#Strike shot has now been broken for 2 weeks...

102 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

sand sail
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kinda feel like this should be a priority to get fixed

true halo
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Sadly their bug fix priorities are horrendous. Hotshot has been bugged for months, they released practice mode (doesn't allow forward queue for some great reason) with Rune not being able to use secondary for 2+ weeks, haven't fixed strike shot, have had ridiculous Dubu wall interactions that they have refused to fix all the way back from beta, sometimes see awakenings that shouldn't be in the rotation etc. If they ever say they care you can 100% be sure they are talking out of their ass

dapper wolf
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So many bugs in this game that still have not been fixed.

warped yoke
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If it is on cool down when you respawn or load into the next set, it's range is cut in half.

sand sail
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Holy cow devs I honestly cannot comprehend why you guys wont fix this, if you guys seriously can't figure out what the problem is than just write some code to reset strikeshot to it's normal state after every goal

woeful portal
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I see you've never written code before 👀

sand sail
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Neither have the devs for this game

woeful portal
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Right. Clever

sand sail
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guarantee you my solution would work just need to put in a hard reset for the visual, but of course it's just a bandaid fix because for some reason the devs are fine with letting this be broken for nearly a month

woeful portal
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Uh huh. And what exactly would that code look like?

sand sail
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if goal strikeshot radius = true

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ezclap

gentle raven
woeful portal
# sand sail if goal strikeshot radius = true

You know radius is a number right? Not a boolean

Like here's the thing: It's bugged. It's obviously not that the radius is turned off, not how I've seen it. That would mean the radius is zero. Instead it's bugged. The value for the radius is likely still its correct value. This is why the projectile still reaches its target range. This means it's likely either something with the way it is being rendered. This could come down to a number of factors and bugs beyond a simple if-type check and setting a value. And who knows what unintended effects a "simple" solution like that could introduce anyways. I've had similar things like that in my own projects where you attempt to reset some value and accidentally cause that value to have unintended consequences further down the line, like, for example, accidentally making the strike shot indicator much larger when the game corrects itself.

true halo
# woeful portal You know radius is a number right? Not a boolean Like here's the thing: It's b...

not about strike shot but wanted to ask about the hot shot bug. Assuming they haven't silently patched it it should be there. The bug is whenever a few (or maybe all haven't tested it) strikers' ult hits the core the CD reduction factor doesn't apply yet it works for their other abilities including strike. Now the thing is they already have the logic for this in the game. Heavy impact does include the core as a target so if your ult hits an enemy and the core it works perfectly fine. With that said, what would be the problem that they haven't been able to fix it for 2+ months?

woeful portal
# true halo not about strike shot but wanted to ask about the hot shot bug. Assuming they ha...

It's hard to say exactly. If the issue was that the core was not being considered a hit by the awakening, then sure, easy fix. But if it's happening to only some of the ults, digging around will take a lot longer. You have to actually compare what strikers abilities are causing it. Maybe it's all impact abilites, that could make it easier, but what if it's something with an ability that often has multi-hit potential like dubu or estelle, or what if it has to do with the damage or the power triggering some kind of override to the ability. It could also be that certain other awakenings are causing this bug, and certain strikers are more likely to take certain awakenings. If the bug is with monumentalist for example, it won't usually cause problems for Kai.

There's a famous bug in one of the civilization games. Gandhi, notable pacifist, could become the most aggressive ai in the game by getting a buff to his pacifism. By making gandhi less aggressive, the bug made him ultra aggressive. This was because he would normally have a aggression level of 0 and getting that buff would decrease aggression by 1. Mathematically that should be aggression -1. Well, computers are bad at math, and the programmers were using unsigned bytes to store the aggression level. This means that -1 would be treated like 255 which is called an byte overflow. This has to do with how numbers are represented in binary. The fix is easy: check if the value is zero before the buff, and only apply the buff if its greater than zero. Finding it is the hard part. You would have to notice that the issue only occurs when the AI takes that specific buff, which is unlikely to be reported by testers or players. Assuming you have that information you'd have to think it would cause the problem in the first place. Reducing aggression is not a good starting place to find a bug that makes them insanely aggressive, you might look elsewhere first. Etc.

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The point is fixing the bug is seldom the issue it's finding the bug that's the hard part. This is why devs want logs, pictures, and honestly most importantly steps to replicate. Steps to replicate a bug give the devs ways to hold everything consistent and trigger it when they want it triggered. If the bug is randomly occurring, it can be damn near impossible to actually figure out the cause which makes patching it impossible.

The other factor is that code is often miles long. These developers are good, so everything will likely be neatly partitioned and well commented, but still you'll need to read through the 10s of 1000s of lines of code to be able to find where the problem is. If a line of code is missing, like the Gandhi example, then that can be easy to find. But massive bugs can occur from a line of code that reads if(x<10) when it should be if(x<=10) and that line could happen 100s of lines up. Finding it will take reading through the code line by line piece by piece with a pen and paper example if you can't really replicate or pin down the cause through feedback and gameplay. That is worse than reading through 40 page academic papers. It's a slog.

true halo
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I understand that in general that bug fixes are no easy feat but in this case specifically it seems (might be wrong) that all the tools are available to do something about it. I'm assuming the devs have a build in which they can toggle on and off awakenings (if not that is definitely on them) and this can be easily replicated , you don't need any one frame specific timings or multiple abilities going off in a specific order. For example you say it is possible that this might only be an issue for impact abilities but then wouldn't that also cause an issue for heavy impact? I'm assuming they would have a certain thing in place that checks for collisions between abilities and the core and that this thing would apply to abilities like hot shot and heavy impact or basically any other thing that would require us to know if an ability hit the core or not. I might be wrong on all this so please correct me if so. I definitely do give them that it's tough, but for cases like this and other "simple" (assumption) bugs
it just feels like they are ignoring it

sand sail
# woeful portal You know radius is a number right? Not a boolean Like here's the thing: It's b...

The problem with strikeshot is that the visual circle radius will stop showing up. So there is code to make the strikeshot radius disappear (when the ability gets used) and then it should re-appear when off cooldown, but in some instances of the game it seems like this code to bring back this visual is getting skipped over. It has nothing to do with rendering because the strikeshot indicator is visible at the start of every game. And therefore adding a hard reset to the visual at set intervals would be an impromptu fix to allow the code to work back and forth at least until whatever specific situation that causes the visual code reset to get skipped

woeful portal
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You're assuming that the bug is caused by the thing not getting turned back on by the gameplay code at it's desired time. Graphics and gameplay interact a LOT and one can effect the other. It's entirely possible that the bug is something else in the graphics. For example what if the render layer is getting bugged out and it's getting rendered properly but displayed behind the map layer so you can't see it

sand sail
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Strikeshot can work for some of the game even most of the game so I would argue that it is much more likely that there is a game interaction that causes code to get skipped instead of a game interaction that causes strikeshot visual to randomly start rendering on a different layer, but theoretically possible. Also if it was rendering on a different layer it would have the chance of being partly visible at times but this is never the case

woeful portal
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Uh huh. And you don't think there is a game interaction that is changing the way things are rendered. Based on what experience with programming and game design? Literally the same mechanism that would result in the code getting skipped would be the same mechanism that would mess up the layering. Besides, not what I actually think is happening, that was an example. Like, it's not uncommon for layers to get played with by the code. For example, when one emoticon is above another and then the player moves up, you need to change layers in the render engine some way or another, otherwise the one that's behind the other first will always stay behind regardless of the position of the player. So a player who is in front of another could have their emoticon lie behind the player's behind them.

The source of bugs is hard to pinpoint. Just because you think the bug is where you want it to be doesn't mean that's where it is.

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And you cannot even begin to patch the bug until you find it. AND the mechanism you're talking about to display the strikeshot correctly, this magical function, let's call if foo() that you're claiming to call with the code if(bugged){foo();} could be where the bug takes place. Like if this magical function is where the bug is that will not fix anything because foo() is where the bug occurs. You'll just be summoning the bug a second time possibly making it worse and making no actual progress

sand sail
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as I said it would be bandaid fix and it would summon the bug multiple times but it would also keep fixing the bug multiple times obviously you still need to fix the actual problem but regardless it shouldn't take weeks to fix the actual problem

woeful portal
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Fixing the bug but summoning other problems is not a good solution for a graphical fix. I mean the hotshot bug was mentioned. That is A) waaaaaay more important and B) waaaaaay worse. It would be a nightmare if fixing this bug broke something like that hotshot bug. PLUS. You have to test that fix on all platforms, make sure it isn't game breaking for, say, mobile, and see if it doesn't cause any other problems. All this while working on new features, tending the other bugs, the micro patches, and, you know, getting time off. 2 weeks in the programming world is no time at all

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If you want it fixed sooner, you can go out of your way to try to replicate the bug between games or rounds. Pay attention to all of the awakenings, all of the things you did -- open the menu, alt-tab out, emoted, which emotes, which abilities are on cooldown, which aren't, which characters, if ss is on cooldown, etc. Any and all information. Then when the bug happens, report all of those things. It will make the devs jobs easier to have that information than to have "it's been x weeks why havent they fixed it, it's so easy just do a,b,c"

sand sail
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You're just assuming that adding a simple hard reset onto an ability is going to create additional problems (which it likely wouldn't), additionally I don't think the hotshot problem is anywhere near as problematic as strikeshot. We're talking about a niche problem that maybe happens in 10% of hotshot games (might not even see hotshot in a game) vs a gear equip that I would argue is absolutely required to use certain strikers as goalies effectively

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also I would absolutely troubleshoot the problem for them, but you can't even get strikeshot in their practice game format. Absolute clown devs

woeful portal
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"Which it likely wouldn't" based on what data or experience? Like what are your credentials to make that claim? Where are you getting that from? Your fix is, again, not even certainly possible. Like I said it could do literally nothing or make the problem worse. And slapping code into places haphazardly just produces what we in the business call "spaghetti code". And if we're talking about "niche problems" I main goalie, exclusively play goalie, and literally only pick off of ss when I get distracted messaging people and forget to pick a gear. I have seen the bug you're talking about in like 3 games, and the one where it's half the actual radius in like 70%. I play literally every day so 3 games in 2 weeks is waaaaay less than 10%. And when it's been missing I just paid more attention to when I used it last and tried to not rely on it with better positioning.

Contrast that with the hotshot bug. If you pick hotshot you should expect it to do what it needs to do. Strike shot still works. You just have to be more careful. Hotshot not working makes it so your pick doesn't do what it needs to. That is way worse. You can play around strike shot. You can't play around picking an awakening that doesn't work. Sure you could not pick that awakening, but you could also not pick that gear, and literally every goalie can benefit from momentum boots. Literally pros are even picking eject button kai goalie over strike shot sometimes. So to me it's a no brainer that this bug is low priority.

And at no point did I say it would introduce a bug, even assuming your fix would be possible. I said it could which means the devs have to 1) implement the change, 2) test it on all platforms 3) roll it out. Two weeks is barely enough time to do any of that (recall how long it took to get the switch update out). Your take is that, from zero experience or expertise, it should take less than 2 weeks to do that.

Absolute clown take

sand sail
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They hotfixed changes to octavia very quickly after her release so clearly it's possible implement changes quickly

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your argument is essentially that there are so many bugs in the game that the devs aren't fixing that they don't have time to fix strike shot

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you might be flaming the devs more than me

woeful portal
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In some cases fixes are pretty easy and so they're quick to implement. And also, go ahead and strawman me all ya want that was never my argument x) But yeah, fr you know what you're talking about with your zero experience or knowledge. Keep up the good work champ

sand sail
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You're just straight up wrong about hot shot being higher priority search these forums and tell me how many people have made posts about strike shot being broken and tell me how many people have made posts about hot shot being broken

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but I mean ideally it would be kind of nice if they could fix both

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in a timely manner

shy orchid
woeful portal
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Your reasoning ignores the obvious confound: strike shot is a visual bug, where as hotshot is not. A visual bug is more likely to be noticed by players than one that decrements a basically off screen timer. Further, as we're seeing here, it's easy to get frustrated because its obvious when you miss because of a strike shot, where as hotshot cooldown is going to have less immediate consequences. Not because it isn't game breaking but because not getting cooldown boost 30 seconds ago is not as noticeable than, say, having to guess when your strike shot is online, striking, not having it online and just missing your strike. So more people are going to A) notice it and B) be more annoyed about it specifically which are both factors that will make people post about it. Most people won't notice the cooldown is working unless they're paying attention to it. But not having that cooldown is basically like not having an awakening from a draft. That is way way worse.

Yes, ideally, they would fix everything. Hell, ideally they wouldn't have bugs. But practically that's just not possible. Realistically, dedicating enough resources to fixing a visual bug with no obvious cause so that its resolved in two weeks is just not a smart use of your <50 person team. I get that strike shot is frustrating. I thankfully get it way less, it seems than others despite basically only playing kai/ss goalie, but when I have gotten it you just have to work around it. It changes the game, sure, but at least you can tell it's changing the game, unlike the hotshot bug which most people won't realize if its happening. At least you can say "it's bugged, I guess I'll work around it"

tranquil mulch
woeful portal
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And if you can't work around it, consider practicing without it idk.

sand sail
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or the devs could consider not rolling out updates so fast that they break everything with new updates and don't fix anything

void slate
woeful portal
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Wait do you want faster updates or slower updates?

sand sail
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slower updates with less bugs

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but when they update with bugs hotfix the bugs

woeful portal
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So you're okay with the inevitable bugs taking a long time to fix then

sand sail
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inevitable bugs

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my dude

woeful portal
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So, just so I'm understanding. You want slower updates, with less bugs, but then the bugs that happen should be fixed quickly which would the have minimal testing (as per the speed of roll out) and possibly introduce more bugs

sand sail
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They clearly aren't testing anything with their updates

woeful portal
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Based on?

sand sail
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how many bugs they introduced with finii patch

woeful portal
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Uh huh. Bugs are way more likely to occur on multi-platform applications

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You literally cannot test every platform. What you shoot for is coverage

sand sail
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and they didn't shoot at all

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ball still in their hands

void slate
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There are too many assumptions here, I didn't read the whole thing

Anyone popcorn?

woeful portal
sand sail
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I don't think you get it

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fix strike shot

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it's been over two weeks

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I didn't make a fuss for two full weeks

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it's now time to fix

void slate
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you don't get to make demands from the devs

being frustrated is understandable tho

sand sail
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as a player you do get to make demands

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if the devs fail you quit the game

void slate
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^

sand sail
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that is the player dev contract

woeful portal
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Sure, I agree with you. That's not what I'm talking about though

sand sail
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idk what ur talking about man

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I want strike shot fixed

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u dont

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idk man

void slate
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I don't know dev constraints, work environment, reasonings etc.

I think Ody is trying their best, no one is perfect

meh, more than that is not smh I can say

woeful portal
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What I'm saying is the fix is not necessarily as easy as you think it is. Maybe it is, but maybe it's not. Devs are people too, and I'd rather have a buggy game than devs who are ground to a pulp in a crunch time like in big studios. Not that those are the only options, but 2 weeks is not a lot of time to fix one bug unless it is as easy as you say. But there's no guarantee for that at all. I've wasted tons of hours debugging what I thought would be simple fixes. But you make the fix and it breaks elsewhere and you go fix that and repeat

true halo
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like if it's a recent issue I can understand giving them some time to fix it

sand sail
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well it's time to start making posts calling them out about that stuff

limber frigate
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What is this bug? I honestly have not noticed

true halo
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but 2 fucking months and they are just pretending it doesn't exist

sand sail
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strike shot visual vanishes randomly

void slate
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I also want strike shot to be fixed, thats why I checked out this thread. But throwing a fit is not helping anyone, (especially yourself)

Read back on this thread, it is unreadable. Note unreadable

sand sail
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It helps get it fixed tho

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if this thread stays at the top the devs know players are talking about the issue

woeful portal
void slate
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a vocal minority is different from issues that need priority

and I am happy I'm not deciding priorities

true halo
void slate
sand sail
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if a thread gets over 100 comments I guarantee you they will note the issue

void slate
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except it's 2 ppl arguing, no offense

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(anyway I'm out)

limber frigate
woeful portal
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Again, if you want it fixed sooner you should really try to pay attention to what is happening when the bug occurs. Like for example, if it happens after you take a specific awakening, or hit with an ult after a goal, or anything like that. Those things can help devs pinpoint the issues and cut down the hunt a lot

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Then make a bug report with include all of that data in this bug report (edit: I keep forgetting we're in a bug report now EstelleFacepalm )

dapper wolf
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At the end of the day, they need to fix this plus the ton of other basic features bugged. Writing whole ass essays about what they need to do and what is exactly wrong is pointless.

sand sail
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Here I'm playing kai, the estelle hits me the same second my strikeshot cooldown finishes and the same time I strike after this point in the game strike shot visual is broken

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The most interesting iteration of the bug I've seen, same juno game as above, but I actually get KO'd, and after getting KO'd strike shot visual returns! ... only to inevitably break in about 30 seconds this time for seemingly no apparant reason I was not hit at the same time I striked or anything of the sort

woeful portal
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Do you know what awakenings you had? I see twin drive in the last 2 and primetime in the first. I wonder if there's something bugged with the extra cooldown?

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I'll try to see if it happens to me if I do/don't have primetime or twin drive

warped yoke
warped yoke