40k-lore-chat

[plush mason]

look at how other primates treat their females and you get an idea of where our own bullshit comes from

[sly ivy]

Whereas with hg they at least range around and talk to each other and gather

[opaque coyote]

Yeah I think it just become more and more solidified.

[sly ivy]

While the men hunt.

[opaque coyote]

And then it became so solidified that any type of like

"outside" the norm

just set off something in our brains

made us angry

because we love the status quo

we hate change fundamentally.

[plush mason]

yeah the more settled cultures have a lot worse patriarchy than the nomadic ones

[sly ivy]

Except in very advanced structured societies might is ultimately going to be most significant in the end

[opaque coyote]

I think partially the reason why it's changed is because now might is measured in technology, not swords.

[sly ivy]

Men are so much physically stronger than women on average most people are shocked by the actual stats

Yeah

[plush mason]

hate is the wrong word, its fear because we fear the unknown and we fear the loss of control

[opaque coyote]

Don't need to deadlift 500 pounds, just send a drone

[opaque coyote]

Wouldn't say much. But it is significant

I would say much on the very high end though

Especially arm strength

[plush mason]

men have far greater potential for physical strength, most of them will never reach it

and unrealized potential is a none factor

[sly ivy]

Much. Like astronomically much.

Like near non-overlap

[opaque coyote]

Yeah, pre-agricultural humans shouldn't be underestimated.

[sly ivy]

you can’t find a study that says otherwise this is total consensus.

[opaque coyote]

It's just that now we know math.

So we don't need to remember where the 6th berry tree is.

[dire loom]

There's only one option now, exterminatus.

[opaque coyote]

True.

[sly ivy]

But anyway yeah modern society is so so young

[opaque coyote]

Although I think women got compensated by this by being able to live longer.

And also guaranteed hair.

Seriously, male pattern baldness is

why

god dammit testosterone

[sly ivy]

Again I think this is often overstated. But there’s some truth to it.

[plush mason]

now a days physical strength is near worthless, unless you are a day laborer or something

[dire loom]

My words were censored again..

Muh rights as a American! Muh free speech!

Anyways, women are strong and dangerous in their own ways.

Just very subtle

You wouldn't know until it's too late.

[opaque coyote]

Again, a headcanon I like to think is that.

The Emperor had it so that only men could become Space Marines because he was lazy as shit.

Easier base-line to get stronger

[sly ivy]

Well except for you know reproduction, the only evolutionarily important thing.

[opaque coyote]

More potential to add onto

[sly ivy]

Physical strength still overwhelmingly attractive

For men

[sly ivy]

This is like def it right? Not just strength but aggression.

[opaque coyote]

Honestly, the funniest thing is that, often times eugenists say that "Only the strong survive."

When in fact, it's not that. Just those who fuck the most.

[sly ivy]

And men (in real life) have bigger and denser internal organs and so on

[dire loom]

@sly ivy i don't want humanity reduced to cloning. Do we really wanna become IRL Warhammer 40k grim dark?

[opaque coyote]

Which is

funny

[dire loom]

Oh no..

[sly ivy]

When did I say anything re cloning

[opaque coyote]

Nah

Zerg rush

[sly ivy]

Marines are mass produced

[plush mason]

yeah because of social conditioning and evolutionary holdover, a stick man with an 8 or 9 figure job will be able to give a women and his kids a vastly better live than some bodybuilder that works nights at a 7/11, but the bodybuilder will have a lot more options on that front

[sly ivy]

It honestly makes sense that the bespoke custodes can occasionally be women bc He is willing to put in the extra time

[plush mason]

yeah

[dire loom]

I replied to the wrong post. Anyways, yeah we need each other.

[storm jungle]

Tbh the dark thing is that isnt really up to us, people will find some way to do it.

[dire loom]

Be dead without each other, extinction.

No tubes plz ty frens

[sly ivy]

I worry a lot about gene editing and so on

[opaque coyote]

I honestly think it's because while Space Marines are basically just taping shit onto a genetic framework.

Custodes are remade from the ground up.

It's why Space Marines are made from kids while Custodes are from babies.

[arctic talon]

Custodes get gene alchemy'd lol

[storm jungle]

Also just say "schizophrenic", we had to block "schizo" because people kept using it as an insult for other users and it kinda snowballed lol

[plush mason]

which why our general inability to tolerate each other for long periods is so paradoxical to me

[dire loom]

That just makes the Emperor seem sus.

[arctic talon]

whatever the fuck gene alchemy is

[dire loom]

Like he had too much free time

[opaque coyote]

Honestly.

I am of mixed opinion

[storm jungle]

Fear is the primary emotion that drives hate

[opaque coyote]

Yeah it can go to shit.

[storm jungle]

If we dont fear something we might not "survive" and so on

[opaque coyote]

But also I would love to NOT get cancer

Y'know?

[storm jungle]

its a natural instinct and it usually is great as much as it sucks

[arctic talon]

see: HP lovecraft

[dire loom]

So true.. unfortunately.

[arctic talon]

and then he started being less racist

and fucking died

[sly ivy]

No man he MUST make beautiful giant golden men to attend him and talk to him no homo

[opaque coyote]

NOT getting cancer is great.

[dire loom]

They will clone us all! Well only the desirable ones..

Dark times

[storm jungle]

Too real lol

but we'll prob all be dead by that point

so dont worry about it

[sly ivy]

Yes I mean we have to start doing it

[plush mason]

bah that stuff is still a long ways off

[storm jungle]

^

[sly ivy]

I worry about baby customization

[storm jungle]

we'll be WAY dead

[sly ivy]

It’s not that far off bros

[plush mason]

skynet is more likely to happen in our lifetimes than cloning

[storm jungle]

Umbrella 🫡

[sly ivy]

Not far off at all for the unscrupulous

[arctic talon]

oh hey its my stellaris runs

[dire loom]

Oh.. that's what it was. Gotcha.

Yeah I've been watching a lot of Zaffy on YouTube and he uses the word a lot. It's catchy.

[sly ivy]

I mean the tech literally exists.

[opaque coyote]

But also regulate it on some level.

Although it does bring up the uncomfortable decision on what to "remove".

Like obviously physical defects. But what about things like autism?

[sly ivy]

Yes this is where it gets weird

and what’s the cutoff

[opaque coyote]

Thankfully, 40k at least shows that they already solved this problem.

Because every space marine is autistic.

[plush mason]

for the record i know that "ai" today is just a sham and or a scam so i dont expect anything remotely close to skynet levels to happen at all

[arctic talon]

when my father was in college

his professor told him real AI was just around the corner

[storm jungle]

Yeah also remember some people literally even find completely normal people that are simply in wheelchairs as "bad" or "non-functional members"

[arctic talon]

It has been 20+ years

💀

[sly ivy]

What if an entire set of personality types or whatever is associated with a set of alleles that increase lifetime chance of some cancer by 1%. 10%?

[opaque coyote]

AI isn't necessarily a Sham.

It is if you're expecting some Bladerunner type shit.

But it isn't for things like automation.

[dire loom]

Truly a mystery

[arctic talon]

and its not even what he was researching back then

lol

[arctic talon]

it is not AI

it is not intellegent

[sly ivy]

Gene editing even for really bad shit necessarily decreases population-scale variation.

[arctic talon]

Machine learning is a simulacrum of intelligence

it is A

but its sure as shit not I

[opaque coyote]

Again, it's an interesting conundrum.

There are still ~ 2 million people who don't use smartphones in the USA.

Sure that's a comparatively small amount, but we're also essentially leaving them behind.

[plush mason]

a hallmark of the last decades of the 20th century was to expect a massive jump in techological development in the 21st, many are still coping that it is happening behind the scenes

it isnt

[opaque coyote]

What happens if the things aren't able to easily be bought in the nearest store?

[sly ivy]

The thing is whether or not it’s real AI it does work for a lot of applications.

[arctic talon]

my dad wrote his PHD thesis on machine learning 💀

[plush mason]

ofc but its not ai. its machine learning

[opaque coyote]

Yeah not saying it's actually "REAL AI".

But the consequences of it are very real even though it's... kinda stupid.

[arctic talon]

I'd make a joke about how after all this time its finally having more practical application

[plush mason]

there is no true intelligence

[arctic talon]

But most people are literally using it for porn

so whatever

[opaque coyote]

It looks like shit

btw

[dire loom]

Yeah, I guess it makes sense he'd want a few ladies around. When you put it that way. Lol

[arctic talon]

I'm pretty sure more people are using AI for assignments

[sly ivy]

Maybe it’s using people for porn 🤯

[arctic talon]

You must understand malcador I must be surrounded by half naked muscular dudes covered in oil

• Neoth

[opaque coyote]

I am gulity of that tbh.

Mainly for math problems

[dire loom]

True!

[opaque coyote]

because I don't want to pay $29.99 a month for some subscription service.

[queen laurel]

Guilty is charged i use it for code some stuff

[arctic talon]

tbf

[plush mason]

ai is just an advanced calculator at this stage

[arctic talon]

thats actually more practical

regarding coding/logic problems

[dire loom]

Well clones on large scale later on, sky net already here.

[opaque coyote]

(and also some women Malcador, but don't tell them that until later)

[arctic talon]

using it for creativity is stupid

Its still like

kind of a horrid waste of resources but whatever

[opaque coyote]

Personal headcanon that the Emperor is Bi, male leaning.

[arctic talon]

Pandora's box is open

the most like

useful application rn is probably in medical fields

but those aren't large language models

[opaque coyote]

Beyond stupid

[arctic talon]

thats just normal machine learning

[queen laurel]

I mean he has complete control over his biological makeup him not being bisexual is kind of a very specific sex choice don't you think?

[plush mason]

maybe the disney/universal lawsuit will close it

[sly ivy]

Doesn’t bro remember himself as a woman at some point in like MoM or one of those

[arctic talon]

Biomancer hitting you with the curse of gender disphorea

[sly ivy]

he is pretty masculine in general tho

[arctic talon]

Emperor has presented as a woman before yes

Though they seem pretty set on being referred to as a man/male generally

[opaque coyote]

Yeah.

Honestly I like to think that the Emperor is genderfluid.

They just like flipping every so often.

Either way they're still a terrible parent.

[plush mason]

house Escher still presents him as one

[opaque coyote]

[sly ivy]

I think it’s more he’s a man gender wise lmao and he occasionally switches sex

Haha

[arctic talon]

Theres plenty of worlds who do

[sly ivy]

Like literally biologically

[arctic talon]

he was born male yes

this is known

unless he's lying

which he could be

[sly ivy]

He would never

[arctic talon]

but he has literally 0 reason to lie about this one

[plush mason]

he is a rotting corpse on a throne that is treated as a god

[arctic talon]

so I'd belive it

lol

[queen laurel]

Considering that he also has lied as easily as breathing

[opaque coyote]

Again, I think a personal headcanon is that he has multiple iterations of him/herself inside of him (insert joke here).

So he could talk to past iterations to get advice and different PoVs.

[plush mason]

sure he does, men are expected to rule and lead

[arctic talon]

oh yeah thats right

bro was fucking neolithic

[opaque coyote]

Like he has lived so long that each iteration of the Emperor is their own person and gender.

[arctic talon]

he might actually think that/j

[dire loom]

Thunder Warrior just chilling on Terra

[opaque coyote]

And somewhere

deep deep underneath

is the original neolithic emps

[plush mason]

talking like people irl today dont

[sly ivy]

Is his original pee pee

Neolithic

Esp when the custodes are well oiled

[plush mason]

"the presidency is a man's job"

[arctic talon]

The emperor doesn't seem to be sexist

[plush mason]

i have heard that phrase so many times

[arctic talon]

unironically

he's a lot of things but that isn't one of them

(as far as we can tell)

[opaque coyote]

I genuinely don't think he cares about sex or gender.

[dire loom]

It's possible some ancient secrets buried underneath Terra.

I mean, kind of obvious but yeah.

[arctic talon]

he doesn't

he's very much a

[dire loom]

Daemon Portal too

[plush mason]

yeah but when the majority of the people you rule are you haveto play the part

[opaque coyote]

He just cares about whether you're useful.

[arctic talon]

"do they serve my vision y/n"

[sly ivy]

Ya emp uncancellable confirmed

[dire loom]

Or chaos portal?

[arctic talon]

"if y sure, if n no"

[sly ivy]

Neither sexist nor racist

[dire loom]

Warp portal? Can't remember proper term for it.

[opaque coyote]

definitely not homophobic.

I mean

[sly ivy]

Any human goes (NOT YOU mutants)

[opaque coyote]

just look at his super soldiers

[arctic talon]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/903727478172975166/1375149100697387198/transports.png?ex=685ec766&is=685d75e6&hm=cc089d818a55513cb0cbcfbc612c6578c2b1d2e8822dcb55beeeed3d76aa7f36&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=1522&height=856&

[sly ivy]

Not homophobic not transphobic

[dire loom]

y/y*

[sly ivy]

Just a good progressive golden man

[plush mason]

https://tenor.com/view/tts-its-our-boy-gif-18135000

[opaque coyote]

(ignoring the many genocides)

[arctic talon]

The Emperor is

[sly ivy]

ALSO anticapitalist lmao

[arctic talon]

he's certianly a person

lmao

[dire loom]

TTS!

[arctic talon]

does the emperor hate capitalism lol

did i miss this

[opaque coyote]

Possibly. I mean he could be more than one

[sly ivy]

Well he is at the head of a monarchy so

[dire loom]

Redacted genocides

[opaque coyote]

Even before sitting on the throne

[arctic talon]

nah the imperium is proud about "educating" those stupid resisting humans

in the great crusade

also in the macharian crusade

Macharius dropping a moon on a planet is celebrated in the Macharian sector

in Maledictum

its an official holiday

[sly ivy]

And the state owns a very great deal

[arctic talon]

I would like to mention

he killed trillions

[opaque coyote]

"Oh boy we have finally managed to make an alliance of humans and xenos. Now we have to figure out how to eliminate cha-"

[arctic talon]

when he did that lol

[opaque coyote]

"KILL THEM ALL."

[late osprey]

The Imperium is probably not capitalist

[opaque coyote]

Feudalist I think

[arctic talon]

The imperium is way too fucked up economy wise to be capitalist

[queen laurel]

Oh buddy they would not care about that they would not redact such a thing because to them and this is just normal

[arctic talon]

its def more feudalist broadly

lol

[sly ivy]

See anticapitalist

[dire loom]

I'm surprised they have any trade to begin with.

[arctic talon]

barter based

[queen laurel]

These guys are the same people that would lynch you for being slightly taller than average

[arctic talon]

arguably

[sly ivy]

Emperor literally uncancellable

[arctic talon]

TITHES PEOPLE TITHES

[queen laurel]

They do not care about human genocide

[opaque coyote]

god trade must be a clusterfuck

[dire loom]

Outside of the Imperium

[arctic talon]

oh the imperium doesn't trade with non imperial stuff

lol

maybe on a smaller basis sure

but not like

[opaque coyote]

the Kin are sad

[arctic talon]

large scale

[late osprey]

Marx's Modes of Production theory gives a pretty nice banquet of all of the different ways a society can be organized economically

So the Imperium is definitely either Tributary or Feudal

[dire loom]

My head canon!

[storm jungle]

its both

[dire loom]

[arctic talon]

its both

if we go by Marx's modes of production

[storm jungle]

its very much forced by the Imperial core government

[late osprey]

Yeah both is the best description

[arctic talon]

its also technically socialist(on some worlds)

but not sector wide

lol

[dire loom]

It's 3 things because eternal ruler

I forgot wot 3rd was called though

Brain hurt

[opaque coyote]

So

The Imperium is Feudalist/Tributary.

The Eldar are communist due to being post-scarcity.

The Deldar are uh... capitalist?

What about the T'au?

[late osprey]

Both Feudal and Tributary modes have theocratic elements

[arctic talon]

Eldar aren't even communist ideologically

as a faction overall

Deldar are def capitalist

[storm jungle]

^

[late osprey]

Craftworld Eldar are like

[arctic talon]

Tau are a command economy

[late osprey]

Monastic, which isn't a mode really

[storm jungle]

Ehhh

[late osprey]

But it's that sort of society

[storm jungle]

they are more than that

[arctic talon]

Craftworld Eldar socities are still stratified to an extent

[opaque coyote]

yeah just the closest descriptor of what economy they have that I could think of

[arctic talon]

on some craftworlds

[storm jungle]

basically each craftworld has a core system of governing, but most of the populace are communist

[arctic talon]

yeah

[storm jungle]

the only monastic members are aspect warriors

[arctic talon]

Beil'tan is uh

[storm jungle]

who are literally monk soldiers

which counts lol

[dire loom]

fuck I hope I remember all this

[storm jungle]

Like

their society is so stable

they literally do not have policing forces

and just trade/barter shit for free inside the ship

lol

[arctic talon]

beil'tan/j

Me when I'm the autarch chosen to be the new

I don't know what the title actually is

[sly ivy]

If an eldar is naughty he spanks himself

(He likes it)

[storm jungle]

Yeet.

[late osprey]

The reason I say monastic is because it seems like the Craftworld way of life revolves around essentially cloistering yourself to your particular chosen path as much as possible, and leaving the Craftworld seems to be a big no-no (hence why they're called Outcasts)

[opaque coyote]

Basically, if it wasn't for the fact that your soul will literally be tortured for eternity when you die (without soul stones).

They would actually be the best way to live in 40k.

[late osprey]

But the Craftworld as a whole is like one big monastery/cloister

[storm jungle]

No you can just be anything you want.

[arctic talon]

tbf they still ahve recreation time and the like

[queen laurel]

Orks are a kratocracy

[arctic talon]

unlike monks

[queen laurel]

Because well you know

[storm jungle]

Nobody is forced on a path

[queen laurel]

Violence

[arctic talon]

they can party ect.

lol

[storm jungle]

^

also like

[arctic talon]

There's a path

[queen laurel]

Absolute violence

[arctic talon]

for sleeping all the time

lol

[storm jungle]

contrary to popular believe they can also have sex and stuff lol

their livelihood is really not that strict

basically just dont be a fucking nutjob hedonistic chaos cultist

thats it

lol

[arctic talon]

The CWE are pretty degenerate by human standards in terms of like

drinking alcohol

[dire loom]

[opaque coyote]

They do have a currency (teeth) and barter also so at least there's still trade.

[arctic talon]

and parties lol

[sly ivy]

I have been forced onto the path of enlightening u philistines

[arctic talon]

its very hedonistic

[storm jungle]

Yeah their society is extremely chill

[arctic talon]

by human standards

However eldar moment

so like

[storm jungle]

like the only downside to their lifestyle is if your soulstone gets broken during a war lol

[arctic talon]

just because its super hedonistic by human standards

[storm jungle]

then its eternal hell

[arctic talon]

is like

a drop

[late osprey]

I thought Craftworlders were the opposite, since their whole concern was the fall to excess or whatever

[arctic talon]

or if your "cousins" meet you

[storm jungle]

Excess means being a total hellraiser tier psychopath

[arctic talon]

Excess is fine in moderation

[queen laurel]

To be fair they are on a higher way of existence because of their you know more attuned senses and stuff

[storm jungle]

like

literally skinning people

[dire loom]

So the dark elves are just based?

[arctic talon]

Drukhari are what Eldar excess look like

[storm jungle]

or cutting yourself

[queen laurel]

Like average human alcohol is probably nothing to them

[opaque coyote]

I mean it is the opposite Eldar wise.

The Hellraiser stuff is their version of like

BDSM

[arctic talon]

craftworlds just hit lines of cocaine

when they're bored

when not doing path shit

[storm jungle]

Dark Eldar are crazy butchering pirates basically

[opaque coyote]

Basically, our extreme is their

[arctic talon]

Also slavers

lol

[opaque coyote]

"Holy shit you're vanilla as fuck"

Bc aliens

[arctic talon]

tbf

[dire loom]

Based

They're truly free

[queen laurel]

And have the best biotechnology in the setting

[arctic talon]

its just a sake of quantity

[queen laurel]

Dark eldar do some crazy biological stuff

It's not even f****** funny

[arctic talon]

Eldar do not operate on a 24 hour biological timer

as far as we can tell

they have some weird fucked up ne

GW has literally never elaborated

same with SM biological clocks

[opaque coyote]

Mostly for torture.

But yeah, they can do some crazy shit

[late osprey]

Dark Eldar mode is difficult imo, it's clearly got that individualist element in Capitalism, but there's no consideration for anything like property rights or anything

[arctic talon]

but its prolly something fucking weird

[sly ivy]

Y do they wear it on their armor lmao

[arctic talon]

Its anarchism almost

[late osprey]

But capitalist is probably closest of the human choices

[arctic talon]

might makes right more then anything

[opaque coyote]

You die, you get into the soul stone instead of into Slaanesh's hands.

[sly ivy]

And not like get it implanted in their chest cavity or at least shove it up their bum

[storm jungle]

Some are decoration, also because it looks cool.

[late osprey]

some sort of de-facto property rights enforced by self-interest and politics

[storm jungle]

why do you wear a helmet yet keep your face exposed

[late osprey]

Actually that has lots of real reasons 🤓

[dire loom]

[arctic talon]

Drukhari are also irredeembly evil as a faction

lol

[dire loom]

Drip reasons

[storm jungle]

yeah and you still get shot in the face 🤓

[queen laurel]

Hey we love those

[opaque coyote]

First one is because somebody still needs to move it

[arctic talon]

Anyways Drukhari moment(skinning people alive)

[opaque coyote]

Second one is because that's fucking disgusitng.

[opaque coyote]

Again. Drukhari would be funny as shit for a comedy series.

Imagine like one of those cheesy comedies like Full House

But it's Drukhari.

[arctic talon]

one of the black library writers

wanted to make a Romeo and Juliette story between rival kabals

but its dark eldar

[storm jungle]

he did tho

[opaque coyote]

LET HIM COOK\

[storm jungle]

Mistress Baeda's Gift

[arctic talon]

oh

[storm jungle]

its a hilarious short

[arctic talon]

wait

[opaque coyote]

Oh I must read that

[arctic talon]

oh my fucking god

is that the one?

[storm jungle]

LMAO

[opaque coyote]

That sounds fucking funny

[arctic talon]

okay then yeah

[storm jungle]

YEA

[arctic talon]

Its really good

LOL

Mistress Baeda's gift is great

[storm jungle]

https://i.4pcdn.org/tg/1550390107462.pdf

[arctic talon]

nah it was a different writer who wanted to do it, but similar idea

[storm jungle]

11 pages

have at it

[arctic talon]

though this is close

lol

its really good

[opaque coyote]

Still want that Dark Eldar sitcom though

Like styled after those stupid ass old family ones

[late osprey]

Klanadyl's Kabal

[opaque coyote]

"Laquris? Did you shove spikes into the human again?"

"I didn't mean to!"

laugh track plays while the human pet screams in agony

[arctic talon]

tbf you do not want to be the "favorite" pet

lol

[opaque coyote]

o h n o

I now have the morbid idea of the "family pet" constantly switching

[late osprey]

DEldar are also some of the best marines in the Galaxy

in Gothic their whole thing is crazy strong boarding actions

[arctic talon]

they're good at boarding yeah

[opaque coyote]

Like it's implied that they just died due to the torture, so they just keep getting a new one

with the same name

[arctic talon]

Deldar and Marines have the same gimmick almost

just different ships lol

[opaque coyote]

Like replacing a kid's goldfish with a new one and pretending it's the same one

[arctic talon]

marines are just worse

[opaque coyote]

But instead it's a human being

[arctic talon]

lol

[late osprey]

Space Marines getting stuck with slow-ass flying bricks

While DEldar have proper ships for boarding

[arctic talon]

Nah

Space marines have the fastest imperial ships

they just have god awful guns

lol

[opaque coyote]

tbh the dark eldar ships are probably my favorite aesthetic wise

[arctic talon]

Marine ships can fucking haul ass in the tabletop

[late osprey]

Fastest Imperial ships is like having the fastest turtle

[arctic talon]

LOL

look

[arctic talon]

if it can run down every faction but Eldar

its pretty fast I'd say

[opaque coyote]

Tbf, if that turtle still crushes you

then it's a good turtle

[arctic talon]

Do not ram with marine ships

LOL

they have bad frontal armor

[opaque coyote]

shit even with that thick ass box?

[late osprey]

I still think DEldar would be better suited because they can just get away and wait for their boarding cooldowns to come back up

Marine ships just kinda sit there uselessly waiting for their cooldowns

[opaque coyote]

I mean they are the experts at it.

[arctic talon]

they have a giant hanger bay infront

[arctic talon]

ye

Drukhari also have better guns

only downside is frail but who cares

zoom

[opaque coyote]

...honestly

for the longest tme

I thought that was meant to be a battering ram

Like intending to smash into another ship

have all the marines get out and kill anybody inside

[late osprey]

I like the Boarding Torbedo pattern more tbh, you actually fire out more marines with it

[arctic talon]

Yeah

[opaque coyote]

Because the Imperium is only just above the Orks in terms of

[arctic talon]

in any case marine ships have relatively poor frontal armor

they're built like a brick shithouse

[opaque coyote]

"USE BIG STICK TO KILL"

[arctic talon]

but they've got defined weaknesses lol

[late osprey]

This is essentially what Marine ships are, they're shipping containers that deliver marines to the enemy ships

[arctic talon]

Orks are the beginer friendly faction in Aeronautica imperialis lol

[opaque coyote]

All because they don't allow anybody to edit the STC.

[arctic talon]

you want to know why

I'll give you one guess

[arctic talon]

its to disgorge a bunch of thunderhawks at once

for planetary landing

the ship surviving is optional lol

[opaque coyote]

Their ships literally work out of pure WAAGH so things like logic doesn't matter

[arctic talon]

it just needs to survive long enough to deliver its payload

[arctic talon]

No its because they're very maneuverable lol

so you won't crash into shit 24/7

Imperial planes have god awful manuverability

[late osprey]

In THEORY it's more like an aircraft carrier, able to sustain an entire operation on its own and using strike craft to do damage

[opaque coyote]

That is the last thing I expected.

[late osprey]

In practice, it's a giant box for marines

[arctic talon]

They have the worst manuverability

in the system

by far

the upside is

you're built like a fucking brick

and you're good at ramming

[opaque coyote]

So that's why so many imperial ships and shit crash

[arctic talon]

(for a plane)

also

absurd acceleration

lol

[opaque coyote]

I feel like it should be the opposite ngl

[arctic talon]

Releveant

[opaque coyote]

Like the Orks should have the best stuff for ramming

[arctic talon]

well

Ork planes are pretty light nimble things

[late osprey]

Also late but Eldar military vehicles in general are awesome

[arctic talon]

imperial planes are brick shithouses and fly about as well as one

[late osprey]

I love the aesthetic design of them

[arctic talon]

Eldar are super fun in aeronautica

shame aeronautica died

[queen laurel]

ork it's about pretty much bricks or as wolf said incredibly fast and dangerous light airplanes

[arctic talon]

Necrons have really good ships but every one costs an arm and a leg

Ork planes are extremely killy and maneuverable

[queen laurel]

That has the same chance of killing the pilot as the enemy

[arctic talon]

Eldar planes are BiS aside from crons

they do everything well

but they're a little frail

[nocturne crest]

The only IoM ship that comes to mind that doesn't look like a brick is the deathwatch's private taxi.

[arctic talon]

not as frail as some Ork planes

[queen laurel]

But their frail as a paper airplane?

[late osprey]

Deffkoptas in the MoWAS mod are great because they're just as likely to crash into each other and explode as they are to unleash colossal rokkit volleys

[arctic talon]

nah the most fragile planes are the Orks

but Orks are dirt fucking cheap

[opaque coyote]

I actually fucking love this partially because it shows how despite the fact that the Imperium is actually pretty advanced, their logic is so backwards that it kinda nullifies it

[arctic talon]

for some of those

[late osprey]

Eldar strike craft are also the best in Gothic

You need like

2 fighter squads to kill one of theirs

It's nuts

[queen laurel]

So you basically have a large maneuverable fast group of air squadrons almost every game?

[arctic talon]

Tau are also nice in Aeronatuica

yes

Orks are extremely good lol

[opaque coyote]

It's wonderful how using aerodynamics actually makes the plane go faster

[arctic talon]

the downside is weapon malfunctions

whic his their gimmick

when they roll well their guns fire more

when they roll badly

[queen laurel]

Violently explodes?

[arctic talon]

the gun fucking explodes and you can't use it anymore(except on bigger planes)

[opaque coyote]

Kinda like a Beggar's Bazooka type of thing?

[arctic talon]

yes

Which is why missiles are good on Orks

missiles can never misfire in a manner that cripples you

missle launchers can

[opaque coyote]

damn this game actually sounds fun

too bad it's dead

https://tenor.com/view/crashout-skeleteon-skeleton-meme-skeleteton-crashout-screaming-gif-2819917983570648755

[queen laurel]

So you're entire game plan is literally by a billion ork planes send your squadron to the enemy and let it rip?

[arctic talon]

to an extent yes

[opaque coyote]

proper orky

[arctic talon]

Tau are like

pretty slow lol

the upside is

[queen laurel]

Well that's orky alright

[arctic talon]

360 degree cone of fire

on almost all their planes

[late osprey]

How's Chaos play?

[queen laurel]

So they don't have to turn around but they basically have omni directional firing?

[arctic talon]

Chaos never got official rules in 2.0

[opaque coyote]

I'm guessing basically the same

[arctic talon]

but fan made rules have them as Imperium but killier + lighter

Less armor, more maneuverability

more kill

[late osprey]

The rules generally seem to mirror Gothic in that way so makes sense

[arctic talon]

which is how they played in the original aeronautica

oh also

your pilots are immune

to death for some planes

because it isn't a plane

[opaque coyote]

Generally I kinda wish Chaos had some more differences from the Imperium tech-wise since it's kinda the same.

[arctic talon]

its a fucking daemon engine

[late osprey]

They do when you get to the high-tech levels

[arctic talon]

in terms of crew safety imperial planes are pretty good for pilots

gunners lol lmao

[late osprey]

Like when the Dark Mechanicum is involved

[queen laurel]

I mean it's simple their tech is imperium but either garbage or daemonic

[arctic talon]

Imperial bomber craft

are literal fucking death traps

for everyone but the pilot

its so fucking funny

[queen laurel]

Tell me you can deploy the chaos robot dragons

Planes

[late osprey]

Chaos do have unique designs because they got the lion's share of the fanciest toys back in the Horus Heresy

[arctic talon]

yes

super manuverable but uh

[opaque coyote]

Yeah I like it when it's daemonic.

Generally had the idea of Chaos Technology actually being biological but that'd go into the Tyranid niche.

[arctic talon]

they're awkward lol

[late osprey]

For example most of their Chaos starships are more advanced

[arctic talon]

they cost a lot

yeah chaos has a lot of differences

imo

lots of daemon engines

and more esoteric atheric stuff

advanced technology

[late osprey]

They generally rely on older models which means more advanced tech

[arctic talon]

the highs and lows are more broad

[opaque coyote]

It's just that most of their ships look like a larger version of Asmongold's room on the inside

Seriously how the fuck do they do anything without slipping on somebody's guts and dying to the numerous spikes around

[late osprey]

Slaves, of course

[opaque coyote]

I do like Daemon Machinery though

Although a part of me wishes for like

Xeno tech turned into Daemon Guns.

Like imagine a Daemonic T'au Pulse Rifle

[arctic talon]

oh also the chaos bomber is extremely good lol

in Aeronatuica

the harbringer?

it has like

the third biggest payload

[late osprey]

What's the use of a bomber in Aeronautica?

[arctic talon]

objective play

and there's also ground units

but no minis for them

AA platforms and the like

[opaque coyote]

The Nurgle mfs laughing as they bomb the random base with virus bonbs

[arctic talon]

the anti air platforms got minis

but not the ground "units"

[late osprey]

Is there like a

Killteam-style campaign mode to it?

Gotta keep your fighter crews alive and such

[arctic talon]

No

don't think so

let me post all the ground assets

with minis

[opaque coyote]

I generally want to know how the Chaos economy works.

Well ""economy""

Like the Arkifane and the Dark Mechanicus are seemingly well known for being actual suppliers of technology

I wonder how deals with them go

[arctic talon]

Bruh

did my post get deleted

ffs

whatever I'll just post the newer versions

rather then all of the ones including FW

[opaque coyote]

Yeah I assume it was auto detected as spam so

Like

Post half of the pics

And then the other half after

[late osprey]

It's all surprisingly straight-forward.

[late osprey]

Dark Mechanicus take slaves in exchange for wargear

Chaos Warbands collect slaves, and use wargear.

[arctic talon]

oh also the mythical craftworld eldar anti aircraft tank

[opaque coyote]

Yeah asking this since Chaos seems to be the perfect choice for a PMC type group.

I already yapped about a Khornate PMC idea

Also Chaos seems

Surprisingly connected to capitalism

[arctic talon]

if you're wondering what its guns are

[opaque coyote]

[arctic talon]

you know what a flak gun is

now imagine its a flak gun, but its shooting out monofiliment wire and lasers

[opaque coyote]

Don't worry, just take off your helmet

Should easily avoid you

[arctic talon]

Eldar vehicles are cool

so sad all the super heavies went OOP

aside from the tantalus

[opaque coyote]

They generally are.

Actually reminds me of like the X-Wing

[arctic talon]

they fear the titan sized gun

on a tank

[opaque coyote]

Biggest Dakka

"FIND OUT HOW TO GET THE BIGGEST DAKKA THAT IS INACCESSIBLE TO EVERY OTHER RACE!"

(ORKS HATE IT)

[crystal forum]

are we posting AA

there's also turbo lasers

https://preview.redd.it/does-anyone-know-what-the-size-of-that-thing-is-found-out-v0-anvael2uu9691.png?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=c9d0571c945d2ac41ffeb47c7d14459f032ec280

that thing on top is AA rule wise

also

[arctic talon]

Theres an anti aircraft basilisk version

lol

[arctic talon]

which is the one in Aeronautica

[crystal forum]

exterminator has AA rules

[crystal forum]

and it has flavor text about it

[opaque coyote]

Is that fucking riveted armor

[arctic talon]

yes

[crystal forum]

it's guard aesthetics

[arctic talon]

the imperium uses it

in general lol

[opaque coyote]

Yeah no wonder the Imperium loses so many people

[arctic talon]

also the ambiguously named "imperial heavy anti aircraft gun"

yes this is its official name

[crystal forum]

just a basilisk

[arctic talon]

no

its explictly not a basilisk

[crystal forum]

oh if we talk about old model

[arctic talon]

the basilisk gun is different

[crystal forum]

there's also these freaks

[arctic talon]

that thing isn't old tho

its from like 2012

which is

oh

oh no

[crystal forum]

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammer40k/images/0/0f/SabreGunPlatform04.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/250?cb=20130213000541

[arctic talon]

Ah yes

the sabre

LOL

[crystal forum]

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammer40k/images/c/cf/SabreGunPlatform05.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/250?cb=20130213000636

large flashlight

the manned tarrantula

[arctic talon]

It was awful

it was so bad

its so funny though

I'm sad they killed it only like

3 years after they made it

[crystal forum]

it looks cool tbh

but air is dead

[opaque coyote]

Why don't they just call them Howitzers

[arctic talon]

idfk

[opaque coyote]

God dammit GW

[crystal forum]

hydra my beloved

[opaque coyote]

I guess they ran out of wacky names for already named modern things

[arctic talon]

so weird GW never made platoon command squads

for IG

[opaque coyote]

The Emperor desperately trying to rename a random object into the "Amashitflipperperium"

[arctic talon]

they had rules at one point

like they were awful rules

but they were rules

[crystal forum]

what's a platoon command squad

is that not the same as the command squad

[arctic talon]

nah the current command squads are company command squads rule wise

[crystal forum]

what did platoon squad get

cooler weapons?

[arctic talon]

No

they were just cheaper and worse

[opaque coyote]

Honestly they should've made it bolted armor for the pun

Bolt

Boltgun

[arctic talon]

which while interesting as a concept

just ended up being worse generally

also used to be you could only take 1 company command squad

and you had to take platoon command squads if you wanted more then 1

[crystal forum]

amazing

two layers of command on a 300 foot war zone

[arctic talon]

LOL

[arctic talon]

you can do 4 layers in Heresy

with Marines

Praetor, Legion command squad, Chapter command squad, company command squad

should you do this?

absolutely not

soon catachan you shall be set free

man they look pretty awful

[sly ivy]

F

[cunning mango]

Hey guys, we know most of the games we showed at the warhammers skull event was mobile game slop, have a unfinished buggy space marine 1 remaster 😊

[arctic talon]

is this supposed to go anywhere

or is this just a statement

also there was only like

1 mobile game shown off at Skulls no?

like new game

[dapper gyro]

Because hotwitzer and AA guns are kind of different...

[nocturne crest]

Imagine if GW decided to replace the Catachan with another known regiment.

[arctic talon]

Catachan players on suicide watch

[opaque coyote]

They can handle the most dangerous planet in the galaxy

But they can't handle GW

[nocturne crest]

I would find it funny if they made Armageddon Ork Hunters to replace the Catachan.

[sly ivy]

All 3 of them

Replace with Tanith please god their outfits are 50000000 times better

Does anyone else think 40k-lore-chat voice chat would be hilarious

So much Dilara yelling at everyone

[shell mason]

Ello gents

I returned

with

https://tenor.com/view/nick-lutsko-songs-on-the-computer2-milk-lol-or-gtfo-gif-23812400

[languid meadow]

Seeing howitzer always reminds me of that Danish mini-series 1864

https://tenor.com/view/howitzers-gif-19247527

[sly ivy]

Literally the Imperial Guard

[shell mason]

bomb em til theres a giant creator

needs to be tertuim imo

the whole hive is fucked

[sly ivy]

Nah it's just got a liiiiiiiiittle tiny infestation problem

is all

Just a little tiddly widdly

I mean look how much one random stinky henchman can do I just got that 40,000 kill steam achievement.

[vagrant fox]

The battle at Dannevirke is wack
The first fortifications were started in like 600 bc and the last battle was in 1864
Do you got these poor peasants sitting in earthworks a thousand years+ old getting shelled by a technologically and numerically superior enemy

It could almost be warhams

[paper haven]

I'm sure the main reason we don't glass tertium is because it has valuable infrastructure or some similar garbage.

[arctic talon]

It is why

Tertium is very valuable

[opaque coyote]

Also steel

That sweet sweet Moebian Steel

Must be better than Plasteel at least due to how it's hyped up

[plush mason]

iirc hadron gives us the statistics for it in one missions

she said tanks made of it are like 33% more resistant

which is a big upgrade

on a side note, Hadron is living every technoarcheologist's wet dream rn and stands to rediscover the lost metallurgical process of making the legendary mobian steel

which is likely the only reason she is willing to tolerate any of this bullshit

[opaque coyote]

Okay it is worth it

Good lord

[arctic talon]

Also

Why is she in Martian colors

When she’s from Uradesh(damn you Abnett)

[plush mason]

yeah i remember that being my reaction when i first heard it

[arctic talon]

Or does Uradesh just use a suspiciously similar shade of red

[opaque coyote]

Would've been funny if it was only like

4% more resistant

Or some small number

Millions of lives are being fought over a 4% upgrade

[plush mason]

yeah but no this shit is actually really good

granted the modern day version is likely close to 4% lmao

[plush mason]

its bone white and blue

if the wiki image is right

[opaque coyote]

Honestly considering it's actually good. It makes sense why they aren't doing more like

Extensive runs

Since so far we haven't really done shit like

Bombings

[languid meadow]

Actually iirc the original number was actually really small

[plush mason]

yeah they cant afford to risk production

[opaque coyote]

Oh.

Yeah that fits more

[languid meadow]

Idk when they changed it but it was like .3% more resilient at the start of this game

[opaque coyote]

Idk I just think a smaller number would've been funnier

Since again, Grimdark (tm)

[opaque coyote]

Maybe it's a type of thing that adds up?

Like the steel itself is only a small number

[plush mason]

honestly it might be .33 im not fully sure, been a while since i heard it

[opaque coyote]

But tanks made out of it are much better due to the higher quality

[arctic talon]

That was the old Moebian steel no?

Then again

It was def 0.3%

[opaque coyote]

Nvm fittingly grimdark

Let's gooo

[languid meadow]

They def buffed moebian steel after SotMG

[opaque coyote]

Tbf if we want to get into it. It could be better in specific scenarios but not others

Either that or the % is different depending on the grade

[languid meadow]

But yeah maybe It was talking about the general steel instead of the special stuff

[opaque coyote]

Like there's different qualities of Moebian steel

[plush mason]

the whole point of swagger and the foundry complex was to gain the true process to make the real deal mobian steel

[opaque coyote]

Maybe the percentage gone up because of our actions

[plush mason]

so its not just the minerals but the refining process

[opaque coyote]

Which is actually nice to think about

[languid meadow]

Yeah I believe the real moebian steel is way higher but the original reason they didn't blow up the planet in the early days of the game was because of the .3% stronger material they normally made

[opaque coyote]

Probably why Hadron treats us way differently at max level vs like low level "rejects"

[plush mason]

well that and the on going claim of the original strength

[opaque coyote]

We actually helped her get that increase of steel

And therefore went up on her ranking from "the shit I took this morning" to "maybe useful"

Major improvements

[opaque coyote]

Also the stims we keep using are interesting

Since they remove corruption

But yet are implied to also be used by the traitors

Probably just gameplay but maybe that's why they're left

They're actually clean

Which for Nurgle worshippers might as well be filthy

So that's why they're safe to use for us

And since they keep being found in random bins, boxes, etc.

They might have been thrown away by the traitors for that reason.

[plush mason]

the ones we take are non-corrupted afaik

the cult and mobians have their own

[opaque coyote]

Yeah I was thinking that maybe the ones that are left are essentially stims that are accidentally non-corrupted

Thrown away by the traitors due to that reason

But since they're non-corrupted. They benefit us.

Since maybe for Nurgle worshippers, it's the exact opposite to us

Dirty needles and corrupted medicine is good

But any actual clean needles and effective medicine is awful for them

So they're left because to them, any clean and effective stim is a bad batch

Probably putting way more thought than the devs ever did

But that's what I think

[winter vessel]

the blighted stims are just drugs the Cult and the 6th purchased from Nurgle Temu

[amber finch]

So could some knowledgeable 40k genius point me in the right direction for books to read? I'm looking for stuff about Trazyn the Infinite, the Men of Steel, and the Unification Wars

[winged jacinth]

There's a new mourningstar line about recent successes replicating it in controlled manufactories so she might be in for a promotion if she makes it home

Mysterious new "urdeshi steel" makes its way to the front

[arctic talon]

The last 2 have no real novels on them, Trazyn the Infinite has The Infinite and the Divine

[amber finch]

I saw 1 book called Man of Steel available on Black Library but wasn't sure if it was about those men of steel or not

[arctic talon]

Man of iron is a short story on Ur-025

who doesn't really give any info on the man of iron

[amber finch]

Ah damn

[arctic talon]

despite being one

[amber finch]

Unification Wars is a hard one to find data on

Found 1 book called Dreams of Unity though. GREAT read

Ah screw it. I'm just buying The Infinite and the Divine and Horus Rising I guess

[opaque coyote]

Tbf it's like asking a human

"Hey do you have any information about the history of your entire species?"

At best you get a mixed answer

At worst you probably get some absolute bullshit

Tbf UR-025 does mention that the Men of Iron did have a machine God

Which implies that the Mechanicus religion is simply an offshoot of whatever religion the Men of Iron used to believe.

And that it has met the Omnissiah and not the "fake one" (AKA the Emperor as the fake one)

Although it also said that the Omnissiah would also have been heavily disappointed to see the Imperium

So still open to interpretation

In my opinion/theory, it's the original inventor of the Men of Iron.

Either that, or some giant fucking AI.

Although I genuinely wonder why didn't he try to disguise himself as an actual tech priest

Probably would allow more room for error and sentience

[tough haven]

Also some tech priests are able to be fully mechanical and admech doesnt bat an eye ig

[sly ivy]

Surely it means the Dragon

[tough haven]

I find it meaning the void dragon unlikely

[opaque coyote]

The Omnissiah is a title

Considering that C'tan generally don't care enough about humanity to even be disappointed

I think it's definitely not the void dragon

[median star]

do other tech priest ever look down on the ones that go off to work for a rogue trader or inquisitor

[opaque coyote]

Nothing mentions any discrimination from that

I think it's just seen as the equivalent of going overseas to study

Although more importantly. How do Tech Priests treat those that keep certain fleshy bits

Let's say that I don't feel like replacing my dingdong despite being a tech priest.

Would I be scorned by my theoretical peers?

[plush mason]

the fact you find this in a random sewer on footfall still gets me

[shadow plover]

[celest dome]

Yes, and also on Enginseer who work in the IG

[celest dome]

Depend on the discipline and Forge World you're on

[arctic talon]

no

though some might find you vain for it

[plush mason]

are the Drusians a particularly large sect of the imperial cult?

[celest dome]

Only in their sectors

[plush mason]

the different sects have set sectors?

is that like an official thing or just a natural outcome based on how many followers the sect has in the area/if the saint they follow came from there?

[celest dome]

No, like iirc it's only really present on the sector that Dwrk Heresy happen on

And in that sector it's very big

[plush mason]

well they are also in the expanse

but thats literally right next to the Calixis assuming thats also where dark heresy is set

[amber finch]

The Infinite and the Divine arrives tomorrow

Horus Rising arrives on Monday

😄

[arctic talon]

Not really

They’re major in the FFG regions

But much smaller outside of that

There’s some in the Macharian sector

[plush mason]

this looks so ridiculous

[near wasp]

I feel like they freeze sperm and eggs and use them to create test tube babies

They may not see the individual fleshy bits as needed since they probably find the act of reproduction a process for lesser more fleshy beings. They also probably don't have much in the form of lustful urges given how devoid most tech priests are of emotion

But in the book I'm reading a young tech priest definitely has a crush on a Inquisitoral agent

[sharp pollen]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1222296592380461116/1388093573844434944/1750979675791156.gif

oh, and another hate video...

right below it

thanks yt

waiter! waiter! more drama please!

[sly ivy]

Lmao what is this

[dapper gyro]

I was rolling on Facebook, mostly to check on my family half a globe away, then I saw some people ranting against a YouTube short on how Halo Spartan with high velocity anti armour weapon wouldn't beat a SM because 40K is just that stronger...

I didn't read the whole rant, but I feel sorry for them.

[queen laurel]

The concept of marines dying too hard for their head to wrap around or something?

[winged jacinth]

Ceramite like... isnt even that good in lore

They're extremely vulnerable to anti armor and while they're more heavily armored than a spartan, spartan anti-armor weapons are for you know, real tanks

[queen laurel]

don't even get started on how crazy halo can get

shit is crazy

[winged jacinth]

An iron halo probably would shrug a lot of their manPAT but that's not exactly bog standard equipment

[dapper gyro]

The weapon in question is the Halo portable railgun.

[winged jacinth]

Must be post 4

That's the last one i played

[dapper gyro]

Like, a Chaos SM can be killed by a squad of IG with lasgun. A company of IG with 4 heavy bolters can push a squad of Marines back.

You are telling me a gun that shoots a super sonic projectile that can go through a tank can't beat the marines?

[winged jacinth]

I always think of marines as similar to a light APC

But yeah an unshielded marine would go down to any normal halo anti-armor weapon or a good old fashioned plasma stick

[dapper gyro]

They were japping about SM combat hundred years experience... But you know, doesn't matter how much you know about your job, it doesn't overcome your physical limitation.

[winged jacinth]

And unlike with a vehicle a marine cant get lucky if a shot busts their visor or something

Plus like, its guns with digital support on both sides

[queen laurel]

hundreds of years experience loses to a muscular green fungus with a gun built out of scavenged broken parts

[winged jacinth]

And honestly vs new enemies space marines are past experienced into inflexible (pretty typical for 40k)

And halo? Hes a pretty cool guy who doesnt afraid of anything

[hallow saddle]

nothing ever happens

[humble shoal]

Halo man vs dreadnought

[gray umbra]

oh no comparing different universes

[humble shoal]

Halo has galaxy wipers doesnt it?

Or is it only systems