40k-lore-chat

[rocky gale]

Yea

[vale fjord]

That's neat

[warm notch]

god please let this be real

[celest dome]

They've already have made such a weapon kit, it's not an impossible one

[shadow plover]

Yeah Titus is demoted from Captain to Lieutenant and has crossed the Rubicon to become a Primaris marine, all can be seen from his armour

[vale fjord]

I cant tell the difference aeuyh

[rocky gale]

I think he was actually demoted to a standard Marine, he had to earn his way back up to being a Lieutenant

If I remember rightly

[warm notch]

I understand the game logic of different MKs of weapons having different movesets and different properties

But it’s still kinda silly in-universe

“I can’t swing my weapon a certain way unless I have a different MK” lol

[celest dome]

It's gameplay, like unless they make directional hits (How Chivalry/Mordhau) it's not really feasible to do it anyway else

[dusk patrol]

Most of the Dual wielded weapons in VT2 were added later so there’s still a lot of time

Iirc only the dual slayer axes were base game

And Kers weapons

But she’s an elgi so we ignore her

[warm notch]

Oh I know

It’s still silly if you try to think about it too hard

[warm notch]

Fr? That’s cool

[celest dome]

It's just game limitation

[warm notch]

What are the lore ramifications of Veterans being able to shit out a grenade every minute

Like why hasn’t the imperium won more wars?

Are they stupid?

They have soldiers that have an unlimited supply of grenades

[tulip brook]

they win every war they are in. xenos are stupid and cowards imperium just can't find more wars

forget endless supply of grenades. imperium has saints who can scorch enemies with just their looks

they have tanks so powerful you can hear the enemies' dying woes when they fire their cannons

blessed war engines bigger than mountains

[warm notch]

And cancer grenades

Don’t forget cancer grenades

[crisp heath]

Question. Aside from crazy stuff like the Eldar's star popper thing, what're some of the single most powerful weapons in 40k and why?

[tulip brook]

thank you for listening adeptus administratum daily broadcast, emperor protects.

[celest dome]

All of them are Necron stuff

[warm notch]

the indomitable will of humanity

[crisp heath]

Figures, but just wondering. Maybe by race? What are some of each races most powerful stuff

[celest dome]

Necron it's the Celestial Orrery

[crisp heath]

Oh shit, that was necron lolol, I said eldar earlier

[celest dome]

Imperium it might be the Throne itself

[crisp heath]

My bad

[celest dome]

Eldar have those mirror that are connected to the heart of a star iirc

[crisp heath]

If leutin's correct, the Eldar gods may have been weapons

That's also something I have a question about

If the Eldar were made by the Old Ones, and we know that for sure, wouldn't the old ones have been their gods? But we know theyre not. As warp proficient as the Eldar are said to be, especially back then, supposedly only a few short steps below old ones, wouldn't they recognize warp manifestations as just that, even create and use them for purposes? The more I think about it, the more I just don't understand them worshiping other beings...

[celest dome]

I mean, nothing is certain that the Eldar God were created at that time, or that they were created as God, they could instead be some sort of Primarch Eldar that were made to lead the Eldar in the War in Haeven

[crisp heath]

I mean, it is certain they were created at that time. They warred against the necron's C'tan. At least, that's what I thought. My personal thought was they were birthed similar to the Tau's god. Just that the Eldar, being as powerful as they were, created a whole pantheon where the tau only made one. I firmly believe they were warp entities, hell nurgle supposedly has one imprisoned. But I don't see the Eldar truly worshipping them. It doesn't sit right with me, because the Eldar should have known it was them that created their "gods". The Old Ones seem far more fit for worship. It just sits odd with me that they worship what's likely their creation and not ther creators.

[celest dome]

Tau didn't make a God themselves, it was their allied xenos that did

[crisp heath]

You get my point

That is true, but still

I meant the "Tau" more as the collective whole. I know tau are warp innert

I don't think how many gods you get is reflective of psychic powers

Humans have many Gods in the warp, Fenris alone has like 3 that show up as characters

Idk, you might be right, just how I thought about it, and what made sense to me

[crisp heath]

Is this 40k?

Yeah

I didn't know this... thought anything in the warp was a Daemon till GW called it different. Even Vashtorr isn't really a "god"

Leman Russ gets into a riddle contest with a Fenris God, the Erlking iirc, and they have a death God called Morkai who is a 2 headed wolf that they paint on their armor

The Leviathan novel also has a life goddess but she doesn't show up as a character

Why does this pantheon not show up, like... at all?

I mean Space Wolves talk about them sometimes but it's pretty much under wraps because the Inquisition thinks it borders on heresy iirc

As far as I knew literally the only gods that actually existed for humans was the Wmp and the Chaos gods, and possibly now the taus

Morkai especially shows up as like, a legend in a few places but you know

Because it does... even old world emp didn't like other religions. He damn sure wouldn't start now

[celest dome]

Localised gods, they are Warp being that are attached to the local culture

[crisp heath]

So... not gods at all. Barely even greater daemons. Just good instead of bad

Blackmane was said to possess the ability to raise the dead from their graves with the power of his mournful calls. After the Primarch Leman Russ, the Wolf King of Fenrisian legend, defeated Morkai in battle and tamed the wolf-god, he slew Blackmane and turned the great wolf's pelt into a magical cloak that allowed him to pass without harm through the Gates of Death and return when his people needed him. Morkai now guards those portals, waiting for his master's return.

[celest dome]

Nope all thr Gods have exist and died

[crisp heath]

I mean, they don't sound like much compared to literally any other god in the setting

[celest dome]

Much more powerful than GD, and they do meet the definition of Gods

[crisp heath]

So I'm not putting them beside them for that reason

It seems they barely influence their local area and gave a primarch a riddle once. Every other "diety" influences the entire galaxy.

They are not the same...

[celest dome]

Apart from the Chaos Gods none have done such thouf

[crisp heath]

The Tanith also had their own pantheon but they mostly just treat it like folklore

[dusk patrol]

God is a meaningless term anyways

[crisp heath]

And the machine god exists independently of the Emperor, even though the "official" narrative of the Admech is that he's the physical incarnation of the Omnissiah

[dusk patrol]

It means so many different things

There’s no clear example of what makes something a god and doesn’t in 40k. Which is actually funnily enough discussed in Godblight I believe

[crisp heath]

The Erlking used to be much more powerful, by the time Russ met the Fenrisian Gods they were all severely weakened by the Emperor enforcing atheism

By 40k though the fenrisian gods are all either dead or severely weakened, except maybe Morkai who answers to Russ

Like... until something does something in the universe, it's not really worth mentioning. You could be the strongest fighter ever naturally, but if you never get in a fight, no one will ever know. @dusk patrol and no it's not. It defines a transition from mortality to immortality, and surpassing power meant for mortals. It means breaking limitations. They are capable of influence and power anywhere and can warp reality at its most fundamental levels. So... they died out. Got it. And there are no human gods now. As I understand it? Which has been my main point... that by the time they did anything, they were fairly worthless?

[dusk patrol]

This is literally discussed in universe as something which isn’t clear dude

By Guilliman and an Eldar

What defines “godhood” is not set in stone

[crisp heath]

Except the emperor literally stopped himself from becoming divine...

[dusk patrol]

He stopped himself from ascending to becoming a chaos god

Or a warp entity

[crisp heath]

Difference?

Apparently one of the ganger houses on Necromunda have their own pantheon too

[molten swan]

I would say we do know what makes “gods”(or god-like beings) in 40k (worship empowers them in the warp just like war does for Khorne), I’d arguably call the Emperor a god nowadays in 40k, as well as the chaos gods and even the Tau god who the Tau auxiliaries worshipped and empowered

[dusk patrol]

Because the chaos gods are not the only “gods”

[crisp heath]

But they are

[dusk patrol]

They aren’t

Several Eldar gods still exist

[crisp heath]

The 4 chaos gods aren't even the only chaos gods

Everything that's a God, is a chaos god. Some are good, some are bad. All form from chaos

[dusk patrol]

It’s not

[crisp heath]

They're just the strongest chaos gods

[dusk patrol]

Warp entities tend to be gods but

Even like C’tan are often called gods

[crisp heath]

C'tan are gods, but not warp entities

Literally anything in the warp forms from chaos...

[molten swan]

Ctan are godlike as well

[dusk patrol]

God is just a title people give to things

[crisp heath]

They might be the literal only exception

There's non-chaos factions in the warp

[molten swan]

But they aren’t empowered through worship like warp beings

[dusk patrol]

It doesn’t meant anything really beyond what they give to it

[crisp heath]

The enslavers are warp entities but not chaos, and there are deformed eldar still alive in the warp who are twisted but not chaos-aligned

[dusk patrol]

They’re all warp entities typically but we see some which aren’t

[molten swan]

I wouldn’t really consider the enslavers gods but yea there are numerous warp entities

[crisp heath]

It's all chaos lol, it's all the warp. It's interchangeable. They may be anti big four. They may be pro this race or that. But they formed from the chaotic, miasmic power of the warp and belief.

[dusk patrol]

The warp isn’t all chaos

[crisp heath]

They are all chaos in some form

Yes it is

Chaos is only one power in the warp

Chaos was something that was created in the warp by the violence of the war in heaven, other things exist there though

[dusk patrol]

Well I guess you have all the answers so idk why any of us bother reading books

[crisp heath]

That's never been shown@crisp heath

Like I said, the enslavers exist in multiple sources and are explicitly non-chaos warp beings

[dusk patrol]

The warp literally existed before the chaos gods

[crisp heath]

Eldar gods are also not chaos, they're eldar psychic impressions

That's also not necessarily true, as the chaos gods and warp exist outside time

[dusk patrol]

The Watchers in the Dark are warp beings and use the warp and hate chaos

[crisp heath]

Old Ones may still exist in the warp

They all have existed forever, never, and always

[dusk patrol]

Faith magic stuff uses the warp and isn’t chaos

The Emperor is anathema to chaos and he’s a warp being

[crisp heath]

@crisp heath last one was chopped up by slanesh and turned into black orbs

Yeah and there are human souls that can persist in the warp that don't turn to chaos, they're just very rare

There's a lot more in the warp than chaos

[dusk patrol]

I could go on but like I said our actual primary sources don’t matter I guess because someone has watched some Leutin videos or whatever

[crisp heath]

Literally, doesn't matter. They aren't formed of the warp. Things formed from the warp are chaotic by default. How they align then after is arbitrary

Iirc the Hrud also have a non-chaos God in the warp

[dusk patrol]

Ok

Whatever

[crisp heath]

@dusk patrol the emperor literally creates daemons...

I don't know how you can claim the enslavers and eldar gods are related to chaos at all when they're explicitly and repeatedly explained to not be to avoid this kind of confusion

Just because they align to him, doesn't change that

[molten swan]

I think he’s saying the warp is the realm of chaos

Which it is, that doesn’t mean enslavers are chaos aligned though

[crisp heath]

Chaos is just the dominant power in the warp at the moment

[dusk patrol]

Imperial Saints and Legion of the Damned being warp related == them being daemons

Which is the point

They’re explicitly warp related

But not chaos

It’s not complex

[crisp heath]

I'm saying things created by the warp, are always chaotic, no matter their alignment

Celestine probably isn't even a daemon, she's more like a really weird psyker

[dusk patrol]

And you’re wrong

[crisp heath]

@crisp heath celestine ain't the only thing the Emperor's created

[dusk patrol]

Chaos literally calls the emperor and his forces the Anathema

[crisp heath]

Sure. And we know he used their power to make primarchs, so your point?

She is flesh and blood and can survive being cut off from the warp, which a daemon can't, she is just severely weakened because of the whole ressurection thing

Again, she ain't the only thing he's made using the warp. Anybody seen some flaming skull legions?

[dusk patrol]

Well first we don’t know what he really did on Molech, but the point is whatever he does, it isn’t chaos related, explicitly. It does not cause chaos corruption.

[crisp heath]

We have no idea what the legion of the damned are, but the theory being pushed right now is that they aren't even warp entities, just badly mutated space marines

But he does use the warp. Fact. And he has made imperial daemons, fact.

We know they're a warp creation for sure

[dusk patrol]

Yes

Not chaos

[crisp heath]

I don't think there's actually anything we can call an imperial daemon with any kind of confidence

[dusk patrol]

^

[crisp heath]

Chaos, just imperial aligned

[dusk patrol]

Also that

You’re spouting fan theories

With no backing

[crisp heath]

Literally the legion of the damned, but ok 🤷‍♂️

[dusk patrol]

People watch a couple YouTube videos and TikTok’s and think they know every piece of lore

[crisp heath]

Like I said we don't know what they are but it's highly likely they're just space marines hyped up on warp juice

There's a whole book about how one is trapped by the Inquisition

[dusk patrol]

Yes they’re warp beings or connected to it

Not daemons

[crisp heath]

Definitely daemons

[formal kettle]

Hey I have a 40K lore question that's (kind of) about Rogue Trader but is more just a general question and this is the only 40K server I'm in, what's the command-structure difference between an Astra Militarum Commander and a Commissar?

[dusk patrol]

Based off what?

What is your source saying this? Where is this said?

[crisp heath]

Literally that book.

[molten swan]

Commissar is a political officer that can veto the commanders orders if they are wasting men or resources etc

Otherwise the commander is in charge

[crisp heath]

It all but states that the thing in front of them was pure power

[crisp heath]

Commissars are not part of the Militarum, they're political officers who are sent to a special school and then attached to a regiment for morale and punishment reasons

[dusk patrol]

So nothing ok

[crisp heath]

Essentially they aren't soldiers, but they do know how to fight if they have to

[dusk patrol]

“Pure power” doesn’t make something a daemon

[formal kettle]

Right on, I honestly thought they were part of the actual Command Structure. Thanks for the answers friends, God bless.

[crisp heath]

Lol I mean, not everybody needs a Glowing sign saying this is what something is when it's pretty obvious

@dusk patrol excuse me, pure warp power

As in the thing was made out of and consisted of the warp

[dusk patrol]

Yes

[crisp heath]

To the point it was driving them mad

I.e. daemon

Souls are also created in the warp, and exist entirely in the warp, and pull their power from the warp, but they are not chaos or daemons

[dusk patrol]

There’s the fan theory jump

[molten swan]

'What of the Daemon's victims?' cried Duty

“They have already earned their freedom from damnation,' said Celestine with warm certainty. "They are victims of despair no longer, and in death their souls will free to join with the Emperor's light. We must follow them.” I also think this is quite interesting, I personally believe the afterlife exists with the Emperor snatching your soul before the chaos gods munch it in the warp, also, even if the legion of the damned aren’t daemons, there are also the imperial ghosts from Istvaan that the Emperor awakens sometimes

[dusk patrol]

Also I don’t hate the term imperial daemons but they’re explicitly not chaos related, it’s not complex. The warp is not all chaos.

[storm jungle]

The "afterlife" is basically only people the Emperor handpicks, a good 95% of humans just go to the Warp

[crisp heath]

I think he can hold on to specific souls, but most are torn apart by the warp. It's basically a Valhalla situation.

[storm jungle]

yeah the "Emperor protects" is usually just bullshit

[crisp heath]

And their souls are immediately devoured@storm jungle

[storm jungle]

Yes.

[dusk patrol]

Watchers in the Dark are another great example of warp dudes who are anathema to chaos

[molten swan]

We don’t know how many go to the warp or if any are saved, but it would make more sense to me if the Emperor intercepted them before the warp, because that empowers the chaos gods eating human souls

[dusk patrol]

World spirits

[crisp heath]

Watchers are weirder than the warp tbh

[dusk patrol]

Eldar gods

And so on

Countless examples

[crisp heath]

Watchers are like, interdimensional beings that aren't psychic/warp based

[dusk patrol]

Anyways I’m bored and done

[crisp heath]

5d light warriors or something

[dusk patrol]

They are warp based but, their whole deal is weird

The one sure thing is they hate chaos

[dire apex]

Wouldn’t phrase it that way, your average commissar fights better than your average guardsmen because they are pulled from the same trainees as tempestus scions and sisters of battle

[crisp heath]

But again, I think the misunderstanding here is what "Chaos" means. Chaos is the active state of the warp. It consists of everything, good and bad, in constant flux and fed by the tide of emotions from the materium. It's like the primordial base state, the ooze everything's seeped from and back too. And so it has no true alignment. The four major gods, along with mortals, have heavily tainted the warp, but I agree not all of it belongs entirely to them. That said, anything else begot by the warp is still chaotic, as it is not materium born. It's not from physical reality. But it's alignment is more determined by its creation, whether this or that god made it, or if it occurred on its own.

[dusk patrol]

You’re wrong, but that’s ok.

Other news, Rogue Trader is great

The Magos is making me jelly

[crisp heath]

Still can't kiss girls, still not playing

[dusk patrol]

Mfer can hold a heavy weapon and a two handed melee weapon at once

Not fair

[arctic talon]

Tech priest moment

[molten swan]

‘I believe that the Emperor will rise again, but what do you believe? Horusian… Talicto called you that before he died.’
‘The warp is always there, Covenant. We fight it, but we fight ourselves. Its strength is our strength. It cannot be defeated, but it can be mastered. It must be mastered.’
It can’t be her, thought Josef, and in his mind he saw Idris as she had been in those earlier times. So clever, so sharp, so focused…
‘Impossible, foolish, vile,’ said Covenant.
‘Argento didn’t think so… and neither did you. What is the Emperor’s power, but the warp given shape and purpose? The miracles of saints and the dreams of a divine saviour, they are just a strand of the warp’s potential. All saints are witches, Covenant. All angels are daemons.’ (This also tracks for me, we can also see that on Cadia when Celestine was fighting Kharn and they activated the anti warp pylons from the necrons, Celestine was extremely weakened)

[dusk patrol]

And he can detonate vehicles and shit, fucks up other cybernetic dudes

[crisp heath]

Thank you... I'm not necessarily trying to convince anyone, just feel like anytime I say any sort of out there idea or throw logic at anything, I get shit on. I appreciate you.

[dusk patrol]

Makes me wonder how the Ranger and Space Wolf are gonna be unique

[molten swan]

No problem gamer

“The massive kinetic strike destroyed what remained of the world's defences, ensuring its envelopment by the now rapidly-expanding Eye of Terror. Perhaps the only positive outcome was that the destruction of the pylons also restored Celestine's own strength and vitality as her connection with the Empyrean was re-established”

[crisp heath]

If something walks like a duck and quackes like a duck... I'm not gonna call it a goose.

[molten swan]

It entirely tracks to me that imperial saints are “imperial daemons”, perhaps cut off from the rest of the warp by the Emperor, who knows (like hey, stay on this pure side wheres it’s all light and sunshine, don’t go over to the realm of chaos, but again, who knows)

[arctic talon]

I’m assuming the space wolf is gona be durable as shit tbh

And ranger has very high damage

[dusk patrol]

Iirc they talked about how the Space Wolf doesn’t have a ton of use in conversations and stuff to compensate for him just being a monster in combat

[arctic talon]

Wonder what the reactions to having the ranger is gona be lol

[dusk patrol]

Curious how weapons are gonna work for them, but I guess considering there’s options off using Drukhari and aeldari weapons later in the game for humans it’ll just become available

[molten swan]

What Xenos are available to the rogue trader?

[dusk patrol]

Currently it’s just the Eldar Ranger I believe

I think a Drukhari dude maybe too?

Although idk if he joins your group

But you also get Drukhari and Eldar weapons later on, and fight them a lot

Probably other stuff too, iirc there’s teases of Necron stuff too

Also you can have a massive party so I don’t think it’s even gonna be hard to pick lol

[rocky gale]

As soon as I left the Prologue I made like three Mercs so I could instantly remove Idira from my party

I must be the best Psyker in the party

[dusk patrol]

Yeah idc about Idira, she’s aight but

Sister of Battle I don’t think is gonna last either

Abe needs to stay though

[rocky gale]

It's nothing personal, it just annoys me that she is and will always be a better Psyker than you

[crisp heath]

Ah turns out the toybox mod has a "bi mode"

[dusk patrol]

Need someone to introduce me to people

[crisp heath]

I'll let it sit a week or so to let the modding scene work out any kinks and then I'll give it a try

[rocky gale]

Yea I think I'm done until we've had a wave of patches and mods

[dusk patrol]

Legit my favorite thing is everytime someone goes “who the hell are are you?” Is turning to Abe and going “Abe! Inform this curr of who I am!”

Everytime

[rocky gale]

Yee, just choosing the "Look at Abe" option and he just knows what to do

[dusk patrol]

Dude is a homie.

Competent, and he’ll gut a mfer

[crisp heath]

There'd 2 dlc already in the works too

[dusk patrol]

Yeah

Assassin and Arbites

[crisp heath]

Owlcat delivers but they didn't deliver enough for me

[rocky gale]

It's Owlcat, they always release like 19 DLC

[dusk patrol]

I’m hoping we’ll eventually get an Ork one

[rocky gale]

Freebooterz would be cool

[dusk patrol]

That was one of my favorite classes to play in the FFG game

Kommando or Mekboy would be funny too

I’m not picky though

Kroot Shaper or Tau too

It seems the SW and Eldar are gonna be a bit later into the game though which is probably a good idea.

[warm notch]

wouldnt it be funny if the karnak twins were zola's siblings

[storm jungle]

Marazhai is in Chapter 3

[crisp heath]

T'au would be so good as just a guy to just hang out on the ship

[storm jungle]

Im gonna guess Yrliet is Chapter 2

which is where im at atm

[crisp heath]

Apparently the Karnak twins never met her, but Wolfer told them a lot about her

[dusk patrol]

I wouldn’t be shocked if Wolfer is related to her

[storm jungle]

Nah

prob just served in the same regiment

[crisp heath]

It's really shaping up to seem like Zola and Wolfer know each other pretty well

[storm jungle]

the "im your relative" shit STINKS

[rocky gale]

I've also noticed something which I think might be a bug, when your Player character becomes lvl 4 they can't take "Plasma/Melta/Bolter proficiency despite the prerequisite for taking them being "lvl4" you have to wait until lvl5, but your companions can take it at lvl 4

[storm jungle]

Yeah same

its so janky

also Iarmoth does your game have a mouse bug too?

[crisp heath]

The sub is full of bugs, seems it really needs a round of patches

[warm notch]

ok then

The karnak twins are Zola's former lovers

Is this better

[dusk patrol]

[storm jungle]

Im gonna shoot you

[dusk patrol]

My foot is about to become the current lover of your ass

[rocky gale]

In the last fight the game just kept panning upwards and I couldn't stop it, had to quit out.

[warm notch]

https://tenor.com/view/jeremy-clarkson-sometimes-my-genius-almost-frightening-driving-car-ride-gif-16463163

[storm jungle]

Clicks registering okay?

[rocky gale]

Yea clicks are alright

[storm jungle]

Ah okay

theres a bug going around atm

[warm notch]

🥺 👉 👈

[rocky gale]

Although if I tab out while playing after a while it disables my keyboard and I need to unplug it and plug it back in

[crisp heath]

God imagine if we get a cutscene where it's just Wolfer complaining about his ex-wife, and it slowly becomes apparent he's talking about Zola. Dude cracks open a cold one and just complains about not seeing his kids in months.

Zola, mind wiped, desperately trying to recall if she's ever had kids

[warm notch]

Zola can't be that old is she?

How long do you think she's been on the job lmao

[storm jungle]

Nah shes in her mid 30's

at best

[crisp heath]

I mean everyone in darktide looks like they've been on crack for the last 20 years

[storm jungle]

Least violent UK Citizens

[dusk patrol]

I’ve luckily not had anything bad happen bug wise

Which is uncommon for owlcat games for me lol

[crisp heath]

Rogue Trader being look "look at all these beautiful, noble explorers of the stars" while Darktide is on a drunken rant in the least coherent scottish accent you've ever heard

[dusk patrol]

Definitely a stark difference in roles

I’m too much of a bitch to be mean this play through mostly

But next one

[storm jungle]

I have trouble being evil in dialogue choices

im a very nice person IRL it feels wrong

[warm notch]

Same

[dusk patrol]

I’ll be giving all the orphans beatings and being a dick

[warm notch]

TFW you can't find that much enjoyment in roleplaying other alignments if it isn't something you'd do personally

[crisp heath]

I'm very nice in rpgs but I probably won't be in rogue trader lmao

[storm jungle]

Im usually good but I do step my foot down in some options.

because yeah this is 40k

[crisp heath]

I'm playing an imperial. I am here to cause problems and make money.

[dusk patrol]

Although being real I should be executing some of these dumbfucks

Mfer you live in 40k, why are you throwing rocks at the Rogue Trader who rules your ship

[crisp heath]

Can I put the inquisitor in the air lock

[warm notch]

Instead of being all "KILL ALL XENOS" I'm gonna be "P-Pwease M-Mistew Xenos . . . can you please die? 🥺 👉 👈

[rocky gale]

I had planned on doing some evil stuff, but then I met Vigdis and I wouldn't want to upset her.

[dusk patrol]

And the gunner dude who goes off on you your first meeting

Like jfc

You are too dumb for this universe dog

[crisp heath]

My Rogue trader is going to meet Eldar and be like "hot ones get on board, the rest of you close your eyes"

[storm jungle]

LMAO

Yeah im gonna be honest

if my team like really dislikes/threatens my eldar companions im getting rid of them

[storm jungle]

Mfers demanding I give them guns and remove the enforcers

bitch please

[crisp heath]

Cassia's opinion comes first, the rest of the harem second, everyone else is a financial decision

[dusk patrol]

Wow gee I wonder want that will lead to

[warm notch]

"If I can't add you to the harem then its a no-go"

[rocky gale]

I like that when getting an update from Vigdis there's an option for "Why do you never give me any good news" and she just starts listing off all the positive statistics that she didn't want to bother you with.

[storm jungle]

Its very fun ironically lol

also some of the choices are hilarious

this guy trauma-dumps you clearly seeking for some positive words

and you can just go

[arctic talon]

💀

[storm jungle]

"YOU FUCKING WORM"

[arctic talon]

Imperial noble moment

[warm notch]

Least shithead noble

[crisp heath]

One thing I've seen complaints about is that dialogue options don't take into account your character so you can be ex-navy and not know anything about ships or a psyker who doesn't understand the warp

[storm jungle]

YEP it doesnt matter

because you are a blank slate

its just reflected in game skills and nothing else

[arctic talon]

If you picked ex navy it should skip the ship combat tutorial

As a joke

[crisp heath]

Again, I'm going to complain, they didn't change dialogue based on factors that matter but they did for gender

I am going to shake owlcat

[warm notch]

this is so sad

[rocky gale]

They still missed some tbh, I've had a couple dialogue options where they refer to my character as he

[storm jungle]

^

[arctic talon]

They forgor

[storm jungle]

💀

[arctic talon]

Simply be fallout 2 and have too much dialogue pertaining to one gender over another 💀

[dusk patrol]

Ok but legit there is not enough dialogue which references this.

[arctic talon]

There's just not any dialogue related to your past is there?

[warm notch]

do bisexuals in Rogue Trader get +15% damage bonus to both genders

[arctic talon]

at least from what I've heard

[dusk patrol]

I'm supposed to be some former commodore, and these mfers are treating me like "And this is the wheel, it controls the way the ship turns"

There's a little

But imo not quite enough

You have the issue of you also need to still explain to newbs what all this stuff is

[arctic talon]

"I know you already know this but protocol dictates I must"

[dusk patrol]

Even though, a fucking Commodore should know what voidborn are.

[crisp heath]

You see my memeing on the space harem is actually concealing a clever tactical ploy. I will gain the loyalty of the pretty half of the population, and the money of the other half. Unstoppable.

[dusk patrol]

I really like Forgeworld background though, intelligence already does so much and you can make it replace most fellowship skills too.

Its kinda hilarious.

[storm jungle]

yeah coercion/persuasion are the key skills in this game from the amount of dialogue there is

I have not failed a single speech-check lmao

[dusk patrol]

Poor athleticism

It’s just

There

[crisp heath]

"Great-aunt? Get over it, that's barely even related."

[dusk patrol]

“Oh not a small shortcut!”

[crisp heath]

I should written the dialogue for this game

[rocky gale]

I think Voidborn get a similar ability that replace all Fel skills and talents with Int

[dusk patrol]

Yeah I think so

It’s really nice tbh

As long as you don’t need the FS bonus

Got that cold calculating rizz

[arctic talon]

DND 5e strength reference

the joke is its worthless

[crisp heath]

How does the difficulty compare to WotR? Am I going to spend 3 hours trying to figure out my first encounter?

[rocky gale]

You can modify the difficulty so that you deal a minimum of 10 damage with every attack, and have a 99% chance to pass every skill check. It's kinda absurd tbh

[storm jungle]

[crisp heath]

For every 1.5 hours of play time I want at least 6 deaths

[storm jungle]

[molten swan]

https://tenor.com/view/f-bi-raid-swat-gif-11500735

When the Arbites get added and search your ship with no notice

Hopefully we get to see void carapace

[green loom]

Funny you should mention them

They're confirmed to be a big part of I think the second DLC

[molten swan]

Ye that’s what I’m talking about, gonna be interesting, love my Arbites

[green loom]

Much much much much simpler to play with nice difficulty you can change to your whims

[warm notch]

When the Arbites gets added and turns on their bodycams

[green loom]

Unlike in WOTR if you make like two mistakes leveling up you'll just be slightly weaker instead of wholesale useless

[molten swan]

No body-cams needed where we’re going, just power mauls and shotguns and your knees

You will probably have to fight Arbites actually as a rogue (heretic) rogue trader if they search your ship and see wtf is going on, hmmmm

With their Punisher Class Strike Cruiser

[green loom]

Aaaa I'm stuck in a loading screen

[storm jungle]

relaunch bozo

[green loom]

It seems my PC doesn't like void battles

Because the loading screen keeps freezing before or after them

[plush mason]

huh? they did like if you are navy you dont ask why the Lady Theodora is called Lord Captain

[green loom]

Oh damn the Eldar pronounces it like Monkey

[storm jungle]

Bro how fast are you playing this game

Im still at Chapter 2 💀

[green loom]

I have 18 hours in the game already

[storm jungle]

im at 16 lmao

[green loom]

Also I kinda ran away from Footfall so I still have to finish that

[storm jungle]

I did a lot there in comparison, so that explains it

[green loom]

I went explorenating a bit

But now I'll be going back with my hotshot lasgun

It's a shame dual pistols isn't viable

At least I think

[tough haven]

I wonder if I can have a Blood Axe Mercenary on my crew

if you can really only get eldar and dark eldar, thats gonna be so disappointing

I hate it when games in 40k's setting use like 10% of the interesting factions available

I just wanna get as many different faction members and people together in one place as possible without them killing each other, and just see all their reactions

I've only played a bit so please no spoilers lol

[queen laurel]

@storm jungle @green loom there are 2 kinds of gamers

[green loom]

There's no Orks afaik

[storm jungle]

💀

[green loom]

There's an Ork skull in your study and it says
"The skull of an unknown Xenos"

I feel like it'd be pretty obvious DLC content though, Owlcat have a habit of making stuff then integrating it into the campaign

[queen laurel]

you would think they would say it's an ork considering they are so numerous only being beaten by tyranids

[tough haven]

Man thats lame

[queen laurel]

Xenos Tend to get the Short end of the stick in warhammer games

[green loom]

Oh my god a good stormcast poster

[green loom]

I feel like it's more or less guaranteed as DLC, so it's a matter of waiting

[tough haven]

I know, but literally adding 1 (2 depending on how you look at it) xenos as an option is literally just taunting us

[queen laurel]

Owlcat has shown the capability to deliver within expectation

[plush mason]

||the eldar is in chapter 2||

[green loom]

What'd everyone name their ships

I named mine the Janissary

[queen laurel]

Fist of Gork

i'll just make up a reason to say to the imperial authority

[storm jungle]

Altyn Kadin

[warm notch]

When does Rogue Trader take place?

[green loom]

Wazzat mean

[green loom]

Roughly before the 13th black crusade looks like

Probably in the perpetual present that was 999 m41

[warm notch]

Oh okay

Nods my head like I understand

[storm jungle]

butchered Turkish for "Golden Lady" its normally Altın Kadın but the english alphabet doesn't have those words so

[green loom]

Does it not detect your keyboard

[storm jungle]

Its a turkish letter and the game doesn't support it so nope

[green loom]

F

I got my Ö in but that was before I realized the game gives you your own last name

[queen laurel]

@storm jungle do you think i can slap an ork and take the punch of one?

[storm jungle]

yes

[queen laurel]

Finally i found it the perfect way to start war punching the s*** out of something with my bear hands

[plush mason]

love my ship

[patent ivy]

I wanna get Rogue Trader but I just got my buddy his Christmas present 🤣

Gonna have to put it off until next pay day

[rocky gale]

Merciful Perdition

[crisp heath]

Spase Bote

[plush mason]

Bastion of Dawn

[tough haven]

I'm trying to make a operative psyker build with a focus on divination and one other discipline but idk which, but I'm not really sure where to start, thoughts?

[storm jungle]

Its a very good game absolutely recommend it still

[queen laurel]

I'm still in the tutorial but it's definitely one of the best warhammer games available in the market

The effort into voice acting upon meeting idira

That girl crazy

[tough haven]

Idk what options are all available for psykers but it seems kinda limited atm

I feel like you really have to commit to a psychic discipline for it to be good, so idk if I should do more than one

[plush mason]

the 5 are biomancy divination pyromancy telekinesis and sanctus

[plush mason]

most psyker comps have 2

[tough haven]

this is what I have so far

idk if I should dip into actual operative abilities much

Or which second discipline to go for

[plush mason]

outside of the heroic operative is kind meh imo

[tough haven]

Yeah but I already picked it and going through all the intro stuff is so tedious

if I could just skip all of that I would re do it

[plush mason]

you can pick a new archetype at the high factorum

[tough haven]

You can? I dont see an option for that

[plush mason]

its near the bottom of his dialog list

what you do is retrain and then pick a new archetype

[tough haven]

What archetype would you recommend? I was gonna go for divination for all of the dodge and defensive buffs, but I also want to have some offensive abilities

[umbral nymph]

Get officer, max out fellowship, conquer the sector with the power of friendship

[plush mason]

pyromancy and tele have a lot of offense options

[tough haven]

I would go tele but thats literally the build the psyker you start with has

[plush mason]

so you can combine it with divination and go ham

frankly pyro has the most over all damage potential

[tough haven]

So how do you pick a new archetype?

[plush mason]

retrain

[tough haven]

I picked the option but I only see options to re pick feats

[plush mason]

back out of the archetype

[tough haven]

How so?

[plush mason]

top right iirc

bottom left lol

or top

[tough haven]

go to archetypes?

[plush mason]

yes

[tough haven]

that just takes me here

You'll have to bear with me, I'm kinda dumb

[plush mason]

hmmmm

honestly op being mid makes it great for psyker

plus it leads to assassin and bounty hunter

and yeah i was told you could pick different archetypes, seem i got bad info as i have never tried it myself sorry

[tough haven]

you're fine

now I just gotta figure out how to build this

[queen laurel]

This game is a looting dream

I have approximately an unsafe amount of supplies now

[tough haven]

I'm trying to decide on contagious luck or psychic barrage

sacred rituals seems good but hard to maintain

[tough haven]

Anything you'd recommend?

[plush mason]

you are a rogue trader. everything is cargo for you to collect

[plush mason]

as far as op goes not much

exploits are underwelming

[tough haven]

I meant for psyker

[plush mason]

ah

[tough haven]

I'm just gonna use op for the minor damage boost I guess

[plush mason]

melee or range?

[queen laurel]

I am also a melee Commissar with the metal nose making me invincible from the scent of heresy

[tough haven]

It's been pretty big on occasion

range

[plush mason]

ok then biomancy is out as thats almost all melee

[tough haven]

this is what I've got

[plush mason]

looks good

[queen laurel]

@plush mason with this metal nose i am granted immunity from the foul scent of HERESY

[plush mason]

lol

love it

navy officer is hella fun

[tough haven]

Tele seems cool but it's kinda redundant since its the focus of the psyker you get at the start

I guess she doesnt have to be a part of my retinue

[plush mason]

yeah

or you can go pyro

because i dont think there is a single pyro comp

[tough haven]

fr?

[plush mason]

yeah

[tough haven]

I didnt go pyro bc I assumed it would be overused

[plush mason]

nah

in fact

i think there are only 2 psyker comps in the game

unless the eldar is

but she is a ranger so i doubt it

[tough haven]

Now I think I should make a character to replace the psyker, but what sort of a build to make them?

[plush mason]

kekw

[tough haven]

I kinda wanna make a soldier to replace the sister of battle I accidentally got rid of

but I'm not sure what build to run, specifically what origin to go for

militarum commander seems half decent but I'm not sure how to use or build around it

[plush mason]

you...got rid of the SoB?

well i guess if you are going heretic

[tough haven]

as much as I want to say it was a intentional choice, it was more of an accident

and I decided to roll with it

[plush mason]

rip

[tough haven]

I'm thinking fortress world militarum commander soldier, but Idk how to really play that

[molten swan]

https://tenor.com/view/nike-just-do-it-gif-26636514

[plush mason]

^

do what i did with my psyker. make a tester character to try it out

[tough haven]

Like how am I supposed to use regimental tactics? use it when the officer gets into melee and doesnt want to get friendly fired?

[molten swan]

Sounds like you should use it when your commander/ Allies are being swarmed and your other Allies can shoot them without damaging the commander/others with their shots. Going into melee also works ig

[tough haven]

How good are heavy weapons?

[plush mason]

idk

[storm jungle]

All ill say is commander/captain characters are fucking GOATED rn

you can spam support stats all-day long to your teammates and watch em fuck enemies up

[coarse pumice]

When do I get the Eldar? Though she’s a sniper and I accidentally rolled sniper apparently

[queen laurel]

My rogue trader commissar straight up charge the chaos spawn in the tutorial ship and almost died truly an experience

That is how i'm going to play

[umbral nymph]

Bruh Abelard is just goated, basically immortal, has a long ass charge and can basically one shot anyone below 30HP

[storm jungle]

Chapter 2 once you visit Janus, she's at a gazebo helping the planetary governor with the rebels while saying shes an abhuman, go talk with the Governor after she gets her introductory cutscene, then you can go out to recruit her.

[storm jungle]

Literally LEAST OP british admiral

[queen laurel]

I'm basically also a warrior so I just sent the two of us together and mop up anything that breaths

while of course having some backline support

[umbral nymph]

3 heretics try to gang up on him
Officer casts "bring it down"
Proceeds to do his best non heretical khorne berserker impression

cleave doing 20+ damage with his starter chainsword. brooo

literally eats lasbolts, bullets and grendes.

[tough haven]

Is having a pistol and a sword actually any good?

[umbral nymph]

this could be memed

ima keep this

[queen laurel]

it's a good way to soften up the targets

But you're probably going to spend most of your stats on melee if you're running that setup

[umbral nymph]

i like running it as a backup for my ranged units, but as Abelard its basically a one man army build

[queen laurel]

The range weapon is just there for support while you try to get close and personal

[tough haven]

So its not really to shoot while in melee or try to squeeze out extra attacks, its just a ranged option?

if thats it, then why not just give him a rifle or something in his second slot

[tough haven]

you are not the first person to do this

[tough haven]

I thought the point was to get the two weapon fighting skill and get extra attackks

[umbral nymph]

it really depends if you have a good pistol thats better than like a primary rifle, plus theres specializations for it so you could go either way

theres no AP cost in swapping weapons anyways

havent delved into pistol builds yet but right now, the point of the pistol is to just squeeze out some damage while you get into range for melee

Now this actually turns Abelard into a Bereserker

[storm jungle]

Speaking of

huh, nice

[tough haven]

I cant figure out how to get a different archetype

[plush mason]

its a mod

toybox

[dusk patrol]

Later on there’s a class which is built around it more

Called Arch-Militant

For the early game it’s not terrible but not as good as just running two melee

Or a 2 handed melee weapon

[dusk patrol]

What level are you?

[tough haven]

8

[dusk patrol]

Just keep playing

I’d say use two melee weapons with two weapon fighter for now

But later in it’ll be come better to have a pistol and melee with Arch militant

[winter pine]

I hope Owlcat gets the nod for a game in the Jerico Reach if FFG lore isn't something totally shelved forever

[tough haven]

Any tips for making a never stop shooting build?

[celest dome]

In DT or RT ?
Cause if its in DT its the wrong chat to ask

[balmy tusk]

Just dropping this in here in case someone needs it when arguing with weirdos

[green loom]

What's weirdos mean

[umbral nymph]

"Trust me guys, this is not a bad idea"

[queen laurel]

Bro mine looks like an imperial Rager

[inland sigil]

Confused by what Iam lookin at?

[celest dome]

All the LGBT representations in Black Library books

Just the 40k ones though

There was one with Fantasy/AoS too iirc

[inland sigil]

Dont tell me people are arguing that 40k is Racitranshomoxenomysoginistphobic again

[celest dome]

I think it was posted as useful in general

[inland sigil]

I mean yeah, but theres a reason this picture was created.
Am just tired of people shitting on fantasy for being fiction and not real

[plush mason]

so. is the Koronus expanse still an untamed frontier?

[inland sigil]

From how I understood it is mostly unexplored.

[plush mason]

where is it in the milky way anyway?

[hexed sluice]

So here is a random lore question: do sanctioned psykers have their own special districts in Hive cities away from standard Imperial citizens?

[celest dome]

No, they usually aren't enough of them to warant it

[hexed sluice]

Thanks, was wondering if it might be possible to have a "psyker's district" to explore in, so I wanted to be sure before I tried suggesting it that it would not break the lore.

[celest dome]

Could have an Astra Telepatica owned Sector

Or something like what they have in Necromunda where House Helmawr has subdued Psykers

[tulip brook]

Threat it as setting, nothing is canon and anything is possible as long as it doesn't contradict established sources

[vale fjord]

AKIMBO PLASMA?

[tulip brook]

It might be possible but not that plausible

[vale fjord]

Do the orks know about their orkosh powers of belief

[celest dome]

yes

[queen laurel]

they are pretty oblivious about it but it's not like they don't know about it

[vale fjord]

Alright alright

One more question

Whats the most powerful entity or being in the 40k verse (yknow, equalling or above the emperor)

[celest dome]

The Chaos Gods

C'tan

[queen laurel]

The old ones before they got clapped

[vale fjord]

Mm

Alrifht

[tulip brook]

C'tan are shattered, old ones are dead, chaos gods are flourishing

Mebe nid hive mind but we don't know much about it

[celest dome]

Emperor is also mostly dead

[umbral nymph]

Perfection

[green loom]

Where'd you get that from

[umbral nymph]

OH NOW WERE TALKING

[umbral nymph]

Starport on Minoris

looted it off an invisible container

[green loom]

Aaaaaa I missed it then

Sadge

[celest dome]

Invisible due to bug or meant to be invisible

[queen laurel]

i like this funny tech priest

[umbral nymph]

probably bugged

[umbral nymph]

gave him a sniper and turned him into a Necron Deathmark

bro is popping heads every turn

[queen laurel]

To be honest I'm going to make him a powerful melee support hero

Have him in the front lines with my character

[urban spire]

usually a bad idea to argue with idiots but this is still good to have, thanks

[urban spire]

nah it's the other way around, it's for when people are arguing that lgbtq+ rep should be kept out of 40k

[umbral nymph]

Who would win

Abelard too much of a chad

Gotta say please

[tulip brook]

Facts and logic

[umbral nymph]

More proof of Chad Abelard

shrugs off a full power kick from a demigod

[green loom]

He kicked Abelard for me too lol

And since I had him surrounded

The Word Bearer managed to set off a chain of opportunity attacks that chunked over half his health

Idiot

[tulip brook]

To be fair they're not exactly known for their melee combat prowess. Other red guys would never lose like that 🌽

[viral yacht]

name randomizer gave me an interesting result while creating a female psyker...

[crisp heath]

Now get possessed

[inland sigil]

My character looks so Antagonisty

[green loom]

Humanity's finest

[urban spire]

bampaia desu

[umbral nymph]

SoB taking a page from the Grey Knights I see

Ngl thats a sick ass exo suit doh

[tulip brook]

that golden gal is the leader of sisters and high lord

get used to the baby carriers

[celest dome]

It's much better than the baby carrier of the GK

[tulip brook]

they would look way better without their arms poking out imo, like terminator armor for sisters

centurion? w/e

[tulip brook]

someone should write books about space dwarves, like, yesterday

[storm jungle]

sorry all we can do is more Space Marines

[green loom]

There's also a book for Morvenn

[storm jungle]

I'll take your entire stock

[spare osprey]

They’re making one

Gav Thorpe is the writer tho

[green loom]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/12/09/the-black-library-preview-online-2023/

[rocky gale]

Yeee the Morvenn book is going to be about Night Lords invading Ophelia 7

[rocky gale]

Led by Kol Rakhul "The Death of Saints"

[green loom]

Also two new EC books

[rocky gale]

Jeez I really am going to have to get a mortgage so that I can afford the Special edition of the Vahl book

[tulip brook]

morvenn, night lords, votann and continuation of brutal kunnin

[green loom]

Fkn brooks and his mohawk

[tulip brook]

yeah good enough I'll take it

[queen laurel]

Yo the Author of Brutal Kunnin

[green loom]

Ufthak is just him but Ork

[rocky gale]

Ye he's writing another Ork book

[queen laurel]

100%

[green loom]

You ever notice that some of the most deplorable fans always just larp as actual 40k chars

[storm jungle]

Rylanor moment lol

[spare osprey]

Yup

[rose thorn]

What the hell is imperium maledictum

[storm jungle]

New RPG

[rose thorn]

Oh sick

What kind of system is it?

[dusk patrol]

D100 I believe

Similar to the FFG ones

Just updated, new stuff and mechanics

[rose thorn]

Nice

[crisp heath]

I’d like to see a 40k version of the “do we have a problem scene” from Don’t Be A Menace but with Necromunda Hive Gangers

[green loom]

I'm already debating restarting as a diff class hmm

[dusk patrol]

Which one are you on rn?

[green loom]

Officer

It's been fun enough but Soldier and Arch Militant seem way more my playstyle

[dense dawn]

Yeouch

53

[rose thorn]

Yea lol

[errant yacht]

Just to make sure I'm not misunderstanding anything but are Feral Orks just fantasy orcs with circular bases?

[celest dome]

Not really

They are similar but still different

[errant yacht]

I assume the Waaagh phenomenon still allows them to comprehend teknologee despite their inability to develop it?

[urban spire]

that's not the waaagh it's genetic memory

[tulip brook]

they can integrate into a normal WAAAGH! just fine.

[errant yacht]

What are the key differences between a feral Ork and an orc? Cuz I thought the Waaagh in fantasy was just a generic battlecry, while in 40k, it's a psychic field that makes minor tweaks reality around their belief systems

[tulip brook]

I assume they have the innate knowledge but no means to produce

[urban spire]

lack of an industrial base

is the main difference

they need labour, materials, big meks to manage those things, and someone who has it together enough to manage them

once they have that they start churning out guns and vehicles and stop being "feral"

[arctic talon]

Feral Orks usually end up making really really shit guns

Orcs in fantasy uh

never really got that far in their tech tree

[tulip brook]

a waagh depletes the planet of resources and fight, then orks move on, then feral orks are born. they are just stranded with no means

[arctic talon]

now granted orcs in WHF are terrifying in a whole other way

[urban spire]

tbf they really don't need it in fantasy

[arctic talon]

Yeah

but Feral Orks end up developing crude technology

steam power and such

but they'll turn into normal orks if there's enough resources around

[crisp heath]

Technically the more orks you have in general; the more Technically adept they are.

As the Gesalt field increases in power so does the orks ability

[urban spire]

it's not known exactly what triggers an ork's development into one of the specialists afaik

[crisp heath]

That's why the beasts orks were a pain in the ass for the imperium

[errant yacht]

Random mutations like with every sentient species as they evolve?

[urban spire]

no it's not a mutation, orks are genetically engineered to work this way

[crisp heath]

Orks develop based on multiple factors; evolution isn't really one of them

Mostly numbers/time

[urban spire]

mutation has actually degraded their function over time

[errant yacht]

But I'm assuming that specialists are mutants in their group?

[crisp heath]

Yeah, like weird boys and pain boys and meks

[urban spire]

normally there's no such thing as evolutionary decay, but orks were specifically designed for a purpose, so any movement away from that template counts i think

[tulip brook]

more like individual traits? they aren't physiologically different than the others

[urban spire]

the concept of devolution is fake as hell, is what i'm saying

all evolution is evolution, there's no regressing

specialists aren't mutants, it's more like a genetic caste system

[errant yacht]

With the talk about mutants... I know Da Emprah was made as a joke by one YouTuber, but is there a nonzero chance that a big stompy boi can be half weirdboy, half dok, half mekboss?

[crisp heath]

But they aren't exactly devolved either, as the potential for a Kork to appear is dependant on most honestly just how big of a ork waaagh energy is present if the beast is anything of measure from

Like Thrakka is getting dangerously close

[tulip brook]

what beast? there's nothing like that in the universe.

[errant yacht]

Wasn't The Beast in terms of his strength and cognitive functions basically something that could be described as "the last surviving Krork"?

[crisp heath]

The Beast is a novel series.

[tulip brook]

no it's not

[arctic talon]

The Beast is a shit novel serise

[crisp heath]

Agreed

[arctic talon]

unfortunately

[crisp heath]

But lore is lore

[arctic talon]

we have to deal with its existance now

which makes some Ork lore really fucking weird

and way too connected to the heresy imo

what I'm saying is it could do with a rewrite

[crisp heath]

Hopefully we get a new ork series

[urban spire]

you can just ignore dumb lore, people do it all the time

tyranids with multilasers is canon, you don't have to acknowledge it and in fact nobody does

[crisp heath]

Meh, there are some good nuggets within its wall of shit

[errant yacht]

I vaguely recall his description being THE strongest Ork, and was remarkably intelligent even by heresy-Era human standards

[arctic talon]

The War in the Beast isn't necessarily bad lore

its just shit writing lol

[tulip brook]

I ignore its existence but orks evolving with bigger waaagh is fun so yeah

[arctic talon]

its like

really shit writing

even by 40k book standards

its bad

[verbal path]

They're called genestealers

[urban spire]

heresy era humans were also dumb as rocks

[errant yacht]

Isnt your average guardsman dumber than heresy-Era humanity?

[crisp heath]

They just need to have Thrakka in lore fight a primarch

So we can judge his strength

[dense salmon]

Im rereading the plague war trilogy

And I gotta say I am confused how people stil perpetuate the misinformation that space marines are religious

[urban spire]

less educated, more malnourished, still about the same

humanity hasn't changed much

[arctic talon]

Yes

[crisp heath]

Plague Wars is alright.

I don't like dawn of fire much though

So far

[arctic talon]

Dawn of Fire fucking sucks imo

[urban spire]

space marines are religious, they just don't follow the imperial cult

[arctic talon]

I'm sorry but its so bad

[verbal path]

Dawn of War game had them praying etc. Often a person's first intro to 40k

[crisp heath]

Space Marines don't venerate the Emperor as God.

(Except for a few)

[errant yacht]

Unless you're a black Templar. Then you eat the Imperium's religious texts for breakfast, lunch and dinner

[arctic talon]

well

they don't exactly agree with the ecclisarchy either

[dense salmon]

The average space marine still subscribes to a slightly changed imperial truth

[arctic talon]

they think he's the greatest human thats ever lived

not a God™️

[crisp heath]

Depends on the author too

[dense salmon]

They don't see the emperor as a god, just the greatest and most important human ever

[urban spire]

in fact

almost every single chapter has chaplains

so idk how you could get off saying space marines aren't religious

[arctic talon]

Codex says they don't see big E as god therfore I agree with the codex

[urban spire]

the ones who don't have chaplains have something else

[dense salmon]

Although plague wars does mention their meticulous devotion to the imperial truth and the astartes standard of excellency verges on religious territory

[crisp heath]

His job is to uphold the traditions of the Chapter no?

[arctic talon]

Yeah

generally

[crisp heath]

Unless they are black templars or dark angels

Then their job is different

Lmao

An oath to the emperor is different than a prayer.

Oath is a bond of fidelity

[dense salmon]

That isn't to say individual chapters don't have their own pseudo-religious beliefs

[dense salmon]

Blood angels for example

[urban spire]

ALMOST LIKE IT'S SOME KIND OF RELIGIOUS OBSERVANCE

[errant yacht]

IIRC, I think they aren't as religious about The Emperor due to their genetic heritage, but also know that they have to play nice with the Ecchlesiarchy since they have more authority

[crisp heath]

Don't forget

Some chapters have marines alive from the Imperial Truth era

Like Bjorn

[urban spire]

on top of that, tech marines revere the omnissiah

space wolves have rune priests

[errant yacht]

Including people not entombed in a dreadnought?

[crisp heath]

Guilliman has certainly instructed his marines

On the Imperial truth

[verbal path]

Part of the Chaplains role is to be the peaceful gesture to the Ecclesiarchy. The Astartes can continue to acknowledge the Emperor as not an actual God but just don't spread that belief and in return the Ecclesiarchy gives them rosariuses and doesn't call them heretics (too often)

[errant yacht]

I know people say that space Marines are so heavily augmented that they are more xenos than human, but don't let your local propagandist hear that

[urban spire]

not xeno, transhuman

[dense salmon]

It should be noted techmarines are regarded with a lot of skepticism even within their own chapters

Though this depends on the chapter

[crisp heath]

Should that matter?

Lol

[urban spire]

it is still another nail in the coffin of "space marines aren't religious"

[dusk patrol]

Some are some aren’t

Goes for techmarines too

[urban spire]

yeah people in dreads get kinda fucked up over time

[dense salmon]

The codex and multiple literary sources dont substantiate it

[crisp heath]

I'm pretty sure the SW honor whatever Bjorn has to say

[verbal path]

Space marines have religious tones because 40k but they're not worshipping the Emperor. for the most part

[dusk patrol]

There’s chapters we know are explicitly religious and aligned with the ecclissarchy

It’s not the norm though

[crisp heath]

Def not

[urban spire]

space marine reverence for the emperor and the primarchs is definitely religious

[dusk patrol]

So yes most space marines aren’t religious as we think of it

[dusk patrol]

It’s not worship

[dense salmon]

We can make a case for it being interpreted as religious in everything but name

[errant yacht]

A black templar and iron hand walk into the bar

[dense salmon]

Which authors are inclined to do

But they still subscribe to the atheistic imperial truth

[verbal path]

The Black Templars are a big exception because Sigismund started being real religious due to the saint he hung around

Which pissed Dorn off rather fierce

[crisp heath]

Lorgar started it

[urban spire]

if you're operating on an extremely narrow definition of religion where a religion has to have a single god who is the main object of worship then yeah some space marines aren't religious, but that definition also makes real life buddhists not religious

[dense salmon]

I disagree with this assertion

I dont have a narrow view on religion

[dusk patrol]

There’s no worship in what they do really

[dense salmon]

My argument is syntax

[urban spire]

the emperor and the primarchs are universally revered by loyalists in one way or another

[crisp heath]

We are operating under the comparing and contrasting ideals of the Imperial truth vs the Imperial Creed

[dusk patrol]

There’s reverence

[crisp heath]

Or atleast that's my assumption

[dusk patrol]

It’s more if you operate with a view so broad that religion can apply to basically anything

[dense salmon]

Reverence isn't necessarily worship, I even rebut the claim that they aren't totally religious with the plague wars source

[dusk patrol]

Which I can even buy into as an idea irl

[dense salmon]

Because in a sense they are

[urban spire]

well it's not a materialistic reverence

[dusk patrol]

But it’s not what the word is meant for

[urban spire]

it has very distinct spiritual tones

[dusk patrol]

Yes

[dense salmon]

I think people can be spiritual without being strictly superstitious or religious

But that's neither here nor there

[dusk patrol]

Spiritual doesn’t mean religious

[dense salmon]

The dogma of the imperial truth is strictly atheist

But what modern space marines practice is a corruption of imperial truth

[crisp heath]

Guilliman could have accidently started what is now the Imperial Creed tbh.

[dense salmon]

Which, in essence, is an atheistc hero cult

[verbal path]

They look up and revere the Emperor but only as a human

[crisp heath]

Didn't Guilliman lock up a word bearer dreadnought under what would become the center of the ecclesiarcy?

[verbal path]

You too can be like the Emperor if you just picked yourself up by your bootstraps.

[dusk patrol]

He wasn’t a dread at the time

But he was one of the primary founders of the church yes

[verbal path]

The Anchorite, ya.

[crisp heath]

So Guilliman started what he hates.

[wet sandal]

Which is definitely not true

[dusk patrol]

He didn’t set him up to do that

He didn’t kill him

[crisp heath]

I mean he didn't mean to

[dusk patrol]

He then went on to be a founder

[crisp heath]

I just find it funny

[dusk patrol]

You could argue because he helped save the Imperium so he already did that

[crisp heath]

How do you guys think eatd3 will end?

As prescribed or with some significant alterations?

[green loom]

Someone's dead

[crisp heath]

In eatd?

[dusk patrol]

Lots of people died

Sanguinius died at the end of the last one

[crisp heath]

Yeah I read it

[dusk patrol]

But I don’t think it’ll change much

[tulip brook]

it'll end with a death ahaHAha.... I'll show myself out

[dusk patrol]

Abnett already has mostly kept it as is

[arctic talon]

^

[crisp heath]

I think Person and grammaticus will follow their line back, then join GEoM.

[dusk patrol]

What will change is what we didn’t know

[crisp heath]

The fight sequence will probably deviate some between emp and horus

[green loom]

Didn't know we had Dan Abnett in the chat damn

[crisp heath]

Which it will have to anyway because the original script is fairly short

[dusk patrol]

I’m hopeful most of it will be the aftermath tbh

[crisp heath]

Dorn will probably arrive to late

Valdors part in it will have to be expanded.

Their isn't original lore for valdor in the visions of heresy iirc

[tulip brook]

half of the book dorn regret monologue snoozefest 💤 yeah that would be the worst ending

[crisp heath]

Obviously Malcador will have to die in the next book

Guilliman arrives at the end

Along with the lion?

Or was he way later?

[storm jungle]

Lion atm is busy nuking traitor homeworlds

I really like that as new lore btw

its funny af

[rocky gale]

Is it? I've never read it but one of the workers my local Warhammer store said it was the best series to start with if you want to read Warhammer, he said this thinking I'm a beginner despite the fact I've spoken to him atleast 50 times, he just never recognises me and thinks it's my first time in the store every single time he see's me.

[storm jungle]

Its universally panned by the fans.

Its very bad.

[rocky gale]

Huh

[storm jungle]

Like not unreadable more just

[rocky gale]

He loved it

[storm jungle]

"What in the fuck am I reading."

[dusk patrol]

Because people don’t read

[rocky gale]

He ranted about how amazing it was for atleast 15 minutes while I just stood there nodding

[dusk patrol]

Oh sorry lol

[tulip brook]

many people will suggest very different entry points with different aspects

[dusk patrol]

Chat went way up

[tulip brook]

NEVER war of the beast

[dusk patrol]

It’s awful in all respects and trust me I tried with it

[crisp heath]

War of the beast isn't horrific conceptually to me

[storm jungle]

Its a good concept

[crisp heath]

It wasn't written very well

[storm jungle]

the execution is just bad

[dusk patrol]

The idea is fine

It’s just goofy

[storm jungle]

and its still canon at least, for all the people that say it was retconned lol

[crisp heath]

And the stark contrast between how the first book was written

And the rest

Is very noticeable

[storm jungle]

"I am Slaughter."

fuck off

[dusk patrol]

That’s what happens when they have Abnett start these series

[arctic talon]

War of The Beast? its just not written well at all lol

[dusk patrol]

And then hand it to the C team

[rocky gale]

Damn, dude was hyping it up hard

[arctic talon]

The quote "slaughter begin slaughtering"

will fucking

live down in my mind

[storm jungle]

NO

NOT EVEN THAT

[arctic talon]

as one of the worst quotes ever

[storm jungle]

"Rogal punched the desk with his fist. *His Imperial Fist."

STOP IT

[dusk patrol]

Slaughter slaughtered I think is a line

[dusk patrol]

?

[storm jungle]

Majorkill jumpscare in ad

[rose thorn]

He finally shilled out

[storm jungle]

LMAO