Shenhe Thread

[drifting vigil]

Ayaka + C6 Shen + hydro catalyst will be busted

[pliant solar]

but its sorta investment brute force territory

[drifting vigil]

Perma freeze and supercharged autos without relying on skills or burtas

Bursts

Actually no

Can't freeze maguus

But any other mobs...

Which one

[pliant solar]

cryo keq

[drifting vigil]

Oh

I'm C6ing Shen just for that

[pliant solar]

its sorta the stuff that i wouldnt attempt without a mistsplitter

[drifting vigil]

Or Black Sword

But yeah

[pliant solar]

need em fat stats

but ye damage is damage

[drifting vigil]

I calced 60k charged attacks

With my Keqing

Cryo...

[pliant solar]

yea if u have c6 shen keq burst wont eat your stacks

[drifting vigil]

I have been soloing abyss 12 with my Keqing and Baal on each side, and getting to 12-3... i wish I had R5 Black Sword

No healing really sucks

Using R1 Mist though

[cloud cobalt]

Hi, I wanted to know, what would be Shenhe place, meta-wise?

I have a friend with freeze Ayaka+Xingqiu/Mona+Sucrose+Diona, and wanted to know if Shenhe could be a replacement for a Kazuha, or would this team have to be hyper offensive replacing a Diona shield for more damage on Ayaka?

[floral jay]

📌 check

[pale root]

So
No beta changes for shenhe on yesterday patch
Mihoyo think she is fine then

[split nacelle]

yep, or testers haven't got to the chars yet

Enkanomiya is pretty big after all

[pale root]

Ah
That makes sense

[split nacelle]

I'm always assuming the worst, so what we have is what we may get on release

a mihoyo-style change would just be lower her ult cost to 60 or 70, maybe a cooldown by 2s and call it a day

[pale root]

You forgot to swap some cons around

[neat geyser]

best u can get are adjustments

[teal belfry]

could shenhe fit into a freeze ganyu team? how does ganyu/morgana/venti/shenhe sound?

[pale root]

Probably one of the best places to fit her, tbh

Either ganyu/ayaka support

Proto amber mona

Time to make Ocean-Mona + proto amber

[dire ivy]

Morgana

In a morgana team

[ionic sparrow]

what spears can shenhe use, i got db/dm/catch

[mystic linden]

royal, favonius, wavebreaker

[ionic sparrow]

wave breaker good on her? i havent lvld it up so far

[split nacelle]

engulfing

yeah, any atk weapon works

and high base atk like favo

[ionic sparrow]

i am ar57 and got 0 fav lance till now, not even in wep banner

[split nacelle]

[teal belfry]

does shenhe's icy quill dmg follow her own cr and cdmg or that of the character she buffs

[true forge]

It is assumed to be the character she buffs

[drifting vigil]

I read "buffs"

as

"buffes"

buffez

[clever tartan]

Correct me if I'm wrong, shenhe buff will be like a +3000 atk for all cryo members, but only on the first 5 attacks, so her best comp is like melt chong nuke

[split nacelle]

it's not attack, it's added flat dmg in the dmg formula for the skills used

kind of like how cinnabar and redhorn passives work

at least that's the current assumption until we know more

[cloud cobalt]

Could Ganyu, John Lee, Kokomi, Shenhe work?

I've accepted this Copium already, I have Kokomi and Raiden afterall, if she changes good if not Imma still use her in the best way I can, it's not like this game is impossible without well invested units

[pliant solar]

i dont see why not

the only thing lacking is grouping

but for 2.4 abyss theres not a lot of grouping u can do anyways

for other content when u mob u can just swap john out

actually a pretty solid team but your ganyu needs to be pretty strong

[cloud cobalt]

I feel like Mihoyo tries to reinvent the wheel, with a personalized Benny for each type of comp to free your Benny on making every team stronger, and to focus on other comps, Sara for electro, Gorou for Geo, Shenhe now for cryo. Which is nice for main pyro dps/Xiangling teams

[vast current]

But Benny’s better than Shenhe in the majority of situations.

[pliant solar]

benny still consolidates too many roles into 1

for me its the healer ontop of giga buffs thats invaluable to me

[vast current]

He’s also better at that role than dedicated support 5* for that element.

[split nacelle]

this is because he's a mistake, they created 2 or 3 characters in one

new specialized ones that are coming out now are mostly balanced and will do very well in those niches

and we're probably never seeing another benny at least for a good while

dendro could possibly be a huge benny nerf depending on how they do it, since we could have dendro aura or more dendro application from enemies and that could be very bad for benny's ult

who knows, though

[pine heron]

inb4 they tone down burning

[split nacelle]

i hope they buff it

come on mihoyo, change up the meta with dendro please

[pine heron]

can you even get rid of burnin once it procs

rare instances where samachurls exist either I'm shielded or healing, feels like its dmg is comparable to high stacked corrosion from rifthounds

[vast current]

Can’t burn me if I’m not on the field.

Checkmate, samachurls.

[pine heron]

or if they're dead

[slate lantern]

simply put ur burning char back into their pokeball

[clever tartan]

Quick question, how many normals would take to make yunjin a better buffer for ayaka than shenhe?

[vast current]

Using Shenhe’s hold E and Yunjin’s Q for comparison since they have the same CD. gets 767.5% of Shenhe’s ATK over 7 hits or 1736.7% of Yunjin’s DEF over 30 hits.

So it really depends on their respective ATK and DEF stats. I don’t think it’s feasible to say dishes out all 30 of Yunjin’s buffed hits.

[sour oriole]

Noelle can do this in AoE

[vast current]

I suppose, but is in consideration here.

AoE on her normals is poo poo.

[sour oriole]

oh Ayaya

her CA is pretty good

but, I wouldnt play Yunjin with Ayaya

not enough synergy

[vast current]

Yunjin’s Q buffs also only trigger with normal attacks.

[sour oriole]

ah yes forgot about that

[vast current]

You want to mix in CAs with .

[sour oriole]

see im fine with MHY doing shit like that

for Yunjin, as a 4*

do it with Shenhe or any 5*

pisses people off

[vast current]

Yunjin has the opposite problem thst Shenhe’s facing. Too many stacks to burn with low multipliers and restricted attack type. Whereas Shenhe has too few stacks to burn with more generous damage sources.

[sour oriole]

Yunjin's max stacks is provisional anyway

i havent calced Yunjin or even looked into her rotation but

not surprised if you're limited to 15 stacks per rotation

[pale root]

Yunjin mostly is the yoimiya buff

Like clam was the kokomi buff

[sour oriole]

i still wouldnt play Yunjin with Yoi

i mean i dont have Yoi, but I play Yanfei

I'd play Yoi - XQ - Fischl - Bei

or Raiden instead of Fischl

or Benny

Yunjin 2/3 particles also starves her a bit

as a solo Geo

another MHY middle finger

[pale root]

I just want to machinegun yoimi

With jean c2+ yunjin c6

And the other slot is either fischl or beidou

[pine heron]

[vast current]

I’d play Yoi with Yunjin.

Attack speed mucho good on her since ranged.

[pale root]

Yup

Already feels great just with jean c2

[vast current]

C6 Yoi goes BRRRRRTTT.

[topaz raft]

Is the english honeyhunter shenhe broken?
From what i understand from her quills
She only buffs when someone deals cryo dmg??

[strong oak]

That is correct

[topaz raft]

Why do i keep hearing her buff is versatile

[strong oak]

The only versatility she has is that she can basically work with any Cryo, but her use is limited to Cryo units

[pine heron]

not only cryo DMG, it has to count as being NA/CA/PA/E/Q, reactions will not trigger the effect

[strong oak]

or well cryo absorbed Anemo attacks

[pine heron]

I've seen people (reddit) try to claim reactions will benefit from it

yea elemental absorption should be fair game

[topaz raft]

Hmm, i guess the only way to see if i should skip her is when she actually gets released

[chilly hinge]

I can't go to /r/shenhe mains, the level of feelscrafting there triggers me

[strong oak]

I guess you could use her for her Q/E/CA/NA Buff and jsut build her as a Sub DPS. But just use Rosa at that point tbh

[pine heron]

and current cryo teams would not give up any other their existing units for that damage soo

[topaz raft]

shenhe is weird ig

[strong oak]

Gotta wait for some Beta tuning. Right now she doesn't look bad but the competition is jsut rough

[topaz raft]

We might see new teams when she comes out tho

[pine heron]

kinda filling in a niche no one asked for, cryo didn't need and top teams won't run for
things may change but that's current status

[topaz raft]

Oh, has the beta started?

[pine heron]

I mean on release

compared to current info

dunno if beta has started probs should have by now

[chilly hinge]

well personally I'm finding her buff ability to be decent for cryo units compared to alternatives, however her low personal damage is really what makes it hard to justify using her over say kazuha

[strong oak]

New Teams certainly but I have reasonable doubt they set new standards. So you'd basically look to upgrade Cryo Comps that are already not super good and still remain not super good. Or sort of sidegrade existing Top Cryo teams

[pine heron]

yea

[topaz raft]

I'd hope she can be more versatile than this

Limiting her buff to cryo dmg seems meh

[pine heron]

she may make chong comps better but he won't become meta from it, dunno if more viable outside of some scenarios like herald shields

if the current cryo cast wasn't this stacked rn

and the limitations on her low stack activation amount doesn't really help her

[chilly hinge]

this is a hot take but I don't think we should necessarily expect new units to become meta given how strong many current units are (including the stacked cryo cast), but if they open up new interesting teams and synergies that will be good enough for me.

[pine heron]

but its really wait and see

[vast current]

More quills, higher quill ATK adder, lower CD.

[pine heron]

no no I concur

they should be aiming to free up certain units from some teams for other comps imho since that's the feel I get from newer supports

[chilly hinge]

Shenhe could potentially free up more universal buff supports (like kazuha for example if you run a cryo team on one side) but then there's also sucrose who I still need to sheet for comparison's sake

[topaz raft]

rn, yun jin is more appealing

[pine heron]

yea and she's the 4*

[topaz raft]

Don't they do the same sht? But only NAs for yun jin
But she doesn't limit the element

[chilly hinge]

true though I feel like there aren't that many normal attack focused units besides yoimiya and I guess childe

[pine heron]

yea

and more stacks

[topaz raft]

I just read her skills and damn, so her E is kinda like beidou?

[pine heron]

yep

[topaz raft]

mihoyo seems to be good at making interesting 4stars lately
But unappealing 5stars

Good thing raiden didn't disappoint

[pine heron]

yea...

[true forge]

Thoma

[topaz raft]

Who?

[true forge]

Also what 5* is unappealing?

[pine heron]

Thoma's shield stacking is interesting

[true forge]

Raiden Koko and Ayaka are the last three and they're all meta

Itto ain't even out yet

[pine heron]

also meta =/= unappealing

they never said it correlated with meta

[true forge]

Yall are in a TC chat saying Yunjin is better. Do you honestly expect me to believe yall don't care about meta

[pine heron]

we didn't doe

we said

more appealing

[true forge]

What's more appealing

[pine heron]

appeal is hella subjective but yea this is TC

and yea between the 5* and the 4*
yunjin overall looks better in animations + counters are fun

imo

[topaz raft]

Appeal is indeed subjective, not an indicator whether that character is better or not in terms of performance.

[true forge]

All I see is a Geo NA buffer. This is a cycle

4* and 5* are revealed
People get hyped for 4* and claim 5* has no appeal in the meta
5* gets buffs in beta
People finally start understanding 5* kit

[pine heron]

[true forge]

Right we are at stage two

Stage three probably starts in a week

[topaz raft]

We'll see, everything is quite early rn

Even shenhe's kit is probably at early phases

Or a placeholder if the beta has not yet started

[pine heron]

1. you're still on about the meta; which is not what we meant (altho meta contributes to appeal, that had little to no influence on my opinion)

and yea

[pine heron]

people do be like that sometimes

we will see in a week, no hate here

[true forge]

I somehow forgot Yoi existed

Between Ayaka and Raiden

[pine heron]

I was gonna bring her up

but didn't

[true forge]

She is such a blur

Like my brain just didn't register her for a few minutes

[pine heron]

f

[patent smelt]

All I know is that I love Shenhe's ghost bestie

[pine heron]

her talismans are nice but that's about it
the hype in animations died down for me
it was kinda like eula, except it just crashed the second I heard her lines

sadge cuz I had interested in her all the way back in last nov/dec, but knew unless design and kit looked appealing to me, not rolling with my primos
reasonable standards

[sour oriole]

is Shenhe voice lines out?

[pine heron]

no

I meant for eula

those EN lines

SHEESH, personality was not her strong suit

[coral onyx]

Unfortunately for Shenhe, the implementation of her kit is way too good in synergy with Ayaka or with Venti+Ganyu(where that works) for it to not have big restriction on it
Ayaka onto a frozen/petrified/succed by anemo should be able to burn all stacks of shenhe E instantly and probably most stacks from a C1 combo shenhe hold E - Ayaka Q - Shenhe E (so they'll probably make her E go in cooldown if the free E isn't used and she switches out of field)

At this point they basically have to balance her specifically to not turn this game into Ayahe Impact

[pine heron]

new pfp?

nice

[sour oriole]

this is what i meant with MHY designing themselves into a corner

[pine heron]

yea

[sour oriole]

buff her a bit, it's Ayahe Impact

not buff her, floor too low

[pine heron]

they should have just made shenhe hydro

and avoided cryo for a while

[strong oak]

Yeah, essentially make her too good and she makes already strong Teams peak too high

[true forge]

They really only needed to make 5* Rosaria

But they chose to do this

For whatever reason

[strong oak]

Make her too balanced and she doesn't set herself apart enough from more general Supports that already set high af standards

[pine heron]

I wouldn't mind if she had pure shielding + smth else vs diona's utility

[strong oak]

They basically have to find the sweet spot between making her better than the general more versatile options w/o elevating Team ceiling too much

[sour oriole]

just make her a sizeable chunk of buff to Ayaka/Ganyu

i dont even mind

make her worth pulling

not cos I have Ayaka

[chilly hinge]

agreed, since shenhe's current mechanics are amplifiable with other strong supports making her like 2x as good as kazuha for cryo teams would just completely break her if you used her with kazuha for example

[pine heron]

they could play with making reactions have negative impacts on buffs

[strong oak]

Yep and would be a potential problem for future units that want to dip deep into modifiers

[pine heron]

or at least frowned upon

[strong oak]

See Yoimiya for instance. Crap ton of dmg% and Crit Stat access. But alos has an exclusive unique multiplier that will likely affect Yunjin Procs

[plush sleet]

I still don’t even get how her E works

[strong oak]

Creating a massive difference in the dmg generated between Yoimiya using Yunjin and any other current NA user using Yunjin

[coral onyx]

whose?

[plush sleet]

Yoi

[strong oak]

NAs are Pyro and deal X% of their original dmg where X is the Talent value

[pine heron]

from what I understand, its a boost towards her NA dmg

[plush sleet]

Ohh so an added X percent to the original non E multiplier

[strong oak]

So say T10 is 160%, so her NAs deal 160% of their original dmg as Pyro dmg, meaning effectively 60% more dmg as its own unique multiplier

[plush sleet]

Ohhhhh

[strong oak]

And since Yunjin's Q Procs should be counted as NA dmg aswell, they would benefit from that, too

So if they created a Cryo unit with a similar mechanic that could escalate Shenhe's Quill value if its balanced to be very strong w/o such an extra multiplier. Either limiting design space or meaning that said potential future unit would have to have their dmg numbers tuned around Shenhe's existence specifically

[wooden stratus]

wont shenhe ayaka xingqiu venti/kazuha be a broken ass team? if shenhe can make alot of particles for ayaka burst

[pine heron]

yea it feels like making a mold for a particular puzzle piece and doing that several times

[strong oak]

It has potential, but it might not necessarily set itself apart from other variants. Like Gaynu+Ayaka Morgana in AoE or if you need healing/shielding replacing Diona with Shenhe might not be the best call even if its more dmg

Thats the competition aspect

[sour oriole]

i dont like how they are locking away 'updates' in character design and meta so stingily without making gameplay more interesting or adding anything new

[pine heron]

fr

[sour oriole]

NA buffer, CA buffer, Q buffer, E buffer

each one you have to whale for

[vast current]

[sour oriole]

where is new character with new mechanics

[vast current]

Where air combos!

[pine heron]

at least to this extent

its shit feeling

[sour oriole]

plis this is a gacha sir

[vast current]

[sour oriole]

yeah at least not this much

[pine heron]

we can't have combos sadly

[vast current]

Imagine making Xiao a pogo stick when air combos would have been way better.

[pine heron]

I wouldn't mind if shenhe's dmg ramped up like how raiden's does in her burst when chaining mutliple Na's and E's

best we have for air combos are OL and EC co-op procs

[strong oak]

I wouldn't even have an issue with that if there was more content to use it in and accessibility wasn't such a nightmare. Gacha + Artifact RNG just prohibit me building whatever the fuck I want on a whim since its either a months long playing the game or very significant monetary commitment to do the same things I'm already doign with a slightly different flavor.

[pine heron]

rifthounds get sent sky high combo'd

[sour oriole]

and this is why we get casuals and people complaining about 'iNAzuMA UnITs ArE FlAwED'

[pine heron]

like there are so many unique functions in the past

that I just don't understand why they weren't kept

they keep infuses and stances

[vast current]

There is an acceptable balance of newcomer simplicity and lategame mechanics exploration.

[pine heron]

but no 3 use E's like diluc

repositions like oz

[sour oriole]

i'd give MHY like 2-3 patches into an 'expansion' if you will, Inazuma is an expansion

[vast current]

Because it took them 7 years to build Diluc's kit, and 2 months to build Shenhe's.

[sour oriole]

to cater to new player influx

[pine heron]

E's with 3 levels of "charge" etc

[pine heron]

TRUE

but that begs the question

reuse it

that's 7 good years of work

and its good work

[vast current]

No, only pogo.

[pine heron]

at least they used stacks again first with eula then with raiden

[strong oak]

Most eggregious thing to me is. I'm still not satisifed with my Raiden Set but fundamentally Mhy wants me to pull new stuff and go grind new Gear for them. So how about they just make Artifacts more accessible so that I actually feel tempted to look into newer stuff sooner rather than later

[pine heron]

having better rates in the patch the domain releases would be nice

or yk

allow us to chose

set and piece

[sour oriole]

artifact grind is one cornerstone that I have 0 expectation to change

[pine heron]

yea

[sour oriole]

by MHY

artifact grind is a function of exponential whale grind

[strong oak]

Its easily and by far the worst system in the entire game

[vast current]

Every time a new artifact domain comes out, I want to burn puppies.

[sour oriole]

my previous comment

[pine heron]

I wish artifact grinds made me political

not acc but

yk

not fun

[sour oriole]

non resin refreshers are meant to accept their fate/luck with whatever artifact they get

[pine heron]

I burn fragiles

[plush sleet]

If we could change an artifacts main stat

[vast current]

Resin refreshers just get to slam their head against the same wall more times.

[strong oak]

Although I wonder if its that lucrative or even helpful for retention as a trade-off for the negatives

[plush sleet]

EVEN JUST ONCE

[vast current]

It doesn't make it hurt any less.

[sour oriole]

monthly resin pass

[vast current]

As long as the total time required to build a character to an acceptable level is more than the rate at which new characters release...

[strong oak]

Well that thing didn't happen so far

[vast current]

Assuming 2 new characters per patch. One every 3 weeks...

[pine heron]

I do feel bad for people who don't see leaks

and have no clue who needs what

to the letter

[vast current]

Let's see... 3 days farming EXP, 2 days farming books, 2 days farming weapon ascension mats, 5 days Mora. Going for a modest 6/6/6 and 80/90, assuming a steady income of event mats....

[sour oriole]

not possible without BP, assuming you pull every character

totally feelscrafting

but BP is there to gate your resources too

[vast current]

Leaves 9 days for artifact farming to round out 3 weeks. Which gets you a 4-piece set, maybe not even correct mainstats.

I guess, I haven't played without BP, so even more days farming mats and Mora, then.

Feels shit man.

[coral onyx]

That was okay in early game and up to a point
but for any really long time player farming a new artifact set for a character to around "current character level of this account" means having to farm 3+ months worth of resin and never less unless you are extremely lucky

[vast current]

Yeah...

[pine heron]

I feel like people forget the resin costs for things

[vast current]

What else is there to do but farm artifacts and log off?

[pine heron]

like holy shit

aight needa sleep

[coral onyx]

But yeah that's the game, do event, story quest and sometime build a character

[vast current]

So not worth the money I put in.

[pine heron]

yep

[vast current]

Cheaper than cocaine.

[pine heron]

no drugs here sir

[sour oriole]

not if u C6R5

[vast current]

I feel attacked.

[pine heron]

say you could own a c6 char and/or r5 weapon
what you pickin

[floral relic]

Both

[pine heron]

I meant

who

and what weapon

[vast current]

Yoimiya C6.

[pine heron]

I'll take a c6 itto or zhong

[wooden stratus]

No idea honestly

[pine heron]

c6 zhong seems comfy for funnies co-op

[vast current]

C6 Yae.

[wooden stratus]

I guess C6 Ningguang and R5 solar pearl

If we’re talking whale shit its C6 kokomi and r5 ttds

[floral relic]

I’d take C6 Eula and R5 SoBP tbh

Wait

[vast current]

R5 donut does nothing for

She's still shit.

[wooden stratus]

[vast current]

[wooden stratus]

I take that youve been ignoring every conversation in #・tc-lounge

Or youre new

[vast current]

I know what she can do, still poo poo, in my opinion.

[wooden stratus]

Why exactly

[vast current]

Because Beidou/Fischl carries her team.

[wooden stratus]

What

[pine heron]

[wooden stratus]

Thats not even her best team

[vast current]

What's her best team?

[wooden stratus]

Her best team has Sucrose fischl xiangling

[pine heron]

question: by that logic, pyro carries shit because they are dependent on XQ

[vast current]

My b, Xiangling, Fischl, AND Succrose carries her team.

[hallow flower]

i wouldnt say they carry her

when any other slot in is weaker

[wooden stratus]

No they carry eachother

[vast current]

Just need a proper hydro DPS.

[wooden stratus]

Replacements of these units end up being weaker

[wooden stratus]

Shes not there just to deal damage

[pine heron]

he did say proper, by a technicality

[wooden stratus]

Hydro app heal and ttds

[vast current]

But I only wanna deal damage.

[pine heron]

we do not currently possess one

[wooden stratus]

So….noone

[wooden stratus]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Genshin_Impact/comments/r60nth/the_sukokomon_swirl_reaction/

[pine heron]

yea

[wooden stratus]

Here, damage

[vast current]

[wooden stratus]

Oh youre talking about raw damage

Idk then

Go suck ayaka balls or something

[vast current]

[pine heron]

[vast current]

had potential, but she's just a Barbara with better hydro application.

[wooden stratus]

Jesus

[vast current]

And to that, I say: HECK YOU, miHoYo!

[random oracle]

tenten posted a new vid about sukokomon

[wooden stratus]

[vast current]

[ripe cedar]

how is people still underrating kokomi

[wooden stratus]

Idk man shes “just a barbara with better hydro app”

[pine heron]

feel like the vibe I'm getting here is, kokomi isn't as impactful to an account as other stronger units but I'm just spitballing here

[wooden stratus]

If this was on main channel these takes would get you smacked

[ripe cedar]

but barbara with a better hydro app is T0

[pine heron]

[hallow flower]

kokomi or childe are one of the most impactful units as a player's first 5star

[vast current]

I like as a character, but she's super underwhelming.

[wooden stratus]

Where are you even using her then

[vast current]

I'm not using her.

[wooden stratus]

There you have it then

Calls unit underwhelming without ever using them

Amazing

[vast current]

She's in friendship team collecting frenship.

[random oracle]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=og3C4RScG3I

youre not even making an argument

[pine heron]

[random oracle]

you just keep saying koko is bad

[wooden stratus]

Youre making a statement and if we show evidence you ignore it and you keep saying shes bad

This is like talking to an antivaxxer

[vast current]

I just don't like her.

I don't want to be shoehorned into playing a 5* in only one/two compositions.

[wooden stratus]

And we need to know it why

[random oracle]

so youre shitting on her viability?

[coral onyx]

More like people saying she is underwhelming don't value versatility, TTDS, ToM, confort of healing and never focus on EC hard or use EC for Overvape
Or really easy and versatile Hydro application for Freeze.
And now that clam is out she even brings okay AoE damage.
How people could say she is bad or underwhelming is beyond me unless they just don't consider reaction at all, or buffs, or heal.

[vast current]

Because I expect 5* to be more versatile and better overall.

[wooden stratus]

She has many comps

[random oracle]

do you like childe?

[wooden stratus]

But she IS versatile

[hallow flower]

childe has like one comp

hutao is glued to xq

[wooden stratus]

3

But i only see 1

[hallow flower]

the others are much weaker

[wooden stratus]

Yeah, ec and freeze childe

[random oracle]

intl is like by far childe's best team

[vast current]

I don't play Hu Tao with XQ.

[random oracle]

and you cant play koko in other teams?

[pine heron]

noted

[vast current]

I don't want to play Koko in those teams.

[true forge]

Everytime I comeback to Discord someone is shitting on Koko

Wtf?

[wooden stratus]

What is your argument even

[wooden stratus]

C6 kazuha and R5 freedom

“This character is not viable because i do not want to play her”

[vast current]

I don't like Koko. She's bad.

[wooden stratus]

This is what you sound like

[pine heron]

[wooden stratus]

Im convinced youre trolling

So bye

[wooden stratus]

C6 kaz and r5 mist

Freedom for me

Kek

[vast current]

C6 Kaz.

[wooden stratus]

Kaz Benny xq and fish

Another team gest to be whatever I want

[hallow flower]

ima have to ask you to keep personal preferences outside of character strength appraisal

[wooden stratus]

Hmm

How good is Kaz as a driver for bei

[random oracle]

oh wait youre an intern

i forgot you have power

[hallow flower]

unless you c6

[pine heron]

AYO APOLLO

[random oracle]

👀

[hallow flower]

then its sorta usable

[sour oriole]

[wooden stratus]

Qiqi better driver ofc

[wooden stratus]

Perfect this is c6 kaz

[hallow flower]

but sucrose is smoother with range

[wooden stratus]

C6 Kaz Bennet xq bei

[sour oriole]

Koko Bei driver trust

[wooden stratus]

YESS I like

[random oracle]

i dont like using koko as a driver

[sour oriole]

nani

[random oracle]

n2 walks are hell on mobile

[wooden stratus]

RIGHT?

[wooden stratus]

I've been spotted

i hate doing n2w

[random oracle]

theyre like the only cancels i struggle with

[true forge]

Also hell on a controller

[random oracle]

most other things i can do

[wooden stratus]

So i just do N2J/N2C

[sour oriole]

y'all n2 walk tryhards

just normal like a pleb

[pine heron]

[sour oriole]

tap tap tap

[random oracle]

never play console games so wouldnt know

[wooden stratus]

But with C1 i just N3

Hmm

I might want c6 eula instead

C6 eula is press Q to win

[pine heron]

Tell El I'm happy for them that shenhe's came back from the "dead"

[wooden stratus]

Im not particularly fond of any 5* c6

But for 4* its Ningguang’s

[hallow flower]

i think kaz has the coolest c6

[true forge]

Her n3 feels extremely slow for some reason. Even if walk canceling her n2 is hard I still prefer it to the alternative

It's the flip man. It was cute at first but now it just gives me anxiety

[sour oriole]

walk cancel is cancer

i dont like it

that's why i play Yanfei

[random oracle]

shouldve given her AA speed in her ult

[wooden stratus]

Yanfei where you cant move while attacking

[wooden stratus]

C4

[random oracle]

imagine if you could cancel her CAs like klee

[sour oriole]

wait till Klee rerun

[wooden stratus]

This kinda of brain numbing is addicting

[random oracle]

i dont read 5 star cons anymore

[sour oriole]

imma pull Klee

[wooden stratus]

10% aspd

[pine heron]

catalysts and bows aren't fun to play (trials)

[random oracle]

dont tempt me

[vast current]

Versatility plays into overall character strength, as well. Point remains the role of in that team is just to apply hydro to a group, which is only unique to her solely because we lack proper hydro characters.

[wooden stratus]

What

[wooden stratus]

Eh btw did u leave.

[vast current]

Anyways, I need to level 🌹

[random oracle]

literally childe

[wooden stratus]

Suddenly healing, driving, and dmg dont exist anymore

[vast current]

The team shown isn't using Kokomi for the healing, and Succrose is doing the driving with autos and Es.

[pine heron]

[wooden stratus]

But kokomi heals the team

[random oracle]

off field aoe hydro app is a commodity

[wooden stratus]

Theres a video where terra just tanks attacks and heals them with kokomi

Is that what youre looking for

[vast current]

I'll have to try the team. Generally healing hasn't been an issue.

[wooden stratus]

Hasn't been an issue to you

[vast current]

No 🌹 levels, though.

[wooden stratus]

Can't really speak for anyone else whether it's an issue or not

[true forge]

I wonder why yellow flairs hate healers so much

[wooden stratus]

I havent really played with shields since day 1

My diano is always underbuilt

[pine heron]

healing in what regard? being able to heal at all? needing it to being with? dealing with corrosion

[wooden stratus]

Shes just there to battery rosaria

[vast current]

My Diano is 60, just like Succrose.

[pine heron]

based

forced to lvl mine

[vast current]

I don't have a second VV EM set.

[wooden stratus]

Ill fully commit to sucrose once i get her c1

Because this game hates me so much and only gave me ONE sucrose

[vast current]

And I suppose Succrose wants to be 90 for maximum swirl.

[pine heron]

trade you my c4 one for ummmm thoma cons yes

thoma cons

[random oracle]

from 80 to 90 it's ~30% swirl dmg increase

[pine heron]

or a spare qiqi or bennny

[random oracle]

so basically ~30% more sucrose dmg

[vast current]

Can't spend resin on Beth until I get Itto artifacts.

[wooden stratus]

I do not have thoma

[pine heron]

[wooden stratus]

You can have my bennett but i dont have qiqi either

Waiting for the fated day she comes

[pine heron]

c5 beny lets go

based

[vast current]

C6 your Benny, you coward.

[pine heron]

I don't HAVE c6

in the first place

[wooden stratus]

I wish i had c6 benny

[pine heron]

that's why I want more cons

[wooden stratus]

When uwant a c6 Bennet

[pine heron]

benny from artemis gives me c5

[wooden stratus]

For pyro yun jin

[vast current]

I also don't use Bennett.

[wooden stratus]

Then I can have more fun with quick swap rosa

[vast current]

Man, I might be in the wrong server.

[pine heron]

and I would c6 benny, he deserves it

had I had gotten copies of him earlier

one copy in 1.6

[vast current]

Maximum meta but only if meeting a certain level of comfy.

[sour oriole]

buried underneath the shitpost and horniposts

are meta slaves and n2 walk tryhards

[pine heron]

[vast current]

There's a middle ground. You don't have to go full meta.

[wooden stratus]

I dont go full meta unless the comp is fun

[vast current]

There is the golden comfy meta level.

[wooden stratus]

I just stick characters that work together

[pine heron]

or if you don't play abyss (just here for the information)

[wooden stratus]

When your so meta

[wooden stratus]

I only play until f11 lol

U calculate char productivity and value 6months in to the future

[vast current]

You cannot convince me is not a comfy team.

[pine heron]

albedo

[vast current]

Albedo is best character in the game and I will fight the metaslaves.

[pine heron]

albedo > kazuha drip factor

[pine heron]

that is all I have to report back

[wooden stratus]

No message for alpha

Cafe

Chia

Dinosaur

I want albedo but shenhe

[pine heron]

[wooden stratus]

Mezzone

Albedo is perfect for my ning comp

Alas, i am tempted by hip windows

Darn you woman

Shame

Jk

I actually like her eyes better

Than anything else

[pine heron]

her eyes and hair are really nice

[wooden stratus]

I'ma just be smart

And listen to my boss

[vast current]

There is an alternate universe where Ning is the 5* and Keqing is the 4*.

[pine heron]

tho she's fairly trophy for me, kit ain't much to look at personally so itto stonks to the moon

PLEASE

[wooden stratus]

But ning is the 5*

[pine heron]

we need to go back to that timeline

[wooden stratus]

The 5* with the easy to get cons

[vast current]

She doesn't have the 5* stats.

[wooden stratus]

Just bouken

Jk

I hate bennett

[vast current]

Same.

Benny bad.

[wooden stratus]

Ning has 5* scaling tho

[vast current]

Her ascension stat doesn't.

[wooden stratus]

2k% mv every 12 or so seconds

[vast current]

Base ATK is doodoopoop.

[pine heron]

benny is based not sorry

[wooden stratus]

Only c6 bennett is based

Otherwise i wont use him

Pyrosaria and pyrojin

[pine heron]

he takes ones for the team despite being shit on his luck

[wooden stratus]

[pine heron]

yo homies wouldn't stare death in the face to save the homies

[vast current]

Pretty sure if ZL was given a chance to die to save Liyue he'd do it in a heartbeat.

Albedo cannot truly exceed the bounds of mortal geo until the mentor passes away, it's in all the animes.

[pine heron]

right, sleep.... fuck

[obsidian ore]

Do you have a recommended guide to read up on how this team comp works?
I'm waiting patiently for kokomi's rerun for my alt account, and i wonder what i should build in the meantime, I'm worried if this team heavily relied on the constellations of the 4 stars [cause my alt is painfully low on chara consts]

[oh scrolled down a bit to see this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=og3C4RScG3I]

[split nacelle]

"new"

his clickbait is still so bad, i'm glad i stopped watching him

[obsidian ore]

[REAL]

[split nacelle]

[NOT CLICKBAIT]

[obsidian ore]

↙️

🐟

[split nacelle]

smh no red arrows in the thumb though

[obsidian ore]

and no shocked face next to a big number

[split nacelle]

[obsidian ore]

dont worry he got you covered in the video

[split nacelle]

still, 1010 or not, it's good that the comp is getting some visibility

i just don't hate his bias and tryhardness for no real reason

but eh, whatever

[obsidian ore]

mind = blown, but imagery broke me

I never knew ghoba applies pyro to himself

[split nacelle]

yeah that's the whole point of guoba swirl i think

[obsidian ore]

whenever i swirled him with idk, anemo MC, i thought that the reason it absorbed pyro was because of the flame attack

[split nacelle]

could be a bug, but it's probably intended

[obsidian ore]

definitely intended, they had to deliberately add that in

[split nacelle]

as if XL wasn't good already

[obsidian ore]

probably for the sake of making MC fire tornados, not for this teamcomp tho

[split nacelle]

they nerfed her ult cost and guoba uptime from cbt, and she's still strong af

and then she became "player's choice" because they polled testers for one free 4* at launch, i think

[obsidian ore]

I'm just amazed people found a use for ghoba, one of the most annoying and unreliable skills in the game

[split nacelle]

true

i wonder if guoba swirl works just as well with kazuha

[obsidian ore]

rip, my alt only has c0 sucrose, so this team is kinda trash there atm. there's a long time before we'll see kokomi rerun tho, so there's still a chance for it to show up.
But hmm, even then, i think i'd prefer playing kokomi in a more comfortable team

[split nacelle]

i heard that team has strict rotations so it's not as comfy as others, despite being strong af

[wooden stratus]

This is the rotation, as for the cons i think sucrose c1 is most important, cons arent really needed but they do help in damage of course

As for a guide im not sure if one exists

But terrapin has videos talking about it

[obsidian ore]

hehe yea, i'm currently watching tenten's video, he gives a fairly good explanation of the team

@wooden stratus do you have any other more comfy team comps that utilize kokomi? Cause atm I just thought of throwing her into all parties that used barbara on my alt. [that account is not very well built btw] I used barbara mostly for stuff like pairing with fischl and yanfei, or as a panic heal button for my newly acquired hutao on that account. Kokomi would be able to do those things no problem, but i wonder what else I could do with her once her rerun is out, and build stuff accordingly

[wooden stratus]

Taser kokomi is extremely easy

[obsidian ore]

fischl and beidou?

[wooden stratus]

Yeah

If st can put xingqiu there otherwise sucrose/kaz

Theres also kokomi as a slot-in for mona

They arent too far off eachother

[obsidian ore]

oh great, i wondered what to do with kaz in that account lately

so just gotta build beidou, sounds fun to me, i never built her up on main so this sounds exciting

tyty o/

[wooden stratus]

Np

[split nacelle]

i'm just glad more people are considering kokomi, it seems

i don't regret her at all

[obsidian ore]

i'd be frank, the clam set was quite the eye opener

[split nacelle]

that set made me finally level up the donut, but it's all good since now i have a decent shieldfei as well with the proto amber koko was using

[obsidian ore]

cause as soon as i saw that, i realized "oh, you don't have to do quirky stuff with kokomi anymore to make her feel impactful, now she's a standalone unit that also has a ton of utility"

[split nacelle]

true, the set helps a lot but she was fine before too... people were just expecting childe dmg on her non-crit or something

also she's easy af to build

[obsidian ore]

I usually don't adhere to rotations much, and just have fun with the teams as i see fit, so as long as each individual unit in the team can carry their own weight, or they don't require too much attention, i end up having fun

[split nacelle]

same, i'm not a tryhard at all

[obsidian ore]

ironically, i still can't enjoy my childe

[split nacelle]

the most "setup" i do is be sure i swirl pyro with kaz for hu tao (that's easy since pyro has priority for him anyways) or be mindful of skill order in something like national

but it's not even that big of a deal most of the time

[grizzled relic]

bruh, Shenhe TC became a Sukokomon room

[split nacelle]

1010 moment

[pale root]

Yes
From what is mostly agreed upon
It used only the dmg bonus/crit values from the affected character
It only uses shenhe atk (not base atk)

[wooden stratus]

I wonder if onfield shenhe with chong will be better or rosaria?

[floral jay]

I will say chong

[wooden stratus]

Oh i meant like, shenhe onfield or rosaria

[floral jay]

its hard to answer that question because i dont know much about rosaria other than her being on field physical dps

Melt rosaria usually is a quickswap i think? Not sure

[wooden stratus]

Well do i pull rosaria now

Im gonna checl honey for NA MVs i guess

[obsidian ore]

If mihoyo decides that quill stacks add up, how much will it increase the value of a c1 shenhe?

Cause frankly, it feels almost too easy to use up these stacks with ayaka

[wooden stratus]

Hmm rosaria has higher scaling

Are quills consumed by na/ca

[obsidian ore]

anything that does cyro damage

so infused attacks of ayaka should work as well

[wooden stratus]

Superconduct?

[obsidian ore]

my initial guess is no, but would need to be tested

[no because of how different the damage calculation of superconduct is compared to a normal cyro damage attack]

[vast current]

No reactions.

[unreal light]

https://youtu.be/AZjKWJmD5no I saw this simplified rotation that works well for me

[vast current]

It’s just swirling gooba flames onto electrocuted enemies.

As long as you remember to set up electrocute first, I think you’ll be fine.

[wooden stratus]

Do we have calcs on onfield shen with chong

[clever tartan]

Fun fact: if you use shenhe with chongyun he enables other non cryo characters to use the quills

Cryo bennett meta

[vast current]

Other characters that typically don’t run cryo goblets.

[true forge]

Then run one on them?

Cryo Keqing has been a thing for ages at this point

[wooden stratus]

Cryo….cryo razor….

[clever tartan]

If you don't have 5* anemo units, you might run sucrose with cryo goblet in freeze teams

If I pull shenhe I think I will try to do a Diano one shot

Her cryo dmg will finally be used

[split nacelle]

[vast current]

You’re not my supervisor!

[ripe cedar]

my kazuha with HoD reaches 55/200 crit value because my first 5* cryo goblet is a VV one. I'm so ready for shenhe lmao

[sour socket]

Is anyone thinking about Eula Qiqi Raiden Shenhe? (Clam Qiqi)

[patent smelt]

yo we are on the same wavelenght

I want to use her with Eula also

[mystic linden]

dunno what shenhe would bring to that team

[obsidian ore]

you'd find it very hard to use all the quills of shenhe in that team

[karmic jasper]

No, only sucrose has the ability to swirl guoba

[obsidian ore]

wait really?

not even venti?

[not that it matters for that team but]

[earnest kestrel]

If Shenhe doesn't bring at least 20% dmg increase to cryo units, I'm most likely skipping her.

[karmic jasper]

Yeah only sucrose has that tech

Sucrose's E is a very very strange skill that can swirl very strange objects

That's why we love her though

[karmic jasper]

Yeah only sucrose (sorry forgot to ping)

[split nacelle]

sadge

[floral jay]

wait doesnt kazuha also swirl off guoba?

Wait he just absorb the pyro

[autumn sorrel]

how viable is chongyun triple melt nuke or aloy burst melt with shenhe?

[clever tartan]

This team makes good use of shenhe, but I don't know if the team actually is viable

In the old national, he used to do triple melt and bring a lot of value to the team, but sucrose variation outperforms him

This makes me think if is actually good to build a team around it

[untold stirrup]

if you wanna do reverse melt rosaria sounds straight up better than chong/aloy

[split nacelle]

rosa is great

[sinful flume]

https://youtu.be/EC15AgRNrNQ

[split nacelle]

Koinzell

[lapis swan]

chongyun triple/quad melt works with just amber, and shenhe can provide enough quills to melt all his burst so think it will work

[ripe cedar]

You can use EM sands with Shenhe

[teal belfry]

Is shenhe ult like useless when used as a support?

[clever tartan]

She has buffs and debuffs in her burst and its the only way to trigger her own quills

[ripe cedar]

her burst is only good to trigger ice quills yeah. The only reason it's 80 energy is to give it 20s cooldown and make C2 valuable lol

I'm either running Shenhe+Chongyun and Cryo Keqing with Jean or Cryo Kazuha with Diona

[ripe cedar]

do you guys think this is a good summary of Shenhe

[mystic linden]

no, if your dps sucks your quill damage will still suck

still need dmg% and crit to use them effectively

[ripe cedar]

Gotcha. It's more of an illustration of how her quills are not exactly a buff, but Shenhe's own delayed damage

[mystic linden]

it's closer to bennett/sara buff than anything else in terms of how you want to build around it

[ripe cedar]

isnt bennett just direct "i'll make your bullets BIG" type of buff

[mystic linden]

they're all extra sources of raw damage independent of your atk

[oak tide]

an ammo system is a good way to describe shenhe

[mystic linden]

bennett adds 1k atk * your skill mv in damage

shenhe adds 4k atk * a fixed 75% mv in damage

[oak tide]

flat damage is the best way I've heard it described

[split nacelle]

idk if i would compare shenhe to bennett/sara buffs, she benefits a lot from low scaling skills and has more value when the character proc-ing the quills has low multis and multi hits

while benny is just a consistent increase

shenhe/yun jin buffs should be the same as redhorn/cinnabar

since it's flat dmg that then gets affected by crit, it's much more valuable on lower scaling multihits like ayaka's charged/ult, rosaria double hits, shenhe's own ult ticks, etc.

[split nacelle]

this video posted earlier explains it very well with the current assumptions IMO

we shall see if/how they change her later

[wooden stratus]

will wavebreakers fin work with shenhe?

[ripe cedar]

will work very well

[wooden stratus]

good bc it looks aesthetic with her

[ripe cedar]

I think currently it's high refine lithic > wavebreakers / favonius > lithic / royal > everything else

[split nacelle]

royal

finally a use for that weird set?

[vast current]

High refine Lithic in all teams?

[mystic linden]

you have a minimum of one liyue char in the team so it's always better than the nothing that everything else gives

[ripe cedar]

in 3+ liyue

oh, so even with only shenhe it's better?

[vast current]

I suppose high refine Lithic is a 44 Base ATK weapon with 38% ATK.

[mystic linden]

it's the only weapon in that list with atk in passive

and generally the base atk vs substat atk difference is an even tradeoff

[split nacelle]

wavebreaker has atk%

[mystic linden]

passive, not substat

[vast current]

But Wavebreaker’s 620 should scale a lot better if you’re going ATK/ATK/ATK mainstats, no?

[split nacelle]

maybe, but i guess lithic helps with more atk%

it kinda mimics her own 5* wep, with atk% and more atk%

[oak tide]

shenhe doesn't "benefit" from low/multi hits

they simply deliver her damage the fastest

it's still the same amount of damage per rotation

[mystic linden]

i'm a fan of favonius, she'll definitely need all the ER she can get

[oak tide]

unless your cryo damage is so slow that you can't use all her quills

[split nacelle]

benefit in the sense that you get more % increase with those vs high scaling big nukes

when you compare it vs benny for example

with and without shenhe it's more increase on low scaling skills

so i think she'll help even out weaker characters while still buffing decently the heavy hitters as well

[oak tide]

the amount of damage she adds is independent of who is using it outside of their scaling stats

their multipliers do not matter

a diona with the same crit stats and cryo% as a ganyu would get the same damage out of shenhe

[split nacelle]

i meant it comparatively, you get more benefit if you're buffing a lower scaling vs a heavy hitter, ofc the amount is the same because it's a flat number

[oak tide]

I don't think it's good to consider it an increase in the character's damage in the case of shenhe

it's just shenhe's damage

done by someone else

since it's truly capped by the number of quills outside of c6

[split nacelle]

yeah but how can you see how much she adds in a practical scenario? you just see with and without her quills, how much % more it is

you can't really see it as "shenhe did this dmg"

[oak tide]

but the % more doesn't really matter here, since it's still practically a flat added amount of damage

as opposed to bennett/sara who are actually multiplicative

if shenhe adds 50k damage, of course you're seeing more on diona who did 5k initially as opposed to ganyu who did 150k

whereas bennett/sara you would see the same/similar % increase between ganyu and diona

[split nacelle]

i mean sure, but it's just a way to see it practically... i see my rosaria do this and this number, then add shenhe, and it's more by this %, that's it

that's why i'm saying you'll see her value more on those lower scalings

[oak tide]

the perceived value will probably be higher yes

I'm looking forward to diona shotgun damage too

[split nacelle]

[oak tide]

honestly this might be the first time diona's cryo dmg% ascension comes in use

[split nacelle]

time for dps diano

[patent smelt]

Im wondering if Shenhe is being built with some sort of future unit in mind

[autumn sorrel]

dendro

[pine heron]

honestly she does seem designed for quick swap burst DPS's

[plush sleet]

Chongers

[cerulean wraith]

[pine heron]

and I mean future ones too

[mystic linden]

i don't see future chars being better than picking two out of ganyu/ayaka/rosaria for a shenhe team

[split nacelle]

who knows, really... gorou's already getting so many def scaling characters, they might do the same for shenhe later

[tame flare]

Has anyone done the math on double cryo double anemo or double cryo hydro and anemo comps with shenhe? Chara that have anemo elemental absorption in consideration only

Shenhe chong kazuha + anemo or hydro flex

She seems potentially geared torwards cryo anemo

it seems like her kit is more built around cryo/anemo comps than freeze comps to me. they're probably worried about stacking VV with the res shred on shenhe. Geo res shred can't be stacked with VV so that's why the shred is higher. Thoughts anyone?

[sour oriole]

replying cos noone wants to talk about Shenhe anymore, yes she will be fine in any triple cryo damage application team

triple cryo, double cryo anemo infuse

double cryo rev melt

[tame flare]

she doesn't seem bad at all in the cryo anemo comps... but there's currently no meta around a comp that relies on elemental absorption to do a ton of damage right

seems like they had in mind a "sheer cold" like comp if I'm right about it.. but I don't know how to crunch the numbers

[sinful flume]

more Cryo characters?

[split nacelle]

hey, cryo has been hot lately i'll take it

[pine heron]

[sour oriole]

she's never been bad

[tame flare]

well the popular discourse would lead you to believe otherwise

she's definitely a bit niche though

compared to most chars

[sour oriole]

she just competes with other cryos

[split nacelle]

this community will always doompost every new character... itto is just an expensive noelle and kokomi a worse barbara

the cycle will never stop repeating

[sour oriole]

cos people want their waifu to cleave an island in half with their Q and one hit overworld mobs with one auto

[split nacelle]

[tame flare]

shenhe diona traveller sucrose.. what do you all think about this as a f2p friendly build?

it doesn't look too bad to me

you can build shenhe as dps like this lol

you get so much res shred... 15% from shenhe, 20% from absorption +20% damage from sucrose absorption 40% from VV

it's reliable up time too

[sour oriole]

you dont build Shenhe mainDPS, you can if you want to

[sinful flume]

there is just one problem
who is doing dmg there?

[pale root]

No news about shenhe beta, right?

the more i look into shenhe, the more Yunjin looks interesting

[split nacelle]

tbf shenhe could potentially buff herself quite nicely, but idk still sounds cope

[sour oriole]

cos u Eula simp

[split nacelle]

true

[sour oriole]

Eula lives rent free in ur head

[split nacelle]

[tame flare]

i guess when I say mainDPS, I mean a lot of the damage is actually coming from shenhe..

[sour oriole]

you need other characters to trigger her damage, think Albedo

she's cryo Albedo that uses her team mates' stats (crit, dmg%, buffs/talents)

[split nacelle]

while that's technically true, it sounds so misleading lol

she's a cinnabar passive made character

[sour oriole]

cinnabar copy paste twice into Yunjin and Shenhe

MHY: one patch done

[split nacelle]

funniest thing is that if their buffs really do work the same, everyone is seeing how good cinnabar is while trashing shenhe at the same time

and then praising yun jin

[sour oriole]

cos Cinnabar as a weapon with how it works is fine

Shenhe and Yunjin with 'Cinnabar-like' feature does not add much into the game

[split nacelle]

fair point i guess, but it's still funny because their buffs are likely very strong regardless

just maybe not that needed for now

[sour oriole]

meta strength does not correlate to gameplay experience

MHY needs to provide both

[split nacelle]

i do like yun jin's kit more, the counter is nice to have with def scaling, but shenhe is waifu

[sour oriole]

a character that does 1 M damage no question asked no setup everytime u press Q is not a fun character

[split nacelle]

yeah

[pine heron]

plus slotting in a different weapon on a unit, should be much different than using someone else in a comp
they may do the same thing but one's a weapon that's an attribute added onto a char
the other is a unit themselves

there's a lot more, give and take, with unit placement vs weapons (ofc that can depend on what weapon and unit you're comparing)

[split nacelle]

the unit potentially applies the buff to everyone though, but yeah it's situational

[pine heron]

yea but not everyone can use it cuz cryo

[split nacelle]

it's definitely a weird situation, she's a cryo buffer when cryo isn't really weak to begin with, a 5* when they seemed to start going for 4* element soecific supports...

[pine heron]

mhm

[coral onyx]

Shenhe buff is extremely strong that's why they restricted it with stacks charges, for example she pretty much gives 70% more damage to 7 ticks of Ayala burst which ends up being somewhat 25%more damage for the whole burst

[split nacelle]

also a support that's coming after gigachads like kaz and raiden

[pine heron]

yea

it really feels like they want to lay out groundwork now

for future units that can use her buff but

[split nacelle]

idk if those numbers are true but also... did ayaka really need that? or ganyu? meh

[pine heron]

that's kinda hopium than a future release will use her

and who knows how long that'll be

[split nacelle]

yeah

[coral onyx]

Ganyu needs it for single target for non whales, but Ayaka with how extremely strong she is if you cc enemy, no she didn't need it

[pine heron]

yea I really did think before shenhe was given these limitations because of those chars existence, esp ganyu

[coral onyx]

let's see the MV if we try shenhe Mdps

[pine heron]

and in a way with c6 being how it is, its kinda true

[split nacelle]

while you can pull for kaz or raiden after seeing their universal potential and be fine with "this is futureproof", even koko to an extent, you can't really do that with shenhe due to her specificity

[pine heron]

but feels like future hopium

yea

[split nacelle]

i think her dmg will be fine tho, at least as sub dps... she should buff herself and her ult has double ticks iirc

so maybe hybrid build is not too bad

but we'll see

[sour oriole]

hybrid Shenhe is situational

[coral onyx]

Talking in MV
Shenhe burst damage at C0 is initial + 10 dot : 777.64% at T10
5 quills : 383.75%
7 quills : 530.32%
C0 Q + 5 quills : 1161.39%
C0 Q + 7 quills : 1314.89%

C2 is initial + 16 dot : 1135.56% at 10

C2 Q + 5 quills : 1519.31%
C2 Q + 7 quills : 1672.81%

Ayaka C0 Q ? = 4143.87% on an enemy cced for 5seconds

[woven mantle]

it's not really worth to take out the comfort out of ganyu team for shenhe imo, ayaka is more arguable

unless you have kokomi as the hydro option

[sour oriole]

just get all the cryo characters with the highest MV, invest to the max, add VV and Shenhe, and call it a day

[woven mantle]

issue there is particle gen imo

it just doesn't seem a great outlook to me

[coral onyx]

Well the thing is that they really benefit TONS with how their damage profile is, multiple hits that each gets buffed a lot
like how ayaka and Ganyu are lots of little hits and even their CA/ infused NA

[split nacelle]

they clearly thought it out tbh... ayaka has ult ticks and charged, ganyu too, rosaria has double hits and dot, kaeya has ult ticks diona too... there's a pattern here

[woven mantle]

in an eventual triple cryo comp like shenhe ganyu ayaka venti are you forced to use ayaka as your on field dps and not ganyu pretty much?

for particles purposes

[coral onyx]

C2 Hold E + Q (wait for 7 stacks consumed~5sec) + Hold E : 2 196,2%

have to have C2 and be really precise in timing or will waste a quill at least

how many time does Rosaria burst hit with her dot?

[sour oriole]

4+2? at C2

initial hit Q 2 hits, E 2 hits

10 hits for double quill stacks

[coral onyx]

Rosaria Q is 1411.2% C0 (6 hits)
C2 1886.4 (8 hits)

[sour oriole]

and can be melt reliably

[coral onyx]

without quills and yeah can be used for melt

[split nacelle]

yep rosaria hates icd

[sour oriole]

Shenhe TC dead not cos she's bad

but cos she's just a Cinnabar

gaemplay wise

[split nacelle]

monday buffs

testers have to have finished the map by now i hope

now it's abyss and shenhe, come on

[pine heron]

also the AoE thing

[strange field]

So how's Shenhe's kit so far

[sour oriole]

scroll uppppppppppppp

[lapis crow]

check pins

[strange field]

oki

it looking dicey ngl

[coral onyx]

A big conditional to even consider for pulls when pulling is probably going to be more and more valuable if they round up hyper specialized support buffers(with big value on the C6) like they are starting to do with Sara, Gorou, Yun Jin, Shenhe

[split nacelle]

idk how to feel about the same trend of specialized support with great c6 coming to 5-stars 🗿

like, i'm going for itto and will maybe get idk, c1-2 gorou if i'm lucky and maybe more if i lose 50/50

with c6 more likely down the line as he comes back or as off banner

can't say the same for shenhe

but oh well