40k-book-club

[iron ore]

He was great in the first two but the third kinda killed his character

[cerulean peak]

He's a simp for Marduk

The best parts for me were the guardsman story in book 1 and the whole of book 2

[royal egret]

Honestly I did enjoy that Marduk basically has no character development

He’s a ambitious backstabbing prick at the start

And that’s how he ends

He just has it work out lol

[iron ore]

It’s totally understandable

Shame about Burias

Book 2 was absolutely fantastic

[iron ore]

Almost done with this, it’s good

[brittle tapir]

did you just read an entire book in a day

i must be doing something wrong

[iron ore]

I am blessed to have wicked reading speed; it is my only true talent

[sour socket]

236 pages in a day is a really good reading speed

Though I remember finishing books 300-400 pages long when on vacation with my family lol

[digital saffron]

I haven't finished a book in 7 years

[gritty epoch]

Look what i found to the flea market i got it for 5 dollars is it a good deal ? I didnt find it online

[unborn merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/gently-brushing-lost-treasures-of-egypt-archaeological-excavation-ancient-egypt-archeologist-gif-18643535

You found a bonafide fossil right there.

$5 is a pretty good deal.

[tall phoenix]

Got the original cover art too

Thats a true relic

[iron ore]

Got about 70 pages into lords of silence and almost fell asleep

Maybe I’ll give it another go one of these days

Time to swap to another book

[tall phoenix]

Boooo

[iron ore]

Had me snoozing

[tall phoenix]

Its a nurgle book, it is kinda slow

you just got no taste for AIDS

[iron ore]

Not the biggest nurgle fan either I’m just tryna polish off every book I can this weekend

[tall phoenix]

Jump this fool

🫵

[unborn merlin]

Did you read the two short stories that precede the book btw?

They add some nice details.

[sour socket]

Lords of Silence gripped me immediately when I've read it

Maybe it's because I was reading it just after Godeater's Son which I really didn't like

[iron ore]

I loved Godeater’s son

[tall phoenix]

I knew I was in for a treat the moment the book started with describing a thick maggot being stuck in someones throat as they woke up.

EXTREMELY relatable after a hangover for me

[iron ore]

I’ve read dark creed and scourge of fate the last two days

Thinking I may do another AOS book

Or maybe titanicus

[tall phoenix]

Im gonna be starting to read Siege of Vraks since my epub unlocks tomorrow

cant wait

[sour socket]

I didn't like it, I thought that the premise was cool, but the writing ruined that book for me
I don't think that it's necessarily bad, I just didn't like it

[sour socket]

Titanicus was really cool

[unborn merlin]

https://youtu.be/pa7Xs9cwwFA?si=-wNVIBQV284WBxdk

[sour socket]

Especially the second half

[unborn merlin]

https://youtu.be/SqxoJO5LjXw?si=TcEBSFswJJlG8U40

[iron ore]

Or maybe fire caste finally?

[tall phoenix]

Yo he reads short stories for free? BASED

[unborn merlin]

His channel has dozens of short story narrations.

[tall phoenix]

Never knew.....

[iron ore]

Was thinking of starting Hallowed Ground today as the cover looks cool

Just wanna work through the humble bundle

[unborn merlin]

Good stuff. I think he’s narrated some old Imperial Navy books too.

[iron ore]

Maybe I swap to fire and blood by George RR Martin for a bit

[sour socket]

I had it on my radar for a long time

[unborn merlin]

https://youtu.be/mI73p5YhfZ8?si=ktMpS1huytzmnceh

[iron ore]

I think after over a few decades of constantly reading warhammer books I’m burning out

[sour socket]

Though first I'm going to finish Valedor, then Gloomspite, and then either Hallowed Ground or Silver Shard

[gritty epoch]

after reading it I will place it in a royal relic box

[random marlin]

Finally!

[random marlin]

Fire Caste could be a welcome change but I also understand the need for something completely different. After reading a lot of guard novels, I also felt burned out by the repetitive nature of most of them, when I’m not finding myself displeased by the author’s take (or absence of take) on the universe in some cases.

[unborn merlin]

Whenever I get fatigued by bolter porn I just usually go back to reading classic literature until the urge to kill heretics comes back.

Almost done with Mortis. Still pretty mid.

[oak pollen]

so like, how many books has Dan Abnett writen for 40k? seems like he has a lot

[lavish badger]

Yes, that happens. No point in forcing it, there are enough good books out there.

That being said, "Rites of Passage" might be a bit of a palette cleanser if you haven't read it yet.

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/51085966-rites-of-passage

(Mike Brooks is generally a fine author. His "Black Coast" trilogy is actually nice modern epic fantasy. https://goodreads.com/book/show/52758545-the-black-coast )

[tall phoenix]

https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Dan_Abnett

Keep in mind Abnett also writes for other fiction and even comics, hes VERY occupied and writes a ton

[royal egret]

It’s actually insane how much he writes and it’s still good

One of his most famous works now is he wrote the comics which inspired the guardian of the galaxy as we know them in the movies

I think he also wrote the Annilius stuff which was dope

[tall phoenix]

Yeah he was also with Marvel in the earlier days too, he wrote a Sabretooth comic i loved which gave me nightmares as a kid lol

[oak pollen]

ngl Sabertooth is one wild character

[tall phoenix]

He has some good moments but hes forever subjected to being a more dumbass Wolverine villain

[oak pollen]

he can be down right brutal at times

far more than you expect from a comic book villian, but that has ways been Marvel's MO

[royal egret]

https://tenor.com/view/x-men-sabretooth-wolverine-gif-11904085392399418635

[tall phoenix]

goofy ah outfit

[tall phoenix]

I very much recommend the comic Abnett worked on with him, its great

the artwork on it is also um

[oak pollen]

he has the same insane regeneration as Logan so shit like that is bound to happen

[tall phoenix]

also holy SHIT he worked on so many comics

https://www.marvel.com/comics/creators/1107/dan_abnett

this page literally does not end

[royal egret]

Red Sonja. So much Red Sonja.

The man has a type.

Apparently his Red Sonja stuff is good I personally haven’t checked them out

[tall phoenix]

I have read em they are great.

As you say he definitely has a type lol

[severe trail]

voluptuous

[royal egret]

Kindle keeps recommending them to me

I have to be like

https://tenor.com/view/real-gif-14323468076528473224

[mellow knot]

I love that Dan and I have Peter Quill in common in terms of Things What We Have Written

[tall phoenix]

I actually got no idea how popular Peter was pre-GOTG movie

i do know to the wider public nobody knew the Guardians existed at least

[royal egret]

It was somewhat popular or well regarded amongst comic reader circles

Sorta for the same reasons GotG 1 was.

Weird concept and wacky characters done well

[mellow knot]

Wastelanders Quill is more comic than film for sure

[unborn merlin]

Just finished Mortis.

https://tenor.com/view/victory-gif-4519337

First half was a chore to get through but I enjoyed the ending. First Wall still holds the title as worst SoT book in my eyes.

Onto Garro: Knight of Grey

[old quiver]

opinions about signus prime? Meros for me, is the goat of that book

[iron ore]

Another day, another dream of quitting my job and trying to write full time

https://tenor.com/view/uncle-ben-gif-26278824

[lucid jacinth]

15 minutes left of fulgrim on audible

Looking forward to finishing it, dragged a bit for me to be honest

[tall phoenix]

Its definitely not one of the best HH novels

not that thats saying much

[lucid jacinth]

My favourite parts of it were when fulgrim wasn’t speaking

Put it that way

[tall phoenix]

[unborn merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/big-oof-size-small-medium-switch-gif-17355313

[shy harness]

Dan ABnett is a fun author. Too bad he can't write a movie worth a damn

[tall phoenix]

[shy harness]

Oh I dont doubt he wrote dialog for movies but give him full control, we get Ultramarines

[tall phoenix]

[unborn merlin]

Hey!

I like Ultramarines 👉👈

[severe trail]

Sentenced to being drawn and quartered by 40000 snails

[royal egret]

The only good part is John Hurt saying BURN HERETICS!

[unborn merlin]

It’s a pretty good time after a few drinks :3

[shy harness]

Iirc in the movie they use the joke of "Faith is good but so is a bolter" three times

The movie had amazing casting but it's boring as hell

And it actually used "Chaos Space Marines" as a term in universe which always feels awkward. Traitor Astartes or something similar wouldve been superior.

And most of the characters suffered the "Bald space marine-itus" that was the trend back then amd it was really hard to tell the marines apart even when they took off the helmets

[cerulean peak]

@tall phoenix have you enjoyed Lyon's latest book yet?

[slow pilot]

@tall phoenix im on chapter 32 so almost done

just got to the part where they found out ||he was already dead||

really good

[brittle tapir]

i hate that book

[tall phoenix]

Finished it on a single day on the 22th

Probably one of the worst books by Lyons ive ever read. Never knew it was possible to make Vraks un-exciting and boring but he somehow managed it

[unborn merlin]

lol that bad huh?

My opinion of Lyons wasn’t exactly high after Krieg.

[random marlin]

What did you dislike in it, Dilara?

After Krieg and his short story Less than human, I'm a bit... wary of his works, which tend to paint Kriegsmen in too favorable a light for comfort.

[wise yew]

Now read it again and listen to the audio book

[tall phoenix]

Its structure is extremely awkward in many places, actually important events like the void battles above Vraks, the decisions of Zuehlke and later Kregori (both get namedropped like 2-3 times and thats it, we never see them calling the decisions they do in the books and such), the blowing up of the Citadel Wall, the arrival/departure of the Dark Angels, even events like the Red Scorpions covering the breach in the wall and all the preperation that goes into it NEVER gets delved into at all and is passed in one single sentence as a mention at best, this very much applies to other sections of the book where if its not skimming over important details of the siege its showing Kriegsmen just doing classic trench warfare stuff against the Vraksians for a few pages as they are our main guard protagonist force, but once again the issue lies in the fact that they don't really display much character aside from shouting acknowledgements/pointing out stuff or nodding at given orders.

I think this is one of the few 40k books that made me realise how crucial well placed and well thought-out POV swap chapters are in helping a warhammer novel, we very much see no POVs beyond Tyborc, Tenaxus, some officer characters who all perish by the end of the book and thats it:

• No exploration of anyone that isnt the named characters above on the Imperial side, like the higherups in the top areas of the chain of command, of artillery-men, Titan princeps, thunderbolt pilots, admirals in the void above the planet, the Inquisitors etc etc

• No exploration from any of the Chaos Marines who do not get a SINGLE line of dialogue and are treated like videogame enemies that just appear to kill NPC characters and leave or even other Vraksians caught up in the chaos, hell not even Xaphan or Mamon, nothing.

These "bolterporn" (yet in this case I guess its the Imperial Guard kind) sections happen a lot throughout the book where it solely focuses on Death Korps fighting people instead of properly exploring the Siege and more or less add nothing you'd have read in the actual Imperial Armor books, which im not sure if Lyons was attempting to condense into this novel for new readers or just didn't want to bother with due to how extremely detailed the entire engagement is, however theres still a few weird yet nice golden nuggets here and there among it.

[royal egret]

Turns out the way the figured out how to tackle such a big and layered conflict as Vraks with so many characters is to simply not do it

[tall phoenix]

YEP

[obtuse elm]

vraks spark notes, from the perspective of personality-less kriegers

[random marlin]

Thanks for the very detailed answer Dilara.

Funnily enough, I don't know much about Vraks. I saw a Youtuber I wasn't a big fan of do a big series about it a long time ago and so I kind of skipped everything about it.

What happens in the campaign of Vraks is in an imperial armour volume right? I should probably check it out, I read the one about Taros campaign after watching the video Arbitor Ian did about it and really enjoyed it.

The book by Stephen Lyons seems to be an unnecessary addition to something which is well documented already. Well, it could have been interesting if there were original POV characters and as such add emotions and differing perspectives on the events, as you suggested. But I already knew from having read Krieg that it was unlikely to be the case, unfortunately.

Did you notice any satirical elements in the novel?

It's weird, I read a White Dwarf some times ago, and there was an article showing two personalities on a planet threatened by a Tyranid invasion exchanging vitriolic articles with one basing herself on facts and the other just saying that the faith in the Emperor is enough and so on. In the end, the second was able to send the other in prison and one can only imagine that the planet was completely unprepared when the Tyranid invasion did happen.

The article had a Don't Look Up vibe and it was hard to miss the satirical elements of it. It made it quite fun to read.

But in all the latest BL books I read (about Imperial Guard, at least), these satirical elements are absent 99% of the time. There were a couple of discreet ones in Krieg but it was nothing compared to the hundreds of pages simply celebrating the fanatical aspect of Kriegsmen.

It's almost as if BL authors and White Dwarf writers don't have the same directives about the tone and satirical aspect of the universe, and are going opposite directions.

[lavish badger]

Personally, I'm not sure there's much satire in 40k. Overall, the general tone seems to be more horror or epicness. That can be compatible with the humour of satire, but imho is not that easy to pull of.

I also don't feel like 40k is written as a social commentary. Or to make people think.

[hybrid turtle]

It is though

[tall phoenix]

Its not in your face as something like Helldivers but it’s absolutely satire

GW has recently said as much

[drowsy urchin]

you don't need to go much further than watching the launch trailer for 40k 10th edition

[royal egret]

I think people overstate how much it is sometimes but it has those elements in most examples. It’s not at all the same as how it was originally.

[cerulean peak]

Thanks you just saved me a few bucks

[lavish badger]

I have to admit I filed that a lot more under "tragedy". They even used the "rage against the dying of the light" line.

I mean, I really liked the structure of the trailer. Start hopefully epic, so that the cosmic horror hits all the harder.

In that regard this trailer feels very 40k. I'm just not sure that the clash of these two main themes creates satire.

[drowsy urchin]

The satire message is pretty clear in how the imperium touts to it's citizens how well they are doing with victory after victory when in reality they are faltering on multiple fronts losing planet after planet

[tall phoenix]

^

The message of 40k isnt complex

Its literally just "Dont be a fascist racist"

which is basically common decency at this point lol

The fandom especially misses this a lot and every time the Imperium does something stupid they go "this is grimderp it doesnt make sense"

[wise yew]

Picklelara how rich would you be every time you got $1 million someone said that this statement is wrong

[tall phoenix]

Probably very rich

[wise yew]

Enough to afford a warhammer army

But yeah it is definitely baffling how the community views the imperium as good

A good chunk of them any way

[lavish badger]

I see the point you are making, but I don't agree. That's just propaganda. And the "hopefully epic" stuff gets backed up by a lot of the books, where the Indomitus Crusade gets presented as a success.

But I think part of satire is "This is silly, don't do that". And I don't see that in the trailer. Or it might be too subtle for me.

It's not like taking away hope is an option that Guilliman considers, or that would make much sense.

You basically could do the same trailer about the Ukrainian counter-offensive

[tall phoenix]

Bruh

[drowsy urchin]

The victory touting is literally the propaganda here.
And in no way I'd connect it to the Ukrainan counter-offensive, a tad in poor taste even

[tall phoenix]

Yeah that.

Also the trailer very much is Guilliman being a doomer and not sugarcoating the situation, hence the entire Marine cadre in the trailer getting absolutely slaughtered.

Theres no "hopeful epic", the Imperium is terrible. Always has been.

[tall phoenix]

Again, official statement.

[wise yew]

No matter how many demigods you bring back you cannot fix a rotting kingdom run by monsters

[drowsy urchin]

Indeed albeit there is no grimdark without the sliver of hope, in the small scale. In the large scale the hope is very much absent

[tall phoenix]

40k's small satirical stone clashes with "Imperial heroes" vibes a lot because at the end of the day you need to sell this stuff to teens/kids

which is as much as the adult fans say arent that big of a demographic they are still very much the main target

[drowsy urchin]

I think Dan put it pretty well in this interview (timestamped to the hope part)
https://youtu.be/VchkiTUisu8?t=423

[lavish badger]

Oh, it is. And at the same time there are quite a few "hopefully epic" stories being told now the Primaris and Primarchs are back. Wether that matters as a whole, dunno. But it's a bigger scale than "we reconquered a planet at silly cost of lifes" of the past

[tall phoenix]

It doesnt because you need to remember these are said from Imperial POVs

Who literally would wipe out anyone in the galaxy that isnt them or their fellows that also don't agree with them.

Its the same with people saying "Guilliman is fixing the Imperium" when hes very much not, he admits himself he can barely begin to scrape the surface of its corruption.

[wise yew]

Hell they don't even follow their beliefs most of the time

Kill the mutant except the three eyed one we need it to travel around and keep the big ones alive too they are useful

[tall phoenix]

Hypocrisy my beloved

[wise yew]

Fascist racist hypocrites the lot of them

[tall phoenix]

LOL

accurate

[lavish badger]

Again, I agree. But none of that matters in the fight against Tyranids or this trailer. Fascism imho isn't a part of the trailer (at best indirectly if you already know that SMs are fascist racists), so it's hard to see the trailer as a satire of fascism.

[tall phoenix]

Yeah because im talking about the general 40k universe/the Imperium, the trailer is more made to show the Imperium's showboasting is empty and they cant kill all the threats they claim they got dominance and power over

Its satirical part in this instance is regards to that not the people they oppress on a daily basis.

[lavish badger]

But at what point is the rotting kingdom ruled by monsters not just horror? I don't think folks would classify Game of Thrones or the Cthulhu Mythos for example as satire. And it's also a terrible setting with terrible people. Sure, 40k is way bleaker, no doubt about that.

[tall phoenix]

Game of Thrones isnt satire because almost every Westerosi/non-Westeros societies are based from IRL civilizations as examples. And Cthulu Mythos are not sold as satire either.

40k still very much keeps its comedically dark tone for a reason, and again

[hearty niche]

Got a free book credit and can’t decide between cain and gaunt

[iron ore]

Do you prefer blackadder or sharpe

Cain is sandy mitchell doing his best blackadder impersonation (funny/failing upwards)

gaunt is abnett read a cromwell book and made his own richard sharpe character

They're both fantastic

[hearty niche]

I don’t read enough books to know either of those sadly

Falling upwards is pretty fun though

[wise yew]

If you want to be on the lighter side of things cain is perfect

If you want to be a bit more grim dark you go gaunt

[iron ore]

So basically sharpe is a story about a british soldier in the napoleonic wars through an act of valor becomes an officer and leads his troops through the napoleonic wars and conflicts in india while fighting the French and dealing with british officer politics and it's awesome. Gaunt is basically that but 40k and it's grimdark

Cain is a fun case of failings upwards/self preservation/imposter syndrome to the max

and is a great time

they're both fantastic

[lucid jacinth]

I know more about cain so I’d suggest cain

I’m two books into the series and I love him as a character

[bright slate]

hey i need some book recommendations

atleast one

[mellow knot]

Check channel pins for a list. 🙂

[gritty epoch]

||Hi, I just finished the fall of cadia and it was really amazing for a first warhammer book (I was a little sad at the end). The characters were quite nice, at times they were classic badasses that we find in many sagas but in a world like 40k it didn't seem forced to me. On the other hand I have a few questions, can I find a book or a short story that takes place just after Cadia? I mean there are so many questions I ask myself, what happens to the surviving characters? What are the consequences of not quarantining Cadians? what does trazyn do with creed at the end? Abaddon “won” but are the losses really that big? in the book it alternates a lot between "abaddon has unlimited troops" and "the enemy has suffered considerable losses" and abaddon himself said that he had sacrificed what he was ready to sacrifice quite early in the war.||

the fall of cadia spoiler for the ones that want to read it

[digital saffron]

Minka Lesk books for the cadians
Gathering Storm 3 for the direct aftermath I think
And basically most books from the the last 10 years take place after the fall

[tall phoenix]

Okay so these arent really spoilers because the book is like a year old now and most of your questions are very well known things in the lore, basically:

• As said above the Minka Lesk series takes place post-fall and she was a whiteshield during the fall of the planet, you can read the books in order as you wish since they arent that old either.

• The surviving characters will just be re-gathered and sent to fight to other warzones until they die because guardsmen lives arent worth much. Cadians post-fall have also began to settle on new worlds given or earned by them from the Imperium to get to breeding and making more kids/future Cadians and future conflicts.

• The consequences of not quarantining the Cadians isnt really anything important, that Inquisitor was just being extremely paranoid, most Cadians fight chaos all the time and they didnt see anything warranting absolute-culling like a Daemon Primarch.

• Trazyn has taken Creed to be a piece in his museum, Creed's daughter takes his place in the narrative afterwards.

• Abaddon's meaning for "losses" is more that he really wouldn't have needed to wage this war if it wasnt for Trazyn turning on the planetary shields to defend the planet from the blackstone fortress' death-ray, it was more annoyance and a waste of time than anything else but he pretty much won fully at the end by breaking apart Cadia and beginning the spread of the Great Rift.

[gritty epoch]

A bit of a shame, I would have liked to see the sequel to salvar ghent, Marda or the Adepta Sorrorita. Thanks for the information, Creed locked up at Trazyn's house is pretty cool for the character rather than a permanent death. So Abaddon continues the 13th Black Crusade project just without a Black Fortress. i'll keep the book mentionned above for later, thank you guys.

[tall phoenix]

[white hawk]

https://youtu.be/0P3O71v3IUc?si=vrjjqK68TmLeX1ZW

[unborn merlin]

At this point in time Abaddon and his cronies are terrorizing the galaxy with the Arks of Omen so the loss of the Black Fortress is a minor inconvenience tbh.

[gritty epoch]

Thats what i think of the loss of urkhantos and krom gat, i mean it s a minor inconvenience for abaddon(even positive for urkhantos) but a great thing for the imperium, how many world the Black fortress could have wipped, or how dangerous daemon prince as urkanthos could have been. I mean abaddon army is still gigantic but i think that some lives were spared or at least were able to live à little longer due to cadia résistance and the losse of the Black fortress( its just me trying to be positive at the fall of cadia).

[tall phoenix]

god Krom Gyatt

i fucking hated his name whenever he popped up in the book

[frigid osprey]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zjUUasBhAGs i figured some ppl here would be interested in this cool dan abnett interview about his career in comics

[tall phoenix]

I said it way above in chat but still cant get over how many comics this guy was involved in, its crazy

his page of credits is endless lol

[frigid osprey]

i know right, its like he has 2 full careers running in parallel

and also hes very prolific in both

it's crazy!

[tall phoenix]

I forget he even writes non-40k shit tbh

then again guy is a Harvard graduate so lol

[frigid osprey]

oxford, he talks about how he happened to get there in the interview

it seems like hes just always had a phenomenal output of stuff!

[tall phoenix]

to be fair same thing

[frigid osprey]

haha, yeah

[tall phoenix]

ALSO DAMN this is almost 3 hours, yeah ill leave it for tomorrow i need something to listen to

[frigid osprey]

its a monster lol

[tall phoenix]

Yeah but sacrifices must be made so ill take it

[sour socket]

It's so obviuos that he likes to play with words considering some lines and names in his books lol

[unreal vault]

Warhammer writers trying to not use the word cacophony challenge (impossible)

[frigid osprey]

literally 100% impossible

[mellow knot]

I immediately went to look, it appears once in Portents, but not at all in Gildar Rift. I would like a medal or something.

Once in 120,000 words isn't that ridiculous a statistic, right?

[tall phoenix]

To be fair its only Abnett that does it to a ridiculous level

him using an ancient egyptian term for the word "lapis/blue" was probably my breaking point for the End and the Death's volumes

it stops being fun after awhile and just becomes pretentious

[mellow knot]

For full disclosure, it also makes a single appearance in Valkia, too.

😄

[tall phoenix]

[mellow knot]

It's a useful word! Honest, guv'nor

[royal egret]

I think the worst thing ever is when the authors call legions by their number not when it’s a character POV

Mfer I’m not gonna count and look this shit up just say Imperial Fists

[tall phoenix]

Yeah like im extremely bad at roman numerals and only remember when its like Legion X / XX since those at least are simpler lol

anything else though 😩

[severe trail]

XIV legion

[wide mica]

Death Guard

[orchid herald]

Anyone got thought on seige of vraks novel by Steve loyns

[random marlin]

Dilara does 🙂

[tall phoenix]

@orchid herald

[digital saffron]

From the review it sounds like a failed attempt at what Fall of Cadia was doing

I figured it sold well though so here's to more Krieg I guess!

[tall phoenix]

I cant even compare it to Fall of Cadia because it does so much things right that this book just doesn't lol

[sour socket]

I saw someone on Goodreads call it "The closest that a 40k book gets to All Quiet on the Western Front"

[tall phoenix]

Yeah that is bullshit lmao

[oak pollen]

in 2004 a game review magazine gave DMC2 a perfect 100/100 score, enough said on the reliability of reviews

[tall phoenix]

[unborn merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/bruh-meme-gif-26978290

That’s what people said about Dead Men Walking.

[tall phoenix]

Honestly a rare case where id say its an insult to the actual book tbh.

[unborn merlin]

100%

[tall phoenix]

Dead Men Walking was prob one of the goofiest books ive read

i get why people like it, but the krieg cosplay ending absolutely ruined me from wheezing

[unborn merlin]

People see a generic war story nowadays and just say “wow, it’s just like All Quiet on the Western Front” 🤓

You know they haven’t read the book if their only takeaway is “war is bad”.

[tall phoenix]

^

People thinking 40k warzones are fun then cue Paul literally in a ditch crying himself to death after watching someone he stabbed bleed out over literal hours 💀

[unborn merlin]

It’s funny that Lyons was mentioned again because I ended up getting Dead Men Walking on Audible for free and the only good thing I can say about it is that the audible production was stellar. Timothy Watson was awesome and I love it when they add little sound effects like distorting voices whenever they’re speaking on the vox.

The book was pretty boring tho. Can’t get behind Krieg narratively but will admit the aesthetic looks cool.

The book was comical when you really think about certain plot points and Gunther (think that’s how you spell it) was an absolute wet blanket the whole time.

Also thought the pacing was weird and didn’t convey the passage of time well at all. Thought certain parts of the book were happening within the span of days only to learn it’s been weeks.

[tall phoenix]

Yeah thats my problem with Lyons' books

Its just boring.

You know its bad when a book also titled Krieg has people more hype about the origin of the planet Krieg more than the actual guardsman regiment from it in the "current time" chapter jumps 💀

[unborn merlin]

That drove me fucking nuts man.

That book also has bad pacing too. ||What do you mean his daughter was killed???? I would’ve liked to have seen that part!||

[tall phoenix]

ITS FUCKING RAAAAW

A friend of mine whos a huge Krieg fan tried to read it and dropped it mid-way 💀

[unborn merlin]

Krieg and Dead Men Walking are to Krieg fans as Damnation of Pythos is to all five IH fans in existence (I’m one of them).

[tall phoenix]

LMFAO

Dead Men Walking definitely excels in comparison but like... thats not saying much.

I genuinely just hate Lyons.

Hes the only guy also riding the Krieg book boat and it sinks every time

[unborn merlin]

Hey, I went into Damnation knowing the IH are terrible people and still got something out of it.

The ending was pretty rad too.

[tall phoenix]

Yeah as I say "it can always get worse"

[unborn merlin]

It can always get worse…

[tall phoenix]

[digital saffron]

Correct you're all one of them

(I joke of course)

Though saying that is kinda pointless since probably a good 90% of krieg fans have never read either past a summary

[unborn merlin]

I’ve come to grips with reality. It’s my cross to bear

[red ledge]

has anyone read any of the novels that follows arminka lesk

[tall phoenix]

Some of us have, you want to know about their quality i assume?

[red ledge]

Well more like your opinions on them i have quite enjoyed them so far I have the fourth book just haven’t started it yet

Also does anyone know the book order for ciaphus cains novels series

[brittle tapir]

ben counter is pretty cool at least

[tall phoenix]

Id say they are quite "good". They dont aim to be much beyond nice to read guard stories post-fall of Cadia and they do the job pretty well.

The plots are kinda simple but so are most military campaigns in general, so its not a lot to complain about and gives you what is advertised i think.

[red ledge]

👍🏻

[royal egret]

At least Damnation of Pythos gave us Attticus (and then killed him)

[tall phoenix]

Bro's helmet looks like a iphone emoji

[timid sonnet]

💀

[unborn merlin]

Atticus was pretty cool.

[royal egret]

My favorite part was when he defended that black man in court from the false accusations

[unborn merlin]

Madail had a cool intro. Sucks he only shows up in one other book to get his ass kicked by Sanguinius.

Wouldn’t be surprised if he shows up in SoT, still haven’t finished them.

[mellow knot]

He is also a staggeringly lovely guy.

[iron ore]

I got the joke

[royal egret]

[tacit raft]

this ones cool, one of the best representation of "drone" humans, so whos is dead there necrons or humies. A clone kid, which we suspected at that time. I still think this book is better than Krieg. Krieg is bland, like the rest of Lyons

[tall phoenix]

Literally nobody liked Krieg i think lmao

[tacit raft]

its very average

i cant find anything to like it for, apart from the lore perspective

[unborn merlin]

Aside from diehard Kriegers maybe.

Had a few friends that raved about it but they’ll eat up anything shovel related.

[severe trail]

bruh the biggest DKoK fan I know doesn't even like Krieg

[digital saffron]

Some Krieg fans have a numbed sense of "good"

[unborn merlin]

That goes for Warhammer fans in general.

Somebody must’ve liked the Salamanders HH books.

Don’t know who but somebody did.

[digital saffron]

I know a few

[random marlin]

I agree with you, Dead Men Walking was a good representation of that idea and of the futility of war in general, a concept the modern 40k seems to have somewhat forgotten in a lot of its latest productions (which is strange for a universe whose catchphrase is "There is only war"), but which is still apparent from time to time, like in the v10 trailer for instance. This trailer struck a fine balance between the heroic aspect of the universe and its hopelessness, which was a nice change of pace from previous trailers which were much more heroic and only focused on showing Space Marines and Sisters of Battle as cool, badass characters.

[tacit raft]

theres rise and fall regarding grim stuff, Fehervari did good job some time ago, big fan. and recent Warhammer Crime series expanded on it

[unkempt wren]

I mean its nifty but i preffer tanith- oh right...

[frigid osprey]

Dead men walking was one of the earlier 40k novels I read and it was pretty awesome to be honest

That and Baneblade were a decent intro to the humies in 40k

[random marlin]

It just so happens there's a (very short) interview of Steve Lyons up on WarCom today: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/07/03/steve-lyons-interview-bringing-life-to-the-death-korps-in-dead-men-walking/

Unfortunately, I have the feeling it doesn't really answer the things that, to me, are problematic in Krieg and Less than Human. And I'm not too surprised but Steve Lyons speaks more of Dead Men Walking than Krieg or Vraks. I'm probably biased, but it looks like he has more things to say about his first novel than the two more recent ones.

[tall phoenix]

It probably still makes some sense because theres a lot of dots to connect here as well

[digital saffron]

I sure can't wait for more Death Korps content

[unborn merlin]

Kinda weird that he had nothing to say about Vraks.

[royal egret]

He didn’t have anything to write about it either

Heyo

[unborn merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/ba-dum-tsss-drum-band-gif-7320811

[tall phoenix]

LOL

CHRIST

[unkempt wren]

When will they realise the untapped potential of ogryns?

Never thats when

[unborn merlin]

One ogryn would have the personality and character development of 100 Krieg guardsmen.

I’m on board for this idea.

[unkempt wren]

Yeah, name an Ogryn Agg and instantly 10k new fans show up

[fickle falcon]

Ogryn do pop up in various novels. There was a female ogryn psyker in one of the ghaz novels called Cassia. She is part of an inquisitiors retinue

Ghazghkull Thraka: Prophet of the Waaagh!

[tall phoenix]

We love our gigantism-people

[wintry blade]

Anyone got any book recommendations

I’m out of xenos books

And Mechanicus books

[severe trail]

Assasinorum kingmaker

[lavish badger]

Warhammer Crime has Clodde. ("Dredge Runners", "The Wraithbone Phoenix". By Alec Worley)

[fickle falcon]

Blackstone fortress series? Pretty underrated, lot of xenos lore (from jokaero to a zoat and lots in between)

[red ledge]

people opinion on thew ciaphas cain novels and the order to read them in

[royal egret]

Pretty good, order of release, don’t binge them

[red ledge]

which is

nevermind found it thank you very much

[restive knoll]

What is yalls favorite hh book?

So far mines betrayer

[unborn merlin]

The First Heretic for me personally.

[restive knoll]

I enjoyed that one a lot

[unborn merlin]

That book boosted my love for Word Bearers quite a bit and works as a stand-alone story in my opinion.

Everything pays off in the end and always found the final standoff with the Custodes pure schadenfreude.

Love that book.

The awesome quotes alone make it a must read.

[iron ore]

Galaxy in flames

[tacit raft]

Deathfire

[lavish badger]

Does "Talon of Horus" still count as HH?

[unborn merlin]

It’s post heresy so no.

[tall phoenix]

Get him lads

[unborn merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/nerd-emoji-um-actually-nerd-actually-um-gif-26028792

Had to do it to them.

[forest spruce]

Well guess its time to read something different. Im having a hard time getting engaged with martyrs tomb. It feels like every conversation is just about "oh my emperor you served with this saint, tell me all about it"

[tall phoenix]

thats because Dawn of Fire sucks

[cerulean peak]

feelsbad

[tall phoenix]

I legit got no idea how they managed to make such a mediocre series

and we are like 7 books in and 2 more to go lmao

[cerulean peak]

I don't even know what it's about

from the covers there's every flavor of warhammer

[tall phoenix]

Basically that + exploring the Indomitus Crusade

and sometimes taking dumbass detours to shit like the Space Wolves totally not accepting Primaris plot even tho they 100% will

for the most part people have been very dissapointed by it since while its not awful its just boring.

[royal egret]

First two were good

After that it’s

[cerulean peak]

It's ok, I have more than enough bad stuff to read to bore me before that

[royal egret]

Very meh or boring or dumb

[cerulean peak]

I've just started third book of vaults of terra

It's a fun series

[tall phoenix]

Its fun and great yeah its only in book 3 it slightly falls off

since the moment you are done you can kinda tell the book was very rushed

also the entire throne mcguffin plot is stupid

[cerulean peak]

I felt like the first half of book 2 was a drag tho\

[tall phoenix]

LMAO

[cerulean peak]

I really liked book 1, book 2 was nice but I found it slow to start

now book 3 i've read the first 2 chapters

I wonder where they'll take me

[tall phoenix]

Yeah its unraveling the entire conspiracy before in book 3 you just meet the people responsible for the whole thing, which is admittedly a bit underwhelming.

Also spoilers... they go to the Dark City

[cerulean peak]

nice spoilers

[tall phoenix]

Nerd destroyed

[cerulean peak]

The end of Book 1 was really nice

I hope I'll get to see more Custards

especially since theres one on the cover

[tall phoenix]

It definitely ends in a point where its both "we got no idea who did this but at least we kinda did something"

also yeah there is, just not too much

[cerulean peak]

As it should be

[tall phoenix]

again you'll see what i mean once the book is over

[cerulean peak]

Kills the mystery otherwise

Mythical beings should stay mythical

[tall phoenix]

And we already had enough of Crowl simping in Book 1

[cerulean peak]

KEK

lol yes

Revus too

But now he simps for Fists too

I hope Spinoza gets some character development

She's "bland"

[tall phoenix]

Man im holding my tongue bad

[cerulean peak]

I have no expectations ever

therefore I can never be disapointed

[tall phoenix]

Yeah keep em that way, thats all ill say lmao

but also yeah its the same reason I find Sororitas books boring, all the more to the people that love them but like

the constant fucking strict by-the-book holy person thing gets boring

[cerulean peak]

I already have the bad feeling that i'll be in her PoV for a looong time

[tall phoenix]

[cerulean peak]

I do love when marines looks at humans with contemps tho

I like them Fists for once

Revus is nice

[tall phoenix]

yeah thats one of my fav parts with Book 2, the entire thing of them meeting up with the Fists near the end is great but also the whole thing of people constantly going:

"Man i feel like something bad is gonna happen! Wonder hows the galaxy doing!"

The readers who know what the Rift is:

[cerulean peak]

kek

yea, I was thinking the whole time " Abby is having a great time"

[tall phoenix]

lol yeah its great

everything after that and Crowl going rogue was very half-assed though imo

its even worse in Book 3 where they spend 50% of it doing fuck-all

you'll see what I mean

[cerulean peak]

I already foresee how it'll end

Maybe i'll be (positively) surprised

I'll just run through my Spinoza slice of life thinking about my next read

[tall phoenix]

It ends how every single 40k book which has a Lovable Cast™️ with Totally Setting Changing Mcguffin That We Will Bring To Light And Fix The Imperium With™️ plotpoints end

[cerulean peak]

Impending doom where nothing happens

Custards mop up the baddies and tell people to fuck off

never to be seen again

I hope the ||Haemonculus|| comes back since it's hinted

He was refreshing

Next up should I read: Krieg (to fuel my Lyons hate), start the HH (it can't be that bad), the inquisition trilogy or anything else in my backlog?

Krieg is just there because i already own it and I don't want the paper to be a complete waste

[tall phoenix]

Krieg is genuinely just boring, i wouldnt waste time on it if i was you.

HH has some good reads which i can recommend a vid-guide if you want, always got the gold nuggets amidst the PILE OF SHI-

[cerulean peak]

I was actually planning giving my copy to a local charity place

[tall phoenix]

LMAO

Both wholesome and evil

fitting for a 40k fan

[cerulean peak]

I already have a planned reading list (made up following Arbitor Ian's video of all books rating in 20ish minutes plus a few extra reads according to my favorite factions)

[cerulean peak]

I always donate my books when I don't want them anymore

I value litterature a lot (I've worked in a bookshop when i was younger) and I feel like everyone should read more

[tall phoenix]

Extremely based 🙏

[cerulean peak]

I've given like 60% of my collection when I moved last year

[tall phoenix]

and yeah i agree on the reading part, one of the reasons i started because my dad always pestered me about it before i caved in

[tall phoenix]

Also lmao ye I was gonna recommend Ian's vid, forgot i already did that way long ago

Hes great because hes absolutely honest about each book, zero HH-fan rose tinted glasses.

Because oof after the first very 3 books it goes "wild" in big quotations

[cerulean peak]

He's really direct with the Salamander ones

kek

I've mostly picked up everything that was 4-5 stars and a few 3-3.5

[tall phoenix]

The sally ones are a rare case of being UNIVERSALLY boring/bad, Kyme is just an awful author.

[cerulean peak]

Sadly I have a thing for the manchilds that are Iron Warriors and Death Guard (they're wholesome)

[tall phoenix]

Nah most of their books are okay at best, they aren't too bad so dont worry

HH has as much awful slop as it has good writing here and there

the more you fling shit sometimes it will stick

[cerulean peak]

I'll make my own opinion. I don't put the memes at face value. ||Else you end up with disinformation like everything popular about the Death Korp||

[tall phoenix]

[cerulean peak]

I need to update my tier list

[tall phoenix]

Definitely

[cerulean peak]

Man I forgot I had a backlog in there

nice

I think was in a necron mood when I made that

[tall phoenix]

lmaooo the fucking lower tiers

"waste of paper" is a great insult to a book

[cerulean peak]

I don't really make distinction between good books

I know.

And I am fully aware of the meaning

Indomitus is trash

Plague Garden is booooring

Goto I don't even have to justify

[tall phoenix]

Its peak "lets rush this book out because marketing"

but also Farseer at near top lets gooo

[cerulean peak]

Soul Drinkers I might have been harsh

Because I've read the two omnibus back to back

Without alternating

So I was burned out

[tall phoenix]

Yeah i was gonna say, i think its a fun series but unless you're a big space marine fan it definitely gets super convoluted as the Drinkers just get into all sorts of nonsense

would i read it again tho hell no lol

[cerulean peak]

But the books could be half their length

[tall phoenix]

Yeah its peak mid 2000's 40k spam-writing

[cerulean peak]

The "short story" formula for the last book kinda make the series stay afloat in my opinion

it was different

[tall phoenix]

Yeee its one of the more preferable ones for me

[cerulean peak]

But after the first two books, it's the same formula with a different Xenos faction everytime

Mechanicus are based in the first and lasts books tho

[tall phoenix]

100%

[cerulean peak]

They're the best thing of the series

I got into it because of their dickery in the first one

[tall phoenix]

I also love how after all that what takes them down is their parent chapter and in a duel their champion has absolutely no chance of winning.

Probably one of the more simple yet realistic endings to a 40k book lol

[cerulean peak]

yea

[tall phoenix]

also a lot better than uh

"EVERYONE DIES"

[cerulean peak]

I don't know about the new Soul drinkers tho

[tall phoenix]

They got nothing

its just

"we got primaris now and got reformed"

lmao

[cerulean peak]

oh well

[tall phoenix]

atm they solely exist for wojak pointing

[cerulean peak]

Maybe in 10 years

[tall phoenix]

"hey i read their book"

[tall phoenix]

LOL

[cerulean peak]

if Ben Counter writes something

(Battle for the Abyss)

TWO

[tall phoenix]

Maybe for the best

[cerulean peak]

Dark Imperium should maybe be in average but I am biaised towards Death Guard books

or books featuring DG

[tall phoenix]

yeah Dark Imperium i was not a huge fan, the only thing that kept me going was the DG bits.

I blame FS for making me love nurgle so much but they are just based

[cerulean peak]

Nurgle is fun

[tall phoenix]

also man Ian Watson huh

i actually think his trilogy is really fun

its just... very Clockwork Orange

lol

[cerulean peak]

It's on my shelf.... waiting

[tall phoenix]

What else can we expect from a guy whos works include Orgasmo Machine

[cerulean peak]

Waiting where it belongs

[tall phoenix]

Yeah dont worry its nowhere near as bad as DoW

its just dated

[tall phoenix]

people also really over-react its weirder parts

[cerulean peak]

between GOTO and plagiarism

[tall phoenix]

LMAO

at least its above Goto

[cerulean peak]

Yea, Goto kept falling off the shelf

I put it in facade as a "meme prize" but it kept falling off because the spine is slightly bent

[tall phoenix]

The paper the story itself is wrote on wanted to kill itself

you dont see that every day tbh

[cerulean peak]

It was a sign

I will not give this one though

Some pains should not be shared

I have another nice one

The fucking font looks like it's made by an amateur

The flames

[tall phoenix]

Lmao yeah compared to the acutal cover too

which is fucking metal

that book is a super-relic

[unborn merlin]

Fire Warrior mentioned let’s gooooo!!!!

[tall phoenix]

[severe trail]

[red ledge]

are there any novels directly about the 8th Cadian

[tall phoenix]

They got no solely dedicated books, they appear for some chapters in the Fall of Cadia and thats basically it

[red ledge]

Ok thank you

[tall phoenix]

[tacit raft]

when lion's lore updated? when, i suffered long enough, like 15 years irl

little sneak from Mike Brooks is insane though

[safe plover]

i started

is it just me or is horus rising awful

i cant

im done

[digital saffron]

Just you wait for "like some other, black Legion"

Hammer banging against metal
Are you getting the foreshadowing yet?

[safe plover]

I will simply skip the book

[severe trail]

get ready for more stuff like this lol

[tall phoenix]

Skipping at the literal first book?

oof you are in for it

[safe plover]

ive listen to 70 hours of summeries in 1.5 weeks

i'll be okay skipping one or two or 12

[unborn merlin]

You’ll be skipping a lot more than 12 lol.

Horus Rising is considered one of the stronger HH novels so you’re in for a bumpy ride.

[tall phoenix]

^

if you dont actually like Horus Rising you are gonna dislike a lot lmao

[hearty niche]

horus heresy kinda got boring after the first few books

I couldn't believe it turned into an anime and they made an entire book into a damn sidelines episode

descent of the angels or whatever

the entire thing was about hunting badgers in the rain forest of a planet of feudal hillbillies

i got 4/5 of the way through it and ran out of patience for it and skipped it

[royal egret]

Some books are bad and some aren’t

Descent of Angels is a commonly mentioned bad one

Dark Angels in general suffer badly from poor writing

Whereas Scars, Word Bearers, Ultramarines, and World Eaters get some of the best. Imperial Fists also get good stuff but it’s mostly towards the end.

[unborn merlin]

Praetorian of Dorn was an absolute banger.

Dark Angels definitely suffer from the curse of being almost written exclusively by Gav Thorpe.

It hurts my wee little heart considering the DA was the legion that got me into the hobby.

Don’t think their HH books are the worst…you got the Salamanders to thank for that.

[severe trail]

Nick Kyme

[royal egret]

Gav Thorpe owns Nick Kyme a lot for working hard to make sure Thorpe isn't the universally reviled BL author.

[unborn merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/honest-word-its-honest-work-it-aint-much-it-aint-much-but-its-honest-work-gif-13763573

[royal egret]

https://tenor.com/view/fire-writing-gif-24533171

Nick Kyme working hard to make the biggest piece of dogshit out of the coolest fucking concepts ever

[safe plover]

i really liked the first two chapters afterwards it got hard to read

[unborn merlin]

Was this your first warhammer novel or just first HH one?

It’s pretty much downhill for you if Horus Rising wasn’t doing anything for you.

[safe plover]

first HH one that i tried to read

[unborn merlin]

That said I don’t even think HR is the best HH book by a long shot.

[safe plover]

i listened to a few things on audio book before

[unborn merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/prayers-praying-for-you-prayers-up-gif-12473296616102354332

Hopefully you find something you like.

The White Scars books are great.

[safe plover]

ill try powering through then see about the next couple of books

[unborn merlin]

That’s the best way of going about it.

Most fans will tell you that you can skip like 75% of the HH series.

Even more tbh.

Unless you like the lore and characters, even then it’s mostly just average at best.

[safe plover]

eh by that logic i shouldnt even read the books just the summaries

[unborn merlin]

Pretty much.

[safe plover]

ill at least try to make it half wat through a book before deciding

[unborn merlin]

It is space opera schlock at the end of the day.

The quality will vary greatly.

[safe plover]

though 90% of my reading is uni text books i dont think dan abnetts style of writing is helping me much

also having english as a second language is hurtin right there

like i had to look up phlegmatic who the hell uses that

[unborn merlin]

Abnett was never my favorite writer.

I’ll happily be a ADB dickrider until the day I die.

[sour socket]

Yeah Abnett can use some big words that are hard for people whose native language isn't english (me)

But I've found that as long as there's a good definition of the word in my Kindle's dictionary, I don't get taken out of the book that much

By far the most obscure words I've seen while having read a few english books was in Noah Van Nguyen's "Godeater's Son"

[small badger]

What book would an experienced 40k lore master recommend for someone trying to take a deep dive into 40k

[tall phoenix]

We got some in the pins you can check out, take a look there

[royal egret]

Outcast Dead

[unborn merlin]

The Master of Mankind would probably be one of them tbh.

[royal egret]

Being serious

I’d never recommend starting with anything heresy

[unreal vault]

The heresy trilogy were my first warhammer books

Although i did read a couple of black books first before that

[unborn merlin]

The Infinite and the Divine was mine.

Started out strong and immediately started the heresy after reading the Night Lords trilogy.

Wrapping up SoT slowly but surely because I usually take a break after every couple of books.

[severe trail]

I honestly think starting with heresy

is one of the worst things you can do to yourself

[dense ether]

the first 3 are a good start id say, but then wait for a while before going through the rest

But honestly starting with Eisenhorn is what i did, but i do love gaunts the most

[unborn merlin]

Honestly think Faith & Fire is another good introduction if you wanna start with something non-guardsmen.

Don’t see that one talked about often.

[frigid osprey]

40k is a way better setting than the Heresy

[tall phoenix]

Semi-hot take but also entirely true.

Its basically only appealing if you just care about space marines and nothing else lol

aka the worst way to treat a setting as rich as this tbh

[frigid osprey]

Yep

40k is so much richer and more interesting

[wise yew]

You can treat the setting way worse

I have seen some takes man i have seen some takes

[tall phoenix]

Yeah its why i very dislike hardcore 30k fans

[unreal vault]

Thats very unfortunate you have one here

But eh i’ll be civil

The entire appeal of heresy to me is a fun semi historical aspect of it

[tall phoenix]

Im not talking about that, i like that too

Im talking more about people who basically think space marines are the apex of warhammer as awhole and that the best part of everything thus nothing else like xenos or other imperial factions dont matter lol

the amount of hardcore 30k fans with this POV is legit a bit scary

[unreal vault]

I’ll be honest ive never seen those types online

The most ive seen are more cynical to GW

If anything ive only seen more SM fanboyism in 40k

[tall phoenix]

I've been a 40k fan for like 15 years and counting, and ive witnessed a ton of it.

Its about as bad as people who splurge the moment they see Primarchs in anything lol

[unreal vault]

Primarch fans

Those people are a different breed

They are probably my least favorite types of people in the fandom,powerscaling ones too especially

[severe trail]

Powerscalers make me want to jump off a cliff

[cerulean peak]

@tall phoenix they finally left terra and things are happening

Based servo skull

[tall phoenix]

Yeah NOW the actual plot starts

hope you like a small road trip

[cerulean peak]

It just took half the book

13 chapters

[tall phoenix]

You can kind of see why i think this book is bad now lol

[hearty niche]

Man necron books always got sneak that gut punch in to remind you how sad and tragic they are despite being soulless robots

Twice dead king is good

[tall phoenix]

Necrons are horrifying to read about until you read it from their POV and get instantly depressed

[fiery canyon]

Though I would like to see a common foot solider Necron Warrior have a personality. Though most or all of them have no mind at all.

[severe trail]

Yeah warriors are kinda

Not sentient

[frigid osprey]

You could do it with an Immortal maybe, you'd have more wiggle room to do something interesting

[brittle tapir]

not warhammer but i finished the steven king book that mentions warhammer

powered through the last 400 pages in the weekend

it was good

[severe trail]

was this from his cocaine period

or his like normal period

[brittle tapir]

2007 so i think normal period

the wacky paranormal stuff feels very toned down compared to say tommyknockers

and it feels kinda similar in a way

[random marlin]

Which book is it?

[brittle tapir]

under the dome

honestly the craziest part of the book for me is how it predicts modern politics

like the main antagonist of the book can literally be a 1:1 portrayal of a certain politician and you would never have guessed the book was written in 2007

[fiery galleon]

See also 1998's Parable of the Talents by Octavia Butler if you want more prescience.

[oblique sedge]

So I'm about 30 books deep into the Horus Heresy series, and I'd say my top three are 1. Fulgrim 2. Flight of the Eisenstein 3. Know No Fear. What are your thoughts?

[lucid jacinth]

What do we think about Legion

Trying to get through it and its a bit of a slog if I’m being honest

[lucid jacinth]

I like the flight of the eisenstein a lot, gives you a good look at garros past

Fulgrims interesting but I personally found it a bit iffy, I think the way the narrator did the voices for the emperors children irritated me a little

Great voices, captures their arrogance and obsession with perfection

[oblique sedge]

legion was good except for the obvious self insert from the author. John Gramaticus is a lame character to me.

[lucid jacinth]

He’s annoying me a bit yeah

I’m finding it hard to follow at points too

[mellow knot]

Greetings, 40k bookworms. Back after a weekend away and hoping everyone is good 🙂

[unborn merlin]

I like Fulgrim a lot. Probably helps I’m a third legion simp :3

Welcome back Cap 🫡

[lucid jacinth]

I like the emperors children because they’re so arrogant, it makes them easy to dislike but they capture it perfectly

[unborn merlin]

They don’t get much development in the HH but really shine in their 40K novels.

I’m perfectly fine with them being mustache twirling villains every once in a while tho.

[oblique sedge]

I enjoyed it because I feel it narrates just how far and their whole process of corruption

[lucid jacinth]

For sure

The bit towards the end where ||they all succumb to corruption is great||

[hybrid turtle]

So reading the ahriman omnibus rn and i dont know if i understood it correctly but did it imply in ahriman: sorcerer that || ahriman was the reason astreos’s chapter was destroyed by the grey knights? ||

[tall phoenix]

YEP

Its another "Set up the future that already happened from the thing you did in the past"

its not a common trope but some 40k novels do this sometimes as a plot twist

[hybrid turtle]

such a schemer

[hearty niche]

So the gaunts ghosts books

I’m seeing a lot of people saying I should read book 3 first not book 1 is that true?

[cerulean peak]

I haven't read it yet but I always recommend reading a series in release order

[mellow knot]

With much credit to @tall phoenix for the suggestions - the faction-specific element of the book list has been updated.

https://pyroriffic.wordpress.com/warhammer-40k-reading-starter-list/

[tall phoenix]

More options for the folks hopefully 😭

[unborn merlin]

I know it’s technically not finished (who knows if it’ll ever be) but I’d also recommend the Black Legion series to be put on the list whenever you make an updated one.

[tall phoenix]

You can poke her for it i think!

[wise yew]

I would like to add warboss in the list yes i know a fourth Mike Brooks ork book isn't the best thing but this book shows how each ork way of thinking pretty well and that they are pretty unique, the characters are entertaining and are good at showing the differences of each ork's way of war and life

And hey it will finish a trilogy there

[mellow knot]

Give me the full specifics, including author, and I'll see what I can do.

[mellow knot]

Done.

[wise yew]

BY GORK AND MORK YES

Thank you so much

[mellow knot]

welcome, nice to at least be useful 🙂

[royal egret]

I can give a more detailed list for some marine chapters and groups like Deathwatch, Iron Hands, Space Wolves, Blood Angels

Once I get home

[mellow knot]

No worries, just drop me a DM and when I get the chance, I'll update again.

[unborn merlin]

So far the series is only comprised of The Talon of Horus & Black Legion (written by the GOAT himself ADB).

Both books follow Abaddon and his merry band of traitorous chaos space marines as they form the Black Legion. The books are chock full of memorable characters on top of giving Abaddon much needed character development.

https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Black_Legion_(Novel_Series)

You could honestly just add it to the CSM section and it would fit perfectly.

[drowsy urchin]

Agreed, it's pretty much the best introduction to CSM there is

[unborn merlin]

Abby really gets to shine in them too.

[mellow knot]

Added to CSM section.

[unborn merlin]

Groovy

[frigid osprey]

i read necropolis first and dont regret it, its awesome

not read 1 and 2 yet tbf

wanted to read a book about a hive city war, fits in nicely with darktide

[fluid yarrow]

And this month the Black Library bestows us with... five Sororitas short stories

BL baby what is you doin.

[severe trail]

Lore

[fluid yarrow]

I never got to watch the Skulls event thing did they even announce any interesting upcoming novels?

[severe trail]

Skulls is for video games

upcoming releases are 5th book in Ahriman Series by John French

Siege of Vraks(came out)

Leilith Hesperax book Mike Brooks

I am sincerely hoping Mike Brooks does not fuck up

I did not enjoy the huron or lion book ngl

[fluid yarrow]

Well. I guess there's always next year

[tall phoenix]

Vraks book is pure dogshit

[tall phoenix]

Lelith book is fun

i pre-ordered and finished it in like a day

[severe trail]

there's probably more upcoming novels

just saying lol

GW doesn't really announce a bunch at once

[tall phoenix]

also yeah like

new novels almost get teased/released monthly

lol

[wide mica]

Huh

I thought it wasn't out yet

[severe trail]

Holy shit brooks wrote a good non ork book/hj

[tall phoenix]

its the early-early version

its now soon becoming properly public i think

[wide mica]

Yea hardback goes up for preorder this Saturday

[tall phoenix]

yep yep

[final trench]

first book i should read: go

[mellow knot]

I will forever be sad I didn’t get the chance to write that. I loved writing for Huron Blackheart

[tall phoenix]

There’s always time!

Re-apply or something!

[mellow knot]

That Red Corsair ship has sailed, I imagine

[tall phoenix]

waaaa

[severe trail]

[cerulean peak]

@tall phoenix finished the dark city. Second half of the book was nice but as you said the ending was typical ||nothing happens. But Gman is back! :^) ||

Going into the mid tier because the first half was a drag

[tall phoenix]

Yeah the entire book just feels rushed

also the entire dark eldar plot is just ???

[cerulean peak]

It's just a big bait thrown that goes nowhere

I just realised that the big battle mentionned at luna was Magnus doing shit and the warp storms on terra was the khorne daemon invasion

Is this covered in books or only in codex?

[tall phoenix]

Its covered loosely in post-rift material, so either random novels or rulebooks mostly.

[hearty niche]

So many books about the drukari and none of them mention the khan blitzing through their city and Mach ♾️ chopping everyone one of them into bits as he passes, it’s not looking good scar bros

[tall phoenix]

Dark Eldar got like 5 books

and if the khan tried that he'd probably already end up as a hood ornament

[hearty niche]

He’d simply parry the black holes shot at em

He’s just that guy

[tall phoenix]

https://tenor.com/view/yourenotthatguypal-pal-notthatguy-weak-gif-21925932

considering how forgotten White Scars are in general yeah hes gonna be a hood ornament for a few more years prob

[hearty niche]

Hit em with the dark eldar destruction speed run, hitless any%

Man I wish the white scars got more love they are very cool

I hate blue

Iron hands need love too

But they kinda gross me out

[tall phoenix]

[unborn merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/luluwpp-gif-25648350

Me patiently waiting for a new Iron Hands book that isn’t doo doo.

I love my body dysmorphic cog bois.

Speaking of White Scars I just finished Warhawk.

It was pretty good but I didn’t love what they did with Morty.

Erebus was very sassy in it so that was a highlight.

[unreal vault]

Are most white scars books good on there own

I don't need to keep up with 12 khanbillion books

[unborn merlin]

They’re great but there isn’t a whole lot.

I see no problem just reading their HH books and nothing else. There’s also The Last Hunt and the Primarch book which I’ve heard good things about.

[unreal vault]

Noted

[cerulean peak]

@tall phoenix it's there

Dawn of fire is great

Written black on white in Kingmaker

[tall phoenix]

LMAO

i love 40k book propaganda 🙏

[wide mica]

Hmm an anthology and a novel for AoS

[cerulean peak]

Any actual good books set in TOW or AoS? I've only read the first omni of gotrek and felix which I enjoyed. I'm not keen on AoS but maybe that's because i'm unfamiliar with it

I've read plague gardens but man the stormcast are boring

[wide mica]

Godeaters Son is pretty cool

[uneven crane]

OGORS

[iron ore]

Okay there are a TON of good books from TOW, the malus darkblade series, the tyrion and teclis omnibus, gotrek and felix books, the bounty hunter dude books, there's sooooooo many good warhammer fantasy books

I've read a few AOS books and so far the two that have stood out as fantastic are Godeater's son and The Hollow King

[mellow knot]

Valkia the Bloody*

• no bias**

** OK, some.

[tall phoenix]

^^^^^

Valkia is some GOOD shit

[iron ore]

I have dishonored myself by not mentioning one of the best chaos warrior books 😭

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-stab-spongebob-stab-anime-stab-gif-20196230

[mellow knot]

It’s all good, I know I’m forgettable 🙂

[tall phoenix]

Stop bad-mouthing yourself JEEZ

[wise yew]

No other legendary Lord made me want to throw myself to the nearest pile of rocks than Valkia, you made a GOATED
character

[mellow knot]

She’s a good girl.

[sour socket]

I really liked both Drekki Flynt books, they were a bit formulaic, but still very enjoyable
And currently I'm finding Callis & Toll: Silver Shard pretty good

[hearty niche]

Do you think anyone got really pissed when in twice dead king book 2 oltyx ||struggled to barely kill a blood angel chaplain in terminator armor and then went on to kill 30 in a fortified location and a dreadnought||

||Space marines || stay losing

[royal egret]

Iirc it was a different chapter but I’m sure there was someone who got mad about something just like there’s someone whose creating a strawman right now to make fun of

The Imperium in the book are portrayed pretty well and it’s one example I try to say a lot of a book series where you can elevate your protagonists by writing their enemies as dangerous, competent, and a viable threat.

[hearty niche]

The imperium in that book is terrifying

“It’s so over” “it’s so over” “it’s so over” the whole book

[drowsy urchin]

Yeah it was Angels Carmine iirc

And I doubt that was an issue to anyone really, character ||models|| have always been tougher to kill

Granted the ||Dreadnought is tougher yet||

[tall phoenix]

Also its important to remember Oltyx's dynasty is very much in repair mode and not at full strength

[royal egret]

It’s an example of one of the more typical dynasties which we don’t get focus on as much

The ones which are typically subservient to the big dick ones we do see a lot

The ones Trayzn likes to visit early to check in on their ancestral artifacts and relics

[hearty niche]

Do eldar get more love in fantasy as far as books or do they get washed there too

[tall phoenix]

Eldar aren't in fantasy

Oh wait you mean like elves in general lol

Their books tend to be pretty good but unless you're a fan of the faction you'll probably not like them too much.

a lot of WHF novels in general can be very hit and miss for every faction

[wintry blade]

In the blackstone books, the daemon that possesses the psyker, is it tzeenchian or nurglite? Cause I can’t tell, it shows elements of both, aptitude and knowledge of disease, but it’s not like actively venerating it, and it’s mannerisms and manner of speech seems too nuanced and manipulative to be a nurgle daemon, what do y’all think?

[royal egret]

It doesn’t necessarily have to be either

[wintry blade]

That’s true

Could be unaligned

How often do those show up? Cause aren’t daemons made as an extension of the will of a warp entity?

Also is that psyker a daemonhost once he’s in the fortress, because it’s painted as if the daemon is seperate from his body now

Or maybe I’m misreading

He’s definitely mutated beyond recognition, that’s for sure

Nvm upon reading further it’s almost definitely nurgle

In how it’s form is described

[severe trail]

WHF novels are def way more inconsistent

[tacit raft]

Konrad's Saga = inconsistency . Still imo one of the vibiest if i may say so

[mellow knot]

Other stories I really enjoyed writing were the two I did for Warcry

[mellow knot]

Also, one of my non-40k novels was nominated for an award today. I am very excited by this, even if I don't win.

[severe trail]

Congrats

[unborn merlin]

Congrats Cap, you got this!

[iron ore]

Let's goooooooooooooo

Which novel is it

[mellow knot]

Marvel Wastelanders: Star-Lord

[random marlin]

Best of luck to you! 🙂

[mellow knot]

Thank you 🙂

[royal egret]

Nice

[slow pilot]

https://www.warhammer.com/en-US/shop/genefather-pb-eng-2024?queryID=a33bb9e2ce6ecc2b5112d3272986baab

[tall phoenix]

Genedad is a pretty neat book

[slow pilot]

im a huge guy haley simp

i tired to get the collectors edition but it was sold out in seconds

[tall phoenix]

[slow pilot]

been waiting months

[mellow knot]

Good morning, bookies

[wise yew]

Good morning Champion of the Blood God

[mellow knot]

I approve of this as a greeting. There’s a reason Jim Swallow nicknamed me ‘Skullqueen’ 😄

[unborn merlin]

About halfway through Echoes of Eternity.

https://tenor.com/view/its-peak-old-man-shaking-head-gif-3938163323164042530

[tall phoenix]

something will be echoing through eternity alright

[unborn merlin]

That sounds very ominous.

[cerulean peak]

Enjoying Assassinorum Kingmaker

Very refreshing

[umbral orchid]

ive been meaning to get to that one

i just restarted eisenhorn and wow i forgot how fun of a book it is

[digital summit]

Im sure you tried Ravenor ?

[acoustic sky]

Finishing betrayer later today
Highly recommend it

[umbral orchid]

and the bequin books too!

[unborn merlin]

Has anyone read Dark Harvest by Josh Reynolds?

It’s $4 on audible rn.

[tall phoenix]

Its pretty good

like nothing amazing but just a neat story id say

[unborn merlin]

It’s $4 so I’ll get it then. Work is gonna be hell this week and I need stuff to listen to.

[tall phoenix]

🙏

[frigid osprey]

i really need to check out some of josh reynolds other work cause i love how he writes but sadly i'm way too warhammer-pilled to get around to it

[mellow knot]

I can highly recommend his Legend of the Five Rings stuff. Like, really good.

[tall phoenix]

^

really fun too

[hearty niche]

Gaunts ghost is false advertising, the man’s not even a necromancer he’s just a commissar smh

[forest spruce]

[hearty niche]

Anyways I started first and only and I’ll be real, so many names so quickly have really thrown me off and I’m a be lost. Know the situation but the names mean little to me

[tall phoenix]

theres also not any Tyranid gaunt ghosts in the books

[hearty niche]

Are there any books from the tyranid point of view?

Could there even be?

Genestealers don’t count

[tall phoenix]

Not really

they dont exactly make good willing protagonist

theres a short story with a Hivemind POV and thats kind of it

[royal egret]

Devastation of Baal has a Lictor PoV

[tall phoenix]

yeah but that has space marines

[cerulean peak]

How was deathworlder?

Im not sure if the comments I'm reading are memeing on the book or actually praising

[tall phoenix]

What are they

[cerulean peak]

It's mixed stuff

Fuck it i'll just read it myself

Way simpler

[tall phoenix]

Its another mcguffin hunt book but i found it a nice simple adventure.

Arbitrator Ian/Mira has a talk with the author too, its pretty good.

[cerulean peak]

I didn't want to get spoiled by Ian

I only watch his bookclubs once i've read the book / positive I won't read it

[tall phoenix]

Yeee i recommend watching it after reading, i found it quite enjoyable. Its not trying to be much, and while Catachans are on the cover they also get another companion with them in the journey.

so its not just gung-ho generic ahh dialogue

[cerulean peak]

Nice

Not an eldar I hope

[tall phoenix]

LOL nah its another guardsman, probably was in there to make it less of a catachan-fest so it works.

its also very much a Point A to B plot, so nothing too complex either

[cerulean peak]

It's ok my brain is fried as of late

Almost done with kingmaker

My eyes are pleased by the words

And i'm actually taking an interest in knights

The knight povs in the iron warriors books were a snorefest for me

Princeps and honor n stuff

[tall phoenix]

Assassinorum is ironically a really good knight novel lol

its more or less like a sleeper-cell advertisement book for them

[hybrid delta]

tyranid non verbal communication

[wintry blade]

In the blackstone fortress novels ||what or whom could the omnissiah UR-25 be referring to? I doubt it’s anything related to chaos because of its revulsion towards it, it could be the void dragon, but it seems unlikely to me for some reason||

||In general UR-25 seems unique compared to other depictions or descriptions of men of iron, it just wants to be left alone, of course that won’t happen. I’d love to see more men of iron perspectives though||

[tall phoenix]

We basically dont know.

[wintry blade]

I figured

Just curious what people thought

[tall phoenix]

also UR25 is a unique case, each Man of Iron more or less at that point would have his own unique personality.

and remember that hes also still wearing a disguise

thats not even his original form

[wintry blade]

Well yeah, but I mean in temperment

He doesn’t want anything to do with humanity

Just to be free