lore

[rotund portal]

What is squib ? Nevers read this in french Book HP

[rocky sierra]

Children of magic folk

but have no magic

well, can't use magic

they have magic blood as pointed by the guy before

Example of a Squib is Filch

[random moon]

Yeah they have the magic “gene” but can’t actually use magic themselves.

There’s are actually scams like “Kwick-Spell” that target Squibs, promising to give them magic.

The do not work lol. They’re just scams

But a Squib still has the potential to have magical children or magical descendants (this is believed to be why Muggle borns are a thing,, having a Squib in their ancestry )

[rocky sierra]

That's cool didn't know that but it makes sense

[rotund portal]

Ok thanks

[ruby thistle]

If magic is a gene, muggles aren't gonna exist for long. :p

One day they will discover the gene, wonder what it does. And x years later, boom, magic gets discovered.

Gene manipulation is a thing today already. ^^

[random moon]

Calling it a “gene “ is really more semantics than anything.

It’s hereditary, but you can be born from two Pureblood magical parents and not be able to use it yourself, instead you an only pass on the potential for magic.

It’s magic. It’s hereditary, and the closest thing we can equate to it is genes, but it’s not actually a gene. If that makes sense?

It can pass through a bloodline from a squib across many generations and suddenly pop up in one of their descendants. So it’s kind of similar to a genetic disposition skipping generations.

[acoustic basin]

im watching the gameplay trailer, and i noticed that they just took off from Hogwarts. how would that work since you cant get in our out of Hogwarts without permission from the headmaster?

[rotund portal]

Not in 1800 i think

[viral fox]

Could also just be something that is disregarded for the sake of fun gameplay

[snow harness]

It's the same as having a cool down on the spells. It's for gameplay so you can't just walk around and instantly kill everyone because it would quickly make the game not fun.

[timid juniper]

So dark arts area confirmed in the forbidden forest

[worthy trench]

Yah

In b4 someone theorizes the statue at the entrance is Morgana le Fay

[thick yacht]

is there anywhere I could catch up on just... general lore before release? I'm rereading HP right now but that's likely not enough

I've been looking around on the wiki a bit

[worthy trench]

Like what lore in general?

Like there's no telling how much lore will be referenced since it takes place prior to any of the book major characters being around minus Flamal, Dippet and Headmaster Black and Peeves. And we ain't likely seeing Flamal or Dippet

I mean nothing in HP books will likely be relevent to the game minus maybe one thing but thats a spoiler technically

[thick yacht]

lol yeah I figured rereading them wouldn't do much, but idk I guess just like the history of the wizarding world and/or hogwarts kinda lore

[worthy trench]

well you can just look up hogwarts school article

like general encopasses a lot

There's ll be little easter eggs and call forwards for sure in the game

but its not likely anything from FB era or HP era will have any relevence at all in the game's story or lore

Not even the spoiler thing is going to be relevent most likely since we know were it will go afterward

The relevent stuff storywise in the game is going to be the Goblin rebellion of which little is known exept it failed obviously.

Most of whats in this is gonna by made up by devs

the game's story is not canon nor wil any lore they add

Like new hogwarts lore or backstories or OCs

unless JK puts them in herself later in canon

Merlin is a major background focus character in this

Salazar Slytherin potentially aswell

But the main story is the goblin rebellion and some group of dark wizards

and you have a rare power to sense and use Ancient Magic, whatever that is exactly and you will decide the fate of the world basically. Obviously the canon compliant ending will see us likely keep this power hidden or remove altogther.

Non canon compliant endings will probably see us cause everything to go FUBAR in a way that would prevent the stuff we know that happens later from happening as it did.

Like we take over the world or become a dark lord and try to with our ancient magic or something

or we kill a ancestor of HP

or something

[thick yacht]

Thanks ❤️ appreciate it Dandelion

[ruby thistle]

Is there some sort of mana equivalent in hp universe?

I know they don't have mana per say but do they get fatigued by casting spells. Is there a difference between casting complex spells for a long time vs simpler ones?

Basically, if you've mastered a complex spell like stupefy or confringo, is there ever a reason to use simpler alternative to not exhaust yourself?

[cobalt jolt]

This is actually something I have wondered myself

[worthy trench]

There's no mana thing. Obviously spells require willpower and concentration which takes energy.

And naturally you will get fatigued from prolonged spellcasting due to the motions etc and if your fighting against others meaning ur focusing on beating their spells or defending against their spells.

Magic may keep you alive longer than muggles naturally and give you greater vitality in older age but your as humans as anyone else and you got to do all the same stuff, eat, sleep, drink etc to keep yourself healthy.

But no there is limit on many times you can cast a spell in quick succession.

that is inherent to the magic of HP verse

only your own overall wellbeing limits you

[unkempt stone]

I'm thinking it will have to do with stamina, like you're a 5th year student that is already BEHIND so it will increase as you practice with teachers, etc.

[ruby thistle]

Nothing that looked like stamina, with exception of cooldowns were visible in gameplay. So i assume we can spam as much as we want.

[worthy trench]

Wait till mods reduce the cooldown

[left saffron]

We might get a build for reducing cooldowns

[quaint magnet]

Do you think back in the past, wizards knew blacksmithing, or something like that?

[cobalt jolt]

I mean, there is an anvil you can have in your vivariums, that are implied to serve that purpose

and I imagine at least metalurgy would be important for alchemy

[quaint magnet]

Have they mentioned alchemy in the game?

[cobalt jolt]

There's probably something you could rp as that

we know there will be potionmaking

[quaint magnet]

If I remember correctly alchemy is a mix of transfiguration, and potions, am I missing something else?

[cobalt jolt]

Ok, that will be helpful for an alchemist build

[ruby thistle]

I mean yeah. To some degree. They probably outsourced it to goblins or muggle smiths.

[cobalt jolt]

I don't see why they wouldn't still

[quaint magnet]

Looked up the wiki for harry potter alchemy, consists of transfiguration, potions and muggle chemistry

[cobalt jolt]

Do you think any magical, and muggle creatures are at all related? Like Unicorns, and Siberian Unicorns, for example?

[quaint magnet]

It's possible that they may share a common ancestor

[worthy trench]

Wizards would have to know smithing cos Goblins view stuff they make as theirs not the wizards who ask them to make the stuff

So if the wizards want to avoid that issue later, they'd make their own

especially in later times when they seperate from muggles.

Wizards and muggles spent most of history intermingled so they will know the same stuff as each other for most of it

its only later that wizards start losing out on muggle stuff after they seperate

[random moon]

Yeah magical folk have used smithing, it’s just done using magic to automate it lol

If you wanted something particularly fancy and/or powerful then you go to a goblin. Goblin Silver is enchanted and has many magical properties

[ruby thistle]

How does one denote the power of a wizard in hp universe?

I mean they keep talking about the power some wizards have, and how strong some spells are, but we see in some scenarios how easy they learn new spells.

Like ron cast imperio for the first time during their heist in gringots, his only previous experience was the presentation in a defence against the dark arts class.

So clearly, if you just find powerful spells and spend some time learning them, pretty much anyone can become a "powerful" wizard.

What actually separates dumbledore from any other wizard or witch?

[stone matrix]

Most of the “most powerful” are people who studied hard that’s true. But there must be something else too

[boreal shuttle]

Ron casting Imperio also is a film-exclusive scene and not actually canon. Harry seems to have a knack for the Unforgivables that can be attributed to Voldemort's soul piece, but he's also generally adept at succeeding & learning really fast when the stakes are high.

Power is something you either have or you don't - and even if you don't, that doesn't stop you from still being talented/gifted and learning most spells.

[ruby thistle]

Point is, the spells themselves are fairly powerful.

Avada kedavra is perhaps the strongest dark arts spell, outside of horcruxes. Yet we see pretty much every average dark wizard cast them all willy nilly.

Say you learn
stupefy -stun,
protego - shield,
confringo- quick explosion, fiendfyre - massive aoe,
avada kedavra - quick shield ignoring insta kill.

And ofc basic utility spells I won't bother to list.

You now have all the spells you could possibly need to be a powerful duelist. No need to learn all those extremely obscure spells. The ones I listed would for sure do the job in 99%of the cases.

In hp universe I feel almost every person we see is a powerful wizard.

[boreal shuttle]

Avada Kedavra has a devastaging effect, it's not even close in power to some other dark spells though - like Fiendfyre or Protego Diabolica.

Power doesn't have anything to do with one's spell repertoire or finesse and everything with what you can do with individual spells. Harry chasing away 100 Dementors in PoA, Dumbledore fending off the Inferi in HBP - those are examples of power.

So one can be a skilled wizard without being particularly powerful or a powerful wizard with barely any skill.

[ruby thistle]

Disagree with your first point. Ak is extremely powerful. Sure it may not have the environmental destruction of fiendfyre, but its the most powerful concentrated curse there is.

It just kills you, no burning you to death, or bleeding you to death. Just the end result outright.

Sure its not as impressive visually, but to call it weaker in power than spells you can survive. Well I cant agree with that.

I do see your point with the patronuses and what you can do with a spell though.

Most people probably can't chase off 100 dementors with a patronus, as you said.

[boreal shuttle]

My point about AK is mainly that the spell, if cast correctly, is always the same. An AK from Voldemort will look and work exactly like the one from Pettigrew, for example - the former might cast it more quickly and can cast it more frequently but other than that there's no real distinction.

The spell is definitely powerful in nature though, on that I agree.

[olive swan]

Meh, if you get hit by it it kills you. If you use something inanimate to block it, it's useless. So, yeah, it's lethal and all that, but it's not the strongest spell.

Also, you can avoid it, or dodge it. So, idk. We don't know the workings behind the spell really. Depends if you consider movies spell casting canon or not, I guess.

[ruby thistle]

We are not talking about straight up usefulness, or range of destruction here.

The spell outright kills you. It doesn't kill you as a side effect of conjuring fire that burns you, and such. It has one use, to 100% kill its target on hit.

There is a reason you get life in azkaban for it, in comparison to fiendfyre or confringo.

[ruby thistle]

Ak goes through protego. Sure inanimate objects would stop it, but that would stop pretty much any spell, depending on how solid/thick said object is.

Another powerful piece of magic imo would be animagi forms.

The ability to transform into an animal at will, without a wand, or even a hand movement nor with a verbal/non verbal incantation (ignoring the process itself).

Sure you can learn to transfiguration, but its the inherent freedom of the spell, and its guaranteed effect that makes it powerful to me.

[olive swan]

Nah, it doesn't. We don't know how fast the spell travels if you can control it once it has left the wand, yada yada.

Using transfigured items to intercept the spell is very much viable and something Dumbledore did, if I am not mistaken in the Battle of the Ministry Atrium as well, or it at least had been heavily implied.

It's stupid, you don't just stand there and let it happen. I belive real wizard fights are a lot more stealthy and deadly. You don't stand in front of your opponent and cast AK repeatedly.

[ruby thistle]

It does go through protego. Nothing except sacrifice through love is able to block ak. Other than there being a wall between you and the spell.

I suppose the twin core laser beam effect can block it too.

But these exceptions are so rare I don't think they really matter to the discussion.

[ruby thistle]

Why not, they can't block it. Only dodge or try to conjure other objects between you and it.

Its an incredibly dangerous spell.

Ok, the transfiguration example is true.

But dumbledore is like the greatest wizard of his time?

I dont think it reduces my point at all, that ak is perhaps thenmost powerful piece of dark magic outside of horcruxes at all.

[olive swan]

I never said it could be blocked by another spell. Not sure why you're so adamant on Pretego.

Because it's stupid. You only need to block it once through some object, then use apperation and its done.

This is so stupid. You don't need to be the greatest wizard of all time to transfigure something between you.

Like I've said, we don't know the speed of a spell so, this could be somewhat interesting, I guess.

Both parties have magic, for only one party to use it and the other one to just get killed is nonesnese.

[ruby thistle]

I assume its as fast as pretty much every other spell we see. Dunno.

They arent so fast that people can't see the flash moving through the air.

[olive swan]

I'd say it's effiecent but not powerful. I think Fiendfyre is much worse, as in you can't control how the spell reacts. For all its worth, it might consume you as well.

And you could burn down a whole city with it if it continues on for long enough.

[ruby thistle]

Eh whats your point here. The one who use the non blockable killing spell certainly has the advantage.

The other person is constantly on the defence, and moving. Whereas the other can use a simple protego spell to block most attacks.

If both use ak, then its a much riskier fight for both sides.

[olive swan]

AK is like a bullet that only kills a single target and only if that target basically does nothing.

[ruby thistle]

If you simplify it like that, we can say the same about every spell.

[stuck epoch]

no its actually pretty accurate to call it a one shot bullet you cant block

[ruby thistle]

The part where you talk about the opposing person doing nothing.

[stuck epoch]

you cant dodge bullets and unless you have a brother wand core you wont be able to do the the harry did

[stuck epoch]

i mean it doesnt really matter if the opposing person does something or not as there is hardly anything you can do

[ruby thistle]

He is right about transfiguration being a block though.

[stuck epoch]

being at that level of transfiguration is hard so unless you spent extra time studying it or are just talented in it you wont be able to use it

[ruby thistle]

I agree. But, just as a general statement. That is perhaps the only way to actually block it, other than teleporting or jumping away.

[olive swan]

But is it though?

[stuck epoch]

probably

[stuck epoch]

yes the general student wont get that level of transfiguration if they only attend school

[olive swan]

One would imagine, having a dark Lord roaming around, you'd learn how to counter the spell, but they don't.

[olive swan]

Yeah, not sure about that. All you need is a stone slate or something. It doesn't need to be intricate or pretty.

[ruby thistle]

I mean the only counter is to not get hit.

[stuck epoch]

why would they they are "save" in hogwarts until they werent and then they probably wouldnt even be allowed to learn anything that is not what they should

[olive swan]

If you're in an open field with nothing left, sure. But inside a room with stuff, I really can't see that happening.

[stuck epoch]

and voldy was also "dead" before so they also didnt bother

[ruby thistle]

There is dirt though if you can transfigure enough of it fast enough to create walls.

[olive swan]

That I would consider advanced.

[stuck epoch]

you dont even really need transfiguration but just a leviosa to use an object but you have to react in time which is like trying to dodge a bullet

[olive swan]

But having something and letting it fly before you is not, or turning a book to stone or something. That's basic transfiguration. It's not turning an animal into a cup.

Is it though. Do spells fly like bullets? Because we don't know.

[ruby thistle]

Technically possible, but its not feasible.

[stuck epoch]

and the casting alone is enough to strike some fear in a normal person making them hesitate which is plenty of time for them to not being able to

[stuck epoch]

yes

[ruby thistle]

Like what are options in an actual fight. Not pure luck based ways to do it

[olive swan]

That's why I've said, fights ought to be sneaky.

You don't just face tank the dark wizard. It's stupid.

[stuck epoch]

without some luck of insane reaction its impossible to counter/defend against it

[olive swan]

[stuck epoch]

so its pretty much impossible

[olive swan]

Yeah, I don't see that.

[ruby thistle]

I wonder if enemies will be able to dodge our spells in game. Or if its always 100% chance to hit outside of blocks.

[olive swan]

Don't enemies have shields that need to be broken?

[stuck epoch]

yes

some have

and some can block iirc

but i dont think ive seen any try to dodge

[olive swan]

Don't think combat will be that sophisticated.

[stuck epoch]

could just be the arena/difficulty that made them like that but i think them dodging is not going to be a thing

[stuck epoch]

from what weve seen it isnt

imo

[olive swan]

Yeah, hope it's a little more tuned down. Arena was basically cheat mode. Ak shouldn't be something you can cast every 10 seconds.

The whole point is, and why I think the curse is so deranged, is that you must mean it, you really want that person dead.

[stuck epoch]

well have to seen when and how to acquire it and how its going to be used i the open world then

[olive swan]

And that's like a totally different mindset to be in. Using a gun is just, well sure - there might be this outcome but it's a tool really. AK isn't.

[stuck epoch]

cause casting it against a human is a ticked straight to azkaban and they would know as we are underage but well

[olive swan]

Just shoes how racist wizards are against other magicals. Really hope for WB's sake the story isn't tone deaf.

[stuck epoch]

thats just humans not just wizards but yea

[worthy trench]

We know the spell's energy jet isn't fast enough to stop people from dodging or blocking it with something else within a certain radius. What the radius is, we dunno. But you still have to be fast enough to see the spell coming to dodge or block and you need to hear the spell spoken if its cast verbally which gives you a couple of seconds to react before the spells manifests from the wand.

[worthy trench]

Well not as fast as bullets it seems since you can dodge a great many spells from a certain radius. With bullets, you need to starting dodging before its fired or else I think your getting hit if your within the bullet's firing distance.

[supple flume]

@ruby thistle

https://tenor.com/view/hogwarts-quidditch-roxanne-flying-broom-gif-12580453

[stone matrix]

Given the whole “voldemorts soul” situation… what would have happened if someone killed Harry?

For example Barty Crouch Jr used imperious on him… if he AKed instead (ignoring his own fate) what would have happened to Harry?

[boreal shuttle]

He would have died. Lily's sacrifice protected him from Voldemort and Voldemort only - without that very unique situation he wouldn't have accompanied the soul piece into the limbo and simply died, taking the soul piece with him.

[stone matrix]

They should have just done that then. Voldemort would still have been able to come back and without his weakness to Harry.

[stuck epoch]

yea but voldy was very adamant about him having to kill harry so they probably never even thought about killing him

[boreal shuttle]

Yeah, Voldemort lost the war due to his own arrogance and need to prove himself, plain and simple.

[unborn geode]

In the end, he lost because he was a Slytherin 😏

[boreal shuttle]

We could go even further back though, imo Voldemort lost because he created Horcruxes to begin with. Wizarding Britain would have been helpless against a Tom Riddle who was less afraid of death and the Horcruxes actually turned him into a lesser version of himself, at least mentally.

[unborn geode]

honestly could even go further back and it was because he was conceived by a relationship with a love potion. The curse of him not being able to know love and feel the compassion of other people is what made him the dark and heartless person he was that made him into who he became

[olive swan]

This purely fanon. The love potion has nothing to do with it.

[unborn geode]

? I'm sure it was mentioned alot throughout the books and movies though?

[olive swan]

The love potion, yes. The other stuff not.

[stuck epoch]

the love potion is merely a symbol

not the reason

[boreal shuttle]

It was a symbolic way of illustrating his conception and upbringing but that's pretty much it, as far as canon goes.

[olive swan]

Tom Riddle was a child of circumstances. Extremly gifted. Its anyone guess what happened after his Hogwarts years and what lead to his descended to madness.

[stuck epoch]

his descended to madness was his fear of death (which he probably got from his mother) and his lack of empathy and love is also something he got from his parents as he received neither of them during his childhood

[boreal shuttle]

Imo the outcome would have actually been even worse had he grown up in a loving home with the support of a family, because he would have had ressources from the very beginning. Some villains could have been prevented with a different upbringing, Voldemort isn't one of them.

[olive swan]

Not according to JKR.

[stuck epoch]

i differ but different oppinions ig

[boreal shuttle]

JKR said that "maybe" things could have been different.

[olive swan]

She didn't rule it out. You did.

[boreal shuttle]

Which is undoubtedly true, I just think that Tom Riddle was a lost cause from the very beginning.

That's how "imo" works, you know.

[olive swan]

I disagree.

[boreal shuttle]

And that's fair

[olive swan]

I believe, at that time, your statement holds very much true. I think he needed help from an early age, psychological and therapeutical. If that had happened, things might have turned out differently.

But for the mid century years, not so much.

[olive swan]

My bad, didn't see that.

[stuck epoch]

if you have a unloving/abusive childhood by the time you reach like 4-5 your mostly a "lost case" with even therapy not doing much for you

[boreal shuttle]

I just don't think that love or empathy is something that can be taught or acquired, Harry is the perfect example of that. I will agree that he wouldn't have necessarily turned into a murdering megalomaniac though, he might have been able to find an actually reasonable use for his genius.

[stuck epoch]

maybe a little later/earlier depending on the person

[stuck epoch]

there are generally two was of dealing with trauma: one is i hurt others to relieve myself of the suffering (so being resentful) and the other is i am kind and caring to others so they wont have to go through what i did (so being "forgivable") and harry and voldy are prime examples of those two

voldy being the first harry the second

so i kinda agree but disagree with you

[olive swan]

The signs were there. There is a lot you can do up to your preteen years in case of therapy. But yeah, case to case basis.

[stuck epoch]

without saying youre wrong

[boreal shuttle]

That's the thing though, Tom Riddle didn't even have that bad of an upbringing. Sure, it wasn't roses and sunshine but it wasn't horrible. That's really the main point why I think that he was irredeemable.

[stuck epoch]

kinda

but thing is some things that are traumatic for someone is not traumatic for others

[boreal shuttle]

That is definitely true.

[stuck epoch]

that he has the potential of being redeemable is there tho with his way of handling trauma is very slim as there is not way of really teaching it

thats why i said i agree but also disagree with oyu

[olive swan]

He was raised in an orphanage. Wasn't that great in the 1930s.. You had a recession and stuff going on.

Also, the UK sold some of these children to colonies to work there.

So, I'd say, it was pretty bad. That with a child too intelligent for its own good. Recipe for disaster.

[stuck epoch]

him getting abused abandoned and not loved at all for all his early years is not something that will not leave you traumatic so if he had a loving family (father and mother) he could have turned out better. tho there would still be a real chance of him becoming an "evil" person after some setbacks/traumas (which he would get many of in hogwarts)

not just his early years but his whole live tbh

[olive swan]

I think he had some predisposition for mental illness and the way he grew up only exacerbated these issues.

But yeah, history isn't written in what ifs..

[loud barn]

guys

dumbldore said in the first book that he saw socks in the mirror of erised

what do you think he really say

[unborn geode]

many theory videos on that

[random moon]

JKR revealed what Dumbledore truly was was his family, alive, happy and reconciled

[raw oxide]

Tom riddle also was born under a love potion so he could not feel anything happiness or love

[loud barn]

oh

[random moon]

That’s not actually true, it’s a common misconception

JKR said that was Dumbledore’s theory but isn’t true. Tom being raised in an unloved environment and constantly feeling like he didn’t fit in is why he was so cold.

If Merope has lived and raised him with love, he would have turned out very different,

[stuck epoch]

the fact that we just had this conversation above is crazy

[sinful stratus]

I know basilisk breading is illegal but can i still do it behind the teachers back?

[stuck epoch]

if you manage to find one sure

but i doubt they are in the scottish highlands usually

[sinful stratus]

get a frog and chicken egg

that is how they are bred

[stuck epoch]

ah right i forgot

well if you find the frog and chicken egg which shouldnt be to hard try and go for it

if you manage to do tell

[random moon]

Pretty sure the ministry do regular checks of every chicken coop owned by the magical community to ensure there’s no basilisk breeding going on.

It’s fortunately a very easy fix if they find an attempted basilisk hatching. Just remove the toad

[stuck epoch]

you could just buy/steal an egg tho

and frogs are not that hard to come by especially with us having a swamp

[young swift]

I wonder when JK Rowling would release the remaining 4 wizarding schools. The first ones are very interesting.

[stuck epoch]

dunno if its and when compared to an if

[ruby thistle]

Thats gotta be a joke lol.

How would you even know who owns a chicken coop or not.

H9nestky, the method of breeding basilisks is way too easy imo.

All you need is one malevolent witch/wizard and you get like 100 basilisks at once spreading terror and risking exposure to muggles

[sinful stratus]

muggles have toad's and chickens too, just need to be a parselmouth and you get a pet basilisk

[ruby thistle]

Buying a chicken is like, so easy

If the ministry registers you for buying chickens, then just buy it of muggles.

[random moon]

They have an entire department dedication to the control and regulation of magical creatures. That involves things that patrolling and ensuring all rules are followed by anyone wanting to have or breed magical creatures.

The breeding of magical creatures was heavily restricted and monitored.

They have a committee for the disposal of dangerous creatures so I expect any investigation would be done by them. That would probably include monitoring anyone suspected of any intention to breed basilisks

[sinful stratus]

yet there is still illegal trafficking of magical creatures so i am sure there are ways around it

[clever yacht]

And yet Hagrid was able to get and hatch a dragon egg...

[sinful stratus]

like i said there are ways around it, not to mention the spider he raised

[random moon]

Well the same way that most countries have bans on the sake and trade of exotic animals but people will still do it.

It can make a lot of money, IRL and in the WW. There’s always ways around it, it’s just a case of keeping ahead of any inspections.

Where there’s a way to make easy money, people will do it, even if it’s illegal and potentially dangerous

[ruby thistle]

Chickens are like such a common commodity. There is no way they manage to keep that under control, especially when you consider muggles trade in it.

In some countries you just buy chickens of street vendors, lol.

[modern moth]

Hi

[clever yacht]

How to breed a basilisk the easy way: take (1) Weasley Burrow. Add (1) Neville Longbottom's Trevor

In the books, the Weasleys had chickens

Alternate recipe: take (1) Hagrid (he has chickens), add Trevor

[random moon]

Something to remember about Basilisks… they can only be controlled by natural Parselmouths

One of the main reasons regular dark wizards very rarely attempt to breed them is that it’s incredibly dangerous and they won’t be able to control it.

So you hatch a little danger noodle

It looks you in the eye

You drop dead

Kind of hard to make any money when you’re dead

[olive swan]

Also, very hard to verify anything if the person pretty much died before anyone could check on them. Also, who says the chicken doesn't have to be magical? MoM checks chicken coops in the WW, so idk - maybe the toad and the chicken need to be magical?

[random moon]

No they aren’t magical

Just a normal chicken egg and a normal toad

[olive swan]

This snake, which may reach gigantic size, and live many hundreds of years, is born from a chicken's egg, hatched beneath a toad.
~ CoS, chapter 16.

That's the quote. I wouldn't rule it out that either might have magical properties, otherwise it's somewhat silly. Or the frog needs to be special in some way, a frog cannot incubate an egg, it being cold blooded doesn't make it possible.
And if the reason it being cold blooded makes the chicken egg go brr, then why a toad and not something else. I would imagine keeping a toad still is difficult in its own right.

[random moon]

It’s based on old European mythology for the Basilisk. Just the way of hatching it is similar to interpretations of how a Cockatrice is made

There are lots of different interpretations but they’re all similar.

There’s nothing magical about them. It’s just some odd phenomena that happens in the WW.

[olive swan]

Yeah, I'm not buying that. There needs to be some twist to it. Its mythological background does nothing here, JKR uses folklore and myths and adds her own twist to them, so while similar, they are also different.

Either they are rare, or they are not. Someone in the normal world ought to have tried something based on the description of how one is allegedly hatched. The only explanation why someone didn't try it, that the myth does not exist in the none WW, which begs the question, are myths known to the populace or not.

Not much of an odd phenomenon if it can be reproduced and scientifically proven.

[sinful stratus]

pretty sure it is a external dark magic factor that makes it work

[olive swan]

Meh, I can get behind there being some other external force for it to work. Maybe some information was omitted, so we don't know the whole picture - so people don't reproduce one.

[sinful stratus]

well if everyone knew how to breed them then some people would try even without being able to control it so of course there would be removed content, same with horcrux

[worthy trench]

LV could have had killed HP many ways without doing it himself but he just had to do it himself and using only one method. And he just had to use HPs blood for his new body in 4. If hadn't done that, he'd have been able to kill him without HP being able to come back later.

[ruby thistle]

Hello

[thorny sage]

Voldy

[crystal gulch]

When Voldy & Albus born?

[worthy trench]

LV - 1926 AD - 1881

[crystal gulch]

Ty

[stuck epoch]

No he had to use his blood so the protection spell wont work anymore harry coming back is only due to the part soul of voldy being attached to him not cause of the blood and he probably needed the blood to resurrect else why bother listing it as an ingredient

Him having to kill harry is just his delusion due to the prophecy as well

[worthy trench]

He didn't need his blood to resurrect himself, just to get around the protection to the point he could physically touch HP without suffering severe pain or burning. But he could have had HP killed in the prior years indirectly via Quirrel and indeed tried with Quirrel while possessed or other people or means. But he just decided he had to do it himself and with a specific spell. Like mundane methods would have worked fine or telekinetically killing him. Prophecy was one he fulfilled himself. If he ignored it and let others do the killing for him or done it a different way, he may have survived and averted it.

And blood is an ingrediant of the ritual he chose. Its not one he put in himself. The ritual is ancient. He HAD to get the blood of some enemy of his. He had plenty of enemies to get blood from but he just decided he needed to use HPs to get over that protection HP had a little bit. Wouldn't have mattered if he picked anyone else just that he wouldn't be able to physically touch HP without an issue if he had picked another enemy.

The DH thing is a case of the Horcrux taking the hit at least. Whether HP coming back or not due to that alone is not clear though AD thinks HP got the choice cos he chose to die in that moment and not resist LV trying to kill him.

Basically if LV was actively trying to screw himself over, he couldn't have done it better

[sick night]

Is it ever revealed what happened to Secrets of the Darkest Art? Was it destroyed, or did the trio hide it somewhere deep within the Ministry?

[ruby thistle]

No clue.

But even if they destroyed it, its doubtful it is the only copy.

[worthy trench]

Yah its probably not the only copy or only book with the instructions on Horcrux making.

[raw oxide]

Why does tom wait till the end of the year to try to kill harry

[worthy trench]

In 2nd year?

Well in that year he had to get him into the Chamber somehow so he could use Basilisk though he could have done it other ways as well like through Ginny while she in a trance.

In year 1 he had many chances to do it via Quirrell and it wouldn't have been hard since Quirrell wouldn't have to even touch him to do it.

Year 4 he could have had Crouch do it at several points.

Year 5, he hadn't wasted some time tryna convince HP to kill Bella and just came in and AK'd him broke his neck, no waiting, its too late for AD to stop him.

LV suffers from the fact his ego makes him want to do it himself and in a complex scheming way.

Except the first year were he tried to have Quirrell do it directly while in a mirror room

The 2nd year he may not have even been aware of what was going on in Hogwarts and indeed only found out bout his lost Horcrux after the fact.

After his Stone plot failed, he was nearly resigned to being stuck disembodied forever and didn't expect his followers to look for him after that or be able to find him.

He's lucky Pettigrew came back and helped him

[stone matrix]

Would be a twist wouldn’t it… Chapter 1 Avada Kedavra!

[worthy trench]

Or telekinetic neck snap

or the many other spells or mundane ways he could kill him

[stuck epoch]

after dumbledore became headmaster he removed it from the restricted section and put it in his own library if it is the only book on how to make horcruxes we dont know but there is another book that mentions them briefly

[worthy trench]

If AD had been smart he'd have destroyed the book

and removed it as soon as he became Headmaster

Hogwarts was not smart to leave that kind of book in the Restricted Section for however long

[stuck epoch]

destroying the book woudlve been worse for him tbh

after he figured out what voldy did and knowing the books content sure but not prior

[subtle olive]

no because once he knew it WAS Horcruxes he knew perfectly well that he would have to pass this onto the Golden Trio so he made sure it was broken easy to gain access to it in his own clever puzzle style way and atm Hermione has the book and I would not be shocked if she keeps it around for whenever Harry needs it in his Auror career

he admitted (after he died) that he knew perfectly well the kids would be clever enough to figure everything out EXACTLY when he wanted them to and that if he just told them everything off the hop they would rush in recklessly and get themselves killed. He couldn't have that happen so he took a chess match approach and put his faith in Harry, Ron, and Hermione's own independent streaks to carry the rest.

Sure enough, he was correct as usual. The one time he made a mistake (which he admits) was not telling Harry why he was avoiding him or why he had to avoid teaching him Occlumency directly which had he done so would have saved Sirius. His only other known error was the three way duel that ended up with Ariana dead.

[stuck epoch]

They didnt need the book he couldve also just destroy it and tell one of them how to get rid of horcruxes and im only saying that it wouldve been stupid to destroy the book before but not after knowing of voldys deeds

Also never said that he should destroy it at all i think its better of him to not

[subtle olive]

see my second comment. If he told them all up front he feared they would be reckless and realized they were smarter when discovering stuff for themselves

[worthy trench]

No it would have been smart. This is assuming he knew the book was there in the first place. If he did, then he should have destroyed that book making it harder for anyone to make a Horcrux in the future. Yah you don't expect or think or hope no one will but by leaving such a book in existence you are taking the risk and leaving the temptation out there for those to do it if they know there's a means to immortality and they don't have moral qualms with murder and whatever the horrible act is to get it. And there's always gonna be someone like that out there. And he couldn't known the Trio would need it that far in advance since they didn't exist and there's no indication he saw the future of TR and the trio. If he didn't know about the book, he has the excuse not do it before TR got it, but he still no excuse not to destroy it after he suspected TR made a Horcrux or used it. Like destroying that gives instructions on how to make a Horcrux is simply a rational logical thing to do regardless of anything else.

[subtle olive]

weeellll, Deathly Hallows proves he DID think that far ahead. Dude's brain thought of his battle with Voldemort as one giant ass chess match so much so that his portrait was STILL directing traffic after he died!

[worthy trench]

And while it did give the trio knowledge of what Horcruxes were, how to make them and repair the soul after, it didn't seem to give info on how to actually destroy one making it not helpful for that purpose which is what they were trying to do

[subtle olive]

no it did that too.

[worthy trench]

not to my recall

[subtle olive]

go re-read DH

I just did literally last night

Hermione explains the whole lot

[worthy trench]

ok gimme me a source

like does she mention basilisk venom

cos if so great

does it mention fiendfyre

if so it was useful then

[subtle olive]

Deathly Hallows, Chapter 6, the Ghoul in Pajamas, Page 82 (Hogwarts House Edition Hardcover variant)

[worthy trench]

but still AD would have been smart to destroy that book when he became headmaster thus depriving future people on making horcruxes

like TR

and he could easily get such instructions and info another way to the trio way down the line when he began making his plan to end TR

[subtle olive]

again, no, Dumbledore expected Hermione to think about how to destroy the Horcruxes so he left his office easily accessible to a summoning charm (considering he could have easily made his office unable to be accessed like he did in Order of the Phoenix to Umbridge)

the only book that shows how to make (and destroy) Horcruxes was Secrets of the Darkest Art

[worthy trench]

A risk he took

better to leave the instructions another way

like the guy relied on chance in his plan

[subtle olive]

again, why when you can get it from the horse's mouth directly?

[worthy trench]

No matter how you are at predicting people's behavior your still risking them not doing as you predict

[subtle olive]

he also states in Deathly Hallows that had he just given Harry everything up front he would have rushed headlong into trouble and not think about what he was doing

the dude was playing chess while everyone was running around playing checkers

[worthy trench]

Honestly tellling HP basilisk venom drestroys horcruxes wouldn't have hurt anythng

And his plan ultimately only worked cos of something beyond his planning

a mundane fight

which won HP the elder wand

[subtle olive]

which he counted on as far back as Goblet of Fire

"the look of triumph in his eyes"

[worthy trench]

him getting the elder wand?

no he didn't

[subtle olive]

yep

[worthy trench]

no he didnt

[subtle olive]

he originally intended Harry to get the Elder Wand

[worthy trench]

he planned the wand to die with him

[subtle olive]

albeit thru Snape

[worthy trench]

no he didnt

[subtle olive]

yeah he did

he says that too in Deathly Hallows

[worthy trench]

No he didn

plan was snape kills him

wand's power dies with him

he did not plan for draco that night

[subtle olive]

and Plan B, Harry disarms Snape

instead

Harry disarms Draco

[worthy trench]

he immobilized

harry

[subtle olive]

yes

and do you not think he didn't consider that?

[worthy trench]

mate the guy didn't plan anyone winning the EW from him

[subtle olive]

mate I would advise you read Deathly Hallows, specifically the three chapter span of The Prince's Tale, the Forest Again, and King's Cross

[worthy trench]

i did

and he didnt plan that

the plan was he dies with wand. no one gets its power after him

draco fcked that up

and they got lucky in the end

if not for that luck LV would have killed HP in their last duel

it all it came down to that wand

[subtle olive]

well no he couldn't

the twin souls routine

even with the Elder Wand

[worthy trench]

once the horcrux in HP was gone

[subtle olive]

that is also explained in King's Cross

nope

"as long as Lily's sacrifice remains inside Voldemort, you cannot die,"

which means Voldemort was an idiot

[worthy trench]

yah that doesn't protect him from all harm

or death a 3rd time

[subtle olive]

actually it does. He can still get hurt and all that

but he can't actually die

he just gets back up

[worthy trench]

and its unclear the 2nd time was the protection, the horcrux, or his own choice to die or all it combined

[subtle olive]

not until Voldemort dies

which he did

Dumbledore was pretty clear about that

[worthy trench]

HP was not immortal

or unkillable

never was

[subtle olive]

"you have less to fear coming back here than Voldemort"

[worthy trench]

not even to LV

LV had many means to do it

[subtle olive]

he was only unkillable so long as Voldemort lived in the resurrected body

before that he was killable

after that he was killable

[worthy trench]

just he went about it in the one way ensuring HP would live

[subtle olive]

but with Lily's blood IN Voldemort's body, Harry was immortal UNTIL Voldemort was killed

ancient magic is a you know what

[worthy trench]

HP could have died by anyone;s hand by simply snapping jhis neck

magic protection only goes so far

[subtle olive]

no, he'dve just wound up in the same situation as Voldemort

[worthy trench]

so much couold have gone wrong with the plan

its just luck that it didnt

[subtle olive]

so he'dve had to be the one to regenerate a body

it just so happened Voldemort was painfully predictable

which is what Dumbledore counted on

while everybody was playing checkers, he was out playing chess

which is why Cursed Child's "Darkest timeline" makes no sense

the one where Harry supposedly died again thanks to a supposed evil Cedric disarming Neville of the Sword and stopping him from killing Nagini?

that wouldn't work since he'd just get right back up from Avada Kedavra and Harry himself invoked Ancient Magic on all his loved ones to prevent Voldemort and his forces from having any lasting or binding effect on everybody

so even IF they managed to save Nagini, he'dve still have been forced into retreat and at best we would have gotten an 8th book

once again proving why Cursed Child is simply a bad story LOL

[worthy trench]

The protection he put on others in hogwarts battle doesn;'t seem to be as strong and ginny is said to have avoided death ny killing curse in the battle in the book which suggests she would died depsite the protection HP gave his allies

I just think after the horcrux was gone and HP came back, LV could have killed him permanently even if only by cetain means. Magic protection in your blood is only gonna so far to save you from certain means of dying. And even prior to that anyone else could have killed him (which is really what LV should have made happen).

[subtle olive]

well no because he was already in limbo when Dumbledore stated "as long as Lily's blood runs through his veins, you still live,"

[worthy trench]

Like if HP ends up disembodied well that'll suck cos he ain't getting back from that i think

[subtle olive]

AND he then said "you have less to fear coming back here,"

which implies he can CHOOSE to die or just get back up

at least until Voldemort was defeated

[worthy trench]

Its not clear why he got the choice only ADs speculation

but he's probably right

[subtle olive]

because even AFTER the Horcrux was gone from him, the golden flames STILL erupted from his wand, meaning the connection was still present even if the mind connection was gone

[worthy trench]

and HP probably wouldnt get the choice again if he died again to him

cos HP the first time didn;'t resist death

implying thats why he could choose

[subtle olive]

yes, the first time

[worthy trench]

the next time hes defo resisting death

[subtle olive]

but that implies he is facing death head on

[worthy trench]

so no choice would be allowed if he died again

[subtle olive]

he knows going into battle again is a risk

which means he is facing death again

"you have less to fear returning here than Voldemort does,"

[worthy trench]

yah and he's not getting the cghoice again

it seems

if he goes back and dies again

simple as that

thats how i interpreted that

[subtle olive]

yeah well the direct quotes from Dumbledore contradict that

[worthy trench]

i don;'t think HP has any kind of immortality while LV is alive

I think ur interpreting his meaning incorrectly

[subtle olive]

Voldemort only has immortality SO LONG AS Voldemort is in the body that uses Lily's blood

which was idiotic

had Voldemort used ANY OTHER WIZARD

this would not be an issue

[worthy trench]

LV only has immortality cos of horcruxes

[subtle olive]

and Harry in turn has it because of the ancient magic

thus making it two ways

[worthy trench]

LV is not immortal due to HP

[subtle olive]

no, HARRY is immortal due to Voldemort using HIS BLOOD to regenerate a body

you are missing what I am saying

[worthy trench]

i disagree

anyone can kill him

throw in the veil, i think he's dead

and not coming back from that

[subtle olive]

the veil is literally limbo to death

[worthy trench]

as i said, magic won;'t let him come from everything

[subtle olive]

we don't honestly know what happens when someone goes through it

and they never said what either

[worthy trench]

like if he's stuck in limbo or disembodied forever well, enjoy immortality then

cos thats a crap existence

[subtle olive]

well possibly not

because Harry's soul was whole

and he was earthbound due to the protection

which stayed on Earth because of Voldemort

[worthy trench]

well since sirius didn't come back i think its safe to say he is dead after he went through

[subtle olive]

Sirius didn't have ancient magic protecting him

that remained earthbound

so yes

[worthy trench]

yah i don't think HP is surviving the viel regardless

we just have to disagree on this

[subtle olive]

I wholeheartedly disagree

[worthy trench]

ok

fine

[subtle olive]

and I have the direct quotes from the book to back me up on this

[worthy trench]

well i think your interepting them incorrectly. but as i said, we jsut have to disagree on the matter

CC though that's just a mess

And yes LV is an idiot

[subtle olive]

yes, Dumbledore straight up confirms this on page 580. The magic shown here is unprecedented and goes far beyond what is considered plausible even by wizarding standards, hence why no wandmaker could explain Harry's golden fire trick whenever he dueled Voldemort or why he could survive AGAIN and again and again

had Voldemort resurrected himself with a nobody, Bertha Jorkins for crying out loud

or Crouch Sr.

ANYBODY

he would have won on principle

but no, he was vain, petty, magpie like in nature, and thus a bloody moron

he literally made Harry Potter, who by all rights is not on his OR Dumbledore's level despite being VERY good at martial magic, the only thing that can kill him 100% of the time with only so much as farting in his general direction

same thing with the horcruxes I realized

if he used everyday items nobody would think twice about and just left them to be swept away into landfills, he would have won again!

but again, IDIOT

[stuck epoch]

Prior go him becoming the headmaster he had no power to destroy/move the book and after he did he removed the book from the restricted section and put it in his own. He knew that voldy used it for something so destroying it right away is outright stupid as he may lose the only source of what he used and how to counter it. It currently is the only book about making horcruxes (with a good chance that its not the only) but before the book was written herpo managed to make at least one so there is no guarantee that there wont be another even if he destroys the book. (Also im not for destroying knowledge even if its knowledge that can be used for “bad” things

[ruby thistle]

They die.

Voldy was earthbound due to his horcruxes. He would go back to being an angry spirit until he could remake his body yet again.

[ruby thistle]

No worries, I'd destroy it for you.

[worthy trench]

The debate is over whether HP was immortal post LV rebirth while LV lived

And if AD intended HP to get EW.

I say no to both

And I say if you shove HP into the Viel, he dies regardless of anything.

[ruby thistle]

If albus intended such things he'd just call harry to his office and tell him to disarm him or something.

Not everything has to be some 4d chess plan, even if we are talking about dumbledore

[worthy trench]

Also I think AD is foolish for not destroying the Horcruxes book after TR used it or even before he used it once he became Headmaster

Would have prevented or made it harder for TR to make a Horcrux or anyone else for that matter cos ya know someone will do it at some point

Goes for all Headmasters prior to AD as long as the book has been in the school

[ruby thistle]

I think he had it after to study what he was up against.

I'm not sure if he was aware of the book beforehand.

[worthy trench]

We dunno but if he was, I'd think he'd have destroyed it on principle

Like that is the rational logical thing to do

He definitely should have done it afterward once he gained all the info he needed off it once he suspected TR made a Horcrux if he didn't already know all the info in the book already.

Like just not smart moves on AD's part imo to keep it around after he decided to take it from the library or finished reading it himself if he did

Just eliminate the risks altogether of anyone using it again

[ruby thistle]

Atleast when he knew he was gonna die, I can agree.

[worthy trench]

Yah its probably not the only copy but still

I mean way before he knew he would die

[ruby thistle]

But srlsy, get yourself a house already!

[worthy trench]

Long before HPs time

I don;t care bout the house roles

Like what benefits does that give me if any

[ruby thistle]

You get a cool Eagle emblem

And a blue coloured user name. Its awesome.

You can only understand once you are one of us

[worthy trench]

What if I prefer color white over blue

But seriously im not bothred by house roles

[stuck epoch]

Please only after ive memorized it

[subtle olive]

And Harry in turn was Earthbound by Voldemort using his blood and thus stealing the ancient magic

[ruby thistle]

No.

Harrys soul was not split up. Having a piece of your soul left intact is the only way to be earthbound.

Harrhs blood being in voldemory ensured lily's sacrifice lived on longer than it would have, meaning harry continued to be protected.

This was among other things, why dumbledore had harry live with the Dursleys, because they shared his mothers blood.

Harry was not immortal by any means when voldy took his blood. Only protected against him, as he was before.

[subtle olive]

Go read page 580. The protection that Lily invoked was still on Earth and by so doing Harry could not die. All having a whole soul did was allow himself to return from Limbo unimpeded whereas Voldemort was trapped.

"You have little to fear returning here," said Dumbledore. And why would he? He can choose to die if he likes or keep going back

[ruby thistle]

Yeah, but that protection was only against voldemort.

[subtle olive]

And who killed him? Voldemort.

[ruby thistle]

Yes.

If he had been stabbed with a dagger by belatrix or whatever, he'd die.

[subtle olive]

Even then dubious and here is why:

They only address the Magic doomfire with the wand when when it comes to that. Otherwise it is strictly said "as long as your mother's sacrifice survives, you survive,"

[ruby thistle]

Maybe we are discussing semantics here.

Voldy can return from any kind of death, Harry can only return from vokdy killing him.

[subtle olive]

Again, no because it is only strictly said as long as Voldemort has Lily's sacrifice in his veins, Harry cannot die

Which functionally keeps Harry able to consistently get back up

[ruby thistle]

Yeah, but in context, the danger they always discuss is that of voldemort. Not the danger of hearing a mandrake scream without earmuffs.

[worthy trench]

That's what i was saying Mihrr with the addition that it would only work as long the Horcrux was in HP and not after the fact or if he only HP in certain ways.

[subtle olive]

This has nothing to do with the Horcrux KH

We are talking the blood connection

The horcruxes keep VOLDEMORT alive

But the blood connection keeps HARRY alive

[worthy trench]

Cos i don't think sacrificial protection will let HP come back from LV crushing his throat or crushing him to death via large rocks etc.

[subtle olive]

Provided Voldemort stays alive

[worthy trench]

Ya know the many ways HP could be kiled by him or anyone else

And if it does, he's not gonna be back long i think

[ruby thistle]

I think its only magical protection yes. Very powerful, but also very specific and limited in scope.

But we won't know that for sure. Voldemort never tried to simply stab the guy, out of pride. He "had" to defeat him as a wizard, not using muggle means.

[subtle olive]

And as I said with that? It would likely be a similar situation to Voldemort. Alive but basically a ghost until he can regenerate

[worthy trench]

Like LV could have had Quirrell in year 1 by just having Quirrel kill him with many spells or luring into Fluffy's room to chow on

[subtle olive]

Well as we established: HE TRIED

Didn't work out very well

Plus

Year one

Pre blood connection

Which means yes Harry could have been offed

But once Voldy regenerated, all bets were off

[ruby thistle]

Not following.

Harry never had any horcruxes. There would never be any kind d of half state lives for him.

[worthy trench]

Yah and Year 5 he could have done it again by himself if he'd not wasted time talking

[subtle olive]

No but LIKE a horcrux, his soul would remain earthbound due to the blood connection and voldemort being alive. If someone ELSE killed Voldemort before Harry could regenerate they would both be dead

[worthy trench]

Like cut his throat or osmething

cut his head off

[subtle olive]

Basically as long as Voldemort lived, Harry lived

[worthy trench]

crush it in

[subtle olive]

Neither can live while the other survives

[worthy trench]

like anything but AK

[subtle olive]

That is pretty much it

Harry was immortal ONLY as long as Voldemort was in the body using Harry's blood

Take that away he was as mortal as any

[worthy trench]

Like i don;'t think HP would live on disembodied post Horcrux death or pre-Horcrux death via anyone else or maybe LV if LV had been more creative with his method of killing

I think he'd just be straight up dead

[subtle olive]

The lore does not support that

[ruby thistle]

Nah man. I kinda see where you are going with this.

But I cant agree.

Harry was protected while the blood sacrifice was active, he was "immortal", only if killed by voldemort. Any other means of death were all bets off.

Harrys blood is not equivalent to a horcrux.

[worthy trench]

also if LV hadn;'t given HP a choice to come to the forest to die willingly, he may not have gotten a choice to come back. That seems to be what gave it to him

If HP rejected that offer Im not sure he'd get the choice to come back after LV killed him later

[subtle olive]

I disagree and even Dumbledore said this is unprecedented magic in the lore. And since it is established his thoughts are correct on how it works, that is functionally the deal

[ruby thistle]

I think that was more symbolic of him being the master of death, and what separated him from voldy in philosophy.

Harry could die for his friends, and even gave them the protection by doing so.

[subtle olive]

"You have less to fear returning here than Voldemort,"

So he goes back

Final battle

Golden flames

[worthy trench]

Yah i don't think thats him getting to come back a 2nd time if he dies again

[subtle olive]

Bob's your uncle

[ruby thistle]

Thats a reference to volsya split soul. Not relevant to the discussion. As harry does not have a split soul.

[subtle olive]

Harry is normal wizard again

[worthy trench]

Thats him saying u won't stuck in LV in limbo forever like LV if you die again after this. You will just go on or become a ghost. your pick. LV gets neither

i think

[subtle olive]

And that was why he was able to return. Whole soul and ancient magic

[worthy trench]

Baically I don't think HP is immortal post LV rebirth by any means

[ruby thistle]

So if they had just destroyed voldy and kept nagini in a box, Harry could live to see cyberpunk 2077?

I think we can just agree to disagree at this point.

[subtle olive]

I disagree and the book itself supports me on this in King's Cross

[worthy trench]

He got away with the 1 choice, but I don't think he was getting a 2nd choice if he died again following his return in DH

[subtle olive]

Well if you get rid of the body that contains Lily's sacrifice you take away Harry's respawn. The only thing keeping Harry in this world was not the Horcrux but the ancient magic

[worthy trench]

We ultimately have to disagree on the matter i think

[subtle olive]

But it was a twofold deal

[ruby thistle]

Fair, my example was off

[subtle olive]

Well that is why Cursed Child makes no sense. It implies Cedric prevents Neville from offing Nagini but that would not stop Harry from winning. If anything it would have allowed Voldemort to retreat and we get an 8th book at best.

[worthy trench]

Yah see i don't think protection would keep him from death post forest duel though if he died again. That's my last word on it. EW saved him in the last duel in castle.

[subtle olive]

EW?

[ruby thistle]

Elder wand

[subtle olive]

Sorry but your two letter shorthand is killing me mate

Thanks

And no the Elder Wand didn't do squat. The Golden flames and rebound happened also in the Battle of the 7 Potters and the Elder Wand was nowhere near that fight

All THAT did was murder Voldemort's ego

The one thing the Elder Wand DID do was successfully repair a Wand when no other could

[ruby thistle]

Well, it refuced to crucio harry when voldy was toying with his "dead" body.

[subtle olive]

The original Phoenix wand

[ruby thistle]

It did try to kill Harry in the forest, but harry was willing to die, so the wand obliged.

[subtle olive]

Ok I'll give you that but he has endured crucio

You'd then think after dying the wand would have changed owners anyways

[ruby thistle]

Harry was not willing to die in the final duel, so it make sense the wand then worked against voldy

[subtle olive]

But it did not

Which means I suspect the wand knew he wasn't actually dead

They ARE semi-sentient afterall

[ruby thistle]

I thought so too.

But one could argue that the wand is not willing to betray its owner, and that harry did not actually die.

But more the first point really. I dont think you can use the elder wand to kill its owner and get its allegiance.

Its a shifty wand, but not that shifty.

I think the crucio scene shows that atleast

[subtle olive]

I agree but Harry also invoked ancient magic so none of Voldemort's NOR the Death Eater's spells were working properly for more than a second and the more serious curses ALWAYS seemed to miss as if they were deliberately being aimed away

He turned deadly killers into bigger jokes than Stormtroopers

[worthy trench]

It wouldn't or couldn't kill him in forest cos he was its master. Its the one thing it won't do either by choice or inability. Ultimately in the final duel, it wouldn't or couldn't kill him cos he was its master thus backfired and killed LV as HP said it would. And it wouldn't harm him at least when it comes to be made to subject him to pain as HP felt no pain when crucio was used on him with it.

As for the protection, book 7 says Ginny just escaped death by AK before Molly took over that duel with Bella indicating that Ginny would have died regardless of the protection HPs allies had. It wasn't as strong or lasting as his own agianst LV for all those years.

[ruby thistle]

It obeys its master. Its perfectly willing to do it if its master is willing.

It didnt succeed because of the blood sacrifice protection put on harry.

[ruby thistle]

The protection was just against voldy

[slow nacelle]

I have just learned, that the Loch Ness Monster was the world's largest Kelpie that preferred to take on the form of a sea serpent and that Nessie sightings made Scotland one of the most frequent national violators of Clause 73 of the International Statute of Secrecy.

[dark oracle]

That's sick

[worthy trench]

It was never going to succeed in killing him in that moment in the forest cos of that or the Horcrux or HP choosing to die or all of them combined regardless of whether he was the master or not.

[worthy trench]

I'm not referring to that in my comment there. I'm referring to the lesser protrction HP put on his allies post forest. They are seemingly not immune to death from him or Death Eaters going off that part were it Ginny barely escaped death at Bella's hands.

[ruby thistle]

What i meant was the protection he gave his friends was against voldy.

They were not immune against bellatrix, because he didn't "die" at bellatrixs hands.

[worthy trench]

I think it was more general cos Death Eaters were firing spells off at defenders and said to be wearing off quicker than they normally should iirr. I'd have to read the chapter again

[modern moth]

mmm

ahh

[boreal shuttle]

Without re-reading the chapter I'm 99% sure that Harry's sacrifice only affected Voldemort's ability to hurt or generally curse/jinx the defenders of Hogwarts, like when Neville broke free of his body-bind curse.

[worthy trench]

Ok i think your correct, though I'm not sure it would spare them from his killing curses as their protection doesn't seem to be as strong as HPs was.

[timid bane]

Nah, it was specifically protecting the defenders of Hogwarts from Voldemort. That’s important too, because otherwise Lily’s protection would have worked against anyone, meaning that Harry would never have been in any danger at Hogwarts.

[timid bane]

Fans can’t even agree that Harry actually died or not

[timid bane]

Are you forgetting the part where the elder wand rebounded Voldemort’s killing curse on to himself?

[worthy trench]

As for the whole HP surviving in the forest, JK apparently said there's no EW - Lily sacrifice = assured survial for HP formula and its just down HP and LVs choices.

http://web.archive.org/web/20110623034201/http://www.jkrowling.com/textonly/en/faq_view.cfm?id=122

http://www.accio-quote.org/articles/2007/1217-pottercast-anelli.html

Which seems to suggest it was just HPs own choice to die when he was given the choice by LV that insured he could choose to go back.

[timid bane]

Yeah even with jk rowling’s explanations this just isn’t explained that well

[serene canyon]

slytherin was right with his policy

[wooden copper]

Agreed. I always believed the others were afraid he was right in that purebloods actually do have a higher power ceiling

[serene canyon]

not the point

letting ppl in who come from muggle families is a security issue

[wooden copper]

Elaborate on security issue because I’ve always viewed it as a magical blood purity thing

[serene canyon]

wizards were hunted in his times

lets say two people are married, muggle and wizard. the muggle eventually finds out their kid and partner are wizards and freaks out. what would happen next? exactly.

its wise for wizards not to trust muggles

@wooden copper

[wooden copper]

I agree with that. But there’s also plenty of evidence for the co-existence and mingling of muggleborn and purebloods in modern times. He would be right in his day

[serene canyon]

he was right in his day indeed

even today i think there is somewhat of a risk

[wooden copper]

But blood purity to me is a bigger deal in terms of magical talent. Like thoroughbred race horses

[serene canyon]

explain

[wooden copper]

It’s the theory popular among death eaters that as wizards continue to mingle with muggles that the magic in their blood will be stretched thinner and thinner until squibs outnumber wizards and eventually wizardkind will cease to exist outside of the random muggleborn. It’s parallel to racism in the real world, but not quite.

Wizardkind isn’t exactly a race in biological terms, but a whole new dimension of categorizing people, unlike what we’re used to with race, intelligence, looks, sexual orientation, etc.

There’s no real evidence for this in HP canon btw. The most powerful wizards we know were half-bloods

[serene canyon]

well isnt it somewhat logical?

afaik if two wizards get a child, said child is guaranteed to be a wizard too, while when a wizard and a muggle have a child, it may or may not be a wizard

and also if two muggles have a child, it may or may not as well be a wizard (with lower chance of it being a wizard though)

so in order to keep the number of wizards high, its logical to want wizards to get kids with wizards

you might now say 'oh no but wanting wizard babies could be seen as racist'. I wouldnt agree. there arent many wizards in the first place and if the community is too small it risks surpression and being powerless. wizards can defend their rights well if their numbers are somewhat high

it makes sense to me

@wooden copper

[wooden copper]

I get that, and yes it's logical, like magical Punnett squares. But I'm more interested in whether this theory manifests in terms of magical ability. I'm not sure it's like Star Wars where some individuals are more force-sensitive than others.

It's interesting to me cuz Voldy puts so much emphasis on being a direct line to Salazar

[serene canyon]

well voldy did inherit quite a few things from salazar

[serene canyon]

ye, i definitely agree more with slytherin than the other founders

[serene canyon]

the question we would have to ask here is -when we set the idea of the death eaters as true- what has come before? if you come from a large family in which one ancestor wizard always mates with a non ancestor wizard and the ancestor wizards are always insanely strong, then yeah. perhaps that does get passed onto you

could be the case with dumbledore

we would also need to discuss other things such as ambition and diligence

[stuck epoch]

its not guaranteed

[wooden copper]

This would be more on the environment, which is a charism of Slytherin house. I like the Durmstrang boot camp method

[serene canyon]

and we definitely see that constitute in the series: hermione is talented and extremely hard working (the latter because she has an I'ma call it inferiority complex, knowing its not the right term, which makes her push through her limits). we got a similar case with snape who worked really hard because he got bullied and found a passion in it. on the other hand we got voldy who was a prodigy at the very beginning. i dont think we got anything like him in the series at all. he woulda been an astounding wizard even if doing pretty much nothing

[stuck epoch]

and thats also not really true. as long as there was once a magical in the bloodline there is always a chance to have another even if its been multiple generations

[serene canyon]

an interesting scene is when young voldi calls harry a wizard of 'not extraordinary talent'. I dont think he was spouting non sense there. harry isnt exceptionally talented the way he has. harry has talent that goes above what is considered the standard but the talent between him and voldy still is worlds, hence he said that

[wooden copper]

He says it may or may not be a wizard. Read closely

[serene canyon]

thanks

[wooden copper]

It's just Punnett squares but for wizards

[serene canyon]

dunno what punnett squares are but Im no native english speaker xd

[wooden copper]

Basically you can pass down traits through your children, grandchildren, etc but they aren't guaranteed

[serene canyon]

I googled it. looks like biology 7-8th grade

had that before

[stuck epoch]

bloodsuperiority is not really something that makes sense tbh as there is no indication that it makes anyone better in any regard but the ones who are half/full muggle born are the more talented from what we have seen

[stuck epoch]

the thing with the lower chance is wrong

[serene canyon]

i think it is a thing definitely

there is a reason we got 'wizards of powerful wizard families'. there are families in HP in which almost every member turned out to be a really strong wizard

we definitely cannot determine all factors, but there is a correlation we need to consider

[stuck epoch]

yes like fostering them from a young age

[wooden copper]

It makes much more sense to me that muggle + muggle means it's rarer for their offspring to be a wizard. Not impossible, but rarer. I'd need a source to confirm otherwise

[serene canyon]

yes. if that wasnt the case, there would be tons of wizards

[stuck epoch]

it is generally not guaranteed to have a magical offspring even if it wizard+witch

[wooden copper]

Yes, but I'd say it's also as unlikely as muggle + muggle = wizard

[serene canyon]

no, the series is often giving us hints to people inheriting their ancestors powers to some degree. prominently featured in both voldy and harry, last of which being said to have inherited many of james' talents

[serene canyon]

its not? do we have a counter example?

[stuck epoch]

yes multiple

[serene canyon]

remind me pls

[stuck epoch]

talent is not something thats passed down there is only one thing that we know is passed down by blood and parsetongue

the blacks had a squib

[serene canyon]

im pretty sure im right on this take, but im too lazy to check sources now

[stuck epoch]

marius black and the blacks are one of the "purest" families

[serene canyon]

do we know anything of the other salazar descendants? were they all talented wizards? or at least by large number? @wooden copper

[wooden copper]

We don't know any of that, which is why the Death Eaters faced so much backlash

If there was overwhelming evidence for it, I think they would have had much more support

[serene canyon]

it sounds like an idea/theory no side can prove or disprove. reminds me of the question whether or not god exists

[wooden copper]

But I'm still not convinced that it's NOT a factor

[serene canyon]

yeah me neither

one side believing it doesnt matter, the other believing its all that matters

truth must lie between those two extremes

[wooden copper]

Surely it's a factor. Genetics comes into play in sports

At the highest level

[stuck epoch]

the gaunt family is the direct line of descendent and most of them were trash

[serene canyon]

you talking reallife or HP now?

[wooden copper]

Both

[serene canyon]

well, i always struggle with rl anecdotes. authors or fictions may or may not copy and paste those natural occurrences

of*

nothing would hinder from me to write a fictional work in which genetics dont matter in sports

technically speaking

@wooden copper maybe it works in analogy to how we pass on IQ

[wooden copper]

Probably. I can't imagine genetics doesn't come into play at some level for magic

[serene canyon]

Yes, I definitely agree on this. Its more likely for the author to write it this way since it comes off more natural and less artifical (world building wise) and I think JKR intended it this way. Though I wouldnt say that is 100% the case, I could ofc be wrong here. Id need to analyze the entire book and all her statements regarding this topic to give a definite statement

[cobalt jolt]

What happens with Scandanavian Muggle-borns, since they can't go to Durmstrang? Are they just SOL?

Unless they immigrate to another country?

I don't think completely excluding them from magical society would work, since that's how you get overrun with obscurials

[boreal shuttle]

Keep in mind that Durmstrang not accepting Muggle-borns isn't exactly confirmed, as Draco Malfoy saying so isn't the most notable of sources, especially as it isn't mentioned in the official Pottermore/WW article; it's also possible that it depends on the current headmaster/headmistress.
Imo it is unlikely since Durmstrang admits students from many more countries than just the Scandinavian ones and that would leave the Wizarding World as a whole with quite a few unattended Muggle-borns. I just can't imagine various governments or the ICW to not step in if it ever were the case.

But even if it's true they're still left with various forms of magical travel that would potentially allow them to attend other schools* and as you said migration as a last resort.

*we don't really know how any of the 11 great wizarding schools, and that mostly includes Hogwarts as well, handles a situation like this

[stuck epoch]

Thats why i believe there is one school per country on average

[cobalt jolt]

I am pretty sure it's just the 11

[cobalt jolt]

I thought it was confirmed, and that Pottermore, or some other thing said Salazar Slytherin had a hand in making sure no muggle-born would ever be allowed into Durmstrang

Also, didn't Krum say there weren't any muggle-borns there?

[stuck epoch]

In terms of how many magical children there are compared to how many schools and students per school there is i highly doubt that its only 11

[cobalt jolt]

Oh?

[boreal shuttle]

Salazar Slytherin had nothing to do with Durmstrang. And no, Krum never said anything along those lines either. The only source we have for that is Draco saying so on the Hogwarts Express in GoF.

But yeah, there are also a lot of countries where it's normal for magical kids to be homeschooled, so there'd have to be some kind of system in place for Muggle-borns.

[subtle olive]

Well if you were reading the chat, I basically laid it out thanks to the ancient magic, no he was not

[subtle olive]

You forgot the golden flames erupted just like they did in the Battle of the Seven Potters when this occurred as well. No elder wand required.

And Dumbledore backs me up in the book proper.

"On the whole, I think not,"

[boreal shuttle]

The golden flames were a slightly different phenomenon based solely on the unique situation Harry and Voldemort found themselves in. Harry's wand basically absorbed a part of Voldemort's when they first connected on the graveyard and thus always recognised him as both a brother and an enemy, regardless of the wand he used. So, while in both instances Voldemort's magic worked against him there is still a slight difference between Avada Kedavra being reflected directly and some of his own raw magic - coupled with the "powers" of Harry's own wand - pushing back against him.

[serene canyon]

is dumbledore actually gay?

[tawdry furnace]

depends on whether u consider words of jk rowling to be canon

if u dont then the answer is left ambiguous bc im pretty sure dumbys sexuality is not mentioned in the books

[random moon]

Rita Skeeter implied he had a secret relationship with Grindlewald in her book about him. But that book was full of lots of misinformation, exaggerations and outright lies.

[craggy moon]

what are the rules against using imperio?

[random moon]

It’s one of the Unforgivable curses. Being caught using it is a one way ticket to Azkaban

[craggy moon]

even against non-humans?

[random moon]

Using any Unforgivable Curse against non humans is technically legal

Morally questionable… but technically legal as the law only states use against other humans

[serene canyon]

i dont see the problem

[cobalt jolt]

Yes

He had a thing with Grindelwald back in the day

[celest mountain]

but in fantastic beasts he says that he was lovers with grindelwald so its canon

[raw geyser]

Only her words are canon. Simple is that.

[frank jewel]

So what do you do when her words contradict her other words? Which one is canon then?

[raw geyser]

Tell me one huge contradiction.

[frank jewel]

How time travel works

[raw geyser]

Time travel is in general dumb, and opens endless quiestions.

[frank jewel]

Okay let's go for something smaller then, She said the Triwizard tournament was started some 700 years ago, but it didn't run for at least 200 of those years due to the ban, it was held every five years. But also has said that Hogwarts has 63 wins and Beauxbaton has 62 wins. Which means a minimum of 125 tournaments must have been held. Which means around 625 years must have passed, but there's only around 500 years to go by.

Even more must have passed if Durmstrang had any wins, but she has never said anything about that

[raw geyser]

Do we know exactly when? Because the word some implies, that they just guessd the date. Do they kept exact records? It could be that nobody kept an exact record when it started, or simply JK is bad at math.

Usually they are the ones who get stuck on every single non essential detail.

[frank jewel]

Sure, I don't care about this. It was just to point out that she contradicts herself

[raw geyser]

it was a throwaway line wich you guys run away with and now wave it around as your flag of truth

[frank jewel]

You asked for inconsistencies, I gave you a huge one and you waved it away. I gave you a small one and you waved it away.

[boreal shuttle]

She should have been doing that, it takes literal minutes and that's how great worldbuilding is done.

[frank jewel]

I'm not saying I care, I'm saying that her word isn't always canon. That is the only point I'm trying to make here.

[raw geyser]

Huge? Where does in the books makes that any contradiction?

[frank jewel]

Ah see, now we're talking only about the books

[boreal shuttle]

This "guy" is one of the most consistent and fun people to talk with on this server. Who are you again?

[raw geyser]

Where does in the books the faact that she misscalculated the triwizard tournaments years makes a huge contradiction?

[frank jewel]

The books don't make that contradiction, the contradiction is from stuff she's said after the books was released

[raw geyser]

leave him. He is the most fun guy around.

[boreal shuttle]

Ah, the old "do it yourself" "argument" that instantly kills any possibility of critique or having a decent discussion. Well done.

[raw geyser]

yeah well, she didnt went back and changed anything in the books.

[frank jewel]

I'm very well aware, but it's just to point out that everything she says is not and can not be canon

[frank jewel]

I know

So how does time travel work? Is it a single timeline stuck in an infinite loop (see Prizoner of Azkaban) or is it a multi timeline jumping type of timetravel? (see Cursed Child)

Because if Cursed Child is canon, then Prizoner of Azkaban can't happen

[raw geyser]

Since Cursed Child is not existing, Prisoner of Azkaban.

[boreal shuttle]

If you're a child, maybe. Not for an adult who values consistency in worldbuilding and certainly not for the great fantasy authors out there who spend countless hours on 'stupid' stuff like this.

I love HP and the WW, it's my favourite franchise, but have some standards.

[frank jewel]

Exactly, but JK has said that Cursed Child is canon. So now, are you still sticking by this ```Only her words are canon. Simple is that.

You're acting more like a child than anyone else in here

[raw geyser]

yeah well. Than its the Cursed Child one. If its contradicting then it is.

[boreal shuttle]

Okay, I'm just going to block this guy. It's a waste of time trying to have a sensible conversation with a literal hobgoblin.

[raw geyser]

If you want standards, look for Tolkien.

But even he wrote contradictions as he was developing the story.

[frank jewel]

"My dad is stronger than yours"

[raw geyser]

i can bring my mom. Shes gonna talk to yours moms

[frank jewel]

I see, we have an 'alpha male' in the house

Anything you wanna say?

[raw geyser]

Jesus, this really turned into childrens argument. Now we judging profile pics.

[frank jewel]

I'm not seeing the problem with the picture

but I guess you can enlighten me

Lmao

[frank jewel]

Anyway, fair enough if that's what you're sticking with. Personally I only consider the books canon, everything said and made after change it up too much for me

[raw geyser]

I dont know how big was JKs work in CC, but man that book is something else.

[frank jewel]

She didn't write any of it, she just helped planned the outline I think

but she still said it was canon 🤷‍♂️

I also feel like a lot of her Pottermore writing was just written in standalone, maybe on a deadline, to create content for the website. Rather than as a way of sharing undocumented stuff she had created for the world while writing the books. And as a result, some of it is genuinely nice and makes sense, but some of it can be straight up contradicting or silly.

[sick night]

Well, I certainly missed a fun conversation.

I take a lot of what Rowling says about the series as canon, but I disagree with CC. It's terrible. Although, the segment about Tom killing Harry and becoming triumphant in the alternative timeline was interesting to read.

[raw geyser]

TBH my opinion about the whats canon whats not thing was, what she says is canon, but in truth i never said that it was good. I mean CC with this.

[raw geyser]

I guess she didnt even proof read it before greenlighting it.

But she tought that some polarising content would be good.

[frank jewel]

She also went back and edited a piece she wrote about Minerva for Pottermore so that the newest FB movie wouldn’t contradict it.

[raw geyser]

*may

[raw geyser]

I knew that one. But honestly reading the books, you never really could figure out when she was born.

[sick night]

I've never seen the FB movies. The ending duel between Dumbledore and Grindelwald was fun to watch, though.

[raw geyser]

I hate CC but i love the FB movies

[boreal shuttle]

I still think that her basically saying "yeah, whatever, it's canon" in a random tweet doesn't count when not a single word (be at of a character or anything plot-related) of CC is ever mentioned on the official WW site.

But I do get why some choose to see it differently.

[frank jewel]

Yeah, the books are pretty light on any contradiction. She even wanted the books to be time-less but then included headless nicks death day which solidified a real timeline for the events

[raw geyser]

Well i guess someone in the WW high table doesnt like it either.

[raw geyser]

wait for a day when it will be changed as well 😄

[frank jewel]

It wouldn’t surprise me

[raw geyser]

Me neither.

[worthy trench]

Later words or info tends to take precedence over the older info in fiction if there's irreconciliable contradictions. So i guess we have to go with newer info from her over older info if she doesn't clarify or reconcile contradictory info.

Though there's instances were the books contradict themselves. Like book 3, Hermione slaps Draco. Book i dunno which, she recalls the event but says she punched him instead. Easy for her to misrecall but i feel that was probably the movie version of the event influencing the writing when it came to that. Wouldn't be surprised if JK herself what she wrote in the book on little details like and the movie version being more known by then.

[raw geyser]

Well on that exact detail. Im pretty sure most of us had already retold stories a bit different to make certain details look better.

[frank jewel]

While not contradictions per-se, you can see it happen a lot as the books go on, where she introduces new things that would have been super useful way earlier, but because she hadn't thought of it at the time it just doesn't exist in the story.

but that doesn't bother me that much

[worthy trench]

And opens questions after she introduces them as some of them could have solved the plots easily and would be the logical things to do

Like the Potters should have just made AD or themselves their secret keepers and LV would never be able to get to them in their home.

Or used it for god knows what else - Philosopher's Stone hiding spot or how it was hidden etc.

Like that one charm solves alot of problems if you make yourself or him your secret keeper

[serene canyon]

@frank jewel is right

JKR certainly isnt consistent with her word. I know some stuff about fictional discourse and perhaps I can apply it here. But since Im too lazy now, I might do it later

[modern moth]

I sure as hell don’t. Those people upset me, it’s very clearly not canon but they’ll just believe it is cause she said so. Like have some sense, it’s all about money and making it sell, so that’s why she called it canon

FB is also not canon. Minerva is NOT suppose to be in FB.

Don’t @ me

[boreal shuttle]

FB still makes me sad. It could have been so great if JKR had spent more time actually thinking about the plot and where she wants the overall narrative to go. The era itself is so incredibly interesting and you have two ridiculously fascinating characters with Dumbledore and Grindelwald.

[cobalt jolt]

Ok seriously, what the heck?

[raw oxide]

The first and third one is cannon not the second

[late cloak]

hi, im new so idk where to ask this. What if i get lost in the castel or in the open world ?

[timid juniper]

Yes? And yes

I believe there are fast travel

To get out of the castle or back to

[random moon]

There’s a mini map

And a larger floor map thing we saw in the Music video

[flat comet]

What’s the name of the music video?
I’m curious to what the larger floor map looks like.

[random moon]

https://youtu.be/NAesuW6qZU8

[flat comet]

Thank you!

[sinful stratus]

why is it that in lord of the rings and a lot of other fantasy stuff elves are supposed to be "beautiful" and "graceful" but in the wizarding world they are ugly and subservient?

[random moon]

Creative differences? Tolkien set the staple for beautiful ethereal Elves.

JKRs are more based on old British/Celtic mythology for faefolk, of which elves are a part of

[sturdy hull]

Dobby is cute 😠

Dudley is so spoiled he had a PlayStation before it was officially released in Europe. 🤯

[cobalt jolt]

Tolkien's Elves were more inspired by their Norse version, who had a similar role to angels

Harry Potter Elves, as @random moon said, are more based off the Celtic Brownies, as well as Dobbs (where Dobby's name actually comes from)

though Celtic Elves were much more psychopathic, and would range from irritating, to outright murderous

Also, Brownies took it as a HORRIBLE insult if you tried to give them clothes as compensation for their work

[random moon]

Yeah you’d have to leave out offerings of food for them.. but if you offered them clothes they’d take offence and leave forever, which is where the whole House Elves being given clothes by their master marks them as freed, comes from

[cobalt jolt]

Yeah, and it does also leave me wondering if Hobgoblins would exist, since in folklore, they're an elf, and goblin crossbreed

[random moon]

And yeah faefolk weren’t something you messed with. Different places had different interpretations but there was stuff like the faeries would steal you away if you wandered into the woods after dark. Swapping human babies for changelings to be rained by the parents. And just lots of warnings to not mess with them as they were dangerous, tricksy creatures

[cobalt jolt]

Yeah, and when The Christians came along, they thought Elves were legit demons

[vapid parcel]

A plot hole I’ve noticed:
Ron fails a spell because he pronounces it wrong, and Hermione corrects him. However, every single person has terrible Latin with a fat English accent. So how come their spells works if pronounciation matters?

[random moon]

Honestly I think that was just Hermione being a bit pedantic. Pronunciation can’t be that important as folks from other countries can do the same spells with different pronunciation due to accents. I think it’s more the right amount of will behind it to get a spell to work.

Ron just wasn’t feeling it at the time I guess? First charms class ever and all that lol

[cobalt jolt]

Maybe it is supposed to be how it's pronounced with their native accent?

[random moon]

But then why would pronunciations matter at all? If it works with different accent, that’s different pronunciation no matter which way you swing it.

Someone with a French accent saying Accio has the same effect as someone with a British accent, but it’s not like if the British one says it in a French accent or vice versa, the spell suddenly won’t work for them

[tropic jewel]

I always took it as the intention and willpower in regards to the spell itself and not the words (which were more foci to stablize/control it easier)

since otherwise that means latin is the one true language in the world and all spells had to be made in it

[olive swan]

JKR wanted to show of how smart Hermione was. She had to show the readers her prowess somehow. That's how she did it. Not so much a plothole, but rather her doing very little in the sense of consistency. Another example is the Weasly's being poor and how they are discribed in the books, which now, years after the release, makes little sense.

[random moon]

We know that the incantation doesn’t need to be said aloud so pronunciation absolutely does not matter.

[random moon]

I think it was just a means to set up him talking bad about her and her getting upset and missing the Halloween feast to cry and then get attacked by the troll.

It was a bit of forced confrontation over something so asinine and unimportant to set up another plot point with the troll

[random moon]

We know that’s not true considering magic has been done all around the world fork a long time. The earliest recorded magical history was in ancient Egypt and they certainly didn’t speak Latin

[olive swan]

Children's book after all. Complex interwoven plot points ain't that great for children.

[subtle olive]

sooo what does that say for those of us who deadlift and squat north of 415lbs on the regular, spend a quarter of our time in the gym with another quarter ALSO literally pointing out and poking holes in our lore and stories we love to reconcile them and have them make sense, and the rest of the time eating, working, sleeping, and going out exploring unique restaurant experiences with friends?

You realize there is plenty of room to be a lifter AND a lore junkie, yes?

pfffffft. You ok dude? Rather insecure of a response throwing insults to a complete stranger.

and yet here you are on this discord trying to be a bully like this is some schoolyard

ohoooo

in creative writing there is a universal truth all writers know:

Fiction has to make sense even if the real world doesn't.

exactly. I had a life to live.

and yet here you are getting defensive and petty

no, that is quite the norm. Everything in a good story leads into the other. Structured rules even if the rules themselves are fantastical

Star Trek explains itself every two feet

and yet within its established context they make perfect sense. Like I said

no matter how fantastical

they still make sense

Warp drive, warp field

precisely. Yet they make sense in the context of their world

[olive swan]

"autistic", WTF. Maybe you should open a dictionary first before throwing these big words around.

[subtle olive]

you were talking about the Cursed Child my dude. Most Potter fans write that off and not even JK Rowling herself has successfully stopped that

[subtle olive]

it's alright.

[olive swan]

It really isn't.

[subtle olive]

seeing as I actually HAVE ASD, I am telling you it is quite alright. Those who need to sink low to feel better only reveal their character and it has no bearing or reflection on who I am nor anyone else.

thank you for making my above point.

see, if you actually wanted someone to read what you are saying and get on your side rather than lumbering insults and focusing on YOUR insecurities and bullying, quite frankly you would not resort to petty insults

but no

so quite flatly? No, I won't read your context because I do not care

You're a Ravenclaw, are you not? I figured you would have been smart enough to figure that out

evidently not.

See, what got someone's eye was your flagrant use of petty insults. THAT is what I replied to, not the conversation that spawned it.

YOU on the other hand were quite quick with more insults

[olive swan]

The conclusion is all kinds of wrong. Just because you are on the spectrum, doesn't mean their conclusion is any better. Also, not defending you or anything. But just because someone is interested in lore and likes to argue doesn't mean that person is autistic.

[subtle olive]

and are now trying to concern troll to feel superior

ah yes there it is again

see you are trying DESPERATELY to be on me for not having an argument yet you don't even have the slightest idea what I am actually pointing out. At least the Slytherin here gets it

because I don't care about your convo. I care about your petty insults

and your response to me cemented that

yet you're still responding

like any petty bully

caught like a rat

handsome man

you can keep trying bud

[viral badger]

Let's move on and get back on topic please

[brave echo]

Can you ride a dragon in the game ?

[random moon]

Highly doubt it. The rig of the dragon we’ve seen is huge and complicated.

Plus dragons are untameable.

[simple swift]

why is it you persist on deleting peoples messages for no apparent reason but when you’ve got someone in here throwing ‘autistic’ around as an insult and saying they don’t expect aspies to understand context all you have to say is ‘get back on topic’ 💀

[raw oxide]

Why is this person a mod if there doing that

[viral badger]

Mind dming me what it was that was removed from you because I'm not finding it and and I haven't removed anything

@simple swift

[simple swift]

it’s been over a long period of time nothing recent, but i’m not the only one it’s been happening to

[viral badger]

There is a reason things get removed for variety of reasons.

But if that is the end of that . Let us get get on topic of this channel

We've derailed it long enough

[karmic basin]

So I know the goblin rebellions were mentioned a few times in the original HP books, but I can't remember if there's mention of how they ended.

[viral badger]

I believe the last one resulted in laws becoming more strict and harsher on them. No wands or magic allowed ect. By the time Harry came along this was the 4th time they tried rebelling

[karmic basin]

Also, I wonder if HL is an actual goblin rebellion or if that's just a fake out for the goblins to try to get this ancient magic

[random moon]

Unsuccessfully outside of a few new rules and laws in place.

A lot of the Rebellions were to try and take over the Wizarding community and become the dominant magical race

[viral badger]

It also made of creatures lives a bit harder as the ministries didn't trust them and kept short leashes on them

@modern moth let's not spam this please

[modern moth]

I'm not spam just share on topic

different

[viral badger]

You're posting something that has nothing to do with channels and across multiple channels so yes it is spamming and against rules

[modern moth]

I don't agree with you because posting on other topic is not spam. spam can only be considered on one channel and not on all so I think you should respectfully read the definition of spam and see if it can apply good day I'm not in the mood to take my head on virtual good day

🙂

[viral badger]

#📄rules 22,8

[modern moth]

Okay that's different

the rule of server and spam ^^

i don't have learn the rule thanks for the share of rule

i go learn the rule of server

have good day and sorry for the desagrement dear

🙂

[rare knot]

Can someone try and justify why Dumbledore was a Gryffindor and not a Ravenclaw? He literally meets everyone of Ravenclaw's requirements and yet how is he put in Gryffindor? I would argue his bravery and chivalry is shaky at best

[raw oxide]

Really

To be fully honest he could have probably been put into slytherin

[rare knot]

Nah, he didn't really have the ambition in the long run. He specifically avoided high political office due to knowing his own shortcomings

[raw oxide]

But like when he was first sorted he certainly had the ambition then

[rare knot]

I'm assuming the hat could see past that

[raw oxide]

He was also clever and resourceful

[rare knot]

For Ravenclaw however, be fulfils every box

[raw oxide]

Ok

[random moon]

So did Hermione. Yet she was still put in Griffindor.

Neville had more Hufflepuff traits but the hat saw deeper potential in Griffindor for him.

It’s not always about which traits you embody then, during the Sorting Ceremony. It’s also about what your potential is, traits even deeper within you that you yourself might not even realise yet.

Like Neville, who was a bit of a wimp, but he 2s willing to stand up to his housemates so they wouldn’t get in trouble and later became even braver (eventually even standing up to Voldy when no one else would.)

[rare knot]

Yeah I know this - JK Rowling would just say 'Dumbledore Chose Gryffindor blah blah". But tbh I actually think Dumbledore showed less bravery towards the end of his life.

It's just a bit of a cop-out explanation, but I guess at the end of the day she can say whichever character goes into whatever house, because they "chose it"

Which renders any descriptors for the House meaningless. She may as well have left the Houses at colours and let students choose their favourite colour.

[raw oxide]

He probably did not choose it no one is that lazy to explain

Snape could have been a gryffindor

[olive swan]

Would have been great if he was put in Slytherin. Would have done wonders for JKRs World building. But in the end, she held on to the whole Good/Evil rethoric.

[brazen moat]

Dumbledore knowledge and bravery is fused with Gryffindor’s house as he is wise and full of wonder/adventure, taking risks that no other house would dare to challenge, his wide range of wisdom and skills represents all four houses at some point. His ambitions towards magic led him to become a headmaster of Hogwarts I believe🪬
Would love to hear your opinion about it as well ♥️ let’s share some thoughts 🪬

[balmy ocean]

Him being older doesn't really transpire to how he was like as a student he was pretty different back then, including his views,etc, considering he was even friends with grindelwald

[frank jewel]

I have always thought and said that your house is not really about the traits you have or will have, it’s about the traits you value.

[rare knot]

That would make some sense, but still seems odd if you don't necessarily embody the traits you value.

[frank jewel]

Not really, you can look up to and appreciate brave people without being brave yourself. Like Neville in earlier books, or Wormtail over the entire series.

[rare knot]

I disagree and still think it's a weak reason to place someone in a House. Especially if no conscience effort is made to embody said traits. Neville absolutely makes sense with his character development. Wormtail does not really, and I would argue Dumbledore as well.

[frank jewel]

But they are still in that house, so there is obviously more to it than what people are, so it makes sense to me that it’s about what they value. Wormtail really looked up to and wanted to be like his talented and brave friends.

[rare knot]

Operating on the assumption that the systems JK Rowling creates are consistent and foolproof (which they arent).

I still think that looking up to bravery, yet making zero effort to be brave should not be enough to put a person in Gryffindor. I would argue the qualities of Hufflepuff are probably the most important of all Houses, yet it is the House I relate to the least. But I suppose this is just my opinion.

[olive swan]

If you want to argue either case, you ought to take JKR's sorting into account and use that as a baseline. Otherwise the whole debate is pointless.

The common thesis is that the sorting hat tends to sort based on the traits one values rather than personifies.

Also, the hat does take wishes into account. So, it's not sorting based on whatever either.

[rare knot]

I didn't say that

[rare knot]

I'm arguing this is flawed.

[olive swan]

Yeah, that's what the book says.

[rare knot]

No, I didn't say it's basing it on "whatever".

I said basing it purely on whatever the person wants is kind of flawed. Especially when what they want is not reflected in any meaningful way through their actions.

But the conversation has been exhausted - I said it is simply my opinion on the issue that it is a flawed system.

[olive swan]

I had a lengthy discussion with someone on Discord about that as well.

It's more about what a child values at that particular point in time. So to speak, being raised a certain way or looking up to someone etc. will have certain effects on how you would be sorted yada yada.

I think reasoning, the hat made a mistake because this and that happened makes its sorting decision a faulty one, or it was right all along because in the end they showed this and that trait is too easy. Not saying you said that - my thoughts in general.

It's several aspects really. Also one could argue that being placed with other individuals trying to live up to certain imaginary traits or attributes does help to mold one into whatever that house may or may not represent.

So, I do agree that there ought to me more to the whole discussion.

[karmic basin]

So I'm re-reading Goblet of Fire right now. Malfoy makes a comment about Ron's dress robes having been fashionable around 1890 - wonder if we'll see anything like them in the game

Assuming Malfoy wasn't just spouting nonsense

[brave echo]

FYI , Malfoy or Ron will not be in the game

[vivid owl]

That's not what they were asking. They were asking about the dress robes and whether we'll see robes like what Ron had in the game due to the reference of them being popular around the 1890s.

To which I'll say maybe. Depends if the devs give us a reason for such dress robes.

[brave echo]

Oh. Did Triwizard tournament exist during that time ?

[vivid owl]

I think it ended in the late 1700s so another century before the time the game is set

[heavy sand]

pretty sure it did

[heavy sand]

but the books said that it was started 600 centuries back so..

[vivid owl]

Yes it did but it was stopped in the 1700 due to the amount of deaths

[brave echo]

If It was stopped in 1700 then when did it start again ?

And what was the reason to restart it ?

[vivid owl]

1994

The reason being Dumbledore and the British Ministry's hubris

[brave echo]

In that case Triwizard tournament can't exist in HL and there is no reason to wear dress robes .

[timid granite]

WHat do you mean?

Only because there is no Yule ball aside the cup?

They certainly have other festivities to wear dress robes

[brave echo]

Yule ball is a tradition for the Triwizard tournament .

[brave echo]

There is ?

[timid granite]

A Yule Ball is not bound to the Tournament. Its bound to Yule. As its name suggest.

And maybe yes, you can always find excuses for a ball

[brave echo]

They could use it for parties too.

[vivid owl]

There can be other events that would require dress robes other than the tournament's Yule Ball

A variety of parties and events would potentially require formal robes.

[brave echo]

Just imagine a mission like : Dance with natsai onai

[vivid owl]

Doesn't sound like the worst sort of mission

[timid granite]

Hmm, I would take Amit to cast a smile on his face. He would be pretty handsome if he smiles more

[hallow forge]

One reason to wear dress robes could be for example graduating from Hogwarts. All the bad shenanigans happened during spring/near the end of school year, so we never got to hear about graduation parties.

[olive swan]

With some insane lunatic on the rise and constantly trying to kill you, doing festive stuff wasn't the main priority probably.

[tropic jewel]

Could have minor events that require formal robes

meetings between clans/families, 'club' events, festive events etc

in regards to hl

[drowsy tangle]

😀

[simple swift]

actually it is only held during triwizard tournaments

[clever yacht]

there are other reasons to possibly wear dress robes, though

Slug Club events (not during HL, but as an example), weddings, etc

[brave echo]

What is a slug club

[brave echo]

That lunatic exists outside of Hogwarts so you can do events

[clever yacht]

the Slug Club is Slughorn's social club - he only invites those he thinks will go far (famouse/powerful/talented) to join. he's the one that told Voldemort about horcruxes

[olive swan]

It was probably not on Harry's main agenda. Not to say that other families did not have their own little events and gatherings.

[brave echo]

https://www.cbr.com/harry-potter-movies-reboot-rumor-warner-bros/?utm_term=Autofeed&utm_campaign=Echobox-CBR&utm_medium=Social-Distribution&utm_source=Facebook#Echobox=1672379251

[olive swan]

Would love that. Would be great if they stuck more to the source material this time around.

[open glade]

I doubt they'd do that

The only way to really stick to the books would be a series, there's just too much for a movie on each books

[brave echo]

A reboot could be a series too

[olive swan]

I would love some 7 season epos like GOT. Just without the shite writing. lmao

[brave echo]

I hope the recasting of harry , Ron and hermoine is good as the previous one

[olive swan]

Would love if they didn't butcher my boy Ron this time around. Also, maybe fix some lore inconsistencies this time around as well, or elaborate on stuff more.

Also, a Snape that is more true to the source as well, Snape was not half as charismatic as Alan Rickman was. RIP.

[worthy trench]

I don't if people are ready or willing to watch a reboot due to the movies still being in the public consciousnes and probably will be considered the definitive adaptation. I'd rather have spin offs

[brave echo]

FB were spin offs and they were terrible.

[worthy trench]

Thats subjective. And i mean other spin offs

[olive swan]

They were subjectively and objectively terrible.

[brave echo]

People won't watch if they don't like the main cast or if the writing is bad. If wb casts them perfectly then and if the story is good then people will give it a shot.

[olive swan]

If I remember correctly there had been talks as well, to boot the franchise since it performed so poorly at the box office.

I would imagine rebooting would be good for future IPs as well. Most of the OG Harry Potter fans are adults themselves.

[brave echo]

Yeah and I don't mind if they put a book accurate Hogwarts.

[worthy trench]

I'd rather see spin offs cos we've seen the HP story already. I want the verse to expand beyond him and Hogwarts

[brave echo]

That's what the FB did

What are you expecting ?

[brave echo]

Yeah

[worthy trench]

thats still tied to HP later. I want something else down the line. Like do Founders or Merlin or something or Ilvermory