・genshin-spoilers

[hoary linden]

also, we never really see the dendro gnosis right? it was never shown at all

[violet briar]

nope

maybe in the future

or another harbinger cutscene

[hoary linden]

archon quest krazy, i’m still reeling ngl

[jovial otter]

[violet briar]

it was amazing but not that amazing cmon

not like it dropped whole game lore on us

I just hope to meet alice soon

[glass jackal]

Are al haitham and kaveh twins? They really look alike but also sound so similar

That fight felt soo cringe

[dense tendon]

Hi why did nahida gave 2 gnosis. What was the reason for each?

[old lodge]

did you even do the story?

[glass jackal]

She gave it to the doctor in exchange for 1) destroying all his clones/perspectives

2. for information regarding the descenders

[dense tendon]

Thats a bad trade off

[old lodge]

electro gnosis > destroy other copies of dottore
dendro > knowledge of fake sky , descendents , probably more

[glass jackal]

It seems traveler is the 4th descender but his sister is not considered one anymore

And the first descender was the heavenly principles (the god we met at the very beginning)

[old lodge]

damn thanks for telling us , da wei

[dense tendon]

What does dottore clones means?

[glass jackal]

Surprised how much we learned tbh

[glass jackal]

It’s his perspectives - versions of him from different ages that he cloned

Dude it feels so depressing to already say goodbye to all the characters

[old lodge]

go do the quest you'll appreciate the story

[dense tendon]

I did the quest

[hoary linden]

if you go back to the fatui video that the genshin youtube channel released, you can see columbina asking dottore where one of his segments are

[dense tendon]

I didnt understand

Segment means

[glass jackal]

I know they’ll still appear but Mann were already done with the sumeru archon quest

[old lodge]

basically like clones of himself

[dense tendon]

So lord r and nahida isnt same person?

[hoary linden]

fr but also we still have a couple of desert regions coming up so there’s more to look forward to hopefully

[dense tendon]

They are under same tree

But nahida is a branch

[old lodge]

no they arent the same

[dense tendon]

So lord r is irmisual tree?

[glass jackal]

I’m more curious about this information on descenders

[hoary linden]

she’s the Avatar of the irminsul tree, like a physical representation/manifestation of it as the God of Wisdom

[glass jackal]

Nahida motivates me, it only took her 500 years to overcome her insecurities, im sure I can start anew tomorrow :’)

[dense tendon]

How do yall rate sumeru quest vs inazuma

[glass jackal]

Sumeru was written a 1000x better than inazuma

[dense tendon]

I didnt understand inazuma

[glass jackal]

They paced it well and connects all the points really well

[dense tendon]

Isnt raiden a dictator

Suddenly she became so nice under ei

[glass jackal]

I get that sometimes the quests were long and too wordy but overall it was really enjoyable

[hoary linden]

inazuma was incredibly rushed and haphazard, sumeru was a nice change of pace despite how long it was tbh i liked taking our time

[old lodge]

wdym she became so nice under ei

[hoary linden]

it gave room for plot to simmer and develop

[glass jackal]

So ei creates two robots to govern inazuma while she goes to mourn

One of them is the raiden and the other is Scaramouche

She discards scara after realizing he is prone to being emotional

And chooses raiden to pursue eternity

It feels weird to be though

If rukkhadevata is erased from everyone’s memories than nahida herself doesn’t know what she really grew out of

[dense tendon]

So is raiden ei a bad person

Given how many pol died

Ppl

[hoary linden]

i would say that’s more up to your own feelings towards her imo

[glass jackal]

I just feel bad because her fight with herself was what made a huge portion of her story

If rukh is gone now nahida doesn’t know the source nor does she know the strength she had gained

It feels strange

[hoary linden]

objectively? i’m inclined to say yes. she jeopardized inazuma’s growth and imposed the sakoku decree + confiscated visions, sending inazuma into a full out civil war

but she also believed she was doing it for the good of inazuma, to preserve her idea of “eternity” and avoid “decaying” or smth

so i think trying to weigh if she’s a good or bad person depends on how you see things, whether you want to consider the rationale behind her actions or not

[dense tendon]

I really hated how signora died tbh

Its so rush

[weary oriole]

yes now I can finally beat scara up

[violet briar]

Signora deserved to die

Scara too but he didn’t

[weary oriole]

No joke he starts talking

and I fall on the ground bleeding from all that edge

scaramouche is like a pizza cutter: all edge and no point

[clever iron]

so wait

you can just upload your entire fucking consciousness into the matrix

in genshin

wtf

[quick chasm]

for me 3.2 AQ has so many cutscenes and the all look so damn good

[ashen canyon]

It's still funny to me to this day how they subtly made isak the dendro archon ppl were demanding and just poof

[violet briar]

?

[wild steeple]

Isak my baby

I loved the little telltale segment of his

[leaden burrow]

https://twitter.com/bl00d_alchemist/status/1588048299583451137?s=46&t=WYCTcBCXLXg8VzSnbCd0tQ

Bl00dalchemist (COMMISSIONS OPEN) (@bl00d_alchemist)

They are workin on -points vaguely- all of that
#scaramouche #GenshinImpact

Likes

12818

Retweets

2804

Twitter · Nov 3, 2022, 5:59 AM

This MIGHT actually be accurate-

[untold rain]

pretty sure nahida just locked scaras conciousness in a samsara dream loop and keeps him there until he becomes a somewhat decent person

[leaden burrow]

I would like to imagine Nahida forcing Scaramouche to watch every single My Little Pony episodes.

[untold rain]

on another note, they should have shown all texts related to rukkhadevata be erased too because thats gonna create some huge plot holes if people can still just read up on her lol

[wild steeple]

I imagine it's just taken for obvious with everyone's memories of rukkhadevata being replaced by nahida

[echo lake]

damn the scaramouche fight just gave me a worse nahida to use

[sacred dock]

Dmc??

[echo lake]

no just nahida in general

just one that was 10x worse than mine

[heady ether]

he needs to learn all those friendship lessons

one thing that I'm really curious about is when did/does Scara get his vision? I don't know all of the lore so did he already have it? or does Venti just kinda give it to him after all that mess like "hey I know you tried to kill my friend and briefly achieved godhood, but go and be free or whatever, wind makes a cool woosh sound so take this"

[weary oriole]

What id do with scaramouche:

Cruficy him. And place a table in front of him with the electro gnosis and also a new and improved Raiden Shogun copy next to it that keeps repeating "youre a disappointment" to him.

[weary oriole]

"youre out of jail so you are free now, take this" lady gaga telephone starts playing

[heady ether]

lmao

[uneven turret]

relax satan

fuck he even do to deserve all that, be mean about teppei? smh

this fandom acts like scara is a confirmed mass murderer of small children and kittens or something

[weary oriole]

Nah I just got harassed on twitter often by his stans lol but who knows maybe I get him by accident if I dont like the rerun character alongside him (I want Faruzan please) and he redeems himself

[weary oriole]

one of his better actions /hj

[uneven turret]

try not to mix up the actual character with annoying stans lol

[zenith plover]

w h a t . . .

[leaden burrow]

I’m skipping him no matter what-

He’s meh for my taste-

[weary oriole]

his concept is cute, Raiden but as a smol boy and just as unable as her to cope.

[uneven turret]

yeah that's how i see it too, both have terrible unhealthy coping mechanisms

[leaden burrow]

What’s so cute about knowing that you’re living as a prototype?-

[uneven turret]

both deal with their emotional pain in a way that ends up harming others

[weary oriole]

Yeah

[leaden burrow]

Oh.

[weary oriole]

you can cope that you aint as bad as the original

[heady ether]

Scaramouche looks fun as hell to play as and I find his lore very interesting, I'll definitely be pulling for him

[ashen canyon]

Ngl is it the first time in a character story quest that we get to use that said character(in this case Nahida in her story quest) multiple times cuz that is pretty good and hoping for things like that in the future

[leaden burrow]

Meanwhile, Albedo: doesn’t even let us play him in his own story quest

[void nest]

I think before we can but now not anymore

[leaden burrow]

Nope.

Not even back in 1.2

Aka when his story quest was released.

[void nest]

I saw my brother play him in his story quest-

maybe I got confused if he played him

[leaden burrow]

He probably either got him from pulling or he was playing the event story.

[void nest]

ah yes perhaps its the event story-

[leaden burrow]

I don’t remember if he was a trial character during the event story but definitely not his story quest.

[wild steeple]

• Archons don't give visions
• Most likely in a future archon/interlude quest or his own story quest

[weary oriole]

Yes, just like Rana when she gained her vision.

[heady ether]

huh I guess taking a 6 month break made me really behind on the lore, I thought archons gave the visions lol

[wide harness]

Why theres stormterror lair theme in nahida story quest

[wild steeple]

It's been debunked years ago since Inazuma days lol

[heady ether]

I guess I just forgot then, sorry

[little quiver]

for me inazuma gets 7/10 purely due to the last act/clean up of the story. there are a lot of memorable moments throughout but the end wasn't satisfying to me and some characters could've gotten more development/closure (koko,sara). sumeru right now im thinking 9/10. the harbingers being involved was much more well done this time, the characters all had a good role to play with enjoyable personalities, and nahida in general has just been a pleasure to learn and watch.

[ocean fjord]

Sumeru overall experience 11/10

[slate agate]

Sumeru was 10/10 during the Aranara questline. Now with Nahida, its 20/10

[thorny mirage]

Hoping they will release more sumeru lore in future story quests/interlude quests/event quests

[weary oriole]

[slate agate]

I think we only have like 60% of sumeru released.

[thorny mirage]

The aranaras is so cute
The lore is fucking sad

I miss arama

https://tenor.com/view/arama-genshin-impact-aranara-arama-dancing-gif-26630449

[open cedar]

no but they are roommates

[weary oriole]

Strongest aranara

[weary oriole]

Anyone has a prediction after Scaramouche's coma is gone?

[meager galleon]

Everyone mentions nahida almost everytime they speak now

[near ermine]

is the act this update the final

[vale ocean]

So uhhj i need clarification

My brain juice ran out during dottore's negotiation

So how dottore's clones work is that its not technically clones, more like he have Access to different dottores from other timelines?

[long perch]

Guys who tf created this masterpiece of archon quest

1. So full of things

2. Omg the cutscenes

3. Wowww

[tawdry blade]

So Fontaine has ship,instead of normal boat

[tawdry blade]

I hope Fontaine act is like Detroit bcome human,you can get different result. Although the ending will be the same (like how different decision lead us to meet which fatui first)

I don't think they don't add that option mechanic in isak part for no reason

[long perch]

I can’t wait for Fontaine story and questssss

Tbh I can’t even wait for 3.3

Scaramouche was so cute during the fight with nahida

And when she took the gnosis omg

[tawdry blade]

Speaking of world quest,i wonder if different decision lead to the npc death or alive

[long perch]

They left him fall and hit the ground so hard

[long perch]

I dunno but I don’t think so

[tawdry blade]

If they can change item description after rukka disappear from people memory I think it possible

[tawdry blade]

Nahida story is pretty good

Hmm,a strange light in the end of the dream

Suspicious

[wild steeple]

https://twitter.com/Ubatcha1/status/1588003802652753921

UBatcha (@Ubatcha1)

[GI] - Clarification

As of the current beta update, I do not see any indication of a hangout for "The Wanderer". I'm unsure as to why this claim was made but I noticed a few people on reddit being confused.

There is an interlude AQ which has Wanderer, Honey Hunter has details.

Likes

5335

Retweets

277

Twitter · Nov 3, 2022, 3:03 AM

[ashen canyon]

Man I kinda wanna see what happened if we didn't press anything or all of the options presented at that specific event

[wild steeple]

As someone who chose the wrong option two times, you just get a game over and retry

||"Izak escaped the guards, the mission failed"||

Stuff like that

[ashen canyon]

That's what at the top of my mind, the retry thingy but hmm, it could've been a bit better if they all lead to the same conclusion and picking different options leads to longer gameplay or something like that

Anyway, I'm thinking too much about it, don't mind what I'm saying just now lmao

[weary oriole]

Setaria exists

[nimble sandal]

So- Since Dottore told Nahida about the sky being fake, didn’t he basically reintroduce forbidden knowledge to irminsul? Essentially recreating the cycle?👀

[weary oriole]

yeah thats what I thought too

Nahida you idiot you corrupted yourself

[weary oriole]

THIS SHIT IS WILD.

[tender sphinx]

Seems to me like the sibling was intentionally added to the irminsul database

Or we getting gaslit as fuck

[weary oriole]

Hmm.

I can't wait for Fontaine.

[tender sphinx]

Yeah I can’t either

Hopefully we get focalors as a thicc hydro mommy

[weary oriole]

Hopefully.

[tawdry blade]

Hydro tentacles

[stable glen]

make it so mihoyo, you cowards!

[scarlet panther]

he's so sad 😭

I really love the parallel and contrast in the story

nahida va scaramouche's feelings of inadequacy
nahida vs dottore's view on clones of themselves

[hardy stratus]

wait guys i finished the archon quest but i havent unlocked the scara boss fight domain?

[broken sluice]

southeast (more of east than south) of sumeru city there's the domain

[long perch]

I would’ve give him back seeing his expressions and voice

I was screaming nooo don’t do that nahida

She did it anyway

😦

[high charm]

why was Nahida called "Beru" or something like that a few times in the last archon quest? I don't remember that name being used previously.

[dreamy granite]

Buer

[high charm]

well, i got the letters right

[finite finch]

their god names or something like barbatos for venti and Morax for zhongli

[weary oriole]

Beur, like the demon

[weary oriole]

Valid because of all the edgy shit he said like yeah he proved he isnt deserving of it

[nimble sandal]

I think that makes sense. Since the world runs into a cycle so there had to be a dendro archon to erase in the next

[high charm]

Nahida said: "In fact, the Heavenly Principles has been quiet since the Khaenri'ah disaster five hundred years ago", is this more proof that Paimon is Heavenly principles or what? it fits. somehow HP lost her power and turned into Paimon?

[weary oriole]

I thought the 4 descendants ( was that the word?) would fit too?

[high charm]

yeah. maybe Paimon is not the 1st Descendand but the 2nd or 3rd

[stoic summit]

Oh my god bruh

Nahidas story quest started off kinda feeling redundant but it tied off so well 😭

[peak shoal]

just me, king deshrets "self sacrifice" seems quite sussy to me

was it the same kind of sacrifice orobashi did

[weary oriole]

I was thinking:
1: Heavenly Principle Woman / Paimon
2: Dainslaif
3: Lumine
4: Aether

[stoic summit]

How so?

[peak shoal]

Forbidden knowledge that he learned the real nature of the world

and has been sentenced to death by the principles, but gotta make it look like an accident/on purpose

[stoic summit]

Hmmmm you could be right

[prisma bluff]

she wouldnt, after all, she didnt end up knowing who rukkha was in the end

only descendants (like the traveler) knew who rukkha was after she was erased from the world

[weary oriole]

Maybe Paimon got the Rukkha treatment?

[meager galleon]

Descenders didnt get the forget rukkhadevata treatment because since theyre not in the irminsul they cant be memory wiped

[vague sky]

is here where we can talk about story for the new archon quest?

[uneven turret]

ye but we dont know who 2 of the descendants are

could be anyone really

[pallid otter]

WAIT A SEC

Rukkha­shava Mushrooms are still called Rukkha­shava Mushrooms.

Wtf does everyone think the name came from now?

[stable glen]

everything circles back to dook-dook with this archon

[humble socket]

the description is changed after you finish the AQ
"rukkhadevata" is not a god anymore, it's a tree

[pallid otter]

Huh.

[humble socket]

many things have permanently changed after you finish the AQ

i saw a thread on reddit

[pallid otter]

Do you still have the thread?

[mortal gust]

man is really going through it

[mortal gust]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Genshin_Lore/comments/yl89md/havent_seen_too_much_discussion_about_this_after/

[umbral vapor]

woah that's an interesting detail

[silver spade]

"Yeah that's me. Youre probably wondering how I got in this situation. Let's start from the beginning."

[tender sphinx]

nahida is the 3rd dendro archon

not the 2nd

rukkhedevata was the 2nd

the 1st dendro archon died during the archon war along with king desheret

and rukkhedevata had to do the same thing

as in she erased the first dendro archon from the world

which is why she supposedly "shrank down to a little child"

she wasn't shrunken

she WAS a child

it was just another samsara

[silver spade]

Oh I just remembered that the boss fight between scaramouche and the traveler was technically streamed through the akasha

He was humiliated to the whole public, no wonder he changed outfits and name completely afterwards

[slate agate]

I thought she shrunk because she was helping King Desret?

[tender sphinx]

yeah but what im saying is

what if there was a previous dendro archon before rukkhedevata

and that dendro archon was polluted by the forbidden knowledge

then, she would have made rukkhedevata, who would have erased the previous dendro archon just like kusanali erased rukkhedevata

but, no one would ever know

what im getting at is that there was never any shrinking, every time you hear about the dendro archon shrinking it just means a new samsara

[slate agate]

Oh you be speculating

[tender sphinx]

yes

but it is possible

[hallow path]

OYASUMI OYASUMI

close your eyes and you'll leave this dreeeeam

[weary oriole]

I don’t think so, and also your wording was misleading at first

[final chasm]

why is she still known as lesser lord kusanali when greater lord rukkhadevata has been erased from all memory

[silver spade]

https://media.tenor.com/O1PFkDC_FegAAAAM/god-of-war-guy-falling.gif

[nimble sandal]

I’m dying on the hill that Paimon is the god of time.

[nimble sandal]

I disagree. All signs point to this

However I do believe she shrunk. Maybe the dendro archon remain alive for more than one cycle? Then when the pollution gets too strong she breaks off a branch and starts fresh. Then dottore messes it up again.

Based on what the previous dendro archon said she didn’t realize that she was the one with the polluted knowledge until after.

This theory has alot of holes tho, since we’d need another cataclysm.

[hallow path]

who the fuck is rukkhedevata i only know that lesser lord kusanali has always been the dendro archon from the very start

[silver spade]

I'm ready to torture my self and my phone

In going to screen record this

[gray raven]

no no, that's not what happened

[tender sphinx]

we don't know

[tender sphinx]

yeah sorry idk who rukkhedevata is

[hallow path]

Yeah, kusanali sacrificed her strength to become small

she's always the dendro archon from the start, it's just people underestimated her a lot

[tender sphinx]

yeah that's right

[gray raven]

greater lord rukkhadevata reverted to a younger form yes but my time of the cataclysm we can assume she was back to full strength or normal as you can say

[hallow path]

Also who the fuck is rukkhedevata again people are making up shit on the internet

who is rukkhedevata

[gray raven]

kusanali is only born/created during the cataclysm

[hallow path]

nah

[tender sphinx]

who the fuck is rukkhedevata

kusanali was always the archon

[hallow path]

who the fuck is rukkhedevata 🥴

[mystic coyote]

there are rukkhashava mushrooms maybe this Rukkhadevata was the one who discovered them? 🤔

[hallow path]

so true bestie

This rukkhedevata guy sounds cool

never has been written in history though

[tender sphinx]

yeah literally never shows up ever

[gray raven]

also pretty sure king deshret survived the archon war

[gray raven]

oh, i'm dumb sorry

[flat saddle]

wtf did a npc just name drop someone who investigated the abyss in nahida story quest?

[fossil silo]

I feel like the traveler's sibling must have rewritten history in the same way that rukkhadevata did to get added to iriminsul right? I feel like that's the only thing that makes sense

I wonder how many times history in teyvat has been rewritten

[halcyon jackal]

💀

[junior dove]

So did scaramouche literally just- die-

I can't get over that shit

[weary oriole]

the truth is
she shrunk because she used all her power and body to eradicate the pollution cause by the forbidden knowledge

that's how it is said
But in reality
She died fighting the forbidden knowledge
the moment before she did , she extracted a branch from the irminsul and created nahida as her reincarnation
that's how it came to be
hence after her death , nahida was born
which is why her death date is the same day nahida was born
hence from the priest pov who narrated this story
it is like she shrunk using her power to fight the pollution
but rukkadevata tells us clearly what happened

The small child was Nahida..? Not Rukkha?

no

thats nahida

not rukka

Rukkha was already dead... The small child the priest saw was Nahida..?

[supple igloo]

Yo what was the meteor that nahida saw

[weary oriole]

yes

its simple

no one other than rukka couldve known that it was not her but nahida

bc she was the one who made her

https://tenor.com/view/mind-blown-whoa-wow-gif-23029400

[weary oriole]

Mind blown

What meteor..?

[supple igloo]

In nahida’s story quest

She saw a meteorite in at the end but she didn’t say anything

The blue meteorite

[weary oriole]

I haven't played the archon quest yet

Everything i know so far came from leaks

[fossil silo]

I am a little torn on whether the traveler should have told nahida about rukkhadevata

on the one hand the quest is about moving forward with life and not dwelling on the past but I think it's also important to accept and grieve your loss

[weary oriole]

well now we can all go back to the original teaser trailer teyvat storyline of sumeru and say "OH, that's what that meant"

[tawdry blade]

What if it the twin

Also it yellow not blue

[tawdry blade]

I don't think so. If the sibling can do that why didn't she just make the abyss win

[weary oriole]

Our sibling is very mysterious

[dense tendon]

Guys am i weird but i cried during sumeru archon quest. When nahida start questioning herself

And when lord r is gone

[gray raven]

no that's different

[gray raven]

it was Rukkhadevata

[weary oriole]

how so

[gray raven]

the collapse of King Deshret's civilisation happened thousands of years ago

the cataclysm happened 500 years ago

[weary oriole]

hm

[gray raven]

2 different events

we can also assume that rukkhadevata was back to the normal by the time of the cataclysm

[weary oriole]

yes it was true , two different events
your point being that the collapse happened 1000 yrs ago
cataclysm five hundred yrs ago

thus implying the fact that the child was indeed nahida

However between this five hundred yr gap , do u think the sages and the sumeru's akedmiya wouldve recognized her as rukkadevata in a child form

moreover , it was said that she kept fighting the pollution of the forbidden knowledge
implying that , from the time of the fall of deshret civilization to the cataclysm , she was in sumeru fighting the forbbiden knowledge
which is why she did not go to khanreah when the 7 were summoned.

this means that she fought all along from deshret's time till khanreah and over , using all her strength and finally died
the pollution of the desert ended with the sacrifice of the scarlet king
however , it did not end in other parts of sumeru and irminsul itself , as she had to continously fight to eradicate it all
which could only explain why she did not go to khanreah

hence these two events are interconnected to her fate
one being the sequel of the other

besides , if the child was rukkadevata , then it would not explain the need to have nahida as her sucessor
because that child would already be everything nahida would be

implying that at the end of her life , she did take the purest branch of the irminsul to create nahida as her sucessor when she died
this is confirmed in the archon quest
if you claim that the child is rukkadevata , then it would also cause a time paradox , since it was clearly stated that nahida is the reincarnation of rukkadevata , which would prove false if rukkadevata was the same child

[sharp mesa]

So

Guys

[gray raven]

um

[gray raven]

you're overthinking this

[weary oriole]

also
from the priest pov
he could not have known nahida was a different entity as that is something only rukkadevata couldve known at that timeframe
therefore the only possible explanation he came up with that made sense was that she shrunk to a form of a child , since her birth date is the same as her death date

[gray raven]

kasala was long dead by the time of cataclysm so he did not witness nahida's birth

[sharp mesa]

What even is the argument right now?

[gray raven]

basically

idk

[weary oriole]

its not rlly an argument
just a normal conversation on whether nahida is rukkadevata

[sharp mesa]

We got that answered in the story

What

[gray raven]

what stopped the forbidden knowledge in the desert was the combination of rukkhadavata using her power and the sacrifice of king deshret

[weary oriole]

yes

that is true

it did end there

but not the irminsul

[fossil silo]

here is the thing about the shrinking to a small child thing

at the end of the archon quest, people's entire memory of rukkhadevata is removed

I think it was said above somewhere that there was a third dendro god but I think this is probably untrue right

[weary oriole]

if you claim that rukkadevata is the same as nahida
that would validate her shrinking to the size of a child

which would henceforth invalidate rukkadaveta in the archon quest stating how she created nahida from the branch of irminsul
which is confirmed in the archon quest
which would mean rukkadevata is lying
but she isnt

therefore they both are different entities

[fossil silo]

ofc

[gray raven]

there was at least 500 years or more. between king deshret's sacrifice and the cataclysm so rukkhadevata had probably gained back all her power and form by that time

[fossil silo]

if you take a seed from a tree and plant it, you aren't creating the same tree

it is a different tree

[weary oriole]

true

[weary oriole]

and even otherwise , if you claim she shrunk to size of a child and then returned to her normal form
that would not make much sense
because in her child form , she wouldnt be able to be the archon of sumeru , neither would she be able to fight the pollution of the forbbiden knowledge in the irminsul

put simply , there would be a complete gap in her role

a five hundred yr gap is a continous event between the sacrifice and cataclysm

[fossil silo]

do you have to do golden slumber before you do the archon quest

if not do we know what the dialogue is in that quest if rukkha has been erased

actually I guess all the stuff about Rukkha is in the archon quest not golden slumber

[weary oriole]

not rlly

I completed the archon quest and

my golden slumber is still pending

so

[fossil silo]

i was wondering if you could like find dialogue where people think kusanali reverted to a child

after rukkha dies

[weary oriole]

thats in the 2nd archon quest

[fossil silo]

i think if there was dialogue that kusanali reverted to a child it would be reasonable to conclude there was a third dendro archon that managed the king deshret crisis and died because of it

[weary oriole]

damn

first Nahida wrote the Harry Potter books

and now she did fight in the apocalypse

[slate agate]

I thought the speculation is that there was more than one Rukkhadevata. There was Rukkhadevata 1.0 that was alive at the time with King Desret, and there was Rukkhadevata 2.0 which was created by Rukkha 1.0 like how Nahida was created by Rukkha 2.0. The question is, is there one or two Rukkhadevata?

[scarlet panther]

I feel like the traveler has always been traveling alone
but someone created a twin out of them and put the twin in teyvat history to trick traveler into saving teyvat

[dense forum]

what was the other obsession of Scaramouche that nahida mentioned?

is that what we find out in the interlude?? Or is it just becoming a god?

[gusty oar]

Can we already conclude that "god" and "archon" is one and the same in Genshin terms?

"God of Wisdom is the Dendro Archon."

I was corrected before that these two terms were different. But after 3 acts, I don't know if I'd still be convinced otherwise.

[hoary dawn]

they're still different terms

god refers to ascended beings
while archon refers to ascended beings that also hold a seat among the seven

[gusty oar]

So if the sages were successful in their plans, will the Balladeer be considered a god?

[hoary dawn]

depends, Nahida didn't want to call him a god, as if implying there's something else missing

he certainly had the power of one, but now that he got defeated, I guess he descended ?

[weary oriole]

How high are the odds that scara broke his neck when he fell out of his mech

[pulsar zealot]

So uh, is Dainsleif a ||descendance|| ?

[weary oriole]

My favourite theory/the one i think is most realistic is, that the Cutscene we get in the beginning of the game is actually the last cutscene of the game. Imagine in the end we somehow get on good terms with our sibling, just to fight against celestia and history to repeat itself.

Perfect time for mihoyo to create Genshin 2.0 where we get out of this time loop

[scarlet panther]

it's probably
sustainer
alice
aloy
traveler

anyway have I been playing a filthy isekai game all this time

[old lodge]

i don't think aloy is actually a descendant lol

[uneven turret]

lmao imagine its aloy

[pulsar zealot]

What if alice is like the opposite of it, came from teyvat but hops to diff worlds. So like an .... Ascender?

[umbral vapor]

he's from teyvat so nah unless there's another secret

[umbral vapor]

there's nobody with this classification yet that's documented by the fatui so it'd just be something new

[gusty oar]

Jeez, so the sages had the ability to ascend the Balladeer? Dang.

I mean in order to qualify for the definition of a god, he should "ascend", right? Failure of such and he can't be considered one.

[hoary dawn]

well Scaramouche claimed he ascended

[clever iron]

gods suck in teyvat

they weak af

[hoary dawn]

but his ego is taller than the burj khalifa

so he could have lied (though he himself believed his statement to be true)

[gusty oar]

He is probably just high on that "divine wisdom" thing lmao.

[umbral vapor]

he did use the gnosis to control the weather so

[uneven turret]

i think scara was technically a "god" at that point but didnt have the divine wisdom that they're supposed to have or whatever so he was like.. he had the power of a god but not the wisdom or knowledge of one

[umbral vapor]

rip bozo

[uneven turret]

bc they didnt have time to upload the capsules or whatever

if they had i guess he pretty much would have been fully a god

[umbral vapor]

still got shit on by a guy with a dull sword

and some repeating loop samsara thing

that was a cool plot twist

[uneven turret]

nah traveler couldn't beat him at first and needed nahida to create a simulation where they lost to him like 100s of times first plus ~all of sumeru~ lending them their knowledge or whatever

i actually think this is one of the only bosses traveler does not canonically beat with their own skill alone

if it was actually just dull blade traveler vs mecha scara with zero outside help they would have been done for

[thorny mirage]

yes

[umbral vapor]

still cant beat raiden without yae's help

same with osial

[uneven turret]

yeah i like that they dont make traveler all powerful and able to easily own everyone tbh

[umbral vapor]

still won against tartaglia and signora

[uneven turret]

tartaglia was more like he beat himself bc using the abyss form or whatever was taking a toll on him

at least partially

[umbral vapor]

that's his strongest form

[uneven turret]

yes i know

but it also weakens him to use it

[umbral vapor]

more like he just has a skill issue

[uneven turret]

signora was a fair and proper victory

traveler had gotten stronger by that point tho

[tawdry blade]

I mean the whole fight is unfair,he is huge and has 5 element and there a small "human" with 4 element

If scara fight us without his robot,now the fight is more fair

[violet briar]

yes and no bc his robot form would only work in that arena , that making him stuck in there and big weak point

[tawdry blade]

Ye

A god that only strong rely on their personal stuff is a weak god

Imagine live your life walking around with a huge robot

[violet briar]

I mean

I don't think that robot did much but access the power of the gnosis for him

he is probably unable to do it himself

yet still

in one description of boss mats or idk

it said that without the wires that connect him to the robot or arena, he is as weak as a newborn baby

[gusty oar]

Well he did claim he ascended to Celestia, the reason he can be called god. But yeah, indeed a weak one. After all, he's just human-made and his "divine" stuff is in a sense "borrowed".

[violet briar]

description of this I think

[violet briar]

only thing that made him close to a god is the gnosis

[gusty oar]

Even Ei discarded him lol.

[violet briar]

bc he did not possess the knowledge of one

[tawdry blade]

He claim he ascended to celestia because he wish he was

Call nahida buer the whole scene because he wish he has demon name for himself

[gusty oar]

Oohhhh, so without ascension, he can't claim he's one?

[violet briar]

no

whole power was from the gnosis

that was the heart of his robot

[gusty oar]

His dream is now completely shattered.

[tawdry blade]

He is lucky that he didn't try put it inside him

[violet briar]

only with that he can unlock his potential

[violet briar]

he would probably go crazy

but killed after

[tawdry blade]

Yeah,it is said that he will suffer if he did according to husk set

[violet briar]

that's why mihoyo put him inside a robot

[pulsar zealot]

Could our siblings, born 500 yrs earlier be the reason he/she is recorded in irminsul?

[violet briar]

so he doesn't die

[violet briar]

I think our sibling is fake

a puppet

[tawdry blade]

Someone mess with the Irminsul maybe

[violet briar]

sibling may still be locked in celestia after the fight

and used as puppet on teyvat

[pulsar zealot]

Susblings

[violet briar]

Impostor

yes

[tawdry blade]

Just a theory,maybe the sibling is in that celestia jail,the one we see is the clone that the sibling made before getting capture

[violet briar]

too much lore info

can't really come up with a explanation

[umbral vapor]

i think it should be noted that nahida needed two gnosis to access irminsul and erase rukkhadevata

[tawdry blade]

But the abyss somehow take over the clone

[pulsar zealot]

Genshin lore is fr interesting wtf

[violet briar]

can't say interesting yet

but def puzzled

like it is given in ways that make no sense

[umbral vapor]

https://tenor.com/view/genshin-impact-genshin-scaramouche-lore-gif-23919170

[tawdry blade]

I think Rukka erase herself rather than the power of the 2 gnosis

[violet briar]

only at the end

you can put everything together and resolve the puzzle

[umbral vapor]

why didnt she do it earlier then

people died because she wasnt already gone which i doubt she would've allowed to happen

[gusty oar]

Now everything makes sense. Conclusion is he can't be a god. I wonder who decides to make one a "god" and let them ascend to Celestia... Primordial One?

[violet briar]

the definition of god in genshin may have many versions

a deity so powerful it can erase mortals

a deity that is praised by mortals

etc

[pulsar zealot]

Yh, like low tier god

A deity so powerful, his eyes starts to glow lightning

[tawdry blade]

I hope in Fontaine there is a secret organization that is powerful as Fatui military.

[violet briar]

I'm really hyped for the winter event this year

wonder what lore it will uncover

about albedo

and stuff

[pulsar zealot]

Yh, if not, it'll take all the military from other nations (not including Snez) to wage against them

I mean, i for one want to see all of us against snez

[tawdry blade]

I hope it not about albedo,I mean that cool but there is snow in other region too so maybe

But if it about durin heart then sure

[violet briar]

I wanna see more rhinedottir lore

or durin

[umbral vapor]

fontaine is gonna be lawyer simulator

[violet briar]

we get sued

just like beta leakers

[umbral vapor]

gg

beta leaker simulator

hoyoverse had enough

[violet briar]

paying 86k mora

[umbral vapor]

what that's like less than 5 artifacts leveled

not even 1 artifact 💀

[final inlet]

It’s still enough for Paimon to probably bawl her eyes out in court

[cedar loom]

If I'm not wrong, you can do Act V of the Sumeru Archon Quest without doing Tighnari's story quest. If so, what happens if you get to the point where Tighnari gets hit with lightning and needs to rest? Is Karkata not there? Or am I simply wrong that you don't need to do Tighnari's story quest?

[haughty yacht]

you don't need to do Tighnari's story quest

[uneven turret]

ye i know i was moreso just responding to the comment that made it sound like traveler easily beat him even in his mecha form bc thats not true lol

[snow lion]

pretty cool story quest. I think my most interesting takeaway (I might be wrong, but I don't think I am) is that this is the first time we've ever really had genshin ever make a reference to honkai. Honkai has made reference to genshin, but not the other way until now. Kind of soft confirmation that the abyss/forbidden knowledge is honkai.

[smoky axle]

The ending of the Archon Quest reminds me if some hoyoverse devs saw No Way Home

Cause the endings of both are very similar

[tawdry blade]

What the similarity

[smoky axle]

Endings focused about erasing everything that has happened, including people's memories of that person, while the MC is the only one remembering what happened

Both are at a significant location (Irmunsul Tree / Statue of Liberty)

[hallow path]

wait how so again i forgot lol

[silver spade]

When I saw kaveh and al haitham arguing each other
I already see ahead that someone will ship those two

[snow lion]

I guess it's less that it's a reference, more that they function very similar to each other. in that forbidden knowledge was referred to as like, an omnipresent force that they couldn't get rid of.

[silver spade]

Fuckin hell

[distant sentinel]

huh how?

[wild steeple]

I was less focused on their interactions and more on Cyno and Tighnari tbh

[weary oriole]

Why did you have to remind me people do that

[rain quartz]

"I was born to be a god"
"My entire life has led to this moment"
Gets wrecked like a bitch
Almost cries like one when the little fairy takes away the gnosis
Seriously scaradouche is utterly pathetic

[rain quartz]

yeah i am thinking the same, which makes sense with the recent lore in hi3 that the honkai "think in dreams"

[distant sentinel]

Well at least he's more mentally complex than the shogun

which is....THIS IS OUTSIDE PARAMETER LETS FIGHT

[hallow path]

meh

I see him as a 1D villain

[distant sentinel]

he's just an edgy kid

[hallow path]

maybe his desire for power comes from him craving for appreciation and validation but I don't think that's ever really explored

[distant sentinel]

well we'll see on 3.3+ all the jsutification quests and dialgoues

[rain quartz]

Well thats what happens when you successfully program a robot to commit to one purpose, it won't deviate and will solely focus on that task

[rain quartz]

i think it is explored plenty, overly emotional and irrational, spiteful and full of malice, also a huge inferiority complex

[hallow path]

I mean at least it's subtle

[rain quartz]

it isnt subtle ~.~

he is pretty much shinji matou without the sister abuse part

[hallow path]

We get to empathize with him, sure, but it feels more like we're observing him than seeing himself confront his underlying problems, which is something I hope for the 3.3 quests to fix

[hallow path]

It is subtle, or more like implied if you consider all the flags he has

It's never stated outright though, even slightly, which IMO makes him come off more as a generic doomsday villain because we don't really put ourselves in his boots

[distant sentinel]

Since Scara is a puppet....is he recorded in the leylines/irminsul/w&e?

[rain quartz]

[distant sentinel]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nb4wLQaOzfQ also paimon confirmed a robot

i didn't relalise the eye movement when i first saw it

[rain quartz]

lol'd at that part

paimon just gets better with every patch

[distant sentinel]

Now that i think about it. Scara should have stolen his momsword instead of the gnosis

[silver spade]

Even his boss fight is.
I was expecting a hard battle only to be disappointed of how easy defeating him

[distant sentinel]

His battle is weird tbh didn't like it much

[rain quartz]

is...just weird fighting a big mecha

without flight

[distant sentinel]

he too big

[rain quartz]

imo for the fight should have been something like the dvalin aerial fight minigame

cuz otherwise we just hitting the feet of the robot

[distant sentinel]

yeah

[silver spade]

His boss fight it's so easy that I decided to make it more harder

By playing ace combat at the same time

At ace mode

[distant sentinel]

lol

[silver spade]

And yep scaramouche boss is easy but the final boss in ace combat is hard as fuck

[rain quartz]

if you think about it the traveler is pretty strong, cuz got stopped the hand of the mecha, got thrown several meters down and lifted a slab of stone that fell on top of him

[silver spade]

I might try it on god of war instead of ace combat

[distant sentinel]

wait golden gate bridge? i don't recall San Francisco to be in Strangereal?

[silver spade]

It's ace combat joint assault

It's set in earth

For some reason

[distant sentinel]

oh

[rain quartz]

and then you realize that there are characters who are physically way stronger than traveler, like shenhe, she could have done a suplex on the robot

[silver spade]

Yeah I mean she lift that rock

[distant sentinel]

or start throwing rocks at him

Also he goes: let's imitate the archon war.... Didn't throw any mountain at us

[silver spade]

Without his mech. Scaramouche is probably weaker than ellin

[rain quartz]

physically pretty weak but still had the electro power that ei infused in the puppet

which likely is all gone now

[distant sentinel]

On paper he was stronger than signora

[rain quartz]

also in the end nahida turned out to be just like theresa is to kallen, a clone of sorts

[distant sentinel]

More like... Small dendro slime to big dendro slime

[rain quartz]

signora got jobbed by traveler without archon help

[distant sentinel]

she wasn't riding a robot though

[rain quartz]

she didnt have to overcompensate

[distant sentinel]

i mean scara without robot was in higher tier than signora

[rain quartz]

yeah because of the borrowed power from raiden

which even if was just a bit it was still enough to put the crimson witch in a lower tier

[icy phoenix]

That scene where dottore kills his segments has got to be the best retcon I’ve seen in my life

They can canonically get rid of goofy ahh dottore

[smoky axle]

Do you think the scara boss fight was similar to Aksis from D1 in Wrath of the Machine

this is aksis from destiny

[rain quartz]

dat looks like this

[glass jackal]

Am I the only one disappointed that rukh was erased? Like it feels like the ending was made to be easy for everyone in sumeru

Nahida made a decision to listen to herself more - in the shadow of her predecessor

She never got to show how she would have upheld that promise given the circumstances around her - because her predecessor has been erased altogher from history - removing any contention about her authority or power

Al haitham was soo worried about how removing the sages would have affected the political atmosphere in sumeru. Cause there definitely would have been cult followings for rukh the same way deshret had followers

Her challenge if rukh was still known would have been to overcome her as lesser lord kusanali. To come to a point, where she could have been seen as her own archon

[umbral vapor]

i wouldnt be quick to assume how it still emotionally affects nahida since she still spent 500 years locked up

plot holes man

[dense ember]

I'm sorry but I can't remember how the history re-written itself

Like, in Teyvatians memories right now, Nahida sacrificed all her energy and then got caged by the Scholar?

[glass jackal]

Yea basically and she was the only dendro archon ever, thereby making her the inventor of the akasha as well

[glass jackal]

Except the underlying reason for the imprisonment has changed drastically. In one version, she was imprisoned because she wasn’t considered as good as her predecessor and in another the sages turned against her and took advantage of her weakened state after her sacrifice. They’re almost similar, but there’s a huge nuance between the two.
The first is the reason why she has such low confidence on her own capacity to be a good archon and it was a big part of the story surrounding nahida.

The latter implies that she was already a capable archon but a victim of betrayal and corruption

[umbral vapor]

im under the impression in the current version she was still resented because of her lack of wisdom though?

[glass jackal]

No… no one resents her now, mostly because there’s nothing to compare her with

[distant sentinel]

Nahida just pulled a Silver Wolf and hacked reality including her own memories

https://tenor.com/view/bronya-bronie-haxxor-bunny-silver-wolf-honkai-impact-gif-25612837

[umbral vapor]

imo, losing your memories is basically the same as losing your life, and that's what happened, although i agree it's less of a point given that they're "the same person"

[glass jackal]

Rather than lack of wisdom, the end of the archon quest is about the lack of power. History rewrote itself to make rukh’ s achievements nahida’s and made it so nahida had fought against deshret and that her fight/sacrifice against him had turned her into a child. Technically it sounds the same as what we know, but there’s a nuance again.
The nuance being the presence of a shadow/predecessor

[umbral vapor]

i dont have a clear take on this tbh and still thinking about it

[glass jackal]

And yet they’re not tho. They’re two entities with a similar soul who were given different circumstances that developed them in different ways

I believe more in nurture vs nature XD

Although nature has a bit of influence too

[umbral vapor]

maybe

i find it hard to think about both perspectives given that we've only played in the version that no longer exists

[glass jackal]

Yea and she’s not the nahida we know anymore tbh

It’s interesting how nahida has lines about rukh before the archon quest but she doesn’t have any after the archon quest

[distant sentinel]

But its the same that Ei lived regarding her own backyard sacred sakura tree

[glass jackal]

Good attention to detail from hoyo

[clever gull]

Is it like that for all chars

Surely some others also had rukkhadevata lines

Thats pretty neat tho

[glass jackal]

Yea

[still iron]

Guys help me out a bit

The traveler is the 4th descender right?

Who's the 3rd then?

One of the Fauti? or Unknown?

[glass jackal]

We don’t know

[distant sentinel]

It could be Alice, or Aloy or someone else

[ashen canyon]

Still kinda scratching my head as to why they still call her lesser lord instead of greater lord even though everyone's memories of rukkha is erased including Nahida herself

[distant sentinel]

Because she smol, or rather that tree reality hacking cannot fix all plot holes i guess

Its like how do they know the date of the subzero's festival if she wasn't born 500 years ago

[ashen canyon]

I wonder if that(memory eraser)only applies to the people of Sumeru or to everyone(since we haven't seen other npc/archons commenting on this), except the descenders ofc

[glass jackal]

I believe it applies to everyone. Her existence was erased from all of teyvat

Was nahida from a branch of irminsul and rukh from the roots of irminsul?

I forgot what the reason was again for her erasure

[distant sentinel]

it shouldn't affect the abyss order though

[ashen canyon]

Yea she's from a branch but as for rukh, I'm not sure but as long as she is known, the forbidden knowledge also exist=the disease of collei and duny(I can't spell it mb)

It still baffles me that irminsul doesn't have any data for our mc but the kid who read our fate or something said that we have angered the gods or smth like I thought nobody knew us

[distant sentinel]

he reading fate was using the cat intelligence network

[umbral vapor]

i already finished archon quest

amogus

[ashen canyon]

It should've been the aranara quest first before the archon quest but they could've just fixed the issue depending if you have completed the archon quest or not

[umbral vapor]

they did for a lot of other details so they just missed this one

i hope so at least

[ashen canyon]

Most likely they didn't expect ppl to finish the archon quest first before playing the aranara quest

[umbral vapor]

i mean it's a pretty long quest line...

[ashen canyon]

Speedrun it

[umbral vapor]

crazy

[glass jackal]

Preserve it, the only time you’ll ever hear her name again

[umbral vapor]

real

[glass jackal]

I do love the sumeru quests so much. A solid 8.5/10 for me

They did a really good job tying everything together and pacing it

[umbral vapor]

fr

[ashen canyon]

It's still pretty funny to me for some reason till today that someone made a theory that eleazar(?) is what's turning people into hilichurls with the wraps and stuff

[umbral vapor]

no shot

[ashen canyon]

Still kinda salty they didn't make rukh an adult version model(same case with makoto) even though they're saving resources and other reasons

[silver hornet]

Have someone already recorded the differences in the Aranara quest if you do it after the archon quest?

[broken sluice]

amogus

[wet moth]

i am incredibly lazy can someone fully spoil me on what happens with the electro + dendro gnoses

[ashen canyon]

Gave it to dottore in exchange of "knowledge"

[ashen canyon]

Look at the recent aranara screenshot, basically they didn't expect ppl to finish the archon quest first before the aranara quest so they didn't have time to edit those like seriously that's a long ass quest to edit every single mention of rukh there

[stoic cypress]

i just finished the archon quest godamn

[broken sluice]

i did Act V a little over 4hrs

[stoic cypress]

i loved the new archon quest its the best out of them all

[glass jackal]

It was super solid

[stoic cypress]

fr im giving it a 10/10

[glass jackal]

It has some problems but much much better than inazuma, mondstadt or Liyue in terms of pacing and story telling

And for once the playable characters in sumeru felt like the heroes

It wasn’t just traveler doing everything alone

[broken sluice]

yeah it isnt very linear or predictable. its almost as if it had plot twist after plot twists

[rain quartz]

they misinterpreted the notes from the desert golem

[broken sluice]

electro gnosis = in exchange of dottore removing his all other segments (i presume Omega Build remains)
dendro gnosis = in exchange of Fatui intel about fake sky and Descenders (beings from outside teyvat)

[rain quartz]

with the ones of the hospital

[broken sluice]

yeah some of the symptoms were same, but not completely same to be considered Eleazar=hilichurl disease/curse

[rain quartz]

the symptoms arent even the same, unless people think that skin hardening into scales is the same as necrotic skin peeling off and forming ulcers

[dense tendon]

I started crying during sumeru archon quest

[broken sluice]

i only cried on Nahida Demo, and Rukkhadevata's farewell to Sumeru

[weary oriole]

since the gnosis are based on chess pieces

arent there 8?

[lusty crest]

there's 2 of the same type

[broken sluice]

as it was stated that It is implied that the Gnoses were rewarded to the gods who emerged victorious from the Archon War, consider it 7.

also the Gnosis is proof of an archon's status as one of The Seven

[rain quartz]

if you count only 1 piece of each with no duplicates it would be only 6 counting pawn

[broken sluice]

unless there is a case of like, pair Gnoses (pyro/hydro being same chess piece)

[lusty crest]

yeah there's probably a pair

also we didn't see the shape of the dendro gnosis

[broken sluice]

yeah, they could've been pair bishops

[lusty crest]

maybe the Dendro and Electro gnoses are a pair which would be implied by the fact that they got taken at the same time (both by dottorein the AQ)

[weary oriole]

I meant more like the ones on the top

[broken sluice]

pawns would be the Vision holders as they can be promoted to a higher rank

[weary oriole]

True

What would be the opposite of Geo then?

if pyro and hydro would be the same for example

Actually

I briefly thought there had to be an 8th god if we go to kaenriah for the waypoints and unlocking the map

but something like chasm and enkanomiya does just fine without that

[broken sluice]

the 8th god thing is an arrogation and unacceptable

[rain quartz]

well there could be an 8th one with the 8th element

probably after snezhnaya

[humble socket]

[ivory bluff]

Hmm

[uneven crater]

"Archon's strength derives from the level of control they exert over their respective region" my ass, no wonder we only heard that thing from him and not other Archons
Did Venti lie to us about his true power?

[snow lion]

both can be true.

they are very similar in concept. By being more present, people would have more faith in you. People in Mondstadt don't even really believe barbatos exists. compared to actual tangible entities like morax and raiden.

[weary oriole]

My dude, they praise him in almost every goddamn conversation. I’m pretty sure they definitely believe in his existence 100%. They just don’t know that he’s literally right there with them as Venti

Venti is probably the most worshipped god in Teyvat so far

[snow lion]

he's the most prayed to because his existence itself is questionable.

there's no actual tangible proof of his existence.

[outer hamlet]

my friend's first scara run:

[weary oriole]

But most people still have a ton of faith in him, so I don’t see your point as to why it would matter whether or not he’s a tangible being to them.

[uneven crater]

Venti is like Jesus, people praying to him even they never seen him
Mondstatds truly love Barbatos

[snow lion]

Really depends on the nuance of how the word is being used I guess. I'd still say both can be true.

[glass jackal]

I just can’t believe nahida told us the time to depart sumeru will come soon… I’m just sitting here going “bruh we just arrived”. We better be here for a lot longer

[snow lion]

a lack of presence can mean the faith is misplaced.

[dry gull]

its so weird that greater lord rukkedavata was wiped from existence but nahida is still called lesser lord kusanali or something

why is there a lesser if now there is nothing greater anymore

[snow lion]

that's just en translations.

[dry gull]

oh its only in the english

wtf

[glass jackal]

I don’t really like how convenient the whole erasing rukh is for the story :(
It felt like the easy way to resolve the political tensions in sumeru without diving further or making it too complicated

[uneven crater]

how about you asking the sages? huh why we want replace our God in the first place?
I am sure they're confuse as hell

[snow lion]

I mean, that really had nothing to do with resolving the political tensions

[dry gull]

lol what

[snow lion]

freeing kusa is what stopped the sages. erasing rukkha was solely for saving teyvat and irminsul.

[uneven crater]

cause they want Greater Lord back, but Greater Lord never exists
so you think they wouldn't confuse why they're doing all of this in the first place

[glass jackal]

I had a huge comment about this before, let me see if I can find it

[dry gull]

didnt they fire all those ppl before they took away their memories im confused what you are trying to say

[snow lion]

Well, the way they believe it all happened now is that Lesser Lord Kusanali pre-cataclysm and post-cataclysm are essentially 2 different people.

[glass jackal]

Okay here it is @snow lion

[glass jackal]

No they believe it’s one and the same now

There was no two dendro archons, there was only 1. That’s why towards the end, the characters are angry, because they can’t believe the sages would turn around and betray their god who had sacrificed herself for them

In essence it’s sort of true, but there’s also nuances..

[snow lion]

Yes, there was 1 archon, who basically sacrificed themselves, and became a different person after that sacrifice.

[glass jackal]

Except they believe that she is the same one, turned into a smaller version

[snow lion]

lost power, lost memories, lost everything.

[glass jackal]

To people of sumeru, post history rewriting, there was only 1 dendro archon

[snow lion]

yes

There was 1 dendro archon, who sacrificed themselves and lost all their power, memory and ability to ever be a powerful god of wisdom again

[glass jackal]

Yup

[snow lion]

essentially 2 different people

[glass jackal]

No

[snow lion]

not viewed in the same lens as pre-cataclysm

[glass jackal]

That’s the thing, post history rewrite, they are considered one and same. I.e the dendro archon (regardless of form and age) was nahida and was also the inventor of the akasha.

[snow lion]

I think you are

really missing my point

[glass jackal]

I think I am too 😵‍💫

[snow lion]

being called the same thing, being in the same body, yes. It is the same person. but their power and ability and the view in which they are held are so different pre and post cataclysm, that they may as well be considered 2 different people,.

[glass jackal]

That was true of the original pre-rewritten timeline. Rukh and nahida were treated as two different people and frankly they are.

But post history, I believe it was mended to appear that the same person was involved in both pre and post cataclysm. I.E nahida in the post did not have a shadow. There was no greater lord, it is only nahida.

So in the OG timeline even if she became an archon, her acceptance may not have been that easy, since people would still compare her to rukh.
In the post, there is no rukh, there is no shadow/predecessor to compare her to. People just know her as the dendro archon. Hope that makes sense as to where I’m coming from

[snow lion]

yes

again

if you lose your memories and everything that makes the current you you, people may start regarding you as a different person if you can no longer do the same things you could previously do.

[glass jackal]

Yea except remember the nuance that was there for timeline 1 with rukh. She was a fully fledged archon and kusanali was not a smaller version of her but considered as an entirely new one.

In the post timeline, people don’t consider her a new one, they consider her a smaller version of herself.
Basically in the post rewrite nahida had all the credits to Rukh’s achievements. Because people consider them one and the same.

If the world still remembered rukh, those achievements would have been attributed to rukh and not nahida. Anyways haha I’m done, I feel like we’re walking in circles

[snow lion]

rukkha was small pre-cataclysm tho

but yes. She gets rukkha achievements attributed to her. which is yeah. ofc.

I think it's early to say there's no ramifications of that and it was an easy and convenient solution

at the moment, sure. you can say it resolves everything very conveniently.

[glass jackal]

No they just showed her as smol cause they too lazy to make a pre-cataclysm model of her
It’s like how they turned makoto into glowing talking purple orb

[snow lion]

well no, the cutscene in act 4

told us

she became small

[glass jackal]

I thought that was just to imply that she was reborn

Cause if you pause it shows a seed and from the seed sprouting a new born

[snow lion]

no. there's centuries of time between when she did that and cataclysm

that's probably how sages were able to instantly recognise kusa as dendro archon, because they looked the same.

scarlet king stuff happened millenia ago

cataclysm was only 500 yrs

rukkha made herself small to cleanse sumeru of scarlet king blight. then cataclysm happened and it was same thing happening to irminsul, and that's when she basically died and had to create kusa.

[glass jackal]

Hmm idk about the timelines tbh, technically the sages could have recognized her because the white hair and green eyes, elf ears and leaves sprouting from her ears could have been a pretty good indicator

[snow lion]

so time between scarlet king and cataclysm is when rukkha was small archon

[glass jackal]

Interesting 🤔

[uneven crater]

nah I don't think so, Rukk become small after she helped king deshret thousand years ago
she still small during cataclysm 500 years ago

[glass jackal]

That could have been it

Wait if she became smaller because she used up her powers, then likely pre-cataclysm rukh also had memory loss.. so why didn’t the sages turn on her then

[snow lion]

I did laugh at that because of how so many people were like "yeah act 4 wasn't that great because it was so predictable that rukkha and kusa were the same person" and then they're all wrong. can't wait to see them go "oh actually what I meant was it was so predictable that she was a clone"

[uneven crater]

you could treat Nahida as Rukk's clone, kinda like that, but both of them are completely different

[snow lion]

well kusa doesn't really have memory loss, she's a different branch of rukkha.

[glass jackal]

No tbh, I didn’t see it coming XD they really kept pushing the whole moon and sun concept, I genuinely believed they were two different people

[snow lion]

yeah.

[glass jackal]

If that’s the case then why does rukh need to be erased but nahida didn’t need to be? Aren’t they from the same tree?

[snow lion]

rukkha was corrupted

kusa was created pure

think of rukkha as a tree. the roots were corrupted, but the branches weren't corrupted yet. so rukkha cut off a branch, and that branch is kusa. the branch has to grow into its own tree.

so they are technically part of the same tree, but they are different.

[uneven crater]

this is Ender Lilies all over again 😄

[glass jackal]

That’s a good analogy

I think a lot of us misunderstood then

Mostly cause the timelines are so confusing

I thought of nahida as a reincarnation of rukh but that this happened after king deshret

[snow lion]

Yeah, the timelines were always messed up. A lot of people believed scarlet king stuff was cataclysm stuff, but those events are so far apart.

[glass jackal]

And I thought the deshret incident happened during the cataclysm

So for me the 500 years for nahida checked that assumption XD

[snow lion]

Like I was very confused end of act 4 because I knew scarlet king stuff was thousands of years ago, and I just thought that scarlet king sacrificed himself the get rid of the corruption, and then during cataclysm rukkha sacrificed herself to get rid the scarlet king one again. but then it didn't make sense how the one of SK sages knew that

[glass jackal]

I don’t even know how casual lore followers will follow along with this XD

[snow lion]

From what I've seen, there's just a lot of people who think they know what is happening, but they don't, and they just kinda convince themselves what they thought was right. kinda like that bit with Alhaitham and that scholar when we go into the Akademiya.

[glass jackal]

Tbf the timelines in Genshin are really messed up

Like the recent event we did mondstat where would that even fall in the timeline

I miss klementime https://youtube.com/c/KlemenTime

Dude made lore so much easier to understand ;-;

[snow lion]

tbh, before 3.2 I saw a video that basically got the whole relationship with rukkha and kusa right. was pretty wild how accurate it was.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTiSrmAHucE

[uneven crater]

https://youtu.be/LgJm0BbzQvs
Sumeru's Archon quest are somewhat similar to Ender Lilies, specially about Nahida and Rukk relationship

[wild nexus]

I never understood this. Was there ever a scene where he actually did this? At the time I thought it was the irminsul but I guess I was wrong.

[ocean fjord]

Yeah I was totally expecting him or traveller to burn irminsul

[jovial blaze]

I mean technically it did

[wild nexus]

I’ll never understand that scene. 😭

[jovial blaze]

It just didn't get burned but forgotten

That or the doc or someone will come back and burn it

[edgy geyser]

this is really sad

[wild nexus]

Probably, because there’s not a scene about him burning any specific “tree” in the archon quest.

And if they forget that scene that just forgets everything that collei foresaw.

[jovial blaze]

I keep hearing this story quest was better the inzuma

And I am like what did inzuma do wrong

[wild nexus]

I really like how they changed her idle animations at the end of the archon quest symbolizing her freedom.

[wild nexus]

Inazuma was great but I think people liked this one since it was longer.

[buoyant lily]

WAIT GUYS WTF

so scaramouche isn't a weekly boss? 😭

o wait nvm i'm an idiot

[raw basalt]

why rana was trapped the whole time during aranyaka quest? is it because her name is related to the aranaras?

[slate agate]

Wait what??

[ashen canyon]

Iirc she was affected by the withering(or along those lines) but before that, she was telling us her stories about the aranaras and finally, arama(?) saved her thus starting the whole quest

[wild nexus]

Before the archon quest nahida had the idle animation of the people of sumeru holding hands in harmony. After the archon quest it changes.

[slate agate]

Do you have a vid of it?

[ashen canyon]

Wait I thought this was already in the leaks even before the archon quest(the idle with the bird and ppl holding hands, not her idle being changed)🤔

[rigid kraken]

im pretty sure it switches between those two!

[ashen canyon]

Yea that

[wild nexus]

Ah I see, it’s still pretty cool!

[hallow path]

motherfucker pulled a peter parker at the end of NWH

[ashen canyon]

Man, if they can make those intense wisdom/witty moments in Sumeru arc, I'm hoping they can make like justice/lawyer pretty enjoyable in Fontaine

[hallow path]

better call saul

[ashen canyon]

With the fake justices and all that

[halcyon sigil]

does anyone know what the text says that Nahida shows to the doctor?

[slate agate]

Nahida didnt show anything to the doctor

[snow lion]

they're referring to the scene where there's a bunch of teyvat text on screen, right after she tells him to delete his clones.

[slate agate]

Yea. I thought that was just the other doctor clones scolding that doctor for killing them all.

[snow lion]

yeah, but the text is untranslated.

[magic root]

😭 bro told me to go closer

[bold pine]

Lol

I think u need to go back to the room

What quest is this

[weary oriole]

following Dottore

[half fable]

Dottore sussy

[stoic cypress]

there are some parts where i didnt understand what ws goining on in the quest

[bold pine]

U should go on the road n then it will tell u to go to a place n watch them n then u will have to go to a room or something like that

[lusty crest]

First Sage of Buer

[dense tendon]

Guys i kept crying

Because of the archon quest

Anyone with me

[slate agate]

https://tenor.com/view/nice-nooice-bling-key-and-peele-gif-4294979

[sinful summit]

https://tenor.com/view/gif-27046454

please embed

[true galleon]

i was hoping they’d reveal it

[broken sluice]

does this sequence already happened in the archon quest? akademiya disappearing

[finite finch]

yea Im pretty sure it's on the 2nd act of the sumeru archon quest

||when the dream kinda ends everything else goes||

[finite finch]

||so it just a dream not the actual akademiya||

srry I don't know if I should put spoiler on them or not

[weary oriole]

has it been mentioned whats rukadevata's archon name ?

[broken sluice]

alright it was when nilou's dance of sabzerus

[finite finch]

yea

[lusty crest]

Most likely the same as Nahida's, so Buer

[weary oriole]

then nahida would also be name rukadevata

her name is still lesser lord kusanali

[finite finch]

no I think they just share the same demon name

they aren't the same yet they are if you know what I mean

[broken sluice]

its Buer as how Zhongli, Venti, and Ei remember Rukkhadevata

[weary oriole]

rukadevata addresses her as buer soo thatd be weird no ?

their relation is like if a human used stem cell research to have a child on their own

[lusty crest]

Rukkhadevata is a Sanskrit based name. Canonically, that name was probably given to her by either her people or herself. Archon names are based on the Ars Goetia so Rukkhadevata's Archon name can't be Rukkhadevata

[weary oriole]

pretty sure she got a different name altho just not mentioned

[lusty crest]

Why would they have a different name if they're mostly the same person

Kusanali is a fragment of Rukkhadevata

So it's safe to assume that they have the same Archon name

[weary oriole]

nah, man, they not the same person, ruka specifically mentioned that in the last part

[lusty crest]

Rukkhadevata said that Kusanali is a branch of her

She's a fragment from herself

[weary oriole]

they're not, but they're also the same at the same time. rukkha and kusa are the same person "genetically" but a different person in terms of personality and experiences

[lusty crest]

Yes

[weary oriole]

[finite finch]

like in a different fate which was said I'm pretty sure

[minor saddle]

Like dottore and his segment

[weary oriole]

they have different given names by the ppl bc the ppl saw them as different ppl

[broken sluice]

nahida is just a rukkha on a restart

[weary oriole]

who assign their demon names tho, celestia ?

[lusty crest]

It's unknown

Could be themselves, tho I highly doubt it

[broken sluice]

thats just how the story goes

[weary oriole]

could be that they were just born with demon names. could be assigned by celestia (which is super sus. why assign a demon name to your gods?)

no one rlly knows

[lusty crest]

Maybe Archon names aren't actually assigned at birth

[weary oriole]

wait what about mikoto and ei , who's who again ? beelzebub

baal is makoto

whats the other one

beelzebub is ei

ohh baal

[lusty crest]

Beelzebul is Ei
Baal is Makoto

[weary oriole]

wait holdon

ppl just use baal w ei cuz it's easier

the banner says its baal

[lusty crest]

Cause the Raiden Shogun is called Baal by the people

[weary oriole]

are we pulling for the dead archon ? or the shogun puppet ?

both

ohh makes sense

we are pulling for the shogun puppet, who is possessed by ei

would spoil the story if the banner is named beelzebub

prty much

[weary oriole]

this also

[lusty crest]

Raiden Shogun is viewed as Makoto by the people and Ei is the same. Inazuma people aren't aware of the twin thing except for that old servant we encounter in Raiden Act 2

[weary oriole]

the inazumans don't know that their archon is a different person

[lusty crest]

Yeah

[weary oriole]

all they know is that the shogun is the shogun, and the shogun is eternal

they can't fathom that their original archon actually died in the cataclysm 500 years ago

ei withheld this info from the ppl for...reasons

we getting closed and closer on getting the full picture

but probably wont get the whole thing until the final chapter

talkin about the archon war

i mean cataclysm

[finite finch]

yea probs around the last chapter of maybe natlan since it's the nation of war

[weary oriole]

shiet, khariyahevent

[lusty crest]

I thought of smth. If a god dying creates chaos (like Havria in Zhongli's Story Quest Act 1), then wouldn't Makoto (and maybe Rukkhadevata but her death is weird) create some hazards too ? Maybe it happened in Kaenri'ah, but we see Ei embracing her body so we don't know a thing

[weary oriole]

entirely possible that some other ppl did know abt the twin thing, not that hard to see that ei is the more reserved twin. but whoever did know alr died 500 years ago so it doesn't matter lol

[lusty crest]

Yeah it's possible

[weary oriole]

the twins are supposedly "the purest form of lightning" so makoto dying in khaen'riah where the war is...

rip field tillers,,, i forgot the name

havria god of salt, salt bombs everyone in her vicinity. what would that mean for makoto?

[lusty crest]

Well if she were to do the same thing Havria did, then Kaenri'ah (at least what was left of it) would be under some severe lightning

[lusty crest]

IEM bomb

No field tillers

No robots

No nothing

[weary oriole]

does it matter ? wasnt khanriyah literary deleted from existence ?

would be nice if we get to khaen'riah and the place where makoto died is just tsurumi

tsurumi during the red phase

when it was reliving the day ruu died

[lusty crest]

It's physically still there. Just in ruins lol

[weary oriole]

or maybe thats how khanriyah got deleted in the first place, makoto dying causing a nuke bomb electro explosion 🤔

[lusty crest]

That was the Thunderbird's doing but yeah Makoto could be the same

[weary oriole]

yeah

i'd like that but worse

and it's like

[lusty crest]

Kanna Kapatcir

[weary oriole]

permanent

look, havria's salt still lives thousands of years later

[lusty crest]

I don't wanna spend my time dodging lighting in Kaenri'ah

[weary oriole]

it'll be fun

[lusty crest]

Lmao

Originally I thought there was going to be a heat bar in the Great Red Desert

And a sand slowing you down mechanic too

[weary oriole]

btw i just gotta check, lore wise

the travelers are the third out of this world travelers that set foot in teyvat ?

[weary oriole]

there's a mechanic where some places are like...chameleoned

i forgot the term

basically sand illusions

[weary oriole]

if we go by unreliable fatui intel

[lusty crest]

The 4th

[weary oriole]

thats been documented

[lusty crest]

Traveler is the 4th and Asmoday is the 1st

That's what Nahida said

[weary oriole]

first was the one that fought the primordial ones, second was the one who fell inlove with the seelie princess ? not sure, whos the 3rd one ?

[weary oriole]

which, if we're going with what we know from enka, is false

[weary oriole]

alice(?)

second is second who came

ohh i forgot about the second

the one who failed

or the one who tried to challenge

celestia ?

1st: Primordial One
2nd: Second Who Came
3rd: ???traveler from afar who married the seelie ancestor???
4th: ???heavenly principles and sustainer???
5th: Alice???
6th: the twins???

wait, how did you guys learn of the name of the first one ?

[weary oriole]

primordial one

[weary oriole]

enka lore

[finite finch]

the first decenders was the heavenly principals which nahida told us

[weary oriole]

arent the heavenly sustainer an entity from celestia ?

[weary oriole]

that's nahida's theory

[lusty crest]

Nahida is really vague on the first. Because a little bit before, addressing us as the 4th, she qualifies The Sustainer of Heavenly Principles (the woman we fight at the beginning) as the Heavenly Principles. I just call her Asmoday. Problem is, Celestia is also the Heavenly Principles. And so could be the Primordial One. So according to her Asmoday is the 1st, which is weird cause there's a whole lot of other entities that came before her for sure

[weary oriole]

and is also based on fatui intel

Asmoday, in my understanding, is more like Celestia's police

wait it looks like theres more lore in the game, i havent finished the archon quest completely

brb , lemme finish the afterevents

[lusty crest]

Phanes is theorized to be the Primordial One, it's Enka lore

[weary oriole]

she's the Sustainer of Heavenly Principles, but not the Heavenly Principles herself

[lusty crest]

Yes but then why would Nahida mention her

Specifically her

[weary oriole]

it's her theory, and i don't think she says sustainer???