40k-lore-chat

[rose thorn]

soryr lol

for my dumb rant

[storm jungle]

all good

its hard to find a favorite chapter sometimes

i dont have any since i almost like all of them

[rose thorn]

i tried making my own, but i cant be creative unless i have a restriction

im about to scroll ebay for poeple selling thier armies ebay rescues

i hate saying ebay rescues its just gross

nayway i feel like oldhammer chapters are generally better then new ones

[crystal forum]

i'll be honest, this is me

[rose thorn]

i wish there were chaos warbands besides those two that are interesting

[arctic talon]

I like the cleaved

they worship nurgle but also don't have that much of a focus on the disease and plague marine part

[winter vessel]

cool, a nurgle worshiper that doesn't look like a reddit moderator

[arctic talon]

also fun fact they never take their helmets out and they seem to constantly leak oil

Said oil is usable to refuel vehicles as well

[winter vessel]

I can imagine they just run out of fuel . "GRANDFATHER DAMNIT, we're stuck here! Someone call Larry, tell em we need a refuel."

[arctic talon]

lmao

[winter vessel]

I like the Red Corsairs, their background is very interesting

and a tragic end with their friendship with the Lamenters

[arctic talon]

Got something even funnier

Comissars can execute the lord solar

actually wait even better

THEY CAN EXECUTE THEMSELVES

[winter vessel]

wakes up one morning, having to oversee a Death Korp Regiment Commissar: "nah not feelin it." unloads bolt pistol round into face

[arctic talon]

Cures battleshock in the squad

[undone zodiac]

Does that persona self shooting thing

Or wherever that thing was from

[rose thorn]

‘Thank god he’s finally dead’

[rose thorn]

Oh yeah they just like murder

[crimson kayak]

Warp ghosts will always be my favorite chaos warband

You know, being the only true time travelers of 40k

And not giving more than two shits about the chaos gods

[crystal forum]

god i love it when chaos groups don't give a damn about chaos. It make the gods look so powerless when they give gifts to people who never do anything for them

[pale onyx]

my favorite chaos groups are nurgle followers who actually are loyal and want to spread his gifts. too bad they are far and inbetween

[storm jungle]

thats literally all of them

[celest dome]

Who doesnt fit that theme ? Except Mortarion ?

[pale onyx]

they're more selfish usually and in it for immortality

[plush mason]

nurgle's "gifts" are the kind you never want to get and if you do get them you want to return them asap lol

[near wasp]

Nurgle gifts suck unless you embrace them

If you give up into stagnation and decay your fine

[crisp heath]

I think it would be nice to be covered in infected welts and eat worms if it wasn't going to kill me

[near wasp]

You know you can just eat worms right?

[pale onyx]

nurgles gifts are amazing

his swamps and gardens are amazing

[queen laurel]

Don't like the place because when i was eating ice cream there, a plague toad stole my ice cream

[pale onyx]

L bozo

[storm jungle]

Ohio???

[queen laurel]

Bro i had to beat, like 5 Orks for that ice cream and i literally lost an arm

Of course i would be mad

[pale onyx]

but plague toads get stomped on by nurgle himself so they ahve it bad enough, let them get the icecream

[queen laurel]

I already gave him one, he stole the second one i was saving for myself

[pale onyx]

he's stressed okay

[queen laurel]

Fine, i will admit this power claw implant is pretty sick but now i can't hold two ice creams

[arctic talon]

Florida

[plush mason]

https://tenor.com/view/ichawkeye-corn-cornfield-iowa-gif-26286275

[arctic talon]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/195404877688602624/1119326931159089193/IMG_4879.png

Idk why but this makes me laugh

[plush mason]

i guess they where worried people would get confused lol

[storm jungle]

Based interspecies racism

[arctic talon]

Commander Farsight believes in non ethereal supremacy

[astral whale]

I mean wouldn’t that be classism, not racism?

[storm jungle]

https://tenor.com/view/thats-the-joke-ranier-wolfcastle-mc-bain-the-simpsons-stand-up-comedy-gif-4372917

[arctic talon]

Technically there is genetic diffrence between etherals and other tau

[astral whale]

Okay… I want your opinions. Would Tau society be better off without Ethereal oversight?

[arctic talon]

Uhh

arguably better

[storm jungle]

Yeah like Tau society is already semi-good

the Ethereals just do all the psyops shit

so its not at its peak because of it

[plush mason]

dont ethereals have some strange mind control powers?

[astral whale]

I mean the castes are pretty much enslaved to the TauVa tho.

[arctic talon]

no

thats from an unrelaible narrator

*reliable

its most likely just extreme propaganda

the same way the imperium does it

[plush mason]

ah ok

[storm jungle]

I mean not really?

the Tau dont really have that many downsides in general

they just lack numbers and territory to be a superpower

can blame GW on that one

[arctic talon]

Tbh thats intentional

they're meant to be the new kids on the block

[plush mason]

is TauVa like the Qun but not as crazy extream?

[terse flume]

very plausibly not? like they're implied to have some kind of abstract precognition in places, and all the shit they do allegedly is to some obscure plan

they would be more interesting without them, or if they were just political leaders or something

that would be neat

[storm jungle]

Tau'va basically means Greater Good

its the the name of the philsophy

but uh, also the name of their god which is slowly forming in the Warp according to the Shadowsun book

[plush mason]

ok so it is like the Qun lol

[storm jungle]

I actually dont know what the Qun is

had to google

[plush mason]

lol

yeah its from DA

[storm jungle]

yeee

[plush mason]

https://tenor.com/view/iron-bull-dragon-age-punch-inquisition-qunari-gif-23958755

my fav race in the setting

[storm jungle]

they are great

[plush mason]

but yeah the Tau have always struck me as an unironically less extream version of the Qunari

in terms of their philosophy and social structure

[storm jungle]

Yeah its why people compare them to communist China under Pol Pot among other shit when its really not that similiar to it

[plush mason]

yeah its really not

[green loom]

Where's dis from

[plush mason]

dragon age Inquisition

[green loom]

Is it from a trailer

[plush mason]

yes

[green loom]

Aight

[plush mason]

from Ironbull's reveal trailer, he is the Qunari which is the big guy with the horns

[green loom]

Yeah ik

[plush mason]

ah

[green loom]

Never watched any of the inquisition trailers lmao

[plush mason]

they are good

[green loom]

Need more Knight Enchanter

[plush mason]

still funny to me that Ironbull is the only true Qunari to be a compainion

[green loom]

A Qunari KGB agent at that

[plush mason]

because iirc Sten from origins was exiled and thus a Talvashoth

[arctic talon]

Pol Pot was the ruler of cambodia

unless this is a joke

[storm jungle]

It is

[plush mason]

https://tenor.com/view/joji-filthy-frank-welcome-to-the-rice-fields-rice-fields-gif-15724064

[storm jungle]

because to the eyes of the average 40k fan tau are like

"Oh yeah they are asian, so that just means China, other countries dont exist"

"Because china was communist, im very smart"

[plush mason]

i think i lost a brain cell just reading that

[arctic talon]

POV imperum of man

[storm jungle]

LMAO

awful 💀

[arctic talon]

pol pot shot have been executed

but he lived to 70 years old and also remarried

[plush mason]

had he been overthrown he likely would have been

[arctic talon]

I mean

Veitnam literally invaded cambodia to remove him

[plush mason]

which is ironic given how vital his government was to them winning the war with the US lol

[arctic talon]

Tbh Vietnam allied itself moreso with the USSR then China post Vietnam war

And cambodia was in China's pocket

to stop soviet influence in east asia

[astral whale]

It’s such a small, overlooked detail that they don’t actually wear shoes.

[arctic talon]

tbh if you play the tabletop

you'll 100% know

its really aparant when you look at them

[near wasp]

I keep forgetting they have hooves and im shocked and terrified every single time i relearn it

[summer rover]

it's why we call them sheep

that and being gullible suckers.

[crimson kayak]

Btw regarding tau castes remember that they are also different biologically from one another, a bit like abhumans to humans

[crisp heath]

In 40k the galaxy is mostly populated by horses

[terse flume]

based on the current ratio of humans to chickens i'd assume there must be fuckin planets full of their domesticated species for every non-cow planet

[crisp heath]

We know chickens still exist so I'd imagine there's a similar human:chicken ratio

But grox have replaced cattle because they're easy to keep alive on pretty much any planet

[winter vessel]

grox are reptillian right? So It'd be like eating alligator in Louisiana then.

[storm jungle]

Wait are IRL cows not reptillian?

Could’ve fooled me

[crisp heath]

Alligator tastes more like pork and/or fish

[arctic talon]

Grox taste like cow according to some rich nobel in a book lol

[crisp heath]

Grox are just spess cows

[arctic talon]

yeah they're space cows

And have just as bad of a like

temper as irl cows

except more dangerous bcs sharper teeth

[winter vessel]

their artwork looks derpy.

[terse flume]

they all get lobotomized

[crisp heath]

Yeah I like to think grox aren't actually any more aggressive than a normal bull, people just haven't seen cows in so long that they assume something that big being temperamental is somehow a dangerous outlier

[terse flume]

as part of their routine raising, cause it makes them more managable

[winter vessel]

wonder if potatoes are a thing in 40k

[green loom]

It's probably like how people don't expect sheep to randomly shoot at you for no reason

[arctic talon]

tbh if they have the same temper as a cow

they'd still be way more dangerous

bcs of the sharp teeth and mass

[terse flume]

cows are deadly as fuck

[arctic talon]

this shit looks like it would murder me faster then a bull

even if it was half the size it isn't its bigger

[terse flume]

like an absolute ton of people die to cows every year

i wanna say the cute statistic was that at least for a period they were the deadliest animal in australia

[arctic talon]

tbh

cows are cute

sorta

[green loom]

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/XGAVjre2OX4

[crisp heath]

We know they have wheat and grapes, so I'd imagine they also have potatoes, especially since you can grow taters in open air

[winter vessel]

yey

[crisp heath]

That's actually a detail that kills me about amasec

I remember reading once that someone had amasec made from grain

So I had to double check and confirm, it is in fact from vinyards according to the wiki

Which means amasec is beer + cognac

These guys out here drinking alcoholic pilk

[celest dome]

Amasec might be liqueur, which can be made from grain

[arctic talon]

Amsec is prolly any sort of liquor

[crisp heath]

Yeah i guess i can see it being reinforced cognac too given how easily everyone seems to get blitzed

[arctic talon]

it prolly tastes like shit

and is highly toxic lol

[celest dome]

Prob depend on the origin/manufacture

[winter vessel]

there an excerpt that details the taste?

[arctic talon]

aside from it burning

no

but its prolly just a general word for alcohol

like prometheium is for flammable fuel

[crisp heath]

I'm pretty sure amasec is supposed to be a specific drink since we have specific names for other alcoholic drinks

I know for a fact I've read a book at some point where they just drank gin

[terse flume]

right but it's a big space empire, and people from scotland and ireland, like, basically next door let alone off planet, produced drinks that were similar but quite different called "whisky". and spelled them differently

in like no time at all

[arctic talon]

actually

Amsec might be like

brandy?

some sort of fortified spirit prolly

[terse flume]

you would think in the space future it would all be like, post actual ingredients, like american beer

[arctic talon]

I mean

it prolly is

we know you can make alcohol out of damaged lasgun power packs and some other crap

[crisp heath]

Yeah alcohol is synthesized from chemical components all the time in 40k

[terse flume]

oh i assume the guardsmen are in it all the fuckin time

ethanol having a ton of industrial uses, and humans being humans

[crisp heath]

I know the Valhallans and Tanith stay blasted pretty much 24/7, but the Tanith do have a good excuse

[crimson kayak]

There's a reason you have to lobotomize them to properly herd them

[crisp heath]

I also really like that excerpt about Abaddon making warp alcohol

It feels so out of character for him but it gives great house husband vibes

[celest dome]

The TSons also make some Warp Wine iirc

[crisp heath]

Isn't that just Ahriman?

[celest dome]

I think it's jus that Ahriman is great at it

[crisp heath]

‘I confess that I am. What materials did you use?’

He grinned. ‘The tears of virgins. The blood of children. You’re familiar with the mysteries of the warp, so you’ll know how it always is in these matters. Symbolism is everything.’

I removed my helm, just staring at him, unsure if he was telling the truth. The air carried the scent of rancid bronze.

‘Funny,’ Lheor chuckled as he drained the rest of the drink.

‘I try, I try. There was also venom from one of the Neverborn that manifested aboard the ship several years ago, which troubled me until I deceived it into containment. Another few noteworthy ingredients would be the corpses of several psykers and Neverborn, left to slow-dissolve in cooled plasma cradles. I then siphoned the remaining slime through hexagrammically warded purifiers.’```

It's trying so hard to be edgy but it'd just cute. He has a hobby

[near wasp]

The fuck

Did these guys just magically forget yeast exists

[arctic talon]

They’re in the eye of terror

Where the fuck are they gona get yeast

[celest dome]

Nurgles' garden probably is very yeasty

[crisp heath]

Yeah apparently Abaddon is saying if you filter down warp stuff enough drinking alcohol is a byproduct, he was trying to make pure warp energy

Which I guess implies the entirety of the warp is somehow permeated by booze

[celest dome]

So TTS wasn't that far off

[green loom]

Daemon blood is poisonous

[crisp heath]

They're space marines, Space Wolves also drink literal poison to get drunk

[green loom]

And the warp is a sort of "Poison" when leaking to the materium

So it makes sense that if Abby fucks with it enough, they'll get a drink

[near wasp]

[crimson kayak]

Tbf that's kind of different, the poison is an ingredient that shuts off their livers/whaveter super organ is used, the rest is just alcohol

In fact humans can drink it if the antidote to said ingredient is put in

[near wasp]

Ollitic kidney

[crimson kayak]

Yeah but the dissolved corpses of Psykers just give it that extra after-taste you know

[near wasp]

In my personal experience theres too much iron in your average psyker and it makes the wine foul

[plush mason]

👀

[storm jungle]

Speaking of

do you know what Darktide needs more

Hard rain

No wait wrong chat

[crystal forum]

i'll be honest, this is the worst campaign in a nearly perfect game

[storm jungle]

Fuck you

Its fun

[crystal forum]

too much mud

also i have several deeply ingrained memories of that fucking corn segment

[ivory canyon]

just run on the pipe brah

[rose thorn]

I disagree this map scary and the ending is fun

Oh wait that’s uhh,,, mud one

Thsi one is cool and kinda scary

[storm jungle]

Yeah i love Hard Rain because its super atmospheric

also the entire thing of the impending storm approaching and you having to track back the way you came from the previous levels was super cool back in the day

https://youtu.be/3IktN4EF1S4?t=6

Also one of my favorite horde tracks

https://tenor.com/view/cat-cats-funny-banjo-gif-13127598

[rose thorn]

Weird you never see weather in like, apocalypse settings

Fallout 4 actually introduced in game weather mechanics

And weather

And FWW gave it mechanics which are really cool

Like, if it’s raining your charge is shorter, fog you can’t shoot long range

Rad storm 💀

[arctic talon]

I love how 40k has weather conditions in rules sorta lol

For 10e

[rose thorn]

It does!?!?

[arctic talon]

Shitty rain == no modifiers

Everyone is just miserable

There’s more modifiers

[rose thorn]

So that one chapter that attacks during sun set

Can

Actually attack during sunset

Time to write mantis warrior characters

And I’m gonna include Pronouns

[coarse pumice]

Like in blood bowl?

[rose thorn]

The space marine chapter

[coarse pumice]

I mean weather in 40k

[rose thorn]

OhHhh

Soryr

[coarse pumice]

In blood bowl you roll for weather before kick off

[rose thorn]

My brain got fucking Lion el Johnson their memory issues

[rose thorn]

That’s fuckibg cool

[coarse pumice]

There’s art for popkhorne

[rose thorn]

YESSSSS

Butter for the butter god

Kernels for the kernel throne

[maiden plover]

yum

[rose thorn]

Carn the butterer

[arctic talon]

There's just general modifiers to the battlefield now, one of them was just really cold and awful rain + wind

[astral whale]

Fan theory question.
Are the Legion of the Damned the reincarnated loyalist war dead of Istvaan?

[winter vessel]

I’d like to believe so. It sounds cooler than just a chapter called the Fire Hawks being mutated by the Immaterum after a warp jump failure.

[astral whale]

It’s a legion tho. Not just a chapter. That’s why I lean towards Istvaan’s dead either traitor or loyalist.

ALTHOUGH a mixed legion of Raven Guard, Iron Hands, and Salamanders working together in perfect unison would be really interesting.

[winter vessel]

That's my point. It wouldn't make sense if it was just the missing chapter, some people believe it is.

I believe however, that is the restless souls of deceased Astartes. From Istvaan III to the Drop Site Massacre at Istvaan V.

The Horus Heresy in its entirety even.

Imagine if you will, The Emperor's Children lead by Fulgrim fighting on some war torn world. All of a sudden space marines wreathed in fire appear before them. A dreadnought clashes with the fallen Primarch and it whispers in his ear "The ancient awaits..."

[crimson kayak]

Why not both?

[arctic talon]

There’s confirmed dead ultramarines a part of it

[astral whale]

Fffuck that novel in particular. I’m sorry but I hate it when writers remove the ambiguity like that.

[arctic talon]

Well

It is what it is

[uneven temple]

there was a short story ages ago of attica centurious recruiting a marine from some random chapter. I don't remember what chapter he'd been recruited from

[green loom]

You may be misremembering

Since his relic has the ability to resurrect fallen Legionnaires

[crimson kayak]

Nope, he's right, a guy gets recluited by the lord on the animus malorum short story

[rich patrol]

If custodes are genetically perfect and incorruptible, and what about the primachs? They are obviously corruptible, so are they genetically imperfect? If they're imperfect then how are they stronger than perfect custodes?

[green loom]

Different breed of weird experiment

Primarchs are much more advanced, and weirder, and also partially warp stuff

Custodes are, literally, hand crafted

[mystic geyser]

Primarchs were intended to have free will. Custodes weren't.

[green loom]

Custodes have some smarts but they're also more or less enslaved to Emp's mindset

[plush mason]

so i guess i should thank yall for reminding me i had to finish DAI so i could set up my world slate for Dreadwolf when it comes out

[green loom]

[stark cargo]

I wish the Custodes were less common in novels.

I don't like them much, but it feels like they are in half the books of the new plotlines.

[storm jungle]

They are pretty overrated

[near wasp]

I like the custodes but i dont think they are all the community thinks they are.

[stark cargo]

After Greyknights and Primarchs, they are like the third variant of Über-Spacemarines. And imho the blandest.
(4th if you count Primaris.)

[astral whale]

They are the Emperor’s 10,000. They should be something considerable.

[near wasp]

I mean they are but some people think they are wayyy better than they actually are

[storm jungle]

They literally can get killed by mining-lasers

so

[arctic talon]

Tbh mining lasers kill most things

[storm jungle]

Yeah but like

[arctic talon]

They’re meant to blow up rocks lol

[storm jungle]

can you tell this to a normal custodes fan

Every imperial fanatic was going nuts when Shadowthrone was announced

because "why would custodes fight GSC, they are weaklings"

or that apparently they would purge the entirety of Terra

[near wasp]

Lol

[storm jungle]

as if that would be even possible

[arctic talon]

Ah yes

All 4 quadrillion people

Approximately

[near wasp]

Part of terra not collasping is making sure the normals dont realize how much they outnumber the palace

[arctic talon]

Terra has a population in the quadrillions

[astral whale]

Tbh tho one question. Custodes practice fighting genestealers and Orks all the time. Why would there be casualties against genestealer cultists on holy Terra?

[arctic talon]

Tbh the guardsmen who guard the palace are really good at crowd suppression

[arctic talon]

You can’t prepare for every outcome

Objectively speaking

Especially in urban warfare

Except this isn’t urban warfare

It’s urban warfare on crack

[near wasp]

Urban combat is bad enough this is Ecumenopolis combat

[arctic talon]

The cult can trade lives for kills even if it’s 1000 cultists for every dead custodes

It’s worth it for them

[astral whale]

That also goes for the Genestealers in this instance as how do they prepare to fight against fucking goldclad demigod supersoldiers.

[arctic talon]

Genestealers themselves literally tear through ship bulkheads like nothing

If they get their hands on a custodes they’re done

Regarding how to kill them

Normal genestealer cult things

[astral whale]

That’s a pretty large If.

[arctic talon]

High power mining lasers, explosives

[storm jungle]

Because they arent invincible

they die like anyone else

[arctic talon]

^

Also yeah custodes are super limited on maneuvering space

[near wasp]

They get cut down in there own books

[arctic talon]

When they’re trying to fight gsc

[storm jungle]

The administratum literally covers every battlefield they participate in as a "victory" even if they lose

[arctic talon]

And it’s pretty aparant in the books

[astral whale]

Not invincible, but they’re still some of the most skilled and well equipped warriors in the galaxy.

[arctic talon]

They straight up can’t fit into some gaps

[storm jungle]

And still die the same

[arctic talon]

In the underhive

Custodes are not suited to urban combat

Like at all

[storm jungle]

Also yeah in the Shadowthrone book the custodes lost like half of the cadre they go down into the GSC lair with ambushes, booby traps and numbers the cultists can spare

thats how you usually defeat a superior foe

[arctic talon]

Most of their fighting styles are not constructive to it

[storm jungle]

Also that too lol

[arctic talon]

Like

They can’t fight like they normally do

The situation on terra for them is very much a fish out of water thing

They’re not in their element what so ever

Fighting inside the clusterfuck that is the underhive

[storm jungle]

Yeah its how the GSC in the book get the upper hand on them

same reason how Custodes can only kill generic warlords but the moment a named character shows up they get steamrolled too

[near wasp]

Plot armor and plot knives

[storm jungle]

pretty much

its why you'll hear custodes fan bitch and whine about getting their asses kicked by Harlequins when they are literally on the same power field

they are that one rich kid who brings a super good toy car to a race and whines the moment it breaks because they should be the best of the best

https://tenor.com/view/if-i-dont-get-the-things-i-am-after-im-going-to-scream-willy-wonka-and-the-chocolate-factory-give-me-what-i-ask-i-want-it-now-blackmail-gif-21442821

[vernal locust]

They only lost because they coulnd't outfunni the clowns

[rose thorn]

SUPERIOR TACTICS WOOOO

[stark cargo]

Most stuff dies when you collapse a hab block or starship on them. 🤷‍♂️

Wether that happens depends mostly on who the protagonists are, and what kind of story you want to tell. Which makes all these bestest of the best comparisons feel a bit off

[rose thorn]

Honestly in game custodies vs gsc would be extremely interesting

Pre ‘uh oh, 70% gsc win rate’

It would have been interesting seeing how it would played out

I’m still annoyed they said it was the pauper princes and then proceed to use cult of the 4armed emperor

For the promotional shit

Also fuck the pauper princes official color scheme is kinda trash

Actually all of them except C4AE

[arctic talon]

Rusted claw and twisted helix are good imo

[meager zinc]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LoJ5LkCr9kU

Ooh man this is a good one

[crimson kayak]

Yes but my gun does big booms and if I point ten at it it makes even bigger booms

It's the usual "guardsman vs marine" equivalent on steroids.

1v1? A genestealer Cultist has no chance, but in the numbers game they can simply outgun the custodes

After all they got bolters on a stick or fancy bolters mostly

[rose thorn]

I disagree that twisted helix looks good, but rusted claw is okay

Pauper princes is, mehHhH

But lore wise they are my fav

I don’t understand why the metal is white

With the rumors of how subfactions are gonna be done we could get new cults

[craggy isle]

"In the course of the tech-priest's investigation, the Emperor explained to Land that, in truth, He had no emotional attachment to the primarchs because they were simply created to serve Mankind as tools and weapons. "
https://warhammer40k.fandom.com/wiki/Primarch

the emperor deserved his fate

[stark cargo]

I still think the Primarchs are overdoing their father issues

[arctic talon]

was being an omnicidal maniac not enough lol

wait thats horus

Sorry a genocidal maniac

[craggy isle]

i mean, yes, but extra so because he really did not care for his creations, it really ties the whole 'the emperor is a bad dad' together, he can't even love his children, he's a terrible being through and through

[arctic talon]

I can see that

[crimson kayak]

Not caring for his creations because they are gonna be replaced later is basically the entirety of the emperor's character and story

[craggy isle]

i disagree, especially in the case of Angron

[crimson kayak]

Tbf Angron has a plot device in his head

So can't really do anything there tbf

[stark cargo]

I think Gilgas means that his followers got massacred because the Emperor only cared about getting him out

[craggy isle]

exactly that, the emperor could've lended angron his aid but he didn't, because he really doesn't give a fuck about his personal relationships

[stark cargo]

But then, massacring people the Emperor doesn't care about is a big part of the reclamation, and the Primarchs care not all that much about these folks

[crimson kayak]

0h, but I mean Angron was gonna break sooner or later anyway from the nails

[craggy isle]

even if he didn't have the butcher nails i don't think he'd ever forgive the emperor

[arctic talon]

Tbh angron would have hated the emperor either way

The same way corax and khan dislike him

[stark cargo]

But generally, the Primarchs are so much about what the big E thinks of them, who gets more praise, wether they are seen and so on. Like vain children

[crimson kayak]

True, but going off the main 40k timeline the literal best option for the emperor was putting him down like a broken dog

[crimson kayak]

Also this

[craggy isle]

'my dad's a psychopathic god: life as a primarch in the imperium of man' would be a hell of a slice of life manga

[stark cargo]

I mean yes, the Emperor is a manipulative, exploiting bitch with godlike charisma to hide it. But so what?

[craggy isle]

he should know better with all that thinking meat

but the 40k universe would not be a dystopian grim dark setting if he had a heart

[stark cargo]

I think his inability to do so is one of the few things that make the Emperor interresting. He can't stop manipulating, and he can't stop "knowing best"

[crimson kayak]

I mean, if it wasn't for the heresy, wich was manipulated by external forces anyway, his plan would have worked

[stark cargo]

There are some hints that Big E planned for the brothers war all along.

[craggy isle]

true, and it really does show that he's superhuman, making him both more and less a human, his powers are great but his conscience is not

@crimson kayak it would've but he bargained with the chaos gods for part of what made the primarchs so powerful, and then planned to take a sizeable amount of power away from them by broadening the imperium and turning people atheist to starve them

[crimson kayak]

Yeah but tbf the Horus Heresy is just one enormous "just as planned" by all parties without a single one having an actual clue at what was going on

[stark cargo]

I agree 😁

Heck, if the Emperor had been a bit more outgoing and kept the Primarchs in the loop, especially about Chaos and his Webway plans, things might have been very differently

But it's ok for him to not be flawless. But it makes the Horus Heresy read like a Korean Drama where all the bad stuff only happens because people don't talk

[craggy isle]

they're all too busy showboating and competing, except jaghatai khan who doesn't really give a fuck about the prestige

[winter vessel]

What he does give a fuck about: SPEED

[craggy isle]

gotta go fast

[gloomy citrus]

He wanted to keep the webway a secret because of the navigators.

[stark cargo]

He trusts his Primarchs to conquer entire sectors, but not to keep a secret?

[storm jungle]

The Emperor is basically as stupid as the plot demands him to be

the lore just tries to cover it up because its bad writing

[rose thorn]

It’s better when writers make tzeentch look stupid 💀

‘Guys this little girl tricked tzeentch?!1!1!1!!!!1

I hate that story so much, I’ve seen it liek 5 times and I don’t think it’s even cannon

[storm jungle]

it is cannon but like

its literally a side blurb

just a joke entry

[stark cargo]

I'm ok with it. Not the best Tzeentch story out there. But people also take strolls in Nurgles garden.

[storm jungle]

They don't tho

😩

and again the little girl thing is literally a Wizard of Oz joke entry

which is fine as a standalone thing

[stark cargo]

In the end, the 40k verse is big and contradictory. It's not masterplanned, but a playground for many authors. Imho better have many authors try, and some fail, than having something that's micromanaged to stasis

[storm jungle]

Having more authors is usually more of a detriment

And it doesnt help when you got guys like Abnett who just does what he wants and fans try to explain it away when hes literally just a guy with zero restrictions writing what he wants without any consequence

or just horrible awful writers like Goto

[rose thorn]

Like, how did she even beat him

[storm jungle]

No idea

again, its a joke blurb

dont take it too upfront

theres a lot worse lore entries out there

like the Blood Tide

[rose thorn]

Like when uhh, the grey knight chapter master entered old world

And then they said ‘no it was actually a beta storm cast’

[storm jungle]

GOD

💀

[rose thorn]

LMAO

[storm jungle]

Im glad that shit is dead and buried

[rose thorn]

Me too

And that faction of half naked jungle girls with 40k guns

[stark cargo]

In the age of internet, you can stick to the ones you like. But that requires having enough of a choice first.

And there are authors like Fehervari who are not really "40k mainstream", but so much fun

[storm jungle]

Ah yeah the classic 40k issue

its all white bald guys writing women

[stark cargo]

Like yeah, I didn't like my one Goto novel (even if it wasn't terrible), but he's easy to avoid imho

[storm jungle]

I mean he literally got fired

and everyone hates his work which helps

[arctic talon]

the what now

you know what

I'm better off not knowing

[storm jungle]

[gloomy citrus]

Sisters Repentia?

[green loom]

You guys know how Sicarians emit a white noise that blinds and deafens anyone near them

[storm jungle]

"half naked jungle girls"

[green loom]

Yeah I think my PC does a similar thing

[near wasp]

Warhammer try not to be down bad challenge (not clickbait, gone wild)

[gloomy citrus]

Only the "jungle" bit doesn't seem to apply in their case.

[storm jungle]

Yeah thats my point

[stark cargo]

I think my first 40k book was "Inquisitor" by Ian Watson. 🤷‍♂️ Compared to that, fluff has settled down a bit

[storm jungle]

I mean yeah

literally all of Ian's work was retconned

but id say it hasnt super settled down, theres still very messy books here and there, I still hate the first Deathwatch book with its GSC impregnation plot

💀

[stark cargo]

Ok 😬

[storm jungle]

Yeah this was back when like uh

GSC werent an army

[stark cargo]

What I meant is more like... Stuff is more planned. There's generally a big respect to authors who came before. There's more of a "brand" now. And if something big happens it gets discussed in teams, and sometimes feels a bit sterile

[storm jungle]

Oh that

yeah im too used to bad books sorry

but thats a fair assessment

[stark cargo]

Authors don't just dream up fantastic stuff anymore

Fehervari is a bit of an exception.

[green loom]

Because the job is to sell product

[stark cargo]

Which is fine. I think the quality of the books has risen quite a bit overall. And actually, I generally tend to like the down to earth books more. Like Warhammer Crime

But old "Pawns of Chaos" is still one of my favourite novels because of how Tzeentch gets portrayed

[celest dome]

Is it due to the author or GW putting to many constraints ?

[stark cargo]

Both I think.

I'm not sure constraints is the right word. There's a lot of respect for the setting going around, and peopke try not to break stuff

If you see how Dembski-Bowden picks up plot strands and setting details, it's very intricate

But I really liked the Nightlords trilogy, where there's not even that much connection with the rest of the setting. But he simply goes crazy with what life on a chaos ship might be like. (And there are some slightly cringe "we are so evil" parts. But generally, the characters are nicely constructed)

[rose thorn]

LMAO

[rose thorn]

also i love the flesh cape death leaper

it might be why i buy nids

[copper slate]

Slightly strange question. How do you guys think the Machine cult would react to a Warframe?

[stark cargo]

Depends on wether they think its human made or not, I think

[arctic talon]

orokin are human

and warframes are more biotech

should be fine

marvel of engineering for the admech

[shadow plover]

men of iron were men made and those are the worst kind of tech heresy out there

[stark cargo]

That's the next thing: If it contsins AI, they would probably lock it away

Or the traditional ones would

[copper slate]

Yeah, but Warframes aren't Robots. They used to be human before they were infected with a specialized strain of something called the Technocyte virus.

[arctic talon]

helminth

my beloved

[copper slate]

The intention of the Orokin was to create something like a Combat grade Servitor.

[green loom]

It sounds a lot like something the Biologis would do

[arctic talon]

tbh

warframes somewhat fall into the same realm as thallaxi

in terms of take a human and heavily change it

into a war machine

[copper slate]

Bio-Machina would be a fair term for Warframes to be labled with, right?

[stark cargo]

Remote controlled Bio-Machina that used to be human?

Honestly, I have no idea how the AdMech would react.

Then again, they are controlled by unsanctioned Psykers? 😅

[copper slate]

I don't think that part will be figured out for a while...

[near wasp]

Its being controlled by a human right?

Well a human brain. If the human brain no longer exists, then its tech heresy

[copper slate]

No AI involved! And the interactions I have planned would make it pretty clear that these 'Xenos' have emotions.

[crimson kayak]

In most cases it's remote controlled remotely by "Operators" (more or less Alpha level Psykers) but can act on their own in rare cases similar to particular machine spirits

Then there's Umbra's, and they can be remote controlled but they also still have a mind of their own

Also idk how mechanicum would react to the whole Helminth part of things

[arctic talon]

Helminth is a hyper advanced bioweapon

they wouldn't care

[maiden plover]

looks comfy

[arctic talon]

It is pretty comfy till it clamps down on you and stabs you lol

https://tenor.com/view/warframe-helminth-ability-infusion-helminth-segment-ember-gif-22594951

[maiden plover]

tbh

ive got some spots there that itch on the inside from time to time

would probably be good for my health

[arctic talon]

The hand stabbing part isn’t that helpful tbf

[maiden plover]

Yeah but the chest could solve some itches so worth it

[crimson kayak]

He's just a really good chiropractor

[astral whale]

Admech would probably break into a civil war whether becoming a Tenno is ultimate heresey or if it is the will of the Machine god made manifest.

[copper slate]

Some might!

[celest dome]

Would probably be kept secret in a vault or be deemed tech heresy

[copper slate]

Bold of you to assume that a Warframe would be caught in the first place...

[crimson kayak]

Yeah warframes, especially lore wise are pretty nuts

Hell, gameplay wise too

[celest dome]

Them they would be considered enemies.

[copper slate]

Oh, the Warframes are CLEARLY against the forces of Chaos. I've got a plan about Styantax assisting a flagging detachment of Astra Militarum soldiers in defending a settlement from Khornite Cultists, and maybe having Styantax face off against the leader of the Warband in single combat.

[crimson kayak]

Main thing is that most surely even stuff like chaos marines is Fodder to any frame lol

[storm jungle]

Yeah I was gonna say lol

like they are ridiculously OP

[coarse pumice]

Warframes make me think of Exarchs with their pseudo eastern feel too

And there was the continued living armour of exarchs that their original name overrides the wearer, and they become that archetypical warrior

Plus the war frame powers are like exarch powers, doing pretty much supernatural abilities/actions

[stark cargo]

Good point

[storm jungle]

I mean thats basically just matching tropes so yeah

[plush mason]

i mean. the warframes come from over 2 MILLION years in the future so ofc they would wreak anyone from 40k lol

hell im fairly sure the operator's void blast attack is just a mini left hand of darkness and just deletes the target's soul or something

[stark cargo]

I'm not sure they would fare better than custodes if fighting in hive cities

(But it's been ages since I last played warframe, and not for very long.)

[plush mason]

depends on the warframe

many can kill everyone in a small hive solo easy

[crimson kayak]

I mean, warframes are quite literally Exarch on extreme crack

[crimson kayak]

Nah, wouldn't be much different that getting hit by your local chaos sorcerer/Psyker warp beam/projectile

After all the void and the warp are kind of similar too due to matching tropes

[crimson kayak]

I mean, for being 2 milion years in the future only some Tenno stuff (frames and similar) and Sentients could outright wipe the 40k universe

Grineer are just extremely weird mass produced shit marines.

Corpus are basically the Tau, but replace the commie memes with capitalist

Infested are well, your local infestation

[copper slate]

Potential epithets for some of the Warframes: Styanax gets referred to as ‘The Champion of Mahkra’ for his stunt of going toe-to-toe with a Khornite Daemon, and coming out of that duel the victor.

[astral whale]

Not really. If I’m not mistaken, FTL travel doesn’t exist beyond the sol system in the Warframe universe

[rose thorn]

so uh

whats mortarions cahracter

is he purposly made to be dislikeable

[storm jungle]

He has no character

lmao

Literally just a grumpy asshole who dislikes Big E because he saved his life and also psykers

now hes just another slave to darkness

he also got killed like

8 times in lore so far

[rose thorn]

LMao

wait if he doesnt like pykers

wait

why does he even not like pykers

doesnt he have pretty okay pykers

[storm jungle]

He does

thats the ""irony""

[storm jungle]

Because in his homeworld Barbarus an evil wizard was abusing the populace before he rose the planet against him

he was also Morty's surrogate father for a bit

its... not that compelling but then again so aren't most Primarchs

[queen laurel]

"Finally, I killed my evil father wizard"

"Hey son I'm your real father and I'm the best wizard in the Galaxy"

[rose thorn]

lol

[storm jungle]

[queen laurel]

It's almost as if the universe is telling him something

[rose thorn]

so hes more of a story object like ferrus

[storm jungle]

Kind of yes

compared to Ferrus he actually doesnt die

so that means he has "more" lore

but like Mortarion is one of the most bland primarchs unless you are a Death Guard fan

they at least tend to huff some poxpium and act like hes a deep character

https://tenor.com/view/copium-cat-gif-27161395

[rose thorn]

i remember in lords of scilence 9/10 characters said they literally dont like him, and the 1/10 say that they have no one else to follow or somethijng

[queen laurel]

if i'm going by character the primarch that I would probably kick in the balls if I have the chance would be fulgrim

[storm jungle]

Pretty much lmao

like you can go read Mortartion's both wiki and lexicanum page if you want

hes just boring

[rose thorn]

counter argument, fulgrim is really cool for like, 75% if his lore

and then he gets terrible lore right at the end

[plush mason]

does he even have balls anymore? iirc he is a snakeman now

[rose thorn]

like his character was just absoluetely destroyed

[storm jungle]

Fulgrim is a good character

people just dont like him because hes a posh asshole

[queen laurel]

it's got to be somewhere

[storm jungle]

[rose thorn]

thats why i love him

[storm jungle]

same

[queen laurel]

I feel sorry for angron

[storm jungle]

Angron is just an animal at this point

[rose thorn]

im just saying, theres a good reason people say hes still possessed by a demonm

[queen laurel]

Like the universe hated him the moment he existed

[rose thorn]

even if he says he isnt

[storm jungle]

relatable honestly

[plush mason]

because big was an absolute idiot when ever he did anything related to angron. even more than normal

[storm jungle]

yeah like he isnt even a character anymore

which i guess fits

[queen laurel]

"Son come with me I will help you reach power"

" but can you save my friends they made me who I am"

"Lmao No"

[rose thorn]

tbh the first captain characters/chapter masters have always been cooler

[plush mason]

"oh and btw im allying with your slavemasters after they kill all your friends after i yeet you onto my ship"

[queen laurel]

Yeah that's the extra spice on the wound

[storm jungle]

I love people that try to defend that shit

[arctic talon]

💀

[storm jungle]

"NO SEE THE EMPEROR ISNT HUMAN ANYMORE, HE DOESNT GET THESE THINGS"

No

its just shit writing

lmao

"How do we make Angron turn traitor"

[queen laurel]

isnt The emperor a combination of powerful human souls

[rose thorn]

'anymore'

lMAO he is just a cruel god dicator

[rose thorn]

isnt that old hammer lore

[green loom]

One of a number of theories

[storm jungle]

yeah that shaman lore hasnt been re-said in like 2 decades

[chilly creek]

Alas, Fulgrim went all snakelike so you can't kick him in the balls because he no longer has any

[queen laurel]

Well I don't know man I'm not an imperium fan

[rose thorn]

little did we know, the empror IS ACTUALLY SIGMAR

[storm jungle]

please no

that'd ruin Sigmar

whos actually based

[queen laurel]

It's slaanesh, it's around there somewhere you just have to look for it

[green loom]

Ok he did also use a utopian device that would've made everyone smart to black out knowledge of chaos

[rose thorn]

lmao yeah

[queen laurel]

yeah after reading a bit of lore on his army it's not so bad

[rose thorn]

sigmar is actually likable

[queen laurel]

You don't truly die anyway

[storm jungle]

Basically Sigmar makes mistakes too

but thats because hes a himbo barbarian

not roman space hitler

[queen laurel]

Also he's friends with gorkamorka so that's a plus

[rose thorn]

also somehow the AOS lore is more fan fic/homebrew friendly than 40k

[plush mason]

he united all the humans and made friends with the dwarves and beat a massive orc army with just a warhammer and a bear fur loincloth, hard to get more chad than that

[storm jungle]

agreed fr fr

[storm jungle]

The Emperor outright wants to kill the orks

meanwhile Sİgmar actually went

"Im gonna arm-wrestle them."

actual lore btw

[queen laurel]

Even though they are not allies anymore they still have mutual respect

He acknowledges things that are equal to him unlikes the certain banana

[storm jungle]

🙏

[plush mason]

Sigmar is such a chad

[queen laurel]

OK that's it you guys convince me AOS is not so bad

Even though my precious warhammer fantasy ended and some of the names can be better I like it

[storm jungle]

AOS is pretty good, its issue is its slowly growing atm

also the setting looks colorful but its genuinely about as grim as you can imagine

[rose thorn]

oh yeah aos is baller, while 40k bets on you having multiple armies AOS wants you to have every model for an army

[plush mason]

looks at 40k with its circus clown color schemes

[queen laurel]

OK that's it I'm making an AOS orruk faction, it's going to be hard to top my original support clan that specializes in rescue missions

Yeah I made an ork plan specialized in rescue missions

I wonder how I will top that

[storm jungle]

Yeee, the only issue is the lore is a bit hard to get into because AoS's wiki community is not as good as 40k's

so you are usually bound to get codexes of the armies in it

[queen laurel]

and speaking of lore videos there are very very few

[storm jungle]

Yeah like i said its fan creator fanbase is not as there

[queen laurel]

i think only Pancreasnowork is the only prominent one I know that explains AOS

[storm jungle]

yeah hes great in that regard, love his giants vid

[queen laurel]

most of the things i know about aos Orruks is because of him

[crimson kayak]

That's like, the only thing that's not advanced in that entire universe

[rose thorn]

oh yeah orruks are doin a drukhari thing

3 armies 1 battletomb

[arctic talon]

It does but the orokin blew it up lmao

Because their terraforming project went wrong

[copper slate]

They had their own version of the ‘Men of Iron’… but I can’t blame the Sentients for turning on the Orokin. The Orokin planned on killing the Sentients once the colonists got to the Tau system.

[arctic talon]

The sentients were arguably justified

In killing the orokin

Except they also wanted to kill everyone else so

Lul

[green loom]

What's the deal with the whole new war thing and everyone being brainwashed

[arctic talon]

Narmer veil shows everything you ever wants and then slowly twists those memories

Into fealty towards ballas

[copper slate]

Astropaths reporting a second light in the Warp? It’s tiny in comparison to the God-Emperor’s beacon, but the light also moves.

Trying to think up antics for the Operator herself. I’ve been calling her Asha Ayatan.

[astral whale]

Even then. Seems like a massive weakness to rely upon a solar rail. Something that can be destroyed.

The Imperial Navy would pose a significant threat to just about anything.

Sure, Warframe factions ships might be more advanced but without FTL travel they can’t be everywhere at once.

So kinda like the Tau they’d have to play defensive.

[arctic talon]

Also they have non Solar rail based ftl

It’s just rare

Also the orokin are extinct so

[astral whale]

Good luck protecting that extra planetary infrastructure.

[arctic talon]

[arctic talon]

It’s all ship based

So

[storm jungle]

Also like

[arctic talon]

[storm jungle]

you say that as if the Imperial navy is any good

[arctic talon]

I mean

[astral whale]

It’s quite possibly the largest navy in science fiction.

[arctic talon]

They aren’t the worst navy in 40k

[storm jungle]

Its really not

[arctic talon]

Literally false

[storm jungle]

like

[arctic talon]

Xeelee sequence

[storm jungle]

^ that lmao

also my favorite part of the Orpheus War is 5 necron ships blowing up an entire imperial armada

[astral whale]

I don’t count Xelee as science fiction. That’s a brand of its own.

[arctic talon]

[storm jungle]

I also don't see 40k as science fiction

more like cringe fiction

but here we are

[arctic talon]

40k is science fantasy

same with like

Star wars lol

[astral whale]

True.

[arctic talon]

space fantasy?

[storm jungle]

its basically fantasy disguised as sci-fi yeah lmao

[arctic talon]

I guess

is a better word

Fucking destiny has more hard science involved in its lore

[storm jungle]

Destiny has like

actual space science mixed with fictional mumbo jumbo

which is pretty based

Paracausal shit makes my brain hurt

[arctic talon]

Stasis is fun

it isn't ice

[astral whale]

Either way if you’re basing this off of SW and ST,
40k’s Imperial navy would absolutely body both the Imperial navy from SW and most fleets from ST just based off of galactic scale.

[arctic talon]

its technically rocks

[storm jungle]

Nah

Imperial ships literally only win through bulk and numbers

any proper navy can fuck em up

they literally rely on broadsides

[arctic talon]

so does star wars

tbf

[storm jungle]

Kinda

[astral whale]

So does Star Wars.

[storm jungle]

Nah

[astral whale]

Bruh.

[arctic talon]

Star wars falls into the weird space navel battle

[storm jungle]

SW is more smaller vessels/dogfighting

[arctic talon]

territory

[storm jungle]

yeah that

[astral whale]

Not really.

[arctic talon]

most big ships are just glorified air craft carriers

[storm jungle]

Yeah really

[astral whale]

The movies are weird.

Like

[arctic talon]

I mean yeah

they're meant to look cool

[storm jungle]

Well yeah hollywood

40k animations/features are weird too

[arctic talon]

also in terms of ship scale most 40k ships are

absurdly huge

[storm jungle]

Also like half of it is useless space for slave labor

[arctic talon]

the manta is considered a fucking dogfighter in space combat lol

[astral whale]

The Tie Fighter is supposed to be a point defense fighter but it sucks in its intended role so much that they needed to develop the Tie Interceptor.

[storm jungle]

Because rebels have plot armor

sounds like another faction

[astral whale]

Big time.

[storm jungle]

"Why dont we just bomb this rebel base from orbit?"

[arctic talon]

The TIE fighter also straight up doesn't have shields

KEK

[storm jungle]

"NO WE MUST HAVE A DOGFIGHT"

[arctic talon]

Which is

really stupid

[storm jungle]

yeah like

[arctic talon]

from a design stand point

[storm jungle]

its literally just "how do we make the bad guys lose harder"

its fucking stupid af

all because uhhh

"Palpatine is cheap"

????

[arctic talon]

TIE fighters are so badly designed from a lore perspective most star wars games glue shields onto them

because that shit would be unplayable

[storm jungle]

THE LORE BOOK FOR VADER'S SUIT SAYS PALPATINE SKIPPED ON MORE ADVANCED STUFF FOR VADER'S OUTFIT SO HE'D SUFFER MORE AND SAVE COSTS

[astral whale]

Granted, if that were the case why not just drop a meteor on it? Why didn’t Abbadon launch the last Blackstone fortress into Cadia?

[arctic talon]

aint no way

I mean meteor drops are common

in 40k

at least from Orks lol

[storm jungle]

the Veteran also literally jokes ingame

[arctic talon]

Deff Skulls

[storm jungle]

saying thats how he'd do exterminatus

[storm jungle]

Because that would be boring

[arctic talon]

Love slamming rocks into planets

so they can loot planets

[storm jungle]

realistic choices in ficiton usually are

[astral whale]

Well, no. Actual lore says he wanted Vader to suffer for losing.

[shadow plover]

y'all need to stop comparing sci-fi universes as if they'd work under the same rules

[storm jungle]

Yeah but its still super stupid

but like

Palpatine is literally evil because he wants to evil

[arctic talon]

no

[storm jungle]

so i dont judge him

[arctic talon]

We must have arbitrary arguments

[storm jungle]

Adeptus Arbitrary Arguments more like

[shadow plover]

fair

[arctic talon]

the one game I can think of recently with TIE fighters without shields

[astral whale]

Nah. Vader deserved it for being a lil bitch and getting his ass handed to him.

[arctic talon]

is Star wars squadrons

[storm jungle]

Those kids had it coming

[arctic talon]

but like

that thing is a literal death trap in that game lol

The only thing that keeps you alive is the fact its fast as fuck and you can redistribute power easier then an X-wing lol

[astral whale]

That’s why I kinda miss legends where he was at least trying to make the galaxy ready for the Vong but even they were stupid.

[astral whale]

Fuck them kids XD

[storm jungle]

https://tenor.com/view/sus-among-us-star-wars-anakin-youngling-gif-20248539

[arctic talon]

[astral whale]

The Tie Fighter was meant to be a swarm fighter. Dogfighting was not it’s intended purpose.

[arctic talon]

Yeah

its meant to be a swarm fighter

except half the time it ends up in a dogfight because movie cool

[astral whale]

Granted can we all agree the Disney trilogy was worse than the prequel trilogy?

[arctic talon]

I don't think anyone can say the sequal trilogy is better then the prequal trilogy

bcs at least one of them had a coherent idea

[astral whale]

One was based because it was cringe.
The other was cringe because it failed to be based. Lol

[crystal forum]

there's an entire generation of people who are more likely to have never watched any star wars movie except the sequels

[arctic talon]

Yeah

And that’s fine

People can enjoy what they want

[crystal forum]

also the only thing i can say the prequels did right is respecting the lore fans. George Lucas understood that at least

[astral whale]

In all seriousness tho the 40k imperial navy would body the SW navy not only because of size but the over reliance of SW’s imperial navy on having larger numbers.

Also Tarkin Doctrine would be worthless against the Imperium.

[crystal forum]

i really hate comparing different IP's but star wars ships having a completely different type of faster than light technology would really complicate things

[astral whale]

Also, speaking of which we need a SW stormtrooper movie just to remove the joke of stormtroopers being pathetic jokes. They’re supposed to be the best of the best and an actual threat. Like they pretty much ignore the Imperial Army.

[crystal forum]

does any movie even imply they're good at anything except in animated stuff

[astral whale]

Kinda… they’re pretty analogous considering SW relies upon hyperspace lanes and 40k relies upon stable Warp Currents which pretty much have the same effect most of the time.

[arctic talon]

Yeah

They have a really good kill ratio in episode 4 lol against non main characters

[crystal forum]

hyperdrives are consistent. You also aren't likely to be invaded by literal demons

[astral whale]

Warp drives for the most part are 95+% consistient.

[crystal forum]

you know what, i never even thought about the hoth battle

[arctic talon]

They like

Literally have a 2 deaths

To killing and capturing all rhe rebels on the ship ratio lol

[crystal forum]

tbh the bad aim joke is just from how they act against main characters. i dont think anybody into star wars lore even thinks that

it's a boomer joke

[astral whale]

We need a TV series based around side characters in the SW universe
“OH FUCK THEYVE GOT A NAMED CHARACTER, SHIT.”

[crystal forum]

still much more consistent than entering the warp which doesn't even give you a fixed time period of travel

[green loom]

Weren't the troopers in ep4 ordered not to hit also

[astral whale]

Yes

[crystal forum]

rogue one was kinda that

[green loom]

Also ships in SW don't rely on broadsides, iirc that's 90% a movie thing

[astral whale]

Rogue one was based. It actually made the Empire seem threatening.

[green loom]

You ever wonder why the Venator, which is mainly a carrier, broadsides a much larger ship

[crystal forum]

rogue one was a rare movie in that it wasn't bad or disrespectful to fans

[astral whale]

Don’t question the carrier broadside XD

[crystal forum]

i like how realistic 3d space fighting is just ships looking at eachother while zip zooming around

star wars was created way before people had a solid grasp of spaceship stuff so they all fly like planes

being chased by tie fighters? just turn around and shoot them doofus

[astral whale]

I mean granted space combat with actual physics would be kinda boring. There was a show that kinda did that and it wasn’t the same.

Like. It would just be a missile/laser spam fight as any damage could potentially cause catastrophic decompression.

Like out of visual range stuff.

Also kinda beats the point because realistic spaceships wouldn’t have windows.

[crystal forum]

yeah just like how realistic naval fights are boring as hell. star trek used to care a little about that once

[astral whale]

Bruh. Realistic navy fights are exciting as hell to read about and to see animations of.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_off_Samar

Even modern stuff is interesting even if it is a but missile heavy.

[crystal forum]

not for movies. It's just not fast paced enough for normies

[astral whale]

Ever watch Dunkirk?

[crystal forum]

what actually pisses me off is how rare realistic plane fights are. They're so fast paced and complexe but directors feel the need to add dumb shit

[arctic talon]

Too bad

Need to uhhh

do stuff

[astral whale]

Actors can’t handle the G-forces and airframes are expensive to risk.

[arctic talon]

also modern air combat is a bit uh

long distance?

[astral whale]

Modern air combat is boring AF. It’s mostly electronic warfare and firing a missile beyond visual range.

[crystal forum]

I'm speaking about all movie plane fights, which is mostly CGI

especially WW2 fights

[astral whale]

Oh, in that case directors are fucking stupid.

[crystal forum]

they just don't care enough to learn any air maneuvers

ever seen the red tails movie

[arctic talon]

I forgot what movie it was but some country said the prop planes were a new US fighter

[astral whale]

I mean granted, irl WWII/Korea era dogfights are pretty much summarized as “climb to altitude, spot target, identify, engage, disengage”

[crystal forum]

you make them sound a lot simpler and boring than they actually were

[astral whale]

The majority of the time in the aircraft isn’t exciting. It is flying to and from combat zone

[crystal forum]

you can say that about literally anything involving the military

[astral whale]

TRUE lol

[crystal forum]

logistics win wars people

[shadow plover]

you're always in a rush to wait somewhere

[astral whale]

Tbh I would like to see another movie satirizing the life of the average logis.

[crystal forum]

Hey you could make an entire movie about the supply line soviets made over a frozen lake to supply stalingrad

movies make it seem like stalingrad only held because of some vague notion of fighting spirit or something

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Road_of_Life

[stark cargo]

Yeah, I think that's a big point. Most folks want their space battles to feel like naval battles in space. It's also how Battlefield Gothic is designed.

Personally, I think that SW battles even back in the day could have felt more 3d. Everything is so neatly arranged on the same plane...

It's one of the reasons I like the battle in the Firefly movie.

[craggy isle]

i think since SW ships can just.. hyperspace whenever.. they could just jump a deathstar into the Sol system and blow up earth and the imperium would just lose

but, they'd have to know what the astronomican is and the emperor

so shrug

would be fun to see if jedi/sith have a reflection in the warp

[astral whale]

Makes sense if you consider how hyperspace lanes work. If you want more verticality in a space battle then look at how the battle over Coruscant worked out

[storm jungle]

A lot of 40k fans forget Warp travel is... you know, kinda unreliable and very shit compared to Hyperspace

[crystal forum]

yeah. The ability to go wherever you want and know when you'll get there is a huge advantage

[celest dome]

And War is won on logistic or stuff

[crystal forum]

not to mention star wars vehicles are probably superior in technology to non archeotech 40k stuff

and their blasters arent dog shit like the imperial flash lights

[craggy isle]

cyclonic torpedo vs the death star though

🤔 hmm

[crystal forum]

death star isn't something we can assume the star wars faction would have available for no reason

[brittle nebula]

Don’t forget the “flashlights” can blow of limbs blasters cannot

[hollow lantern]

Lasguns confer the same energy as .50 bmg iirc

[crystal forum]

the blasters have consistently ignored pretty much all armour in star wars movies. probably PG rating constraints but that's still pretty strong

[brittle nebula]

That’s one way of putting it

[hollow lantern]

They rip limbs off like they do

[brittle nebula]

True

[craggy isle]

and now i wonder how the CIS advanced robots would do against the nekron

[crystal forum]

droids are pretty limited in abilities. They're just good in numbers and that's not even an advantage in 40k

[brittle nebula]

Hmm Bx commandos vs necron warriors. Yah that sounds fair

[crystal forum]

sure there's limited production super droids but it's not like you can field an entire army of those

[brittle nebula]

Not with Star Wars production

[crystal forum]

let's just remove "special strong units" out of the equation

no space marines, no mech storm troopers or whatever they're called

[craggy isle]

blasters are also plasma guns and don't have the drawbacks of the 40k plasma guns >.>

[crystal forum]

i didn't even know that

[brittle nebula]

So Guardsmen vs B1s?

[crystal forum]

or storm troopers or even rebels. just normal ass soldiers

[brittle nebula]

They use tabana for ammunition. It’s the same stuff they use to fuel the hyperdrives

[craggy isle]

or wait.. no, they're sorta lasers? but also sorta plasma?
"Operating under the same principles as laser weaponry and firing at least partially by means of magnetic induction, blasters converted energy-rich gas to a glowing particle beam that could pierce and melt through targets."
https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Blaster

[storm jungle]

We say PG but in Clone Wars droid blasters have sometimes put gaping massive holes through clones

which was oof

[crystal forum]

yeah but they managed to escape ratings by making clones faceless behind behind their armour lol

no excessive blood either

it's pretty ingenious how much fucked up shit they managed to get away with

[storm jungle]

https://youtu.be/bX8iN6T_M_A

Yeah this show was violent as fuck

[crystal forum]

some scenes genuinely terrified me as a kid

[storm jungle]

not that im complaining its great

also same