Spent some time typing up a decently-sized document with feedback on the game, trying to basically dodge anything related to game balance because I figure the devs are probably in a better spot to address that with all of the changes coming to live than I could possibly be. Feel free to let me know your thoughts on anything in here, maybe I'll revise it before I inevitably ping Aesop with it.
#Omega Strikers Feedback Document
wanton crag
sweet knoll
gray gazelle
Reading through it, most of it seems fine
I disagree with making Static Cam the default option as it acts as a gateway to the game, there's less to focus on with Dynamic Cam, helping new players get a feel for it. Once people feel comfortable enough to turn it off, they can but having it off by default could be very overwhelming for new players trying to keep up with their character
wanton crag
Fair enough, but in that case dynamic needs to not be literally unusable on anything not 16:9 aspect ratio
gray gazelle
yeah and that'd probably be fixed with graphic settings and such so I doubt it'd be kept how it is now
BIG ORANGEANDBLACK5 W TAKE
It ain't that serious but like, definitely should look into changing them so they're less demanding. Especially pass
Let us change character while queueing as well
wanton crag
True good idea
wanton crag
I'm aware it's not the consensus take and I'm willing to discuss it but I'm also pretty firmly set on the idea personally
gray gazelle
About the hard reset on ranked
just raise the requirement to entry rank as you suggested good job 
I think this needs to be chall and above
Let diamond be the peak of low elo as it is now
A lot of diamond players aren't super serious about the game and that's okay, don't need to make them feel like they HAVE to play daily or even weekly (I know a longer time but still)
Chall and Omega tho definitely need it because holy fuck the 2900-2910 sitters part of omega was like 8 pages long or something
play a few games, loss streaks happen
+10 at least
If I get +1 I'm writing a nicely worded message in the #🧶│feedbac-archive channel
smile
This is already on the way I believe
gray gazelle
uh pretty sure I saw a screenshot where you could see the entire lobbies rank as you loaded in
I can probably find it hang on
gray gazelle
Also I don't think this is good. The entire point of the new systems is to add another layer of depth to an otherwise simple game. A part of the skill ceiling should be knowing what characters work well with various buffs and which ones don't and if you put this in one game mode (Casual) and it doesn't translate to ranked it can feel like a different game entirely
wanton crag
I get that and yet I still hate the idea of having the entire meta warp around whether you've randed one map buff or another
We'll see how it plays out, most likely
gray gazelle
I'm noticing a lot of people have this opinion where RNG is bad for ranked and I agree for the most part. RNG in game is bad, however, RNG before the game, where you can pick based off of it (and ban if your ban idea goes through) is healthier for the game than just straight up keeping it where it is now
wanton crag
I agree to a point
Orbs are some RNG element
Maps are another
Future maps are way crazier from what we've seen
So that's already a fair amount
But also adding in game buffs on top seems to me like we've extended beyond the point where it's a reasonable skill check
And into the territory of just being crazy random for the sake of diversity
Personally I'd still be playing even on only Origin with orange orbs (the worst ones) so I'm definitely biased here
But I do think there is a line where pre-match RNG is too much
And I'm afraid game buffs in particular will cross it
gray gazelle
Yeah it definitely needs to be seen, but the game does need to change. Currently, too many games are decided based on who can win strike wars and that needs to tweaked in some way.
wanton crag
Agreed
Although isn't that one of the goals of the core flip mechanic
Which seems like a much better attempt at a solution than "throw random modifiers at the wall and see what sticks"
gray gazelle
okay so I see it and I imagine the ones that are the main culprits here are:
Era base
Era Vamp
Estelle Nurse
Underworld Kai
X + Skins
wanton crag
Estelle/Juli/Asher base all prolly also count
gray gazelle
And I agree Era is weirdly shown off (Go you, girlboss queen) but like for Nurse Estelle I think its fine, it's very tame honestly. Underworld Kai is pretty tame as well but I can see it, and X is part of his identity
But yeah I can see it being a slight problem
I dunn oif its to the level where people are gonna be like "Oh this is WAY to much fanservice, I can't play this" but something to keep an eye on
wanton crag
I don't think it's like, incredibly distracting or horrible, and I don't think any one skin is in and of itself over the line
But the fact that that was somebody's first reaction is, imo, telling
And frankly I've known that person for a while and they are not particularly prudish
arguably quite the opposite
something I think is worth keeping in mind
wanton crag
this is the only change I suggested that I think is explicitly helpful to smurfs
But I don't care it's just necessary lol
gray gazelle
I mean yeah but its like
If you make the game more accessible to new players
it does the same thing to smurfs
that's bound to happen
wanton crag
ye
and I'm not like, fundamentally entirely against the idea of ever alting ever
I literally made one
But it's still something I think should be mechanically discouraged where possible
gray gazelle
I mean for the most part the majority of it looks good the only one's I had a problem with was the reset but even that's fine
Oh and new map stuff
wanton crag
ye fair enough
gray gazelle
also its so cool that I get put in stuff by the community now lmao
wanton crag
I strayed almost entirely from the particularly hot topic of game balance so I'm not expecting a lot of heated arguments over most of it lol
like who would read "make game work better on ultrawide monitors" and say "no" lol
wanton crag
also its so cool that I get put in stuff by the community now lmao
And yeah easy to do when you have a recorded example of the theoretical issue I'm trying to describe readily available to prove that not only is it a theoretical issue but in fact a real one
wanton crag
And yeah easy to do when you have a recorded example of the theoretical issue I'...
Because a lot of the issues with Ranked that could exist in theory fail to exist in a perfect world with an infinite playerbase with a reasonable skill distribution
Like if you have infinite players matchmaking is always fast and pairs players with roughly even skill levels
Reality is much more messy and it's easy to forget that when designing a system
Anyways it's late af so I'ma go to bed but ty for reading it over and giving feedback on the feedback, appreciate it
gray gazelle
NP ima do you a favor and ping him so he shall see it
otherwise this gets drowned out and unseen adn I think it needs to be at least recognized
@vernal quiver
covert plover
bold dew
was omega, TIL stagger swagger heals when you're low and not when you're healthy
round lake
was omega, TIL stagger swagger heals when you're low and not when you're healthy
I could've told you that
Markers ignoring me again for the 5th time
tight canyon
absolutely, stunningly, kawaii https://media.tenor.com/iaDZTTxdWJEAAAAC/good-job-konata.gif
versed cloud
holy shit the amount I agree with this entire section
want to add to the aspect ratio part, playing on mobile is much harder because your fingers will block at least half the goal for the enemies, which can make it harder to play fwd, and having an option to zoom out the camera/change dynamic's zoom amound would make playing fwd much easier
wait did someone actually get +0
wanton crag
wait did someone actually get +0
At least twice that I'm aware of, yes.
versed cloud
yikes
hearty lily
Losing 0 also happens too 
wanton crag
I don't think anybody is going to complain about that tho
south python
Okay read throught he whole thing, pretty much agree with everything!! Approved!
Good work Orange for summing everything up nicely 
still pelican
I think most of the doc is pretty solid
Personally I don't think static camera should be default. I play on dynamic with no issues and think it looks nice. Obviously static is more competitive but since there's already an option to enable it I don't think it's an issue.
it's kind of a whatever point tho tbh we already have the option
I'm pro-crossplatform as well. Yeah, some platforms have clear advantages over others, but ultimately in the grand scheme of things I don't think that separating the playerbase will do good. And having a variety of systems to opt-in separating platforms seems....like a lot of unnecessary back-end work for the devs
fuck trainings in the shop tho u absolutely right about that
I'm fine with trainings having tons of power but not so much with them being locked behind currency
Maybe locking them behind player level is fine but I'm even against that tbqh
wanton crag
Maybe locking them behind player level is fine but I'm even against that tbqh
I was thinking along the lines of "you have them all by like level 10" so it shouldn't be a grind, just staggered to prevent overwhelming new players with too many options
versed cloud
Eventually, it might become a mess of " hit lv 40 to get this training" though, depending on if they keep adding more or not
Though, it really shouldn't be a 12k grind for one training
wanton crag
Keep ranked Best to 5 - win by 2
...was that changing?
for what it's worth I do think first-to-five-win-by-two works very well with the current setup
I do see a world where the new mechanics like core flip and goal barriers could lead the devs to want to change it, and I don't think the current system is so immutably perfect that no change could ever be an improvement
but in general I'm still pretty iffy on goal barriers in the first place (might change my mind to play with them, we'll see) so anything that would be a response to them feels a bit hasty to me personally at the moment
hearty lily
i think just keeping them in the shop but making trainings cheaper is better
like 2000-3000 gold
5000 gold felt fine to me but that's my experience, the 15k trainings felt absolutely ridiculous
still pelican
I'd be okay with 3k trainings
wanton crag
I think the issue is that as a new player spending gold on trainings feels like sacrificing a new character (because it is) while once you get out of being new you have literally nothing to spend gold on
I'm pretty sure I have several hundred thousand on my main lol
hearty lily
i was never a fan of leveling up to unlock certain trainings, it feels better to me to pick a training i want and spend a bit of gold to get my desired loadout faster
wanton crag
frankly I'd rather have the "too much gold, not enough to spend it on" issue than the "new players can't buy trainings they need to match others' performances" issue
and it's not even close
hearty lily
its just that they were too expensive
still pelican
Ideally we have free trainings but idk if that'll happen
wanton crag
i was never a fan of leveling up to unlock certain trainings, it feels better to...
counterpoint, if the level is low you're gonna hit that well before you'd have been able to save up for your desired loadout anyways, considering all your early gold will be going to characters
hearty lily
there's no reason to spend my gold buying every character when im only going to play a certain few
if training mode lets us try characters we haven't unlocked yet at least
free trainings would be nice too tho
wanton crag
I think that free trainings is an inevitability to be entirely honest
And the faster we move there the better
south python
I understand the argument for having the trainings in the shop for a little gold
Helps new players not be as overwhelmed with choice during their first matches but it definitely should not have to be a decision of choosing a training over a character to buy
Like I think even 3k is too much
still pelican
3k is like 10 games with a 50% winrate
that's not the worst
still think it shouldn't be in shop but I don't think 3k would be awful
hearty lily
i just think either free or very cheap in shop is best
i hate the idea of level based unlock trainings
south python
Yeah it's not awful I will say, nothing will be worse than the 15k gold, everyone knows its a bad idea
still pelican
15k is 
still pelican
You had to play like 55* games to get a 15k training
south python
Sorry orange, you have to be banished for that lie 😔
broken tulip
okay, I read the entire thing and must say there's a lot of good and clever takes in there
so yeah, rly nice professional feedback 😄
that said there were a few minor parts where I was either a little confused or might slightly disagree:
for example, I really don't understand the entire thing about linear/nonlinear speed/haste and diminishing returns/less than actual percentage part. Why wouldn't speed just be a numerical value and haste a multiplier?
that said, I completely agree that these terms need to be communicated better and I completely agree with your next point of character stats needing to be available in-game. If the stats are shown in-game and the speed stat is clearly labeled "speed", then I think everything from there should make a lot more sense. (haste should probably be explained somewhere more clearly as percentile increase to speed regardless though)
but yeah, I don't know how many players have never seen a stat sheet like this (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1m5ML1Z4xzDA3Npqy1ciosyMRXbxa-dABZOwa3B5DorY/edit#gid=0), and imo that's pretty critical info to withhold. So if there were some form of that in-game that would go a huge way, esp. for clarifying speed vs. haste. or +power vs. +X% power
also one thing about the stagger bar is that visually it very clearly depletes from right to left. I think if Ody for some reason doesn't want to use the word health or any equivalent and stick with "stagger" instead, then imo it might even make sense for the stagger bar to fill up from left to right instead 😂
I'm also a little curious about what you envision when you mention a "ability direction indicator" for controller. Would it perhaps be an indicator always showing you which direction your right stick is aiming to on screen at any given time?
wanton crag
for example, I really don't understand the entire thing about linear/nonlinear s...
the reason you don't want speed to be a numeric value and hastes to be a multiplier is that multipliers stack multiplicatively
that's going to lead to very fast people if you start stacking hastes
the way the devs currently account for this is making hastes have diminishing returns - ie, if you have two hastes, your final speed stat will be significantly lower than you'd expect based on their listed percentage values
broken tulip
oooh, I get it, and it isn't clear if it's X% of the increased speed or of the base speed at your current level, got it ^^
wanton crag
my argument is that this approach is silly and that 30% should be 30% but 1000 speed should not be twice as fast as 500
which resolves the issue of having stacked multiplicative buffs being more and more powerful
without trying to redefine what a percentage point is
wanton crag
I'm also a little curious about what you envision when you mention a "ability di...
yes, if that already exists then lolme
broken tulip
so you're saying don't make speed linear, I get it
wanton crag
pmuch, because the alternative is making hastes nonlinear and as those are measured in percent, which has a standard meaning, making hastes nonlinear instead of speed is super confusing
broken tulip
yes, if that already exists then lolme
no it doesn't just the normal ability indicators that kbm also has access to. I just wasn't sure what you meant. If it's an indicator that doesn't cost me casting time I might even try it out in case it gets added xD
wanton crag
yeah that's what I had in mind, just a little arrow showing what direction your stick is pointing in
broken tulip
pmuch, because the alternative is making hastes nonlinear and as those are measu...
what if it is always the percentage of the raw level speed though, before any effects like other hastes or slowdowns get applied? Still takes some communication but I think linear speed has some benefits for intuition as well, and wouldn't making speed nonlinear mean that gaining 50 speed at max lvl is *way *less effective than at lvl 1?
broken tulip
yeah that's what I had in mind, just a little arrow showing what direction your ...
could be fun yeah, I use my right stick so fast sometimes that I'm not sure the indicator could keep up (and be relevant), but definitely a fun idea for sure, would be interesting.
might rly help if you have time for lining stuff up though, which currently is pretty impossible
wanton crag
It doesn't need to be way less effective, and yeah obviously changing how Speed works from the ground up would require tweaking basically every single speed and haste number currently in the game to maintain the desired end result - but I do see what you mean about just always operating off of base speed.
My fear is that without nerfing the haste buffs by some things I can see worlds where Era-in-particular becomes way too fast from applying the haste from her ability and multiple haste-boosting trainings, and while making the percentage hastes additive instead of multiplicative does mean it won't be quite so bad, I'm still pretty sure that it'll be overboard if Speed is left as is and hastes are converted to straight percentages.
That's really something only the devs could test though, I have no ability to run those numbers and try the systems out.
gray gazelle
I think it just needs to be cleared up that anything granting Speed is flat, so Stacks on Stacks will grant you the same move speed regardless of how fast you are
Haste is a %
broken tulip
ok, for fun I kinda wanna do the little math to see how far I get. Let's for now just assume there's a Super Surge Era and Kai both lvl.5:
Era uses Flutterfly and Kai uses Blazing Pace, how fast does Kai go?
His base speed at lvl.5 is 500, he grants himself a 35% haste boost bringing that to 675, then Era further boosts him with a - okay - here I see a lil problem in figuring out how super surge boosts hastes but I'm guessing that 50% faster hastes just is an actual multiplier here, so instead of 40% starting haste, Era grants a 60% haste to Kai. Now my guess for not making everything go multiply crazy would have been to take the 60% of Kai's base lvl.5 speed which is 500, so 300 to be added on top of the 675 speed that Kai is already going at, which would push him to 975 speed?? which I think is already about the highest ever recorded Kai speed ever recorded, and the Kai didn't even have super surge or lvl.10 yet, so I guess I don't get how hastes work after all 🤣
wanton crag
yeah
the reason the math fails
is because a X% haste is currently not a X% increase to your speed
broken tulip
yeah, seems that way 🤔
wanton crag
ok here: your movespeed should be ~1100 with super surge but its 937 iirc
basically, long story short, that is a silly solution to the problem of excessive speed
broken tulip
yup ok xD
you have me on board now xD
gray gazelle
The issue is that tweaking those could break Kai and Era
broken tulip
quickly some more thoughts I had, those are more of the slight disagrees I had when reading:
Touching on ranked decay, I really don't like the idea of decay because I think that it can lead to frustration and frustration can lead to toxicity which Ody made really clear that they are trying to avoid but if decay is only applied in the highest ranks (chall & omega) as Fwop also suggested earlier, I think it could definitely do a lot of good for the game.
when it comes to rank resets upon full release, my personal take on it is:
I'm fully on board with a hard reset. Honestly, when I started playing on the first days of beta, I had no clue who the people on top of the leaderboard were yet, but it was super exciting for me regardless to keep checking the leaderboards and to see what rank the highest ranked players had gotten to yet. Who would be first to hit omega basically, so I'd absolutely love to see a race like that happen again, though that's maybe more of a personal argument.
When it comes to how I'd solve the rookie vs. very experienced players issue, I'd personally solve it like this:
"Are we beta players rookies?" No. So just let us skip rookie and reset everyone to bronze. That way ppl must get at least ~5 ranked wins before potentially being matched up with one of us. I kinda like having access to ranked very quickly after installing the game but that may be just me.
also when it comes to the "keep ranked simple" section, I also agree with what Fwop said earlier. I think Ody made it very clear by taking down the beta version that they want to implement more diversity and I'm pretty sure that ranked is the place for it, I was also scared at first but I'm kind of anticipating it now getting to see how it'll play. That said I'm someone who mains at least half the roaster and is looking to add more and more mains, so if I see a "ult boosts size", red orbs map, well maybe I wanna try out X and punch people. So for me trying to make the most of that variability is pretty exciting. I completely get how it can feel completely rng to the majority of the playerbase though who only have a few mains.
okay, and this is the one thing you suggested that actually has me a lil scared:
queue accepts 🥶
I think if we have a big enough playerbase, afkers shouldn't happen nearly as much anymore, and then waiting for ppl to accept the q just adds unnecessary extra time to each match, when I would prefer to transition from one game to the next fast-pace and fluently. And on the other hand, if there are less queuers (either during demon hours or at very high omega rank), then I think that a lot of people might tab out, stand up from their seat etc. and if the queue accept time is short and there is some punishment for it, that could be an issue. Speaking for myself during beta I was tabbed out / afk a lot while queuing but with very very few exceptions I always made it back to my matches on time - sometimes the first players had already picked their characters, and sometimes it maybe even auto-picked Juli for me but still... I'd rather have that than not getting matches cause I have to accept them manually. But maybe I'm just the problem in that case 😂
If there's no penalty for not accepting a queue, then I don't really mind it that much, but I certainly wouldn't love it, and I'm really hoping that the game develops to a point where queues don't even take that long. Imagine clicking queue and having to confirm the found game 10s later every single time. idk if that's my dreamworld but yeah, and also probably I'm just the problem here, not your idea xD
but finally with all of that said, I really gotta say that there are a lot, a lot of good ideas in there and I still agree completely with the vast majority 😄
esp. the bringing back the battle pass from beta was something I even was planning to write myself in the feedback section xD
but yeah, really nice work
for implementations
wanton crag
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