kuki-theorycrafting

[subtle finch]

eh more aoe shouldnt be useless

[idle turret]

Besides, as a Beidou main, it would be especially nice

[torpid oak]

• the fact that Fischl can probably dish out more damage than Kuki even with a Tenacity set

[tardy cosmos]

C4 is also kind of weak compared to Fischl's A4

[subtle finch]

its not probably, she absolutely can if the number of hits we have for her ult is correct

[lunar zealot]

if it really is 13 hits, then that is soooo bad it's depressing. You are asking us to keep an enemy in the area for 3.5sec for that? her healing isnt even that big and mono target, where did the power budget go?

[idle turret]

Damn what is it with Fischl outdoing so many electro Inazuma chars lmao

[subtle finch]

and on a 5s cooldown

[subtle finch]

her c1 increases the aoe so imo that part is fine

[tardy cosmos]

all power budget goes to yelan

[last flare]

but Fishl doesn't heal...overall, I do agree that Shinobu won't prolly be meta, because it's a damage-oriented one

[shrewd crescent]

What interval between hits were you hoping for? 0.1 seconds?

[lunar zealot]

amber also has some range boost on Q and can struggle to keep an enemy in ult for 2 sec

[last flare]

but I dunno, I think she'll be fine, quite technical to use, very niche

[upbeat acorn]

If only there was a ttds but for sword wielders

[last flare]

after all, she's a healer that will get obliterated by Corrosion

that in itself means she'll be niche

[torpid oak]

I mean, does healing on the active character really outpace the fact that Fischl can kinda do everything else she does but better

[tardy cosmos]

what comp can be helped with an electro healer btw
I'm cureently thinking of geobros klee shinobu
klee's pyro application is fast enough to make shinobu consistently deal overload
and albedo can share EM

[tired berry]

Do we even have an HP% sword?

[last flare]

for non-Abyss content, hell yeah

[tardy cosmos]

we do

3* ones

[tired berry]

Ah I see

🥲

[shrewd crescent]

I don't think so

[lunar zealot]

dont think so too

[tired berry]

Oh

[shrewd crescent]

Yeah we don't

Closest you'll get is Jade Cutter

[tardy cosmos]

OH WAIT TRAVELER HANDY SWORD IS DEF

[subtle finch]

anyway do you guys have any team ideas in mind

[shrewd crescent]

You thought it was hp too

[subtle finch]

my best idea is still Ayato Yelan Kuki Kazuha

[lunar zealot]

we need The Bell as a sword

[tired berry]

I never thought I’d be excited for an HP% sword in the future

But here we are

[spare torrent]

Can't use ToM better. Rotations are kinda scuffed for the comp I wanna do using Fischl.

[tardy cosmos]

klee kuki albedo zhongli
overload comp

[last flare]

Ayato or Childe/Beidou/Kazuha/Shinobu

[shrewd crescent]

Rosaria, Kuki, Fischl, someone else idk I Judy wanted to try phys Kuki

[orchid folio]

Ayato Fischl Kuku Kazuha

but it won't be more damage than Sara Sayu

[subtle finch]

is she doing anything there better than fischl?

not saying she has to for that team to be valid

just curious

[tardy cosmos]

she heals and can do triple em build

[spare torrent]

PF Zhongli/Yun Jin/NO Rosaria/ToM Shinobu.

[tardy cosmos]

that's what I'm currently thinking

[subtle finch]

do you need a healer in geobros?

[last flare]

also, Eula/Rosalia/Xynian/Shinobu, Eula hyper team

[upbeat acorn]

Damn what if she had been a shielder and not a healer, so she could have at least given resistance to interruption

[torpid oak]

Pale Flame Kuki, Rosaria, Yun Jin, Zhongli

[tardy cosmos]

because I cant think of anything else

[subtle finch]

xinyan you have my attention

[shrewd crescent]

I forgot about Yunjin

[spare torrent]

Zhongli E > Shinobu E > Yun Jin EQ > Rosaria EQ > Zhongli NA5D×4 E

[subtle finch]

no multi hits tho

[median wagon]

We have %HP catalyst, claymore, bow, spear
And zero %HP sword
Shinobu is being disappointed every second

[tardy cosmos]

I cant think of anything else

[spare torrent]

That's just a worse version of mine.

[lunar zealot]

my main issues with triple EM build are: overload on melee, not practical AND why would you put her instead of bennett if you are playing pyro unless you are me and dont want to play Bennett?

[alpine dock]

Itto albedo gorou kuki

[subtle finch]

do you rlly need a healer there though? fischl does good damage there

[torpid oak]

[placid pine]

Haven't had the need

[last flare]

Shinobu replaces Bennett, so the team goes toward more Burst damage than auto-attacks

[alpine dock]

If she's a battery she can replace fischl on sucrose taser

[orchid folio]

and that team really appreciates a healer actually

[tardy cosmos]

I'll be honest with you: I cant really think of anything that shinobu will do better in current established comps

[orchid folio]

so that's a good niche for her

lets sucrose run sac frags

[spare torrent]

I'd build Shinobu ATK/Electro/Crit tbh. Fischl doesn't use ToM as well and the rotation's just a lot less smooth.

[subtle finch]

fischl doing 7k personal damage in pikeli according to my calcs tho. I can try replacing her with what we currently know about Kuki see what happens

[simple cypress]

hp hp crit doesnt look too bad

[orchid folio]

we need to see her ICD

potentially she'll allow you to replace Kokomi Fischl in sukoko with Yelan/Xingqiu Shinobu?

[shrewd crescent]

We need to see everything

Text ain't cutting it man

[plush mirage]

yeah

[subtle finch]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1snnq0h-BzS7DowRVNtq_k6ezOT6X73JwoNy2kUa66pw/edit?usp=sharing this is what i have pikeli sheeted at with fischl if you need a refference

[plush mirage]

electro healer allows you to run yelan/xq kaz combo

[tardy cosmos]

dont you have to attack if you use yelan and shinobu

[plush mirage]

cant calc without knowing yelan but it's a possible niche

[spare torrent]

I mean, it's not just about personal damage. Worried about ToM running out too soon or having to use Fischl later in the rotation to keep it up, interfering with the other buff timings.

[tardy cosmos]

in sukokomon, everything is automatic

[orchid folio]

sucrose does in fact attack

[last flare]

Keqing Sara Kazuha Shinobu for the return of the Electro Queen

[tardy cosmos]

it's only to fill time, no?

[orchid folio]

it also swirls

it's definitely not just to kill time

[last flare]

alternativly, Keqing Yenlan Kazhua Shinobu for max Keqing on-field time

[orchid folio]

idk who comes on field when kokomi usually bursts though

[tardy cosmos]

kok only burst to refresh jellyfish, right?

[orchid folio]

in sukoko she does normal idk the full rotation

[subtle finch]

heres where I am currently seeing the value in Kuki

you guys can probably guess

!!noir

[subtle finch]

TF Ayato

[plush mirage]

yelan shinobu kaz is probably a strong core with healing and ec

[subtle finch]

so you can have a healer in TF Ayato+Yelan team idea and enable kazuha

[plush mirage]

that works too

[subtle finch]

since youd want kazuha there not bennet since he doesnt buff yelan

[plush mirage]

any ayato/kaz/shinobu flex

[last flare]

this

[subtle finch]

TOTM doesnt do anything for Yelan tho

[orchid folio]

just fischl again

[plush mirage]

yeah

[subtle finch]

you wouldnt have a healer in that team with fischl

[plush mirage]

helps with aoe electro application as well

[orchid folio]

no ayato kaz shinobu fischl

[last flare]

Yae/Yenlan/Kazuha/Shinobu

[shrewd crescent]

I wanna try c4 Yelan with Kuki tbh

[plush mirage]

for better swirls and ec

[subtle finch]

if fischl is there i dont see why shinobu is

just replace her with jean or sayu

[orchid folio]

healing obv

[subtle finch]

but you would objectively get way more value out of having any other healer there

[orchid folio]

shinobu lets you easily swirl electro for fischl without having to re-snap

plus totm for her and ayato

[subtle finch]

oh wait you have kazuha there

[orchid folio]

electro resonance for more energy too

[subtle finch]

thought that was still ayato yelan mb

[plush mirage]

depending on her energy you can also throw in beidou

seems pretty flexible to me

[brave mica]

Waiting for the shinobu reveal

[orchid folio]

on 2 targets beidou might compete but fischl damage is stupid high

[shrewd crescent]

Wait 6 weeks

[subtle finch]

I can see value in her letting you free up fischl for your other team, assuming she provides good enough energy in place of fischl

[shrewd crescent]

[subtle finch]

for someone like me that uses fischl literally every single abyss, having a fischl alternative is valuable

[orchid folio]

she doesn't have 100% skill uptime without sac sword tho

[plush mirage]

well there's c2

[orchid folio]

unless the rot is 15 seconds (which it isnt)

[plush mirage]

oh yeah

[last flare]

she has with cons, and since she is 4 stars, they're attainable

[brave mica]

Six weeks to get a meh ToM set mhm mhm

[subtle finch]

wait

[plush mirage]

15s does match with yelan and kaz though

[subtle finch]

would sac sword let her get 100% E uptime

[plush mirage]

hence why i am liking it

[orchid folio]

yeah easily if it procs

[subtle finch]

hang on Maxi you might have struck gold

hmm

[brave mica]

But you’d be shredding her HP if you keep recasting

[last flare]

porccing Sac on Shinobu will be quite easy

[subtle finch]

let me see if i can think of a rotation where sac sword is increasing her uptime

[nocturne plover]

c2

[subtle finch]

she needs that

[tardy cosmos]

oh right there's this

[subtle finch]

to be below 50%

[shrewd crescent]

Is that not a good thing?

[subtle finch]

she wants to shred her hp

[orchid folio]

she can't go below 20% anyway

[glad harness]

I thought she has 100% uptime already. C2 is +3 seconds

[shrewd crescent]

Until corrosion hits but that's really specific

[subtle finch]

only if your rotation is 15 or 30 seconds

[plush mirage]

maybe in a non 15s rot the uptime is not max

[tardy cosmos]

20% of 30k is... 6k hp
too low for comfort

[orchid folio]

yes but unless rotation is in increments of 15 seconds you can't keep it 100%

[brave mica]

I mean yes but with these enemies she could get knocked down to nothing unless you have her C6

[plush mirage]

but using sac will desync you up anyway

[brave mica]

Unless you can be super quick with the rotation

[plush mirage]

unless you are praying sac dont proc at the first E

[subtle finch]

guess that gives her c6 more value than i thought

[plush mirage]

and only on the second

[orchid folio]

no it won't proc on the 2nd E because it's still on cooldown

[last flare]

Sac sword cannot proc off-field, but Inital hit + quick sword attacks + 1.5 sec E hit means it'll be easy to proc...even more seeing her Burst

[brave mica]

Have we confirmed if her burst is like Amber or is it truly a “barrier”?

[subtle finch]

yeah i think doing E+NA to proc the passive damage should get the job done

[plush mirage]

nah like if you refresh 12s in, the cd will only be online at 27s

so it depends on what rot you run as well

[last flare]

but Shinobu has 100% uptime with her C2 con I think

[brave mica]

Ok but Festering Desire methinks could work for her too

[orchid folio]

yeah so in a 20 second rotation you refresh ~5 seconds in

etc

[subtle finch]

she doesnt unless your rotation is in increments of 15 seconds

[brave mica]

It has a duration at C2 of 15 seconds with CD of 15 so yes

[plush mirage]

yeah, but that takes fieldtime as well. will need to see if it's worth recasting 5 seconds in

[glad harness]

Honestly, rotation in something like taser doesn't have to exactly line up. You are constantly switching anyway. Once you see the ring gone, recast.

[last flare]

don't forget that her Burst will trigger the passive pretty much all the times since it's multi-hits

[orchid folio]

sac requires your skill to do the damage

[brave mica]

Very much like Raiden E -just keep an EYE on it

[plush mirage]

will probably just do this rather than sac for now

[spare torrent]

@subtle finch What is the rotation you have in that Pikeli comp btw? And does Fischl use ER sands?

[last flare]

ooops, my bad

[unkempt ginkgo]

natural mini Kazuha? enable stacking it, Kazuha powercrept

[subtle finch]

she alternates E and Q every other rotation

[last flare]

maybe Favonius then

[subtle finch]

Q first rotation E second rotation Q third rotation

[brave mica]

Okay so I’m still unsure about the passive EM. Is it % bonus or flat based on total EM

Maybe the translation is off

[plush mirage]

most likely flat but not confirmed

[spare torrent]

Oh, so no ER needed 'cause she's only bursting every other? That makes sense.

[orchid folio]

I checked the chinese it's equally unclear

[glad harness]

If her job is to supply electro, then there is some time needed for electro aura to decay as well, meaning + 1 or 2 more seconds for the duration.

[brave mica]

[subtle finch]

iforgot the rotation i made this sheet back when I was still dumb enoughto not map rotations on my sheets but iirc it was Zhongli E
Rosaria EQ
Fischl E/Q
YunJin EQ
Zhongli NA spam

[spare torrent]

Why does Rosa EQ so early?

[subtle finch]

for fischl to snapshot her buff

can do fischl before rosaria for more Fischl procs and for rosaria to snap totm instead

[spare torrent]

But then Zhongli won't get it for his full field time...

[subtle finch]

that might be better

[subtle finch]

wont he? she lasts 12 seconds

at c2+

[spare torrent]

That's her Q duration. Doesn't effect her buff uptimes which are only 10s each.

[subtle finch]

can change the order to Zhong E>Fischl E>Rosaria EQ>Yunjin EQ, or Zhong E>Fischl E>YunJin EQ>Rosaria EQ

anyways, on topic of Kuki this is a rotation i had in mind

Kuki Q
Yelan E
Kazuha EQ
Ayato Q
Kuki EN
Yelan Q
Ayato E 5N3
Kazuha E
Kuki E
Ayato E5N3

can probably be optimized a lot better

[brave mica]

So are we swirling Hydro yeah? We want the hydro swirl?

[subtle finch]

trying to swirl both

[brave mica]

“Trying” looks at enemy hp bars

[keen sinew]

kuki en?

[subtle finch]

im also hoping clam is worth using on Kuki there since totm isnt doing anything for yelan and kazuha

so totm would only actually be buffing ayato

[glad harness]

4Insts.

[orchid folio]

yeah

instructor

[subtle finch]

clam wont give her crazy damage there but i think it would be enough

[orchid folio]

is an option

[subtle finch]

instructors would also work

[orchid folio]

or even exile

[glossy reef]

I'm an idiot, so, what does ToTM mean exactly?

[subtle finch]

but i really hate using 4 star artifacts

[tardy cosmos]

tenavity

[subtle finch]

tenacity of the mileith

[spare torrent]

This will all make sense once Heizou turns out to be an HP buffer.

[orchid folio]

I hate calcing 4* artifacts

using them is fine

[glossy reef]

I never would have guessed that

[brave mica]

Tenacity of the Millelith

[orchid folio]

I asked Geon to make a 4* version of the artifact calculator

and he said no 😭

[brave mica]

Oop

[subtle finch]

iwouldve said no too

[spare torrent]

Good.

[glad harness]

4 Instructor should be a simple +120 EM for everyone which can buff swirl and EC. Kuki should be doing some nice EC as well, but it will be hard to calculate. Just remember to switch to her time to time to reapply buff.

[orchid folio]

my bennett is 45/80 crit ratio on instructors and I'm quite proud of it

[subtle finch]

i think instructors would make the rotation annoying to minmax uptime

but i defiitely see the value of it here

[glad harness]

Actually, Yelan Kuki Kazuha Albedo for more EM buffs and Petra?

Would love a sac sword kazuha here

[spare torrent]

Why not Yelan Shinobu Sucrose Albedo?

[tardy cosmos]

why not sucrose instead of kazuha

[plush mirage]

all 4 diff elements as well for yelan max a1 kek

[brittle osprey]

hows kuki placed in theory

[plush mirage]

we need someone driving so sucrose should be possible to

[tardy cosmos]

hmm that is one good taser team

[glad harness]

Kazuha because Shinobu skill is small aoe around her, so he pairs with her better. But sucrose works too.

[tardy cosmos]

sucrose can drive better I agree

[glad harness]

The last slot is really flex. Can be fischl, lisa, raiden, childe, mona, or even klee.

[plush mirage]

driving with fav kazuha is pretty nice as well, although ideally you wouldnt want albedo for the 4th slot

[tardy cosmos]

drive with c6 kazuha

[spare torrent]

What about Xiao driver?

[glad harness]

Xiao pog!

[subtle finch]

do you guys think she will get buffed at all btw

[tardy cosmos]

xiao yelan kuki yunjin
xiaojin

[subtle finch]

and if you do how

slightly better MVs?

[plush mirage]

how can we know when her kit aint even fully out

[tardy cosmos]

slightly better em passive

[subtle finch]

was leaked

[tardy cosmos]

slightly better mv

[subtle finch]

[plush mirage]

the q ticks still a mystery till now

[subtle finch]

its 7

7/13

[last flare]

everything can happen, but it would expect more HP scaling on her E

[tardy cosmos]

and slightly better stat distribution

[glad harness]

EM xiao? Since I don't want to farm more VV ...

[plush mirage]

ah leaked already?

nothing in the pins so i assume theres none

[subtle finch]

Someone posted a SS of them saying its 7/13 and uba doing ^^ to confirm

[glad harness]

actually double anemo is ok

[shrewd crescent]

Haha no

[last flare]

thing is, getting 13 hit should be very reliable

[subtle finch]

@knotty crag dont mean to bother you friend but do you know is Kuki ult actually 7/13 as rumored?

[subtle finch]

think so?

[spare torrent]

Including her particle gen?

[subtle finch]

i can see it after the first rotation

[subtle finch]

was told 1 per hit on unknown rng

[last flare]

she looses 30% max HP per E activation. It'll be easy

[subtle finch]

prob just wont have ti first rotation

but after that should be fine

[last flare]

exactly

[tardy cosmos]

shinobu gets to 49% hp after two e activation

[subtle finch]

well we could probably rotate it so that she does get it first rotation

[tardy cosmos]

with sac it's ez

[subtle finch]

but i feel like it wont be worth changing up the rotation to get it first rot

[spare torrent]

Using Sac Sword just to kill her faster. lol

[subtle finch]

well let me see what i can do with the rotation i came up with

[tardy cosmos]

except if she gets her first heal tick twice

[last flare]

no, she goes to 40%, since it's max HP loss...lemme check

[tardy cosmos]

oh that make sense

[knotty crag]

wdym 7/13?

[spare torrent]

It's current HP loss.

[tardy cosmos]

not current hp like hu tao

[shrewd crescent]

It is called sacrificial sword for a reason

[subtle finch]

7 above 50 13 below

[tardy cosmos]

damage ticks

[knotty crag]

ahhhh sorry I've been focused on Yelan so I don't have that to check rn

[spare torrent]

It is current like Tao.

[subtle finch]

so it may be more

until uba confirms it could be more

[shrewd crescent]

Don't.

Don't do that to yourself. It's not worth it

[subtle finch]

but nagito told me to never lose hope

[shrewd crescent]

Just accept 7/13

[subtle finch]

ill assume 7/13 unless we get confirmation on different numbers

[plush mirage]

7/13 seems to be on purpose for an extra electro application lmao

3/4 electro application + 1 more if initial cast is seperate icd

[orchid folio]

ok but 7 in 2 seconds is an odd interval

[subtle finch]

^agreed

[orchid folio]

every.... .285 seconds?

[subtle finch]

but genshin is an odd game

Kuki EN
Ayato Q
Kazuha EQ
Yelan EQ
Ayato E5N3
Kazuha E
Kuki E
Ayato E5N3
Kuki Q

hows this rotation?

[plush mirage]

it is yeah... so far mhy's interval is pretty clean

[subtle finch]

this way Kuki Q gets below 50% hp on first rotation too and also gets kazuha and vv

[orchid folio]

and then when it goes to 3.5 seconds it's/// every .269 seconds?

[plush mirage]

but maybe they fucked it up on purpose to fit in one extra electro app under icd

[last flare]

mmmh, it's not specified in the skill description, we'll have to wait more info

[spare torrent]

It is.

[subtle finch]

wait if Kuki snapshots

might want to use her E after kazuha

[last flare]

I don't see it 😮

[subtle finch]

hmm

[spare torrent]

You blind.

[subtle finch]

I am hoping that Kuki does not snapshot

[last flare]

ha, indeed, thx

[subtle finch]

will make her a lot easier to use with kazuha if she doesnt

[orchid folio]

I don't think her E damage is worth altering rotations for

[subtle finch]

i agree

[orchid folio]

it's atk based after all

[subtle finch]

but if she doesnt snapshot she still get the dmg anyway

if her Q ends up being rlly weak might even be worth just not using it at all

[meager valve]

mihoyo are shying away from snapshotting as of late

[subtle finch]

since it doesnt provide anything other than damage

which is part of my disappointment

[orchid folio]

ok so I checked out the interval and 7 / 13 really doesn't make sense to me

[spare torrent]

Oh, right. Her base atk is low enough that PJC should make HP sands just as, if not more, valuable than ATK sands even if you're building for E damage.

[subtle finch]

Q doesnt do anything other than damage and looks like it might not do much of it

[subtle finch]

maybe the source for that counted wrong

[orchid folio]

even if it ticks immediately so we can pretend its 6/ 12 the tick rate doesn't make sense

.291 seconds per hit at 3.5 seconds?

[plush mirage]

let's wait for confirmation then

the fact it speds up after 2s is hilarious as well

[orchid folio]

amber is 1/9th of a second each hit, it's a repeating fraction but it is a fraction

for reference that above is 7/24th of a second per tick

??

[spare torrent]

1 (.25) 2 (.5) 3 (.75) 4 (1) 5 (1.25) 6 (1.5) 7 (1.75) 8 (2) 9 (2.25) 10 (2.5) 11 (2.75) 12 (3.0) 13 (3.25).
The clear answer is that it does not tick the last interval.

Or that it starts ticking .5s in and then is faster after that.

[orchid folio]

ok you know what @subtle finch she honestly doesn't seem so bad to me now

if her energy gen is alright sac makes her seem pretty good

I have her at 100k dpr with kazuha buff

not ideal but she's healing and hopefully batterying

[subtle finch]

Yeah that’s good enough imo

How many E ticks and c4 procs did you assume?

And is that 7 or 13?

Q procs

[orchid folio]

I assumed 13 q hits and only 10 e hits which is wrong

but 4 C4 since we get additional time

[subtle finch]

Also is that clam or ToTM?

[orchid folio]

oh true

[spare torrent]

What's she built using?

[orchid folio]

this was 2 tf 2 no

I'll try with totm

[spare torrent]

What weapon.

[subtle finch]

Sac

Unless he forgot to change it

[orchid folio]

totm is 95k

[spare torrent]

Oh, right.

[orchid folio]

yeah it's sac

[subtle finch]

What happens if you remove ToTM and put on clam

[simple cypress]

you have a bad time

[orchid folio]

yeah I have the healing here

[subtle finch]

I think clam is still gonna be beat for her overall damage if hydro resonance is there

[orchid folio]

need to know the rot length tho

like when are we using the 2nd E

I'll assume 20 seconds of E total

so we get 3 more hits out of sac

which actually I didn't have before so totm is 99k just below 100k

let me try clam

[spare torrent]

I still wanna try using PJC on her. lol

[tardy cosmos]

pjc hp dc?

[orchid folio]

also keep in mind her A4, we're not sure exactly how it works

for now I have it additive with healing bonus but it's possible it's a separate multiplier

[spare torrent]

dc?

[orchid folio]

damage crit I assume

[spare torrent]

Oh.

PJC HP/Electro/CD

Because with PJC, she's actually gaining more ATK from HP sands than from ATK sands.

[orchid folio]

oh

[tardy cosmos]

I hope yelan bow comes with pjc again

gonna get the bow for ganyu or yelan

[orchid folio]

clam isn't bad noir, 136k dpr

and that's without any EM built and without hydro resonance

[tardy cosmos]

maxi you're testing ec comp right

[orchid folio]

this isn't in a comp

it's just with kazuha buff

[tardy cosmos]

oh

alright

[orchid folio]

I don't want to do a full team calc until we have actually seen her lol

actually hold on

Are Healing Bonus and Incoming Healing Bonus... separate modifiers?

[placid pine]

No

Iirc they are on the same mult when I calced

[orchid folio]

OK thanks

[subtle finch]

so it was best for her own dps?

[orchid folio]

yeah it was

[tardy cosmos]

what about triple em

[orchid folio]

I'll indulge the curiosity

wtf

triple EM

Noir you have to check my math

[tardy cosmos]

is it high or low

[orchid folio]

waaaaay too high

[tardy cosmos]

[orchid folio]

"damage dealt is increased by 25% of elemental mastery"

how are we interpreting this?

[subtle finch]

idk

how does yaes work

[tardy cosmos]

flat damage before % and crits

[orchid folio]

yae's is additive skill%

oh it's additive you think

interesting

[tardy cosmos]

like sayu's iirc

[orchid folio]

the phrasing is very different from sayu

but that makes sense

hold on let me try that

I don't have EM scaling for attacks in my sheet

I have to update it 😦

[spare torrent]

Why wouldn't you have such a common and obvious mechanic on your sheets?

[tardy cosmos]

because reaction damage are usually copium

not worth to calculate

or hard to do

[orchid folio]

No I have reaction damage

but that's separate

triple EM is 136k with clam set

but if she has any ownership of EC or whatever

that's a big improvement

[tardy cosmos]

is 136k before reactions, or after?

[subtle finch]

Mei was right to preach triple em?

farming triple em clam tho

[orchid folio]

I'm not considering any EC or whatever

this is just her raw damage with kazuha, and clam

[tardy cosmos]

YESSS TRIPLE EM SHILLING VINDICATED

[subtle finch]

thats rlly good

[spare torrent]

Hm.

Wait, how is EM that good?

[orchid folio]

oh you know what

that was with hydro resonance

which makes sense the healing is very high

without its 120k

still has potential

[subtle finch]

still beating crit build tho?

[placid pine]

Is this c0

Or c6

[tardy cosmos]

or did you give your calc triple em and dc

[orchid folio]

C6 but not including the C6 itself

[placid pine]

Or in befween

[spare torrent]

Why can't they just release HP Spindle?

[placid pine]

I see

[subtle finch]

[orchid folio]

H D C is 126k under these conditions

but again that's no reactions included

[subtle finch]

HDC is hp damage crit?

[orchid folio]

yeah

[subtle finch]

[orchid folio]

let me see if I replace the HP with EM?

[placid pine]

Gonna check if I have em clams

[subtle finch]

yes plz

[tardy cosmos]

ballpark, with reactions included, do you think triple em can reach something like 180k

[orchid folio]

hm no it seems like you need to go all in on EM for it to be worthwhile

let me try subs

or hb circlet

[spare torrent]

Wait.

[orchid folio]

bruh

[calm ice]

[orchid folio]

EM EM HB with 10 hp% subs + 6 EM subs beats crit

it's 128k dpr

[spare torrent]

So what about using EM/EM/EM ToM Shinobu with R5 Iron Sting?

In a phys comp, wonder what her superconduct damage would be...

[tardy cosmos]

I dont think you gonna need to R5 iron sting

or maybe the dmg% will make it worthwhile

[simple cypress]

yes more EM believers

[subtle finch]

Wait

[placid pine]

What's the weapon bte

[subtle finch]

So her em scaling is actually good

[spare torrent]

Yeah, 24% DMG% is good.

[placid pine]

Btw

[orchid folio]

this is sac sword

[tardy cosmos]

em yae was stolen from me
i wont let mhy stole em shinobu away

[glad harness]

[placid pine]

Oh right

[orchid folio]

hold on I need to make sure my EM scaling is correct here

[subtle finch]

Ok overload Kuki might actually be rlly good if it’s doing decent damage from MVs/clam and overload damage

Gonna wait for maxi to triple check his math

[spare torrent]

[subtle finch]

And then I’ll calc it myself as well

After I’m done farming clam like a clown

[spare torrent]

"It's actually 40k DPR."

[subtle finch]

I hope Maxi is right cuz this makes her a lot better in my eyes if true

[orchid folio]

I may have been wrong

nah nothing that low

So her A4

[tardy cosmos]

lmao

[orchid folio]

her A4 for the healing

[tardy cosmos]

yeah for damage is only 25%

[orchid folio]

ugh

it isn't like Sayu

[glad harness]

Overload with kazuha and xiangling should be her dmg ceiling.

[orchid folio]

Sayu swirls is 1 point of EM -> this much healing more

[subtle finch]

It’s a flat increase to her healing right?

[orchid folio]

same with her burst boy

[subtle finch]

@small turtle you did healing calcs how did you do a4

[simple cypress]

so.. full EM TF Kuki?

[tardy cosmos]

maybe full em tom kuki

[subtle finch]

!!noir

[placid pine]

Can they pls just make her c4 not have cd

[orchid folio]

or lower the CD

[placid pine]

So ayato synergy

[subtle finch]

Wait for maxi to triple check his math once he does I’ll also calc it myself

[subtle finch]

I’d love it if it had lower scaling but no cooldown like fischl c6

[orchid folio]

I'm sorry ladies and gentlemen

it is 95k dpr

[tardy cosmos]

lmao

[rose tiger]

[subtle finch]

So what was the highest damage setup you got I forget

[orchid folio]

HDC

[tardy cosmos]

but that's before reaction

[orchid folio]

126k

[subtle finch]

Which set?

[orchid folio]

clam

[tardy cosmos]

so it wont be that bad

[placid pine]

What's 95

3em?

[orchid folio]

EM EM HB clam

[tardy cosmos]

damage per rotation

[subtle finch]

Thx Maxi

[placid pine]

Oh

[subtle finch]

What about em/damage/crit

[tardy cosmos]

thanks maxi

[orchid folio]

lowkey I want to calc EM EM HB sayu now

em dmg crit was lower

[tardy cosmos]

triple em?

[subtle finch]

Clam Sayu?

[tardy cosmos]

lower too?

[subtle finch]

Lower than both?

[orchid folio]

hold on tho

HP HP HP is 113k

[simple cypress]

em em hb clamyu can slap

[subtle finch]

So she’s easy to build

Many options

[tardy cosmos]

that's around 42k hp right
means 8.4k hp at 20%

[orchid folio]

43.8k hp

with triple hp

oh I had too many hp subs that's on me

[tardy cosmos]

8.6k hp
should not be too risky

[orchid folio]

HP HP HP is strangely good

[subtle finch]

What about hp hp crit

[simple cypress]

but I would put a fat atk stick on sayu if you're trying to get as much out of the first bubble

[subtle finch]

I’m assuming triple Hp is good because of clam?

That’s assuming 2 heals per clam right

[orchid folio]

I assumed 6 clams from 2 ticks and 1 clam from 1 tick

[subtle finch]

I don’t know what that means

[orchid folio]

6 of the clams come from 2 ticks of kuki heals

[tardy cosmos]

btw is clam really that good on healers

[orchid folio]

1 tick is only 1 tick of kuki heal

[simple cypress]

depends on the healer

[orchid folio]

since it's 20 seconds of presumed uptime

[subtle finch]

Huh?

I am very confused

Oh wait I think I get what you’re saying

[placid pine]

6 bubbles have 2 kuki heals

[spare torrent]

I still wanna know what PJC Shinobu with ToM could do in 15s with HP/Electro/CD.

[subtle finch]

You had 7 clam procs, 6 with 2 1 with 1

[orchid folio]

hold on

[shrewd crescent]

What about the other 4 bubbles

I'm so confused

[subtle finch]

So assuming a 25s rotation? Seems reasonable

[subtle finch]

What other 4

[placid pine]

Where did the other 4 come from

[orchid folio]

I need to know how clam works more actually

[shrewd crescent]

I don't know

That's why I said I'm confused

[placid pine]

3.5 * 7 = 24.5 sec

[orchid folio]

0s - kuki heal tick - clam appears
1.5s - kuki heal tick - clam grows
3s - kuki heal tick - clam pops

does this heal count for clam damage?

[placid pine]

That's the rotation time

[glossy reef]

Is Ocean-Hued better than Maiden's? I see everyone talk about Ocean Hue and never Maiden's here

[simple cypress]

all 3 heals in that 3 second window will count

[tardy cosmos]

maiden doesnt contribute to team damage no

[mental stag]

cuz maiden su-

[shrewd crescent]

Okay so what are "6 bubbles"

[placid pine]

It is largely because ohc has dmg, maiden doesn't

[orchid folio]

is that so, all 3 including the 1 that occurs as the clam should start to pop

[simple cypress]

yep

[orchid folio]

my calcs are wrong let me correct

[subtle finch]

At 0 and 1.5s it should yes I think

[orchid folio]

this will increase damage

[simple cypress]

sayu's burst with clam timing is similar in that a heal happens right when it pops, but it counts

[subtle finch]

Wait so she can actually get 3 clam procs?

[orchid folio]

no each clam proc will have 3 kuki ticks

[placid pine]

Since there's a total of 7 bubbles created throughout that time, 6 of them have 2 heals from kuki, whole 1 has 1 heal from kuki

[subtle finch]

Sorry that’s what I meant

Describing clam shit is hard

Lol

[orchid folio]

I need to make a timeline of events

[glossy reef]

But isn't Maiden's better for general healing because of the 4-piece bonus? Isn't that what you would want on a healer, more healing?

[subtle finch]

Feel like you will need exact timing to get 3 tho

So I hope they change it to 1s instead of 1.5

[placid pine]

True but u want damage

[subtle finch]

Wait her E ticks automatically right

[glossy reef]

Why would I want damage on a healer?

[placid pine]

That's why healers give more than just healing using ohc

[tardy cosmos]

at some point you dont need more healimg

[placid pine]

To not waste slot

[subtle finch]

Yes but you don’t need that ever

[subtle finch]

Why wouldn’t you

I don’t understand

[orchid folio]

since her E tick is the only thing proccing it if sayuman is correct it will always work exactly like that

[shrewd crescent]

6 having 2 heals meaning Kuki's healing happened twice to "power" that clam damage?

[subtle finch]

More damage is better than less damage

[placid pine]

Yup

[subtle finch]

Pog

[shrewd crescent]

I'm learning

[tardy cosmos]

change to 1.3s
so 7 overloads in a rotation

[glossy reef]

I don't know if my Qiqi is just built wrong but I could use more healing
It takes a couple of hits to get my characters back to full

[subtle finch]

Do you need to be at full tho?

[glossy reef]

I mean, it'd be nice?
I don't run a shield, nor do I run a character that benefits from low HP

[simple cypress]

does this help

[subtle finch]

If all you are care about is comfort from having the biggest heals possible then for that specific purpose maidens is better

[orchid folio]

so does that heal count for the pop

[simple cypress]

all three should count

[subtle finch]

[mental stag]

nd thats wastefull .. its like you only going for c.rate where your max cap is %100 nd u built it to %150 instead

same situation why generally maiden is unnecceserry nd wastefull .. i mean when u are already full hp .. what use in there for having extra healing bonus whatsoever .. or why do u demand extra healing bonus when u could get to max hp with 3 hits anyways ..

[subtle finch]

Idk if akane was counting all 3 or not

Need him to check ping

Kuki E ticks trigger automatically right I forget

[orchid folio]

personal damage it definitely looks like clam is the way to go

[subtle finch]

Automatically every 1.5s?

[orchid folio]

yes

[subtle finch]

Cuz if it’s automatic that should work

[tardy cosmos]

team damage might be different

[subtle finch]

But if it required player input like attacking to trigger I don’t think it would

[orchid folio]

yeah depending on the team totm could provide more value

[subtle finch]

My faith in Kuki getting restored if yall are correct

Yeah is prob a team by team basis

[shrewd crescent]

All it took was Clam damage?

[mental stag]

bdw guys .. do you know the range of Kuki's ES circle? is it smol like Qiqi's? or a bit wider?

[subtle finch]

But now I think she has a lot more value than I thought

[lament cargo]

did we get new info ?

[tardy cosmos]

uba said 3 hilichurls wide

[lament cargo]

[subtle finch]

She might be able to do good clam damage with say Eula with SC and Eula shred

[tardy cosmos]

idk if it's radius or diamter

[subtle finch]

No just realizing she might get 3 clam heals and not 2

[tardy cosmos]

if it's radius thay's around pyronado
if it's diameter it's around qiqi's skills

[lament cargo]

oh ok

[mental stag]

hmm .. sooo she wouldnt strugle with using ToTM? i guess? i mean if ur dps is a close range?

[tardy cosmos]

knowing mihoyo it's probably qiqi skill's width

[shrewd crescent]

I'm still waiting to be proven wrong and having her E changed to hp scaling

[glossy reef]

Well to get to full with my Qiqi, it takes more than 3 hits. The passive regen is usually able to restore a lot of my HP, but when I get body slammed by Azhdaha or something, that passive regen isn't really going to save me.

Which is why I look for more healing on my Qiqi- if I can heal even more with her, then my team is doing better.

[shrewd crescent]

Definitely not a copium idea

[mental stag]

ahhh then prolly Qiqi lik

[subtle finch]

Same

[glossy reef]

Isn't it already Max HP?

[subtle finch]

Praying it’s bad wording

Cuz if her E was going scaling we could build healing e damage and ult damage all together

[tardy cosmos]

e scales off of atk

[shrewd crescent]

The damage on E looks like it's atk scaling but the healing itself is hp

[subtle finch]

And she would be a very respectable unit

[glossy reef]

Wait, what? Seriously?

[placid pine]

Is there anyone that heals 1.5 seconds or 1 second or 3 seconds

So we can rest if last heal can count

[tardy cosmos]

that's why noir was angry before lmao

[orchid folio]

bennett is every second

iirc

[spare torrent]

But you can do that already with PJC, because PJC provides more ATK from HP sands than ATK sands does on her.

[shrewd crescent]

Jade Cutter Kuki with hp scaling everything

[subtle finch]

Ok well not everyone has pjc

And I mean like your sands too

[shrewd crescent]

We're poor

[tardy cosmos]

yeah @orchid folio what about pjc hpdc build

[placid pine]

What is diona's tick rste

[orchid folio]

it was fine

I didn't check with the current knowledge of ticks tho

[mental stag]

2 sec iirc

[orchid folio]

and I didn't check with clam

[shrewd crescent]

Once every like 2 seconds?

[subtle finch]

Maxi how much damage do you get it 3 heal ticks works

[placid pine]

Aysh

[orchid folio]

I just finished the timeline

[tardy cosmos]

for team damage AP Shinobu might be good as well

[orchid folio]

it's 5 clams of 3 ticks each

let me get the damage now

[placid pine]

What about sayu

[orchid folio]

this is kuki tc I'll do sayu another time

[mental stag]

should be 2 sec as well

[placid pine]

I mean her tick rste

[glossy reef]

Is EM even worth building onto Shinobu so far with her healing, or just all in on HP%?

[placid pine]

Who ticks 1.5 seconds

OH

[subtle finch]

We don’t know yet

[placid pine]

Gorou c4

Maybe yall can test if yall have that...

[subtle finch]

I don’t have

[placid pine]

Surely I dont

[orchid folio]

I do

[glossy reef]

I got C1 if that helps

[tardy cosmos]

I dont even have c0 gorou

skipped itto altogether

[placid pine]

Need the c4 to test the heal

[mental stag]

when calcing her numbers .. are u guys giving her full HP artis? or standart build with Electro-crit? or something else?

[orchid folio]

HP HP HB is at 120k now

with 5 clams of 3 ticks each

[mental stag]

also u know how many hits her Q does?

[subtle finch]

Btw is that hydro resonance?

[orchid folio]

No

[subtle finch]

Uba said he doesn’t know

[mental stag]

so her Q still a mystery to all

[subtle finch]

Speaking of, I wish her Q healed too

[glossy reef]

Same

[orchid folio]

I actually realized here that my healing calcs for sayu were wrong before and she's doing even more healing than I had thought

[simple cypress]

here is the bubble timing for sayu if it helps

[tardy cosmos]

right now maxi is calcing hp hp hb clam

[mental stag]

she indeed takes her "ninja" job seriously appearently .. secretive nd evasive .. ohh Kuki ..

[subtle finch]

Aren’t you happy you get to tell us about Sayu

[tardy cosmos]

[orchid folio]

but her skill ticks, the actual damage itself

[simple cypress]

always happy to c:

[orchid folio]

is critting for 700 😭😭

[tardy cosmos]

hahahahhaha

[placid pine]

JAHSHSHSHHS

[subtle finch]

How much is burst doing

[orchid folio]

3.2k

[subtle finch]

Per tick or total

[orchid folio]

oh total?

[placid pine]

Yas queen give us 700

[tardy cosmos]

total?

[subtle finch]

[orchid folio]

41k

[subtle finch]

Assuming 7?

[orchid folio]

might not even be worth casting

13

[subtle finch]

Agreed

Since it doesn’t heal or anything

[mental stag]

[tardy cosmos]

shime shinobu

[placid pine]

Might be worthwhile for some reactions

[subtle finch]

What if hp hp crit?

[nova sierra]

what ab her e? how much does it heal

[orchid folio]

yeah we're focusing on her healing now

[nova sierra]

oh!

[orchid folio]

hp hp crit doesn't seem worth it

but tbh they're all pretty close

[subtle finch]

Mainly wanna know how close they all are for the sake of knowing what’s worth keeping when farming

[mental stag]

soo her personal dmg is real bad? so u trying to max her healing to abuse clam effect instead?

[subtle finch]

[simple cypress]

does ayato's comp need the vv shred? because if not, sayu's clam damage is her highest burst dps potential

[orchid folio]

HP Electro Crit is 124k

the highest so far?

[subtle finch]

Yes

[subtle finch]

With clam?

[simple cypress]

oof.. oh well
vv always eclipses clam :<

[orchid folio]

yeah

HP Electro HB is 125k

[subtle finch]

Unless double anemo

[orchid folio]

they are too close, it's all substats at this point

[mental stag]

is that 124k includes ES-Q + clam dmg total?

[glad harness]

except in Taser with double anemo! I always love to see my sayu do 3 max clams.

[orchid folio]

So for some reason electro is worth it

[shrewd crescent]

It's always worth it

[tardy cosmos]

it's either abuse clam or abuse reaction

[mental stag]

umm what about hp-pshy dmg -crit build for clam?

[placid pine]

What if tf

[mental stag]

[orchid folio]

phys? clam doesn't scale off phys damage

I removed the EM subs

her EM scaling is bad

[placid pine]

Phys doesn't affect clams

[simple cypress]

only phys res shred affects clam

[placid pine]

Phys res however does

[mental stag]

ahh nvm then .. never used clam so didnt know that .. my own dumbness sorry

[simple cypress]

it's okay we all learned something today

[glossy reef]

So from what I'm able to gather from this convo, Shinobu is fucked?

[orchid folio]

@subtle finch we need an optimizer for this

[shrewd crescent]

Shes fine imo

[subtle finch]

How I make that

[orchid folio]

135k with HP Electro CR

with more optimized subs

[subtle finch]

[mental stag]

[spare torrent]

WAIT A SEC

[mental stag]

200k soon

[shrewd crescent]

What's the set up for that?

[amber plover]

Huh? Do we know how her burst works now?

[spare torrent]

IF PHYS RES SHRED AFFECTS CLAM...
What if she's in a comp that's doing 80% Phys shred?!

[subtle finch]

No

[glad harness]

She's fine. We are just trying to optimize the dmg output. Being electro healer and tenacity user is already very good.

[subtle finch]

Eula

[spare torrent]

Pikeli.

[subtle finch]

Eula Kuki Xinyan

[subtle finch]

Ok now Kuki over fischl in Pikeli makes sense

[mental stag]

bdw this all 120-135k thingies for 1 rotation time right? is it within 20 sec or 15/18 sec?

[subtle finch]

I think Maxi current calcs have hydro resonance tho

[spare torrent]

Alrighty. I'm going Clam over ToM, I think.

[orchid folio]

no they don't

[subtle finch]

Oh shit

[orchid folio]

but they did have VV

so let me remove VV and kazuha buff

[subtle finch]

So it’s even more in the Ayato Yelan team

[shrewd crescent]

What's the weapon

[subtle finch]

Sac

For E uptime

[shrewd crescent]

Sac got that damage?

[spare torrent]

Doesn't need Sac in Pikeli since the rotation's short.

[subtle finch]

In the Pikeli team I think you could do a 15s rotation

Yeah

[orchid folio]

with superconduct like in a eula team she's at 123k

with HP HP HB

[little forge]

What is it?

[mental stag]

i would say wait a bit more before deciding .. i mean Clam is gud for her personal dmg but ToTM benefits the team dmg .. so wait for tc folks to do the comparison for both sets

[orchid folio]

there's a lot of exploration that needs to take place for her is where I'm gonna leave it

[spare torrent]

Zhongli/Yun Jin/Rosaria/Shinobu.

[orchid folio]

it's not immediately obvious which subs she needs to prioritize etc

and it will likely depend on teamcomp too

[little forge]

Why is it called pikeli?

[spare torrent]

Because he uses Crescent Pike.

[tardy cosmos]

crescent pike zhongli

[simple cypress]

looks like pickly

[little forge]

Ah, pikeli

Got it

[spare torrent]

I know, I know, but this is giving me some hopium.

[orchid folio]

with the -80 phys res shred from Rosaria c6 + zhongli + superconduct she's at almost 140k

[tardy cosmos]

@subtle finch shinobu looking good

[orchid folio]

we need to see her battery potential

[little forge]

For some reason I read it as ['pi:keli]

[orchid folio]

but I think she's fine

[spare torrent]

Is that still with Sac?

[orchid folio]

I was dooming her at first

yes still with sac

[mental stag]

defo 200k soon .. trust

[spare torrent]

So, it could go higher with a more fitting weapon.

[orchid folio]

she doesn't really care about ATK so no reason to run a good weapon on her

[subtle finch]

So prob save any artifact with a usable main stat of hp, HB, or electro or crit

[orchid folio]

sac is the best weapon cuz it gives her more uptime on healing

[tardy cosmos]

corin still want to test pjc haha

[subtle finch]

And on energy production

[spare torrent]

I was thinking R5 Iron Sting as a budget option, since it's still better damage than Sac.

[orchid folio]

but it isn't better damage than sac is what I'm saying

[simple cypress]

sac over fav?

[orchid folio]

depending on rotation length you miss out on a lot of uptime of her skill which translated to clams lost

[subtle finch]

I think Corin means on a 15s rotation

[orchid folio]

oh on a 15s rotation

[subtle finch]

Cuz he’s doing Pikeli

[orchid folio]

definitely something to look into yeah

[spare torrent]

Rotation length for Pikeli is about 15s.

[orchid folio]

PJC is fine there

she probably won't burst

depending on ER ofc

[subtle finch]

Pikeli is smooth as butter

[mental stag]

but isnt c2 litterally makes her ES infinite cuz it gives 3 more sec to her ES?

soo for c2 sac sword is unneccery i guess?

[simple cypress]

neither will zhongli

[subtle finch]

I’d assume no burst to ensure you don’t go beyond 15s rotation yeah

[tardy cosmos]

hmm

[orchid folio]

well if your rotation is anything other than exactly 15 seconds or increments thereof, you won't have 100% uptime

[tardy cosmos]

I think Spindle will be good for shinobu

[subtle finch]

^

[orchid folio]

Oh

no he's on to something

she has decent base def

[subtle finch]

[orchid folio]

gets about the same number of hits as albedo

[spare torrent]

We need HP Spindle tbh.

[orchid folio]

let me calc it in a 15s rotation

[tardy cosmos]

spindle fixes the skill's low scalimg

[mental stag]

why not just festering ?

[tardy cosmos]

the problem lies with the 45% scaling

[mental stag]

nvm cuz ES's scaling bad

[spare torrent]

WAIT

[little charm]

Did we find out what the q does

[simple cypress]

q is like amber's burst

[spare torrent]

What if you use... E bot Shinobu in an Itto comp with Spindle and just Gorou E at the start of the comp?

[little charm]

We are sure? Does it hit as much as ambers burst?

[spare torrent]

Like uh... Gorou E > Shinobu E > Albedo E > Gorou Q > Itto

[orchid folio]

we need to know if shinobu snapshots

[mental stag]

[orchid folio]

problem is you can't run albedo AND shinobu on spindle

[rose tiger]

whats albedo using then? harbinger?

[spare torrent]

Oh.

Freedom-Sworn, fuck it.

[little forge]

Exactly

[little charm]

So at t10 what's the scaling uhh

[spare torrent]

Yeah, sorry, I overlooked that one major thing.

[tardy cosmos]

give albedo your pjc

[spare torrent]

Ok, let's try again. Shinobu as flex for Triple Geo Noelle.

[gaunt pivot]

pin this shit

[lament cargo]

how reliable is this ?

[calm ice]

We took what we can get

[gaunt pivot]

or confirm with uba first...

[spare torrent]

Uba doesn't care about Shinobu.

[lament cargo]

uba said not to ask about kuki yet

[gaunt pivot]

asking if someone is using his name to spread fake info counts?

[mental stag]

i think thats safe

[orchid folio]

idk people were spamming him with just random questions in yelan TC

I felt bad for him

[gaunt pivot]

he asked for it

[mental stag]

more reason to ping him here .. at least he might think its something serious

[lament cargo]

he mainly said ask yelan questions iirc

[simple cypress]

no idea tbh.. i wasn't there for whatever q&a
it's posted in the shinobu leaks channel in kuki mains

[tardy cosmos]

how is spindle shinobu

[lunar zealot]

i ve done a big sheet on sayu clam. Let me tell you she is the 2nd best clam user after Qiqi. her ult heals a bit faster than every 1.5sec so you basically have 3 tics in every bubble. you start the combo with skill and proc the ascension heal to trigger the first bubble, thenyou dont immediately press Q, you wait just an instant and press q to fully charge the first bubble, it explodes and the first daruma solo heal tick will create the 2nd bubble, all daruma heal will go into bubble,

[orchid folio]

I ran into a confusion

[lunar zealot]

she is not known as a clam user bcz 4VV exists

[lament cargo]

where koko

[tardy cosmos]

what is it

[orchid folio]

I can't tell how many clam procs she gets

in fact I can't tell if shinobu has 10 or 11 procs of her skill

[tardy cosmos]

isnt the clam peoc still the same
she just get more scaling on skill

oh

hmm

[lunar zealot]

kokomi doesnt nearly charge as much clam damages while not needing field time as qiqi and sayu

[subtle finch]

if its like other DoT abilities it should get an initial DoT proc on cast

like kazuha and rosaria

[lunar zealot]

kokomi needs to attack to charge it

[subtle finch]

they both get a tick on cast

[orchid folio]

but doesn't that kind of defeat the purpose of hurting herself for it

[subtle finch]

which is why kazuha ult gets 6 swirls and not 5

[orchid folio]

she'll immediately heal

[simple cypress]

can i see your sayu clam sheet?
E before Q seems weird to me.. I found that would mess up the timing

[subtle finch]

idk

we need footage

[simple cypress]

but i guess you're waiting? that seems unoptimal
inoptimal? nonoptimal? what's the word

[orchid folio]

in which case its 11 ticks at c2

not 10

[lunar zealot]

well, wait 5 min, have to co on my other computer :p

[dapper walrus]

yall what if i built a dps healer comp
qiqi-diona-sayu-shinobu
dps qiqi with superconduct

[calm ice]

3mins before paimons bargain resets

[lunar zealot]

and need to look how to make sheet read only xD

[simple cypress]

this is what i've made that includes clam damage with different builds and whether or not sayu is in a swirl friendly environment
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/12Jqdd9LPur-_T22x_rO7XIN8uVTmLc_mhUBRjil4df8/edit#gid=1403088465

[dapper walrus]

WAIT I KNOW WHATS BETTER

barbara-qiqi-diona-sayu

the ultimate freeze team

[orchid folio]

113k dpr

but that includes her burst

let me try different configurations

[simple cypress]

kokomi kuki sayu bennett
Bennett QE > Kokomi Q > Kuki QE > Sayu Q hE
OverHealVape

[tardy cosmos]

spindle def/elec/crit

[brazen snow]

5.6k DPS?

[lunar zealot]

@simple cypress how u make read only xD im noob at sharing, i do calc for myself xD

[dapper walrus]

would do that if i had kokomi </3

[gaunt pivot]

and kuki is gone

[simple cypress]

when you press 'share' there's an option to choose what people with the link can do.. i think read only is the default

[orchid folio]

100k

[dapper walrus]

i can just replace diona with kuki

[gaunt pivot]

XQ is a healer

[dapper walrus]

freezehealtazer

[subtle finch]

Oh Vin came to help

Nice

[lunar zealot]

@simple cypress https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1BKAIoJ120XEHvJ-fUD1GTTUKYoRXjzdkoq-TU07orDY/edit?usp=sharing

[tardy cosmos]

ah sadge

[orchid folio]

spindle doesn't seem bad

[tardy cosmos]

but not too good either right

[subtle finch]

Maxi doing gods work

[tardy cosmos]

thanks maxi

[lunar zealot]

parameters have green background

[orchid folio]

it gets to like 113k with hp electro cr

oh

I wasn't including the -20 res shred from ZL