👾┃showdown

[hard glade]

I Wonder if you farmed Enigma topaz this week?

[hushed rock]

alright thank youu
one last question: why ice/ poison wielding? does it depent on the hero? wouldnt thunder make more sense because yk THUNDERpull, counter etc? xd

[fierce light]

0-600 I did Enigma, 600+ I did the event.

[fierce light]

The build's focus is on canceling the Thunder Counter to get Scorching off. So Divine Thunder DMG is the least of your concerns. Furthermore, the more Thunder-Wielding you have, the slower it builds up.

[hearty rivet]

how long have you not recasted anything? :o

[fierce light]

2nd week now.

Well 1.5 weeks, cause I finished my Thunder Scorch halfway through.

[hearty rivet]

wow!

[hushed rock]

ah okay and so do i use ice or poison wielding?

[hearty rivet]

wow congrats!

[hard glade]

Thankyou... Great!!! I am at 1005, was little upset as I was not getting enough fragments ...
Now I will farm at the event .. new hope found ✨

[fierce light]

Ice, cause there's no benefit of using Poison in the Potential for Hydroflare.

[hushed rock]

thank you! :D

[fierce light]

I pretty much got a better Poison Souljade for all of them in the set. Granted I made my first Poison set with terrible %'s (all around 10-30% of max). So I can convert those later to beef up my Poison build.

[hearty rivet]

Is the current demonkilling event good for souljade farming? For salvaging said souljades?

[fierce light]

It's a bit tough to say. It's certainly worse for Crystals, since it's hard capped at 1 per 15 fatigue (vs Nirriti's Ruins who can get 8+ from 45 fatigue). It's also worse at Souljade Fragments than Enigma Domain.

I'd mainly recommend it for farming for high attribute % rolls.

[hearty rivet]

Thx! Yeah for crystal it is definitely bad but Last week my typical nirriti rewards were on normal fatigue between 1 gold+3 purple to 0-1 purple, for 45 fatigue. Plus this game mode takes like half-1 minute to complete (+ loading screens) so I wondered.

Enigma is so nice (when I get more than 1-2 golden souljade at 150% reward with potion), but alas it is limited bc of rune keys.

Thankfully with the last couple of quench crystals I was able to fix the %s of most of my frequently used souljades 🫠

[hushed rock]

so do i scrap this? dont wanna do something shitty haha

and maybe i should have waited with imbueing the 4th substat?

[fierce light]

The event is also good for restocking on Rune Keys.

[fierce light]

I wouldn't, you have two high % Attributes (Attack = 75% & Increase DMG to Boss = 96%).

Can reroll it for either a max attribute or a rare that you want.

[hushed rock]

so what do i do with it, try getting a good 4th one and then value recast? what would be a good 4th one? do i need a rare one?

[hidden creek]

reroll the rare attribute into a max value attribute

then reroll the defuse trigger recovery into a rare stat

[amber terrace]

finally

[hushed rock]

do i automativally get a max value for rerolling?

[hidden creek]

not automatically

but you have a chance

w/o needing to do value recast

[hushed rock]

kk ill try

do i just cancel till i get a good one with high stats?

[hidden creek]

yeah
or the rare that you wanted

[hushed rock]

that good? xd

[hidden creek]

it's not

max value of health is 15%

8.5% is just 56% of the max value

[hushed rock]

can i show max value somehow?

[hidden creek]

hover your mouse over a jade

then press alt

then you gotta remember them lol

or make a list yourself

[hushed rock]

kk haha

[hidden creek]

get a max or nearly max value first

then reroll it into health later

[hushed rock]

doesnt it loose the max value when i reroll again?

[hidden creek]

no

for example if you got a 200 armor stat (max value)

when you reroll that attribute to health it gonna be 15%

[hushed rock]

okay so values dont change at all when recasting?

[hidden creek]

yes

[hushed rock]

ooooh

[hidden creek]

with the only exception of rare attribute recasting

reroll a rare have a chance to be... whatever

from lowest to highest value attribute, or another rare (with the condition of it being the only rare attribute of the jade)

[hushed rock]

but like if i have a low stat souldjade i shouldnt even try rerolling

i never knew that xd

[hidden creek]

you should, if you're aiming for a rare

[hushed rock]

yeah but i mean if im trying to build a good jade for my build i should start with one that has good stats already

[hidden creek]

yes

you should get a jade with at least 2 high value stats to even begin rerolling

which is maxed, or close to max, like 80% and up

[hushed rock]

okayy shit i never did that

thank you

[hidden creek]

for example, this one

what i gonna do now is i gonna reroll the rage/dmg stat, aiming for a rare

[hushed rock]

okay got it

[hidden creek]

and in the process, if i reached the roll pity w/o getting a rare (which mean i can choose what the next opt gonna be)

i'll reroll the HP into attack

then keep rerolling the rage/dmg for a rare attribute

[hushed rock]

and if u get a rare one?

[hidden creek]

take it ofc

then i can reroll the hp to attack, then back to reroll the rare

[hushed rock]

yeah but if it isnt the one u want u just reroll

[hidden creek]

you have to take it first

[hushed rock]

yeah

[hidden creek]

then if it's not my desired rare i'll reroll later

to a maxed value attribute

then repeat the process

[hushed rock]

okay

i wasted so much stuff rerolling low stat jades man haha

[hidden creek]

dw we all did

i've been there

[hushed rock]

hahaha

thanks for the advice though

[hidden creek]

''value recast couldn't be that bad, right?''

famous last word

[hushed rock]

do u even use value recast?

[hidden creek]

sometimes

[hushed rock]

but is shitty?

[hidden creek]

but try to avoid it god know hm it gonna takes to even increase a 4.5% dmg to boss to 5%

i think i did like 200 value recast it still couldn't reach 5%

[hushed rock]

damn

kk

one thing i sill dont get

why is health important?

i remember in earlier seasons u never wanted health

[hidden creek]

health is important on burn/hydroflare based builds only

[hushed rock]

just attack and damage etc

[hidden creek]

bcoz of this potential

[hushed rock]

why though? cause ur dying easly

[hidden creek]

no no

with the potential, more hp = more burn dmg

[hushed rock]

ah so cause of potential tree?

[hidden creek]

yeah

[hushed rock]

got it

u helped me alot man haha ty

[hidden creek]

yw

[rigid barn]

Anyone can help me with buried giant normal , ive no idea whats going on.

[flat pier]

I still have not gotten the useless rock and the red, i always play with viper ning

any tips or tricks please?

[crisp horizon]

Do i need to kill all bosses. Or just kill some quick, quit, then repeat?

[flat pier]

I mean if you can clear all bosses in less than 10 minutes or around 10, why not clear it all, it does give more souljades per fatigue spent and time consumed

but if you can't, and you're still raising your sense, they say, the first 3 bosses is enough and just quit

which is stronger generally? mod poison or poison fang?
which is stronger for bosses?

[crisp horizon]

Well i could do it under 10 min. But last time i did it, the reward not significantly better, just much more busy work

[flat pier]

yeah, i think the purple and gold jades don't increase just the blues, i get tons of them i think after i finish all of em

[fierce light]

To get the most out of your Rune Keys, I'd say kill as many as you can

[crisp horizon]

Alright, the problem is keys for sure

[fierce light]

Legendary Rune Keys increase the quantity of jades the user gets even more

[restive wraith]

is this just the normal stages? I randomly did 3/5 and cant finish it

[ebon parrot]

yk the ice map on top left

holoroth, the only boss there is matron

also it seems like suffer no demon scales with sense lv but the drops remain the same?

cuz i tried with my viper thats like 800 smt and clear speed is basically the same as my tarka thats 1027

[hidden creek]

wdym

you're saying it ''scales with sense level'' but then saying ''clear speed is the same between 800 and 1027 sense''

so what are you trying to say

[ebon parrot]

wait theyre saying the same thing🤡

oopsies

im a whole ass clowjn

[fierce light]

Yeah believe it says somewhere that it's not affected by sense

Only difference would be the change in your base attack

Probably the fastest I've capped out my fatigue in a while

[ebon parrot]

The poison one is so satisfying

[restive wraith]

thank you! I haven't done anything there lol, only do event stage to farm up my sense lvl, just started a week ago

[grim girder]

Just got a souljade that had [scorching] right away, without recasting. First time ever.

I didn't even know that was possible

[flat pier]

wwait but you only get 1 curved crystal per run, it's not fatigue proficient for carved crystal farming though

is it?

[whole pebble]

Question:
For the Thunderpull / Scorching Build, what would be a better replacement for Copperward if i want to play safer, would it be Defuse-Raging Flame or Incineration? or do you guys have a different suggestion.

[grim girder]

is farming Suffer No Demon effective in terms of shards/hour? I feel like I spend more time on getting in/out of the game then on clearing the level itself.

[thorn narwhal]

drops seem to be awful this week so not much options

[grim girder]

I thought so as well, but then Cyan Fang with [scorching] dropped in Suffer no Demon so now I'm excited

[thorn narwhal]

interesting

i don't think its worth farming this week

[whole pebble]

still need to push to 2400 fatigue though if you are min-maxing your jade stats.

unless you already done so, then yeah. lol

[thorn narwhal]

still need ye so will try

[whole pebble]

im still getting decent drop at topaz enigma using normal keys currently at 100% drop reward.

lesser carved crystal vs Niritti, but im currently out of souljade fragments for recasting. so need to farm epic/legendary jades to deconstruct.

[thorn narwhal]

weird gonna try more

[warped falcon]

I’ve been struggling to unlock this anima ring. Is there a way to make it appear more likely?

I know you can increase your chances of getting avarice by getting money type anime rings in the beginning so was wondering if theres a certain way for this ring too

[hidden creek]

but you unlocked it already?

[warped falcon]

No this is just a cropped image of a screenshot i took

[hidden creek]

ah

you know how to get this right

[warped falcon]

Yessss im listening

Tell me :<

[hidden creek]

oh so you don't know?

[warped falcon]

Nope

[short meadow]

Bruh you will be cooked

Its kinda super hard rn

[warped falcon]

Not touching grass this weekend so im up for the challenge

[hidden creek]

https://youtu.be/kRkeLt0mMa0

[warped falcon]

OK TYSM!

[sullen pawn]

odds of getting lost seem low af now tho so gl with that bro

[warped falcon]

Oh yh im cooked xD

[fierce light]

No it's not. It's mainly if you plan on building a Poison set so you can stock up on good Souljades

[thorn narwhal]

bruh i just got the room today and didn't know about the wall

anyway what happens when u get 2 windfull to the stats

[subtle bramble]

Only appears in nightscream and higher now yikes

I got it so many times last season but didn't know how to get the jade lmaoo missed chance

[sullen pawn]

ah that explains why i havent seen it much, havent done much aside normal since we even got the chests

[subtle bramble]

I can't even complete nightscream solo 🤭 had someone help me in trios bless

[fierce light]

The chance of getting the room once you get the curse seems noticeably higher though

[thorn narwhal]

just got it lol, it was annoying that it only opens with the charging attack

[short meadow]

Why none complaining about this shit drop?

Only 150% rewards are good . other rewards are dog shit this week

[fierce light]

It takes a lot of hits to break. It'll make a distinct sound whenever it hits it.

[fierce light]

Yeah i think they're still experimenting with drop rates

[thorn narwhal]

oh i see

[short meadow]

I barely did 1110 fatigue Now im done with this shit

I'll try next week

Playing enigma topz with gold keys and its giving me 6-7 normal jades (100% )

[crisp horizon]

Other than thunder scorch, which build fit Kurumi

[hidden creek]

poison, classic thunder counter, or even classic hydroflare

[round glacier]

Cyan fang poison wielding great with kurumi

Builds up poison fast

Thunder counter probably higher dps though

[thorn narwhal]

luck in naraka

[wispy garnet]

Guys is it for real 120 needed or again wrong on xbox like 20k-dmg-shot challenge??

It kinda doesn't make sense

[drifting lance]

🎉 | SchattenBlitz leveled up!

[hidden creek]

120 needed

it's just 60 runs

[finite lily]

how much difference does sense level make for paragon

i'm about 10 levels down to paragon 1 and since i'm fairly new to showdown i'm not sure if i'll get basically one shot either way if i mess up

[hidden creek]

alot

[fierce light]

It'll convert to 6k when you hit it.

[frosty totem]

any good build in showdown for Feria ?

[hidden creek]

https://dark-zer0.github.io/Showdown/build.html?option=1

[frosty totem]

ty

[fierce light]

Standard Thunder Build vs Poison Fang Build (on Kurumi)

Standard Thunder

• Souljades

Thunderpull, Thunder Counter, Thunderproof, Sub-Zero Seal, Ice Break, Spring's Call

• Attributes

Divine Thunder DMG +30%,
Attack +4%,
[Windfall],
[Windfall]

Poison Fang

• Souljades

Noxious Blast, Pestilent Pool, Infectious Touch, Miasma Drive, Cyan Fang · Poison-Wielding, Defuse · Solidification

• Attributes

Attack +4%,
Increase DMG to Boss +5%,
[Windfall],
[Windfall]

There's a surprisingly big gap between Thunder and Poison Build even at max Attributes.

[round glacier]

Poison seems better right?

Epic breakdown though!!

[steep patio]

Is using those green boxes the only way to get extra atrib?

[hidden creek]

yes

[steep patio]

That’s kinda dumb

[fierce light]

It's slower than before to get 4-Slots, but you're no longer locked to 3-Slots in search of a Rare Attribute.

[fierce light]

Ah Arcane Thunder? Nice

[polar light]

Yeah XD

[fierce light]

Oh you're running the Thunder Scorch Mod build

Lmao

We need another Hero with a strong ability. Viper hogging all the good builds.

[polar light]

Viper and Tariki are the only hero’s that benefit from their weapon to get thunder in thunder scorch build,other hero’s need to use the fist (punching or slapping) technique to get ur thunder XD

[polar light]

And Tumlech and Toto with Aerial weapons jade as well

[polar light]

Bout other wise this XD

[fierce light]

Yeah slap has some pretty high base dps so it can build it rather quickly.

[thorn narwhal]

why poison blast not a higher priority

[fierce light]

On the graph there, you can see that Element Damage makes up a pretty small percentage of your total damage. Toxin Blast isn't considered Elemental Damage, so Poison Blast DMG ends up being not worth it.

[thorn narwhal]

oh i thought it did as i saw the toxin blast dmg was increasing

thx i'll focus on attack then

[round glacier]

What would be the 3rd trait to target instead of double windfall?

[fierce light]

Then you'd want Poison Blast DMG (better for mobbing) or Melee Weapon DMG (better for bossing).

[thorn narwhal]

double wind is 10 --> 17.5 or 20

[restive python]

Wooooooowzzzzaaaa

[dusk plover]

I’m ready

[whole merlin]

Does anyone know what the find conditions for the secret anima rings Inferno Hero, Divine Army from the Sky and Useless Rock are? I can't find them or any info on them I want to assume it's all the attack tree for at least the first 2

[fierce light]

Divine Army from the Sky

• Get the Lost curse on Nightscream or Legend difficulty.
• Lure Mountain Ghost to the corner that sticks out and have him hit the wall until it breaks.
• There will be an item on the ground to pick up.

Useless Rock

• Random chance it will appear in Nirriti Codex while playing Viper Ning, Temulch, Tarka Ji or Matari.

Inferno Hero

• Random chance of appearing when you have Useless Rock in your inventory.

[whole merlin]

Holy thank you! I never would have figured those out haha

[hard glade]

Disappointed!!! drop rate tooooooo bad 😔
Not sure why they messing up with drop rates!

[limpid pecan]

yoto can get useless rock too right?

[fierce light]

Hasn't been confirmed yet.

[frosty dagger]

is poison fang doesn't need poison blast dmg bonus?

[fierce light]

@frosty dagger

[frosty dagger]

oh damn .. thanks sirr

[neat thistle]

Can anyone carry me showdown nightmare?

[signal kite]

Nah i definitely have to build this freaking scorching build, I mean look at the dmg 😭 best for bossing

Not me doing bosses with poison build

[short meadow]

is this for thunder scorching?

[warped falcon]

No thunder shorch use hydro flare potential build

[short meadow]

Oh Okhy

[flat pier]

@fierce light @hidden creek @short meadow so do you have to get the useless rock in an early stage to get the red secret? like in 1 match?

i am still looking for the red secret xD

[short meadow]

yes you need useless rock early then after next zone there is a chance to get red ring

you will get rock in 11 zone mybe

there is a chance to get red on 12/13 zone

[flat pier]

i have gotten rock in zone 1

multiple times

and red one never shows up

i am with ning 😦

I also don't get rings because someone said, i am not supposed to get 4/12 combo rings to get the red

[short meadow]

[flat pier]

is it true?

[short meadow]

I have no idea about this to be honest

[flat pier]

you still got it even though you took the powerup rings?

[short meadow]

All of my friends got rock on 11th and got red on 12/13th

[short meadow]

I always go with full hydrofire ring

Also where are you farming this?

[flat pier]

nirriti hard

nightscream without ring, it is too intense.... so i dropped down

[short meadow]

No idea if they changed or smthing

[short meadow]

Hard is best tbh

[flat pier]

ok..

so get rings and just repeat in hard

[short meadow]

Yeah

[flat pier]

hope one day it shows up...

[short meadow]

Its all about luck

[flat pier]

and my luck is shite... so...

thank you duck

[chrome agate]

Not true I got 4/12 for Elemental on Pre Stage, then got Useless rock on 2. stage. Got it in Normal and Nighstcream so far. (All during latest patch)

[flat pier]

thank you

[wind widget]

best hero clear Nirrit Legend?

[flat pier]

I'd say any hero except matari

[fierce light]

I just played normally and got it, don't think it's affected by your rings. Also got it while farming Normal difficulty a couple of times, but that was before they adjusted it's appearance rate.

[spice canyon]

me personaly would be Tarka he is good with any anima ring you choose (except maybe yin yang anima)

[fierce light]

Kurumi, Wuchen or Viper Ning.

[fervent junco]

Takeda best solo

No

Best duo/trio

With Kurumi

They are lore-connected after all

[hidden creek]

https://tenor.com/view/chloe-sideye-seriously-gif-10549810

[fierce light]

Tarka is best for farming Normal/Hard, but for Legend not really.

[fervent junco]

Who’s tarka

[fierce light]

Oh I misread that lmao

Wish they would bring him in, he was my main when I did play PvP.

[polar light]

good luck building that XD

[drifting lance]

🎉 | NotToxic[EU] leveled up!

[fierce light]

That's the Thunder Scorching Mod build. Even more particular.

[ebon parrot]

Honestly would be so cool

But I wonder what his skills would be like

[fierce light]

Could make it do lot of Aegis Damage when used against a focus attack

Or damage in general. It should be stronger than Viper's and Feria's ability to be any good

[ebon parrot]

I’m just picturing takeda flipping the boss over when they focus

Lmao

[fathom bobcat]

Personally, I'm waiting Justina. Maybe they'll introduce her into PvE before I die of old age, but it's not certain.

[short meadow]

She will get dagger mybe

[fathom bobcat]

No, no, no. According to history of game world, she's use sword like Viper, even has personal long sword.

[short meadow]

Lets see lol

I saw justina using dagger on Hero assmble

[fathom bobcat]

It's also funny that the chamber of justice fights have her among bots. It's kind of like PvE content and she's the only one among the participants who isn't in that mode yet.

[short meadow]

who knows if they put same thing on main hero

[short meadow]

Yes and she got dagger

[fathom bobcat]

Cringe

[short meadow]

Fr

They will destroy a powerfull hero with shit weapon

[fierce light]

If so, hope they finally buff Dagger, or she's going to be the worst hero.

[short meadow]

I dont understand why they made purple atk on dagger

The right click charge atk . its so cringe

[fierce light]

Yeah it's pretty pointless

[fathom bobcat]

It would just be most stupid moment possible, giving character an uncharacteristic weapon. Moment Justina has clear image as swordsman.

[short meadow]

You cant even dodge or move during this atk

[short meadow]

Hope they give her heng sword

[fathom bobcat]

It's for Shayol Wei.

[short meadow]

So my grandchild will play PvE with shayol

[fathom bobcat]

I'm happy for him.

[short meadow]

Actually I'm 20

[fierce light]

You can dodge cancel out of it. Unless they removed it, cause it used to be a combo in PvP

Still not worth using cause the damage is bad

[short meadow]

yeah its kinda different compare to PvE and PvP

dagger is a good tier weapon on PvP tho

[fierce light]

Also doesn't help that it's hitbox is so small that you can whiff bosses with a lot of its attacks

[fathom bobcat]

I'm six years older. That's okay, maybe we'll get PvE season without new hero, I wouldn't be surprised. I'd be even less surprised if it was Kylin. And I wouldn't be surprised at all if current imbalanced build continues to take down bosses as mobs and beyond.

[fierce light]

They're probably going to remove Water and Fire Raged

[fathom bobcat]

That would be bad.

[fierce light]

Build would still be good though

[restive wraith]

Is there any tips you guys can give me about defuse/ counter? I can 90% dash away an atack with shift but with defuse/counter I'm always too slow, is it because I was in another animation or I need to react before the attack is right on my face?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQaoddU4Lo4
this video do give me some thought about it, just wanna make sure since I'm a new player

• should I always start a combo with defuse? since I'm using defuse solidification

[hidden creek]

you said it yourself, you're being slow with it, so next time do it abit earlier

[fierce light]

That video was before the changes to Defuse Solve, so the positioning and timing may be a bit different. But yeah with Defuse Solidification you want to try to Defuse at least once every 15 seconds. When the boss is being aggro, it's generally a good idea to go for Defuses for the big Aegis damage as well.

[crisp horizon]

Is there a pattern to the next hero to be included in showdown? Based on pvp hero release?

[hidden creek]

no

[restive wraith]

I'm practicing this right now, just go in Yama's Abyss and try to learn the boss' move set and react tbf If I cant counter or defuse at all I have no chance to pass this rank, practice make perfect

[copper summit]

I downloaded Naraka to play BR with my friend but ended up just playing Showdown the most, been a couple weeks now but with the event being super convenient ended up grinding to 1010 and Paragon 1, it's a shame the game isn't as promoted as it could be cos having a game within a game is usually always a good thing, Showdown supremacy, Showdown great, Showdown updates soon plsthx

[fierce light]

Yoto Hime broke the pattern iirc, before it was released in the order they appear in the heroes tab.

[fierce light]

Yeah it's nice that Yama's gives a chance to practice against bosses without the constant loading screens. Just wish it displayed the enemies on each stage from the menu.

Sorta like this

[thorn narwhal]

is this part of the change and do u get it too, defuse neutralize the attack but doesn't trigger it (the click) if i do it abit late or just in time of the attack, it has to be very early to trigger properly

[fierce light]

There's always been a delay, especially for Defuse Solve. If you use it as soon as an attack hits you, the initial iframe will ignore it (that's why it consumes stamina cause it has that iframe). Then after that iframe is the Defuse window.

[thorn narwhal]

that totally make sense then

[rancid rivet]

hiii

how do i adquire scorching?

[molten lagoon]

Whenever you roll an attribute to a new one, it has a chance of being a rare attribute. There are 3 and scorching is one of them.

It’s very rare though and getting one can take many many rerolls.

Rolling these is a very end-game thing to do

[rancid rivet]

ah i cant send screenshots

[molten lagoon]

You’ll need to talk in the discord more

[ebon parrot]

Hey dark, is the enigma peak portion in ur guide still up to date

[fierce light]

The rewards are out dated, but the strategy is the same.

[ebon parrot]

Percentages the same?

[fierce light]

Yes.

[finite lily]

how exactly does windfall work?

[drifting lance]

🎉 | Lumio leveled up!

[hearty rivet]

It increases the non-rare stats on the souljade by the indicated %, like at 50% +4 attack becomes +6.

[polar light]

What game is this,it look nice

[fierce light]

Wuthering Waves

[fervent imp]

heey, is here a way i can farm soul jades for lvling up them faster? because i'm just trying to finish the journey's dawn and it's literally taking forever

[fierce light]

Suffer No Demon is the fastest right now. Particularly if you run it with anyone that has an Elemental build.

[fervent imp]

oh yeah i had no one to play with so i cleared the challenge one alone because it says that the max sense of dropped jades is 1010
but all i got is a couple of 750~ jades lol idk maybe i got it wrong

[fierce light]

It won't drop jades all the way at max right away. It usually goes up by 2-3 Sense Levels per run.

[fervent imp]

ty anyway! time for grinding i guess lol

[restive wraith]

It take me a week to go from 700 to 1000 (farming for substats right now), just spam Tarka Ji (whatever lvl you have) with first stage of Suffer No Demon since he can spam skill with his ult

second stage need to kill mobs for explode so it is not as fast if you are new

• if you are in SEA I can join in... 6-7 hrs

check your inventory for x2 drop x2 fatigue too for faster farming

I think it is a yellow bottle

[short meadow]

Why do I need Ice blessings on Thunder hydrofire?

[fervent imp]

oh dang thanks that's a lot of advices

i just need to go from 750 to about 800
so i hope it'll take me less time haha

[warped falcon]

To proc thunder counter faster

[short meadow]

So ice blessings make thunder proc faster?

[warped falcon]

Yes because thunder wielding makes the elemental accumulation slower

[short meadow]

THis is why my thunder proc is slower than others

I have 4ice and 2 thunder blessings

[warped falcon]

Yeah change it prontooooo

[short meadow]

Okhy

[tropic bramble]

What’s the scorching hydroflare potential

Is it just the same as the hydroflare one?

[hidden creek]

yes

[tropic bramble]

Thanks. Also anyone else getting kicked out of games early?

They just took my fatigue potion too

[woeful monolith]

Yama is a fukin joke . Paragon 2 with 4 phases of the guy that just randomly grabs you....but OH WAIT if you have thunder scorch build you dont have to worry about shi cuz you just 2 tap bosses ||TOTALLY FAIR RIGHT|| No skill and literally no point in even trying for leaderboards when you have people stacked with triple rares on every jade ||All while completed things in under a minute while everyone else is atleast double or triple the time||........ This is why its so hard to get people into this game mode and why its dying/dead.

[finite lily]

well I mean you are not gonna compete for leaderboard if you aren't stacked

[sullen pawn]

Standard hydroflare clears that pretty fast even at 0 scorching, obviously better build should have better times so that cant be that surprising

[drifting lance]

🎉 | El Chapo Blu leveled up!

[fierce light]

Yeah Omnious Rock attacks a lot, so Standard Hydroflare can put out some decent numbers. Also his extra hands turn sandy when he's prepping for a grab so you can defuse those. Other than that it comes down to learning the pattern of the grabs. Triple rares are also just less effective than two rares with Attack and Health.

[limpid pecan]

it actually takes more skill to clear it with thunder scorch than hydroflare xd

[subtle bramble]

I had that issue a week or so ago

Nirriti kept kicking me out as if I had lost

when I had never even died once

[limpid pecan]

in fact im pretty sure thunder scorch is the highest skill build we have right now

[subtle bramble]

what would you say is the best build for noobs I am so bad at learning the timings, stuck on paragon 2 as well

hydroflare?

[limpid pecan]

i think poison build probably

especially if u have cyan fang on viper

u just spam leftclick till everything dies

even with absolutely 0 stats

[subtle bramble]

oh ye I have that but still struggling her difuse is difficult for me because I got used to wuchen and feria's

[limpid pecan]

it clears rly fast

[subtle bramble]

I have 50% moderation and lvl 4 scorching on it

[limpid pecan]

u dont really have to defuse much on that build

[subtle bramble]

Dodging it is then xD the bosses on paragon 2 kill me in under a minute

[limpid pecan]

hydroflare is not too hard too as long as u dont take copper ward

but u have to learn to defuse well

takes time to learn all boss patterns

[subtle bramble]

especially eerie bosses 😭

[limpid pecan]

hmm if u wanna clear yama

idk how viable poison is there

hydroflare is prolly easiest to clear it with

[subtle bramble]

I'll give it a shot

[limpid pecan]

u can keep safety with defuse recovery

[subtle bramble]

hydroflare is good with wuchen right?

[limpid pecan]

its kinda iffy with wuchen

his defuse throws him too far back

so its hard to apply soak

but feria for instance should be great

[subtle bramble]

nicee imma try it with her

tyy

[limpid pecan]

her defuse is really nice if u are struggling in general

its easy to trigger and offers option to chain defuses

[woeful monolith]

This is the biggest cope I have ever seen.

You end the boss fight in 1 minute there fore you dont have to actually go thru the stages like anyone else.

[limpid pecan]

bruh the boss healthbar has hardcap

once he reaches 50% hp he goes next stage

u cant do anything about it

same first dr octopus phase

[woeful monolith]

oh no you cant defeat it as fast as the other stages wahhhhh

[limpid pecan]

if it was possible to kill first stage and skip everything

u;d see times like 15 sec or something

[woeful monolith]

I meant go thru the stages as in a ctually have to fight the boss

not do one fukin counter n go to the next stage

[limpid pecan]

i mean it sounds like u never even tried this build

i played both hydro and thunder on paragon 2

literally first try did it with quite good time on hydro

with thunder it was problematic

it has better potential for fastest clear time, yes

[woeful monolith]

Oh ok

[limpid pecan]

but u have to play perfectly

[woeful monolith]

Perfectly is a joke

Im not g oing to argue about this dumb build.

[limpid pecan]

not sure if u noticed but standing like 5 sec parrying thunders twice is quite a luxury against eerie bosses

also u miss important point

the build damage output is almost 0 outside of counters

so if boss interrupts ur thunder parries

or doesnt release many blues

u do nothing

[woeful monolith]

Oh no

God forbid you might actually have to fight the boss as intended

instead of clearing it in a minute

wahhh

[limpid pecan]

i mean normal hydroflare also clears it in 1minute with some seconds

so like

idk whats ur point xd

[woeful monolith]

Your making my point by trying to justify it

Copium .....Goodnight

[limpid pecan]

ur point is thunder scorch requires no skill, which is just straight up dumb

its hardest build rn im pretty sure. yes sure its most op also

[woeful monolith]

LOL keep huffin that copium

[limpid pecan]

i mean i played hydroflare and skyfire entire last season

they are really not very complicated

[woeful monolith]

please tell me more

[limpid pecan]

once u learn boss patterns to defuse u are gucci

i mean its clear u never played the build, u just hate it coz its OP

which is fair, u can hate its op

but its not easy to play

also was funny how u complain about triple rares on jades xd

its worse than double rares

[fierce light]

Thunder Scorch is the hardest build to use right now I agree. Especially if you don't have any healing attributes. You're slowly going to chip your Health down between the Incineration procs and the Divine Thunders you don't counter. Pretty much one mistake or greediness will get you killed.

[limpid pecan]

technically best output is to have 3x scorching on one jade with 15% hp, 4x with 2 windfall, hp 15% and atk 4%, and last jade with 1 windfall 1 scorching 15% hp

though i saw one guy in EU use arcane thunder with 3 x moderation on top of other rares

im not sure how good is this but maybe its secret metabreaker?

[fierce light]

Yeah Thunder Scorch Mod is probably the top build

But only if you're aggro enough for it

[limpid pecan]

arcane thunder builds meter quite decently

but he uses this build

on all characters

thats interesting

he is top1 on all chars rn

except viper last i checked

someone beat him

guess when i get moderation on my next shard

[fierce light]

You don't want more than 3 rares on a single jade generally. Want Attack & Health on all of them cause they end up being roughly the same damage increase when you account for Diminishing Returns and non-Burn damage.

[limpid pecan]

im not gonna complain

[limpid pecan]

i did some calculation

its worth on 1 jade

3x scorching

u get 157.5% total hp and 38% attack

as opposed to 150% hp and 40% attack normally

7.5% hp should outperform 2% attack

[hidden creek]

nothing secret about it, it's just bcoz he gonna use it on mod poison build also

so just 3 mod on arcane thunder for both thunderscorching build and poison mod build, the rest he gonna dump into windfall

[limpid pecan]

i mean its not really secret but its interesting he uses it on every char

and has best times with it

[hidden creek]

well i mean it's not necessary to be bcoz of that 3 mod jade

maybe in actual calculation it won't bring better dps compare to standard thunder scorch setup, it's just that he's good

and his other jades are good

or even top notch

[limpid pecan]

i kinda wonder what i am missing in current stage with matron

i think something like 1:15 or so seems realistic

but less than that dunno

i can kill first stage in about 15 sec or so with right setup

but the ultimate of 2nd stage wastes so much time

[hidden creek]

someone posted a vid less than 1:15 above

[limpid pecan]

oo

i need to see

[hidden creek]

here

oh it's 1:10

[hidden creek]

0:59 with yueshan damn

[limpid pecan]

oh, looks like i have too low stats

i need 4 scorchings to kill first phase

he can do in 3

he has every jade 15% hp 4% attack

2 mods

well one jade is

200 counter recovery

with 15% hp

ok i got it now i think

though on feria i still dont know

he used overcomer to trigger full meter quickly

[hidden creek]

looks like everyone is taking 200 parry recovery and that's it

[limpid pecan]

on feria the boss starts fight before u can build up full meter

shooting during ultimate seems key also

this is some good ideas ngl

the top 1 feria guy has 1.09

with these jades

not even copper ward

kinda crazy

[hidden creek]

i'm guessing 75% mod too?

[limpid pecan]

yes

[hidden creek]

theoretically speaking feria F with mods could be good

strong aegis break

[limpid pecan]

ye but i dont think in course of minute u can even break aegis

[hidden creek]

yeah idk

[fierce light]

It nets you around a 1% increase in Burn DMG, however, when you account for non-Burn DMG it ends up being a net loss.

[limpid pecan]

i dont quite get it

if 7.5% hp < 2% attack

then why we dont prioritize attack in general?

also isnt non-burn dmg like idk

5% of total output in thunderscorch?

[fierce light]

For example, based off this video and the stats on the 3 Scorching 1 Souljade build, Burn DMG makes up ~90% of your damage output on Thunder Scorch build:
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1266668634609025076/1289746921594032161/Untitled_video_-_Made_with_Clipchamp_10.mp4?ex=670526ac&is=6703d52c&hm=716880384869b22ce0f0e80077a6d13a441f378453da33f5555f613bed12899e&

Main issue is that HP has a lot of Diminishing Returns cause you can get so much of it compared to Attack.

[limpid pecan]

yeah so 1% extra burn dmg

would be better

u would need at least 10% non-burn dmg to offset it

[fierce light]

?

That is 10%

[limpid pecan]

i mean net bonus from stats

like i would need to buff non burn dmg by 10% at least

to match 1% burn dmg increase

[untold marsh]

I have 3 windfalls on thundercounter /3 windfalls on thunderproof and did some comparison
With 8 windfalls in total and 360 atk tou deal 6k dmg by clearing hydro flare alone vs 6.7k with 400atk

[limpid pecan]

the way i see

the 3x scorching option

we gain 4.5% burn dmg extra

which is 1.8% overall burn dmg increase

meanwhile 2% attack extra is 1% overall damage more or less

so essentially we get extra 0.8% burn dmg

at expense of 1% non burn dmg

so essentially 0.7% overall dmg vs about 0.1% overall damage

if we use the 90/10 ratio

[untold marsh]

Why do you want this 3 scorching option so badly ?

The way you’re going with this you’d need 9 or 10 windfalls to contend with someone who’s on 8

[limpid pecan]

its just theoretical for max dmg

rn im not even close anyway

i have 7 rares rn on thunder scorch

4 scorch 3 windfall

so its quite a long time until i get there

[untold marsh]

Well from what i see you could still go for 1 single 3 rare attribute jade

But you’d have to compensate with 1 more windfall

[limpid pecan]

yeah i have quite good potential on draco stride actually

it has 2 scorching rn

[untold marsh]

More than 1 and you’ll lose too much attack

[limpid pecan]

if i added 1 more

could be pretty nice

but still it will be only worth once I max out rares everywhere

[untold marsh]

Yeah that too

[limpid pecan]

rn its much more worth to remove defuse recovery for more windfalls

[untold marsh]

I ended up switching to 1 windfall to max attack

If you’re only using the build for Yama yes you could since you can heal in between phases

[limpid pecan]

i mean the build is not really all that useful if you think about it

u can farm enigma

and speedrun

and yama

thats all

enigma is too easy anyway

and for speedrun, well if u want best time, u need perfect run too

[untold marsh]

Yeah but if you remove recovery and play anything other than yama you’ll finding really hard

Even impossible actually

[limpid pecan]

think we need one counter recovery

[untold marsh]

Thunder will kill you

[limpid pecan]

yeah

[untold marsh]

Incineration will kill you

[limpid pecan]

i agree

i didnt really calculate much

the counter recovery

how would it shape the damage

[untold marsh]

That’s what CN does they remove all recovery for yama

Depends on which jade you put it

If it’s a double scorching you wouldn’t lose much atk

[limpid pecan]

yeah probably double scorching jade is ideal

[untold marsh]

A double windfall on the other hand

[limpid pecan]

maybe single scorching

is not too bad either

little extra heal

for 6% attack i guess

well

2%

diff

to be precise

[untold marsh]

Once again it’ll be ll depend on the top builds in your server

[limpid pecan]

rn i kinda realized i have too low stats

[untold marsh]

The reason why that guy with 3 mods on his thunder scorch is first is because no body is contesting it

[limpid pecan]

people can 3-shot matron first stage

i need 4 scorchings

[untold marsh]

This stage is low stat friendly

[subtle bramble]

I have double windfall on a jade do I just deconstruct it

[untold marsh]

Matron can throw a lot of blues

[limpid pecan]

i have overall quite good stats

[untold marsh]

4 to 5 if you’re lucky

[limpid pecan]

all jades 15% hp

and 3+% attack

but i miss double windfalls

[untold marsh]

Depends on what jade

[subtle bramble]

I need to check I think one of the gold poison jades

[untold marsh]

I doubt you’d have invested that much on a useless jade

It’s good the priority is attack now

You need at least 390 attack on thunder scorch

[fierce light]

Okay I redid the math from scratch with no bonuses at all to see the base %'s. Burn/Hydroflare Damage makes up 77.5% of your total damage before multipliers. That's assuming you have a perfect rotation where you execute Thunder Counter as soon as it's ready without interruption.

The 3x Scorching on one Jade build does pull ahead, but the difference is so negligible, it's not really worth the extra 2 Flux Jade Shards to go for. Talking a 0.5% increase in overall damage. Now of course this may vary more if you get more parries and the like, but is still very negligible.

[limpid pecan]

ye i mean its just purely theoretical anyway

and i didnt consider option when one stat is 200 counter recovery

in that case i dont know which is best

its probably best to have 200 counter recovery on jade with 2x scorching 15% hp

[limpid pecan]

i have 380 attack rn on thunder scorch

[untold marsh]

That’s high

I got 383 because of the three windfalls I have on thundercounter

At 7 windfalls our attacks are almost the same lol

[limpid pecan]

i rly need more windfalls

i have 5x defuse recovery

rn

[fierce light]

Nice, averaging slightly above 4% Attack per Jade.

[limpid pecan]

and ye i need to switch one of them to counter recovery

i died a lot of times from incineration due to not having it

[fierce light]

Yeah it's a good thing they got rid of burn immunity from Hydroflare build at least.

Pretty troll making it burn your Armor first with Armor Guard though

[untold marsh]

As if they saw this build coming you mean ?

[hidden creek]

same

i got just 3 windfalls though

[fierce light]

I doubt it, but they did buff the regular Hydroflare build as well. So it's kinda compensation for it.

[limpid pecan]

same

i did little test

raised attack on draco from 3.4 to 3.6

and it still displays 380

[hidden creek]

has to remove scorching 2 times bcoz they exceeded 12

[untold marsh]

0.2% increase

It’s in the decimals

[fierce light]

Believe it rounds down

[hidden creek]

it's not even 0.2%

bcoz of diminishing return

[limpid pecan]

btw i dont think its even diminshing returns

its actually constant returns no?

diminishing returns would be something like softcap or something

[fierce light]

Less than 0.2% increase in total attack

[limpid pecan]

like imagine after reaching 100% attack, each 1% after that would count for just 0.5%

[fierce light]

Yeah

That's diminishing returns

+0.2% Attack
1.002 * f(I) > f(1.002 * I)

[limpid pecan]

i dont think it works like this

the function output would represent total damage increase

and input would be % attack

f(40% attack) = 40% damage increase

f(80% attack)=80 % damage increase

[fierce light]

If it's you're only source, it's constant

But multiple sources add together

[limpid pecan]

but the sources are independent from each other

[fierce light]

Base Attack at Sense Level 1030 & Hero Level 20 is 272. 140 + 103 = 243 * 1.12 = 272.
Equip Untouchable Talent and it increases to ~292. 243 * (1.12 + 0.08) = 291.6.

If it was constant returns, equipping Untouchable Talent would net you ~294 Attack. 243 * 1.12 * 1.08 = 293.9.

That's due to a change they made a couple years back.

[limpid pecan]

yeah but untouchable talent is just generic attack buff, same as stat on jade no?

[fierce light]

Yeah

[limpid pecan]

so its constant returns no?

it just adds more to the bag of generic attack bonuses

its like u sell 10 apples a day for 10$ profit

and next day u sell 12 apples for 12$ profit

now if u have too many apples and sell 20 a day at full price, but another 10 are getting old and you need to sell them for 0.5$ otherwise nobody wants them

that would be diminishing returns

or alternatively if there was massive demand on apples and u could jack up prices to 2$ for last 5 apples in stock, u would have increasing returns

but as long as each apple sells for 1$, its constant returns, even if they come from different supplier or something

[hidden creek]

wdym

diminishing returns will always be there

you can't get rid of it

[fierce light]

Diminishing Returns doesn't mean you're getting less from the same amount. It just increases your total less the more you have.

An example of constant returns in Showdown are the Demon Elixirs. They multiply your attack by that value, so 38% Attack means you have 38% more total Attack. Attributes and Potentials have Diminishing Returns since it adds to your Attack. So say you have +50% Attack already. Getting an extra 4% Attack will only be a 2.67% increase in your total attack. 1.54 / 1.5 = ~1.0267

[limpid pecan]

but in this case we would need to define the function as:
overall_damage_increase (attack %) = x

but this would complicate the function a lot, since you would need to include previous state at this moment

because it will be different function every time basically

[fierce light]

Yeah

The damage formula is pretty complicated

Zhuqi had the entire formula up before the server got hacked

[limpid pecan]

but we can only talk about diminishing/constant/increasing returns within realm of one function

every time u change the initial state (% accumulated attack) its new function basically

[fierce light]

It's something like this:

Google Sheets let me create a custom formula so all I need are those values and it calculates it for me

[fierce light]

I'm not really sure what you mean exactly. But you can even test it in Free Training. Go in with Untouchable Talent for +20% total Attack and then try equipping Backfire. You'll see around a 16.67% increase in your damage rather than 20%.

[limpid pecan]

i mean this i all agree with this

im kinda just discussing semantics really

[fierce light]

I think the rule of diminishing returns is just different in gaming anyway

[flint geyser]

Hey guys, how would I go about getting a rare attribute? I have a souljade with max value so do I just keep rerolling it until it hits a rare attribute? And is there an estimation for how much material needed

[drifting lance]

🎉 | Infinity leveled up!
ℹ | Level up messages can be disabled for the guild with owo level disabletext

[hidden creek]

if u're aiming for rare, roll the lowest % attribute

[flint geyser]

@hidden creek How come? 😮

[hidden creek]

cuz the chance for a rare to appear is random

[thorn narwhal]

how do u change attributes in training

[flint geyser]

sure, but then I would have my rare attribute in my lowest %. Wouldn't I want it on my highest?

[fierce light]

Yeah you don't want to get rid of your max attribute for a rare. It's harder to get a max than a rare

[flint geyser]

Oh, so getting a rare recasts the % value?

[fierce light]

It'll be a random value when it turns into a rare

[hidden creek]

this isn't true

[flint geyser]

ahh

Makes sense, thanks

[hidden creek]

a min stat attribute could still be a maxed rare

[flint geyser]

Got it, thanks 🙂

[hidden creek]

and even if you got a min rare it's still easier to get it to max since it's just 3 lv

compare to getting other attributes to max

value recast is pain

[flint geyser]

I am getting the impression. Reminds me of playing Monster Hunter lol

With this in mind, how do I most efficiently spend my Flux Jades?

[hidden creek]

only use flux jade on a jade that already has a rare attribute

cuz it's the only way to get the second rare on a jade

[fierce light]

And use it on your lowest proportion attribute

[flint geyser]

Okay. Thank you very much guys 🙏

[flat pier]

oh new update coming again?

[fierce light]

Should be, it's been 2 weeks

[copper summit]

I got my first flux jade and this is the only like good jade I've gotten so far, should I roll the last one and prayge for mod for viper, worth it since I don't have any other jades really built up yet to care about double rares on them (since they don't have single rares either lel)? and if it's scorch would it still be usable with the poison builds or wind/mod just best option?

[hearty rivet]

You could try to reroll windfall for mod and then use the flux jade. Might take some time but will result in less disappointment imho.

or try to get mod on the rest of your poison souljades and only return to this once all of them have one and you still need mod.

[copper summit]

hmmm that's true, might be better to see what other rares drop from the rest before really committing to using flux since it's a lot more limited atm, don't really have anything I need to push immediately to worry about immediate powerups compared to just getting the build up and running

[fierce light]

Scorching is pretty much just a placeholder for the other rares on this build. Pretty much only want to keep it if it's a HydroFlare focused build.

[timid stirrup]

anybody else having connection issues

i was queueing for a game> got a game> disconnected> wont let me rejoin said game but says game is currently in progress would you like to join> hit yes but nothing

close the game and try to restart> still says game in progress and wont let me rejoin

finally after 10min it lets me back in the game

[timid stirrup]

why does renewed vigor drop in the poison suffer no demon

[fierce light]

It works if you're using Cyan Fang in particular

[fierce light]

Occasionally, yeah it happens.

[thorn narwhal]

what were they thinking changing drop rate to this, its just the worst

30+ runs and not a single legendary

[quaint girder]

How many Windfalls on one Jade? It seems like it kind of is bad if you get more than one since it scales off of how many other stats you have

Unless you want Element Burst to hurt a lot lmao

[fierce light]

2 rares is ideal per jade at the most.

[quaint girder]

Thanks Zero 🙏

Follow-up. I'm kind of cooking my own custom build to make Abyssal work (fools errand I know), but can you give me a general rundown of why someone would take Scorching or Moderation?

I know Windfall is a generally good all rounder since it just increases all your stats by 50% but Moderation and Scorch seem a bit more specific

[fierce light]

If you're not running a Hydroflare build, then ignore Scorching.

Moderation tends to go hand-in-hand with Arcane Thunder. Both are less effective without the other. Viper Ning and Tarka are the main ones that should consider it. Matari can consider it somewhat because of her Ultimate, but it's a bit awkward without it.

[limpid pecan]

i think scorching would be good in skyfire build too no?

i even saw interesting build

where they replace defuse attack buff jades with thunder counter + pull

to proc scorching more

[fierce light]

It could work if you're mobbing maybe. It has a really long duration though, so chances are you're just going to be overwriting it.

[quaint girder]

Interesting. I was thinking about it too since I just rerolled one of my moderations into Windfall and it's a bit more clunky. I have to be more deliberate with my Blinks so I keep the Arcane Thunder and attack up. Ulti is generally used either as emergency healing comeback which is unoptimal or as continuation of the Arcane Thunder/Attack Buff

But the benefit is that I'm never overcapped for blinks which is actually better since I don't have to keep blinking and losing DPS

Hmm, then I think probably 2-3 jades with Windfall should have Moderation as well

[fierce light]

Well her Backstab does pretty good DPS now, especially in combination with Arcane Thunder. If you're using Abyssal though I'd assume you're running Thunder? The damage on it isn't terrible, but the hitbox is.

[quaint girder]

Yes I'm doing a Thunderbolt/Divine Thunder build. Hitbox is awful because it considers boss leg gap as empty space

It's half a skill issue, need to aim directly at the leg when you're done with a throw.

Half is like...why is it coded like this

[quaint girder]

Yeah I'm thinking I fudged the ratio. I think it's 6 Windfalls, and 3 moderations

3 Moderations are doubled up on Windfalls.

[fierce light]

Yeah Moderation generally works better on Ice and Poison cause of their boosted accumulation.

[quaint girder]

From my experience I overcapped on some Dashes, but the CD to reduce the dash by 60% is important to keep attack/Thunderous Power Uptime close to 100%

Hmm

Yeah, then my goal next is to do Moderation on one more Jade with Windfall, then add Windfall to the rest of my Moderation Souljades

[quaint girder]

That's what I was thinking too, but Matari is a bit special due to her two dash charges and her ulti giving her 3-5 additional Dashes depending on Skill CD Passive and Moderation and player skill

[fierce light]

But also she has Cyan Fang now which is just her best option out of the Wielding Jades for her. DPS is slightly lower than Abyssal, but it allows you to work for Poison.

[quaint girder]

So I'm trying to make her work with Abyssal, so far I'm having pretty good success, but after consulting with you the 3 Moderations plus 6 Windfalls will probably push her DPS enough to be viable in Speedrun and Peak. Definitely not competitive though even with skill she can't compare with Pyroblast Wuchen or more consistent poison builds.

[quaint girder]

For sure. I really like Abyssal's animation though. Which is why I'm cooking so hard.

I know it's not ideal, but I want to play with what I enjoy and make it at the very least viable

[fierce light]

I gave it a try when it first came out and dropped it since lol. Hitbox just sucked too bad, especially against Omnious Aureate which was like the main boss at the time.

Was sad though, cause I thought it was going to be her Blue Moon equivalent, but it's no where near.

[quaint girder]

I'm trying to get skilled enough to get around the hitbox issue

I might submit it to feedback and pray it gets noticed

Anyway thanks Zero I think I cooked a build. It's double Windfall on 3 Jade's with Divine Thunder and Attack and then a Moderation/Windfall with again Divine Thunder and Attack on the last 3

This going to take a while to build, but I'm excited to see how it turns out. I'll probably play around with Moderation though since Arcane Thunder and Attack Buff uptime is key

Need a lot of Flux Crystals though to get this up to snuff

[fierce light]

Yeah I getcha. It's a struggle for sure.

[fierce light]

Not sure on the activation rate for Divine Thunder for it, but yeah she does have a lengthy cooldown on her skill.

[quaint girder]

DT's activation rate is ass, maybe a bigger Moderation modifer is better to make that one Divine Thunder proc in a while value where she'll always have 3 Blinks that she can cast

Or that's my working theory, hardest thing to test is how much is too much Moderation before you start gimping DPS

[fierce light]

Against mobs it should be fine

But on bosses, it'll take a while to proc

[quaint girder]

This is my experience, trying to make the boss part a bit less painful

[fierce light]

Thunder Counter doesn't count for it, so it's really iffy on Thunder builds.

No way to boost accumulation rate other than Defuse · Solidification.

[quaint girder]

It's pretty rough since a Lightning DT build dictates a lot of Lightning

I'll show my build after this ED run

[quaint girder]

Playing around the reroll on Moderation did hurt my boss fights a bit. Makes the timings a lot tighter. 3 Moderations I think is the minimum for this Abyssal build I'm doing

Still working on Fire Forge for Untouchable Talent, but this is the DT/Lighting setup I'm trying to make Abyssal work

This season is just rough for Lightning and DT builds in general

[fierce light]

Wait, so you're not even running Thunderpull + Thunder Counter? Missing out on like all the major damage sources tbh. Thunderbolt isn't strong enough on its own since it lacks an attribute for it.

Stormstride and Stormstride Sword kinda contradict it's playstyle as well since you're not really going to dodge cancel out of Abyssal, more so just dodge if you need to. Also won't be using Uncharged Attacks much so Stormstride Sword has minimal use.

[quaint girder]

But isn't it good for stacking when using Thunderous Power?

I was going for a full Lightning build trying to abuse Thunderous Power

[fierce light]

Yeah, but it's only an additive increase in top of Divine Storm. Ends up being around a 15% increase to Thunderbolt damage which is very negligible on a Weapon that doesn't hit very often.

Not worth sacrificing the +20% Attack and damage from Thunder Counter + Thunderpull

[quaint girder]

Oh wow, that additive increase is pretty bad. I'll swap out and then work on the other SJs then

[quaint girder]

You have to against Omnious Void because he only be hit by the final stab/pull out of Abyssal during his Aegis Down stance and his attacking stances hunched over.

Most of the time against him in particular I'm boomeranging the dagger and cancelling to dodge/defuse attacks

[fierce light]

Well 1 Stormstride is roughly equal to 6 + 2/3 Thunder Swords in damage.

[quaint girder]

wow

Thats acutally alot

[fierce light]

Yeah and one Thunder Counter is roughly equal to 8.2 Stormstrides. With the added fact it scales off of Divine Thunder DMG

[quaint girder]

Then actually its better to use Stormstride over Thundersword just because you have to break animation for Abyssal for a lot of bosses where the hitbox doesn't work

like Void

[fierce light]

Yeah

They made Thunder Sword really weak some reason

Even only Kurumi really can take good advantage of it

[quaint girder]

I think Matari would have found use if it proc'd on Dreadful Wail properly

[fierce light]

That's an Uncharged Attack

[quaint girder]

Game counts DW as a normal attack even though its by all means a charged attack in both PvP and PvE

I mean you can counter it because it goes from blue into gold focus, I think that's just spaghetti

[fierce light]

Yeah Blue Focus doesn't necessarily mean it's charged

[quaint girder]

My personal opinion, it should count toward TS

[fierce light]

Same for the third strike in any uncharged combo

Stormstride Sword is slightly stronger than Thunder Sword, so it's not really a detriment in that regard

It's DPS in Showdown though is pitiful, so generally not worth using Dreadful Wail

[quaint girder]

Dancing Leaves is clunky how they combined it with Wail

really wish it was separated

[fierce light]

That's if you hold it. It's mainly so you can defuse while airborne. It was fun when Matari's Aegis-Break was actually strong.

[sharp ember]

I'm trying to do some math for my thunderscorch build and I got stuck.
What'll deal more damage: +2% attack and +7.5% health, or +6% attack? Anyone know for sure?

[scarlet ginkgo]

Hello! ive been quing for about 15+ minutes in showdown. are qu's always that long or?

[sharp ember]

Most queues in showdown don't have people in them, since there're so many modes to queue. Most people play in premade groups.
The Suffer No Evil mode that's out for a couple more days has queues that pop most of the time, and the doom modes pop pretty easily early in the week as well, but that's about it most of the time.

[scarlet ginkgo]

awww, i see

thank u for the reply

[copper summit]

matchmaking in naraka is hella ded in general when it isn't peak play time 😔 having a team or at least a duo consistently does wonders for your mental health while waiting to queue up

[round glacier]

Solo most lmao

[quaint girder]

Well now deals no damage lol

[drifting lance]

🎉 | JustNaes leveled up!

[quaint girder]

@fierce light Also. Swapping out Thundersword and Stormstride Sword for Thunderpull and Thundercounter actually solved my F rotation problems. Apparently it counts as elemental proc when you counter Divine Thunder.

So I always had F up when I needed it for rotation. I'll have to experiment if 2 is the magic number for Moderations or if I can go less

Or I just didn't notice my F CD since I was too busy countering DT

Either way, I just need to get Windfall on my Thunderpull and Thunder Counter

[limpid pecan]

huuuh?

parrying thunder procs mod?

[limpid pecan]

idk i watched video above

viper was countering thunder and didnt get proc

had moderation for sure tho

[quaint girder]

Hmm, then maybe I just didn't notice because I was less reliant on Blinks for Attack Up buff/Arcane Thunder damage.

Also focused on countering

I thought the Moderation proc'd more often because it felt like Omnius Aureate got summoned every time after a DT proc plus 4 DT Counters

I assumed the Aureate summon counted the countered DT as DT similar to how DT damage on Jades also count the countered thunder for damage calculations

[limpid pecan]

maybe aureate gets summoned

but no mod triggers

[fierce light]

Counterstrike does a lot of accumulation if you're landing that, but it doesn't count as an Elemental Burst for Mod.

[fierce light]

6% Attack.

[fierce light]

Aureate summon could help against multiple enemies, but against a boss it often summons while your DT is on cooldown.

Thunder Counter itself also accumulates element, so that could help.

[quaint girder]

Gotcha, then the Element Burst is just proccing more often due to DT Counter which then fuels the Moderation machine. 2 Moderations seem like enough, but I'll have to build the Thunderpull/Thunder Counter Souljades first since I haven't built them yet.

To do further testing

This helps a lot. I basically solidified a build. Running Arcane Thunder, Thunder Mastery, Stormstride, Thunderpull, Thunder Counter, and Thunder Mastery

Thundersword's damage is pretty bad and since you're cancelling animation a lot against bosses whose hitboxes Abyssal's final stab and pull misses a lot, you use Stormstride to deal that damage. Thunder Mastery for additional Thunderbolt but more importantly 15% Attack and Arcane Thunder is juicy with Matari's F

I still have to get used to Matari's defuse to properly avoid damage, but Abyssal is a super technical build that requires really good mechanical play to just get it to viable numbers not even meta or ideal DPS

But it looks soooo cool throwing boomerang dagger

Hopefully this build is the one that will remain stable when seasons change.

[fierce light]

Thunder build hasn't really changed since release

Sub-Zero Seal and Spring's Call just made it better

[quaint girder]

Hmm. I see your Thunderwielding build just stuff Abyssal in there, but it feels a lil sad. Trying to make different builds that take on different traits

I miss Season 1 where pure Thunderbolt was an actual build because the Potential tree allowed for it

[limpid pecan]

they probably need to expand potential tree

instead of replacing it

they want to fit too many things in very few slots

[fierce light]

Thunderbolt builds were still a tier behind element ones. Simply cause it lacks a main attribute for its damage. Element builds have Element DMG attributes while Burn builds have Health %.

That combined with the generally low base damage on Thunderbolts makes them rather underpowered. Probably why they placed their Potential Glyphs where they did in the potential tree cause they're usually just sub-components of a build.

Like Skyfire Storm or Poison Storm.

[quaint girder]

Gotcha. Makes me a bit sad. Maybe one day the system will be reworked and we can get pure builds

[fierce light]

Even in Nirriti's Ruins it's a bit underpowered unless you absolutely stack on Awakening Rings. Doesn't scale quite like the other options.

[timid stirrup]

@fierce light why does the potential tree for poison mod go to the left side of blue vs the right side like in poison fang?

[limpid pecan]

i think its pretty good lvl 4 blessing

there arent many ways in nirriti to boost ur focus attack damage

part of problem is they are scaling slowly

since they synergize with each other

and u need the ring with up to 120% thunderbolt dmg bonus

[fierce light]

Yeah it scales much slower than the other collections

[limpid pecan]

yin yang also scales very slowly

but is quite strong when u get like 15+ rings

some of the bonuses are in 500+%

[fierce light]

Yin Yang is very easy to build up cause they improved the algorithm for it

[limpid pecan]

its very slow to scale though

u need all the dmg rings that can offer 500+% dmg bonus

[fierce light]

Yeah

They usually show up right after you get it

But Awakening, it's rare that you'll get theirs

[limpid pecan]

awakening is easiest to stack

they have the most rings

they appear 24/7

[fierce light]

Thunder Array is a waste of Anima Ring space

[limpid pecan]

at least something like defuse bolt

im starting to think

hydroflare is actually goated

[fierce light]

HydroFlare got a big buff

[limpid pecan]

with the last change to cloudscorch on lvl 4 blessing

u can oneshot trash mobs with 1 focus attack

and just let them burn

thundercounter is nice for boss but its subpar on mobs

[fierce light]

Thunder Element + Yin Yang
HydroFlare
Are probably the strongest builds

Cause Yin Yang has high damage coefficients, it builds Thunder Counter up quickly.
HydroFlare works well on its own, but they need to remove that Anima Ring that limits HydroFlares to every 4 seconds

[limpid pecan]

ye that ring should just be

hydroflare no longer clears soaked but reduces soak duration by 1 or 2 sec

and thats all

[whole pebble]

anyone can explain how to get this achievement? i dont get it. i believe i was top 10 on seasonal score last season but i did not get it.

[ebon parrot]

Hmm

I’m not too into leaderboards and stuff but

Were u top 10 in ur chamber or were u top 10 in like the leaderboard area for individual chamber score

If there even is one

[finite lily]

I think the wording is off and this might be the chamber leaderboard itself not your seasonal score

but I am not 100% sure

[fierce light]

Yeah that sounds like your ranking among your chamber

[valid void]

Im curious lol is it normal to think I'm doing okay at this game only to have my dreams and future uninstalled by players who don't use the normal alphabet in their name and is there any way to not que with players on the other side of the planet?

[fierce light]

I don't see why that would be an issue in Showdown tbh.

[valid void]

It isn't as much of an issue as it is disheartening. I almost never see players who can understand me so it's hard to communicate

[short meadow]

if you reached top 10 with chember score then you will get this badge ( must need to be a money whale )

around 1500 $ worth spending is enough for top 10

[whole pebble]

really weird... pretty sure i was 3rd place last season on chamber because i had this before it ends.

so was thinking you need to be on top 10 for each character here in yama abyss leaderboard. lol\

[short meadow]

you are not even in top 500 with this chamber score

[whole pebble]

it's new season and that's not mine. i only use it as reference for 3rd place. sorry.

[whole pebble]

where to check this?

[short meadow]

No no you have to make sure than you got 10th place on Chamber score

[whole pebble]

ohhhh.

[short meadow]

Rank- chember score - personal

[whole pebble]

jesus christ, yeah this is impossible. lol

[short meadow]

Yeah

like i said

spend 1500$

[whole pebble]

Thank you for the answer/inputs everyone. 🙂 ❤️

[short meadow]

Bro how much money did you spended for Chember score? @lone umbra

He is on top 6 mybe

[bronze wharf]

[magic prairie]

Didnt know theres badge and now my heart aches that I finished at 11th place instead of going for top 10 💀 🤡

[short meadow]

None even know about that before

Hopefully Oneday they will make a popularity rank to

[magic prairie]

Fml lmao. Now im too inactive to any badge

[short meadow]

i think a normal player can get 16k chamber score if they complete 2000 chember score each week

still its not enough to make top 100

[lone umbra]

That question is not a valid question

[short meadow]

it is

In another way it is'nt

[timid stirrup]

@fierce light will u b adding poison cannon to the site along with potential tree?

or is ice cannon better?

[fierce light]

Ice Cannon is simpler to use, but yeah less potential damage output than Poison. Figured if you're going Poison anyway, you'll have enough AoE.

[finite lily]

I reroll my lowest attribute out of the 4 to be my rare, right? :D

[timid stirrup]

yes

[timid stirrup]

damn i switched from ice cannon to poison already. welp i still have some of those jades so i'll make another ice cannon set. thanx

I was also wondering why does the potential tree for poison mod go to the left side of blue vs the right side like in poison fang?

[fierce light]

Potential is the top-right one among the 4 in the pins.

[fierce light]

Cause of Arcane Thunder. No Thunderbolts in Poison Fang build.

[timid stirrup]

ah

[hearty rivet]

what are those slaps o_O

[timid stirrup]

it sucks that the drop rate was changed for the poison Suffer No Demon chapter

[fierce light]

Yeah, guess they didn't want people getting good poison sets too quick

[hearty rivet]

But really how does one do unarmed attack with weapons equipped (Why neither dagger nor pistol are highlighted) and how does it build so much lightning meter? O.o

[polar light]

cuz unarmed attack(fist) have faster and higher dmg than dagger which will result in faster thunder accumulation since they made dagger have weak dmg long time ago

[hearty rivet]

Yeah it clearly shows in your video but how do you do you turn off your weapons and do unarmed attacks?

[polar light]

by pressing 0

[fierce light]

Yeah Slap has a Base DPS of 993 which is way above anything Dagger has. Thunderpull generates faster based on the Base DPS of an Attack. Only issue is it doesn't benefit from the +140 Base Attack from having a Purple Weapon so it ends up dealing less than half it's actual damage.

[hearty rivet]

Hah! Found it, sheath weapon and it was mapped to something else for me

Thanks!

[timid stirrup]

how many stages of matron is in paragon 3? just the 2?

[fierce light]

Yeah

Rock just had 4 cause they're mimicking the fights on their stage.