Polls 5.0

[urban quiver]

Wow ok you guys seem to like the eastern veil

[hybrid echo]

what software is this from

[urban quiver]

SkySafari Pro

I’m on my phone so I can’t get the fancy Stellarium pov

[rain void]

Heresy

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/975845011260309587/1390688240545300591/CygnusMyBeloved.gif

[urban quiver]

The veil is in Cygnus tho?

[rain void]

But it doesn't feel like it is

In my mind the "real" Cygnus is only the bright connected nebulosity and not veil hangin out by itself lmao

[delicate lance]

What a twist.

[zealous cloak]

i love how marc voted with his alt too

[cold moon]

The fact the RC lost is enough to make me leave the server.

[rain void]

And by only 1 vote

Makes me happy to have voted for the noot

[glacial bear]

https://tenor.com/view/pingu-noot-intensifies-penguin-gif-12659856

[delicate lance]

RCs are not that good gang

[delicate lance]

theyre good but not that good

[brisk copper]

they look so sexy tho

[mint talon]

tea do not the telescope

[brisk copper]

awh, okie :<

[mint talon]

i mean, its probably possible

[brisk copper]

hai steve :3

[glacial bear]

I mean, from what I see it's like packing the focal length that an SCT allows, but while still using the principles of a Newt. I can see the benefits. 🤷

[brisk copper]

and its got a better f ratio

sct f10

[ivory mural]

I just like that they're sharp

[brisk copper]

rc f9 or 8

[brisk copper]

they are very sharp

[ivory mural]

sadly is not the best choice for me

i have ass seeing and very very few clear skies

and rc6s are very slow

[brisk copper]

yaa

dont forget that they act like a sail bc of how fat they are

[ivory mural]

i don't trust my eqm35 with an rc8

[brisk copper]

yea no, that would be a bad idea

😭

im probably going to get an eq5 for my newt

[ivory mural]

eqm35 can handle like

8" carbon newt at most

[brisk copper]

okay

[ivory mural]

if it's windless

and very good guiding

[brisk copper]

is it better guiding that the eq5?

[ivory mural]

eqm35 is eq3 and eq5 hybrid

[brisk copper]

oo

oker

[ivory mural]

Dec axis of the eq3 and ra of the eq5

[brisk copper]

that seems kinda cursed 😭

[ivory mural]

(get the eq5 i hate my dec axis)

I only got it bc am not european

[brisk copper]

okie

[ivory mural]

Astroshop was the only place i saw selling eq5s and shipping costs are insane from there

[brisk copper]

ooooof

[cold moon]

But the second implies the first

[static sapphire]

I see that Polls 5.0 won’t make it much longer

[delicate lance]

its bobs fault

why not banish him from these sacred grounds

[late summit]

Won't be the only thing that won't last much longer

wink wink #💬-general-chat

that sounds like i'm asking general to be purged, but i'm just saying someone's trying to defend being on their phone while driving

[swift heart]

That is part of the reason I shot M24 for the competition

[swift heart]

now this is actually invalid

[delicate lance]

RCs are good but not that good cuh

[swift heart]

now that is actually invalid

RCs are glorious

[delicate lance]

youre telling me RCs are so star sparkling awesome that if people prefer newtonians over it that you would leave the server

im going to make this valid or invalid poll series extremely big

every time i see something controversial i will post one

[cold moon]

Just to be sure, invalid here means that I think they are good and underrated?

[cerulean elm]

As a proud newtonian user, i prefer the RC cult

[delicate lance]

Invalid means that the statement was false, and that in any way.

[cold moon]

As a proud SCT user I prefer the RC cult too

[zealous cloak]

RCs are factually better

Than other reflectors i mean

[cold moon]

You mispelled "everything"

[cerulean elm]

That renders Hubble and JWST bad and overhyped?

[swift heart]

JWST is a Korsch telescope (three-mirror anastigmat)

[delicate lance]

not disagreeing that theyre factually better

i just think theyre way to overhyped

[elfin mauve]

Newts are best imo

[delicate lance]

theyre good yes but theyre not THAT good that you would start a civil war

[cerulean elm]

Never!

[zealous cloak]

Well, that's your opinion

Optics say RCs are superior

[cerulean elm]

Actually they are underrated. How many people here use an RC?

[delicate lance]

no theyre just shitting expensive

[elfin mauve]

RCs are slow

[delicate lance]

you telling me jwst is underrated since theres only one!?

[swift heart]

I wouldn't start a civil war. An interplanetary or galactic war, sure, but a civil war? Nah

[cerulean elm]

Because they are goood

[swift heart]

So just one of us?

[cerulean elm]

Vel and Kit-Kat

[swift heart]

In this discussion at least

Here's my big thing

[cerulean elm]

[swift heart]

With an RC you get coma-free imaging without any refractive elements, so the near IR and UV are easily accessible with a mono sensor

And that lets you stitch mosaics much more easily

[elfin mauve]

RCs are slow, that’s their weakness

[cerulean elm]

A lot faster than a Mak

[elfin mauve]

Still slower than a snail

[delicate lance]

theres mak newtons, theres schmidt newtons

WHEN RC NEWTONS!?!?

[swift heart]

I'm not sure if that's a huge disadvantage tbh...I was worried about how long it might take to get good data on various targets, but it's really not excessively long

I do wish I could get a mono sensor with slightly bigger pixels though

A slow telescope is fine if your pixels are large enough

It's all about étendue

[cerulean elm]

technically a bit of both. you mount the camera along the ALT axis

[delicate lance]

the QHY990 has 5um pixels

[zealous cloak]

@ornate glen How fast was your RC?

[swift heart]

@zealous cloak I have an 8" RC as well and I shoot at its native f/8

[cerulean elm]

Keep this secret. Binning🤫

[swift heart]

He shoots with a 0.65 reducer

[zealous cloak]

Vel has it at 4. something iirc

[swift heart]

5.2 I think

[delicate lance]

and its QE is ABSOLUTE PEAK

[swift heart]

W. H. A. T.

[delicate lance]

It only costs 14.000 USD

or was it 24

idk i dont remember

[swift heart]

Makes sense lmao

I want an SWIR cam someday

[delicate lance]

ill email touptek rn about their SWIR331

[swift heart]

135 electron read noise??

Okay so maybe I won't use one for V-band imaging lmao

But a dedicated SWIR cam would be cool

[delicate lance]

it captures a LOT of light dud

and it captures a LOOOOTTTT of thermal noise

[swift heart]

I've heard that dedicated SWIR cams with no visible coverage are cheaper

[delicate lance]

Toupteks SWIR331 has 900nm to 1700nm

and 6 um pixels

[cerulean elm]

Did anyone considered the coating on the mirrors might have an impact at those long wavelengths?

[swift heart]

I want a larger sensor too. Basically an IMX533 scaled up, still 3008×3008 but with a 20 mm diagonal or something

[delicate lance]

Theyre fine until 2.3 microns

[delicate lance]

you could probably bin the imx411 to that

[swift heart]

wait that's a medium format camera

[delicate lance]

the imx411 is FF

[swift heart]

I could not make use of the whole sensor lol

[delicate lance]

why not

its only 150mp

youll manage

[swift heart]

Ohhh oops QHY lists it with the IMX461

[swift heart]

Are there any other interesting Starvis II sensors besides the IMX585

[late summit]

How come? If this is true I want a RC instead of a big newt

[swift heart]

Zero coma

[delicate lance]

678

[delicate lance]

Trading Coma for Astigmatism

[swift heart]

Minimal distortion of star positions (ideal for mosaics) since RCs were designed with astrometry in mind

[delicate lance]

the astigmatism isnt as noticeable tho

also yall are going off topic dont let thomas catch your ass

[sudden locust]

Slow.

[zealous cloak]

2 hyperbolic mirrors are usually gonna be better than any other mirrors

[late summit]

Very neat, time to look into RCs then

[ornate glen]

F/5.12

[late summit]

If we even had half the number of DSO targets for planetary, we would be dead

plus, deep sky is more interesting imo

planetary is very cool, but not "there's a supernova happening in X galaxy right now" cool

[delicate lance]

tru

[sudden locust]

F/2.

[delicate lance]

im honestly interested in the general opinion of these takes

[hybrid echo]

technically
it does
theyre just really far away

[marble hearth]

valid poll

[young quail]

I think you misspelled I think you mean reflector 👀😅

[cold moon]

https://tenor.com/view/mods-low-tier-god-ltg-gif-4022085103641635431

[delicate lance]

That’s a funky way of spelling reflector

[static sapphire]

Yes, it’s a triplet

[brisk copper]

btw ther is astigmatism but its not bad at all

(jus a lil disclaimer)

[glacial bear]

Define "distracted."

Either one should result in at minimum 3-5 yr loss of license, $5K fine, requirement to re-take driver's ed and take advance driving courses before earning the license back.

[late summit]

It was a dig at someone in general chat defending being on your phone while driving, rather than a legitimate question

but I agree with what you said

[glacial bear]

I went hands-free phone before my state passed a law requiring it. And I understand now the Mythbusters test that they did with someone on the phone having a conversation that required thought, while driving - vs driving drunk. Heck even a passenger can be a distraction

[swift heart]

How strong is He-II compared to S-II on average?

[static sapphire]

Especially when they give bad directions

[brisk copper]

or do backseat driving and complaining about the drivers decisions

[delicate lance]

Depends solely on the target. He-II is mainly found in very hot shock zones AND makes very pretty hot stars

He-II could be as strong but also below 1%

However He-II is mainly strong in planetary nebulae, so comparing it to S-II isn’t that simple

[rain void]

Circular cameras and cable guides have circular diffraction patterns, so no different than a secondary mirror or the edge of the scope

The diffraction pattern is probably the last reason to hate on the RASA, because you get to choose whether you want spikes or not

And it's super easy to manage

[marble hearth]

Just use a wireless camera

[delicate lance]

the statements i put on these arent once I automatically agree with

[rain void]

I mostly just meant the people who voted valid or semi valid

[delicate lance]

finally a clear-ish take

[late summit]

I mean, if the Asiair was as open and compatible as NINA, it'd literally just be NINA but by zwo

could easily replace nina if you wanted it to in that case

[cerulean elm]

Mele plus NINA = What ZWO believed that the ASI air would become😂

[late summit]

yeah

if their shit wasn't so locked down, it'd be a half decent option

[cerulean elm]

Let's hope Touptek fixes the stellavita

[late summit]

Now with Cygnus App I'm kind of hoping that what Asiair was meant to be actually happens

Still has a long way to go though

[cerulean elm]

Personally, I don't like to use my phone to control the telescope.

[late summit]

For me it'll be on an iPad, I don't like using the phone for this either

[cerulean elm]

I don't have a tablet. But I have a crappy notebook that I use😂

[delicate lance]

you can probably use bluestax to use it on a laptop but wirelessly with a good connection

no more sitting out in the dark

[cerulean elm]

I don't sit out in the dark. My miniPC has its own hotspot when I'm in the middle of nowhere, and it connects to my home network when it detects it

[delicate lance]

AHAHAHHA

NO WAY REFLECTOR STILL WON

[static sapphire]

this was rigged, 100% fake news fraud

[rain void]

From this result I can only infer that people do not think RC's are good

[ivory mural]

idk man, 5 votes vs 13 votes

[static sapphire]

https://tenor.com/view/schade-gif-13502113816779142580

[marble hearth]

Very helpful.

[ivory mural]

they're only a self automated machine if you let it be

just like any other rig they need a bit of effort to get it's full potential

[hybrid echo]

i think thats true but they make it intentionally so you want to
you dont have to make as many choices, and they dont want you to make choices

[delicate lance]

evil flipping company

[desert obsidian]

Just ask any dealer in north america

[zealous cloak]

[ivory mural]

only at very low budgets

where $900 isn't an option

[zealous cloak]

https://tenor.com/view/does-he-know-gif-17552966235424643644

[late summit]

I don't think it's overhyped, considering people just accurately depict how much better mono is over osc

[supple wraith]

If you’re a morning person in the hobby you need to find a better hobby.

[late summit]

Or you just have an automated mount that doesn't require you to be awake

Jobs exist

[supple wraith]

That’s true, I’ve just accepted the reality of sleep deprivation.

[glacial bear]

12:00 midnight starts the morning, I don't see the problem.

[violet dagger]

2 hours vs 1 hour

[supple wraith]

That would mean people waking up at 12 would be going to bed at 4-6pm it’s not feasible.

[violet dagger]

osc is still a good option if you are on budget or you just dont wanna go through the pain of shooting with different filters to get color (or both)

[late summit]

electronic filter wheel enters the chat

[urban quiver]

looks like different scopes, so I mean it isn’t really a fair comparison

[violet dagger]

bro its literally the same rig

the only difference is that the second pic was taken with a cooled mono cam

same sensor

[late summit]

A while ago he said that it's not a fair comparison unless it's the same sensor on the same rig with the exact same conditions unless you're swapping out the cameras on the same night it probably won't be a fair comparison for him ever

[urban quiver]

Looks cropped then

[violet dagger]

maybe because it is

[urban quiver]

Yea how are you gonna compare mono vs ocs if it’s not the same sensor, telescope, conditions, moon, etc

[violet dagger]

both of the pictures are cropped

[urban quiver]

You can’t have an equal comparison if anything is different

[late summit]

But you've already seen mono vs osc taken on the same setup with the same sensor, you just said "if it wasn't the same moon phase and conditions then it's not fair"

[urban quiver]

Yea exactly

Because the moon phase is important

[late summit]

Yes, and most people don't really image during a full moon

[violet dagger]

cooling makes a massive difference tbh

-20c vs 31c

[urban quiver]

big difference

[urban quiver]

What camera do you have

Brand

[violet dagger]

uranus m pro

player one

[urban quiver]

Do all player one cameras cool to -20

I think my asi533 can’t go past -10

[late summit]

ZWO issue

my qhy easily goes 40 below ambient

[violet dagger]

forgot to mention that thats not my comparison

[late summit]

Zwo has really bad coolers

[urban quiver]

Considering what I paid for my asi533, it’s ok

[violet dagger]

tyking made that comparison

[late summit]

and this is at 50% cooler power

[violet dagger]

tykingm27

[urban quiver]

-40 seems a bit much tbh

I can’t imagine it is a big difference from -20

[hybrid echo]

nah mfs lie about how “ThE gReEn PiXeLs DoNt Do AnYtHiNg”

[late summit]

40 below ambient

so if ambient is 20c, it's -20c

[violet dagger]

yeah

below AMBIENT

[urban quiver]

Yea I said -40?

I’m confused now

[late summit]

saying -40 doesn't signify anything because it heavily depends on the ambient temperature

[violet dagger]

if the ambient temp would be 30c then that would mean its at -10

[late summit]

^

[hybrid echo]

ambient isnt zero degrees

[urban quiver]

Yes I know

[late summit]

Every 5 or 10c, the dark current noise halves in the 585 for example

so -5c and -20c is a decent difference

[urban quiver]

Interesting

[late summit]

Nebula Photos even got his minicam8 to cool to -50c, which is pretty nuts

[violet dagger]

my player one cam for example was able to cool down to -15 while it was sitting in my room

[late summit]

right now my 585 is cooling to -20c while my ambient temp is 23c

[violet dagger]

usually the sensor temp in my room is at around like 30c or something like that

[violet dagger]

thats crazy at just 50% cooler power

[late summit]

yeah, I kind of want to see how far it'll go ngl

[urban quiver]

ZWO claims the 533mc can go to -35

I only set mine to -10 never really tried anything lower

[violet dagger]

no

it claims it can go 35c below the ambient temperature

[hybrid echo]

-10 is 35 below ambient alot of the time

[urban quiver]

I hate Celsius it’s too confusing

[late summit]

it can go 35 below your ambient temperature, so if your ambient temp is 30c like it easily can during a hot summer night, then it'd cool to -5c at 100% cooling power

[violet dagger]

it has nothing to do with celcius

[late summit]

we are literally just adding and subtracting numbers? it has nothing to do with celcius

[hybrid echo]

this is not Celsius this is subtraction

[urban quiver]

It would make more sense to me in F

[violet dagger]

?

[late summit]

it'd still be the exact same thing in fahrenheit, just a bigger number

[urban quiver]

How is -10 35 below ambient

[hybrid echo]

no it wouldnt

[late summit]

if ambient is 25c, then -10 is 35 below ambient

[violet dagger]

chat gpts response

In astrophotography, ambient temperature refers to the surrounding air temperature at the location where you're imaging

[late summit]

it's basic maths

[hybrid echo]

even chatgpt understands the concept so you know its basic

[violet dagger]

so if the air temp is 20c and the camera can cool down 35c below the air temp it would be sitting at -15

[late summit]

so again, and let me try to explain this the same way I'd explain to a first grader:

My ambient temperature is 20 right now. My camera is sitting at negative 20, so it's a 40 degree difference

therefor it's cooling at -40 below ambient

[hybrid echo]

i feel like you are misunderstanding something big here

[urban quiver]

Why wouldn’t it be -20 difference

[late summit]

because there's a 40 degree difference?

20 minus 20 is 0

[hybrid echo]

subtract 20 from 20

[late summit]

20 minutes 40 is -20

[urban quiver]

That’s a weird way to do it

[late summit]

what

[hybrid echo]

WHAT DO YOU MEAN

[late summit]

I mean this in the best possible way I can, you sure you wanna persue a career as a teacher?

[urban quiver]

If it’s 50* ambient and cooled to 20 below ambient, it makes sense to be 30* sensor

[late summit]

what???

how are you able to apply the logic correctly there

but completely not get the other stuff

[hybrid echo]

I think he never learned negatives in school

[late summit]

the logic is the exact same that you just used

but instead of the sensor being at 30 degrees, it's at negative 20 degrees

[urban quiver]

That’s a weird way to say it

[late summit]

how?

what is weird about that?

[marble hearth]

What is this chat 😭

[urban quiver]

To me it’s confusing the way it’s listed with -20 or whatever

I see it now, but I think it’s weird

[late summit]

it's just listing the sensor's temperature, which is negative 20 celcius

[violet dagger]

ambient temperature

[late summit]

you set the target you want, which in this case is -20c

[urban quiver]

My brain doesn’t work that way

[hybrid echo]

callo not understanding subtraction

[late summit]

and it displays the temp it's currently at

[hybrid echo]

its not about your brain
Its about the capabilities of TECs
They cool based on generating a differential between two sides of a plate
One side becomes hot, and the other cold. The way they work means they are limited in how far they can bring down temperature from the ambient temperature.

[ivory mural]

callo this is basic math

😭

[urban quiver]

Listen my brain already hurts from work

[urban quiver]

I thought it was how much it cooled

not the actual sensor temp

So it shows it’s cooled -20, not actually is -20

[late summit]

But it says Sens. Temp

[urban quiver]

Tomato tomatoe

so my math is fine, it’s just I misunderstood what it means by that

[late summit]

Sure but we explained multiple times what it meant

[hybrid echo]

massive cope

[urban quiver]

no just truth

[hybrid echo]

b1 cause ive been to international waters

[frigid compass]

Nice, must’ve been a nice time

[late summit]

b9 if we only count places we've stayed at for a considerable amount of time

probably b1 otherwise because plane above water etc

[hybrid echo]

nah not really

[fading dust]

evening and night are the same right?

[fading dust]

yeah I was trying to find out if there are any morning ppl doing ap

[ivory mural]

b5, but if youre only counting since i started astro, b6

and well yeah b1 if you mean under any condition bc plane

[waxen tundra]

0 = freezing 100= boiling it can not be that hard lol

[urban quiver]

Dumb temperature

Fahrenheit is better

[waxen tundra]

It really isn’t

There’s a reason Celsius and Kelvin are used much more

[urban quiver]

don’t care

just cause it’s used more doesn’t make it better

[waxen tundra]

Your small American brain can’t comprehend anything better. Standard units exist for a reason

[hybrid echo]

Fahrenheit is standardized

[obsidian plover]

SI units when

[hybrid echo]

even cgs is standardized

[waxen tundra]

SI isn’t Fahrenheit, it’s kelvin which is directly interchangeable with Celsius from the shift from absolute 0 to freezing point of water

[ivory mural]

firehdn would be proud

[bronze minnow]

im gonna do every consytellation

[cerulean elm]

Easy way to understand temperature measurements.
0K = Dead
100K = Dead
0°C = Mildly cold
100°C = Dead
0°F = Really cold
100°F = Really hot

[hybrid echo]

at least we can agree that -40 degrees is really, cold, and 574 degrees is really hot.

Celcius and kelvin tho dont agree on anything

[marble hearth]

Still don't get how some people think fahrenheit and the rest of imperial system is superior

Metric is basically centered around water
0C = water freezes
100C = water boils
1 litre of water ~ 1kg
1m^3 of water ~ 1 ton

And ridiculously easy to interchange between one another

[cerulean elm]

Why the size of a shoe is not one foot?

[brisk copper]

bc most people dont have feet the size of 1 foot

[cerulean elm]

Then why use it as a measurement?😂

[brisk copper]

idk, it pointles :<

[bronze minnow]

celsius is kelvin shifted up

so they kinda agree

also makes it easy to interchange
just add or subtract 273.15

[static sapphire]

all units in all systems are just made up arbitrarily by Big Government to troll you

[cerulean elm]

Aren't scientists who invent unites of measurements and the government invents arbitrary units of measurements to make marketing stock more manipulative and favorable for them?

[supple wraith]

You said it, metric is centered around water. Telling the temperature using imperial is better because we’re not all scuba diving.

[cerulean elm]

Telling the temperature in K is the boss way of doing it.

[cerulean elm]

But your body is mostly made of water isn't it?

[supple wraith]

I mean ambient temp not body.

[cold moon]

Kelvin is superior.

[static sapphire]

Fun fact, both K and F are officially based on C

[violet dagger]

mr mods please dont delete this forum

ik this is kinda off topic

and i know it depends on what its gonna be used for

[rain void]

C is actually based on K now, but it hasn't always been like that

Because they defined k_B, which indirectly defined the kelvin scale

[static sapphire]

Well, technically it’s really the same scale only translated by -273.15

By based on C I mean they took OG Celcius and replicated it with the Boltzmann constant

In any event it’s really defined with joules anyway

[cold moon]

Is the dob for visual?

[delicate lance]

Visual and Plannetary

[cold moon]

As a visual enjoyer I'd get the dob and possibly a UHC. But it depends on what you want to do more eagerly

[zealous cloak]

https://tenor.com/view/emoji-meme-jar-gif-4658690738464352739

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1018612234819223632/1377087696899674112/IMG_2278.gif

[hybrid echo]

yes
but refractors arent telescopes

[urban quiver]

How’s it feel to be do wrong yet so confident

Enjoy your coma correctors, nerds!

[delicate lance]

Field Flatteners:

https://tenor.com/view/funny-hahaha-gif-22505124

[urban quiver]

My refractor doesn’t use one

[cold moon]

Enjoy spending thrice the amount of money for something with half the aperture I guess

[urban quiver]

Doesn’t need it

[delicate lance]

thats what they all say

[urban quiver]

I wouldn’t say aperture is king for imaging

[cold moon]

I would

[urban quiver]

It doesn’t tho. It’s built in

[delicate lance]

what

[cold moon]

Btw that's why RCs are kings, they don't need correctors 🔥

[delicate lance]

fun fact
Maksutovs and Schmidt Cassegrains also have built in correctors

[urban quiver]

I’d rather not carry a 12” dob to a dark sky. Give me my small frac

[delicate lance]

and some newtons

[delicate lance]

youre going to see more with the 12'' just sayin

[urban quiver]

and they look like a garbage can

[urban quiver]

don’t want that focal length

[delicate lance]

theres a funny little thing called a reducer

[urban quiver]

Which means fast optics, which means annoying to collimate

[delicate lance]

id argue that collimating a refractor is a lot more annoying than collimating a newton

[cold moon]

Skill issue 🗣️

[urban quiver]

well you only need to collimate a refractor if you dropped it or factory messed it up. So you send it back. 99.9% of the time you won’t collimate one

[cold moon]

And yeah I would take the big dob with me every day of the week lol

[urban quiver]

Sounds annoying

[delicate lance]

you know what sounds annoying

no proper aperture

🗣️

also when talking about looks like you did with the cassegrains

do we forget

how GOOFY

refracs look on those chonky mounts

atomic bomb vs crying baby

[urban quiver]

no

They’re pretty

Gorgeous I might add

[delicate lance]

they look fugly

id even say a RASA looks better than that

[urban quiver]

your scopes look like a garbage can

And could function as one too

[delicate lance]

garbage cans can look good indeed

but a refractor which is just ugly cannot can it?

[cold moon]

Trussed RCs are the best looking ones

[urban quiver]

https://tenor.com/view/lie-detector-gif-9388384639890532829

[delicate lance]

my god theyre pretty

[delicate lance]

wheres your trussstyle refractor buddy

[urban quiver]

2nd best, after refractors of course

[cold moon]

Wrong!!!

[delicate lance]

you cannot tell me you keep a straight face while looking at a tiny inefficient refrac and comparing it to the Trussed RCs

[urban quiver]

Frac supremacy

[delicate lance]

thats a great argument wow i cannot say anything about that so structured argument

[urban quiver]

🥰 🥰

[late summit]

[delicate lance]

90% cable 9% accessories 1% telescope

[late summit]

The "It doesn't need a field flatner because mine has it built in" also applies for coma correctors btw

There are imaging newts that come with them

[urban quiver]

meh

[delicate lance]

quattro right?

[late summit]

And there's plenty of fracs that do NOT come wtih them at all

yeah sw includes them iirc

[urban quiver]

still need to worry about backfocus with those though no?

[delicate lance]

do you think you dont need to do that with flatteners

[urban quiver]

Another pro of a petzval frac. No real concern with backfocus

[urban quiver]

I never worry about backfocus with my frac

[late summit]

just like you need to worry about backfocus with a frac

[urban quiver]

it doesn’t need to be precise

with a petzval like mine

It has a range

[late summit]

Not every frac has the same style of focuser that doesn't care about backfocus

[urban quiver]

but mine does.

sooo

[late summit]

that's not an argument for or against fracs though?

[delicate lance]

thats just saying "my telescope is better than fracs"

[late summit]

there's plenty of dobs that come with focusers that don't need perfect backfocus either

newts*

[hybrid echo]

and you could also make a newt with cc that does if you really wanted to

[delicate lance]

i love how dry the arguments for fracs are lol

[late summit]

Aperture is also absolutely king on imaging, specially on smaller fracs like the 71f

71mm of aperture has a pretty big limit

[urban quiver]

don’t need to put any effort into it. Cause fracs already won over 400 years ago

[late summit]

Wha

Won how? Where?

[urban quiver]

by existing first

[cold moon]

It's cause we were dumber back then

[late summit]

I'm older than you therefor I win this argument then?

[urban quiver]

that’s a dumb argument

[cold moon]

Plato ahh argument

[late summit]

Considering all the arguments that Callo gets into in this channel, I seriously believe he's just a master ragebaiter

[urban quiver]

Meh, 50:50

[delicate lance]

do you know what also existed first
bows and arrows

you telling me theyre better weapons than a tank?

https://tenor.com/view/silly-idiot-emoji-idiot-emoji-gif-5038697630482117366

[urban quiver]

in certain aspects yea they would be

[delicate lance]

i agree now

[urban quiver]

I can think of multiple scenarios where a bow and arrow are indeed superior to a tank

[delicate lance]

lets take a sharpened rock, which was one of the first ever weapons
Thats better than say a knife or even just.. ANY other weapon?

[hybrid echo]

sure, if the tank is in the process of exploding on you

[urban quiver]

have any of you owned a frac

[hybrid echo]

ye

[delicate lance]

yes

dark times those were...

[hybrid echo]

i have a 114mm frac im building currently

[delicate lance]

have YOU ever owned a reflector

[urban quiver]

no you were in the light. Don’t worry you’ll be back

[urban quiver]

yea

[delicate lance]

what kind

[urban quiver]

DOB

[delicate lance]

front of base?

[urban quiver]

what

[late summit]

yes i own a frac and a newt

[delicate lance]

one thats meant for ap

[urban quiver]

no

[delicate lance]

FOB means front of base lol

[urban quiver]

cause it’s expensive

[late summit]

callo have you ever actually tried imaging with the 150p?

[urban quiver]

yea

[late summit]

like, a proper try?

[delicate lance]

theyre cheaper than fracs lol

[urban quiver]

not in a while

[late summit]

do you have anything to show for it

[urban quiver]

Not when you consider the additional expenses needed

You can put a small frac on a gti. You need a much heavier and expensive mount for a newt

[delicate lance]

we are talking about reflectors

also there are lightweight reflectors which canbe put on a gti

[urban quiver]

which

what’s their price

[delicate lance]

A small mak works (around 250) but if you want an actually practical scope you can get a carbon fiber small-opening newt

[obsidian plover]

Ive owned both and the frac gets used a shit ton more cuz its better, easier to use and gives better data

[urban quiver]

Collimation itself is a big reason why I just don’t wanna bother. And the fact I’d need another, more expensive mount

[urban quiver]

What’s a small opening newt

The cheapest carbon fiber newts I can see are like $800

[delicate lance]

5''

[urban quiver]

oh

[delicate lance]

btw even if you wouldnt find a comercially sold one you can make one yourself

[urban quiver]

no that’s a skill issue

I’d break something

[delicate lance]

so we agree reflectors are just superior but refrac users have to much of a skill issue to use or construct them? alright great

[urban quiver]

no

[cold moon]

Wha

At the same aperture an imaging newt is multiple times cheaper lmao

[urban quiver]

at the same aperture yes

But for me to have a reflector I’d probably need a bigger and more expensive mount

[hybrid echo]

because you would probably get a larger reflector than your refractor

[urban quiver]

are there 71mm reflectors then?

I don’t see a point in one of those

[late summit]

why would you want a reflector that's so aperture limited

[urban quiver]

Convenience

[delicate lance]

why would you want any telescope thats so aperture limited

[urban quiver]

Not gigantic

[hybrid echo]

why would you want a refractor that is so aperture limited

[delicate lance]

HAC125dx

[urban quiver]

If you think aperture is so important, then wouldn’t all lenses be completely useless for astrophotography?

[delicate lance]

[urban quiver]

That thing looks like a nightmare to own tbh

[delicate lance]

its an F/2 astrograph

weighs like

[urban quiver]

yea

[delicate lance]

idk like 3 kg

[hybrid echo]

as in camera lenses or as in the concept of a lens?

[late summit]

yeah both are valid questions

[urban quiver]

A camera lens, like the Roki

[hybrid echo]

most camera lenses are pretty bad for astro

[delicate lance]

They work but they arent optimal

[urban quiver]

3.81. A bit heavy for my mount, but is about my refractor.

[delicate lance]

and setting this aside youre doing widefield with them

[urban quiver]

And that’s what I’m doing with my frac

[delicate lance]

yeah but theres also widefield reflectors

[urban quiver]

I won’t say a frac is useful for planetary

[urban quiver]

yea

[delicate lance]

with a LOT more aperture

[urban quiver]

they’re rarer and because they’re fast there is other stuff to consider

[delicate lance]

which are a lot more optimal and efficient

just sayin

[late summit]

wdym "if you think aperture is so important", it's literally the limiting factor 💀

if aperture wasn't important we'd just build small scopes with really long fl's

[urban quiver]

I feel like you are trying to miss the point I was making

[delicate lance]

the point being?

Something being unoptimal and impossible to use are two very diffeerent things

[hybrid echo]

i mean
tbf alot of people did do that
like
lotta old scopes are slow as shit

[delicate lance]

F/15 refracs oh god

worst type of telescope and worst focal ratio

bad combo

[urban quiver]

my club has f/11 frac I think it is

[late summit]

yeah and it resulted in pretty bad imaging lol

[urban quiver]

Well they mostly made them before cameras were around or had any usefulness for Astro so

[ivory mural]

i do think fracs that have decent fl are dumb

they're only a better choice for short fl

like redcat

[ivory mural]

ngl sounds like laziness

@late summit the gti can do 30s exposures with the heritage right

[late summit]

i have no clue

it can handle the heritage, i don't know how long it can do unguided

with my 585 i'd need pretty perfect guiding

[ivory mural]

i mean heritage 150 btw

ik u have the 130 but do you think it could take the 150

[urban quiver]

it can’t even balance

[late summit]

it can balance if you add magnetic counterweights to the tube to oppose the focuser and camera weight

[urban quiver]

Rings would make it more convenient

I’m curious if my 533 and filter drawer would sag the focuser

Doubt I could get good enough guiding though

[ivory mural]

ngl i just run unguided a lot

[urban quiver]

With what

Camera

[ivory mural]

My drilled holes into the tube aren't secure enough for good guiding

[ivory mural]

Imx585

[urban quiver]

Why did you drill holes again

That poor heritage

[ivory mural]

to mount a guidescope

[urban quiver]

why didn’t you use Velcro or idk super glue

[ivory mural]

velcro would be 100x worse??

[late summit]

velcro would literally be the worst possible way for him to do that

[ivory mural]

and i don't want to permanently put it on there

[late summit]

it's right there with zipties

matter of fact, zipties would probably do better

[ivory mural]

I'd say worse

you can tighten the zip ties strongly but velcro will always be shit

[delicate lance]

VELCRO

WHAT

[urban quiver]

What’s wrong with it

[urban quiver]

Why

[ivory mural]

...

[urban quiver]

I got Velcro on my heritage

[ivory mural]

have you ever grabbed something mounted with velcro and wiggled it?

[ivory mural]

For what

[late summit]

yeah for what lol

[urban quiver]

failed project….

[delicate lance]

AND YOURE ASKING WHY VELCR-

[ivory mural]

what did you try to do

[urban quiver]

So you know that one website for your phone that is supposed to help you star hop?

I tried to make a phone mount so I could use that easy

Like that Celestron phone thingy

[ivory mural]

yes, star hopping yourself works better

[urban quiver]

Well it was a cool idea, and it didn’t work

[ivory mural]

yea using an app isn't good

[urban quiver]

Yea didn’t work at all

[ivory mural]

the reason celestron starsense works so well is bc it actually platesolves your sky

it's not just a compass

[urban quiver]

yea

well this was when I was extremely new, and only did visual

[ivory mural]

visual better

[late summit]

i mean you can't really ask someone "Why not velcro" in relations to the guidescope and then say "But I have velcro" because you velcro'd your phone to starhop

it's not even apples and oranges, it's apples and hatchbacks

[swift heart]

Perhaps we need to teach you a lesson about the glorious Ritchey–Chrétien, young man

[urban quiver]

yea well tbh I’d rather try Velcro instead of rolling holes

[ivory mural]

[ivory mural]

callo

[urban quiver]

you can always remove Velcro

[ivory mural]

did you learn anything from the last 5 minutes

[urban quiver]

Can’t fix a drill hole

[late summit]

actually you can

it's one of the most popular fixes on literally anything that people often drill

[urban quiver]

He literally messed up his tube

That can’t be fixed

[ivory mural]

im just gonna slap electrictrical tape over the holes when i retire it as a visual only scope

[late summit]

that's not because he was drilling, it's because his father put a stupid amount of pressure on the tube

[urban quiver]

Either way, Velcro is easily removable

[late summit]

yeah but you can't velcro a guidecam

what even are you trying to argue here

[urban quiver]

you’d Velcro the scope

Wouldn’t be pretty but maybe it’d work

[ivory mural]

no it would not

[urban quiver]

Hey you never know

[ivory mural]

yes we do

[urban quiver]

ok

Well anyways

[ivory mural]

velcro is not stable

[urban quiver]

Why didn’t you buy rings or something

[ivory mural]

it does not hold it accurately in place

[ivory mural]

free option

[urban quiver]

When you risk damaging your $350 scope instead of buying $50 rings 😭

[ivory mural]

rings are $70 also its not supposed to damage it

[urban quiver]

I hope you didn’t expect it to damage it, that would make it worse

[swift heart]

Hey the 6" f/15 achromat we have in a dome at my university observatory dome is pretty fire on the planets

[ivory mural]

i didn't expect for my dad to not let me do it myself and for him to mess up the drilling

[urban quiver]

Visually or imaging wise

or both

[swift heart]

Visual, but I'm not sure if anyone has tried imaging with it.

[delicate lance]

6'' is fine but the ones i mean have a 35mm opening

[swift heart]

I might try it myself if I can get trained on it

[ivory mural]

what

[delicate lance]

they exist

[ivory mural]

i strongly encourage you to make that statement false

[delicate lance]

sorry they cost like 600 eur cuz theyre vintage

[ivory mural]

worth it

[obsidian plover]

what a useful contribution to this channel

[summer turret]

rasa but somehow worse

[brisk copper]

its just rasa

they fixed most the issues

the only issue they cant fix is smol appature

bc that kinda defeats the perpose

[rain void]

Ofc. RASA is pretty hard to beat since it's the best

[rain void]

But it really is just a worse rasa

But also much cheaper so maybe it's fine idk

[brisk copper]

mhmhm

[brisk copper]

you get a bit better than what you are paying for

i know that much

[rain void]

16mm corrected field is pretty bad

[brisk copper]

the effective f ratio is 2.5 btw

bc the obstruction

[brisk copper]

buh

[rain void]

Actually Idk if it's radius of diameter tho

[brisk copper]

xD

[brisk copper]

i know rightttt!

[ivory mural]

it's meant for the imx585 and 533

[cold moon]

Usually it's the diametre

[rain void]

Yeah I'd think so too

But that's just so small 💀

[brisk copper]

something you can relate too ^~^

[cold moon]

Good for the 533, diagonal is slightly more than 16

[brisk copper]

so conners are slightly less iluminati?

[cold moon]

Less corrected

[rain void]

my RASA11 has 43.3 mm fully corrected field

[cold moon]

Illumination is probably still 100%

[brisk copper]

oh, silly ovals

[rain void]

And 52 usable field

Just a bit more vignetted

[brisk copper]

yea well,

take that :<

[rain void]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/794651916646350859/1389303297654919218/togif-1.gif

[cold moon]

If I get the RC that I want and I run the corrector I'd get a 70mm fully corrected circle

[brisk copper]

okie :<

[brisk copper]

wha, rc no need correctors

rc correcteded by themselves

[cold moon]

They correct more, not perfectly

And the corrector also reduces so that's nice

[brisk copper]

astigmtism

[brisk copper]

to what f-ratio?

[cold moon]

I think it would be F/5.6

[brisk copper]

wta corroeter you getting bc i getting an rc agter mount

[ivory mural]

i want an rc8 so baddd

[brisk copper]

so ill want one

[brisk copper]

tbf, i my proverty ill probably end up getting an f5 8"

i prefer f5 over f4

[cold moon]

Idk, most probably the ones included with it since they are made for that scope specifically

[brisk copper]

what rc you getting?

can haves link?

[cold moon]

At least a 12" but 14 is also possible

[brisk copper]

buh, that's like 4k

[ivory mural]

Why

[cold moon]

You didn't see the mount yet

[brisk copper]

did you get a big bonus or something

[brisk copper]

is the mount 12k?

[cold moon]

15

[rain void]

Where do you live? Because unless your seeing is really really good, a newt is probably a better choice

[ivory mural]

f/4 is friendlier on the mount and seeing

[ivory mural]

ik i am getting a newt

[brisk copper]

f/5 can be sharper

[ivory mural]

i just want the crazy stuff rcs do

[brisk copper]

why not a salamander?

[cold moon]

Great question

[ivory mural]

chicken

[brisk copper]

get a cnc spider and pretend its an rc

i want a maksutov newtonian

they look so silly

i just want it to hang on my wall

not even to use

i also want to make an f/8 3" telescope

also to put on the wall

[brisk copper]

NOOOO

THATS TOO MEAN

[brisk copper]

@ivory mural you haven votid

[ivory mural]

yes i did

what

it removed my vote

there i re-voted

[brisk copper]

thats wut they all say!

[ivory mural]

i was in the car

probably lost mobile daya

[brisk copper]

MEOW!

[ivory mural]

data

[brisk copper]

is a good Choice :3

[cold moon]

@rain void @brisk copper look at the tracking (not guiding) error of that mount

[brisk copper]

damn

thass hawt

[urban quiver]

Probably a good mount. I’d never consider buying one though. You buy it, you got no support something goes wrong

[late summit]

It's as simple as a harmonic mount can get and it uses onstep

If anything goes wrong, you might not have any support at all (some people reported they got wiring diagrams from them to fix their mount)

but it won't exactly be rocket science to figure it out either

[cedar dome]

Yeah that’s was I was seeing, it’s an interesting mount and a good concept, but it has some tweaks mainly in the company it is made by

If I were to get a harmonic mount now, I may honestly get the AM3 or some Skywatcher strain wave

[brisk copper]

wat

[undone sinew]

orion solos cygnus any day of the year

[summer turret]

Investing

[stone zealot]

Veil nebula solos

[undone sinew]

I was literally about to type “when’s the next round gonna happen”

Bro orion better win this shit

If its cygnus i swear to god

[bronze minnow]

orion is overrated icl

everyone knows orion

[cerulean elm]

Orion is boring. Look at WR134 and you'll love Cygnus after that

[undone sinew]

CENTAURUS IS NOT THAT GOOD WHAT ARE YOU GUYS. ON ABOUT

[bronze minnow]

omega centauri?? nearest stars?? centaurus A??

[undone sinew]

centaurus A is like a C-tier object bro yall are hyping it up way too much

[cerulean elm]

Give me couple reasons why Centaurus is not good

[obsidian plover]

Omega cent, omega centauri, tweezer shall I continue

[summer turret]

All centaurus DSOs are bright enough to see visually through a scope

And alpha cent trinary

[cerulean elm]

And yet nobody mentioned the extremely powerful AGN in Centaurus A

[bronze minnow]

that and omega cen being naked eye visible (literally why it's called omega centauri)

[cerulean elm]

Too bad most of us will never see it

[desert obsidian]

Besides refractors

[supple wraith]

And what if I have multiple?

[undone sinew]

Then just whichever one you use most often / you like the most

[ivory mural]

living in space would be horrible

cool for like a month

[urban quiver]

More like a few hours at our tech level

If we had like cool sci fi, FTL, futuristic tech, then living in space would be fun and cool for a long long time

[cerulean elm]

What do you mean? It's fun. You'll become a vegetable because your muscles will be atrophied and your life expectancy will be shortened because of increased radiation exposure. Awesome

[obsidian plover]

Lmc is horrible Rn

[cerulean elm]

Ok, then the dragon

Anything but the Lagoon nebula tbh

[restive fiber]

heheh

[cerulean elm]

Never enough

[brisk copper]

the more the better!

[glacial bear]

Not sure this has an answer, really

[ivory mural]

depends how far they are

[cerulean elm]

Hiw about that... it's a tie

[delicate lance]

A mono 294? I hope you mean the 492 which replaced if

[delicate lance]

do people not realise

the 492 has tiny pixels at 48MP

meaning you can bin to like 5um at 12MP if you wanted

[young quail]

I do now 😅

[static sapphire]

You also get better than the expected 4x well depth at bin 2

[supple wraith]

I dunno

[restive fiber]

The truth triangles are supposed to be curves.

[brisk copper]

Simplex is a peer to peer encrypted chat like whatsapp but it requires no password or accounts to create

meaning its completely private

and requires no numbers to join

[obsidian plover]

overlap seems silly

[cerulean elm]

The overlapping filters give you the most realistic colors

[rain void]

Realistic is boring

[cerulean elm]

Then why y'all hate SHO?

[rain void]

I love SHO my man

Also my best images are narrowband

Just look at my pfp lol

[young quail]

Facts!!

[cerulean elm]

You are excused.

[rain void]

We need a SHO enjoyers thread

Like the RC snobs, but better

[cerulean elm]

#1369967051199746129

[rain void]

Ah, good point

[cold moon]

Almost every one I've seen is the third option. I believe the reason is that there's a wavelength between green and red that was used in sodium lamps

Now it's not an issue anymore. Player One are like the second option

[undone sinew]

why cant i play wordle here

1984

[cerulean elm]

All of the above

[static sapphire]

This reminds me of the polls in here https://clickens.chicken.pics/

[rain void]

NB would be nothing without them

Especially the large ones

[brisk copper]

nice try glass sheet reflector user

[rain void]

?

It's the foundation of great nb

[brisk copper]

i cant trust you your ratio is about f2

[rain void]

Great scope, I know

[cerulean elm]

Too expensive for me. I stick with open mirrors

[brisk copper]

awful scope, i know

[rain void]

why

It's not like you're not mixing mirrors and lenses if you're using most other reflectors

Unless you're an RC snob, in which case I decide your opinion is wrong

[cerulean elm]

Those that make Schmidt newtonian telescopes also bad?

[brisk copper]

i may or may not be an rc snob

[cerulean elm]

Prove it

[rain void]

In that case I wish you great luck processing your absolutely PERFECT 36 photons in your miniscule fov

[cerulean elm]

Hey hey hey! No attacks against RC!

[ivory mural]

rc8 with reducer and imx571

much bigger fov than my own at 750mm fl

[brisk copper]

correctors arent real

[brisk copper]

i love my 36 photons ill let you know

[rain void]

Sure but 6" f4 newt with a 533 is pretty much the same but one tenth of the price

[brisk copper]

hmm

[rain void]

If my guesstimates are right, but I think it's not too far off

Sharpness won't even be much better with the RC unless the seeing is good

[ivory mural]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1326833769495269376/1399497793785303200/M16_raw.png?ex=688c8323&is=688b31a3&hm=321437218539e5f9c5fb8cd12d5c02cf989fb86435d37c5ea220c12f78c5e06d&

vel's image

[rain void]

My calculations say that an 8" f4 newt with a 533 has 40% larger fov than an rc8 with a 571

38.4% to be exact

And the 8" f4 newt is pretty well sampled at just under 1 arc second per pixel

[cerulean elm]

5" Newtonian

Too bad i have to image it below 16 degrees of elevation

[cerulean elm]

you said you like SHO? I have the most cursed SHO and the most boring at the same time
SHO but each channel has it's real color😱

[rain void]

Then it's just not SHO

But still a disgrace lmao

[cerulean elm]

Sechnically it contains SII, Ha and OIII.

[rain void]

But SHO refers to S->R, Ha->G and O->B

You wouldn't call HSO SHO

[cerulean elm]

I know, i was just experimenting with a script in Pix and that abomination was born

[rain void]

Ungodly

I didn't know it was possible to make nb boring

[cerulean elm]

In my case the Palette is S -> Deep red, Ha -> less deep red, OIII -> Turqoise

[supple wraith]

Underated*

[fading dust]

https://tenor.com/view/silly-idiot-emoji-idiot-emoji-gif-5038697630482117366

[undone sinew]

i mean emission not diffuse

god damn it

[bronze minnow]

we need all of them to have the same number

[ivory mural]

no idea honestly

it's a tie for me

[delicate lance]

same man

this sucks

[marble hearth]

didnt we have this question before

[delicate lance]

no

we had IMX571 colour vs 492 Mono

and since people dont know what the 492 Mono is they voted 571 sob

[zealous cloak]

Osc 571 is a waste of money

[ivory mural]

looks better than mine with a 6" newt 😭

[brisk copper]

miau

[stone zealot]

🐈