Yunjin Thread

[tardy thunder]

catch work as an ER stick tho

[red island]

oh nevermind lol

[viral lotus]

that stat won't transfer to the buffed target

[tardy thunder]

but you prob have a raiden or xianling or rosaria that would want your catch instead

but if you dont, no reason not to

[red island]

It's the same with shenhe's case

I guess favonius is the way to go

[tardy thunder]

or starglitter

or skyward spine

or deathmatch if you have enough ER without weapon

[red island]

however she won't have enough crit to proc everytime

[viral lotus]

tbh, yunjin doesn't really have a must have weapon

[red island]

deathmatch is copium

[tardy thunder]

you can still use fav on her as just an ER stick without fishing for procs

[viral lotus]

deathmatch is only for the defense

[tardy thunder]

how?

its the only polearm in the game that increases defense

how is that copium

[viral lotus]

i think you misunderstand how yunjin works @red island

[red island]

the def bonus wont be active for one strong opponent

there will only be atk buff

[tardy thunder]

so?

[viral lotus]

name me one abyss floor this rotation that only has 1 mob on field the entire time

[tardy thunder]

almost all the content in game is more than one target

[viral lotus]

even magu kenki is 3 mobs now

[red island]

magu kenki

[tardy thunder]

theres 3 of them

[red island]

Abyss 2.4

[tardy thunder]

so one chamber out of 3

[viral lotus]

"this rotation"

[tardy thunder]

out of one rotation

you are proving my point

one enemy out of 3 chambers out of one rotation

[viral lotus]

just put her in other party, issue solved

[red island]

still tho at some point in the end of every chamber you will see yourself left with one enemy

[viral lotus]

still, i wouldn't waste DM on yunjin

[tardy thunder]

not sure how thats a waste

[tardy thunder]

im not seeing the issue

if you're left with only one enemy you already won

[red island]

the def% will be up like 80% of the time

[viral lotus]

can go on the driver instead

[compact girder]

Whos the driver though

[viral lotus]

i only have 1 DM

[tardy thunder]

and if the driver isnt a polearm?

[tardy thunder]

uh thats really good...

[viral lotus]

then use it on the other team if it needs it

[tawny spoke]

The yoi comp will be pog on 2.4

[tardy thunder]

you sound like you are selling DM not speaking against it Nov

[compact girder]

Which character wants DM over catch tho

[tardy thunder]

[red island]

Favonius is the way to go

[tardy thunder]

^

[compact girder]

What if its in 3geo

[tardy thunder]

DM is specifically for if you dont need the extra ER from a weapon.

[viral lotus]

Hutao if you don't have homa

[compact girder]

Dragonsbane

[red island]

Currently there isn't really any replacement other than these 2 weapons

[compact girder]

[viral lotus]

assuming i got good DB

[tardy thunder]

starglitter and skyward spine also work

and catch if you dont have anyone else using it

you just want an ER stick or DM

until we get an actual def weapon

for her

[compact girder]

DM is if you have enough ER already

[tardy thunder]

^

[red island]

All of these weapons are kinda like on the C tier for yun jin

[compact girder]

What else do we use then

Theres literally nothing else

Unless you go homa yun jin and shit out 120k counters

[sand sluice]

I think she'll get a free def weapon sooner or later

[red island]

Yeah it will take her some time to stand out

[compact girder]

[tardy thunder]

she shouldve been sword

[red island]

until theres a new polearm

[tardy thunder]

imagine cinnabar on her

would be so fucking good

[compact girder]

She already stands out with yoi no?

[tardy thunder]

i think he means a weapon that stands out on her

[red island]

A good polearm would do her even more damage

[viral lotus]

jokes aside, yea, DM started becoming less useful in my account as of late, its already lvl 90 so if ill get yunjin it will probably just park on her

[red island]

Not that she's bad now I mean

[viral lotus]

because i got myself homa on hutao's banner

[tardy thunder]

the fact that there's not even a 3 star defense polearm is pain

[viral lotus]

Believe in 2.5 event defense polearm

[tardy thunder]

why would that happen

[viral lotus]

yoimiya rerun

let me cope even harder

[tardy thunder]

maybe they could do a weird thing and give her a signature 4 star weapon on a banner

[viral lotus]

[tardy thunder]

like how fischl randomly got that 4 star bow as banner weapon

[viral lotus]

i think that was related to her release on honkai

i think that's the bow they gave her there?

[tardy thunder]

Ah

[viral lotus]

its weird that they'd release a 4 star with literally no reasonable weapon for them to wear

[tardy thunder]

They want her to use dragons bane for bigger crystals lol

[red island]

How's Childe with Yun Jin

[tardy thunder]

I wish she could use Kitain properly for energy refund and bigger crystals

[viral lotus]

because if they don't plan to release a weapon for her, they'd balance her around never having a weapon, but then they won't be able to release such a weapon in the future. But if they plan to release a weapon, she'd be balanced around that and feel weak until that weapon arrives

[tardy thunder]

Does Kitain work if you do QE? Like, does it work if there’s no energy to drain?

[viral lotus]

tho, so far, the TCs of yunjin look promising

[viral lotus]

nah

i bet it works like shim

[tardy thunder]

I’ll ask kqm

[viral lotus]

shim doesn't trigger if you don't have enough energy

annoyingly, kitain with an EQ basically ruins her

and EM is ehhh

[tardy thunder]

Works

According to KQM

[viral lotus]

really?!

wow

[tardy thunder]

Yeah

[viral lotus]

15 free energy?

for real?

[tardy thunder]

So I guess you can do Yunjin QE instead of EQ with Kitain

[viral lotus]

15 energy are not affected by ER tho, right?

[tardy thunder]

Correct

So I guess if you want an energy weapon that does slightly more than just give energy you can use Kitain

[viral lotus]

hmm, i wonder what's the breakpoint between kitain and Fav in terms of ER then

[tardy thunder]

And getting bigger crystal

[viral lotus]

so you only need 5 billets

[tardy thunder]

Don’t think it matters both should easily get you enough energy if you have decent er subs I would think

She already ascends with 26.7 ER

[viral lotus]

oh wait... if you go QE, yunjin won't grab her own E particles

[tardy thunder]

You could also just use an r1 starglitter

[red island]

So where does Yun Jin get her own Geo%

[viral lotus]

you want to swap her out right away

[tardy thunder]

She doesn’t

[viral lotus]

she doesn't need it

[red island]

Do you get to equip other members with geo

[viral lotus]

E damage is negligible

[viral lotus]

yunjin Q does not deal geo damage

[red island]

Interesting...

[viral lotus]

it intergrates damage into normal attacks of the active character

[compact girder]

Initial hit does

[tardy thunder]

fair point. she still need 6-10 ER subs with r5 kitain in the Summer Opera team without catching her own particle

so just use an actual ER weapon

[viral lotus]

who gives a damn about that

[tardy thunder]

[compact girder]

Oh

Idk im running some crit on my yun jin because i wanna mess around with E

[red island]

the first hit is like 8 triggers

[tardy thunder]

?

[viral lotus]

400% MV on lvl 10 burst geo is ehhh

[red island]

How about that sweet level 2 charge damage

670%

[viral lotus]

its cute, but you need to focus on defense to make it deal damage

if you focus defense, burst hit doesn't do much

and if you compare it to beidou, it kinda falls short

[tardy thunder]

And it scale with attack not def

[viral lotus]

still, its not bad

[red island]

I like how she can be played both ways

[tardy thunder]

[viral lotus]

ikr?

i think the only non-copium way to play yunjin is c6 self driving yunjin

but maybe that's a bit copium as well

the numbers were serviceable at least, but feels like a waste to not focus all the way with defense on her

[tardy thunder]

buffer Yun Jin isn’t copium

[viral lotus]

i didn't say buffer yunjin is copium o-o

i meant in how to build her as a DPS

[tardy thunder]

You said the only non copium way

[viral lotus]

only dps way to build her

[tardy thunder]

you shoulda made that clear

[viral lotus]

oo i forgot to reply to nov lol

buffer yunjin is clearly the best way to play her

should go without saying tbh

dps on the other hand... focusing on E and Q hit damage is silly

[red island]

well is childe also a good pair with yun jin?

I don't have yoimiya...

[viral lotus]

hmm, i don't remember seeing people's calculations on him

[red island]

he's another AA spammer

[viral lotus]

@tardy thunder does childe's hydro explosions count as normal attack?

[red island]

Rust increases the dmg from riptide

[rocky adder]

Childe mostly does charge attacks though

[red island]

does that make it a normal hit? Idk

[rocky adder]

Also I know this
It counts as his E cause stringless increases it

[viral lotus]

conflicting answers

[rocky adder]

If you mean the riptide

[red island]

normal attack% does the same thing too

[viral lotus]

ye riptide

[rocky adder]

I might count as burst for some reason but I know stringless increases it so it can't be normal

[viral lotus]

random redditor
wasn't able to find answers in KQM for some reason

maybe i wasn't searching well enough

but it says skill damage

[rocky adder]

It's a weird thing

[viral lotus]

nvm found it on KQM

[rocky adder]

While it's probably not good but when Yun is out in just going to test a team of yoimiya, burst support Childe, Yun Jin, flex
To see what normal attack talent 11 yoimiya can do

[viral lotus]

so i don't think childe will go well with yunjin

he spams charge attacks a lot more than normals in the popular rotations

so if riptides won't trigger yunjin stacks, then you won't be left with much

[red island]

True...

[viral lotus]

unless you want to forcefully use only normal attacks on childe, i don't know how yunjin will help him

[red island]

Yun Jin needs a ton of normal attack% so it better be a bow user right

Damn I should've pulled yoimiya

[rocky adder]

Maybe thundering pulse Childe cause that's when he gets his damage from normal atatcks

[rocky adder]

[sand sluice]

Yunjin's not gonna change the fact that Yoi is purely single target

[red island]

Rust gives the same amount of Normal Attack% with Thundering Pulse

Both single target users can't go wrong

[viral lotus]

yunjin wants the driver to do fast normal attacks, and have many multipliers. So crits, damage%, and reactions like melt and vape

not necessary just normal damage%

[red island]

Yoimiya, Yunjin, Xingqiu, Bennett?

[viral lotus]

sure

[red island]

I heard albedo is good too

What's her meta team then

[rocky adder]

Ok?

[viral lotus]

but i'd go with VV anemo instead of bennet, like kazuha or sucrose

[red island]

Yes kazuha helps alot with clearing mobs

[rocky adder]

What about fichl instead of xingqui?

[rocky adder]

Does that team have a healer?

[red island]

Fischl has high icd when not c6

Same with raiden i think

[tardy thunder]

Does it matter

Kazuha is AoE coverage

[red island]

With this team we have 3 single target users

[tardy thunder]

Some do

[red island]

Boss would go poof

[tardy thunder]

Idk which

[rocky adder]

Beidou normally fixes AoE as well doesn't she?

[tardy thunder]

Ya

Being mostly ST isn’t nearly as bad as it’s made out to be

If you kill each enemy super fast does it really matter you’re ST

[rocky adder]

People make it a bigger deal when it is
Plus yoimiya is great at enabling supports

[tardy thunder]

If yoi gets rerun I might go for her and pulse. If there’s no one else I want around the corner

[gleaming cedar]

which has a better impact for sands,goblet and circlet combined?
Def ,Def ,Def or Def ,Geobonus , Def or Def , Geobonus , Cdmg/Crate

[languid socket]

For buffing or her personal damage?

[gleaming cedar]

for team buff

[languid socket]

The former with er subs emphasis

[gleaming cedar]

thanks
is running ER sands still viable? I plan to use proto starglitter if that compensates everything then I'll just go def on all

[languid socket]

Depends on how many geo

[gleaming cedar]

she's the only geo
I plan to use her as a buffer for any teams like what peeps do with Bennett and Sara

[languid socket]

I think she needs more er than that, try to aim er subs from the defense pieces you're using, she has er ascension but she will need more er to compensate being the sole geo and only producing 3 particles at most

[gleaming cedar]

got it thanks

[languid socket]

I would try to avoid using the er sands if need be just because it reduces her buff damage

And while it is annoying I know, because of my recent farming with getting er subs

I would only use one if you're trying to keep upkeep on the burst and replace it with a defense piece that gives required er

[red island]

I converted all my def circlets and goblets yesterday lmao

what have I done

[red island]

xiao is broken with yun jin

100% damage bonus

first normal attack is 2 hits

[sand sluice]

Hate to break your bubble but someone calced that

It's a marginal increase compared to the usual tactics

[red island]

what's the usual?

[sand sluice]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1aB3XMmnG76nzGqidDE80ePfV78Aq_J2g2Y2aZkwm8MA/edit#gid=0

The usual is plunge spam

[red island]

let me see...

[winter steeple]

So not viable

[red island]

he's apparently comparing yun jin to bennett

if yun jin is not that good with xiao then what can you even use her for

just slap bennett instead

[river yew]

Yoi?

I think that's just the reason she was made mostly

[winter steeple]

Ya same

[red island]

what advantage does yoimiya have over xiao

[river yew]

she does nas

[winter steeple]

Vape and crit ascension

[red island]

crit same with xiao

[river yew]

xiao is also crit asc btw

[winter steeple]

Along with dmg bonus related passives

[river yew]

also maybe maybe not she can work with yoi E

[red island]

vape only happens for 3 nas

[river yew]

But anyways

[red island]

You can always use Bennett I mean

[winter steeple]

It’s still strong

[river yew]

the fact that yoi is already NA based is important enough

[river yew]

you could use both, or you could use yunjin for lower opportunity cost

[red island]

Ikr

[winter steeple]

According to calcs Yunjin Yoi nearly matches fireworks with beidou Bennett

[tawdry lava]

did somebody calced noelle?

[winter steeple]

Pure pyro

Currently calcing vape Yoijin

[red island]

It's like saying sucrose is bad cuz there's kazuha

I think xiao yunjin is pretty poggers

[winter steeple]

Ok sure

[red island]

the dps is pretty close to what yoi gets

[winter steeple]

23k?

Noir did some and got 36k

[red island]

I haven't done any calculations lol

[winter steeple]

How can ya say for sure then

[red island]

it's just that they basically have the same stats so it's easy to assume

[winter steeple]

[red island]

one little advantage xiao has is he does some aoe

[winter steeple]

Sure that counts

[winter steeple]

Pls quote numbers when saying statements like this tho

[river yew]

The thing is

[winter steeple]

Don’t feelscraft pls

[red island]

yoimiyas aa is stronger but xiao benefits more from yun jin with that 100% bonus

[river yew]

don't quote me on this but afaik waving in nas on xiao is usually a dps loss

[tawdry lava]

...huh?

[red island]

@winter steeple my bad

[river yew]

so you lose some dps and you get some in return so the result is pretty minor

[winter steeple]

I think they are assuming plunge gets the buff?

[river yew]

but plunge doesn't?

[winter steeple]

I saw only number of plunges

Idk lemme check

[red island]

Xiao's aa is viable with yun jin

also the animation is noice

[river yew]

yeah he goes N3P here

[winter steeple]

Oh whoops

I wonder how the numbers scale with Aoe

Since n3 usually doesn’t have gd aoe

[red island]

Can you replace Zhongli with Yun Jin

[river yew]

i am positive it will be bad even on paper

[river yew]

since 20% res shred is def more than 3.6% dps increase

and on practice having shield is pretty important for xiao

[red island]

how about for AA

[river yew]

?

Like aa only?

[red island]

yep

[river yew]

aa only is a massive dps loss compared to plunge spam, not to say about the fact that xiao loses his aoe

So overall it's not a good idea

[red island]

3.6% gosh is that how much yun jin buffs?

[river yew]

she does more but with the fact that doing nas with xiao loses you dps overall it's just 3.6%

[red island]

I see

how about yun jin > albedo then

[river yew]

well albedo def does more dmg increase than 3.6%

[red island]

damn

[river yew]

like

i'll be honest with you

[red island]

she ain't meta for xiao

[river yew]

even geo traveler is better

[red island]

ouch

[winter steeple]

I think she’s meta for Yoi tho

Beats fireworks in total dmg

Even with 2 targets most likely

Noir is crunching the rest of the numbers tmr

But looking like it

Bennett replacement

[river yew]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1JRuWiWwU1U4qzdBYeEYjk5DLoypduwt3k7gHzX8mPZs/edit#gid=0 yoi kaz benny yj may or may not beat ht in st dps because of short rotations

my calcs with the help of those guys from yoi mains like lp

kinda scuffed but should be good enough

[winter steeple]

Looks like a 20s rotation

[river yew]

it doesn't have yoi q

[winter steeple]

Also shouldn’t the kaz E be at the back after YoiE

Not the front

[river yew]

hmm?

[winter steeple]

It’s like not swirling anything

At the start of rotation

[river yew]

there's also this

the first e is mostly for energy

[winter steeple]

Put that at the back

More dmg and same energy

Gained

[river yew]

Could you elaborate

[winter steeple]

18s is quite tight but I can live with it ig

Start with Benny EQ

And put 1st kaz E after Yoi E

[river yew]

like that?

[winter steeple]

Ya

Also hold e Yunjin is scuffed

It’s like beidou coping with hold E

Might have to do another e on her

[river yew]

i am not sure if you can even get her ult back in time in that case

[winter steeple]

Try using my ER calc in library submissions or Zaks one to check

[river yew]

yeah i used it

[winter steeple]

And?

[river yew]

it was quite some time ago so i don't exactly remember but i think i got some absurd er req without hold e, and 2 press es is too much time wasted

[winter steeple]

Hold e is variable

As in can take 3 s

I think a 2nd Yunjin E is fine

Just don’t stay in to collect the particles

And save a second

[river yew]

oh i guess it's actually fine, huh

[winter steeple]

Oh no that’s my old one

[river yew]

is it innacurate?

[winter steeple]

Use the new one in library submission

It has hp threshold particle table and weapon drop down

[winter steeple]

No but very not-user friendly

[river yew]

holy fuck it might take me like a year to understand it honestly

[winter steeple]

Oh I thought I improved the look

Manual inputs is red colour

Drop down is blue

[river yew]

but anyways, before i assumed 5 white particles per rotation with 1 collected by yj

[winter steeple]

Other colours not to be touched

[winter steeple]

Hmm ok

209ER huh

So ER sands and 8 liquid subs?

Oh wait fav lance

[river yew]

yeah

that's with fav

and actually fav on kaz too

[winter steeple]

Maybe no Er sands

[river yew]

oh btw i think it might be a tad bit lower since i forgot that i've put yoi at 1 q every 2 rotas (Not how it actually is but i am just used to doing that) so it was actually 4 particles, but whatever

[red island]

C4 Yun Jin damage bonus with my Xiao is 22700 per instance

R5 deathmatch

[lofty karma]

sort of
it increases riptide from charge shot and c4

[red island]

Also crit is 78%

so 17,700

[red island]

Oh so no riptide from skill?

[lofty karma]

correct

[river yew]

wait what

you definitely forgot about def

and maybe res

[red island]

yeah right

[river yew]

and that number still sounds too high

[red island]

lv10 burst xiao with homa

it's pretty good

[lofty karma]

hm
xiao also gets a ton of dmg%. If you forgo plungabunga he might actually be a decent driver

[river yew]

idk 10k is the damage yunjin gives to yoi assuming her dmg is modified by E

And that's 160% multiplication

And xiao has lower dmg bonus than yoimiya with r5 rust iirc

or maybe around the same not sure

[red island]

On top of that yun jin gives 12% attack speed

[river yew]

unlike yoi

xiao is affected by hitlag

[red island]

how did you get 10k?

xiao is faster really

[river yew]

here

[river yew]

you can see the numbers here

[red island]

I gave my Yun Jin 2990 def

[river yew]

that's high as fuck

[red island]

Nah

Well r5 deathmatch yes

[river yew]

deathmatch gives def right?

[red island]

32%

[river yew]

that'd be 2332 def

[red island]

c4 20% def

[river yew]

it counts c4

[red island]

these are the artifacts

[river yew]

btw

you can't use def def def on yj, not with deathmatch

[red island]

why tho

[river yew]

her er req are pretty high

i am too lazy to run numbers but i am 90% sure you'd need er sands here

[red island]

you can get 40% with the substats you have little use for

[river yew]

that's not enough

that's your team right?

[red island]

well lets take out deathmatch out of the calc then

no team just xiao and yun jin

I only did the basics

[river yew]

anyways

that'd be her def with triple def

actually slightly lower

[red island]

artifacts
main stat: 58.3 x3
flower & feather: 30x2
other substats I gave 150 flat def for the 3 artifacts

[lofty karma]

honestly favlance with crit/def/def looks good

[river yew]

i'd try to get crit from substats tbh

[lofty karma]

you cannot get enough crit from subs

Yunjin favlance proc calcs
at r1 ENQ would need 100% crit for 95% chance at proc. 87.8% at En2Q
R2 90.22%/75.3
R3 78.9/65.9
R4 70.1/58.5
R5 63.1/52.7

all assuming single target

for 2 target
R1 75.1/65.5
R2 64.3/56.1
R3 56.3/49.1
R4 50.0/43.6
R5 45.07/39.3

one last calc for EQ
2 target
R1 87.8
R2 75.3
R3 65.8
R4 58.5
R5 52.7
1 target
R1 no
R2 no
R3 97.3
R4 86.2
R5 77.6

R5 En2Q in 2 target would be the only one sub is even close to possible

[river yew]

well ig depends on account

i kinda just assume everyone has r10 of every fav weapon already

[languid socket]

Me and my r3 weeps

[lofty karma]

39.3% CR is still more than you can realistically get in subs

And it does impose a fairly large requirement on time

[river yew]

you can get 34.7 with 7+2 substats + 5 base

and tbh at this point it is kinda situational

[lofty karma]

with high refine fav crit hat is better than ER sands for sure though

[river yew]

like if you can proc it from just e or something - then nice, no time wasted, if you can't - just do more nas

anyways

we were talking about procs dmg with xiao with nov

though actually i've just realised i've missed his message where he assumed 100% crit rate on xiao

[red island]

imma use 4pc gladiator on xiao

[river yew]

but tbh

[red island]

the damage from gladiator is additive right

[river yew]

it's a meme comp anyways

[river yew]

every dmg bonus is additive

except the ones that are multiplicative and those are only for XQ and Yoi

[red island]

I heard some say 4pc wanderer is multiplicative

[river yew]

no it's wrong

[red island]

that explains it

[river yew]

btw not sure but you might do one mistake here

[red island]

hmm

[river yew]

dmg bonus is elemental dmg + all dmg + dmg type dmg bonus, they are not independent

[red island]

I know

[river yew]

okay

[red island]

So xiao get 166.8 + 25%, 5% every 3sec on burst

[river yew]

can you explain the source of each one?

like where do you get 166.8

[red island]

it's just geo goblet and lv10 burst

anemo*

[river yew]

it'd be 141.8

[red island]

Oh I also added the passive burst

[river yew]

what passive

[red island]

25%

but it's probably gonna be only half at most

[river yew]

okay let's just assume it's 12.5%

[red island]

yep

Gladiator 35

[river yew]

is that it?

[red island]

yeah that's as far as xiao can get from dmg bonus

[river yew]

well

it's 289.3 total multiplier

yoi is 343.6

with rust r5

[red island]

I use homa on xiao

[river yew]

homa doesn't give dmg bonus

[red island]

crit damage

well I guess you would have thundering pulse if so

[river yew]

nah

it's fine

r5 rust

[red island]

and what the crit dmg gonna be

[river yew]

my assumed crit ratio for yoi is 88.3/129.2

[red island]

yun jin needs more crit

[river yew]

?

[red island]

with 130 crit you're not really maximizing her true potential

[river yew]

who cares i can't get more

it's kqm standards

anyways

can you just say

what was your average dmg bonus for yj

like honestly i want to sleep rn

[red island]

2204

[river yew]

?

now that sounds low

no like how much dmg does she give per instance

[red island]

it's 8580 non crit

[river yew]

can you just show your calcs actually

[red island]

I'm saying polearms can have better advantages here

[river yew]

no just show your calcs

[red island]

I already did

the full sheet is on my pc

[river yew]

can you screenshot or something ig?

[red island]

2755 def > 2204 burst dmg

Wait I made a mistake

with 189.3 dmg bonus

it's 6376

non crit

[river yew]

still too high

[red island]

How so lol

[river yew]

can you just

show calcs

[red island]

total def 254.9%
def flat 150

burst 80%

[river yew]

wait what

wdym?

burst 80%?

[red island]

lv13 talent

[river yew]

oh

i see

but can't you just screenshot

[red island]

There isn't much to show

[river yew]

can we go in dms please

[red island]

c3 yun jin is actually not that hard to obtain

[river yew]

i know

[red island]

okay

[red island]

so in the end yun jin gives xiao 10-11k damage per hit

best case scenario

[red island]

childe, ayaka and others I'm assuming 6k

[vestal cipher]

i have like 2 fav lances, my polearm luck is cursed

but i also dont pull weapon banners

[sour root]

I recently got r4 and do pull weapon banner

I have had over 15 sac swird though

[vestal cipher]

6 swords, 0 catalyst 😂 , 2 of the rest

[radiant wagon]

i have like r0 fav lance

[tardy thunder]

@winter steeple Does kazuha get any vapes in the yunjin yoi team? and do we know how many of his swirls are pyro vs hydro?

[winter steeple]

roughly 7 pyro swirls and 1 hydro swirl in st

aoe is much different

none of them vapes btw

[tardy thunder]

not even his a2?

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1OgUhPXlqOBmLRUMqUlDHQBAoFtJhMGa6AFEc4BF56es/edit?usp=sharing this is what i have for team dmg so far (gave Yoi Thundering Pulse cuz it's a whopping 18% increase)

61k team dps. should go down a bit once Kazuha is corrected

i have him at 10 pyro swirls that get double swirl, 2 vaped a2s, and all vaped Q DoT. assuming that's incorrect

[winter steeple]

nope

[tardy thunder]

okay ill remove his vapes

[winter steeple]

aoe is quite different

recording aoe rn

[tardy thunder]

ok

i think it's only fair to assume there's at least 2 targets when kazuha is involved since thats what ppl do for beidou and childe

[winter steeple]

ugh where in abyss has 2 targets

ive been recording with 3 enemies

oh geovishap

[tardy thunder]

60.2k team dps when i removed his vapes btw

will go down a bit more if i need to lower his swirl counts

[winter steeple]

thats quite a bit higher even in st owo

[tardy thunder]

yeah this seems to be the play as long as i didnt do anything fatally wrong

vape being yet another multiplier that works with Yun Jin Q is quite nice

if only Yoi E worked too

if Yoi E worked too i think this would make her stronger than Hu Tao

if it doesnt already

lemme see what the numbers would be if that did work for fun

would be fucking 72k team dps lmfao

if it worked Yun Jin Q would more than double Yois damage

Mihoyo why'd you code Yoi E not to work with Yun Jin

[winter steeple]

no bennett as well damm

[tardy thunder]

screw bennet he suck here

he provide basically nothing to Yoi now

he's losing his supremacy

[winter steeple]

pyro dps without bennett

first time ever

[tardy thunder]

[winter steeple]

wait tao

[tardy thunder]

oh

[winter steeple]

other than tao

[tardy thunder]

i mean, diluc can use a c6 diona instead cant he?

i thought he could

maybe im wrong

i wonder how sucrose and c2 jean compare to kazuha here

obviosuly i dont expect either of them to be better

but wonder if they are acceptable alternatives

also imagine this with a c2 kazuha

[winter steeple]

kaz sub dps

[tardy thunder]

Yoi rerun 2.5 plz

i want her now

and TP

[winter steeple]

getting footage kinda pain, geo vishaps are like separated at all times

[tardy thunder]

kazuha groups them

[winter steeple]

[tardy thunder]

btw do we know what vapetao team damage looks like for comparison?

[winter steeple]

nope

[tardy thunder]

guess ill have to figure out the counts and shit for that team and calc it myself

[winter steeple]

have to ask around

[tardy thunder]

or ask jstern

[winter steeple]

2 enemies actually looking cope

im consistently getting double 4vv shred but

hydro tends to swirl more

[tardy thunder]

🤔

[winter steeple]

no double swirl abooz

[tardy thunder]

should i just assume half are hydro half are pyro for now

also if you get a chance can you test how it play out with sucrose instead of kazuha for plebs without him?

[winter steeple]

nvm its just the geo vishap with pyro aura i framing kaz E and making his E infuse hydro instead

[tardy thunder]

makes sense

wait why dont you just do the island of ruin guards

on guyun

[winter steeple]

ok i should do that

cant trust the test rn

[winter steeple]

around 2 missed swirls and 1 hydro swirl

for each ruin guard

the rest are pyro double swirls

[tardy thunder]

so 9 pyro swirls 1 hydro?

[winter steeple]

7 pyro

[tardy thunder]

wait only 8 swirls? but Q is 6 and each E is 2 🤔

[winter steeple]

so swirls missed the mark

[tardy thunder]

how do you miss swirl?

[winter steeple]

cos vape triggers first

and removes all auras

[tardy thunder]

wait i thought you said he doesnt get vape

[winter steeple]

b4 anemo

[winter steeple]

in st

checking vapes in aoe now

[tardy thunder]

ok

[winter steeple]

2 Q pyro ticks vape

thats all

[tardy thunder]

sadge

oki

@winter steeple kekwait his dmg went up if i did this right

losing few swirls but gaining 2 vapes

went slightly up

[winter steeple]

how does that work haha

[tardy thunder]

let me double check

okay nvm i think i added something twice

fixed

teams at 59k dps now

maybe back to 60k when i add Yunjin E+Q personal dmg

59k is still a lot

klee PP is 55k

@winter steeple i wonder if theres a better attack string for vape Yoi with yun jin to get more yun jin stacks but still vape her higher MVs

maybe N3RR

would she vape her N1 and N3 if doing N3RR?

[winter steeple]

the icd definitely doesnt align

ill give it a try

[tardy thunder]

aww

wait would that even be more hits

[winter steeple]

https://streamable.com/35jpvd

n1 x1,n3, n2 ,n1x2, n3, n2, n1x2, n2

hits vaped

total hits during 5n3rr is 20

compared to 23 hits with 3n5 n1

8 hits vaped with 5n3rr while 10 hits vaped with 3n5n1

@tardy thunder 3n5n1 easily beats n3rr

[tardy thunder]

Rip

Btw do we know how VapeYoi damage typically look with bennet instead of Yunjin?

[winter steeple]

nope only did fireworks

ill do it later today

[tardy thunder]

I wonder if it would be worth using NO on Xinqiu here instead of EOSF

[winter steeple]

Doubt so

Yunjin is a huge portion of dmg and doesn’t scale off Atk

[tardy thunder]

True

[winter steeple]

I rmb some calcs long time ago in which vape Yoi is worse than fireworks

Just for reference till I calc it again

[tardy thunder]

Ok

I did lazy math and made copy of my sheet and replaced Yun Jin with bennet plus pyro resonance plus noblesse

Yois dps went down by 5k

[winter steeple]

Actually stuck with Yunjin

[tardy thunder]

Well I also changed her from 3N5 1N3 to 3N5 1N1

To account for loss of attack speed

[languid socket]

Isn't it more like blessed 👍

[tardy thunder]

Bennet is a lot closer to Yun Jin buff than I thought he’d be tho

Guess it cuz his attack buff gets Yoi E benefit but Yun Jin Q doesn’t

But she still higher

[winter steeple]

Imagine Yun Jin Q actually gets Yoi E benefit

[tardy thunder]

This will be one of the strongest teams in the game if it does lol

[winter steeple]

Kinda high skill cap tho

[tardy thunder]

And then imagine Ayato is also hydro off field NA damage with enough hydro aura for Yoi vape

[winter steeple]

Rr cancels and little healing

[tardy thunder]

Off field driving

[tardy thunder]

Do you think Koko would work instead of Xinqiu?

[winter steeple]

Doubt so and can’t test don’t have her

[tardy thunder]

Could possibly use a prototype amber sucrose instead of Kazuha

[winter steeple]

Extreme cope , but maybe need to do Er calcs first

[tardy thunder]

You do have a ton of DR tho

Xinqiu plus resonance

[tardy thunder]

I’ll run it rn

@winter steeple

[winter steeple]

Reduce sucrose E to 1

[tardy thunder]

doesnt she get 2 charges?

[winter steeple]

She can’t maintain 2 past first rotation

[winter steeple]

Ya but 15s cd

[tardy thunder]

but 1 would completely exclude the second charge

shouldnt she get it every other rotation at least?

first rotation 2 second 1 third 2 no?

[winter steeple]

Ya turns out liddat

[tardy thunder]

if i do 1.5 in the calc then she need 196 ER

so would need an er sands and 8 ER subs

[winter steeple]

Her Q mechanics are different from Kaz’s Q so definitely needs more testing

[tardy thunder]

yup

[winter steeple]

Iirc she applies anemo then the absorbed element

[winter steeple]

Scuffed , maybe if kaz’s one works well then we can think about it

[tardy thunder]

welp thats the price you pay for comfort

theres of course also jean

but prob want her at c2

do you think 4 N5 is reasonable to assume for c2 jean plus c6 yun jin?

maybe even 4 N5 plus 1 N1?

[winter steeple]

Actually I’m not sure if Jean c2 is gd for Yoi

[tardy thunder]

[winter steeple]

Too much Atk speed ruins the icd timer

I checked

[tardy thunder]

so she would overpower the hydro aura?

[winter steeple]

Nope her second n1 won’t vape

Cos 2.5s haven’t passed

Maybe

[tardy thunder]

its 3 hits or 2.5s tho

[winter steeple]

Nope 3 hits doesn’t reset 2.5s timer

But 2.5 timer resets 3 hits

[tardy thunder]

is that not what standard icd is?

3 hits or 2.5s

am confused

[winter steeple]

It’s not lemme find the explanation on kqm

They have it quite digestible

https://library.keqingmains.com/combat-mechanics/elemental-effects/internal-cooldown-of-elemental-application

@tardy thunder watch the vid in there

[tardy thunder]

so she'd still be vaping but the hits that vape would change?

[winter steeple]

Yeah

[tardy thunder]

i dont think it matters too much which hits vape tho cuz of Yun Jin

i think more hits should be more important

[lofty karma]

@tardy thunder what about favlance + crit hat?

[winter steeple]

Hmm I think this testing is better done when Yunjin is released

[lofty karma]

does that change anything?

[tardy thunder]

[winter steeple]

This makes sense tho

[tardy thunder]

her buff gonna go down

i dont wanna see that

[lofty karma]

gotta calc minimum crit and ER

but I think with favlance proc you can do DEF timepiece

[tardy thunder]

that would be quite nice

would we no longer have fav on kazuha then?

or fav on all 3?

[lofty karma]

all 3 why not

[winter steeple]

Dmg tho

[lofty karma]

this team makes like 0 energy

this is yunjins biggest caveat

fav weapons are absolutely necessary

[tardy thunder]

i had fav on kazuha and xinqiu already

the energy was already managable

dont rlly see reason to use it on yun jin unless you're tryuna use freedom kazuha

[lofty karma]

in 2 target situations with 1 E 1 normal 1 Q you can get away with 45% crit rate and have 95% proc rate

39.3 if you have 2 normals

assuming r5 fav

[tardy thunder]

but if she can use favonious with a def timepiece theres no reason not to use fav on her

[lofty karma]

yup

and 3 fav makes yoi more able to use SR

[tardy thunder]

under kqm standards with def/def/def she can have 44.6% cr

[winter steeple]

She’s not using her Q again

I think

Just rotation 1 only

[tardy thunder]

Even with triple fav Yoi isnt using her Q

[lofty karma]

are we gonna have to calc a max ER for tpulse then?

[tardy thunder]

you dont want her burst to be up anyway with Tpulse right

cuz it wants you below 100

wait ignore this

i did +15 er not -15

[lofty karma]

you don't want to fill up burst during her E with tpulse

[tardy thunder]

she need 221 er with SR

[winter steeple]

Nah SR drains right b4 AAs

Should be fine

[tardy thunder]

she would need 176 er even without sr

Yun Jin could have 10 CR subs 3 ER subs 4 def subs and 3 flat defense subs there

if we remove fav from kazuha he need 195 ER

[winter steeple]

Also it rlly depends on enemy threshold particles as well and when they drop to include that ,kinda pain

[tardy thunder]

so he could use an er sands and freedom

[lofty karma]

move kaz to hold

[tardy thunder]

2 hold will extend rotation tho wont it

[lofty karma]

you have hold + tap

[tardy thunder]

thats why i had it on 1.5

[lofty karma]

which is same particle gen as 1.5 hold

[tardy thunder]

oh it should be 1.5 hold

not 1.5 press

[lofty karma]

yes

[tardy thunder]

duh

145 er with fav on him

170 without

what exactly are we tryna achieve here tho

[winter steeple]

Isn’t it 1.7?

1.5 is 6 particles not 7

[lofty karma]

wait

I forgot to remove exile

[tardy thunder]

oh you have Yoi tryna burst every other rotation

[tawny spoke]

Just have a kazuha with 170 er with 900 EM

[tardy thunder]

not every rotation

i see

[tardy thunder]

you didnt allocate funnels

[lofty karma]

they all self funnel unless indicated otherwise

[tardy thunder]

not sure how you're getting so much less ER for Yoi than i am then

oh wait i see why

i had 1 E

not 2

[lofty karma]

And here is the hold E for yunjin if we can consitently parry or fit hold into rotation

[tardy thunder]

you didnt give xinqiu his c6

[lofty karma]

The biggest ask with this comp tho is r8+ fav sword + r5 favlance

[tardy thunder]

but other than that matches what i have exactly

[tardy thunder]

kazuha and xinqiu can prob get away with both running r3 favs tbh

[lofty karma]

XQ needs r5 more than yunjin

unless you're also autoing

kaz can prob get away with r3

[tardy thunder]

actually the ER calcs are almost the exact same with sac sword on him instead of favonious

but i assume the rotation would be like a second longer?

[lofty karma]

probably

[winter steeple]

Ya

[lofty karma]

I don't think we have spare time in this rotation

especially with fav yunjin

[tardy thunder]

is using Yoi Q every other rotation even worth giving her 3 ER subs tho @lofty karma

[lofty karma]

here's what I have now

[lofty karma]

yes

Her Q still does a good amount of damage

[fallen crystal]

Yoimiya, XQ, Zhongli, YunJin seems to be a very good comp.
-Zhongli with Tenacity (takes care of ER issue with Yun)
-Yunjin with noblesse/husk

[lofty karma]

ZL better than kaz?

[tawny spoke]

[fallen crystal]

I feel that people trying to run rainbow (unless you include Raiden) will have issues with Yun's burst uptime.

[tardy thunder]

no but he'd prob be fine as a comfort pick

lose 16% DMG bonus 20% shred and like 140k dmg. gain comfort.

[lofty karma]

the ER calc right here shows yunjin being able to get by with 173 ER
easily achievable with asc + fav sword + a few subs

[tawny spoke]

Less dmg overall but u can play with no worries

Thats just it

[tardy thunder]

still i think id rather us jean than zhong as a comfort pick

[fallen crystal]

And plus, with ZL, its a cake walk

[tawny spoke]

The er thing aint a problem

[lofty karma]

no you lose 20% shred as well

because you lose VV

[tardy thunder]

yeah Yun Jins energy isnt a problem as well

[tardy thunder]

i literally said that

[lofty karma]

you lose kaz damage bonus which is greater than geo res

and you lose VV

[tardy thunder]

yup

[tawny spoke]

Kicker here is that ZL provides u a safety cushion to play yoi optimally by not being cucked mid combo

[fallen crystal]

In Kazuha's comp, whos the healer?

[tawny spoke]

Its less dmg

[tardy thunder]

your yun jin buff goes down a bit too

[tawny spoke]

But

[tardy thunder]

xinqiu

[lofty karma]

XQ/ yunjin E

[fallen crystal]

Quite risky if you ask me, esp against enemies that we see in current F12 abyss.

[lofty karma]

the main bonus ZL would give is if we're doing n5s

[winter steeple]

Cope with zl

[lofty karma]

and we don't have time in rotation to hold E zhong + Q

so you don't get Q nuke unless C2

[tawny spoke]

Just hold E and cope on Q

But eh ZL doesnt bring much

Other than comfort

[tardy thunder]

xinqiu provides a crap ton of damage reduction and you also have protective canopy

and a few crystals

[winter steeple]

In actual fights only loses like 10% shred tbh

[lofty karma]

And honestly albedo might bring more to the table than ZL in damage

[tardy thunder]

if you really want more healing you'd prob be better off going with a healer build xinqiu than trying to fit in zhongli honestly

[lofty karma]

what combos are we doing?

[tardy thunder]

i calced it with 3N5 1N3

[tardy thunder]

or just get a c2 jean

[lofty karma]

ok so shielder is a must then

[tardy thunder]

[winter steeple]

Xq gives poise as well as DR

[tardy thunder]

^

[winter steeple]

I think it needs further testing

[lofty karma]

the thing is
you cannot dodge

if going for n5

[tardy thunder]

should we just go back to N4 then?

[lofty karma]

and XQ isn't enough healer to let you facetank

n4 is kinda pushing it

[tardy thunder]

or jean instead of kazuha?

[lofty karma]

jean could work

or zhong or albedo

[tardy thunder]

where VV

[lofty karma]

or sayu

[winter steeple]

[tardy thunder]

gonna be a noticable drop in damage not having kazuha tho

31% dmg bonus is a lot

[lofty karma]

bascially for noshield teams with yoi
assume n4 and n5 do not exist

[winter steeple]

Zhongli does make rotations way quicker

I think it makes it so the rotation is stuck at 21 cos of xq tho

[tardy thunder]

ya

most we can shave off is 1s

[lofty karma]

if n4 is mixed with n3s you can just go for the n4s when you get a chance

[tardy thunder]

if we arre already doing 21s

need to figure out what the vape counts would be if we had jean c2 as well

so i can calc her at c2 instead of kazuha

[winter steeple]

If only Yunjin gave a shield

[tardy thunder]

how would we build Jean if using her here?

[winter steeple]

[tardy thunder]

favonious ADC?

or EM?

Ive never used her outside of sunfire idk her build

[winter steeple]

ADC prolly

[lofty karma]

Fav EEC?

[winter steeple]

There’s like 2 double swirls only

[tardy thunder]

i dont kow what aee is

[lofty karma]

sorry EEC

[tardy thunder]

i dont kno wwhat that is

[lofty karma]

EM EM crit

[radiant wagon]

is this with bennett or no

[tardy thunder]

ah

[tardy thunder]

no bennet

[lofty karma]

ah right no sunfire

ADC it is then

she can also use freedom sworn

[radiant wagon]

who's holding fav here? is it still yunjin+kazuha

[tardy thunder]

what would the rotation be?

[tardy thunder]

everyone not named Yoi apparently

[lofty karma]

same as kaz, but with jean EQ

[winter steeple]

I don’t think there is a way to use Jean

No cap

[tardy thunder]

why

[winter steeple]

Can’t swirl pyro when xq is up

And need to Yunjin EQ after pyro swirl for max uptime of her Q

[radiant wagon]

is yoimiya using adc or edc in this team?

[tardy thunder]

EDC

[winter steeple]

Can waste up to 5s of pyro shred

Of 10s

[tardy thunder]

sounds like we need to just use a different attack string then

so we can keep the team the same

[lofty karma]

Also if we change SR to some other set like LW or bolide

yoi can ult every rotation

[tardy thunder]

Atilla what are other attack string ideas we could do

[winter steeple]

The only reason why pyro infuse kaz works is cause he is able to overpower xq easily

[tardy thunder]

to not need shield

[winter steeple]

Cos Yoi can’t

[tardy thunder]

would n2rr be copium?

[winter steeple]

Actually don’t think Jean can fit it after some thought

[lofty karma]

n2 spam

but that's kinda sweaty

[winter steeple]

I’m used to it

[tardy thunder]

do we have to just go back to PP

[winter steeple]

I find it applies wayy too much pyro tho

[lofty karma]

XQ is still a truck load of damage

but I do think zhong might have a place now

at least at c2

[tardy thunder]

if the team just straight up cant function without him then yeah

looks like we might have to use him over kaz

[winter steeple]

It’s either Zhong or kaz or sucrose