Persona 3 Reload | Master Quest

[iron pilot]

Oh wait

Take off phys junpei, put yukari

There

[dreamy orchid]

koro seems pretty horrible when hes not just revolution botting

bro is like his fes version where he does literally no damage

[iron pilot]

Well no weaknesses aside he isn't contributing much without a phys mf

They can one shot weakness phases but needs debilitate for that

[hollow trail]

ken junpei koro is worst comp?

it's best comp in vanilla p3n

[iron pilot]

Oh nah you replace ken with aigis (you don't need repels in vanilla)

shittiest party comp ever

it's really bad, I burned through many more items than usual

Yukari is technically the strongest of the three

just that

she's level 81

Koro's 87

Ken's 90

[iron pilot]

How tf can you send 300 mb shit

[dreamy orchid]

idk

also was hoping that'd embed lmao

[iron pilot]

Post on youtube

I'm not downloading that

[dreamy orchid]

i will do it later

lmao

okay now it will make them mp4s

lmaoo

[iron pilot]

Free online converters my beloved

[dreamy orchid]

@hollow trail unsure if this is intentional or not, but Junpei will never shift to Yukari even when she can hit a weakness

I thought this might be a full assault quirk, but Yukari passes to Junpei when on full assault so who knows

[hollow trail]

semi intentional

FA junpei will never

FA Yukari passes to high Str

not really perfect

but yea

[iron pilot]

Akihiko with charge for faster theurgia gains

[dreamy orchid]

ah

also lmao poison was absolutely gutted

was hoping i could stall with poison on rampage drive due to junpei not being able to guard

but nah it does like 20 damage lmao

[hollow trail]

poison is really just a chip damage strat now yeah

[dreamy orchid]

what percent of max hp is it

is it 5%?

[hollow trail]

5% with hard cap of 250 dmg

[errant pumice]

AI: “Man, everyone is affected but me. I better cleanse their ailments”

Then they see an ally lower than 50% HP: “Hold up, I gotta heal them instead”

That’s probably an issue on my part since I should really have resist ailments on my main character, lol.

By the way, I’m liking the mod a lot! Keep up the great work.

Really puts strategies into a completely different perspective with it.

[hollow trail]

My main thing was being smart with items and really thinking about your personas, team, and equipment

more about that kind of preparation than just buffs and stuff

hope that was successful

[iron pilot]

Probably only most felt if it's a full playthrough

When testing, we really just uh

Just try to look back on what's doable or not compared to vanilla

[celest kindle]

One cool thing abt MQ so far i think is that it also kind of encourages you to use AOA as finishers in a way, even if you are able to get one they don't always kill all enemies and you are vulnerable after them

overall you just have to think a lot more

Enemies can kill you much more easily now

[errant pumice]

Mhm, the item changes do play a huge part in this mod. It makes it extremely obvious of “Hey, your team is underleveled and can’t handle this strong enemy” compared to “I have money so enemies being strong isn’t a issue since I can spam items”

[celest kindle]

Talking bout you Phantom Mage... I hate you

[iron pilot]

Skill issue

[celest kindle]

It's ok i learned to think now

They can't kill me as easily

[errant pumice]

Isn’t Phantom Mages the second Block white hooded shadow creatures that use dark attacks?

[celest kindle]

Yea

[hollow trail]

it's not really supposed to be about "I'm underleveled" because there's an xp cap

it's more like

"can i craft better armor and weapons"

but yeah xp plays a role

[errant pumice]

To be honest, I never crafted in the Vanilla version in the game and just always bought items from the police station since there wasn’t any real reason to craft to put me at any real advantage

[hollow trail]

Yeah, I'm hoping the passives from this gear will become appealing

Kurosawa kinda falls off after the early game but he was extremely useful for Priestess

[iron pilot]

Lmao

Fallen Noble's armor hard meta

[hollow trail]

what was that one again

[celest kindle]

I think the game heard of me saying the enemies barely hit Mudos because now it just hit 2 in a row on Junpei and Akihiko and almost clocked me with Eihas

The RNGods were merciful

[iron pilot]

Unshaken will

The girls technically get insta heal ones, those are better

[dreamy orchid]

i beat rampage drive but junpei did lmao

gonna try refight it so he can learn rakukaja for priestess

[celest kindle]

The Arqa statue boss is tough

I think i figured out the strat for it though

Akihiko and MC are the main ones who are gonna act i think

And kind of Junpei when the boss uses Marakunda

[dreamy orchid]

tarunda is so comically overpowered in this game lol

taking less than half damage makes most fights really easy

[dreamy orchid]

yall think im ready for priestess with the GOAT

LMFAO

[hollow trail]

good luck

[celest kindle]

It worked!!

Sure took a tad though...

10 minutes

[celest kindle]

https://youtu.be/2LgHdeBuMVw

In hindsight it was 11 apparently

The going was pretty robotic but if I didn't do that guarding thing every party member would get instakilled

[left spear]

not being able to use revival items is kinda fun

haven't had a lot of time to play but i just cleared thebel and did it in 3 nights instead of slugging through w low sp like i did in base p3r

[celest kindle]

Def a lil limiting though...

Had to be extremely cautious against that boss i was fighting because i had no form of revival

Had to constantly keep an eye out for everybody's health

The Junpei Rakukajas technically weren't really necessary but they allowed me to have to resort to media a little less

[hollow trail]

https://tenor.com/view/リンゴ-ソウルハッカーズ2-ringo-soul-hackers2-gif-25242952

[celest kindle]

Reference

[dreamy orchid]

priestess is annoying on tactics oml

especially since im trying to do no items

[hollow trail]

i know right???? jesus fucking christ lol

[dreamy orchid]

i don't really get why all the adds need to resist phys lol

[hollow trail]

took me about 2/3 hours of attempt

[dreamy orchid]

junpei keeps griefing

[hollow trail]

git gud

[dreamy orchid]

i set myself a challenge to not use jack frost and not use any items

and i accidentally forgot to register my onion

so it no longer has zio lmao

[hollow trail]

the onion resists ice?

[dreamy orchid]

no

i just don't care to resist it lol

[hollow trail]

uhh

[dreamy orchid]

the adds are a much bigger problem than the actual boss

you basically just tarunda the boss and it can't do anything

[hollow trail]

at your level sure

I did it at a level where tarunda would still leave everyone at critical hp

[dreamy orchid]

the main issue is just getting hit in weakness

what level?

[hollow trail]

mc 11 junpei 7 yukari 7

[dreamy orchid]

protag and junpei are 10 rn while yukari is 9

oh lmao

i reloaded my save to make sure junpei leveled up on rampage drive fight

cus i wanted rakukaja

[hollow trail]

actually junpei yukari 8

they leveled up with the adds

[dreamy orchid]

doing that deathless on tactics was funny

[hollow trail]

still no raku

only on mc

[dreamy orchid]

the like

[hollow trail]

which was lifesaver to protect from adds

[dreamy orchid]

maha-jio gems can one turn kill the adds

but i don't wanna use items

so

[hollow trail]

it's rng if you only have 2 gems/1 element

but yes they're very good

[dreamy orchid]

yea i only have 2 maha-jio gems and that's it

i have like odd morsel or whatever which is like 150 hp heals but thats pussy shit

i ain't using that

[hollow trail]

i had to use 2 rancids

at the very end

[dreamy orchid]

rn my main issue is just like

its hard to keep up dps because you gotta focus the adds

but tactics junpei doesn't realise this

and just attacks the boss anyways like a mad man

if this game had assign target this would be a million times easier

[hollow trail]

he can't handle adds either

[dreamy orchid]

well yea especially cus he defaults to phys

[hollow trail]

no his agi does like 20 dmg

[dreamy orchid]

and they resist that so he just wastes turns when he does attack them

[hollow trail]

it's shit

[dreamy orchid]

yeah but he gets baton pass from it

so its kosher

[hollow trail]

I prefer handling Despairing with MC agi and keeping junpei on boss crit duty

works good

[dreamy orchid]

the main problem is just like

if someone doesn't have rakukaja, then getting hit in weakness is just instant death guaranteed

[hollow trail]

yes

[dreamy orchid]

so i need to either do rakukaja or focus killing them

[hollow trail]

it's a skill check

[dreamy orchid]

yeah but junpeak rakukaja is random cus no support target tactic

just gamble and hope he supports the right person

i should just do mc raku tho

[hollow trail]

yeah get raku mc then

[dreamy orchid]

would be better

[hollow trail]

i had tarunda, great yakiniku and rakukaja

[dreamy orchid]

yeah but that shit costs sp bruh all this mf does is buff

[hollow trail]

sonikku panchi

[dreamy orchid]

i be like tarunda -> rakunda -> rakukaja

nah im using holy arrow lol

[hollow trail]

that's also ok

[dreamy orchid]

its basically the same skill

[hollow trail]

but yeah it's possible just really fucking annoying

I'm afraid I can't work miracles on the AI

Could write per-boss exceptions but that's making the game play itself

so idk

[dreamy orchid]

well thats a predicament

i skill issue'd here lol i should've just killed with junpei instead of doing raku

[left spear]

i got killed by a summoned shadow in the priestess fight 😭

[celest kindle]

The summons are random so it becomes a tad harder

Esp with the buffed damage

[hollow trail]

yeah they're way more dangerous than priestess herself

[left spear]

yeah this is kinda crazy, might literally have to rewind and fuse a fire res persona with zio

if i roll double skeptical tiara that's an instant game over

can only kill one and no way to dizzy the other

[hollow trail]

Can use 2 mazio gems if you have em

can also rakukaja yourself

mc can tank a minion

junpei and yukari need buff

[left spear]

oh shit right i forgot about those items

[hollow trail]

Yeah and you did 3-day

you have a fuckton probably

more than enough to blaze through

[left spear]

yeahh not zio items but magaru items should still save me from the agi using ones

[hollow trail]

yea

bufu ones are the only really shit ones here

[dreamy orchid]

i think this boss is actually impossible with the ruleset im doing rn 😭

people die too quick and i don't really do enough damage

ig i could try again with the garula skill card but it feels like cheating almost

[hollow trail]

Doing a MQ challenge run before beating MQ itself is insane

i respect it but like wow

[dreamy orchid]

i just feel like no items at all is in the spirit of the mod

sh2 reference and so on

lmao i lost to the time limit

it still had nearly half its health left

tho i found out near the end of the fight, it just stops summoning adds and attacking party members

jack frost would be really good for that lmao

but alas im lazy

[celest kindle]

Doesn't Priestess Null Freeze/Ice?

[dreamy orchid]

you use jack frost just for the resistance

there is zero reason to attack her with any magic

jack frost has sonic punch anyways

but anyways lmao thats enough testing for tonight

there are just some scenarios that are inherently unwinnable in the tactics version of this fight, especially if items are banned

like the boss summons two despairing tiaras lmao hope you tarukaja'd mc beforehand otherwise you just can't kill them

i imagine its a lot more managable with direct commands though

i will try again tomorrow maybe but with a less scuffed setup

[hollow trail]

yes but in practice the early game is really not friendly to this concept

[hollow trail]

it summons 2 adds, then on death immediately one more, then 2 more after the final timer speedup, and i think then she just spams ice storm + bufula

[native garden]

FF7R wants it’s hard mode back

[celest kindle]

lol

[native garden]

Can I beat Master Quest with Orpheus and Protag only?

[hollow trail]

doubt

GL

well

maybe if you arcade spam actually

but there's no endurance arcade

so you're kinda shafted

personas don't scale xp though so you can painfully grind him

for endurance

[native garden]

Did that get yeeted like skill card duplication or???

[hollow trail]

no

arcade was always strength/magic/agility

[celest kindle]

That's like that since vanilla

And also since other re-releases

[native garden]

Ohhh

[celest kindle]

Today was a productive session of Reload

I didn't forget to save this time and have to everything all over again due to a death by the phantom mages

Life is good

Hoping to continue forward in this way

One thing I'm kinda 50/50 on rn with MQ is that fights are a lot slower when I don't get destroyed by the enemy

Though in a way i guess that should happen to an extent in early-game

[hollow trail]

i mean yeah they're slower ig but you also need to sustain resource

[celest kindle]

Wym

[left spear]

i guess you could also grind gems for the stat cards in the antique shop

if those are still a thing in reload

[hollow trail]

they are

[celest kindle]

Yeah they are

[hollow trail]

they might make the game a cakewalk actually

[celest kindle]

You can buy them from Mayoido Lady

[hollow trail]

i need to test

[hollow trail]

fights taking more actions means you need to also be more careful about economy

and not spam shit

[celest kindle]

True ig

Do things go faster as you progress

[native garden]

Damn, I better make sure the leader invest into Tanaka’s Amazing Commodities stocks before going into Tartarus

[hollow trail]

i'd argue fights do end pretty quickly once you get access to the fucked up phys abilities lol

at least normal battles

[celest kindle]

Hm

I think I only have regular phys rn

I have Vacuum Slash on Junpei

Is that fucked up

[hollow trail]

it's aoe phys

the damage was nerfed to shit

but aoe phys is aoe phys

[celest kindle]

Hm

So the fucked up ones are single target

Aight

[hollow trail]

thats not what i said tbh

aoe phys is basically hax even at low damage

especially on junpei

the crit rates are lower sure

but he gets a lot of crit from his personality

[celest kindle]

Hm

I'll look out for that

Junpei does crit pretty well on his own

I think he's the one who crit the most even when i DIDN'T go for crits

[hollow trail]

single target always has more crit, but if you have a lot of enemies that's 5% + his trait, rolled per enemy

[celest kindle]

That or the second

[hollow trail]

odds are good

[celest kindle]

Damn

[celest kindle]

If he is the second, oddly enough the first is Yukari

Those 10 damage crits got hands 🥶

[native garden]

Something tells me MQ makes this fight works even though this fight is 99% identical to how it behaves in vanilla

[left spear]

oh shit i just noticed

you just straight up can't use ANY healing items mid battle

[celest kindle]

Wrong

You can use the Risk-Reward ones

Like the ones that have a chance to poison you

[native garden]

Either I don’t heal and die or eat this weird food in my pocket that can poison me

[hollow trail]

yeah, the ailment-risk ones can be used

[celest kindle]

Well i died a lot of times in MQ because i forgot to guard and the damage boost was instadeath for my party

[native garden]

I’ll just take my chances

[hollow trail]

also the xmas gifts at the end of the game

[celest kindle]

Or me

Or both, really

[hollow trail]

if you null ailments the food is safe

[native garden]

Ohh

[celest kindle]

The fight was a tad more robotic since i had to follow the bosses pattern

The only thing that slightly tripped me up a couple times was the Marakunda

Which could be avoided if you preemptively buffed everyone with Junpei

[native garden]

Yea, let me null ailments- wait nvm, I can’t do that until the 3rd semester

[celest kindle]

But it's not necessary tbh

[left spear]

oh that's interesting

[celest kindle]

Fr

Kinda wish u got more of the risky items though...

[native garden]

I would’ve just relied on Polydeuces’ tarunda tbh

[left spear]

well it's still better to just use skills i take it

unless those items also got buffed

[celest kindle]

Yeah but that's 1 less turn for Akihiko

And Akihiko is like

Pretty good

He has a decent chance of Distressing and even shocking if the RNGods smile upon you

And that can help you dish out a lot of damage

That's what i relied on for the fight actually

Which paired well with my weird Omoikane

[celest kindle]

I think they're unchanged from how they were in default iirc

But they're good by default so it works

[native garden]

Weird Omoikane?

[celest kindle]

Lemme try to get an sc hold on

[native garden]

Oh…

[celest kindle]

He inherited Sharp Student and Regenerate 2

The former is of note because it means he just crits more

Distress makes crit chance higher

[native garden]

Wait, doesn’t sharp student reduces the chance of you getting hit by a critical hit or that’s different in master quest?

[celest kindle]

It's the critical thing right...

Unless i just got extremely lucky whenever i hit distressed enemies 😭

[left spear]

jesus that was close

[native garden]

Rip the exp for the squad tho

[celest kindle]

Are you playing Tactics?

[left spear]

yeahhh arqa is gonna be a pain

[left spear]

nah im just not that good

[celest kindle]

Ah

I understand

[left spear]

tho yukari mightve stayed alive if i guarded properly

[celest kindle]

Tbh guarding felt kinda irrelevant in Vanilla so yeah

But also the adds make it a little hard to guard so

[left spear]

yeahh, in the end i just got lucky because i managed to get her to the point where she focuses mc only

so w jack frost it was just a stall and hoping i didnt waste my resources

i had a magaru gem still tho so i wouldve won even if my sp ran out

[celest kindle]

Damn nice

One thing that def makes things hard is not having a lot ot AOE early on

That coupled with the low sp makes every use of magic have to count

[iron pilot]

Jack Frost with Agi

Maragi gems

Takoyaki

These are the key to everyone not dying

[celest kindle]

Agifrost propaganda

[hollow trail]

jak fragi

[iron pilot]

An odd morsel is better but you need to keep one of them for Nozomi

[hollow trail]

those are thebel only and rare as fuck right

at least i remember a friend spent like 5 hours grinding for one

[celest kindle]

Can't you farm them on Thebel?

[iron pilot]

You can savescum a chest or two

[hollow trail]

i wont lie

i cut it close

[celest kindle]

Kinda hilarious that you befriend Nozomi by giving him shit food

[iron pilot]

Do you guys just like

Just get satisfied even if people died

[hollow trail]

usually no

but here i really really REALLY dont care

after 3 hours of attempts

i dont care

[iron pilot]

Lmao

[celest kindle]

Depends on the fight or if i think it's avoidable

[iron pilot]

I'm dissatisfied if Akihiko made the fight longer just by existing

In terms of Thebel I think it's practical if you somehow don't do any sort of fighting except the first two guardians

Then you spam beating up lowlives to get persona cards to fuse

[iron pilot]

lmfaoooo

🤡

[warm dew]

genuinely what does his trait even do

does it buff the effects of kajas? passives? both?

[iron pilot]

10% increase to effect of buffs then the upgraded ver is 30%

just imagine another 1.1 or 1.3x multiplier on him when buffs on him are up

how much difference this is depends on the buffs because they don't have the same multiplier

rakukaja beats up tarukaja for example

even with that though he gets shit late and better members exist

so he's underwhelming in a lot of things

[warm dew]

i was under the impression that they were all like 33% boosts before

[iron pilot]

well if we're talking just tarukaja it's like

40% now basically

lmao

it came a long way, in OG/FES it's 25%

in P4 it's 33%

in P5 it's 40%

and reload took that

[warm dew]

so what does mq do to make him more viable besides debilitate

like whats his skill prog

[iron pilot]

single target boost is the main thing

and auto tarukaja

the problem in vanilla is you gimp protag's turn to

just get tarukaja on him

when you're better off using protag turns to attack

the other members should also be, like, attacking too but that setup is the main problem

basically you need to baby him to even get numbers out of him

and even with that he's still terrible

the fact that he's technically stronger with 99 all stats on crit doesn't change that fact, he's garbage in a regular playthrough setting

the debilitate isn't even that bad, since every other member can do that with items

but his established role now is "single target specialist"

his raw damage from those is now uncontested

which is good, he literally sucks ass before

[warm dew]

so he's closer to someone like kanji then?

a single target messatsu?

interesting

[iron pilot]

That's a good analogy actually

But he can do both Magic and Phys at the same time

Perfectly

Since you can have both boost and amps for strike and elec

[warm dew]

what would be his ideal skill setup then

since only 8 skill slots

is his strike boost weapon still his best

[iron pilot]

that's the best part, his overhaul makes you think of many ideal skillsets

since there's no evasion cap now his evade x skills have purpose

they're not deadweight even if he has ali dance from shoes

[warm dew]

iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinteresting

[iron pilot]

charge is good for theurgia building mostly so him having that innate helps a lot

high counter (from shinjiro) makes him just as good of an option as Junpei when dealing with a phys heavy enemy

[warm dew]

what about other party members? has anyone else's skill prog been changed?

[iron pilot]

hmmmmm nah Akihiko got most of the changes (he needed it)

[warm dew]

fair

[iron pilot]

the others have a solid skill tree

the only other change of note is Koro losing debilitate and Ken getting endure (from shinjiro)

very fitting skill change for that last one honestly, in both story and gameplay

[warm dew]

is ken still the superior healer or is Yukari balanced more against him now?

[iron pilot]

depends on what you're running

if you're running a mage nuke party, Yukari beats him easily

but if you don't want to afford being risky

Ken is even more integral for that

[warm dew]

what about mitsuru? is she still dogshit?

[iron pilot]

idk what you mean

well the main thing is freeze is way more accessible than before

and she's the easiest member to use mage builds for

innate concentrate ensures that she's never a bad option

ailments are a bit more viable in cases so more or less she isn't bad to pick

rakunda in general, you can never go wrong there even in vanilla

I will say though she's hard required for some quick kill strats

[warm dew]

even so I found myself using Mitsuru less and less as the game went on for some reason bc I felt she was being outclassed in terms of magic by other party members like Yukari
once I reached block 5 i literally just never picked her unless I wanted to see her level match up with the others via great clock or reaper farming

obv rakunda is always useful but even then thats a single debuff where her theurgy charge scales off of debuffs and ailments, and as you said youre better off using Makoto for attacking than applying debuffs in the first place making her one of the least quickly charging theurgy party members in the game outside of Koro

and her second theurgy is literal ass

if she's a good magic nuke though, I'll take your word for it

[iron pilot]

here's some number comparisons

[iron pilot]

the freeze is the main thing, here's an example

https://youtu.be/KrJezZU81I4?feature=shared&t=160

technically the damage numbers should be lower due to nerfs added later but the main idea is the same

she's an enabler for phys users, sometimes better than Koro's revolution

so in those cases (many more cases now in MQ), she's good

[warm dew]

i see

[iron pilot]

akihiko not sucking ass is good

[warm dew]

has ailment rate been raised at all? is weapon power no longer being halved?

[iron pilot]

technically yes for former but no for latter, no one has found a non jank way to do that latter bit yet

this is with max stats though so Junpei is still potentially stronger

[warm dew]

what about light and dark skills? have they been adjusted the same way as the other magic types, especially with regards to -dyne level skills? Instakills?

[iron pilot]

they're the same tier as their elemental counterparts

the dynes got buffed to P3 numbers so hopping from -la to -dyne isn't a shit upgrade anymore

IKs are untouched from what I recall but they're decently usable in vanilla so that's not a bad thing

[warm dew]

All DLC Personas have had their exclusive moves removed. They can safely be fused in legitimate gameplay.
so things like Cross Slash or Masquerade are simply not there anymore?

[iron pilot]

yep

and drivers

those fucked off

they're replaced by appropriate skills on the level they are obtained

izanagi gets getsu-ei as an example

[warm dew]

I personally would've preferred they be rebalanced in and of themselves or simply reskinned versions of other skills rather than being removed entirely but I understand the reasoning why

except drivers

[iron pilot]

that's not possible in some cases

[warm dew]

obv

[iron pilot]

Nyx uses the 4th tier AoEs

and they can't have that be player usable

[warm dew]

how much have Charge/Concentrate been reduced in strength? 2.25x?

[iron pilot]

2x

vanilla has it as 2.3x

theurgia charges are unaffected, those always scale by 2x with charge on in vanilla

[warm dew]

so it's more just to save SP or clear certain phases than to be more powerful than casting it normally?

[iron pilot]

the most important bit is it increases theurgia gains

just having charge/concentrate on a character makes the funny meter go up faster in vanilla

[warm dew]

IT DOES THAT??????

HUH?

[iron pilot]

and having methods to do AoE charge/concentrate just means it's basically free

so this decision is based on those factors

it's more tactical to charge up and since theurgia is always 0 at the start of fights

this is important to keep in mind

[warm dew]

shit that's actually really useful to know

i didn't even know charge/con did that in vanilla wtf

[iron pilot]

charge on akihiko lmfaoooo

that's actually the reason I start this fight with giving Yukari charge

https://youtu.be/6992Ui7O1AM

I look stupid if you didn't know that

[warm dew]

I'm kinda curious to know why skill card duping was removed

nihil item duping is obv super fucking useful

[iron pilot]

considering I have 69420 cards at the end

that's probably it

[warm dew]

yeah fair

[iron pilot]

material dupes are less broken in comparison

since you need only a specific number of them and they become obsolete next month

also this removes a lot of dead moon husk grind

so I'm happy with it

lmaooooo

[warm dew]

FUCK dmh grind bro onggggggg

fucking hated that

spent literal days trying to get one to make aigis's max rank weapon

lost braincells

[iron pilot]

F

so yeah these changes are more so about removing grind even though it looks like it's adding more

[warm dew]

and like
im not even opposed to grinding too much so it didn't really matter in the first place, it just seemed like an odd choice to make at the start

[iron pilot]

could always talk about being dissatisfied of certain changes, this is the first iteration after all

[warm dew]

how was omni orb changed exactly?

[iron pilot]

turned into an En 99 accessory

and regen/invig 3

[warm dew]

https://tenor.com/view/shaq-buffalo-wings-hot-ones-shaquille-o-neal-shocked-gif-13728541

may actually make me want to fight liz

[iron pilot]

she hits way harder now so just phys isn't gonna cut it

I tried it out with magic no mastery and yeah it's beatable

but I used both phys and mag for that one

[warm dew]

i remember seeing Meovv talking about removing some of liz's rules? is that true or am i dumb

[iron pilot]

Oh nah it's more like

The same rules

Same AI

But hits harder, can be hit with ailments, her persona's affinities fits with their regular versions (except Cu Chullain)

Removed the 3rd phase skip too so you're not going to be able to cheese her

That's more or less it

Masakado and Pixie has firm stance though so lol

[warm dew]

why would you give pixie firm stance

[iron pilot]

She doesn't null all anymore tbf

Weak to ice like the usual

Same goes for Masakado, weak to elec

[warm dew]

apologies for asking all of these questions btw, I just haven't kept up with the mod until today

[iron pilot]

Hee ho

[warm dew]

@hollow trail just fyi, the adjustment to lifestones isn't working properly. I just tested and its still restoring 30% hp to party members its used on instead of 15%

[warm dew]

also along similar lines, I'm assuming this is still the case with armor defenses? as in, there's still no point in using them for their "stats" but their passives?

[iron pilot]

They have the most effect to them stats wise in a persona game but yeah that's still the case

The meta armors are endgame armors though so it's not really that bad

[warm dew]

sucks that we still can't do much about that tho

[iron pilot]

Most of the equipment is left untouched apart from certain items

The notable ones being

Strike boost rocket fist for Aigis

Fire Amp Surt Sword for Junpei

[hollow trail]

I'll check, life stone has been a bitch for ages

i could swear it was fine

[celest kindle]

It seemed like it was doing % health item things to me

[hollow trail]

Yeah it's supposed to be 15%

but apparently it's doing 30% even though i triple checked

[hollow trail]

life stone was broken all your runs are invalidated!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

cheated item!!!!!!!!!

[iron pilot]

Lmfao

[dreamy orchid]

Tarukaja is 40%, Rakukaja is 66%, Sukukaja is 30% Accuracy and 42% Evasion

Debuffs are the same, just inverted

Tarunda is lowering by 66%, Rakunda is lowering by 40% and Sukunda is lowering Accuracy by 42%, and evasion by 30%

[celest kindle]

[dreamy orchid]

just use auto-heal button

that's never broken

[celest kindle]

That's lame

[dreamy orchid]

spam medicine, then

[errant pumice]

Some player in the future: “Man, I’m on January after grinding in real life for 3 months, I’m finally about to beat the game with this mod!”

Mod gets updated with a minor balance adjustment: “Yeah, you gotta start all over again since it invalidates your current run, GG!”

[dreamy orchid]

adachi_true

koromaru buff when

[celest kindle]

I'll just redo Clairvoyant Relic

I did it once i can do it again...

[dreamy orchid]

i think i'll do the priestess fight again as well

[errant pumice]

Just dodge the attacks, easy!

…

[dreamy orchid]

i want to beat it with the fucking scuffed ruleset so bad

we will not be using items or jack frost 😈

so far the high iq strat seems to just be like

ignoring the skeptical tiaras since they do like no damage

and can't hit any weaknesses

[celest kindle]

Me omw to dodge magic:

[dreamy orchid]

evade ice

[celest kindle]

If only it was that easy...

[dreamy orchid]

im so mad that i have evade slash and not evade fire or some shit

[errant pumice]

If Yukari ever dies, just hit the start button to fast forward the fight. I tend to do that if I know I won’t beat that battle guaranteed.

[celest kindle]

At least the boss never focuses protag unless it knocks down party

[dreamy orchid]

oh yeah on tactics its genuinely impossible if yukari is dead lol

the other big issue is just like

sometimes junpei and yukari will randomly attack the adds and not the boss

so its very hard to actually do enough damage to win the fight

[celest kindle]

Assign targetless behavior

[dreamy orchid]

ikr!

assign target would make this fight a genuine cakewalk

keeping up buffs is hard too cus eventually protag will run out of sp

[celest kindle]

If only it was possible to add tactics

[dreamy orchid]

it is in fes

[errant pumice]

“Okay Yukari, you knocked down this enemy and you can shift to me, I’ll deal with the other one— Wait, nonono DONT HEAL JUNPEI AHH”

[dreamy orchid]

nah they seem to kill them alright

the main issue is like

they attack the adds i want to just leave alive

like the ones who do nothing but spam fire skills

even though they resist wind, fire, slash and pierce anyways

[celest kindle]

Hm

[dreamy orchid]

the phys resistance on the adds is actual CBT for tactics i won't lie

if i were to suggest any change at all it'd be to just make them neutral to phys lmao so junpei stops fucking griefing

[celest kindle]

I think you might have better luck making sure to test all the elements they have so that they at least know if they can knock down or not

[errant pumice]

I know I tend to set the AI tactics always as “ act freely” but is there any good settings for individual allies that works better compared to act freely?

[dreamy orchid]

damage also seems kinda rng on tactics cus you need junpei to land at least a couple crits (he's allergic to this for me tho lmao)

i have landed like

2 crits within 10 attempts

[dreamy orchid]

Full Assault Junpei will never shift to others so depending on the scenario, this can be beneficial

Full Assault Yukari will also never waste turns on Dia and will prioritise shifting which is good for saving SP

Heal/Support Junpei does nothing besides spam rakukaja which can be useful for priestess but thats about it

[errant pumice]

Yeah, I tend to do Full Assault Yukari when exploring floors since I would rather heal when the battle is done compared to losing a turn with heal.

[celest kindle]

I think it can be useful for the Relic Tartarus boss because that deals a lot of damage

Even if you defend

[dreamy orchid]

well in mq i just use items to heal since dia is an actual scam

but in bosses, dia is nice

healing using protag is a horrible idea in mq though cus of how much sp it drains which kinda sucks since in an itemless setting, i am wholly reliant on yukari for keeping everyone topped up

and she seems to always prioritise protag if both protag and junpei are low

[iron pilot]

simp.

[errant pumice]

Isn’t healing items only useful for early game in MQ though? I haven’t reached to mid-game/late game with this mod yet

[dreamy orchid]

i got a garula skill card so i won't lie im just gonna use that to kill the boss in a couple turns

[dreamy orchid]

the in battle ones cap at 150 hp

[celest kindle]

The healing items are more useful early game yeah

[dreamy orchid]

im banning all items in battle tho, not just healing

so no kaja or gem items either

and ailment cure unless tactics use them

[celest kindle]

And they're kinda rare, to cap it off

[iron pilot]

the in battle ones are good for early game for the most part but they're not bad to be around later on

[hollow trail]

150hp does last quite a bit as a semi decent heal but yes it drops off hard

[dreamy orchid]

by the time it drops off though you have amada and yukari mediarama anyways

[hollow trail]

yeah it do be progression

[celest kindle]

And also a fuckton of life stones

For post battle

[hollow trail]

im debating restarting thebel again because i relied on life stone

[dreamy orchid]

i think garula omoikane will be my winning strat for priestess though

kinda sad that onmoraki wasn't as good as i'd hoped

but its fine

[iron pilot]

onion sucks

[celest kindle]

No Earlynubis allowed

[iron pilot]

snowman better

[dreamy orchid]

nah he's awesome

i specifically didn't want to use jack frost cus everyone else was using him

[hollow trail]

mutate drain ice on onion

[dreamy orchid]

he's technically the best option (if you care to kill the skeptical tiaras ) but like idc

imo forneus is kinda better if you can get the stats

cus no fire weakness!

[iron pilot]

the priestess moves are predetermined

[hollow trail]

i did it with Valkyrie in vanilla

[celest kindle]

Doesn't Forneus have elec weakness though

[dreamy orchid]

the adds she summons are not tho

[hollow trail]

the adds are predetermined too

[dreamy orchid]

yeah but you have garula skill card for that

[hollow trail]

well

not the element

but the action is

[iron pilot]

nulling bufula and ice storm is a worthy thing to risk

[dreamy orchid]

no its random which ones she spawns tho which fucks me

[hollow trail]

yes

[dreamy orchid]

if you get two despairing you just lose lol

cus ain't no way junpei killing those

[hollow trail]

maragi gem:

[dreamy orchid]

i have none

[hollow trail]

jak fost with agi

[celest kindle]

Junpei

[dreamy orchid]

does jakku two shot them

[errant pumice]

Me in Vanilla P3R: “Shinji, we need to cook!” (He does make a pretty mean restore max HP to all allies item)

I’m assuming that’s massively changed with the MQ mod

[dreamy orchid]

rn i can only two shot if i have tarukaja

[hollow trail]

junpei can't hit them

[iron pilot]

F

[hollow trail]

jack frost with agi can 2shot yes

barely

[dreamy orchid]

well i can force junpei to hit them if i use fucking

rush

but sometimes that just hits priestess anyways

this is why i wish they didn't resist phys lol

very hard to get junpei to make decent plays

[iron pilot]

it's not usable in battles

so it's just an AoE heal after battles

his samarecarm herbs are useless tho

lmfao

[dreamy orchid]

actually yknow what could be funny

i could rollback my save and grind ma at the arcade

on omoikane lmao

[errant pumice]

Rip social stats

[hollow trail]

If you have jak fost with agi you can

1: Knock both down, kill the second, and finish it off with Junpei if either of them had Tarukaja

2: Knock both down, kill one, and use sword to maximize Dizzy odds (normal wep attacks are highest dizzy proc)

3: Knock both down, kill one, and Rakukaja Junpei so he lives (if Priestess targets him it's gg)

[dreamy orchid]

i have rank 2 everything anyways

finish off with junpei...

if only tactics ai were that merciful

[hollow trail]

sad!

[iron pilot]

I can see the idea that the mod isn't exactly tactics oriented with this one

[dreamy orchid]

also i try to do the normal weapon dizzy strat but like

it never fucking works for me besides that one time where i dizzy'd rampage drive 3 times

[iron pilot]

losing the coinflip

[dreamy orchid]

my winning rampage drive fight was brilliant though

nobody was in any danger lmao

orpheus with tarunda op

[errant pumice]

What is the % chance of landing a dizzy on a knockdown enemy with a physical weapon attack?

[dreamy orchid]

its like 50% i think

phys/ma skills are 20% and theurgia is 80% though

[iron pilot]

correct

[hollow trail]

imo those odds are nice

i didn't even change

gives wep a purpose

niche

but it's there

[iron pilot]

tbf p3p has dizzy strats and reload doesn't for a reason

[hollow trail]

aoa can dizzy xd!!

[dreamy orchid]

aoa has been by far the most consistent way of inflicting it for me lol

for some reason striking weakness a second time doesn't add any extra dizzy chance lol

[hollow trail]

hey

one less rock paper scissors mechanic

works for me man

[dreamy orchid]

yeah but now i don't even know what dizzy is trying to do lmao

it feels wholly random now, not something you actively account for or attempt to inflict

especially cus aoa can do it now

[hollow trail]

I've consciously tried to dizzy for early game survivability

had success too

[celest kindle]

Dizzy hardly ever happened in AOA for me tbh

[dreamy orchid]

i just do all out attack and chances are that'll inflict dizzy anyways

[celest kindle]

It happened a bunch with AOE phys though

And Ma-Magic

[dreamy orchid]

i did an all out attack which dizzy'd 3 enemies in thebel

[celest kindle]

Hacking

[iron pilot]

personally I had moments where dizzy fucks me over because of the dizzy chance on aoa

so I personally don't like the aoa chance

[hollow trail]

The enemy it happens to is random, with sword you pick

I disabled an enemy that was next and it saved me the entire battle, for example

[dreamy orchid]

see i've tried to do that and usually it doesn't work
but when it does its nice ig

[hollow trail]

gamble

it's 50%

[dreamy orchid]

oh right you made early game phys skills all 30 power right

which means i should prob by junpei's best sword in the shop cus its technically better than his skills lol

unless you buffed the crit chance on power slash/bash

[hollow trail]

sword gaming???

[dreamy orchid]

what are the stats tho i need to know lol

[iron pilot]

that's technically true in FES iirc

[hollow trail]

single targets are 10, aoes are 5

[dreamy orchid]

yea in fes it is

[dreamy orchid]

for the whole game?

[hollow trail]

for the majority of the game. moves with proc have less iirc and heaven's blade exclusively is 20

or 25

i think stuff with proc is like 3%

the tables pinned i think

why u metagaming.....

[dreamy orchid]

metagaming is how you win in a challenge run!

i tried to metagame with poison earlier though but its literally worthless now lmao

im pretty sure poison also prevents inflicting dizzy in this game so its actively detrimental if you do

[hollow trail]

yeah ik what i meant is like

i made the conscious decision to hide numbers on 1.0 so people would try to discover strats

but ig you were here for development

[dreamy orchid]

yea lol

[iron pilot]

funniest number change

[dreamy orchid]

but i do wanna know if weapons have any practical application as like

attacks

[iron pilot]

nah just dizzy tbh

[dreamy orchid]

which i think may only be the case for thebel

[iron pilot]

or stats

or ailments in Yukari's case

[hollow trail]

SCARLET MIDD??

[dreamy orchid]

nah junpei's one in the shop is like 68 atk or something

[hollow trail]

wait wdym number change tho

I didn't touch their powers

[iron pilot]

wdym you didn't

how?

[dreamy orchid]

he nerfed the crit multiplier

[hollow trail]

i nerfed hack n blast and made crit 1% on the phys ones but that's it

[dreamy orchid]

on merciless

[hollow trail]

Oh yeaahh

i set mult to 1x

[dreamy orchid]

crits only 1.5x damage now 😔

[iron pilot]

yeah that's what I mean

because crit scarlet havoc outputs mastery king and I numbers now due to the crit damage nerf

[hollow trail]

tbf i think if you put in the work to mutate all that magic shit

[iron pilot]

yeah you deserve it

[dreamy orchid]

test magic ability vs phys

[iron pilot]

phys is still the easier option and 17% crit rate isn't bad

or 32% with koro

you get what I mean

[dreamy orchid]

bloody charge too

thats an extra 7%

[hollow trail]

bloody charge is rebellion tho

[dreamy orchid]

yea

it stacks with rev

[hollow trail]

ik but

ig you can pick it over reb

[iron pilot]

they stack

[dreamy orchid]

rebellion by itself is never worth using

but bloody charge is worth

[iron pilot]

yeah you want it with bloody charge or auto rebellion

[hollow trail]

is there a rebellion vegetable

[iron pilot]

just ability king and I outputs scarlet havoc numbers but no crit

[dreamy orchid]

don't think so but either way it'd still be garbage

[iron pilot]

the 1.5x comes from mastery basically

[dreamy orchid]

-1 turn for rebellion is not a good trade in like any scenario

[iron pilot]

so for no mastery situations you can really just pick scarlet havoc in that scenario

because the crit rate gives you a chance to do more damage

[dreamy orchid]

so i assume scarlet havoc still shits on it if it does crit so tldr just be lucky?

[iron pilot]

yeah

however

freeze strats

[dreamy orchid]

freezing nyx

[iron pilot]

that can be a reason to pick king and I regardless

tbf though magician is weak to ice, that's another reason

[dreamy orchid]

just use diamond dusto or midsuru for freeze tbh

[iron pilot]

weakness removes the need to use debilitate to one shot

[dreamy orchid]

do you really wanna use a theurgia on magician?

wouldn't you be able to kill it quick with just normal skills

though ig you get it back quick enough

[iron pilot]

well I did manage to one shot it using saturnus inferno

oh wait I mean

my diamond dust persona

but the problem is

that needs debilitate

and that needs a high roll on damage

[dreamy orchid]

just do rakunda item

[iron pilot]

yeah...not very reliable

[dreamy orchid]

even with weakness tho

scarlet havoc will still outdamage assuming crit

cus weakness multiplier is lower than crit

funniest shit ever

[iron pilot]

yeah well I'm not gonna gamble that if I have a surefire way to do it

[dreamy orchid]

yeah lol but i do think its funny

[iron pilot]

plus in a solo setting I would have expended my charge to kill fool phase

so going phys then magic is faster turn wise

hmmm I guess you can go the other way around but that scarlet havoc needs to crit

yeah I'm not doing that

[native garden]

[iron pilot]

smells like a skill issue

[rapid epoch]

rip gods hand

[iron pilot]

who tf cares for that mid skill

akasha arts better

[rapid epoch]

surviving > midiarahan

[native garden]

no it doesn’t. It smells like uh…old spice deodorant

Hold up, how come Master Quest is only 204KB? Aren’t difficulty mods normally like at least 3GB or more?

[celest kindle]

❓

[iron pilot]

wdym

[celest kindle]

I don't know where you got that from

[iron pilot]

this thing is more on just manipulating the numbers and AI

not adding a lot of shit in there

[celest kindle]

Yea

It's just code editing, stat tuning and AI rewrites

Pretty sure some of those are kept on a single file

[native garden]

Ohh

[ashen pulsar]

that's only if they add a bunch of fuckass models

[celest kindle]

Partly unrelated question, is there any way to make Reloaded-II check for updates?

[hollow trail]

opening it

[celest kindle]

Seems it's not picking up that my MQ is outdated

for some reason

[hollow trail]

just download it again then

it overwrites

[celest kindle]

Hm

I'm gonna guess it's cuz i set it up manually

and with a different package name to actual MQ

so even though it knows it's downloaded it doesn't know it's outdated because it's prob looking for the actual MQ package name

[iron pilot]

means you didn't even update it to have the funny dupes

[celest kindle]

not rlly

i have the release version

Oh wait

it just popped up

Ok it was

Minimized

for some reason

oh well

Reloaded-II ur weird

Just realized I'll have to get to floor 42 again

Man

Eh at least I already did the grind on the floors leading up to 36 I'll be fine i think

[celest kindle]

Surprisingly, it was slightly shorter than the first time i killed it

11:27 (1.0.0) vs 11:23 (1.0.1)

o wait i think i kinda know why

i used Bewilder on the boss a couple times which meant a couple more turns spent wailing on the boss

https://youtu.be/wYd2pxs07fc

[dreamy orchid]

lmao

i got two of these now

[hollow trail]

savescoom

[dreamy orchid]

i didn't!

it was in a random tartarus chest

i had to go back into tartarus cus i wanted the +1 ma weapon that mc gets

anyways yeah the boss is impossible without the items if on tactics

you just don't do enough damage and can't sustain the sp costs of your skills

and Yukari for some reason will literally never use Patra to heal distress

[celest kindle]

Can Tactics use items in Reload?

[dreamy orchid]

i don't want them to either way

but they can use ailment cure (i think?)

but i have no ailment cure items for distress anyways cus i was planning on doing no item

i can win this if i allow myself to use items to kill the adds tho

[native garden]

BOT Yukari: What’s a patra?

[dreamy orchid]

yeah idk how im supposed to do enough damage lmao

like jack frost would help with taking damage sure but my damage output would actually be lower if i used him over vakyrie most likely

ig i will just need to spam mazio gems

and im gonna use direct commands only for the sake of guarding because wasting 8sp on a tarunda for a single attack only to take more damage than if we had just guarded anyways is making me go insane lmao

nah fuck it thats pussy shit

but yeah rip no item run

i will try to do no item for the rest of the game after this at least

[native garden]

Mission Failed, we’ll get em next time

[hollow trail]

no

yukari isn't using patra cuz she thinks healing is more important

You can actually use items like medicine if you're confused

but that's a throw

you'd die

[native garden]

Yukari is ||secretly a Strega plant confirmed||

[dreamy orchid]

okay yeah lol

literally first attempt i used items, i won pretty effortlessly

maha-jio gem op

i won with like

3sp left lmao

no jack frost too 😎

literally just tank ice storm on neutral resistance 4head

you only take like, 100 damage if tarunda/rakukaja isn't up

its fiiiine

[native garden]

Shhh, don’t say that. You’ll make the mod author buff the boss

[dreamy orchid]

no the boss is fine

i imagine on direct commands and with better personas (don't use omoikane for the entire fight like me lmao) you can win pretty easily

especially with gem items

tactics only is a lot harder because you literally cannot guard even when you know ice storm is coming

so you need either tarunda or 3 rakukajas active or you basically lose

[celest kindle]

I won using some personas and magic

I think i died a couple times before i knew how the adds worked

[dreamy orchid]

i had forneus for tarunda and omoikone for all elements and rakunda 😎

i didn't even bother with the adds this time though i think

well i had to one time

there was no skeptical so i had to knock down the adds first then use maha-jio gem

and then that killed

but yeah idc to do that itemless on tactics, it might be possible but you need really good rng and perfect buff uptime which just isn't feasible for a tactics run

overall though, good boss. this is probably the hardest fight i've ever done because of the restrictions i put on myself lmao

the only thing i don't like is the eerie sound bit because if that hits the whole party its really hard to recover from, especially on tactics

[native garden]

Are the thebel guardians any different in this mod?

[dreamy orchid]

They are unchanged but they generally feel harder due to the other changes

On tactics they are kind of annoying but very manageable

Uncontested GOAT

[hollow trail]

gonna give her tarukaja and concentrate i think

[celest kindle]

Can you give her Armageddon

[native garden]

NOOOOOOO

[native garden]

Anytime I get a game over in MQ, I always see that emote

[celest kindle]

Oh man

I think i might have to do some preparations for the Emperor and Empress fight

[hollow trail]

is it giving you trouble

it's a tutorial so i didn't make it too hard

[celest kindle]

I uh

Died once i think

I just bought 6 muscle drinks

It was pretty troublesome cuz fuuka ran out of SP

But GOD

I had a gamer moment

I fucking guessed the weaknesses

I think my heart rate jumped whenever i tried a skill and actually hit a weakness

Haxman died though unfortunately

His sacrifices were not in vain however

Btw @hollow trail can Empress have strike weakness?

I don't think she had it once

[hollow trail]

It's slash and pierce right

[celest kindle]

Yeah

[hollow trail]

then yeah

no strike

alternates from one to the other always

[celest kindle]

Wait so it's unintentional or?

[hollow trail]

it's intended

[celest kindle]

Ah good call

I can imagine it'd be tok hard if it cycled all phys types

Especially since i had no strike persona

I would have been COOKED

[hollow trail]

yes I chose 2 elements so you'd always be able to guess

then the magic ones is

Fire
Elec
Light &Dark

random, but never repeats

so you can guess pretty easily in a single turn

[celest kindle]

Ye

I actually had to do some tech where Junpei or Aki self damaged in favor of finding the weakness

Akihiko sadly died because Emperor liked focusing him

Ngl the toughest part of the fight was when Empress used Bufula on protag and the protag got frozen

[hollow trail]

these element picks are actually what makes this fight tactics friendly actually since junpei won't sell

[celest kindle]

Oh speaking of, the fight took me about

20 minutes

[hollow trail]

wtf lol

a single attempt or what

[celest kindle]

The first was less but i don't remember how much less

Also it was less because I died lol

Imma post the video since i was recording

Who knows maybe it'll give u an idea of roughly how it is for a casual

[hollow trail]

sure

[celest kindle]

aight

finally

https://youtu.be/IbzPYYINSJM?si=PbFUpojd8SNDx1cu

It was taking a while to get the HD option

[hollow trail]

this

is really weird gameplay

[dreamy orchid]

lol tactics do not know at all unless you put them on conserve sp at which point they won't even hit weaknesses

regardless i think im gonna have to put aki on conserve cus wasting 10sp on mazio every fight is really annoying lmao

[hollow trail]

empress?

this is unironically the first time ive seem empress use eiha

i forgot she even could

bro got NUKED

[dreamy orchid]

HE USES DIA ON CONSERVE SP??!?!?!

[celest kindle]

To be entirely fair i did throw a couple times

[hollow trail]

that doesn't sound right

lol

[dreamy orchid]

junpei can rakukaja on act freely as well???

[hollow trail]

yes

thats intended

[celest kindle]

Akihiko used phys on her near the beginning because i was hitting spacebar too quick and hit it when his turn began

[hollow trail]

ah, yes people can use dia on conserve SP if hp is critical

[celest kindle]

Does Reload AI have any concept of changing tactics