Im not British tho 😅

[main bison]

So where r u from?
You've got native role

[smoky pagoda]

Noice

[smoky pagoda]

She's from America

So what exactly @torpid edge are they talking about

And how your presence made the yapping stopped

[torpid edge]

Stop I didn’t mean to make the chat dead 😭😭

[smoky pagoda]

Well it did died Mey

[main bison]

America once was a British territory

[main bison]

Why r u so shy?
Dont be shy

[smoky pagoda]

Hahaha

[smoky pagoda]

@torpid edge the reason I told you not to come here

They also tryna put some bs anyway

[main bison]

bs?

[smoky pagoda]

Bullshit

[main bison]

do u mean me?

[smoky pagoda]

Sure if you think that

[shy summit]

Immigration even illegal immigration is a net benefit to the American society. This is something dumbass Trump supporters never get

[main bison]

i dont think that

[smoky pagoda]

Then you're not.

[main bison]

im happy i have blocked the upper message

[main bison]

people now supporting illgal immgrations wtf

[smoky pagoda]

@torpid edge is stalking the chat

Lol

[shy summit]

Its not a matter of supporting them

Its a matter of making legal immigration a less annoying and difficult process

[torpid edge]

Yes ☺️

[torpid edge]

Okayyyyy!!!

[main bison]

Whats ur name bts fan?

[dapper laurel]

Even illegal immigration?

[shy summit]

Even that

[dapper laurel]

The world is over

[main bison]

He's himself probably an illegal immigrant

[smoky pagoda]

Lol I knew it

[dense agate]

alien entities who work and fill low skilled labor at no cost on welfare, pretty explanatory

[dapper laurel]

Oh man

[dapper laurel]

What about crime rates and social cohesion?

[dense agate]

but ofc there are other variables that matter too so there will be cases where it can cause some problems

[torpid edge]

It’s mey ☺️ wbyyy!

[torpid edge]

Yeah 😭😭

[shy summit]

Try me.

[dense agate]

aka like if you have a country which is already not building enough houses to match it's population growth and then intake large amounts of immigrants (whether legals or illegals) you cna expect housing prices to go high

[dapper laurel]

Well, that's not our problem, so I think we'll close the borders forever

[main bison]

hi mey mine is Reza

[dapper laurel]

🤨

[torpid edge]

That’s a cute nameee!!!

[dense agate]

when it comes to immigration and crimes it's not that clear from the get go, for example in the context of USA there are many studies that debunk the myth of immigrants = more crimes, but there are cases like Sweden where yes immigrants of non-eu origins tend to be present more in certain crimes but this is strongly linked to socioeconomics

[smoky pagoda]

For first time in history I saw peace in this chat

💀

[dense agate]

huh ? the housing crisis or what ? what are you saying

[torpid edge]

It seems chill tho 😭😭

[smoky pagoda]

Right now it's

[smoky pagoda]

Sometimes there is just pure chaos

[torpid edge]

I wanna see that!!!

[smoky pagoda]

Believe me you don't

[main bison]

dumbass harris supporters dont understand

[thorny steeple]

Immigration into most nations has generally been more rule-abiding than smuggling, in recent times. Whether or not this is considered a "net positive" economically isn't a good perspective. Permits and visas must be renewed, that is the agreement upon entry.

[torpid edge]

Aw man 🥲

[dense agate]

you got trump's pp off your mouth to just say this ? put it back in lil bro

[smoky pagoda]

If you really do wait lemme show you that in vc of religion and politics

[smoky pagoda]

I'mma ping you come there

[torpid edge]

There’s a vc of that? Also I can’t I’m in class 🥲

[main bison]

Wat

[dapper laurel]

If you go and compare in quantitative models, you will realize that it is not even just a problem of Sweden, but also of France, Germany, Netherlands, Belgium, UK, Norway and Italy. Very often the myth of low-cost productivity by illegal immigrants is not true, in fact the state does not gain from their work, they work illegally and receive black money

[smoky pagoda]

Study close your phone

[thorny steeple]

Economically, it is viable, I suppose. Slavery is a good alternative to paying workers, and threatening them with deportation is the ideal, capitalist approach to a disgruntled worker.

[dapper laurel]

In Italy apartments are very expensive, but the population is decreasing, the demand will decrease over time

[torpid edge]

WAITTTT NO IM GOOD 😭

[uncut mist]

Hi

[thorny steeple]

Everyone makes black money. Even the public workers...

[smoky pagoda]

Study bruh

[main bison]

afzal hi

[feral river]

I agree with that they really contributed a lot to your economy even it's illegal

[main bison]

thank god i dont like crowded cities

[dapper laurel]

So? Immigrants do it much more likely because they have poor economic conditions and cannot give money to the state. On the contrary, it is the state that gives them money sometimes

[feral river]

all of your cheap labor that produce a lot of cheap stuff in america are from their effort

[thorny steeple]

This is Greek humour, there is practically no difference between the immigrant and native, we all abuse the government in this way.

[feral river]

I won't surprised the price of your product will rise 10-20% if they deported those immigrants

[torpid edge]

But like I wanna talk 🥲🥲

[dapper laurel]

In civilized countries this typically does not happen

[thorny steeple]

You would be surprised. Distrust of a government leads a people to do many an "uncivilised" thing.

Barbaric, even...

[dense agate]

you have some points that are right here, this pattern repeats albeit at different intensity in other countries in EU, but the last part that they mostly work illegally is true only for countries like Spain and Italy where a large part of the illegal immigrants who reach those states end up working illegally and in terrible slave-like conditions, especially in south Italy and south Spain.
in this case they do not contribute to any welfare system (some of them might be getting some welfare checks so they're a net negative) but they are still beneficial to the farms and their owners since they work for low salaries in labor intensive jobs that Italians/Spaniards aren't interested in

[thorny steeple]

Ordinarily, these immigrants are either imprisoned or documented.

The slave-like conditions, at least, are just standard, low wages and practically no rights therefrom, as the employers have no desire to care and they've no means to enforce them. There is an interest, certainly, but moving to Germany or Northern Europe for quicker, easier & more secure present and future is a common trend here.

[dapper laurel]

Brother, undeclared work is not just working in the fields, what you just described can happen in all European countries, in restaurants, on construction sites etc, it is not just our problem. Anyway, at least here there are benefits for these "disadvantaged" people, I don't know how it works in Spain

[dense agate]

there is a similar debate about this in the States where some expect the high cost of housing might be improved when some of the elderly starts passing away, but that's unlikely to happen since in countries in North America, EU and China where real estate is seen as an investment

[feral river]

not really bro

[thorny steeple]

Undeclared work is the norm, at least here in Greece. The recent laws passed are to "legalise" it so the government has a way to tax the black income.

[feral river]

do you know how much APY in rent you could got from a normal 200k worth house

in US, it's 10%, in China it's 2.4%

which means in the US you earn 20k per year from this house by rent, but in China only 4.2k, (in USD)

even if you get a mortgage the interest will definitely above the 2.4%

[dapper laurel]

There are ghost villages here where the houses are not owned by anyone. Also it makes no sense to rent many houses to a few people, this would only reduce the cost of the houses themselves

[thorny steeple]

That's pretty nice. A good half of the annual salary just from rent.

[feral river]

in US that probably will be 4%-6%

[feral river]

nice as hell dude you know 2.4% is just like

that was insane which means you can't even start your business with that

that was so fucked

if you get a house you need to wait 50 years to get any profit

[dapper laurel]

It has nothing to do with not trusting the government, it's about a sense of community and respect for others

[feral river]

in america you only need wait 10 years to get any profit and start your real estate business with average 4-5% apy

in China you can't even do that

[thorny steeple]

Oh, ours is entirely from distrusting the government. Thanks be to the Ottomans, "Kings", Junta...

[dense agate]

i've already said it's in other EU countries in different quantities ofc, but there do provide the cheap labor, so the benefit comes more from the businesses that are hiring them rather than the individual worker.
EU's bigger problem is attracting high skill labor, and Italy is one of the most affected by this.

[thorny steeple]

Add in low wages, absolutely nobody is paying taxes. We just pay the people we know. LOL

[dense agate]

in China people do invest their money in housing, im not debating this

[thorny steeple]

I'm still surprised that it grants a profit. There aren't a lot of us with land, so the ones that do usually sit on it.

[dapper laurel]

Italy has no interest in attracting any type of immigration

[thorny steeple]

Or, in some other cases I know, the owner just uses the income generated from the rent and pays his rent with it, kek.

[feral river]

only few rich people and bureaucract

for me my family own 4 houses now we still can't start a real estate business

[dense agate]

Italy joined the EU blue card program. Italy launched the "Italian start-up Visa" in 2014 aimed at non-EU countries.
Flat tax incentive to get high skill labor to reside in Italy.
and so on

[dense agate]

but apparently it has no interests in doing so because you say so, plus when you make your country more attractive to high skill labour you tend to also convince your own 'home-made' italian high skill labor to stay rather than go to germany

[dapper laurel]

Search only for the electoral program of the party in office 🤷🏼

[dense agate]

aren't families pouring their savings into it as well ?

[dense agate]

Italy as a state with it's own interests didn't just start with the new party

[feral river]

you should research some information of real estate apy in China for normal family

[dapper laurel]

Literally our prime minister is a Mussolini supporter