#starfield-lore

1 messages · Page 6 of 1

safe kite
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Oh, was she the shadowy creepy crawly thing?

Nice.

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I'll update the wiki.

daring lake
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At first sight it looks like House Va'ruun are going to need some help to
overcome whatever it is that is destroying them. As for Anasko, I don't know.

scenic loom
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think House Va'ruun is just stuck where ever they are? and we have to find them and help them?
and the zealots are just escapees?

safe kite
scenic loom
rigid kiln
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also 3rd named location in Dazra, Herald's Rest

daring lake
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Good spot Nieves ... also ... looking at other parts ... That planet looks
nothing like Serpentis IV

jaunty ginkgo
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Oh that's a manufacturer's branded cockpit alright

rigid kiln
jaunty ginkgo
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Is there a name for the coming-of-age knife? I saw it in that previous shot

rigid kiln
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Nah, I just refer to it as groat skull blade

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I also feel like the ritual of killing the groat is the Rite of Kre'jar

daring lake
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It almost seems as though the entire city has been ripped out of the ground
and then placed in its current location.
It reminds me of the terrain we find around many of the Temples.

rigid kiln
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I'm pretty sure this is on-top of the scaled citadel

jaunty ginkgo
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I just remembered, based on the weapons I had expected the city to be green in overall palette

rigid kiln
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well I now have 3 fauna, 3 flora

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2 fauna are unnamed but whateverI feel like that's enough to make a lore page for va'ruun'kai soon

keen acorn
rigid kiln
keen acorn
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I checked its short 5

rigid kiln
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if you are refering to the va'ruun planets, those are the planets just renamed

keen acorn
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No astronomical charts of the real serpentis system. The Starfield is short 5 officially.

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I did my due looking for 2 days

rigid kiln
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???

keen acorn
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So they can open 5 objects for the DLC when it comes live.

daring lake
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Are these 5 listed as absolutes. Or are they in the possible/probable column?

rigid kiln
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I'm pretty sure Alpha Serpentis (Unukalhai) has no confirmed planets?

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unless you are refering to the Serpens constellation which has 15 stars that have confirmed planets

keen acorn
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In true life astronomy - you can look it up at nasa and other sites. The Starfield system is short 5 plaents/objects for Serpentis system. The Starfield chart has its true astronomy designation. its easy to cross reference.

daring lake
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What is the actual cat.no. for the main star?

rigid kiln
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source?

keen acorn
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Nasa - the star chart designation of astronomy - there are two official listings of exisitng start systems. One is used for our dgames Serpentis system.

rigid kiln
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can you just link it please

keen acorn
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Its short 5

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its research give me a few

safe kite
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Always best to have the sources handy to link instead of stating it was looked up.

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Source: NASA is more compelling than Source: Trust me, bro

rigid kiln
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Like I know that the serpens constellation has multiple planets but I thought Alpha Serpentis (Unukalhai) has no confirmed planets

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and that's serpentis in game

analog junco
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Groats were in the trailer too

daring lake
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I'll be a minute but I'll find it.

rigid kiln
daring lake
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.... just need to get the Gliese number ...

rigid kiln
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I'm pretty sure Dosai confused Alpha Serpentis with Serpens constelation

versed tangle
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I just checked the Gliese number for the Serpentis system (GL 596.2) - no known exoplanets

rich zenith
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@rigid kiln Hey! Do you manage the starfield wiki?

rigid kiln
rich zenith
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Great to see how invested you are in it though! Hoping SS really adds to the lore, like Shivering Isles did

silk lotus
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watch us get va'ruun paints and skins before we get a discord role.

daring lake
exotic nacelle
rigid kiln
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:)

sharp tendon
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inb4 the great serpent is a heatleech that snuck it's way into the ||unity.||

safe kite
sharp tendon
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what actually do we know of House Va'ruun doctrine in game, other than Isolationism, Fanaticism, and Xenophobia.

They have an Eschatology that is very Abrahamic, insofar: Linear, meaning there is an apocalypse that will come. Punishing the unbelievers, reward the faithfull.

rigid kiln
sharp tendon
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iirc from chats with the Va'ruun characters in game, the religious is rather fatalistic, thinking there is a set destiny?

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very mysticism oriented, trying to glimpse meaning in "the voice of the serpent" it seems.

daring lake
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Only the hard line Zealots "punish" unbelievers.
as Andreja says "They have interpreted .... (scripture etc.) .. in the harshest way possible"
The "punishment" is being sacrificed. Fatalistic, but not mystic. The Great Serpent is real
to them, and it spoke to Jinan. who passed his teaching on ...

rigid kiln
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The great serpent only spoke with Jinan, however members of house va'ruun get visions of the great serpent, probably by venom tree sap

sharp tendon
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somewhat reminding of apocalyptic abrhamic cults and mystic sects. Gnostics, Qumran Caves Sects, and to lesser extend more radical modern day apocalyptic groups. New age Christian or Radical islamist alike.

@daring lake mystic doesn't have to mean not real. People who believe say, in the Zohar, believe it's very real, even tho most evidence point to it being made up in the 14th century.

daring lake
sharp tendon
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Mystic in religion as I understand is dealing with mysteries, the unknown, something more based on experience and gleaming secret knowledge and interpreting it, rather than logical arguments and sophistry. All religion has mysterious elements, but it's the difference between say in Judaism having your morning prayer to thank god, vs putting a talisman under your pillow and salt on your floor to ward off bad spirits.

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or, say in ancient greece, the difference between sacrificing a goat to zues, and going to a temple of Demeter, sitting in a dark room, and getting high on something narcotic/alchoholic and seeing visions.

daring lake
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Yes. But here we deal with a work of fiction that has at its heart something
that is not mystical at all.

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An anthropologist may be interested in how fiction deals with religion. But here
there is something strikingly "un-mystic" going on 🙂

sharp tendon
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Hearing voices from a god in something otherwise mundane (grav jumping) and then interpreting it is classic mysticism. That's how the oracles in delphi worked. that's how much of mysticism works. Interpreting signs via secret knowledge.

safe kite
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mysticism

Fun reads 😄

Mysticism

Mysticism is popularly known as becoming one with God or the Absolute, but may refer to any kind of ecstasy or altered state of consciousness which is given a religious or spiritual meaning. It may also refer to the attainment of insight in ultimate or hidden truths, and to human transformation supported by various practices and experiences.
The...

sharp tendon
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House Va'ruun claim to have access to knowledge only they have, because only they the worthy hear or see the great serpent and can interpret it. That's straight up mysticism. Wheter it's actually real or not doesn't actually matter - in real life, people who believe in mysticism actually think it's real.

daring lake
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So ... we are back discussing my hypothesis are we? 😄

silk lotus
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wonder how easily it will be to have our characters convert to the Va'ruun faith. Like I know we can just take the serphents embrace trait post unity but it would be cool to have more rp options.

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I have a level 156 character who is my main.

sharp tendon
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House Va'ruun thinks the serpent is real. It doesn't matter if it's real, fake, or Jinaan Va'ruun standing behind a really strong lamp swining a dead heetlech around speaking with a very deep voice.

rigid kiln
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rookie level

sterile saffron
silk lotus
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i wanna keep him going as long as I can.

sharp tendon
silk lotus
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only issue is the Va'ruun could be just a enemy faction, but its unlikely.

silk lotus
daring lake
sharp tendon
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@silk lotus Nah, doubt. They'd be antagonists, almost surely, but you'll be able to interact with them peacefully.
@daring lake I personally think that the Great Serpent is an... anti-unity. Like some sort of parasitic entity that is doing the opposite of the unity.

silk lotus
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I think seperate but connected. I still think the shrouding is what happens when the serphent finally gets to the unity and spreads its essence and space ashes around the universe.

rich zenith
silk lotus
peak halo
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I hope they put in a lot of stuff for the serpenta embrace trait.

safe kite
sharp tendon
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my personal theory is that the great serpent is actually why starborn exist. I think the unity is calling starborn to it to protect itself (and by extention the universe) against the great serpent. It's a chaoskampf thing. Great warriors slaying the great serpent represting chaos at the end of time.

silk lotus
safe kite
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It certainly is.

silk lotus
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so the universes we leave are defenseless once we abandon them?

rigid kiln
peak halo
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I mean, like, if you take the trait that makes you a Va'ruun

rigid kiln
daring lake
# sharp tendon <@756639405330137259> Nah, doubt. They'd be antagonists, almost surely, but you'...

Maybe. But I made a link between artifacts and grav drives based on the evidence
provided by a random ship encounter. This link suggests that Temples, Artifacts, Grav Drives,
The Unity and The Serpent are all interconnected like a distributed machine.
In short I believe that Jinan did experience actual communication with something.
Rather like yourself, I suspect conflict within this self aware machinery is ongoing.

silk lotus
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I still say separate entity, one possibly in pursuit of the unity.

rigid kiln
daring lake
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Sorry Nieves. 🙂 But I've also got to stay true to myself 😉

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You realise that I'm saying The Great Serpent is real ?

sharp tendon
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Bethesda has before dealt with themes of Mythology, Gnosticism, and such. I don't think it's strange to except Starfield to be like that too. And it might be because I'm currently doing a degree in the subject, but there are many symbolic parallers one can see. The unity can be likened to many thngs, from the Forbidden fruit from the knowledge tree to yiggdrasil to the cosmic wheel. The Great serpent is such a ubiqutous entity in so many myths, from Indo-european ones to Semitic ones (Tiamat, Tyhpon, Tanin, Jormugandr), as the fight between him and the other gods (Aesir, Olympians, the Canaanite pantheon... and starborn, in this case?) before being slain by a great warrior. (Anat, St. George, Thor, Marduk, Gilgamesh... us?)

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Maybe it's a bit on the nose, especially seeing this is basically the plot of Skyrim.

rigid kiln
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I'm way to defensive about this stupid game religion but that's bc the great serpent is a familiar concept rhgrehgrejhg

daring lake
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tbh you could say the same thing about Star Wars ...

rigid kiln
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oh heres dorsai with the planet source

keen acorn
rigid kiln
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Va'ruun'kai doesn't have to be in serpentis tho

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especially now we know that va'ruun'kai is a moon

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which is...strange since they call it their home planet

keen acorn
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They had time to expand. if the image is of cloning technology ? or incubator technology - they could expand beyond.

daring lake
rigid kiln
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valid

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I meant like with what va'ruun'kai originally was

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Almost done with the miz'ra lore page :)

keen acorn
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Was Jinan Va'ruun a scientist ? Do we know more than that he is the founder of the faith ?

rich zenith
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Do we think the lore of the DLC will link in with unity stuff so will reuqire advanicng the main story?

rigid kiln
daring lake
sharp tendon
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"During one of the ship's many Grav Jumps, one of the passengers, Jinan Va’ruun, claimed to have spent the time communing with a celestial entity known as the Great Serpent, what was only a few seconds for everyone else felt much longer for him, and he brought back a mandate. "

"It's longer than you think. *It's eternity in there"

Are we getting some Gaunts references?

scenic loom
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we getting to embrace the gravy drive yet? potatoderp

rich zenith
daring lake
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Its called a story expansion so .....

sharp tendon
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... So uhhh, is the Tracker Allience guy a ||Starborn? Has a title instead of a name. Starborn esque-mask and a coded voice?||

whole egret
feral whale
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Hey has anyone found the Derelict Mule random encounter before or is it new? I feel like there are a lot of interesting lore implications there...

silk lotus
plain cipher
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I thought I repost this as a lot of people is coming back to game but this is Starfield Guide I post in here in past after 1,080 4 months ago on Xbox I made this guide that has all Fauna,Flora, Family Fauna, Family Florea, locations, Planets/moons and powers so it does have spoilers https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1G5GsAnvd5hikuyVvHxg6mjrQ_Grfi1D8ZZSzml84WmI/edit#gid=947097479

Google Docs
Borisov Guide Into The Stars

Main Page

Weclome to my Starfield Guide called Borisov Guide Into The Stars
My name is Victor Borisov, and no, that's not my real name, and I'm from England. Do note that I have dyslexia, so if you find
spelling errors, etc, and I've been using Google Autocorrect and a Gammar Helper bot to try ...

rigid kiln
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I wanna know why the scaled citadel blue energy thingy looks broken and why we need to restore it

faint cave
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Do not question the Great Serpent!

rigid kiln
jaunty ginkgo
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Trackers Alliance formation history is similar to that of Fighter Guild in Elder Scrolls. Neat

safe kite
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The additional lore is the real gem of the June update.

silk lotus
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The code name thing reminds me of the railroad in fo4.

brazen wedge
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Is there any lore behind Starborn Gravis?

daring lake
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If that is the suit available on Creations then no, I would not think so.

brazen wedge
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Yeah im talking about the suit from creations. Cause the creation isn’t listed as lore friendly so im assuming he or she might be introduced at some point?

solemn bough
brazen wedge
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Especially if this Starborn is supposed to be unique with a story

safe kite
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Same reason the armor shows up in your room before NG+.

It's not lore friendly. It's just some neat armor.

solemn bough
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but also you get different starborn suits independently of the characters who wear them. you get the emissary's suit at like ng+6 i think? it's not like you're taking it from him, you just recieve it on your own

brazen wedge
brazen wedge
safe kite
solemn bough
brazen wedge
solemn bough
safe kite
brazen wedge
solemn bough
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if its not lore friendly why are you asking for the lore lmao this is so confusing

brazen wedge
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Buddy, I explained and ur brain cant grasp around the idea of why its not lore friendly

solemn bough
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i feel like you're the one not understanding that part

safe kite
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Yeah dude, quit saying it's lore friendly. Sheesh.

I have no idea what's going on here anymore, I'm going to go make coffee.

solemn bough
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and again, the suits are not named after the characters that wear them. hunter's suit is the venator

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ok actually venator is latin for hunter so thats a bad example

brazen wedge
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But u can via creations

solemn bough
safe kite
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Not lore friendly yet

But yeah, that's not generally how mods work. If it was lore friendly, they would have said so.

solemn bough
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its not lore friendly in the same way lightsabers and x wings arent lore friendly

safe kite
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Good job team, mystery solved 😄

solemn bough
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the work never ends

brazen wedge
brazen wedge
solemn bough
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either way, there is no current lore for the new starborn suit and i believe that was your original question

brazen wedge
solemn bough
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you're looking too deep into the armor. it's just a suit to go along with the other starborn suits

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i think what's tripping you up is the fact that even though it isn't canon, it looks like it could be

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but like i said as of right now its as canon to starfield as lightsabers and x wings

brazen wedge
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Whats the issue with believing it could be canon tho?

silk lotus
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One cool thing I have now realized. We can basially become trackers alliance us as the universe with a bunch of our variants dosnt have a trackers alliance varient already unless they added one withoyt me knowing.

solemn bough
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do you also assume they're adding characters for all the other starborn suits you can get?

brazen wedge
# solemn bough do you also assume they're adding characters for all the other starborn suits yo...

Uhh what? What are u talking about dude. The other starborn suites are clearly not named after a specific starborn character. The whole reason I made this assertion is because the creation is literally called “Starborn Gravis”. Gravis being the name of the starborn that wears that suit. Its not that hard to understand where im coming from. It honestly feels like u either don’t understand that simple concept or ur arguing against the idea just because.

solemn bough
brazen wedge
solemn bough
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i said it COULD be, but i'm also saying there is no reason to believe it will other than the possibility that it could be. you keep talking about the fact that it has a name like that means anything. all the starborn suits have latin names

bright trellis
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Children you’re both right. Let’s relax a little. It’s a game

solemn bough
scenic loom
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When we gonna get some Chunks lore??

safe kite
faint cave
brazen wedge
faint cave
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For any and all lore discrepancies I see, I'm pretty sure it's the guy at the Unity's fault. /jk

scenic loom
peak halo
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The name of the suit is not the name of a character. It is 'starborn gravis suit'

Meaning: It is a suit in the Starborn style, of the 'gravis' class

Not 'a suit belonging to the Starborn named Gravis.'

old plinth
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I have a question regarding lore stuff. Where's all the animals? Like I can get not every animal could be saved, but like food and resource wise. Like cows and pigs and sheep? Like if they wanted to colonize planets wouldn't they need livestock and stuff? Also they were a little rushed I think but still you would assume that considering the kind of similarity they would pull a Noah's Ark with vital animals. Also they have like models from other games like a cow or chickens

keen spear
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Ships weren't that big back then, like the ECS Constant was shortly before grav drive became common and a big thing was it was the not only the biggest ship but extremely costly and resource intense. It's possible that in order to make sure enough people got off earth smaller ships were the prime focus because they take way less to make and would be more effective to get people off, which would be the first priority.

That said no ships with preserved DNA for eventual cloning, animal cloning being something we kind of have a grasp on nowadays, is a bit weird. Of course that said it could be that cloning technology is still on the level we currently have where it's less growing something in a vat and more impregnating an animal with a donor DNA.

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It's also the issue of introducing foreign species to an environment can lead to environmental collapse which is something we have going on during the age of colonialism when Europeans were bringing in a ton of foreign animals from livestock to birds that have caused a lot of damage to ecosystems in America.

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For instance an issue Florida currently has is during a specific period in the US pet pythons were a big thing, especially among middle class to rich but when they got too big people started releasing them into the everglades, leading to a huge crisis they still haven't solved. Now imagine that on an alien world, it could cause such a huge ordeal for preserving an environment, it's possible that's why crops like carrots and potatoes are still mainly grown in hydroponics bays instead of out in the open.

solemn bough
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great username/pfp btw lol two of my favorite things combined

high copper
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Doylist sounds like a nerd

solemn bough
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and yeah he totally was

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doylist of course referring to an outside-of-lore explanation for something, as opposed to a watsonian explanation

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but yeah theyd have to pick and choose which animals to add, come up with a reason why we have that one but not this one, questions about breeding, have places for them to exist, etc. much easier to just ignore it altogether

high copper
rigid kiln
solemn bough
high copper
solemn bough
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i would expect a ton of ranches around akila city at the very least

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its really kinda dumb how small and isolated the cities are

keen spear
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There's also synthetic food is way more common, especially in the UC which was a major problem during and after the colony war where there was food scarcity because there weren't enough resources or people to make enough synthetic food, leading to over harvesting livestock. We also see livestock on the wagner farms with alien life.

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synthetic meat replacing actual meat is a common trope in a lot of sci-fi properties because it's easier to store, preserve and transport.

solemn bough
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aceles burger

keen acorn
crystal zealot
dense spindle
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We talked about the whole animal issue a lil while back I remember, it was something like how the earth died, so did all the animals that came w/ it, it's why you don't see dogs or cats

brazen wedge
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Yeah but you don’t think if something like that were to actually happen and we had the technology to evacuate the planet, we wouldn’t bring with us some animal DNA to perhaps archive it, and bring some live animals with us like some pets and livestock?

safe kite
crystal zealot
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Not that you cannot farm alien species, there are a few assets that show alien species in a butchers diagram anyhow.

summer iron
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Where do yall think the UC. Army is

solemn bough
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large ground based battles might not be very common in the setting tbh

brazen wedge
crystal zealot
# summer iron Where do yall think the UC. Army is

General impression I get is that everything in the setting is fairly spread out. No need to keep everything centralized when you can instantaneously muster damn near everyone in a 30 ly range or so. Only limitation is no instantaneous transmission. Prolly waiting in reserve or patrolling like sysdef and the vanguard.

slate valley
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Just tried a NG+ and using a mod chose the variant with the Hunter in the lodge. Am disappointed there are no bodies laying about and no outfits etc to pick up or loot. It was all too sanitary in my opinion.

crystal zealot
maiden dew
daring lake
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This has been gone over before. And the conclusion was that hydroponics +
synthetics would be the most effective way to go.

solemn bough
daring lake
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Its an old subject Clarence. And has been done to death here.

peak halo
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Chickens eat A LOT. same with goats

solemn bough
peak halo
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In all honesty, livestock animals are bad idea for long term space travel, they are avoidable inefficiencies. Insects would be a better, more sustainable, protein source.

daring lake
solemn bough
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i'm just saying just because you and some other users agreed on what you think would work best in this hypothetical sci fi scenario doesnt mean its accurate

peak halo
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In all honesty, the Constant was in the black for over 100 years. Even if they did have chickens or goats, they would have most likely eaten them within the first half of the journey

daring lake
peak halo
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Especially considering most livestock animals have a significantly shorter lifespan than humans, and the likelihood of having a stable breeding population onboard a starship, assuming you could maintain the feed supplies for them, would be very low. in fact, I doubt the breeding population of humans on the constant is enough to maintain a stable population over the years. It was enough for the journey, but I doubt it will be enough for the longevity of a colony.

solemn bough
rigid kiln
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imagine having stinky poopoo animals on your ship

daring lake
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And all of them groats? 😄 j/k

rigid kiln
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yea I wouldn't take those on my ship

keen acorn
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When Starstations come into play and colony spaceships - you could revisit animal husbandry in space. but right now its not really feasible. You can transport animals someplace for sure. Just remember the air is recycled and does not remove everything in that process. LOL

whole egret
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I think Sam said it best, pets don't do well on a spaceship. He tells this to cora. I am assuming that it also means livestock don't do well on spaceships.

crystal zealot
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To be clear, with current space tech animals are disastrous in many scenarios. Shed fur is a nightmare on electronics and filtration in zero g. Not to mention odor and sanitary concerns. Or even feeding them.

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Starfield has the benefit of artificial gravity to be sure, but I imagine most of these issues remain.

cinder mauve
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Does Anybody know what the Update is thats 3.31gbs that i just got just a few minutes ago

daring lake
cinder mauve
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Thanks, Didn't know where to look on here.. Is Anybody gonna be Driving Vehicles when that comes out?

daring lake
safe kite
rigid kiln
scenic loom
keen spear
maiden dew
keen spear
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So as someone with a lot of vegan friends and a vegan brother that is absolutely not true at all and is a common misinformation to dissuade from veganism, a thing humans have been doing in various cultures for thousands of years but also the game literally says the ship could not support animal life for the voyage

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Does it require more diverse types of food? Yes. But a healthy vegan diet is very doable

peak halo
brazen wedge
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There are just some essential vitamins that you need that can only be obtained from consuming another living thing

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But since today supplements exist, its a lot easier now

keen spear
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Jainism was an Indian religion literally based around nonviolence and not eating meat, there were entire monk orders, different sects of Judaism, Buddhism

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Humans are omnivores and with the right diversity in plant foods yes, you can get all the nutrition you need

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Tofu has been used as an effective meat replacement for literally 2000 years

rigid kiln
crystal zealot
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Snakes can be pretty dang smelly if you don’t know how to upkeep their habitat routinely. For example, House Va’ruun’s embassy was left alone for just a little bit and got so dang stinky.

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Try and pay more attention to your esoteric religious orders next time

rigid kiln
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Snakes stink less than hairy dogs do

woeful cipher
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I've just discovered the Tau food production site, but its just dead people. Is there a quest here at some point?

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ive read all of the computers, its very intriquing that this place went south

safe kite
torn zodiac
bitter scroll
late fulcrum
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As far as factions any recommended order to join/do faction missions for optimal results or just do them as you please with little consequences?

dusky wyvern
daring lake
silk lotus
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I mean you can also sneak fine without the operator suit.

next forge
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The Constant wouldn’t need animals to have meat. Lab-grown meat from cloned cells is already available today in the US. The constant would have a facility for growing meat in vats and on racks, just like they have a place to grow plants.

peak halo
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Yeah, ive hea d that a fast food joint, Checkers, is using cloned meat for some of their burgers.

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So, they most likely weren't fully vegetarian, and utilized lab grown meats.

Also, in regards to the population: Just making them 'shag' doesn't actually do anything for the genetic diversity. If you even have two people with blue eyes, the genetic diversity is greatly reduced. There have been 4 or 5 generations about that ship, maybe 6, and, unless the ship is larger in the lore than represented in game, there isn't a large enough population to maintain genetic diversity in the long term. In all honesty, the constant will get to where Its going, and maybe survive for a few hundred years, but eventually, everyone will be inbred, and the colony will fail, unless they have random people join them after founding the colony.

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And the blue eyes thing: the original blue eyed peoples were a very small group of people, who eventually ended up in the iberean peninsula. Most blue eyed people have that exact same genetic mutation, and are descendants of at the very least, a tribe of blue eyed people, which, would have been a family.

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If you look at Vault 33 in the Fallout show: they specifically mention the fact that they need regular additions to the vaults genetic diversity. Hence the trading system between 33 and 32.

next forge
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The ship could carry a diverse genetic library of frozen sperm and egg samples and use IVF to facilitate pregnancies in the population aboard (when needed). They would need that capability at the end of their journey anyway, when they land and want to expand the population in their new colony world.

ashen seal
#

So, I’ve always wondered, when you’re reborn after the Unity, does your consciousness hijack the new universe version of you’s mind and body?

safe kite
ashen seal
#

The reason I ask, is because when you enter the lodge after becoming starborn, Vasco mentioned he was with the miner from vectera but they disappeared

#

Not to mention, if you have the Kid Stuff perk, your parents claim they haven’t seen you in ages, implying they’ve seen a version of you at least prior to your arrival

#

Then you have the reality where you meet yourself

safe kite
#

The current universe version of you is generally whereabouts unknown but exists. They also generally took the job with argos, and experienced the cf raid, unless you get a variant universe where that can change.

ashen seal
#

I’ve always taken it as, you hijack them and overwrite them but in the alt you universe, you materialize in a completely new body

dense spindle
#

Will we be Agent No.1 in the future?

high copper
#

no you're the hunter

dense spindle
#

Based on past Methesda games, it's typical in guild type quests to work your way up the ladder to become the head honcho, so I was wondering if this will be the case

high copper
dense spindle
#

Well I guess that answers that question; I wonder if we'll get to see who no.1 really is

wise kite
#

Possible story spoilers: ||I always thought he was Starborn, but he doesn't glow the starborn colour when using the power to detect that stuff||

rigid kiln
#

nor does the keeper

wise kite
#

Really? Maybe it doesn't work like that then.

rigid kiln
#

I have a mod that fixes that

ashen seal
#

But seriously, i feel like the lore behind Starborn Reincarnation is both horrifying and interesting

daring lake
#

Also .... pretty straightforward

brazen wedge
#

And a bit confusing

faint cave
#

It's now Sunday here in my country, Happy Father's Day to Dad!

keen spear
#

I love him and mom are both star trek actors

#

Pointing at my screen the moment I heard Nana Visitor

jaunty ginkgo
#

Are staryards also factories of ships?

scenic loom
#

shoutout to all the Starborn dads out there! KidThumbsUp

next geyser
keen spear
#

I think hopetech is the only planet based manufacturer

#

Taiyo doesn't have a star yard or factory we've actually seen

scenic loom
#

im hoping we get to see more ship parts from them
or new Manufacturers on later updates/DLCs

keen spear
#

Can't wait to see va'ruun ship parts

scenic loom
summer iron
torn zodiac
rigid kiln
keen spear
next geyser
keen spear
#

Yea and taiyo is the odd one out where it doesn't actually have a visible production yard

next geyser
#

... DYNO ... *Facepalm

scenic loom
#

Careful Dane haha

next geyser
#

am getting really peeved by that bot...

scenic loom
bronze shoal
#

Ah that's fun> I'm playing the Tracker's Alliance Starjacker quest

The Decoy ship lets me have 11/10 ships, however I cannot Modify the Decoy; only Sell it. Which, btw, will softlock the quest.

#

Whoops.

keen spear
#

That quest made me want to have a chopshop in the game

fallow whale
#

That is basically the Angry Tree Quest.

scenic loom
#

sasihmmm .... what am i looking at?

fallow whale
#

Probably DNA.

scenic loom
crystal zealot
#

A top down look at some really lonely treeees

scenic loom
#

all of them?.... together?
doesnt sound that lonely to me potatoderp

peak halo
solemn gale
# rigid kiln nor does the keeper

||I have wondered why the Keeper and the Hunter are both present in every universe we go to. If the Keeper were that Universe's version of the Hunter, it would make sense, but the Keeper knows and says he's Starborn too.||

peak halo
#

||Yeah, that would mean that each universe has Three Keepers: that universes, the one who founded the church, and the hunter..... But if the keeper is ancient, that means that the original might have already buggered off into another timeline.... ||

silk lotus
#

||Or he just isnt around, same as when we ususlly show up and dont see another us except in a few rare universes.||

daring lake
faint cave
#

Headcanon: Psychopath You is the one whom Starborn Cora is hunting

high copper
rigid kiln
#

I mean I let sam die in most of my universes

silk lotus
#

I usuall like the idea of barret being the one do die. Nothig against him just feel it makes a better story with him being the ine to recruit you into constalation to begin with.

peak halo
#

As far as I know, the only way to pick which companion dies, is to befriend them, and don't go to the eye.... But if you do that, then it's the companion you have the highest affinity with.... Otherwise it's always Sarah.....

#

Atleast, I believe that's how that works

#

Which means, if you let Sam (or Barrett) die, you had them as your highest affinity.....

#

NIEVES! did you romance Sam and then let him die?

feral whale
rigid kiln
#

To tag him as highest

faint cave
feral whale
#

I'm responsible for so many accidental innocent deaths

#

In Starfield. This one I need to clarify.

hard tulip
peak halo
#

Oh.... Huh

#

Because, like, I swapped Sarah out for Sam as soon as I could, lol

rigid kiln
#

I just need sam removed from the game as a whole tbh

#

Maybe all of the freestar

peak halo
#

Why?

#

Why so mean to my lonely cowboy!

rigid kiln
#

Bc bigot

peak halo
#

How so?

rigid kiln
#

Try unity quest with serpents embrace

peak halo
#

My current character is actually. Serpenta embrace.

rigid kiln
#

Goodluck

peak halo
#

The Va'ruun girl in the UC jail in New Atlantis.... Is pretty much just there for the option to remove the serpents embrace trait.... And the Unity quest.

rigid kiln
#

Also based 🙏

peak halo
#

Like... Why is she even in there?

rigid kiln
#

Bc she attacked uc ships

#

(Not my best page)

peak halo
#

Fair

stable bloom
rigid kiln
#

Yea, but they are based

stable bloom
rigid kiln
#

😂

obsidian glade
#

The fact that Va’ruun scriptures are contraband makes me need to know what’s written in them.

stable bloom
#

I imagine it's similar to extremist propaganda we have today

keen spear
#

It's specifically that contraband is heretical va'ruun scriptures

#

Most likely it's contraband in the UC and FC because

  1. Honoring agreements with House Va'ruun
  2. It's the heretical beliefs of the misguided zealots
#

So just imagine it's about killing innocent people and being awful people that are a disgrace to the great serpent

rigid kiln
faint cave
leaden gale
#

it's objectively good and correct to attack UC ships.

rigid kiln
#

🙏Great_Serpent

rigid kiln
#

Freestar can also go tho

keen spear
#

Freestar did nothing wrong

rigid kiln
#

Existing was it's first mistake

keen spear
#

The only mistake was allowing Bayu to keep control of Neon

rigid kiln
#

Tbf freestar will collapse on itself so the UC is the only main threat

keen spear
#

I'd actually say the UC is just as likely to collapse on itself and from the sound of shattered space and the va'ruun zealots House Va'Ruun is in the middle of a schism that can destroy the faction

rigid kiln
#

Yea but I just like to see democracies collapse

keen spear
#

Freestar has the benefit of people enjoy more freedom that reform is more possible then UC or Va'Ruun

#

UC's citizenship requirements are the big thing that's hurting them

rigid kiln
#

Both are poopoo

solemn bough
#

dont fence me in

crystal zealot
peak halo
#

Burying? Ghost? Well, he is under ground (in the side of a cliff), but he most certainly is NOT a ghost (yet)

leaden gale
#

i don't believe they killed him even if you out him to the president. just moved him elsewhere. Eat the rich yourself, because the rich won't do it for you.

keen spear
#

Vanguard ||I can believe they would kill him but also yea, I don't think trusting the UC is the brightest idea. I'd sooner trust Bayu because at least if he betrayed me it'd be "Yea that checks"||

rigid kiln
#

Va'ruun lore fact of the day:
Anasko is hot

keen spear
#

Anasko is a robot

#

I am curious what his opinion of the schism will be when we meet him, unless the schism is because of heritage

rigid kiln
hard tulip
#

(which i was a little sad about actually but i suppose that's what i get for trying to have my cake and eat it too LOL)

solemn bough
leaden gale
#

why? it's as old as story telling. "you didn't see them die, and they're back!!"

#

but don't misconstrue it. i'm lamenting that he isn't dead. not praising it.

solemn bough
#

itd be like killing a character, then resurrecting them and giving them a more meaningful final death, only to then resurrect them a second time

#

lazy writing

leaden gale
solemn bough
#

doesnt make it good writing

#

and there's absolutely no way the freestar collective would let that happen again. theyd be like "we want to see the body and dna test it"

vocal scarab
#

Just glad I can arrest people now

So when I do FC again I can arrest ||Ron Hope|| instead of having to just kill or accept being corrupt

keen spear
#

I actually haven't tested that with like an EM weapon

vocal scarab
#

It's nice, on controller you just stun them, cuff them with x and then send them to the brig with X too

#

Obviously you have to make the handcuffs too they're misc items

brazen wedge
#

Does it actually have that option now?

#

Like it completes the quest and everything?

vocal scarab
#

Yeah I think it counts as killing him though

#

Sadly hopefully someone mods in where arrests are actually quest effecting

hard tulip
brazen wedge
#

Oh

#

I thought it was an actual feature added with the creation dlc 😂

keen acorn
hard tulip
inland hare
#

That's so cool I wish it was in the base game

#

Btw I wanted to ask here, does the game state anywhere how Starborn aging works?

#

My headcanon is that the DNA just stops degrading but idk what the canon is (if it has been revealed yet)

keen acorn
#

Never heard anything explaining any aging info on Starborn. But I agree I think the aging process ends, or at least slows down a lot.

hard tulip
# inland hare Btw I wanted to ask here, does the game state anywhere how Starborn aging works?

its kind of weird because the Hunter says that he's old enough to remember Earth, like he was from there, so he must have some kind of weird immortality to be alive for so long, but also Aquilus when he writes about not wanting to go through the Unity anymore, he implies that it's possible for him to die of old age despite being Starborn:

"I imagine if I took a different path. If I stopped running, stopped seeking to gather my own power. If I instead embraced the twinges of compassion I feel in my heart, and let myself care for the people who seem to gather about me wherever I try to work. If I simply lived, and taught, and perhaps brought others to the light. And died."

#

so, my best guess is that every time you go through the Unity it prevents you from dying of old age, like maybe each NG+ your body is a "new" one even though you're the same person so it resets your biological clock- i say so because Aquilus and Hunter are different versions of the same person so literally the only difference between them is that the Hunter still wants to continue doing NG+ but Aquilus quit entirely

#

kind of a weird/convoluted answer but its the only one that makes sense to me atm to reconcile Aquilus implying that he wants to die instead of going through the Unity, with the fact that he/the Hunter are from Earth so logically they'd be dead by now if they aged normally

#

i hope that makes sense LOL

inland hare
#

I think that if you stay in a universe for some time, maybe you do start growing old

#

Like crossing the unity somewhat constantly is a requirement for immortality

hard tulip
#

yeah!! thats exactly what i was thinking c:

inland hare
#

Similar to the va'ruun character trait

hard tulip
#

that recent update also made it so that you can change your character's appearance and whatnot after entering the Unity so that gives a precedent for the Unity physically altering your body (even though its optional and was added post-release, still, it is in the game now)

#

i suppose if you were going really hard on the roleplay aspect you might try to make your character look 10% less old every time you go through the Unity lol

inland hare
hard tulip
#

i think if your character settled down for decades then she would probably look old given how aquilus talks about it yeah ^^

vocal scarab
#

Wrong chat

inland hare
#

yeah I was about to say that

vocal scarab
#

Look I can be a ditz sometimes

inland hare
#

I'll keep the young design too just in case they reveal how it works in a future expansion

vocal scarab
#

I honestly feel like Starborns gain immortality, since they basically become stardust

#

I want to know if a starborn does settle down and has children do they become starborn too?

#

Or are starborn infertile?

hard tulip
#

thats a good question and now my brain is hurting LOL

keen acorn
fallen kiln
#

Not sure if you're immortal in the "never die of old age" sense of the word. ||The Hunter/Aquilas can remember life on Earth so he's lived way more than his three score and ten||. But there may be other explanations for that

#

I'd guess that Starborn are infertile (except maybe with other Starborn) but it could go either way depending on what the story needs

vocal scarab
fallen kiln
#

Not disagreeing, just thinking out loud

vocal scarab
#

It's ok, I didn't mean for that to come across hostile or snappy

fallen kiln
#

Thinking about it - meds still work on Starborn, so they must have functioning biology. As opposed to being projections from Unity

#

so from that angle, there's no reason why they shouldn't be fertile. Do they bleed? It'd be embarrassing if their sperm glittered away into starstuff when it left the body...

vocal scarab
#

Call them sparkle pants

keen acorn
leaden gale
#

Also consider the following: Every time you're scanned, you're told you're radioactive.

#

I have no horse in the "are starborn reproducible" race, but if the Starborn are the end result of Crucible's experiment, in the far and distant future. Could they reproduce? Possibly. Delano wants that outcome. I'm not sure it's the intended purpose of the program, though. They already reproduce, by making infinite copies of whoever enters The Unity.

fallen kiln
#

I don't think they're related to the Crucible. I think that's an experiment that parallels the Starborn, but I think that's co-incidental. At best, it's some Starborn running an experiment to better understand the psychology of his people by try to replicate the experience with normal humans.

leaden gale
#

Alright, well. Even if it's unrelated to Crucible, The Unity makes near infinite copies of you the moment you enter it.

fallen kiln
#

Hopefully we're not that radioactive or we'd be sterilizing the other members of Constellation. I think Noel and Sarah would have me wearing lead lined boxers if that was the case 🙂

leaden gale
#

Personally,

#

I think it'd be cool if the PC could have a kid with their love interest. That was more or less advertised before the game launched with the art of the dude with his daughter that probably ended up being Sam Coe. But! The point of the Unity is probably not to enter it a millionty times and forget your humanity. It's to accept your humanity and help better others.

Do not be General Zod. Be Kal-El.

#

Accept your world. You are not the original person that entered the Unity. You were created after they were destroyed, dispersed into stardust. This is your world. Better it.

fallen kiln
#

That is rather the challenge of the game 🙂

#

Will you retain your idealism and strive to improve the world yet again, or will you do a Keeper and pursue your own interests and let the rest of the world choose its own path? Or will you take the Hunter's path?

rigid kiln
#

I'll just do the serpents will

leaden gale
#

i don't want this to be true, but i'm pretty sure the serpent is just another starborn. that'd suck, cause then there's no reason to be part of the great serpent faith.

rigid kiln
#

I mean even if then the idea is still there
Of the great beast that will destroy the universe at the end of time and return everything to the void it came from

#

The starborn great serpent would just be a pretender

leaden gale
#

but that's not what he promises. He promises to save his chosen. But regardless of his promises (or lack thereof) if he's just a Starborn, you have absolutely no reason to revere him. He's just (probably) an older Starborn than you. You could one up him, given time.

#

Honestly, the serpent eating its own tail plays so heavily into the Starborn dilemna. Every time you enter the unity, you are destroyed. What makes you unique is gone, and near infinite copies of you are made. Then they, too, enter the unity, are destroyed, and the cycle continues with a progressively 'lesser' version of you. The snake consuming itself to try to fill its own gullet.

#

As an example, one of the universes you enter has ||a Venator variant of yourself, lording over your dead Constellation friends. When you condemn him he's like 'I WAS SO GOOD SO MANY TIMES JUST THIS TIME I WANTED TO BE BAD',|| and you are shown how bad you will devolve, given enough time, enough self sacrifice.

#

The power is unworthy.

fallen kiln
#

I wonder if the founders of the three space religions are all starborn. I mean we know about the Pilgrim/Keeper. Jinan Va'ruun seems likely. I don't suppose anyone's tried murdering Andy Singh? Just to see if he vanishes in a cloud of starstuff?

leaden gale
#

I bet you the founder of constellation is starborn and invented it

fallen kiln
#

Sebastian Banks? He's certainly a candidate for Starbornhood. At the very least. he must have had the Vision, since he presumably collected that first artifact.

#

There's a potential story DLC. Whatever Happened to Sebastian Banks and the Secret Origin of Constellation

rigid kiln
#

The great serpent is real and that's the only truth I need

glad jacinth
#

I think it's just crazy Starborn

leaden gale
#

I think the serpent is probably the first starborn. he's probably seen the end of the multiverse in the far future, and came back in time to try to stop it. but also, yes, he seems pretty insane from what little we know of him.

fallen kiln
#

I think it's Unity. Three religions founded on visions during grav jumping. I think they got a vision a little bit like the ones we get from the artifact, only not so clear since there was no artifact to amplify the effect. And I think the three founders each interpreted what they saw very differently

#

But I think it's the same "trying to comminicate" that we get with the Unity visions

leaden gale
#

Aquilus didn't get a vision that sparked his realization, though. It was by becoming a monster, valuing no one, and then slowly realizing how wrong he was. That everyone had value.

fallen kiln
#

But did he found the Universals?

leaden gale
#

really there's almost no difference in aquilus's religion and the fellas that just wanna help people.

fallen kiln
#

I remember reading somewhere that each of the three religions was founded based on someone's experiences while jumping. Else why would the Universals tell everyone to seek god while jumping?

#

But yeah, Acquilas is a better fit for the House of Enlightenment. Unless he knows something we ain't been told yet.

leaden gale
#

We've met the guy who invented Universalism. He tells us what he thinks. We read his journals and the story of how he came to understand his religion. He didn't gain any knowledge from jumping. He gained knowledge from not jumping. By staying.

#

By living his life.

fallen kiln
#

Did he found it though? Or did Aquilas come to it after he stepped down as the Hunter?

#

I'm not sure that's ever made clear

leaden gale
#

He founded it. He tells us he did.

rigid kiln
fallen kiln
# leaden gale He founded it. He tells us he did.

I don't suppose you know where or when? I'd really like to confirm this to myself so I can stop having this conversation. I know we have Pilgrim's Rest, but I don't think it's confirmed that Acquilas as the Pilgrim, or that the Pilgrim founded the religion.

#

It's widely assumed, certainly.

leaden gale
#

i don't remember when he tells you. just that he does.

fallen kiln
#

Unreferenced, though. That was one thing about the UESP wiki - if they said something, they'd tell you where they got it from.

leaden gale
#

though to be fair this wiki is not correct. aquilus became the hunter. he becomes aquilus only after becoming the hunter.

#

His experiences as the Hunter are part of what leads him on his path to discover Universalism. Because he couldn't learn to truly value each individual without having first valued none of them.

fallen kiln
#

It also assumes that Aquilas was the original identity. I'm not sure we can that that for granted, either.

rigid kiln
#

I hate the wikia so much

leaden gale
#

Yeah Aquilus was not his original identity.

rigid kiln
#

UESP one for the win

fallen kiln
#

Damn right.

rigid kiln
#

I'll never use the sf Fandom wiki always the other one

leaden gale
#

I think he tells you he founded Universalism either when you first meet him, or only after you finish the main quest without crossing into the unity. which isn't to say that you cann't hear it on any of your NG+s, just that you need to go back to him after you beat the hunter and the... whoever, I donn't remember their title.

fallen kiln
#

But The Hunter couldn't be the original either - no one gets christened "The Hunter"

leaden gale
#

I don't think anyone thinks he was originally the hunter. the entire thing with starborn is that it's implied most start off well meaning, but end up being jerks for fun. they're very much a commentary on how players play bethesda style games.

fallen kiln
#

I just started a new Universe. I'll keep my ears open when next I talk to him. Also maybe not run him off so I can get the Hunter's knife.

#

No argument about the meta-commentary 🙂

leaden gale
#

So he could've been Pete Davidson for his first six or eight new universes, but eventually he becomes the Venator / Hunter.

#

Then after umpteen more universes, he starts to really reconsider himself and more importantly, other people. Their value and worth.

#

He is no longer The Homelander. He becomes Aquilus.

fallen kiln
#

I like the idea that he could have been Victor Asiz. But that's also not entirely without its problems

leaden gale
#

He isn't. That's people jumping to latch onto stuff.

fallen kiln
#

That's very dogmatic. Any reasons for being so certain?

leaden gale
#

There is WAY more evidence that Starborn are the product of Crucible than there is evidence that Aquilus is Asiz.

#

The only evidence that people have is that Asiz is the first recorded Starborn, and the Hunter is believed to be old as heck too.

fallen kiln
#

But there's no sign of Creator level tech at the Crucible. No indication of any interest in Grav Drive research or anything related to the artifacts. No weird gravity effects. Apart from the repeated lives they have nothing in common that I can see

#

And the Pilgrim must have pre-dated Asiz if his drawings of Musketeers and formal Victorians is any guide.

leaden gale
#

Time and space. Currently tanking a game

#

okay killed the boss. If Crucible is what spawned the Starborn, then it stands to reason they did so in the far future. You do not need any creator tech at all for this to be true.

#

Genghis Khan.

fallen kiln
#

I think we even know what the Crucible was for. They were trying to produce better human beings. They cloned exceptional people from throughout history and were not going to release them until they pass a test and convince the researchers that they were worthy. That's what the Believers believe in, and the other factions don't seem to dispute it - they just think another solution needs to be found.

rigid kiln
#

Do we think anasko is hot?

leaden gale
fallen kiln
#

Where's the test?

leaden gale
#

Don't know. It doesn't matter, really. And they didn't just clone people from history. They created brand new people with skillsets that they had never encountered.

#

And to be clear, it doesn't matter what the purpose of Crucible was because FDR can decide what it will be later. Anyone could. You gave away the keys.

fallen kiln
#

Where's the test? Where are the robot administrators? What's the prize? What's the "outside" the successful starborn can hope to be released into?

leaden gale
#

It doesn't matter. The keys to Crucible have been exchanged. Amanirenas, FDR, and not at all Genghis can decide that the purpose of the test is. Their creators are long dead.

daring lake
rigid kiln
#

Ayo not the heathen

fallen kiln
#

Well, I won't say it's not possible. It just seems like reading a bit too much into a literary device intended to get us thinking about the Starborn by showing us a parallel society

leaden gale
#

I think it's important to note that all of them are aware they're clones while still possessing memories of the incredibly long dead (if they are clones of living people, at least.) Amanirenas can remember how Kush smelled.

fallen kiln
#

Yeah, and the others think Amanirenas is deluded.

leaden gale
#

Yes. And she is. But more to the point, Amanirenas wants to be humans but better. And that's exactly what most Starborn consider themselves. Better than humans.

fallen kiln
#

No one else claims that sort of recall. Amelia is well aware that memories have been placed inside her head. Including some her original never posessed.

leaden gale
#

Genghis does. So does hotel boy, FDR, and Amelia.

daring lake
#

All the clones at Crucible have been programmed. Everything they know has
been given to them.

leaden gale
#

Yes.

fallen kiln
#

Yeah, but Amanirenas is the only one to claim memories beyond those she knows to be implanted. She's the only one to claim to be the original in all but biology

rigid kiln
#

"Hotel boy" 😭

leaden gale
fallen kiln
#

And most starborn don't do anything, so far as I can see. One of the first thing the Emissary tells you is that they're not a monolithic faction. They do seem largely united on the idea that you are not worthy of Unity, but then that's only the ones that attack you, so we may be judging from a very small sample set.

leaden gale
#

If you're cloned but unconscious when it happened, and you and your clone both wake up, how do you prove which one of you is the clone? You certainly both feel like you're the real McCoy.

fallen kiln
#

I'll ask the Mauler twins next time I see them

leaden gale
# fallen kiln And most starborn don't do anything, so far as I can see. One of the first thing...

What does that have to do with the price of Coca Cola in Atlantis? Starborn are not the person they're created from. That person dies and is destroyed, and what's left of them is used to create near infinite starborn with the Unity.

It doesn't matter if they're a monolithic culture or not. Crucible certainly isn't that way. But Starborn do have factions. The Gatekeepers are one such faction.

fallen kiln
#

So "most starborn consider themselves better than humans" gets downgrade to "some starborn" and the point of similarity with the Crucible's creators is weakened

leaden gale
#

it is generally a product of going through the unity, seeing that everyone is the same, and thus valuing them less through your personal experience of 'all of them are exactly the same.'

fallen kiln
#

I don't know. I can't quote you chapter and verse on this like I could on some earlier games, and for all I know you may actually be right.

fallen kiln
leaden gale
#

Do you agree that the concept of Starborn eating their own tail and becoming more destructive in a world that they no longer value as having 'real people', is meta commentary on players who play bethesda games?

fallen kiln
#

Substitute "The Hunter" for "Starborn" and I'd agree without reservation

leaden gale
#

Infact, they're so far removed from their humanity that they think you're wrong to relive your life with humans because you aren't human anymore.

fallen kiln
leaden gale
#

They just haven't gone through the unity enough times to no longer value humanity at all.

fallen kiln
#

Tcha. Just typed a long response and got it eaten by discords profanity filter 😦

leaden gale
#

I hate it when that happens.

fallen kiln
#

Point is, the Emissary doesn't see humans as less worthy as such. They see them pretty much as they did when they were human. They just want to impose some quality control over who gets superpowers.

#

Unity Me tells you that's the effect of siding with the Emissary

leaden gale
#

Infact, they're so far removed from their humanity that they think you're wrong to relive your life with humans because you aren't human anymore.

fallen kiln
#

I'll grant there is a tension between the Hunter's creeping alienation and the Emissary's determined optimism, but I don't see that as an automatic slide into dehumanizing the rest of existence. If anything the reverse.

leaden gale
#

They still consider humans worthy of becoming more than human. But there is a clear cut delineation between the two for the Emmissary: You are either Starborn, or you are human, and to be human is to be lesser.

The Emissary has already begun their journey on the Hunter's path. They consider interacting with humans at all to be a chore.

fallen kiln
#

Emissary Sarah Morgan is basically the same Sarah as constellation Sara. Only instead of telling you which solution you should have picked for the Terrormorph problem, she wants to control who gets to enter Unity

leaden gale
#

Have you talked to her after becoming Starborn and reliving your life? She has nothing but admonishment and condemnation for you.

She doesn't approve at all.

fallen kiln
#

Which one?

leaden gale
#

What do you mean?

fallen kiln
#

Starborn Sarah or Constellation Sarah?

leaden gale
#

Starborn.

All Emmissaries have this outlook. They all condemn reliving your lives and interacting with humans.

fallen kiln
#

Starborn Sarah disapproves of you pretending to be human and pulling the wool over Constellation's eyes, and I think she disapproves of such manipulation because she sees it as first steps to Hunterdom. But I don't see Sarah's corruption anywhere in that behavior. She's the same judgemental, self-righteous, goody two shoes that she is in the Lodge

#

And yes, that applies to all the Emissaries

leaden gale
#

They outright tell you that they don't interact with humans at all and wouldn't have interacted with human you if you hadn't attained so many pieces of the Armillary.

fallen kiln
#

Which isn't the same as "sees them all as lower forms of life without value".

leaden gale
#

I didn't say that. I said they seem them as lesser.
HUNTER is the one that seems them with no value.

fallen kiln
#

And if the Emissary does allow new Starborn to be created (as Unity Me says they do) then clearly they do interact wth normal humans. They just don't want us setting up the Armillary and allowing access to all and sundry

#

You said they were on the path to becoming the Hunter. I don't see that slide at all, is what I'm saying

leaden gale
#

the Emissary always allows some people to attain Starborndom. They just Gatekeep who can and who can't.

Emissary doesn't hold humanity with no value yet. Each trip through the Unity they lose a piece of themselves. They grow tired of seeing the same people do the same thing and because everyone is so the same (not unlike an NPC in Skyrim), the Starborn grows not to see them as people. Just toys for their amusement. As Venator you and the Hunter tell you flat out.

fallen kiln
#

So when they tell you that they "don't interact with humans at all", that clearly isn't the case?

leaden gale
#

How often do they induct someone into Starborndom, Doc?

#

Emissary tells you people aren't ready yet. They didn't even think you were until the Meeting with the Hunter.

fallen kiln
#

Every time you side with the Emissary, if Unity Me is to be believed. He doesn't offer actual numbers. I think he says a large number, but we don't know large relative to what

leaden gale
#

Have you ever taken the Yes Man ending?

fallen kiln
#

They don't want random humans mucking about with the Armillary. Not an entirely unreasonable view

#

The one where you oppose both of them? Yes.

leaden gale
#

You were a random human in the Emissary's eyes.

fallen kiln
#

So?

leaden gale
#

Then you know that when you Yes Man, Unity You tells you that no one gatekeeps the Unity. People find it on their own. When they're ready. So, if that is true, why does the Unity need to be Gatekept?

leaden gale
# fallen kiln So?

So the Emissary was wrong. And that's a very important point. They don't take the time to get to know you, to know that you are ready. They make that judgment of you from their Horse on High without ever really getting to know you until they're forced to because you don't give up, and the Hunter is amazed that something new is happening.

fallen kiln
#

I'm not saying it needs to be gatekept. That's a moral and philosophical consideration. On the other hand, you can make a case for trying not to allow too many Hanibal Lecters and the like through. You can also make a case for the Hunter's anarchist approach and for the laisez faire approach of the "Yes Man" ending. That's one of the things that makes the game so interesting

leaden gale
#

I know you're not saying it needs to be. I'm saying the Gatekeepers think it needs to be, and they're wrong. They value humanity so little that they make the wrong estimation of truth.

fallen kiln
#

And you may think the Emissary is morally wrong to try and control access, but I don't think they're factually wrong about anything. And if they didn't value humanity they'd not care who got to be Starborn

leaden gale
#

You keep going to extremist viewpoints, and that makes this discussion difficult.

fallen kiln
#

The Emissary's recurring theme is "look at the damage you cause or can cause". They don't mean to them personally.

#

What's so extreme about "you can make a case for all three viewpoints?"

leaden gale
#

The Emissary has not yet become a venator. They do not yet "not value humanity"

they value humanity less than they should.

fallen kiln
#

See, I really don't see that. Worst you can say is they have a fairly jaundiced view of the moral character of most humans. Which isn't entirely hard to justify if you look at some of the things we routinely do to one another.

leaden gale
#

They flat out consider interacting with humans wrong because humans are not Starborn. They tell you this to your face. They judge you wrong when you're human, until you keep up at it so long that they have to accept you, because if they don't, the Hunter might get the Armillary.

fallen kiln
#

You don't think maybe they don't want to interact with humans, because if humans as a whole learn of the existence of Starborn, Amillary, Unity and so on, it could lead to massive human wars and governments try and gain this power for themselves? Tell me that doesn't sound like a valid concern.

leaden gale
#

Let me put this another way.

fallen kiln
#

And for all we know, they've seen it happen

leaden gale
#

Unity you tells you that there is absolutely no wrong choice with the Unity. Stay or go. Why do you feel that the Emmissary is correct to judge who can enter the humanity without even interacting with them?

You can be a member of the Crimson Fleet, Doc.

fallen kiln
#

Who said I thought they were correct?

leaden gale
#

Well the entire merit of this argument is to show that Starborn lose value and estimation of humans over trips through the unity. I am showing you examples where Starborn are wrong.

fallen kiln
#

I feel like Aquilas here, having to say both "yes" and "no" to every question. I think the Emissary's position is valid. Not necessarily correct, because I'm trying to see them from their own perspective rather than judging them by my own, our-world political leanings. And because I think it's valid, I think that they genuinely want to do what's right for everyone and they continue to do that, time after time. So I don't see any slow moral decline or particular undervaluing of humans as a whole.

I really don't think "wrong" applies at all here.

#

As for Unity Me, he tells you that more "Noble Starborn" are created when you side with the Emissary. He doesn't say that's a good or a bad thing, but he says it is a thing. And he says that the "yes man" ending allows anyone who wants to become Starborn and if that doesn't worry you at least a little, then maybe it should

#

I mean take Benjy Bayu. His statue in Neon shows him standing in front to what looks like the cods used to seal the Temple gates. Since that's unlikely to co-incidental, there's a good chance the Bayu is Starborn. Do we really want more sociopaths of that ilk joining the ranks of the immortals? Would you support Ron Hope for membership? Or Delgado?

leaden gale
#

We're not judging the Emissary by real world values. He judged you unworthy. He did so without ever meeting you, without any intent of ever meeting you and he only met you at all by forcing his hand via acquiring too many pieces of the Armillary. He informs you that the Starborn do not normally reveal themselves.

The Emissary was categorically, objectively, completely wrong.

fallen kiln
#

He doesn't actually say that. He says you have something that doesn't belong to you, and there is great danger in you knowing about it, so much so that he won't answer any questions because he doesn't want you to learn any more.

#

The hordes of lesser starborn ships that come after you when you have the artifacts all go "you are unworthy" but I don't remember the Emissary ever saying that. He was quite clear about the danger of you learning more, however

#

Which again, doesn't sound like valuing you less.

leaden gale
#

He does tell you that his group do not normally reveal themselves. And every Starborn you meet is not necessarily a member of his group.

fallen kiln
#

And yet they do - every time you side with the Emissary they stay behind from Unity and create new Starborn

#

So there's clearly a wider context to that comment

#

A degree of nuance that doesn't come across in that first encounter

leaden gale
#

Okay. Every once in a blue moon they induct someone. But they don't induct many. They misjudge many. They misjudged you, so you cannot in good faith make the argument that they're good judges of who should enter, and who should not.

fallen kiln
#

Every time you side with them. You don't know what they would have done when you don't because you kill them, or at least take their artifacts and deprive time of the option

leaden gale
#

Again, YOU CAN BE A MEMBER OF THE CRIMSON FLEET AND THE EMISSARY EVENTUALLY SAYS YOU'RE WORTHY.

What determines worthiness to the Emissary? Do they even know themselves? Cause, again, you were not worthy until you were.

leaden gale
fallen kiln
#

Personal judgement of your character, perhaps? Maybe you just pull the wool over their eyes because you're so charming. Maybe they succumb to hope-over-experience because they're pleased to see you - they were the one who cried over your corpse in their reality, remember

#

And I was talking about Massal, not VolIii - and you don't have to kill them, but if you don't side with them, you do deprive them of access to the Unity. Which is what I said.

leaden gale
#

In all of the examples you just gave, the Emissary is wrong.

fallen kiln
#

By what yardstick?

#

Hang on - cancel that. I see what you mean.

#

OK. They may be wrong about your character. Or they may see something in you that you don't see in yourself. Either way, this isn't indicative of seeing you as less than human. If anything the reverse.

#

And when you first meet them, they don't really know you. They may well assume you're not morally fit for Starborn because that seems like a reasonable default for humans as a whole. But if they reverse that based on getting to know you, how is that a bad thing?

#

There's a difference between "may have made an error in their estimation of your character" and "are utterly morally incorrect in their chosen course of action".

#

Anyhoo - I need to drop offline around now. Interesting discussion; maybe pick it up another time?

keen acorn
#

I find it interesting. Where. The Hunter and (possible same) Emissary have been through a thousand Unity's. In Each I have died. I got from the dialogue. This time I survived and things are different. The Hunter is more interested than the Emissary about you. I am causing changes through Unity. It is something different to The Hunter.

glad jacinth
#

Could Issa Euklund be same Issa that betrayed Kryx?

solemn bough
#

also i imagine they have different voices

glad jacinth
#

But if it would be funny

daring lake
silk lotus
glad jacinth
#

And people from from Akila should be shorter due to high gravity

leaden gale
glad jacinth
#

😄

glad jacinth
#

My dad question from yesterday: How deep it's Volii (Neon) ocean

leaden gale
#

if the gravity well isn't more powerful than earth's, i'd guess the two planets are the same size. But also like... if it's the same size as earth, with no land, i can't imagine Neon would survive earth's storms.

torn zodiac
glad jacinth
#

xD

astral walrus
#

I'd say Waterworld deep

static sky
#

Faction roles don’t have constellation

sand spruce
#

If you jump into it you can see it's not deep at all in-game. I wonder if that's just game mechanics though. Either way - the platform could be as tall as it to deal with large waves following the gravity influences of its orbit.

solemn bough
#

Since we can swim underwater or go down, we’ll never know.

misty solstice
#

Anyone knows what is the in-game lore specifics about planet population for Jemisson and other major planes? Is it supposed to be "low-pop" as observed on the surface or is the canon something more massive for numbers? [Asking for some data crunching for my mod]

slow sand
#

Probs meant to be more as many portions of the city appear to be inaccessible such as some of the living space potentially being under the towers but abouve the well

keen acorn
# glad jacinth Its 2330 people should live longer

Yep. They are currently working on something to repair the dna ends . The timer of death. So once they are done life extension will be possible. could be before 2100. One person has so far reduced his age via food restriction and some sort of experimental injection.

misty solstice
slow sand
#

You also have to remember the population of the factions has also taken a massive hit due to the colony wars

keen acorn
slow sand
#

I'm thinking it may be the inside of a colony ship and those are all cryo lods with people from earth (well I hope) and maybe the varuun zealots want to indoctrinate them to serve the great serpent

keen acorn
slow sand
#

Oooooo maybe that would be interesting

keen acorn
slow sand
#

Or maybe a tranquility lane situation where the people of varun ki are entering Into a simulation to talk to the great serpent

silk lotus
#

Or it's some kind of preservation pod to survive the shrouding?

#

Maybe not cry. But a stasis pod of sorts.

astral walrus
silk lotus
#

The parents from kid stuff have a home in new atlantis and neither of them served in any military capacity. Dad was a professor and mom I actually dont remember.

#

The maternal grandmother was mentioned as being navy or another branch.

astral walrus
#

Yea, I remember that. If you listened to your dad specifically as you played the game you find out he has "friends" with connections or also wealth inheritance

silk lotus
#

darnit really hope it wasnt implied we won it in his poker group.

#

suprised I didnt get censored.

#

I changed it to be safe.

leaden gale
#

I wanna arm wrestle the great serpent

molten sequoia
rigid kiln
#

Fhe great serpent cammot be sedeated

molten sequoia
#

Oh the Great Serpent cannot be defeated

#

That's true as well

leaden gale
molten sequoia
leaden gale
#

but then it isn't a serpent
and i win

molten sequoia
keen acorn
#

The Great Serpent will devour you all. The Va'ruun too but they do not realize it - The Great Serpent needs the others wiped out as much as possible. LOL

faint cave
#

Is uc citizenship for the entire uc or just new atlantis?

astral walrus
swift willow
#

I gotta wonder… Did whoever was in charge of writing ||Vae Victis’|| character ever read Warhammer’s ||character of Inquisitor Kryptman?|| ?. Their ideas are quite similar.

leaden gale
#

It's a common trope tbf

silk lotus
#

so am I the only one who dosnt like ship mods like derrtek and the one that starts with a A? I feel like their aesthethics dont fit with the rest of the world.

#

like they arent bad at all. I just feel they dont fit in.

safe kite
crystal zealot
#

Does not mesh with the janky future past aesthetic

digital tapir
#

what would the space equivalent of the "high seas" be called? specifically in the context of the crime of "piracy on the high seas"

glad jacinth
#

Blackest Seas

digital tapir
#

oh right Vlad says that doesn't he

glad jacinth
#

Yes

#

Shame he is not follower

digital tapir
#

also a shame you can't get a SysDef/Crimson Fleet follower at the end of that quest chain

glad jacinth
#

Then yes. Also... dogs 😦

digital tapir
# glad jacinth You mean with affinity follower?

Yeah. Like, assign Toft to me once we've dealt with the key, or...OK I don't actually know who'd be good on the CF side since most of them can end up gone, Naeva would never fly under someone else, and Jazz has her hands full for the forseeable future.

high copper
heavy vigil
torn zodiac
#

There's also Jessamine, a recruitable CF person. She's pretty fun

scenic loom
#

and if you never got to her throughout the CF quest and go against them
she can be seen and recruited again in Gagarin bar area

faint cave
late fulcrum
#

Looked at my steam hours pushing 298 hrs still mid/late game of first playthru. Really happy I’m taking my sweet ass time. Hopefully will be at endgame perfect timing for expansion. Also really looking forward to vehicle to finish surveying

astral walrus
astral walrus
fallen kiln
# silk lotus like they arent bad at all. I just feel they dont fit in.

I loved DerreTech at the start. It's just that as time goes on and he's got better at building new modules, it gets more and more like he's making a parts list for a mecha from some beloved childhood anime. Matilija too.

Not a bad thing, and they're both entitled to their vision, but it's quite hard to find a use for a lot of the new stuff.

scenic loom
fallen kiln
#

Jess is probably my favorite follower 🙂

scenic loom
#

shes great if you need a follower if you playing as an evil character or a character that likes money lol

#

i havent talked to her in a while but im wondering how things will go when the SS expansion is out
seeing that she's running from House Varuun... or was it just the Zealots, i forget now

leaden gale
#

Bloodhound calls it the 'Verse in game.
I've seen both "the black" and "the blackest sea" in game

fallen kiln
scenic loom
#

Oh, ofc

leaden gale
fallen kiln
#

Certainly, the Serpent's Crusade, and therefore the worship of the Great Serpent is a lot older than that

sand spruce
#

Sanctum Universum is very new by comparison, and some of its members mention that in dialogue.

late fulcrum
# astral walrus Surveying *every* planet/moon? Wow

I’ve only surveyed 150 planets out of 1000 and I don’t plan on surveying all planets. Just a mix of doing main quest and factions slow, registering all side quest in the log and lots of exploration and surveying. I also took 5 months off from the game tho

#

Plan on jumping back for vehicles and DLC. Hoping DLC is Aug/sept release instead of November

solemn bough
peak halo
late fulcrum
peak halo
#

You sure?

scenic loom
#

If I had to guess, the land vehicle update might be during or after the SS expansion

late fulcrum
scenic loom
silk lotus
#

My guy went full happy chaos. If there are infinite universes, then does anything truly matter? The question should be what matters to you. Now let's have some fun shall we?

#

Crazy space viking.

late fulcrum
scenic loom
late fulcrum
scenic loom
late fulcrum
scenic loom
# late fulcrum Speaking of surveying after 300 hrs is when I found out you can just scan the hi...

lol dont beat yourself for it, its part of playing Bethesda games, you learn as you explore and so on
Todd did say he wanted players to figure stuff out and share with one another so, dont beat yourself for it haha

900+ hours now, and i just need to reach lvl 100 to finish off the achievements... i dont really care for achievements but it does keep me occupied til a new update happens or the first expansion is out

#

but yeah, cant wait for the land vehicles to hit SF soon
with the Desolation mod added in, cruising through empty moons and planets sounds like a fun idea

astral walrus
bronze shoal
#

What happens to our crew when we fly through Unity?
are they getting left behind? or do they split off into different universes where each of them is now Starborn?

dialog with Constellation members makes it sound like they're all going to Unity too, but in the 'epilogue' space we're alone, and they don't arrive in the next universe with us.

faint cave
#

Quick question because I forgot, but are Grav Drives instant? Like there's no movement of in-game time when we grav jump?

high copper
#

Almost instant id say

hard tulip
#

we learn so because if you walk away from the Unity you can have additional dialogue with the companions where they talk about how they were also given a choice between crossing the Unity or returning home, and they returned home -- so basically your crew takes the same decision as you

faint cave
high copper
#

Funnily enough I just dropped in to The Clinic and the courier is complaining how he’s using the grav drive, literally can’t go any faster

round charm
#

anybody noticed that we were originally able to find the Seokguh outside of Neon?

#

we even have affinity events dedicated to it yet its not being used ingame

torn zodiac
daring lake
torn zodiac
tough lark
torn zodiac
tough lark
#

I really wish we got a chance to interact with the Emissary more to learn about what happened when they went through the Unity. Or even to remeet one of our actual companions

leaden gale
#

yeah.

#

bethesda truly messed up by telling you that the people you re-meet are never actually your people.

#

the only way to compellingly use the unity is if your lover dies in the hunter's attack and you basically are okay dying when you enter the unity, so your starborn copies have a chance of meeting other versions of them again.

silk lotus
#

Imagine that universe where we meet another version of us and trying to play matchmaker.

keen acorn
#

My Emissary keeps changing. Never the same NPC.

#

Like I hear Sarah's voice to land. The Emissary on the ground could be Barret, or any other one.

leaden gale
#

Yeah I've had that too

#

I imagine before a companion dies it's based on rep but if no one dies the rep keeps changing.

leaden gale
manic igloo
safe kite
dense spindle
solemn bough
#

here's something interesting about the real serpens constellation though:

In Greek mythology, Serpens represents a snake held by the healer Asclepius. Represented in the sky by the constellation Ophiuchus, Asclepius once killed a snake, but the animal was subsequently resurrected after a second snake placed a revival herb on it before its death. As snakes shed their skin every year, they were known as the symbol of rebirth in ancient Greek society, and legend says Asclepius would revive dead humans using the same technique he witnessed.

rigid kiln
keen acorn
#

The blade is deigned/based on a snakes Scale. They are not round.

solemn bough
keen acorn
# solemn bough not a fang?

Hmm Could also be froma fang. But that would be interesting to find which species of Fang. They are like finger prints ! just sayin'

solemn bough
#

i mean a snake's fang

keen acorn
# solemn bough i mean a snake's fang

and a Fang is like a DNA foot print. Research. Find its matching Fang thousands of Snakes each fang is different. Is what I am referring to. Like I said also plausible.

solemn bough
#

i feel like they're all the same basic shape lol but i'm not a taxonimist or whatever so idk

silk lotus
#

weird how a group with a circle emblem has such a angular theme on their weapons.

solemn bough
#

well if the guns were round they'd look like super soakers

keen acorn
#

Its a symbolism thing. Along with they are constantly on a drug from the Venom tree (hallucinogen) . before you say it. They are all raised in that. Therefore all of you do not understand The Great Serpent. The Great Serpent entangles and squeezes all things. This you do not understand and this is of the shrouding.

solemn bough
keen acorn
solemn bough
keen acorn
solemn bough
#

what does andreja say about it?

keen acorn
#

I will not argue with you. Informationis there is you look. I am back into the game cheers.

solemn bough
#

lol

silver eagle
#

Please be respectful of eachother

solemn bough
#

idk what i did but alright

#

anyway yeah those plants probably grow on va'ruunkai but i kinda doubt that they're all exposed to it for their whole lives. maybe used in special ceremonies or something like that

leaden gale
#

the venom tree's sap is poison. they aren't on it.

broken flower
#

a little bit doesn't hurt...much

fallen kiln
peak halo
#

Even water can kill you if you imbibe too much. And I'm talking drinking. It's called water toxicity, or hyper hydration.

leaden gale
fallen kiln
#

Botulinum toxin is the nastiest, apparently. 100 nanograms will kill most humans outright. Even then, the same toxin finds a non-lethal application in Botox treatments

next geyser
#

😂 The stuf i can read on here is mental!! Are we actually talking about bio agents and chemical warfare? 🫥 😂

fallen kiln
#

Well... a bit, maybe.

rigid kiln
leaden gale
#

he tells you flat out that the spores aren't dangerous, but that the sap is.

fallen kiln
#

The Va'ruun wouldn't be the first religion to incorporate hallucinogens as part of their rituals of worship.

rigid kiln
#

He doesn't say that the sap are dangerous tho?

#

Just that there is something with them but he doesn't elaborate bc that isn't a topic to discuss at that moment

leaden gale
fallen kiln
#

I mean "Danger of dying by poison?" "Danger of everyone getting irrevocably stoned and letting the Embassy fall into total disrepair?" "Danger of accidentally setting the robots and turrets to 'Murder All Everyone'?" "Danger of the spores germinating and having half your rooms buried under Poison Tree roots?"

Danger could mean many things here.

leaden gale
#

or wait i misread what YOU wrote. he does say that the sap is dangerous.

#

it's called venom for a reason, docclox.

#

and that reason is that it wants to make out with eddie brock.

rigid kiln
#

I should have added the stupid dialogue on the wiki I can't acces it here

fallen kiln
#

Boy did it spawn in the wrong parallel universe.

#

Wrong universe if it wanted to make out with Spawn as well, come to think of it

leaden gale
rigid kiln
#

@rigid canyon do we still have the ambassador dialogue doc we used for the wiki when we wrote the lore article?

#

Honestly annoyed at myself that I haven't added that dialogue to the wiki bc I've done it for divided loyalties

rigid kiln
#

Can't access our files rn

rigid kiln
#

harmless spores, you have my word. But hard to navigate. Hence why I was guiding you through the intercoms to restore the environmental controls... and release me.
It is the sap of the tree that gives it its... well, perhaps not a topic for this exact moment

I guess I can see why you come to that conclusion but he doesn't outright state it. Because he cuts of so yea he hints at it I guess
Same as that the Rite of Kre'jar is probably the killing of the groat but we don't know that for sure

leaden gale
#

dude. she gives you its skull.

peak halo
#

What is a groat?

#

And is it anything like a Goat?

I didn't do her questline. I saw hot cowboy daddy and jumped on him till we were married. Then I finished that universe.

rigid kiln
rigid kiln
astral walrus
#

Wonder how similar the groats will be to earth goats?

rigid kiln
#

They look diffy

#

Some don't have horns so there is a sex difference I think

#

Looks like it

silk lotus
rigid canyon
leaden gale
#

Andreja says the groat is to teach them that anything can be disposed of to make a tool.

We know groats have horns. We've never been told there are groats without them. Occam's Razor suggests it is not a groat.

astral walrus
#

All speculation...

leaden gale
#

I've stated things that we know to be true. We know there are groats with horns. There is absolutely not one iota of evidence that there are groats without them.

This is a game filled with vast swathes of alien animals. Why do you believe that if an animal exists on the Va'ruun homeworld, it can only be a groat?

rigid kiln
#

We also don't know if the sap is dangerous tho bc the embassador didn't state that he ended the conversation before he could explain what the sap was special for

rigid kiln
#

Like I agree that we don't know that it's a groat for sure but that's the same with the venom tree sap

rigid kiln
safe kite
leaden gale
#

We absolutely have evidence of groats having horns. We see the skull she fashioned into a knife.

I do have to question its practicality, though.

safe kite
rigid kiln
#

😭

#

I hate it here

astral walrus
#

But what colour is groat milk?

rigid kiln
#

Groatic

safe kite
peak halo
#

Um, on the note of 'that thing is poisonous, you don't do it as a drug', IRL, there is evidence that the ancient Europeans would smoke or (more likely) burn (and inhale the smoke (different process to 'smoking', which is burning something with the intention of inhaling a significant amount of its smoke, most likely what they would do is make a burnt offering, and stick their head in the smoke, breathing deeply)), toxic plants to 'have visions', in addition, Fly Amanita/Fly Agaric is a toxic mushroom (apparently, deaths are uncommon, though IDK if that's because of awareness, being one of the literal poster children of 'poisonous mushroom', or medical advances, or if it's just... Not that dangerous to humans) that, when properly processed (which was done in the Olden Times by letting it pass through the digestive and urinary tract of reindeer, which is probably one of the reason why the animal was partially domesticated), causes intense hallucinogenic effects. Fun fact, it's a different chemical than what's found in the other common 'magic' mushroom, though, these were probably the earliest versions utilized by humankind)

daring lake
#

Catnip

safe kite
#

Debate is kinda moot since we don't know if/how/when the venom tree is used by the varuun. Only that it exists and is important to the culture.

Isn't to say yall can't debate it, however. Go nuts.

rigid kiln
#

the name venom tree still confuses me tho like do you touch them and die? 😭

#

I know the vines are also classed as venom so 😭

safe kite
#

Considering you crawl through the vines in the embassy, I expect it's not immediately fatal.

Apt name for a serpent-centric religion to name their special hallucinogenic tree, even if it isn't actually 'venom'.

rigid kiln
#

pretty sure touching the tree in game doesn't do anything tho and the ambassador also hid among the branches so...?

#

yea that was also my guess bc like they do nothing 😭

#

same as the scaled citadel not being...scaled from what we've seen in the shattered space trailer

safe kite
#

Mmhm.

Thematic, not literal.

#

Like most Varuun topics, SS should clear up some of the questions.

rigid kiln
#

also gave alot more

#

the change to make va'ruun'kai a moon is interesting

#

means I have to rewrite all "home planet" lines on the wiki to home moon at some point

#

or homeworld maybe that's better LMAO

safe kite
#

"Home planet" would still apply, imo. "Home moon" is just pedantry.

rigid kiln
#

homeworld it will be I guess

astral walrus
#

Correct me if im wrong but at the Unity, when you go around reviewing all the major choices you made in that universe does it seem like theres two missing story quests or just the one for Va'ruun?

rigid kiln
#

what va'ruun story quest? 😭

safe kite
#

Dont recall specifically, but there were definite placeholders for future content, feels like.

astral walrus
rigid kiln
#

I love how the game acknowledges(jité what a stupid word, had to google that) it if you marry more than one person in the unity

astral walrus
#

I haven't married all four yet... Ill attempt that in my next NG

safe kite
astral walrus
#

But Andreja has to be first

rigid kiln
#

is there a lore reason for why our closest star isn't in the game?

#

it still annoys me so much

#

that and toliman not showing up in the sky of new atlantis

safe kite
rigid kiln
#

yea it's really sad

keen acorn
#

To me The Va'runn zealots and the documentation. Indicate a mode of poetic statements. They try and make statements in a poetic Va'runn form?

daring lake
# rigid kiln is there a lore reason for why our closest star isn't in the game?

This has greatly puzzled me tbh. And I can only come up with 2 possibilities.

  1. BGS messed up and its absence is a mistake.
  2. The entire star and any planetary bodies around it don't exist in the universes
    that we experience. Something that would be revealed in a future story expansion.

Unless BGS come out and tell us directly, we will never know.

rigid kiln
#

it annoys me so much tbh it's a small detail but I'm sitting here like... it's our closest star...it has a confirmed planet inside the habitable zone... unlike Alpha or Beta (toliman)

safe kite
#

Simplified for gameplay purposes is my guess.

#

Would love a dev answer though.

daring lake
rigid kiln
#

Venom trees are interesting tho bc like we know the burning the leaves has psychoactive properties, so do the spores

safe kite
#

Less clutter on the map, less confusion for the player (first system they jump to), don't need to justify why the UC gets 3 whole systems instead of the original 2 (both FC and UC have binary systems in their 3), etc.

Are there any other systems on the map that have just a star and not bodies? Could be that in the SF universe, Proxima Centauri has no planets, and thus nothing to grav jump to, and consequently irrelevant for the map.

#

Even if IRL Proxima has planets, SF is not bound by theat and the game already stretches what we know of known systems significantly to make them accessible. Ex: Adding planets where there shouldnt be, moving things around as needed, etc.

#

All just guesswork, though, since it just isnt there and is never addressed in game.

rigid kiln
#

is it btw same to assume, that everything in the venom tree and va'ruun'kai fern room is from va'ruun'kai flora wise?

#

bc it has like 2 confirmed va'ruun'kai plants

safe kite
#

It all being from va'ruun'kai would add weight to why the zealots raid the station, though.

rigid kiln
#

`yea but finding two random va'ruun'kai native plants is insane unless they stole them from the embassy?

#

it has both the Venom tree and va'ruun fern

daring lake
#

Sometimes it is better to leave some things as "open questions" rather than
try to shoehorn something into known lore.

safe kite
safe kite
rigid kiln
#

yea I know but I'm trying to figure out what flora va'ruun'kai has

#

we have 2 flora and 3 fauna as of now (not counting the umbrella vines bc the game places those everywhere so I just ignore the venom tag they have)

safe kite
#

Jokes aside, I can feel you vibrating with anticipation for the SS launch from here. 😄

Keep the faith, my dude.

rigid kiln
#

nah as of now we have:
Flora:

  • Venom Tree
  • Va'ruun Fern (probbo has a cooler name in lore but that's how they're called as of now)
  • (maybe) Umbrella Vines (have venom tag and show up in embassy, but are also used in other places)

Fauna:

  • groat
  • unnamed flying creature
  • unnamed insect type creature
#

ìf they actually are called va'ruun fern I'm gonna cry hope they change that to atleast va'ruun'kai fern

safe kite
#

'Scaly Fern'

'Slithering Vines'

rigid kiln
#

I just hope Anasko is hot

#

and that we get to visit Jinan's grave in the scaled citadel

trail dune
#

I have a question, are the ng+ universes in an strict order everytime you play with a new Character or are they put in random?

safe kite
#

In terms of the alternate universes?

NG+1 will always be vanilla
Otherwise, it is based on chance.

The gear (suit plus ship) you get is set to progress up to NG+6 for the ship and NG+10 for the suit

trail dune
#

Yes thanks because if I would make another playthrough and all ng+ universes are in an order it would be annoyingly long

peak halo
#

(IDK why I was thinking that Sirius was the closest star to Sol... However, I do still feel that it's possible that Sirius and Wolf are supposed to be the same system. A name change could be because of a certain Witch lady, or because Sirius is kinda... Difficult to read accurately.

rigid kiln
#

Which is part of the trinary system that also includes alpha centauri and a centauri B (toliman)

peak halo
#

Why did they rename beta centauri?

#

Also, how would one star in a trinary system be any meaningfully way closer than the other stars in that same trinary system?.

#

I mean... Proxima IS located towards the outer edge of the other stars gravitational field, which, in local astronomical scale, is massive, but, as the stars orbit each other, and the galactic core, the stars position would change, and it would stop being the closest, and one of the other two would get that spot. Granted, that might not happen for hundred of thousands of years... But point still stands: how can one star in a trinary system be 'closer' than the others, except on the local solar scale, a star on the outer edge of its system... Would be fractionally closer. It's honestly not a meaningful distinction

crystal zealot
#

I think the distinction was closer to us, Earth

#

Oh wait, I think I see your point

peak halo
#

Again, that's not a meaningful distinction.

crystal zealot
#

Apologies

#

Hard to emulate I imagine, it’s an odd exclusion.

peak halo
#

Like .. the Centauri system is just about 4.37 light-years away.

#

Are there any trinary systems in the game at all?

crystal zealot
#

The shifting of position I mean, and that is strange they are missing a star

crystal zealot
#

I know of one, but there miiiight be more

peak halo
#

I think the reason they renamed Beta Centauri was to avoid confusion, (basically the same reason I think they might have renamed Sirius. Becaise honestly, renaming 'the Dog Star' to 'Wolf' would be fitting, and a simple enough change that it should still get the point across.

crystal zealot
#

Were I close to my game I would look it up, searching details like that in browser is a bit of an undertaking for this game.

#

I enjoy the changed names in most examples as it shows development both culturally and scientifically as the context of these systems change over time

peak halo
#

I'm just blind... Apparently Sirius is in the game.

crystal zealot
#

It’s elsewhere

peak halo
#

I always find it weird when in a sci-fi show, first contact with a species, and they named their planet [Starname] [position of planet from star] and possibly even [position of moon from planet]

crystal zealot
peak halo
#

Like... Are other species so un-imaginative that they don't name their planet the cultural equivalent for 'dirt' or (more accurately) 'Solid Ground's?

crystal zealot
peak halo
#

I mean... Maybe for some cultures, like the Highly Logical or potentially Synthetic ones, (like Vulcans from Star Trek, or the Kaylon from The Orville), but I feel most cultures would, at the very least, have an ancient diety that represented the planet, and was given it's name after (presumably) her?

#

Like. Unless they are made aware of the cosmos at a very early developmental stage, they likely wouldn't even know there are other planets in their star system when the cultural name for the planet came into being.

crystal zealot
#

Straight up if you live in a celestial neighborhood you better have a fun name for all your funky little spheres within a reasonable distance

fallen kiln
peak halo
#

Define 'reasonable distance'. We have names for things that are so far away we can only see them with the most powerful telescope in human history, and near human future, at distances so cosmologically vast, that to travel them, time would lose all meaning, and you would be driven insane by the void of space. Distances so vast, even light, the fastest thing in kmthe known universe, can die before it reaches us. Distances so vast, a civilization on an alien planet could rise, expand, conquer their galaxy, and die, and it will still be hundreds, if not hundreds of thousands, of years before we have any kind of awareness of their existence. Distances so vast, light would take the entirety of the span of human existence... Of life on this planet, to cover.

fallen kiln
#

Maybe the Universal Translator just does that sometimes 🙂

crystal zealot
#

Navigational notes make sense.

peak halo
#

Honestly, that's a good point, and Next Gen has an excellent episode on how cultural references can be insanely important when interfacing with a new culture, either that of an alien species, or one on your own planet, that you might not know much about.

#

Also, I can't remember their name, however, their entire language is literally just Meme culture.

#

Navigational note for who? The space men they haven't met yet? Their own non-existent space ships?

crystal zealot
peak halo
#

True, lol

#

But have you ever actually thought about how powerful the Hubble actually is?

#

The JWS telescope is also very powerful, but it has a different focus: closer objects, with higher resolution.

The Hubble was made to see things so far away, with so little light reaching it, that it's likely there are entire interstellar civilizations that have risen and fell between when the light started its journey, and when it reached the Hubble.

#

The Hubble is STILL one of the most powerful telescopes humanity has ever made. Some of its tech was used by Big Brother to make spy satellites.

#

(because of course, nothing can be invented without the military getting a cut)

rigid kiln
rigid kiln
#

Being unable to see toliman from new atlantis also annoys me 😭

#

Concept art had alpha centauri have 2 suns in the sky

fallen kiln
#

Orbital mechanics were probably too hard to debug for a binary system.

peak halo
#

Yeah, add in a third... And then we have the Three Body problem, (I'm sure it's applicable in some way, lol), and that's something we haven't figured out a solution to...

#

I mean, really it's a mathematical/physics equation, not an issue that need to be 'fixed', just is humans being nosey about the fundamental forces on the universe

rigid kiln
#

I just wished they yeeted an extra star behind the last planet so you could see two stars from the planet

fallen kiln
#

But I can imagine it would be easy to tie yourself in knots trying to work it out.

crystal zealot
#

Im not sure how stars function in the map/space play area but just the addition of a second star within visibility could have accomplished that. Making a fused two or three star map sounds like an implementation nightmare tbh

trail dune
#

Whats the best starfield Ending and why?

leaden gale
#

I have a theory with evidence. I believe the Serpent is merely a Starborn.

Starborn suits and technology feature circles heavily. The Pilgrim comments on this in his notes. Even their armor does it, and he doesn't know why.

Have you ever looked at the blast marks left behind by Starborn in the final confrontation?

Circles.

Have you ever looked as the blast marks left behind by the VA'RUUN Inflictor?

Circles.

https://i.imgur.com/EFamEyx.jpeg

Imgur
mortal storm
leaden gale
mortal storm
crystal zealot
#

The major theme of the Unity or underlying tone for Starfield (in my opinion) seems to be a focus on romanticizing a cyclical universe. The symbology all seems to play on that and the Varuun definitely play on that theme to a degree.

#

Notably || when you fall into the timeline that involves house va'ruun zealots responding to a vison that claims the pursuit of the artifacts is heretical. This makes me think that the Serpent regards the pursuit of becoming a eternal cyclical being is heretical, but given that seems to be the underlying theme of the Serpent itself its more likely the pursuit of being a cyclical individual is the real issue. Everything in Va'ruun lore and the DLC trailer dialogue implies the serpents wants to incorporate others into itself. Genuinely think its a Starborn esque hivemind thats solution to the unity is very literally unity||

leaden gale
#

If the Serpent is Starborn, he should not in any way suggest his worshipers should seek power to maken them equal to him.

daring lake
leaden gale
#

Which ones?

daring lake
#

Big Bang, Disruptor, Razorback ... They all persist on a variable timer

rigid kiln
#

somewhere in the multiverse theres a universe where house va'ruun nuked new atlantis and that makes me happy

daring lake
#

Also ... a Uni where Discord users have the House Va'ruun role 🙂

rigid kiln
#

stop

daring lake
#

sry .... 😉