#This is a preliminary list, ik there are wayyy too many schools </3 Premed interested in BSMD

145 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

latent pebble
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add Carleton

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replace Lehigh and replace it with Carleton 😭 😭 😭

sharp hamlet
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oh i meant like cuny i think that's bsmd right

foggy venture
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It’s a waste of time to do all ivies as the applications are crazy long, not because it’s obnoxious

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Especially if you are applying to BSMDs

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I’d cut the number of hyper selective schools you’re applying to so you can actually produce high quality essays

sharp hamlet
sharp hamlet
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tbh i rly wanna apply to mit

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bc an ao suggested i apply

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bc my profile gives more

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engineering mit wanna be than med

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and it's cool id love mit a lot more if it did ok for premed

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omg so no

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nooo i dont wanna apply thennnnn.......

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wait

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rochester is racist lowk

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my counseor spoke to the ao

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and he was like

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we prefer white students

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bc we pity them when it comes to them

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against asian students

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"we pity them"

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was the words he used

foggy venture
# sharp hamlet what would you suggest given my interestS?

I’d cut 3-4 of the 8 ivies based on preference, and then one or two of Vanderbilt/Northwestern/Stanford/JHU

JHU is a difficult one as a pre med because the grade deflation is horrific but the research opportunities are very good. So if you have a high capacity to withstand stress keep it on there, but if you don’t eliminate it

sharp hamlet
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but the ao likes me

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and idk

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i love jhu research

sharp hamlet
sharp hamlet
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i want 6 bsmds

foggy venture
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The reason i categorize ivies and the other4 separately, is because ivy apps are longer

sharp hamlet
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and like idk

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14 trad???

foggy venture
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Then u prob wanna cut at least 4 ivies

sharp hamlet
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sooo lowk bye bye cornell, bye bye vandy maybe (or should i say bye bye dartmouth but the thing is dartmouth values recs and i can get a good rec from a dartmouth alumn)

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research

sharp hamlet
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ok bye cornell

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rly???? but its like more attainable than the others 💔

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i wanna get into oen of those bsmds

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lowk do i even apply to vandy + darty

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r they good for premed

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true...

sharp hamlet
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guysss

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which ivies / other schools do i removeee

lament bronze
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You need to sit down and have a serious conversation with your parents

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“Upper Middle Class” is not able to afford $800,000

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Over 7-8 years

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So the question is, are they covering you just for undergrad?

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And if that’s the case, would they instead cover you for med if you went to a free undergrad?

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@sharp hamlet

sharp hamlet
sharp hamlet
sharp hamlet
lament bronze
sharp hamlet
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also, want to put it out there that i want to apply to ~25 schools max

sharp hamlet
sharp hamlet
lament bronze
sharp hamlet
lament bronze
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Your list would completely change in this hypothetical

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Undergrad prestige is mostly irrelevant for medicine so the main difference here is the $400,000 medical school debt

sharp hamlet
sharp hamlet
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i kn

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know

sharp hamlet
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to them my undergrad studies truly matter

lament bronze
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I don’t think they understand the math here

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Or they seemingly think medical school prestige matters

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Because $400,000 growing at 9% a year from the moment you borrow it is years of your working life

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What specialty are you most interested in @sharp hamlet

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Just so I can best calculate this

sharp hamlet
sharp hamlet
sharp hamlet
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or radiology

lament bronze
# sharp hamlet yep...

“The move toward holistic admissions in the 2010s and beyond has pushed institutional ranking even further to the margins. Holistic review emphasizes not just numbers, but the whole person: values, service, communication skills, mission alignment, and the potential to contribute to medicine in unique ways.

Monroe et al. (2013) found that in schools using staged admissions processes, college prestige rarely factored into final decisions. Early screening relied on GPA and MCAT, but interviews and letters became the deciding elements later on. Stratton and Elam (2014) observed that admissions committees were increasingly looking at traits like professionalism and personality in predicting student success, with no mention of institutional ranking. Most recently, Bergemann and colleagues (2024) showed that undergraduate prestige wasn’t even included in regression models predicting applicant success; non-academic measures and traditional academic metrics carried the real weight.”

sharp hamlet
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I understand that college undergrad prestige is not significantly considered in the case of med school applications, but i think my parents also want to invest that much with the hopes that it's a safety net if i ever change my mind about medicine

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or being a physician in particular

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they also believe that this experience is worth the invest ent for like quality education, connections,a nd all

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and i feel like ideally id love to go to a traditional college with a scholarship tbh, i really want to be able to have the college experience to really further gain clarity about my future

lament bronze
# sharp hamlet i honestly dont know, but potentially reconstructive surgery or surgical patholo...

Looking at surgical pathology:

You’ll be entering medical school at 22 if we assume traditional pathway. You’ll take on roughly $100,000 a year of debt, with simple interest of ~9% accruing immediately.

Pathology residency is 4 years.

When you graduate residency, your $400,000 debt will have grown to $634,000.

Pathologists make about $400,000. After taking out federal tax, state tax, and FICA, you’ll be left with about $250,000. You’ll need about $60,000 of that to live off of with a pretty decent lifestyle.

It will take you 4 years after residency to pay off this debt. That means putting your life on hold for another 4 years, as you’ll only be living off of $60,000 take-home.

Hopefully that does a better job of illustrating it


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There are ways to make that situation better, but you won’t be able to shorten it below 2 years even if we assume everything becomes a best case scenario (low tax state, refinance loans after medical school, attend a cheaper state medical school)

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So going to a prestigious undergrad is the equivalent of costing you 2-4 working years of your life

lament bronze
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But I wouldn’t be making your list completely random schools

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They’d be strong flagship state schools

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Ranked more like 50-100 instead of 1-25

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Going to a school like Rutgers isn’t going to hold you back

foggy venture
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You will regret paying $400,000 for undergrad if you want to go to med school

raw ore
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which is a suprising chunk of pre meds

foggy venture
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State schools can even be directly better than some T20s for premed because of grade deflation

foggy venture
lament bronze
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2-4 working years of your life + all of residency + all of med school being in debt

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Delaying everything an extra 2-4 years

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So
 delayed house

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Delayed retirement savings

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Delayed vacations

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medicine is already a lot of delayed gratification so why delay it another 2-4 years when there is an option to not

late vault
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There is good reason to have doubts about medicine. Most premeds do not ever apply to medical school, either because they find out medicine is not for them or because of academic underperformance. It is also true that if you don't end up going for medicine, many other fields rely more heavily on the connections and alumni network that a more traditional prestigious school could offer. I would have a very serious sit down conversation with your parents about finances. Tell them that you are strongly considering premed, and with that comes the question of medical school tuition. Tell them that this is affecting your considerations for undergraduate selection. Ask them if they would ever consider paying for medical school, and if not, would they have the capital for you to borrow money from them at a low/no interest rate should you get into medical school in the future, so that you can pay them back as a resident/attending in the future.

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IMO, which is probably a hot take and not a great one either, as long as undergrad is free, I don't really see medical school tuition as a huge barrier to attendance. At the point at which you are applying/been accepted to medical school, you are all-in on this path already. Medical school is always going to cost a lot, and physicians do get paid a lot, and paying back those loans is unfortunately the cost of doing business. There is only one path to becoming a practicing physician and it is to pay for medical school.

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That said, it is always important to keep finances in mind. If you can get to the same place with less money, it is always a good idea. So I would pay attention to many of the messages above. Going to a good state school will never hold you back.

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Anyways basically I feel like your parents will direct you down the right path for your family. They will know how much they can spare for your education, and how long they want to be providing for you before you start your career. That's what parents do- it's their job. (or should be, anyways)

lament bronze
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Interesting

late vault
# lament bronze I would have expected the opposite take from you

well, I think med school fees are exorbitant, and I think students should avoid debt. But as long as medical school costs as much as it does, and given that around 50% of accepted students receive only one acceptance, you take what you're given, even if it comes with a loan attached to it. I also think that since most students don't end up as premed, I advocate against optimizing your life for a career that is not for most people. College should be for figuring things out, and financial freedom can help you feel more comfortable finding what you enjoy during undergrad, whether it comes from your family or from scholarships.

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Obviously it would be nice to get medical school discounted or free, which are usually at very well endowed and prestige heavy schools, but that's not most students so why worry about it? I extend the same philosophy to competitive residencies.

lament bronze
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Totally get the second part of your paragraph, but would a school like Rutgers really hold him back?

late vault
kindred musk
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Apply to USF if you think you can get a 516 MCAT

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They have a bsmd as well as a full ride for national merit finalists so ur only paying for 3 years of med school provided u can get that mcat

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And I think morsani is pretty good?

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Problem is that only guarantees an interview which supposedly is just a formality but idk

lament bronze
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They are one of the few midtier schools remaining that still has a graded preclinical instead of pass fail preclinical

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So an already stressful medical school experience is made way worse

kindred musk
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Since I could graduate loan free if I’m only paying for 3 years med school

lament bronze
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USF? The undergrad is good

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Morsani won’t hold you back in the match. just know that it’s definitely not very oriented toward student happiness

kindred musk
lament bronze
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Yes

kindred musk
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Where

lament bronze
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The Mayo Clinic

kindred musk
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WWW

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Where’d u go for undergrad?

kindred musk
lament bronze
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I went to Brown

kindred musk
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I feel like the hard part would also be getting in since there’s probably hella people doing their “BSMD”

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USF I mean

kindred musk
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Idt I will I don’t have enough volunteering to stand out in front of these ppl

lament bronze
lament bronze
late vault
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Not to necro an old post but if you can get a 516 on the MCAT you can probably get into a lot of other schools, GPA permitting and all other parts of the application in place. Wouldn't go to USF just for the bsmd.

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also would pay attention to true P/F cirriculum, for some that extends into clerkships which is nice (altho usually they are only able to do that due to large brand name/prestige)