40k-lore-chat

[crimson kayak]

Just xenos

[lament sluice]

Weird

Looks like it could be a subrace

[crimson kayak]

Lol, not every bug is a nid

[lament sluice]

Has nid in its nameeee

[crimson kayak]

They had consciousness and interstellar travel, no Hive mind also

[crimson kayak]

It's... It's arachnid, they are big spider like, so mega-arachnid

[barren tapir]

Random xenos that is a big threat and looks like a bug
Random person: is this a tyranid?
Answer: no, not everything that looks like a bug is a tyranid, nids aren't the boogeyman responsible to all weird stuff
SMH stellaris didn't taught nothing to people

[celest dome]

Tyranids PoV
Random Humanoid that look like biomass
Tyranids: is this a Biomass?
Answer: no, not everything that looks like a Humanoid is Biomass, Biomass aren't the boogeymen responsible to all weird stuff

[crimson kayak]

Kroot shapers be like

[barren tapir]

Necrons says bzzzzzbzb... Also get off my lawn

[spark relic]

And being Necrons, by "lawn" they mean "blackstone porch" because they hate living things

[barren tapir]

They hated* living things

[celest dome]

They hate us because they can't be us

[barren tapir]

There was a meme that would be perfect as answer for this

https://preview.redd.it/ospsda3y1gz51.jpg?auto=webp&s=add6bb10ae3bbb306c5532feb66183ce609dee32

There it is

[crimson kayak]

The regenerating necron is a good touch

Anyhow, looking at some darktide videos and some comments I saw an interesting theory that the cutscenes we have in game were supposed to all just be the prologue for when you reach certain parts of the hub

[rose thorn]

I mean, yeah being a god like robo race is cool, but if you lose a necron it’s gone for ever, even if they loose 10 out of 30,000 every battle it will catch up

[worthy tendon]

Question: of all the various abhuman strains that are tolerated or even "sactioned" within the imperium, which of them are the smartest - which of them would be the best fit for the role or retinue of an Inquisitor?

[crisp heath]

We know of multiple Inquisitors who use ogryns as muscle

Also astropaths are pretty much obligatory for any imperial official who travels

[arctic talon]

A psyker is very good to have on hand as an inqusitor

Astropaths as mentioned before

[worthy tendon]

Sure but I'm not asking about muscle. I'm asking about BRAIN.

[timid ferry]

Hot/shit take but a Ratling inquisitor would be dope asf

[crisp heath]

An inquisitor getting their ass saved by a blank is pretty much a trope at this point, but I think Bequin is the only one who is actually part of the retinue

[celest dome]

Ratlings, Squats, Psykers,

[crisp heath]

Also comes with the caveat that unless you're Dan Abnett, you'd need to keep your blanks and psykers separate most of the time

[celest dome]

But Abhumans (Psyker aren't really Abhuman) can't become Inquisitor proper

[mystic geyser]

I mean, it's not a hard rule, but there would never be the opportunity

[worthy tendon]

What about a Navigator Inquisitor? Would that be possible?

[celest dome]

In theory nothing would stop it, but in practice

[mystic geyser]

Navigators are far too important

[celest dome]

Not sure teh Navigator house would allow it

Political strife and stuff

[timid ferry]

Unfortunately, I don’t think Squats/Kin are in the running anymore. Their entire civilization is tech heresy out the wazoo (clones, AI, etc.)

[mystic geyser]

In terms of Abhumans in retinue, absolutely fine loads of examples. Even of full on mutants the more radical you go.

In terms of Intelligent. I mean only Ogryns are notably unintelligent

[crisp heath]

In theory anyone could be an acolyte or inquisitor, since they're given power directly by the decision of other inquistors, but I don't know if yall have noticed, but inquisitors tend to be kind of racist

[mystic geyser]

And beastmen, but maybe that's nurture..

[worthy tendon]

And which of the notable abhumans would be the best educated / intelligent council for an Inquisitor?

[crisp heath]

There are still kin in the imperium who aren't members of the League, but they're very scattered

[mystic geyser]

@worthy tendon navigators. Maybe a Longshank or a Pelager to be fancy.

A nightsider could be cool too

[worthy tendon]

So Ratlings, Ogryns and Felinids would be considered brawn rather than brain?

[signal bramble]

Ratlings aren’t brawn.

[mystic geyser]

Basically. Ratlings are smart, but unlikely to be educated

We don't really know anything about felinids (fanart aside)

[arctic talon]

Beastmen are as smart as a human

They just don’t get education normally since

You know

They’re beast men

[signal bramble]

Ratties get taken because they’re clever, good at sniping, excellent cooks, and good at stealing shit.

[worthy tendon]

But in terms of cognitive potential, they could?

[mystic geyser]

Sure.

[arctic talon]

Most abhumans have plenty of cognitive potential

[signal bramble]

Keep in mind also that inquisitors don’t recruit just anyone. They usually recruit based on a specific need or role they want fulfilled.

[arctic talon]

The imperium just doesn’t want them too smart

[celest dome]

And Felinids we don't know much about so who know

[arctic talon]

Uneducated masses are easier to control after all

[worthy tendon]

What about Ratling Admech? I mean, Admech are already technology cleptomaniacs, a Ratling would fit in perfectly 😂

[arctic talon]

Them existing is the extent of our knowledge lol

[arctic talon]

Abhuman so no

[signal bramble]

The new inquisitor book awakenings had a squat in the retinue of the inquisitor.

[mystic geyser]

Uhh lol

[arctic talon]

The admech don’t like abhumans very much

[timid ferry]

Unfortunately, beastmen have fallen “out of the favor” as abhumans within the eye of the imperium. Really goes to show just how horrible 40k is when your mere existence is predicated upon how much people consider you worthy of it

[arctic talon]

They don’t even like normal humans that much

[timid ferry]

Cool

[signal bramble]

A lot of the kin on hive worlds have formed a subculture all their own.

[worthy tendon]

Imagine, Ogryn Skitarii.

[signal bramble]

They don’t have the Votann or a lot of the advanced stuff.

[timid ferry]

Thinking about how the veteran is the only one nice to the ogryn out of all the characters

[signal bramble]

They have ogryn combat servitors already.

[arctic talon]

Servitors

Why bother making a skitarii

[mystic geyser]

@worthy tendon ogryn servitors are definitely a thing

[arctic talon]

When the ogryn mind isn’t important

Skitarii are valuable because they’re smart

And can think on the fly

Ogryn aren’t as smart as a human on average

[celest dome]

Can be independent

[arctic talon]

So why bother making a skitarii out of them

[signal bramble]

That’s because the veteran knows that being nice to the Ogryn is a good idea and Ogryn tend to be really protective of people that are nice to them.

[arctic talon]

Bette to mindslave them to a tech priest

[worthy tendon]

I'd argue that depends on the Forge World they originate from

[arctic talon]

Martian standard skitarii

Is what I mean when I say skitarii usually

[signal bramble]

You could do a lot worse than having an eight foot tall slab of muscle that can drag an APC with their bare hands watching your back.

[arctic talon]

Since it’s what’s on the tabletop and most common in books

[crisp heath]

It's probably just a warrior bond too, ogryns got you're back so they're friends, even if they're big, stupid friends

I don't think guardsmen are totally pragmatic about who they're nice to, as a rule

[arctic talon]

I mean obviously

They’re human

[signal bramble]

Yeah but it can’t hurt either.

A lot of soldiers get fond of the Abhumans they serve with.

My interpretation of our rejects though is that it’s perfectly rational that many of them would be more focused on staying alive than anything.

[crisp heath]

Except ratlings, who are Kinder in space

[timid ferry]

Or, you know, actually having positive face to face interaction with ogryn as opposed to being spoon fed racist drivel about what abhumans are like without ever actually meeting one

[signal bramble]

Which means pragmatism.

[arctic talon]

Kinder aren’t smart tho

[crisp heath]

Kinder are smart asses

[signal bramble]

The last guy who thought the ratlings weren’t smart probably had all his stuff stolen.

[arctic talon]

Lol

[timid ferry]

Allport 1954 ftw

[worthy tendon]

Ratlings are good at stealing, Admech are tech cleptomaniacs.

[crisp heath]

I'd love a ratling character who bonds with the protagonist over the harmful stereotypes of his people and briefly joins the team, and then all their stuff disappears

[celest dome]

Last guy who said that Ogryn are stupid in their face was crushed and thrown in the latrines

[mystic geyser]

There is strength in ignorance

[arctic talon]

Emprah says ignorance is strength

I’m very strong

[crisp heath]

Anyway what I originally came in here to post

[timid ferry]

Guess that makes toddlers the strongest of all 😆

[crisp heath]

 ‘I thought Anathrosis was your patriarch?’ asked Oltyx, briefly distracted by wondering if he had misremembered this detail of the seccession war. 
‘That changed.’```

Transcrons transcrons

[celest dome]

Children do have certain Warp power iirc

[signal bramble]

In throne of light, some teenage psyker kills a bunch of primaris by himself.

[celest dome]

But that can simply be due to being a strong Psyker

But I remember a story where an "innocent" child had some sort of protection from the Daemons, might be in fantasy now that I think about

[frosty stag]

Could magnus get rid of tzeeches control?

I know how he never really wanted to fall to him

[crisp heath]

Magnus is basically a slave at this point and can't really resist Tzeentch himself, but Ahriman believed the psychic bond could be broken, which ultimately failed and led to his exile

Magnus is one of the more likely primarchs to get "uncorrupted", but the plague wars implied that Big E wants Mortarion back first for some reason

[celest dome]

Not anymore

[celest dome]

Second best Psyker, hate Chaos the most, most likely to deal a massive blow if he turn

[signal bramble]

Not at this point. He’s under tzeentch’s control entirely and only exists because of him. Daemons can be unmade by their deities when they fail or displease them in some way.

[celest dome]

In theory all of the Primarchs that went Traitor are like that

With the possible exception of Omegon

[frosty stag]

Alright thank y’all

[signal bramble]

It’s important to remember the daemon primarchs are now warp entities, despite whatever freedom and power they have now it means they are inextricably bound to the chaos juice to be able to manifest.

Abaddon wants to stay mortal for that reason also, so he can have more autonomy.

[frosty stag]

I see

[barren tapir]

With the exception that nothing stop them from making more

[celest dome]

In theory if you found a way to sever the link and replace it with something else you'd be fine for the most part
But you still need to find how to sever it (Fantasy did have that) and something to replace it with (Not sure if there ever was such)

[crimson kayak]

Basically the only way to unfuck a primarch would be making it somehow switch sides to becoming "Imperial Daemons"

[celest dome]

Don't they need people with the Piriah gene for that ?

[storm jungle]

This.

People forget that Necrons can make infinite canoptekh constructs lol

but dont because thats kinda broken

[signal bramble]

I’m not sure if that could really work with a creature that’s a part of a specific god. Like if Magnus severs a link I feel like tzeentch would take his essence back and it would unmake Maggie.

I could believe it for Perturabo or big B who are undivided daemons.

[celest dome]

Canoptekth sure, but they aren't really Necron though

[storm jungle]

I mean they are

also just as deadly

and a lot better than warriors in some cases

[celest dome]

Suppose so

Didn't think of them being somewhat equal

[storm jungle]

I mean

giant robot centipede with deathrays

Kind of equals more or less like 10 necron warriors

[barren tapir]

Nope

[storm jungle]

Theres a reason necrons can get nothing done because they'd just steamroll everything

[celest dome]

In fantasy there was a cauldron that cleanse all Chaos influence, some though that if you put a Daemon in it it would either suffer true death or become an independent daemon

[barren tapir]

Necron warriors doesn't even need a person to turn, they are just robot, the fact that the ctan told them to use living people was because it was a way to feast on the living essence

[storm jungle]

Yeah they don't even need sentience

[celest dome]

Ah didn't know that

[storm jungle]

especially since they are basically mindless drones

[barren tapir]

But lets say you need living people, a raid on an imperial world would give so many new recruits anyway lol

[storm jungle]

As long as theres a higher necron ordering them around its basically a done-deal

[celest dome]

The Ctan really pranked the Necron

[storm jungle]

Szeras is also doing this too lmao

my guy is emptying entire worlds and turning people to soup

[barren tapir]

He is indeed, testing my poor fellow blanks the shithead... Never thought that if he asked nicely and didn't killed blanks they could actually help them willingly, like, if they are fair and nice to them, since blanks are always ill treated by others

[storm jungle]

I do like how the lore says he does all the surgery stuff to you while awake

because "I'm a scientist bro believe me"

[barren tapir]

Yeah, fokken grimderp

[outer wave]

Much as I love 40k for alot of things, thats one of the aspects I like the least: every faction not doing anything because they're probably too strong for their own right

[barren tapir]

Like, as a blank, switching to someone that doesn't instinctively hate you wouldn't be too far fetched, and there is also a possibility of scarab pet!

[storm jungle]

Yeah like necrons literally got a sniper unit that can appear anywhere and erase you from reality

"Thats kinda broken tho"

[barren tapir]

And stupid

[storm jungle]

"Okay uhhh, they dont use deathmarks too much because ROYAL HONOR"

Edit: Actual lore reason btw

[outer wave]

Dude you're killing everyone thats not you what the fuck

[barren tapir]

One thing is broken and the explaination why it isn't used is always worse lol

[storm jungle]

also necrons can literally do anything with super-science to the point that it looks like magic to us too

like a cryptek can just instantly make a primaris into a bronze statue no sweat

[brittle nebula]

Don’t forget in Battle Fleet gothic they had a artificial moon that closed the eye of terror. Or the astral map that could delete a star with a push of a button.

[storm jungle]

Yeah pretty much this

that entire campaign was just:

"Okay we got no plot-restrictions anymore, lets go kill everyone."

https://tenor.com/view/necron-necrons-40k-warhammer-gif-25759052

[brittle nebula]

Pretty much

[storm jungle]

but the campaign and the characters were great so i didnt mind it

"What is a Primarch, Cryptek?"

"It's a human but taller I believe."

[outer wave]

Sorry didnt mean to divert from your original topic, but least if there were no holds barred you'd see some pretty dumb but funny shit like closing the entire Eye of Terror

Sure the setting wouldnt last long but it'd be pretty fun for those few moments

[brittle nebula]

It would

[storm jungle]

Basically only gonna happen when 40k needs to get a reboot

so not soon yet

[barren tapir]

It wouldn't actually lose much honestly

[brittle nebula]

Beside someone will open it again. Probably not in the same way but it would happen

[storm jungle]

it would require a catastrophic amount of psychic fuckery

[outer wave]

Enough to create a god

[barren tapir]

EldarS: we did it once, we can do it again

[arctic talon]

It’s humanities turn to open the massive warp rift

[barren tapir]

That would be the super bad ending indeed

[storm jungle]

Thats kinda what the Great Rift was so

👀

[arctic talon]

That was chaos opening it tbf

[storm jungle]

chaos are mostly humans

[brittle nebula]

What caused that again I forgot

[arctic talon]

I’m talking about the giant one on terra

[storm jungle]

checkmate

[arctic talon]

[storm jungle]

[arctic talon]

[storm jungle]

Also cant come soon enough tbh

[outer wave]

The best way to end 40k is to make it all something the Necrotyr were predicting by manipulating space time then going "Wow that was cringe. Lets go be better people than that." and bring galaxy wide peace

[median vault]

who wins?

[outer wave]

No one

Everyone dies

[signal bramble]

The chaos gods.

[barren tapir]

Me

[meager zinc]

what does the imperium think of lgbtq+ people? is it illegal to be gay?

[celest dome]

At large doesn't care

just meat for the wargrinder

[meager zinc]

I mean space marines are kind of an asexual army.

"Aces rise up, your army is here at your beck and call."

[signal bramble]

The imperium doesn’t care about that because you as an individual do not matter. You’ll work your 16-18 hour 7 day a week manufactorum job and meet your quotas. Literally no one outside of your immediate social circle cares if you live or die. If you tell your supervisor you’ve got new pronouns they will tell you to shut up and get back to work or you’ll be whipped.

[meager zinc]

well loyalist SMs.

[signal bramble]

The imperium doesn’t discriminate, everyone is fodder for the war machine no matter what their individual identity is.

[meager zinc]

but will i get whipped MORE because of my new pronouns? thats the question. I'm assuming its a case by case basis.

[signal bramble]

No you won’t.

Keep your head down, your mouth shut, and meet your quota. Your boss probably doesn’t even use your pronouns, they will refer to you by a number.

[meager zinc]

True. Keep your pronouns to yourself, #17.

[signal bramble]

Indeed.

If you meet your quota he meets his which means he ignores you.

Which is what you want.

On the opposite end of the spectrum, if you’re rich and powerful you can indulge in anything you want.

In Bloodlines it’s made clear that a wealthy individual can have any partner or identity they want. It outright says wealthy folks can have “men, women, boys, or girls.”

It’s difficult to convey through words just how much the individual doesn’t matter in the imperium. Your individuality is ruthlessly oppressed no matter what it is unless you’re wealthy/powerful enough that people are too afraid or can’t tell you what to do.

[meager zinc]

ok good. as long as everyone can endure the horrors of the galaxy equally.

[signal bramble]

Chances are you’re going to die young anyway.

[arctic talon]

The Imperium doesn't care about gender, skin color or sexuality

[meager zinc]

"whoa whoa whoa. how come only white guys can succumb to the madness of the warp?"
"i just made a huge mistake"

[arctic talon]

in the end you'll die (working in a manufactorum/on the battlefield/agriworld ect.)

[signal bramble]

Nobles are expected to reproduce but that doesn’t require intercourse. There’s a knight world where married couples don’t even live together, they just combine their dna and artificially grow a baby.

All artificially done.

[arctic talon]

Vat grown babies are very common

among the Mechanicus

and Mechanicus aligned knight worlds

child birth is in fact dangerous

[signal bramble]

They’re imperialis actually.

[arctic talon]

neat

[signal bramble]

They do it because married couples that got too close would betray their houses for each other.

Can’t have that love thing get in the way of politics so they “solved” it.

[meager zinc]

oh i didn't know most imperial citizens were vat grown

[signal bramble]

As usual, it depends.

[meager zinc]

where, when, etc. I gotcha

[arctic talon]

‘It all serves a purpose, of course. It is a right of passage. The pain will activate certain chemical processes within you that will bond you and make rearing the infant easier.’

‘I will love it’, she said, ‘because it will hurt me?’ It sounded ridiculous. His explanation probably was, but she would love it, she knew. She felt it as surely as a star warms its planets and brings forth life from the sea. The Machine-God decreed it to be so. -Titandeath

[signal bramble]

The imperium is a million worlds and vast beyond the scope that we humans can comprehend. So the answer to “how do they reproduce?” is “yes.”

[meager zinc]

are lgbtq+ tolerated in the imperium?
"everyone in this hive city is lgbtq+ but everyone is suffering and so oppressed no one has realized it."

[signal bramble]

No one cares.

Literally no one cares.

[meager zinc]

exactly lolll

[signal bramble]

Yup.

[meager zinc]

i mean i dunno. gangers seem to have some downtime.

[signal bramble]

If you’re familiar with the hierarchy of needs, most people are too focused on trying to stay alive.

[storm jungle]

Realistically speaking some planets would not tolerate them

human bigotry exists eternally lol

but mostly yeah nobody would care

[signal bramble]

Complete apathy. The best form of tolerance.

[storm jungle]

Sexism still exists so its not that far off for the most part

[meager zinc]

i feel like orks would be more cool with it than the imperium for some reason.

[storm jungle]

I mean orks are mushrooms

they just wanna kill anyone and anything

if it breathes and fight, they'll kill it

[signal bramble]

Orks will happily kill and/or enslave and/or eat anyone.

[meager zinc]

exactly. im a filthy humie, so what i define myself as is no interest of him.

but what i define myself as in the imperium COULD be heresy or a chaos corruption

[signal bramble]

Why you’d be worried about things like identity when you could just be out fighting would make the ork confused.

[storm jungle]

Yeah like

just look at how the catholic church has treated gay people over the centuries

thats the only evidence you need lol

[signal bramble]

As usual it depends.

[meager zinc]

but with an ork, itd just be like. "uh huh. uh huh." SMASH.
no risk of the situation getting worse by what i say.

[signal bramble]

If you’re a hive worker with the job I mentioned above no one will care.

If you’re wealthy and powerful no one will care.

Whatever constitutes “heresy” is in the eyes of whoever is powerful enough to do something about it.

[meager zinc]

im just talking about the risk of a situation escalating is all

[signal bramble]

There’s nothing in the Emperor worship that addresses sexuality that’s been mentioned. Only that big E is the one true god, saying otherwise is heresy, hate aliens, witches, mutants.

[meager zinc]

your identity to an ork? nothing. so the situation plateaus. (whatever that means)

[signal bramble]

Your identity to an ork is “target.”

XD

[meager zinc]

exactly. so the situation cant be elevated anymore lol

you can gauge the situation.

but if a commissar comes up to you and start asking you about who you find attractive in the habblock? you gotta play 5D chess

im not really trying to make a grand statement on the imperium. i just think telling an ork your non-binary is funny.

[crisp heath]

In Gazghkull Thraka: Prophet of the Waaagh, there'd an ork that uses they/them pronouns, because he's aware they aren't male in the same way humans are

So they do understand the concept even though it doesn't apply to them

[arctic talon]

Orks are intresting

Sometimes they say something really insightful

And then go back to beating someone to death with an iron pipe

[winter vessel]

Can't forget during War of the Beast where an Ork Attack Moon was within Terra's orbit, and sent 3 ambassadors to demand for their surrender. and these big greenies spoke in perfect Gothic.

[crisp heath]

‘I thought Anathrosis was your patriarch?’ asked Oltyx, briefly distracted by wondering if he had misremembered this detail of the seccession war. 
‘That changed.’```

Anyway reposting the trancrons for relevance

[storm jungle]

And Oltyx just goes

"I see. Anyway onto my problems."

[barren tapir]

Like a chad i would like to add

[north lotus]

I mean to an extent all hatreds still exist thanks to the vast space.

[storm jungle]

Yes. Thus my point.

[tame jasper]

any of you peoples know a good place to read about sister of battle battle gear please

[north lotus]

Have you considered their codex?

[tame jasper]

dont own it

[celest dome]

Lexicanum ?

[tame jasper]

i can try there the wiki page had a tiny amount

[storm jungle]

https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Adepta_Sororitas_Armoury

[tame jasper]

thanks

[celest dome]

To note that those are the Table Top weapon

[tame jasper]

okey

[celest dome]

There are also weapon that they could also use in the lore (So not restricted)

[tame jasper]

i am more conserned with lore then tabletop as i am gonna make a game for a friend of mine "rp"

[arctic talon]

that list on lexicanum includes lore stuff

and stuff that isn't on the tabletop anymore

[tame jasper]

okey 🙂

[celest dome]

But it isn't exhaustive

[arctic talon]

Like the repressor

[signal bramble]

The Bolter, Flamer, and Melta are their holy trinity of guns though.

[arctic talon]

which is a riot supression vehicle

[signal bramble]

To them.

[arctic talon]

or rather was a riot supression vehicle

the SoB replaced the water cannons with flamethrowers

It is in fact very good at burning protesters alive

[tame jasper]

sounds resonable

and wery mouch like them hehe

[signal bramble]

Nothing quite like a substance that sticks to your skin and roasts you alive to make you rethink your current activities.

[tame jasper]

hehehehehe

god old napalm 😄

40k version

*good

[honest trellis]

all the lore about "royal honor and protocols" is so cringe for necrons

[signal bramble]

Man on the world eaters codex is so devoted to Khorne he decided to become an axe.

[crisp heath]

Necrons having some OP stuff is fine though since they have a handful of hard counters

Even though they can get back up that's mostly up to chance and it makes attrition risky, no actual psykers which means they lose a turn on the tabletop/can't use warp fuckery in lore

[meager zinc]

he's got his head in the game. literally.

no wait... he's got a sharp mind. HEH

[dense trench]

Curious what y'all think of a custom guardsmen army I'm planning on making

The Cadian 24th Combined Arms Regiment "the living dead". Comprised of cadians that fought on and survived the fall of Cadia who's regiments were too decimated to be rebuilt. As they continue to fight in the emperors name they are reinforced by other regiments that are decimated wholesale and can't be salvaged. Commanded by Colonel Polski.

[dense trench]

Or maybe the Cadian 24th "Red Raiders" specializing in hard and fast attacks to complete their objectives. I dunno still very much undecided

[open pumice]

I dig the color scheme

and its definitely a decent army idea

a patchwork of different regiments that themselves couldnt be maintained, but were still large enough to be usable

[north lotus]

Why not add on to this that their retirement let’s them become instructors

[open pumice]

"retirement"

[rose thorn]

Who would you considered the most paranoid warhammer characters?

[signal bramble]

Asdrubael Vect

Or the Drukhari in general.

[rose thorn]

I DIDNT EVEN THINK OF HIM LMAO

Didn’t gw kill him he faked his own death like 5 times

And then got pissed off and murdered everyone who looked sad at his funerals

[signal bramble]

I don’t remember but that sounds believable.

But yeah when it comes to paranoia I say the Drukhari.

[crimson kayak]

ah yes, the guy that's so important that he was part of a vehicle model on soulstorm

[rose thorn]

Lol yeah

He also has liek

20 body doubles

[signal bramble]

Especially because when the Drukhari take revenge they don’t just kill you. They make sure you suffer and stay alive.

[crisp heath]

I mean is it paranoia if all your fears are real?

[signal bramble]

There’s a Drukhari that makes a very vivid threat to a space marine, like how he’d use his flesh to make a cape and keep his eyes and brain alive so he could watch him kill humans.

At first you might laugh and say it’s edgy but then you realize that the Drukhari can and will actually do that.

Then it becomes a lot more scary.

[rose thorn]

Is it paranoia when your assassin’s assassin’s assassins have set up a 15 separate plans to kill you after you pay them for killing the two other assassins you ordered to kill each other

[crimson kayak]

btw remember when dreadnought's were just ED-209 from robocop but with angry facegrills?

[signal bramble]

I found it.

:/

Context: a Deatwatch kill team is trying to cripple a "Drukhari Craftworld" and they get interrupted by the Archon using a meat puppet to taunt them.

‘Know this, xenos,’ Arkamedies snarls, his voice echoing Beymund’s righteous fury. ‘This is the last day that you draw breath.’

The human-puppet spreads his arms in a strange gesture and makes that grotesque laughing sound again.

‘Do you know what I find most disappointing in your kin?’ the sinister creature chuckles. ‘An utter lack of imagination in the arena of threats.

Now allow me to make you a promise, mon-keigh creature.

Your bones will form the handles of the instruments I use to extract suffering from millions of your wretched kind. Your muscles will form the cushions beneath my throne, where I rest my feet while I survey my domain. You skin will form the garments I use to clothe my glorious form. Your eyes I will embed into my armour, allowing you to watch with intimate closeness every mon-keigh I reduce to a screaming flesh-morsel. And I will keep you alive through it all, the dissected remains of your body sustained by machinery beyond the comprehension of your primitive species, your nervous system connected via unfathomable technology, so that every piece of your body may experience every iota of your humiliation until the ending of the universe.”

Fixed it so the stupid bot won’t delete it.

[rose thorn]

the bots 24/7

[signal bramble]

Read that though.

[rose thorn]

I know it’s gonna end bad when they said ‘drukhari craft world’

[signal bramble]

Like I said, it sounds edgy. But then you have to remember (unlike the edgy teenager) the Drukhari archon would actually do everything he just said.

[rose thorn]

I do love Drukahri, it’s probably on stove for my next army when I start a new army with someone else

But I need to read more of their lore

[crimson kayak]

and more

[signal bramble]

I normally love elves in settings but the 40k ones just don’t do anything for me.

Back in the day I had a high elf army in the warhammer fantasy days.

But I’m just not in to the aos or 40k ones.

[rose thorn]

I wanna like craft worlds

But I don’t like that samurai bullshit

Drukhari and harlequins i love

It’s like 4 different things mashed together

Drukahri are like, every dark fantasy 80s movie

[crimson kayak]

personally i like the ynnari

[signal bramble]

If I had to pick one I’d probably go with Harleys.

But I’m satisfied with what I got rn.

[rose thorn]

I’d like them

But ynnari, more like ynno more lore

If they had more stuff I’d probably like them

But also in game play apparently they don’t like letting you combo stuff

So instead of all the eldar together, it’s more like, drukhari | harlequins | craft worlds

[signal bramble]

Right now most competitive tournament lists are Harleys with or without some drukhs.

[crisp heath]

I like exodites and some craftworlds are ok, but other than that I pretty much hate all eldar

[signal bramble]

But the cwe aren’t bad at all.

[rose thorn]

Eldar honor <<<<<< imperial knight honor

[signal bramble]

[rose thorn]

I fucking love imperial knights

‘FOR THE GLORY OF THE BLOOD LINE’

steps on dude

‘A FAIR DUEL’

uses tank sized gun to melt a unit

[signal bramble]

I’m a knights main.

[rose thorn]

I’d be a knight main

But the price hikes >:(

And chaos wardogs are in the shadow realm

[rose thorn]

Fuck I wanna paint my armingers now

I fucked up pretty badly dry brushing metal on, it’s too thin so there’s just glitter everywhere

[signal bramble]

I love painting armigers.

I think they strike the perfect balance of not being too small to give me eye strain on the details but not too large that painting them takes ages.

[rose thorn]

Yee

Who’s your favorite house for loyal and chaos

My favorite loyal house is house griffith tbh

[crisp heath]

I jotted down some notes for a homebrew knight house that operates on magical girl logic, because knights have an extremely femme design

[signal bramble]

Taranis or Krast. I don’t really like any of the CK.

[rose thorn]

It’s like

They are fucking psychotic and they hand killed every dragon on their planet to find the stash of the ore they needed to build knights

[crisp heath]

https://spikeybits.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/imperial-knight.jpg Quintessentially hyperfeminized

[signal bramble]

I’m very interested in house Kamadar that’s been appearing in the Dawn of Fire series. The next one is suppose to go to their homeworld. Their knight house is also matriarchal which we don’t see very much.

[signal bramble]

That’s actually the wallpaper I use on my phone.

[crisp heath]

You got assigned lesbian by lock screen, it doesn't care if you're a boy

[rose thorn]

Fair enofih

[signal bramble]

I like the lore for Taranis most.

I like krast because that’s who I played my knights as on the 8th edition tables.

They were undefeated as well until 9th edition rolled around.

[rose thorn]

Most people honestly just like either house korvax or herpatrax for their favroite dread house

Bud I really like khymere

Idk if it’s new lore but they have allot of that uhh

[signal bramble]

I know who they are.

[rose thorn]

Star reading tarot card stuff

[signal bramble]

Yar.

I do like the CK a little more. A lot of the new books depict them less like evil nobles and more like savage kaiju.

Which I can totally get behind.

[rose thorn]

Yeee, I think house uhhh

[signal bramble]

Kingmaker did a good job of that.

[rose thorn]

I FUCKING LOVEEE KINGMAKER AAAA

House khormentis is pretty funny and cool, like their wardogs just being basically wild animals they tame and train is amazing

And their whole dynamic is like hunters and the bloodhounds

[signal bramble]

I can’t wait to see house kamadar in the new novel.

Even though gate of bones showed us that a single Chaos marine can destroy a knight single-handedly.

[rose thorn]

OOoOo??? I don’t keep track of the books is there a new one coming out

[signal bramble]

Yeah.

[rose thorn]

Who would win, 1 ork or a knight Dominous

[signal bramble]

Gman is going to the home of house kamadar and their queen in the next novel to demand more knights and to force the queen to turn her planet in to an imperial staging point.

[rose thorn]

Ooooo fuck yeah

[signal bramble]

||Bringing with him the corpse of her only daughter and heir who got punked by a single iron warrior.||

[rose thorn]

Lmao

[signal bramble]

The iron warrior climbed her knight, ripped the hatch open, and crushed her head like a tomato.

[rose thorn]

I hope gw eventually fixes their US prices, they use to be pretty affordable but now almost 200 dollars for your normal model is horirble

[signal bramble]

Second hand is the way to go.

[rose thorn]

Yeah definitely

It’s 144 on Amazon

I wrote my own knight lore, and it’s basically just someone murdering her arranged husband after he makes fun of her for letting her brother die

Her brother inherited the knight and went to war the night before her wedding so she snuck out and stole an arminger

And watched her brother die, but she couldn’t inherent the knight because she was getting married so her husband would get it instead

So she challenged her husband to a fencing duel, and then stabbed him so hard the went though his neck, and snapped on the wall behind him

So she’s a pilot now <3

The knight’s name is ‘the gentle blade’ once a name of pride for her family’s finesse, it’s now a joke from how cruel and brutal she is with it

[signal bramble]

Mine had their home devoured by tyranids and became freeblades. But after expending much of their diminished resources they were given a choice to either be stranded or bend the knee to mars. Without a choice they became a vassal house to taranis.

Eventually given control over an agri world of their own that exists solely to provide ore and food to an allied forge world of mars. The knights are there to guard it and provide warriors for a Titan legion and protect the Admech interests in the sector.

[orchid thicket]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8nZPM08XGc

Thoughts?

[echo vault]

I don't know much about AoS lore but does each realm constitute a planet or a plain of existence at a specific size

Because I wanna imagine there's a human city there built solely by some lesser god to figure out how to inevitably make an iphone and they're failing horribly at it

There is that one city industrializing so bad it's like england during the industrial revolution but worse

But this is like civilization setting the city to work on a specific tech labeled "iphone" and they can't do it

[celest dome]

No real definite size, just that the further you go from the centre the more it become "weird"

ANd unstable

[echo vault]

Thank you

[celest dome]

Do we allow magic stuff ? Cause if so we might already have phones in AoS maybe even in Fantasy but not sure anymore

[echo vault]

I mean my thought process for this idea is the monkeys on typewriters making Shakespeare thing, how much industrial revolution era casualties would it take to inevitable plan and produce an iphone, like iphone 4

They don't have the instructions to make an iphone because that's cheating but have the general visual of an iphone in their head

They know it exists and want to build it, but after that it's have fun

They know it's a machine that has component parts like a tank or any of the more advanced pieces they can come up with, but that's about it

[celest dome]

Can they use Daemons ?

[echo vault]

No daemons sheer human ingenuity

It has to be invented and constructed with each part ""invented"" by a human no elves or dwarfs

I mean this is like asking someone from the early 19th century to make an iphone just more whimsical

So idk

[celest dome]

If they are given the time; maybe, but it'll take a lot of time

[echo vault]

That's what makes it funny

[rapid jay]

what % of the imperium are planets with breathable air, and has it ever been explained in lore why the number is so high?

[celest dome]

Nearly all of them have breathable air, just toxic

Or filled with pollution

And we don't know the percentage

But most likely Aggri world are nicer to live on than Hive or Forge Worlds

[rapid jay]

was there ever an attempt to explain why/how so many worlds have breathable air?

[celest dome]

You mean have air at all, or air that is clean as what you'd have in a forest without any spec of pollution ?

[rapid jay]

as compared to the real actually existing universe

where whe know 1 (one) planet with human breathable air

[celest dome]

There is plenty of worlds where the outside air is normal

Like even Atoma has outside breathable air

[hallow saddle]

Depends on altitude too I think

Some spires are above the pollution

[crimson kayak]

No guys, I think he means how planets are naturally more sustainable for life

And for that yeah, they weren't, most of the habited planets are either terraformed by humans or an older race or just happened to be in the livable area of their system

It's just that all races except like... Three? (Nids, Orks and Necron) and chaos fucks all require oxygen

So when you have intergalactic empires you try to make sure you can breathe in the planets you live on

And tbf, with the levels of pollution on most imperial planets you would probably be better off without oxygen

[simple sparrow]

Speaking of pollution, I’m confused as to how the steel legion survives whatsoever

They’re just wearing jackets but the air is supposedly so corrosive it can turn you to soup?

[celest dome]

40k and lore that make no sense is not that weird

Most likely an exaggeration like most often

[crimson kayak]

Depends on the area

Think of it like chernobyl, you can stand relatively near with just getting cancer in 20 or so years, or you can go to the elephant foot and melt alongside it

If I learned one thing is that if in any way, shape or form you see some description of an entire place/group, 90% it's just a generalization of the situation

[simple sparrow]

So do you think people on Armageddon or other super polluted worlds have a huge cancer/mutation rate?

Or I guess if they’re in the hive they’re protected

Maybe the soldiers or people who venture outside I guess

[barren tapir]

Mutation is rampant in every hive city

[rose thorn]

That’s sick!!

Who is more petty, purterabo or Mortarion

[barren tapir]

Mortarion

[celest dome]

Perturabo is petty for no reason
Mortarion is very vindicative

[echo vault]

Everyone forgets the most important god in the Warhammer setting

Nuffle

[mystic geyser]

Nuffle be praised.

[crimson kayak]

as silver said Mutations due to a good number of factors are relatively common, they usually don't spread due to racism+purging, but there were even cases of full-on mutant rebellions on some planets

[signal bramble]

A lot of the poor laborers in the books from worlds like that are depicted as being very pale and thin and sickly.

But not so much mutated.

Even if exposure might mutate them over time they’re much more likely to die from the poor conditions first.

[red spruce]

Are the space marines alive from formation of first space marines up to the 41st millenium?

[open pumice]

No

[celest dome]

Think so, but they are rare

[open pumice]

Except for like 3

The oldest living space marine whos not in a dreadnaught and did t fall to chaos is dante

Whos 1500

Technically there are a few like bjorn whove been around since the great crusade

And rylanor

But they are interred in dreadnaughts

So their life/death status is a bit fucky

[red spruce]

iis this dante impeded by his age?

[celest dome]

Rylanor is dead though

[celest dome]

Somewhat

[open pumice]

And then there are chaos marines, but time in the warp is fuckywucky as well

[red spruce]

chaos marines dont count

[open pumice]

Besides having to lug his incredibly massive balls around, no

[celest dome]

Then there is very few ancient SM
Like very very few

[red spruce]

because most old legiones turned traitor?

[open pumice]

Only half the legions

But yeah

[celest dome]

No, because Chaos juice them up and they can survive for longer (But it's more difficult for them to create new CSM from Geneseeds

[open pumice]

Like abbadon was one of the og of og marines

But one, time is fuckywucky in the warp

And two thayre high on warp juice

[celest dome]

Abaddon, Kharn, Doctor dude

[open pumice]

Many of them are more chaos than man

[celest dome]

A lot of named CSM are

[red spruce]

but i dont count chaos marines because time is optional in the warp

[open pumice]

A bit ye

[red spruce]

yay i learned this in darktide 😄

[open pumice]

One of the older marines to ever live was sigismund

[red spruce]

but what about the custodes? thes are all pretty old

[open pumice]

Hes a badass, we like sigismund

[open pumice]

Oldest custodian we have a confirmed dat on is 3000

[mystic geyser]

@red spruce there are very old custodes about. But they do die of old age eventually, shenanigans aside

[open pumice]

There are likely many from the time of the herest amd earlier

[open pumice]

We havent seen any die yet

They just start to slow down and become eyes if the emperor

(Die of old age that is)

[mystic geyser]

Quite possibly

[open pumice]

As far as I know the oldest co firmed one was a 3000 year old warden who served on the companions thrice

I know that valoris is old as balls

But his age is never confirmed

[red spruce]

can you imagine serving in a war for 3000 years?

[open pumice]

Custodes arent an army

And as such didnt really go to war pre indomitus

[red spruce]

ya fancy honor guard

[open pumice]

Thats not to say they didnt fight, or see the galaxy out around them

They just didnt deploy in force, or declare wars

[red spruce]

im just saying opposite to the regular imperial motto of "doing your utmost to serve" the custodes had a lot of service left base on their potential

[open pumice]

Kinda

I mean the custodes capture live space marines so they can set them free on terra and hunt them for sport on the regular lmao

But their 'potential' is prettymuch exclusively guarding that corpse on the throne

[red spruce]

what
whats the point

[open pumice]

Practice.

Knowing thy enemy

Also im pretty sure they straight up just get bored

[red spruce]

enemy? in case of another "horus heresy"?

[open pumice]

Kwep in mind thrse are usually chaos space marines or renegade chapters

[open pumice]

Custodes hate space marines with a burning passion

[red spruce]

arent they kinda the same?

[open pumice]

No

Spqce marines have organ implants and genecode modification, they are a mass produced fighting force

[crisp heath]

A custodes is to a space marine what a space marine is to a laborer

[open pumice]

Yeah

[crisp heath]

Not even a guardsman, an actual untrained worker

[open pumice]

Except the custodian has more in common with that untrained laborer than the space marine does

Custodes dont recieve geneseed

And also dont get extra organs

They are just normal humans, brought up to the absolute pinacle of humanity, from about the age of 1-2

[red spruce]

still wont help you when your ship blows up in warp transit

[signal bramble]

Exactly what the custodes are and changed in to isn’t clearly explained in any lore. Only that they take in babies from Terran noble families and they are then handcrafted from birth in to the custodians we see. Any slight defect and the subject is discarded.

[celest dome]

Do we know if they don't get extra organs ?

[signal bramble]

We don’t.

[open pumice]

We do?

[signal bramble]

The exact process isn’t revealed in their codex either.

[open pumice]

Well yeah but its fairly commonly.implied they dont recieve extra organs

[signal bramble]

wot

[open pumice]

Atleast none that we know of

[celest dome]

I would say that Custodes are closer to Primarch than Space Marines, but not to Laborers

[open pumice]

Or atleast were told quite often they dont gave any of the space marine organs

[open pumice]

Honestly this largely depends on author

[celest dome]

Each are custom made and get their own specific upgrades, some of those most likely are organs with specific roles

[signal bramble]

I can only go by what’s in their actual codex and it says the actual process and that goes in to it is unknown. They undergo gene therapy and mental conditioning beyond any other, that we do know.

[open pumice]

I meam yeah but whats your point lol

[open pumice]

Potentially

[signal bramble]

And the dudes who make the custodes are themselves gene enhanced and bionically enhanced so their work is amazing.

[open pumice]

Yeah its a top secret tech

[signal bramble]

And I just remembered they specially use the phrase “gene alchemy” in the codex also.

[open pumice]

Arcane genetic alchemy yeah

[celest dome]

Well knowing that they are worked on by special geneticist and not Admech robotician would tend to them having mutant organ if not added organs to boot

[open pumice]

The implication is always that they are gods amongst men, even to the astartes, forged by preternatural powers beyond modern day understanding to achieve what is peak understanding

[red spruce]

considering the emperor raged a univere wide war, the concentration of power on singular individuals is maybe not a successful strategy

further thinking perhaps the custodes were a failure and the space marines the actual success

[open pumice]

No

They were not

You are factually incorrect

[open pumice]

The custodes arent so much an army as they are a fighting force

They were never meant for long distance engagements

They were meant for the protection of terra and the emperor

The first custodian, valdor, was hand crafted by him

[celest dome]

Thunder Warrior were the failure and SM were the next plan for the weapon. Custodes were supposed to be the future of humanity, neither replacing thr other (Though most likely scenario would have the SM ne culled after they served their uses)

[open pumice]

His weaoons and armor forged by the emperor

[red spruce]

for being their bodyguards, the custodes didnt really do a good job

[open pumice]

It would have been easier if magnus hadnt fucked up the webwag projecy and killed over 90% of them lmao

[red spruce]

id say thunder warriors were a neccessary evil

[red spruce]

he did kill 90% of them? ooooopsi

[signal bramble]

That being said, since the exact process of what the custodes are made of is unknown, it’s just as possible for them to have their own special extra organs.

[open pumice]

Mount errerat was unnecasrily cruel to the imperiums heros

[signal bramble]

The custodes were always meant to be his bodyguards and confidantes.

[open pumice]

not directly, the war in the webway was hard fought and lost

but its magnus the red's fault

because sending an astropathic text to terra was like

the smart move

[red spruce]

wait a minute... a fight in the webway resulted in 90% of the godlike custodes lost?
this is a bit inconsistent

[open pumice]

custodes can be felled

it just takes an extreme amount of force to do so

such as, oh idk

Greater demons of all four chaos gods coming down to slay the emperor, and having to get thru his wall of golden glory first

[red spruce]

i will continue to defend magnus!
in my opinion it was the emperors fault for noone warning to the dangers of the warp except "do it and i will slap you dead"

[signal bramble]

I believe it. Big E admitted that the webway was impossible and gave up.

Which says a lot.

I have my own theories on that but they’re just speculation.

[celest dome]

And also reality warping around them and stuff, wouldn't be an easy battlefield

[open pumice]

there were literal heretic titans, godlike or not, titans are rough to fight

[signal bramble]

My general theory is that if the heresy never happened and he conquered the galaxy he’d then put all the legions in to the webway and focus their raw force on that.

[celest dome]

As long as I can say that the Emperor was a net loss for Mankind

[red spruce]

shots fired

[open pumice]

potentially, the webway was largely secure, demon infestation in it was rare

I find it more likely that the final fate of the legiones would have been a simple order to

stop making more legionaires

the emperor is known for his hubris, but he's not quite that dumb to think his custodes would actually be able to kill of the legiones astartes at legion strength

[celest dome]

I mean he was

[open pumice]

debatable

[celest dome]

He game Chaos the biggest power up since the accession of Slaanesh

[signal bramble]

[The Master of Mankind]

Machines were going dark all around them. Great engines of the Emperor’s own vision – centuries in the design and decades in the making – were cycling down, haemorrhaging power. Slowly, slowly, far too slowly.

Diocletian sought the Emperor Himself, seeing His master ascending the steps to the Golden Throne once more.

‘My liege!’

The Emperor enthroned Himself, His grip loose on the armrests.

‘Sire! Seal the gate!’

The Emperor waited, staring towards the portal. Even from such a distance, Diocletian could see the intensity of that stare. The Emperor fixed his gaze on the gateway, waiting, waiting. Hesitating to do what must be done? Reluctant to abandon His greatest ambition? Or hopeful, yet, that another figure might manifest from the golden fog?

A shape darkened the mist. Something winged and clawed. Another figure, bloated and horned. And more. Others. A host of inhumanity. The Throne-engines were still cycling down.

‘Sire!’ Diocletian pleaded.

The Emperor closed His right hand into a fist, clenched within His glove. With a harmonious pattern of thunderclaps, every generator within the chamber went dark, their internal mechanics rupturing, starving the Golden Throne of energy.

The archway that led to humanity’s doomed salvation was nothing more than an ornate doorway, leading to the bare rock of the throne room wall.

Power failed completely, plunging the Imperial Dungeon into darkness.

The Emperor turned to him, His eyes focusing on the Custodian for the first time. ‘The war is over, Diocletian. Win or lose, Horus has damned us all. Mankind will share in his ignorance until the last man or woman draws the species’ last breath. The warp will forever be a cancer in the heart of all humans. The Imperium may last a hundred years, or a thousand, or ten thousand. But it will fall, Diocletian. It will fall. The shining path is lost to us. Now we rage against the dying of the light.’

[copper patrol]

morally? yes, longevity maybe not as the imperium while shit has been around for over 10k years which is very impressive

[signal bramble]

Check out that quote.

[open pumice]

man

Diocletian is based

I loved that book

[open pumice]

It's hard to say, most of the "morals" we see come the 41st and 42nd millenium are due to decay of the imperium
we don't get a good look at what life was like for most people pre heresy

[red spruce]

so... humans are doomed in the long run because of the warp?

[copper patrol]

we know that ultramar was pretty decent

[open pumice]

yes, just as is everything else in the galaxy

except maybe possibly nids

[signal bramble]

That’s what big E believed but it may have been despair and/or frustration

He saw his greatest work foiled.

So he was definitely not happy.

[red spruce]

or bad recordkeeping knowing the imperium

[open pumice]

I'd buy that, except for the fact that its reinforced at almost every turn

[copper patrol]

i'd say it;s hard to say whether or not big e was a negative or positive without seeing what would have happened had he not been there

[open pumice]

agreeable

[copper patrol]

considering all the other shit that was going on when he popped up

[open pumice]

when he showed up eh was definitely a positive

i.e.

old night, Slaanesh bottom text, etc

[copper patrol]

thanks eldar

[red spruce]

well he couldve popped up during the age of strife?
before AI went crazy

[copper patrol]

wasn't he working on thunder warriors during that

[open pumice]

yeah but that wouldn't have been as narratively interesting, nor was it a drmaatic point in time

[open pumice]

no

[copper patrol]

the real reason

[red spruce]

oh yes true, show business ^^

[open pumice]

warhammer is, first and foremost, a story

often decisions are taken and things happen not because they make logical sense

but because they are dramatic

especially durring and before the horus heresy

[arctic talon]

Well it’s first and foremost designed to sell minis

[open pumice]

which is, to humanity, the great drama

[arctic talon]

The story just needs to work

[open pumice]

well yeah

[red spruce]

you know the emperors story is for me quite simply summed up: god-like being failed in the basics of humanity and as a father, dooming all humanity

[open pumice]

It's a pretty bog standard greek tragedy

[copper patrol]

the emperor is less of a character and more of a narrative driving device

if that makes sense

[red spruce]

nah, a revenge/evil/hatred filled empress is missing

[open pumice]

I

no?

factually incorrect?

spreading misinformation on the internet?

[red spruce]

what?

[open pumice]

Amar astarte, botom text

and that other one i cant remember, also botom text

[red spruce]

what

[copper patrol]

lady helped make the primarchs

also a stupid reasoning why they are called adeptues astartes

[plush mason]

the chick that lead the primarchs project

[red spruce]

oh? didnt know
but was she an evil witch about it?

[open pumice]

i think it is perfectly petty

[arctic talon]

Amar Astartes a bit silly

[copper patrol]

she's who cast the primarchs out to the random ass planets iirc

[open pumice]

she detonated several high grade explosives inside the imperial palace

[arctic talon]

Instead of just naming them after the goddess

[open pumice]

so probably

[open pumice]

thats not astarte, thats the other lady

[copper patrol]

it's like the land's raider

[red spruce]

nvm
back to greek tragedy

[copper patrol]

not becuase it raids over land

[open pumice]

no

it's arkhan land's raider

[copper patrol]

but becuase Arkhan Land found it

[open pumice]

they actually cover this in master of mankind

which I find

[arctic talon]

Arkhan Land’s raider

Is pretty fun

[open pumice]

genuinely amusing

[arctic talon]

Also it’s been with the lore for so long

So

[plush mason]

tbf it doesnt "raid over land" that phrase alone is dumb as hell

[arctic talon]

Honestly anyone who complains about it just hasn’t read far back enough

[open pumice]

I think land's raider is a perfectly 40k thing lmao

[arctic talon]

In the lore

[copper patrol]

I mean it's stupid and fine at the same time

it's surface level stupid

but fine on a deeper level

[open pumice]

arkhan land is a based as hell techno archeologist

[copper patrol]

doesn't he have a monkey that throws shit at people

[open pumice]

yes!

based
as
hell

[copper patrol]

Land himself is pretty neat yeah

[open pumice]

Reject humanity
return to psyber monkey

[arctic talon]

It has a poisoned tail

That it injects venom with

[copper patrol]

but like I named my vet Johnny-Las, not becuase he uses a las gun

[arctic talon]

Because that is clearly what the tail is used for

[plush mason]

a raid is a fast small scale assault with limited forces so a giant and fairly slow super heavy transport/assault craft like the land raider is the last thing you want on one so

[open pumice]

mans gonna get land's raided

[red spruce]

i dnt follow but i dont really want to know more, last time I asked for more information I ended up reading a wiki article for 2 hours about a clepto necro

[copper patrol]

Trazyn

[red spruce]

ye

[open pumice]

Trazyn!

[open pumice]

the land raider was an STC found by a techno archeologis Arkhan Land, who dubbed the Land's Raider after him self

it is Arkhan Land's Raider

[red spruce]

he is honestly just a carricature of the average 40k enjoyer

[plush mason]

naming it the "raider" was a bit of a dumb move but then such is 40k

[red spruce]

okay
understood 🙂

[celest dome]

Amar Astarte or what ever was her name

[open pumice]

we can fight on semantics, but Land Raider is catchey, unique and copyrightable

[copper patrol]

I mean

[plush mason]

true that

[copper patrol]

"lumineth realm lords" are copyrightable as well

[open pumice]

Yeah but that name is cringe and so is AoS

Give me Ulthuan or give me death!

[plush mason]

it also makes sense in that they are the "lords of the realm of light"

[celest dome]

AoS has great things, it's elves aren't it

[red spruce]

this works even in our world
google suggests the wrong form
this is a 1000 IQ life-time troll

[copper patrol]

AoS names are cringe, AoS is fine and i'll leave it at that

[open pumice]

AoS makes me sad

Stonk miss fantasy

[celest dome]

Thr Fyreslayer are the worst faction

AoS isn't at fault for Fantasy ending

Fantasy only has itself to blame

[red spruce]

what makes me really sad is that all the mankind armies have boxy and ugly tanks 😦

[open pumice]

Not the custodes!

[red spruce]

why would a custodes have a need of a tank?

[celest dome]

The Admech tank are nice

[open pumice]

because what if the threat to the emperor is armored

look at this sleek gamer

With the enhanced arachnus blaze cannon

[plush mason]

because they are the emperor's special golden bois so they have to have the best version of all of the imperium's best toys

[red spruce]

_> waste of resources

[plush mason]

yup

[open pumice]

i mean welcome to 40k?

that's

the whole shtick

[plush mason]

yup

[open pumice]

from the getgo

but the tank is rad!

[red spruce]

I prefer the Tau vehicles but then again lore wise Taus dont really matter at all at all at all

[open pumice]

complains about vehicles being boxy praises tau

wat

[open pumice]

radical dread gaming

[plush mason]

whats funny is the custodies dont even care about the imperium nor do they even really recognize it as the legitimate government

[red spruce]

tau vehicles are not boxy !

[open pumice]

half true, they recognize it as the legitimate government

they jsut

[celest dome]

Are they piloted by Custodes or do they have Unaugmented people for it

[open pumice]

see themselves as outside of it

[open pumice]

theres a custodian in there, an almost dead one, but a custodian none the less

[celest dome]

Not the Dreadnought, the tank

[plush mason]

and if the emperor ever told them to wipe out the high lords they would kill them all in a milla second

[red spruce]

that is a bad angle

[open pumice]

probably a custodian

[open pumice]

Correct

[plush mason]

the imperium is merely tolerated

[celest dome]

Didn't they already do that once ?

[open pumice]

Not quite yet

[red spruce]

also technically this is no vehicle but an ... exo suit?

[open pumice]

They see themselves outside of the government, they only answer to the emperor

Valloris is still a high lord of terra though

[open pumice]

It's classified as a vehicle in game so

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[plush mason]

its a mech so yes to both

[open pumice]

they have one

specific tank

that doesn't look incredibly boxy

this one

and it still looks bad

[plush mason]

isnt that more of an IFV?

[open pumice]

"tank"

[signal bramble]

They do use the normal people to help crew starships but that’s true for most of the elite factions.

[plush mason]

fair most IFVs are just light tanks with a space for some troops to sit in lol

[open pumice]

he's talking about the tank

[red spruce]

but this looks better? more like stolen and slightly modified from WW 1 tanks

[signal bramble]

I know.

[open pumice]

its based as hell

[signal bramble]

I was adding additional info.

[signal bramble]

Well yeah they borrowed designs from modern military.

[plush mason]

i love GW said "lets take the worse tank track design in history and use it for the main tank of the guard"

[open pumice]

It's based, its goofy, it looks super derpy

[signal bramble]

“It’s made from an stc so it must be good!”

[open pumice]

that is peak 40k model design

[red spruce]

if the imperium would get their heads out of their asses and design some decent weapons and promote scientific progress instead of throwing uncalcuble amounts of resources in the great meat grinder humanity would still have a chance

[signal bramble]

https://tenor.com/view/heresy-detected-war-hammer-40k-gif-9829547

[open pumice]

my man
you have missed
the entire point of warhammer 40000

[plush mason]

agreed but that misses the whole point of 40k

[timid ferry]

^

[open pumice]

also this is tech heresy, someone shoot that man

[signal bramble]

We love our horrific dystopian nightmare thank you very much.

[plush mason]

https://tenor.com/view/warhammer-40k-adeptus-sororitas-gif-14288794

[red spruce]

ALSO banning rudimentary electronics and replacing it with living servitors (therefore somehow vessels of the warp) is also MAYBE a bad idea in the long run

[signal bramble]

Trust not the thinking machines!

[open pumice]

servitors cant warp

they kinda lobotomised

[plush mason]

kinda?

[signal bramble]

https://tenor.com/view/warhammer-40k-techpriest-binaric-screeching-screeching-gif-20192683

[red spruce]

that what the guy says who puts your brain into a radio

[open pumice]

just a lil bit, as a treat

[open pumice]

excuse you it's a vox

[plush mason]

a bit? my man they all look and sound like Dr. death went hog wild with them

[red spruce]

but they have a entity in the warp? as far as i know only blanks have none

[open pumice]

just a sprinkling of brain removal

[open pumice]

i mean yeah, much in the same way a rat does

they don';t have

emotions

so they dont feed warp entities

and so aren't really a usefull conduit for them

[red spruce]

pretty sure i have read somewhere they do have emotions
not sure if it was canon .... let me see

[open pumice]

They don't usually The medicae seritors on tertium weren't lobotomised correctly

[red spruce]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CB7Yh2af_Bk

[red spruce]

azh yes! the tertium servitors ... lonely fellas

[open pumice]

this is fanfic

just FYI

[plush mason]

that can only happen if the lobotomization is flawed, even irl those subjected to the barbaric practice are left little more than vegetable husks with little higher brain function

[red spruce]

i leave a big X doubt
because I googled a bit and there is a huge debate on reddit about it
so its kinda your interpretation?

[open marsh]

Something I find very interesting. Morrow is mentioned as having fought in the Badab War as well as the Second War for Armageddon. The SWfA happened 20 years after the Badab War. Meaning he actually got to go back to his homeworld.

That's almost unheard of for an Imperial Guardsman. Especially someone who isn't a commissioned officer

[open pumice]

Every time we see a servitors perspective in the books, they are never feeling entities

they are machines, for all inttents and purposes

the parts of their brain used for emotion are canabalized into more cogitator power

[red spruce]

but with the exception of battle servitors most can feel pain

so is pain an emotion?

[open pumice]

no it's a biochemical response to outside stimuli

this is known to modern science already

[red spruce]

but does it have an effect on the warp

[open marsh]

There was that time a servitor got hit in the head and it jangled it's cybernetics abit loose. So the human it was made of regained much of his free will. Even if most of his memories had been lost and...well....he had been brain damaged to the point of significant retardation. Regressing him to more like a child

[plush mason]

i mean that debate is easily settled, is the story from the black library or at least commissioned by GW itself?

[open pumice]

anguish has an effect on the warp

[red spruce]

considering what the dark eldar do ... i would say yes

[open pumice]

anguish and suffering are emotions

which servitors feel not

[arctic talon]

Servitors aren't supposed to have emotions

unless the techpriest fucked up

[plush mason]

that is what lobotomization does, even those that dont become near brain dead end up stuck in a toddler level of brain development

[red spruce]

https://www.reddit.com/r/40kLore/comments/cfs4p8/best_examples_of_servitors_still_having_feelings/
there are several more
not sure if its wise to link them all here

[open marsh]

Yep. I'm sadly aware. Depressed medical researcher noises

[plush mason]

yeah

[open pumice]

r/40k lore is interesting

[plush mason]

its a fucked up part of irl medical history and perfect for 40k

[arctic talon]

All most all of those are examples of defective servitors

[open pumice]

but is largely occupied by people who glance over the wiki and then know exactly what they are talking about

[arctic talon]

The forge of mars one

Was lobotomized properly till a Tech Saint started messing with them

[open pumice]

This is also fishing for examples directly

[arctic talon]

^

And they’re all considered defective

Lol

[open marsh]

"Oh your wife is back talking you? She must have a maniac mental illness. Here, I will schedule her for a transorbital lobotomy and we will have her feeling right as rain (and compliant) in no time!

Also do you want a cigarette? It's good for you."

[open pumice]

so a lot of the various examples are going to be pulled out of context to meet the need

[arctic talon]

^

The guy was looking for stuff on arco flagellants

Or something similar to them

Servitors aren’t supposed to show emotion

[red spruce]

ye but my general point is that using humans for simple electronics like door locks, vox, toasters, etc. is not the right way
also even if these are defective: what if these emotions were only found in servitors because of their defects? doesnt rule out that an average servitor has somewhat emotions on a basal level
also scaled up the the size of the imperium the amount of defective servitors is also significant

[arctic talon]

I mean

Door locks can be mechanical

Servitors are only used for complex things

[open pumice]

My brother in emperor

40K isn't the right way

[arctic talon]

Servitors are expensive

They aren’t gona waste them on a door lock

[red spruce]

in darktide you can find a servitor skull on every door lock

[arctic talon]

When you can just use a bunch of basic electronics

[arctic talon]

Those aren’t servo skulls

[plush mason]

those arent servo skulls

[arctic talon]

It’s just skull decoration

[open pumice]

skull to small

just a decoration

[arctic talon]

The imperium loves skull decoration

^

[plush mason]

^

[arctic talon]

They literally melt bone into gold

[open pumice]

^

[arctic talon]

The imperium is a death cult

[red spruce]

hmmm has a chaos wipe

[arctic talon]

I mean

Yeah

[open marsh]

Inquisitor: Martyr and Necromunda: Hired Gun both have servitors who function as door controls

[arctic talon]

The imperium is a death cult

Filled with fanatical worshipers

[open pumice]

Bohemia, exactly how new are you to 40k

[arctic talon]

Except there’s plenty of examples of mechanical doors not using servitors

Also yeah the imperium isn’t meant to be good

They’re evil

[open pumice]

because I don't think you've caught on just yet

[arctic talon]

Very very evil

[open marsh]

Correct. Was that was the question was?

[red spruce]

im not saying good or evil
but strategically competent

[arctic talon]

It’s about the inefficiency of servitors I think?

I mean

It is competent

[open marsh]

The Imperium is good...in that they really are humanity's only hope as a species.

[plush mason]

nether of those are fully canon and even in martyr the PC mentions that using servitors for such a task is very strange

[arctic talon]

Flesh is the cheapest thing the imperium has

Human life is worthless

So why not turn a few trillion people into lobotomized robots

[plush mason]

ofc they use the phrase "seems excessive"

[open marsh]

They are canon. Claiming "partially canon!" only refers to stuff that is changeable by the player. Not the game setting itself

[arctic talon]

Many basic machines don’t have fleshy parts

[open pumice]

what's that guilliman quote
"Better that we had all died in the fires of horus' ambition than live to see this"

[arctic talon]

It’s when you get to advanced computers

You start to run into that issue

That need to do trillions of calculations a second

[red spruce]

point of discussion is that servitors were humans with a warp identity. we kinda discussed what the extend of warp indentity is left in a servitor and if it has a negative effect on the imperium as a whole compared to usage of basic electronics

[plush mason]

yeah no. the alpha pariah is so not canon

[open pumice]

There are almost no instances of servitors with chaos possesion

[arctic talon]

It doesn’t have a negative effect emotionally because servitors are a normal part of life so people are used to them

[open pumice]

there was an entire war fought ebcause of rogu AI that almost wiped out humanity entirely

[open marsh]

He also immediately recognized it was a lie.

[arctic talon]

Servitors can def get corrupted by chaos

[red spruce]

nooo
thats not what the point was
its about the servitor itself

[arctic talon]

Like their soul?

[open marsh]

Source

[open pumice]

the whole quote is war a shell tho

[arctic talon]

It wouldn’t effect it negatively as far as we know

[red spruce]

do you have a canon source for this?

[open pumice]

"Why do I still live? What more do you want from me? I gave everything I had to you, to them. Look what they've made of our dream. This bloated, rotting carcass of an empire is driven not by reason and hope but by fear, hate and ignorance. Better that we had all burned in the fires of Horus' ambition than live to see this."

[arctic talon]

One literally gets possessed in the Cain books

[open pumice]

they can, but its rare

and generally

[arctic talon]

And there are instances of it in skitariius

[red spruce]

I rest my case your honor

[arctic talon]

And also warzone charadon

But it is rarer

[open pumice]

go read up on the men of iron

[open marsh]

Use the whole quote

[red spruce]

electronics have NO risk of possession

[open pumice]

thats just what I could copy and paste at the time lmao

[open marsh]

‘Why do I still live,’ he snarled. ‘What more do you want from me? I gave everything I had to you, to them. Look what they’ve made of our dream. This bloated, rotting carcass of an empire is driven not by reason and hope but by fear, hate and ignorance. Better that we had all burned in the fires of Horus’ ambition than live to see this.’

Even as he said it, Guilliman heard the lie in his words. Amongst his brothers, none had been more idealistic than Roboute Guilliman. None had envisioned a brighter future, not just for Mankind but also for the warriors of the Legiones Astartes. That flame of hope had been a part of him for as long as he had lived. Even now, as it was smothered by darkness and woe, Guilliman realised that his flame endured.

[arctic talon]

Literally false

Electronics can get posessed

[open pumice]

also, MEN OF IRON

[arctic talon]

Daemonic scrap code

Is a thing

[red spruce]

im not saying full on humanity hating AI, but to use humans for radios is a bit dumb

[arctic talon]

And is very scary

[arctic talon]

Radios don’t use fleshy bits

[plush mason]

https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Caligari_Sector seems there is a black library page about the game's setting but it was removed or the link no longer works so i guess it is canon

[open pumice]

https://warhammer40k.fandom.com/wiki/Men_of_Iron

[open marsh]

Ironkyn noises