40k-lore-chat

[odd sparrow]

it's creepy without having to just go

LOOK

[peak hamlet]

No wait im dumb

[odd sparrow]

BODY HORROR

[storm jungle]

Yeee dont worry hobo

[odd sparrow]

PERSON BEING TORTURED

[storm jungle]

Yeee

[peak hamlet]

https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/mediawiki/images/b/b5/Mortifier.jpg

Mortifier

https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/mediawiki/images/8/81/AnchoriteMini.jpg

Anchorite

[storm jungle]

Yep yep

I legit wish these were sister dreadnoughts tho ngl

i love the image of the front having an iron maiden but its more beautifully decorated like a coffin lid

[odd sparrow]

idk i think these are good enough

[plush mason]

these things are way more fucked up than i thought

[odd sparrow]

i love how aggressive penitents look is the thing

[storm jungle]

Imperium Moment

[odd sparrow]

like, how simple their legs are and how front heavy they are

they look like they physically cannot stop or slow down

[peak hamlet]

Yee they are def neat

[odd sparrow]

my hc is at the end of the battle if they're still alive they either just run around in circles or faceplant until they're recovered by their allies

[peak hamlet]

Liked how rubbishly engineered the old ones looked tho

[storm jungle]

the old one is really good

[peak hamlet]

Yee

https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/mediawiki/images/4/4a/PenitentEngineNEW01.jpg

[odd sparrow]

they still look fairly rubbish to be fair, v expendable vibes

[storm jungle]

minus porn

SIDEBOOB

[odd sparrow]

yes minus the hehe

sideboob

[peak hamlet]

Was about to say lol

[odd sparrow]

be horny

[storm jungle]

lmao

[peak hamlet]

Also butt

[storm jungle]

Mistress of Repentance to Repentia Superior

fucking cowards

[odd sparrow]

I hate sisters repentia so much

[peak hamlet]

I love them

[storm jungle]

i hate the new models the most

[odd sparrow]

i'm glad they got changed dhjfsa

[storm jungle]

i wish they had robes

[odd sparrow]

fight me

[storm jungle]

ONTOP of the body suits i mean

they look way too plain

[peak hamlet]

Allow my bdsm fetish into tabletop pleas

[final spruce]

Drukhari

[odd sparrow]

The giant ass swords make up for them being visually kinda bland imo

[plush mason]

oh hey thats the DOW model

[odd sparrow]

tho i can sorta get what u mean

i'm just glad they're not horny anymore

[peak hamlet]

Yee

[storm jungle]

I hate the whipping woman name change

[peak hamlet]

But like old ones were bdsm overload lmao

Its crazy

[storm jungle]

Mistress of Repentance to Repentia Superior

[odd sparrow]

yee

[storm jungle]

fucking cowards

REEE

[odd sparrow]

I dont mind the bdsm aesthetics sometimes but like

acceptable for a single callidus
not so much for an entire formation of nothing but scantily clad leather bound ppl

[storm jungle]

yeah and lets be fair

all the assassins are gay/lesbian bait

latex moment

[odd sparrow]

Correct

[peak hamlet]

Oh i absolutely love that aestetic, old ones def had a vibe to them but alas 3rd party minis and ppl converting their own made it like a million time worse than it already does

[odd sparrow]

yep

horny etsy models my beloved'nt

[peak hamlet]

Like latex bodysuit combined with crazy spikes, self mutilation and religious extremism def got something to it. Just making naked women and adding chainswords is.. eh

[storm jungle]

Death Cult Assassin Moment™️

[peak hamlet]

I love em

[storm jungle]

literally latex gimps

its so good

[peak hamlet]

Glad gw still got the balls to do em

[storm jungle]

i hope if their minis ever get updated we get a guy one too lmao

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-Uyq8t0Pi2OI/TgX24d5JH9I/AAAAAAAABPs/6LXaE7LLggc/s1600/m1241950_99060107007_DCAssassinsmain_873x627.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-KQlYpXDWPHw/T5SlvzHEh7I/AAAAAAAAAIo/29ETFJ6HB7g/s1600/Severina+and+Sevora.jpg

like DAMN

[odd sparrow]

literally just gimps

[peak hamlet]

This was the most recent one i think

https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/mediawiki/images/b/bf/Prond.jpg

[odd sparrow]

ooh i like that design

[peak hamlet]

Also no need for the nipples gw but i kinda apprechiate it i guess lol

[storm jungle]

have you guys seen her backside

she has radiators on her ass

[peak hamlet]

But yee death cult assassins def have a vibe to them

[odd sparrow]

hot

[peak hamlet]

Wait so we cant see her butt 😭

[plush mason]

the death cult assassin inquisitor backgroud was one of the best to play in inquisitor maryter

[storm jungle]

they were on the GW store but got krumped i think

[peak hamlet]

Bruh what gw

[odd sparrow]

and it's aligned to her cheeks too

my lord i love it

[peak hamlet]

Lmao what

Ass pads

[odd sparrow]

you've been a bad girl
CLANK

[peak hamlet]

:/

[storm jungle]

haha

[peak hamlet]

Other ones are around 35€

[storm jungle]

yeah her and the entire rogue trader guys have been removed from the store sadly

which is kinda weird

[eternal ledge]

I got here and the Rogue Trader Kill Team

[peak hamlet]

I mean kill team octarius is gonna leave us too at some point

[eternal ledge]

Was gonna use them for Wrath and Glory

[peak hamlet]

THIS IS UNACCEPTABLE

Bruh what

100€

I could literally do that better

No offense to the painter intended but maybe i should start selling painted minis on ebay for a living?

[storm jungle]

100%

people like me would buy them

[peak hamlet]

Ok i buy nun bsdm minis, paint em and sell em for 100€ each to you, deal

Im rich now

Thanks

[odd sparrow]

idk that's fairly solid

[plush mason]

lol

[peak hamlet]

Yee it is

[odd sparrow]

painting smthn as well as that takes quite a lot of time

ur paying for the painters time as well as necessary resources

[peak hamlet]

Im aware lol, i finished like 1 mini this year (and some basic ass terrain)

[odd sparrow]

mood

i'm getting that cursed city elf model for christmas so i can paint it and nothing else

[peak hamlet]

But yeah like are ppl unironically buying that? I think i could pull that off lol

Tho it might turn something i like into something that feels like a chore

[odd sparrow]

yee and it would take you many hours of work

so you'd charge accordingly

many ppl have more money than time to learn how to paint well

I do believe @placid timber has painted on commissions before so maybe she can give some advice on it

[peak hamlet]

Also painting is constantly improving, takes lots of time

[odd sparrow]

yee

[placid timber]

I have been summoned

Whats up?

[peak hamlet]

Might finish that gsc dude i started tho, idk im at the basecoating stage but it doenst have too many different details

looking at you csm minis

[placid timber]

@peak hamlet you need comission advice?

[odd sparrow]

im scared of GSC just cus there's so much flesh

[placid timber]

Flesh is ez if you do it first

[placid timber]

If the very first thing you do is flesh from start to finish its pretty ez, just mind the other details but if you need to paint over small mistakes, your flesh highlight will be fine

Thats if you do dry brushing for highlight

[odd sparrow]

How do you usually do it?

[placid timber]

Its quick and ez and really good looking

[placid timber]

So for my basic white skin tone i literally prime the model in wraith bone, a coat of guilliman flesh and a dry brush of whatever flesh highlight you want like kislev flesh for a warmer tone or pallid witch flesh for somthing lighter

Trying to be careful with guilliman flesh is a bad idea so thats why i do my flesh completely first

So i dont get streaks instead of full coverage

[odd sparrow]

do you use a wash for it?

[placid timber]

Thats what the guilliman flesh for

[odd sparrow]

ooh right a contrast

that makes sense then

[placid timber]

Its THE flesh contrast paimt

Its really nice

[odd sparrow]

Yeah i've been meaning to experiment a lil with contrasts for a while now

they seem like they could be useful

[placid timber]

Some are some arent

[odd sparrow]

Makes sense tho! I'm gonna have to figure out a solid scheme for tau flesh sometime, i only have to do it v rarely but every time i do im just like

what do

so they all look different

[plush mason]

so GW really does have its own paint names

[odd sparrow]

i have absolutely not memorised them dfshj

[plush mason]

do they have a color code?

[odd sparrow]

i usually use vallejo and stuff, the only gw paints i really like are metallics like leadbelcher, the washes seem uniquely good and uhh

that's basically it

[odd sparrow]

there's whole charts online equating them to competitors paints, which do have normal names

[plush mason]

wait so GW makes its own paints

[odd sparrow]

yee, citadel paints

[plush mason]

thats impressive

[odd sparrow]

this has been a thing for like decades

[plucky moth]

really paints them in a different light huh

[plush mason]

i dont follow the TT stuff so i had no idea

[odd sparrow]

they're not the best designed and they're overpriced so you prolly wanna use other brands paints where you can, but some of them are genuinely useful

main issue with them is that uh one sec

[peak hamlet]

Imma use this recipe for the skin https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8vJeNnwiAHM

[plush mason]

so just a typical GW product lol

[odd sparrow]

in the foreground is the pots citadel paints normally use, they're trash and dry out the paint rapidly, and in the background is dropper bottles that the paint has been transferred to

this is not official, GW refuses to produce paint in dropper bottles

[plush mason]

lol

[peak hamlet]

Only had drying out problems with ceramite white but that paint is literal trash anyways

[odd sparrow]

i have it v often, plus the pots get super dirty and crusty and sometimes the mechanisms bork

they're just bad

[peak hamlet]

I kinda like the gw pots, would be cool if they did dropper bottles for those that prefer them tho

[odd sparrow]

the vast majority of other, more competitive brands used by historical types, use dropper bottles

[plush mason]

you know this does explain why i have had such a hard time getting warhammer colors right in other rpgs i play

[odd sparrow]

cus they're objectively SO much more efficient, convenient

just way better fdshj

[peak hamlet]

Yee that def happens, you gotta pick out the dried paint from time to time

Which is annoying

[odd sparrow]

the only issue with vallejo paints is they are inherently a little thinner, so can be slightly worse for drybrushing

which is a part of why i like leadbelcher, thicker paint better for drybrushing and i drybrush metallics all the time

[odd sparrow]

it suck

it's how inefficient it is that gets me. like

with vallejo you can use EXACTLY how much u need without exposing any of the rest to air

[placid timber]

@odd sparrow btw army painter is coming out with their own brand of contrasts that are cheaper and higher quality

[peak hamlet]

I can def see that but idk, that smol paint shelf thingy gw paints got is handy imo

[odd sparrow]

I've not tried army painter stuff yet besides their primers

[odd sparrow]

would be more efficient spacewise if it was in dropper bot dies

i have a grudge vs citadel paint pots

[peak hamlet]

Imma try vallejo metallics at some point tho since edge highlighting with gw ones is a pain in the ass, smol metallic flakes are superior

[peak hamlet]

Eh not gonna change my mind, i prefer gw pots, never had any major problems with em

[lofty storm]

@odd sparrow Army painter is exceptional stuff.

Their primer and varnish is all I trust/use.

@peak hamlet And yeah, Vallejo metallics are all I use. LMFAO. I have 8 varieties.

[peak hamlet]

Based

I just have gw's shit

Sometimes i just basecoat and apply a wash or two, edge highlighting is literal pain

[lofty storm]

I hate edge highlights. A lot. LOL

[final spruce]

Army painter also have created their own contrast

[peak hamlet]

I love edge highlights lmfao

[lofty storm]

Oooo. I should check out their contrasts at some point.

Army painters products are pretty incredible for their spray products.

[final spruce]

Yeah Army painter contrast are better as contrasts than GW but they make for worse inks

Better coverage in average, consistant paint quality across colors

Also half the price

[lofty storm]

Very very good to know dude! Thnk you.

I like to use GW contrasts as either legit contrasts or thin down for inks

Or washes.

But I don't mind expanding my collection to include better contrasts to use specifically for that.

Since I use contrasts as my first "thin layer"

[final spruce]

@lofty storm https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHTeFwcKE9A

[lofty storm]

[rose thorn]

so, do the phoenix brethren/flame falcons, how religious are they

like black templar levels

and in additon how dead are they?

[plush mason]

?

[rose thorn]

The flame falcons were a… I think a Raven guard successor chapter that believed the emperor was a god, they actually had a geneseed mutation that made it so those with the most belief and were in the heat of battle literally burst into flames, but they were never hurt by the fire but instead it did an amazing job dealing with demons

Then the inquisition thought their fire was chaos caused and hunted like all of them down

And there is only like 2 named characters

One of them is a black shield in the deathwatch

And the other is the new chapter master

That’s like all I know

[plush mason]

so do inceptors and aggressors have the same armor type?

[prisma lark]

I think they both use Gravis armour, yes

although quite modified for both

[plush mason]

well yeah

so inceptors are basicly flying terminators

[lofty storm]

There's also Omnis armour.

Very very cool pattern for Vanguard Suppressors.

[barren tapir]

Suppressors... Aren't they the heavy guns guys for vanguard special marines?

[lofty storm]

These cuties.

😳

Even their helmet makes me happy.

[barren tapir]

Aren't those aggressors?

I swear, the new crap naming thing with Sm make me hate them more

[peak hamlet]

Nah the agressors have 2 heavy bolter pistols and are a lot more bulky

The supressors look odd imo, sry jambus 😔

[barren tapir]

Ah, ok, so the new devastators squad are called hellblasters now, and have mostly plasma weapons instead of heavy bolters

The aggressor is just a centurion replacement...

And Primaris now have to get a squad for each single weapon type... LOL

[peak hamlet]

Agressors are centurions yes, but hellblasters arent devastors

[barren tapir]

I mean, i already knew that intercessors got their weapons pool extremely limited, but i thought it was just them

[barren tapir]

https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Hellblaster_Squad

They are the primaris version of a devastator squad for lexicaum

[peak hamlet]

Eh bad interpretation imo

They clearly arent

[barren tapir]

Oh, just noticed something interesting, one of the SM in the trailer of the SM must be another firstborn that crossed the rubicon

[peak hamlet]

Since yes both are heavy support but only the devastors use heavy weapons like lascannons, missile launchers or heavy bolters

[cerulean wagon]

arent hellblasters exclusivley plasma guns

[lofty storm]

@barren tapir The best way to thank about it is like... Every major weapon type that the old Tactical Marines could branch into.

There are Primaris units for it.

[peak hamlet]

Yes, thats my point

[lofty storm]

So hell blasters are specifically plasma, inceptors, Suppressors, etc.

[barren tapir]

I know they are only plasma, but it seems they are the devastator version of primaris

[cerulean wagon]

basically primaris dont have devastators or tacticals anymore

instead they have eldar style specialists

[peak hamlet]

Yeah exactly

Eldar = primaris confirmed

[lofty storm]

Yeah! That's a good way to put it.

[peak hamlet]

Wont get new eldar, already got primaris

Ez

[lofty storm]

They all have their own specialities.

Eldar updates is Primaris Eldar.

[odd sparrow]

cus that means toucan drop more releases

to keep the fattened primaris players eternally happy

[lofty storm]

GW has a feeder fetish and fills my tummy up with plastic.

[odd sparrow]

OH YES ANOTHER WEAPON VARIATION FOR THE INTERCESSOR
POG

ᛁ᛫ᚹᚨᚾᚨ᛫ᛞᛇ

[barren tapir]

I found it is stated that primaris returned to the old legion era speciality division...

[lofty storm]

THESE ONES HAVE MISSILE LAUNCHERS.

[peak hamlet]

Just gib new nids gw

[barren tapir]

Harking back to the single-armament specialties of the Space Marine Legions, these squads are nonetheless strategically versatile.
Here, anyone know if it is true that legion where organized that way too?

[peak hamlet]

Also love how some ppl still think primaris dont replace firstborn lmao

[lofty storm]

Primaris will 100% replace it in most ways.

Tactical will probably always be "legal". But Primaris will have flash and specialty shit that will be hard to not want.

[peak hamlet]

They already did lmao, does anybody buy firstborn units when they start 40k? Heavy doubts

[lofty storm]

Thank god I joined the hobby in time.

Nope.

LMFAO

I only buy Primaris and characters.

😎

[peak hamlet]

Yee exactly

Will prolly just be the same way gw handled some other old stuff, make it legal for the next edition or two and then just dont put it in the next codex

Maybe add external pdf with rules for them like they did with chaos lord mounts

[lofty storm]

I think it'll take time to phase it out, but yeah.

And honestly.

I don't mind.

LMFAO

I joined at the right time. 😎

[peak hamlet]

Yee i kinda like the old marine design tho 😭

[barren tapir]

You like historic stuff Hobo, and now they are part of history, so it all make sense now

[peak hamlet]

Tho i dont play tabletop either and in the end you can use your firstborn as counts-as-primaris

[lofty storm]

100%

I also don't play it at all. LMFAO

[peak hamlet]

Man using firstborn as counts-as-primaris would make some nerds suuuper mad lmfao

[barren tapir]

IMO if you play TT you shouldn't care too much about lore on TT, if you like lore you shouldn't care too much about TT balance...
This way we can kinda keep the two things still connected but different making both sides happy

Due to their extended time behind enemy lines, Vanguard Space Marines are drilled heavily in the art of survival and self-sufficiency
So, what is different from firstborn? This was also part of their training dammit

[final spruce]

Nothing anymore

Fun fact that someone pointed out, Cawl , with the Primaris reintroduced Horus Heresy type of battle technique ( specialized squads) and weapons aswell, Volkite, Antigrav and Hellblasters being Dark Age technology that was either chapter specific (volkite was admech, hellblasters for Dark Angels and theirbplasma stc) and the land speeder being one of the only antigravs widely spread

[signal hill]

So...how do custodes measure up to primarchs? (I have the distinct Feeling this might end up in 'depends in source')

[errant mauve]

If we mean in a 1v1 combat scenario

Certainly far better than a space marine, but they still get their arses kicked in

If we want to do a bit of speculation, the Emperor sent 20 Custodes lead by a shield captain to oversee Lorgar after the whole Monarchia shebang, but that clearly didn't work out in the Custodes' favour when they all died on Isstvaan.

[signal hill]

Oh, the custodes were on isvaan? That is new to me

Or did i read that wrong?

[errant mauve]

20 Custodes were sent to monitor Lorgar at all times after Monarchia

Including and upto Isstvaan

Where they proceeded to get gibbed

[signal hill]

I guess there were too many Marines for them

[errant mauve]

They got ran through by the Gal Vorbak

Argel Tal bit off Aquillon's (the captain in charge) head off Venom style

[signal hill]

Dunno much about Istvan but the Essential
Honestly I don't know any of those names but venom ^^°

[errant mauve]

Haha

Basically

The first ever possessed marine gave the strongest Custodes out of the 20 the big chompo

*out of the 20 sent to monitor lorgar

[signal hill]

Posession makes sense, i was already wondering about the big mouth of that guy

[errant mauve]

Probably should specify that

[signal hill]

That was probably the Moment some realized that it was about to become nasty from thereon out

[errant mauve]

Guess you could say he really lost his head about it

https://tenor.com/view/ba-dum-tsss-drum-band-gif-7320811

[signal hill]

Rimshot indeed

[dusk widget]

Aquillon and Argel Tal were buddies too 😦

[storm jungle]

@errant mauve Also for the current timeline stuff in the new novel Wolftime one of the custodes is practicing against a hologram of Guilliman and keeps getting killed by it since they're too paranoid he'll go rogue or something

[errant mauve]

COPE-stodes

[smoky mauve]

I iust imagined a custodes fighting one of those inflatable flailing arm things with guillimans face crudly taped to it and just getting completely bodied

[storm jungle]

LMAO

technology is sparse

[smoky mauve]

https://tenor.com/view/police-wacky-waving-inflatable-tube-man-tube-man-inflatable-riot-gif-13206956

Custodes fights local blueman. Loses

[crisp heath]

Thats cool

Custodes are awesome

[rose thorn]

bruh i get the motives behind the space wolves in the months of shame, but they most likely ended up causing more planets to fall to chaos then people they actually saved

[storm jungle]

To be honest it makes no difference either way

the entire war was inconsequential since planets within the Imperium fall to chaos on a daily basis when you consider the size of the galaxy

[smoky mauve]

Because the nids are coming to kill us all. 🥲

[storm jungle]

🙏 Soon i hope

but its one of those events where when you consider the grand scheme of things it doesnt really matter much

[plush mason]

so blood angels can fall to the black rage even if they are in a dread?

[cerulean wagon]

yes

[plush mason]

wtf do they do with them?

[gaunt vector]

||this happens in Battlesector||

[plush mason]

||thats why i asked about it||

[barren tapir]

The same they do with all the others

[gaunt vector]

thankfully, unlike battle brothers, dreadnoughts have an "off" button

[errant mauve]

congrats on your new death company dreadnought!

[plush mason]

lol

[errant mauve]

bad ass mofos

[gaunt vector]

||well they either wrangle the dreadnought back under control and put it in death company or the battlesector thing happens where it just runs off fighting things until it dies like all death company do||

[plush mason]

so are they crazy fast like the normal death company battle brothers?

well fast for a dread

[gaunt vector]

||well ur entire force in the battlesector campagin fails to keep up with one so presumably yeah but I can't remember their rules||

[plush mason]

||he was a libarian dread tho so he had his psyker powers to do that||

[storm jungle]

librarian dreadnoughts

christ

[errant mauve]

Lore wise they're n ot necessarily faster, btu they get some funky wargear that lets them keep up.

[plush mason]

i see

[errant mauve]

the death company dread

they have these funky magna-grapplers on top of them

that stop metal fellas from falling back

[plush mason]

wow

[errant mauve]

it also fuckin ets it do a rocket jump

[gaunt vector]

||true||

[errant mauve]

basically

it's a magnet on a rope

[plush mason]

omg the impact of that

[gaunt vector]

what about them?

[errant mauve]

and depending on where you point it

it either goes push or pull

[storm jungle]

The fact that they exist

like wulfen dreadnoughts

[gaunt vector]

hehe drop pod with lightning claws go AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaa

ngl I can see why librarian dreads exist

[plush mason]

those things kick ass

[gaunt vector]

its not as confusing as somehow putting a mutated wulfen in a dread

[storm jungle]

they dont lmao

its literally just wulfen in a metal box

its one of the dumbest ideas ever

[plush mason]

they mutate after they are put in

[gaunt vector]

ah ok

[storm jungle]

"Ah yes lets put the mutant werewolves we regard as freaks we lock in cages in a dreadnought."

[gaunt vector]

so that would make them more like DCDs than LDs

[plush mason]

yeah

[gaunt vector]

#40k-lore-chat message

[storm jungle]

That still makes no sense

why keep them in the dreadnought

[plush mason]

nah they dont put wulfen in dreads. the wulfen are more or less the space wolves' version of the death company

[storm jungle]

Im glad they have never properly appeared in the lore

[gaunt vector]

because how TF do you get them out?

[storm jungle]

...

with cutting tools?

[gaunt vector]

I was joking

partially

[storm jungle]

AAA-

but yeah its the same as how the space wolves riding giant wolves have almost never made big appearances

you cant really make something like that cool

[plush mason]

just think of the wulfen as death company and you will understand how they are used

[gaunt vector]

I imagine that the SW don't keep them that way for long in the same way that BA DCDs don't stay in DC for ling

*long

[gaunt vector]

yes you can because "cool" is subjective

[storm jungle]

As usual no

[gaunt vector]

I think its cool

[storm jungle]

sometimes its not cool lmao

[gaunt vector]

to u

[storm jungle]

its literally just a dreadnought with a wulfen head

i call that lazy

lol

[gaunt vector]

then clearly you haven't seen the "death company intercessors"

[plush mason]

isnt the space wolve chaptermaster's hover boat pulled by 2 of those wolves?

[gaunt vector]

they are the laziest thing I have ever seen

[gaunt vector]

those are fenrisian wolves not wulfen

[plush mason]

i know

[storm jungle]

they're basically just death company marines so

beats me

[plush mason]

again wulfen = death company

[gaunt vector]

they aren't. they are normal intercessors with the blood angels upgrade sprew attached as standard.

there is no sculpting to them

there is nothing to mark them out as death company

other than the paint

which u could do to any model

[storm jungle]

In that case thats just the modellers being dumb

[gaunt vector]

they are blood angels intercessors not DC

[gaunt vector]

this is beyond stupidity its just lack of effort

[plush mason]

so primaris arent immune to the defects

[gaunt vector]

of course not

[storm jungle]

mostly because IRL fans got salty so

[plush mason]

so much for that plan lol

[gaunt vector]

nah

[storm jungle]

Basically because nobody wants to play Marines without their genetic defects

and the writers were pretty aware of this

[plush mason]

fair

[gaunt vector]

its quite hard to find a reliable cause tho

[plush mason]

so primaris wulfen are a thing?

[storm jungle]

Ye

[gaunt vector]

because everyone is so opinionated about marines

[plush mason]

the only valid opinion on the dark angels is that they suck 😛

[storm jungle]

wat

[plush mason]

its a joke

[storm jungle]

[slow prawn]

It had better be

[plush mason]

lol

so the death watch is made of marines for different chapters right?

how did that work with the dark angels and space wolves?

[frosty cobalt]

Rule of cool

[plush mason]

i imagine it involved a lot of insults being thrown back and forth

[frosty cobalt]

I mean with rivalries

When ur highly trained warrior monks working for an extra special strike force, you prolly leave the playground drama behind

[plush mason]

what other inter loyalist rivalries are there aside the DA/SW one?

[plush mason]

SW arent monks tho. they are vikings

[frosty cobalt]

Bruh

All SM are warrior monks

They pray/devote themselves to the emperor, meditate, and train

Its just in different flavors

[plush mason]

the space wolves also may have other gods

[storm jungle]

They have other gods yeah

but its the Imperium so yolo

[frosty cobalt]

Do they still meditate, train, and revere the emperor?

[plush mason]

if by meditate you mean down insane amounts of beer and food yes

space wolves litterally live in vallhalla

when they arent fighting they are feasting drinking and singing

[frosty cobalt]

Huh, forgot why they were so boring, thanks for reminding me

Makes sense that they needed executor marines

If ur dumbass wolfy mc wolfface gets upset during a feast or smth

[plush mason]

they are litterally every trope about vikings save the horned helmets lol

[storm jungle]

yeah but they still live the monk culture

its just with a viking skin over it

[plush mason]

fair

[storm jungle]

[frosty cobalt]

Thats what i figured, they still have chaplins and stuff

Just called different things

[plush mason]

hell feasting drinking and singing are great ways to meditate in fact

[plush mason]

wolf priests. they are also the apothocaries

[frosty cobalt]

Yea just a wolf slapped on

Still “priest”

[plush mason]

yup

part of me still hopes Russ comes back at some point

[storm jungle]

He is going to

every primarch is a big marketing tool

they'll probably show up in-between a few years

[plush mason]

show up how tho?

[frosty cobalt]

Some rando wolfpriest be like

[plush mason]

so what exactly do SM chaplins do?

are they like the navy chaplins?

[frosty cobalt]

Just a military priest. They run the prayers and all that jazz

[plush mason]

which are litterally just ordained therapists

[plush mason]

so just like the chaplins of today

but why would SMs need that?

[frosty cobalt]

Because the emperor was a thing

[plush mason]

yeah big E aka mr im not a god stop worshiping me

or ill kill

[frosty cobalt]

Having a skull faced maniac with a mace yelling “the emperor is with us!” Is good for moral in your hypno-indoctrinated troops

[plush mason]

i guess the whole "and they shall know no fear" thing is just BS propaganda

[frosty cobalt]

Yea

Hypno indoctrination can only go so far

[final spruce]

If I remember correctly its the Wulfen curse activating AFTER being interned into a dread

[frosty cobalt]

The oldest emotion of man is fear yadda yadda

[plush mason]

why not just gene mog their brains so they litteraly cant feel fear?

[final spruce]

Because fear is useful

[frosty cobalt]

Cause then u get SM throwing themselves at something they cant kill

[final spruce]

Allows you to access danger and nothing like adrenaline to kick ass

[frosty cobalt]

And i know GW forgot this but, marines are supposed to be a bjt rare if not Expensive

So u dont want them throwing themselves at smth they cant fight

[plush mason]

then why not mog their brains so the fear is no longer able to override their frontal cortex

[frosty cobalt]

A-like i said twice u dont want marines throwing themselves into death
B-gene tech is rare and done by the book.

[plush mason]

for me its the fact the emperor was able to make god men that can survive having their entire head blown off and then he cant even give his creations more indepth control over their own brains

it like he makes damn near perfect warriors on his first attempt and say "fuck it ima half ass everything else"

[frosty cobalt]

Or he goes: i can have 10000 perfect ones or 1000000 semi perfect ones

Also length of time it takes to make and equip a custodes vs a SM

[plush mason]

tbh i bet the chaos gods had something to do with it. if the whole "E made a deal with them to make the primarchs happen" theory is true

[proper helm]

I am 99% sure that theory is true

[frosty cobalt]

He made the custodes before the primarchs tho

So like why did that stop him

[plush mason]

idfk

i mean look at the thunder warriors

[frosty cobalt]

Badly made short lived no pressurized armor

[plush mason]

yup

[proper helm]

but cheap and numerous

[plush mason]

yup

[proper helm]

and they outstrip everyone else

[frosty cobalt]

Yea and he prolly didnt wanna give that up for “whoops-all-custodes”

War is logistical and monetary considerations before any fighting starts

[plush mason]

true

and i still dont get why big e needed the chaos gods to make the primarchs

[frosty cobalt]

Sangy has wings and was vampiric i dont think yur pulling that outta the human genome

[proper helm]

I saw a theory that he imbued them with aspects of his own personality / soul, with the reason being that due to people venerating him, even if he suppressed outright godhood, it would mess with who he was

[plush mason]

an yes the one mutant everyone in the imperium loves

[crisp heath]

We don't know how Custodes are made but we do know that they go over 10,000 often bc its hard to keep exactly 10k

[proper helm]

The Imperium is the heavyweight champion of managing cognitive dissonance

[frosty cobalt]

I bet u if that theory is true, all the “planets the primarchs are from gave them mutations” stuff is just cover up for saying the gods muddled them up

[proper helm]

I'm fairly sure a custodian is a work of generations to create

[crisp heath]

Well we do know that it is fleshcraft but you gotta remember the first custodes were the sons of pre unification terra warlords

[final spruce]

I saw someone talk about the Thunderwarriors

[proper helm]

oh right

[final spruce]

Keep in mind those dudes were physically stronger than current Primaris

[proper helm]

same with a lot of marines

[plush mason]

iirc they are still the sons of terra nobility

[crisp heath]

Unsure on that

Id have to go through my codex

But probably

[proper helm]

The Terran nobility would kill each other over who gets to have a scion in the custodes

[plush mason]

yeah

iirc its only the biggest and most powerfull families that get to send their sons off to become custodes

ofc that info comes from a little web comic thing on reddit so take it with a grain of salt

[barren tapir]

You don't send your son to become a custodes, one day a custodes is at your door and take them, if you try to refuse they make sure there is no one that can next time they pass

[plush mason]

lol

[barren tapir]

Ok, mine was an exageration, but it is also true, if they see a possible candidate they might go take it themself

[storm jungle]

Yeee thats the rare case

in the general one terran nobles go to a giant door and give them through there

[storm jungle]

alsoi this is from ADB in an old reddit thread he was talking in

@smoky mauve

Not exactly. What I was saying was, at the time of working on the lore, there was no reason they couldn't be male or female (and as far as things still stand, there's still no lore reason they can't be). But there is a non-lore reason, which was the previous IP overlord saying "There are no female Custodian models, they're all male, so don't write any female ones."

There was also a Studio mandate a couple of years after that, saying "Don't do female Custodians." Again, that seemed to tie in with the release of an all-male mini line.

Two very rare moments of direction from on-high.

I don't want to argue about what that may or may not mean, since although I'm ambivalent to the notion of female Space Marines (really, they'd make such little difference at the end result, I couldn't care less what gender they start out as), several creators actively thought female Custodians would've been cool, and there was no lore against it. (Hell, we were in the position to make lore for it.)

But long story short, no, the answer seems to be "There aren't any", though the reasons aren't in-universe (yet?).

[rose thorn]

Anyone have a good guide or anything on making a custom imperial guard regiment?

[scenic bolt]

in terms of what?

backstory, kitbashing, coloring?

[rose thorn]

Backstory

I got an idea for one but I have no clue how imperial guard is structured lmao

[scenic bolt]

it's pretty loose in many ways

in terms of their equipment, their recruiting, doctrine, homeworld etc

short of it is the adminstratum sets a tithe of bodies that a planet has to provide in the form of guardsmen

and it isnt too particular in how that quotas met

so you could have vostroyans who see it as a privilege and dynastic honor to serve, or the savlar chem dogs where they just flush out the prisons every few months and tell them youre guardsmen now

[rose thorn]

Ahhhh okay

[scenic bolt]

in general equipment is either loaned, given or sold to planets, or it is made on world

[rose thorn]

Ok perfect my idea for a guard regiment would work perfectly

my idea is the homeworld had a fuck up when given commands, and basically half of the entire planet thinks the other half of the planet turned traitor, and then everyone forgot about them

and it turns out the planet has a metric shitload of supplies stashed onto it so they have been depending on that while they battle

[final spruce]

Ah, asking for guard lore

[rose thorn]

then when they finally find the planet that infinitely at war, with it self, instead of clearing everything up they just pick up shit loads of their soldiers and send them to war under the pretense they were promoted or some shit

[final spruce]

Well Usually the IG is equipped by their homeworld so it will vary what they have

Some regiments are supplied by the Administratum exclusively

[rose thorn]

Administratum thats the word

makes sense, tje administratum are the people who are in charge of the entire imperial guard

?

[final spruce]

They are in charge of the admnistration of almost all the Adeptus

So not only the Imperial Guard

[rose thorn]

okay i see

[storm jungle]

I got u fam

oh no wait

[final spruce]

Yep wrong one

[storm jungle]

THERE it is, the guard are the bottom portions

their main insignia is the skull with wings

(tab opening-reading recommended obviously)

this pretty much is a perfect manual for how you want to structure it, you dont have to follow it step by step

read the text-boxes and you should be fine

[rose thorn]

oh okay!

[storm jungle]

Again though think of these as an instruction manual, dont gotta do everything it says

i just posted it so you know whos who since GW does a shit job at explaining it

[rose thorn]

lmao alright!

[buoyant crypt]

Flashbacks of reading the dark heresy starter manuals

All the empty space in my brain filled with warhammer knowledge :PES_Hands:

Never even finishing a play through

Ohhh the painnnnn

[errant mauve]

Man what a great set that was

Awesome sculpts for both sides

Where are my Chaos chosen GW

[buoyant crypt]

Idk man idk man

[storm jungle]

: YOU'LL GET YOUR DAMN CHAOS CHOSEN WHEN YOU BUY MORE LOYALISTS.

[atomic pelican]

soon

[errant mauve]

I stg if they fuck up chosen I will

be mildly annoyed

[odd sparrow]

! chosen exist in 40k?

[storm jungle]

Ye!

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammer40k/images/a/a8/Chaos_Chosen.png/revision/latest?cb=20200408192912

very humble boyz

[errant mauve]

We are forgotten chosen bros....

[plush mason]

do they fill a simulor role to the chose in fantasy battles?

[rose thorn]

mood

[upbeat arch]

Whats a chaos chosen?

[plush mason]

in fantasy they are litterally just upgraded chaos warriors

litterally the exact same but better in every way

[errant mauve]

CSM veterans

basically

[upbeat arch]

So like above an aspiring champion but below chaos lord

[errant mauve]

They're elite troops of a CSM warband, the most hardened warriors outside the leadership, beginning to be blessed with boons from the Chaos gods

but basically yes

[upbeat arch]

Neat

[plush mason]

so what happend to the sisters of sigmar in the fantasy lore?

[buoyant crypt]

You mean The Holy Convent of the Order of Merciful Sisters of Sigmar

[storm jungle]

Basically forgotten as a faction

[plush mason]

do they even still exist?

[storm jungle]

Not really

if GW wants to bring them back we'd have heard about it

[plush mason]

cuz wherent they declared heretical after the events in mordheim?

[storm jungle]

Nah

its literally just that they really arent that popular

theres not really a reason they would be added back in unless someone at GW wanted it

[plush mason]

no i just mean in the lore

[storm jungle]

For AOS?

[plush mason]

no

for fantasy battles

the sisters of sigmar are from the mordheim TT iirc which takes place during the time of magnus the pious

[storm jungle]

That i dont know, their lore is like a single page long

[plush mason]

so like 300 years before the end times

[storm jungle]

either way yeah they arent probably gonna appear anytime soon

especially since female stormcasts also fill their role just fine

so there isnt really a need for them

[plush mason]

for the sisters of sigmar to exist again fantasy battles would have to as well kekw

[buoyant crypt]

Ngl I read up on them when you mentioned them, finished everything in like 16 minutes, then forgot it all

[storm jungle]

LMAO

[plush mason]

i was just asking if its ever followed up what happend to them in the end times

[storm jungle]

https://warhammerfantasy.fandom.com/wiki/Sisters_of_Sigmar#History

Short answer: nothing

they are only in 2 sources

a random white dwarf article and the mordheim book

[proper helm]

I'm fairly sure they were excommunicated or something

[storm jungle]

Yeah i remember reading that somewhere

might have been 1d4chan

[plush mason]

yeah the wider cult of sigmar wanted to

[proper helm]

Many of Sigmar's priests wish to disband the Order altogether, claiming that women have no right to teach the holy word of Sigmar. Even the Grand Theogonist, ostensibly the chief authority over the Order, has cooled towards the Sisterhood, denying the throne to Magritta of Marienburg who was brought up by the Sisters and said to be sympathetic to their cause.

[plush mason]

so ima assume they did

[proper helm]

Yeah

[storm jungle]

lmao

sexism much

[proper helm]

Sexism and political convenience!

[plush mason]

yup

[proper helm]

The imperial civil wars are a really interesting time and I think GW (if they're still doing it) are going in the right direction by having the new Warhammer Fantasy Old World stuff set in that time

[storm jungle]

Yeee

[plush mason]

wait what

[slow prawn]

Yep!

The Old World will essentially be the Horus Heresy of Fantasy

[storm jungle]

very unbased

[plush mason]

oh shit

[storm jungle]

[slow prawn]

Hey, at least they won’t pump out 500+ novels about it

I hope

[plush mason]

i hope they cover wtf happend in marienburg

[proper helm]

If they pumped out some short stories in the tone of second edition WFRP I'd be happy

What, with their independence

[plush mason]

yeah

[proper helm]

and psuedo-democracy

[slow prawn]

Personally I’m happy for more Bretonnia stuff

[storm jungle]

The one advantage of WHF is that the world was incredibly rich too

its not like 40k where its just

"i dont fucking know fill in the blanks yourself lol"

[proper helm]

You can go and download the sourcebooks with most of that lore in them

Since a lot of it is in the Second Edition roleplay books

with such wonderful things like:

• French Karl Marx
• Halfling political movements

[plush mason]

lol

[proper helm]

And a whole network of satirists going up against the Empire

for democracy

[storm jungle]

god i love WHF

[smoky mauve]

This is honestly why, if I wanna DM a warhammer RPG, its going to be at a high level commanders, where I don't have to explain the socio economic policies of planet ex, where with warhammer fantasy, I can just say, "Barter, pay, or steal" with some modicum of confidence...

Because I have no idea how their sci fi economy works

Other than "the warp" or locally produced goods

Or 'regional equivalents" of things that my players wanted

[storm jungle]

I remember explaining vermintide to my friends once lmao

"Its literally just germanic europe ill explain more later"

[proper helm]

There is an actual damn map of trade routes going across the continent

lemme go get it

[storm jungle]

Haha yeah, like the world being a single place gives it so much identity

[proper helm]

Also you can occasionally pull a "when in doubt, steal from IRL history but make it fantasy"

[smoky mauve]

The Altdorf and Middenheim source books for Warhammer Fantasy came out and are coming in the mail soon for me 🙂

I'm so glad the old FFG simplified the sector to sector economy when they made rogue traders have like.... what was it? Money points? Profit Points?

Profit points I think

[proper helm]

Also? The Empire has trade routes linking it to Norsca

that's really cool to me

[smoky mauve]

So with enough PP (Heh), you could get anything

[storm jungle]

Oh yeah the fact that not all Norscans are psychopaths

[smoky mauve]

And honestly, this map is what I looked up when I was reading "elf slayer" and saw that they were trying to use that chaos harp artifact to try and literally close off altdorf and the empire by trying to seal up the sea of chaos? I was like... yikes.

[plush mason]

wait that part of the age of reckoning mmo was canon?

[storm jungle]

hm?

[plush mason]

that the southern most parts of norsca are practicly civilized

[proper helm]

honestly they could just seal up the bay Marienburg's in and everyone would be screwed

[storm jungle]

Oh nah its less canon and more that just common sense

[proper helm]

the rivers are the life of the Empire

[storm jungle]

a continent full of billions of people cant all be evil

[smoky mauve]

It might have been that. It was awhile ago

[storm jungle]

that and the outer edge territories not all worship chaos

[smoky mauve]

https://tenor.com/view/doubt-press-x-press-la-noire-gif-18717264

[storm jungle]

AAA-

[proper helm]

A fun detail is that the chaos gods kinda get lumped into pantheons with non chaotic deities by a lot of Norscans

Like Ulric is fairly popular among the norse

[plush mason]

dont they have animal names too?

[storm jungle]

Yeee its really cool stuff

also yeah the chaos gods get the Crow, the Hound, the Serpent etc

[plush mason]

like khorne is the hound and tzeentch is the raven

[storm jungle]

it basically depends on the tribe

[proper helm]

Odin Tzeentch

[storm jungle]

sometimes they just call them by their names

[proper helm]

perfection

[plush mason]

i mean odin was the god of magic wit and learning so it fits kinda

[proper helm]

Yeah overall Fantasy's chaos gods are a bit more excusable for why people worship them other than "anything but this hellscape"

[plush mason]

imo everything is better about fantasy vers 40k just due to the more reasonable scale of it

40k is great but it often goes way overboard on everything

[storm jungle]

Yeah its both a blessing and a curse

its still my preferred setting but fantasy holds a more special place in my heart lol

[plush mason]

same

[proper helm]

absolutely

[smoky mauve]

Its like... everything just seems more grounded?

[proper helm]

When you boil it down, it's really silly, but it has that feel

[plush mason]

yeah

[smoky mauve]

https://tenor.com/view/ah-shit-here-we-go-again-ah-shit-cj-gta-gta-san-andreas-gif-13933485

Is the basic feel when chaos attacks

in 40k

[plush mason]

yup

oh chaos is attacking. it must be tuseday

[smoky mauve]

But small raids of chaos marauders? Attacking the borders?

Oh they're just pirates

When the chaos hordes come from the north

It feels like something

[storm jungle]

DUDE. THIS.

Like i still get chills whenever Kruber mentions that a Norscan invasions is pushing into the Empire

thats more chilling than chaos marines destroying another nameless planet

[proper helm]

They have rolled down twice, and each time they have almost won

hell

they did win the second time in the End Times canon

[storm jungle]

Yep true

[plush mason]

verse the reaction to one of abby's black crusades

[storm jungle]

Nah like the black crusades are fine

the problem is that when the scale is TOO BIG you really just dont care

[plush mason]

yeah

[storm jungle]

I cared more about Kislev getting steamrolled than Cadia

[smoky mauve]

Yeah, its like... if every avengers movie was stopping an alien invasion?

[proper helm]

This is why I effectively create my own sub-settings. Sort of like what Wrath and Glory did with their Gilead sector

[storm jungle]

Best way to play warhammer is to make AU's cael

🙏

[plush mason]

same

[smoky mauve]

Its honestly why I liked Civil War the best out of the films <_<

[proper helm]

eyy I'm glad I'm not the only one

[plush mason]

Praag was sacked how many times and it still got back up?

[storm jungle]

Uh

[proper helm]

Once

and it's a screaming hell city that people are just used to now

[storm jungle]

Yeah it was mutated to the point that the stones themselves were turned into people etc

[proper helm]

I think it was the opposite

[storm jungle]

i think it got demolished once as Cael said and was rebuilt

[proper helm]

where the people merged with the landscape

[storm jungle]

Yep

[smoky mauve]

It was rebuilt, because the people of kislev are stubborn mfers. And I can get behind that.

[plush mason]

wtf did Kul do to that city?

[smoky mauve]

Everything

[storm jungle]

Siege it a lot i think lmao

[proper helm]

The city held out for a long time

and the attackers really were pissed

[storm jungle]

Yeee its more that chaos corruption started to spread

[proper helm]

ah

[storm jungle]

thats when things get fucky

[proper helm]

I really think it's funny that people just got used to the weirdness of it now

[storm jungle]

Yeah the best part of kislev lore is they are hardy people but have that vietnam veteran outlook on life

[proper helm]

"Pavel, the oven is screaming again. Be a dear and hit it until it stops"

[storm jungle]

aka every day could be your last so just have fun

them also being the first defense against norscan crusades is better

[plush mason]

and the fact they are cossak/russian is a nice touch

[storm jungle]

Yeee they're a mix of all the slavic cultures pretty much

with a slight mix of mongols

[proper helm]

There's a really big split between the Russian part and the Siberian part

[smoky mauve]

Honestly, I still fondly remember the Kislev portions of Gotrek and Felix. Those were a treat to read.

[storm jungle]

Yeah Kislev is mostly empty

[storm jungle]

The hot russian vampire babe helped 👀

[smoky mauve]

Because honestly, until that point there wasn't a lot of mention of Kislev until tthat point, right?

[proper helm]

You've got the ungol and the gospodar tribes

when did the book come out?

[smoky mauve]

Bruh. And the fact that her father, who is practically a lord in his own right, and his own men chased with them to bring her home? God damn dude. That still gets to me.

[smoky mauve]

2004 I think? I'm not sure

[proper helm]

hmm

ah, so that's even before the big Kislev sourcebook got published

[smoky mauve]

I just remembered cameos by the ice queen, and like... the court of Kislev. The other slayers. The twin dudes on the chaos side? Ahhh a good book

I miss fantasy

[proper helm]

well between the new RPG content and GW eventually bringing The Old World, it isn't really dead.

[smoky mauve]

Yeah, just... its hard to forget the end times haha

[proper helm]

yeah..

At least AoS is good nowadays

[smoky mauve]

Yep! The designs alone of the Lumineth Realm Lords made me buy in haha

[plush mason]

so back to 40k. what exactly is the process of becoming a primaris?

is it some machine they hook a first born up to or something?

[smoky mauve]

They are either built that way, from scratch byBellisarious Cawl

[odd sparrow]

drink milk, bones get longer, grow taller

[smoky mauve]

Or they undergo a surgery

Or that

[proper helm]

I believe it's the implantation of a few new organs at least

[storm jungle]

^

but basically

[storm jungle]

Already primaris? You go through the Rubicon

You are a fresh recruit? Just the usual surgery nonsense but primaris

the only real difference is just minor organs and a few enhancements

[plush mason]

wtf is the rubicon?

[proper helm]

It's called the Rubicon Primaris

after the river Caesar crossed

[storm jungle]

^

Yeee

its the procedure you need to go through to become a primaris if you're a firstborn

[plush mason]

ahhh that rubicon

makes sence

[storm jungle]

If you got plot-armor you'll do just fine

if not you might die

painfully

[proper helm]

It's been a few centuries since the Primaris were unveiled I think so the process is probably a lot safer now

but still

[proper helm]

that

[storm jungle]

60% change to succeed iirc

BUT Cawl says with every passing they are improving the procedure

[plush mason]

thats a lot higher than i was expecting

[proper helm]

I think that's the failure rate

oh

the process literally kills the marine

and they have to resuscitate him in time

[storm jungle]

Yep it is, just google checked

[proper helm]

medically dead and actually dead are different things

[plush mason]

wtf so they are litteral reborn?

[storm jungle]

Yep

welcome to why people dislike the primaris lol

[proper helm]

well in the same way that people IRL can be

[marsh grail]

Didn’t you know you need to restart your computer when you get an update?

[plush mason]

these arent skitarii tho

[marsh grail]

What are humans but fleshy skitarii?

[plush mason]

aka weaker skitarii

lol ofc Gotrek and Felix are in warhammer odyssy as well

oh so is it true the imperium cant even build new battleships and battle bardges?

[proper helm]

I'm fairly sure it theoretically can

but the time and effort of doing one is prohibitive

especially when you could cover a much larger area in Dauntlesses which are more than a match for the shitty pirates the navy goes up against usually

though some models absolutely can't be replaced

[plush mason]

didnt the ultramarines turn one of their battle barges into a giant bomb to destory the hive fleet attacking ultramar?

[proper helm]

I think it was an Emperor class battleship

[plush mason]

oh are those replaceable?

[proper helm]

theoretically

[plush mason]

so the defence of ultramar really was a phiaric victory

[proper helm]

Well Guilliman didn't become an appetizer so not really

[plush mason]

fair

and the chapter itself didnt die like the OG imperial fists did in the war of the beast

[final spruce]

Yeah for the Rubicon to work they need to insert the Cawl Forge (name of the organ) inside the marine which kills him and hope that the forge actually works and brings back the marine to life

Its supposed to work in tandem with the Lamaraan Organ to bring back marines from the brink of death to a state where they can fight after taking terrible wounds

Then they add some coils around your tendons

[smoky mauve]

https://tenor.com/view/arms-nintendo-minmin-idle-china-gif-17556347

[final spruce]

New Titus abilities in SM2

[serene jungle]

So you're saying

SM2 is becoming the oldschool God of War games

coil his arm forward with those chainswords or poweraxes

and just aircombo

until the highest difficulty turns into the most boring and tedious 1-2 combo dodge rince repeat endurance fest

[barren tapir]

I was thinking... If Perturabo has a small personal empire now, this could mean that the Iron Warriors are the only traitor legion that can actually replenish their number using normal recruits, since Pert despise chaos i doubt he is making his worlds into the warp, this would mean that the geneseed of new IW can be harvested and used for making more like the old days...

[final spruce]

I assume very few Chaos warbands actually use the training way jsut because of how Chaos is

I assume the IW are the only ones that can manage to do that or afford it

Since a promising CSM in training would quickly be assassinated / killed by anyone that wouldn't want to bother with a potential enemy

[errant mauve]

They generally replenish it through geneseed raids on loyalists

Most IW geneseed got real fucked up post-scouring, and are too mutated to implement

[gaunt vector]

hence Valrak's chapter

[final spruce]

I assume they go the good old cloning facility aswell then ?

[errant mauve]

Yurp

However, the IW are one of 2 Chaos Legions still resembling the old GC era levels of Unity

[gaunt vector]

Death Guard is the other one

[errant mauve]

in the new Honsou short stories, it's implied that the IW actually have surpassed Legion numbers at Ullanor

which is pretty much unheard of for any legion

[final spruce]

I mean it would make sense

IW are the only current legion with enough unity to thrive around smaller chaos warbands

So I assume smaller warbands wouldn't even bother to raid IW territories just for the sole fact that you got a huge empire backing you up

And if IW are as pettty as Pert, they would do vicious counter attacks against the assailants

[buoyant crypt]

I wish I knew enough to be a part of this conversation

[errant mauve]

IW also control a lot of the prime Warp Space routes as well, hence why Abaddon had to barter with Perturabo

Geneseed for Route Access

[errant mauve]

on they definitely are

[barren tapir]

Yeah, i knew they normally raid for geneseed, but i was thinking, that now, if Pert has a small empire outside the warp corrupted zone of the eye his space marine shouldn't had their geneseed being "destroyed" by chaos influence, so they could harvest it and use it as normal geneseed

[errant mauve]

I'll answer your question by using another example ig

Why was Tsons geneseed so mutated during the GC despite never having spent a second in the warp?

[barren tapir]

Because it was hardly tampered for making them having great warp connection

[errant mauve]

Now

IW

being chaos space marines

that regularly shove daemons inside tractors

also have regular contact with the warp

[barren tapir]

I know...

That is why i was saying NEW space marine

Take a human recruit, slap in them stolen geneseed, they don't get contact with warp, new genessed can be harvested

Old IW are already fucked

From a geneseed PoV

[errant mauve]

Oh I get you

[barren tapir]

I know that IW use warp, i know they despise it, i also know they are quite pragmatic

[errant mauve]

It's because IW geneseed, for whatever unexplained reason, has become standardly mutated biologically like any of the less stable legions during the Great Crusade.

The Chaos mutation is just the cherry on top

[barren tapir]

So, them having some non chaos world, where they can harvest recruits, seems reasonable

[errant mauve]

It's why Honsou

in his discovery that you could duplicate IW without direct geneseed implementation

Instantly shook up the politics on Medrengard and in Khalan-Gol

IW geneseed has just degenerated over the course of 10k yearss with little biologic maintenance.

[final spruce]

Nothing stops the IW doing geneseed farms like the mechanicus

[errant mauve]

they do GS farms

just not usually with exclusively IW geneseed

[plush mason]

so what do orks do with sentenals other light vehicles they steal/loot?

[storm jungle]

just ramshackle it into other vehicles they use

[final spruce]

^ Orks either dismantle vehicles for loot or ramshackles them into more orky versions

[marsh grail]

They should just install lift kits into every vehicle they salvage

Where’s my lifted chimera?

[plush mason]

lol

[rose thorn]

god i love how varied and inconsistent the emperor's children's personalities and motives are

also i love how becoming a noise marine is just trapping yourslef in an infinite cycle of self destruction

its probably realistically the worst thing you cna be besides like, a chaos spawn

[buoyant crypt]

Yeah I’d give anything NOT to be a noise marine lol

[rose thorn]

yeah its honestly fucking awful

like at first

its amazing

but like 6 months in it is god fucking awful

[plush mason]

?

[rose thorn]

noise marines are some of the most envious bastards in 40k

and they have an unmatchable emotional pit they attempt to fill with pain, suffering, and any form of attention from the dark prince

if a noise marine gets any gift of slaanesh they should expect every single other noise marine to back stab them

and so alot of noise marines become horrifically paranoid, and often take drugs to attempt to sooth them selves and again, fill that emotional pit with anything

is basically devoting youself to a god who doesnt really care about you

damn following slaanesh fucking sucks

unless you are at like

the lowest fucking ranks

[crisp heath]

I have that emotional pit already but I fill it with warhammer

[rose thorn]

so debt?

[crisp heath]

Hence why I praise Slaanesh

YES

[rose thorn]

noise marines are often like, receive a metric shit load of pleasure upon first becoming one

but then slaanesh sucks that away slowly

then you attempt to do as much as possible to reach an impossible high

[crisp heath]

PRAISE SLAANESH

[rose thorn]

YEAHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

THE SILENCE OFFENDS SLAANESH

[final spruce]

@errant mauve So let's say you actually got me interested about CSM and the Iron Warriors, do you have any good and bad suggestions to me apart from Black Legion (Just began it)?

[errant mauve]

As in books or to play?

[final spruce]

Books ofc

I'm not interested in painting CSM, my KT is more than enough

[errant mauve]

Assuming this is for 40k only

IW
Storm of Iron
The Honsou Omnibus / Iron Warriors Omnibus
Siege of Castellax
Any War of the Beast novel with Kalkator in it

I can drop the 2 new honsou short stories as well

BL
Black Legion series (that's about it )

[buoyant crypt]

Storm of Iron is chad

[errant mauve]

WE
Wrath of Kharn
Kharn: Eater of Worlds
Trials of Azrael
The Red Path
Chosen of Khorne

[errant mauve]

still my favourite 40k novel since reading it in 5th ed

EC
Fabius Bile Trilogy
Lucius: The Faultless Blade
Wrath of Iron (a misnomer, I know)

DG
Lords of Silence
Reunification

TS
Ahriman Trilogy
(I don't read much on TS)

NL
Lord of the Night
Night Lords Trilogy
Carcharodons: Red Tithe

[final spruce]

Mmmh thats a lot of box

[errant mauve]

WB
I feel 30k reading is mandatory but for 40k only:
Word Bearers Omnibus

[final spruce]

Already read Lords of Silence, I liked it

[errant mauve]

Wraight is a good un

Vorx is a good boy

[final spruce]

Yeah 30k is fine as long as its no HH book

I ain't touching this

Beyond the third book

[errant mauve]

well

in that case

no 30k for u outside the black books