it let me see the contract that was stolen

[peak raft]

spymaster stole my contract from my deck then a turn late the a.i played it and I could click on it and see the contract

it let me see the contract that was stolen

[vapid spear]

Oh shoot?

Ill take a look at this

[limpid relic]

Ain't it supposed to be like this since spymaster shows you the card in the first place

[vapid spear]

Ehh but if mulligan is playing augur could skew it.

[limpid relic]

If its mulligan contact it doesn't show, if its the players it does. I know because in ranked I look at my opponents cards to see what card they stole

[stark burrow]

When a contract is taken from your deck, I do believe you can always see it. Even if your opponent has show cards off. Its always been see able.

[vapid spear]

Just saying visually, even if someone stole it it shouldnt be visible to the other player in the contract zone. Due to the possibility of other contracts in hand

Its not a bug sorry for if i confused anyone 😅

I wasnt 100% aware of it working with contracts

[rain apex]

Wait, I know that when a card is stolen, it is revealed to all spectators but why is the card permanently revealed to the opponent as well?

It’s a contract, its entire gimmick is being hidden until the trigger is met, it being revealed (to the opponent) because it was stolen feels like it should be wrong.

[sharp lance]

Stolen cards are public knowledge, have been since PG was added to the game.

[rain apex]

But like, why

How is this, being in the game, a net positive. All it really does is encourage looking at hands and knowing what contract is what when your opponent otherwise would have been relatively in the dark.

[limpid relic]

Yeah when my opponents steals a card and i don't see what they took or don't remember, I just go to thier side and look at their hand since my card will be shown, I especially do this in ranked since I know thier hand is off

[sharp lance]

If it's your card, and I steal it, we've both seen it. It's public knowledge, and therefor there is no harm in keeping it revealed. We shouldn't be actively punishing someone's poor mental tracking, that's not fair.

[vapid spear]

However if someone has two contracts as augur, it gives away information that isnt just that card..

[sharp lance]

It gives away information I had anyway. If you stole my contract.

I also don't understand how we are only now taking an issue with something that has existed for 3 years.

Other online games end up with external digital tracking tools that keeps track of this stuff for people. Why drive people to need to use external tools when it's something we can just support and make it a equal balance across the board

[rain apex]

“Back in my day, we used to walk uphill both ways to and from school”
Just because something’s existed for a long time, it doesn’t mean it’s always been good.

When my contract is stolen and when my opponent goes to play a contract, they could play literally any contract in the game. It isn’t possible for me to know that they’re currently playing my contract specifically when they could be playing any other contract they run in their deck.

And you’re right. Magic the Gathering Arena tracks cards and displays public info. Good thing it’s smart enough to know what’s actually public info. Cards and tankards isn’t smart enough to do that.

When my opponent looks at my hand and sees my Badgermole Cub. Then I draw a card they don’t know (and it happens to also be a badgermole cub). The game won’t care which one I play and my opponent will not just automatically know what’s in my hand if I accidentally play the wrong badgermole cub. C&t isn’t this smart and makes mistakes.

When a contract is played, it could literally be any contract in existence. Just because it was stolen and is now common knowledge that it is in my hand, it does not mean that they know what contracts I’m playing.

[sharp lance]

“Back in my day, we used to walk uphill both ways to and from school”
Just because something’s existed for a long time, it doesn’t mean it’s always been good.
You missed the point I was raising. Why is it only now after existing for 3 years being brought up. Surely if this was an issue someone would have brought it up before now.

When my opponent looks at my hand and sees my Badgermole Cub. Then I draw a card they don’t know (and it happens to also be a badgermole cub). The game won’t care which one I play and my opponent will not just automatically know what’s in my hand if I accidentally play the wrong badgermole cub. C&t isn’t this smart and makes mistakes.
Strange, because if you track your opponent's cards after such a thing you know if it's that card or not.

[rain apex]

Clearly you didn’t understand my example

[limpid relic]

Would you say remove the contract showing or the card in genral

[next mortar]

Just because it hasn't been discussed before, doesn't mean something isn't an issue, Khat. It should just be discussed internal among the Card Design team for if they feel there should be a change or not

[rain apex]

Contracts should never be shown as they will always be unknown as to if that specific contract that was stolen was the specific one that was played.

[sharp lance]

I'm not saying it's not an issue. I'm questioning why it wasn't ever brought up before, does that mean it isn't as much of an issue as is being raised.

[limpid relic]

But the thing is that once that card is shown you can keep an eye on that card and where it is in their hand until they play it so now you know what it is. Since enough mental tracking allows you to know what the contract is i agree with khat that it should just be shown

[sharp lance]

Or even worse what if your game lags as the steal happens, then you don't get to know at all.

So when you would have knowledge and abiliy to track it, now you don't, because of something out of your control.

[cursive latch]

this is working intentionally isn't it?

[stark burrow]

This is more so turned into a debate over if this should be the case for the future.

[cursive latch]

I'm on the side that it should be the case for the future

[rain apex]

I have a Fish in my hand that my opponent knows about. I have a Fish on the top of my deck that they don’t know about.

If I draw a card I’ll have 2 Fish in my hand but my opponent doesn’t know that.

From here on Fish 1 will be the one my opponent knows about and Fish 2 was the one I drew. Still the same exact card, I’m calling them different names so you don’t get lost.

Magic the gathering arena knows that it doesn’t matter if I play Fish 1 or Fish 2 because they’re the same exact card and my opponent won’t know I have a second copy in my hand.

Cards and tankards Does care about which card is played. Fish 1 is public knowledge and Fish 2 is hidden knowledge.

Same thing is happening but with contracts. Contract 1 is public knowledge and Contract 2 isn’t. But your opponent has no way of knowing which is which as they’re supposed to be hidden. Showing them what the contract is, is actually providing More info than they would have otherwise known.

[stark burrow]

Like you can see cards stolen or that you cant?

[cursive latch]

that you can

[rain apex]

Not what I’m talking about. They’re shown in the hand for a reason and I’m not against that. I’m against knowing what a contract is when you never should have known such a thing.

[sharp lance]

I can physically watch you move the cards around in your hand and know where Fish1 is.

[sharp lance]

Then this unfortunately falls foul of the technical issue where you would see the contract as it's played.

[limpid relic]

Like I said all you need to do is keep an eye on where that card is in the hand and then see which one they play

[sharp lance]

So now it doesn't matter if it's hidden, I saw it go in as Pact

[limpid relic]

For me if there is something that allows you to know, we should all know

[rain apex]

I give up. I don’t care enough to try to fix this. This isn’t my problem to deal with

[sharp lance]

That's up to you. I'm willing to listen and talk it out, but I won't force you to continue discussing it

[peak raft]

I learn something new today. I do a have question then does it reveal the cards from pick pickpocket when you draw them? I am asking because if so I should look at my opponent hand every turn after they pickpocket me

[sharp lance]

I believe cards that end up in the deck are the exception. I am not 100% certain though.

[vapid spear]

Its specifically cards to hand im pretty sure

[peak raft]

When I get back on I will test it with someone

Should there be a symbol showing that this card is reveal to everyone?

[sharp lance]

No, no special symbol or anything like that.

[peak raft]

Reveal cards are public knowledge. I think the player that gets the reveal card should have a way to know its public knowledge in their hand.
Do you think there a way that can be added?

[sharp lance]

What would you propose would be a good way to achieve this, if you have a suggestion?

We are dramatically running out of real estate space on the card itself so I'm not sure where it could fit.

[peak raft]

One idea I have is to when you hover over a card instead of the blue it a yellow. this would make people question why its a different color and remember it's public knowledge.
A more bolder solution is when its hover over the card a eye show up. there would be little to no confuse at all with this one but idk if it fit the game
Does any of them sound good to you?

[sharp lance]

I’m not sure what yellow you are referring to

[peak raft]

I am talking about color yellow. The idea I have is instead of blue highlight around card when you hover over it you turn it into a yellow color

[sharp lance]

OH the highlight around the card. I can see what you meant now by re-reading it with that context.
I wasn't thinking about the highlight and couldn't think of what "yello" you were referring to with the graphic of the card itself

[peak raft]

so how does the idea sound to you?

[sharp lance]

I don't think it conveys the idea that "this is revealed", sadly.

[peak raft]

ok if I think of other idea I will send it in one of feedback channels

[torpid nest]

Idk is this is the same thing, or if this has been mentioned, but if one player has their cards hidden and the other doesn’t, when the “hidden cards” player takes a card from the “non-hidden cards” player, then the card they took will remain visible in their hand… hopefully that makes sense, if not I can try and replicate it and send a video of what I mean

[sharp lance]

Same thing, a card being stolen becomes public knowledge as you know what it was prior, and they now know what it is

Your hand hide state doesn’t matter for this