#elder-scrolls-general-chat

1 messages · Page 51 of 1

dim reef
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Did I do something wrong finally?

spice whale
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forgot to clear fingerprints probs

weak sapphire
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But we're talking a nation at LEAST the size of Minnesota, if not the size of Germany. Even if they hear that someone closed the gates, no one is going to freaking recognise you

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It all just ends up contributing to how pathetically small the world ends up feeling.

spice whale
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i would like the npc's recognition to be optional too, it gets especially weird in ESO

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but anyway, when it's the end of the world and there's a hero who manages to deal with it people would likely talk about this hero

weak sapphire
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Its like, people complain about the lack of recognition you get for saving the world in Skyrim. But really, how many people even know? Maybe 20? In all of Skyrim?

dim reef
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Most of the recognition went to Martin anyway

weak sapphire
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Yeah. I'm just saying, these aren't the sorts of setting where everyone can recognise someone important.

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Even the Emperor isn't likely to be recognjsed by 90% of the population

nimble pond
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Idk, hard to miss someone walking around with royalty attire, and amulet of kings around their neck, surrounded by guards. Lol sticks out like a sore thumb

weary quiver
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i hated oblivion persuasion system like any other normal person at first, but grew to like it. its a fun addictive minigame and it represents a presuasion system. logic and immersion gets thrown out the window but in game design two of three ain't bad

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henry has come to see us praise talos

eager remnant
weak sapphire
nimble pond
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But wearing what he was wearing, you would think it would automatically click. Its not something just anybody or other ppl wear, whether you seen him for first time or not

weary quiver
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as i suggested in another post, persuasion system should be like scouting is now in madden. you spend points on players/dispositions and get their best skill/reaction for 15 pts, 2nd best for 10 pts and 3rd best for 5. immersion saved

fringe path
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Do you guys think TESVI will just be in Hammerfell or could it be both Iliac Bay provinces?

nimble pond
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I hope its both hammerfell and high rock.

fringe path
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Like all my exposure to the fandom's discourse is just based of the Bethesda subreddits and, well, that's Reddit. Haha

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So I'd like opinions from other fans rather than random Redditors

weary quiver
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i do think a temperate/nordic landscape has mass appeal, so adding in high rock with a northern middle earth east of the misty mountains would be the target from a marketing standpoint

fringe path
weary quiver
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in skyrim the world was the star

nimble pond
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I mean they did arena and daggerfall. But they could definitely put a lot more detail into it now with the technology and open up the entire province for exploration

fringe path
fringe path
weary quiver
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and we should get giant dwemer moving gears and pistons we can platform. something like this is the next gen stuff todd is talking about

fringe path
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What's your guys' main in-game race?

nimble pond
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Dahmer, lol

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Dwemer*

fringe path
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Ha

weary quiver
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my starting character is a argonian assasin

fringe path
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I always go Breton Witch Hunter first, then roleplay myself for survival mode, then try out different builds

weak sapphire
fringe path
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I'd love Hammerfell too tho tbh. It would be perfect for bringing back Survival Mode from Fallout 4. It would also be a welcome change of pace from the medieval Europe aesthetic of most other RPGs

weak sapphire
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A good example of this is a modern Aircraft Carrier. The CO, ExO and Coxswain typically have to have escorts to identify them. And that's on their OWN ships.

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Woof, my scroll didn't load, that conversation has moved on. Whoops

fringe path
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All conversations are welcome, friend

weak sapphire
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Over the years, I've become more and more anti-2 Provinces

fringe path
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Valid

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That does kinda spell doom on the detail side of things

nimble pond
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Im too greedy. I want to see even beyond Tamriel

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Not necessarily. It just depends on the tech. I mean you can only put so much detail in a smaller map. I thought Skyrim was filled out quite nicely for its size and time with the current tech.

weary quiver
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proc gen might arguably be better suited for vast expanses of desert and barren mountains

weak sapphire
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Yeah, Procedural Generation could handle the wilderness generally quite well now

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Its anywhere you want ruins or towns or people that becomes a bigger issue.

nimble pond
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Though I will tell you when it comes to quests, I much rather rather have longer, in-depth, well-written quests rather than "many" quests of the mediocre variety simply for the sake of having a lot of quests in the game.

weary quiver
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i think a mixture of proc gen wilderness and hand crafted cities and certain sections would be feasible

nimble pond
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Though tbh a lot of the side-quests I don't even consider to be "quests" at all.. despite their labeling as such.

weak sapphire
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I think there is room for both. If you're getting a job from the Fighters Guild? Procedural. If you're working to uncover a conspiracy to overthrow the king? That better all be hand crafted

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But ky biggest issue on doing more than one province is in the development of the cultures and peoples we experience.

The wider you cast the net, the less development each gets. And i think creating these cultures and peoples is where TES can really shine in its worldbuilding.

eager remnant
weary quiver
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i'm pretty sure tree placement is pro gen. but it almost seemed the opposite, the ayulidin ruins and oblivion plane seemed proc genned and hand crafted much of the world terrain

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guild quests need to be improved from a straightforward fetch kill quest, and more like a system of chained quests where the things you do in one quests affects later chained quest

fringe path
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I would still like some handcrafted bits in the wilderness tho. Bethesda has a real gift for environmental storytelling so if the wilderness lacked that I would feel a bit cheated

weary quiver
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world map terrain is almost certainly hand crafted, as you need an overall design for locations of major places, and in the case of fo76 it has to somewhat resemble the map of west virginia - of course much liberty was taken

fringe path
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How would procedural generation work with areas that have to be a certain way lore-wise?

weary quiver
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it would be cool if the edge of the map is procedurally generated infinite honeypot instead of running into an invisible wall

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beth can certainly add hand crafted ruins and villages in a proc generated wilderness

fringe path
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True

weak sapphire
fringe path
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I stoopid haha

weak sapphire
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Its ok. Most people think that Procedural Generation keans its generating all the time. In mkst cases though, you only run it once, and then you habe a basic template to develop further

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Depending on the complexity of the procedural generation, you can also make it do a lot of the work towards hand-crafting as well.

fringe path
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Cool cool

weak sapphire
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In principle, you COULD generate the entire world with a sufficiency complex procedural generation system

fringe path
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Do you think there will be more verticality to the environments in-game? That would be rad. After playing so much Dishonored and seeing so much Cyberpunk gameplay I really really really want more options for traversing the world

weak sapphire
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I'm not sure, depends on Bethesda

fringe path
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This is true

weak sapphire
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Bethesda strugfles with ladders, afterall

fringe path
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Also true haha

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I just think it wouldn't be all that hard to implement simple parkour mechanics like a soft double jump, vaulting, and sliding animations

weak sapphire
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Ideally, i would like to see something like Dying Light, using a stamina penalty for weight to limit too manage the absurdity of parkour in full plate

weary quiver
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Downtown Boston struggled a bit. Although it was fine for me when upgraded to one x

weak sapphire
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Oh, optimization is a whole other thing...

fringe path
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BGS games tend to have really floaty jumps so if that could be fixed I would be pretty happy

weak sapphire
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Yeah.

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In general, i don't think that Bethesda should focus too hard on balancing approaches, so long as everything is viable. But there should be tradeoffs.

If you want to scale a building in full plate, with the entire South of France's worth kf cheese in your backpack, you should be able to. But it shouldn't be EASY

fringe path
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A lot of people wanna make carry weight a gradual system but I don't get that. How would you make gear that increases carry weight with that system?

weak sapphire
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Depends.

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Now, i actually favour a more complicated Carry-System than some. I don't think Equipment should increase Carry Weight directly

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Like, adding more pouches to something doesn't let you carry more. That is entire about volume, not weight

fringe path
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I like the idea that more pockets = lower encumbrance. It kinda makes sense

weak sapphire
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So, your Carry Weight should be entirely determined by physical stats, like Strength.

Your Bulk, on the other hand, can be attached to gear. Bulk being how much space something takes up.

fringe path
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Ah

weak sapphire
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So, a backpack could have, say, 50 Bulk. You could fill that wkth 50 1-bulk gold bars. However, each bar weighs 5lbs so thats 250lbs in that bag. You have to be hella strong to lug that around.

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Something like a Feather Enchantment on tjat bag could basiclaly serve as a negative weight modifier. So, a bag with 50 Feather thats full of .1lb cabbages is going to be wasted.

fringe path
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Interesting

weak sapphire
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The reason i personally like this approach, though, is because it facilitates dropable containers.

fringe path
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It's a well thought out system haha

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Just sounds like an annoyance to program

strange sky
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I am glad that es6 isn't coming out sooner cause I like seeing people who feel entitled to videogames that don't even exist yet get upset

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I'm gonna be honest

fringe path
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Put that in off-topic lol

strange sky
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Ah okay my bad

weak sapphire
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Lol

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I've seen similar systems in much simpler games. Rimworld, for instance, has mods that effectively do this.

fringe path
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What's your ideal TESVI companion roster?

weak sapphire
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Roster? As in the characters i want, or how i want the system to work?

fringe path
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Characters you want

strange sky
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Probably as fleshed out as the fallout 4 ones but with a few more available ones

fringe path
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I already know I want it to work the way Outer Worlds did it lol

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But with Fallout 4 levels of character quality

weak sapphire
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I think, maybe half a dozen individial characters is fine really

strange sky
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How did outer worlds do it?

fringe path
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Wait never mind Fallout 4 did the system just as well

fringe path
strange sky
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Ah

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I too hope the followers live on your tamriel ship

fringe path
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But Fallout 4 let you send them to live at your settlements

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So any system like that which lets me bunk with my homies is a welcome one

strange sky
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The first and only dlc for es6 better be hearthstone but again

fringe path
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Fallout 4 had about a dozen companions iirc Dogmeat, Codsworth, Preston, Piper, Nick, Macready, Hancock, Curie, Strong, Cait, and Old Longfellow from Far Harbor and all of them are really memorable and fleshed out imo so TESVI can definitely do more than 6 and still have them be interesting haha

fringe path
strange sky
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Hearthfire my bad

weak sapphire
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I'll be honest. 500 hours in, and i don't thinn I've ever used Strong, Macready, Hancock or Longfellow

eager remnant
weak sapphire
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I appreciate the range though. And that each is a defined character

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Most of Skyrim's companions are just cardboard cutouts.

fringe path
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Ah shoot I left out Deacon, Danse, and X6-88 haha

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But them too

fringe path
cinder idol
weak sapphire
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In order to do something like that, you'd need to figure out static intercepts and terrain cutting though.

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Which is doable, but im not sure if Bethesda's engine allows it.

nimble pond
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Regarding rumor for Elder Scrolls 6.. I had heard something about procedural generation affecting cooking. Like you can actually watch a chicken roast over an open fire.

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As it goes thru different cosmetic stages from being cooked

nimble pond
magic tundra
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todd beware

weak sapphire
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Unless they do something like in some survival games

nimble pond
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I hope we can actually breed animals and varying stats or abilities for these breeds. Like some horse breeds could be more suitable for carry weight, while others would more of a war horse of sorts with strength in combat.

magic tundra
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I hope we don't have such complex side systems in a TES game.
this has almost no overlap with what defines a TES game

nimble pond
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I dabbled with the idea of spirit animals the player could select at the beginning of the game for character creation. Since ppl talk about pets. But they could do the same thing with the gods, like you pick which God you worship in character creation and each one grants your player a unique ability z not just a boring stat increase. (Like you find more treasure)

magic tundra
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what if you worship several gods?

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or none?

nimble pond
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But yea, I feel like pets/creatures should somehow be acquirable to the player as a companion

magic tundra
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I prefer to not be railroaded into a certain amount of things; I really liked that you could focus on as many skills as you want inskyrim

nimble pond
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Like I would want a bird friend with the ability to give me better perception of my environment around me as well as alert me of nearby traps

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While a canine might be sniff out hidden treasure around the wilderness

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I kinda want to be able to affect the environment too. Like actually cutting down trees and observing them fall. Perhaps on enemies at times. Then either given the ability to replant or just have them regrow overtime on their own while the player is away from that area

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Or if some theif is up in a tree hiding from me or trying to shoot arrows from me up there like those blasted valenwood elves

weary quiver
nimble pond
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Cooking competitions.. chef of the year, need a angry NPC to play chef Ramsey

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But idk, I suppose they could add to the lore to apply a spirit animal to each of the gods.

weak sapphire
magic tundra
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that would limit us to only the nine divines, though

weak sapphire
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True

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I have played around with Animal Husbandry though, circling back to another point

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Basically because there's no real mechanism at play that allows you to develop non-humanoid companions

nimble pond
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They kinda do it with the illusion magic system upon animals, but meh..

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I'd like to have pet mudcrabs and stuff like that though

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I'd name him Sebastian for sure

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And play my lute while he sings his sea shanties to the locals in taverns

weak sapphire
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Little Sebastion?

nimble pond
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Naval combat is another thing that has been discussed for Elder Scrolls VI. Which I'm more interested in how it would be implemented. To me cannons are boring and overdone in old school naval warfare games. Besides I would just launch a fireball or exploding arrow before resorting to the cannons

weak sapphire
nimble pond
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My little pony

weak sapphire
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But yeah, i think we've seen enough games with naval mechanics lately that show it COULD be done. It's just a matter of how

nimble pond
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Anyway, I would like a more strategic setup for dealing with naval combat. Like having to do with the men and women on the ship itself (melee warriors, archers, mages). You get a certain amount of crew slots to fill, so if you want to go all melee, you could. But yeah, like you could have melee fighters with different melee weapons for different abilities like spear throwers or ropers who board enemy ships and slice and dice. Archers of course for archery explosive tips or roping ships, critical hits, scouts. Mages doing their thing with fireballs, perhaps different males you can select from like summoner who can summon gigantic beasts of the sea upon enemy ships or manipulate the weather and water causing water spouts or lightning storms

weak sapphire
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Yeah, i think there's a lot of interesting dynamics you could introduce into it

nimble pond
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But if you don't have the right setup against varying setups of higher level ships you'll get your butt handed to you. Or if you don't have enough crew yet to match the numbers of higher level ships

weak sapphire
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And some of them could carry over into other places, such as having control over your Guild Members and their equipment, or the Guards in a player-run town

nimble pond
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Leveling crewmates who also unlock abilities as they level could go into play as well (but you don't loose that level if a crewmate dies and you replace with a new one)

nimble pond
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I also despised magic scrolls in Skyrim.

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They just ended up in my pile of hoarding or for decoration. I hardly ever used them.

sinful hatch
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it's lose not loose

nimble pond
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Anyway, if they wanted to implement something with that effect.. I would prefer bottled magic, like splash potions. Cheaper form of magic for those not pursuing the arcane arts skill-wise.

magic tundra
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well, that's basically scrolls

nimble pond
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Plus its much easier throwing it down rather than waving my arms all around to cast a magic spell via scroll only to get interrupted in the middle of it by enemy attack

weak sapphire
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Scrolls should serve as the into-Enchanting mechanic

nimble pond
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I know that's what I'm saying. Replace the magic scrolls with bottles magic and give the magic scrolls themselves a new purpose.

sinful hatch
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Just go back to how Oblivion did magic casting.

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Much nicer being able to cast spells while you have your weapons in your hands.

fringe path
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This may be hypocritical of me since I want parkour in TESVI but a lot of y'all are really hoping for too much for the game to deliver lol

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Breeding animals??

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Play Planet Zoo or something like that lol

nimble pond
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With magic scrolls I felt that should be held as the highest form of magic, suitable only for the most skilled of that arcane art. Like you got to learn a magic school to its max level or at least upper level like 75. Once you do that you get a special mastery of that school of magic quest. Once you complete that you unlock you have learned the ultimate and most powerful spell or spells for that school of magic and when I say that I mean like insta-kill on enemies or massive amounts of damage, real magic power, some even combining all the effects of a school of magic skill. They could add different animations when initiating these as you unfold the magical spell via magic scroll, like they did with the magic scrolls previously except it can't get interrupted. Now with these spells being OP as heck and rightly so and earned, obviously gonna need some sort of cooldown. Whether its a timer or something you build-up to be able to form the magical scroll in the first place (by the way, these magic scrolls would not be ink and paper, but appearing out of thin air in the form of magical energy as you write the spell in the air with your hands). Haven't figured out what that build-up could be for mages yet, but to give better example.. You can do similar buikd-ups for the other classes too, like warriors would require a bloodlust (amounts of damage or kills) while archers would build-up by the number of landed critical hits.

nimble pond
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But yeah, basically I think it would be nice to have a lil more incentive to master these skills besides simple damage stat increase (cap 100). Like you actually get these powerful moves/spells as a reward for that work in the skill

sinful hatch
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Hopefully they don't put in settlement babysitting like what was in fo4.

nimble pond
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The thing about that is they should give players the ability to assign jobs yo other NPCs to handle that for you if you don't want to be bothered with it for a time

sinful hatch
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Or if you have enough gun emplacements to cover every way in, you shouldn't be bothered by raiders.

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Hopefully they spend most of their time on the story and quests, and not on adding annoying crap that might seem cool to some, but just ruin the gameplay.

nimble pond
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Its all about balance

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Cause people like and dislike different things.

sinful hatch
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Keep it optional, not mandatory

nimble pond
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But yes, offering availability and methods to players in some of these mechanics is good yo have, cause there might be some things in-game that various players may not want to be bothered with

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Alternative methods *

weary quiver
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i want rune magic

nimble pond
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You shall be Avowed with your catsense

cinder idol
nimble pond
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Was contemplating on Elder Scrolls diseases. I know they got vampy and fleaball diseases, as well as something similar to rabies. But what about a ethereal or ghost-like disease? We come into with enough of our ghost-y friends.

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And what notable diseases are there in High Rock and Hammerfell? Akavir too if any are noted.

nimble pond
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Hmm, perhaps save the ethereal idea for like Akavir. Banshees?

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Hamerfell makes me think of pyramids and mummies. So perhaps a undead-like disease there. If we get more underwater ganeplay, perhaps being bitten by a siren like in the iliac bay region and we would acquire more aquatic abilities, movement,, and physical features. High rock idk, fairies?

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For boosts to our magical properties in high rock

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Hmm water horses (kelpies). Never knew there was such a thing

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Or changelings for High Rock. Apparently they are fairy'like creatures of irish folklore

dim reef
nimble pond
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If we are in part of High Rock perhaps we could bring in some club-like weapons like Shillelaghs. If not simply make them a unique staff type found yo be uniquely used by the Bretons.

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Orcs need more chain-like or chain-linked weapons in their ranks too

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Speaking of staffs, I think they should get their own skill tree like one-handed weapons and two-handed weapons do. But within the mage skill group.

cinder idol
nimble pond
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For sure

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I wonder what we can expect from M'aiq the Liar in this go round for Elder Scrolls.

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6

weary quiver
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could use more of a druid class and spells if in high rock

nimble pond
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Druids are cool

weary quiver
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and some sort of druid faction

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actually a prominent central druid faction would be great. i want to summon a unicorn

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think beth can once again do a great job of art design and world building with a druid faction

nimble pond
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Would the unicorns bleed metallic looking blood like on Harry Potter?

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And the druids have the ability to shift into something that looks like dementors?

weak sapphire
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I'd rather see more traditional Druids, like a male counterpoint to Breton Wyrds

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None of thks shape-shifting nature magic stuff. Stuffy old men engaging in human sacrifice and interpreting vague celestial signs

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As for Unicorns... controversial, but i want them to be made into Daedra

stoic fiber
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I always saw them as Daedra, one of Hircine's most fiercest hunters, rather than the real world graceful stallion. They themselves are weapons, born with His spear.

dim reef
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Here's what i want from bethesda in every single game. I want there to be a system when you pick up an object to manipulate it (generally these days by holding the grab button) and you can manipulate its x, y, and z axis. And you can also determine if it's static or not (so that you or your companions don't accidentally set it off).

weak sapphire
weak sapphire
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Though i also think the idea of Carniverous Unicorns is really cool...

stoic fiber
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But the beauty of Daggerfall, was, while yes the "Oblivion" was a thing, the line between Daedra and Aedra and even Hero-Gods were still muddy. That should be the case of the Ye Olde Bretnik before the Imperialization. Old spirits, hero-gods, local deities that would even confuse the Empires Mythographers.

weak sapphire
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Yeah

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Here's an idea... what about a dual form Daedra? As prey, they look like the usual Unicorn. As Hunters, they look like Tikbalang

stoic fiber
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Very Gloranthan Ralzakark Unicorn-King so Imma have to give the canon stamp on this one

weak sapphire
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Lol

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Along with Herne, they could round out Hercine's Daedra.

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With mortals-turned-Werewolves serving as his hunting hounds

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Most of the Princes and thejr servants could be fleshed out, i think. They rely on Dremora too much

stoic fiber
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"The war was over and with the forests free of the Diarainí Tribe, the warrior-goddess of the west, Áliass made peace with our hunter-king Írcenia and the armies of beast-men and men-beast. The augurs drank in celebration and shared all the known 111 names given to them by Ífrrai and the green-dancers, with their new allies..."
https://puu.sh/HTOWN/57cc6f771d.jpg

weak sapphire
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See, thats the Highrock i want tk see

stoic fiber
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If we dream hard enough, we can monkey-dance it into being

weak sapphire
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Highrock should be pockets if high-medieval human kingdoms, mostly along rivers and the coasts, with the thick forested interiors being full of minor Beastmen, witches and celtic-influenced tribes (like the Reachmen)

stoic fiber
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Dont forget my Bjoulsae River-Horse Men

weak sapphire
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River-Horse Men, or River Horse-Men? :P

stoic fiber
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Yes

weak sapphire
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Lol

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But i think Highrock should almist feel like The Villiage. Idyllic, stable pockets, with everyone leery to cross that line into the forests

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Hitting that wall of trees at the edges kf the farms around Daggerfall should be like Aragon and co. hitting Fangorn Forest

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Highrock is the FIRST land, its wilderness dictated by Adamantia, and Civilisation should feel like islands amidist primeval creation

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Ok, now I'm kinda interested in the potential of Highrock...

stoic fiber
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It should indeed be a land with time as its space. From the primal, tribal forest dwelling, shamanistic stick-pickers to the small Gaulish/Celtic Druidic settlements honoring the nature's spirits and the gods above to Imperialized and Elevenized Castles and Kingdoms.

dim reef
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Not very daedric behaviour

stoic fiber
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ESO does kinda hint to their Daedric connection with Hircine however

dim reef
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Yea I thought they were daedra

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But if they went extinct it kinda ruins that idea

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Maybe there’s a realm of them somewhere in oblivion that we haven’t found yet relaxdunmer

weak sapphire
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Extinct on Nirn maybe

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Have we been to the Hunting Grounds really?

dim reef
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If they’re Daedra I bet meridia has some too

weak sapphire
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Im inclined to think Meridia's Daedra are limited to the Aurials. She's not the most creative, and demands obedience

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Animal-Daedra aren't her style

dim reef
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Ok now I’m thinking a bit too hard on this

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They’re in the hunting grounds which makes them daedra yeah. But like, before that

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Before they got out there

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Cause you go to the hunting grounds from being prey also right

wispy maple
weak sapphire
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Aaand that got too serious. Back to Unicorns eating people

dim reef
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Horses bite hard. Imagine a powerful one biting you

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Whole arms gone

wispy maple
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Horsigator?

dim reef
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Can unicorns shoot lasers?

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That wasn’t a serious question but I think it’ll be scary

weak sapphire
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No, but they fart rainbows

dim reef
weak sapphire
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Anyway, Tikbalang-like Unicorns would fit perfectly with Hercine, i think

wispy maple
weak sapphire
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See, now, heres my problem, conceptially. I like the perspectivr that the Mer are descendsd from the Old Ehlnofey, while everything else non-Hist is descended from the Wanderers

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SOME Wanderers were taken by Lorkhan and Kyne, amd remade (at the Slyforge) into Men, to serve as his armies against Auriel. The rest were left to their own, explaining the range of humaoid beastmen we see. Different tribes of Wanderers developong in different ways

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Im just not sure if I'd rather see Tilbalang like creatures as another minor Humanoid group, or as Daedra under Hercine

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Satyr i absolutely want to be the Goblin-like enemies in Valenwood though. The original inhabitants long since driven underground by the Bosmer

weary quiver
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I would like traditional fantasy druids. Also a rival animalistic cult druids. And an enemy nature defiler cult along the lines of witches or demon or ancient alien god wkrshippers

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And of course Tolkien stuff would fit in like shire and mirkwood, a hostile dreary forest

weak sapphire
stoic fiber
#

Not a fan of the whole WoW Fantasy Druid stuff. Wyrds are shapeshifters enough and the Bosmer Greenspeakers shape nature into houses as is. Tbf we even have historical druids as the Spinners. A new flavour of druids of the Breton would be much more interesting. As for enemies of nature... points to the Reachmen

weak sapphire
#

Just, everything ESO introduced wkth the Bosmer. Burn it down

stoic fiber
#

I whole heartedly disagree, I think it was a fantastic addition and it fits the Bosmer rather well

weak sapphire
#

I have nothing positive to say about ESOs Valenwood. Even Green-Sap and the Perchance Acorn is worn very thin on me the more i think about it

weary quiver
#

An enemy flesh golem faction faction that makes constructs out of human and animal remains

weak sapphire
#

Nah, just the Cult of Worms, making zombie constructs

#

Necromancy

weary quiver
#

Necromany not the same as flesh constructs

weak sapphire
#

Only in the same way that Daggers aren't swords

fluid tendon
#

Do you think creation engine 2 can do ladders by es 6?

#

🪜

weak sapphire
#

Creation can do ladders. Gamebryo could do ladders

#

The engine is not the problem.

fluid tendon
#

I heard Todd say that the reason they have fade to black ladders is because of the ai nav mesh gets broken because of it.

weak sapphire
#

Only because they can't figure it out

dim reef
#

I can understand that tbh

weak sapphire
#

Its a coding problen on the part of Bethesda, not an actual engine limitation

#

But then again, Bethesda's AI navmesh has trouble dealing with elevation changes anyway

dim reef
#

Navmeshes were a bane to my existence when I tried modding

nimble pond
#

Even tho you can pretty much bunny hop up rocks and mountains

fluid tendon
main anvil
#

Are there players stashes in ESO?

magic tundra
#

Stashes?

spice whale
#

ooh i remember i made stashes couple times in Oblivion. First time, i dropped some stuff behind some Tamika vineyard warehouse, can't remember why. Was overloaded, maybe? i left em, adventured a bit and when returned there were nothing ._ . learned about ~console magic a wee later, tcled to see what happened and found em floating like a meter beneath the ground, defying gravity

spice whale
#

my second stash, i cleared some vampire infestation in a cave near Bruma. was overloaded with loot and had some bounty on me. desided to do time, dropped all loot near the cave entance..
returned there after justice was served to find enemies respawned, loot gone. checked time and it turned out i spent bloody month 8n the prison, not couple of days as expected >.< yrah, those were the days

nimble pond
#

Lol, I always piled up loot in the entrance of every dungeon. Looked like an episode of hoarders

weak sapphire
weak sapphire
cinder idol
eager remnant
cinder idol
eager remnant
weak sapphire
#

Its ok

cinder idol
#

Absolutely fine by me.

eager remnant
weak sapphire
magic tundra
dim reef
#

|| < use these on both sides to make a spoiler tag

#

on pc you can right click for things like this

magic tundra
#

we also have cursive, bold, bold cursive, and strike through

dim reef
#

||Nvm I can mark words as spoilers quickly on mobile too||

weak sapphire
#

Nah, the old Forums had Tabs, which condensed entire sections of text to make it so you didn't just have massive walls of letters

dim reef
#

Oh

#

Yeah that one is a problem

weak sapphire
#

I mostly keep my more detailed ramblings on the Nexus nkw because they still have the feature

weary quiver
#

We need sad vault boy emoji again

nimble pond
prime marlin
#

||you can also often cancel commands with a slash||

#

*like this aswell*

#

~~and this~~

fringe path
#

Complaining about a lack of Oblivion gates in Skyrim is goofy imo

#

Nords hate magic

#

They would have torn them all down

nimble pond
#

Shouted them down like the big bad wolf

#

Read something a while ago that made me laugh tho about the argnoians basically chasing the daedra back into their own portals to close them to keep the argonians out lol

spice whale
#

we dont even know how stable that oblivion gate material is. maybe they decay like bread

magic tundra
weak sapphire
stoic fiber
#

void salt water*

dim reef
weak sapphire
#

The Oblivion Crisis definitely made it worse, but Magic was already disliked by traditional Nords by Morrowind. It was the purview of witches and the source of their troubles

stoic fiber
#

And why Jhunal left the North to join the Moth-People

dim reef
#

Yet ancient nords were rather fond of magic. Iirc mage or wizard in nordic meant elder man or something similar. It's also why a lot of draugr use magic.

weak sapphire
#

Oh absolutely. Once upon a time, the Nords were as magically incluned as the Altmer

#

I suspect the rise kf the Thu'um is what really drove the shift

#

The Nords learn the 'power of the gods' in the Dragon War, and conventional magic fades. By the time the Tongues are defeated at Red Mountain, conventional magic is rare amongst the Nords. Then, Jurgen does his thing, and the Thu'um starts to decline.

#

But instead of a resurgence in Magic, Magic us now viewed as an Elf thing, so the Nords distrust it

stoic fiber
#

Dragon Cult, Chimer, Falmer, Dwemer, Daedra. It added up over the eras

#

Ofc Skyrim isnt a monoculture. Each region, kingdom, and clan has their own views for sure.

weak sapphire
#

Huge missed opportunity woth Winterhold

#

They should have been pro-magic, crediting the College with saving the city from the Collapse

#

Then, you could explain their continued state by the other Holds not really wanting anything to do with a 'City of Witches' and it strangling trade

#

They could then have sided with Ulfric because he promised to officially endorse the College and drive trade back to the city by restoring the Clever Men.

magic tundra
stoic fiber
#

Hah, not those moth people. I meant the Imperials here.

dim reef
#

Finished dawnguard. It's a lot longer than i remember. Overall, 9/10.

thorn aurora
#

An idea I see come up quite often is that future TES titles should go by what the majority of players did in a game. Achievement data would be enough to determine quite a few instances of this, and for things that are generally split down the middle, the result could be kept vague. An interesting thought that sometimes comes up from a different camp. There's obviously the camp that doesn't want to be told anything.

#

But if you were to have canon endings, player chosen ones would be better.

dim reef
#

Ewww... Mass effect style where it botches writing and lore.

thorn aurora
#

No it's not Mass Effect style

#

Mass Effect/Dragon Age means that your own personal choices carry over

#

This is more majority rule

dim reef
#

Data from your prior game is mass effect style. Even if it's tweaked a bit, the idea is just...no to me.

thorn aurora
#

This isn't Mass Effect style 🤣

#

The idea that I've seen suggested is that a percentage of what players chose to do what is taken based off of data collected from the games themselves

#

between every player

dim reef
#

Yeah i'm still not a fan.

thorn aurora
#

And then you design a game based around that

#

Don't have to be a fan, but you can't say it's Mass Effect style

dim reef
#

Why should it be decided in the first place?

thorn aurora
#

I didn't say it should

#

I'm honestly happy either way

dim reef
#

You suggested a way to make "player endings canon" so that implies it should.

thorn aurora
#

I think the idea is interesting and thought it might make for an interesting discussion

thorn aurora
dim reef
#

To me, it just botches writing and lore and creativity. I didn't do the dark brotherhood, but because people did well now it's canon the protagonist did the dark brotherhood. It's fine how it already is. The main events are canonically done by the protagonist, everything else is said to have happened but either by you (if you say your protagonist did it) or some random person.

thorn aurora
#

Yeah that's not what's being suggested either

#

You keep thinking of this in a Bioware way

dim reef
#

What i'm getting from your statement is this: majority achievement means canon, i.e. if majority says players beat dark brotherhood then it's canon the last dragonborn did dark brotherhood

thorn aurora
#

It'd be more for things like "is Paarthurnax dead/alive" than direct statements about what a player did

#

Small little details

dim reef
#

But why is that needed? It bothered me that fallout 2 decided that the vault dweller was made a male and had his entire exploit explained canonically.

thorn aurora
#

I'm not saying it's needed, I think it's an interesting idea

#

I don't think I've heard of a game where the community voted for the future of the setting before with their actions

dim reef
#

It isn't. It just hampers creative freedom.

thorn aurora
#

It's not necessarily the best approach, it's just a novel one

thorn aurora
#

I'm not saying they're right either

#

There's a wide range of thought on this

#

And taking any option has its own pros and cons

#

The cons of never being able to reference any protagonist again is that the protagonist has very little impact on anything outside of the direct events

#

And even those can only be mentioned vaguely

#

But the pros is that you have more freedom within that blurry spot

#

The pros of the other idea is that you now as part of a conglomerate have some say in shaping the narrative and there's a decent chance that your decisions will carry over or create a feedback. Cons is that decisions could be invalidated, and obviously a lot of people wouldn't like it (including me probably)

dim reef
thorn aurora
#

I'm not "some people" lmao

#

You're punching at air

#

I'm pointing out that you are not the only perspective

#

And I think weighing different sides is fun

dim reef
#

I'm on the perspective that i'd prefer creative freedom in my roleplaying game.

thorn aurora
#

Sure

dim reef
#

If someone wants everything to be told they can go play a game like last of us.

thorn aurora
#

That isn't exactly the same thing but okay

#

(Neloth is alive no matter what you do)

mystic heart
#

Hello is there any modder here? I have a follower request for ps4

thorn aurora
nimble pond
# thorn aurora An idea I see come up quite often is that future TES titles should go by what th...

They could do this, but in smaller measures. Little things. But instead of just going off the "most popular" choices. It could instead be an optional thing for each player to select a save file from the previous game(s) on their cloud or harddrive of that individual player. It's not anything I'm all that worried abou, but if one wanted to do something like that, that's just how I would implement it

weak sapphire
#

Or, simply keep mutually exclusive choices with alternate endings to minor things no one will ever remember. The the local farmer girl marries, the traveling Bard or the town Blacksmith? Did the local Town Crier find his lost keys, or did his absent mindness get him robbed blind? Can Batman get himself out of this sticky situation?

magic tundra
#

No Echmer here

weak sapphire
#

Ok, so, since its come up again in Lore circles, and since i see some faces i don't recognise from the last time... Races... burn them to the ground

#

Or rather, make them visually deterministic but otherwise have no direct impact, opening up proper Cultural Backgrounds to play with

magic tundra
#

I like races having a small impact in gameplay, both stat-wise and story-wise
Nothing major, but a little

weak sapphire
#

With Khajiit and Argoniand as exceptions, the most i think is appropriate is maybe some minor resistances

stoic fiber
weak sapphire
#

The idea that all Dunmer, or Nords, or Altmer are cut from the same cloth is not only shallow, but inherently racist.

Instead, let us play with the cultural spread of the various populations. Give me the ability to pick between a Great House Dunmer, Ashlander, Refugee or even an Imperial (a naturalised immigrant) background.

stoic fiber
eager remnant
#

I like Selene's idea of giving each race a selection of racial bonuses and maluses to choose from at character creation. I think this would help eliminate the shallowness of all members of a race being identical, while at the same time making one race feel a bit different from another.

stoic fiber
spice whale
#

i'd kill to take a look at BGS's players stats. like, what's the most played race, what gear they choose, what they do in game mostly. BGS audience is mostly power players, right? can we agree on that? x) players pick race because of stats. Orcs in Skyrim have double damage boost if im right, could this mean majority of Dovahkiins are actually orcs?

violet lily
#

I've got at least one conflicting data point for your hypothesis: myself.

#

I always play Dunmer mage-types

spice whale
#

that's cool, and i myself run around wearing some rags even without enchantments \o/ and in ESO my main char doesnt have a weapon. And we're like what, 0,00000001%? and then my nephew keeps sending me vids titled How To Become A God in Skyrim

#

and i don't believe Bethesda would add one more menu in character creator, skills or passives menu. They ditched birth signs in Skyrim

weak sapphire
#

I mean, menues, stats and RPG mechanics are creeping jntk everything from Platformers to Shooters

spice whale
#

true that, but picking up buffs and passives is gameplay, not char creation menu

#

kinda surprising F4 has stats part in the intro. they fixed it in 76, ha ha

#

mass effect games even have quick start option. just skip char creator and play

#

i understand the fun of browsing stats menu but it's definitely not something to expect from TES6

thorn aurora
#

Well I'm glad this led to some constructive dialogue....eventually

#

TES comes from a long tabletop tradition of which the ethos is "anything can be attempted," and I'd like to see that maintained

magic tundra
#

"anything can be attempted"
About the only game that has restrictions for weapons, armor, and magic

weak sapphire
thorn aurora
#

That's where this idea that you should play the game and do whatever you want comes from

#

No vidya game is going to accomplish "anything can be attempted," at least not at this time

#

Dwarf Fortress is kind of getting closer

#

And the idea that mechanics that take you out of the immersion should be minimized is an old idea too

#

Pretty much everything Todd Howard says can be traced back to the 1960s and 1970s Twin Cities Gamers who would invent the RPG

spice whale
#

umm, okay, so what if these cultural background passives were perks you can pick during leveling? dunmer savage perk tree, house dunmer perk tree

thorn aurora
#

Eh idk, I feel like just having adjusted racial bonuses would ve enough

#

That's certainly something to explore though

weak sapphire
#

Spirit schmirit. The aim should be to create a better game, not maintain some fancy idea that never even really worked in the medium

thorn aurora
#

I think it's made better games than not

weak sapphire
#

I think it's held video games back, more often than not

thorn aurora
#

Can you give an example?

#

The narrative driven mechanical design of RPGs has infected everything, including Call of Duty

#

And if the RPG hadn't begun on such a novel approach, this probably would not have happened

#

Almost everything in gaming today partially owes that old zeitgeist some gratitude as far as I can tell

#

Concessions have to be made to the medium but I still think it's a good ethos

#

Never want to forget where you come from, including with RPGs

weak sapphire
#

True, but the adherance to that memory gets is terrible mechanics like Classes and atrocious Dialogue Systems

spice whale
#

i forgot the name but there was some text rpg, came out a couple years ago. main idea, you type whatever action you want and game reacts, creating some weird adventures. anybody tried it?

weak sapphire
#

And god awful Mutually Exclusive Ending stories

thorn aurora
#

I don't think classes are a bad mechanic

#

How good classes are is highly game dependent

#

Early games made them work well and a lot of the 90s ttrpgs just straight up removed them

#

I think being too heavy handed with class is bad

#

At least imo

#

Idk what you mean about dialogue system tbh. There is no dialogue system in most tabletop games I've seen

stoic fiber
#

I must agree with Lachdonin. A lot of good has come from RPGs, but like every "traditional/categorised" system is alas a limitation because it keeps game devs from straying off the golden path. Always fun to break the monomyth, with typical class systems and racial traits is a good place to start for betterment

thorn aurora
#

You're assuming here that D&D is the thing that best adheres to the ethos I'm talking about

#

I'm not really talking about D&D though

#

Ken Rolston made RuneQuest with the exact mentality I just gave

#

I actually run games in the OD&D tradition and classes are minimal and there is no social mechanic system

#

There are very little racial bonuses to be found too

#

Plenty of games ignore them

stoic fiber
#

Oh no I speak not with just DnD tabletop, tho it is ofc a big part of it. As for RuneQuest, while there are still old RPG traps here and there, it was nevertheless different. For example, there were no classes. And even races had minimal game mechanical effect outside of cultural interactions.

thorn aurora
#

The philosophy that made tabletop has nothing to do with these mechanics you are bringing up

#

You can throw away all of these mechanics and still beling to the philosophy

#

There's a difference between understanding what an RPG is and imitating the mechanical design of previous games

#

RPGs are about a data exchange between quantitative and qualitative in a way that enhances roleplaying, and about the idea that anything can be attempted

#

And that alone can be a long discussion

#

But one mechanic or another doesn't really matter in the face of this

weak sapphire
#

The problem is, the philosophy of "You can attempt anything" isn't possible in the medium. So attempting to recreate it actively spreads effort too thin

thorn aurora
#

Well yeah concessions have to be made

#

But plenty of games evoke the spirit

#

TES certainly does

#

I think that's enough

stoic fiber
#

Well, like a lot of things depend on what RPG means to you, as even the definition is personal. If it is "Narrative/Story > Gameplay" then sure. But it's one of those ideal vs actual things and the line between story and mechanic touches more than you think. Two faces of the same coin. By manipulating the Gameplay Mechs, you affect the Story Making Opportunity. Chisel and Marble

thorn aurora
#

I'm going by the actual definition given by academics who research the subject

stoic fiber
#

At the Academy of RPGs? 😛

thorn aurora
#

No

#

Various historians

#

There is a lot of documentation on how these games began and what makes them what they are

#

And one of the three main dudes who invented the entire genre is still alive

#

And he himself is an academic of game theory

weak sapphire
#

That alone doesn't make him right though. For instance, many, even most, RPGs do not qualify for the second criteria

thorn aurora
#

So that's the definition I stick to

weak sapphire
#

Does that mean that JRPGs, which are notoriously structured and linear, aren't RPGs?

thorn aurora
#

There are tabletop games that don't either but they are still tabletop RPGs

#

The point is not some literal perfection of choice

#

Before the RPG, games always had declared win conditions and were almost always zero-sum

#

What the RPG did was sort of untangle all of that and make it so that things not central to what would normally be the purpose of the game could be done

#

It was rooted in the Free Kriegspiel tradition that the Prussians started. It was an American variant for casual gaming that gave the phrase: "anything can be attempted"

#

In order to facilitate this though you needed a referee/DM

#

Today the game is the DM

#

Julian, the guy who built TES, was fixated on crafting a game that could function as a "perfect DM" but he was decades too early

#

But the idea is that you are playing an RPG and you get to attempt anything that the built-in system DM will let you do

#

There are obvious design limitations here, and if we need games to conform to a platonic ideal of a genre than the definition of said genre will no longer be good

#

Plenty of people have been part of this zeitgeist and conformed to the medium of video games without issue

#

And without this kind of philosophy you wouldn't have games like Fallout New Vegas, which is 100% rooted in this ethos

#

And TES would no longer be TES if you removed this philosophy from it

weak sapphire
#

Well, bear in mind, you're talking to someone who absolutely reviles New Vegas, which embodies my complain.

Nothing in Vegas matters. Its attempt to offer so many approaches and options renders them all meaningless. The medium is fundimentally unable to handle that yet, and adherance to that philosophy actively makes these games worse.

#

God awful writing, terrible world design, and Tarantino-esque wit didn't help it either of course.

thorn aurora
#

The majority of people will disagree with you on FNV, I'm sure you realize that

weak sapphire
#

Oh, i do. But the majority of people also think Retirement is a good idea, so... popular opinion doesn't always make you right.

weary quiver
#

i enjoyed fonv as much as any bethesda game, but it certainly is not the epitome of writing and rpg'ness as claimed by obsidian fans

thorn aurora
#

Well when it comes to enjoying what you like you are nearly always right

#

It's just compelling to someone like me who likes FNV and sees that the majority of people like it too

weary quiver
#

i like to have both the ncr and legion revile me so they send death squads at me. give the game some sembalnce of open worldness

thorn aurora
#

I can't see it as an example of something being done wrong

weak sapphire
#

It's more complex than that. Of course, bear in mind that i am at ny core an empiricist. The universe works on formula and math, us included. There is no individuality outside of physics.

thorn aurora
weak sapphire
#

People like what they like because of electrical and chemical reactions

thorn aurora
#

Lmao okay dude

weary quiver
#

legion would have been much more interesting if they were the most compelling faction. another example of poor writing

thorn aurora
#

That's very French

#

I know you hate hearing that but it's true

#

"Poetry is just ink on paper"

#

"I schooled the poets ayyyyyyyy lmao"

weak sapphire
#

No, Poetry is ink on paper eliciting the firing of neurons and drawing upon common memory forms to elicit a reaction.

thorn aurora
#

Lord have mercy Lach

#

Yes if you're going to be very reductive

#

Man don't take this as me insulting you, I love ya dude.

#

But you're talking crazy

weary quiver
#

as dirac so poignantly noted, physicists try to take obscure things and make it understandable too everyone as much as possible, poets do the opposite

thorn aurora
#

Yeah not what I was getting at

#

The point is that you can assemble things to have a whole greater than the sum

#

I can put together a human body from chemicals or even make a clone but it won't be you

#

And I can write poetry but it won't be Thoreau

#

Thick and thin concepts are being mixed here

#

And that's often a grave error of the rationalists

#

Hmmm yes chestfeeders

weak sapphire
thorn aurora
#

Which is why I specified a clone as well 🤣

weak sapphire
#

If you took the same genetic individual (a clone) and gave them all the same experiences, they would turn out the same

thorn aurora
#

It's possible but that is inferred

#

And such a thing isn't really possible anyways

#

It's not really a useful way to look at anything

#

Do I need to throw the definition of thick concepts into the chat

weak sapphire
#

No, it isn't. But, my point is we aren't talking about a reductionist system. Its not 'Simple', it is in fact extraordinarily complex. Every single experience reacts with every single other experience, which reacts with our biology down to an atomjc level.

There is no 'Soul', but a far more complex system of physical reaction

thorn aurora
#

I don't believe in souls

#

Outside of the emotional subconscious "soulfull" feelings

weary quiver
#

i believe souls are possible in a holographic infromational way possibly

weak sapphire
#

And because of this, everything we do or react to is, inherently deterministic. We lack the ability to really explout this fact, of course, but it doesn't change that.

thorn aurora
#

You believe it is deterministic

#

But you have no way to prove this

#

This is extrapolation rather than the scientific method

weak sapphire
#

There is a reason why stories, music and art follow structural formulas. It's taken us thousands of years to start understanding those formulas, but we know that they are thete now and create uniform psychological reactions.

weary quiver
#

plato was presciently correct, the basic building blocks of reality are abstract geometrical shapes

thorn aurora
#

You're presenting a far too black and white view of this

spice whale
#

is LOTR character driven or plot driven? if formulas were simple, i mean

weary quiver
#

if you approach it from the opposite end, art and aesthethics transforms human perception, like in wallace stevens 'idea of order at key west'

thorn aurora
weary quiver
#

tolkien himself was tapping deeply into pre-existing myths and archetypes

spice whale
#

ah, and i mentioned earlier about that text based RPG that attempts to allow everything, here it is
https://play.aidungeon.io/main/landing
i believe there will come time when this thing could also generate graphics in real time <3

weak sapphire
thorn aurora
#

I actually understand your argument and used to have similar sentiments when I was growing up. I get what you're saying

#

But I think it's not a very good way to look at things

#

I see a lot of "perspective of the universe" type thought here

#

But perspective of the universe isn't particularly inclusive of human perception derived information

#

And that's also a very important thing

#

Under the perspective of the universe, there really is no meaning in poetry. It's just the atoms in the ink and paper

#

And yet I can read poetry and can even correctly ascertain what the poet wrote. He can even tell me as much to confirm it

#

There's a lot of information within human perception itself

#

And if there wasn't we could not have invented so many concepts that are transcendent of mere biological function

#

The idea of thick concepts us that there are perception heavy words inherent to language, even emotion heavy words at that

#

However they do have encoded information in them

#

This is just a big part of life

#

People want to rename breastfeeders to chestfeeders to sound more "scientific." They are operating on a framework that everything must fit rationalist "perspective of the universe" lens

#

And yet this deletes important information from the system

#

This can be observed in as many things as you like, even things not purely emotional

#

The problem I have with this kind of thinking is that perception inherently provides context to information, and the perspective chosen here trends towards an absolutist conception of reality where all that matters is what the chemistry beaker holds

#

But this is ultimately myopic and blinding.

#

And it leads one to miss the point of a lot of things in life

#

Whoops Pseron is getting me back on topic

#

I'm assuming

eager remnant
thorn aurora
#

Anyways without going too much further...

#

Most people I see thinking this way are very depressed

#

Because ultimately they applied a microscope to meaning and discovered it did not exist

#

Despite people perceiving it all the time, even coming to shared conclusions demonstrating a few coherencies in what has been observed

#

To strip meaning out of a thing may be necessary for some labors but does not a good perception of existence make

#

Because the universe can't perceive anything to begin with

#

This is still all just human perception

#

Poetry is not just ink on a page

spice whale
thorn aurora
#

"Sorry for the mess"

eager remnant
spice whale
#

just wanted to illustrate that formulas in art dont always work x) many writers say they've no idea how the story will end, like it's characters dictate what happens next. not formulas

weak sapphire
#

My overall point is that, at their core, human reactions are predictable. We generally lack sufficient data to make accurate predictions, because of just how complicated it is, but that doesn't change the underlying dynamic.

As such, we should strive to understand what drives particular. But the flip side to thjs is, until confronted with a variable, we don't actually know what the reaction will be. This is part of what makes innovation so difficult in creative mediums, and what drives traditionalism.

thorn aurora
weak sapphire
thorn aurora
#

You assume

weak sapphire
#

True.

fringe path
#

Elder Scrolls fandom is going deep rn

weak sapphire
#

But based on past discoveries and studies, its far more likept that the inconsistencies are a result of missing data points than they are indicative of a fundimental lack of predictability.

thorn aurora
#

All I can say Lach is that poetry has meaning in my world and it's ink in yours. Something isn't right here. 🤣

weak sapphire
#

No, it has meaning in both. I just take a longer route to get there.

thorn aurora
#

Meaning is not scientific

#

Science can explain perceptions of meaning, sure

#

But they are still different concepts

fringe path
thorn aurora
#

Alright Yannick what cool TES thing you got for us

weak sapphire
#

Im just taking the scenic route.

fringe path
#

So from what I researched the forebear/crown dichotomy seems very reminiscent of the differences between how the Berbers and Saracens handled their cultures (and interpretations of Islam but that's another thing entirely)

#

So if TESVI is in Hammerfell I wanna see that reflected in the architecture and dress of each area. Maybe weapon skins, too.

weak sapphire
#

My point, pertaining to the original conflict, is that adhering to the idea 'Anything Can Be Attemted' ultimately leads to an overabundance of options and a total lack of meaning to them. Sure, you can kill anyone, by why? What purpose does it serve, when the game is fundimentally unable to appropriately react to that action?

thorn aurora
#

Just for clarification Lach, have you played tabletop under those principles?

fringe path
#

Do you think spears and throwing weapons could see a return?

weak sapphire
#

I habe extensively DMd over the years and do adhere to that idea. My players can try anytbing they want.

thorn aurora
#

Ah, okay

weak sapphire
thorn aurora
#

I like games that let me do more things

#

Even in vidya

#

This is also the main appeal of TES for people

#

Most people play TES for the freedom

fringe path
weak sapphire
#

And that's fair, but the problem os when More ends up being an illusion. Look at Weapon Types in Morrowjnd and Skyrim

#

Morrowind has more weapon Skills and Types, but Skyrim actually gives those types meaning. Skyrim, even though it has less on tue surface, does more under the surface

thorn aurora
#

Sure

#

But this doesn't go against the basic principle

#

They just had to make sacrifices

#

People generally don't make things that embody the platonic ideal of something, but I think motivation and what drives them is still relevant

#

I don't think often get games loke TES because the philosophies are different in outlook

#

There's a difference between having a focused more linear game as a priority and striving for a less focused game with more to do that you still have to narrow more to add more depth

#

I think if they didn't have the old tabletop ethos, there would be no drive to make TES the way it is

weak sapphire
#

And that's why i vastly favour Objective based design. What do we want to be able to do? Thats objective 1. How do we do it? Thats objective 2

thorn aurora
#

Even though they have to make concessions

weak sapphire
#

Just tossing everything in fkr the sake of having it doesn't inherentmy give you more.

fringe path
#

I think thematically there's sort of that thing in the story or setting that drives the shaping of the game mechanics. I could be wrong tho. I mean Skyrim had the Thu'um and kill animations as well as mounted combat. Oblivion added horses and idk what else lol. Hammerfell, assuming that's the setting, has arguably the most warrior-centric culture even by the standards of other warrior cultures, so it would make sense for greater weapon variety as well as a combat mechanics overhaul to make it into the game

thorn aurora
#

Lach you like TES though right? Don't you just want to have more of what is working?

#

Why would we abandon one ideal for another when the OG ideal is working and producing content people like

#

If TES switched from open world fixations on being able to attempt as many things as possible, the backlash would be immense and the series itself might die

weak sapphire
thorn aurora
#

The fans would see this as a betrayal of their interests

weak sapphire
#

I enjoy it as it is, but im also constantly frustrated by just how close it comes tk truly revolutionary

fringe path
thorn aurora
#

It's never going to be perfect man

#

TES tends to make you notice all the could have beens

fringe path
#

@weak sapphire he/him?

weak sapphire
#

Its uniquely poised tk really reform the entire RPG concept in video gaming, but its always just clinging too much to old school solutions and approaches and unable to just take that extra step

weak sapphire
thorn aurora
#

But that's because the more TES strives for greatness, the more flaws you see

fringe path
#

Ok cool cool

spice whale
thorn aurora
#

The last decade has seen several variations on the TES design

#

Almost all of them flopped

#

Except the Witcher 3, chiefly

#

Turns out these are really hard games to make

fringe path
thorn aurora
#

I'm not saying whether W3 is good or bad. Just saying it didn't flop and was a massive success

fringe path
spice whale
weary quiver
#

witcher 3 is the outlier for cdpr. and i am more convince then ever it was a very mediocre game, never having played it XD

fringe path
#

Ok that's fair

thorn aurora
#

So now we have to question whether W3 was catching lightning in a bottle

spice whale
#

red dead redemption 2 is kinda close to TES by its freedom

weary quiver
#

beth is bad at support characters, look at healing magic in skyrim 😛 hope beth does imrpove that in their next game. the fantasy trope is a fellowship

thorn aurora
#

It came out right when people wanted more open world games like TES

weak sapphire
#

Trying to hold a ck versation while working is a nightmare...

weary quiver
#

lets just say w3 involved a ridiculous amount of shilling and proseltyzing

fringe path
thorn aurora
weak sapphire
#

Anyway, the core problem, at least in my mind, is "It just works". People poke fun at Beth all the tkme fkr tbis, but i think jts at the core of everything they do wrong

thorn aurora
#

I have also noticed the shilling

weary quiver
#

it was probably a decent god of war clone

weak sapphire
#

Its not 'It just works', its really 'It JUST works'.

As in, it works? Good. Move on to something else.

thorn aurora
thorn aurora
weary quiver
#

saints row 2 was the closest spiritually to a beth game

fringe path
weak sapphire
spice whale
#

missions in rdr2 arent too scripted from what ive seen

fringe path
#

I'd say BotW is the closest any game has come to Skyrim's level of freedom imo

spice whale
#

still havent completed it

thorn aurora
thorn aurora
weary quiver
#

hmm? r* missions are linear... although i never played rdr2

#

i'm still butthurt r* ceo lied and gaslit us about gta5 single player

thorn aurora
#

Dragon Age Inquisition, Final Fantasy XIV (original release), and Cyberpunk 2077 did not work

weak sapphire
fringe path
thorn aurora
weak sapphire
#

Its functional. And that is all. You can't create deep and thoughtful and engaging gameplay loops which mechanics that ultimatly function at the bare minimum

fringe path
#

Very true

thorn aurora
#

Everyone who did something better than TES had to sacrifice something else that TES did well

weary quiver
#

as i like to repeat beth should improve their speech system, go more back towards oblivion or as i proposed something similar to current madden scouting system

thorn aurora
#

It's very hard to get that much more out of man hours

weary quiver
#

but not sure who does a better speech system than bethesda. its all crap out there

fringe path
thorn aurora
weak sapphire
fringe path
weary quiver
#

i'm one of the few who didnt hate it for fo4, its more responsive to roleplaying actually when you can quickly answer an npc with a known response rather than read through a list

thorn aurora
#

Fallout New Vegas style speech system is probably something they should aim for

#

It worked really well

weary quiver
#

obsidian is still push a button to move the convo

thorn aurora
#

It basically is a refinement of Bethesda's dialogue systems

fringe path
fringe path
thorn aurora
weary quiver
#

the major issue is there is no real reason to talk to someone in a city except as a fetch/kill quest starter/finisher and an elaborate inventory management system

thorn aurora
#

What? Dude I actually roleplay in that game

#

Like a lot

weary quiver
weak sapphire
thorn aurora
#

Honestly if you want to throw out the whole system for dialogue in favor of maximizing reactibility, you're getting Dragon Age Origins system or nothing at all

#

Because otherwise you're not getting an improvement anywhere

weak sapphire
thorn aurora
#

Most of the time when FNV is stupid it's in a fun way

#

Which is a pretty old Fallout aesthetic

weary quiver
#

i proposed a better speech system 😛 again you're missing out on a major component of tabletop rpg if there is really no reason to visit a city, or lets say adventure in a city

thorn aurora
#

So what is your speech system

#

I never miss out on any components of tabletop RPGs fyi 😜

weary quiver
#

something akin to madden scouting, where you spend points to gain more info on a player, similarly you can use speech points on npc dispositions to learn more of their like/dislike

thorn aurora
#

Nah

#

This is a mechanic that will reduce immersion

#

The tabletop equivalent is replacing dialogue at the table with only die rolls

weary quiver
#

but sometimes you have to forgo immersion for fun and purpose

thorn aurora
#

Different strokes for different folks

#

To me that's way less fun and enjoyable

#

I delete mechanics like that in every game I run

fringe path
thorn aurora
#

And at my table we call that bad design 😜

weary quiver
#

i enjoy minutiae, so that is why i play bethesda games. i also like open world strategy games and can no longer player your typical rts

#

i also like the 50 pages of critical hit tables in lotr tabletop rpg

thorn aurora
#

Clearly the apex design is CK3 dialogue using the Bioware dialogue wheel but only with the Morrowind topics as response prompts

#

Hell yeah, I win everything

weary quiver
#

beth world is open world and emergent. cities are not and thats the issue - but thats most games

weak sapphire
#

Of every system ive seen, Fallout 4s remaind the best. Easy offloading of interaction onto secondary inputs so it doesnt take away character control in conversation.

Easy branching that allows for up to 16 options per dialogue layer, all within a single branch. And ultimately being able to acess thkse 16 options with fewer keystrokes than a traditional list.

#

How Fallout 4 USED it was terrible though.

weary quiver
#

it was condusive to rp. if you're a smartass character, you know where the sarcastic response is, without reading through a list where it might be 1st, last, somewhere in the middle, none at all

fringe path
#

I just don't get why there wasn't a "more options" thing in the dialogue system

#

Not to mention way too few skill checks for characters who specialize in speech

#

Far Harbor did what it could to remedy that but you can only do so much

weak sapphire
fringe path
#

You sure?

weak sapphire
#

Yeah, we did a breakdown of it back in 2017ish on the forums

#

The problem isn't the number of speech checks, its that... most of the time they don't DO anything. They just give you a different dialogue reaction that leads to the same end, so no one remmebers them.

#

Which is just another example of how More is pointless unless it does something.

#

Its sort if like how everyone says its too easy to master everything in Skyrim, failing to recognise the fact that, until Dragonborn, it was LITERALLY IMPOSSIBLE to do.

fringe path
#

I did notice the speech checks didn't do anything for me except in Far Harbor

weak sapphire
#

Yeah. Again, despite being the best system, what Fallout 4 actually did with its system was... well, awful.

#

Still, you don't call a Screwdriver a bad tool just because you're using it like a hammer

fringe path
#

I do wish I could actually read what my character was going to say though

#

Which is why I personally prefer the dialogue wheel in BioWare games

weak sapphire
#

Bioware wasn't great at it either

#

Better, but...

#

In situations where you are actively going to voice your PC, you really do need those options to be comprehensive

fringe path
#

Don't voice the PC then

weak sapphire
#

That would be my solution, yes.

#

With an unvoiced PC, so long as the intent of an option is clear, the prose doesn't matter

magic tundra
#

Rumors!
Bravil!
Mages Guild!

fringe path
magic tundra
#

Oblivion dialogue system

spice whale
#

what

#

..ESO's next dlc or what's this about

magic tundra
#

Oblivion's dialogue system

weary quiver
#

the choice of different voiced actors in saints row 2 added a lot to your character

nimble pond
#

They just need to make player creation more unique. I didn't necessarily like how the took the night eye effect of the Khajiit and made into a power or spell as well.. (I think a potion too, but I'm not 100% on that). Instead of granting the same exact effect for everyone, achieve it with different methods. Like Mages have light spells already and warriors can use torches.

cinder idol
nimble pond
#

Same with Argonians and water-breathing

spice whale
#

is there even a way to get that info? no achievements for this thing

weak sapphire
#

Night Eye has been a spell since Morrowind though

spice whale
#

ZOS posted their data, i remember Altmer were the most played in ESO

#

but that's mmo, no power fantasy here

weak sapphire
dim reef
#

i think the redguard part is because redguards kinda dont really have anything going on for the racial bonuses

weak sapphire
#

If we get a game in Hammerfell it will be most telling, i suspect

#

And i already suspect i'm going to hate it

dim reef
#

i love how i looked up redguard stats and theres like 3 racial perks wheeze

#

actually its even less than that

weary quiver
#

redguard had a decent bonus to stamina. i would think elves were least played because they all ugly in skyrim

#

for mass appeal, i think a temperate area is best, like high rock. i know i know it will likely be a tolkien clone. the star of skyrim was skyrim.

dim reef
#

i like elves

weary quiver
#

people like trees. like bob ross

dim reef
#

i like bob ross too

weary quiver
#

bob ross will never lead you wrong

weak sapphire
#

Yeah, let's be real. We know why Redguard are the least played.

weary quiver
#

people dont like curved swords

weak sapphire
#

Elves and Beast Folk are easy enough to detach from real world people.

weary quiver
#

like skyrim guards

dim reef
weary quiver
#

redguard had a stamina bonus, but orcs had better fighter perks so maybe redguards were shunted by that

#

i don't like elves. they're usually portrayed as 1 dimensional goody two shoes. i like dwarves, while basically good are avaricious, resentful and stubborn

#

i do like dark elves usually

weak sapphire
magic tundra
#

well, none of the TES elves are goody two shoes

spice whale
#

i like TES elves because they get to live long, pointy eared bastards

weak sapphire
#

Maybe i don't want a game in Hammerfell... I am pretty sure the Race Pick statistics will make me hate humanity... Lets go somewhere less hot button hmm?

dim reef
#

goody two shoes?

#

theyre always the villain

cinder idol
cinder idol
weak sapphire
dim reef
#

Bethesda's games should use a radius more than a direct compass marker. Take for example finding septimus signus. The people who point you to him say "idk where, somewhere north in the ice fields" and you instantaneously know where this long lost guy is. Plus this would also make knowing clairvoyance more useful.

#

Eso does that

#

Not all the time but some quests like to do it

violet lily
#

In Morrowind you get directions like "Northeast of Caldera, past the egg mine but before the foyada"

#

and there's no markers

dim reef
#

I don't mind certain quest markers. Mainly for npcs that roam around (due to them having schedules). But for times that it's like the septimus signus example, it shouldn't go "he is riiiiight here.

weak sapphire
#

Yeah. Though Area Markers weren't common yet in 2011, so i can forgive the failure in Skyrim to use htem.

#

Now, they're basically standard, to GPS tracking markers aren't acceptable in most cases anymore

dim reef
weak sapphire
dim reef
#

I will give bethesda credit as they don't use a minimap. But still.

weak sapphire
#

Yeah

#

Area Markers also fit a nice abstract for 'Directions' rather than having to have every single NPC explicitly state them

sinful hatch
#

For someone who doesn't have the time to have to search for everything, quest markers are great.

nimble pond
#

And yeah, markers basically make clairvoyance void. But like the other guy said, not everyone has the time for all that in trying get into a quest or finish one. I would just simply make it a toggle option in the settings menu for the game.

weak sapphire
#

Maybe integrate it all directly into the Clairvoyance Spell.

magic tundra
#

I want a system that helps with "ok I'm in that area now, which quests do i have here"
Which Skyrim's approach does, but clairvoyance would not

weary quiver
#

stealth archers were op, but most powerful was my khajit merchant crafter with no combat perks

cinder idol
weary quiver
#

yes its a virtuous cycle of crafting, ehnchanting and alchemy. plus selling potions of poison, bonus endurance and cold resistance for 5000

#

a hammefell setting would be cool if it focused more on sumerian and babylonian themes and culture. and have rare oasis i can settle and fortify

dim reef
#

dovakiin

#

dovakiin

weak sapphire
#

naal ok zin los vahriin

fringe path
#

Can we talk about how good Bethesda made archery feel in Skyrim?

#

I have yet to see another studio come close

#

Maybe Ubisoft with Far Cry

sinful hatch
#

Which is why all my characters become stealth archers.

#

No matter how they start out.

fringe path
#

I can DM the perk trees to specialize in if need be

magic tundra
sinful hatch
#

@fringe path is it the game from 2007?

sterile field
#

archery is nice. havent played it in skyrim in years though lmao

fringe path
sinful hatch
#

Oh

weary quiver
#

i had trouble killing deer with a bow early on

fringe path
fringe path
# sinful hatch Oh

Yeah you specialize in Archery, Sneak, Destruction, Conjuration (but not necromancy), Restoration, and Alchemy. It's great fun imo and offers tons of roleplaying potential

sinful hatch
#

All my archery classes are maxed out. Smithing and enchanting are maxed. So I usually end up with a maxed out dragon bone bow that is dual enchanted.

fringe path
#

Oh Enchanting too I forgot that one

sinful hatch
#

The archery in oblivion is definitely a step down from skyrim.

fringe path
weary quiver
#

the world building in horizon dark zero is really oddball, archery in robot dinosaur world. who thought that up

fringe path
sterile field
#

horizon had some of the most fun combat to me

weary quiver
#

its a bizarre mismash

sinful hatch
#

I'm planning on replaying the old games. I'm out of work from shoulder surgery. Will be a couple more weeks before I can game on my pc. I did recently start fallout 3. Will probably start oblivion after that.

sterile field
#

hitting weakpoints on dinosaurs was a fun time

fringe path
sinful hatch
#

Could never get into morrowind though or else I'd play it as well.

sterile field
#

has a hump at the beginning for new players for sure, but everything about it is very enthralling to me

sinful hatch
#

I could never get much further than the first town. Coming from games with quest markers, morrowind is difficult to play.

fringe path
#

has it occurred to anyone on here that maybe the TESVI reveal trailer wasn't meant to be taken as a hint or anything and we all took the bait? I feel silly

weak sapphire
fringe path
#

fair...

spice whale
#

"I don't want to spoil anything yet. I think the teasers we put out are announcing the game, and ones of tone. How does the game feel? Hints at where it's set, for both Starfield and Elder Scrolls set. Even for us, though, redoing that music and putting it up there, even we get goosebumpy. We can't wait to have everybody be able to play this game. But that's us, too. We want to play it."

weary quiver
#

its also quite possible beth completely change their minds about things since the trailer

weak sapphire
#

When harassing a developer about a future game as far out as TES6 was st the time of that teaser... yeah thats always a risk

cyan stag
#

Wow, I am so overwhelmed with ESO. It just seems like there is an encyclopedia of knowledge required.

dim reef
#

I can understand that

#

Neh, tbh there’s a lot of things people probably never knew about when going into eso that I never thought about

#

You know things that just get thrown at you

hardy halo
#

Hi y'all

dim reef
#

Hoi hoi!

#

Welcome to the coloured rooms! I think…

fringe path
#

So I brought it up in Starfield chat and they brushed it off and told me to just go play Assassin's Creed lol so I wanna know what your guys' take is on advanced movement options in Bethesda titles, like sprint-sliding, vaulting over small obstacles, and being able to pull up onto ledges

eager remnant
fringe path
#

This is true for sure

rich shadow
#

In the elder scrolls 6 I hope we get to find out more about the dwemer.

I also really hope we can get another version of the arena like in Oblivion.

dim reef
magic tundra
#

I think he intends it to stay a mystery
Some things are better that way

nimble pond
#

Mystery is good for building up on it. Small lil bits of information to make you wonder and indulge more in the mystery until it eventually is revealed

weak sapphire
#

Especially in regard to lightly armoured 'Thief' styles of play, i think that sort of movement versatility could be really valuable.

fringe path
#

Absolutely

#

I just really loved the feeling of danger while exfiltrating Markarth after Calcelmo's Museum and the fact I didn't get that feeling for the rest of it really bummed me out.

magic tundra
#

are you telling me Goldenglow was a walk in the park for you?

weary quiver
#

arena's conceptually sounds like a cool idea, but its always lamely implemented. its just fighting in a smaller enclosed space the same monsters you can be fighting out in the open world

weak sapphire
weary quiver
#

i think todd wants to keep the dwemer the big mystery. for me it made exploring skyrim ruins more interesting, the possibilty that we might discover something about their dissapearance - although knowing in the back of my mind todd won't reveal that

fringe path
weak sapphire
#

Pfft, only time i used an invisibility potion was infiltrating the Thalmor Embassy

fringe path
#

Ohok well aren't you cool

weak sapphire
#

Truth be told, i usualy just forget magical potions are a thing

fringe path
#

Most of my Skyrim characters are alchemists haha

weary quiver
#

if i see flowers blooming in real life i want to pick it

dim reef
#

make sure you don't steal them from peoples gardens. thats stealing and property damage

weary quiver
#

but muh alchemy potions

cinder idol
#

What effects can you get from Japanese Knotweed again?

fringe path
#

I've done that before where I see a plant like nightshade or something and I'll ask the person who lives there if I can take a cutting from it. They usually say yes

dim reef
#

Oh?

#

I mean I made a clarification to not steal but I’m surprised people will let you take some plants if you ask

weary quiver
#

nightshade is real now?!?

dim reef
#

Yeah nightshade is a real plant

#

Potatoes and tomatoes are in the nightshade family

#

But there’s also deadly nightshade which will kill you so don’t eat it

nimble pond
dim reef
#

Better! Make a stone golem in the shape of a troll to guard your garden!

nimble pond
#

And I can have him attend to the chickens as well

#

Lmao

dim reef
#

Make two stone golem trolls

nimble pond
#

True

#

Farmer troll. He will wear a straw hat, overalls and a lavender stem in his mouth

dim reef
#

Aww

#

I wanna draw this troll now

nimble pond
#

Mod it

dim reef
#

Modding is hard

nimble pond
#

All in a hard days work tilling this land

#

That would be hilarious if they did bring sneaking in thru windows to TESVI. All those lonely pies sitting on windowsills.. I would be the notorious pie thief of all Tamriel. Sounds like another great chapter of the Lusty Argonian.

dim reef
fringe path
#

Unpopular opinion: Creation Club is fine. The content is content I want in my game and I don't like getting shamed for paying into what some people think is a bad service

weak sapphire
#

I think, like most microtransaction systems, its over priced. But otherwise i have no real complaints.

#

I think they could cut prices by half, to increase sales volume, and still make a tidy profit.

magic tundra
#

yeah, it's definetly overpriced
I would also have expected their models to be closer to vanilla art style in terms of materials
I mean, look at the vanilla dwarven helmet and the dwarven mail helmet - despite them being 80% identical shape-wise, the dwarven mail one is shiny as hell

fringe path
#

Because the dwarven mail is based on Elder Scrolls Blades

magic tundra
#

I know that
still, they could have at least tried to get the different texture map values similar to vanilla

weary quiver
#

Modding in farm trolls should be relatively easy. Just use preexisting trolls and give it a straw hat

dim reef
#

How do I add in the straw hat though @-@

weary quiver
#

Cc Slocum Joe pack is one of the greatest content in recent gaming

dim reef
#

I’ve tried this before and I raged

weary quiver
#

I'm the ideas guy

dim reef
#

I had a idea for a mod a year ago and the ideas I had were impossible to implement in creation kit

#

So I’m withered

magic tundra
#

I always check my ideas agains my skills and discard the ones I deem impossible

onyx pewter
#

Hmmm I do feel in ES6 that magic books should be harder to come by, noticing in Skyrim that scrolls are kinda useless. You only get one use out of them and when your a full fledged mage you use up books to learn the spell anyway . Perhaps in the next chapter ones character can collect pages of a spell to create a book to fully learn the spell. I also like the idea of once learning the spell the book is not destroyed, instead you can collect books and add it to a bookcase at home or once a book is fully complete it becomes really expensive and highly valued. Spell vendors only carry basic spells but are really expensive to buy. And mage teachers at a college teach more advanced spells but those spells are still quite average. Only the arch mage knows powerful spells and you character has to work his way up the ranks in order to be taught by him. I feel that there should be really old powerful spell books or pages that are hidden throughout the land that not even the college teaches, hidden secret magic.

#

Basically make the spellcaster journey ES6 way harder this could probably be said for many different facets of the game 🙂

weary quiver
#

We should have rune magic

fringe path
#

i love this discord

#

ngl

#

it's been great to talk to people who actually care about BGS games so my friends don't have as much of a reason to pick on me haha

weary quiver
#

Bgs fans are the elite nobility of gamers

weak sapphire
weary quiver
#

we are the philosopher kings and sons of heaven

dim reef
weak sapphire
#

:P

#

Seriously though, i do find BGS fans to generally be less toxic than most fanbases these days. T'wernt always like that though

dim reef
weary quiver
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strangely enough gtao forum members were well mannered, maybe because of good moderation. the actual fanbase of course...

weak sapphire
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Lol

hazy glacier
dire compass
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i never fast travel in skyrim

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i walk it like a true adventurer

hazy glacier
dim reef
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I haven’t but it’ll be fun to

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I think I was referencing Cicero there tbh @-@

weary quiver
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i rarely ft in a bethesda game, only if i'm going back and forth in an area that i already cleared or through an area that doesn't spawn anything, like country crossing to prydwen. i ft in fo76 all the time since its mp

weak sapphire
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I tend to have very little free time, so i extensively fast travel

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When i only have an hour, spending 45 minutes just getting to my destination is not fun

weary quiver
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maybe you want to be a farmer troll wearing a straw hat

weak sapphire
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I could do that, yes

dire compass
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do u guys have lots of mods

weak sapphire
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Nevermind, the answer is yes.

dire compass
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oh my bad wrong chat lol

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I meant skyrim

weak sapphire
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I was being kinda snarky

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As i mod evert game that supports mods. And some that don't

magic tundra
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depends on yoru definition of "lots"

fringe path
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I have like 25 mods I think and a handful of "Creations"

eager remnant
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I don't use as many mods as I did back in the Morrowind era. Back then I often had 500 or more in one game. These days I limit myself to about 50.

dim reef
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i think it'd be neat if skills that normally improved in combat also improved outside of combat. now, to make it not so easy to just get level 100 by not having any risks, i think there could be some limitations.

for example, say the blade skill can now level up when you attack dummies, that'll stop when the skill reaches level 25. and i'd like sparring to be a thing, that can stop at level 50. so for 50 extra levels, you'll need to level it up normally. same with armor skills, heavy armor improves while just moving around in it, though will stop at level 25. also these methods would increase them slightly slower than normal.

fringe path
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Interesting

weak sapphire
weak sapphire
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Like, when i approach Rakeesh for training in Shapir, it doesnt fade to black and i get exhausted and get skill points... i actually have ti FIGHT HIM. the difference being I'm not actually at risk of dying, but I'm still DOING something.

When im training my Agility in the Simbani villiage, i actually need to try to cross the balancing beam.

When im sitting with Kreesha learning Magic, i actually have to CAST the spells she wants.

weary quiver
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you could increase archery by archerying things with archer lady in skyrim

weak sapphire
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I won't lie. I hate that that sentance made so much sense.

eager remnant
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I am adding the word "archerying" to my vocabulary. 🏹

weary quiver
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i wouldn't mind really expensive high level trainers. bgs games do need cap sinks

magic tundra
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They need what?

weak sapphire
cinder idol
cinder idol
magic tundra
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The dark brotherhood has what kind of birds?

cinder idol
cinder idol
nimble pond
cinder idol
weak sapphire
fringe path
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What are 5 ways to make magic more satisfying in future TES titles?

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Again BGS has done fantastic work with making archery feel perfect and literally nobody comes close to them in terms of that, but melee and magic need reworked

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What are some of the best magic systems in gaming to date?