The Ultramarines have lost effectively no Captains since Macragge, and their named characters(Agemman, Sicarius, Ventris, Tigurius etc.) Are still alive and kicking
#40k-lore-chat
green loom
No he's still there
Wolves barely ever lose any named characters, except the Ironwolves specifically who lost 2 Wolf Lords in like, a month
summer rover
lol, he's never getting a model again tho
summer rover
they wouldn't be able to get him out anyways, he finally worked the perferct butt-groove into the ceremite harness.
storm jungle
Wolves barely ever lose any named characters, except the Ironwolves specifically...
I feel like im going into a hallucinogic trance whenever i start reading anything with space wolves units
Ironwolves had two Wolf Lords who were named Svane Deathwolf and Gnarly Redwolf
HELP
near wasp
The fuck
storm jungle
Dude
green loom
Ironwolves had two Wolf Lords who were named Svane Deathwolf and Gnarly Redwolf
The first guy was called Ironwolf
storm jungle
go to their special character wikipage on the lexi
storm jungle
The first guy was called Ironwolf
GOD
green loom
The company was named after him
storm jungle
MAKE IT STOP
summer rover
spacve wolves are great because they KNOW how stupid they are and lean into it.
green loom
No they don't
Lukas' entire character is shitting on them for it and he's practically exiled
storm jungle
They 100% fully expect you to take them seriously
summer rover
buddy, they're acting like drunken LARPers
green loom
Well they are, but they're fully into it
storm jungle
oh yeah that too
green loom
It's like the delusional wizards in total drama that take themselves 100% seriously
storm jungle
Great Mighty Kevin Moment
green loom
Why do you know his name off the top of your head
summer rover
have you read this shit? they know they can fuck around like this so they've committed to the bit in a way that makes everyone in the setting pretending they're actually serious look dumb alongside them
storm jungle
I have
its why i said that lol
Also like... space wolves fans have said its stupid too
green loom
Yeah again, it's Lukas' entire character to make fun of them
summer rover
yeah, that's my point, it's stupid on purpose
astral whale
Ironwolves had two Wolf Lords who were named Svane Deathwolf and Gnarly Redwolf
Now they get successors so you can cram “Wolf” into things that have nothing to do with wolves.
green loom
Written that way yes, but it's serious to the wolves 
near wasp
The great and mighty kevin is so lost on his own sauce
storm jungle
fr fr
anyway basically Space Wolves are bad
off to the pits of Tartarus with them
astral whale
anyway basically Space Wolves are bad
What’s wrong you don’t like reading “Wolf wolf wolf wolf wolf wolf wolf”
summer rover
40k is bad, it's only fun if you mack the whole setting.
storm jungle
What’s wrong you don’t like reading “Wolf wolf wolf wolf wolf wolf wolf”
AAAA
near wasp
To the old folks home with bjorn
summer rover
Vulf Wulfsonson, Dreadwolf Wolfmaster of the 7th company of the spacewolf Wulfengunnars.
storm jungle
Die.
astral whale
To the old folks home with bjorn
I’d go to the old folks home if it means shoving me into a dreadnought
near wasp
Absolutly no
summer rover
i just made that up and it's probably canon.
green loom
Vulf Wulfsonson, Dreadwolf Wolfmaster of the 7th company of the spacewolf Wulfen...
It wouldn't be 7th company
storm jungle
The one named chaos space wolf character has the surname Badvulf
green loom
Itd be "Dreadwolves Great Company"
near wasp
The one named chaos space wolf character has the surname **Badvulf**
How do wolves not cringe at themself
astral whale
The one named chaos space wolf character has the surname **Badvulf**
Still better than Arkhan Land.
storm jungle
Arkhan Land is fine honestly
astral whale
WHO HAS THE SURNAME LAND?
storm jungle
SAME GUY WHOS NAMED
DICK WARLOCK
IRL
and yes hes real look him up, absolute legend
astral whale
**DICK WARLOCK**
His parents are based.
storm jungle
honestly the most ridiculous yet badass name
then you get fuckers like this
💀
BLUD BRODER
near wasp
Im fucking done with 40k
astral whale
Grimnir Blackblood sounds like a badass name
storm jungle
DSFSKLDLSKSD
near wasp
This is to ridiculous
astral whale
Or the Brothers Bloodhowl?
summer rover
Thurgi howlhammer, wolfhammer longtooth!
near wasp
I refuse to believe that any human being had any part in writing that, it has to be an ai. Which is blasphemous to the machine god
astral whale
I’m surprised that there isn’t a character named “Odin Thunderdick
summer rover
Bluudi Rageclaw, wolfscout wulfranger veteran!
storm jungle
Yeah the only reference to Odin namewise is the space wolves calling the Emperor All-Father
that and i guess Odin somehow is too on the nose lol
near wasp
The emperor could of been odin
summer rover
it's reserved for russ calling the emperor that to annoy the other primarches
astral whale
that and i guess Odin **somehow** is too on the nose lol
Tbh, it wouldn’t surprise me considering that Big E has two sons themed after members of the Corvidae family of birds.
crisp heath
I do like the idea of mostly keeping the myths part of their mythology, it would be kinda lame to just have space Thor running around
storm jungle
For now at least
storm jungle
The emperor could of been odin
An old bearded guy fucked up on shrooms poking his eye out does sound like him
crisp heath
Tbh, it wouldn’t surprise me considering that Big E has two sons themed after me...
who's the second?
astral whale
I do like the idea of mostly keeping the myths part of their mythology, it would...
The Lord of Crows, Kurze.
near wasp
Im gonna cry, is it cause the symbol of the imperium is an eagle so they choose bird names ;-;
astral whale
I do like the idea of mostly keeping the myths part of their mythology, it would...
Tbh the Space wolves seem like a parody of Beowulf. They have none of the other qualities of Vikings.
crisp heath
Russ as Beowulf makes a lot more sense than Russ as Thor/Odin
crisp heath
The thing with Beowulf references is that I know way too much about Beowulf to ever pick up on the pop culture version
astral whale
Leeman*is headed into the vast psychic ocean seeking out a woman.
Beowulf dove into a lake looking for Grendel’s Mother.
What are the chances he comes back with a sword and some loot.
crisp heath
Beowulf also earned his fame by killing sea monsters, so there's also that. Could be warp shenanigans or just krakens
green loom
Russ as Beowulf makes a lot more sense than Russ as Thor/Odin
And Bjorn is the last warrior
crisp heath
The biggest blow here is that Russ doesn't have a Grendel. Magnus doesn't quite fit the bill since he's probably the least monstrous of the traitor primarchs.
Magnus could definitely be Unferth tho
idk I feel like if they wanted to do a Beowulf thing, that would be really, really cool, but since everyone reads it in highschool I think if they were doing Beowulf it would be more obvious
astral whale
The biggest blow here is that Russ doesn't have a Grendel. Magnus doesn't quite ...
Didn’t he beat the shit out of Angron?
And get punched by the Lion?
crisp heath
I'm thinking about everything I know about Russ and trying to pin him to an actual legend but I'm pretty sure he's just generic wolf viking
maybe Harald Fairhair, but that's a really big maybe
The only vikings I actually expect GW to know about in any kind of detail would be Beowulf, Sigurd and Harald Fairhair but none of them really fit
green loom
Beat the shit out of Angron?
Mf the only fight Russ won was against Magnus
Even then he lost a heart doing it
crisp heath
I'm looking through Leman's backstory before he took his legion
Little bit of Odin, little bit of Thor
Just a generic viking guy
Why don't they ever make viking themed characters based on the really cool myths
Like Tyr put his hand in a wolf's mouth to bind all the evil in the world
Just tell me this isn't metal as hell
We get Loki characters all the time, but never the coolest story
Ok so I have to tell this story, it's great
The long and short of it is, there was this father who lost a board game to a giant, and as a prize the giant wanted his son, so they started a second game where every day the giant would come and try to find the son and if he did, he got to keep him
So the father prays to Odin who comes and turns the boy into a grain of wheat in a wheat field, and the giant comes out and just starts cutting all the wheat, but the boy is able to escape
So the next day the father prays to Hoenir, who turns the boy into a swan and hides him with other swans. The giant comes up, sees a flock of new swans, and immediately picks one up and eats it's head, which is somewhat upsetting for swan boy
So he runs away again
Finally the father prays to Loki
And Loki is like "yeah I'll protect your kid, but I need a favor"
"build me a boat house, and give me an iron bar"
So the father does that and the next day the giant comes back while Loki has the boy in a boat
Loki turns the boy into a fish egg and just shoves him up a fish's, well
So when Loki comes back, the giant's like "oh, yeah, it's a good day for fishing, I'll go do that instead"
So Loki panics and is like "ok, wait, I want to fish more, take me with you"
So they go out and the giant catches the fish the boy is hidden in and starts squeezing out eggs, like a normal person
Loki manages to catch the boy-egg and hides him behind his back, and tells him "as soon as we get to shore, jump out and run as fast as you can to the boathouse"
The boy does, the giant follows
And now here's the loony tunes shit
The giant gets stuck in the door with his massive, girthy body
and Loki picks up the iron rod and hits him over the head, killing him instantly
The end
crisp heath
Yes!
green loom
I was expecting context
Is it better than the MCU where he is, straight up, fucking himself?
crisp heath
"Himself" would be less troubling than most of Loki's bedroom activities tbh
green loom
I guess it is better than beastiality
crisp heath
One time he ate the heart of a woman burned at the stake and then gave birth to her
green loom
Though now the dilemma is if it counts if he's also a horse
crisp heath
Loki is basically Bugs Bunny, any time he has a problem he is quick to think of a solution that involves crossdressing
One time he called Odin gay and Odin was like "true, but you dress like a woman and had sex with a horse so we probably don't want to have this argument"
My bad, it was Frigg who was like "yes my husband is gay, let's not discuss that"
"They say that with spells | in Samsey once
Like witches with charms didst thou work;
And in witch's guise | among men didst thou go;
Unmanly thy soul must seem."
Frigg spake:
"Of the deeds ye two | of old have done
Ye should make no speech among men;
Whate'er ye have done | in days gone by,
Old tales should ne'er be told." ```"unmanly" is a euphemism here. The word in Old Norse was "Ergi", which is basically equivalent to the F slur for gay people today
green loom
Huh, TIL
crisp heath
Lokasenna. Great poem. Loki is just insulting all the gods, some of them get angry, some try to calm him down, and then he gets to Skadhi and she's just like, "oh, sick burn. I will now proceed to tie you to a rock and rip out your innards."
There's also a poem where Thor asks this old guy if he can ride in his boat, and the old guy literally says "who's this clown?"
"Who is the fellow yonder, | on the farther shore of the sound?"
The ferryman spake:
"What clown of clowns is yon, | that calls o'er the bay?" ```and then Thor's like "please let me get in your boat, I'm very tired" and the ferryman says "lol your mom's dead"
absolutely unhinged poems
desert dust
Didn't Loki fuck a horse
It wasn't him fucking a horse it was him getting impregnated by a horse
crisp heath
ok, so that's how baby horses are made
desert dust
Only if you want one with 8 legs
crisp heath
I do like the logic of "twice as many legs = twice as many fast"
desert dust
8 wheel cars from my crayon drawings where right
crisp heath
The actual logic is way cooler though
So basically there's also an 8 legged horse that exists very tangentially in some Indian poems, not like as a major figure or anything, just a footnote
but anyway it's probably has the same origin as sleipnir because linguistics and comparative religion and blah blah blah
anyway, the 8 legged horse is the dead body being carried by 4 pallbearers
It is the horse of Bagri Maro.
What should we say of its legs?
This horse has eight legs.
What should we say of its heads?
This horse has four heads. . . .
Catch the bridle and mount the horse.```
crystal forum
``` What horse is this?
It is the horse of Bagri Maro.
What should we...
trying to reach the word count for the essay
if there's one thing i hate about english literature it's the usage of old english words for absolutely no reason when the same result can be achieved with modern english
I'll bring back gendered nouns if old is so superior
covert flame
wooden ridge
I've been always wondering if a space marine in a terminator armour can take a T-pose 👀
crimson kayak
I've been always wondering if a space marine in a terminator armour can take a T...
Old cathapracii and tartaros users definetly can
wooden ridge
Old cathapracii and tartaros users definetly can
Yeah, it seems that for Indomitus users even the A-pose is a challenge..
I am just a bit curious of how Game or Film creators can find a way to make it more mobile without breaking the iconic shape. In Space Marine it was painful to watch how shoulder pads were clipping through Nemeroth armour 
crimson kayak
Clipping
Lots of it
Same as "how can space marines point up without destroying their shoulder pad?"
wooden ridge
Same as "how can space marines point up without destroying their shoulder pad?"
Fair enough..
crimson kayak
Yeah they are not really thought out
echo vault
Didn't Loki fuck a horse
Mr hands
green loom
Yeah, it seems that for Indomitus users even the A-pose is a challenge..
I am j...
Yeah it's ALL clipping, regular marines shouldn't be able to raise their arms to the side or up basically, but they do anyway
wooden ridge
So, I assume that the lore description of the space marine armour being mobile and practical is actually an exaggerated imperium propaganda 
celest dome
Or you assume that Minis are more limited than the lore
coarse pumice
they've gradually become bigger and blockier
green loom
So, I assume that the lore description of the space marine armour being mobile a...
It's like irl plate armour but instead of form fitting, carefully articulated plates it's a bunch of slabs bolted on to the marine's body, with an extra massive slab of armour stuck on his shoulders
They can do crazy moves because they don't really elaborate on any of it beyond saying they did xyz
coarse pumice
wooden ridge
Or you assume that Minis are more limited than the lore
No, I don't think so. It doesn't really matter how big or detailed a space marine figure - there always will be issues of how they can move with such large shoulder pads
It's just a design choice aimed to make it cooler and recognizable over practical. And I have ABSOLUTELY nothing against that
green loom
Oh I mean yeah I think most of us like the shoulders
I dislike a lot of things about marines and I still mainly draw/write them 
queen laurel
I dislike a lot of things about marines and I still mainly draw/write them <:smi...
My opinion on them is just that they are quite the Mary Sue other than that they can be quite good except for the space wolves we don't talk about them
crystal forum
it's the official merican holiday
get your autogun and start blowing up krak grenades
crisp heath
My opinion on them is just that they are quite the Mary Sue other than that they...
There’s tiers of sueness in 40k
Emprah then Primarchs then Custodes then Astartes then Skitarii then Inquisitors then Sororitas then Elite Guard types then Guardsmen then assorted normies like the Rejects
crimson kayak
Emprah then Primarchs then Custodes then Astartes then Skitarii then Inquisitors...
Inquisitors are definetly above skitarii
storm jungle
Inquisitors are top tier Sues because the setting basically encourages you to make your own characters with them.
And I have seen many cringe inquisitor characters in my time, both canon and fanon
crystal forum
the only mary sue guardsmen are named regiments
tanith first and only is even more mary sue than ultramarines
green loom
Mfw someone reads the Cato books and realizes he's one of the better Marine characters 
storm jungle
Fr fr
coarse pumice
obiwan sherlock fans untie
coarse pumice
storm jungle
you know its old when its Spacewolves™️ instead of Space Wolves™️
summer rover
i like being reminded the crimson fists precede the imperial fists by like a year.
arctic talon
obiwan sherlock fans untie
he got potentially mentioned last edition lol
Unless there is another Inqusitor OSC
crystal forum
im still in denial that such a character name exists
crystal forum
i just noticed that genestealers use autoguns for their units
according to stats alone, lasguns and autoguns have the same effectiveness
however, the cadian sergeant's drum fed autogun has the rapid fire 2 type
arctic talon
according to stats alone, lasguns and autoguns have the same effectiveness
Ignore tabletop stats
It’s almost always not accurate to lore
Bcs it’s not nearly granular enough
Bcs by tabletop standards eldar are as strong as humans
Same with genestealer cultists
And both of those are way stronger on average
Also sisters of battle in power armor being as tough as guardsmen
And as strong
crystal forum
hey some guy said that tabletop lore came first so i wanted to entertain that idea
but still i think it kinda shows the idea that autoguns and lasguns are similar in effectiness
arctic talon
hey some guy said that tabletop lore came first so i wanted to entertain that id...
💀
crystal forum
of course the moment you add anything to a lasgun it probably outperforms autoguns by a lot
astral whale
but still i think it kinda shows the idea that autoguns and lasguns are similar ...
I mean they both kill people real dead.
crystal forum
like hellguns
astral whale
Other than that yeah. Lasguns are surperior but they’re overkill.
Against humans that is.
crystal forum
i don't think that's true
i think people tend to assume that lasguns are better but i don't think lore ever really proves that
spring cairn
a lasgun shot will tear off your arm
astral whale
i think people tend to assume that lasguns are better but i don't think lore eve...
Lasguns literally blow fist sized holes through people.
crystal forum
a lasgun shot will tear off your arm
so will a big ass caseless round
undone zodiac
I mean more factors in autogun vs las is that auto gun requires more effort in logistics
astral whale
I mean more factors in autogun vs las is that auto gun requires more effort in l...
I’d imagine a lot more can go wrong with a lasgun.
spring cairn
yeah but i can't refill my caseless ammuniton gun's mag by throwing them in a campfire
crystal forum
I mean more factors in autogun vs las is that auto gun requires more effort in l...
yeah that's the main reason that the imperium uses them imo
undone zodiac
Other is loaded by light boxes that recharge vs multiple mags that add up in weight
spring cairn
checkmate autocucks
crystal forum
i don't think imperium goes through the trouble of making lasguns just for negligible combat performance
on a logistical level it's a lot easier to ship power packs than it is to ship trillions of cartridges
astral whale
Then again there’s my point that Lasguns are overkill against civilians and other human targets.
undone zodiac
Likr lasgun is the ultimate firearm for rifleman
If it existed today other guns would ragequit
astral whale
Likr lasgun is the ultimate firearm for rifleman
Tau Pulserifles.
crystal forum
im talking about pure combat performance though
i think autoguns and lasguns are pretty much the same
astral whale
im talking about pure combat performance though
Tau Plasma rifles.
arctic talon
Tau Pulserifles.
Um akshully that’s more logistical trouble 🤓
But lasguns are a logistics experts wet dream
spring cairn
i think autoguns and lasguns are pretty much the same
well no, because laser can't ricochet
astral whale
Um akshully that’s more logistical trouble 🤓
Em akshully PEW PEW.
crystal forum
well no, because laser can't ricochet
are you seriously implying that collateral damage is an issue in 40k
undone zodiac
And saying lasgun is weak is like saying m16 is bad because it cant kill tank
spring cairn
if you're talking pure combat perf, laser can't ricohet yes
so can't bounce off helmets
arctic talon
And saying lasgun is weak is like saying m16 is bad because it cant kill tank
It can kill a WW1 era one 
spring cairn
at any angle
storm jungle
hey some guy said that tabletop lore came first so i wanted to entertain that id...
Late but they meant as in tabletop comes first as a product
Lore for the stuff around it is made later
arctic talon
^
storm jungle
especially since GW's departments are VERY disconnected
storm jungle
they dont know what the other is usually doing
astral whale
are you seriously implying that collateral damage is an issue in 40k
As someone who often plays Admech. Yes. Apologize to the cybermastiff you nailed four blocks down
crystal forum
so can't bounce off helmets
weeeeeeell lasers can deflect from surfaces if the incident angle is high enough 
crystal forum
Late but they meant as in tabletop comes first as a *product*
Lore for the stuf...
no they said that tabletop is lore
arctic talon
no they said that tabletop *is* lore
If anyone says that they’re stupid
crystal forum
and every edition defines lore
arctic talon
In Minecraft
crystal forum
so basically by their logic every edition is a retcon lol
storm jungle
bruh
storm jungle
going by that logic Guilliman is not alive and the Indomitus Crusade didnt happen
💀
arctic talon
Lol
crystal forum
yeah i didn't get it either
arctic talon
Tabletop stats are amess
astral whale
going by that logic Guilliman is not alive and the Indomitus Crusade didnt happe...
I mean. Did it really tho or is that just Imperial Propoganda?
storm jungle
I mean. Did it really tho or is that just Imperial Propoganda?
💀
astral whale
Cadia still exists. It’s just space dust.
arctic talon
Astroid field akshully
crystal forum
lasguns are probably also easier to clean and are lighter than autoguns
arctic talon
🤓
crystal forum
though i don't think cleaning a lasgun crystal is easy
astral whale
lasguns are probably also easier to clean and are lighter than autoguns
Tbh if you’re comparing the two weapons you have to decide what the intended target is.
crystal forum
that's the thing, i think both are similar in what they can reasonably kill
astral whale
If it’s Orks then actually there might be an argument for autoguns as Orks might be less pissed at the sound of Dakka.
crystal forum
autoguns aren't the assault rifles of our present day, they're overkill against humans too
rustic forum
Also ammo is much easier to get, there are hand cranks for charging lasgun battery packs when your in a bad situation
astral whale
autoguns aren't the assault rifles of our present day, they're overkill against ...
If anything they’re worse lmao
crystal forum
in terms of stopping power, definitely not
astral whale
@crystal forum do I need to pull out the lore accurate 1911 in 40k?
crystal forum
wait what
crimson kayak
Ye
crystal forum
like straight from the dark ages?
crimson kayak
But isn't that considered a stub technically?
crystal forum
wow some artist really wanted his favorite gun in there huh
astral whale
crystal forum
it doesn't even fit in with 40k design lol
arctic talon
Yeah but funny
crystal forum
the more i learn about old 40k the more i think it was all a joke
astral whale
it doesn't even fit in with 40k design lol
Okay that being said I want a commissar that wields one of these instead of a boltgun to issue out “less lethal” corporal punishments.
arctic talon
This new scheme is pretty
crystal forum
does less lethal mean the guardsman won't immediately die
astral whale
does less lethal mean the guardsman won't immediately die
Oh, no, it just means the guardsmen isn’t worth a bolt round.
Those are expensive.
crystal forum
wow that's insulting
astral whale
wow that's insulting
I know, isn’t it great?
crimson kayak
This new scheme is pretty
Carnage looking mf
crystal forum
pulling out the WW2 glock to finesse some insubordinate
arctic talon
Carnage looking mf
Very red
crimson kayak
Also necromunda autogun
crimson kayak
Or house orlock oversized autopistol
crystal forum
isn't it funny that oversized designs are always treated as better
crimson kayak
Ye for 40k guns mostly just never look up what bullet they should be firing
Doesn't make sense
crystal forum
maybe authors are trying to emulate the real life problem of soldiers never having the best equipment they need for their current situation but the fact that they always say it makes it funny
crystal forum
meanwhile eldar are shooting ninja weapons at people
crimson kayak
Ye for 40k guns mostly just never look up what bullet they should be firing
Looks at the agriipina wich in lore is said to use long 8.25mm ammo
crystal forum
oh yeah it's pretty funny that they even bother giving detailed stat sheets
but then it looks like they wrote random numbers
crimson kayak
They most probably did tbf
crystal forum
it's also a lot funnier when they mix caliber and metric system together
crimson kayak
Wich makes it funnier considering how seemingly no bullet in 40k seems to go over the 9mm range
crystal forum
tank sheets are also very funny
i'll get the leman russ
btw the amount of armour on this stat sheet is the equivalent of WW2 era armour lol
green loom
so basically by their logic every edition is a retcon lol
The lore exists to sell the tabletop
crystal forum
naaah
green loom
The tabletop itself doesn't really do shit to the lore beyond influencing who gets killed or brought back
crystal forum
the lore exists to sell overpriced audiobooks
crystal forum
true
reading soul drinkers makes me want to buy plastic
this passage with the exterminator russ was pretty cool
after the first shot is fired there's a bunch of sparking electronics in the tank and the driver has to use a fire extinguisher to put out a small fire on the console lol
the entire crew compartment is filled with the humming sound of the recharging plasma coils
and it even mentions that since the tank has no sponsons it needs infantry support to cover its sides. i love it when writers know a thing or two about tank warfare
coarse pumice
the guns look oversized because you needed them to be for the model to show the weapon distinctly and not break to a stiff wind
same with the heads
crystal forum
https://youtube.com/shorts/9xw0cEbJlLE?feature=share
i love how the slow mo shows him being punched in the shoulder instead of firing a gun lmao
crimson kayak
btw the amount of armour on this stat sheet is the equivalent of WW2 era armour ...
Tbf it's made of Fantasy materials
desert dust
I think brag did
storm jungle
Whos brag
normal people can fire bolters
your arms are only gonna break if you are some disheveled starving homeless person
crystal forum
Tbf it's made of Fantasy materials
that literally makes no difference
crimson kayak
Tbf it does when you don't know how resistant is is compared to modern armour
desert dust
He's a guardsmen from guants ghosts.
Dudes like 8 foot tall and can't hit shit.
storm jungle
I mean still doesnt matter
normal trained people can fire bolters
aka the entire reject cast of darktide
GW also approves and patents this stuff before its put in the game
so its entirely fair and normal
crystal forum
Tbf it does when you don't know how resistant is is compared to modern armour
armour made of metal or composites actually have very similar ballistic properties when shot at. it always comes down to how thick it is
unless you're using reactive armour or something
for how huge leman russes are it's pretty dumb that it wouldn't have more armour
which i'll assume it does because whoever made the stats has no clue
crimson kayak
" Even impacts powerful enough to lurch the tank several meters sideways will fail to penetrate through its tough hide"
I don't remember any modern armour doing that
We don't know how effectively resistant stuff like ferro-steel and plasteel is
crystal forum
they'd still make the russes smaller if the armour really wasn't that thick
again i'm saying it's an error on the stat sheet
like the speed of leman russes is wildly inconsistent
crimson kayak
As is everything else tbf
crystal forum
no you can't use that excuse for everything
some things are a lot more consistent than others
arctic talon
The russes stats given make no sense
Overall tbh
But it was prolly made up by some bored British guy
Who needed to get a few more pages in into imperial armor
crystal forum
it's annoying because some writers clearly care about the accurate portrayal of tanks
arctic talon
Others don’t
crystal forum
then some guy decided to just write whatever sounds right
which is funny to me because brits love tanks
anyways we still don't have any lore on the rogal dorn
i really want something GW pls just tell me where the hell it's from
rose thorn
Love how a cop for a dog shit hive scum planet have more advance weapons then the militarum
storm jungle
Yeah its because Helmawr supplies his enforcers good
they are his own private army so they get access to the best equipment
storm jungle
Uhh kinda
rose thorn
Also that’s 2 factions mroe advance then the militarum on necromunda
storm jungle
Enforcers are just expected to defend a planet since they are the cops but as Darktide has shown they get entirely steamrolled
Arbites meanwhile no they always are independant unless called upon by someone like an Inquisitor
rose thorn
Wait enforcers are on multiple planets?
storm jungle
the new lore states that they sometimes have enough ammo/munitions to wage an entire defensive war from their precinct
rose thorn
I thought it was just a necromunda thing
storm jungle
Yeah Enforcers are local cops
storm jungle
Necromunda is a special case because they are all helmawr (the governor's) personal army
because corrupt prick
arctic talon
Palestine enforcers are
rose thorn
Lmao
arctic talon
Way more armed then average lol
storm jungle
Yeah this
arctic talon
And they’re a gang in their own right
storm jungle
Helmawr gets them the best shit
your actual local enforcer will almost always be shittily equipped
because the actual lawkeepers are the arbites but they dont care about petty crimes
they are here to make sure the tithe is paid
rose thorn
I really liked hired gun I might check out more the books
storm jungle
Necro has fun books
rose thorn
If it’s like, a rich planet or something I imagine it will have better enforcers
storm jungle
Yeah it has lots of resources that it provides to the Segmentum Solar and beyond and is very proud of this fact
the planet itself is a shithole but still lol
you can read a lot about the planet from the Gang Codexes
rose thorn
Lol
I had an idea for a kt of enforcer type guys that operate on top of those huge fuck off titans
The ones where nobles just live it on them
green loom
Palestine enforcers are
Palestine enforcers?
rose thorn
That’s so fucking cooLll
crystal forum
holy shit a space marine just cut a bullet in half
uneven temple
arctic talon
💀
nocturne crest
Did any of the traitor legions have any genetic flaws before their fall to heresy?
green loom
Depends what you count as flaws
The EC were almost wiped out by something called "The Blight"
The Thousand Sons were constantly plagued by the Flesh Change
Luna Wolves had lots of Horus Doppelgangers
crystal forum
if by flaw you mean the ones that give special units like in loyalist chapters then i don't think so because that's reserved for sellable minis
green loom
I don't think there's anything else of note
Maybe Night Lords being pale and having better vision in the dark
crystal forum
im starting to like mark 3 armour btw
i think one day i'll get mark 3 horus heresy minis then put mark 6 helmets on them
mark 3 helmets look so bad
green loom
It's definitely an acquired taste
I'm a MK4 person
Except for the helmet
At least not the Maximus one, since there's like 50 variants of the damn thing
queen laurel
normal people can fire bolters
Yeah they say that is only going to happen if you're an average person but you forgot one thing, this is warhammer 40K
You can be physically fit enough that you can even carry a heavy bolter
shadow plover
Whos brag
Also seen using a heavy bolter in a similar fashion, here with an autocannon. Cool dude
shadow plover
formal belfry
gloomy citrus
celest dome
Necromunda is a special case because they are all helmawr (the governor's) perso...
Palatine Enforcer aren't on the whole planet. Just the Palatine Cluster iirc
crimson kayak
Palatine Enforcer aren't on the whole planet. Just the Palatine Cluster iirc
They even in the badlands now
And in fact their badland models are soo good
Also yeah, forgot about the fact that Palanite enforcers are equipped with drum fed bolters
Btw the Palanite name comes from their Precinct of origin
As in campaigns they are rule wise unable to hold any territory and use only the Palanite Precint
summer rover
sounds like they beat anyone they recruit with a brain to death to me.
crimson kayak
sounds like they beat anyone they recruit with a brain to death to me.
think of it as a privatized schola progenium
summer rover
So i'm right!
rough condor
Would enforcers on other planets, or even locations, have entirely different appearances?
It would seem like they are locally managed unlike the sorts of Tempestus scions
celest dome
Scions are a global system
Enforcer are local
Like the PDF
But they work for the Arbites most often than not, so it make sense that they sometime get issued similar gears as other Enforcer
arctic talon
Would enforcers on other planets, or even locations, have entirely different app...
Enforcers are very varied
crystal forum
enforcers are fairly weak and easily corruptible because they'll serve anyone with power over them
meanwhile arbites have a level of loyalty to the emperor that's comparable to custodes
they're the only units on a planet that you can be 100% sure will not turn over to chaos and will die to the last man
arctic talon
Yeah it also means they usually get their brains blown out by chaos cultists first
if they can do it
near wasp
Abrites sometimes fall but its much rarer than normal people falling
crystal forum
Abrites sometimes fall but its much rarer than normal people falling
i dare you to find one instance of arbites switching sides
your reward will be an ogryn's friendship
crimson kayak
Ye, Palanites are an exception through as they are Arbites light
With the Sanctioners Dreadnought-Automata thingies literally being Robocop in 40k
In general through Enforcers can be as varied as Ig regiments
near wasp
i dare you to find one instance of arbites switching sides
Watcher of the throne, one of the heretic leaders was a marshall of the arbites
crystal forum
Watcher of the throne, one of the heretic leaders was a marshall of the arbites
damn. a marshal too
near wasp
On holy terra none the less
crystal forum
goes to show that nobody is immune to the temptations of chaos
crystal forum
In general through Enforcers can be as varied as Ig regiments
speaking of regiments, in the soul drinkers book im reading there's a rough riders regiment that's not death korp
crystal forum
i thought rough riders was the name of krieg cavalry
crimson kayak
Nope
It's the name of all cavalry regiments
Or well, usually it is
Then you have the guys riding dino's and stuff like that
crystal forum
didn't know anybody else was suicidal enough to use horses
crimson kayak
Ye, ench why it's mostly contained to low tech worlds like Attilan or they have Uber-horses like krieg
crystal forum
something i don't get with guardsmen is why none of them ever get to use rhinos and their tank variants
crystal forum
daaaamn
crimson kayak
also the jetpack-gun but we don't talk about it
crystal forum
im guessing it's because of tabletop balancing that they don't anymore
arctic talon
something i don't get with guardsmen is why none of them ever get to use rhinos ...
TLDR supply chain issues
also they're just worse
then their options on tabletop
in 7th marines would ally in guard to get chimeras lol
crystal forum
then their options on tabletop
worse than chimeras?
crimson kayak
im guessing it's because of tabletop balancing that they don't anymore
Mostly it's that back in rogue trader most factions could take pretty much everything
arctic talon
bcs of how fucking good they were
Chimeras can fit 13
Rhino can only fit 10
chimeras also arguably have better firepower
crystal forum
don't rhinos have more guns
crimson kayak
Yeah always remember different patterns and stuff
crystal forum
do they get more wounds
arctic talon
chaos rhino has a havoc launcher
crystal forum
wtf
crystal forum
see but that's part of what i don't get
crystal forum
rhinos look bog standard and marines have infinite numbers of them
crimson kayak
Standard rhino is literally the Metal Boxes meme
crystal forum
so why are rhinos reserved for elite units
arctic talon
The militarium doesn't use them literally bcs money
they're expensive to maintain
and have picky machine spirits
crystal forum
they really don't look that advanced
arctic talon
they aren't
the machine spirits are just a bitch in them
they grow very attached
and also they don't really fit the needs of the militarium either
if they need a fast transport they have the taurox
crimson kayak
Also rememeber the predator is literally just a rhino with a big gun
arctic talon
or the other one I forgot the name of
crystal forum
why don't sororitas use taurox then
arctic talon
why don't sororitas use taurox then
Power armor bulky
Rhino designed for power armor
Taurox also is a piece of crap thats not that durable lol
crystal forum
Also rememeber the predator is literally just a rhino with a big gun
the gun is smaller than a leman russe's arsenal though lol
arctic talon
its very fast
queen laurel
the machine spirits are just a bitch in them
"Sir the tank is out of Commission"
"why isn't it working then?"
"Well John got shot and he's the only one who knows how to tell the tank's favorite bedtime story"
arctic talon
Lol pretty much lol
crystal forum
so from what you're telling me, the main reason they use rhinos is because it can fit power armour and it's decently tough
crimson kayak
Yep
arctic talon
so from what you're telling me, the main reason they use rhinos is because it ca...
Also fast
crimson kayak
Literally a metal box that goes broom broom and brings marines from point a to point b
arctic talon
Chimera used to be faster but that’s changed in 9e
crystal forum
why don't they use guardsman tanks though
crimson kayak
Too cramped
crystal forum
space marines used to have their equivalent of the baneblade but they don't even get that anymore
crimson kayak
Guard tanks insides are the bitchest of bitches regarding space
arctic talon
space marines used to have their equivalent of the baneblade but they don't even...
They usually had mortal crew
crimson kayak
With the russ literally stated to be cramped even for humans
crystal forum
Guard tanks insides are the bitchest of bitches regarding space
hahahaha and soul drinkers steal chimeras in one of the books. it's from the perspective of an exterminator russ gunner's view
crimson kayak
hahahaha and soul drinkers steal chimeras in one of the books. it's from the per...
Chimera is the only one that could fit as they are troop transports so larger and emptier
So they got as close as they could get lol
crystal forum
on the radio the gunner hears a commander asking where the rear echelon medical chimeras went and all of a sudden he sees them barrelling past them towards the enemy fortress
arctic talon
Chimera can fit ogryn so it can fit marines
But I think like
Ogryn take up 3 spaces
Or something
crystal forum
They usually had mortal crew
and yet you can't use them for guardsmen 😤
arctic talon
Yeah lol
crystal forum
that fucking astartes keyword
arctic talon
Lol
crystal forum
kinda funny though that it gets all the astartes bonuses even with potentially human crews
i guess the crew could be chapter serfs
crystal forum
i just really wanted more guardsmen tank variety
if anything they should have gotten a light tank instead of the rogal dorn
idk why GW thought they needed a heavier tank
queen laurel
i just really wanted more guardsmen tank variety
I agree more things to blow up for Tank bustaz
crystal forum
kinda annoying that the interesting tanks are forge world exclusives
therefore terribly balanced
GW could have made the macharius a normal tank instead of adding the rogal dorn
just look at how sexy this thing is
lmao i just realized that a variant of the macharius has two vanquisher cannons
when you REALLY want an enemy tank dead
queen laurel
lmao i just realized that a variant of the macharius has two vanquisher cannons
Hey it works engineer once said if guns don't work use more guns
coarse pumice
they need to remove the turret, and make the sponsons more impressive and further forward, and call it a mark tank
though we have our mark tank (sorta) still
crystal forum
i think you could create a WW1 looking tank by taking a thunderer and putting sponsons on it
coarse pumice
nice
crystal forum
you're not supposed to put sponsons on it and the rulebook doesn't let you
but the track parts are literally the exact same as the ones on a leman russ
queen laurel
you're not supposed to put sponsons on it and the rulebook doesn't let you
One thing I will take about the space marines is reading is just something you throw out of the window
crystal forum
i'm thinking of printing myself a thunderer and putting sponsons on it but treating is as a normal russ demolisher rule wise
it just looks so cool
holy shit this smells like 90's
were painting standards just lower back then
crimson kayak
Models were also worse
So less point in godly painting an horrible face or models with close to no details
rose thorn
i got 5 intercessors from a preowned LGS, but i came with 6 and the guns are missing half of the gun because i got two of teh same sprue lmao
what should i convert htem into
rose thorn
holy shit this smells like 90's
luckily the old hamemr vehicles dont age because they are just brikcs
arctic talon
were painting standards just lower back then
Not really
Just less realistic ig
I do like the super colorful painting style
Back then
rose thorn
im planning to get old hammer shit since my space mariens are gonna be a godo mix of old hammer and new hammer
first born iand primaris i mean
celest dome
Models were also worse
And the paint was also worse no ?
rose thorn
and with the death of teh key words of primaris and first born im totally gonan ahev mixed units
crimson kayak
And the paint was also worse no ?
Ye, lots of reasons all around
crimson kayak
first born iand primaris i mean
Oh ok, cause oldhammer usually means rogue trader era stuff or similar lol
I always wanted to build a 13/5 Regiment (Hylgar Hell Raisers) army and try to convert new stuff into oldhammer stuff
near wasp
Is ghazkull hunting angron or is that just the community being wildly speculative again
queen laurel
Is ghazkull hunting angron or is that just the community being wildly speculativ...
Honestly I'm one of the people who kind of speculated that to happen because well it's his you know favorite fight buddy
near wasp
Because i constantly hear abput it but ive never been given a source
queen laurel
Because i constantly hear abput it but ive never been given a source
yeah right now it doesn't seem to be the case
celest dome
Is ghazkull hunting angron or is that just the community being wildly speculativ...
Meme
near wasp
Oh yeah for sure
celest dome
Honestly I'm one of the people who kind of speculated that to happen because wel...
Wasn't the rivality mostly spurred by memes, like iirc Ghazkull didn't really care about him or something
rose thorn
I always wanted to build a 13/5 Regiment (Hylgar Hell Raisers) army and try to c...
YEE i want to do that too
queen laurel
Wasn't the rivality mostly spurred by memes, like iirc Ghazkull didn't really ca...
ghaz treated yarrick with respect and even let him go and he said this to him before letting him go "good enemies are hard to find"
near wasp
Ghaz respected him greatly as afar as i know,
rose thorn
i mgiht make primaris jetpack fuckers i forgot the name
queen laurel
ghaz also admitted at times to losing to yarrick
He truly finds him as a worthy opponent and if it's anyone who gets to kill yarrick it would be ghaz
Also one thing orks hate is getting one of their kills stolen
naive burrow
Why not aggressively non-binary Hekatrix?
arctic talon
time to make the hardest quesition of my life
Flip coin
If you don’t like it
Pick the other one
celest dome
Cut both in two and make it Half and Half
rose thorn
love the idea, but i have like 3 units of wyches to get through
i jsut got my dyrkhari boaridng patrol
celest dome
1 Fem, 1 Masc, 1 Both/Neither
rose thorn
TRUE
ill make the non binary in the blodo bride or what ever the elite unit is called
let me read teh index cards eal quick
celest dome
Happy to helf the bd-sm elves
rose thorn
:> helal hype
i swear to fucking god its so hot im gonna die from heat stroke lmao
like
i dont have AC atm
crystal forum
i dont have AC either but luckily the ground is mostly sand here so basements get really cold
also im pissed that leman russes are out of stock
rose thorn
wait
rose thorn
do drukhari not have the upgraded units anymore
arctic talon
I'm 99% sure GW is reboxing them
crystal forum
im starting to get the impression that the most bought units are the ones that will have better metas
arctic talon
do drukhari not have the upgraded units anymore
prolly won't have them till the codex like in 8e
bcs GW is weird
crystal forum
if only that was true
idk i just see lots of really powerful units being out of stock. leman russes are going to be pretty good during 10th apparently too
arctic talon
idk i just see lots of really powerful units being out of stock. leman russes ar...
Leman russes are always good lol
its gona be a cold day in hell
before they're unusable or bad
crystal forum
meanwhile rogal dorn is under the top sellers list but there's no fucking way anybody's buying that
arctic talon
the top sellers list is literally just a monthly rotation
of random stuff lol
also if people were meta slaving
the Basalisk would be sold out
crystal forum
is it good?
arctic talon
absurdly so
also GSC are strong as hell and acolytes and Jackals are still in stock so
meh
crystal forum
what's GSC again
rose thorn
if y ou areplaying for the meta then by the time you are gonna finish 500 points the meta will change
genestealer cult
arctic talon
Genestealer cult
crystal forum
oh
crystal forum
im just mad that all guardsmen infantry are out of stock
even the kill team
actually wait
yeah no all out of stock
crystal forum
kasrkin, krieg and even the damn navy breachers
arctic talon
Editon starts are ironically the worst time
to hobby
BECAUSE THEY'RE REBOXING EVERYTHING AGH
crystal forum
what's reboxing anyways
crystal forum
wait so everything on the site is 9th?
arctic talon
its 10th
they just didn't need new boxes in GW's eyes
its very arbitrary what they choose to rebox
and what they don't
but the new guardsmen kit did have an instruction error
crystal forum
could this mean they might update the models
crystal forum
god damn it
the only things i can buy are cadians or kriegers on forge world
forge world sells so much astra militarum stuff but it's ALL KRIEG
crystal forum
you literally get more support units than infantry units in that kit
arctic talon
They sell normaly infantry kits
tbf
but DKOK has always been expensive as shit lol
crystal forum
i still think that's barely enough infantry for an army
arctic talon
but at least its not solar auxilia
arctic talon
i still think that's barely enough infantry for an army
It isn't
crystal forum
is this the reason why chaos players are rich as fuck
arctic talon
4 DKOK squads + command + HWT is like 500 points
crystal forum
zerg armies must be so expensive
crystal forum
but at least its not solar auxilia
did forge world ever sell solar auxilia infantry
crystal forum
does it still?
arctic talon
They aren't in 40k
green loom
They have their own rules for 30k right
arctic talon
but yeah you can run them as the most expensive guard army in existance lol
yeah
they're SEQ
they have carapace armor
crystal forum
30k is a different game?
green loom
Yeah
crystal forum
horus heresy?
crystal forum
oh ok
green loom
It's got wacky stuff like insta kill duelists
arctic talon
if you're wondering what the most elite army in horus heresy is
excluding superheavies
its mechanicum
like by far lol
crystal forum
huh
arctic talon
Thallaxi cost an arm and a leg
crystal forum
so are there any transferable units between 30k and 40k
arctic talon
and make every other "basic" infantry unit their bitch
arctic talon
so are there any transferable units between 30k and 40k
mostly vehicles
green loom
so are there any transferable units between 30k and 40k
A good chunk of the basic marines
arctic talon
and also they all got sent to legends
also yeah marines
you can use most HH marines as 40k units
crystal forum
yeah i noticed that a lot of 30k vehicles seem to have rules in 9th
so is 30k updated at the same time as 40k
arctic talon
Almost all of them got sent to legends in 10th lol
crystal forum
what's legends
arctic talon
its also way less balanced
arctic talon
what's legends
not usable in Comp play
green loom
what's legends
Technically playable but not really
green loom
They also don't get updated rules
arctic talon
they do
green loom
They do?
green loom
Ah
crystal forum
i guess relegating stuff to outside comp at least lets them be lazy about balancing without affecting normal fun rules
crystal forum
so is forge world stuff usable in comp
crystal forum
i was actually wondering if rules even mention super old minis
green loom
Generally removing peoples' ability to use their long term range of expensive models is frowned upon so they try keeping everything playable at least ig
arctic talon
yeah that lol
crystal forum
in legends
is legends like its own rulebook or something
arctic talon
its a free digital pdf
crystal forum
where do i find a list of all those units
crystal forum
bruh so malcador and macharius are both legends
and death riders too
AND death korp marshal
arctic talon
AND death korp marshal
No
They’re forgeworld lol
They aren’t legends
Legends is it’s own specific thing
arctic talon
bruh so malcador and macharius are both legends
Nah it’s forgeworld
It’s in the forgeworld index
@crystal forum it looks like this
while a legends datasheet
looks like this
arctic talon
right so the only legends units are horus heresy era
And some other super old stuff that’s no longer in production
crystal forum
there aren't as many as i expected
rose thorn
while a legends datasheet
Oh cool
crystal forum
i thought there was a ton of super old models
rose thorn
I always wanted them to be on table top
crystal forum
so is there a 40k equivalent to this https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/04/j2TwD3c2AB8oLsVW.pdf
this looks so cool
you can make an entirely custom guardsmen unit
green loom
That's just imperial guard no
arctic talon
legacies is actually different
from legends
legacies in Horus heresy is a whole other can of worms lol
arctic talon
you can make an entirely custom guardsmen unit
Custom subfaction building has been a thing for a while
it was in 9e for every faction but world eaters and CSM
crystal forum
then why can't i find a PDF like this for 40k guardsmen
arctic talon
also daemons ig
arctic talon
then why can't i find a PDF like this for 40k guardsmen
because its in the codex
which costs money
and also its less fluff heavy
crystal forum
will it be free in 10th
arctic talon
if they bring back custom regiments maybe?
idk
odds are the whole codex is gona end up on a pirating site anyways
crystal forum
wait so are custom regiments gone or not
arctic talon
For now yes
bcs we're playing indexhammer
(hell)
which is GW has basicially hardreset the rules somewhat
and that means all previous codecies and suplements are out of date
so they have given us a free index for every single army
@crystal forum if you would like to take a look at them
arctic talon
yeah we don't have full codecies yet
The space marine and Tyranid codexes
will prolly be a good indication of if we're getting custom subfactions again
also if you want to look at the old subfaction stuff check your dms in a sec
crystal forum
what im wondering is why it says in the militia PDF that forge world and citadel both sell tons of options for guardsmen. was that once a thing?
arctic talon
Sorta?
forgeworld used to produce a kit for standard cadians called hazardous environemnt armor
snow timber
I noticed that listening to Industrial, Gothic, Black, or Death Metal while painting Drukhari feels... right?
arctic talon
but aside from that not really lol
when the imperial cults and militias book came out
we just had Cadians, catachan, some elysian and Death korps of krieg
along with some forgeworld "upgrade" kits
now you might be wondering why did FW stop selling them
big suprise they costed like 100 something USD for 6 guys lol
never forget the imperial guard totally not a warthog that came out a year after halo 3
crystal forum
it's for kitbashers
arctic talon
makes sense
now consume product
cults and militia in HH is like
the kitbashers wet dream army tbh
crystal forum
yeah that's why my custom regiment will pretty much be that
im so happy i found this
and it even lets me put autoguns on all my guardsmen
praise the emperor 
it even lets me use rhinos
hahaha and i think it brings back conscripts through the levy squad
random chance to instantly lose all your units lmao
crimson kayak
never forget the imperial guard totally not a warthog that came out a year after...
I hate it, gimme 4 of them
crystal forum
kinda lame that i can't use militia rules for 40k but i guess GW wants to keep the fluff to 30k
crystal forum
Humans that are not the solar auxilia?
are you joking lol
summer rover
most planets have their own armies.
crystal forum
also i just realized that the starter sets were removed from the GW store
guess we're getting the 10th edition ones very soon
summer rover
these are not a big and sometimes pretty janky compaired to the guard, but having what amounts to a garrison on every world makes sense
crimson kayak
Oh I thought you meant as something like models and stuff
arctic talon
Wait there's militia in 30k?
yeah its called Cults and Militia
regarding the army
they have like 0 minis
crimson kayak
Oh that's why I never heard of them
crystal forum
Oh I thought you meant as something like models and stuff
nah militias are made for kitbashers to invent whatever they want
crimson kayak
Never looked up HH rules
crimson kayak
Wot
crimson kayak
Lol
crystal forum
Never looked up HH rules
well this looks incredibly new anyways. the militia rules were created this year
crimson kayak
1 tonk army
arctic talon
well this looks incredibly new anyways. the militia rules were created this year
False
they've existed since HH 1.0
summer rover
they loved them some sponsons back in the golden age of mankind.