・genshin-spoilers

[ashen ocean]

Fair enough

Tru

One does wonder why Och Kan was a mindless dragon when his father is likely the smartest being on the planet

[slender haven]

He only became mindless after getting the abyss lobotomy

Before that he was a brilliant engineer

[ashen ocean]

And the wiki says his father experimented on him as well

[frigid lily]

I just had the worst coughing fit of my life

[slender haven]

Yeah that was the abyss experimentation that corrupted his body

[frigid lily]

Something interesting I thought about from the Skirk set

[slender haven]

We started talking about dragon lore for a second and your body couldn't handle it

[ashen ocean]

It doesnt get better

[frigid lily]

It was actually a spicy soup I was eating

Anyways

[ashen ocean]

Oh

[frigid lily]

In the Skirk set

They mention that Seelies and their names are very important

[ashen ocean]

And his body didnt even reject it, and rather , thrived unlike other dragons

[frigid lily]

And that the first Angel lost her name

[slender haven]

He started attacking everything he saw though

[ashen ocean]

His lack of soul/ brain aside

His body was doing fine

[frigid lily]

So I wonder if the name in the Pyro Gemstone description could be her name? Or something similar?

[slender haven]

Well he was half human too
So maybe that's what let him take in the abyss

[ashen ocean]

So are u tryna say angels are beyond saving when they forget their own self, to truly LOVE another being ?

[frigid lily]

More so love themselves as well

[slender haven]

Actually? That could make sense
The "he" could even still be Capitano since he has access to the memories of both the land and Yohual so if he finds out about the First Angel (possibly his ancestor too) he'd follow in her will when he comes back

[ashen ocean]

Loving yourself when your purpose and powers are to help others is a cruel fate

And esp being given the sentience to recognise this

[ashen ocean]

Tru

[frigid lily]

I still want to know how the first 3 lines of the gemstone description have anything to do with it

[ashen ocean]

Could be her, or a moon sister

[slender haven]

I just like to think they're generic Natlan competition slop

[frigid lily]

I mean they are

[slender haven]

Mavuika describing the broad stuff before zeroing in on something specific

Does that make sense?

[frigid lily]

Kind of

[ashen ocean]

It could be the boys name

[frigid lily]

Fuck it maybe Capitano is the Light Prince
Capitano is getting revived, Light Prince is supposed to be revived
Light Prince had star eyes, Capitano has star eyes
Light Prince was posessed randomly by someone from outer space
Capitano has his heart thing that allows him to catch people's ghosts and he also almost got posessed
Light Prince was friends with Nibelung
Capitano has weird dragon scales
It all makes sense
He's going to be revived as a woman to piss off his fans even more
The firefly theories were true after all
They're going back to their roots

[ashen ocean]

Firefly ?

Also why capitano

[frigid lily]

Goddamn it this soup isn't even that spicy why is it fucking up my throat this much

[ashen ocean]

Hes literally a rando in the larger picture

[frigid lily]

I mean its a joke but I honestly don't think he's a random if he's gonna be revived

[ashen ocean]

Capitano wont be revived until like the PO curse is lifted imo

The one that prohibits khaenrians from leyline recycle

[frigid lily]

If you say that to a Capitano main you will be dead within a milisecond

[ashen ocean]

Idc

His fans are too whiny

[frigid lily]

I agree though

[ashen ocean]

He took the bullet for dottore

Dottore just has to luck out once again and outlive Bina

And he will be playable

[frigid lily]

I don't like Dottore
I hope he's not playable

[ashen ocean]

Isnt dottore supposed to be Dr Ratio or whoever it is of this game

[slender haven]

That would make him even more dead 😭

Why would getting his immortality removed make him alive?

[frigid lily]

Who is doctor ratio

[slender haven]

It would also fuck over Yohual too

[ashen ocean]

He will reincarnate as beautiful tall lady then

[slender haven]

HSR character

[frigid lily]

Oh ok

I dont play hsr sk

*so

[slender haven]

Nah dude Dottore is going to get absolutely fucked in Nod-Krai

[frigid lily]

Do you guys know what game I do play though

[slender haven]

I don't but he came roughly around the time I stopped playing

[ashen ocean]

No, we will see his good intentions and feel bad and he joins us to fight the big bad in Nod Krai

[frigid lily]

Thatd even worse
Its better if he stays dead

[ashen ocean]

He always has his clones

[frigid lily]

Anyways are none of you going to ask me what game I play

[ashen ocean]

We could fet one of them

[slender haven]

Not a woman so he doesn't get to

[ashen ocean]

It is the game from your previous pfp

[frigid lily]

Yes

[ashen ocean]

https://tenor.com/view/scaramouche-wanderer-stepping-stomping-angry-gif-17641666272709896302

Why is this on tenor

[frigid lily]

What the FUCK is thay gif

[slender haven]

https://tenor.com/view/ltg-gif-40123618314459872

[ashen ocean]

Idk but am howling

[frigid lily]

How do I look for gifs

[ashen ocean]

They will never let a noble white collar profession like doctors be evil it will serve a bad example to kids

[slender haven]

Also Scaramouche got fucking humiliated and his dreams crushed in front of him and attempted to erase his own existence
Meanwhile Raiden goes "sorry lol" and have the devs sucking her off for the rest of time lol

[ashen ocean]

Emoji

[slender haven]

We already have Baizhu as a good guy doctor

[frigid lily]

https://tenor.com/view/slay-the-princess-opportunist-tlq-the-long-quiet-pristine-cut-gif-17741594663123567104

Thanks

[ashen ocean]

We need an ethically ambiguous doctor to counter his good doctor energy

[ashen ocean]

https://tenor.com/view/the-man-in-wall-warframe-gif-24269482

[slender haven]

Anything other than pure morally good is not allowed in Da Wei's world

[ashen ocean]

Dottore gets a pass coz 5* male privileges

[slender haven]

https://tenor.com/view/natlan-archon-quest-capitano-il-capitano-the-captain-genshin-capitano-gif-1247879089939367631

[ashen ocean]

He was charming like Dottore

[slender haven]

Capitano was rizz
Dottore was sexual harassment

[ashen ocean]

https://tenor.com/view/il-dottore-dottore-genshin-genshin-impact-kawaii-gif-13349515419829033685

[ashen ocean]

Dottore rizzed up all of Sumeru City in one afternoon
Capitano wore winter clothes to a tropical nation

[frigid lily]

https://tenor.com/view/slay-the-princess-slaytheprincess-slay-razor-good-morning-gif-6859898233123390501

[ashen ocean]

Evergreen tweet

[frigid lily]

There are not enough slay the princess gifs for my liking

[ashen ocean]

I bet capitano STANK

While dottore has a skin care routine plus perfume routine

[slender haven]

Capitano has ice powers so he can be room temperature wherever he wants

[frigid lily]

Where's that one superman picture

[ashen ocean]

Dottore is likely a hydro claymore from way back in sumeru leak days

And is a shatter dps

[slender haven]

🤤

[slender haven]

Not hydro but maybe claymore

[frigid lily]

I feel dendro suits him more

Idk

Not that I care

[slender haven]

Nah harbinger are never the same as their archon rivals
I'm guessing either electro or pyro

[ashen ocean]

What is this game even about

[frigid lily]

Its a visual novel

[ashen ocean]

Oh

[frigid lily]

Where you have to kill a princess and save the world

Its peak you should play it if you like horror games

[slender haven]

Two bipolar pookies trying to flirt with each other from what I've gathered

[frigid lily]

Pretty much

[ashen ocean]

Hes an element that reacts with cryo

[slender haven]

So not Dendro? That works

[frigid lily]

Who would be Tsaritsa's rival

[slender haven]

Uhh Pierro?

Maybe rival isn't the right term

[ashen ocean]

Ill try
Till now my horror games are limited to TLOU2, RE2 and 3, Bloodborne

[slender haven]

Harbinger complement

[frigid lily]

It is a visual novel so not much "gameplay"
But it has a fuckton of choices you can pick from
Also the guy you play as is hot

[ashen ocean]

Ig if you take action out if it, only bloodborne or tlou2 count

[frigid lily]

and by guy I mean he's not actually a guy

he ain't even human

[ashen ocean]

https://tenor.com/view/mergo's-wet-nuse-gif-2150136964327074677

https://tenor.com/view/mergo's-wet-nuse-gif-1094194001160197546

I find it funny how even in bloodborne the moon is a huge part of its story

[slender haven]

https://tenor.com/view/micolash-cybervist-gio-bloodborne-gif-18463493

[ashen ocean]

https://tenor.com/view/bloodborne-gif-21730409

[slender haven]

https://tenor.com/view/orphan-of-kos-blood-borne-bloodborne-soulslike-game-gif-11338724960386404358

She doesn't

[ashen ocean]

She did

Then the hunters wrecked her village and desecrated her corpse

[slender haven]

She was already dead when she washed up on shore

[ashen ocean]

She granted eyes to hamlet before that

[slender haven]

Guess she may have helped out Rom become a great one though

[ashen ocean]

Her grsnting eyes is why she was killed

[ashen ocean]

Hmm

[slender haven]

She wasn't killed I don't think
She just died

[ashen ocean]

Even better

[ashen ocean]

She was killed
You can see whaling ships on the horizon

[slender haven]

I don't think she did, parasites only began infesting the village after

[ashen ocean]

Killing her was why the hunters curse came to be

[slender haven]

We don't see any weapons coming out of her

[ashen ocean]

The parasites were already present from the villagers transforming upon gaining eyes

[slender haven]

No it's because the people of the Hamlet cursed the Hunters and their descendants for the pain inflicted on them and the Orphan

[ashen ocean]

Her corpse washed ashore

[ashen ocean]

Humans cannot create nightmare planes in bloodborne

It was the curse of kos

The nightmare was hosted by the Orphan

[slender haven]

It was caused by the Orphan if anything

[ashen ocean]

Greta design
Sharp, bold and clear as summer skies

[ashen ocean]

Yes
Only great ones can host nightmares

Mergo, Orphan and Moon Presence

[slender haven]

Read the Kos Parasite description
They only came when Kos died

[ashen ocean]

Hmm
But doesnt change much still

[slender haven]

They need a human host though
That's what Micolash was
That's what Gehrman was too
The Hunter's Dream is hosted by every hunter

[ashen ocean]

Micolash attempted to become an Amygdala

[slender haven]

The curses were from the Hamlet people though

[ashen ocean]

No it was Kos

[slender haven]

He just wanted to be a great one

[slender haven]

She was dead

[ashen ocean]

Great ones dont die

[slender haven]

They literally do

[ashen ocean]

Kos was “dead” in the physical realm
Because they live in higher realms

That is why we never see Oedon

[slender haven]

When one dies another takes their place I guess
When we kill MP we become a great one
When Kos died her kid became one

[slender haven]

We see her corpse in the dream realm too
In all realities she is a corpse

[ashen ocean]

Kos doesnt die
Shes the one who sends down the lightning when Orphan cries

[ashen ocean]

Which dream realm ?

[slender haven]

I think the Orphan is the one doing that
Since they're a god and all

[slender haven]

The dream realm the Hunter's Dream is happening in?

[ashen ocean]

Baby god but still
If orphan really called the lightning it would hit us or the beach directly, not start from the sea
And when orphan dies, it goes into the sea

[ashen ocean]

We dont see her corpse at all

The hunters dream is at the very bottom iirc
It is the deepest layer of existence in the game

[slender haven]

It's a baby it can't pinpoint accurate hit us
Why wouldn't Kos directly hit us if she was the one shooting us?

Lighting flares us around it during its normal attacks too iirc
It's the one shooting the lightning

[ashen ocean]

She is somewhere beyond the sea
And that is where the orphan proceeds to after being killed
In search of its mother

[slender haven]

No we just put it out of its misery

Least tarded Ayato Coper lore theory

[ashen ocean]

Idts
It looks scared and angry that is all

[ashen ocean]

Her kid was always going to be a great one

[slender haven]

It's real body was horribly tortured in the real world too
The thing we fight is its dream form

[ashen ocean]

Oedon is a great one who sired Mergo, another great one

[slender haven]

Every great one loses a child and longs for a surrogate
But the opposite is true here

[slender haven]

And we fucking kill Mergo lol

[ashen ocean]

Fair enough
But we never come across its corpse in current Yharnam or Yahar’Gul

[slender haven]

My guess it could be the source for one of the umbilical cords

[ashen ocean]

No
We do kill the great one’s child

[slender haven]

That's what I said

[ashen ocean]

We only kill her physical form / manifestation in our lower reality
She or He can never die

[slender haven]

But in Kos' case the parent died while the child lives and longs for a parent

[ashen ocean]

Umbilical cords could also be taken off of Arianna

[slender haven]

We hear its cries slowly get snuffed out after we kill its protector in the dream realm

[ashen ocean]

Mb

[ashen ocean]

It is because she cannot sustain herself in this reality anymore

[slender haven]

Considering how she dies if we take it off her I don't think she gave it to then

[ashen ocean]

Also, Mergo is thousands of years old

[slender haven]

I think Mergo was a he

[ashen ocean]

Yeah
Shock of seeing her baby and that does it for her

[slender haven]

No we stab the baby and she dies too
Their life forces were linked or something

[ashen ocean]

The wetnurse hosts for mergo

Is my guess

[slender haven]

The Nightmare was its nurturing grounds so with both its host and protector gone he fades away

[ashen ocean]

Wetnurse beint a Pthumerian Monstrosity herself/ itself

[ashen ocean]

Yes

[slender haven]

Yeah that makes sense
So when we kill her Mergo dies too

[ashen ocean]

I wish Bloodborne had a bit more time in the oven

Its dungeons I spent over 300 hours in

They were meant to be larger

Having DS3 Release the very next year meant both games couldhve used some of the others dev time and become solid 10/10s

[slender haven]

Maybe if they didn't spend so much time on the procedurally generated chalice dungeons that suck ass and for some reason I still play maybe they could make some full areas

[ashen ocean]

The chalice dungeons needed more time

[slender haven]

They also released DS2 the previous year too iirc

[ashen ocean]

They are really buggy and could have been optimised

[slender haven]

Man I didn't realize they were stretched pretty thin

[slender haven]

The rouge like idea was good but they're too same-y

[ashen ocean]

But otherwise
The dungeons needed more enemy variety and the final 2 bosses completed and added in

The feral moon presence and great one beast

And the final lake arena room

[slender haven]

I think those were just scrapped bosses and ideas

[ashen ocean]

Kinda

[ashen ocean]

Lack of dev time
They also had the archers from ringed city here as enemies
Ig they were planning to add human knights exploring the dungeons at some point

[ashen ocean]

Dark souls 2 was handled by their B team

[slender haven]

Just because something is scrapped doesn't mean it was cut for time
They could just be early ideas for bosses and enemies

[ashen ocean]

Dark souls 2 and BB were developed parallely

[slender haven]

Yeah but it would have still taken resources like money and developers

[ashen ocean]

Great one beast ended up becoming the ancestor spirit in Elden Ring
The feral moon presence was the only boss they cut out of lack of time imo

[slender haven]

Half Life 2 has a whole beta of things they didn't add because it didn't fit the tone they were going for

[ashen ocean]

And the lake arena

The lack arena is so beautiful even in its unfinished state

[slender haven]

We don't know why they cut Blob Presence
Could have just been an early form of the actual MP

[slender haven]

No that was just an early design for the Orphan's boss arena

[ashen ocean]

Hard to work out optimally in PS4 hardware i reckon

[slender haven]

You can see it in the art book I believe

[ashen ocean]

The game drops to 5 fps for Loran Camera Beast and Hot dog

[ashen ocean]

Could be
It was called mud lake after all

[slender haven]

I like the theory that it's the Moon Presence's physical body like Rom's corpse

[ashen ocean]

The most egregious example of cut content being the bridge

[ashen ocean]

Yes

Also
Have you seen the theory of the nightmares stocked atop each other ?

[slender haven]

Nah it didn't seem too crazy
Just an idea that didn't work out

[ashen ocean]

Bloodborne is horrible at frame generation and stable gameplay

[slender haven]

Yeah that one is pretty popular
Not even really a theory since it seems pretty confirmed

[ashen ocean]

Yea

[slender haven]

Yeah

[ashen ocean]

The other side of the theory is

The deeper you go in the chice dungeons

Chalice

The further back in time you head to

[slender haven]

Nah
They're just ruins

[ashen ocean]

There is an element of time travel

In dungeons as well

[slender haven]

Spacial distortion I guess

[ashen ocean]

They are both ruins and temporal travel

[slender haven]

Most IRL ruins are physical locations too

[ashen ocean]

Mesnt to type temporal
Mb

[slender haven]

I don't see any signs of time travel really

[ashen ocean]

The pthumerians precede humanity by a ton

[ashen ocean]

Bloodborne is full of it

[slender haven]

Yeah but like they're undead and far past their primes when we see them
It's like Dark Souls

[ashen ocean]

Since Cainhurst Nobles are descendants of Pthumerians

[ashen ocean]

Yeah, they are entombed and in the close of their time as a society

Or go mad and haunt the ruins

[ashen ocean]

And we also go fight Queen Yharnam herself

[slender haven]

My guess is their civilization collapsed when they seemingly forced Yharnam to get pregnant with Mergo

Idk how but they did

[ashen ocean]

Or they bit more than they could chew
And went mad
Yharnam getting pregnant wasnt the final straw, it was prematurely birthing
Mergo by tearing him out of her womb

[slender haven]

Well she isn't back in time
She's just been there for a very long time

[slender haven]

Oh yeah, forgot the giant blood stain on her stomach

[ashen ocean]

She is
We see her spirit thrice in the over world

[slender haven]

That's just cause her mind is separate from her body
That's her dream self

[ashen ocean]

She cannot fully pass or rest when mergo is “alive” ig

[slender haven]

The Yharnam Stone says her mind is immortal and constantly churns

[ashen ocean]

Could be that we fight her physical self in the dungeons
And her dream self is still alive in the future

Or she regenerates herself like annalise

[slender haven]

Her dream self is still alive to appear when the blood moon appears

[ashen ocean]

And right before and after wet nurse fight

[ashen ocean]

Oh i dont dispute that

[slender haven]

That too

Yeah, I just don't think we're time traveling

[ashen ocean]

We do find more older blood echo currencies the further deep we go

[slender haven]

Well they wouldn't be old if we were time traveling now would they?

[ashen ocean]

We were time travelling to the distant past when their society fell off not too long ago

We could find madmen roaming

And great old one blood

[slender haven]

Those are just old tomb prospectors of hunters like us who wanted to find secrets

[ashen ocean]

No those are pthumerian knights

[slender haven]

Which ones are you talking about?

[ashen ocean]

The knights we see in the dungeons with Greatswords

[ashen ocean]

Wait

[slender haven]

Those aren't the madmen
They're just undead pthumerians like every other one

[slender haven]

Yeah they're pretty ancient

[ashen ocean]

These two are the same

[slender haven]

Well some fell to madness while some didn't

I was talking about the tomb prospectors we see over the place

[ashen ocean]

Oh wait

NOw i remember

The chalice descriptions isrlf

Itself

The isz chalice is the oldest

Loran second oldest

Pthumerian more recent

[ashen ocean]

They are like us who wound up there

[slender haven]

That's just cause they're deeper so they're more ancient
Not that they literally take place back in time

[ashen ocean]

Loran ?

[slender haven]

That's an ancient civilization too

One in between the ancient Pthumerians and modern Yharnam seemingly

[ashen ocean]

Loran is meant to be a desert civilisation

Going by the sandstorms

And the only chalice dumgeon to show it is within a canyon

I havent played the game in over a year

But remember there is somethimg that proves the time travelling

Would need to check it
Out

[slender haven]

Guessing it just got buried over time

But idk

[ashen ocean]

Yes

[slender haven]

I played BB only a couple months ago actually lol

[frigid lily]

Damn I went away for like idk 30 minutes and I have no idea what this chat has turned to

[ashen ocean]

My view is that by the time the hunter begins the hunt in Yharnam

Pthumerians are long extinct

And the remnants are at cainhurst or serving as Yharnam shadows in servicr of Mergo

[ashen ocean]

Oh

Late player

[slender haven]

Eldritch god fetuses

[slender haven]

It was me replaying it
I first beat it back in like 2019

[ashen ocean]

I have around 700 hours in it

Lmao

I remember why
I kept farming blood gems

Like rerolling artefacts, i kept reloading the boss fights for better blood gems

[slender haven]

Well their civilization is
The pthumerians we see are mainly undead
Byrgenworth has canonically been abandoned for like centuries and several of its inhabitants are still kind of alive

So it should be the same for them

[ashen ocean]

Brygenworth was abandoned for mere decades

The hunters nightmare is set a bit in the past

No wait it is not

[slender haven]

That would mean everything that has happened in the game timeline only happened over a couple of decades and that doesn't feel right

[ashen ocean]

It does
Laurence’s crime was the arson of Old Yharnam

Hence hes a burning cleric beast

[slender haven]

The vibes I get are that it's been several generations

[slender haven]

He committed a lot of crimes

[ashen ocean]

And in the base game, old yharnam was abandoned not too long ago, a few decades at most after the plague out resk

[ashen ocean]

Burning old yharnam was the principally the most evil of them all , hence Kos punished him as such

[slender haven]

Also he could've just been burned to death when he first turned into a monster, not that he burned Yharnam down personally

Also Kos was dead

[ashen ocean]

Laurence was the first cleric beast iirf

[ashen ocean]

Kos isnt dead
Shes still a great one exerting influence from a high above plane like Oedon

[slender haven]

Yeah so it happened a long time ago

[slender haven]

She's dead in the dream world
That is the higher plane

She's dead

[ashen ocean]

We also see Vicar Amelia in the DLC

[slender haven]

After we kill her yeah

[ashen ocean]

I mean higher as in conceptually higher

Like Oedon

[slender haven]

The dream world is conceptually higher too

[slender haven]

He just lacks a form completely

That's why he's called "formless Oedeon"

Who knows where he dwells in the dream realm

[ashen ocean]

Great ones can assume forms at will
Like Kos
True / higher great ones dont have forms

[slender haven]

That would mean Oedeon is the only higher great one

[ashen ocean]

Kos too

[slender haven]

She literally had a fish body that we see

[ashen ocean]

Remember we couldnt see mergo’s true form either

Or the wet nurse’s

[slender haven]

That's cause Oedeon is his daddy

[ashen ocean]

Nah

[slender haven]

Maybe it's just something unique to their genus

[slender haven]

You haven't played the game in a year what do you know

[ashen ocean]

No
It is only their forms are beyond are capacity to form

[ashen ocean]

I played long enough for this part

[ashen ocean]

Remember the insight mechanic ?

[slender haven]

Or they just don't have forms
Like the game tells us

[slender haven]

Yeah, and by the end of the game we get have so much insight we become a god

We also kill the Moon Pressence

[ashen ocean]

They do tho, at the end of wetnurse fight we see Mergo’s cradle with his blood around ot

[slender haven]

Not from what I saw

[ashen ocean]

Replay that fight when possible

[slender haven]

Ok

[ashen ocean]

“The Great Ones are group of extremely powerful, multi-dimensional beings that can exist across several planes of existence. They have often been described as gods, and play a mysterious yet crucial role in the game's plot, as well as its overall lore.”

[slender haven]

That's just the wiki description

[ashen ocean]

Simpler great ones like Amygdala exist in multiple planes like the one beside the church of oedon

[slender haven]

The tentacle Amygdala are called "lesser Amygdala" in the code
So I'm guessing the one we kill is the big boss Amygdala

[ashen ocean]

They are all scholars of mensis anyways

[slender haven]

No they aren't

[ashen ocean]

They are

[slender haven]

You just made that up

[ashen ocean]

Look at the scholars with their caged mask

And the amygdala heads

[slender haven]

Those are designed to replicate the Amygdalas most likely

Not that they ARE Amygdala

[ashen ocean]

Or become them

[slender haven]

We already know why they have them

They're antenna

[ashen ocean]

Amygdala could be several different entities or one entity with multiple presences

[slender haven]

Maybe

[ashen ocean]

Theres also the fact that

The mensis school is connected to the Nightmare Frontier

Which has the amygdala boss

[slender haven]

No it isn't
Byrgenworth is connected to the Frontier

[ashen ocean]

Did you go through the floating school of mensis

Oh wait

[slender haven]

That's Byrgenworth

[ashen ocean]

It is the lecture hall of byrgenworth

Mb

[slender haven]

You haven't played the game in a year

[ashen ocean]

And it shows

Sigh

[slender haven]

Lol

[ashen ocean]

I quit on NG+5 laurence iirc

I beat him eventually but got bored

[frigid lily]

Damn

Anyways @ashen ocean if you do play slay the princess tell me what you think of it

[ashen ocean]

Aight

[ashen ocean]

And then the bloody crow of cainhurst

[ashen ocean]

Also

https://youtu.be/oRzYb3Xx_HM?feature=shared

[slender haven]

I watched that already lol

[ashen ocean]

I wanted to spell it out but the tao bot censored me

Wait

I just remembered

Make contact

Which is a right angle sign with your arms

[slender haven]

I can't get that far playing these games I just get bored

[ashen ocean]

Its trying out different builds and the vibe in general

[slender haven]

Yeah I understand

[ashen ocean]

For DS3 i pushed to NG+4 but got bored

For sekiro i pushed to NG+50 with randomiser runs too

[ashen ocean]

Like in genshin
Rifthounds are in angles while humanity lives in the corners or something

From that one fontaine world quest

Anyways

Is there any indication that we have been part of a nation’s stages in a samsara thus far ?

Like rene said with natlantea, hyperborea, etc !

[slender haven]

One of the samsaras was Khaenri'ah so we were definitely involved there

[ashen ocean]

Liyue, Fontaine ?

Natlan?

[slender haven]

We don't know what the current samsara is

I think

It could still just be "Khaenri'ah"

Or well Khraun-Arya as Rene called it

[frigid lily]

If Natlantea isn't just another name for Natlan there's probably a chance that Khaun-Arya is a nation before Khaenri'ah
Or something like it

[slender haven]

Maybe the original dynasty for Khaenri'ah that the Outlander and Angel ruled over or something

[frigid lily]

Probably

[slender haven]

But Rene puts it as the 4th cycle which wouldn't really make sense with the timeline so idk

[frigid lily]

That is true

The whole thing about the Outlander and the Angel possibly founding Khaenri'ah is interesting though
It also might idk give us more info on the whole pure blood Khaenri'ahns and their curse and more

[slender haven]

Hm yeah, still wonder if Nibelung's reincarnation has anything to do with Khaenri'ah
I mean probably but like how is the question

Maybe there were 4 dynasties to parallel the 4 descenders
1 - Outlander and Angel
2 - Nibelung's reincarnation
3 - Crimson Moon
4 - Eclipse and Irmin

[frigid lily]

Not sure about them paralleling the descenders but yeah

[slender haven]

Maybe not the cycles but the samsara

[frigid lily]

Speaking of samsara
In everyone of the nailed civilizations, there's always like
A "pattern" of sorts?

[slender haven]

Being based

[frigid lily]

Well I wouldn't really call it a cohesive pattern

But like
Sal Vindagnyr had Imunlaukr and the Princess, the Princess had the vision of Durin and afterwards the place went to shit
The desert had Deshret and Nabu Malikata, and Deshret made that deal with Apep to eat all the forbidden knowledge and we know how that went
The Golden City had the Traveler and the first Angel and the Traveler was friends with Nibelung I guess

Ok, so its not a pattern exactly, but all these stories have:
A Dragon
A Angel or Angel equivalent (Princess of Sal Vindagnyr)
And some guy who shows up out of nowhere but is important

[slender haven]

Deshret isn't really a guy who came out of nowhere

[frigid lily]

I guess for Remuria it would be Remus, Scylla and Sybilla but Remuria wasn't nailed so

[frigid lily]

Fair but you get what I mean
In both of the other examples those two guys were outlanders, Imunlaukr and the Traveler

I still want to know more about Imunlaukr

[slender haven]

When Varka happens hopefully

[frigid lily]

Maybe

[slender haven]

If he is a descendant of Imunlaukyr like we suspect

[frigid lily]

Also the Skirk artifact set mentions the Spiral Abyss

[slender haven]

Yeah that's cool

[frigid lily]

Which is interesting

[slender haven]

Also iirc the Angel in the Circlet description mentions building a tower too

And the Spiral is a reverse tower

[frigid lily]

Also, they keep talking about North, and Mondstadt technically speaking is North right?

[slender haven]

Dornman's Port is definitely

But Mondstadt as a whole is too

[frigid lily]

Plus, the set mentions how the Welkin Moon was the one that watched the Angel and the Traveler
And there's an NPC from Natlan that mentions Mondstadt having a Moon shard or whatever just like in Natlan

[slender haven]

There is? I don't remember that Natlan NPC. I just remember them saying that the moon fragments can't be seen from other nations
Although there is how Andrius was given his godhood by the first Angel which is HUGE now

I mean it was always huge but now even more so

[frigid lily]

That makes me wonder what even happened to her afterwards

Did she die like

Or is she still alive

But also, in that book Andrius was in the Dark Sea

[slender haven]

The set implies she eventually devolved but like it's kind of confusing
I still think she could maaaaybe be Istaroth but I'm more unsure now

[slender haven]

Just in reference to how it was in an area not ruled by the modern seven I guess

[frigid lily]

Yeah idk about her being Istaroth

[slender haven]

Istaroth is still weird cause like we know she's rebellious but like, why

The First Angel is called "the daughter of dawn" which would fit a time god imo plus Istaroth helped make an artificial sun once but it's all very weird

[frigid lily]

I wonder if she has something to do with the Primal flames magical future hopping thing

[slender haven]

The what

[frigid lily]

That and the fact that Ronova is called the "envoy of dusk"

[frigid lily]

How Mavuika got sent to the future or whatever

[slender haven]

Mmm good call

[frigid lily]

Maybe its Asmoday
I mean she is Kiana so

[slender haven]

During the weird flashback sequences? When did she get thrown to the future?

I don't really remember that

[frigid lily]

No like
When she put herself in the primal flames
To go to the future
In Natlan

[slender haven]

The first angel you mean?

[frigid lily]

I'm phrasing it in a bad way but still

[frigid lily]

Yeah

[slender haven]

I just assumed it was just putting herself in storage somehow for a long time

[slender haven]

Unless her brain got controlled by the PO then nah

One idea I had about Istaroth is that she did eventually dissolve but as a time god she can just time travel a whole bunch which could explain her later appearances long after Hyperborea's fall

[frigid lily]

That is true

But how would she have helped Enkanomiya?

[slender haven]

So to her all the stuff we know she did happened to her in like one day

[frigid lily]

Oh ok fair enough

Forgot time shenanigans

[slender haven]

Well she only gave the blueprints for the artificial sun to that one guy she didn't make it herself

[frigid lily]

Speaking of time shenanigans

The parable of the tree or whatevwr

*whatever

From before sun and moon

The one that hinted at the Sacred Sakura

I still think about it sometimes

Because I feel like it's going to be important for more than just the Sacred Sakura

[slender haven]

What did it say?

[frigid lily]

Hold on

The thing about planting the spirit branches on the ground reminds me of the Princess of Sal Vindagnyr

[slender haven]

Interesting

Idk what it could mean though besides the PO being a dickhead again

Besides what we already know about the Sakura of course

[frigid lily]

Because when the Irminsul tree from Sal Vindagnyr was destroyed, she tried to take a branch of it and plant it on the ground, but it withered and she died
Later on someone else came, possibly Imunlaukr? To try and heal the ley lines, but they couldn't and so they buried the Princess
And the place Princess is buried is where that blue Irminsul branch that we see in all the places that got nailed is located

[slender haven]

Didn't it fully grow when Durin's blood hit it?

[frigid lily]

Thats the Irminsul tree itself, I'm talking about the small branch

These things

[slender haven]

But the Irminsul tree was grown from the branch right?

[slender haven]

Do we have a blue branch for Dragonspine?

[frigid lily]

Yes but not the branch that she took specifically
It was more so grown from the ring of the tree

[frigid lily]

Yes

[slender haven]

But wasn't the og tree where the nail hit?

[frigid lily]

And we have one in the Eternal Oasis and in Tsurumi Island right next to the boatman
And there's a chance there's one in Natlan as well going by the pattern

[slender haven]

I swear it said that once

[frigid lily]

Kind of?
The nail hit, and it split into three pieces
One of these pieces destroyed the Sal Vindagnyr tree and the others got scathered around where we find them in game

[slender haven]

Yeah sure that works I guess

[ashen ocean]

Fontaine is thr only nation without a nail
Also, one interesting thought

The whale was the first abyssal being that willingly went in search of an elemental source to feed

[frigid lily]

Well I mean we don't know if that's entirely the case, maybe the civilization that Sybilla was from got nailed who knows.

[hasty narwhal]

I miss the whale I hope we see it again

It was just hungry and bored with Skirk, and sensed Childe was walking near primordial waters and decided it was better than hanging out with Skirk

[ashen ocean]

Doesnt this set say there were 6 nails

Or was it an old erroneous translation

[ashen ocean]

Skirk and the whale are best buddies now

I just need one more lan yan con to complete her C6

[dry bough]

Banners out?

[ashen ocean]

For asia yes

[frigid lily]

Looks nice
I'm interested on that island in the bottom left

Have we gotten exploration videos btw

[frigid lily]

Do we know what exactly was the purpose of Capitano's heart
Like I mean as in, why did the people of Khaenri'ah create it or whatever, for what reason

[slender haven]

I think they say it was to contain information

But we don't know why Cap got it yet

[ashen ocean]

It can function like a mini leyline
Store souls
Process their memories
Or convert them to elemental energy

It was originally used for empowerment

Capitano made it an oversized pokeball

[frigid lily]

I see

I want 5.6 already

[ashen ocean]

The sentinel knight’s heart is just another step in the direction to eventually reveal Khaenriah really does process souls / present beside the golden hall me thinks

[ashen ocean]

Filler patch
5.7 Skirk

[frigid lily]

Do we know if its a filler patch
Idk

[ashen ocean]

Skirk’s voice lines may just have more lore for angels than 5.6 Dain

[frigid lily]

Not convinced
Now with her artifact set I have gotten every Angel lore I could have wanted
I only care about the Night Kingdom nail and the name in the Pyro Gemstone description now

[ashen ocean]

Yeah
5.5 - Volcano and end of WQ
5.6- filler patch with Dain (maybe not) or Archon Interlude , Skirk re intro
5.7- Mare Jivari (possible skirk quest, interlude, dain quest)

[frigid lily]

And also what the fuck they're going to do with Capitano idk

[ashen ocean]

Possibly intersect with Dain quest

[frigid lily]

Maybe

[ashen ocean]

I just know it in my bones that a major plot twist/ reveal regarding Descenders or angels or dragons is in bound in the coming two patches
Besides the artefact sets descriptions that is

Likely some point based on shuttle space travel the dragons had

Is there a description of nibelung that could have actually been for Phanes

Since both are “winged” “gods”

[slender haven]

I do too but I'd settle for 5.5 even more so

[slender haven]

Not really

[slender haven]

I don't consider interlude quests filler at all

[slender haven]

Skirk should hopefully give us the full expose on gnoses I hope

[ashen ocean]

Caribert came as close to filler as possible without dropping any substance at all ngl
Also, was fontaine the only region without interlude

[slender haven]

Yeah Fontaine didn't have any interludes for some reason

[ashen ocean]

Either that or the inverted city or the abyss order or the ??? Place
Any would do

[slender haven]

She isn't a part of the Abyss order
More Sinner lore should be expected though

[ashen ocean]

Coz of Chenyu Vale ig
It gave us lore chunks of chasm people and archon war

[slender haven]

Wonder if we'll get a Surtalogi design reveal

[ashen ocean]

We dk which sinners are connected to Abyss Order beyond Verdrfornir

[slender haven]

None of them are besides Vedrfolnir I feel
Even then Vedrfolnir doesn't feel like an active participant in the Order

[ashen ocean]

Skirk may not be but she can acknowledge their presence

Abyss lectors and mages regularly traverse into her domain (i hope they do)

[slender haven]

Sure ig but idk what she would know

[ashen ocean]

I think the fault lies in Hoyo not building them up at all
Their absence in Inazuma and the whole 2.x made the pacing weirder

[slender haven]

My theory is that just both Skirk and the Abyss Heralds have a similar fighting style because of them are derived fro Surtalogi's who was probably a general or something

[frigid lily]

Speaking of the Chasm

[slender haven]

They appeared in the 2.X. Dain quest

[ashen ocean]

Heralds are synonymous to Lectors arent they

[frigid lily]

Its still one of the areas with the most mysteries to this day

[ashen ocean]

Briefly
Wish they had more appearances before

[slender haven]

Heralds are more physical while lectors use books and stuff

[slender haven]

Yeah

But Inazuma is already so fucked up they probably just didn't see a point in messing with it lol

[ashen ocean]

And baptists fully enslaving 3 of four elements at a time, which were meant to counter influenced like themselves

[ashen ocean]

The view from ??? And the inverted city

[frigid lily]

• We still don't know what's up with the mysterious letter
• There are vishap/dragon fossils there that have little explanation
• Xamaran was completely forgotten
• Agnill and Egis (I think thats their name??) Are still a big mystery
• The Fountain in the upside down city
  And probably more that I'm forgetting

[ashen ocean]

Ig hoyo plans to keep teasing it until hyperborea

[slender haven]

Maybe we'll get more Chasm lore when we get Blackliff Forge
Since there are ancient civilizations down there too

[frigid lily]

Can you imagine if blackcliff forge came before dorman port

[slender haven]

I'll crash out

[ashen ocean]

Also
I see this pattern that Mondsdadt has one of every group on teyvat

[frigid lily]

Oh yesh

Do you guys remember the beta map

From cbt

With the black castle

[slender haven]

No

Post it

[ashen ocean]

No

[frigid lily]

Let me get it

[ashen ocean]

Have we met the “angel” of mondsdadt yet ?

[frigid lily]

The closest we have is the Princess of Sal Vindagnyr

She isn't an Angel per se

But she like

[slender haven]

Well Boreas got his powers from the first angel

[ashen ocean]

No
I meant angel as In Youhuacoultin types

[frigid lily]

Had future visions just like the Seelies
And she also fell in love with an outlander

[frigid lily]

Then no

[ashen ocean]

Capable servants of Celestia

[slender haven]

And Boreas has angel wings on his sides

[frigid lily]

Is it the 1st Angel like actually I forget if the book actually says that

[slender haven]

Yes

I'll find the exact quote

[ashen ocean]

Hmm
Ig she was poised to rebel against celestia with this

[ashen ocean]

First am hearing of this black caslte

[frigid lily]

This is from like, wayyy back in 1.X to be honest lol

[ashen ocean]

Since humans are hunting here
Can we assume this was after the war of vengeance when the era of abundance was long gone

[slender haven]

Also I've been thinking, if Skirk's journey to Hyperborea actually happened relatively recently then what if she bumped into Varka? Maybe I'm just desperate for Varka crumbs though

[slender haven]

Yeah, since the first seelie sings about the collapse of her species too

[ashen ocean]

Then the castle is either expansion region lore or Khaenrian facility in Mond

[slender haven]

We still have to get Dvalin's temple too
Hope we get to see that eventually

[frigid lily]

Speaking of Angel lore
I'm gonna be honest
I made a joke about "Capitano is the Light Prince"
But now I'm honestly kind of believing in it just because it would be the single funniest fucking thing if even after all this time, he actually did turn out to be a woman the whole time

[ashen ocean]

Skirk said she has not been on the surface for a really long while

[frigid lily]

Oh yeah Dvalin's temple

Wasn't there a theory that Klee blew it up?

[slender haven]

Time moves differently for her in the Abyss so it could have been a long time for her

[ashen ocean]

Tru tru

[slender haven]

Or maybe she just got there through travelling the Abyss Minecraft Nether style

[slender haven]

She did blow up a mountain once

[ashen ocean]

Maybe the skirk in that set desc only began her tutelage under surtr

[frigid lily]

Oh yeah I forgot about that
The whole time in the Abyss thing is pretty interesting
Wayyyyyy back in 1.X I made a crack theory that this was because Istaroth died in the Abyss

But I do wonder if she has something to do with it

[ashen ocean]

I think its just Istaroth changing flow of time within teyvst

Teyvat, to be different from outside it

[slender haven]

I mean it isn't too crazy but it could just be that the Abyss doesn't follow the same rules as the rest of the world

[ashen ocean]

Our traveller slept for 500 years

[frigid lily]

Also

Currently, Sumeru is the only area in game where there are like
Actual hints about what our Sibling was doing
Or more so actual evidence of our sibling traveling accross Teyvat

And I feel like we don't talk about that enough
Like about what our sibling might have done in the other nations and stuff

I mean I doubt they did anything huge

They were just visiting

[slender haven]

Yeah that is peculiar
Sumeru is the nation closest to Khaenri'ah after all

[frigid lily]

But the fact that they helped the Aranara is interesting

[frigid lily]

I'm assuming you meant to type Khaenri'ah lol

[slender haven]

Plus there's the whole thing about how "the forest never forgets" in Sumeru so maybe what they did in other places just wasn't that memorable

[slender haven]

FUCK

[frigid lily]

They forgot Rhukkha though 😔

But yeah I get what you mean

[slender haven]

Who?

[ashen ocean]

Also
Sumeru had its own primitive collective consciousness

Narayana

Or something

[slender haven]

Plus some of Deshret's descriptions mention that he wanted to create a collective conciousness

[frigid lily]

But more so, I was thinking about how its interesting how we kind of followed on our siblings footsteps in the Aranyaka quest
Like we basically did exactly what our sibling did when we were there
We had the festival
We fought Marana
And we replanted the tree thing

[ashen ocean]

Kings and researches adding more slop souls to become descenders vs
Traveller being one just touring teyvat and sleeping on dirt ground

[ashen ocean]

Sibling also met the Pari didnt they

[slender haven]

The Sibling did tell the aranara that the Traveler would be greater then them though

[slender haven]

I really hope the Traveler getting an ancient name means they stop being a descender and just stop being relavant to the main story

That'd be so funny

[frigid lily]

I think that someone did something for our Traveler to become a descender
Because like
Our Traveler is a fucking bum compared to the other descenders

[ashen ocean]

Yeah but they explain how they got their name

Someone put stories of them

Not record the traveller themselves

A faux leyline copy
And a real phenomenon
Co existing

[ashen ocean]

Then that begs the question, why didnt they take the power for themselves

[slender haven]

Almighty invincible AI god-king
Undying dragon king powered by the forces of darkness itself
Immortal ghost travelling the stars for eons that was best friends with the dragon king
And finally, some guy

[slender haven]

Maybe cause aliens are easier to work with

[ashen ocean]

How even

[slender haven]

Since they're inherently less bound to the rules of the world then others would be

[frigid lily]

I don't fucking know maybe they're trying to manipulate the Traveler

[ashen ocean]

Either PO made traveller a descender or they were always one

[slender haven]

Maybe it was Irmin
Since we already know they made the Sibling an abyss battery

[ashen ocean]

Hmm

[slender haven]

I don't think the PO can make descenders

[frigid lily]

What about Paimon

[ashen ocean]

They can control the leylines

[slender haven]

Too stupid and racist

[frigid lily]

I know Paimon theories are like

[ashen ocean]

Shes celestial

[frigid lily]

Weird to talk about

But

[slender haven]

Not being in the leylines isn't the sole requirement for being a descender

[ashen ocean]

A direct line to celestia

[frigid lily]

She could very well be Phanes for all we fucking know

[ashen ocean]

PO gave us will boosting drugs every fay of the 500 years

[slender haven]

I've accepted we won't get anything on her till the very end of the story
We just have to live with her racism till then

[ashen ocean]

Me thinks paimon is his discarded body

[frigid lily]

The racism is the best part of her character wdym

[ashen ocean]

Phanes was a winged god once too

[slender haven]

The Traveler would just be the average athlete then

[ashen ocean]

And paimon is king of demons in ars goetia

[ashen ocean]

Yeah but we got the best fixes from the big P

[slender haven]

She's only racist towards non-celestial dogs though
She'd betray the Traveler in the heartbeat if they ever decided to go against Celestia

[frigid lily]

Good

[slender haven]

Yeah then we'd finally get to kill her

[ashen ocean]

It reminds me

Is our traveller a memo keeper too

[frigid lily]

Idk

Our Traveler is just a Traveler

[slender haven]

Since they're supposed to be a witness and all yeah

[ashen ocean]

It would be a good reveal if paimon really was a shell/ remnant of Phanes that accompanies the Traveller/ Memokeeper as a “host” showing their way around

[ashen ocean]

But then we eventually determine fate of the world and a Dainsleif with no memories challenges us

[slender haven]

I guess

[ashen ocean]

Which is odd
Thats a massive change in only 2 - 3 regions

[slender haven]

But the Traveler seems to be kind of like a vessel for the people's will then a being like Phanes who is just really fucking strong

[slender haven]

Suppose we'll have to wait and see

[ashen ocean]

Almost like a comprehensive record of the concept of teyvat’s lesser being , a collective memory ?

[frigid lily]

By the way

[slender haven]

Yeah

[frigid lily]

The Traveler's story in their profile pic

It isn't even halfway done

[slender haven]

"for you shall ascend"

[slender haven]

Yeah that's weird

[frigid lily]

Not that specifically

Like holy shit
How long are they going to draw this out

[slender haven]

As long as they'll keep meat-riding Mavuika
Till the sun blows up

[frigid lily]

I am wondering what they're going to do with her tbh

Because I still fully believe she's sus

And not a good person

[slender haven]

They're gonna have her ascend to become the fifth descender and single handedly destroy both Celestia and the Abyss

Then she'll become the immortal god-queen of the universe and have everyone bow down to her
Except Capitano, he's still dead

[ashen ocean]

2028

[frigid lily]

Honestly good for him

[slender haven]

I do like the idea that she's just the storybook version of herself and not the original Mavuika

[frigid lily]

Yes this

[slender haven]

Like how Gunthred in the NK was

[ashen ocean]

Is it explained how she reincarnated ?

[frigid lily]

It would actually be really interesting

[slender haven]

He doesn't get to experience this bullshit anymore

[ashen ocean]

Same like our traveller getting their ancient name

[frigid lily]

Like that theory you shared has been on my mind ever since

[slender haven]

So it's practically Heaven

[slender haven]

I presume she just like cryogenically (or "pyrogenically" hahahahahhaha) froze herself or something

[slender haven]

It is weird that they'd just drop such a weird bomb like storybook Guthred on us

[frigid lily]

I mean
Mavuika mentions that a good partnership means that the two parties would have different views right?
And she said that Capitano was like, a good guy and Guthred was a shit person
And in the Archon quest Capitano and Mavuika have their opposing views on the future of Natlan
And if Capitano is the good guy, then idk, Mavuika is the shitty one

[slender haven]

Or they want us to think Cap was the shitty person for not leaving eveyrthing up to chance

Equally possible tbh

[ashen ocean]

He was

Shitty

[frigid lily]

Yeah no, that was really interesting
Guthred is interesting mostly because Capitano holds him in such high regards despite the fact that he was really shitty supposedly
And doesn't like he say that Guthred sacrificed himself to make the weird Abyss potion?
And yet in the cutscene we see it doen't seem to be the case

[frigid lily]

Shut

[slender haven]

I doubt he was actually that bad of a guy
Just far more of an "ends justify the means" person

[ashen ocean]

He was about to take away leyline support for the whole of natlan to smother the anydd

[ashen ocean]

He was mean to other natlanese 500 years ago

Professional khaenrian racist

[slender haven]

You sound like Da Wei

[ashen ocean]

And they recorded that in their story book

[frigid lily]

Well I mean yeah but still

[slender haven]

Make like a Da Wei and get shot

[slender haven]

Yeah, maybe the storybooks just portrayed him as really self-conscious or something lol

Also I don't really remember the Cap animation too well but was it guthred who he was absorbing? Could have just been another solider of his with white hair or something

[frigid lily]

Also the fact that we haven't seen a single storybook about Thrain is odd
Honestly Thrain is just odd
We know so little about him that it pisses me off

[frigid lily]

No I'm 99% sure it was Guthred

[slender haven]

It would have been a nice opportunity to have those two Khaenri'ahns we fight in that one stone needle quest to bring him up once
That would have been all that was needed

Also maybe it's moral oral tradition and not actual storybooks

[frigid lily]

That could be true

[slender haven]

Then maybe he was like weakened by making the potion and just died in battle from it? Idk

Or maybe the animators just didn't get a memo

[frigid lily]

Who knows

I don't think any of the devs got the memo on anything Natlan related

If we are truly honest with ourselves

[slender haven]

Yeah that's very possible
Also idk if I told you this already but I finally realized who those three scholars Capitano talked to were, they were Waxaklahun in disguise, that's what they were hinting at all along...probably

[frigid lily]

Hmm

Maybe

but that's kind of boring sorry

See

I have a feeling that

[slender haven]

What else would you want though

[frigid lily]

We are gonna go back to the past in some way and redo the whole Natlan archon quest again
But like with new info or whatever
And all of these small bits of things that didn't make sense or weren't explained are going to get explained
(For example, Mavuika's painting or whatever)
And then in the end Capitano won't actually sacrifice himself, thus getting "revived" in a way
Idk

[slender haven]

Sounds too much like copium

[frigid lily]

It is

[slender haven]

We will get time travel eventually though probably

[frigid lily]

But its just what I believe

[slender haven]

Would be pretty cool though

[frigid lily]

I just want Natlan to be good ok 😭
I don't hate the nation, I just hate Mavuika

[slender haven]

Yeah I love the world quests

And most of the characters are alright

They just fumbled the ending so hard

[frigid lily]

Well I don't really like the world quests to be honest
They didn't vibe with me as much as the Narzissenkreuz quest did
Still my favorite wq series to this day

But maybe Mare Jivari will change that
Maybe

[slender haven]

Well I really like Waxaklahun and Och-Kan's stories

And the little one is silly

https://tenor.com/view/bean-saurian-natlan-genshin-impact-genshin-impact-natlan-gif-16766598371220497656

[frigid lily]

Yeah idk I didn't really get attached to Waxa and Och-kan story
But little one is cute I guess
I named mine Fofura

[slender haven]

Well maybe it's just because these are the first world quests I really stretched my brain to understand fully
I liked Narzissenkreuz a lot too of course but I just sort of did them passively

[frigid lily]

That might be why I haven't gotten attached to it
I adored Narzissenkreuz from the very world quest and collecting all of the pages and slowly figuring everything out was so hype
It was to the point I was more excited for its finale than the Fontaine AQ finale
But as for the Natlan wqs I didn't pay much attention to them
I couldn't find the incentive I guess?
It's not like I skipped dialogue or anything like that but even reading it I still struggle to understand most of everything

[slender haven]

Hm I understand but idk it just sort of clicked with me

Maybe when the quests are fully finished you'll start to appreciate them more

[frigid lily]

Maybe

[ashen ocean]

https://youtu.be/Pmm_iXY_OKc?feature=shared

[ashen ocean]

varesa weapon lore

[ashen ocean]

I had an interesting thought

Is hyperborea the city of the sun ?

It is a crack theory based on a throwaway line i heard from Lan Yan

“Everything the sun touches is gold”

Hyperborea is alluded to be the Golden City

We know the sun chariot was somehow involved in the moon sister - angel feud

Okay i was just shooting randomly in the dark but somehow within a locale

Is there any lore on the Sun ?

Other than the potentially foreshadowing sun children of the real sun’s role

[slender haven]

Maybe
I believe the First Angel (who I believe may be Istaroth) is called "the daughter of dawn" or something like that
And if she is Istaroth then she also created the artificial sun in Enkanomiya indirectly by teaching Abrax

[slender haven]

Nothing major asides from some comparisons the pyro archons and sovereign have to the sun. Deshret does too oddly.

[slender haven]

Personally I believe the solar chariot to not be real and instead just be the Divine Nail in the Chasm but even then the blue stone that dropped from the Nail is called lumenspur which I believe means "light mineral" so that's kind of like the sun

[frigid lily]

I still don't think Hyperborea is the Golden City
Like it was probably built on top of the Golden City or something but idk.

[frigid lily]

No

[weary oriole]

Where i can see leaks about 5.6?
Here there is nothing atm

[frigid lily]

There aren't any 5.6 that I know off, but you can go to the Genshin leaks reddit

[slender haven]

Well it's like how Petrichor is above Remuria I guess

[ashen ocean]

Only abyss (?) and IT leaks are out

[weary oriole]

Leaks about 5.6 banners

[ashen ocean]

So far only Effie is confirmed

The imaginarium theatre for that month is Hydro Cryo Geo

So I expect Navia first half

Or second half

5.6 likely is the Version’s Fontaine event patch

[weary oriole]

I want Emilie banner

[ashen ocean]

Me too, but the problemo is

Skirk is in the very next patch

5.7

So is Mavuika

[weary oriole]

Already have mavuika and skirk isnt a problem for me

[ashen ocean]

Hmm
Then you are good ig

Wait
I forgot mualani or kinich may rerun in 5.6

Next patch has xilonen rerun

[weary oriole]

Already accumulated enough primos for her

My girl Emilie...

[ashen ocean]

If you like Emilie you may like Iansan

[frigid lily]

I'm excited to see her design

[ashen ocean]

cryo chef , polearm

supposedly works like cryo yelan/xingqiu

[frigid lily]

That sounds fun

[ashen ocean]

skirk is freeze or melt dps
its almost confirmed

i just know her animations are gonna be gucci afg

[ashen ocean]

https://fixupx.com/aboutnatlan/status/1897983187134926930?s=46

[frigid lily]

Meh not that interesting

I want more Natlan lore
Give me Night Kingdom lore

[slender haven]

Can't wait for none of this shit to be relevant to the main quest and only be referenced in world quests

[frigid lily]

To be fair it kind of has always been this way
Most artifact lore are just fluff
The only ones I can name that give important lore would be flowers of paradise lost, pale flame and the new skirk set
Crimson witch and the scaramouche lore set also kind of count i guess

[slender haven]

How is Flowers that important? I feel as if you may be biased here...

But I agree with the rest

[frigid lily]

Is it not? It was the first ever artifact set to even mention phanes and the 4 shades, not to mention the descenders

[slender haven]

Yeah but we got Phanes and the 4 shades back in BSaM and we got descenders in both Sumeru and the Narsizzenkreuz quests. It's not like Flowers tells us anything new about them either. Maybe you just like it cause it has a seelie be at the forefront lol.

[frigid lily]

Not really

It still did give us info on the nails as well
It was the first piece of lore that told us that the nails were sent down to purify forbidden knowledge

[slender haven]

We could kinda figure that out from before though
At least with the Divine Nail in the Chasm

Plus Apep tells us the same thing literally next version

And she also reveals Nibelung too who we now know is one of the descenders, incredibly important

[frigid lily]

We learned the info on the divine nail in the chasm in Nahida's SQ which came after flowers
But sure yeah its a meaningless artifact set and I only like it because Seelie, moving on

[slender haven]

I wasn't even trying to be mean I was just saying it's kind of small potatoes compared to everything

[frigid lily]

Alright

[slender haven]

Now that I think about it the "Prayers for" sets are even more important since they deal with the Angels, the Unified Civilization, and also might have to do with Golden Hall lore

[frigid lily]

Yeah
There's one of the prayers set that hasn't been released yet
It doesn't reveal anything huge though

You know what I find odd

[slender haven]

There is?

[frigid lily]

Yes

Let me try and find it

They say that,
The line of chief priests have always seen this same sight as their days draw to an end:
A mountain of crowns in a secret place, beneath a withered tree—
—each one hiding a lifetime of secrets kept.
Each retiring chief priest offers up their crown of flawless white branches to this world.
Every mighty and ancient city, and every austere place of sacrifice must one day return to profundity in the earth.

All prosperity must someday end.
But this does not mean that nothing is eternal.

At the end of a cycle, the earth shall be renewed. Thus eternity is cyclical.
The search for truth is a product of prosperity, and not the seed that plants it.

They say that,
Once upon a time, the people of the land could hear revelations from Celestia directly.
The envoys of the gods walked among benighted humanity then. In those days, life was weak, and the earth was blanketed in unending ice.

Its called prayers for springtime

Also can I just say that the line "the search for truth is a product of prosperity, and not the seed that plants it" is really cool

[slender haven]

It's in the game

[frigid lily]

Oh

Ok never mind then

[frigid lily]

When I searched for it in the wiki I could't find it

Ok but anyways

[slender haven]

Odd that it says the Earth was covered in ice
Guess that explains why Hyperborea is the way it is though

If it does contain the Golden City that is

[frigid lily]

If you read the sets in "chronological order"
It basically like, talks about how at first there was snow
And then there was fire
And then there was water
And then thunder

[slender haven]

It also talks about how the preists started questioning the angels and how they became silent in response. The new Skirk set also mentions that as the Outlander stops it by revealing the truth to the First Angel.

[frigid lily]

Yeah

Also, I swear there was another prayers artifact that was not released
It was a wind one
Like idk, I swear I'm not crazy I remeber it so clearly

[slender haven]

https://tenor.com/view/everywhere-at-the-end-of-time-its-just-a-burning-memory-backrooms-the-caretaker-trollge-gif-24774320

I mean cryo and anemo do have similar colors I guess

[frigid lily]

Alright fine maybe I might have misremembered
But I swear there was one
Alongside the glaciers and snowfield set as well

[slender haven]

Maybe there was some unused asset for one in the files someone digged out or something

[frigid lily]

Probably

Or not

Idk
The original weapon compedium we had in #・wangsheng-library got deleted so I can't look if it was there or not

[slender haven]

Tragic

[frigid lily]

Ok back to this because I finally remembered what I was originally talking about
Something I find odd is Tsurumi Island and Enkanomiya.

If we are to assume that all the nails fell 6,000 years ago

That would mean that Tsurumi Island and the Enkanomiya civilization are basically at around the same "age" I guess?
Yet both got different fates seemingly and despite being pretty close together on the map
Enkanomiya fell into the ground
Tsurumi Island got nailed
But not only that but they have completely different building aesthetics?
Or motifs would probably be the better word
Enkanomiya has the "unified civilizarion" buildings just like in the Chasm and also a little bit in Fontaine
Tsurumi Island just has the regular old ruin styles?
And I could excuse Dragonspine and Enkanomiya not having the same building styles despite being from the same era because Enkanomiya came wayyyyyy later than Dragonspine
But Tsurumi Island was just like two patches before Enkanomiya
I don't know I'm thinking about it too much but its odd to me

I need to like

Go back to older areas and try and look for traces of the unfied civ architecture and the other old civilization architectures

And make a chart of sorts

[slender haven]

Well wasn't the Tsurumi civilization built at least some time after the nail dropped and broke on the island? At least the one that worshipped Kanna that is. It also got completely separated from the world too.
Enkanomiya seemed to have maintained some connections to their past history at least since they still worshiped the shades and the PO for a time. They even got Istaroth teaching Abrax about the artificial sun which could be where their architecture comes from.

[frigid lily]

That is true, but even so, the traces of Tsurumi Island's first civilization doesn't have the unified civilization architecture
And thats what I'm confused about
But again its probably not that big of a deal because its the same thing for Dragonspine as well

I also took this picture the other day

This is in one or Tsurumi's ruins

You can notice these small blue particles

Signs of where the nail landed, probably

[slender haven]

Oddly enough there are some Enka-esque ruins on Seirei too. Though we know so little about Seirei's greater lore it's impossible to make anything of them.

[slender haven]

Oh yeah I never caught that

[frigid lily]

Yeah Seirai is interesting but I don't think we'll ever get lore on it lmao

[slender haven]

But I guess if you really want you could just argue that Enkan culture/architecture diverged based on the Helious which had a different architecture style. Maybe Enka would even have the same architecture as the Golden City if my theory on Istaroth being the First Angel is true.

[slender haven]

Yeah, I'd like to get some resolution on where Domeki wound up but he's an Ei hater so the devs probably hate him

[frigid lily]

Ok but
Enka architecture is seen in:
The Chasm
In a small mountain in Fontaine
In the arena for the Iniquitous Baptist bossfight
In Natlan where Och-Kan's corpse is
Which is why people usually call it the unified civilization architecture

[slender haven]

There's architexture where Och-Kan's corpse is? I don't even remember there being buildings there

Well I guess there's that one tower if you look really hard

[frigid lily]

Yes, that tower lol

Thats the one I'm talking about

[slender haven]

I'm pretty sure that's the same tower you get to by doing all those Night Wind parkour things
With the dream catcher portals

But yeah it's in the same area

But getting back to the architecture let's just use Occam's Razor and say it's the placeholder archictecture for when Hoyoverse doesn't want to use whole new assets for a single room or two

[frigid lily]

This is what I mean
Left is the "unified civilization" architecture as seen in:

Enkanomiya
Chasm
Fontaine
Sumeru
And kind of a little bit in Natlan

Right is the other old civilization architecture that we see in
Dragonspine
Tsurumi Island, Araumi and Seirai Island
The "Ruins of Dahri" in Sumeru

More examples

It might look the same

But its not

[slender haven]

Yeah, like I said, it just kind of appears to be the standard go-to for when Hoyo wants stone structures in a place
but the problem is that the top 2 images aren't even Unified Civ, derived from it yes but not one and the same

[frigid lily]

Fair enough
I just find it interesting regardless

[slender haven]

Yeah

And then when the Golden City comes around it probably will have a different architexture style there too lol

[frigid lily]

Most likely

[ashen ocean]

The Golden City is underneath a lake is it not

[frigid lily]

Where does it say that

[ashen ocean]

Idk
Ballad of the Fjords desc ?

[frigid lily]

Hmm

Yeah I think that makes sense

Because

Didn't Childe fall down through a lake or something idk

[ashen ocean]

Ues

Yes

While he was fishing

[opal raptor]

where do you yall think iansan would be in? phase 1 or 2

[ashen ocean]

Phase

1

In varesa and xianyun banners

[opal raptor]

i saw a leak on twitter saying varesa will be free

but i lost the link so apologies

ig ill go for xianyun

[opal raptor]

nvm found it

https://x.com/yunjinzone/status/1897614521016983858

haise (@yunjinzone) on X

WHAT

X · Mar 6, 2025, 11:45 AM

so its kinda like the whole ratio scandal in hsr (back in 1.6)

[frigid lily]

Twitter
Ah yes the most reliable leak source
No, she's not going to be given for free, you need to stop believing everything that's going around lol

[ashen ocean]

Literally the second strongest DPS in the entire game

She wont be given for free lmao

[opal raptor]

lol i found it kinda sus

but free or not

ill go for xianyun

since shes more universal anyway

[frigid lily]

If you want "mostly" reliable leaks just go to the genshin leaks subreddit
Everything posted there is checked by the moderators so you don't get random bs """"leaks""""" like those
I mean not to say everything there is reliable but it at leats comes with a source

[ashen ocean]

Hxg Diluc and Rajor Language on Twitter are reliable too

[ashen ocean]

Tonatiuh is beautiful

so reading Lord of Eroded Primal Flame's in game description

could it be that the ode of ressurection could be Xiuhcoatl's mocking, painful one ?

[frigid lily]

Wdym

[ashen ocean]

"Brought back by the very otherworldly forces it had once resisted, a once dead dragon opens it's eyes anew, forsaking all in this brief dream of ressurection. Trapped perpetually in the final day of it's existence by this pitch-black gospel, its boundless fury has consumed all reason. Now, what remains is its unrelenting lust for battle, burning on without end. "

[frigid lily]

I don't get what you're trying to say

[ashen ocean]

It seemed to me that Xiuhcoatl was really brought back briefly

But it was xiuhcoatl on his final day who was ressurected

Like it was how Mavuika uses ode of resurrection for her warriors

But this time it was given to her enemy

[frigid lily]

Ehhh I'm not sure

It probably isn't the case where Xiuhcoatl was truly revived

It was just Gosoythoth with Xiuhcoatl's memories

[ashen ocean]

Gosoytoth is described as the reaper of the abyss and is able to corrupt leyline memories
But this description makes it seem like Gosoytoth resurrected Xiuhcoatl and immediately shrouded his self for a form to fight Mavuika

[frigid lily]

Hmm

Maybe

[ashen ocean]

Also, can we assume that Nibelung brought an Abyssal army with him to fight PO ?
Assuming more entities like Gosoytoth were prevalent

[frigid lily]

But I don't know what to make of ot

*it

[frigid lily]

That seems to be the case

[ashen ocean]

My guess is abyss has its own entities with consciousness and individuality like Gosoytoth or
Gosoytoth is related to a sinner

Before Gosoytoth, did the abyss have any notable personality/ individual?

[frigid lily]

Gosoythoth being related to a sinner sounds plausible considering the prophet it mentions might be one of them

[frigid lily]

Marana's Avatar maybe?

[ashen ocean]

His master is the “prophet”?

[ashen ocean]

Could be
But my guess was it is Apep’s abyssal refuse concentrating into one being

Like AMgelus points out the likeness to Apep’s children

[frigid lily]

Yeah

Marana's avatar has always been very interesting to me, but I hadn't seem many theories about it

[ashen ocean]

The whole aranara thing

I need to replay it

So many sanskrit names and references

[frigid lily]

I still want to know the "secret" Mavuika was supposed to tell us in the Travail trailer
Like, peoppe have been saying that "Oh it's just the secret regarding the Gnosis" but I don't think so
Because the Travail trailer specifies it as being a secret about the Ode of Resurrection

[ashen ocean]

I think it is related to Guthred

And Gosoytoth resurrecting

[frigid lily]

How so

[ashen ocean]

Or its about the Golden and Blue memories/ ghosts

[ashen ocean]

Leylines are merely only recording your actions on teyvat
Your soul is turned to fuel for the leyline process , and can be utilised for elemental energy or azozite or what not

Like humans being turned to lithin in men of lithlin book

[frigid lily]

Hmm

I mean yeah Guthred is pretty interesting