#40k-lore-chat

1 messages Ā· Page 103 of 1

brittle slate
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You mean FFG

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FFG is a powerhouse of lore

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More put together than GW

storm jungle
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Still cant believe they did my guy dirty

fierce pendant
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If there's no merchant in the remake I'll riot

storm jungle
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but alas new voice actor

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@astral whale Anyway so

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the Imperium is uniform

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its just not exactly enforced because its a tabletop game

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secondly, they got literal death camps and genetic supremacy messages that is said to all their citizens among many other things

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dont give me this "feudal oligarchy" nonsense lol

unique berry
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Oh no not one of those again

storm jungle
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Yeah alas

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"ITS NOT FASCISM WHEN IT HAS SO MANY RULING TYPES"

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Like okay but thats not really the same thing

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šŸ‘©ā€šŸ¦¼

unique berry
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This Universe attracts the the worst and stupidest people way to often

honest trellis
# storm jungle the Imperium is uniform

Yeah for a system that literally can't centralize as much as other settings it dedicates an obscene amount of effort into destroying other internal human cultures and punishing breaking from the party line

storm jungle
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Yeah like the Imperium's un-uniformity is mainly for homebrew reasons but its explained much better in lore as to why its the case.

honest trellis
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the lack of "official laws" about it just means there isn't actually a law outside of "the church/secret police say so" that can be pointed to

storm jungle
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More or less yeah

honest trellis
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Just ya know, people take a hint that being "The wrong kind" towards mutants or say "The heresy of democracy" which is a literal thing Astartes were sent in for in FW lore...is bad for their health. While being a corrupt self-serving asshole is a'okay, even encouraged

storm jungle
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Yep.

fierce pendant
storm jungle
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Yeah like i said just has a new VA

fierce pendant
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ruined

barren tapir
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Uhm... Did some messages got erased?

storm jungle
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Nope

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or at least not in the last 2 hours

dusk patrol
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This is literally every book with Primaris recently

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Like, every single book has this, itā€™s kinda a boring plot point by now tbh.

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Codexs and lore releases too for the longest time.

honest trellis
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I think discord's just eating them

celest dome
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I want a Primaris vs Old Born but with the Malevolent
But the main character are a Primaris that isn't an ahole (At the start) and a Dreadnaught (Who know why they are Ahole)

dusk patrol
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The issues is the MM never got reinforcements

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So all their Primaris are homegrown already

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They just got the tech

barren tapir
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MM should just get deleted

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So we could have a named chapter go away

celest dome
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Nah, keep the Ahole Marine, and destroy a good chapter

dusk patrol
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There were a fair number wiped out or almost wiped out during the 13th and the aftermath

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Iā€™m pretty sure one of the Consuls chapters was

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White Consuls lost their homeworld and a large part of the forces

brittle slate
storm jungle
brittle slate
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I cannot wait for more info about the interregnum

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Basically the last hold out of ā€œrationalā€ imperium as it tries to stand against the rise of the ecclesiarchy

honest trellis
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TBH Imperial civil wars really make a lot of sense

celest dome
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I could go with a Pre Emperor Kill Team type of game, the sad part would be no Tau, though they could be replaced by a human faction or another

dusk patrol
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Unfortunately I donā€™t think GW is really interested in doing that early of a setting on the timeline

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Probably for the best

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Valdor was a cool book but I think itā€™s better kept vague

storm jungle
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Yeah none of that is happening until 40k needs a massive shakeup

desert matrix
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suspicion is GW is about to end times us and do age of primarchs

brittle slate
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Works for everything these days.

brittle slate
desert matrix
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new arks of omen tarot card being an inverted god emperor, as well

brittle slate
storm jungle
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which most likely wont be at least for a few more years

desert matrix
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i wouldnt be so sure of that. the 3d printing issue is forcing them to move sooner than later

celest dome
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3d printing will always be an issue

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And a non issue because its not that big

barren tapir
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GW has been sitting on a platinum mine (lore) all this time, and instead went to the gold one (minis), but the 3d printing being more widespread will force their hands i feel

outer wave
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I still want an Endtimes situation in 40k where every faction dies and thats it

barren tapir
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They are just a bunch of old people at the top that think to know what is the right thing but in truth they are just stuck in older times

desert matrix
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theres a reason they experimented with age of sigmar and endtimes, and there's a reason they're splitting 40k into horus heresy and pushing towards a revised model line for 40k which will probably go end times mode and result in an age of primarchs kinda deal

north lotus
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Mizozi or whatā€™s her name

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Also itā€™s likely big guy ate one or the vetā€™s wearing one.

lilac wave
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Well, when they tried to shake up fantasy they just fucked it up really bad. I can understand the hesitancy.

desert matrix
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primaris were the first step towards this, experimenting with "can we get space marines players to buy replacement space marines by making them slightly larger and more powerful" and the answer was a resounding yes

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now its very likely they're going to end times 40k and use that as an excuse to revamp the model line and push an accelerated codex cycle

lilac wave
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Primaris units would have sold well if they were just re-sculps I think. Maybe better, almost no one actually likes Primaris marines as a concept.

desert matrix
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if they were just a 1:1 cosmetic difference with no gameplay reason to "upgrade" i dont think they'd be as compulsory to include in people's lists

lilac wave
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Which is more evidence that gw has a very hard time changing anything without fucking it up.

storm jungle
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We will watch it all burn, at some point.

desert matrix
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tbh i dont think it'll go like endtimes exactly, just a refresh where the emperor "dies" for awhile then pops back up in the same universe. no exploding universe stuff.

rich sail
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no the emperor should die for good and have the imperium finally move forward with girlboss as its leader

desert matrix
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theyll do ded emprah phase where its a civil war scenario, then emprah returns phase

storm jungle
rich sail
storm jungle
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damn it

desert matrix
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in the dead emperor phase you'll have to buy all new primarch models. then in the returned emperor phase you'll have to buy something else and an emperor model with lots of details that is super expensive

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then they'll make a 3rd option like "the old world" where suddenly you can use the old original 40k models again, if you kept them that is... otherwise buy those again too

lilac wave
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We'll get an agonizingly slow dripfeed of returning primarchs over the next 30 years.

storm jungle
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Super recommend the 40k wiki for that stuff if you want an in-depth look.

Saves you money because a lot of the lore there is entirely copy pasted from the codexes.

desert matrix
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meanwhile this will all be tied in with a subscription streaming service and a "cinematic universe" because why the hell not.

vital kernel
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Emperor can't even die properly anymore. Neither can roboute.
In Plague War the guliman basically died and then got better, Emp turned him into more or less immortal who will just regrow fresh meat.

And Big E can shittalk Nurgle in his own garden now.
Anyone thinking the Emperor will just die, or even can die at this point wasnt paying attention

desert matrix
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and yknow what, i have a problem with none of it. at least it keeps GW going.

barren tapir
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Oh... Wait... Damn... That is true

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Big E revived big G

desert matrix
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he can "die" and disappear physically for a bit to set the stage for returning

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meanwhile terra gets eaten by the warp and something else happens to justify all new models

vital kernel
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Big E, through whatever means has become a Chaos God in his own right by now.

desert matrix
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cawl pulls some new imperial guard outfits out of his closet, too

storm jungle
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Yeah basically just skim-read the Blood Angels' wikipedia page, it helps.

rich sail
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i can see the lion comming back soon

vital kernel
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E is Ordergod

brittle slate
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And an addiction to Reddit opinions

desert matrix
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no, the Emperor is the god of plastic, resin, and die cast model sales

vital kernel
desert matrix
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he can do ANYTHING that serves the purpose of selling more models

brittle slate
rich sail
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i wonder hows the inquisition will react when the lion comes back KEKW_ogryn

brittle slate
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Everyone just gets over it these days.

vital kernel
rich sail
desert matrix
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cawl is less of a deus ex machina, more "the one character who isn't being willfully ignorant just so the plot won't advance"

vital kernel
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The Inquisition has no concept of what Lion ever did even beyond myth, the Dark Angels keep everything under wraps

desert matrix
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he highlights the others being a plot device more than he himself is one, weirdly

brittle slate
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Cawl just invents everything.

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And itā€™s stupid.

barren tapir
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Well, have you seen the last tarot?

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The god emperor inversed?

brittle slate
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And now heā€™s inventing gods lol

barren tapir
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That is fun

desert matrix
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i mean like everybody has names that tell you exactly what they do. and yet everyone pretends they dont see it. kharn's name is arabic for betrayer. his name is betrayer the betrayer. but nobody saw that one coming?

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and how did the emperor not know horus heresy was a problem, his name is literally heresy i mean cmon

brittle slate
barren tapir
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Ferrus manus is iron hand

brittle slate
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They thought they were being clever

barren tapir
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Corvus corax is just raven raven

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There are lots of fun names combinations

brittle slate
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They never imagined the internet making every 12 year old a Rhodes scholar

desert matrix
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its like "hey gee i wonder what this despoiler guy is going to do, i bet he came here to trade"

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ferrus manus is the worst offender in the unoriginal names department. he's beter off without his head tbh.

vital kernel
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Roboute Guilliman is french for Robert got Ligma

desert matrix
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"so ive got metal hands right. my name is metal hands. and my legion are called... the metal hands"

rich sail
desert matrix
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he should have stuck his head in that necrodermis instead

brittle slate
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Lol

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I snorted with cheese in my mouth

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Thanks for that

vital kernel
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what did you guys expect when theres a guy literally called John Theemperror in this setting

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but yeah, Lions gonna be back soon, expected him back sooner but it will be cool. Maybe he'll go set up shop in Imperium Nihilus

storm jungle
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Sorry late but no worries fingerguns

outer wave
vital kernel
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When I first heard about "Age of Sigmar" I thought 'man cool its like Horus Heresy but for Fantasy, seeing Sigmar unite the tribes and stuff'
I was in for a rude awakening

earnest snow
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What is the meaning of life 40k?

storm jungle
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Toys.

earnest snow
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In the grimdark of the far future there is only toy

crisp heath
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Remember kids, the first named Inquisitor was Obiwan Sherlock Clousseau

visual lodge
vital kernel
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What I don't get from a lore point of view would be why we never see the guard using Rhinos, or Skitarii using Chimeras, Rhinos and Valkyries

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All of them are produced by the Admech, the vast majority of them anyway.
There's nothing inherently superior about the Skitarii hovercraft or flappy planes compared to Guard gear, aside from the need to sell plastic.

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how is this

ChimeraHeavyBolter.jpg
visual lodge
vital kernel
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worse than

Fest2019-Sat12-Dunerider1kjcw.jpg
crisp heath
vital kernel
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I mean cmon, this has to be a joke.

5yefvmh0os141.jpg
visual lodge
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@crisp heath - Yup, knew that. Dominus' usually make some sorta comment about it almost any ad-mech interaction I've seen. I just didn't know if they have special "rules" to make their marching or vehicle use "lore friendly".

@vital kernel - Yup, they do make everything but they usually reserve the best for themselves

visual lodge
vital kernel
visual lodge
vital kernel
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imagine this, you are Archmagos Dominus Assrapist of the Overproduction IV Forgeworld and kitting out your 8000 strong Skitarii Army.
Do you A: equip them with a fresh batch of Land Raiders and Rhinos that your factories produced.
or ...
B: ask the Ministry of silly Vehicles to cobble together a bunch of 40k higgins boats without roofs and door mounted stubbers?

visual lodge
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it's clearly B...varlet...

barren tapir
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The reason is back in time when Skitarii had the first release, they were just infantry, and they were said to not use vehicles because they simply walked, now, ignoring how much stupid such thing is with due time GW realized that they could charge players more if the skitarii used, and had to use to be competitive, vehicles, that is how we got them

visual lodge
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knew it was something like that...

barren tapir
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Now, regarding the tanks and transports at least there is a clear advantage compared to the ones that the IG use, mostly being anti grav vehicles compared to threaded tanks, cannot be said the same for flyers

vital kernel
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yeah, I know it's a GW ploy to sell plastic. But I reject that logic.
My skitarii use Rhinos for transport, because it's not like those Primaris fatasses fit in those anymore, so lots of Rhinos without customers in the Galaxy

barren tapir
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The thing about tanks and transports for skitarii also fit very well with one of the main point about Ad. Mech. they hoard the best tech for themself

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Theoretically speaking there was a lore reason as why rhinos were used by SM and not by IG, and it was because they were only reserved to them, IG got chimera instead... Old great crusade lore btw

vital kernel
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I would agree if the Admech transports were Van Saar level eldritch super BMPs, but they are stupid looking open top hovercraft with idiotic armament.

barren tapir
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TBF, using logic all crumble in the 40K timeline since they could easily swap all production to the superior pattern of vehicle helping also in standardizing the armed forces, but that is too reasonable

barren tapir
vital kernel
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because if your Admech transport lools shittier than GSC and Necromunda Ganger Trucks, shit just doesn't add up.

I mean look at the Votan tranpsorts, the Admech looks like they are Madmax junkers in comparison.

visual lodge
barren tapir
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Ad. Mech. transport was clearly inspired by the transports used to naval invasion by allies in WW2

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Someone at GW must have watched "saving private ryan" while thinking about how to add a transport to Skitarii armies to rob their players more money

vital kernel
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yeah, 40k higgins boats

barren tapir
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But tbh, all this short comings can be easily removed by kitbashing, and it would end up being a better model too

visual lodge
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until GW trademarks "higgins boat"

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named after great physicist john higgins

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gotta keep the arkan land tradition alive ya know

barren tapir
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The most important thing is that they are anti grav, that give them huge advantage over other threaded transports and tanks

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If you have ever played civ beyond earth and went with purity affinity you will understand how much powerful is having tanks and transports that can go over water

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Can you spot the peculiar dumb design part in this tank?

visual lodge
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if the machine sprit wants to take a dip, i'm gonna let it

vital kernel
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aside from the fact it has a huge flat target on it's front, uselsess stubbers on each side and an open turret up top?
Not to mention, a coaxial weapok at the ideal heigth to shoot the commander who's view is obstructed by the turret?

visual lodge
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fin on the back of a hover craft

image.png
barren tapir
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You nailed pretty much all, but i wanted to point out that the huge flat target in the front is also inclined so that if a hit doesn't penetrate and is deflected it will go toward the bottom part, where there are the anti-grav plates that keep the thing afloat, anti-grav plates were known to be quite delicate stuff

vital kernel
visual lodge
dusk patrol
barren tapir
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Now, if you have the will and time to hear another rant from me we could talk about why the new skitarii flyers are dumb

dusk patrol
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A lot of it has nonsensical design

vital kernel
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Imagine this as a surprise transport for the Admech:
"jealously guarded for millenia, the Mastodon is no longer supplied to Space Marine Chapters since the Horus Heresy, but the Adeptus Mechanicus kept the mighty weapons exclusively to themself!"
Plastic Mastodon, lots of money, lots of plastic, doesn't even have to come up with something new

99560101507_Mastadon01.webp
vital kernel
barren tapir
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Good, then we can all agree that Valkyries are commonly used by skitarii

vital kernel
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That is the headcanon for my Admech at least. Mars can keep it's silly flappers.

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Marcellus Skitarii use Valkyries and Thunderhawks, because noone can tell them otherwise.

barren tapir
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Good to see that it isn't only my fan made forge world that use valkyries unstead of the flabby horrid stuff

plush mason
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so if the demolisher cannons on those leman russes at the checkpoint on the bridge where to fire would they bring the whole rail bridge down?

vital kernel
barren tapir
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I agree

vital kernel
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ties to Van Saar are questionable but fruitful

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better than xeno obsessed Stygies scum

barren tapir
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HEY! Stygies is my fav official forge world and the "father" of my fanmade one!

vital kernel
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Lucius>>>>>Agrippiina>powergap>Stygies

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to this day, Lucius Pattern Warlord remains the Warlord Titan in my eyes

WarlordTitanicus-horz.jpg
barren tapir
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Eh, cannot say that i agree with that list

dusk patrol
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Especially because Mars is best

vital kernel
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it's okay, not everyone can be right

dusk patrol
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The competition is for second place

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Although if Iā€™m being serious I love Lucius purely because Legio Astorum

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Most badass Titan Legion ever

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And itā€™s not even close

vital kernel
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Mars is Mars.

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Oh, so you like Legio Astorum? Name every Princep.

dusk patrol
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You may think youā€™re cool, but are you ā€œteleport onto the fucking battlefield from orbit in a goddamn Titanā€ cool?

IMG_5768.webp IMG_5769.jpg
vital kernel
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how do they dew it?

dusk patrol
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They got giant teleporters for titans on their ships

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And they arenā€™t sharing

vital kernel
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sounds like something Lucius would do. I am not surprised

dusk patrol
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Theyā€™re called the Warp Runners

vital kernel
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simply the best

dusk patrol
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They also modify their titans to be able to sprint faster and close on the enemy faster

vital kernel
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which one was the Titanicus posterboy legio, with red details?
I like the look

Topeo0IWlpwtwDQ8.png
dusk patrol
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Might be Ignatum

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Or Vulpa for that one

vital kernel
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hmm nah I think Ignatum has way different details

dusk patrol
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I think that one is Vulpa though

vital kernel
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Nah, turns out thats probably Mortis, going from references

dusk patrol
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Yeah itā€™s got the symbol on its shield there

vital kernel
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ah, damn you stupid sexy Ignatum

4f0s214krkz81.jpg
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Ignatum has that 90s energy

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anyone remember how in that one Siege of Terra book they hyped up the Psytitan Legion as if it was this unfathomable power and then it jobbed to Mortis offscreen?
That was a laugh.

signal bramble
vital kernel
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still sorta cheap, could have at least had a bit of an impact

dusk patrol
honest trellis
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@barren tapir The whole point of new Skitarii stuff seems to be one specific vibe

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Mars

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Even in setting, we have stuff like the technobarbarian skitarii

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The flier as I see it is an example of an entire class of vehicle

near glade
vital kernel
near glade
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Oh lol

vital kernel
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the main colour looked a little too blue for mortis in that picture

near glade
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Smh how can yā€™all forget about the best Titian Legion

dusk patrol
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We were talking about Astorum earlier

near glade
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OOF

winter vessel
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I can't comprehend seeing the Abominatus on the field of battle, like, there are no words.

latest.png
dusk patrol
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Lots of spikes

rich vale
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Giant crab robo

crisp heath
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Khrab

stuck kindle
honest trellis
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tbh I've always wanted to see a more modern redesign

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just something that doesn't make sense but still exists and is butchering all in its path like an ancient multi-armed god given form

dusk patrol
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Maybe one day

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But considering its lack of appearances in so long though who knows

plush mason
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what even is it?

signal bramble
plush mason
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weird looking titan

thick cedar
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is the presence of beast of Nurgles any indicator how well the war is going?

signal bramble
sharp cedar
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Not necessarily, daemons can be summoned even by small cults and the conditions of the planet even before the whole heretic disaster were not fantastic.

signal bramble
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If we saw a great unclean one or armies of plaguebearers Iā€™d be concerned.

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Though the pox Walker zombie plague can be devastating.

warm crest
dusk patrol
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Its probably not a good sign though

warm crest
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Even the Marines Malevolent would be good backup

sharp cedar
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Given how well supplied and numerous these guys are it wouldn't be out of the question.

dusk patrol
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But not necessarily like, "oh no its over" either

sharp cedar
warm crest
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Exterminatus time šŸ˜­

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Tertium broke before the Rejects did

signal bramble
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Theyā€™ve also said nuking the planet isnā€™t on the table yet because itā€™s pattern of russ tanks are considered too valuable.

sharp cedar
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Or you might get the silver ones

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Problem solved, no more daemons. Problem 2, you are still about to die

warm crest
warm crest
signal bramble
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One hive falling to corruption doesnā€™t necessarily mean the planet is lost yet.

winter vessel
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Of course thereā€™s the whole,Exterminatus is only used when youā€™re at DEFCON: THERE IS NO HOPE, PLEASE DO IT.

sharp cedar
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^ That. It would be wiser to just form a perimeter around the hive and then blast it to shit.

signal bramble
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Plus our hive is tertium. As in, the third hive.

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We have yet to see hive primus and hive Secundus going by the usual imperium naming pattern.

winter vessel
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In the words of the opening text in Space Marine: ā€œSTRATEGIC VALUE ABSOLUTEā€

signal bramble
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One tertiary hive containing a few billion people is a drop in the bucket for a hive world.

winter vessel
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  • I wouldnā€™t call in the Astartes unless if your planet is really in the shit.
signal bramble
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Also thereā€™s another thing to consider. Once the planet is sorted out, regardless of the damage, the planetary governor is still going to have to pay his tithe and back taxes.

sharp cedar
signal bramble
sharp cedar
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The best part is that the paperwork for any consideration in leniency for the damage will take so long to process the governor will be DEAD before it finally goes through.

signal bramble
sharp cedar
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Yeah, it's kind of a chapter by chapter basis. Blood Angels would help. Dark Angels may tell you to kick rocks because they're too busy looking for someone

signal bramble
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Clearing nurgle corruption from the hive (if they donā€™t destroy it) could take decades or even centuries. Otherwise quarantine is an option.

winter vessel
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Gets on the Vox:
Blood Raven Techmarineā€œYouā€™ve reached the Blood Ravens Hotline, this better be importantā€
Operative:ā€clears throat RELICā€
Blood Raven zooms in Thunderhawk

signal bramble
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If the atoma pattern russ tank risks being lost in the mess then the Admech may take a more active role as well.

sharp cedar
signal bramble
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It wouldnā€™t be the pdf that cleans it up. It would be the inquisition and the Admech and the ecclesiarchy.

sharp cedar
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This will be a pretty damn long drawn out affair

signal bramble
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Conflicts lasting for years is normal for the imperium. A few centuries isnā€™t that long.

winter vessel
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Facts

sharp cedar
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Probably, my issue is more the long term pockets of this cult that pops up after its said and done because they'll eventually leave and it's impossible to have killed all of them.

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Seriously there are so many of these assholes and the game does a great job of showing it.

winter vessel
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The Moebian 6th Regiment, if 40k follows real life unit size, estimates less than 3,000 Traitor Guardsmen. Plus an unknown but most likely massive size of Cultists and Poxwalkers. The Inquisitor Warband of MourningStar has their hands tied at the moment. So we have a lot of grave pits to fill.

sharp cedar
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40k sometimes follows real unit sizes. Sometimes. When it wants to. I can't help but think it's a lot more than that.

crisp heath
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I mean, there's the nurgle tree. I can't say what direction they want the story to go, but between the tree and the beast of nurgle I'm assuming there's some kind of warp rift in Tertium

sharp cedar
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Cadian 8th is about 8,000 isn't it?

winter vessel
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Yeah, also known as ā€œThe Lord Castellanā€™s Ownā€

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And as far as I know, itā€™s just the MourningStar that appears to be the sole base of operations for the Inquisition over Atoma Prime. The Mourningstar, iirc, is a sword class frigate. An escort ship. weā€™re alone, unless thereā€™s other ships in the sector that we donā€™t know about.

brittle slate
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do we know where the planet is definitively?

crisp heath
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We don't even know for sure what side of the rift it's on

winter vessel
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The Moebian Domain, beyond that I donā€™t know where on the map which side itā€™s on between the Great Rift.

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I thought it would be close to the Cadian Sector because one of the options to chose for our background is Cadia

crisp heath
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Yeah but one of the psykers was probably on Necromunda at some point and those planets aren't even the same Segmentum

winter vessel
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I remember back when it was just the Eye of Terror, I thought ā€œNo way it can get more complicated than this.ā€

IMG_6715.jpg
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And then I discovered the recent map of the Great Rift, and it looked like someone threw up on the galaxy cuz itā€™s a MESS.

IMG_6714.jpg
crisp heath
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Once you really start keeping track of planets and figure out how to read the map they aren't so bad

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Really weird that Ultima Segmentum is like, half the Imperium though

mystic geyser
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It's supposedly in the Segmentum Solar, between Terra and Cadia (which is a weirdly empty bit of the map, makes sense)

winter vessel
#

Weird, if thatā€™s the case youā€™d think thereā€™d be a better response force since itā€™s well within Imperium territory. But hey, itā€™s just another planet in a struggle against Chaos so who cares am I right?

mystic geyser
#

Well, we are trying to get messages out. But the thing about this point in history is everywhere is at war all at the same time. Atoma is getting off fairly lightly compared to other places

#

Heck Terra has just had a full scale daemonic Incursion (which somehow my guardsman has heard about, which both makes no sense and perfect sense.. )

odd palm
#

A world having all the assets an inquisitor can throw at it is better off than most

winter vessel
#

True enough. The Inquisition at the very least has some form of control and organization. Even if theyā€™re members are unhinged for as long as they breathe.

echo vault
#

Say something nice to the malcador tank

Malcadorbc.jpg
mystic geyser
#

I love you malcador tank.

#

I always wanted an infernus, but they kept randomly cutting it out of lists I could use.

echo vault
#

I like the infernus a lot I just don't get the need to have the hitched on fuel tank

#

Especially since the fuel source for the flame weapon on warhound titans is like, I can't find it. So putting it on the back could work rather than making it a big exposed piece

winter vessel
#

What in the Emperor's name?!

vlI0WjX.png
echo vault
#

Pingas tank

crisp heath
#

I mean that's just good imperial engineering. A tank is just a gun on a box, so they got a really good box and put a really big gun on it and now they have a great tank.

celest dome
#

How likely would a Slaaneshi cult get to have access to Sonic weaponry ?

mystic geyser
#

I suppose they could be 'inspired' to modify their instruments, like the Emperors Children were.

celest dome
#

Well the Noise Marine had Sonic weapon, not just instrument

#

With the Cacophony

#

And the Sister of Battle (And the Ecclesiarchy i would suppose) have Laud Hailer, so would Sonic weaponry be fitting if a Slaaneshi cult was to be introduced in Darktide in the farther future

vital kernel
#

Give Orks

#

no more cultists, one flavour is enough

#

You know the Imperium is in for a bad day when the Gudrunite Rifles show up on the battlefield

celest dome
#

Orks wouldn't make sense, keep it fully Chaos

#

And there are ways to make the different cult work differently enough to be unique enough

#

Orks in their own game, in the future

#

As they would never make sense against the Reject we have

fathom niche
#

was the emperor alive befor 40k, 30k 20k, 10k etc? was he always in existent ?

mystic geyser
#

8000 BC

jagged monolith
#

Ancient Anatolia

fathom niche
#

christ exists in the 40k universe?

mystic geyser
#

Uh, I Don't think he's ever named. A version of Catholisism shows up, (catheric).

#

But even though its set in our history, it is a fictional version of our history

celest dome
#

Supposedly since Christianity existed

crisp heath
#

There's a very popular theory/joke that the emperor was jesus but that's not actually written anywhere

fathom niche
#

i heard he was made of 1000 shamans

mystic geyser
#

Older lore, but hasn't technically been contradicted

fathom niche
#

how about his birth of birth? was it mentioned it was in tera?

mystic geyser
#

Yeah Terra

celest dome
#

Wasn't the conclave of Shaman still mentioned not that long ago ?

dusk patrol
#

Itā€™s one theory basically

#

The way itā€™s given isnā€™t really a concrete answer

crisp heath
#

All we really know is about his past still was that he showed up in Anatolia like around -10k and then him and his boyfriend destroyed the tower of babel but they got into a fight because the Emperor wanted to steal God's secret language so they broke up for a few millenia and Emps started talking to a woman and then he just kind of fucked off for like 20,000 years with her until it was time to conquer Earth because there were demons and biker vikings and evil robots. You following all this?

fathom niche
#

the emperor is gay?

crisp heath
#

I don't think he's gay but he definitely wants to be surrounded with large, sweaty men at all times

fathom niche
#

was it mentioned he ever had parents? or any sort of ancestry?

barren tapir
#

Big E is lactose intollerant

dusk patrol
#

We donā€™t know

#

In Master of Mankind it goes into him being born in a village

mystic geyser
#

@fathom niche in the Novel Master of Mankind we get some flashbacks. (If you believe them to be truthful)

dusk patrol
#

But we donā€™t know if any of what we see is true

#

The end of the novel kinda implies it was all just lies or potential half truths

mystic geyser
#

It's deliberately mysterious.
The people who assume he's just a rogue bioweapon are my favourites.

dusk patrol
#

Also the whole novel has Big E completely change in how he speaks and appears to different people based on who heā€™s talking to

celest dome
fathom niche
#

Hmm I see.. and how about the 4 chaos gods? They came into existent long before the emperor I'm assuming? Dense question I know.

mystic geyser
#

The warp doesn't follow linear time, so it's not quite straightforward

#

Slaanesh came after, with the fall of the eldar, (and then always existed)

#

The other 3, possibly before, or alongside, idk.

#

The wiki says Khorne was first to awaken in the middle ages , but idk where that's from

celest dome
#

The Chaos God aren't exaclty bound to time

fathom niche
#

Meaning they dont exist in the physical world?

celest dome
#

And them possibly being involved in many realm and Great Game

#

The "birth" as we know of seem to be more about when they revealed themselves to Humanity and stuff

#

Apart from Slaanesh, who coalesced when the Eldar were a bit too freaky

#

Though again, it could also just as well be when it beome involved in this reality/great game

fathom niche
#

Who is the Eldar? Is he like the "god"?

mystic geyser
#

Aeldari. Xenos race

fathom niche
#

Ahh I see

mystic geyser
#

Created Slaanesh when thier culture slid into dedication to excess

fathom niche
#

Interesting

rich sail
sick bronze
#

Merry Sanguinala, loyal followers of the Emperor

celest dome
#

Sanguinala and Candelmass

brittle slate
#

But the gods have ā€œalwaysā€ existed appearing before and after their own linear creation

brittle slate
vital kernel
#

I thought Sanguinala was on the day he destroyed Kabantha and Angron at the Eternity Gate

dusk patrol
#

Sanguinala tbh is more like Easter than Christmas in a lot of ways

vital kernel
brittle slate
#

Itā€™s also cool because it makes humanity as a whole more complex

dusk patrol
#

The rogue bio weapon one doesnā€™t really work with the lore we have which does confirm heā€™s been around before the DAoT

#

Unless a bunch of characters are just misremembering or whatever

#

I think the intent from GW was to make him from ancient humanity but how he came about is still up in the air

vital kernel
#

thats why I mention bending time, would be interesting if the DAoT guys created a warp weapon so powerful it literally moved back through time and couldn't be killed

dusk patrol
#

Yeah I guess, I think my thing is more

#

It doesnā€™t really matter how he came about

barren tapir
#

Everyone talking about a guy that couldn't even come up with a fancy title himself and forget about the chad Ollanius Perrson, a guy that saw the rise and fall of mankind, and also saw the rise and fall of all religions and yet somehow followed one... Such a funny guy he was

vital kernel
#

The Emp is unironically the most realistic depiction of an immortal mind.
Utterly alien to regular human consideration.

barren tapir
#

I like them, or well, at least their concept, but jeez, they are awfully made

storm jungle
#

The Emperor isn't alien

#

hes just badly written to look alien

barren tapir
#

^^

storm jungle
#

dab

dusk patrol
#

Itā€™s more BL just didnā€™t ever know how to write him

storm jungle
#

^

barren tapir
#

The authors that wrote him wish they could make him alien, instead it is just a mess

dusk patrol
#

So he makes no sense

storm jungle
#

Too many cooks in the kitchen as ever

storm jungle
#

you are just dumb

#

he is too gigabrain

#

its why he left Angron's friends to die

#

totally not because he has to follow a movie script

#

insert novel excuse here

dusk patrol
#

Like the Angron part is just completely nonsensical

storm jungle
#

Like i said yeah

#

its literally just:

#

"We need a reason for angron to hate big E"

#

"Have him leave his friends to die"

dusk patrol
#

ā€œOh but uh the world complied so he didnā€™t want to kill one small armyā€

vital kernel
#

I would have left Angrons friends to die too. Angron and his merry band were idiots doomed to die anyhow.

storm jungle
#

LEL

#

I mean yeah

#

but rescue them

#

and have them die doing something useful

#

thats a lot more gigabrain

dusk patrol
#

Literally every other primarch he spends weeks with or longer

#

Angron he pops in, letā€™s his friends die, gives him to his legion without talking to him

storm jungle
#

I just hate that people try to defend the dumb decisions he makes because a future novel tries to cover up the obviously bad plotholes

vital kernel
dusk patrol
#

Angron was

storm jungle
#

HE LITERALLY WAS

dusk patrol
#

Itā€™s just bad writing because they didnā€™t want to redo old lore for no reason

storm jungle
#

^

dusk patrol
#

Like I enjoy the Heresy but so many of the traitor primarch falls are poorly done

storm jungle
#

Same with Mortarion hating Big E for kill-stealing, its genuinely not that deep. Its just bad writing hidden under mountains of books.

#

Same with how Mortarion never noticing Typhus being a sus-lord

dusk patrol
#

I love ADB, but he honestly I think is waaaay to hamfisted with how he writes the emperor

barren tapir
#

The kill stealing thing with Morty is extremely laughable

dusk patrol
#

To the point where he just makes the emperor a dumbass, and not a believable one

vital kernel
#

It doesn't really matter for Angron or the World Eaters, seeing how they end up, can't really blame BL for not trying. Giving them good motivations or characters would have been a waste of time and effort when they just devolve into retardation before we ever see them anyway.

storm jungle
#

no it would not have been a waste

#

they just didnt do it because Angron has to turn traitor

#

so they went the lazy route

dusk patrol
#

I donā€™t think the Emperor should be flawless but thereā€™s a difference between flawless and just a self sabotaging dumbass

storm jungle
#

Yeah exactly

#

He ignores everything the traitor primarchs do to prep the Heresy because plot

dusk patrol
#

It could have been done a lot better and for some it is

vital kernel
#

the least self sabotaging choice would have been to send the World Eaters down there and cull all of them with Angron in orbital bombardment

dusk patrol
#

I mostly enjoy the Heresy after the fall but the initial lead up is meh for me

barren tapir
#

World eaters weren't that unstable before going all in with the nails

dusk patrol
#

And tbf thereā€™s good reasons why it was

vital kernel
#

would have saved a lot of trouble later, because no matter what emp would have done, those guys were predestined to khornes ride

dusk patrol
#

They thought the whole thing was gonna be like 5 books

#

So the first books rushed way too fast

barren tapir
#

If there was a sus legion since the start were the word bearers

#

They were sus even before meeting with lorgar

dusk patrol
#

Tsons should have just been put down too

barren tapir
#

World eaters were just extremely brutal, but a very controlled brutality if you get me

barren tapir
dusk patrol
#

Thereā€™s no path for the Tsons which doesnā€™t end badly

barren tapir
#

Psychic mutation get you a extermination ticket in my book

vital kernel
#

All the traitor legions save the SoH were obvious fucking shit, anyone could have seen them becoming a problem.

dusk patrol
#

Emperors Children werent but also they got written terribly in Fulgrim

barren tapir
#

But i'm also very biased against psychic stuff, i am very anti psychic stuff... Which also bring me to dislike big E because i don't think the psychic path is the best path for mankind

dusk patrol
#

No BL author gets that the EC weā€™re supposed to be the ā€œwow those guys will never fallā€ legion prior

barren tapir
#

After all, we saw what happened to eldar, a superior psychic race, why not walk on their footprints? Oh, wait

dusk patrol
#

And Fulgrim was considered one of the most loyal

#

Same as no BL author getting that Ferrus Manus was supposed to be a top contender for Warmaster, but because he exists to die they just write him as a dumbass

vital kernel
#

I mean, yeah the HH was poorly planned and executed, but aint anyone convincing me that Angron and the World Eaters had any hope of not being shit.

barren tapir
#

The world eaters had hope for not being shit, angron was messed up from the start though

vital kernel
dusk patrol
#

They were brutal but they werenā€™t ineffective

vital kernel
#

Orbital Bombardments are effective too.

dusk patrol
#

Angron just used them like an idiot

dusk patrol
#

If weā€™re gonna nitpick what tactics these forces should actually use

#

Weā€™re gonna be here all day

vital kernel
#

sure it gets the job done, but the place is fucked

dusk patrol
#

Also typically the excuse for no orbital bombardments is they needed the place intact

#

The GC was about taking worlds, not destroying them. If they could help it.

vital kernel
#

Well, the World Eaters are not the right guys for that job.

dusk patrol
#

They didnā€™t destroy worlds, they just killed people

vital kernel
#

World Eaters are the one Legion that can entirely fall to Chaos and noone even notices a difference.

dusk patrol
#

But I agreed itā€™s largely nonsensical and was poorly done

vital kernel
#

Nothing changed, it was just their nature. They weren't corrupted or goaded into anything, weren't seduced by power.
They just were khorne berserkers all along.

#

And thats why I think it's a shit legion.

dusk patrol
#

They definitely got a lot worse

#

We see it progress as the Heresy goes on

#

It was why Erebus killed Argel Tal

#

To make Kharn lose his last tether to ā€œthe worldā€ or whatever

vital kernel
#

sure they become entirely senseless. But they lose themselves to the nails before

dusk patrol
#

Yeah but itā€™s way worse after corruption

#

Thereā€™s differences between the two

vital kernel
#

its barely noticeable unless you are currently reading a Kharn pov.
Compare that to a Saul Tarvitz or Garro, and how their Legions turn out in comparison.

#

day and night difference

hot bison
#

How quickly would they execute me if I yelled "For the Great Unclean One, our God Emperor of mankind!" ?

rotund linden
#

on the spot

hot bison
#

Okay

#

When are they adding friendly fire because I really want to be punished for saying things like that

#

The sooner I can become corrupted the better.

fierce pendant
#

afaik there are no plans for friendly fire, they just had indicators and that's where they wanted to leave it.

storm jungle
#

can't blame them tbh

#

as much as I wanna shoot my teammates it would get toxic af

barren tapir
#

I always think that the "it is gonna become toxic" is just an excuse, friendly fire would definitely improve the game imho, and if the griefers rise their head just ban them

#

And for ban i mean put them in a group where they can only match make with each other

#

Throwing grenades on your feet is cringe

#

Spamming LBM without caring about your positioning with the teammates is cringe

#

Having no friendly fire for guns is detrimental to the team play since at least with the damage they will have to learn to not walk in front of people that are actually firing

brittle slate
mild coral
#

Since we're in Christmas I might as well ask, is santa still a concept in 40k?

brittle slate
#

Like the psyker could become possessed

#

The ogryn could rampage

#

They do it in some games and itā€™s always fun to have to suddenly deal with a teammate

brittle slate
#

A guy breaking into your hab and giving you stuff? Sounds chaos

mild coral
#

Yeah lmao

brittle slate
brittle slate
barren tapir
#

I would also rework the wound system, if not removed entirely

brittle slate
#

I do wish there were more opportunities for mini games

#

Like when the daemon hose or a hound has you you should have a chance to do some kind of button configuration to struggle out

#

Even if itā€™s hard

#

Relying on teammates absolutely is kind of annoying at times

barren tapir
#

The segments might still remain to indicate how much wounds you have, since there is no other way to see them afaik, but the mechanic would change from "you can get downed x times before die" to "each time you get downed the amount of hp in downed state get reduced", so you will only die when the enemy beat you to a pulp, but if your teammates are pro they can always save you, even after expending all wounds and getting downed would have low HP

signal bramble
barren tapir
#

In general i would just do a question to the design team... WHY?

signal bramble
#

Iā€™d also change it so you take 0 health damage until your toughness is completely gone.

barren tapir
dusk patrol
#

I'm sorry, is this lore chat or boring nerd game balance chat. Back to discussing which primarch wins in a fight and female space marines!

signal bramble
#

Lorewise it would make sense that at least the Ogryn should be able to break out of stuff.

barren tapir
#

On another topic, anyone have an image of the model of the kantrael lasgun ingame? I need it for research

barren tapir
#

Also, did you knew that a vlakyrie is more armoured than a thunderhawk?

#

Hilarious isn't it?

signal bramble
#

How so?

#

Is there a reason it shouldnā€™t or should be?

barren tapir
#

Armour on valkyrie is stated to be 75 mm, on thunderhawk it is 65 or 55

dusk patrol
#

I don't think that holds up in actual lore depictions.

#

One of my favorite Thunderhawk moments is in I think the Serpent and the Snake

signal bramble
#

I snapped it with my phone but there you go.

dusk patrol
#

Iron Snakes marines are on a long mission in the outskirts of a planet, and they have to conserve ammo when they can

plush mason
dusk patrol
#

So they come across a chaos convoy, which they could just strafe once with the Thunderhawk and destroy

#

But they don't need to waste ammo

#

So instead, they fucking ram the Thunderhawk into the convoy APCs and flip them

#

Doesn't hurt the Thunderhawk at all

barren tapir
signal bramble
#

Here it is without the camo.

0550A640-A5C9-4460-A7DD-DB11172FB6AE.jpg
plush mason
dusk patrol
#

And they just keep doing this, then the other marines get out and kill the crews.

plush mason
#

frankly tired of using my characters as my pfp kek

arctic talon
#

Built ford tough šŸ’€

celest dome
#

Tbh o though it was another Nameless

barren tapir
#

Eh, as technical stat go, thunderhawk have 55 mm for the superstructure and 65 mm for the hull

signal bramble
#

I paid money for my pfp, so got to make sure I use it.

plush mason
#

fair

celest dome
#

I just ripped a sprite from a game

dusk patrol
#

Probably not made of the same stuff

celest dome
#

Dunno which

arctic talon
#

Honestly the imperial armor stats are weird as fuck

dusk patrol
#

Or its just 40k numbers not making sense

arctic talon
#

But adamantite is

#

Idk

celest dome
#

Does the IG use reactive armour ?

arctic talon
#

Itā€™s not real so we donā€™t know itā€™s properties in comparison

dusk patrol
#

Like, the Warhounds top speed in lore is described as 35MPH in some stats books.

#

Which.....

barren tapir
arctic talon
#

Slow

dusk patrol
#

Marines can run faster than that.

arctic talon
#

And makes no sense

#

Like at all

#

Something that large wouldnā€™t be that slow

#

By sheer virtue of how much ground it can get per step

dusk patrol
#

And on top of that its an infantry and armor killer

#

You can't kill those things if you can't catch them.

plush mason
#

arent warhounds the smallest and fastest titans?

storm jungle
celest dome
#

Didn't one of the Airplane have stat that would mean that it's perpetually in stalling speed ?

dusk patrol
brittle slate
storm jungle
#

Warhounds are the smallest yeah

dusk patrol
#

Basically my point is, 40k stats are just silly

storm jungle
dusk patrol
#

And make no sense

#

Like the armor thickness numbers for some tanks are absurdly small

arctic talon
#

Lemen russ

dusk patrol
#

Because people writing them don't know how much armor tanks actually have irl

plush mason
dusk patrol
#

So they wrote what they thought was a big number

storm jungle
dusk patrol
#

But which actually isn't

arctic talon
#

Honestly

#

Just throw out all the old armor and speed stats tbh

storm jungle
#

people say the Reaver is small have clearly never stood beneath the Eiffel Tower before KEK

arctic talon
#

Itā€™s so fucking weird

arctic talon
dusk patrol
#

And it'll be a cold day in hell before I acknowledge Imperators as only being like 90 feet tall or whatever

arctic talon
#

And itā€™s moving

#

And it has guns

plush mason
dusk patrol
#

Yes we all know

#

And we don't care

#

Beeeg is cooler

plush mason
#

and the lore says the warlord is like 50m iirc

dusk patrol
#

These are my Warlords

brittle slate
#

They only made them smaller to sell toys.

plush mason
#

yeah those are well over the 50m tall and i love it

storm jungle
#

They put em in Imperial ShrinkRays

arctic talon
#

Honestly

plush mason
#

lol

brittle slate
#

And the largest ones:

arctic talon
#

I just ignore titan sizes

#

Bcs itā€™s more fun

brittle slate
storm jungle
#

Its fun when you arent dealing with someoe that wants them as big as Mt. Everest

dusk patrol
brittle slate
#

Have literal running battles inside of them

plush mason
arctic talon
#

I want them large

#

But not that large

storm jungle
#

you know its bad when the maker of the Titanicus tabletop game got mad at the BL authors for making titans the size of mountains KEK

arctic talon
#

Like

#

Make it a big walker

#

Not fucking stupid

plush mason
#

150m walker is plenty big

storm jungle
#

Yep

arctic talon
#

Yeah

#

People have no idea how big things feel

#

Sometimes

#

Like ā€œmarines arenā€™t that tallā€

mystic geyser
#

Do people actually want the current Canon titan sizes or are we happy just imagining

rose thorn
#

titans are literally dick measuring contests lmao

arctic talon
#

But eh

plush mason
#

the empire state building is 450 odd m tall

arctic talon
#

I donā€™t mind em

dusk patrol
#

People like big robots

storm jungle
#

someone post the Megas XLR song

plush mason
#

imagine something half that side coming at you with guns the size of a small warship

storm jungle
#

also yeah like

#

people legit got no idea what even half the size of the Empire States is like

#

especially when you stand beneath it and look UP

dusk patrol
#

Especially something that big marching around

#

Firing off guns the size of apartment complexes

rose thorn
#

what was that ship in a space wolf book that was literally bigger then an emperor class ship?

storm jungle
#

yeah like the Warhound being smaller than the Statue of Liberty doesnt matter, that thing is still a death-machine

dusk patrol
plush mason
dusk patrol
#

Or a battle barge

#

Space Wolves have one of the biggest fleets in the Imperium

rose thorn
#

i cant remember what it was btu i remember people arguing if it was a typo

dusk patrol
#

Shitton of battle barges

#

And they still have their Gloriana

rose thorn
#

because it was stupid fucking big

plush mason
dusk patrol
#

yarp

arctic talon
#

Emperor class battle ships arenā€™t that big

#

Like theyā€™re big

#

But thereā€™s bigger

brittle slate
#

A legit army type for guard should be serfs

barren tapir
dusk patrol
#

It kinda annoys me how we have several Gloriana still in Imperium control but we never hear about them really.

brittle slate
#

Like a strike cruiser has between 50-65k crew

dusk patrol
#

Just the Macragge's Honour and the Eternal Crusader

#

I know the Dark Angels and Wolves still have theirs

arctic talon
#

The dark angels have one still

#

The blood angels is scrap metal on Baal

#

Uhhh

dusk patrol
#

But the DA obviously the Rock kinda takes precedent

arctic talon
#

Yeah

brittle slate
#

Thereā€™s not enough space marines for all these mega ships

dusk patrol
#

You know I don't think we learn what actually happened to the Fist of Iron

arctic talon
dusk patrol
#

Because it didn't actually get confirmed destroyed during Istvaan V or anything

#

Most of the IH fleet survived

brittle slate
arctic talon
#

Not very many lul

brittle slate
#

Exactly

#

Factor in the fleet?

dusk patrol
#

That's always been the case though

arctic talon
#

Yeah most ships are crewed by serfs

dusk patrol
#

You only need one marine to captain a ship.

brittle slate
#

Itā€™s probably 1 marine ever couple of ships

dusk patrol
#

Generally with a few extra for other duties.

brittle slate
#

If any of them are expected to engage in missions

dusk patrol
#

Battle Barges are mostly what have a large amount of marines.

barren tapir
#

Especially since they are made to planetary invasions instead of space battles

brittle slate
#

The rock must have a tactical squad on it at any given time

arctic talon
#

Also prolly some chapalains

#

And apothecaries

brittle slate
#

A strike cruiser can support 100 marines

dusk patrol
#

The Rock has a fleet around it at all times at least, and I can't think of any time it wouldn't have a fairly large force

arctic talon
#

Tbf

dusk patrol
#

Its not actually very powerful by itself

arctic talon
#

Serfs with guns

#

Are people with guns

brittle slate
#

That would mean the rock is likely participating in every slightly major DA engagement

barren tapir
#

And you can stack more serfs with guns than SM

brittle slate
#

Or is nearby

arctic talon
#

Idk how the dark angels treat their serfs

#

But Iā€™d assume not absolutely horrifically

brittle slate
#

But this is why I think serfs need to be an option as an army

arctic talon
#

Like some chapters

dusk patrol
#

Based of the books, fine mostly

#

Azrael is pretty chill tbh

arctic talon
#

Just gota find kitbash options

dusk patrol
#

Its mostly just Asmodai whose nuts, and hes nuts to everyone.

barren tapir
#

Probably how the servants of the Order were treated, so snobbed, but also cared for

brittle slate
#

Itā€™d be cool if they had aspects of chapter tactics

arctic talon
#

Asmodai is

#

Asmodai

barren tapir
#

Repent!

arctic talon
#

Heā€™s an asshole lul

dusk patrol
#

Most of Sapphon and Azrael's job is reining him in.

barren tapir
#

Yeah, and it is hilarious

dusk patrol
#

It sucks too because hes insanely valuable in an actual fight.

#

He turns no win scenarios into crushing victories time and again

barren tapir
#

Having a chapter master doing whatever he can to prevent a chief chaplain to mess up all he touch

brittle slate
#

In Spears of the Emperor the capabilities of a serf, at least for a Mentor, is pretty incredible

dusk patrol
#

He's just also batshit crazy

brittle slate
#

Theyā€™re basically inquisition level operatives

dusk patrol
#

I think they even say so in the book.

#

Especially due to how they operate.

barren tapir
brittle slate
#

Of course- but then so are custodes serfs

dusk patrol
#

The Aurora chapter has their serfs crew the tanks they drive.

brittle slate
#

Serfs, out of necessity, have got to be one of the more elite formations in the imperial military

dusk patrol
#

And drive some of the smaller tanks themselves.

barren tapir
#

Space wolves serfs get way better equipment than IG

brittle slate
#

So do ultima aux

barren tapir
#

Yeah

#

Was just gonna write about them too

#

Oh, and Imperial fist serfs too

dusk patrol
#

Imperial Fists and Space Wolf serfs are weird because itā€™s super fucking brutal to get into that whole deal

#

But theyā€™re treated really well once they do

arctic talon
#

But like

#

Yeah

dusk patrol
#

I guess for Fenris too

arctic talon
#

Also thereā€™s a bunch of cadian serfs

dusk patrol
#

Itā€™s kinda

arctic talon
#

Now as well lol

dusk patrol
#

Just another day

arctic talon
#

On the phalanx

dusk patrol
#

Yeah itā€™s fully crewed now mostly

#

Itā€™s back to itā€™s GC levels of power

arctic talon
#

Still very empty of actual marines

brittle slate
#

Anyway. I think it would be a great option

arctic talon
#

But itā€™s got people

arctic talon
#

Tbh

barren tapir
#

I mean, if it is true that shit is hitting the fan then fielding the serfs wouldn't be out of the table i feel, and would work well with also an improved quality for guard

signal bramble
#

In the new void kings book thereā€™s a fenrisian rogue trader dynasty that are human space Vikings.

dusk patrol
#

Imperial Fists are weird in how their training is probably only second to the Grey Knights in itā€™s attrition rate and how brutal it is

#

But theyā€™re also one of the most chill

arctic talon
#

Imperial fists try not to kill initiate challenge(impossible)

dusk patrol
#

If that Chem trooper wasnā€™t high as balls right now, he might be concerned

#

But I guess thatā€™s kind of like saying if the sky wasnt blue right now, it would be green

winter vessel
#

Weird, I thought Terminators would be a little taller.

dusk patrol
#

If we assume the Guardsmen is about 6 feet

#

Then, that would probably put the terminator at around 8-9 feet tall, which is generally in line with most depictions

#

Not counting that space marine height can be quite variable

plush mason
#

so if a SM's armor adds like a foot to their height how do they use their hands and feet?

odd palm
dusk patrol
#

Probably, but itā€™s hard to say without numbers. IF itā€™s something like 1 in 5000 made it

#

Which is just absurdly low compared to most other chapter we see

odd palm
#

Thatā€™s fair. But the impression is the attrition rate is so high that they need a second scout company

dusk patrol
#

Generally we see in groups of a thousand a dozen or so making it

dusk patrol
#

Which is kinda nuts, so I wouldnā€™t be shocked if theirs is worse

odd palm
winter vessel
#

The way the Guardsmen is positioned makes it like heā€™s seeing a terminator half naked and looking from an unfortunate perspective

brittle slate
#

and it sucks how terminators aren't frightening anymore

#

back in the day they made you worry

sinful crater
#

But aren't terminator armor made for heavy assault in space normally?

arctic talon
#

Especially if theyā€™re creations of bile or Iron warrior

dusk patrol
#

I just want them to make Primaris terminator armor already

#

Gravis doesnā€™t do it for me the same way, I donā€™t dislike it but itā€™s not the same

candid hare
# dusk patrol Gravis doesnā€™t do it for me the same way, I donā€™t dislike it but itā€™s not the sa...

It's understandable that you might have a preference for the look and feel of certain types of armor. The Gravis armor worn by Primaris Aggressors and Inceptors is designed to provide enhanced protection and mobility in close-quarters combat, while the traditional Terminator armor worn by Space Marines of the First Founding Chapters is designed for a more heavily-armored and specialized role. Both types of armor have their own unique characteristics and can be effective in different situations. Ultimately, it's up to the individual Space Marine and their Chapter to decide which type of armor is best suited to their needs and preferences.

dusk patrol
#

I mean all thatā€™s accurate, I just want Primaris terminators is my point.

#

In lore they can probably use it still

#

Itā€™s not like we havenā€™t seen terminator armor for abnormally large marines

candid hare
#

In the lore of the Warhammer 40,000 universe, it is indeed possible for Primaris Space Marines to be equipped with Terminator armor. In fact, the Primaris Space Marines were created using advanced genetic engineering techniques and are physically larger and more resilient than the original Space Marines of the First Founding Chapters. As a result, they are capable of wearing Terminator armor and using its advanced technology to great effect on the battlefield. It's worth noting that Terminator armor is considered a rare and valuable asset in the 41st millennium, and not all Space Marines are able to access or use it. However, for those who are able to wear it, Terminator armor can provide unparalleled protection and firepower, making it a formidable weapon in the hands of a skilled warrior.

candid hare
brittle slate
#

you sound like the GW HR department.

#

currently there has never been primaris in terminator armor that im aware of

odd palm
#

Iā€™d wager that if they make primaris terminator armour, itā€™s likely to drop at the same time we see assault intercessors equipped with the new jump pack seen on Shrike

brittle slate
#

like so much of the new stuff (and it's turning the corner on 5+ years so i don't even know if calling it new anymore) leave too many holes any third year warhammer lore nut could have answered in a reddit post

odd palm
#

Just have to wait and see

honest trellis
#

which honestly is a sign they're at least recognizing the original designs are better

plush mason
#

wouldnt giving the primaris first born kit options just push the first born out of the TT or has GW already taken steps to avoid that?

candid hare
# plush mason wouldnt giving the primaris first born kit options just push the first born out ...

it's worth noting that Terminator armor is considered a rare and valuable asset in the 41st millennium, and not all Space Marines are able to access or use it. It's also worth considering that different Space Marine Chapters have their own traditions and methods of warfare, and they may choose to use different types of armor and equipment depending on their needs and preferences. It's possible that the inclusion of Primaris Space Marines in Terminator armor could affect the role and use of traditional Terminator armor by the First Founding Chapters, but it's not within my knowledge or capabilities to say for certain how this might happen.

storm jungle
#

Lore doesn't really matter in that regard.

#

If GW wants a new terminator mini they will make it, push it, and make new lore around it. Its how its been for years.

brittle slate
storm jungle
#

But I don't think they could be ever dumb enough to try to replace Terminator armor considering its iconic nature.

Though hey, could have said the same thing with the Firstborn

brittle slate
#

that's a given

storm jungle
brittle slate
#

they've done a few things not to piss people off too much

#

but the writing is on the wall

storm jungle
#

Marine fans always buy it in the end

#

so it doesnt matter

brittle slate
#

yuuuup

dusk patrol
#

Thereā€™s no in universe reason they couldnā€™t wear terminator

candid hare
# storm jungle so it doesnt matter

yep, it's true that the creators and publishers of the Warhammer 40,000 universe have the ability to introduce new models, miniatures, and lore elements to the setting as they see fit. While the Terminator armor is an iconic and popular aspect of the Warhammer 40,000 universe, it's always possible that the creators could decide to release new models or updates that expand upon or modify existing lore. However, it's worth noting that the success of new releases or updates is ultimately dependent on the reception and support of the fans and players of the Warhammer 40,000 universe.

dusk patrol
#

My brother in Christ can you type like a person

brittle slate
dusk patrol
#

Iā€™m not convinced youā€™re not a robot

brittle slate
#

this is how bad it is @candid hare , you're making eternal and me on the same page

candid hare
#

I apologize if my responses seem repetitive or unrelated to your questions. As an AI language model, I do not have personal opinions or biases, and I'm here to provide information and assistance to the best of my abilities based on the knowledge and information available to me. My responses are generated based on the input that I receive, and I do not have the ability to browse the internet or access current events, so I may not always be able to provide the most up-to-date or relevant information. Please let me know if you have any specific questions or if there is anything else I can help with.

#

lulz

storm jungle
#

It served you well

#

time to put it down

brittle slate
dusk patrol
brittle slate
#

šŸ’„ šŸ’„ šŸ’„

candid hare
#

to help them with schoolwork, and they try to act as if theyre smart now lol

brittle slate
#

that doesn't mean we'll put up with that shit in a 40k discord

#

let's move on

plush mason
barren tapir
arctic talon
barren tapir
#

OOF, poor votann, they are not slow, they are just over thinker... Which is heavily relatable i say

celest dome
lilac wave
#

This is the funniest shit I've seen. I hope it's just a guy rping as a chat bot.

dusk patrol
#

Heā€™s been on discord for like 5 years

#

So who knows

plush mason
#

what if its one of those "learning" AIs like the one they put on reddit lol

honest trellis
#

there is an AI amogus

dusk patrol
#

:emergencymeeting:

plush mason
fierce pendant
brittle slate
#

So reading new bits from the guard book

#

-The Astra Militarum is the largest coherent force in the galaxy. The guard regiments are the mainstay armed forces of the Imperium. Many of the largest wars fought by the Imperium were fought by the guard alone.

#

BUT

-The Warp displaces much of Imperial travel and communication, which hinders the Imperium's effort to conduct unified strategies and maintain centralized command.

#

so it doesn't matter that it's the biggest if it can't be mobilized correctly ~Napoleon (probably)

#

-Of the nearly one billion that stood in defense of Cadia, only three million escaped its fall. Creed and the Cadian 8th were not among them.

#

Ah, look, finally drama!

-There is a dark underlining to this renewed resolve among the Cadians. Their hatred of the enemies of mankind crossed into uncompromising zeal. Many Cadians perceiving that the fall of their world was a personal failure, fight harder to restore their honor. Some resent the homeworlders that failed to protect Cadia or blame themselves for not being there. Others have developed scorn for the other Imperial regiments that they believed had failed to aid Cadia during its darkest hour. They refuse the reinforcing of their regiments by troops from other worlds. For them, the burden of loss is theirs and theirs alone.

#

Kinda weird:

-True combined arms regiments are rare in the Imperium. For example, tank regiments field little to no infantry. Infantry regiments have little to no artillery. To wage an effective war, the different regiments have to become interdepended on each other. This is not seen as a weakness by the Imperials. It's a necessary precaution that prevents any regiment that turns traitor from having access to the tools required to wage a full-scale war.

#

-The tanks of the Imperial Guard are constructed in accordance with ancient STC. Within dataslates that date back to humanity's deep past, many of the tanks that fought in those ancient times can be recognized as virtually identical to ones fighting in the wars of today.

-The super heavy tanks of the Imperium are remnants of the Dark Age of Technology. The technology that allows for their manufacture is becoming increasingly rare, causing whole regiments of them to be uncommon among the armies of the Imperium.

#

And back on Armegeddon

-The birth of the Great Rift ripped open a Warp Rift in the northern pole regions of Armageddon. It was a legacy of a previous apocalyptic war. It was a mere crack in reality that marked the banishment of the Daemon Primarch Angron. The Great Rift ripped it open and, from within, spewed the mortal and daemon legions of Chaos. The Warp Rift was named Red Angel's Gate.

storm jungle
brittle slate
#

Reading a compilation on my phone, let me ask

storm jungle
dusk patrol
#

They forgot the part where it says Unless we make another new tank named after Rogal Dorn

plush mason
#

lol

barren tapir
barren tapir
dusk patrol
#

Yeah itā€™s the reason for most fragmenting of Imperium systems

#

Same as why the Navy and Guard are never aligned

barren tapir
barren tapir
# dusk patrol They forgot the part where it says *Unless we make another new tank named after ...

Naaaah, uhm... You see... We rediscovered it... Yeah, it was the stoic determination inspired by rogal dorn that let use find another STC that in no way was new and developed of course, and we called it rogal dorn exactly because of the determination he inspired in all us tech priest, not because we made a tank that looks like a brick and thought that naming it after another brick was a fun joke, no sir

brittle slate
barren tapir
#

It is the mainstay of the guard that it has to be interdependant between regiments

plush mason
#

yeah they dont want a repeat of the heresy when the imperial army was able to wage full scale war very quickly due to being fully integrated with the navy and what not

barren tapir
#

That was the second part, after the heresy the army and the navy got divided, but for the army they went even deeper and made so that each regiment couldn't have a tactical versatility, so if a regiment went rogue it would be even easier to encircle and crush

#

Honestly, if you fear a rebellion from within it is an extremely reasonable and smart thing to do, too bad that it make you extremely less efficient in dealing with problems from without your forces

#

Since then you will have inter regiment grudges and miscommunications because of different approaches to war and doctrines

brittle slate
#

I see- I was under the impression the Tallarn were combined based on the fw book

barren tapir
#

Depend on which era they talk about

dusk patrol
#

Well like Cadians definitely have armored and infantry regiments

#

So technically theyā€™re not combined

#

But effectively sometimes they basically are

#

What matters more is the Navy and Guard canā€™t be aligned

barren tapir
#

But sometime do

brittle slate
#

I knew about the guard and navy

barren tapir
#

It is like, that when things need to be done, they get done in the reasonable way

plush mason
#

does the navy have a fancy name like guard or no?

barren tapir
#

Which isn't the way that they were divided, at least not the reasonable way to have stuff working for facing outside threats

sinful crater
#

well not like it save cadia sadly

barren tapir
#

BUT, if the threat is from the inside, then the by the book divisions work very well

sinful crater
#

definitivly

#

divide and conquer, quite a classic.

#

sadly, the size of the imperium make most of the tactic we know kinda... not adapted

plush mason
dusk patrol
barren tapir
dusk patrol
#

And other issues

plush mason
dusk patrol
#

It was planned for a long long time

sinful crater
dusk patrol
#

Well if they had won the void war they could have maybe

#

But they were completely overwhelmed on that front

barren tapir
#

TBF, cadia didn't even needed to be conquered to give chaos full access to imperial space, they didn't had a FTL inhibitor SMH

dusk patrol
#

Shush itā€™s cool

#

Mandeville Point or something

sinful crater
#

it was more for hit the imperial guard morale, since a lot of the best did come from cadia

dusk patrol
#

Techno jargon

plush mason
dusk patrol
#

Itā€™s the basic theme of the Imperium since forever

barren tapir
#

TBF they might even had better chances in loading all those troops in "transports" and tried to board as many chaos ship they could and destroy them from the inside, maybe even putting them in collision route with each others... All those troops stacked on cadia wouldn't do anything if the atmosphere was full of chaos ships

dusk patrol
#

Tau could be crushed anytime but it wouldnā€™t be worth it

plush mason
#

i take it the art of war did not survive to the 42nd millennium lol

sinful crater
dusk patrol
#

Plus the Tau provide a benefit to being where they are even if the Imperium probably wonā€™t admit it

brittle slate
#

And especially not now

dusk patrol
#

It is possible, itā€™s just they would lose too much in other areas

#

Itā€™s not worth the cost

#

And the Tau are a nice buffer state

plush mason
#

where is the tau empire located anyway?

dusk patrol
#

Not quite as hostile as other entities they repel

dusk patrol
brittle slate
#

The sectors wide crusade was the attempt and it spectacularly failed.

barren tapir
sinful crater
#

right now T'au are kinda the less of the trouble the imperium face, they let them live since they can be used as buffer and are not that extended yet

brittle slate
#

I donā€™t think you realize how absolutely poisonous the greater good ideology is

plush mason
dusk patrol
#

It wasnā€™t really a failure either

brittle slate
#

Thatā€™s Damocles 1

barren tapir
brittle slate
#

Damocles 2 had it all

sinful crater
#

or all the sedition happening

brittle slate
#

Including somewhere close to 10k plus space marines

#

Spread across 3 sectors

sinful crater
#

but you are right, greater good is a naive and dangerous idea

brittle slate
dusk patrol
brittle slate
#

I donā€™t think thatā€™s true anymore

#

The tau are actively at war with the imperium. I donā€™t think theyā€™re trying to work with it anymore.

dusk patrol
#

So are the Eldar, they still work together sometimes

brittle slate
#

Look at Chalnath lore, medusa v, Muā€™gulath Bay.

dusk patrol
#

They still have scions who go fight with Tau against various threats

celest dome
dusk patrol
#

Itā€™s just as much to learn about one another as anything

celest dome
#

Though Smurfs are Belgian at least

dusk patrol
#

But itā€™s still an option, which is more than almost any other faction is good for

plush mason
dusk patrol
#

And like I said, the Tau absorb Tyranid and other major threats in the area which is nice for the Imperium

celest dome
plush mason
#

it was a joke

celest dome
#

We got our independence fair and square

brittle slate
#

With tau now organizing pirates to cause problems in segmentum Solar and tau diplomats running rings around imperials, I donā€™t think anything but major armed conflict is in the future

dusk patrol
#

I donā€™t know enough about Belgium history to comment on any of this so idk

brittle slate
sinful crater
#

if lion come back and help actively gulliman, i doubt he will let the tau continue without acting

celest dome
#

I'm from Belgium, we have a weird history, but we aren't just a buffer state that Germany and France decided upon

dusk patrol
#

Itā€™s still true even if theyā€™re antagonistic, which theyā€™ve always been ultimately

brittle slate
#

With inquisitors trying to get genestealers to infiltrate tau planets

dusk patrol
#

At the end of the day itā€™s the lesser of other evils

barren tapir
brittle slate
#

I donā€™t think the imperium is in a place to do anything about the tau. And honestly blew their shot before the rift opened.

dusk patrol
#

None of the changes in lore changes that theyā€™re still the most ā€œfriendlyā€ of other factions and lowest on the threat list for many reasons

#

Besides maybe the Eldar

brittle slate
dusk patrol
#

And only some Eldar

barren tapir
#

The imperium is fully capable to deal with tau, they just have more pressing stuff, like, you know, the fucking giant rift

dusk patrol
#

Tyranids

#

Orks

#

Necrons coming back

brittle slate
#

Yeah- but a hive world was lost without a relative shot fired

dusk patrol
#

Tau have always been the least dangerous threat of the major factions.

barren tapir
#

And tbf, i would really like to know how tau can affect the segmentum solar when they probably don't even know where it is

dusk patrol
#

Hive worlds are lost daily in this new era

brittle slate
#

I think recent lore shows there at the insidious level of genestealer cults

vital kernel
#

I'd be so hype if part of the darktide turns out to be a kroot warsphere.

dusk patrol
#

GSC I kinda just lump with Nids tbh

#

Itā€™s basically the same deal

sinful crater
#

maybe more chance to see ork than kroot

dusk patrol
#

Technically itā€™s different but itā€™s like Iā€™d still consider the Ad Mech Imperium even if thereā€™s some distinction