ark-2

[mystic wharf]

How do you know that nobody will play it ? ,You don’t even know the game and you’re already saying nobody will play it , makes no sense

[normal wigeon]

ark is a one of a kind game, everyone that plays it knows its shit they arent gonna swap to an even worse version like what

[mystic wharf]

How do you know our version is gonna be worse than asa ? , we can make it better but the models and animations gonna be différent

[normal wigeon]

"we decided that it will be the asa killer but dont be mad for the fact that our game can be superior to the game you love that's alright" dawg wrap it up please 😭

[mystic wharf]

Ye i said that because zen was mocking our plan for the new game we are making for no reason, probably because he is a fan of asa

Its not gonna be like ark 2 type of style but more like ark 1

But différent in how it looks a completely new dino models and animations , dévelopment started couple years ago and close to finish , the models are meant to be realistic rather than cartoony because asa looks a bit cartoony , right now we are working on the last parts of the game , i like asa but our new game is meant to be A better version ,but with différent look we are créating new ones also we are working a lot of performance that lacks in asa

[mystic wharf]

Also asa is a game very simple, look how simple and quickly made the animations and the gameplay are ? Its a game that can be easily overthrown so i dont Even understand what you mean by its gonna be worse , you are talking like asa is a perfect game which is very far from it , asa is the most Simple game i ever saw , the animations and gameplay are not even deep or hardly made it just look like someone made animations in a hurry

[dire needle]

If its better than asa then its fine for me .....

[tiny glade]

Ark 2 is a myth

[mystic wharf]

Lol i think he hâtes ark 2

Idk some just are able to really hâte on ark 2 because they love ascended at all cost

[mystic wharf]

Well i played it myself and its a ton better than asa to be honest, lot more fun, its actually a real World full of danger , a true game not asa fake game i mean like only made to build but there is building in our games too , its asa but more immersive and more realistic

[dire needle]

I will probably leave asa if your game is good then .... , imaginé because of you no one is gonna play asa anymore lmao

[mystic wharf]

It wasnt the plan in the beginning,we just wanted to make kind of a better asa because we were tired of some things that the developers give no fuck about , but if it does then its cool

If they leave from asa

To our game then its would be much apreciated

But we dont force anyone

I forgot to tell you that the dinos will have animations in the wild its a lot more on the immersive aspect

That's what i found boring in asa boring dinos

But you will be able to build , tame , ride dinos and stuff

[dire needle]

Sounds cool , but what if the developers of asa becomes jealous of your game lol ? 😆

[mystic wharf]

Its the same type but different on how it looks , They never tried to make asa more immersive more better in terms of quality, so why would i give a damn about them becoming jealous or not , that wont bé their game that will be mine.

[mystic wharf]

Not a bad choice

But you will have. A New type of camera and more immersive environnment

It means that the dinos around you will be more dangerous than what asa offers

No mercy for your tiny human

Now im making building system and clothing

The mouvement will be more easier because asa is a pain when you try to move while riding dinos turning and stuff

[untold ingot]

You should appreciate wc then

I've already done cameras. I could even do them without a game engine

[mystic wharf]

Try to make a camera detached from the body in asa like for example being able to walk while being able to move the camera in every direction like GTA 5 for example, you will not succeed .....

[untold ingot]

I guarantee I would. It's just code and there are tutorials everywhere. I bet I could do it in a weekend.

[blissful perch]

@untold ingot have I lost my mind or is that a description of a third person overhead camera

[untold ingot]

Yeah

Apparently basic aspects of game development are hard now.

[mystic wharf]

Me and my friend didn't and my friend was in game development since child me a lot more recent

[untold ingot]

And? Just because you can't you think I can't? I could do it from the math lol.

It's just linear algebra

[blissful perch]

The hardest part imo is strong design and maintaining creativity rather than falling back on recreating other games

[untold ingot]

Correct. There are loads of people with the skills to make games, few with the ability to make good ones themselves

[winged dome]

'Shits too hard! Impossible task!'
Trying to do things the first 3d platformers did/perfected 30 years ago

[mystic wharf]

Being orginal is kind of easy for me when i think about making a game , i have a lot of ideas but the hardest part for me is more like hard coding and finding solution for problems my friend is a bit better in coding than me though

[untold ingot]

Having lots of ideas is normal. Everyone has lots of ideas. The issue is you have to have lots of ideas that are GOOD ideas and you have to actually be able to make them happen.

Also you said your friend has been doing games since a kid. If he is just a bit better than you who just started he absolutely sucks at it.

[blissful perch]

You also have to be humble about ideas not working, keep the ideas lean (ie not scope creep), and maintain a strong sense of what the end goal of the game itself is

I may bash WC’s game design decisions at times, but most of that is micro. In a strategic sense, WC has remained very focused on making Ark stay Ark in the most simple sense. It’s why I’m still here

[mystic wharf]

Well i have good ideas ,but its actually my friend who tells me im almost in his level , but for me he is far better than me to be honest

[mystic wharf]

Developers of asa has no ideas tbh

[untold ingot]

If neither of you can make a third person camera (that is literally built in to ue5 as a template), then I wouldn't have too much hope in your abilities

[blissful perch]

Bold claim. Would you consider new content, mechanics, and features “not ideas”?

[mystic wharf]

The problem isnt that , its just that in asa the modification to be able to make it is really hard compared to a normal game we are making from 0

[mystic wharf]

They are ideas but simple ideas , it so simple for me to think about what the developers of asa though about , i can think of better things and bé completely original but its because i have a différent brain than most guys you probably noticed it

[untold ingot]

You have a high opinion of yourself

[mystic wharf]

I knew you would say that , ye im kind of confident

[untold ingot]

Confidence in my experience comes from decades of practice, or is entirely misplaced due to ignorance. Which one are you? 🤔

[mystic wharf]

Im confident in myself and what i can do with my ideas and for now what we built looks so damn cool and well made

For example asa is so simple but some peoples like it ...

Ours is even more deep , so ye im very confident

[untold ingot]

Give examples.

[mystic wharf]

I already spoke about it , its mainly most things i didn't liked about asa and implement it in our new game.

[untold ingot]

What you spoke about is how you couldn't make a third person camera. But somehow have confidence that your "game" isn't trash.

[mystic wharf]

It’s different when you’re working inside an existing game like ASA. You’re limited by how it’s built. From scratch, you have full control, so it’s actually easier to implement things like that. That doesn't mean the game will be bad , you just reflect the fanatic of asa that you are , you dont care about a better game .

At least its better than asa by a long

[untold ingot]

I'm not a fanatic. I just don't particularly like you lol.

[mystic wharf]

And i dont like you too.

[untold ingot]

Great.

[mystic wharf]

Yep.

[dire needle]

Why are you so rude? you just said that their games are trash ? dude you really need to chill

[blissful perch]

Are you saying that in hindsight these ideas were simple? It’s usually harder to think of them from scratch then to see them and go “oh yea I could have thought of that”

[untold ingot]

This guy has been bothersome for months. I have lost patience with them.

[mystic wharf]

How ive been bothesome? The only one annoying is you

[winged dome]

Bruh.

Get this fella some self awareness

[untold ingot]

Hey, I tried.

[blissful perch]

Is it my fault for not filling the chat with better conversations? WC’s for not giving us new news?

[winged dome]

Same

[untold ingot]

Yes, it's all your fault 😂

[mystic wharf]

Talking about my game is botherdsome you really seem trolling dude or you are crazy

Then ignore it but dont show your insécurities and agression

[blissful perch]

What I don’t get is someone who is functionally trolling can accuse someone else of trolling and it’s fine because it sounds like an innocent comment

[untold ingot]

You spent months asking about the camera for Ark2. And now with like 0 game dev experience you think you are going to make an Asa killer. 😂

[blissful perch]

🧐 interesting indeed

[mystic wharf]

2 fanatics trolling that's the real reason tbh

[mystic wharf]

Again so?

I will talk about what i want

[winged dome]

You're the one coming back time and time again to bring up the same conversations and points repeatedly. Who's really the fanatic here?

[tawny isle]

https://tenor.com/view/now-let's-move-on-buzzr-next-subject-fremantle-moving-forward-gif-1356865492021210274

[blissful perch]

Thank ya kindly for stopping by

[winged dome]

Bless

[tawny isle]

I mean everyone, not any one person

[mystic wharf]

Im not défending a game just because i like it so ye you are a fan

[untold ingot]

I don't even play it really anymore. Dunno how I am a fanatic. 😂

[mystic wharf]

You really seem frustrated and an unlikable guy though, always annoying trying to go to war against a person that doesn't like everything inside the game you love that's why i dont like hardfanatics as you

[untold ingot]

Sure thing 😂

[tawny isle]

[winged dome]

I think we've lost sight of the true topics we should be pursuing:

News and updates for Saladmander

[untold ingot]

It's leafy and green

[winged dome]

And red! Sometimes

[untold ingot]

Oh I meant the Ark2 one.

[winged dome]

Yeah, it's reddish when it opens to flower mode

[blissful perch]

Can I toss it with dressing

[winged dome]

Prolly

[untold ingot]

I'm red green colorblind. Soooo

It's green 😂

[blissful perch]

And does it allow me to fly, use charge light, walk my dog, and file my taxes like an Asa shoulder pet?

[winged dome]

Pick 2, but if you enable Companion mode then you can swap abilities for what you need

[blissful perch]

Makes sense to me

Anyone else wish that archy just worked like a glider without using both hands?

Is that still not a thing in Asa?

[winged dome]

YES. Justice for Archy! Down with Sinomacrops!

[blissful perch]

Basic qol incoming?

I might scream if the ark 2 archy is the same as the old ase one

[oblique horizon]

[worldly garden]

Why does chaos ensue after certain posts in here 🤣 Anyway, we're one quarter closer to ARK 2 release!

[dire needle]

Quick question i know that ark 2 isnt out yet but if someone said you have to pick one do you prefer to play asa or ark 2 forever ? On which side ?

[worldly garden]

I can't answer that question because I have no experience of Ark 2.

[dire needle]

Ok ok , my question then is rather Do you think there’s a chance you might end up liking Ark 2 more than ASA ? Hope you understand lol

[worldly garden]

There's always a chance I might yes.

[dire needle]

Oh ok i asked that because there is some peoples that are just locked and tied up to asa and doesn't want to hear anything about a new game that is close to asa type of game , so i wanted to know if you are like open or not but they have the right to for me... As we too

[winged dome]

People will like or hate whatever they want to like or hate. Personally, ASA took some steps in the right direction while also having some questionable changes from ASE. Ark2 will likely follow suit.

If they stick to what they're saying then Ark2 has potential for me to really enjoy it - but it's still far too early to tell for certain since we don't have gameplay or anything yet

[worldly garden]

Some people just like to have what they already have instead of something new. After 10 years of playing one game it's understandable some won't be interest in something brand new, especially when it is said to differ in many ways to the original.

[winged dome]

Majority of the PvP community was abhorrently opposed to ASA because they'd lose all their progress and their exploits might not work anymore

[obsidian zenith]

Santiago is vin diesel

[untold ingot]

I don't think there are that many people who actually like Asa enough to not want Ark2.

[winged dome]

ASE holdouts/ASA Official Players that don't want change (again)

[blissful perch]

Given Asa exists I’m skeptical it’s not “that many”, but it’s probably not so many that Ark 2 would flop from lack of migration

[mystic wharf]

Im more into ark 2 that's more my type

[winged dome]

Thanks

[untold ingot]

Thx

I've been playing around with evolutionary algorithms recently. It would be cool if they were able to build Ark2 with some of the new results we are getting.

[tiny glade]

Ark 2 is a myth

[foggy creek]

Agreed its propaganda

[tribal chasm]

That wikipedia page is hard to follow, lots of 'technical jargon'. What would this mean if included in Ark 2?

[untold ingot]

Continuous learning for pathing. Migration patterns. And if they really get cronky then adaptive animations. But that's not likely

[rare rock]

man ark 2 was such an amazing game the end really messed me up. did they mention theyre going to make ark3 ever or is this it

[celest vine]

? ark 4 literally released 2 years ago wym 😭

[tame geode]

This is it. Otherwise there'd be an Ark 3 channel. Although, they may be getting ready to announce Ark 3 so they can have the channel on standby for 10 years. Just in case there aren't enough "Ark 3 is a myth" or "Is Legends of Santiago Ark 3", jokes in addition to all the weird talk about Ark 2's remastered cameras.

[mystic wharf]

But i dont want it to be

Ark 2 is more my type of game

[worldly garden]

We know it is more your type of game. Why do you take the Ark 2 is a myth posts seriously?

[main viper]

Morning gp

[worldly garden]

Good morning

[mystic wharf]

Idk he seem serious

Maybe he is in love with asa and dont want ark 2 to replace it

Who knows but nothing wrong About that since i like ark 2 more so everyone has what he likes

[worldly garden]

he's not serious, you need to learn to read jokes and sarcasm. People come in here and state Ark 2 is a myth to mock the situation. That's all it is.

[mystic wharf]

Oh Ok , i took it seriously because a lot of peoples dont like the new style of ark 2 (mechanic etc .) , so i was like he maybe wants it to be a myth rather than something that is possible to happen

@tame geode what's the problem with me liking or wanting ark 2?you strange dude, you know that's its not because you stick to a game that i will stick to it too? So your emoji just makes no sense

[tame geode]

I reacted to your comment because you know nothing about Ark 2. Nobody does, debatably including Wildcard.

[mystic wharf]

Its not because we didn't saw anything about ark 2 that it is not my type of game ? Im talking about the type of gameplay im more into ark 2 gameplay than asa , so i still dont understand what you dont understand

[tame geode]

Oh, my apologies, I didn't realize you had early access to Ark 2 gameplay. Last I checked there has not been any footage of gameplay making it impossible for you to know what the gameplay is like, but I guess if you've seen the gameplay, and know what it's like, I guess you could have a valid preference.

Let's say you were telling someone else you find alien women attractive. The problem is we haven't seen any alien women on earth. So, how could you possibly know they were attractive? You either have had some individual exposure that no one else in the entire world has had, or... you may be attracted to YOUR own ideas of what an alien woman might be like, but the reality is you have no idea what those alien women are like until they show up on earth.

So, what's going on is someone has told you, "Dude, those alien chick's are soo hot... man like for real." and now you've adopted that sentiment having never seen an alien woman, but have had someone else give their botched/hyperbolized description that has stuck with you.

[woeful grove]

Idk why yall are even talking about this. Asa is as close to an ark 2 as you are going to get 😂

[devout ravine]

I don't think I have seen anything about Ark 2 at all recently, but are they still planning on doing souls-like combat and forcing 3rd person?

[gilded flame]

hi

[blissful perch]

So far that hasn’t changed, and it would be a bit odd if they abandoned that core

[tiny glade]

Ark 2 is a myth

[rare rock]

as a hardcore soulsborn fan i dont want that in ark , but it is what it is

i have about 5k hours across ds1 2 3 , elden ring , demon souls , bloodborne and sekiro holy shit

[mystic wharf]

Why not ? It will make the game funnier and that's literally what i wanted, more action instead of the boring asa gameplay , maybe the peoples who like asa combat dont really like combat, they just like building but that's what i find not so much fun for me i dont only play to build that's why ark 2 is more my type i can't explain it clearer its already clear

[hearty osprey]

And people like u are the target for ASA, a more updated ark, but not forced into the big pivots of ARK2

[dire needle]

I get your point , you mean you want more chaos rather than chilling gameplay ?

[lunar siren]

yerah\

ballrightt

chat is there a point in getting acssended

[mystic wharf]

Not chaos but a decent difficulty at least , because i find the chill side of asa boring.

[dire needle]

What kind ?

[mystic wharf]

Just a decent type of dinos attack like other games i played , i get bored that in asa dinos give up combat so easily, that break immersion and doesn't make the combat aspect fun and enjoyable for me, that's what i mean by the chill side of asa , also shooting while the dinos stay in a statue mod just makes me want quit because it breaks immersion

[dire needle]

Well you need to hope for better dinos in ark 2 , i wonder if the dinos gonna act the same as asa or different since the developers seem to be very bad on that

[mystic wharf]

Ye but since im more of a 3rd person camera guy then i would prefer that first, the rest is less big for me , that's why i said ark 2 is a lot more made for myself than asa but whatever im bored of talking.....

[rare rock]

your edited reply is much better

to each their own in short

I just don’t really flow with the idea of god of war like ark2 gameplay , which is why we have ascended. Does not mean I’m not going to try ark2 though obviously, and also does not mean it’s going to be bad

[rare rock]

exactly

[rare rock]

since you’re in PC no not really , you already have access to almost everything in Asa except the graphics and laggy unstable game

if I could use mods in ase , I would never play asa. But I’m on PlayStation obviously

hopefully the 5.7UE update will fix everything and make the game worth it to actually fully immigrate there even as a pc player

[mystic wharf]

Im not against the idea of no combat in ark 2 , but at least i would want more challenging dinos , i dont like when its to chill or not immersive, then wether there is a combat mechanic or not its fine for me literally the same

[tame geode]

I can not wait for you to be disappointed when Ark 2 drops and their "souls like combat" was adding a basic parry feature and that's it.

But hey, thats more your type of game!

[mystic wharf]

How do you know that i will be disapointed and why do you force me to be disapointed that's the question ?

Looks like you want to force me to like asa more than ark 2 rather than saying each has his own kind of games they like , what is even funnier is that you said that you want to play ark 2 but then when someone says ark 2 is more my type of game you become so Frustrated , which is very hypocritical , contradictory and a bad behavior , i play what i like not what others force me to like

[dire needle]

Man, if he is more interested in Ark 2, that’s his choice. You don’t get to decide what others should enjoy. People like you are just annoying.

[mystic wharf]

I think i might ignore these nonsense comments next time , it will be a good idea , these dudes are so annoying

[broken otter]

You know that Snail games does not even own the IP of Ark!

[untold ingot]

Yeah they do?

[broken otter]

Snail games pay 1.5M $ per month to use the ARK IP from SDE Inc.

[broken otter]

SDE Inc.

[untold ingot]

Oh interesting

[broken otter]

Kinda crazy.

[untold ingot]

Yeah, itsnot technically snail then. Super weird

[broken otter]

Yeah, I just hope Snail games + the ARK IP from SDE gets bundled into one sell to a big tech giant like Tencent or Microsoft

[untold ingot]

I really don't want either of them to own ark

[devout ravine]

I do not want it in Ark either, and if history does that funny thing where it repeats itself, then I think it will be a flop.

I also have about 5k hours in ASE and ASA ha ha. I know that is chump change to some players, but I have played this game a lot.

[untold ingot]

5k hours is a lot for the average base.

[rare rock]

😭

[rare rock]

understandable, kinda have the same opinion but just WANT to have no combat , no “soulslike”

because you know essentially, it’s not really ark anymore yfm

[rare rock]

I have 1k on ase and double digit numbers on asa because I refunded it back in 2023 (shit was not playable on the ps5) . What I’m trying to say is 5k is really a lot

[rare rock]

someone I watched couple days ago has 32k hours on ark , apparently

[untold ingot]

There are some with 80k+. But how much of it is afk time?

[worldly garden]

Yes SDE Inc owns the IP and acts as Licensor to Snail

[winged dome]

To me, Ark is special because of the freedom it allows with nearly every creature being tamable and you can build pretty much whatever you want wherever you want it. Combat in Ark is really basic and is due for a major upgrade.

Most mounts are essentially cars - they can't turn unless moving forward, no strafing or turning while moving backwards - combat is basically left click simulator with occasional repositioning (RE: car driving movement)

Player combat is also very basic, except you have the added bonus of holding left click to attack repeatedly

Having more variety with dodges, combos, improved movement, ect I think will really help push Ark to the next level. Everything that makes Ark ARK will still be there - just the relatively weak combat is brought up to snuff

[rare rock]

good point

[mystic wharf]

So do you mean you like the direction Ark 2 is taking with its combat ?

[mystic wharf]

Tbh i dont really care about combat i just want more challenging environnement and the only thing that i really want in ark 2 is a dodge mechanic but then if they make the combat really far im not against it , it would be the same for me

[mystic wharf]

It seems that not everyone want what you want though

[worldly garden]

We have no idea if the environment will be more challenging in ARK 2 than it is in ASA.

I mean no survival game is challenging after you've played it a while.

[dire needle]

Hmm, i dont really agree with that though

[mystic wharf]

Agree i view ark 2 as an improved version of asa...

[rare rock]

not at all , has nothing to do with asa from what we have seen at all

[mystic wharf]

I want to add that for me asa is an incomplete and unfinished game ,there is dinos getting stuck everywhere on the map and that thing looks like the game is still in early development although its finished, the thing is that they dont Even work on that although they can make it better , but with ark 2 i feel that the game will be complete i would be surprised if not i have a feeling that the developers dont really care much about asa and will care a lot about ark 2

[somber egret]

asa is just a port and upgrade of ase. and ase was more borked than asa. ark2 is a completely different game. they care about extending the development because they had teams working on asa.

[worldly garden]

ARK 2 is meant to be an early access game, so don't be expecting a "complete" game.

[untold ingot]

Yeah, Asa wasn't even an idea when Ark2 was being pitched.

[mystic wharf]

I kind of agree with zen though and that's what i always though about ark 2 just seem to be ark but with a better combat that's our vision

[dire needle]

I get that you like the combat of ark 2 but that sounds kind of hard , i will be wasting my time with every dino i encounter

[winged dome]

It's not meant to be easy, that's kind of the draw for Survival, and Souls-Like games.

We don't know how long any encounter will be in Ark2. Smaller creatures like Raptors or Carnos could go down in a few hits where a Rex would likely take longer and would probably require dodging to reasonably survive - which makes sense. A Rex is a huge apex predator, arrows and swords probably won't do much against it

[untold ingot]

I imagine it'll be more like Conan or enshrouded vs elden ring.

Wc don't have the time or experience making lots of hard to fight things, but they can make combat moderately more interesting

[devout ravine]

How do you change the player combat style to something that is souls-like system without completely overhauling the creature combat system at all. How does that effect changes on tamed creatures vs players who are not on foot. How does creature vs creature combat change? If you want to keep a PvP system in play, how to do balance combat where tamed creatures or the new combat system doesn't get left unused. A lot of these changes will ultimately change the core experience of Ark.

For me, personally, at the end of the day, I do want to see some sort of updated combat system, but I think smarter AI for wild and tamed creatures, more in-game options to allow creatures to not be trapped so easily or get stuck on cliff-sides just staring at you while you tranq it. I also would like to see more combat like we see in COD games. Running and sliding for an example, and as Tek gets aquired, then wall running and using jetpacks to quickly strife left or right. I would think that style of combat would allow more non-mounted options in PvP combat but keep the core ark experience alive.

[untold ingot]

Tek won't really be a thing

[winged dome]

You don't, creatures will need to be updated to compensate. Smaller creatures like Raptors should be dangerous because of their mobility and tendency for pack tactics. What they lack in raw power they make up for in other areas. Same with a Rex, that raw power is going to have a lot of weight behind it, meaning you'll have to time attacks carefully to catch smaller opponents.

Creating that balance where both creature and on-foot combat scenarios are both viable and interesting will be a very difficult challenge to overcome from a design standpoint, but if WC devs nail it then the final product will really be something special

But would adding mobility change the core Ark experience? Considering pretty much every Ark1 expansion added new movement options for both tames and players

[untold ingot]

Don't get hopes up

[untold ingot]

Yes, as movement on foot in ark feels super clunky

[winged dome]

I think the core Ark experience is more focused on the freedom of taming creatures and building whatever/wherever you want. Movement, mobility options, or in many cases lack thereof, isn't really what makes Ark ARK

[untold ingot]

By that argument most things in ark aren't what makes ark ark. I want better movement and better combat. If that somehow makes it not ark, then I don't want ark lol

[winged dome]

It's what makes Ark different from most other open world survival games. Every game has walking, not every game has dinosaurs trying to force their way through your handcrafted thatch house trying to eat you

[untold ingot]

I don't see why we can't have both.

[winged dome]

You ... can.
It's called Ark lol

[untold ingot]

Except movement in ark sucks.

[winged dome]

It doesn't have to

Hence ... all of my posts above lol

[untold ingot]

Why did you respond this then?

[winged dome]

Because having so-so movement options isn't what defines Ark for me

[untold ingot]

Right. But ark isn't Ark2. I personally won't play Ark2 if it doesn't have major movement reactors.

[blissful perch]

I think (and Zen stop me if I’m wrong) the question isn’t “is better movement good” it’s “is better movement required for Ark 2 to be a serviceable sequel worthy of carrying the Ark label”

And on that point I’d definitely agree ark 2 at its core is about taming creatures in a fairly open environment - advanced combat and movement is great but it’s a cherry on top of that cake

[tame geode]

Look, I'm assuming English isn't your first language, and I can appreciate that. But your intentionally ignoring huge aspects, if not full entireties of the points people bring up. I don't even play Ark anymore. I don't care which game is better. My point is that no one can like something without having experienced it. We don't have the ability to experience Ark 2, so there's no way we can have a positive experience with it. So saying you prefer a game that doesn't exist yet doesn't make sense.

Now, if you're point is that you like what Wildcard has proposed for Ark 2, and you enjoy those aspects they've proposed, and how they work in different games that's one thing. The problem is words can mean way to much, especially when it comes to trying to convince people to give you money. Wildcard may have said Ark 2 is gonna be souls-like, or 3rd person only how ever many years ago, but things change. Definitions and ideas shift. I'm not defending ASA, nor am I attacking Ark 2. I'm not saying you shouldn't enjoy Ark 2 when it comes out. I'm saying you can't prefer/like/enjoy a game that doesn't exist yet and could be completely different than advertised.

[blissful perch]

Thankfully nobody can buy Ark 2 yet…I can only imagine the chaos that would create for these exact reasons

[tame geode]

Absolutely. There's a difference between early access and pre-odering for sure. I want Ark 2 to be awesome. I think all of us do. WC created something special with the Ark franchise, and I think folks should be rewarded for those awesome things they contribute. The only people crapping on ark 2 are kids that just want to mix emotions for fun. Everyone else may have differing opinions on the proposed ideas WC has suggested for Ark 2, but any adult isn't actually judging the game until actually exists.

[dire needle]

But if ark 2 movement is the same as asa that doesn't seem interesting for me

[dire needle]

I agree with that

[blissful perch]

Yea I think you’re right here, though I do enjoy running out the thought experiment on what gameplay with some of these fundamental shifts could look like

For example, a lot of my early concerns and conversations with Aratai are kinda what wound up coming to life in lost colony

[winged dome]

Correct. Nice to have, but it's not what makes Ark the dinosaur punching game we love (to hate)

[tame geode]

Imagine ark 2 ends up emulating Green Hell with dinosaurs as opposed to the monster hunter-esque proposition. Who knows what that'd be like. PvEers would probably love something like that, but PvPer's probably couldn't be bothered checking their arms and legs for scrapes and cuts lol.

They'd probably have to abandon the 3rd person only aspect, but that's kind of my point.

[dire needle]

Actually more peoples want the ark 2 combat im surprised

I think that we can do nothing against it

[dire needle]

It is what it is

[tame geode]

It isn't anything yet. Heck, there's actually a strong chance they've not yet made a single aspect of the combat system folks are saying they prefer.

[dire needle]

I dont want ark 2 combat men! But i understand some want it , mostly zen and nero

[tame geode]

I'm tilting at windmills...

[winged dome]

Please don't associate me with them.

[dire needle]

Then Why you are defending the new combat system of ark 2 saying having improved combat will push ark to the next level ? Im confused.....

[tame geode]

Probably because it's easier to skim comments for keywords and take a black and white stance than it is to actually read and understand the full context of a response. Although, I don't think that was Zen.

"That comment had the words, 'Ark 2', 'combat, and 'bad'' in the same sentence! Get em boys!"

[winged dome]

It do kinda be that way sometimes.

[tame geode]

Oh I forgot to add the follow-up. "Man... I can't believe literally everyone hates Ark 2..."

[mystic wharf]

It seems that understanding simple things is not your first language, You are assuming things that i never said , im just saying that since ark 2 gonna be a soul like game then it is more my type meaning that i like souls like games , so im Interested about the idea only , and even if its not completely souls like but a bit of a better combat i will like it too.

[tame geode]

No nero, I understand things just fine.

[mystic wharf]

You seem to be smart only when it suits you though

[tame geode]

You're not interested in understanding why folks have issue with your stance, and thats ok.

I'm not interested in wasting anymore of your time trying to help you defend your point better.

[mystic wharf]

Lol i never said that it will improve the game i said im just interested in the idea dont put me in the same Bag as them .

[teal canopy]

when does ark 3 comming out XD

[dire needle]

True sorry.

[mystic wharf]

But whatever ark 2 is far away so a bit useless to talk about it.

[blissful perch]

I’d say lost colony’s tek spear might be the closest we got, and that’s a very far cry from a true souls-like or monster hunter combat system

[untold ingot]

The Mei yin boss fight was supposed to be a teaser

[pearl vale]

3000

[untold ingot]

And it was rife with bugs and invincibility glitches between stances.

I think it's very prudent at this stage to temper expectations until we see something real.

[novel nacelle]

Can someone come to N39.09° W84.98° pls I need obsidian spear but can't get into colony ship caves to find some

[rare rock]

well that would be the best outcome for me personally, but it’s likely not going to be the case. Can only wait and see until 2030 or something where I’ll be 20, I don’t even know if I’ll still be a gamer by then or not

[untold ingot]

Habits are hard to break. If you game a lot now, chances are you'll game more in your 20s.

[rare rock]

I haven’t turned on my PlayStation or played a video game in 8 months but I used to fairly game a lot , now I don’t really have any passion for games except for wanting to try out Asa again and the upcoming FH6 and F1 26. That’s it

I would prefer if I entirely stop gaming at 19 at max , but who knows

[untold ingot]

I hear that from kids a lot these days. There is nothing wrong with playing a few games now and again. The problem comes when you get addicted to it

As long as you have someway to relax after crazy work/study days it's fine.

[rare rock]

yeah I just don’t trust myself man especially after what happened during the pandemic with my ps3 😂

[untold ingot]

Yeah definitely dont then.

[rare rock]

really don’t want that to happen again after I finish these upcoming exams , cus the only reason I haven’t played in so long is cus the PlayStation is hidden somewhere

[untold ingot]

I do feel bad for kids who were in school during covid, yall got screwed over by government policies.

[rare rock]

real

[opal rapids]

.

[mystic wharf]

Same for me but me its a bit différent its rather there is things that i dont like in a game

But nvm I wonder if the mouvements in asa 2 will be janky as asa 1 or not

That would be strange if it will be the same janky game

[rare rock]

wait is it asa2 ase2 or just ark2

[dire needle]

You seem so agressive though, i find nothing wrong with what he said , maybe the problèm comes within yourself

[rare rock]

I think he does not like your face

[tame geode]

Your confusing impatience for aggressiveness.

I kinda bounced back and forth with trying to help that kid understand why it seems like so many may be against his opinion, and realizing it's pointless because there's some sort of communication barrier preventing them from ever understanding.

[mystic wharf]

What kind of impatience did you ever had ? Saying im interested about ark 2 combat is what makes you impatient ? Then you are the only problem if that makes you impatient.

[tame geode]

I tried to be fair, and recognize that potential barrier, and was immediately insulted. Twice.

[mystic wharf]

But whatever men no need to come back on that i ignored his message on purpose Yesterday so i dont need to argument on nonsense comments again, so just ignore it

[tame geode]

Nero, you still don't even know what I was saying, and you refuse to try after I've explained it several times. That's why I've gotten impatient with you.

In the least offensive way possible, it's like arguing with a LLM while trying to fix its prompt.

Crazy I was deemed the aggressor after essentially being called stupid three times, and still tried to rectify the miscommunication gap.

[mystic wharf]

You have 0 arguments , you only seem to be toxic and that's all

You are talking in a bad way without explaining the true subject that affects you , which means you have 0 arguments

[tame geode]

Oh, you're trolling. I get it now.

You were actually getting me worked up for a sec.

[mystic wharf]

How am i trolling when you have 0 arguments ?

You are just forcing peoples to like asa more than ark 2 that's all i saw

[tame geode]

Wow...

You're good.

[tame geode]

Hear me out Nero. Take a moment and reread this message, but with a different slightly more positive tone.

[mystic wharf]

Ik You are trolling , but since im not like you Im gonna talk seriously, the thing is that i already read that but strangely you seem to be smart only when it suits you and try to not understand when it doesn't suits you.... So at that point that's not my problèm that's yours

[tame geode]

Another insult. Fair enough.

[mystic wharf]

There is no insult just the truth but you insult a lot though.

So now be serious and stop trolling, bring arguments because you seem to insult only without talking about the actual story which makes you look like a troll, i think that you rather have issues with everyone that has a different opinion than you,i encountered a fair amount of guys like you , who were crying because of having different opinions i see that a lot , so the Stance you are talking about comes from you not from me , because what i see is that you act like you want ark 2 but then when someone like me says im more into ark 2 , you become Frustrated and mad for no reason , so where is the so called ark 2 that you suposedly want? , it really seem and feels hypocritical from your part

[dire needle]

Stop trolling.

[mystic wharf]

The reality is that You dont care about what is right , you just want to force your opinions into others , so ye continue to troll it will not change anything , im different than you , to my point of view everyone has his own liberty to have an opinion they want , i can't stand the ones who force me to their own opinions , so ye the Stance is rather peoples having problems within themselves not me

[dire needle]

True

[mystic wharf]

But in reality looking at your tone it looks like you just want play games like a child you play with words with such egocentric way , and i already know that you know what you are doing which is so disgusting, you already know that you are in the wrong but doesn't want to accept it because it hurts your ego and you hâte being wrong although you already know you are wrong , that kind of behavior is disgusting and unacceptable, you speak about me saying to talk in a positive tone in the message above although you are the only one hating on ark 2 and being toxic forcing peoples to agree to your opinion so ye nobody gonna believe your game , it can already be seen thé reality is that you dont care about what is toxic or not you just want to be right even when you arent and you want peoples to agréé with you on opinions

[winged dome]

Block and ignore. Both of them have nothing to actually contribute while they insult and rage bait. Few people have fallen victim already, save your time and don't acknowledge

[mystic wharf]

The only one rage baiting and insulting is the 2/3 of you hating on ark 2 and forcing peoples opinion to be like yours , i dont understand why you are still trying to make a point ? Everyone can see that you are being annoying forcing peoples to agree on your opinion even more proof you have no arguments

That's crazy how much hypocritical you are thats insane

[winged dome]

🥱

So, any new Ark2 takes?

[mystic wharf]

So just because someone agrees with me, they have to be blocked? What kind of immaturity and controlling behavior is that? First you target me, now you target him too?
That’s honestly just toxic and egocentric. So anyone who disagrees with you gets blocked?
Good job showing your true person and how ridiculous you are you won a prize

[rare rock]

bruddas , get a room

[scenic bison]

@rare rock oh ja yes 🤣

[mystic wharf]

I blocked them , you should too they are so pathethic, at least everyone can see who is hating on which game and who is being controliing so the fact that they want to be in denial although everyone can see who is wrong is beyond me their ego is so High , that guy named zen thinks peoples owe him something so everyone that isnt in his side should be blocked , so immature and egocentric guys , i decided to not pay attention anymore to these kids , also one last thing is that they hâte on ark 2 so why in the world they come in the ark 2 section ? To being annoying and that's it ? They are so strange

[dire needle]

Already done. As soon as I saw that creepy zen comment I knew it wasn’t even worth responding to.
I’m not going to waste time talking to peoples that irrelevant.

[mystic wharf]

Good, are you a computer player or a console player ?

[mild beacon]

.

[dire needle]

Console

[dire needle]

But btw At first, I wasn’t that interested in Ark 2’s combat, but the more I think about it, the more it actually seems like a really good idea.
So yeah, I’m starting to agree with the new direction , it could be really dope if the developers do it right.
ASA honestly got me bored, it always feels like the same thing.
I’m way more interested in Ark 2 now, I just want something new.

[astral token]

see y'all next decade then

Bcz ARK II before 2030 aint happening

[mystic wharf]

Then we see you in next decade we will still play it we are the lovers of ark 2 not the haters

[astral token]

Everyone in this chat is ARK II lover

[mystic wharf]

No they dont lmao they are haters of ark 2 they insulted me Just because i said ark 2 is more my type of game , i dont even know what they are doing in the ark 2 section if its to hate on it, probably just wanting to bother others and being annoying and toxic to other Peoples

[pearl lichen]

Not that deep js a game

[mystic wharf]

It’s kind of deep when there are a lot of haters insulting for no reason, just because you prefer Ark 2.
But I don’t care I still think Ark 2 is more my type of game.
What’s funny is that those same people says to others like they’re good peoples and that they want ark 2 but in reality they dont even care and they are the complete opposite of what they say

[astral token]

:O I don't see any haters

[winged dome]

Love is a strong word.
Care for, and interested in the well-being of, absolutely. I'll save love for the first date~ (gameplay)

[pearl lichen]

I haven’t seen any haters either, the game hasn’t even been released so it’s premature to hate on it

[mystic wharf]

I already know that a small amount of peoples wants ark 2 so there is gonna be plenty of peoples that will try to deny hâtes or hating on others although you can see the comments, but the thing is that i play for what i like , not for what other peoples like , so it's not because some prefer asa that i should perfer asa too that's all i have to say , i like asa but not at 100 percent , certain aspect of the game can be better , that's why ark 2 can do a better job a it maybe and then i could say that's an amazing game but forcing on me will Never work

[rare rock]

I don’t know man who insulted you?

there’s no hater here for ark except maybe veloci

even then , he was just making a point

we love ark2 but we just want it to come out before 2030

[pearl lichen]

Bro that’s not true at all, people wanted ark 2 before ase but they made an ase instead of ark 2 because they lost money with trying to make a car company

And they needed a way to make their money back

[pearl lichen]

Exactly

[broken otter]

I just hope that snail games gets bought or can keep being on NASDAQ

[worldly garden]

There are no haters of ARK 2 in this chat because no-one can hate a game that doesn't exist. Some people just get a bit too emotional in here.

[mystic wharf]

Strangely some get mad for no reason when someone says ark 2 is more my type of game and even throws insults but aparently they arent haters of ark 2.... That's pathethic i dont even know why im still talking to peoples that are trolling and denying facts

[oblique horizon]

correct, that would not be hating on ark 2. it is just people sharing their opinion about deciding to like a game when we only have vague text descriptions about it.

[mystic wharf]

I was kidding actually.... They are hating on ark 2 since they insulted me when i said ark 2 is more my type

[untold ingot]

Dare I respond?

[winged dome]

Don't bother.

You'd get more engagement and less of a headache slamming your head into a brick wall - repeatedly

[mystic wharf]

That's why ark 2 is more my type , i get bored of asa combat , asa combat is not even a combat lol its just animations , i dont like the fact that the movement animations has just one type too and since im more of a 3rd person player then ark 2 is the perfect game for me , i also want a caméra détached from the body because i dont like the feeling when you only can go forward it just feels like there is no feeling in it i dont even feel like im playing at all and it just feels boring , i like asa but if they change these tiny things then it would be Amazing

[tame geode]

Yeah, the juice ain't worth the squeeze. Just a super weird series of interactions.

[mystic wharf]

Ye he was being the worst so far ....

[tame geode]

As long as it's clear I'm hating on both ASA and Ark 2 it's whatever. (I miss ASE though...)

I don't think I was actually being as confrontational as it seems. Just a squeaky wheel following my long messages.

Peeps should have strong opinions. It shows they care. I do like challenging folks efficacy though. It makes their argument stronger for others when they have a well thought out defence. Like I said before though, other times it's tilting at windmills.

[winged dome]

Peeps should also know that having a differing opinion doesn't mean you're attacking them directly or to take the disagreement personally - so far as to sink to insults and name calling just becomes cringe.

[mystic wharf]

When the opinion is being driven in an agressive, insulting and disrespectful way its not an opinion anymore its a mix of hatred/agression , the goal is trying to force someone to like something that you like but i guess you are too egocentric to admit it

You see things that way , if you dont agree with me you are against me and its Even more strange that veloci who seem smart when hé want to have that ridiculous mentality

[untold ingot]

Fr. Especially about games, there are so many other things in life to be upset about. Its wierd to get worked up over strangers opinions on games, especially when they dont exist yet.

[rare rock]

exactly I mean this is why the channel was created in the first place , for discussion

[untold ingot]

It has been a long time since we had fun conversations about ark2 here.

[rare rock]

I mean it’s outdated , ark 4 is almost here

[rare rock]

nooooooooooo man that’s so wrong. Someone disagrees with you does not mean he’s against you, seriously

if so then it gets personal but that’s not case , veloci was just criticizing what is APPARENTLY going to be in ark 2 no one is against you I can assure you

you might have just got the wrong tone , but this is text can’t really know yfm. He also said to read what he’s saying in a good way , because he wasn’t trying to come off as rude, or something like that

[mystic wharf]

I was not talking about me i was talking about them , they have the mentality of if im not with them im against them ,that's why the guy were saying disrespectful comments towards me , i dont have the same mentality but if they want think like that its their choice im not here to say how someone has to think , i let everyone have his own freedom that's why i can't stand when someone force me to like something when i dont like it , because then i can do the exact same thing to them and force them to like something i like but what's funny is that they will be exactly acting like me saying dont force me wouldnt they ?

[tame geode]

Yeah, I know I have a tendency to write like a teacher/crappy politician. I'm not gonna pretend like my responses are all puppy dogs and skittles, but I would definitely encourage folks to read each other responses with a grey perspective as opposed to black and white. I've been there before where I've misread intent. So, know if it seems like I'm pointing the finger, I've got three back at myself. Crazy how text can be simultaneously one of the best forms of communication and the worst.

[winged dome]

If people want to play the victim, then they'll twist whatever you say to make it a personal attack against them and ignore all other points/discussions. Once they're on the defensive, they'll keep bringing up the same perceived slights over and over because they don't have anything else to contribute to normal discussions

[tame geode]

You are very correct. They'll also mirror your responses back at you even if they have no merit. However, this whole rabbit hole about actor movement (I think that was part of what got us here) kinda brings up a good point of discussion.

One would hope that Ark 2 introduces a more nuanced behavior tree system. Very subtle additions can really make a difference to the feel of creatures, and any dilettante can go online to find tutorials on how to create those sorts of robust high performance systems in ue5 blueprints. It really just comes down to attention to detail. Taking the time to design a modular/diverse set of parent classes, and solving some of the EQS issues ASA seems to have.

Either way, I think many folks would agree, they had better remake everything from scratch. They can solve those issues. Unfortunately because it's a business, that doesn't mean they will solve those issues.

[mystic wharf]

And Sadly you are showing us that you are the only victim by saying things you dont even explain, because i already explained everything wanting to deny it a hundred Time not going to change any fact because you are the only one with 0 arguments where i clearly explained why both of you are haters of ark 2 with sentences and proofs taken from your own words but you you are just talking without even talking about the story itself and bring 0 arguments to défend your position which again makes you look like a troll and a guy that just wants to deny stuff instead of someone that wants to understand and be serious

[winged dome]

Exhibit A: Twisting words and meanings for their own benefit

[woeful grove]

Just a reminder to everyone here. Ark 2 is a lie. You are already playing it

[winged dome]

If I didn't like/care for Ark2, I wouldn't be active in this chanel and no other in this entire Discord. Its literally the only reason I'm here lol

[mystic wharf]

Then why being agressive when someone says that ark 2 is more his type of game? 🤔, kind of sound contradictory

[winged dome]

When have I ever done that. Link it.

[split dove]

(He can't)

[winged dome]

(Impossible challenge)

[mystic wharf]

Dont say i can't when you dont even understand anything of what were are talking about Flob thanks

[split dove]

His source is that he made it the fck up

[mystic wharf]

The way you seem frustrated over me in saying block them

[tame geode]

I just like dinosaurs. And taking care dinosaurs, raising them, fighting with them, combined with what used to be a cool story was everything you could want in a dinosaur game. ASE was kind of unprecedented for the amount of content the game has, and even taught more things I appreciate like pvp politics, planning, and organization. Hopefully Ark 2 will be able to reinvent the concepts we all love, reduce some of the garbage, but still capture the essence of why we picked up the game in the first place.

[mystic wharf]

And veloci is the best example

Of how hatred i received when i said ark 2 is more my type of game

[winged dome]

Waiting for link

[mystic wharf]

You already know that you wanted to block me for no reson, acting ignorant although you already know it doesn't
Gonna change anything

[winged dome]

Waiting for link (doesn't exist)

[split dove]

[tame geode]

I keep giving that kid opportunities to talk about Ark 2. I guess that's not what they're here for.

[mystic wharf]

Dm me then zen i will give u

But i guess you dont care

That's not your goal

[split dove]

Oh oh no, don't forget the camera possition for third person view

[tame geode]

Give that kid a cracker or something. I swear he was talking about movement too.

[mystic wharf]

Flobs how strange are you

[winged dome]

Man, these Discord Bots got more links than examples Nero is trying to call me out for (again, don't exist)

[tame geode]

(That's me being a bully, see how that works)

[mystic wharf]

We dont even understand what are you trying to say you just look like a child playing with words you dont Even understand

[split dove]

You named your mirror after me? Talk about obsessed already

[mystic wharf]

Oh i forgot i blocked u i dont remember why but there is a reason

[winged dome]

Now whose the hypocrite?

[mystic wharf]

Why you speak about the 3 rd person view ? Yes i like it so ?

Are you good?

[tame geode]

Mirroring would be a cool creature tactic in Ark 2. Like dilos that try to mimic your movement. Kinda like the scene from Jurassic park.

[split dove]

Every projection from him is a confession

[mystic wharf]

You talk about yourself more than me flobs

[split dove]

You really are the pot and the kettle ya know that?

[mystic wharf]

Your expression is so Cheesy

[tame geode]

I'm the ladle.

[winged dome]

That would be pretty neat - or like Raptor packs running around to flank/attack from multiple directions/hit and run instead of running straight to their target

[mystic wharf]

Really neat

It means easier gameplay , mostly in pvp

[tame geode]

Right, I think you can actually have that sort of event dispatcher logic. I'm not too sure how resource intensive it would be to have like a linked behavior tree for pack bonuses. But man, coordinated attacks would get me to play for sure. Put the fear back in the game.

Wait I actually know you CAN do that. I've seen vids of folks designing behaviors trees to wait on other enemies in order to stagger attacks. It's the same sort of root logic.

[mystic wharf]

You can still run straight to a target with that caméra

You are just making stuff up of your own head that isnt what it looks like

[winged dome]

Camera has nothing to do with this particular discussion.

Whose making stuff up now?

[mystic wharf]

Bro likes to troll hard whatever do you know that a lot of peoples use the camera i want ?

And even if not who Cares

[split dove]

Delusional

[mystic wharf]

You are still trying to force me to belive the asa cam is good

[winged dome]

I mean, sure ...? But again, camera has nothing to do with a discussion on Wild Creature AI

[tame geode]

🦜

[mystic wharf]

Tell me when i spoke about creature ai and i will explain if i did

Like i said the camera i want is easier for pvp gameplay, and i was talking about more challenging dino ai not other kind of stuff dont mix everything its harder to play pvp when you can't see behind you to avoid ennemies so ye asa caméra is not the best

[winged dome]

We were talking about Creature AI, and you tried to bring camera into it. What does camera have to do with Creature AI?

[mystic wharf]

We never spoke about creature ai dude flobs was talking about third person camera

[split dove]

What a c(r)ockwomble you are, genuinely

[mystic wharf]

But go ahead

With creature ai

What's up with that

[winged dome]

You inserted your camera mechanics into our discussion though.

Truly, whats up with that?

[mystic wharf]

Flobs can answer it

But what's up about creature ai?

What about it

[winged dome]

You can, since you're the one bringing Camera mechanics into the discussion

[mystic wharf]

Flobs did it

Im not flobs you know?

[split dove]

If you can't even give an answer yourself best not instigate

[winged dome]

Bruh.

[mystic wharf]

Im nero

Bruh what?

Asa cam is so boring

[split dove]

Bait used to be believable

[winged dome]

Well, another interesting discussion ruined thanks to someone bringing up camera mechanics once again

Hate to see it

[mystic wharf]

Listen zen make a new camera for asa and then we could be friends

[winged dome]

See, the thing is, I don't really mind the camera in ASA.
Please stop trying to force your opinion onto me, its okay for others to have opinions other than yourself

[split dove]

Nuh uh! /s

[mystic wharf]

You cant try to be right

You rather look ridiculous

Where i forced my opinion on u?

[winged dome]

My opinion is my opinion. There is no 'right or wrong', merely personal preference

[mystic wharf]

In your Dreams maybe

I guess

[winged dome]

You're the one offering friendship for making a new camera system

[mystic wharf]

So mine is wrong then since you agresséd me

[winged dome]

Where have I said your opinion is wrong?

[mystic wharf]

I though there werent a right or wrong opinion

[winged dome]

Link it

[mystic wharf]

By agressing me my opinion is not good why agressing me then if my opinion is good ?

[winged dome]

But you're the one who inserted your opinions about an unrelated system into an ongoing discussion...? How is that me aggressing?

Again, link it. I'll wait.

[mystic wharf]

Why You wanted to block me then ? Just because my opinion was Wrong

I though there isnt a good or wrong opinion to you

[winged dome]

Please don't put words into my mouth - I didn't block you because of your opinion

I blocked you because I find you insufferable

But thats my opinion - and is neither right nor wrong

[mystic wharf]

You found me insufferable because of the fact that i didn't agreed with you

[winged dome]

No, I find you insufferable because you try and twist other people's words, victimize yourself, and bring up the same points over and over again ad nauseum

[mystic wharf]

How i twist other peoples words ? Give me an example then

[winged dome]

There are plenty of other peoples' opinions I strongly disagree with, but am still able to hold a polite and productive conversation with

[mystic wharf]

Then answer to that

[winged dome]

Exhibit B:

[mystic wharf]

Hey are you there lol

How im i twisting peoples words

Give me an example

[winged dome]

You continuing to try and claim that I and others hate Ark2, despite being told this is literally the only channel in this Discord that I care about/am active in

[mystic wharf]

I only say what i see , you are just trying to défend some because you know them more than me or because they are your Friends

[winged dome]

I'm defending myself against your baseless accusations.

[mystic wharf]

Again why being agressive when i said im more into ark 2 than asa then

[split dove]

Want to make a bingo chart?

[winged dome]

Already have one halfway completed across 3 lines

[tame geode]

I'm almost entirely convinced that folks are planting LLM rooted accounts into this discord server.

It has to be...

[winged dome]

I'm ... not being aggressive? I'm answering your questions politely and without the use of insults

[north grail]

You're into vapourware?

[mystic wharf]

Repeating words doesn't mean that you are a bot its a strategy

[split dove]

Insert the doakes suspicious stare from Dexter meme

[winged dome]

Think we broke the bot lol

[mystic wharf]

Whatever i might play some games kind of bored, cya after maybe if you are still here Alex

[tame geode]

It's all part of the strategy...

I'm too stupid for this shit lol

[winged dome]

I want to think they realized how ridiculous their attempts at logic and conversation were getting, and decided to quit while they were behind

But that is ... just my opinion

[tame geode]

Anyway, if y'all did have interest in what I was referencing about the behavior tree stuff, one of the youtube channels I was alluding to was Ali Elzoheiry. He has several vids designing "Smart Enemy AI" and team combat was one of the vids in the series. Very interesting if you're a nerd, like me.

and one on group enemy combat. So, the head knowledge is out there.

[winged dome]

I have no programming experience whatsoever, but learning about game AI (not the bad kind of AI) would be neat to listen to

[tame geode]

I think his vids are fairly digestible in that it's less of a tutorial and more of reasoning to get to a goal.

He even covers EQS and nav mesh stuff. How AI selects its targets, enemy "senses" so to speak to determine when they can "see" or "hear" the player

[tribal chasm]

I find in recent versions of Ark, a lot of the PvE difficulty is removed because of how easy the game has become. You gather more resources than ever, your gear is better than ever, your character is stronger than ever etc.

They can modify dinos and make them smart as they want, but unless they actually balance the game in Ark 2 it will go to waste

[tame geode]

Like I said, using words I don't know the meaning of apparently, even a dilettante can install UE5 and with a little inspired passion you can make all kinds of cool stuff.

What would be cool is if there was a difficulty value maybe tied to the player experience lelvel or something that scaled the functionality of what the wild AI could do. That might be way to intesive, but then you could balance simpler dino AI for newer players that would progress as the player progresses.

Kind of one of the gripes with 7D2D is that it's one game stage for everyone.

With how the behavior trees works, I would image you could just set a series of bool inequalities to determine the weights of certain actions based on the current aggrod actor*.

[winged dome]

[In my opinion] (Since apparently this needs to be very clearly stated these days,)
One of the worst things that happens in Ark is the ability to skip the entire Early Game. Note Runs can get a fresh character to mid-lategame exp-wise in like an hour or so. Extra levels means higher stats to make resource collection and taming way easier. Like you mentioned, AI is easy to manipulate to get an end-game tame with very basic materials. At that point, the 'survival' aspect of the game is completely moot.

Easily manipulateable AI makes the majority of the game trivial then, the only real threats are other players who also abuse the same mechanics

[blissful perch]

there's a few major flaws in ark's current difficulty design, and note runs is top three for sure. The other two are gear strength via absurd loot drop powerscaling and mutation stacking

[tame geode]

Yeah, it's kind of that balance when it comes to player progression vs player experience right? Older players can/will manipulate the system to get out of the tedious bits of early they may not like, but then miss out on the "difficulty" of not having enough weight or health for whatever tasks.

[winged dome]

Scaling AI response would be ... kinda crazy. Scaling based on map region (kind of how like some MMOs do it with essentially re-used enemys with new abilities/higher stats) might be a viable approach

[blissful perch]

with player stats so high, AI becomes meaningless...you can take near infinite damage and one shot whatever you fight

the biggest issue with AI itself scaling with player progression (rather than say, putting tougher AI in creatures found in more challenging parts of a map) is that this can 1) be abused by alts or 2) makes it tough for well intentioned players who are trying to play together but aren't synced by level

ark does desperately need difficulty however that comes in other forms than "go get 10,000 metal ingots"

[winged dome]

Valheim kinda has this problem - Raid difficulty scales off the number of bosses defeated in a particular world, so new players to a group could get their teeth kicked in by end-game raids

[tame geode]

Yeah, thats why I was proposing the creature AI taking the value of it's specific target as opposed to the average around it. You can always use a dummy character to try and tank, but then it's not gonna have enough HP.

And if you lose aggro it's behavior tree options open up.

[blissful perch]

my opinion is to simplify a lot: just have some creatures with more challenging or complex AI than others

[tame geode]

Honestly they should do both. They kind of allude to this in the current games. With things like diplo mindlessly "playing" with you until it dies, or megaraptor stalking you from the fog.

[blissful perch]

similar to a lot of open world games, some creatures should be avoided by weaker players and others can be approached/engaged more safely by them. An ark 2 dodo doesn't need a supercharged AI, but a pack of deadly raptors with one can give early game players something to fear...while a rex that ambushes and stalks later game areas presents a tougher challenge for later game players

[tame geode]

You're right that things like a dodo doesnt need super advanced AI, but I would hate to just copy and paste what other open world games have done for their progression. Thaty's kind of what make ark great to begin with was not just the yoinking, but the twisting of existing concepts in very untraditional ways.

And I honestly don't think it's too far out of reach to have dynamic real time AI. Especially with some of the other stuff they want to have in the game.

I'm just hopeful that they do something unique and inspired to help make Ark 2 a better successor to the current games.

[blissful perch]

I'd argue that adding a very gamey ai shift based on player level would probably be a step backwards to older open world concepts

a positive trend in the genre is that players don't need to be able to beat everything in the space they're in. Sometimes the big scary thing is right in the beginner zone, and being smart and cautious is a huge part of the gameplay

[tame geode]

Would you happen to have specific example in mind of what you mean? What I'm suggesting via words could be too generic of my intent.

[winged dome]

Sneak gameplay my beloved

[tame geode]

Like when y'all mentioned raptors, using current game mechanics, maybe they dont pounce players until they their implant has gamma brood, or they something. Maybe they get a gashing bleed after you unlock beta dragon.

[blissful perch]

I'm thinking of, for example, MMOs like runescape. The enemies are largely reskins of each other and attack the same, but have greater stats as you progress (it's not dynamic, but it's a simple picture of my point about "gameyness")

as for relying on stuff like implant level to alter behavior, that adds a ton of complication in a multiplayer setting. If a raptor "learns" to pounce gamme players and is stalking one, what happens when a gamma player and non-gamma player are side by side?

[tame geode]

We kinda have that dont we? Just on different maps. aberrant variations with shifted stats, X-creatures with buffed stats, etc. We also have "alpha" variants whose AI is supposed to be higher quality.

[blissful perch]

I think a potentially better idea is to have the full suite of complex AI available for a given creature, but put players in better or worse situations to deal with them. Take raptors. Imagine in an early game area raptors can only spawn in packs of 1 or 2, and in later game or more dangerous areas raptors can spawn in packs of 4-6. Larger pack size dramatically complicates the challenge if packs can ambush or fan out to search for players - so the AI behavior is the same, but the challenge is magnified by a more simple equation

especially if raptors behaved differently based on pack size, similar to how Deinopithicus works - where a single raptor may be more cautious but a big pack will be more bold

[tame geode]

I think they could easily have both ideas.

[blissful perch]

you could then explore those "new behaiors" as you advance across the game's world and gather experience as a player (ie the person playing the game)

[tame geode]

Becaus ecertain area sof the map should be more dangerous than others.

[winged dome]

It'd also be nice if all carnivores weren't hyper aggressive murder machines. A cooldown on hunts, or hunger-based hunts could add new dynamics to nearly half the roster

[tame geode]

ASA/ASE already tries to do that, but we as a player get a flyer, and everything becomes easy.

[winged dome]

Fliers should be nerfed heavily imo

[tame geode]

However, that still comes back to what was alluded to before with power creep. I think one of the online jokes was "Just tame a giga!" and then you kinda win the game. Although thats not 100% true in all aspects of the game, the loop really does seem to have a few targeted creatures that dwarf all other options, and are just as easy to obtain.

Like we're about to experience one of those shifts when genesis drops. Why would I bother focusing an anky breedline when I can just get a magma? I only need the anky for a day or two.

Actually scratch the anky example. Shards are a thing, but the point still stands.

[blissful perch]

again I actually think this goes back to the stats issue

Ai is pointless if players aren't asked to engage with it...doing thousands of damage a giga bite means there is no point in engaging with AI to come up with creative solutions

[tame geode]

I will say when it comes to things like limitations on creature AI forcing all carnivores to be hyper agressive, at least they took the effort to reason it out in the lore. I absolutely loooooove that shit. Literally the only reason I kept playing ark after seeing the trike model for the firs ttime.

[blissful perch]

I agree powercreep is also an issue, but I see it as more of a "balance within the available creature roster" question than one about the broader design of the game world if that makes sense

[blissful perch]

gameplay first, and despite it sounding like i undervalue lore, lore second. Meshing the two is so valuable for immersion

[winged dome]

The only meshing we actually want lol

[tame geode]

Well, it just shows that there was intentional design. Therefor is proof of care in their product.

[blissful perch]

as for fliers, I agree that they need a serious overhaul in ark 2. Combat (air to ground) fliers need to be removed entirely, and fliers should focus on travel and air to air combat

also some more aereal hazards would be nice

[tame geode]

It sucks because flying around on a just prhistoric vulture eagle and just eating murdering stuff is fun. And then it can also carry a ton of crap??? So, it gets hard not to want to use just that guy. Hopefully WC will get really creative with whatever direction they decide to go. In the past they've been able to produce things no one in the community could have expected.

[blissful perch]

creativity is what WC has in spades...what I'm far more concerned with is implementation

[tame geode]

People are adverse to change. So, many people are gonna hate the differences, but those same folks that stick with it, often times look back with, a "yeah, this is definitely better" sort of mindset. Like the flyer nerf for example.

I miss zooming around the map at mach 5, but it was definitely for the best.

[blissful perch]

the flier nerf was definitely controversial, as any player nerf can feel...but using them in caves, mach 5 silliness, and a billion damage a hit? why ever use another type of creature

it's a huge part of why I love Ab so much. Maps feel larger without fliers, you get to learn maps better when you're on foot, and the environment feels more engaged and challenging when you have to interact with it

[tame geode]

I think playing around with skill tree could help blend some of these gaps we've mentioned. I also wonder what the viability of having some sort of prestige system that could tie in with the skill tree for when you make new characters to help alleviate the need to bust out a note run, but also make tedious early game aspects a bit less cumbersome.

You dont really want to make exp useless, but punching trees for thatch can get boring time and time again.

[winged dome]

That is the unfortunate nature of Survival games. We at start at the bottom, punching trees

[tame geode]

I guess ultimately it doesnt really matter how they change those sorts of things. Advanced players are gonna figure out how to manipulate the game.

[winged dome]

Unlockable quest rewards (since theres going to be more of a story focus) maybe? Do enough quests and you get an account bound scaling 'Survivor's Pick' that is an unbreakable pick/axe to make early game resource gathering a bit easier?

[tame geode]

I can't believe all of you hate ark 2.

|| poking the bear||

[winged dome]

Ikr?
Its almost like we don't

[blissful perch]

oh of course we do. only reason we've been here exclusively since 2022 (we hate it a lot)

[blissful perch]

it imo has to do with tedium vs true difficulty

a lot of ark's current difficulty is tied to 1) jank (nobody wants this in ark 2 but it's prolly a certainty) and 2) tedium

lots of survival games transition players to advanced resources rather than basic ones to reduce tedium and push people into later game areas or otherwise away from early game resources. Ark however does the funny meme of instead tripling down on needing thousands of basic resources the entire time you play

[tame geode]

Exactly, I think that's probably why I keep finding myself coming back to the scalable AI thing. Like 100's of megalodons spawning perma aggro'ed from out of render distance isn't hard, it's just tedious.

[blissful perch]

oh dear let's hold oceans for another conversation, but in this case I actually moreso mean the need to even deal with those megalodons because you need 10k silica pearls and you're combing the whole damn ocean before you blow your brains out with boredom

[tame geode]

Now the xiphactinus... I'd say was a welcome change. The first time I got yoinked by one of those guys I'll admit I was puckered.

[blissful perch]

higher quality threats that are more rare imo is always better than the old ark staple of "fill the screen with animals and hope that makes someone die"

[tame geode]

Yeah resource collections tough though. Wildcard doesnt really want us building giant massive bases, so they have to slow us down some how.

[winged dome]

TekCave.jpg

[tame geode]

I'm not too sure what a good solution to that is.

[astral token]

I agree

The early game is actually the best part of ARK imo

And even if u don't want to, you just breeze through it

It's more of a problem with me too, because I guess I've played for so long I know where to go and what to do. I may die a few times but most of those are slip ups

[tame geode]

It didn't use to be that way of course. It's just been a more glaring problem after doubling rates twice. Hopefully they'll figure out a better way to handle that in Ark 2 from scratch knowing what the could come later.

They had no way of really knowing that with ASE.

I remember when the server "currency" was picking stone by hand on the beach.

[winged dome]

Same. Knowing resource locations, relative aggro ranges, even general stat spreads and how the AI works can really trivialize the game over time without really going out of your way to do so

[tame geode]

Kind of alludes to another problem people are gonna have with Ark 2, is that it probably won't reinvent the wheel when it comes to ark games as much as we want it to. with as much experience as folks have with ASE and ASA, it's gonna be really hard to design a game that can capture that feeling cluelessness/helplessnes of unknown things without deviating too far from what Ark has demonstrated that it's about.

Many of us will go in and either be experts at everything from the get go, or maybe we will be clueless because the games so different. Both have their pros and cons. If ark 2 is too much like ark 1, you'll get the kids in here spouting the same ark 2 is ASA type garbage over and over, but if it's too different you'll get folks complaining about the camera.

Wait, I mean, complaining about how it isn't even ark.

[blissful perch]

i see this as two problems: 1) player experience trivializes certain mechanics because game knowledge allows you to bypass or cheese certain things (unavoidable) and 2) player leveling and material progression is so accelerated that you are already at metal tools and guns even if you ignore notes entirely in a few hours at most

[blissful perch]

this was a common complaint in this chat from its earliest days. I think it's very difficult to create a sequel to a sandbox game, and it's also challenging to innovate without punishment. I agree with WC's logic that ark is about creature taming and survival (the rest is mutable), but that's not a universally shared take

however, I also think ark is shackled until it throws some of those old ark 1 mechanics away in ark 2

[tame geode]

Ah see, to me Ark is very different. It was about proving yourself as the ultimate survivor against other players using dinosaurs and base building as a catalyst. They didnt even have PvE servers on launch. It's only really been post ASA, debatably gen 1, that WC has really dug into a shift towards a more PvE centric game.

I say as they literally redesign caves entrances for pvp.

[blissful perch]

ultimately what you describe is a pvp sandbox with a taming and survival focus though right?

[tame geode]

I don't want to simplify, but I think the core concept derived more from "we want to design a pvp game where you fight to be the strongest" followed by "dude, what if there were dinosaurs" Not necessarily even if you can tame the dinosaurs, or any of that.

I may not be doing a great job of translating my thoughts. Ultimately I think they found out... oh people like this in the same way they like pokemon... lets work with that.

I know the lore doesnt dictate the gameplay loop exclusively, but I do think it kinda of highlights their original intent. Most of the non dossiers notes are way more about the politics on the arks rather than anything about the creatures.

Which is crazy given thats debatably the coolest of all the mechanics. It's very intelligent game design. Just a home run when it comes to appealing to as many people as possible, and addictive as fuck.

[blissful perch]

i'm not sure i know enough about the initial ark design intent to agree with that. My understanding though was that pvp was rolled out first because survival meant exactly that...against players and the environment

taming always appeared to be a central focus for the game though

[tame geode]

You're correct, but I think the goal was that the environment was kind of a misdirect, and the people are the real problem. Very similar to jurassic park right.

I know it's kind of a semantic point, but it's important to understand why some pvp folks have already written ark 2 off.

[blissful perch]

i dunno, i think the lore is about people because stories ultimately are about people

i think the biggest reason pvp folks wrote ark 2 off has to do with changing combat mechanics (a huge part of pvp), and a persistent rumor that ark 2 is a pve (or even singleplayer) story game with no pvp even being offered

[tame geode]

I think we're in agreement, I'm just romanticizing the intent. To me (not saying wildcard said this) aside from the first couple of weeks, this game has always been about the people, and the interactions we have. Handling conflict, resolving conflict. If you've ever owned a business, pvp politics is scarily similar to doing business in so many ways. Of course when I joined I thought... "oh cool, a raptor, I gotta tame em all" but if that were the entirety of the gameplay loop, I'd never gotten addicted. Someone kills my raptor...all of a sudden I have motive... a reason to keep playing. That's the story.

[blissful perch]

i see what you're getting at, and yes we're in agreement. what ark is not, and I agree probably should never be, is a creature collector

[tame geode]

That's kind of what I mean by if the game were designed solely around... "ok we want folks to tame dinos how do we make that interesting" well dinos are already interesting.

But pokemon already exists

Honestly, games like ark are probably the reason why folks are getting impatient with gamefreak and nintendo.

[blissful perch]

i'd say what ark is designed around is needing "tames" and relying on them to achieve your goals, and sometimes being scrappy and taming what's around to do what you need to do in a pinch. You spend a lot of time mounted in ark, and I see that as central to its design. What ark is NOT, and I think we agree, is an RPG experience that relies on hunting for "the perfect wild creature" or collecting X number of each creature, collecting them all, etc

[blissful perch]

I think pokemon and its current community outlook is as colored by its age as it is by its real design. Ark may be old, but it's a child compared to the history and impact pokemon has had on gaming and honestly the world and its culture

[tame geode]

Yeah, thats why they have to innovate which was kind of my point.

Pokemon may not need to innnovate... I guess... but ark definitely has too.

That's why when folks come here saying, "ark 2 won't have tek, so blah blah wont be a problem" it's kind of shallow thinking in my opinion. The game has to progress. That's why TEK got to where it is in ASE. ASA had the unfortunate consequences of people alreayd knowing TEK exists. But the progression made total sense if you've been around since the very early days.

[blissful perch]

I'm a bit amused to hear your take on TEK, because I'd argue a huge positive innovation for ark 2 is the exclusion of tek in favor of other forms of progression

[tame geode]

Whatever they choose to use as that catalyist may not be called TEK (even though it still exists), but there will have to be some form of evolution, and being a sci fi game tek, kinda makes sense.

[blissful perch]

though I think it illustrates a very potent point about what "innovation" really means to people. An innovation to WC may be damning to people who have played ark for a decade. That's a big risk for any dev to take

[tame geode]

Right, it's a tough challenge. They can try to design a game that stays only primitive, but how many useful additions can be made to the game before it gets stale. There's a reaosn prim+ didnt make it. People love the early game, including me, but there's has to be development if you want to be relevant for years like ark has. Like, I'm pretty sure ASA is still in the top 20 games on steam. But games like conan or 7d2d, I dont think are.

Minecraft struggles with this problem. I'm convinced if it were for redstone and modders the game would be dead.

I dont think it would've bridged the generational gap like it did. and it got real quiet there for a bit.

That being said, they can delay having to resort to some sort of win the game TEK system by having more diverse early systems in play.

Like considerably more dynamic creature AI, or introducing building mechanics specifically for trapping dinos maybe how we would in real life, not just slapping gates down or whatever.

Even still eventually that stuff gets old, and they'll have to progress the world in some fresh way.

The last thing I want is for Ark 2 to be another "two week stint" kind of thing like minecraft has become. Currently you cant really experience all the game has to offer in two weeks unless you crank rates.

[blissful perch]

In my opinion? An awful lot. There’s a lot you can do with a primitive theme, especially if you’re careful not to over powerscale players. But a more subtle touch may be off putting to people who are used to getting to a sort of godlike/OP status in ark 1

[blissful perch]

I think this is reasonably true for folks in the 20’s and above, but I also think that’s a huge success of the sandbox genre above anything else. People make their own experiences on the Minecraft blueprint, and that’s what keeps so many people engaged for so long. Ark right now has taken a similar angle

[blissful perch]

I’d also say it’s kinda ok for the initial stuff to get “old”. Thats what inspires new content dlc, new mods, new ways to challenge and innovate the game, new player made content types, etc. Ark the series is all about players making their own stories and experiences, which I’d argue is the core to its longevity above everything else

Every game no matter how much content eventually gets old though. It would be unfair to expect anything otherwise

[tame geode]

Unless you can innovate and stay relevant, which has become increasingly more difficult these days. Gen 1 is a huge example of trying a drastic innovation. Many folks hate it. Same reaosn the other guy hates cameras or something, but many folks figured out that you can actually have both aspects in the game. Which is cool.

[blissful perch]

I’d argue that’s making more of the same game. It’s just the modern equivalent of making a new cod game every year

[tame geode]

And after some refinement of course figuring out what works and doesnt, you get some cool stuff. I'll tell ya, I spent way too much in Star dolphin, and those types of things are what gets ya.

[blissful perch]

I don’t see that as a bad thing, but so far nothing has really discarded Ark 1 mechanics just yet and shown us an Ark 2 style innovation (which is fine and to be expected)

[tame geode]

I'm not convinced the cod games actually try anyhting different.

Every DLC WC has been out was a massive innovation to the game for better or worse.

[blissful perch]

They don’t, but it’s the same point. It’s ultimately more ark 1 each time there’s a new dlc. Credit where due, wc is often creative with their dlc content, but they aren’t remaking the wheel with them

[tame geode]

Even scorched, but it only makes sense if you played ark pre scorched.

[blissful perch]

They’re working within the defined boundaries of what Ark 1 is

[tame geode]

You're talking about for Ark 2? You're correect, thats part of the reason why love it or hate it, regardless of what they said about tek, we'll more than likely see aspects of it in working form at some point. It's the fundamental catalyst for every aspect of the story. Which is also why Santiago probably despises it in ark 2.

[blissful perch]

Uh no I was talking about Ark 1 dlc

For tek, the tweet about the tek tier not returning I think was a stroke of genius. The tek tier is wholly unnecessary for Ark 2, but the environmental tek that sets the stage for what Ark is can exist in Ark 2 without players getting jetpacks

[tame geode]

Right, but thats where I get jaded about WC. You used to be able to take what they tweet or post about at face value. Now it all seems like hyperbole or trying to sell something to us whether it's an idea or feature.

I think the phrase is, "the truth will out" we'll see what they end up doing,but we wont know until years from now.

[blissful perch]

Well there is the whole snail games and promises gone sideways aspect, but I try to look past it where I can to retain optimism

Though at the end of the day the best Ark 2 teasers I’m seeing are what’s being test driven in Asa. Lots of what was promised is slowly being added to the game for us to begin to poke at

[tame geode]

I use being jaded with WC's recent decisions as personal reasoning for breaking my addiction to the game. I was weak. There was no balance. That's not their problem, but in the same vein if the reward of playing the game isn't better than the things I can do elsewhere, why would I bother with it? I think many folks feel similar, and may be looking for that out/excuse, and that's another thing Ark 2 has to overcome.

I mean, heck even the transition from ASE to ASA has been a mess.

Their solutions generally aren't black and white. That's what I love about them.

[blissful perch]

I was very invested in ark right up until I realized I was sick of playing tedious games 🤷‍♂️ . It turned me off in a big way from ever really coming back. What excited me most about Ark 2 was a chance to perhaps experience the best part of Ark (the early game primitive part) without the insufferable grinding

[tame geode]

seriously...

[blissful perch]

Ope. Yea you gotta watch that. I lost a few good posts over the years to that

[tame geode]

I think it's worth the effort. Jeremy had mentioned wanting to do something that's, ""Never Been Done In the History of Gaming" (fewer caps, fuck me). I'm hoping that would be some sort of cross compatibility between Ark 2 and ASA. I think that would solve so many issues folks face. Have your two completely different games, that handle very differently, and if you get bored of one you can go to the other whilst retaining some sort of cross game bonuses. Whatever those could be.

[blissful perch]

Oh sweet Jesus I hope there’s no cross talk between the games

[tame geode]

Pokemon has had those kind of interactions in the past, generally one way, but they've always been super cool methods.

[blissful perch]

From what I’ve seen, the creatures just aren’t apples to apples like pokemon has been

The whole stats and skills system may be different enough to make such a thing dubious…ignoring that it’s unclear the ark 1 and ark 2 creatures are even meant to be the same creatures

[tame geode]

Yeah, I don't really know what all that'd entail, but back in the early discussions of ASA that seemed to be something they were hinting at. And so far they've set up so many things as if they were prepping for that.

Even more so now with Legends of Santiago.

[blissful perch]

Ase to Asa would have been nice tho

[tame geode]

And even further so with all the cross Ark 2/ASA cutscene garbage in LC.

[blissful perch]

Well there’s definitely a plot connection

But it sounds like the ark 2 creatures are derived from but not the same as the ark 1 creatures based on “lore” and definitely based on the concept art and materials we’ve seen

[tame geode]

That's also talking about crap from like half a decade ago at this point. Things change. WC's started this "test the waters" bull crap that they can pull out of at any moment when things go south, and that drastically changes what Ark 2 will be. That's kind of my main point to the camera guy.

[blissful perch]

I think a lot of specifics are in the area you describe

But in terms of larger stuff? We’re kinda already seeing it in Asa so I think it’s reasonable to believe it’ll show up

[tame geode]

Sure, but for example. They've started adding these new mechanics that revolve around traversal underground or living underground. They program a rabbit that can dig procedural holes through the landscape, that ends up being an overwhelmingly inadvertent success with community. That in combo with the bunker, and next thing you know, they pivot to a voxelized world for Ark 2. Something like that would change the entire way the game is played. I'm not saying thats what the rabbit will do, or that they would ever do that. Just that none of us know when something sticks too well not to move forward with. Like recently with the missions, I guess, where every story DLC going forward will probably some sort of mission system.

What I suggested is a huge example, I'm mostly alluding to small details that add up over time and change from what they originally presented to us.

[blissful perch]

Instances bases tho actually were part of the ark 2 concept arts where they showed us a “player island” that seemed to be off the main map

So the tek bunker on its face seems to be a test of that exact feature

The exact details I completely agree are subject to change, but a LOT of these mechanics are already integrated and I suspect will pass muster to go into Ark 2

[tame geode]

Maybe, or they just thought is a cool modded structure they wanted to implement. There's literally no way of knowing what they'll do until it exists.

Hopefully. I don't want them to lie to us.

I dont think WC will want to either, but snail...

[blissful perch]

I wouldn’t place a money bet on it, but I also think it’s not that hard to notice Asa content that’s a clear nod to theoretical Ark 2 content

Thralls to test Aratai, blood bench for component crafting, tek spear for parry system to name three

[tame geode]

Sure all of it's leading to something.

Hopefully a good something.

LC was super fun... until they ignored the lamprey/thrall bug for as long as they did... and ignored outpost spawning issues for as long as they did... and started convoluting the lore like they did... hopefully they'll be better going forward. But I think thats what folks are concerned about after a decade of previous questionable mixed decisions.

I hate ark 2 though, and anyone that likes ark 2 can suck it. /s

[gray anchor]

is ark 2 gonna take up 2 computers of storage

2000 gb I bet

[tame geode]

15... no 50 computers of storage!!! A whole brontobyte of storage!!!!! || It's a real thing look it up. ||

We've now come full circle from the multidisk PS1 days where you'll require multiple PC's to even play part of the game. The devs themselves can only collectively run 1/5 of the entirety of Ark 2 amongst all of their PC's.

How have they managed to accomplish such a monumental task! It must be intentional!

[split dove]

Did we manage to actually have a good design discussion, without being derailed for once?

[tame geode]

Not really... we didn't quite manage to get to the camera.

[split dove]

Dang. we were on the verge of greatness, we were this close

[kindred osprey]

I def didnt read this whole discussion and find it super interesting as a new player to ark! (Started playing ~1 year ago)
Im not very competitive so i dont play pvp, i agree on the powerscaling being wack but tbh i like having the option of getting absolutely busted tames to nuke my enemies with (if my love of shadowmanes wasnt enough of a hint)
I run my own server that i invite very few people to, the whole point is that im playing the way i like and despite people continuously judging me for that i believe it should be respected. Im enjoying the game, its fun to me and the people i play with enjoy it too isnt that all that matters?

Honestly the thought of ark 2 hasnt interested me much due to me not really caring all that much for the "souls-like" genre but you guys' discussion actually made me reconsider and i think i will genuinely play ark 2 when/if it comes out!

The way ive been playing has been just experiencing the game how i like (boosted rates so grinding isnt tedious, allowing myself to explore the building mechanics in creative mode and just creating dinos that are OP i can get attached to and care for)
Also mods are a huge part of how i play! It varies the game play map to map greatly and adds new things for me to discover and play with! Keeps the game fresh with new experiences :p (even if sometimes its something as stupid as filling the map with 15 kaijus and hoping the playthrough goes smooth) would highly reccomend!

Just wanted to give some of my perspective on ark as a new-ish player (since you guys seem to only have the veteran view on this)

[tame geode]

You bring up a good point. Wildcard's been pretty good about allowing folks to customize the game in almost every way, and I do feel like that gets lost on a lot of folks who are skeptical about Ark 2.

I guess it kinda seems like they're laying down the hammer when they say things like, "Meh, games gonna be third person only... kick rocks if you don't like it." Which is almost something you'd think should just be an option. It debatably could be an option. So, I don't blame folks for being hesitant when it seems like they're cutting options that should be kind of a given. "What if they cut the option to adjust maturation! I already spend too long staring at babies asses!" An extreme example, but you know...

The 3rd/1st person argument is considerably more nuanced, but for folks that don't know programming they might not see it as a big deal.

[blissful perch]

I’m a huge fan anytime someone gives thoughtful feedback like yourself, especially as a new player - even though with Ark I’m just a player like you 😛 . Your points are extremely reasonable though! Ark is fist and foremost a sandbox experience, and your points to me speak to the value of a baseline experience that retains customizability

A lot of my conversation and discussion about nerfing things etc is for the baseline experience, but I’d firmly retract my entire stance on nerfing fliers, players, etc if WC didn’t plan to allow modding or settings changes that made the game easier for folks (I just assume they would though 😅)

[shrewd portal]

Y

[winged dome]

Im enjoying the game, its fun to me and the people i play with enjoy it too isnt that all that matters?
This. This right here is something people too often forget. Mods, customizability, and being able to tweak the experience to your liking is such a massive part of the Ark experience. Official servers are the minority of the player base (despite being the loudest complainers)

[somber fable]

Ark is so fun

[mystic wharf]

It can be a lot better

There is tiny things that kind of drove the fun away for me but its something personal, there is no true fun

[untold ingot]

Rip, the first interesting conversation in literally years and I missed it 😭

[untold ingot]

Honestly wc devotion to allowing pve and casual play be completely unlimited is what gives ark it's allure compared to other similar games, I think it's the main reason ark is still relatively popular

[untold ingot]

No no, you know if you don't min max pvp then you are a terrible person 🤣

[mystic wharf]

I feel that asa has the less challenging dinos comparing with other games i played , so making the ennemies even less agressive will just make the game more boring tbh , unless if you just like asa for the building, im more of a warrior type of player personnaly

[hearty osprey]

pve and SP is what keeps ark going

[untold ingot]

I know 🤣

[rare rock]

exactly , like if I could have that with ase on console I would’ve never touched asa until it is fully stable

but , all friends switched to asa , game literally is unplayable without mods etc.

[rare rock]

I’m always bob the builder

[kindred osprey]

Lol so many times people here have heard how i play the game and immediately started dog piling on me for it, im glad you all were able to see my point of view :)

[blissful perch]

I’m sorry to hear that! It’s one thing to bicker with people when you’re choosing rates and mods for a server to all play on, but when it comes to the broader community? Play what you want

The only time I get a bit passionate is when people want some of that stuff in the base game…Ark doesn’t need 100 Mach 20 insta kill dragons for example as a vanilla experience. But by all means mod it in if you crave it - and I’d never bash that

[untold ingot]

How dare you enjoy playing a game. It's unheard of

[kindred osprey]

"Im not having fun so you cant be either 😡 "

[untold ingot]

Exactly 🤣

[kindred osprey]

Ofc it shouldnt be in the base game that would be ridiculous

[tame geode]

Yeah, imagine if they started adding modded ideas like fire shadowmanes or Harry Potter thestrals. It'd completely ruin a lot of the world building they've setup over the years.

[untold ingot]

I was drinking milk, you can't do that to me

[kindred osprey]

Firemanes... just a pyromane with extra steps

Oh wait

Ignore me lmao

[kindred osprey]

Yeah why would they do that? Next youre gonna tell me theyd add some wierd amphibious slug creature that shoots lasers with its eyes 🙄

[iron crescent]

gang gang #1

[valid locust]

Ark 2 release on?

[tame geode]

Well, even if they did add a creature who could shoot laser beams from its eyes, at least we wouldn't see folks running around in something straight out of children's cartoons. Imagine you were getting fobbed, and someone pulls up in a transformers triceratops skin, and then that starts shooting a death beam out of it's chest that is way more powerful than anything else.

That's actually irritating. I've gotta drop that topic. Super funny in hindsight, but really sucks in the moment.

[unkempt vigil]

Cual es el mejor mod para un tecnico

What is the best mod for a survival game?

[blissful perch]

I really respected The Hunted for ase, though I simply haven’t seen enough mods to pick a “best”

[winged dome]

Entirely based on personal preference and what kind of experience you're trying to get out of it

[delicate vector]

GTA 6 before ARK 2 will probably be an actual thing 🥀🥀

[hearty osprey]

it's not even a contest

[dire needle]

Same

[mystic wharf]

The thing about the developers is that they seem to make everything like they dont care they just implement quickly some stuff and that's it even if its broken and let it that way forever , that's why im not interested that much in the development of asa i dont take the devs seriously , i know another game that is the same type as asa and gonna make everything that the devs of asa never do even though i hate the other devs , they are very greedy

[mystic wharf]

For me the developers dont care about asa , otherwise they would improve the game in itself not just add some useless maps

[untold ingot]

If you hate the developers, why are you here.

[mystic wharf]

I though you didn't wanted to talk to me ? I said i hate the devs of another game since they are so malicious and greedy not of asa learn to read @untold ingot

[tame geode]

Oh that's not fair... consider at least saying you mistyped in your response before jumping to the offense.

Don't worry Raq, we know what the original message was. Not gonna let that slide.

[mystic wharf]

Veloci can you just hush up and stop trolling ? Thanks

[untold ingot]

Learn to write maybe.

[mystic wharf]

Nah its pretty much understandable men but ye they might do a better game than asa and are stealing some ideas but how much i hâte them

[tame geode]

Lmao

I guess it wasn't worth the response.

[untold ingot]

Never was lol.

[hearty osprey]

most of the difficulty from ark comes from the learning curve, once u reach the top, most pve outside of specific thing don't really pose a challenge to experienced player
how i wish i could be a bob again

[untold ingot]

Fr. Back when ark was exciting

[hearty osprey]

most that we have left is grinding, and finding optimisations for it, little by little

[untold ingot]

Gaming could do with less optimizations and more goofing.

[hearty osprey]

honestly, wish LC had more environmental challenges, even the cold isn't a major issue, weather like SE and rockslide like gen1 could have helpped, but even then sometime SE weather is more of a bother than a challenge

[untold ingot]

Fr. Wc should stop listening to the playerbase on weather things. Add more fun weather effects.

Asa se weather was peak

[hearty osprey]

the visual on the weather are breath taking

[untold ingot]

I really hope gen1 with it's new ocean will have crazy water and weather effects.

[hearty osprey]

wonder who they could implement a actual lighting effect (not just visual)

[untold ingot]

These guys made atlas. They can do weather lol

[hearty osprey]

atlas had the tornado/thyphone, hopeful that comes

[tame geode]

They could probably tie a bastardized version of the desert titan squirt into the weather system.

[untold ingot]

Um what

[tame geode]

Obviously different visuals, but if they want procedural strikes they'd have to make it an entity. Although, maybe the gen1 meteors are procedural in which case they already have a system. I'm not sure.

[hearty osprey]

oh the lighthing strikes

oh yeah, desert titan has it

[tame geode]

My bad, I assumed Tiago meant lightning strikes.

[hearty osprey]

i did

[untold ingot]

Biggest problem with lightning strikes is actually lighting. It can make severe lag for people. But yeah they could do it if they did it well.

Or something like hail, a particle effect that damages armor and structures

[hearty osprey]

yeah, make a area be tagged like desert titan does, 3s build up then bum
something to defende vs it like a lighting rod (now i'm just thinking minecraft 😂 )

[tame geode]

And the genome meteors are big proof for that as well with the performance tanks.

Genome? OK autocorrect.

[hearty osprey]

oh gen1 metors shower gonna be back

forgot about it, did volcano also have falling rocks while errupting?

[untold ingot]

I'm really interested in seeing gen1 remade

[untold ingot]

Yeah and the permanent snow storm in arctic

[tame geode]

Yeah, I think every biome had some specialized weather event for it on gen1. Meteor shower, eruption, blizzard/avalanches, green rain, and whirlpools.

[untold ingot]

We need more dynamic weather. Not less

[tame geode]

Sorry all we got is Fog.

[hearty osprey]

green rain?, bog i assume, what did it do, or was it just rain
just have memories of magamsaur raiding in bog and rain slowing it down

[tame geode]

Green rain was different than normal rain. It's been a while but I think it just made the swarms spawn more often.

There's probably more to it, but obviously very subtle/forgettable.

[hearty osprey]

didn't know that
cool mechanic if so, f them swarms, took me a bit to figure their deal
also bog (easy) forever love whoever did that

[untold ingot]

I had an undefended base in a gen1 tree for every wipe of mts Mesa, in arkpoc for like 6 months. No one ever found it

[tame geode]

Everyone was probably too busy scouting the sides of asteroids.

I really hope one of the DLC's for ark 2 ends up with us going to some of the destroy remains of the colony ship, and it's got bits similar to the lunar biome.

[untold ingot]

Last time I played I have over 5k tames, and capped dedis in this tree. Raided half the alphas out of a bobs base in gen1 🤣

[tame geode]

Kinda a real dead space-y environment maybe.

Like the colony ship was huuuuuuge. And the players only ever really experiences the main focal points with their simulation counterparts. Maybe they could try and bandaid some recently introduced lore elements too. idk.

[untold ingot]

I think they said next time the whole outside of the ship will be explore able.

[tame geode]

Are you talking for the ASA remaster with the extended space biome?

[untold ingot]

Yeah

[tame geode]

I hope it's that extensive.

I also hope it's not just an empty void, but that's kind asking a lot. We'll have to see what they end up doing with the gen1 ocean and gen2 space.

[untold ingot]

Fr. It could be really good.

[rare rock]

at this point they’re fighting for the spot of the most delayed game in history

[winged current]

298656

[mystic wharf]

True the developers are fighting for that they want to win

[mystic wharf]

But I wonder if they gonna re use asa caméra for ark 2 3rd person if yes i will not Play ark 2 what do someone thinks about that?

[dire needle]

For me they gonna use the same

[mystic wharf]

Then im not Interested in ark 2 if it does.

[mystic wharf]

I will play the asa stealer that has the camera i want if not

[untold ingot]

It's like a broken record

[mystic wharf]

do you keep playing asa if you have done everything in it or not ? Because the pve players already finished the game since a long Time so im like doesn't it get boring at one point ....

[worldly garden]

There is no "finishing" the game in ARK. PvE is still thriving, majority of players still have lots to do and enjoy.

[mystic wharf]

I agree i took that sentence from a stupid guy to make fun of him since he only say that to a game he doesn't really care but if it would be a game he cared about hé would have never said something like this

[tame geode]

Consider not being a rude child. Not everything is an attack, but if everywhere you go, you find enemies, maybe it's not a "them" problem.

[feral salmon]

Is Ark 2 even happening

[untold ingot]

Wouldn't that be nice

Along the same lines, if everywhere you go everyone is stupid, it's probably not them either.

[mystic wharf]

Veloci dont assume i had a fight with him , thanks . you know that you are the problem

[hearty osprey]

they still say it will, but let them focus on ASA for now till we have all the stuff ported

[feral salmon]

Right cause this game is not working the best rn they need to fix it asap

[tame geode]

Maybe I'm snooping around things that aren't my business. Maybe I'm misreading exchanges, but I'm fairly certain you're trying to gloss over calling Raq a "stupid guy."

If it were clear you're a jokester sure... maybe. But I don't think it's worth just flat out being rude, with no recourse. Reel it back bud. I'd expect others to call me out when I cross the line too.

[untold ingot]

He hates me. So it definitely wouldn't have been a joke lol

[tame geode]

I'm trying to figure who he doesn't hate aside from bryan.

[untold ingot]

The only people he doesn't go off on are those who suck up to him. Been that way for months.

It's kinda textbook narcissism.

[tame geode]

I keep hoping by poking the bear, and calling that garbage out we'll get a change of heart. Sometimes it ain't meant to be. The pseudo programmer in me would actually be interested in discussing what he's trying to convey about the camera or movement, but it's hard to make it through the abrasive front. And that's coming from the guy that can be fairly abrasive himself.

[mystic wharf]

Veloci why are you being paranoïd? I was talking about someone i saw in another game in another server that has nothing to do with asa or peoples that are in here , you seem so frustrated and trying to create drama or problems on purpose but i wont let you have that fun

[tame geode]

Meh.

[untold ingot]

He doesn't like the camera in Asa, couldn't make a mod to fix it, and now makes it everyone else's problem

[split dove]

Don't forget the "Asa killer" they're working on

[mystic wharf]

You are very confusing raq , i dont like asa camera so how that makes your problem ? Thats my problem

[untold ingot]

Right 🤣

[mystic wharf]

Nothing wrong with that ?

Is it a problèm for you flobs ?

If yes Then you are the problem

[tame geode]

I spent quite a while messing about with render targets in ue5 for a project I was working on trying to make a seemless portal teleport effect. They're extremely finicky, which why I could understand why it might seem difficult to implement some new version on top of potential jank WC may have behind the scenes.

The problem I have is that there are several types of camera actors for various different purposes, and with a bit more detail, there could maybe be a discussion had.

Especially if there were actual man hours put into trying to design his own camera mod.

[untold ingot]

Someone good with ue5 could hack together a camera pretty quickly

[tame geode]

That's my impression.

But there may details I'm not quite privy too.

[untold ingot]

I did a hacky camera in ase dev kit a few years ago, I don't know ue4 or ue5, and it's a lot easier now

[split dove]

Correct me if i'm wrong but iirc @untold ingot isn't their "Asa Killer" planned to be a straight copy paste job but with "better models and changes"? Sounds like an easy lawsuit and bankruptcy for them with how little it's going to sell inevitably

[tame geode]

That's also my impression. UE5 has made game dev just soooo much easier.

[untold ingot]

Yeah. And fixing "all" the problems

[mystic wharf]

Raq since you already played Conan exiles then that's the type of camera i want to be implemented in asa , the developers can easily do that right ?

[tame geode]

What's cool about the blueprints is it can actually serve as a good foot in the door for things like flutter with dart or js.

At least if you're big into widgets like my stupid self is... fuck me

[untold ingot]

A normal person would hear 3rd person camera with souls like combat to have a souls like camera and leave it at that. Rather than haranging the topic for 6 months

[tame geode]

Nero are you talking about having the camera anchored to the player character head as opposed to the top of the torso?

[mystic wharf]

That's exactly the type i want , souls like, do you think in ark 2 There will be ?

Sadly i dont think they will implement it in asa

Because i tried it , it is impossible at least for me very tricky

[tame geode]

I may be mixing up games. I seem to remember Conan or that game with all the strandbeest devices having a camera anchored to the head that is definitely different from asa.

[mystic wharf]

If only the developers could implement better modding to create mods like this type some are Impossible to make

But my mod is a personal préference like everyone mods is their personal préference and changes

[tame geode]

The devkit may be a bit of a mess at times, but it's far from limiting. I just think you've not truly shared what makes your idea impossible or different from the current camera.

Try describing it without*** using a game title.

I know ASE had 3rd person offset and interpolation. Maybe that's what you're referencing? I can't remember if ASA has offset.

[mystic wharf]

If you already played GTA 5 then that's the exact type of caméra im talking about i want to implement that in asa , it doesn't mean i dont use first person i like both but i like a différent cam when it comes to 3rd person

[tame geode]

Unfortunately, I've never played gta v. That's kinda using a game title to describe the camera.

Best reference I've got for gta v are dougdoug streams.

[untold ingot]

Club ark is proof that they can do camera stuff...

[mystic wharf]

If you already used the car véhicle in asa then you will understand i want that type to be in character and dinos riding

[tame geode]

I haven't played around with the cars.

[mystic wharf]

Like being able to look around you while walking or running with the camera

I want that for easier GamePlay and more immersive GamePlay too

[tame geode]

Like the selfie cam?

[hearty osprey]

didn't amarga already have that

[untold ingot]

Free cam with omni movement isn't usually a thing

[mystic wharf]

I dont know if you already used or know about the orbital caméra in asa then im talking about that

[tame geode]

So, you can run is a direction or whatever that your camera isn't locked to?

Oh, I was gonna say the orbital camera in asa isnt* locked on the player.

[mystic wharf]

But Sadly you can't move in différent direction its still locked somehow

[tame geode]

That fairly different from ASE

[mystic wharf]

Well i want to make that as a mod but fully made like being able to move hit

Shoot

Etc ...

With that type of cam...

[tame geode]

To confirm my understanding, something like Breath of the Wild's camera system is in this vein?

[untold ingot]

There is a reason they dont have that in Asa.

[mystic wharf]

What is the reason?

Ye veloci

there you go

GTA 5 breath of the wild has that

[untold ingot]

Because the Asa camera was supposed to be like the ase camera.

[tame geode]

I'm not sure why they couldnt have a camera like that, but it may too performance heavy to prevent all the exploits folks would have with looking through meshes into folks bases, or looking through dinos to get better. All stuff that can be solved, and are still isuees in ASA without it.

The biggest thing is just copy pasting from ASE I reckon..

I could definitely see them using that style in Ark 2 though. I don't think it's super obtrusive either.

[mystic wharf]

I agree ark 2 could have that but im saying to myself maybe they gonna re use the camera type of asa in ark 2 so idk

[tame geode]

Especially if they want to have climbing walls and crap. Wildcard generally tries to cash in on things when they hit big like chinese dragons after TOtK.

or giga after jurassic world launches

I don't think they're gonna copy paste the camera. They're gonna have to redo the whole player character in order to do the things they want.

[mystic wharf]

Ye that would be cool

[tame geode]

I think they honestly have to have some sort of dynamic camera boom system if you're gonna be able to climb on any sort of inclined surface.

Also debatibly makes the game look more polished especially with things like custom idle animations.

[mystic wharf]

Yes That is a high possibilty

That would be strange having the asa caméra for ark 2 if they are going to do better Dynamic movement and stuff

But who knows

[tame geode]

There is of course a bunch of logic they have to figure out with mounts and the various scaling for different types of creatures.

[mystic wharf]

True kind of tricky

[tame geode]

I know botw has a few mounts, but none of them are super drastic in size. In that same vein though, you can lock targets for parrying from quite a ways away which also proposes a couple of challenges. Potentially with pvp.

I say that but things like the dreadnoughtus kind of demonstrates they can manipulate the camera.

[mystic wharf]

Never played with dreadnoughtus but they did a different type of caméra for the vehicles , cars and stuff différent from the dino caméras

[tame geode]

I don't see why you couldn't make that in the dev kit though. I reckon you could just make a child class of the player character and controller (which we should definitely be able to do post thrall introduction), make a custom gamemode, copy and paste all the logic for handling the character, but overwrite the camera.

Heck, you could probably copy most of the logic from the cars if thats how they work.

[mystic wharf]

I never though about that but i will try that at one point for sure

[tame geode]

If that doesnt work, you may be able to make some sort of invisible shoulder pet/companion that hijacks the normal camera movements, and then copy the vehicle logic.

[mystic wharf]

Ok tx i will try that hope it will work

Do you think it will be possible to add shooting with guns and hitting to ?

[tame geode]

To me the game already has shooting guns and hitting things. You'd have to explain more of what you're looking for.

Parrying maybe?

Parrying is tougher I reckon because of replication, but they already have the foundational logic for it in the game. Heck even ASE had aspects with the tek shield. Now they've got traits and crap. They probably wanted to add that sort of system to ASA before it became a glorified update.

Thnx snail...

[mystic wharf]

Lol

[tame geode]

I haven't played with tek spear to know how that works if thats the kind of thing you're referencing, but I've heard it's cool in theory, but clunky in practice.

[mystic wharf]

No im fine with asa combat , im just like asa movement feels so janky so having a différent type of caméra will just maybe make it worst

But well i still want try it lol

[tame geode]

iirc, botw wilds link model isn't totally bound vertically to the camera. At least visually. He does bob up and down, but I dont think that effects the player capsule or whatever theyre using for character basing. I know in base UE5 projects it's a capsule but most folks adjust the height so they can have effective foot inverse kinematics.

Once again... camera view bob is also a setting ASE had. I'm fairly sure ASA has it too, so it shouldn't be too hard to implement logic.

Now translating dynamic hit animations for creatures and designing all the blendframes, custom localized pain decals, and maybe even localized player injuries for all the possible hit types is a WHOLE other beast. If they can pull that off... we'd have a magical game. I wanna watch a rex carry some guy a away by the arm like the snake guy from The Lost World JP.

[mystic wharf]

Yes that's exactly what i want too

[tame geode]

Imagine if a thorny dragon type creature shoots poison needles at you, hits your arm and it just goes numb... cant use weapons or tools in that hand. You just run around like Jim Carrey from When Nature Calls getting chased by a direwolf, two terror birds, a thyla, and the thorny.

[mystic wharf]

Yes , that's what i wanted since a long time in asa , more immersion while playing the game and cool things like this

Not just dinos hitting you infinetly lol

The game can be a lot more fun than it is

[tame geode]

Yeah, it's kind of a product of it's time though. When ASE launched there really wasn't any other game that had that kind of stuff to such a degree. Ark 2 allows them to be a pioneer once again. It's expected. They know it. We know there are limitations, and they'll want to try and surprise us with something cool that we dont entirely expect.

As much crap as they get, it's their game. They're the expert of it behind the scenes (maybe not so much when it comes to their individual gameplay), but they also don't want to be out of a job. And they aren't big enough to never fail.

If they do put out crap for ark 2... then shame on them. They'll deserve being lost to obscurity especially after the garbage with ASA.

[mystic wharf]

I agree

I would also like to see a raptor going after a human and just taking his head of and seeing the head roll into the ground next to me lol , making the player scared a bit in that world and that's what i like , making it more hardcore in visual aspect

[tame geode]

Man as much as I'd like to see dismemberment in the game, and as much as they kind of allude to that type of violence in the teasers, I just dont think they'll commit to it. I think they really want to push the games to kids. Unfortunately means the adults don't get a say.

[mystic wharf]

Ye i forgot about that , in Conan exiles there is that type of stuff but i guess in ark its for younger players as you said not just adults i though it was only adults lol

But wouldnt it be cool?

[tame geode]

It's definitely becoming a huge focus for them. Especially when they're trying to adopt a kid as a main character. We've seen more of Meeka than Vin Daddy at this point.

[mystic wharf]

Yep , if only that game was made only for adults

Like Conan or GTA 5

[tame geode]

I'm trying to think of a game with humanoid dismemberment that isn't rated M.

There's generally some sort of line of gratuity that some games can get away with.

[mystic wharf]

Yep but personnaly if ark 2 make the dinos less robotic and more alive i would be fine , no need for dismembering stuff because in asa the dinos looks like mounts/cars to travel but with no soul make them more realistic

Like feeling you are next to a true dino

Not just a game model

[tame geode]

Yeah, I think we can all agree that's the minimum. And UE5 is primed for it with the blackboards/behavior tree system.

[mystic wharf]

True they can pull something good if they can

Im tired to see dinos just walking in asa i want see them doing animations while wondering in the wild

Like for Exemple a spino sitting

Next to a tree

Things like that

[tame geode]

They should really rework the alpha/pack system or have a sort of group leader for things like herbivores so they have roaming herds for creatures we think did that.

[mystic wharf]

Ye

[tame geode]

Have creatures aggro or deaggro depending how the player looks. Maybe if you're holding a pike out, trikes aggro automatically if you're too close kind of thing.

But maybe theyre passive if you have open hands.

[mystic wharf]

Ye why not

What else you want see in dino changement/behavior ?

[tame geode]

One of coolest things about carcha taming is when it senses you holding that dead body, and it seems like it's trying to decide if you're the meal or if it's just the thing you're carrying. Those sorts of details go long way for immersion.

I think there's achance we'll see some sort of smell mechanic. Like carnivores being more aggressive if you've a bunch of raw meat on you.

Maybe herbivores will playfully beg if you're full of berries.

[mystic wharf]

Not a bad idea yes

[tame geode]

Pteras dive into the water to pick fish like the ichthyornis. Certain environmental things like that shouldn't be niche to one creature.

All wild flyers should be able to pick you... desmos do it... come on...

It's annoying, but it's just the reality of their defense.

[mystic wharf]

Ye

[tame geode]

Creatures like sauropods should migrate to trees and then play an eating animation as if theyre eating off the tree instead of bending over to the ground. Carnivores should nest near carcasses they feed off of.

Wild babies should play with each.

[mystic wharf]

Yes i want that kind of stuff in ark 2

Yes

Dinos animated is actually what makes a game feel a lot more fun to me

Seeing raptors just spying you from hours

And following you

Silently

Then you see a little eye or head looking at you from a distance lol

Kinda of scary and funny at the same time

Things like that ...

That's what is lacking in asa to me the lack of immersion and feeling that you are in a dino World

[tame geode]

They've constantly drip fed these sorts things across many creatures in ASA, but the game would better if all creature did things that make sense to their species. Like the dreads will eat veins, so that means that herbivores targetting trees for eating animations is possible. I mentioned all flying pescavores diving for fish. Bears climb trees for honey.

It's not a matter whether they can, it's just if they care enough to do those types of things.

[mystic wharf]

Yep , i hope they will since its what makes a World fun to me if not then They have to be thrown into obscurity like you said , because it would be a waste to not add that

Only a small part of asa dinos has animations and even are rarely visible

[tame geode]

Look up Ryan Laley "Unreal Engine 5 Tutorial - Third Person Camera Setup" the vids 2 years old, but it's a starting point.

That guy has lots of videos of digestible UE5 tutorials. I'm not sure if that's exactly the type of camera you're looking for, but he explains many of the things to make the camera your own. You may notice the default ue5 boom movement is already way closer to what we were talking about with BOTW.

I would've sent ya a direct link, but I reckon I'm probably still blocked.

[mystic wharf]

Yes tx for the help i will try to do it i hope i will succed lol

[worldly garden]

ASA does have a new camera, it's called "loose camera", "mid camera", and "tight camera", all of which you can disable to get back the original ASE camera.

Whether ARK 2 camera will be any different is anyone's guess.

[tribal chasm]

Was it implied that saddles for Dinos in Ark 2 will somewhat act like armor does in Ark 1? Or at least not adding a universal damage reduction, but only protecting certain parts of the dino

[mystic wharf]

Ye but i want a better one just like the one you have in enshrouded since you already play enshrouded @cunning talon @vale pike

That type of cam into asa

[worldly garden]

Isn't Enshrouded pretty much similar to ASA 3rd person? although you can turn the camera without turning the character which I like in Enshrouded.

[mystic wharf]

Yes for the last part

Do you think they can add that type to asa or not

?

I use first person too but when i play third person i prefer the enshrouded type because its easier and more immersive not rigid like asa

You can turn the camera while Moving you character something you can't do in asa

I just find it more fun playing with that type , personal preference

[mystic wharf]

Im afraid they will use the same type to mounts at least

Because the developers re use a lot of mechanics from older games i noticed that

At least why they dont add more Options while using 3rd person

Giving a cam similar to enshrouded for those who like it , since a lot seem to use the enshrouded like cam in asa even though its not fully complète

[worldly garden]

it really depends on what type of camera works with the souls-like combat they are going for, plus the parkour too. I have no idea if ASA camera would even work well with that, if not then it will need to change. Although i'm wondering if the new camera will be part of the Legend of Santiago DLC.

[mystic wharf]

Hmmm for that dlc i wonder if the character Santiago will be in it or if it will just still be asa characters , but isnt legacy of Santiago still asa ? Because if its still asa i dont think the camera type will be différent