#・lore-basement
1 messages · Page 51 of 1
shame that whole him with Capitano thing didn't develop much
I hated Mavuika in the story but when I saw her kit I hated her even more and she was mt first archon skip
Ahh I remember my old theory that Capitano was an Abyss mimic and was going to be named Nyarlethotep
When I'm glad people warmed up to her. Because all I rememeber were people saying how she was a f##ish character and that I made a comment on reddit about how she was my favorite Natlan design and was downvoted to hell
She's still is my favorite Natlan desihn, and is my favorite character in general...
The good ol days
Meanwhile there was me with my Murata theory
Ineffa is better 
No for fucking real
People were saying the part in her teaser where they showed her stomach while she was eating was a f##ish and I'm like what?????????????????????????????????
She is the one piece I'm missing from having the perfect Flins team
I gave up on it after 5.3 so it's in the trash bin
I have Mavuika
I haven't built her and I refuse to until Capitano comes back 
Sometimes I throw her off a cliff
She's rerunning alongside Lohen right
I was too stupid to figure out how to work it though still
Why does the Herra have to start in its charge mode when there's no fucking energy 😭
If that's the case there's a chance I'll get her since I'll pull for Prune
I'm gonna make a torture chamber in my teapot for her if that happens
I heard someone call it "an organ f*tish" which even I disagree with 😭
Atp they are self reporting because how do you come up with that
Oh
Didn't know that
That's good then, I won't have to wait for her
Honestly I think Lauma's design is better-
I don't like Lauma's design
I don't know why
I like her Centaur form though
Yeah that part is cool
Closest thing to a fully inhuman character we can play
I mean she has an excuse to wear skimpy clothes 
Going off the mythology of her name
Or Durin's.....
Man people were mad at that lol
Her heart eyes freak me out at times
Natlan fucking monolopized travel mechanics
*Silly little guys
Linnea's biological dad design reveal:
Bro they look like jellyfish
So like
Why is it that in lore the faes swap their children or whatever
Linnea's parents did it because they have a curse that causes them to see their entire lives ahead of them when they're near each other and since its fate it can't be changed
Also the kid they replaced had an illness
So they helped cure that
It's both a power and a curse
Yes
Linnea's species is special
They're called Aubrey birds
Only like 8 of them left in existence
Flins is probably the last of his kind too
Nah
And old men fae
Same here
Yeah but a lot of fae have fire connections for all we know
Wrong message replied to
Yeah most likely
The Fatui are the pale flame
Though you told me that's a mistranslation?
When is Flins called an azure flame
Hm
I doubt Flins will be important in Snezhnaya
Though
They have something to do with the after life
Which could be useful for manipulating Ley Lines
We don't know much about his noble house
And have ghosts following them
He had to have parents bruv
He's only 6-700 years old
Which is young for Genshin immortals 
He says it himself
Possibly something to do with Koitar and Seutervoinen
@odd thicket so based on re reading stuff I think there is no breaking of cycle at all
It's just the 4 samsara cycle were transitional period
Cataclysm basically started the 4th phase (not breaking any cycle) as the Ordo believed they were living in the first half of 4th cycle they called "Khraun-Arya"
Yeah I also got headcanon mixed up mb
Yeah but i think 4th cycle began with cataclysm which is why Ordo says they are living in it
Actually now that I think about it I already had this theory before
First cycle started with end of dragons age with PO's war
2nd started with Nibelung starting war
3rd started with archon war
And 4th started with cataclysm
Don't know why I thought 4th cycle broke 
Yeah
I don't think it did apart from ruins of course
If it had abyss twin wouldn't be looking for reviving khanerriah no?
Yeah that's different then
I thought the kingdom itself which we see in Rerir past survived..
Civilization still lives you could say
Actually every cycle had descender interfere directly even except for 3rd where they were catalyst themselves
Aka gnosis
Also I found an interesting comment saying we now know more about celestial era war than archon war
Which I admit is very 
PO surviving like cockroach evey time and using other descender will for their own benefit 
So basically what you're saying is Istaroth saved traveler from becoming another gadget by PO 
In Orphic cosmogony,
Ananke is the primordial goddess of necessity, compulsion, and inevitable fate.
Chronos (Khronos) is the primordial, unaging god of time, emerging self-formed at the dawn of creation as a serpentine being with heads of a man, bull, and lion.
Phanes is the primordial deity of procreation, light, and creation, born from the cosmic world-egg.
In Orphic tradition, Chronos (Time) created a silver egg, which was then warmed and nurtured by a serpent (Ananke).
Time created egg nurtured by fate led to birth of phanes 
Probably lots of different myths are there can't be sure which specifically hoyo took inspiration from
But general theme is there
Phanes was birthed from egg that was created by time because of necessity (fate)
It might just be one giant self closing loop ngl
Abyss destroying the cosmos
So cosmos out of necessity created a world aka teyvat that could survive through time
But all that would lead to Nibleung who was born alongside this new world
Probably not correct theory nvm
unless the modern fate system was modelled after that and just like nibelung was born alongside teyvat
Phanes was birthed alongside the new fate...
I always knew Istaroth was the goat
Hmm that could explain the dream
But I doubt it simply because I dont think angel have "god remains"
Is her body not in the Eternal Oasis ?
Nicole's trailer tells us that angels had to give up either power or wisdom as punishment
Most of the selees we see are those who chose former and gave up the latter
Nicole didn't give up either but instead lost her voice which is what she says is loophole
Now I ask what did Nabu, Sybilla and Yohul chose? What was their loophole?
Zibai we can say was saved by Istaroth but what about others....
Yohul is her form? Because she is messy
Yohul maybe Ronova got involved..
And I'm asking how?
Zibai we know Istaroth helped she was after all an agent sent by celestia anyway
What of others?
Yohul I can see made a deal with Ronova
Azur light only tells of prophetic future not that first angel actually did something
So not convinced there
And with zibai we already saw first angel had nothing to do with her
I feel like because they were the special angel which is how they cheat the curse
Yohul with leyline maintenance, sybilla protect the irminsul which nicole later take the responsibility ?
Zibai and to some extend Yohul I can see shades being involved but Nabu and Sybilla are mystery to how they retained both wisdom and their power...
She didn't we have the cutscene of what happened Istaroth was involved not first angel
Yes to rebel nothing says she saved them from upcoming punishment
She couldn't even protect herself you want me to believe she protected others?
And again nothing shows she did
Zibai already proves she didn't do anything in her saving it was Istaroth
Same with Yohul I'll believe since she made a deal with her to establish night kingdom
Maybe sybilla did something similar with Naberius...
Which still leaves Nabu as a mystery
What does this prove? Nothing
We can even see Nicole standing after war in latest trailer
They were given a choice to either chose wisdom or power that was the punishment
Most chose their power but lost wisdom and that's how they became selee
I'm asking the ones who did survive with both how did they do that... Nothing to do with first angel because by that time she was already in prison
Doesn't matter the choice was still there they somehow found a loophole like Nicole did or some other event happened like in case of zibai
I'm just thinking what could that be for Nabu, Sybilla and Yohul...
Yes they didn't
Yohul I can see gave up her visage in exchange for retaining both wisdom and power
Zibai well the loophole was basically splitting her souls into 3 and sealing them inside her 3 impurities
Sybilla and Nabu still don't know what they gave up or how they survived...
Maybe next update we see Nabu past hopefully
She was an angel that much we know
Like I don't think there's any other mention
Also angel is not really a post it's their existence itself
Like saying human is a post doesn't make sense...
They were born an angel
Yeah and human mavuika became god doesn't mean human is a post 
You can't change it any time
It's not the same as saying moon envoy for example which is a post now
Human God angel it's all name for species itself
King archon moon envoy these are post
Nicole is an exception of her race
Just like Mav/other pyro archons is for humans
Yeah
Also neuv made all oceanid in his realm humans
But again it takes exceptional powers to do so he's sovereign after all
Naberius even got punished for doing the same 
Well we are getting voyager and first angel either way with snezhnaya
Even 3rd descender I'd say
Who?
Ah right it was egeria not Naberius
whats the implication here?
I see
Tho tbf, dottore's is more a lack of empathy, understanding and willingness to change on his part
Durin (simulanka) scares people away, but he was able to calm down and accept the help of us plus friends (Wanderer, navia, etc) to show others that he doesnt purposefully intend tk hurt others
Dottore is shown multiple times that others can change but he himself cannot (or rather will not, due to reasons like how he sees the world logically or bc of his own ego) and it will be his downfall if he doesnt accept that truth first
Dottore wanted a descenders aid too
He just didnt realize that we're not morally apathetic to our friends and people of teyvat as he is
The dude literally offered us the ability to kill and genocide everyone we didnt like cmon bro
empathetic????
fuck no
If he were empathetic he wouldnt have ruined scaramouche's life back in inazuma, for starters
Even if pierro gave him orders too
I will say he does have some sort of emotions tho if he desired a family
Like how he saw columbina as a sister
But hes never fully understood
That was an offer
He was offering us power beyond measure to become a god
As long as we went with him
OF course we said no and he kept trying and asking and asking again
Fatui are given task in each region but what they do how they do and what agenda they have of their own is their own making
Pierro didn't order him to do what he did...he just did it himself 
well that certainly doesnt help his case if he chose that method of making scaramouche into what he is now
it was cruel
Even that is twisted and columbina saw through
He was just luring her into his own experiment
Pretty much
It's the same way how he was luring traveler
Yea and we dont want that of course
Not at the expense of KILLING PEOPLE
We even reflected and mentioned Rerir
It stopped being a test the second we stabbed him in the back with our sword
He lunges at us with a roar
And then imprisons us in his little cube before scara saved us
At that point negotiations or whatever were off the table we clearly were not going to go with him
Even if he made reasonable points, the way hes going about it is not our way
we beat his ass
it stopped being a test long before that
And we took none of that
For good reason
its always experiments with this mfer
The fact of the matter is that his ego will be his own downfall and if he doesnt bother to change, then theres no salvation for him
His fate is his own and no higher greater entity is in charge of his fate as people may think it may be
Bro don't blame your character on fate that's not how this works 
Despite whatever trauma or obstacles he faced in the past he still took those actions he did today
The whole point of Nod krai antagonists facing off against us was to show them the truth and make them confront themselves
well I said my piece already if were not gonna get anywhere with discussion then I might as well just leave it at that
rerir reflected and was willing (and did!) change
dottore did not
Not for the sake of others
yea bc any family and home he could've made
he DESTROYED
He destroyed the lives of the inazumans with scara when he was falsely living among them
He could have made friends with the other Harbingers besides like maybe pantalone but he doesnt
Idk if sumeru had any salvation for him but there could've been something
you keep blaming fate as if its this big puppetmaster entity controlling everything and purposefully making his life worse
that is not it bro 😭
his actions made him who he is now
Its fine to blame him yknow
Same way rerirs actions made him the sinner he is now
Ain't defending that but I see why he did what he did
Same with dottore
Its all about what they do next
RERIR DID NOT BREAK FREE FROM FATE LMAO
He is stuck in the moons reflection unable to escape or do literally anything and hes not reunited with Tholindis
Dottore is the guy who could foresee back in 2000 that covid pandemic would wipe out a lot of people in 20 years and then say if that's fate might as well commit crimes before that happens 
Ved's words in his drip market say it clearly - his obsession shakes the laws of the world, not break it
Hes yet to even transcend to the power that someone like surtalogi has
ved breaking the false sky???????
when did he do that
Now we get into theorizing because id argue Ved has not broken from his fate
Even if he sees through all of time and is stuck at the end or wherever
His manipulation is widespreading, but limited to whispers and taking advantage of people at their lowest
He lamented himself to rerir that even tho he sees the future he cannot change it and thats what makes him despair at times
Who knows what he sees
But we see in Linneas story how that end can be circumvented
Just like with Fontaine and the prophecy
Just like with celaeno and Linneas match
Okay so whats the point ur making here
Because of our influence we helped people's lives be better
Its not about the destination its the journey to it that changes them
Is that not more important than the pre-determined ending?
We've been shown many kinds of stories throughout genshin
Joyful ones, tragic ones
Its not about the end but its how it was achieved that made it matter
And we carry those experiences on our journey as a traveler
Someone so obsessed with fate and not potentially having hope
May as well not just do anything at all
Lmao id argue he doesnt really care much about the fate of others unless that person mattered to him for whatever reason
But what do i know about dottore
Dudes ego makes it hard to get him to understand others anyway
Anyways 6.6 is gonna culminate in how we not only deal with him but how he deals with himself anyway
Looking forward to what kind of ending he gets, if any at all
Hehe
Mhmmmmmm
Sureeeeeee
That or total ego death im okay as long as he can eat shit for a bit and realize he fucked up
Otherwise
No point in caring about him
Im done with him anyway
Morning chat
I'd imagine so?
I mean Chlothar was able to die so
Not sure
I'm not caught up with sinner stuff
We don't even know any details oh how he did that even
It was too vague
I assumed Chlothar figured out how to do it himself
It's the immortality curse preventing them from going in
If the curse is gone, no more getting blocked
Probably reincarnated by now
Capitano is the current ruler of the Night Kingdom
Well, co-ruler
He reincarnated as Kaeya

Yeah
NK works differently though
Ley Lines = reincarnation
NK = actual afterlife
Primordial Sea is also reincarnation
It figuratively does through the Ancient Names
Yeah
I did the whole nodkrai archon quest line without visiting half the map (the northern part) because it wasn't necessary, so now the Favonius Keep ppl have different dialogue...aside from different dialogue what else did I miss out on? Was Cardinal Seamus there?

Would be cool if we got to see it when we go to Hyperborea
We don't know that do we?
We literally see a painting of Voyager and Koitar in the teaser though
What's the quote
Maybe she was in the Nod-Krai part of Hyperborea not the main part of Hyperborea
Also she mentions a new ancient civilization we haven't heard about before
In some of the new marketing
Here
She mentions a "Patra"
I can't tell if that's his name or if it got cut off
Yeah someone else said that
Could be in the south of Sumeru's deserts
That was always Rukkhadevata's
My guess is it was Thoth's civilization
Since Zibai had Lang-Gan he should have had something too
Since he was also an envoy
It would be a desert now though
What even is he?
Yeah but non Angels gods are kind of mysterious still
They just popped up after a while and nobody knows where
He could have a demon name we don't know yet
Egeria too
They don't necessarily have to add up
I doubt it but it's possible
Decarabien may have been a moon worshiper though
So I guess it is fairly likely
I don't remember that
His tower kind of looks like an astrology tower
We still don't know what it is in his basement btw
Or Dvalin's boss arena
That place is still weird
Dvalin casts a domain expansion and we never see it again
Early installment syndrome 
Also the Abyss moon inside it is weird
Zhiqiong may have gotten trapped in it
Could it be part of the Moon Palace somehow?
Idk
Some broken off part of it
It has a moon in it though
I think it stretches beyond Teyvat itself
Not Irminsul
I think it's where Saarelainen was "reborn" as a descender too
It stretches upwards though
I forget what the line is but the implication is that it's outside Teyvat
Yes but inversion bullshit
Rumor has it that people who've ascended to Celestia have also witnessed the same helix-shaped divine ladder that can be seen within Visions. Venturing out into the universe and down into the abyss are the same in that both are braving the dark unknown
So "ascending" is the same as "descending" for the Abyss
We see the heart of Irminsul in the AQs though
And that's a realm beyond Teyvat
No Belyi
It was Belyi
The Tsar is the only one called "snow king"
Who?
It only says a traveler and a spirit of frost helped him
He had a Moon Wheel he gave to Flins
Cause he was black mailed
No
He isn't called a king
I believe so
No
Jack Frost aren't hunanoid
No
Just realized Kukulkan probably did this
Doubt it
Don't think so
Yeah I checked Hymns again and she isn't
We see what they look like in Linnea's flashback
They're blue blobs
No but Lumi wears a cardboard box with a normal jack frost drawn on
Here
No they don't
Does this mean Chongyun is a fae cause he's blue
This is what Snegurochka fae look like
How do you mix that up 😭
White people am I right?
Freakscender
Tsaritsa statue shares cultural inspiration from Snegurochka irl
She even got the wand
Idk
A bunch of monarchs use those
But yeah
Could it be Tsurimi Island?? I fucking hope so
God fucking damn it I can never win can I
Well, maybe all that means is that my theory on Tsurumi Island's civilization being important might be true
I just think it's odd that it's the only nailed civilization that we know quite frankly nothing about
You mean the Boatman?
Where is it said that Kapactir is related to Ronova
I know that she mentions that there was a "she" that gave her a name originally, but there's no confirmation that it's Ronova, we still don't know who it is
Eh
Well it's not 100% confirmed still though I get what you mean
I personally don't think the "she" is Ronova
I would prefer if it was someone from that civilization...
Wdym by Khia?
Wtf
Well ok
I had a prediction is that maybe the she in question is who the omnipresent god statue is meant to represent
Speaking of which
I found out a few days ago that if you have Columbina and you have welkin, it changes like, the icon thing?
Like, when you log in and you get the welkin moon blessing, you get Columbina instead of that random lady
Which makes me wonder who the fuck she was
Because she is very similar to the Omnipresent God statue
I'm probably overthinking it but that's what I like to do
I mean, the lady in question also didn't look like any of the moon sisters as well
4th moon sister? Imagine
Well, we do know that there was an attempt at making a 4th moon
But it failed
And I also have another like, weir observation about Canon that I wanted to mention while we are at it
When the war arc begins...
You'll see 
No
This is how Canon's moon is represented in murals
Oh why
Oh
Uhm
Well what I wanted to say is that
It looks like the sun is behind the frost moon?
Yeah that
Canon's moon or whatever
Canon is frost moon not eternal
Ehhh
Is that like too important
My point is, why is the frost moon/eternal canon's moon or whatever in front of the sun
I don't fucking know
All I know is that the two murals I showed represents Canon's moon, and Canon's moon is the one in front of the sun
And I'm just wondering if that can somehow be important
That and because of what I was talking about earlier regarding the welkin moon lady
Sun could be representation of PO and we know frost moon was not destroyed by him
Could it be the representation of this fact then?
In the presence of sun(PO) we see frost moon
Maybe, that's an interesting thought
But as always when it comes to the sun my mind immediately goes to Natlan
Mysterious welkin moon lady looks very similar to the statue of the Omnipresent God
Statue of the Omnipresent God has the Homa/Ronova wings
We see those wings a lot in Natlan, especifically in the Masters of the Night-Wind tribe, which is the Cryo tribe
There could be a connection there but I am mostly spit balling
You are misreading which one is which
Canon
The waves below are clouds
You see the stars in the sky
And then the moon
Maybe it's just that...
Also the spikes with the circle behind are also present behind canon so I wonder if that even is the sun..
Uh no
Yes, that's what I'm saying about the spikes, the spikes are the sun is what I mean
I'm saying that Canon's moon is like, connected to the sun
Tbh this could be it
You can see there's no open cut on the moon here
While with canon you can see the open cut on top
But there are two other moons represented in the Tsurumi Island murals
So that one has to be Canon only
Second one look like iridescent you see something falling out likely abyss
Yes
Ok you know what, the natlan mural is the best way to explain it
Middle one with the sun behind it is canon
That's what I'm trying to say
The one on the left doesn't look like Sonnet's or Aria's moon when you compare it to the Natlan murals, like it doesn't have the "melting" part (which is likely more related to Sonnet but in the Natlan mural Aria's moon is also melting) and it also doesn't have like, those curved lines inside it
But like maybe the devs just forgot idk, I just wanted to make that observation
Yes, that's whay I'm saying
What did you think I was referring to???
The large one in the middle...
What about it
I'm saying that's Canon's moon
But there's already 3 above
What?
y'all are agreeing but misunderstanding each other
Jen is talking about the one in the top
That's what I thought you were talking about
being canon's
No
I'm talking about the blue one being canon's
Yeah that's canon
Blue being distinct while other two are white
Probably another representation that she's the one that still survives in the sky
But then...All 3 looks to have something behind
So there's a bigger golden circle and inside you see blue/white circle
If golden Circle behind canon represent sun wouldn't that go for other two as well?
Actually there's black circle as well in between for all 3
I don't think like the white/blue circle really means anything
We only really see it in that mural
I think 4 is supposed to be the tonatiuh
Because the Tonatiuh was like an anchor for the moons?
And well we can see in the mural the moons being anchored to it
That's...reasonable yeah
But wasn't it built by pyro sovereign...am I remembering wrong?
Nvm got it wrong I was thinking of something else
Yeah looks like it but this was build by och kan
Wait he modified it
Yeah this is it then well got too far ahead again 
Yeah that
I'm not caught up with Dragon lore but you get what I meant
I just never paid attention to that part of Natlan's lore to begin with
I was only interested in (and still am) learning about the Munatlans
I saw someone say somewhere that the whole story of the dragons is basically a mirror to how natives have been pushed out and nearly eradicated by colonists and I thought that was a cool angle with their story
Like it never even crossed my mind
Yeah, that's something I find interesting as well
And that's something I feel like, could also tie in to the Mu-Natlans as well
Like the fact that their history got pretty much erased idk
I mean
Could be a metaphor for forceful assimilation
They felt thats what they had to do to survive
Idk
I don't like the moon sisters
Yeah, Tenoch is very interesting to me
It works they weren't some evil who did it for evil sake
They were weak and it showed in their judgement
The sympathy comes from realizing that their moment of weakness is relatable
I was referring to the Moon Sisters but yeah it works for the Mu-Natlans too
Not like they could do anything that was their weakness yeah
For moon sisters the new visitor wasn't really the problem but abyss
Their lack of judgment costed them but at the moment they really thought the new visitor would cooperate
Rerir???
Well that happens
The new guy didn't turn out to be the good guy so obviously the blame would shift to them only
But then again not like dragons were any less arrogant 
Yeah I know who the guy is obviously I mean how does his story tie into colonialism or whatever
Seeing how they treated humans I don't think so 
Same shit anyway
If it wasn't for kukulkan who hated his own race more than humans they would still been hunted down 
Yeah that's like saying humanity time is over once aliens arrive and you start siding with them
Not cool 
Yeee
Yeah
Literally just going out of their way to eradicate a civilization because they were deemed dangerous and were forcefully erased from the world to better your own civilization in their place
Not the fault of humans
These dragons couldn't do shit against PO so they vented their frustration on humans
Same shit as people venting on immigrants instead of their government (sorry for being political)
Done by PO not humans
Government brings immigrants too to settle
Fault is with system not people
That's the thing for most of the humans they too have lived for 6k years now you can't just ask them to leave
It's their home now as well
And hoyo is heading toward that direction too
Humans banding together with dragons and going against PO
Neuv already agrees but some of his fellow sovereign might not like Apep
But they too will have to move forward at some point
The immigrant example doesn't work because of the fact that PO colonized the Dragons, he got rid of most of them and kicked them out of their land
Immigrants don't do that.
Immigration and colonialism isn't the same thing
Humans in this case didn't kick them out either is what I'm saying
Instead they were settled by PO after kicking dragons out
And they still were hunted by dragons wherever found
Hell humans don't even know what their God did
And once they knew they rebelled don't forget
Yes, but its like
Is Eula at fault for what her ancestors did?
No, and she shouldn't be blamed for it, but still its something that she kind of has to acknowledge
I'm not agreeing with the fact that humans need to leave Teyvat, but I'm just saying
And does anyone from mond ask her to leave? I don't think so
No but they shit on her everyday
For the most part
The Lawrence clan are still assholes
Yeah and neuv is ruling his own kingdom now
It'll happen give it some time
Plus not everything will involve humans giving up their own civilization they build
Yeah like idk
Eula whines too much about how she's opressed because of what her ancestors did instead of beating the shit out of her family, which is what she should do if she wants to prove herself better
I'm not saying humans should give up their own civilization, but they need to coexist with the dragons
Which as you said above, it probably will happen
Yes
Eula goes to Natlan imagine
Thing with dragons and humans is that they both have done harm to each other over the period of 6k years
So blaming solely either of the side won't fly with either of them
While the single entity responsible for fucking over both of them still hasn't been involved
Not cause of lack of intent but lack of power to do so
Yes it's primarily PO's problem
But I dislike the ehole "both sides have done bad" thing when it comes to idk, colonialism metaphors
The Dragons had a right to fight back
Like yes, its PO's fault, not the humans so them wanting humans dead is bad
But humans worshipped the PO and the Shades, and they really only came to despise PO when their rules started to affect them, they didn't know about the Dragons
It's also more complicated because of the fact that humans could not have lived in land with the dragons more or less
Because of the light realm and human realm and whatever
Humanity was deceived you can blame them for their ignorance
But you can't blame them of PO's crime
Yeah thats another thing too
Koitar feels no pity for the Dragons as far as we know
Yeah
That's why I hate her
Where? That was shades no?
Angels aren't even mentioned in BSAM
Let alone first angel
That's a parable not literal
And branch is irminsul anyway
It was both
Also the Angels
3 if she's the Pale Princess
Neither is Nibelung
At least not directly
But 2nd throne is
It's possible some dragons sided with her
Yeah but we had no idea who that was for years
Even when Nibelung was revealed it took years to connect the dots
Wellllllllll its been datamined for years now
But yeah
The final version might be different
I'm aware
Yes then some other word referring angel should also be mentioned for war it wasn't
But I hope they don't change too much from it
... assuming it will even come out at this point.
It doesn't describe the war at all
It just says that it happened
And that's it
Lmao
So how can you say angels were involved....
And PO and shades are indeed mentioned to fight seven sovereign
Because it's implied
You can't fight a war with only 5 dudes
And the Nails
There has to be foot soldiers for the conflict
The Moons imply they used them before too
Or something akin to them
It doesn't say it's dragon's related but I get the point yeah
Or the hillichurl curse maybe
Yes elements ruled the og world I know
Or so we think
Ukko became a Hillichurl
Still though
They've had it in their arsenal for years
Hillichurl curse is what? Abandoning your god no?
For that you need to have the rule for God first... Which definitely happened after the war
@odd thicket what will you do once PO is revealed to be same as dottore... 
Fighting the inevitable aka fate of abyss destroying everything
They are the same in the sense they're psycho control freaks 
Didn't dottore do the same he literally live experimented on humans 
Pretty much yeah
Dottore wanted to be God and failed
I don't understand Dottore fans
Do you want him to be a unsympathetic piece of shit or a good guy
So did PO when he allowed them to build the unified civilization and sent angels to bring them wisdom
The cycle turned into a spiral
Just like dottore would have succeeded if not for our arrival
Khaenri'ah as the culmination of the spiral
Yes the demiurge does not want to be risen up against
That was him toying with them
He was angry that he got beaten and lasered
Be evil and also be symphatetic is gray though
You can't be sympethetic to pure evil
His arrogance finally ended
Which reminds me of this
It was also found in Zhiqiong's quest where it was the first mention of Hyperborea and the Black Watch Tower
It was an experiment to conduct his God powers
That was Pierro's experiment
He was using Dottore to achieve fhat
Dottore would not be aware though
No he just doesn't like the Shades
No way
We don't know where the OG is or if he's even alive
He thinks he already ascended fate
I don't understand how you can want them not to be grey but then also say you want them to be symphatetic and understanding 
You can't have one without other 
The Dottore fan's paradox
Also the Spiral Abyss description mentions how the spiral staircase in the Spiral Abyss is the same one that vision users see when climbing to ascend to Celestia
So that's cool
And a little ominous
So more implication that Celestia is tied to the Abyss
Somehow
He thinks he already won
The mask he drops
He wanted to study a descender
Which puts those villain into moral grey area automatically
Yeah but it sounds like you want him to be entirelu sympathetic
He wants to study them to give their power unto himself
That's it
They're still calling him out as having a false moon 
Bitch couldn't even plagiarize right
What trauma does this motherfucker have
Rene also wanted to be a God and failed
He already had two
Couldn't do it on his own
People got upset at him for killing people 😞
With the sole exception of Satoru Gojo, of course
Bro got a baddie simping for him and he fucking killed her
Still failed
No no no no he totally didn't kill her! He was framed! By who? Uhhhhhhhh
Signora has an actual trauma 
That's a symphatetic villain done right...that is if only her past wasn't hidden in lore
)
No welcome the Traveler
Rerir is just the better Dottore
That's it
No it was for the Traveler
I can't tell if you're joking or not
Ok
But like
He was still accepted into the Academy up until he killed that chick
Idk man maybe his family was onto something in kicking him out
He was just going that to try and convince the Traveler he would be a good god 
Hilarious that his idea of that is just shipping random people
And he was accepted by the Fatui too
Why
I still don't remember where dottore past was shown besides the one where he already was experimenting in some hospital... 🥀
Like, Columbina didn't like him but it was for a good fucking reason (can't believe I'm defending her on this 🤮 )
Crucabena woked for him
Pantalone and him are in good terms
He just sounds entitled.
Same here
Honestly Pants will probably betray him too 
Genuinely think that the army he's bringing is actually to help
Pants wants to be playable 
Also it said it was for "unknown reasons" who's to say he wasn't killing cats or something like every serial killer does as a child
There's like....one description that says it
He's smart like that
Then they would just do him like they did Nefer
Give him easy assignments and never challenge him
Not kill another student
If my academy wanted me to experiment on rats and I started doing so on humans my academy also will kick me out I'm afraid 
Sounds like he was doing fuck shit if he "acted without authorization" for the third fucking time
He wasn't humbling them he murdered a woman
Yeah but I'm telling you why I would be kicked out 
Crucabena gave him children to experiment on
It still says he was an arrogant person who didn't care for others
The lady he went on a date with died after going on the date with him
Partially because of Thoth's lies
No she didn't
No she doesnt
Show it
Thoth still thought he may have left him to die
She does, but what you're saying is still wrong
We are eternally trapped
^^
Do you want him to be evil or not
Then why didn't Arle ever see them again?
Repurposed in a cemetery that is
You know dottore already created a God one time and we all know what happened and what "reason" he really had
Nothing to do with "humanity"
Dude just projected his own selfish desires onto humanity
Arle is a Harbinger she would know
This is going nowhere but I would honestly have more respect for Dottore fans if they actually wanted the dude to be evil as they claim he does
Pierro explicitly tells her that he will tell her anything she wants to know
Shocked you didn't say that Dottore cursed Collei's eleazar so it's ok
I have legit seen that
She did her lore explicitly shows what she asked
We don't see all the questions
Only 2 of them
Pierro gave her 5
She would know if Dottore killed the kids
He did
"Merely an enhanced human? If your great nation can furnish me with sufficient resources and ample time, I could even manufacture that which you would call a god. What say you?"
"Will you treat me like the Akademiya did? Will you call me a monster, a madman?"
"Or will you treat me as my hometown did, and chase me away with pitchforks and clubs...?"
This is the whole contention here right? That he was chased because he was "perfecting" humans
I was just saying his "perfection"/"experiments" are just projection on his part where he thinks he's being misjudged when reality is that he's doing it for himself
He doesn't even see humans as humans...
"A human is nothing more than a machine of a certain level of complexity."
Thus declared the youth from his lectern in the seedbed of wisdom.
He killed the kids years ago already
We know he even tried approaching her to get more kids for his island
I literally qouted what he thinks of humans 
It's all a piece of puzzle for him in his grand experiment
Because she wanted him too
It was a more humane solution than actually killing traitors while still keeping the fear in her kids
That he failed
Evolution by killing and experimenting on people and killing random innocents
He also tortured Abbas
For himself
No she came up with it and just got him to collab
His boss theme says that only he alone will ascend
Yes
He died in 6.3 and will die again
In 6.6
You know the kind of villain you want dottore you can find that in abyss durin...
He was a monster that destroyed everything around him yet all the destruction from his pov was reflected through innocence of a child
Dottore isn't innocent is the thing though...
he knows what he's doing and he doesn't care
That's not really a symphatetic villain (not so far at least)
She figured out her own supply
We can claim his innocence when hoyo decides to actually show his benevolent/innocent side
They haven't so far
"I alone will be liberated"
So never 
No it doesn't
It's his own treatise on how he alone will become the next Phanes
Yes we'll get the secret good segment soon
That has no memory of the past
It's a prayer to him
A prayer about his own ascension
And the world is his
Where does it say that in the song itself
It doesn't
"Pi from wfp believes in me I can't kill innocent people I can't betray him...
I'll severe this part of "benevolent dottore v1.0" out of my mind and hide it in irminsul...yeah that'll do..."
You guys be ready for playable dottore now
Secret good Dottore that's a medium male and has no memories of the past
Because he doesn't think he's doomed he's arrogant
And wears the shortest shorts in existence while outfemboying Venti
He thinks he's better than Rene
He thinks he's better than everyone
Rerir has better chance atp than dottore ngl
Dottore becoming playable would actually get people on china straight up killed
Well yeah he has a drip marketing
That's a literal confirmation
Well he thinks it's a foregone conclusion that they'll side with him
Or he'll just kidnap them
A literal drip marketing?
Rerir has thr paimon painting emotes and Dottore has none
Huh
Arlecchino harmed Traveler with 0 consequence
No they wouldn't idiot
The Shades don't give a shit about them
They don't
None of them do
Except Asmoday
I guess
No it doesn't
No not her either
He "begged" cause he sees them as his own aka a being who preside over the world
And he wanted to find out what made them click
And when traveler revealed they're nothing like him that's when he flipped
Istaroth's plan already worked so I doubt she cares atp
Neither would Dottore
Dottore wanted to experiment on them
She doesn't care about anything rn
Why didn't they come down on Raiden then
She tried to kill Traveler in the AQ but was stopped by Midzuha
Except Asmoday
Tf Kazuha do?
😭
Dottore says that he was gonna bring them back to his labs before Scaramouche reduced them
Also Dottore would have experimented with their capabilities
Yeah and he was gonna do something similar before Columbina showed up and defeated him
No he literally says he would have
When he's talking to them
Yeah that was how traveler showed they're not what he thinks of them
And yet couldn't think how others would feel when he was busy experimenting on them 
He was intrigued by the constitution of a descender that's all
He already had the authority over the world yet here's a person who has will to overcome that
That piqued his interest
In fact in the cutscene where he froze time and traveler kept moving made him gasp for a moment
That's where traveler fully caught his attention
Yeah one he planned to win
But he didn't and was raging because of it
"This rotten decaying world.. " His last seethe before he finally vanished into nothingness 
Wonder what he'll say when he dies again in 6.6
Tbh I do hope he gets proper background in game before he leaves and not just vague loreposting
I wouldn't want him to be signora'd when it comes to narrative
Sorry 
Signora got an artifact set at least
Well he got pale flame as well kinda one piece at least 
Capitano didn't even get that....
I hope Da Wei gets cancer
Dude at least got his backstory with cool cutscene
That was nothing and you know it
Compared to what we got in natlan it was definitely the best part 
Definitely better than the fucking Traveler dance party
Stupid fraud can't so shit without the power of friendship
Mfs when characters have differing views on another character depending on their relationship with them
Except the Goat Baizhu who actually has more than one kind of relationship
"Dance if you're a fraudulent weak bum without constantly leeching off the gnosis":
"Dance if you left your nation to fend for itself for 500 years so that you can hoard all the glory":
No Hu Tao
She hates his ass lmao
It was just in a constant state of war
Well they kinda made up in 5.3
No it wasn't
No reason to when she could transfer memories across generations
She's a disgusting pig with a dog shit design and dog shit lore and I can't wait until the next pyro DPS power creeps her
I still want to know why they said natlan was frontier for abyss attack when whole teuvat is spherical and abyss can just arrive from anywhere 🥀
It had some Abyss but not much
And Scarlet Eyed Hero
And The Archons who helped seal the Bakunawa
No they didn't
She abandoned all her people equally
No they all helped keep the Bakunawa sealed
Atea was post Cataclysm
None of the Archons did that
She was busy in the fire doing shit
Scarlet eye hero, gunhildr, nameless bard, first knight of boreus.... Surely there's an actual lore relevant reason why every civ has these important fate changing people who's identity got wiped out....
I meant the Pyro Archons
Also Venti summoned Dvalin to help
Gunnhildr didn't have their identity wiped
The very first one didn't have the name no? But probably not relevant I guess
Well yeah but their identity wasn't wiped
Nameless got his removed cause he used Istaroth's power
First Knight of Boreas is ??? Still though
And SEH intentionally wiped his name from history
Rukkhadevata and Egeria?
Also we don't know what Belyi did yet
None have been wiped from memories it's just that their names are intentionally hidden
Yeah that's what I meant
Except Nameless his name was removed because he used Istaroth's power
He did great humanity better after he visited Hyperborea
And Rotwang sounds like he was a funny little guy can't blame him for that
The Jinn agreed to it
Also that was in Deshret's kingdom
All that happened one time he decided to give human equal rights shame really 
Belyi had to fight some straight up demons during the Archon War too
It was a joke 
Like TF you mean he fought the "God of Darkness"
RuKKKhadevata then I guess
I mean Xbalanque put Och-Kan in charge after his death
That was a stupid decision
No she sucks
Her entire plan would have failed completely if Capitano wasn't there
Entirely luck based
If Chasca and Ororon didn't awaken Natlan would be dead
Mavuika is a gambler
She did
Without him Ororon wouldn't have awakened
They wouldn't have if it wasn't for factors outside of her control
No he wouldn't
He wasn't a fighter
I wonder if that was just Miscislav as he took the abyss powers to fight Belyi
No she never even met some of them
It's possible
So she placed her whole plan into the hands of luck
Yeah
No she didn't
She didn't know what fate was it was luck
She was bluffing
Also no she didn't
She wasn't doing anything to contact them or awaken them
No she doesn't
Yeah cause she didn't know them
How would she know something that hasn't awakened yet?
No it didn't
Mavuika let Chuychu die by the way
A coward
Through and through
It was necessary to let Chasca awaken so Mavuika wanted her to die
Only after she got 6 luck based heroes to let her leech off of Ronova's power and still didn't win
Capitano's plan wasn't based on letting people die so that other heroes could awaken
Didn't even kill it
If she didn't sit on her ass waiting for the heroes to awaken it wouldn't have happened
With the Traveler
Would have failed without them
Can't even destroy their books
No she waited years as Archon for the heroes to awaken
And didn't do anything to look for them
Or help them awaken
It would have saved all their lives though
Not Fontaine
For the most part
Capitano would have helped
No
Traveler was just a pawn of the prophecy the whole way through
That was Neuvillette
He's a Sovereign
He is
"One as great as he should have no need for a constellation to shine over him. After all, "fate" is merely the manner in which the present ruler of this world plays with living beings."
Sinners can change it
Because of Neuvillette the Fontainians didn't dissolve
Also Kukulkan would have been thrilled to have a black canvas again
Lol
They can remove the immortality curse
If he's outside fate then he is by definition a variable
He is
Vedrfolnir says that none can say proscribe Surtalogi anymore
No Varka says a bunch of things are variables in his quest
Varka avoided his own fate just by not doing it 
And his lore
The Abyss is also a variable then
There's an explanation for why you can't point where 
Focalors didn't plan for the Traveler
It was all on her own
Narwhal basically
It was supposed to destroy tryvat as predicted by Rene
Traveler changed that fate
You're sounding like Dottore with how hard you're glazing Traveler
After all the incels got mad Arlecchino bitched him
The Abyss is entropy that will consume all of the universe eventually
Trust me a lot of people got mad at Traveler in Fontaine because they weren't constantly winning
But it is a variable in Phanes' fate
And then got mad when they did kept winning in natlan 
Nah they're different groups
Part of same fandom which is why no matter what happens in story someone gets angry
Fandom is just too big atp
But Phanes' fate can't possibly account for it it is too strong
Yeah
They were too young then
Probably
We don't know how their planet was destroyed exactly
Yeah
Yeah but how did it consume the planet
And how old were the Travelers
Descender are a concept in teyvat context only
No not destroyed planets just planets O visited
No they aren't
Nibelung was free from the universal fate too
Some of them maybe but not all of them
Some of them are never mentioned to be destroyed
I don't think so
The name itself implies it
They descended to teyvat both literally and metaphorically
It's also related to will of the planet itself which is where teyvat is unique
I don't know what their description says
I mean yeah but all the special outfits are from other planets
No because variable can be anyone
Descender are only 4
Not all that is from outside is a descender
Don't have to be but still they arrived the same from outside aka descended into teyvat
We don't know that so no
Yeah but they have another trait that makes them a descender
Otherwise the Narwhal would be a Descender
And if pale princess is to be believed they too came from outside
Yes other is the will to rival the world aka teyvat in this context
But that will is a factor outside of Teyvat too
We know that there are things that effect fate outside of Teyvat too
Undying Flame says so
Yes but we don't have descender outside teyvat
They are very much contextualized for current world
"The fortune teller then explained the underlying principles. Put simply, it's something like this:
In our world, the stars are the heavenly strings by which humans are bound. But in other worlds, the subjects of astrological study are the solar ecliptic energies, the various lunar energies of the satellites, the will-energy of the celestial rulers of the planets, the scattered interference energy of distant stars, and the dark energy that suffuses the pitch-black cosmos. Of course, it's not like these things don't exert influence on our planet — they have merely been greatly weakened by a giant sky-shroud. As such, astrology on other worlds is far more abstract than that which is practiced in ours."
All these things also effect fate on their planets which Descenders should be immune from
I believe so
But both Phanes and Nibelung are also descenders
When?
Yes
The cost was being horribly crippled
That's why they blackmailed and killed Saarelainen
To get the gnoses from them
The gnoses maintain Phanes' order in some capacity
They do have a form
Also Abyss poison
No they shouldn't
Only Traveler can
Cause they're special
And maybe Saarelainen
Nibelung was poisoned by the Abyss and Phanes was too
Well The Sibling also has a variation of it since Irmin used them as an Abyss refinery
Skirk isn't affected by abyss either it's not unique to descender
Yes
Nibelung was a descender who was weak to the Abyss as he was a dragon
I think that’s Beidou before Diona icon
Mizuki getting a buff within a year is super funny tho
A version anyways
All that jazz
wait wha
t
wtf?
wtf???
why not finish the Mond units first
wtg?
wtf
i dont get it
If I was gonna wager a guess
It’s to prepare for the ||Stellar Conduct reaction|| mechanic in 7.x (leaks)
But that makes it funnier bc they still left out Kaeya and Lisa
yeah duh I'm just wondering why

especially since for lunar there were no such buffs
yeah no shit
it still doesn't make sense
what are they gonna tie the buffs to
you're delusional
But Mizuki is the only anemo
Wrio in hex?
I like tea too
am I a witch
why am I not included in the hex buffs
well anyways
I genuinely don't like the fact
they didn't finish buffing rhe other Mond units
🥀
god this sucks
Noelle, Lisa, Kaeya, Mika, Diona, Amber, Rosaria, Eula, Dahlia
I mwan yeah
but
eh
Jean Diluc
too
they gave a Hex 4* for free so it doesn't matter
doesn't matter
🥀
I want whoever makes these decisions
in hoyo
to get
bone cancer
You don’t need to be a witch to get a hex buff
That was never a hard rule to begin with
it's a joke about what they said
Lore wise the Hexenzirkal are just interested in XYZ characters
So are they going to be Hexerei characters or completely unrelated to Hexerei?
Because I thought Hexerei was for Mondstadt characters
Hmmmm
I want more characters to feed to my Varka
So hopefully Hex
Yeah
But the lore is that Varka made a deal to buff his own people
Possibly
Diona should be Secret Rite though
Oh God
At least Wriothesley is getting a buff
He's been dog shit for so long
The greatest Imaginarium Theatre filler
Stellar Swirl is low-key confirmed for now at least too
So more Varka buffs lol
I know but I'm greedy
No
I know
Prune already does that on his teams
Varka holds the Hexerei DPS set
Celestial Gift goes to Nicole or Durin
Who knows
It depends on how they go about it
Well Tsaritsa should enable it ig
Yeah
Cause Varka needs two of the other element
Yeah that's annoying
Unless it turns out it's Diona
What if it's Pierro lol 
Actually would be pretty cool
Is that supposed to be a copium gif?
Hopefully
I just built her too lol
I've had her C6 for years and only built her now when her buffs first got leaked
||Actually her C6 was leaked to be getting buffs like a month ago lol
||
Well not even "leaked" they messed up and put it in a beta
Also I wonder
We did just get that Zibai anecdote about Qiqi's zombie magic fading
Her buff quest could relate to that
And the third adeptus who helped bless her
I got him yesterday
A friend of my mom's got him for her daughter but she ended up having really bad allergies, so he's with us now
His name is Mickey, he is the sweetest cat
Yeah he's 1 year old
Awww how cute
He's very sweet
I've wanted a cat for the longest time now
I lost my 6 year old ferret last year and I've been devastated since
So I was really happy when my mom asked me if I wanted to take him in, lol
Also about the announced Hexerei buffs
No Raiden 
Sad
She's more of a dog person but she doesn't mind him, lol she got him for me mostly.
She already is, she's just trying to be sleek about it
She doesn't dislike cats, just prefers dogs :p
Lol, cats are like that
Well not always, my Uncle's cat is like best friends with his dog
The two can never be separated
Aww, yeah it'd make sense she wouldn't like dogs
We got our cat from a homeless lady on the side of the road who gave it to my mom heading back from work
Here he is
I think he's like 5 or 6 years old now
Yeah
This is his compact form he can stretch out 
They pick the spot that makes it the least capable for you to sleep in a comfortable position
Yeah he was just a kitten when we got him
Our dog would have probably eaten him if we weren't careful
My ferret liked to sleep on a hat I had laying around
Oh wait wrong pick
Here we go
The other one was my friend's
No when my mom brought him home our dog was curious and we were scared he'd bite him
Yes, but I only had one, the other one was my friend's ferret
My cat also sleeps on my chair sometimes though he usually wakes me up when he wants to go out my room since I like to keep the door closed
So far Mickey has just been hiding under my bed,
He's very very sweet, but he's still nervous being in a new place so I'm just letting him be for now, though he comes out every now and then
Anyway on Genshin Lore talk
So the Hexerei buffs won't be exclusive to Mondstadt characters?
Unclear
That's good
It was honestly the main complaint I had
How so?
We don't know if it's Hexerei or something else
Or if it'll be the same as what say Varka and Lohen have
Varka and Lohen have something different??
I mean the Mondstadt characters' Hexerei
In general
Ah, ok.
bro putting Cyno in Hexerei would be so dumb
it's definitely not Hexerei
I think Diona might be Hex
and the others some other bullshit
It would be pretty limited then though with only 5 characters getting a unique buff
But then again both lunar and Hexerei is already pretty limited
it's just
other than Diona
the rest don't make sense
for Hex bullshit
and for future potential buffs
Hexerei doesn't give af who they give powers too
the premise started when the witches wanted to help Mond citizens get stronger to be able to fight future dangers
But since we're here I have been thinking
We got that Qiqi anecdote with Zibai about how her zombie powers were fading and that there were three adepti who apparently helped her with it
So her buff quest might deal with that
could be
I know that but then why is the video Hexenzirkel themed? Hmmm