40k-lore-chat

[arctic talon]

ykw

that makes sense as well

[full bane]

IIRC he also lost to a landmine

[arctic talon]

but Moloc took a fat fucking L against a Necron Lord lol

[arctic talon]

the landmine is funny tho okay

[thin crescent]

He'd slice Cato Sicarius into Julienne fries.

[half aurora]

Idk, I just like tomb kings in their setting more than necrons in 40k. Necrons seem to be too big of memes to me but maybe I just need to read more of the necron books

[full bane]

It is, and the follow up just hammers in that Slaanesh doesn't actually have any hard rules for how his resurrection works and just kind of plays Mad Libs while bringing him back.

[odd palm]

As much as I'd like to agree, unfortunately not. One has much more powerful plot armour

[arctic talon]

yeah Slaanesh just has fun

lol

Cato unironically is a decent duelist

but Lucius prolly trumps him

[odd palm]

He's good but not Lucius good

[plush mason]

the actual fuck is that mistake of a loli tech goblin?

[cyan oxide]

But could he beat Cain

[full bane]

Cherub of some kind.

[odd palm]

I mean Cain should be trumped by your average tactical marine in melee tbh

[arctic talon]

Mebbe

[thin crescent]

Captain Sicarius 6" 2+ 2+ 4 4 5 4 9 2+
Lucius the Eternal 6" 2+ 2+ 5 4 6 5 10 3+
Just without wargear....

[arctic talon]

Crunch != fluff

[full bane]

Sometimes the Imperium lobotomizes babies for tech-support.

[cyan oxide]

Aren’t most cherubs clones or artificial births

Most servitors too if I remember correctly

[arctic talon]

Cherubs are usually vat grone

*grown

servitors varry

combat servitors usually are vat grown

menial ones aren't

[thin crescent]

Cherubs are frightening.

[arctic talon]

Key word is usually

[thin crescent]

Like porcelain dolls and clowns

[dusk patrol]

Example: Culexus in fluff Vs lore

Culexus in lore: Dissolve your soul with a touch, can’t be seen by normies they’re so blank

[thin crescent]

Fa sho fa sho. Hard to quantify cunning and sneakiness into a stat.

[dusk patrol]

Culexus in fluff: 4+ WS

[arctic talon]

4+ WS

[dusk patrol]

[arctic talon]

assassins

literally has worse WS then a scion

[full bane]

Vat grown in theory. Though I recall some kind of baby theft for Cherub manufacture in one or more novels/RPG sourcebooks.

[thin crescent]

I getcha. Just wasn't aware that Cato Sicarius is considered that much of a BA with his girly chapter and all.

[plush mason]

they are oddly accurate to the biblical depictions of the cherubs tho. which i do appreciate

[arctic talon]

Cato has ultra depression kekw

after getting stuck in the warp

[dusk patrol]

Ultramarines are based smh

[arctic talon]

then again most llike Ultramarine characters have some levels

of ultradepression

except like

Tigerus

[full bane]

Sicarius and the Ultramarines get meme-ed to hell and back and their actual interesting elements get ignored/discarded by fans.

Just like most things in 40k

[thin crescent]

Tigerius is usually having his warp tea every afternoon with Mephiston though. That's how one stays calm and the other learns skills.

[thin crescent]

Interesting elements? You mean roman history?

[arctic talon]

Something something shovel something

[dusk patrol]

Some great excerpts from the Calgar comic

[dusk patrol]

I mean if we’re playing that game most chapters aren’t interesting

They’re not Roman anyways

They’re space Roman

[minor lance]

I mean, TKs have Settra. Who is the memelord of WHF

[thin crescent]

The gauntlets of Ultramar were made to kill heretics? Lemme correct that for ya Marnie, "The gauntlets of Ultramar were made BY heretics."

[dusk patrol]

Some would say they were just awaiting their true purpose

[thin crescent]

Some would also say...

Heresy!

[dusk patrol]

And considering it’s been a long long time since they’re done any non heretic killing

[thin crescent]

But to be fair pre-heresy the SM's used lots of xenos weaponry. Ask Fulgrim how that worked out.

BTW @dusk patrol let me show you what I think of ole Marnie... https://www.redbubble.com/people/cuy50/works/38940535-marneus-calgar-pimp

[cyan oxide]

i like revived guilliman i like the conflict he has with everything he faces

[thin crescent]

Man got more cybernetics than flesh at this point. He should be a dreadnaught.

[dusk patrol]

The above comic is a more recent depiction

He’s old, and a little battered

But he’s still got it

[bleak drum]

Are the servo skulls alive? I know that the use of AI is prohibited in the mechanicum so I assume that there's a brain inside the skull controlling it?

[crisp heath]

correct

[cyan oxide]

define "alive"

[bleak drum]

Not dead?

[cyan oxide]

like living biological tissue?

[crisp heath]

ye its not really alive per say but there is a human consciousness controling them

[bleak drum]

Ah I see I see

[cyan oxide]

a servitors mind is completely wiped before service and they use the brain as a CPU

[bleak drum]

Ah alright thank you for the answers guys

[cyan oxide]

technically servitors actually still have their souls and maybe some of them arent totally wiped

[bleak drum]

Sounds like a punishment almost

[arctic talon]

Not fully wiping a servitor mind is grounds for servitorization

Also servoskulls

Aren’t supposed to use the original persons brain matter

[cyan oxide]

so servitors are suseptible to warp fuckery IE watcher in the rain

[arctic talon]

Key word is “supposed”

[trim junco]

The Mind is still there, but mostly so much left that the task the servitor has to do can be achieved. so a door opener is more or less "alive"

[arctic talon]

But servoskulls are not supposed to have any sort of personality normally

If one does

Well

It’s technically heresy

But it happens so much

It’s just an unspoken rule to not ask

[crisp heath]

the mechanicus gets away with so much simply because no one can touch them

[arctic talon]

Lol

Yep

Also the fact that the forgeworld Metallica have a servoskull that has a skitarii marshals cortex in it

[cyan oxide]

and the fact they can hand wave things because no one else understands the things they do but them

[arctic talon]

Which is uh

Not allowed

But it’s too much of a asset strategically

[crisp heath]

the arch biologus literally just made an AI and covered up saying, "it's just a copy of my brain hehe :3"

[cyan oxide]

"all pre recorded responses lol"

[arctic talon]

Arch magos’s are arguably stronger

Then an inquisitor

In terms of what they can get away with

[crisp heath]

lol

[arctic talon]

They only need to answer to their peers

And usually their peers don’t give a shit

Or one of my favorite admech quotes

[cyan oxide]

yea mechanicus are typically more unified in thought than inquisitors

[arctic talon]

“I’m an arch magos of the Adeptus mechanicus, I can do whatever I want”

And he’s right

Who’s gona challenge him on his decision

[cyan oxide]

some times literally

[arctic talon]

The admech loves to argue with each other

But the only thing they hate more then each other

Is outside influence

[crisp heath]

say one word of sas from him and you lose support of the mechanicus for you chapter/regiment/whatever you belong to

no more titans

[arctic talon]

Whoops

Production issue

[crisp heath]

no more tanks

[arctic talon]

No bolt guns

[crisp heath]

no nothing

[arctic talon]

Also only half the usually ammount of ammo

[cyan oxide]

oops maintence failure machine spirit is not pleased

[arctic talon]

Archmagi hold so much power

[cyan oxide]

awww shuks seems like the baneblade didnt like that comment about me and my order and wants you to say sorry

[arctic talon]

;p;

I think the funniest thing is when the admech just blatantly sends the wrong thing

because someone upset them

[crisp heath]

apologize to the machine spirit before i use your guts to grease its treads

[arctic talon]

I.E a shipment of basilisk artillery ammo

to an infantry regiment

[crisp heath]

hehe we made an uh oh

hope you guys can fight off that WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAgh tho

[cyan oxide]

isnt that more a munitorum thing?

[arctic talon]

no

the admech still gives stuff to the munitorium

to send

like a box of lasguns

intended for X

its up to the munitorium to actually like

send it

and thats where unintentional shipping errors occur

or the munitorium being malicous

[crisp heath]

"unintentional"

[arctic talon]

Sometimes it is

othertimes its uh

yeah

[crisp heath]

sometimes

[slim jewel]

[cyan oxide]

so in theory the ad mech could be pissed and send las guns to an artilley regi but then munitorum fucks up and sends artillery shells that was supposed to go instead

[arctic talon]

also Cawl's most power tripping quote is

"I’m the Prime Conduit of the Omnissiah! If I say it can be done, then it SHALL be done!"

[slim jewel]

Lore question. Did Horus do anything wrong?

[arctic talon]

Yes

like

a lot lmao

[crisp heath]

many many things

[slim jewel]

Was his crimes as severe as arthas from WoW?

[arctic talon]

worse

lmao

Arthas is like mid tier

[crisp heath]

much worse

[slim jewel]

[arctic talon]

compared to Horus

[thorny turtle]

Is Alpha legion traitor or loyalist? thats the real question here

[arctic talon]

Traitor

overall

[crisp heath]

their T

[arctic talon]

There's loyalist elements we know of

[thorny turtle]

No, they're loyalist

[arctic talon]

Hydra Dominatus

[crisp heath]

[cyan oxide]

but are they really his fault because he was under warp influence

[thorny turtle]

No, they're traitor

[slim jewel]

I'm a baby in lore but I have no clue where to start

[arctic talon]

hell

Guilliman

is more evil then Arthas

[coarse mirage]

Are there any books about pre-30k (yes 30) Imperium?

[lavish quarry]

traitor but loyal to the emperor

[arctic talon]

No

pre 30k imperium is

has like

0 lore

[coarse mirage]

:(

[arctic talon]

aside from some flashbacks we get in horus heresy books

[slim jewel]

What it does have is the god emperor

And the emperor protects

[thorny turtle]

No, they're actually Alpharius

[cyan oxide]

supposedly horus was free of warp fuckery just before he died and regretted everything

[lavish quarry]

lol even a low lvl tech priest or commisar is more evil then arthas

[crisp heath]

some pretty good youtube channels that do intros to the lore that are a lot easier to get into then just get facefucked by the books and deep lore

[coarse mirage]

pre-Imperium is what's the most interesting

[thorny turtle]

@coarse miragethe last church is a pretty good one

its pretty short tho

[coarse mirage]

Yeah I've seen that one, it's wonderful

[arctic talon]

Guilliman just did a little bit

[slim jewel]

So post nut clarity pretty much

[arctic talon]

of genocide

and by a little bit

I mean a whole lot of genocide

Like an absurd ammount

[coarse mirage]

Perhaps little in the context of how much everyone else did?

[crisp heath]

whats a primarch without a little bit of genocide

[thorny turtle]

Horus never died, it was actually an Alpha legion disguised as Horus

[arctic talon]

More then Vulkan Less then the Lion

is where I'd put him

[cyan oxide]

adeptus ridiculus is an entertaining way to ease in if you dont want information overload

[arctic talon]

def less then Sanguinius

Who was a genocide machine

[thorny turtle]

leutin is also neato for lore

[arctic talon]

and did the good ol

kill surrendering combatants

[coarse mirage]

Alpha Legion are so good at disguises that they've managed to fool the universe that they're actually relevant and that they've actually done anything important.

[thorny turtle]

Angron is probably the most murderous out of all of them

@coarse mirageDid Alpharius actually die though

[crisp heath]

they were good character devolpment for rogal dorn and the imperial fists

[cyan oxide]

well thats just unfair

[coarse mirage]

Yes

[thorny turtle]

No

[slim jewel]

I'm here for the party and for the knowledge

[arctic talon]

If we aren't hear for the joke yes

[slim jewel]

Also my friend told me that sanguinius tripped onto Horus's blade

[arctic talon]

Alpharius did literally die

[thorny turtle]

No

[arctic talon]

funny joke

but not true as far as we know

[slim jewel]

[arctic talon]

but like Arthas burned a single city and killed alota people

Guilliman has

[thorny turtle]

Alpharius never died, Omegon did

[arctic talon]

burned a few planets

and blown up a few

[coarse mirage]

Astartes are flawed and broken

[slim jewel]

Ok I'll tone down the trolling, my bad. I'm here for chatting and to just read and lore exerts that get dropped. Thanks for accepting me my brothers and sisters

[crisp heath]

https://tenor.com/view/warhammer40k-no-no-40k-gif-24271093

[thorny turtle]

How do you even know that you aren't Alpharius?

[lavish quarry]

so did they actually confirmed that alpharius is dead i read the books where he fights rogal dorn but i still dont wanna believe it

[thorny turtle]

You don't, you purposely mind wiped yourself

[cyan oxide]

anything specific that you are interested in that you want to learn more of?

[dusk patrol]

Because I’m not a cringe meme

[thorny turtle]

Nah, that was a fake Alpharius

[dusk patrol]

No, it wasn’t

It was real

Super duper real

[thorny turtle]

We all know Alpharius wouldn't put himself right in the line of fire

[slim jewel]

Not really but if a discussion is had then I'll probably lurk and learn

[dusk patrol]

Omegon himself literally tells us basically from his POV

[cyan oxide]

understandable

[dusk patrol]

We see the “primarch dead” fireworks

The author confirmed it

Alpharius died

[slim jewel]

Every preacher must learn the stories and fables of the imperium

[lavish quarry]

welp some author also make harlequin slaughter custodes

[thorny turtle]

Do you truly think that Alpharius wouldn't lie to you?@dusk patrol

[lavish quarry]

sooo i dont trust them anymore haha

[dusk patrol]

I think I’m not a cringe meme

[lavish quarry]

or a orc and gretchen kill a fucking warlord titan

[dusk patrol]

So idc

[arctic talon]

Harlequins are more then a match for custodes lore wise

the problem is

[dusk patrol]

Some are

[arctic talon]

how its written

[snow fern]

The first time I saw your name I thought you were either a tf2 spy main or a Disney Movie enthusiast ngl

[arctic talon]

its badly written

[cyan oxide]

but wasnt that alpharius just omagon pretending to be alpharius while alpharius was being omagon and after omagon died apharius took his place as alpharius

[dusk patrol]

The whole passage is shit though

[arctic talon]

the idea itself is fine

Harlequins fighting custodes

[dusk patrol]

Just like all of War of the Beast

[arctic talon]

would be a pretty even fight

but they way its written is uh

dogshit

[lavish quarry]

1 vs 1 not two of them slaughtering bunch of custodes

[thorny turtle]

exactly, Alpharius switched places with Alpharius, thus saving Alpharius from Imperial Fist

[arctic talon]

Its a shadowseer and a death jester

[dusk patrol]

Tbh it doesn’t matter much, but Omegon has an inner monologue as Omegon and he realizes Alpharius is dead

[arctic talon]

which is like a shield captain

and uh

a tribune I guess?

Custodes don't really have an equivelent to a death jester

[thorny turtle]

But how do you know that was even the real Omegon and real Alpharius?

[dusk patrol]

Champion maybe

[arctic talon]

but a shadowseer is like a shield captain

I guess?

[dusk patrol]

Because my dad works for Games Workshop

[arctic talon]

but a shadowseer and a death jester are more then a match for a normal custodes

the same way a shield captain

[thorny turtle]

My dad owns games workshop

I run these streets

[arctic talon]

is more then a match for a bunch of normal harlies

[crisp heath]

i keep seeing shadowseer and thinking far seer

[dusk patrol]

Mmmhmm

[arctic talon]

also the fact a shadowseer is a psyker

doesn't help the custodes

[dusk patrol]

It’s more they’re just pants on head stupid about how they approach the situation

[arctic talon]

yeah

the war of the beast

was written so badly

[dusk patrol]

They run around, kill a few Custodes, say “we come in peace”, want to speak to the Emperor or whoever

[crisp heath]

just needed a few sister of silence

[dusk patrol]

And get killed

[arctic talon]

y e p

[thorny turtle]

All I want is to have a plague marine boss fight in darktide where we all die horrible deaths

[dusk patrol]

Well I got some bad news for you

[crisp heath]

very possible

[thorny turtle]

and then the plague marine reveals himself to be Alpharius

[snow fern]

No space marines

[lavish quarry]

or kill the plague marine with power of friendship

[crisp heath]

jk

[dusk patrol]

FS has said no Space Marines

Quite a few times

And yes plague marines are space marines

[crisp heath]

need to watch my ogryn get melted by a plague spewer

[arctic talon]

hug him

[crisp heath]

https://tenor.com/view/plague-marine-warhammer40000-chaos-space-marine-wh40k-death-guard-gif-22151656

[thorny turtle]

All I want is to see a 1v1 between one plague boi against a can of febreeze

Even a vox chatter easter egg for a plague marine attacking people would be neato

[snow fern]

No Space Marines, but a Bolter with Incendiary rounds inspired by the Salamanders would be cool. ||(Inb4 I get deranged about the damn Inferno Bolter nonsense again)||

[dusk patrol]

Infernus you normie

[crisp heath]

do we get meltaguns in darktide?

[thorny turtle]

Did someone just say Legion of the Damned?

[dusk patrol]

It seems we do

[crisp heath]

excellent

[dusk patrol]

There seems to be a Melta in the guns leaked

[snow fern]

I believe the word was (possibly) on the melta. Flamer confirmed tho if you cared.

[crisp heath]

i do like flamers

[cyan oxide]

i have a problem with meltas. how are they diffrent from a plasma gun or a flamer. i know they are but i just dont know what they are supposed to be

[snow fern]

Anti armor laser designed to melt enemy armor

[fierce pendant]

Low ammo, high damage anti armor melter. (Anti anything melter tbh)

[thorny turtle]

The final mission you just get back to the gunship and a grey knight just obliterates you, no more darktide

[crisp heath]

anti armor shotgun basically

[lavish quarry]

i hope they give flamer to the ogryn

[dusk patrol]

Meltas in action

[thorny turtle]

Double flamer for ogryn

[dusk patrol]

Short range “fuck your armor” heat blast basically

[snow fern]

Melta is designed to fuse joints together, explode exposed rounds and just disable/outright destroy enemy armor, as opposed to the plasma rifle being similar to like a sudden explosion hitting somebody in the chest or a flamer being a more traditional flamethrower that could in theory kill a tank if you overheated the engine or something

[cyan oxide]

so if i were to think of it in a real world way is it like a big ass plasma cutter turned into a weapon

[snow fern]

A thermite charge

[fierce pendant]

Ye one that has a trigger attached to it

[dusk patrol]

It’s described as more of a microwave heat blast tbh

Half the time in novels it’s just like, not even visible

It’s just a heatwave

But we’ll see how it’s done in game

[snow fern]

That could have a really cool effect like the microwave pistol in DRG

[crisp heath]

people just disintegrate and tanks melt

[dusk patrol]

Understandably it’s not as sexy to just have a “heatwave” in art

Or in game

[fierce pendant]

No visual feedback = shit weapon

[snow fern]

I mean this returns to the lasgun recoil understanding(I'm sorry dear bot). Yes, in theory, a laser has no recoil, but the visual feedback of the recoil prevents a bit of the uncanny valley effect that might turn people away from the lasgun.

[fierce pendant]

Yes.

[copper cliff]

Also lorewise lasguns have both had and not had recoil

[fierce pendant]

Yes.

[crisp heath]

pew pew (insert laser pointer meme here)

[cyan oxide]

yea from what im reading around on the wiki it seems like a melta is a supersized plasma cutter

[copper cliff]

I say its probably just tied to the power level of the weapon. As recoil is caused by energy discharge, something that produces light at the force of a .50 cal might not have mass but probably still produces an energy discharge that causes kinetic force to send the gun up.

But im not a physicist

[fierce pendant]

Space no

don't turn into black mesa scientist

[snow fern]

I don't think light obeys the laws of planet physics

[fierce pendant]

guys please

[cyan oxide]

light is affected by gravity

[copper cliff]

Not talking about the laser itself but the reaction that creates it.

[dusk patrol]

I think it’s funny sci fi universe laser gun is inconsistent

[thorny turtle]

kinda bummed out how the chainsword turned out

[copper cliff]

Just kind of how it goes in 40k

Inconsistent manufacturing

[fierce pendant]

It was reworked suppousedly.

[thorny turtle]

Las guns, more like Flashlight guns slaps knee

[snow fern]

It got changed, we'll see in the beta

[thorny turtle]

Don't worry though, Yarrick never died, just like Creed he was kidnapped by Trazyn

[slim jewel]

You know what's not inconsistent?

Corpse starch

[thorny turtle]

kinda curious how that would taste

I promise its for science, no heresy here.

[slim jewel]

Probably like taco in 102° Florida weather

[snow fern]

Like an actual beef taco or taco bell beef?

[thorny turtle]

I'm thinking more of a dry chewy beef that tastes awful

[snow fern]

There used to be a taco truck at my campus, god that was good stuff

[thorny turtle]

like it was overcooked and undercooked at the same time

[snow fern]

Is there like any views into the Imperial citizen's life that aren't "and then they died in a completely expected manufactorum incident".

[arctic talon]

Warhammer Crime

Has some slice of life stuff

[thorny turtle]

Yes, there is a story on how a Grey Knight came down to a planet and let everyone live

[arctic talon]

For the average imperial citizen

The above average life

[snow fern]

Like is there rec time in the 41st millennium? I remember some discussion among the rejects about a theatre performance on Atoma Prime, but not much else

[crisp heath]

its always been there for us, and itll be there long after us as well, and will also be us

[arctic talon]

And the really shit life

[arctic talon]

Yes actually

There is rec time

What people do with it is up to them as long as it isn’t you know

Heretical

[snow fern]

right

[crisp heath]

dont do anything in ur freetime that would end with your planet getting explodinated

[thorny turtle]

Any time spent outside of working is heretical

[arctic talon]

That isn’t true but okay

[thorny turtle]

That sounds pretty heretical to me, not working to death for your emperor?

[dusk patrol]

Eisenhorn and it’s sequels have a lot of the lower level stuff

[snow fern]

@thorny turtle You really need a detox of the 40k meme stuff. I was asking a more genuine question.

[arctic talon]

But unironically

Rec time also overlaps with like

End of shift stuff as well

Like sleeping

Eating

Ect.

[snow fern]

I imagine kids get little emps themed toys

[thorny turtle]

@snow fernI'm like 70% certain that there is a story of a regular citizen seeing a grey knight and actually surviving and its from their pov, gatta look that up rq

[arctic talon]

There’s shops that sell miniature titans

On forge worlds

[snow fern]

I want that, not the 40000000$ titan model but a little toy to put on a shelf

[arctic talon]

Lol

[thorny turtle]

Oh, you could probably read some of the Horus Heresy books and view things from the perspective of the Rememberencers

or however you say their title

Fulgrim was a pretty good book that showed how everyone slowly turned into Slanesh worshipers

[lavish quarry]

i dont know why i read all the books and is a lot of alpha plus physcker demon etc dont know why people consider those books what normal humans deal with

i would say gaunt ghosts is more close to normal human scale

[dusk patrol]

Because that’s not all the books are

There’s plenty of bits where he’s dealing with normies or low level people

And it continues with the Ravenor books and so on

Plus the shorts

[odd palm]

Hmm

The Vaults of Terra is another good series in a similar vein to the Eisenhorn/Ravenor series

[dusk patrol]

I didn’t say “Eisenhorn is a book about the lower level people in 40k exclusively”

I said they have that stuff in them

Abnett likes to do that in a lot of his books though

[lavish quarry]

i was not refering to you but this is what so many people suggest to read

[cyan oxide]

I love that about Dan abnett

[dusk patrol]

Because it’s a great introduction

And it’s a great series

[cyan oxide]

My favorite aspect of 40k is the common man stories

[lavish quarry]

i loved the infinite and divine

[dusk patrol]

Outside of reading the codexs it’s what I would, and what typically is reccomended for starting getting into 40k lore

The core rulebook and codexs are what I would recommend first typically if you can

[lavish quarry]

i wonder if there are any eldar boooks

[odd palm]

There are

[dusk patrol]

There’s several

Varying quality levels

[atomic pelican]

Path of the Deldar and Masque of Vyle are good

[lavish quarry]

and necrolns boooks?

[crisp heath]

yes

[atomic pelican]

Path of the eldar are Interesting

[odd palm]

A handful too

[atomic pelican]

And the Ynnari books are actually awful

[dusk patrol]

Necron has Severed, Infinite and the Divine, and the Two-dead King

All of which are good

The last is a two parter

[cyan oxide]

Cain books are good too for common man things because it separates the theory of how things should work versus how they actually work in the imperium

[lavish quarry]

two dead king is the sad one right?

[cyan oxide]

I guess twice dead king was sad in a way

[odd palm]

Throne, how many Cain books are there?

[cyan oxide]

To be honest maybe too many

[odd palm]

I’ve heard the same said about the Ghost novels too

And Heresy XD

[cyan oxide]

Yea

I stopped at guns of tanith

[lavish quarry]

the heresy books are kinda nice tho

[cyan oxide]

And I just finished cains last stand

[odd palm]

Fair, I haven’t started and I’m hesitant to.
People say the first three or four are solid and then quality varies as much as the heresy

[odd palm]

Definitely, fleshes out legions and characters. Which is nice, but has unfortunately only served to double down on the SM focus

[lavish quarry]

sm?

[cyan oxide]

Space marines

[lavish quarry]

ohh yeah i am a sanguinuis fan but goddam they kinda made him go too nuts in my opinion

[coarse mirage]

I liked the Deathwatch: Shadowbreaker book

[cyan oxide]

Space marines are kinda boring to me because they don’t have much room in terms of character development

[coarse mirage]

it's Deathwatch vs Tau

[lavish quarry]

tho they kinda made me seee ultramarines in better eyes i kept seeing them with all the memes about them

[odd palm]

Same, it’s a solid read and especially for the audiobook version. Really cheap

[coarse mirage]

Yeah I have the audio one

[odd palm]

Admittedly most of those memes are from what?….4th or 5th Ed

[coarse mirage]

And that comic where Calgar rips the head of a Khorne daemon engine with his hands

[odd palm]

True, though iirc some of that is purposely explained as dramatised for propaganda

[atomic pelican]

Marines troubles are basically all in books and non-tt media. Loyalists have always been kind of a middle army, or if current, garbage

[odd palm]

Unless a supp drops

XD

[atomic pelican]

Even then

[crisp heath]

That lord of skulls didn’t deserve that

[coarse mirage]

Lukas the Trickster is also a neat book

[cyan oxide]

This chat basically became the book club hasn’t it

[odd palm]

I’ll take your word for it. The Vylka don’t interest me in the slightest tbh

Somewhat

[crisp heath]

Maybe

[odd palm]

I’d like to see the Elysians and Harakoni get a novel or two each. With a focus on their worlds culture and doctrinal differences so as to better differentiate them from one another tbh

I’ll cling onto these hopes and likely not see them come true

[cyan oxide]

Do you guys think that the camo cloaks the tanith used were just normal camouflage or were they chameleon cloaks that adapted to the environment

[odd palm]

Likely Cameoline

[copper cliff]

Likely Coraline

[odd palm]

It’s common place

[grizzled grove]

so, found out about a Grey Knights weapon called a "Psilencer". the concept of a gun designed for use by psykers is cool and all, and something I would probably want to see in DT in some other form, but how do the Grey Knights justify using xeno technology?

[cyan oxide]

The fact that they are top secret and if you know about grey knight you just die anyway

[odd palm]

Cope?
I mean few are off limits when they are essentially you’re last option to kill chaos.

When you’re desperate enough and the situation warrants even a single GK, you don’t want to hamstring them with the usual Imperium bs

[atomic pelican]

Alot of the Imperium uses xenos tech now

Basically half of Cawl's innovations are based on aeldari works

Reavers and marine hover tanks iirc

[dusk patrol]

The Imperium doesn’t really care as much as people think

[atomic pelican]

Its not all that rare, just covered up

Yea

[dusk patrol]

It’s just you have to go through the channels

The whole “never innovates” thing just isn’t really true

They just do it slow

There’s processes to it

[rustic spruce]

what keeps the hive mind from transmitting adaptations to tyranids all across the galaxy, how come they seem to be relegated to specific fleets.

[dusk patrol]

And approvals

Like the ships have evolved a shitton over the millennia

[cyan oxide]

And when it’s grey knights they are basically inquisitors and can literally kill anyone asking too many questions

[dusk patrol]

Also they just take every advantage they get

And ain’t nobody gonna notice anyways

It’s not like it says “Made in Xenosland” on the side of their gun

[grizzled grove]

I know the Psyker class definitely won't get a Psilencer themselves but I do wonder if there's any other imperial psi-based gun in existence that they can use

[dusk patrol]

Psicannons

But they probably won’t get those either

[copper cliff]

Its mostly a system of inefficiency occasionally with hints pragmatism. Fragmented bureaucracy makes it hard to document who is doing the heresy and its usually a case by case basis who gets fucked. Which makes sense. Even the Rejects in Darktide seem to get a lot of punishments that are just wrong place wrong time.

[dusk patrol]

Those are like, Inquisitor only type guns

Inquisitors or Grey Knights

Also they one shot literally almost anything

They don’t care about armor or any of that shit

Only some of the most powerful daemons and shit shrug off the shots

[copper cliff]

The whole point of the Inquisition, irl and in 40k, is that its unfair and will contradict itself constantly because its about oppression not fulfilling the fake propaganda they themselves spread.

[cyan oxide]

Besides giving warp based weapons to normal people is prime real estate for chaos to seed

[copper cliff]

You're a criminal because the Inquisitor said so. 🫵

[dusk patrol]

Doesn’t matter if you’re a criminal

[cyan oxide]

Well to be fair in 40k it makes sense in a way

[dusk patrol]

Their authority is unlimited

Doesn’t have to be a justification even

[copper cliff]

One of the guard backstories for how they got arrested is they moved out of the way but not fast enough

[cyan oxide]

Someone may not know that what they are doing can cause a chaos incursion and if an inquisitor finds it what are they supposed to do? Explain chaos to the person?

[copper cliff]

Problem is for every 1 near chaos incursion there's a billion said something the Inquisitor didn't like

[dusk patrol]

I suspect there’s a reason most of the backstories have a similar theme of being petty reasons

In that the Inquisitor chose them for those reasons

[dusk patrol]

That’s an exaggeration tbh

[cyan oxide]

Besides the back stories seem to be that the punishment wasn’t from the inquisition but another authority

[dusk patrol]

Like it’s definitely unfair and innocents get fucked over but Inquisitors do have to show results

[cyan oxide]

The inquisition just emptied every prison they could find for man power

[copper cliff]

Yes. Because the Imperium is an exaggeration of a fascist empire. Your life and death are constantly in the hands and whims of the authority.

[dusk patrol]

Or they get their ass canned by other members of their ordo

It’s like how Exterminatus are super rare

And most Inquisitors or authorities who sanction one are investigated and executed for it

There’s a whole ordo around them who investigate them

[cyan oxide]

Reminder that exterminatus is an absolute last resort and when one inquisitor did it too much they got excommunicated

[copper cliff]

Also didn't mean to specify inquisition but just general authoritative punishment.

[dusk patrol]

They have like a 90% rate of prosecution

[arctic talon]

Inquisitor darkhammer lmao

Is another exterminatus happy

Idiot

[dusk patrol]

Dark hammer is the Inquisitor stereotype though

That is true

[copper cliff]

Not to mention everyone who got to skip the lane for punishment and were just executed on the spot

[dusk patrol]

Sure

[orchid acorn]

It's not facist. Highly authoritarian, theological, xenophobic and a dystopia sure, but I can't think of a single example of it interacting with corporations. Or corporations even existing in the imperium.

[dusk patrol]

It’s not fair, but it’s also not as exaggerated as people make it out

[copper cliff]

You just described fascism lol

[dusk patrol]

Words don’t mean anything anymore

No one will ever agreed what fascism means ever again

[orchid acorn]

The imperium is a totalitarian theological state, if anything. It's really not facist, any more than it's capitalist or communist

[cyan oxide]

The term fascist is so misunderstood and over used. Most of the time when people say they mean to say totalitarian

[crisp heath]

space feudalism

[atomic pelican]

I'm sure there's some word spaghetti HOI4 ideology that covers it(and has never existed)

[barren tapir]

Fascist term is used as how anglos use it, which mean it is used as totalitarian state that crush everything that want to get out of its grasp, if you are using the term for what actually mean then it is clear that you will not accept that the imperium is considered fascist by english speakers

[copper cliff]

1. Cult of tradition ✅
2. Rejection of Modernism ✅
3. Cult of Action ✅
4. Disagreement is Treason ✅
5. Fear of Difference ✅
6. Appeal to Frustrated middle class 🤔 eh not really, no more middle class when everyone is lower class!
7. Obsession with a plot ✅
8. Enemy is too strong and too weak ✅
9. Pacifism is trafficking with the enemy ✅
10. Contempt for the Weak ✅
11. Everybody is educated to become a hero ✅
12. Machismo ✅
13. Selective Populism ✅
14. Newspeak 🤔 Idk if speaking in cryptic gothic counts

[orchid acorn]

"Everybody I don't like is Hitler, and everything bad is fascist" yes.
re: Silver, yes I'm using it's actual definition because I am a pendatic bugger.

[crisp heath]

you pedantic bugger you

[orchid acorn]

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fascism
a political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition

[atomic pelican]

The Imperiun matches Umberto Eco's definition of fascism from A practical list for identifying fascists

[orchid acorn]

It's got fascist elements, absolutely. It is not a fascist government though, the relegion is way too deeply imbedded.

[atomic pelican]

There have been fascist governments with religion involved.

[copper cliff]

A political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition

Literally describing the Imperium

Stands for is the operative term, because although the Imperium is fragmented it stands for an autocratic government headed by the dictatorial leader, the Emperor

[atomic pelican]

The catholic church supported franco

[cyan oxide]

Theocratic feudalistic oligarchy is probably the best to explain the imperium as a whole

[atomic pelican]

HOI4 ideologies lets go

[cerulean wagon]

A quick reminder this server has a rule on no politics

[barren tapir]

The catholic church supported pretty much all extreme right governments of WW2 in europe

[cyan oxide]

Because each individual planet is left to operate as they please as long as they follow general rules and pay taxes

[dusk patrol]

The important thing is, it’s not a very cash money regime

[orchid acorn]

hint taken, back to arguing over power armour

[crisp heath]

space marines...

[dusk patrol]

It’s totalitarian, and whatever other ism you don’t like

[crisp heath]

are cool

[dusk knot]

orks are cooler

[copper cliff]

Well I have nothing else to contribute anyway.

I've cited both the academic understanding and general understanding and they both describe the Imperium. Sometimes it hurts to be this much of a right opinion haver.

Orks are definitely superior

[crisp heath]

imperial guard are cooler

[copper cliff]

I say we cook da emprah

[dusk knot]

they ain't even got the shootiest shootas

[copper cliff]

Imperial guard have to get their weapons manufactured, Orks just throw metal at people in various configurations. Chad ork vs virgin guard

[crisp heath]

you tellin me a baneblade aint the shootiest shoota

[dusk knot]

if it so shooty why didn't they weld two of them together

[dusk patrol]

They do

[grizzled grove]

orks are symbolik of everythin' good 'bout foutyk!

[dusk knot]

like a propper zappa

[crisp heath]

what if

[dusk patrol]

Baneblades have an absurd amount of variants

[crisp heath]

we take two emperor class titans, and we duct tape them together

[orchid acorn]

never get to see them in games though

[odd tulip]

The new Shadowsword profile is damage twelve

that's pretty damn shooty

[dusk knot]

but is it choppy?

[crisp heath]

a chainax is proper choppy

[odd tulip]

They got an improved weaponskill. So, a little, I guess

[dusk knot]

tape a choppa to it

[orchid acorn]

All I remember about shadowswords is how they never hit the bloody targets in Final Liberation.

[atomic pelican]

Most accurate to guard ballistic skill

[crisp heath]

accuracy via volume

wheres my meme about the convict guard squad getting 120 shots in a single shooting phase at

[odd tulip]

The shadowsword also benefits from the +1 to hit with turret weapons rule despite, y'know, not being on a turret

[atomic pelican]

Is it not?

Hang on I have to see this thing

Oh I see

[odd tulip]

Yeah it's hull mounted haha

[atomic pelican]

It's a funny meme

I've seen the conscript blob kill a GUO by itself

[crisp heath]

lol

[atomic pelican]

but I've also oneshotted the officer with them and caused someone to RQ with a sanctus

Since guard HQs drop like flies

[crisp heath]

i watched one of my friends guard squad melee kill a hive tyrant in a single phase

funniest shit ive ever seen

[copper cliff]

Death by a thousand angry kicks

[scenic bolt]

just flagging you that that rule got deleted

[atomic pelican]

Oh wait it did LMAO

Not that it matters but

[copper cliff]

Politic allowed now? 😈

[atomic pelican]

Women

[scenic bolt]

I've brought it up a couple times since the rules update last month

[copper cliff]

Not to get political, but I think I am Alpharius and idk what to do.

[crisp heath]

stop doing that

[copper cliff]

The most political gender of all

[scenic bolt]

politics is back on the menu boys.png

[dusk patrol]

I see we’re being cringe today

[celest dome]

You too might be Alpharius without knowing it

[copper cliff]

You'll never catch men going to the polls 🫵

[sonic valley]

I came for my lore chat and I never saw lore 😦

[snow fern]

Memes aside Alpha Legion is just traitor right?

[copper cliff]

🙃

[atomic pelican]

Yeah pretty much

[snow fern]

It really isn't that simple?

[copper cliff]

[atomic pelican]

There's really no big conspiracy with them, they're basically just traitors who use misinfo and such to their aid

I mean yeah there's conspiracy to them but it's not rlly as high as ppl think

[sonic valley]

Wasnt the Alpha legion involved in the Badab war?

[copper cliff]

Until 40k endtimes when Alpharius is like no actually I was a spy teehee

[cerulean wagon]

still a no politics rule in place, this aint the server for it

[copper cliff]

It would be a real GW move to do that but we'll never know cause 40k end times never happens as long as the plastic keeps pouring!

[storm jungle]

They are traitors yeah.

People just want to joke that they are not.

They have not helped the Imperium once since the Heresy

[odd palm]

If the AL wasn’t directly involved in the badab war, then they likely had agents involved/observing

[copper cliff]

And Malekith didn't help Ulthuan once since the fall.

[odd palm]

If they have helped, it’s purely by happen chance

[scenic bolt]

you mean grimdank has been lying to me this whole time???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

Why would they do that

[snow fern]

Him turning the dwarfs on the High Elves is still one of the craziest events in fantasy.

[storm jungle]

https://tenor.com/view/disappointed-snapped-sad-gif-22165289

[crisp heath]

theyre ontologically evil

[atomic pelican]

WHAT? YOU MEAN PEOPLE ON THE INTERNET GET 40K LORE WRONG? ON GRIMDANK?

Impossible

[storm jungle]

Literally half of the disasters on warhammer fantasy can be blamed on Morathi

[lavish silo]

It's impossible to get 40k lore wrong

[copper cliff]

Are you saying Krieg aren't funni shovel men who commit suicide?

[snow fern]

you mean 1d4 chan isn't the most accurate source of 40k info?!?!?!

[fierce pendant]

I still like the Asuryan basically fucking with him more.

No you were worthy I just burned you for being a dick lmao

Obviously retconned but

[celest dome]

I mean, the High Elves had plenty of ways to defuse the war, they chose their own death, Malekith might have been the instigator but still they were dumbasses

[copper cliff]

GUYS IT WAS A JOKE STOP TALKING ABOUT END TIMES ELVES

PLEASE

[celest dome]

It was ?

[lavish silo]

In the grimdark of the future, there is no canon, only fanfic

[fierce pendant]

retconned as in original stuff where he was considered unworthy.

And then turned into that he was worthy for end times.

mb with the wording

[scenic bolt]

live by the retcon, die by the retcon

[copper cliff]

He was worthy to start bitch slapping Tyrion

[celest dome]

I'm more confused

Was he always worthy or not ?

I know the other weren't as they used protections

[scenic bolt]

prior to endtimes he wasnt worthy, endtimes changed that

[fierce pendant]

^

[scenic bolt]

cause they needed a narrative twist for every faction

[fierce pendant]

End times rewrote it

ye

End times added the bit with others needing healing magic/protection to pass the trial

[thorny turtle]

Alpha legion is helping the imperium free of sanity, so kind and gracious.

[lavish silo]

Was there any kind of 40k 'endtimes'?

[celest dome]

Not really

[fierce pendant]

I mean 40k's TT didn't suck a fat dick so no.

[odd palm]

20th legion propagandist spotted. Pfp confirms this yes I am a highly competent detective.

[scenic bolt]

era indomitus is a pseudo endtimes, they lean into while still pumping the brake cause they intend to keep the setting mostly

[fierce pendant]

Yeah but it's not like, a hard reset.

[thorny turtle]

I am not a 20th legion propagandist |this is a lie|

[odd palm]

[scenic bolt]

cadia blew up, eye of terror expanded across galaxy, but largely the status quo is in effect

[odd palm]

I am convinced

[atomic pelican]

I think this was originally the full intent tbh. Or atleast some bigger reset of sorts. But fundamentally nothing has really changed

[odd palm]

Mmm, enough of a shake up to warrant a progression in the story without really changing much

[atomic pelican]

Yee

[dusk patrol]

Idk there’s been a lot of major changes

Like obviously factions aren’t gonna be wiped out

[snow fern]

squats

[dusk patrol]

But there’s a lot of cutoff factions

[dusk patrol]

They weren’t wiped out

[arctic talon]

Squats are in munda

[snow fern]

They were until last April

[thorny turtle]

I mean, all that is needed is for the necrons to close the eye of terror

[arctic talon]

No they weren’t

Necromunda

[dusk patrol]

They still existed

[arctic talon]

They had minis

[dusk patrol]

Just in a

Smaller

Way

[arctic talon]

And also still existed in lore yeah

[dusk patrol]

Heh

Minis

Cause they’re small

Get it

[snow fern]

Necrons cutting off the warp kills anything with a soul

[dusk patrol]

Yeah it’s not cash money for the rest of us

[thorny turtle]

perfect, thats what they want anyways

[fierce pendant]

[thorny turtle]

Why doesn't the imperium just paint their planets purple?

[stuck kindle]

Purple is slaanesh color

[odd palm]

Because Ork logic doesn’t always work XD

And that’s a meme

[thorny turtle]

Ork logic is the best kinda logic

[snow fern]

purple orks is a meme

Ork snipers is real though, the Inquisition says so

[thorny turtle]

pretty sure there were ork snipers in Helsreach book

well they were mentioned for a few moments

[storm jungle]

We got an ork kommando with a sniper now

[snow fern]

Nah Slaannesh is Pepto-Bismol colored like that corruption Morathi spreads all over the damn map in TWW3

God Dork Elves are annoying

[thorny turtle]

all elves are annoying

[arctic talon]

tbf it is a full auto gun

but yes it is a "sniper"

[stuck kindle]

Pink is one shade from purple. Close enough

[storm jungle]

dwarf user spotted

[dusk patrol]

GW was nice enough to offer two Ork models for Warhammer+

[dusk patrol]

An Ork Warboss and an Ork Sniper

[storm jungle]

THERE HE IS

[arctic talon]

its a scoped big shoota

[thorny turtle]

I feel like the Imperium would invest in tricking orks into thinking purple makes things invisible, makes sense to me

[storm jungle]

OH

[snow fern]

How is a scoped rifle a sniper?

[storm jungle]

😔

[arctic talon]

Because its used as a sniper

lol

Its stull a fucking heavy machine gun

but the Ork is using it like a sniper

[storm jungle]

Call of Duty Vanguard Moment

[snow fern]

I used a scoped PKP to snipe recon players back in BF3, that ain't no sniper rifle!!!!

[arctic talon]

tbd

Tbf

a browning machine gun

[quaint sparrow]

You see those rounds and that scope? its basically firing giant slugs

[arctic talon]

can be used as a sniper lol

So an ork using their big shoota

as a sniper isn't that weird

[thorny turtle]

artillery cannons are just large sniper rifles

[snow fern]

Missiles are just tactical sniper rounds

[arctic talon]

but the scoped big shoota

[quaint sparrow]

You say this, but have you ever seen a purple ork? No? exactly

[arctic talon]

is like

used as a sniper

the Kommando is literally called a Snipa Boy

in the rules

[thorny turtle]

I've never seen a purple ork because they're invisible

duh

[quaint sparrow]

a marksman rifle would likely be a better term than a sniper

[thorny turtle]

Yarrick will become the third ork god now that he has died

[arctic talon]

yeah prolly

[thin crescent]

Gork, Mork, and York

[arctic talon]

Ol bale eye

[quaint sparrow]

but what about the forgotten Bork

And Zork!

[thin crescent]

Meh, I guess we can throw Bork and bone.

[vapid solstice]

so whats your favorite part of the lore of the all guardsman party

[snow fern]

they almost survived if not for the vile Spawn they encountered

[thorny turtle]

Nah, Trazyn kidnapped them right before they got smooshed

And you know he would do something like that too, so you cant deny it

[vapid solstice]

pff, there was no spawn

i hope

i have not read the latest, i hear the author is posting on t witter though

[thorny turtle]

So, has the whole city fallen or is it just the sub-levels?

Because I want to see a final mission where they call exterminatus, but the bomb fails and they have to go manually set it off

[timid latch]

for the emperor

[storm jungle]

Just a majority of the underhive

at the moment at least

[crisp heath]

for now...

[thorny turtle]

Sounds like a good enough sacrifice to just blow the whole hive up

[timid latch]

naw that would be a bad idea tbh cus its the biggist one on the planet

[crisp heath]

some worlds are too important to just blow up for a cult infiltration

[thorny turtle]

Yeah, but once a cult takes root there is no getting rid of it, especially if its at a point where hordes of nurgle worshipers are about

Better to just burn it all

[crisp heath]

cant doom the other hives because one fell

also you can still reclaim what was lost

[thorny turtle]

With all that pox and disease laying around?

[crisp heath]

it an still burn

*can

[odd palm]

A cult can still be removed, regardless of its grip upon a planet. It ultimately depends how much blood the Imperium is willing to spend and the quality of blood too

[thorny turtle]

Khorne flakes sitting there all smug like knowing he wins no matter what

[odd palm]

True

[thin crescent]

Hot Take: Big E is Khorne.

[thorny turtle]

Khorne was Alpharius all along

[cyan oxide]

the story here seems like they kinda wrote off the planet and are willing to blow it up if need be but someone wants to make a half assed attempt at saving it using the rejects

[thorny turtle]

that makes more sense

[cyan oxide]

or maybe any overt action on this cult could cause massive civil unrest across the sector due to being such an important planet so no major gaurd units can be used and they dont have enough storm troopers to deal with it so why not bolster the storm troopers with cannon fodder and if some prove useful so be it

[mossy mortar]

nobody knows

[rustic spruce]

How do space hulks form

[mossy mortar]

ships lost in the warp tend to accumulate through mysterious warp processes

Especially since some are ancient megaships with long lost technology and warp drives

[rustic spruce]

How come tyranids like to set up shop on space hulks so much

[dusk patrol]

It’s mostly genestealers

But it’s a good way to get around

[celest dome]

Survivor of Tyranid battle flees, Tyranid stow aways wake up and roam around on the ship being lost

[dusk patrol]

Their goal is to infiltrate all corners of the galaxy and shit

[mossy mortar]

it's not that common, but when it happens man is it memorable

[cyan oxide]

orks like space hulks too

[rustic spruce]

I mean orks will set up shop in an asteroid if it’s hollow enough

[snow fern]

Which is your favorite, the Pope making an all women’s army because of a legal loophole, or a Mechanicus ambassador bringing a titan to negotiations

[copper cliff]

Id like to picture the mechanicus negotiation via bullhorn while standing on top of the titan.

[rustic spruce]

When did cawl get into the whole omnissiah thing

[cyan oxide]

insert get out of the tank meme but with a titain

[dusk patrol]

It’s basically how it went down

[arctic talon]

Since he was born technically

He was born into the cult mechanicus

So he’s always worshipped the omnissiah

[cyan oxide]

vat grown in fact

[celest dome]

Was Cawl a Vat grown ? Don't remember that

[rustic spruce]

The cult mechanicus was allowed to exist under the emperor?

[arctic talon]

Yes he was

[celest dome]

Yes

[cyan oxide]

he was seperated due to him being diffrent from the other vat grown

[arctic talon]

Yes

If the emperor needed to crush the cult mechanicus

It would have taken too much time

And he needed Mars

And the mechanicum

[celest dome]

And cost to much

[arctic talon]

To provide war material

For the great crusade

[cyan oxide]

yes only because it would be too difficult to get rid of them as they had the big weapons

[dusk patrol]

Mars needed the Imperium as much as the Imperium needed them too

Same with Saturn

It was a mutual agreement

They all had something they each needed

[arctic talon]

But if we’re talking when Cawl started to like

Call himself a prime conduit of the omnissiah

Like

Prolly when he became an arch magos

[thorny turtle]

I wouldn't say it was mutual, safe to say the emperor would have just obliterated the mechanicus if they declined, at least thats the way it sounded when I read mechanicum

[cyan oxide]

to lean more of cawls past read "the great work"

[arctic talon]

The mechanicum would have been destroyed but at a pretty big cost to the growing imperium

They’d lose a chunk of the production facilities on mars

[crisp heath]

a few space hulks are very old human ships used to colonize the galaxy before ftl travel was created

[arctic talon]

And also the fact that there’s no one to like

Maintain and use them anymore

[cyan oxide]

prolly would have delayed the great crusade by a century or more

[crisp heath]

mans really didnt want to fight all the titans

[snow fern]

The emperor being reasonable? Doesn’t sound like him.

[arctic talon]

Lol

It was more of a

He’s on a time crunch

So it would be illogical

[thorny turtle]

big e seemed pretty cool when he was in the "Legion" book

[dusk patrol]

Ad Mech debated nuking Terra before they arrived

It was mutual

The Ad Mech got a shitton of benefits from the deal

They were able to reclaim their forge worlds and get dibs on STCs

As well as maintain their autonomy within the Imperium

Which basically no one else got

[thorny turtle]

The fabricator general claimed it was forced 🤷‍♂️

[dusk patrol]

It was forced in that he didn’t want it

But a lot of the Ad Mech did

[thorny turtle]

Yeah

[dusk patrol]

He was also a dipshit who was only mad because there was some tech they weren’t allowed to touch

And when he did try, he got infected and corrupted to high hell

[thorny turtle]

heck*

[dusk patrol]

It was “forced” in that it was gonna cause a schism on mars if he didn’t agreed

[thorny turtle]

yes

[dusk patrol]

Since a lot of the Ad Mech wanted it

[storm jungle]

what did you expect from a guy called Kelbor Hal 9000

[dusk patrol]

He does have good drip though I won’t lie

[odd palm]

Indeed

[dusk patrol]

Him before he started vaping Chaos code

[arctic talon]

What chaos does to a mf’er

[odd palm]

I was expecting…..more chonk. But I suppose that became the norm post heresy. Turning yourself into a server room

[dusk patrol]

And here’s some fun fanart of a theoretical 40k version of him

Since we’ve never properly learned his fate, just that he got away after the Siege broke

Cause he’s a lil bitch

Didn’t wanna go toe to toe with Land after he lost his monkey

[odd palm]

XD

I mean he is after all the true fabricator general. His life and knowledge is surely to valuable to be lost for a petty squabble between father and sons

[dusk patrol]

But in all seriousness I wouldn’t be shocked if he becomes an HQ for the potential dark mechanicus faction that they’ve tease

Since it’s very possible that he still alive

[dusk patrol]

Well I mean he did do that whole thing where he tore mars a part irrevocably lost a shit ton of technology titans their greatest scientists and all that because he was an idiot that let Horace play him like a fiddle and infect him on the first date with a Space STD

[thorny turtle]

You get your STC test results back and find out he gave you scrap code smh

[odd palm]

What ego does to a mf. Especially one with such power and influence.

As far as I know there isn’t a Mars equivalent currently for the Dark Mech. Granted I know almost nothing about them.

[dusk patrol]

Yeah they haven’t been expanded on much Thurs I think one or two Forge roads in the eye that maybe you could point to as being that but there really isn’t a single one just because of how little they’ve been expanded on but that’ll probably change soon hopefully

I hope he is alive though, the dynamic of him claiming himself as the real Fabricator-General of Mars is a fun one

Plus I mean

What the hell must he look like by now

[jade crest]

What does corpse starch taste like?

[dusk patrol]

Probably pork

If we’re going by how human tastes like

[odd palm]

Hopefully. If they do decide to give the Dark Mech some love, having Kelbor return running ‘new mars’ name pending would be interesting.

Maybe he’s spent the past 10k years gathering power and influence maybe in a way not to dissimilar to Vect

[dusk patrol]

He’s similar to Cawl too in how long they’ve been around

[odd palm]

Indeed

[dusk patrol]

Which is a rare dynamic for chaos and the Imperium

[odd palm]

Though compared to Cawl, who until his book was a nobody in the lore. Kelbor has been given some tid bits of development throughout the heresy

[woven ermine]

ayo the grey knights are pretty resistant to chaos ye? how come the primarchs werent so resistant, for example fulgrim falling to the blades influence? could a grey knight resist it?

[storm jungle]

Because grey knights lore is more or so pretty mary sue

their geneseed is from the emperor himself somehow and they take a hilarious amount of precaution against corruption, down to putting subdermal anti-daemon wards under their flesh

[woven ermine]

damn they hardcore

[storm jungle]

Yeah they basically take every precaution avaliable but its also a mix of big plot armor.

[woven ermine]

if u had a ship with only nulls (for example full of sisters of silence), would you need a gellar field for travelling through the warp?

[storm jungle]

Yep you would.

at the end of the day daemons could still board it and attempt to kill the nulls

[woven ermine]

sadge

yo what would happen if you got that one tyranid that evolved to eat souls, you put him on a ship, ship jumps into warpspace, would it consume a shitton of daemons?

[celest dome]

First question is would it be able to evolve a Tyr to consume souls

[woven ermine]

there was one that ate the infinity circuit of a craftworld wasnt there?

[celest dome]

But it didn't become able to eat peoples souls iirc

[woven ermine]

https://warhammer40k.fandom.com/wiki/Doom_of_Malan'tai

[celest dome]

Do people not know the power level of Grail Knight compared to SM or something ? VT2/DT related

[woven ermine]

oh so it only eats eldars?

[mossy mortar]

The funny thing is how they pull it off lol

[odd palm]

Well you can’t really consume a daemons soul that belongs to a chaos god.
Likely said Tyranid would be torn to pieces in a fairly rapid fashion

[celest dome]

Ah i was wrong

[mossy mortar]

Like, somehow Grey Knights doesn't seem that cheesy

[thorny turtle]

yo mamma so fat that her null field covers a whole fleet -guardsmen

[celest dome]

But can it take biomass out of it

[odd palm]

Biomass out of?

[storm jungle]

Basically medieval doomguy

[celest dome]

Souls/Warp stuff

[storm jungle]

Can die to conventional means but can also kill things half his size

[uneven temple]

He can kill things half his size? What a bully

[storm jungle]

😔

[odd palm]

If it’s in the materium, yes as it has been given flesh in most cases.

Within the immaterium no, because it’s just warp energy, no real biomass

[storm jungle]

its mostly peasants

[minor lance]

If you're referring to Kruber, it's hinted that he's only recently been given the gifts and hasn't learned the full extend of them. Also, power curve flattening

[celest dome]

But comparing a GK to the other VT2 member compared to a SM to one of the Rejects archetypes

Some are arguing that GK in VT mean SM in DT could work

[storm jungle]

Lmao no

[mossy mortar]

So can i

[storm jungle]

at the end of the day a GK is still a human

[celest dome]

Maybe you are a Grail Knight

[storm jungle]

Marines would just be playing the Ogryn

but you use astartes weapons

no big difference, peeps are just needy

[thorny turtle]

ogryn getting bolters 🙂

[mossy mortar]

The rejects in game are like marines in lore

[storm jungle]

Pretty much

they kill hundreds of cultists akin to a Special Character

[minor lance]

I'm against SMs for a variety of reasons, but GKs are... I mean, they... Are human... Mostly? Like, biologically, sure. But there's a lot more to humanity than biology, ewspecially in WHF.

[storm jungle]

Yeah like i said they are just humans enhanced with grail magic

so its like

a super weird comparison

[minor lance]

I mean, SMs are humans enhanced with genetic augmentation and bionics.

[storm jungle]

Magic =/= Biology

[minor lance]

Again, I don't support SMs in DT. And VT2 was a different situation

[storm jungle]

at the end of the day not the same thing

[mossy mortar]

SM may involve light magic too

But just a tiny bit

[minor lance]

Ehhhh, they're... Close enough in the sense of power.

[storm jungle]

its a bit like comparing a Stormvermin to a Kasrkin

[minor lance]

Like, GKs aren't fantasy SMs

But as far as power levels go, and the whole 1-man-army thing

They're a pretty apt comparison

[storm jungle]

Thats the idea yes.

[minor lance]

Yeah that's really all I'm sayin'

[mossy mortar]

Isn't a grail knight more like a living saint in 40k?

Well i guess living saints are rarer

[minor lance]

Nah, GKs can get deaded pretty hard.

[woven ermine]

yo, the emperor came about by 1000 perpetuals merging, the imperium is so much bigger now, wouldnt then there be much more perpetuals now?

[minor lance]

The Green Knight is a living saint equivalent

[mossy mortar]

Living saints can die too

[storm jungle]

Perpetuals are super specific humans

they arent around anymore

[minor lance]

Also, I guess Grombrindal counts as a living saint

[mossy mortar]

That's ancient lore and they were shaman spirits

[celest dome]

I'm taking Grail Knight = Sister of Battle more than I take GK = SM to be honest

[woven ermine]

is it no longer canon?

[mossy mortar]

Perpetuals were made up by Abnett but they are a riff on the old Sensei lore

There's no canon on the origins of the emperor

Besides that he is very old

[minor lance]

Not at all. That'd be... Actually it's a hard comparisson to make.

SoB fantasy equivalent uhhh...

Pilgrims?