40k-lore-chat

[daring creek]

on how ot get rich

[opaque coyote]

And accidentally struck and killed his bio dad

Unknowingly

[daring creek]

angel shit

[heady rivet]

I dont believe in ghosts but some buildings are haunted

I will not explain

[daring creek]

I just hope her eyes open before its too late

but I'm not seeing that happen

[daring creek]

You should check out an abandoned building forum

[opaque coyote]

You are not obligated to try

[raven stone]

Some people live their entire lives with eyes closed…

[daring creek]

smile and nod

[dense osprey]

Question

[daring creek]

yello

whats up

[dense osprey]

hi

[opaque coyote]

Honestly? Just say that you're being stupid and then ignore it

Every time

[dense osprey]

How many Cyphers from DA are being mentioned in the books?

[opaque coyote]

Unless if she's in charge of your finances

[heady rivet]

Hey everyone! Lets beat this guy with hammers!

[opaque coyote]

Then don't

[dense osprey]

welp

what can i say except

[raven stone]

That is…well, it is a tricky question.

[rocky gale]

Where's the Dark angel nerd when you need them

[daring creek]

I call her stupid regularly just not in a direct matter. She knows I think shes dumb as hell

And

she is dumb as hell

[dense osprey]

oh, gifs cannot be sent, oh well

[rocky gale]

Gotta earn that right

[daring creek]

bitch got chemical burns from tryna wash dishes with INDUSTRIAL STRENGTH DEGREASER

[opaque coyote]

Clarify the question a bit

[heady rivet]

Speak fo yo self, playa

[daring creek]

https://tenor.com/view/giga-gigacat-cat-mewing-mogging-gif-12429734670640119345

[dense osprey]

Anyway, i am asking because in the Angels of Caliban appears a Cypher. Then there's a book titled "Lord Cypher [...]" that takes place after DA breaking (and on the Holy Terra). And i am wondering, if there were any other Cyphers

[opaque coyote]

Although tbf I don't know shit about the DA so I might be of zero help but that question is a bit confusing

[fervent geode]

Oh you mean how many held the title?

[dense osprey]

yeyeyeye

title is Lord Cypher to be specific if i am not wrong

[rocky gale]

https://klipy.com/gifs/tusareve-katy

[opaque coyote]

Oh.

Generic answer I know but we have no idea who 40k Cypher is

Or how many Cyphers there are

It's a mystery™

[fervent geode]

I think in First of the Fallen the Cypher was an older man, this was prob the original Cypher in Angels of Caliban

[rocky gale]

There may also be multiple Cyphers at the same time we're not sure

[opaque coyote]

Who knows if it's the original 30k cypher or a title passed down

[fervent geode]

This Cypher was later eliminated by Zahariel El'Zurias

Who took up the mantle

[opaque coyote]

Basically an Alpharius situation except actually a mystery

[raven stone]

We can also provide more contextualised answer if you tell us what the intent of knowing the number of title holder is (I.e. are you fanfic writing, homebrewing, etc.)

[fervent geode]

As for 40k Cypher

[dense osprey]

I believe there can be only one. And in Angels of Caliban Cypher there was killed, in 30k by a psycher

[fervent geode]

Wait i know a DA guy who has a better explanation than me

[fervent geode]

That was the Original Lord Cypher being murdered and replaced by Zahariel

[rocky gale]

Yea but in 40k I think it's been implied that there are maybe two people both claiming to be Cypher

[opaque coyote]

Cypherception

[fervent geode]

It's Zahariel or Corswain more than likely as per Luther first of the fallen

Zahariel concurrently is the avatar of ouroboros

Corswain goes missing during the fall of caliban according to Farith, who asks a captured Luther if he had seen him since he was by the Lion's side

Luther says Corswain had taken arms and chased Zahariel into the catacombs beneath Aldurukh

And that was the last he had seen of either of them

-this from a DA guy

[opaque coyote]

Damn this is definitely me being unfamiliar with DA lore

Cause I didn't know any of this shot

[fervent geode]

Its probably Corswain imo

[opaque coyote]

Tbf I barely pay attention to the DA

[fervent geode]

Zahariel was too chaosified by the Ouroborous

The Watchers also were against him iirc

[raven stone]

DA team killing makes them hard to pay attention to :p

[dense osprey]

Wasn't Corswain killed during chapter break?

[fervent geode]

Nope

He was last seen chasing Lord Cypher (Zahariel) on Caliban in the final battle

[dense osprey]

Then ye, prob Corswain

[fervent geode]

I think Zahariel is Lohoc from Son of the Forest maybe

[fervent geode]

Me too tbh

Im just constantly attacked by dangles

[storm jungle]

I THINK theres been 2-3 cyphers?

[dense osprey]

Unless... in "Cypher: Lord of the Fallen" the DA marines fight with "heretic" DA marines, on which side Zahariel was.

[storm jungle]

Its kinda confusing because its a title

[dense osprey]

"heretic" as deemed heretic

[opaque coyote]

Yeah I'm just not interested in anybody except my favs

[fervent geode]

Then again they were trying to nab him

[fervent geode]

Same ngl

[fervent geode]

Yeah, OG Lord Cypher, Zahariel, Corswain?

Also also

[opaque coyote]

And usually mysteries like this are just confusing and lame to me

Cause like

[fervent geode]

Idt we ever see 40k Cypher do warp shit

[heady rivet]

Cypher is a missing Primarch

[dense osprey]

DA, AS and IG are the best in my opinion

[fervent geode]

Zahariel was a Librarian steeped in Warp shit

[opaque coyote]

IS MAN TITLE MAN???? Is used a lot in 40k

And like

I don't care because I don't care about the man

[fervent geode]

Adepta Sororitas, Imperial Guard and Dangles?

[dense osprey]

yep

[fervent geode]

Ah i see

[raven stone]

The closest we got to that is Cypher disappearing himself from a Black Templars battle barge holding cell.
Before said Battlebarge then suffers “catastrophic damage for unknown reasons.”

[fervent geode]

WB, but i like these T'au guys and these crons

[dense osprey]

Last books i own i have to read are 2nd, 3rd and 4th chapter of Ghant Ghosts

[heady rivet]

You, the reader, are a missing Primarch

[fervent geode]

I still reckon that was fallen shenanigans

[opaque coyote]

The Missing Primarchs are clearly just

[fervent geode]

They all hunt his ass

[dense osprey]

no, it was mee all the time, Alpharius!

[opaque coyote]

"Hey yo, just insert whatever you want here"

[fervent geode]

Alpharius IS DEAD

[opaque coyote]

"Make up your own Primarch for fun"

[fervent geode]

Omegon IS DEAD

[dense osprey]

then Omegon XD ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[fervent geode]

THE ALPHA LEGION IS DEAD

[rocky gale]

[opaque coyote]

Nah, confirmed alive

[opaque coyote]

I didn't stutter

[fervent geode]

QUETZAL CARTHACH WAS THERE THAT DAY ON CURSED ESKRADOR WHEN HE DIED

And Occam too iirc

[heady rivet]

Well thats the popular misconception, accoeding to the original writers it was purely a reference to Romes lost legions that just got out of hand and got grandfathered in to the revised lore as an intentional mystery for funsies

[fervent geode]

RAHHH KEEP THEM DEAD AS DORN

[raven stone]

Surprisngly this is genuinely true. The guy who wrote Dorn VS Alpharius clarified there was no trickery there, Dorn really did off the actual Alpharius. Or definitely one of the two twins even if we take swap shenanigans into account.

[dense osprey]

I feel like i started something bigger by accident. Do i mind? Not at all ❤️

[fervent geode]

Yeah ive heard

[opaque coyote]

Yeah it was clearly a reference lore anecdote turned into an excuse to make your own

[raven stone]

Welcome to lore, this is what it is all about

[fervent geode]

Nah this is tuesday

Just another tuesday

[opaque coyote]

For homebrew

And tbf good choice

[dense osprey]

Yeyeye, like honstly? I am happy i found such lively lore channel

[opaque coyote]

Cause you can do a lot with a missing primarch

[fervent geode]

Insane*

But yeah

[opaque coyote]

Just look at the theories and OCs and such

[daring creek]

the village on fire and u celebrating

[dense osprey]

Obbviously

[fervent geode]

My theory is that the 2nd and 11th primarchs are DEAD DEAD DEAD DEAD

[raven stone]

Even as an Alpha Legion fan I actually liked that. If there is anyone who can just stay through all the tricksies the AL throws, it is Dorn.

[fervent geode]

More DEAD PRIMARCHS WAITER

[raven stone]

Pretty much semi confirmed. We just don’t know how they died. Russ is implied to have participated in at least one of their deaths.

[fervent geode]

Based

Omegon dying to Guilliman i find ironic too

[winged jacinth]

I like to think they ran out of ideas after 18 legions

[opaque coyote]

Honestly I like to imagine that they did what Guilliman wanted to do during the Heresy.

They escaped and are drinking a nice glass of wine looking at the Imperium and being like

[fervent geode]

Since they hated each other since Tesstra Prime

[opaque coyote]

"Man I'm glad I escaped"

[fervent geode]

Considering they had names like crow crow and iron hand near the end i agree

[opaque coyote]

While seeing the Imperium tear itself apart

[raven stone]

Yea that is the one that is still somewhat slightly up in the air even now.
Maybe the new post-Siege novels will clarify it.

[fervent geode]

Guilliman didnt want to do that, but still relatabke

[dense osprey]

Btw, are there official books about shark space marines? Charadrones?

[fervent geode]

True, we shall see

[opaque coyote]

I mean he did want to escape

[fervent geode]

Yeap, a series by bob mcniven

[opaque coyote]

Live as a farmer specifically

[heady rivet]

Bring back the Rainbow Warriors legion

[dense osprey]

Is it any good?

[opaque coyote]

It was like a split second thought tbf

Like the equivalent of

[fervent geode]

Ooooooh 100%

I yhought you meant desert

[opaque coyote]

"Fuck I wish I didn't have to do my job" but 100x more stressful

[fervent geode]

I didnt read it lmfao

No word bearers

[opaque coyote]

Yeah I like to imagine the missing Primarchs actually did that

[heady rivet]

Bro thinks he's Diocletian

[fervent geode]

Oaths of Damnation was aight by me tho

[opaque coyote]

Because it's funnier to think

[dense osprey]

I just finished Angron

[fervent geode]

Same author

[opaque coyote]

Like they saw the Emperor's Imperium and were like

[winged jacinth]

Gw reveals one of the lost legions are women just to piss youtubers off

[opaque coyote]

"Nah I'm good."

[dense osprey]

From Ian St. Martin

[fervent geode]

Slave of Nuceria or Red Angel

Oh okok slave of nuceria

[dense osprey]

Slave of Nuceria

[fervent geode]

How didya find it

[dense osprey]

Not fun of the chapter, but i got invested into it's origin

[opaque coyote]

Honestly there is no given reason for why Geneseed doesn't work on women. So I like to think it's purely cultural

[heady rivet]

They were Grey Knights actually

[dense osprey]

I was given it for XMas

[fervent geode]

I only read my legion's garbage

[fervent geode]

Two T'au women actually

[opaque coyote]

Either that or simple statistics.

Since men do have a higher strength capacity/ceiling. We just reach it never

Like the last time we did was 10,000 years ago

[fervent geode]

I think it kills them in lore, but idk

[dense osprey]

I have Sisters, DA, Angron, Imperial Guard, Necrons and Mechnicus books

[opaque coyote]

So I imagine Space Marine enhancement is just

"Which sex has the best base to strengthen"

[dense osprey]

So a little bit of this, a little dash of that

[fervent geode]

It was when a women passed the aspirant trials they said so

[heady rivet]

There is a reason, something about Zygotes. Big E never made it compatible with women

[winged jacinth]

Iirc there was something about being similar to the primarch's genetics which presumably includes having a y chromosome

[heady rivet]

Also he didnt want them banging anyway

[fervent geode]

ONLY MEN SHALL BEAR HIS SEED

[winged jacinth]

That's where they keep the boring genes

[fervent geode]

He wanted no super race created iirc

To defy him the superman

[opaque coyote]

I mean I thought the SM penors didn't work in general.

[dense osprey]

Welp, i gotta dash, thanks for the talk guys.

[heady rivet]

Astartes were meant to be a temporary solution

[opaque coyote]

Or didn't have the

Drive

[fervent geode]

He'd destroy all legions eventually iirc

[opaque coyote]

So women wouldn't affect that

[raven stone]

So I am going to rain on the parade a bit and say I am fine with Marines being men only.
There is a series called Claymore where only women can become super powered medieval fantasy monster hybrid knights, so…

But that being said - yes, GW did a piss weak job justifying it when they had the chance to do so, basically just saying “because Emps tried and failed.”

[fervent geode]

Except maybe the trefoil

[heady rivet]

So, they have them and they work apparently. Its just a cultural/mental thing

[fervent geode]

Maybe those could stay

[winged jacinth]

I like to think space marines have tiny roid nuts

[fervent geode]

EC do fucked things mkay

[rocky gale]

Claymore mentioned

[opaque coyote]

Tbf I think SMs being men only are fine purely because it makes sense for the Imperium to be that stupid

[rocky gale]

https://tenor.com/view/claymore-claymore-clare-clare-claymore-anime-shonen-anime-gif-26277825

[limpid granite]

Space marines dont have a sex drive at all

[opaque coyote]

Also because SMs are a criticism on masculinity

[limpid granite]

But that doesnt mean they cant romance

[fervent geode]

They are just infertile anyway iirc, since their genes are human anymore

[heady rivet]

There's this little-known series called Age of Sigmar, with these things called Stormcast...

[fervent geode]

Eidolon has fucked before

[raven stone]

I am glad it is approval 😅

[fervent geode]

Look it up

[winged jacinth]

I watched claymore years and years ago
The ending to that show is insane

[opaque coyote]

Like especially scenarios like how Black Templars select candidates

[rocky gale]

The shows ending is so bad

[opaque coyote]

Are clearly meant to be stupid

[fervent geode]

WB going door to door for kids is funny

[rocky gale]

They made it before the manga was finished, so winged it

[fervent geode]

Since it happened

[arctic talon]

Many such cases

Lmao

[opaque coyote]

Because there is a certain logic to it

It's just stupid

[raven stone]

Oh I don’t mind that either, just saying gender-restricted super empowering can be done, but there needs to be superior world building to support it. Something GW has failed to do, and in which Claymore succeeded.

[arctic talon]

I mean marines aren’t meant to really be empowering, they’re toxic masculinity the faction

[rocky gale]

The thing with Claymore is that they aren't just women, it's revealed later on

[fervent geode]

True (not CSM tho we are insanity ahahahahahshshs)

[opaque coyote]

I think the only anime that actually was interesting from that is

FMA 2003 which basically just had a completely separate storyline from the manga.

And it's worth watching because it is genuinely interesting

[raven stone]

(Basically: in Claymore, men go mad with power and become monsters in record time if put under the same procedure.)

[arctic talon]

There’s some positive aspects of masculinity in them but they’re very much toxic masculinity the faction in how they act

[opaque coyote]

It is genuinely so fascinating to see how different writers saw Ed and al's characters. And both are valid

[raven stone]

Oh…crap, my age is putting me out of touch lol.

[rocky gale]

They can make Men, they just can't resist the urge to use all their power and essentially overload

[heady rivet]

Female Space Marines are a nothingburger since nobody actually wants that because Astartes are boring and this would just be another Astartes wank to fuck over other factions. Its just bait

[opaque coyote]

Overall Sisters are cooler

Clearly

[fervent geode]

More faith = more based indeed

[limpid granite]

https://tenor.com/view/adepta-sororitas-sisters-of-battle-nuns-in-space-warhammer-40k-black-templars-gif-8164329001177689819

[jade holly]

When are we getting female Ogryns in the Sisters of Battle smh

[raven stone]

I mean, yea. You know the setting enough and eventually you grow out of marines.

[daring creek]

they put woke in my marines

[raven stone]

Unless you are a chud who doesn’t

[arctic talon]

I like marines smh

[limpid granite]

I wont

[arctic talon]

They’re interesting

But not my favorite

[daring creek]

I thought u were malarkey for a sec

[fervent geode]

I like marines but other stuff is cool

[limpid granite]

Marines are cool as hell

[heady rivet]

Some crimes can never be forgiven

[arctic talon]

People can like different things

[opaque coyote]

Tbf I still like a bit of Chaos Space Marines

But yeah, you eventually do move away not even out of hatred.

Just that there's a big galaxy

[heady rivet]

I mean jokes aside yeah Astartes fun

[limpid granite]

https://tenor.com/view/warhammer-40k-warhammer-space-marine-space-marine-2-space-marines-gif-8191171422399458629

[fervent geode]

I dont like the loyal ones

Fuck en

[jade holly]

I like Iron Warriors because machinery, using Daemons for wars pragamatically and the fuck you levels of pettiness are amazing

[opaque coyote]

And of course, everyone wants to explore that big galaxy

[rocky gale]

Using their powers is kinda like uhhhhhh edging, women can resist the urge to go too far. But none of the men could.

[heady rivet]

But why tho

[daring creek]

he spammed that gif b4

[opaque coyote]

Tbh loyal SMs are definitely harder to be interesting cause they can't be

Too different

[daring creek]

https://tenor.com/view/warhammer-40k-space-marine-2-dreadnought-gif-7495076671582279435

[raven stone]

Damn all this claymore talk is making me want to watch anime (clips) of it again XD

[rocky gale]

And well the most powerful men could resist the urge, just by that point the organisation had decided to execute all the men so they purposely overloaded since they would be killed anyway

[jade holly]

The best space marines are unironically the dreadnoughts

[opaque coyote]

Sure they all have their quirks but most of them do the same thing.

[daring creek]

dreadnoughts are transition goals.

[jade holly]

Everyone loves seeing granpappy come out of his retirement home and raise Hell

[fervent geode]

Except UM, tbh the 30k UM esp have some cool ass fucks, and the White Consuls

Exorcists are aight too

Daemons

[jade holly]

You think IH would ever start going renegade?

Nah

They like working with Admech too much

[limpid granite]

I mean

Iron warriors are literally iron hands but traitor

[fervent geode]

Didnt stronos want to have distance with em now

[rocky gale]

Heretecks exist

[arctic talon]

No

[fervent geode]

No Ferrus deosnt fucking murder his marines for telling him things for a start

[arctic talon]

Every tech priest has a little heretek in them

[fervent geode]

Also mechanisation vs siege warfare in terms of doctrine (oversimplified)

[jade holly]

Me when I get my best ideas from the dragon in Mars that totally isn’t a Xenos star god

[heady rivet]

EXTREMELY LOUD INCORRECT BUZZER SOUND

[jade holly]

[rocky gale]

Is recommend the manga

[opaque coyote]

I think the only ones that are interesting are ones like

Salamanders (yes I find them interesting shut u-)

Exorcists

And Minotaurs

Because they also have a culture as well

[daring creek]

Oh that sword girl anime

[jade holly]

One is iron within, the other is iron without

[opaque coyote]

With their quirks being very distinct

[limpid granite]

https://tenor.com/view/how-it-feels-when-you-meme-nanami-jjk-gif-10683277372535996893

[heady rivet]

What about my cool epic homebrew chapter

Checked and mated

[opaque coyote]

Probably very cool

[fervent geode]

I like White Consuls too, they do good governing

[opaque coyote]

[fervent geode]

I likey

And 30k UM

[jade holly]

I like my homebrew Iron Hand successors chapter

[heady rivet]

On the contrary. Bet you feel silly now

[opaque coyote]

But generally Chaos Marines are so much more interesting because they're allowed to be varied

[jade holly]

A small rag tag group of IH stuck on a backwater fringe planet resorting to cowboy warfare

[fervent geode]

Rust and Rot

[fervent geode]

Defo

And their motivations, betrayals, regrets

[opaque coyote]

Like Red Corsairs basically making their own mini empire

[fervent geode]

https://tenor.com/view/gordon-ramsay-ramsay-gordon-let-him-cook-let-willian-cook-gif-20750589

[jade holly]

I wanna see more non chaos aligned renegade marines tbh

[opaque coyote]

It's also why I glaze the NL book series cause it goes into detail how much it

FUCKING SUCKS

[jade holly]

That’s an area that could be expanded more

[opaque coyote]

Being a CSM

[fervent geode]

Soul Drinkers Omnibus

[opaque coyote]

Their struggles, their weirdly captivating brotherhood

[fervent geode]

I think the relictors had a book

[jade holly]

Counterpoint: Noise Marine

[opaque coyote]

And the fact that they managed to successfully make characters that have sympathetic qualities but aren't sympathetic themselves

[fervent geode]

I like the WB one

[opaque coyote]

Like you clearly know they're absolutely awful

[fervent geode]

They are all evil fuckheads

[opaque coyote]

Terrible

But they're human

[jade holly]

WB embrace it the most

[fervent geode]

What else is there to do

[jade holly]

they love worshipping gods and being called good boys

[fervent geode]

They see it you know

[opaque coyote]

WB are interesting because

[fervent geode]

The truth of grimdark

[opaque coyote]

Imagine finding God

Only to realize that

God is actually four evil dickheads

...

[fervent geode]

The fucking gods are real, even if they are satans they are real, what the fuck is one to do

[jade holly]

Imagine finding God but God himself was a Reddit atheist

[opaque coyote]

Some would fight against them

WB are the other response

Accept

They are Gods after all

[fervent geode]

All we ever wanted was the truth

Its them

Literally

[jade holly]

Five*

Vashtorr Copium

[opaque coyote]

Malice moment

I like Malice as an idea

IDC if I get slandered for it

[jade holly]

who cares about Malice smh, we getting all industrial and engineering up in here

[fervent geode]

I like to think he still exists somewhere

[opaque coyote]

Like Chaos is inherently self defeating. Entropy eventually calms everything

[fervent geode]

The WB have some little chapel for him

[opaque coyote]

So I think having a God of that is valid

[fervent geode]

Nurgle is entropy

[opaque coyote]

Since it goes off the scientific definition of Chaos.

[fervent geode]

Malice is anarchy iirc

[jade holly]

Just a small one in the janitorial closet

[opaque coyote]

How it eventually succumbs to being calmed

[opaque coyote]

Yeah but Malice clearly is self hating and self defeating by design

[wintry cloud]

Malice army when

[fervent geode]

Yeah near the Cathedrum of Fuck the God-Emperor

[opaque coyote]

It hates chaos, it hates itself, it hates everything and everyone

[fervent geode]

Indeed

[opaque coyote]

Tear it all down

Leave nothing but ashes

Maybe then it can finally die

[fervent geode]

Sons of Malice drop in 12e this was revealed in a dream

[opaque coyote]

Also a suicidal chaos God is a funny idea ngl

[fervent geode]

Real

[arctic talon]

Play normal CSM

[opaque coyote]

"PLEASE JUST LET ME DIE."

"nah we wanna keep the game going"

[arctic talon]

The sons of malice aren’t that unique equipment wise

[wintry cloud]

Im collecting them yeah

I just want malice to be present

[fervent geode]

Yknow what i find unique about sons of malice

[opaque coyote]

Yeah it's quite sad since there's a lot you can do and they just...

Don't

[arctic talon]

Why

[wintry cloud]

Love the colors

[arctic talon]

There really isn’t

[fervent geode]

They were at Cadia

[arctic talon]

Beyond their colors

lol

[opaque coyote]

In terms of equipment at least

[arctic talon]

Why

[wintry cloud]

Yeah ik

[arctic talon]

They’re recentish traitors

Why would they have unique gear

They’re a warband

[fervent geode]

They were also called sons of malice whilst a loyalist chapter

[arctic talon]

You’re expecting too much

[opaque coyote]

Have weapons that are risk vs reward type shit.

[arctic talon]

That’s just plasma

And psykers

[opaque coyote]

Yeah IK this is a pipe dream

[arctic talon]

500 more minis to LSM

[wintry cloud]

Im guessing this was like 10 years ago? They haven’t done anything recently i presume

[arctic talon]

No

They were mentioned in a recent thing

[wintry cloud]

Really now?

Better than nothing

[fervent geode]

I think in Fall of Cadia

By Rath

[arctic talon]

Its the fall of Cadia book yeah

[fervent geode]

Just a mention

[arctic talon]

And they’re brought up in a white dwarf

Not much

[fervent geode]

Like oh yeah the chess coloured guys are here

[wintry cloud]

Well atleast they exist yknow

[fervent geode]

Say hi fellas

[opaque coyote]

Probably to keep consistent with how most traitor factions just

[wintry cloud]

Cool enough

[opaque coyote]

Kept their name

[fervent geode]

True

[opaque coyote]

Even the Emperor's children

[fervent geode]

I still find it funny

[opaque coyote]

Who just decided to keep it just to be ironic

Which tbf

[fervent geode]

Wait ill pull something

[opaque coyote]

Yeah that is very funny

I fucking love that about them

"Fulgrim, should we change our Legion name?"

"Nah keep it, it'll be funny."

They even sardonically chant "For the Emperor"

I fucking love that

[fervent geode]

Someone asked what would the worst Deathwatch Kill Team would be

They said all blackshields was ok

1 Blackshield (Son of Malice)
1 Blackshield (Flame Falcon)
1 Blackshield (Crimson Sabre)
1 Blackshield (Knight of Blood)
1 Blackshield (Relictor)

[arctic talon]

Nightmare blunt rotation

[fervent geode]

I think the watch master will kill them himself if they come back too many times

[arctic talon]

You can also mix a bunch of Badab chapters together

lol

[opaque coyote]

Honestly the worst would be

A warband of black shields that were all ex-major traitor factions than woke up in 40k after being in warp travel while all were still loyal

[fervent geode]

Oh god hahahha

[arctic talon]

Executioners, Minotaurs, lamenters, howling gryphons, mantis warrior

[opaque coyote]

One Night Lord, One Death guard, One Iron Warrior

[arctic talon]

That’s a Killteam alright

[opaque coyote]

One World Water (Nails included)

[arctic talon]

They’ll prolly kill each other

[fervent geode]

Minotaur
Lamenter
Blackshield (Astral Claw)
Blackshield (Fire Hawk)
Executioner

[arctic talon]

But yknow

[opaque coyote]

The Minotaur towards the Lamenter

[fervent geode]

Peak still

[jade holly]

Marines Malevolent when they see imperium civilians enjoying life

[fervent geode]

The two blackshields boutta murder each other

[arctic talon]

The Minotaur is first to die because everyone hates them

Then it’s up to air

[fervent geode]

Ik the Fire Hawk will pull some shit

He started it

[opaque coyote]

"take off your armor..."

||so I can steal it clearly||

[opaque coyote]

https://tenor.com/view/jo-jo-gang-beat-up-anime-kick-gif-17369990

"YOU MUST BE THE TRAITOR"

"WHAT A TRAITOR?"

[fervent geode]

The Lamenter just accuses him of being IW

[opaque coyote]

"No no you see, my chapter rob gear, kill people, and are generally very unpleasant.

The Iron Warriors rob gear, kill people, and are generally very unpleasant...

But. But...

They have no horns."

"Therefore we are different!"

[fervent geode]

I don't like you - AC
Me neither - EX
"Lets kill him"

[opaque coyote]

Either way, I genuinely wish Blackshields and SM using Xenos weapons were more common

Like c'mon

Using a Necron Gauss gun as a heavy trooper

Would be cool

(if they can jury rig it to be usable for non-necron hands)

Or even T'au weapons

And some Deldar weapons

The ones that are meant to actually be weapons and not portable torture tools

[cerulean trellis]

don't necron weapons go poof with their wearers when they die?

[fervent geode]

I think so

Wiat

Cant recall

Hmmm

[cerulean trellis]

tehy do in the pariah series

[opaque coyote]

Yes and no

Necrons have their death look the exact same as teleportation

[cerulean trellis]

and in tithes

[opaque coyote]

But Necron guns have been collected

There's just one problem

[fervent geode]

From the tombs yeah iirc

[cerulean trellis]

need necron metal hands to activate

[opaque coyote]

A) They're extremely heavy. Even an SM struggles with carrying one

B) Necron hands are needed to be used

[fervent geode]

Who tf really knows how to use one anyway

[opaque coyote]

But they still have triggers so

[cerulean trellis]

do they?

[opaque coyote]

Still more potentially usable than Craftworld Eldar weapons which explicitly don't have triggers

[cerulean trellis]

i mean granted my necrons are old af with them being 8th edition but i see no triggers

[opaque coyote]

Look at the left end

There's clearly a square looking button

Clearly a trigger

[cerulean trellis]

could be, yeh

but we do know how to fire eldar weapons

[arctic talon]

It depends

Also necron guns have triggers

[cerulean trellis]

at least asuryani and drukhari ones

[arctic talon]

You can just shoot them

They’re heavy as fuck though

To the point they’re unwieldy and too heavy for marines

It’s why warriors are so hunched over

[opaque coyote]

Also @cerulean trellis you are right in that most of the time. Enemies with them peace out

Either teleporting away or getting disintegrated

Both look the same

[jade holly]

Yeah the Battleline of the Necrons is basically an entire squad of heavy gunners

[opaque coyote]

So you won't know

[jade holly]

[arctic talon]

The average human isn’t able to pick them up

[cerulean trellis]

thanks for confirming :3

[arctic talon]

Shits heavy

Like way too heavy

[opaque coyote]

But also the idea of a SM heavy gunner using a Necron Flayer

Is

Fucking sick

[arctic talon]

Awful ergonomics as well

lol

[limpid granite]

necrons having dogwater mobility

[opaque coyote]

A weapon so hefty that even they struggle to carry it is awesome

[jade holly]

Maugan Ra looking at a Flayer wondering how he can integrate it into his Maugetar

[limpid granite]

deathmarks gotta rely on teleportation to get anywhere

[opaque coyote]

But their power is even more awesome

[arctic talon]

Lychguard and praetorians are pretty good lol

But below them yeah no

lol

slow as fuck

Initiative 1 having asses

[opaque coyote]

Tbf it's not like you can run for long.

[jade holly]

Praetorians are roughly Custodian level tmk

[opaque coyote]

[jade holly]

Szarekh’s own elite guard

[arctic talon]

Low ranking necrons don’t need to be fast

[limpid granite]

i would too be eternally assmad and grumpy if i had a slow as shit steel shell for a body

[arctic talon]

Or have good reflexes

[jade holly]

Why be fast when you can shoot them no matter how far they run

[opaque coyote]

I love how every Necron can technically be the same as the leaders

But their body is running off of windows 95

[arctic talon]

Other way around

[cerulean trellis]

no need to be fast if you can just be relentless

[arctic talon]

Body is shit

Engram is complex

[jade holly]

The real fun comes in when a Skorpekh Destroyer shows up

[opaque coyote]

So they're just stuck as mindless robots on the surface while inwardly they are screaming

[arctic talon]

It’s like running windows 10 on a TI-85

Yes

[jade holly]

giant, fast and hellbent on butchering you in the most savage way possible

[jade holly]

The Necron hardware gets better the higher your standing in society is

But Warriors? Mindless drones with the basic needs for a warrior

Immortals get a wee bit more autonomy, then you get into stuff like Deathmarks, Royal Wardens, Lychgard

[opaque coyote]

Although as a genuine question.

A) Why is an engram needed for the soldier bodies? They could use a simple AI and get the same result.

Is there a given reason or is it just a shrug because the Necrons and C'tan don't care

B) Has anybody tried shoving a Necron warrior engram into a higher tier body?

[arctic talon]

Bio transference was meant to be immortality for all necrons that’s why. The bodies don’t work with AI

Yes

[jade holly]

Idk bout A, but B the lower tier body was a deliberate choice by Szarekh. You can give a warrior a better body but why

Szarekh’s body is the best of the best. The most pristine, durable and agile of any Necron body

[opaque coyote]

Yeah ik but like the idea of somebody stuck in a Necron Soldier body for a while finally getting freedom to express themselves would be interesting

[arctic talon]

Soldier caste field commanders were given better bodies

And retain more of their mind and personality

Immortal Despotek’s

[jade holly]

Those being the Royal Wardens right? Or do you mean Immortals

[arctic talon]

Despite using the same engram as a normal immortal

Immortal Despotek’s

Specifically

[jade holly]

Oh yeah

[opaque coyote]

Just wondering if any soldier somehow through some circumstances, managed to get an updated body to be able to retain more of their mind

[jade holly]

forgot those exist lmao

[arctic talon]

No one would bother

[jade holly]

Highly doubtful tbh

[arctic talon]

It happens with crypteks

But everyone is basically stuck at the rank/caste they were

[cerulean trellis]

you are thinking too human

[jade holly]

Also new Necrons can’t be made.

[arctic talon]

The Necrons are also yeah assholes culturally

[cerulean trellis]

hence teleport the dead ones back home and repair

[arctic talon]

To their lower classes

They can make new bodies

The issue is the minds

[opaque coyote]

Yeah makes sense.

I thought of a scenario where the automatic system malfunctioned due to the millions of years.

And accidentally got an error in their programming where they think that there was a mistake.

That a soldier needs to be in a higher tier body. So they move the engram from the soldier body to something like an Immortal one

Although this in homebrew territory obviously

[cerulean trellis]

i mean... there has been errors

loads of them

[opaque coyote]

Yeah and I'm thinking that would be an interesting story

[cerulean trellis]

most common case are the nightmares/horrors

[opaque coyote]

Imagine being stuck for millions of years. Stuck in your own body

And then...

You manage to finally get some semblance of freedom

[cerulean trellis]

sometimes whole dynasties do simply not wake up

[opaque coyote]

To be able to think

Again

[cerulean trellis]

so tehy repurpose the ressources, easy. no need to save what is dead

[opaque coyote]

Wouldn't they take the engrams from unawakened dynasties

Or would they just not work

[jade holly]

Crypteks are such a fun twist on fantasy mages

[opaque coyote]

Like since no new Necrons can't be made

[jade holly]

I love them

[opaque coyote]

Engrams would be a finite resource

To be hoarded

[cerulean trellis]

honestly, you woudl either end up being a subject for a cryptek or just sent back into stasis to reinforce your protocolls

[jade holly]

Why would a dynasty help another?

[cerulean trellis]

that si actually somethign that can bee seen in Pariah Nexus

[opaque coyote]

I was thinking more like

To install into soldier bodies

Not helping, just more soldiers

[cerulean trellis]

the deathmark asks a few questions and then they get scanned if they need to be... well reset to factory settings basically

[opaque coyote]

Damn

[cerulean trellis]

why? they are not loyal to them

• they did not wake up ergo: free real estate

[opaque coyote]

Since soldiers are mindless automatons on the surface. Theoretically you could use engrams on soldier bodies to replenish any possible losses

[cerulean trellis]

yeah and that si what would happen if any lower class necron woudl suddenly get mroe freedom

[opaque coyote]

Also more necrodermis bodies to throw at any enemy you want

[cerulean trellis]

but here is the thing: they failed to wake up: ergo broken, non existent, error

[jade holly]

Though honestly props to Szarekh, if he didn’t give the Necron’s free reign before self exiling they would all be mindless drones awaiting their master

[opaque coyote]

So if they don't wake up, their engrams are broken

Not their bodies?

[jade holly]

not mindless drones

But they wouldn’t be able to act without his command

[cerulean trellis]

yes, bodies can be repaired, engrams... not so much

[opaque coyote]

Ah

I thought there could be a situation where their bodies are the one that breaks somehow

[cerulean trellis]

i mean thast basically what happens on the battlefield: body breaks, gets portet back home, gets repaired, sent back out

[opaque coyote]

But I realize that is probably very very very unlikely

[cerulean trellis]

so logn repair is possible

[opaque coyote]

Because they have auto repair systems

[opaque coyote]

So basically do they just melt all the bodies

To reuse

Or do they just throw away the broken engram and throw the bodies in storage

"To be used if soldiers are running out"

[cerulean trellis]

as far as i understand it, kidn off, yes. what they can use, they use (weapons, ships, relics and so on) what theya can not use.... hello there canoptec scarabs and spiders ^^

desintegrate and store for new buildings

or new bodies if required

well ... ish

that reminds me ... the blakc monoliths of the cadian gate ... do we know/have confirmation if they were actually necrontyr/necron artifacts?

[arctic talon]

Yes

They’re explicitly necron Blackstone tech

[cerulean trellis]

that si interesting

[arctic talon]

No

Necrodermis doesn’t need to be smelted

Its programmable matter

[cerulean trellis]

becasue that means tha the necrons, unliek the eldar, have a technology that can somewhat satbilise the warp

[arctic talon]

The eldar also have tech like that

They have reality anchors

It uses Blackstone as well but also weird esoteric nonsense

[raven stone]

Woah woah woah hold the presses.
Cyberstan actually won!?
I was expecting the Internet to be aflame with Helldiver monkeys crowing at victory at this point.

[arctic talon]

Statistically speaking the campaign was impossible to win

Even with the rate of reinforcements

[raven stone]

Ah, unwinnable by design…

[arctic talon]

Well

Not by design

Because people died a lot lol

[limpid granite]

the pillars couldve prevented cadia from being destroyed

which it did

until abbadon threw a blackstone fortress at it

[cerulean trellis]

isnt blackstone inherently necrontyr tech? so the eldar utilise it but instead of utilizing it scientifically liek the necrons do, they utilize it in a more esoteric manner that fits their bone singing antics?

[arctic talon]

No

Blackstone is stolen from the old ones

[cerulean trellis]

ohhhh

[arctic talon]

It’s old ones tech the Necrons co-opted for their own usage

[cerulean trellis]

so reverse engineering

[arctic talon]

Yeah

[jade holly]

Pariah Nexus my beloved

[arctic talon]

The greatest example of old ones Blackstone tech is the Blackstone fortresses

[jade holly]

I wish I was around for the Pariah Nexus story when it came out

That seems like it was fun

[arctic talon]

Which can somehow channel the warp to give literal immortality to people

lol

[limpid granite]

How is vashtorr even operating there?

[arctic talon]

Among many other things

[limpid granite]

Isnt it an anti chaos area

[jade holly]

Idfk

Didn’t realize he was

[cerulean trellis]

holy sheet

[jade holly]

I was focused on the Necron part of it

[arctic talon]

Mechanicus used a warp based super weapon to annihilate a necron fleet

[limpid granite]

Its the next area for vashtorr's keypiece

[raven stone]

IoM had the funniest way of using Blackstone Fortresses.
They basically just retrofitted the thing to be a giant Space Station

[arctic talon]

Vashtor took advantage of all the destruction caused by the giant super weapon array

To tear a hole in reality

And beelined for a pylon cluster control node

And inverted it

[limpid granite]

GRAB HIS OBELISK AND TWIST IT!

[arctic talon]

TLDR the Mechanicus dumped as much juice as possible and broke the veil between reality and the warp even in the nexus

[cerulean trellis]

gotta go fast

[arctic talon]

And ended up giving Vashtorr a chance to take advantage of

And now a chunk of the pariah nexus is basically a warpstorm on steroids

Much to the horror of literally everyone but the chaos forces

[raven stone]

Happy Fun Times (TM)

[jade holly]

I bet Szarekh regrets giving Necrons free will sometimes

[cerulean trellis]

waitasecond

[jade holly]

especially with Imotekh running around

[cerulean trellis]

isn't vashtor a deathwatch sergeant?

[limpid granite]

Chaos is going to will a necron imperium alliance i swear

[arctic talon]

There’s a dude called that yes

But Vashtorr is a chaos god

Well

[limpid granite]

Hes a daemon trying to become a god

[arctic talon]

Chaos Demi god

People can have similar names

[limpid granite]

Vashtorr the arkifane

[arctic talon]

[cerulean trellis]

oh the heretek admech one?

[arctic talon]

He’s not admech

[jade holly]

Szarekh looking at the tyranid threat and constantly pressing the panic button

[arctic talon]

He’s not even connected with the dark mechanicum

[cerulean trellis]

father of the demon engines and shit?

[arctic talon]

Despite some people worshipping him as such

He’s the dark master of the forge of souls

[cerulean trellis]

oh i thought he was kinda liek the dark omnissiah xD

[arctic talon]

Nah

[fervent geode]

Lorgar actually made the first of those iirc

[arctic talon]

He does love technological advancement and destruction though

[cerulean trellis]

i knwo those picts!

[arctic talon]

But Vashtorr isn’t actually the true omnissiah

[limpid granite]

Vashtorr is the equivelant to chaos dwarves in 40k

[arctic talon]

According to Martian dark mechanicum doctrine

Untrue

Hashut isn’t related to industry

[limpid granite]

Bruh

[arctic talon]

Hashut is the chaos god of tyranny and fire

What

It’s literally true

Hashut has never been tied to industry

Beyond his worshipers

[limpid granite]

I will will it into existance

[arctic talon]

No you won’t

[jade holly]

What does Vashtorr’s path to apotheosis look like currently?

[arctic talon]

Rough

lol

[cerulean trellis]

wait but theoretically he is kidn of the chaos counterpart to what the admech is for humanity, no?

[arctic talon]

No

[jade holly]

Better than Be’lakor’s though

[arctic talon]

Vashtorr doesn’t care about preservation of technology

Like the mechanicus

Or have weird religious dogma

[limpid granite]

He is responsible for the lion waking up basically

[arctic talon]

He’s like a used car salesmen

But for chaos weapons

And daemon engines

And he’s really racist to mortals

[jade holly]

You think Perturabo had a sort of licensing deal with Vashtorr that he gets all the good daemon engines

[limpid granite]

Hes currently going to the pariah nexus system for the next keypiece for the prophecy

[jade holly]

[arctic talon]

Vashtorr hates mortals

And dislikes daemon princes

Because daemon princes are filthy part mortals

[cerulean trellis]

vashtorr is liek: machines are the best, better if they destroy everything?

[jade holly]

He does work with Perturabo sometimes though right?

[arctic talon]

Daemons fused with machines best

Daemons good

Technology good if kill people

[storm jungle]

https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Vashtorr

read his page

[arctic talon]

He’s literally a sleazy arms dealer

[storm jungle]

it explains everything

[arctic talon]

He’s fun

[limpid granite]

Vashtor is an anti boomer

[arctic talon]

I love him

[limpid granite]

He embraces technology and gets grumpy about human parts

[jade holly]

I wanna see him succeed

[cerulean trellis]

i did, btu that was a while ago ... logn while ago

[storm jungle]

yeah so re-read...........

[jade holly]

If he becomes a chaos god would he get a new model since we don’t have models of the other chaos gods?

[cerulean trellis]

that i will do

[limpid granite]

Maybe

[fervent geode]

We cant have him on TT anymore

He's a God now

[arctic talon]

No

They’d just make it an avatar

[limpid granite]

Or hes a minor chaos god like the great horned one in age of sigmar

[arctic talon]

Like in AoS

[fervent geode]

Forgor about those lmao

[arctic talon]

None of the gods are physically on the table in AoS

As funny as that would be

They’re avatars of the gods

[storm jungle]

Hes explicitly a demi-god

[jade holly]

Who would be the best choice for an avatar of Vashtorr?

[storm jungle]

Perturabo

[arctic talon]

The current Vashtorr mini

[storm jungle]

he fits the bill

[limpid granite]

https://tenor.com/view/bye-felicia-friday-shoo-go-away-gif-4389994

Shoo shoo

Let me spread my innacuracies

[storm jungle]

Ill staple your mouth shut before i let you do that

https://klipy.com/gifs/time-for-the-long-sleep-2

[fervent geode]

No. Perty is claimed

[jade holly]

Given how elite talks about how much Vashtorr hates mortals idk if he’d want a daemon prince Primarch as an avatar

[fervent geode]

https://tenor.com/view/chaos-symbol-warhammer-warhammer40k-warhammer-fantasy-gif-15664973

[arctic talon]

The avatar is the existing mini Grimm

[cerulean trellis]

i thoguht vashtorr HATES mortals

[arctic talon]

It’s an excuse to why you can run the god on the table

[storm jungle]

doesnt matter, marketing first

[arctic talon]

Daemon princes better

[storm jungle]

He doesnt really

depends on the mortal in question

[jade holly]

I meant for 40K lorewise

[fervent geode]

Daemon princes technically arent mortals

[jade holly]

Wait I’m lost now

[fervent geode]

But i doubt he'd take perty

Perty is claimed by the four already

Stealing him

Well

[limpid granite]

Daemon princes are ascended champions

[arctic talon]

Vashtorr dislike Dameon princes is due to their origin but they’re better then mortals

[limpid granite]

Theyve ascended past mortalhood

[jade holly]

Do Perty and Vashtorr have some level of mutual respect for both being engineers?

[arctic talon]

Probably

[storm jungle]

We got no idea

[jade holly]

If very minuscule

[storm jungle]

they barely interacted aside from offscreen

its not like perturabo's opinion is worth jackshit

[arctic talon]

Yeah

[storm jungle]

Vashtorr knows everyone is dependant on him

lmao

[arctic talon]

Number 1 arms dealer

Do you think Vashtorr has a giant mug

That says that

[storm jungle]

Definitely

[fervent geode]

Theyve cooperated on daemon engines

[limpid granite]

Galaxy's best mechanic mug

[jade holly]

So given he is a Demi-god as is, does he get power from anyone that builds, innovates and creates?

[fervent geode]

But people cooperate anr fucking hate each other so who knows

[fervent geode]

Yeah

Primaris fed him alot

[arctic talon]

He gets power from technological innovation that leads to war and catastrophe/death

[jade holly]

I wonder if the Leagues of Votann help him out too

[storm jungle]

No lol

why the fuck would they

[jade holly]

Not directly

[arctic talon]

He feeds off of any technological innovation but he mostly feeds off of the violent stuff

[storm jungle]

Oh that

[jade holly]

But as a byproduct of their industrialization

[fervent geode]

Which there is alot

Of violeny shit

[storm jungle]

yeah literally EVERY single thing of industrialism and invention feeds Vashtorr

[arctic talon]

Them coming up with new horrific guns is a drop in the bucket

[storm jungle]

hes been around before even the Dark Age of Tech

[arctic talon]

But it feeds him

Vashtorr fed a ton

When Bio transference occurred

Then the war in heaven

Then the DAOT

[storm jungle]

yeah i forgot about that lmao

bro is ANCIENT

[arctic talon]

For his known “big feeding” times

[opaque coyote]

Wonder how he hasn't become a Chaos God yet

[arctic talon]

Not enough

[storm jungle]

Not enough pull

[opaque coyote]

Especially with things like the Bio transference

[storm jungle]

Vashtorr avoids grandiose stuff

[jade holly]

Call it a hunch, but think something big will happen for him when we get another Armageddon

[arctic talon]

Vashtorr’s aversion to mortals leads to him not preying on them enough

He’s also way too honest

lol

He gives you everything you need to know

When making a deal

[jade holly]

Khorne gets away with being brutally honest cause his domain is simple

Draw blood

[opaque coyote]

You'd think an entire race turning into fucking robots would fuel him

Or does it also need build up. Similar to how Slaanesh was made due to the Eldar revelling in degeneracy for possibly millions of years

[jade holly]

Don’t care whose, don’t care how, don’t care when don’t care why

Blood flow, Khorne happy

[opaque coyote]

Maybe the millions of years (or however long they were degen) part was the most important

[arctic talon]

It did fuel him

[jade holly]

A cake doesn’t get baked in an oven in mere seconds

[arctic talon]

It’s likely what turned him into a Demi god

lol

[opaque coyote]

True

[arctic talon]

He speaks of it with way too much gravitas

For it to not be something super important to his current state

[opaque coyote]

But also fuck does it take so much things to make a Chaos god

Lmao

GL to Belakor

[jade holly]

And he’s starting lower on the totem pole than Vashtorr

Lmao

[opaque coyote]

I'm sure you'll get there one day

[jade holly]

Stupid daemon Prince Xenos

stupid goofy ass chaos god wannabe

Go cry and throw another fit

[opaque coyote]

Bro ain't ever becoming a Chaos God

[jade holly]

His ass is not Chaos god material

[celest dome]

I mean, did Baby Bel try to become Chaos God, or just the Everchosen

[opaque coyote]

If Vashtorr couldn't become one after an entire race got turned into robots and the entire war in heaven

[arctic talon]

Everchosen originally

He’s trying to become a god in AoS

[opaque coyote]

Then Belakor's ass ain't ever becoming one

[arctic talon]

Yeah he isn’t

[limpid granite]

Vashtorr becoming a chaos god would also introduce another competitor in the cabal

[arctic talon]

He’s marked

[limpid granite]

Chaos gods already have enough infighting and bickering

[opaque coyote]

Khorne is just violence

Any act of violence fuels him

Punching somebody fuels hum

That slap fight fuels him

Of course blood is preferred obviously

[jade holly]

If Vashtorr achieves apotheosis (is apotheosis the right word here?), would the IW align under him at all?

[arctic talon]

Some would

[opaque coyote]

But his domain is so common

[celest dome]

The Domain already exist, it doesn't really matter

[arctic talon]

Some wouldn’t

[fervent geode]

Some, its a divided legion

[opaque coyote]

Compared to Vashtorr

[jade holly]

Apotheosis is the word I want to use here right?

[opaque coyote]

Which requires people to advance in technology

Which can take a while

[jade holly]

That’s what Vashtorr wants?

[arctic talon]

Yes

[limpid granite]

Yeah id think vashtorr would nuke the iron warriors for atempting to bind him earlier

[opaque coyote]

And is very inconsistent

[jade holly]

I wonder who the new champion on the block would be alongside Typhus, Kharn, Lucius and Ahriman

[opaque coyote]

And also would things like

The Age of Strife be like Vashtorr suddenly getting less food

[arctic talon]

Well he already fucked that group up

[opaque coyote]

Since humanity degraded in tech

Actually the Imperium would probably be starving him out ngl

No wonder he's so frustrated

[jade holly]

Honestly if Vashtorr really wants to get serious he should start taking on a Belohegor role among humanity. Playing into their sloth and apathy to build new creations in secret that make warfare simpler for them

[opaque coyote]

Since very few new things got developed

[jade holly]

Start tempting humans to commit tech heresy

[opaque coyote]

But he also hates mortals

[jade holly]

Yeah that’s the problem lmao

[cerulean trellis]

the tau are basically approachign their age of technology

[opaque coyote]

So that's probably why he isn't a Chaos god left

[cerulean trellis]

and tehy developing weapons FAST

[jade holly]

Bro needs to let go of that prejudice if he wants to make it big

[opaque coyote]

But yeah, Vashtorr is probably frustrated at the lack of food

[jade holly]

I bet the Drukhari feed him quite a bit

[cerulean trellis]

again: the tau are advancing weapons tech rapidly

[opaque coyote]

Yeah but they're also small

[cerulean trellis]

and innovating super fast

[opaque coyote]

Relatively

[cerulean trellis]

as was humanity once

tau are abbies that grow

[opaque coyote]

They aren't populated enough to really start affecting the warp much

yet

[cerulean trellis]

and tehy do a lot of innovating

[opaque coyote]

Actually I just had an idea

Do you think the Age of Strife happened to fuck over Vashtorr

[cerulean trellis]

errrrr you do know there was a warp entity fro the greater good?

created when tehy tested their slipstream drives?

essentially a sortof chaos god?

[opaque coyote]

"Ah shit, humanity keeps making deadly weapons. At this rate, we'll get a 5th."

"But we're having so much fun!"

"Fuck it. Just make some of the AI evil and have their Psyker emergence early."

[cerulean trellis]

if i understood that correctly

[opaque coyote]

Aware ye

[cerulean trellis]

so that influenced the warp quite a bit

enough to create a new demi god

[opaque coyote]

That is true but at the moment. Not big enough to feed him much.

Now if they got a chance to spread wide and far

Then that would be a feast

[cerulean trellis]

see... innovation is always the same

[opaque coyote]

Yeah but it was explicitly from other races within the empire

Not the Tau themselves

[cerulean trellis]

it is one person innovating somethign or a small group

that si what feed vashtorr

[cerulean trellis]

which are even less than the tau in number

[opaque coyote]

It was the auxillary races understanding of the greater good

[opaque coyote]

I think it's like an exponential thing

[cerulean trellis]

i do not

[opaque coyote]

Maybe it's surprisingly easy to create a new warp entity

But it takes much more to create a Chaos God

[cerulean trellis]

the innovation part, no. the destruction part, yes

innovation is not exponential

[opaque coyote]

And by exponential I mean how much it takes to ascend

Like it might be relatively easy to create a new warp entity

[cerulean trellis]

that maybe yes, but the feeding part deu to innovation, less so

[opaque coyote]

But creating a new Chaos God is the type of shit that takes millions of years to come to fruition

[cerulean trellis]

important it that it happens

especially if said entity does not liek to feed on mortals

[opaque coyote]

Tbf that might be exponential judging by our history.

Humanity just figured out farming around 10,000 BC

And then quickly rose in technology from then on.

[lament shoal]

Also its an incredibly violent event, if slaanesh's birth is any indication

[opaque coyote]

I mean the War in Heaven is a violent event for sure

[cerulean trellis]

yes but each innovation in and on itself was somethign small, not big

[limpid granite]

from horses and carriage to rocket ships in a span of 200 years

[lament shoal]

True

[opaque coyote]

And apparently the Necrons turning into Robots did turn Vashtorr into a demigod

So it was an ascension

Just not

The ascension

Overall, if y'all know runescape

It's a

"92 is the half of 99"

Type of situation

[jade holly]

He’d need like… 500 War in Heavens

[cerulean trellis]

well it wasna n ascension, not apostheosis

or just the right things at the right time

[jade holly]

Vashtorr looking at his xp bar angrily