40k-lore-chat

[median marsh]

To get more about wolfer, as she states in her previous logs

[warm notch]

Yas

[storm jungle]

I love how much of this is Zola just being a brainwashed moron

and like, not noticing anything about the Imperium's hypocrisy

its very funny lmfao

[normal light]

I think you know too much

[storm jungle]

[green loom]

She's like a worse judge

[storm jungle]

couldnt have picked a better comparison ty

[arctic talon]

"I hate rich people" - Zola

[tulip brook]

she's alright. she didn't straight up shoot us when she had the chance

way better than 99.9% of imperium

[arctic talon]

lol

[loud crag]

Has anyone here read ravenor?

I got a bit of a question

Bugging the hell out of me

[shadow plover]

shoot

[loud crag]

Do you remember Zeph?

[shadow plover]

the kid?

[loud crag]

Zeph mathuin

The guy ravenor used to wear

[shadow plover]

oh yeah

[loud crag]

Wasn’t he just the guy from Final Fantasy seven

[shadow plover]

Well that I can't answer

don't know shit about final fantasy

[loud crag]

Garret Wallace

[loud crag]

Well, that’s a picture of him

And from the very few times that Zeph gets described in the books that’s the appearance

Dark skin, no shirt, chain gun for an arm

It’s a very specific look

[shadow plover]

I don't recall him having a gun for an arm

he had the rotary cannon he liked

[loud crag]

It was his arm

[shadow plover]

but not as his arm

[loud crag]

That’s why he had to dream about the hands

On the beach

It got bitten by a crocodile like creature when he was hanging on top of at the carnivora

I mean, I don’t blame you for forgetting him Zeph was quite literally a non-character. He was such a non-character that it was almost a writing device that Gideon could wear him easily.

[shadow plover]

wasn't his arm just severed and he had an augment in place of it but the hand itself wasn't the gun he used

[loud crag]

The crocodile bit the rotator cannon instead of his arm and started dragging him into the cage. I remember that very specifically.

[shadow plover]

he even had the special harness to wield the gun

[gray umbra]

of the best moments in rogue trader was when one of my companions was like

"Nobles being nice and tending to the poor? There must be some heresy involved"

and my iconoclast trader is like "haha yeah...."

[shadow plover]

iirc he did use the arm to directly interface with the gun but I honestly don't think it was in place of his arm

[loud crag]

I mean, maybe you’re right, but you have to agree with me that Zeph is basically a non-character

[shadow plover]

yeah fair

[loud crag]

So forgetting little details is an exactly hard to do

[loud crag]

Also, I mean, it seems like that little non plot was taken care of in the second book

[shadow plover]

quite

[green loom]

They do second guess you nonstop as iconoclast lol

[loud crag]

Harlan also kinda got done dirty as the series went on

He deserved his own book

I really specifically remember there was a Warhammer book about a bounty hunter

[shadow plover]

I think he is a great supporting character but not a main dude for a story sorta guy

[loud crag]

Oh, come on basically it would be him as like a detective but he’s a bounty hunter

He could be like Sam Spade

But with more gun fights

Imagine a hard-bitten crime drama set in 40 K starring for once ….. a completely regular dude

Not a psyker

Not a inquisitior

Not a commissar

Just one really badass dude

And not a story about him, babysitting the “clone” of his bosses ex girlfriend and getting his ass kicked every 50 pages because he’s old

[gray umbra]

Wake up, eat some corn starch, go to work, die because i tripped and fell off a non OSHA approved railless walkway

[loud crag]

OSHA is the 5th chaos god

Back in my day, the forces of chaos had multiple worlds just for making weapons in the eye of terror, and they made so many weapons that the entire orbit ring of said planets was made entirely of weapons and ships would come by and scoop them for various war bands to use

[dire apex]

Dune has the exact same thing that 40k copied where an ai rebellion led to a cramping down on advanced computers and tech

[loud crag]

It’s almost as if 40 K was originally a parody of sorts

[dire apex]

Yes 40k is a parody but not of dune, I’m sure the men of iron lore didn’t exist until a few years after the start of 40k as rogue trader

[dusk patrol]

Maybe as a short but his whole major career is him being in the service of Eisenhorn or Ravenor

[crystal forum]

"copy" is a pejorative way of putting it

[dusk patrol]

We’re already getting the highlight reel

[arctic talon]

The usual sci-fi/fantasy blatant stealing but it’s fine bcs it’s cool

[dusk patrol]

It’s quite different now anyways

[loud crag]

Dune is …. Such a major sci-fi novel that there’s no way you can’t just count it among the sources for 40 K.

[dusk patrol]

Early on it was way more blatant

[dire apex]

Duh

[loud crag]

Early on, it wasn’t meant to be taken seriously

[dusk patrol]

But 40k since has established itself more

[loud crag]

And that’s why they’ve moved away from some of the more ridiculous stuff though I have to say I do love the old stuff more

Nowadays things are a little too I don’t know how to put this melodrama?

Eye of terror is such a fun book

[crystal forum]

the lore takes itself a lot more seriously these days i'd say

[dusk patrol]

There’s plenty of silly stuff still or what not if you look for it

It’s not as goofy as it was back then

But it’s still got plenty of silly stuff if you want that

[loud crag]

Eh

I’m not a big fan of necrons

Or eldar cat familiars

[dusk patrol]

Ok then don’t read about them

[loud crag]

…..bruh

All I’m saying is if I wanted to read about the tomb, Kings, I would read about the tomb, kings

Necrons used to be cool

[crystal forum]

it's true though. 40k lore is so vast that you can just ignore the parts of it you dont like

[loud crag]

Yeah, but just saying ignore it is sort of dismissive

I want to talk about it

[crystal forum]

i dont know much about old necron lore but it seemed pretty generic

[loud crag]

They’re really wasn’t any they were sort of not knowable

[dusk patrol]

They used to be boring imo but

We’re all entitled to our opinions

[loud crag]

There’s a difference between boring and not knowing about some thing

[dusk patrol]

Also you can still find the old Necron stuff

[dusk patrol]

I’m very aware of how old Necrons were

[crystal forum]

nids still do that

[loud crag]

Inb4 there’s a tyranid book from the perspective of of a hive mind

And it’s just basically playing an RTS

[crystal forum]

i actually want that but it sounds like a massive challenge for an author to pull off

[loud crag]

I do believe the first ever mention of them was GorkaMorka

[loud crag]

What are you talking about? Everybody writes giant galactic intelligences.

Like that half of dans stuff

[crystal forum]

it'll be an entire book without any dialogue at all

[loud crag]

It’s about really powerful psychers doing really powerful psycho stuff

It would just be vivid descriptions of stuff, going on intercut with scenes of human characters, having to deal with the hive mind

[crystal forum]

yeah that sounds awesome

[loud crag]

Oh yes, the son

The Achilles heel of any famous author

[crystal forum]

"the estate"

no you cannot use this 70 year old character in your short story

[tulip brook]

wouldn't you want to get super rich just by writing fanfic

[loud crag]

Better to protect

Then to end up with like rings of power

[arctic talon]

Free money

[loud crag]

shudder

[crystal forum]

it's not the authors who are making money, it's their descendents who did nothing except be born

[dire apex]

Never read the son’s stuff, but it’s been a while since I’ve read the old books,

[loud crag]

But going back to 40k

[crystal forum]

i dont think tolkien would have enjoyed how much branding is injected into the lord of the rings these days

[loud crag]

I’m just so not a fan of god children arguing about stuff

[storm jungle]

LOTR literally started as bed time stories

Tolkien just wanted to write

[loud crag]

That’s the hobbit

That’s different

[storm jungle]

Not much difference

anyway

it just blew up because his writing was spectacular

he didnt exactly write it to be a billionare

[loud crag]

He didn’t need money he had clout beyond all fucking reason

[storm jungle]

The guy is basically the father of fantasy so

[loud crag]

It was well-deserved, of course

But I mean, like he was in that status, where he could literally just go anywhere

He didn’t need any money

[crystal forum]

read guard books

[loud crag]

I have

[crystal forum]

based

[loud crag]

The Horus heresy series in my opinion is a complete waste of time

[crystal forum]

now that's a hot take

[loud crag]

There are decent books, but overall the story just really isn’t necessary to be told

Master of mankind actually made me physically throw the book

[storm jungle]

Its really not

[warm notch]

I want to learn about how Horus heresied all over everybody

[loud crag]

I could not finish it

[storm jungle]

HH's entire point is to appeal to space marine fans

and like, empty you of your money

[loud crag]

Master of mankind is fucking terrible

It’s even got a “Lands Speeder”

[shadow plover]

now that I don't get, that's a great book

[crystal forum]

i like how dramatic they can get

the HH books

[loud crag]

Two words

AMARA

ASTARTES

[shadow plover]

nah that's fine

[crystal forum]

i dont read 40k books expecting high class literature

[loud crag]

No, that is not fine

That is the opposite of fine

That’s so stupid

That’s like giant moon with a grinning face, eating half of the defenders of earth stupid

[burnt maple]

Over 130h on Rogue Trader, barely getting to the last push.

My Emperor...

[crystal forum]

that sounds so fucking cool

[loud crag]

That’s PRIMEORCKS STUPID

[storm jungle]

[loud crag]

Beast arises book 2 i think

[crystal forum]

i read 40k books so the inner kid in me can go FUCK YEAAAAH

[summer mural]

are there chaos entities that are stronger than greater daemons and daemon princes but not chaos god strong

[arctic talon]

Wrong reply

[arctic talon]

Vashtorr

[storm jungle]

Vashtorr

[arctic talon]

But he’s arguably a chaos god

Just a small one

[green loom]

The Blade of Antwyr

[summer mural]

the forge of souls guy?

[arctic talon]

“Lands raider”

[loud crag]

The whole idea that the astartes were named after some lady is beyond dumb

[arctic talon]

Yes

[loud crag]

Both yes

[arctic talon]

Land raiders funny naming scheme has been since 1e

So

[coarse pumice]

you mean in real life?

[crystal forum]

i actually love that stupid shit

[summer mural]

do they have a heirarchy of their own, like uber daemon or something?

[loud crag]

It also undermines the emperor as a character

[storm jungle]

Jimmy Space

[coarse pumice]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astarte

[storm jungle]

John Lasgun

[arctic talon]

That one if you want to complain about blame GW like years ago lol

In the 1990s

[storm jungle]

Ferrus Ironhands

[green loom]

Hold on I'll get the reddit pearl clutching script

[crystal forum]

i want the emperor's name to be revealed as "war hammer"

[arctic talon]

Iron Hands, leader of the iron hands who has a ship called the fist of iron

[loud crag]

Astra millitarum

[arctic talon]

Meh

That one’s fine

[crystal forum]

astra militarum is a branding thing

[loud crag]

Means space army

[arctic talon]

Yeah

What about it lol

[crystal forum]

they couldnt copyright imperial guard

[summer mural]

The emperors name is Anathema Skywalker

[coarse pumice]

to be fair, I think Ferrus Ironhands was meant to be one entry in a table in some irrelevant background lore and forgotten when they first added him

[loud crag]

Adeptus mechanicus

Means mech force

[arctic talon]

Are we just going into dumb naming conventions

Bcs these have been around

For forever

[loud crag]

Adeptus astartes

[green loom]

But these all sound cool

[loud crag]

Why would that mean it’s somebody’s name

[green loom]

What's the issue

[shadow plover]

I mean if the biggest gripe in the setting is how things are named in-world it can't be that bad then can it

[crystal forum]

what's the name of that inquisitor again? obi wan something?

[storm jungle]

Obi Wan Sherlock Clouseau

[loud crag]

Astartes being someone’s name is ridiculous

[green loom]

Hardly

[storm jungle]

its literally a reference to IRL mythology

[loud crag]

Rouge trader is not cannon

[crystal forum]

literally laughed out loud every time i read that

[storm jungle]

Its in the lore of the game, accept it

[green loom]

Are we going to call everything named after someone irl stupid lol

[arctic talon]

We can talk about old stuff

[shadow plover]

Seeing Astarte named in the book had me literally go "oh alright" and then continue listening

[arctic talon]

Guillotine

[coarse pumice]

astarte is literally the name of a goddess

[arctic talon]

Lol

[loud crag]

The Loredoesn’t start until second edition

[green loom]

Boycott

[dusk patrol]

Nah he wanted an excuse to make everyone read about his obsessions with linguistics and the languages he made

[arctic talon]

3e arguably

[green loom]

Nicotine

[storm jungle]

Yes, that's literally what I said lol

[arctic talon]

That’s when the big tonal shift occurred

[coarse pumice]

it was late rogue trader

[arctic talon]

But people can talk about funny rogue trader lore if they want

[dusk patrol]

LotR was just a vehicle for his linguistic obsession, and it happens to be banger

[storm jungle]

Obi Wan has been referenced in recent lore, his initials were on an inquisitor report

[crystal forum]

when most characters are some made up name or something from mythology, pedro kantor strikes out

fucking pedro

[arctic talon]

It was inqusitor O.W.S.C

Lol

[green loom]

Peter Office

[loud crag]

Shall i bring up Draco

[coarse pumice]

modern 40k bears more resemblence to late rogue trader than early rogue trader

[storm jungle]

Draco has nothing to do with this so

[storm jungle]

YEP

tho i get why they didnt fully name him

[shadow plover]

it could be worse, it could be a space fantasy and one of the main characters was named fucking PAUL

[storm jungle]

because lawsuit

lmao

[storm jungle]

DUNCAN IDAHO

[loud crag]

What’s wrong with Paul

[shadow plover]

or that..

[warm notch]

You mean to tell me he wrote an extensive mythology that literally almost all fiction in a fantasy setting takes inspiration from just so he can nerd out on the fictional languages he made

[dusk patrol]

That’s not even the worst name in Dune

Although tbh

I like the names

[arctic talon]

Goofy ahh last name

It’s fun

[dusk patrol]

As silly as they are

[arctic talon]

Tbh

[crystal forum]

tolkien was such a chad that he entered "dwarves" into the dictionary

[dusk patrol]

And most of the names are pretty sick

[arctic talon]

Mhm

[storm jungle]

He might not have succeeded but he was still a chad for trying

[arctic talon]

I still can’t get over Duncan’s last name

Fucks sake Duncan Idaho lol

[storm jungle]

"dwarfs" is dumb lol

[dusk patrol]

Tolkien founded modern Fantasy basically

[loud crag]

Tolkien was essentially a literary saint

[rose thorn]

You mean duardin

[storm jungle]

As much as Herbert was the father of sci-fi Tolkien was the father of fantasy

[winged jacinth]

Paul was named paul because they were literally catholic

[green loom]

No I mean dwemer

[tulip brook]

who needs names when you can just call the angry guy angron and perturbed guy perturabo

[dusk patrol]

All that stuff existed before but he made and collected so many of the tropes which we now see commonly used in fantasy

[loud crag]

I hate how everyone says alderia

[green loom]

Or the raven guy raven raven

Or was it just raven

[storm jungle]

They are still very much pioneers for spreading it around

[arctic talon]

What

[storm jungle]

because you can make this argument about anything

[loud crag]

But i really hate how people just regular motherfuckers in the military seem to know the difference between aldarie and drucari

[storm jungle]

what

[crystal forum]

i dont think anybody took irish mythology as seriously as he did though. except the irish.

[storm jungle]

its Aeldari and Drukhari lol

[arctic talon]

Eldar just get called eldar

[storm jungle]

^

its just a copyright name

[arctic talon]

Like 99% of the time

[storm jungle]

because the term "Eldar" is literally stolen from Tolkien

[coarse pumice]

I would say Asimov over Herbert

[green loom]

And they also don't typically

[dusk patrol]

Or pointy eared bastards

[green loom]

Except veterans

[loud crag]

They use it in the books and lore

It sickens me

[storm jungle]

copyrightable term

its not that glaring

[coarse pumice]

Dune is descended from Foundation

[arctic talon]

Does everything sicken you

[loud crag]

Most modern things yeah

[storm jungle]

that explains a lot

[outer wave]

oof

[winged jacinth]

science fiction emerged among a handful of authors who were all friends to some degree

[arctic talon]

Also eldar just get called eldar in a lot of books?

Idk

[loud crag]

Not anymore

[storm jungle]

Yeah they do

[arctic talon]

Yes they do

[dusk patrol]

They get called Eldar plenty

Same with the IG being called Imperial Guard

[crystal forum]

the problem with saying a work "copy's" a previous one is you can follow up the chain of "copying" forever until you hit the first piece of fiction written by a human. that was also copying real life so who cares

[dusk patrol]

And not always Astra Militarum

[green loom]

Just like how the guard is called either Guard or Militarum and scarcely anything else

[dusk patrol]

And space marines space marines

And not always Astartes

And so on

[loud crag]

So you are saying

[arctic talon]

And most people don’t know the difference between druhkari and craftworld eldar

[storm jungle]

Pretty much this yeah.

Dune and LOTR deserve more recognition because they invented most of these in abundance in a single bowl of creativity and writing.

[loud crag]

That in the new books they call them Eldar

[winged jacinth]

eldar and dark eldar are basically the low gothic names

[arctic talon]

Sometimes yeah

[dusk patrol]

Yes

It varies

[arctic talon]

^

[storm jungle]

just let it go

we're gonna be here forever

[loud crag]

Drukari was always a thing

[storm jungle]

💀

[dusk patrol]

Generally people like Inquisitors will know the distinction

[storm jungle]

Dark Eldar / Drukhari get used interchangably

[winged jacinth]

most people who know about eldar only know them as pirates

[dusk patrol]

But most dudes just know “pointy eared dudes are Eldar”

[rose thorn]

🍿

[dire apex]

Iirc the first example of power armor and orbital drops is starship troopers,

[loud crag]

Only the eldar know the name generally

[storm jungle]

they dont

eldar got their own words for them

💀

[loud crag]

It’s Drukari

[storm jungle]

OH MY GOD

[dusk patrol]

Like dude

[crystal forum]

when it comes to dune and 40k it's unfair to call it copying when the people who created 40k were huge fans of dune. it assigns a malice to them like they didn't care about what they're using as inspiration

[dusk patrol]

You can just say you don’t read the books

[green loom]

Craftworlders are called Asuryani by the Eldar

[arctic talon]

Aeldari just refers to the whole specices

[arctic talon]

yeah this

[green loom]

This also isn't new

[dusk patrol]

I agreed, especially when originally it was just some silly thing some British punks were making

[green loom]

Like afaik the dark and high elves were the Druchii and Asur for a while

[dusk patrol]

As it grew it changed

Became its own thing

[loud crag]

I do read the books I don’t know what you are going on about

[coarse pumice]

don't forget Moorecock

[storm jungle]

literally nobody knows Moorcock

which sucks

💀

[dusk patrol]

Don’t mind if I do

[storm jungle]

they literally stole the guy's chaos symbol

[dusk patrol]

[storm jungle]

lmao

[green loom]

Who wants more cock?

[winged jacinth]

i know the name elric of melnibone but ive never read any of it

[coarse pumice]

I think

[winged jacinth]

i know he has an evil sword which is a 40k staple

[loud crag]

The Witcher stole more from Elric tbh

[storm jungle]

Elric is basically the original moody guy with a cursed sword

[coarse pumice]

it's more famous for what it influenced than have read it

[storm jungle]

he was suppose to be antithesis of Conan the Barbarian

[crystal forum]

i have no idea who that is

[loud crag]

He wrote that book

[outer wave]

More Cock!!!

[loud crag]

Above

[coarse pumice]

I spelt it wrong, should be Moorcock

[storm jungle]

The guy that invented the concept of Order vs Chaos Gods and the eternal champion along with arguably multiverses

he also invented the chaos star we know today

GW also stole that lol

its a public domain symbol tho

so

[arctic talon]

[loud crag]

Again it was a parody at the time

[coarse pumice]

AdMech are basically the Tech Men from Foundation

[rose thorn]

The only books I really read is warhammer books so idk stuff GW stole lol

[winged jacinth]

40k does a lot of direct aping which is kinda funny but it's basically a parody of scifi anyway

[coarse pumice]

along with the loss of knowledge in the Empire

in Foundation

[green loom]

Don't forget the Budget Butlerian Jihad

[loud crag]

Admechs and comstar steal motifs from eachother alot too

[storm jungle]

40k is basically built on stolen IPs lol

[crystal forum]

huh i though chaos was one of the only purely original things from warhammer fantasy

[storm jungle]

Hell no lmao

[winged jacinth]

it basically directly parodies the fascist stuff in starship troopers, it has the history and space travel of dune, yadda yadda

[rose thorn]

At least the newer stuff is being more original

[coarse pumice]

warhammer chaos ended up different to Eternal Champion chaos than it could have

AFAIK, one of the old CEOs wanted basically to rip it off more directly, but Rick Priestly changed it to be slightly more distinct

[winged jacinth]

warhammer 40k is the sequel to Dune brian herbert wishes he could write

[crystal forum]

at least it's not approving the fascist stuff like starship troopers

[storm jungle]

but basically Moorcock was also accidentally responsible for Dark Elves in Warhammer, in Elric he's a part of a race referred to as the Melniboneans who were a decadent old race that worshipped chaos, over time they were depicted in an elvish manner and then this lead to the Dark Elves in warhammer fantasy being modelled after them, down to even worshipping chaos in some aspects.

The Dark Eldar soon followed afterwards in 40k.

Its a very nice chain of creation/inspiration lol

[loud crag]

Yeah “inspiration”

[storm jungle]

shut up

lmao

[arctic talon]

[storm jungle]

Also all good artists steal

[outer wave]

Man came in to fight the entirety of Lore Chat

[loud crag]

I have never heard someone say that Elrick was the opposite of Conan

[outer wave]

Also this exactly

[dire apex]

What?

[storm jungle]

Moorcock's entire reason for making him was that

[loud crag]

But I’ll take you at the word

I have never seen that before

[winged jacinth]

reading the silmarilion and going "this is literally a bible ripoff wtf"

[green loom]

The starship troopers book is apparently barely marketable fascist propaganda

[storm jungle]

Instead of getting the glory, women and treasure

All Elric gets at the end of his journeys are betrayal, bitterness, dead friends and a lover

[rose thorn]

sad but true

[coarse pumice]

also Elric is really frail

[loud crag]

Did you read Conan?

[storm jungle]

Yes.

[dire apex]

It isn’t, verhoeven never read the book

[loud crag]

How many times does he actually come out on top? It’s about an even split.

[green loom]

Is this why I'm a bad artist?

[storm jungle]

Books dont matter, Conan's media depiction is a badass barbarian that kills people and gets the girl

[loud crag]

Did you just say the books don’t matter

[storm jungle]

this has been a thing for decades

[storm jungle]

God enough already

💀

[loud crag]

Are you serious?

[winged jacinth]

heinlen was a gross freak but i've never actually read starship troopers

[storm jungle]

do you genuinely think

people read the conan books

[winged jacinth]

conan is famous for movies lmao

with arnold

[storm jungle]

^

[loud crag]

The robbert e Howard stories, Are Conan the barbarian

[crystal forum]

read about the author

[storm jungle]

Conan is a media icon more than a literature one

literally nobody knows he has books

[green loom]

The Conan RPG is fun

[storm jungle]

hes more towards comics/artwork

[loud crag]

I read them all when I was 15

[storm jungle]

Good, most people still haven't.

[loud crag]

And solomn cane

They are fan fucking tastic

[storm jungle]

Conan's public depiction is still very different

[dusk patrol]

He’s fun

Him and Red Sonya

[loud crag]

Robert e Howard was a damn master

[dusk patrol]

Who coincidentally Abnett writes a lot for

I’m shocked

[rose thorn]

Holy fuck the Conan audio book collection is a dollar

[winged jacinth]

this is a channel inhabited almost entirely by people who read 40k books we're disproportionately likely to know what classic fantasy and scifi are lol

[dire apex]

I’ve done light reading about the author, I know he was in the navy, was once communist, became anti communist, and then changed political stances a lot over time and his books reflect the different political ideas he was trying to reason out at the time he wrote them

[dusk patrol]

Abnett writing a comic about a hot red head fighter girl

[loud crag]

Abnett is basically writing Robert e Howard prose in 40k

[dusk patrol]

Who could have predicted this

[loud crag]

That is literally his style

[dire apex]

Don’t remember anything egregious about Heinlen

[storm jungle]

its a pretty good drink

[dire apex]

Shut

[winged jacinth]

most of heinlen's later works are about thinly veiled fetishes lol

[loud crag]

Ok I got a joke for all of you guys

[fossil vale]

so moorcock went back in time to write elric's depiction based off an arnie film

[winged jacinth]

"dying rich guy with hot secretary" etc

[loud crag]

Ready

CS GOTO

[winged jacinth]

yeah yeah

[dire apex]

Old man writing smut isn’t the worst retirement tbh

[crystal forum]

the guy hated communism to an extreme degree and he genuinely believed in the militarism of the books being necessary. He also believed in moral decline of society and all that 50's shit

[loud crag]

Who wouldn’t hate communism

[winged jacinth]

quick question what do you think of the imperium

[storm jungle]

Its the same reason why the movie director Veerhoven tried reading the book, barely made it through the cringe, took cliffnotes, and did his own thing.

[crystal forum]

that's not what i meant. he hated everything he perceived as communist like rock music and shit

[loud crag]

It’s necessary

[storm jungle]

no

its not

[loud crag]

Yes, it is otherwise humanity would just completely die

[storm jungle]

It'd be better off dead

[winged jacinth]

works every time

[green loom]

I wonder who caused that to happen

[crystal forum]

because you know, in the 50's communism meant anything that wasn't approved by the american government

[loud crag]

I don’t understand

[forest orbit]

the Imperium is bad, and I say this as the black templar fan

they are space nazis lol

[green loom]

Incredibly self destructive space nazis!

[loud crag]

The imperium is about as bad as anybody they’re the baseline characters

[forest orbit]

they are monsters

[arctic talon]

McCarthy

[forest orbit]

unnecessary ones

[winged jacinth]

there were other human orders that could have won out over the imperium and resisted chaos

[loud crag]

So are the literal demons that they fight most of the time

[winged jacinth]

the emperor stamped them out

[outer wave]

Yes, otherwise we wouldnt have a rotted carcass of an empire with corrupt individuals throwing in human waves at the 1% of xenos they couldnt kill after murdering everything else (that mind you, could have been peaceful and/or cooperative).

[forest orbit]

The greatest monster in fiction will always be humans

[loud crag]

What about the demons?

[green loom]

Daemons they perpetuate

[forest orbit]

Who do you think feeds them

[loud crag]

Or the elves that fucked the God into existence

[forest orbit]

and?

the Imperium provides chaos with its greatest champions

lol

[green loom]

Most of those elves are dead

[loud crag]

Eldar made GODS OF CHAOS

[forest orbit]

also yeah the eldar that were aware of what was happening are the ones we got now that left

no?

[green loom]

And like, Imperial High Society literally does the same thing

[forest orbit]

Just Slaanesh lol

also the Imperium feeds the chaos gods more

than any faction in the setting

[loud crag]

I mean what about all the other races

[forest orbit]

What other races

[loud crag]

Like the ones that live in the eye of terror

[forest orbit]

you do realise humanity is the most numerous one there is right

[outer wave]

They made ONE god, which isnt great, but the Imperium is still feeding into chaos simply because of the hellish conditions they put the common man through

[green loom]

The tau and their compadres do fine without being th eimperium

[forest orbit]

theres a reason uh

tau dont have abundances of genestealer or chaos cults

i wonder why

lol

[arctic talon]

Eugenics

[green loom]

Well beyond hardcore genetic screening

[loud crag]

Tau are just as bad

[forest orbit]

not really

[loud crag]

They’re just nicer about it

[forest orbit]

the Imperium is worse

[outer wave]

^

[arctic talon]

The tau are less bad then the imperium

[forest orbit]

tau are bad but nowhere near lol

[arctic talon]

They’re still evil as shit

Just

Not as evil

[green loom]

No Tau are like, normal bad, and they even bother with PR

[crystal forum]

tau get special protection from GW

[outer wave]

They got a caste system and probably will treat you like second class citizens, but they actually will treat you like citizens and people

And not like cattle

[loud crag]

The imperium is humans i’ll always be on the side of humanity, even if my favorite faction is Orks

[arctic talon]

I mean yeah but I like humanity in 40K bcs of how evil they are

[loud crag]

The orks are at least having fun

[crystal forum]

nobody's forcing you to pick a side

[green loom]

The Imperium is one of the main enemies of humanity

[forest orbit]

the Imperium has literal death camps

and genetic purity messages

[arctic talon]

Also the imperium looks cool as shit

[forest orbit]

and the purging of "undesirables"

[arctic talon]

Even if its

The imperium

[loud crag]

I mean, when people are trying to play Gotchu moments and stuff I really think that’s what somebody is saying

[forest orbit]

speaking as a jewish person i dont exactly like that lol

[crystal forum]

in fact picking a side in 40k is pointless. no faction will ever win as long as GW keeps making money

[loud crag]

Im Jewish too what’s your point

[dusk patrol]

They have the best funni space men so I like em

[forest orbit]

That you shouldnt be a traitor and preach for literal space nazis lol

[loud crag]

They’re not real

[green loom]

It's not like I don't like the imperium

[loud crag]

None of this is real

[forest orbit]

They are a cautionary tale

[dire apex]

That’s just being a boomer, can’t blame him for that. But his hatred of the actual political ideology can from his concern for individual rights and him probably cringing at his younger days. The st book is largely a discussion of the necessity for commitment and personal responsibility in a democratic system. He predicted that if people become apathetic about their country, government, voting habits etc. then America would decline. He worked under the assumption that military strength and capacity for violence is a necessity to maintain the right to exist in a cruel world where evil people can and will take your life for their own gains, which is a philosophical perspective you can argue with but isn’t fascist.

[winged jacinth]

rogue trader dogmatic choices are so insanely funny

[forest orbit]

the Imperium of man is s satire

[loud crag]

No, it’s not

[green loom]

Yes

[forest orbit]

this is GW's statement

read

lol

[loud crag]

I don’t care what they said

[forest orbit]

they made the setting

their word is final

[loud crag]

I have my own opinion

[forest orbit]

yours is not lol

[dusk patrol]

I like it when they hit their sword on another dude and then yell and then go blam and then it hits the other guy they’re fighting and the guy goes kabloooee

[outer wave]

Bruh

[green loom]

The notorious Rogue Intern

[crisp heath]

I'm genuinely so relieved I live in a pretty peaceful period of history because I keep falling for Imperial propaganda and it's not even a real country

[arctic talon]

Real

[dusk patrol]

Or when they go pew pew pew

[coarse pumice]

technically, any living Eldar are the ones specifically who didn't do this

[loud crag]

Dude, you are taking a fictional setting way too seriously and this is coming from a guy who just argued about a naming convention

[dusk patrol]

And then the other guys go blam blam blam blam

[arctic talon]

Well rakarth

Might be from that era lol

[forest orbit]

I mean you are the one ignoring literal statements from the people that make the lore lol

[dusk patrol]

Lies

[arctic talon]

Is he not literally older then dirt

[loud crag]

I don’t really care

[dusk patrol]

Rakarth never got laid

[forest orbit]

You seem to lol

[arctic talon]

LOL

[outer wave]

Oh man

[loud crag]

You just wanna purge me as a heretic it seems

[forest orbit]

Fascists are fascists no matter the setting

[loud crag]

I mean, you are a black Templar fan. Of course you want to eliminate anyone who thinks differently than you.

[dusk patrol]

I want to purge all of your butts ngl

With my foot

[forest orbit]

I can like a faction without defending its ideals

lol

Im not being a weird apologist rn

[loud crag]

I’m just saying you’re acting pretty close minded

[forest orbit]

I mean when its defending the Imperium yes

[loud crag]

You embodied all the ideas that you’re claiming the imperium has

[forest orbit]

its not a faction you are suppose to stand up lol

[outer wave]

"Erm you're being very close minded, you should like the Imperium as much as ME."

[loud crag]

This is just kinda sad lol

[crisp heath]

I like whichever faction makes my mom worried about me the mosy

[storm jungle]

Yeah no offense I ran this through the Fatshark people here once to be sure, what GW said goes, do not do Imperial Apologism here especially following the words of the actual company to back it up

last warning, drop the subject and stop being a fascist defender

[loud crag]

lol ok commissar

[forest orbit]

inb4 the most dumb reply 💀

[winged jacinth]

its actually good when the imperium exterminates every sapient alien they encounter

[fossil vale]

its all the necrons fault anyway

[outer wave]

Yeah it was pretty dumb

[winged jacinth]

one of them might turn evil when they get wet like gremlins

[dusk patrol]

https://tenor.com/view/eyebrows-wink-gif-5753057

[outer wave]

Guys its the writers' fault, they wrote the setting!

The setting where I have to like the bad guys!

[forest orbit]

Bro I LOVE dying as a slave in a factory

[arctic talon]

What is wrong with her boobs

[outer wave]

Bro I love LOVE being lobotomized

[dusk patrol]

Not a damn thing

[loud crag]

I really don’t see why I gotta comply or be purged

[dusk patrol]

They’re perfect

[outer wave]

Then being turned into a fridge

[arctic talon]

Actually I guess it’s boobplate

[loud crag]

I don’t apologize for anything I said

[dusk patrol]

Could be a dude also smh

[forest orbit]

You can just leave, nobody here agrees with you

[winged jacinth]

there is literally no way to use computers and machines safely it's been proven time and again

[arctic talon]

True

[coarse pumice]

it's needed to hold enough breath for shouting waaaaagh

[loud crag]

Why would I leave because nobody agrees with me

[forest orbit]

because you are being weird

[outer wave]

Its because people typically look at the Imperium and unironically go "Wow, thats how we should run the real world!"

[forest orbit]

^

[loud crag]

I don’t think that’s how the real world should work

[coarse pumice]

goes back time and treads on some ants in Nottingham...
The timeline:

[loud crag]

Not by a longshot

But I can see necessity in the setting

[fossil vale]

i love putting words in people's mouths

[forest orbit]

theres no necessity lol

[outer wave]

Oh I like the 90's look!

[crisp heath]

a legends of the galactic heroes esque 40k anime would be sick

[loud crag]

I like the guard I like the space Marines

[crisp heath]

somebody get me a time machine!

[loud crag]

I think that the emperor had a good idea

[forest orbit]

Literally killing everyone that didnt agree with him?

humans included?

[crisp heath]

Legend of Galactic Heroes moment

[winged jacinth]

bro even the emperor starts going "uh oh" by the heresy lol

[outer wave]

Literally stomping down all religions?

[loud crag]

In that universe it was a plan

[forest orbit]

you do realise the Emperor is a literal incel right

[fossil vale]

literally trying to starve chaos out?

[forest orbit]

and failing?

[loud crag]

What the fuck?

[forest orbit]

horribly?

[coarse pumice]

to be fair, you could regard the entire HH series as character assassination for the Emporor, all the primarchs and anyone else involved

[outer wave]

True

[loud crag]

What does that have to do with anything?

[forest orbit]

You are defending a guy that was literal waging a galactic genocide to make people comply to his idea, if you resisted you died, and it ended up with him as a literal skeleton on a throne lol

[fossil vale]

imagine how boring wh40k would be if the main premise of the setting was "and everything worked out fine, the end"

[forest orbit]

More like get the message dingus

[loud crag]

I mean when he reconquered earth, wasn’t it already genociding each other

[crisp heath]

part of what makes the setting truly grimdark is the tragedy of it all, just how avoidable so much of it is

[forest orbit]

wha-

[forest orbit]

This lol

[outer wave]

I think he's referring to Techno Barbarians

[forest orbit]

im not saying "oh i wish 40k never happened"

[loud crag]

Yeah, he made the thunder warriors

[forest orbit]

And massacred them

rip

[loud crag]

Yeah, they were no longer necessary

[forest orbit]

Yeah

[loud crag]

They had to go

[forest orbit]

like all his helpers in the future

its like its poetry, it rhymes

[outer wave]

That's a fucked way of looking at things

But tbf they were unstable at some point

[loud crag]

Yeah, the universe is pretty fucked up

[forest orbit]

So?

its still a cautionary tale

GW said so

why are you ignoring this so much lol

"I dont like it"

[loud crag]

lol that’s why it’s good to read

You can’t take that out

[forest orbit]

they arent?

[loud crag]

But if you stand back and look at it objectively

[forest orbit]

they are just saying dont be a nazi lol

[loud crag]

The imperium of man is the last hope of humanity

[winged jacinth]

its important to remember that humanity didnt fall to chaos before the imperium

[forest orbit]

by murdering billions of their own citizens daily

right

[loud crag]

In the setting, as of now, the imperium is the only hope

[winged jacinth]

not the men of gold or the collective successor states

[loud crag]

I am just looking at it from a perspective of the lore

[forest orbit]

And by the lore perspective the Imperium is bad

[loud crag]

I am not agreeing with it because to do it in real life would be insane

[outer wave]

Which they put themselves into that corner in the first place, when they could've had other options 20K years beforehand

[forest orbit]

like, why is this so hard to get

[loud crag]

But overall, if I had to pick a faction to Support in this series, it would be the imperial

[winged jacinth]

from one point of view humanity is only under threat from chaos BECAUSE of the imperium

[forest orbit]

Why is there so many hostile aliens?

Oh right we killed all the peaceful ones lol

[mild rapids]

I think Vect is too

[arctic talon]

Vect says he is

[loud crag]

lol let the ambles inherent the galaxy

[arctic talon]

Rakarth might actually be older then dirt

Ambulls?

[winged jacinth]

i kinda suspect vect is lying because, y'know

vect is vect

[arctic talon]

He’s vect?

Yeah

[loud crag]

Be like ambul

[storm jungle]

Man I'm tired of reading this shit

[forest orbit]

OFF HE GOES

[outer wave]

He's still here methinks

[winged jacinth]

theres literally pronouns in her username lol

[outer wave]

She excuse me

[forest orbit]

Whoops

[outer wave]

Wait no Rocket had no pronouns

I was referring to Rocket

[winged jacinth]

oh i thought you meant dilara who just anouncer her exit whoops

[forest orbit]

I kinda had a suspicision the moment they started their weird arguments 💀

[outer wave]

No no I know Dilara is a womon

[storm jungle]

Beaned em regardless so

because I know the moment I pop up again this chat is gonna turn into a warzone

[fossil vale]

[storm jungle]

@winged jacinth also good job on asking the bait question

[outer wave]

What a weird argument

[winged jacinth]

that person was not going to be a positive contributor to the conversation lmao

[winged jacinth]

its easy every time

[forest orbit]

I mean yeah even before that they were being weird

[mild rapids]

In the grimdarkness of a 40k lore chat, there is only war >_>

[winged jacinth]

you get the bad vibes and you set the trap

[outer wave]

Im just wondering now: where's the line where saying you'd want to side with the Imperium is okay, and where is it that it goes too far?

[crisp heath]

anyone that invested in apologia for a fictional evil empire is probably going to be a bit problematic

[storm jungle]

^

Basically you can like the Imperium

[crystal forum]

you forget the whole concept of only military members having any political rights in his book. the story isn't lamenting about a future where a bad outcome happens due to the problems he identifies in modern society, it's about his own sort of utopia where actions were taken to make the world better. his version of a better world is one where you can't say anything about the government until you've suffered for it, until you've learnt how to be a soldier. This is how he believes the world should function.

To this day there's no solid consensus on whether he was a fascist, especially with how difficult it can be to attribute that term to people when they're not explicitly stating their beliefs. It is agreed though that the book heavily promotes militarism which is what i should have said earlier. My point is that Robert truly believed in what he wrote about unlike 40k.

[storm jungle]

just dont be an actual fascist about it

Eli is a good example

he literally has a black templar pfp and name but is a swell person lol

[outer wave]

Funny thing is that he said he was Jewish too so

[forest orbit]

Yeah man you wont see me defending the BTs lol

[outer wave]

What a twist

[outer wave]

Very fair

[crisp heath]

i love the blood angels, therefore i must defend the ethics of drinking the blood of my enemies (and my allies in a lot of cases)

[storm jungle]

Yeah I'm not gonna ban you because you like them, now that would be literally 1984

[winged jacinth]

not to get political but not so much anymore depending where they're from!

[outer wave]

Give me your best defense for cannibalism NOW

[dusk patrol]

We can discuss something fresh and new instead like lasgun recoil or 40k tank design

[shadow plover]

the worst thing about these people is that instances like this when they experience slight push back about their way of thinking it just reinforces their toxic views but better this than suffering the bad takes in bad faith

[crisp heath]

brain yummee 😋🧠

[storm jungle]

LET ME OUT

[dire apex]

It’s not just military members, any form of public service earns citizenship. Military only was a verhoeven detail. And you have rights no matter what, enfranchisement is what you have to earn.

[forest orbit]

Yeah but the issue is theres so many of them that it just doesnt matter

I literally showed them what GW said

and the response was "lol i cant read"

[mild rapids]

40k aircraft design is arguably worse than the tank design

[outer wave]

I thought they just straight up said, "I dont care"

[mild rapids]

Aerodynamics? Wut is dis

[arctic talon]

Thrust™️

[crisp heath]

and that's what makes it so great

[winged jacinth]

40k aircraft design is actively a joke i think

im pretty sure the model makers just tried to think of the funniest things they could

[outer wave]

Guys lets talk of actual topics like when GW will make 40k naval combat a thing

[crystal forum]

that is still militarism. i dont want to take a side for or against it, im just stating he wrote about it and believed in it

[crisp heath]

this thing probably couldn't even taxi properly, but damned if it doesn't look neat right?

[winged jacinth]

there are navies in 40k but they dont really make a lot of sense?

naval combat barely makes sense irl

[outer wave]

Not space navy, I mean actual ships in the water kinda navy

[winged jacinth]

yeah

[outer wave]

GIVE ME BOATS

[crisp heath]

maritime stuff is prominent on a lot of planets iirc, in the eisenhorn books the hives of thracian primaris are connected via maritime commerce

[winged jacinth]

the moebian 21st from darktide are a marine regiment

[fossil vale]

so close to having a clue to the irony

[winged jacinth]

i cant imagine a situation where you can have a warships exist without total space superiority

a battleship cant hide from or avoid a lance strike

[dire apex]

I think maritime navies are reasonable enough, there’s not always going to be a fleet in orbit and you need to be able to control the surface, so they would essentially fill the role that tanks do on solid ground

[crisp heath]

are the moebisn regiments recruited from across the domain, or exclusively atoma? ik the sixth are drawn primarily from atoma

[winged jacinth]

the whole domain

afaik

[green loom]

It's from across the domain yeah

Same idea as the Ultramar Auxilia

[winged jacinth]

i like the idea of orbital drop submarines

[crisp heath]

also, what's the deal with the moebian shrineguard? would that be a violation of the decree passive since it's guard raised from a world controlled by the ministorum?

[winged jacinth]

i havent heard that term

i imagine that despite their origin they're in the astra militarum chain of command

[crisp heath]

it's mentioned in one of the zealot background options if you pick messalina gloriana as your homeworld

[green loom]

I don't think they're guard

They're just as the name suggests

Militia that protect shrines

[winged jacinth]

oh yeah they might be local security

[crisp heath]

ah

[crystal forum]

yeah you cant have sisters of battle on every single shrine

[green loom]

Also the name Shrineguard goes really hard nglk

[winged jacinth]

yeah its sick

[gray umbra]

Lol did i miss the drama

[crystal forum]

i like to think the shrineguard act like honor guards IRL

like the soldiers who protect the tomb of the unknown soldier

[crisp heath]

oh ik it's such a sick idea, i decked out my zealot to look like one of them

i also really wish they had cross-operative cosmetics for the non ogryn ones, i want that vanguard zealot top for my veteran so bad

[dire apex]

Also the decree isn’t violated as long as the force isn’t significant enough, that’s why Crusaders are allowed

[crystal forum]

a lot of the power the ecclesiarchy has seems to be a result of them being given such massive leeway with how they operate

[crisp heath]

So once the necrons all wake up and hit the griddy on the corpse gods throne what do they do to human worlds that surrender to them? Vassals and tributaries? Or do they get wiped out like a pest

[primal kettle]

All planets in the imperium need to give a certain amount of Guardsmen and those guardsmen are controlled by the departmento munitorum

IIRC only a select few planets are given an exemption

Like Macragge doesnt have to raise guardsmen since its the homeworld of the Ultramarines

[coarse pumice]

do Heinrix and Yrilet have any funny interactions?

[gray umbra]

funny in a haha way or funny in a im gonna purge you way

[coarse pumice]

haha funny

I mean both can be

[storm jungle]

Yes.

a lot actually

both dialogue interjections and in-gameplay message popups as they talk to each other

[coarse pumice]

I want to use too many characters

[gray umbra]

isn't the whole formation of the SoB based on the line "men shall not take up arms" or something

[storm jungle]

yeah it is

[gray umbra]

love it

[arctic talon]

Yirlet has fun interactions with everyone tbh

[gray umbra]

i like it when she calls me monke

[crystal forum]

no it's the legally distinct term "monkeigh"

[arctic talon]

They usually try to make it sound not like monkey

But lol

Not in this game

[storm jungle]

Yeah its usually ending in "kai"

the "monkey" bit really takes me out of the game

LOL

[sacred ginkgo]

I think mon-keigh is also supposed to be used for every other "inferior" race

its just funnier for humans

[arctic talon]

its for any race the Eldar find very violent and aggressive

[sacred ginkgo]

so every other 40k race

[arctic talon]

Mhm

except the necrons

[sacred ginkgo]

well they probably have their own slur for necrons

[arctic talon]

prolly

considering their shared history lol

[wind heron]

Enslavement and mass experiment thralls

Like before

But I don't fear a race that lost to the Eldar

[arctic talon]

holy based

[green loom]

Can anyone outside Yrilet/marazhai use Drukhari weapons

[arctic talon]

also they didn't really lose tbf

[coarse pumice]

Jae

[arctic talon]

You can take a perk also jae

[green loom]

Can I use that perk on everyone

[mild rapids]

Yes and no. SoB were allowed to stick around because they killed Goge Vandire.

[green loom]

I love the loading screen getting stuck

[mild rapids]

The no men at arms is to stop the church having too massive an army

[coarse pumice]

Is bounty hunter yrilet ok?

If I make another assassin that’ll be literally half my characters

[sacred ginkgo]

she plays better as a bounty hunter yes

stationary suits her

[velvet imp]

Sorry for late reply, I went to work right after I made my last comment....

That aside, ya Chapter 3 feels like a intentional Gatekeeping Stage of the Main Storyline by a DM who really wants you to quit the game at this point or to artificially make the last half of the game harder than it is by debuffing and prevent you access to certain characters because you did not micromanage and "save scum" during this moment to remove all the drawbacks.

Though fortunately I did learn we do get enough "parts" to trade so we can remove all debuffs and still get Ulfar

[arctic talon]

She's better as bounty hunter tbh

[velvet imp]

the down side is that they require specific tasks done and 2 require decent Medicae stats to obtain

Abe's debuff can only be removed if we fight and defeat that hard option boss which is annoying since it is made to literally one or two shot each party member

emphasising that experience of a DM wanting to really screw over the players who are playing the table top RPG

atleast 2 companions won't have issues in this part since they reunite just fine in chapter 3 without any negative debuffs you have to work to remove being ||Argenta and Idira||. Strongly recommend to bring them both because they do not suffer any debuffs and because a very IMPORTANT main story event only happens when ||Argenta|| is there in Chapter 3 and ||Idira|| will have things to say in it with ||Abe|| since this is about the Truth involving Theodora's death. Without her there, you will not see this Main Story event and the Rogue Trader will continue to assume Kunrad killed Theodora.

[arctic talon]

tbf ||she's also got a fcking autopistol in her inventory when you meet her||

its literally chekov's gun

[velvet imp]

||Cassia and Heinrix|| on the other hand will cripple your journey in chapter 3 a bit since you cannot save them until after you complete all arena fights and deal with the mad doctor but I heard you can save 1 first in advance if you bring them both.

[velvet imp]

ya there is a lot of hints to this if you play a character with high perception stats and awareness stats as well through chapter 1

I still feel the developers really wanted to screw over players who like having Pascal in their team for Chapter 3. His debuff is not a issue since most of the time he is never in the frontlines. It is how to get him back that majority of players from what I seen agree is really jerk move. Players can only get Pascal back if ||your character can pass a persuasion check dialogue option and anything else will always have him die. Thus permanently killing him off from this point in the game||

though players are rewarded taking this risk to bring Pascal into Chapter 3 because there is a special event exclusive for him if he lives in Chapter 3 which will give the Rogue Trader a new special pet if they want it as a pet.

[rose thorn]

Dark tide makes me wanna make my chaos cult gang for necromubda

But I. Have so much shit to make already lol

[storm jungle]

you should check out some of Miguel's concept art if you want even more inspiration

[rose thorn]

I porbbalug will!!!

I really want the uh, cultist hq

[green loom]

The cult demagogue?

[rose thorn]

I think those are my favorite models in 40k

The dark circle

Or dark coven

[green loom]

With the fancy spiky dudes right

[rose thorn]

Wtf I can’t remember

[green loom]

And the lady with boots

[rose thorn]

Yea the dark commune

https://www.sunwardhobbies.ca/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Warhammer-Chaos-Space-Marines-Dark-Commune-43-87.webp

I love these guys so much

This, the cultist box from black stone, the normal cultist box, and the mutants and you got basically infinite possibilities for nevrkmubda

I just need a cult name

[green loom]

What god

[rose thorn]

I wish there was undivided

OH YEAH JACKALS TOO

I hope world eaters get more cultists

[green loom]

Isn't that undivided

[rose thorn]

Necromunda doenst have undivided rules

[green loom]

Ahhh

[rose thorn]

i have no clue why it doesnt have undivided rules

maybe if it affecetd post game it would be neat

or pregame

[hallow basin]

So, I have this idea of learning the rules and DMing Rogue Trader for a bunch of my buddies. But there is one guy among them who I know will want to be the trader (no bad blood here, he likes to be in position of command in ttrpgs and other people are cool with it), and he really likes to play it very safe. Which, in this case, means that he'll try to sit on a ship as much as possible in order to minimize the possibility of harm to him.

And that leads me to a question regarding lore: how much do Rogue Traders have to take part in active action? I mean, I can imagine a bunch of ways, but I'm reading through Forsaken Bounty campaign, and during the part where the group has to board the abandoned ship they don't go into why a Rogue Trader would go in there himself and not just send his people to investigate. Would there be any tangible reason as to why they would want to lead the expedition themselves? Or is it just the "you play a cooperative game, so you gotta take a part in the action" thing?

[green loom]

Wanderlust

Being bored

Enjoying being involved

Rogue traders do whatever they want lol

[arctic talon]

ngl why do they look like friends here

Most rogue traders are also quite eccentric

or want to like

[civic vigil]

Noob question. If Tyranids are outside our galaxy, have soooo many DNA and stuff that new blight, diesese from Nurgle can be contradicted...Doesn't that mean that through outside ou galaxy not much inteligent life existed ? Why is Chaos Bound just to our galaxy it seems. Wondering...

[arctic talon]

get their hands dirty if its important

[arctic talon]

unknown

[green loom]

Yeah it's just

We dunno

[arctic talon]

we never got an answer to this excluding Ian Watsons ancient ass book that is explicitly non canon

which has some ossified xenos corpse aboard a nid ship in some sort of weird power armor

[arctic talon]

Also they might fear their underlings stealing stuff/hiding things

[hallow basin]

I see. That would be a good reason lel. Thank you for your responses, guys, I really appreciate it

[arctic talon]

👍

good luck

[green loom]

Like in the new CRPG you do everything and you're the trader so it's not like it's weird

[civic vigil]

Hmmm... I'm wondering, if their losing now more than they win - Argument for how and why they are considered worst threat - They lose, they wait to see how for example much improvment can be done by humanity regarding biomancy and genetic play? makes sense to me if we consider Hive mind being really smart

[arctic talon]

They're the worst threat because they completely destroy planets and they never stop coming

[green loom]

Yeah

You knock a hive fleet out, it splinters, and you're stuck combating the remnants for a long time

They're coming from everything, they don't run out of bodies either

Say you sacrifice an army to stall for time
They've lost nothing fighting them, no matter how many they kill

[arctic talon]

Also yeah

The imperium cannot win a war of attrition

[civic vigil]

Yeah, i just wonder if at the end of the day it's a tactic, force enemy to develop new genetics, weapons, tactics to know even more, as exactly - it costs them ussualy nothing

[arctic talon]

No

They just want to eat everything

The hive mind is pretty animalistic as a whole

[civic vigil]

So the change in tactics/development of new units for certain war is like an ogranism reaction to infection ?

[arctic talon]

yes

The prey is fighting back in a new way

[green loom]

Oh I just found ||The genestealers||

[arctic talon]

therfore adapt to it

[robust zephyr]

So I'm painting flesh tearers and I have a lore question about their helmets

I know for standard blood angels, the sergants have yellow helmets, but do flesh tearers follow the same comventions?

Or are all their helmets black no matter what

[arctic talon]

Always black

They don't follow the usual rules blood angels do for helmets

Which is Red == battleline, blue == fire support, yellow == cqb, gold == veteran excluding terminators

[robust zephyr]

Okay cool, it's my first foray into flesh tearers so I don't know much about em. I just finished mephiston book 1 and dante and am about to read devastation of baal which I've heard references them alot

I've heard they have a few dedicated books which are..less than stellar

[arctic talon]

There's one thats like

decent iirc

but the flesh tearers are like

pretty devoid of rank marking

they do follow the same company color stuff as blood angels I think?

[robust zephyr]

Although this is how I made My sergant...before I chose flesh tearers

I feel like he looks a bit too "proper"

Thoughts?

[green loom]

Doesn't matter

He's still a blood angel

[robust zephyr]

I used some of the upgrade sprue shoulders

[arctic talon]

nah

Flesh Tearers can look very fancy

[green loom]

A Flesh Tearer with a little more style is still a flesh tearer

[robust zephyr]

I'm very much looking forward to painting them

Ordered some decals and everything

[green loom]

My scheme looks like Flesh Tearers

Lemme grab a pic

[robust zephyr]

And this may be a painting question but I'll ask it here, if I want to do some chipping damage on the black parts what do you think would look better? Silver chipping or a dark red

[robust zephyr]

Oh that's clean

[arctic talon]

Probably silver?

so it looks like exposed metal

[green loom]

Silver yeah

[robust zephyr]

Gotcha, I'll probably do a more subtle chipping with silver than I would with red

Little goes a long way

Well I'm gonna go read devastation of baal, got high hopes for this one

[arctic talon]

Devestation of baal good

also has one of few rare Tyranid PoVs

[rose thorn]

it hink its the fact htey have the same lighting making htem look like they are vibing together, im still pissed about the leagues of votaan box having 2 different

lightings happening at the same time

[civic vigil]

So are Tyranids the ultimate enemy of Chaos ? Destroying the source of emotion ?

[green loom]

Best way to look at it