hivescum-class

[upbeat gyro]

My Darktide play time has like 200-300 hours of bloat in there

[solemn thorn]

that darktide hours?

[upbeat gyro]

As back in 2023-2024 i left the game on the check the shop every 1h

Before itemization changed

[solemn thorn]

:),

[reef spoke]

still in Uprising UwU

[upbeat gyro]

I wish i had the time to rack up way more hours than i currently do

[solemn thorn]

yep yep

[upbeat gyro]

👶 💀

[solemn thorn]

played alot when the game came out and even more when the talent tree update and now just everynow and then

[solemn thorn]

one skin i really want from the game and that is a red blood skin for the knife

[dull dagger]

Man I can't tell when my stimm is ready to use again.

How do I set up curios for my Hive Scum?

[mighty belfry]

at least two toughness curios

or, maximum meme

go all stamina

[solemn thorn]

2 different mods for it

one is better than the other

[solemn thorn]

all stamina is always the way

[abstract nexus]

what does the switch mode on the needle pistol do?

[tardy cedar]

the blue causes targets to explode

[abstract nexus]

how about the default?

[weary knoll]

less toxin on hit target but do aoe explosion when target dies

different mark has different explosion effect

[weary knoll]

sadly they are same
although they are different Mk

[tardy cedar]

the default is more for single trget dott damage

[abstract nexus]

okay thank you! do you guys have a list of general effects to disable on disable sceen effects mod?

[dull dagger]

2 toughness 1 stamina then? What perks?

[solemn thorn]

sprint efficiency

gotta go real fast

[low harbor]

Toughness, health, stamina
Gunner x2
Toughness x3
Health x2
Last 2 whatever u want

[solemn thorn]

dont need gunner if you dont get hit nor let them hit you

by the time they released your existence they are already dead and that thought was from another gunner across the map

[dire badge]

We should be able to wall jump and do a flip 😔

[jagged latch]

Chem gernade nerfed </3

[dull dagger]

Oh snap, patch?

[jagged latch]

literally just as i logged off

Seems like a buff

lowkey kinda massive

devs lowkey said "you can have .05s more dodge time than psyker"

[dull dagger]

‘Rampage!’ no longer makes the player “exhausted” after use, the ability now simply ends.

[limber cradle]

No pickpocket changes?

[dull dagger]

This is how you get ants.

[limber cradle]

Nah rampage buff goated

[jagged latch]

Just the first change seems absolutely goated in terms of viablity

[limber cradle]

If SG simply gets to exist so should ramp

[jagged latch]

they also made unload refresh so they are just making hive scum overall more active i guess?

[compact oyster]

A shame

[limber cradle]

Yeah no pickpocket nerfs

Insanity lol.

[dull dagger]

I'm not complaining I love shooting guns.

Pew pew.

[spark gyro]

I saw the thing

You guys saw the thing too

[limber cradle]

I mean i expected them cause its horrifically op

But I'm not complaining

[spark gyro]

Rampage chads stay winning

[low harbor]

I don’t think this actually makes melee hvs’s ceiling that much higher

But floor is way higher than before

[compact oyster]

I wouldnt say melee scum ie that op

Its quite balanced due to the weapons

[limber cradle]

Tbqh with you I just think it was unjustified to give rampage nerfs while SG exists as it does

The ceiling is obviously unchanged

[compact oyster]

Ranged scum is very opressive tho

[limber cradle]

But you're not detrimented now

[dreamy rover]

The rampage changes!

[limber cradle]

It'll make rampage feel better which is nice

[dreamy rover]

I had to stim to fight off the negative effects.

[limber cradle]

I think this is simply overall scum buffs which is crazy

[jagged latch]

Toxin build is now marginally more useful

[limber cradle]

My fellow drug addicts I believe we are winning

[dreamy rover]

I might have to get that toughness penance now.

[compact oyster]

Toxin build was on par with ranged

[jagged latch]

Idk tho they kinda like, orboburus'd it and now it seems like chem and pocket are going to be run together

[low harbor]

Channeled aggression buff gud
Makes swords more viable on hvs

[limber cradle]

Meta build ran pick with everything anyway

[jagged latch]

more so they just let you dump a bunch of stacks early with pocket

[limber cradle]

Glad one class gets to use them

[jagged latch]

exactly

Im glad the fix here was "make hive scum consume even more grenades"

[compact oyster]

Now we just need a chainglaive

[dull dagger]

What's dump stat on braced auto?

Oh probably mobility.

[dreamy rover]

Playtesters: "No"

[dull dagger]

Didn't notice it had mobility.

[compact oyster]

Why would playtesters decide that?

Its up to GW

[dreamy rover]

Looking at the pool of weapons each class has. They decide quite of bit of stuff.

Remember the enlarged poxburster radius that slipped through?

[limber cradle]

No pp nerfs genuinely crazy to me, infinite ammo lives on

[jagged latch]

Ew okay so now dependecy tank build can kinda exist because uptime > cooldown now with regain

[low harbor]

No dependency change either yikes

[limber cradle]

Yk what

Good

Fuck psyker

They need competition

[compact oyster]

Youd really think playtester decide a bigger radius?

[low harbor]

Not by making another class as op lol

[dreamy rover]

"It slipped through"

[low harbor]

They need direct proper nerfs

[jagged latch]

Eh

They need to change enemies

DoT should be normalized and nerf as a whole

[dull dagger]

Do I gotta change my builds now.

[compact oyster]

Fatshark implements things independantly from playtesters

[limber cradle]

Yeah well, apparently they're getting it via scum op

[jagged latch]

God

2 psykers bubble walking with 2 hive scum max tank

[low harbor]

I don’t think melee hvs at the same level as psyker tbh

Ranged hvs is psyker tier tho

[jagged latch]

Its kinda hard to fight infinite cleave + insane amps

[limber cradle]

Agreed, and it isnt getting touched

[low harbor]

No, it got buffed actually

Unload got buffed

[limber cradle]

Aye, thats what I'm saying

[jagged latch]

oh hell

bubble tank build is actually insane you can just eat damage for entire stim and after bubble breaks you can eat an entire pox auric

[limber cradle]

I think this is uh

Indicative of future dt balance

[jagged latch]

I mean fuck it right

[limber cradle]

Or lack thereof

[jagged latch]

let everyone be psyker

[dreamy rover]

So tanky scum is going to be a thing now?

[low harbor]

It’s a small but questionable buff to ranged hvs

[limber cradle]

Always was tbh

[low harbor]

And a bunch of pretty reasonable buffs to melee hvs

[limber cradle]

No pp nerf is genuinely crazy tbh

[low harbor]

But they didn’t nerf psyker, didn’t nerf ranged hvs

[low harbor]

Prob no time

[compact oyster]

Melee scum is held back by its melee weapons

[low harbor]

lol just run Rashad

[limber cradle]

Depends on your taste

[dreamy rover]

I'm going to be OD'ing off my stims now

[limber cradle]

I think shivs are genuinely that good

[jagged latch]

25% toughness on top of 51% from curios

[limber cradle]

Rashad is rashad

[jagged latch]

and 20% replenish

so thats like a total overall buf of like what 22% toughness affectiveness

[boreal island]

Despite the patch saying the contrary, when I stay still or dodge while under desperado I do not activate any ranged dodge talent and blessing

only when I manually dodge melee attacks

[jagged latch]

a bug? heresy

[low harbor]

Wait fuck
I might want to take cheap shots for Rashad now??

[jagged latch]

they basically decided "you know how psyker can just spawn toughness, yeah fuck it uhh hive scum can do that too except like uhhh idk make it like 4% below psyker stats if you use the meta tree and itll be fine"

[limber cradle]

I think its defo a more viable option

The loons who run crowbar probably want it too

[dreamy rover]

This game is missing the plasma pistol.

[low harbor]

They said 10~15% strength, not damage
If it’s really strength then its actually worth picking for quite a few weapons

[neat delta]

You think they're gonna nerf pick pocket at this rate

[limber cradle]

Aye, agreed

[woeful jackal]

Scum

[low harbor]

Both axes, both chain weapons, crowbar

[limber cradle]

I think it already leaked it code so im surprised it didn't get nerfed

[dreamy rover]

Wouldn't nerfing pick pocket hurt chem builds?

[low harbor]

Yes

Worth it

[limber cradle]

It would hurt every build cause PP is a default talent cause its so op

But it seems we have 2 resourceless classes now

[dreamy rover]

Given how many players are greedy with taking all the ammo, I think we deserve it.

[woeful jackal]

I am the victim.of that

Hush now

[compact oyster]

https://tenor.com/view/whatsapp-hl2-halflife2-gordonfreeman-gif-4476561939831071209

i like crowbar

[limber cradle]

Alright looney

[mental trellis]

Definitely need that in havoc. Holy ammo economy is rough

[compact oyster]

especially when you use the attack speed stim and rampage because jesus christ you attack so fast

[dreamy rover]

Try playing with rumbler ogryns and plasma gun vets.

Take all the ammo

[compact oyster]

scum would still be able to regen ammo with melee kills and have desperado infinite ammo

[woeful jackal]

There isn't a more worse feeling than playing normal vet and the flamer zealot takes the ammo

[winged bay]

I guess the other changes weren't ready to go

[limber cradle]

Apparently not

[compact oyster]

or theyre brainstorming on how to nerf ranged scum

these are probably just ideas on a pinboard

[woeful jackal]

I will scum if that happens

[mental trellis]

Combat blade. Bonesaw. D. Claw are all quite insane. IMO

[dreamy rover]

They can't nerf it too hard. Still got to sell that dlc.

Arby nerfs were warrented though

[compact oyster]

bonesaw is unusable until you run a bunch of cleave stuff

[mental trellis]

I’m liking this toughness replenishment change. Healing crates!

[woeful jackal]

I will heal the world

[mental trellis]

2 point tax.

[compact oyster]

toughness replenishment is the same as restorative verses right?

[limber cradle]

Arby "nerfs" were mostly bugfixes

[compact oyster]

also a flat 20 toughness reduction

[compact oyster]

(this somehow ruined the class according to people)

[limber cradle]

Oh no, 200 toughness instead of 220

[jagged latch]

okay so big wait

[dreamy rover]

Arby is fine now. They just crying cause they have to try now.

[jagged latch]

targetted toxin and tank just lets you lowkey eat bosses now

[solemn thorn]

most arbitrator players i see wouldnt be able to hold up once the team dies

[woeful jackal]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-cam-cat-camera-cat-wide-cat-wide-gif-16729570673879006163

[dreamy rover]

Dog or no dog? The no dog ones I see go down so fast.

[solemn thorn]

both

most i see have dogs

[jagged latch]

also burst of energy now just refills most of ur toughness w/buffs

[mental trellis]

Dog is way more relevant since shock mine nerf. Also rotten armour rotated out

[jagged latch]

very goojf

[dreamy rover]

I hate rotten armor...

[main holly]

anyone else no longer gettign a voiceline indicatign you used rampage?

[jagged latch]

I dont think it happens after the first one

[solemn thorn]

ah wdym it was good fun too see your most strongest weapon feel like smacking a tank with a wet noodle

[dreamy rover]

Don't forget the elite buffs back in december.

[jagged latch]

Yall better be careful complaining about rotten armor they might add this event to the fucking pool next

[solemn thorn]

elite resistance?

wait the crusher buff

[dreamy rover]

They doubled their health.

[jagged latch]

[solemn thorn]

elite resistance was a modifier they added a while ago and removed couple days after

not sure if it was before or after talent tree update

but

3 brain bursts for a single gunner on auric

[dreamy rover]

Havoc is just unfun now

[dire badge]

wait did they add a recent patch nerfing stuff?

[jagged latch]

we can form a new meta...

[dreamy rover]

buffs

[dire badge]

when and where cn I read it

[mental trellis]

Fatshark forums or on steam page

[solemn thorn]

use meta skillset instead of meta builds

[main holly]

did yesterday, not today

[jagged latch]

New patcch new bugs

[main holly]

always ^^

[dire badge]

can someone explain the new nimble to me?

[dreamy rover]

Ah, no. Plz...

[jagged latch]

dodge ranged for .35s total

[solemn thorn]

i encountered the greatest bug known to man kind and idk if its possibly getting that bug again

straight up was flying

[jagged latch]

no tangable affect on melee because you either move out of range or not

[dire badge]

ah gotha

[austere coyote]

Toughness stim changes

[jagged latch]

I love teleporting in the 2019 error code

[jagged latch]

if a psyker breaks bubble while ur running full toughness build you can tank pox buster after pox buster

[solemn thorn]

wasnt teleporting, like i was swimming in the air

[dreamy rover]

The only class were I have to be careful about dodging too hard or watch myself fly off the edge.

[solemn thorn]

was the most funniest shit i encountered

[jagged latch]

I went to like a fucking PU like i blj'd

[flat mist]

With max toughness and defense stim you'll generate 42.975 toughness per crit with precision violence lel

Weakspot crit*

[jagged latch]

bubble is giving like 19 toughness a proc right now wtf is going on

[dreamy rover]

Regain or Tank node?

[jagged latch]

how is hive scum supposed to die pre-havoc 2

[flat mist]

Tank

[dreamy rover]

Gonna try it out.

[jagged latch]

regain is lowkey kinda bad unless you wanna deal with forever cd

like if you just look at the tree a 10% amp to toughness gen is overall an increase of +180% toughness you can regen (based on all nodes)

lowkey unload is kinda meta

you can just spray and pray infinitely no?

[dire badge]

is cheapshots worthi t now

[mighty belfry]

noh

[dire badge]

is it better or worse than backstab

[mighty belfry]

i'd prefer backstab if only because it's actually a decent choice for bosses

but not enough of a decent choice for me to really say it's worth having

[mental trellis]

Backstab is terrible. Needs a rework or removed

[jagged latch]

let gimmicks gimmick

[mental trellis]

Definitely more viable. Scum has a hard time staggering in general.
This talent goes way up when there is a arbites/shout vet. Maybe with blackouts

[mental trellis]

That’s fine but it drops all its stacks after 1 hit. Just give it the zealot back stab treatment tbh.

[jagged latch]

Strength vs dmg is huge

[flat mist]

Path was saying cheap shots for combat axe maybe

[sand haven]

Backstab is huge. 50% strength is no joke and there's no duration on it. The stacks stay infinitely until you hit something other than a backstab.

[calm aurora]

and a psyker, and an ogryn

[solemn thorn]

huge until you miss every goddam hit

[sand haven]

So don't miss?

And your attack speed is already ridiculous with dual knives. It takes little to no effort to build stacks and maintain them.

Use the dodge distance thing and start learning how to run past mobs that are aggro'd onto your teammates.

[winged bay]

Cheap Shots being str is a lie

[solemn thorn]

not a new player but when using knife i can for some reason not use the mk3 knife, miss most weakspot hits

[mental trellis]

Treat it like the DS thrust.

[dire badge]

my mods stopped working do i need to update them or osmething?

[mental trellis]

Yes do the loader thing after every update

[dire badge]

the hwat

[mental trellis]

Hotfix included

[dire badge]

i got mods like a week ago

[mental trellis]

How do you load your mods? Same process. You have to reenable it

[flat mist]

Funny thing about strength on rampage scum is that you get so much of it that occasionally the extra from cheapshot would actually equate to lower numbers than +damage

(Not that strength wouldn't still be better)

[dire badge]

oh throiugh the files got it

thought id have ot update every single mod and drag a new file for them xD

[mental trellis]

That would be time consuming

[solemn thorn]

dont use dueling sword

[mental trellis]

Hmm new vulture dodge on Uzi =always dodging? Lol

[mental trellis]

Well smaller hitbox it’s now a sniper lol

[solemn thorn]

way i play is very aggressive and dont have time to hit precise hits

[mental trellis]

Skill issue? It’s okay the mk 6 blade has more variety

[solemn thorn]

been using that mark

[mental trellis]

Wait it now buffs melee? Hidden mod

[winged bay]

no, it's what they are still working on

[mental trellis]

Oh. Good. Scum’s keystones all pigeonhole your builds. Except for chem lab

[winged bay]

but yes, it was already previously changed to all damage rather than ranged only on development/test build

[worthy jewel]

Rampage already felt better in melee than zealot to me except for one shotting bosses and then they buff it

God bless, next they nerf it to the ground

[dreamy rover]

Anyone else noticing a couple of specialists and elites getting stuck in place?

[nova valley]

Where is this? I read about Vulture's Mark not Dodge

[livid raven]

Pickpocket chads

We survive another day

[livid raven]

Undocumented vulture mark change?

[winged bay]

not implemented

on live

[upbeat gyro]

So Regain or Tank for defensive stimm on Rampage Melee?

Tank seems stronger by the looks of it

[solemn thorn]

quite sad when you run into a psyker using full meta build and still out damage them by alot with the trauma staff

[upbeat gyro]

Youd get that if you teamed with me most likely, i have played psyker 2 years ago and since returning about 5 games

[winged bay]

speedloader probably still not worh on needler due to the range limitation and short duration

the blessing that is

[upbeat gyro]

Gonna try max stacking DR and toughness on my melee hivescum on alternate build

[livid raven]

Btw any line about pickpocket?

[winged bay]

just the various previous potential nerfs

[astral canyon]

Neither

Defensive branch is turbo dogshit

[livid raven]

They got buffed now

[astral canyon]

Whar

[livid raven]

Basically fixing every problem it had apart from the fact you are using a defensive stim

Now it gives toughness replenishment

And the values got increased

[solemn thorn]

rampage has gotten the greatest buff known to man kind, no more exhaustion

[upbeat gyro]

And 100% rending uptime

[livid raven]

I'm still second guessing having the stim for a momentary defensive buff, but it's much more competitive now

[tranquil fjord]

where did you get these notes

[livid raven]

Patchnotes of the latest patch

[upbeat gyro]

https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/1361210/view/494967984678241600?l=english

[livid raven]

Cheap shots is an actual talent too now

[dull dagger]

So what's this class' best melee options? I saw combat axe mentioned.

[livid raven]

Combat axe, shivs, tactical axe

[upbeat gyro]

Been liking Tac Axe a lot

[spark gyro]

Bros are EEPY on the devil claw

[upbeat gyro]

Shivs amazing too, Rashad feels unhiveyscum as bit slow

[dull dagger]

Taxe alt attack just for stagger?

[nova valley]

https://tenor.com/view/jasontodd-redhood-joker-crowbar-beat-gif-19560767

[spark gyro]

Hypercrit does big funny

[upbeat gyro]

Yeah apparently it can even stagger mutant

[nova valley]

Sorry, I am a crowbar enthusiast

[dull dagger]

At least I've been using it correctly then.

[upbeat gyro]

I wish crowbar and bonesaw were better, worthwhile options

[dull dagger]

I kinda just spam lights on heads, feels a bit weak against crushers but still kills them eventually.

[astral canyon]

Same

[dull dagger]

Makes me sad when the class uniques are underwhelming.

[livid raven]

Taxe relies on uncanny strike to deal with crushers

[dull dagger]

I've mainly been using bonesaw on chem build.

[upbeat gyro]

25% rending from rampage does lots of the work

[livid raven]

But yeah, two thirds of the melee uniques are kinda trash

[nova valley]

Wish there was a (indubitably op) perk on the crowbar allowing you to derank the armour of the target you hit with the special attack. Like you hit carapace and it becomes flack

[dull dagger]

Crowbar alt attack is very satisfying animation-wise.

[astral canyon]

But also slow as balls

If latch attacks could scale with melee attack speed it would be way better

[dull dagger]

For the way melee meta works where you really don't want melee animations keeping you in place too long

Would be nice if such moves gave nice big debuffs for the team to abuse.

[astral canyon]

They should just up the speed instead

[nova valley]

It does with Can Opener. But still, as Buff ilas said, it does too slowly

[flat mist]

Wot

[livid raven]

Not uncanny strike

The other

Just smash m1

[flat mist]

Crit?

[livid raven]

No wait i was thinking of the shovel

[flat mist]

Anyone tested if speedloader only procs if you directly hit the enemy with needle pistol? No aoe shenanigans

[muted pivot]

Tac axe is ok Vs carapace tbh

Middle of the road iirc

Tbh as far as Auric bonesaw seems fine?

It's not shivs but shivs is shivs

Purple mode is pretty good on bosses but I guess it's Just Another Brittleness really

But like if you slap a burgle on the ass with it a few times, you and your team end up ripping it open from the front np

[dull dagger]

Why am I so unlucky in this game.

"My build is weakest dealing with carapace, but I'm sure someone among the team can handle that."
Matches with a team that can't handle carapace

[manic wolf]

Bonesaw is "fine", but its not good

[balmy radish]

kinda interesting they buffed rampage by removing thr negativ

[modest sorrel]

No more exhaustion after rampage? Melee builds will actually work now!

[manic wolf]

The fuck? Melee builds on Scum are top tier regardless of the debuff lol

[astral canyon]

Melee builds were already incredibly powerful

[cursive mica]

neat buff

[near mauve]

they always worked

[balmy radish]

here i go stabbing again

[cursive mica]

They were, sure, but hey, less drawbacks are always neat

I wonder what data they pull from because there's always a diaconnect between top players and "everyone else in the game"

[astral canyon]

Idk i kinda liked it thematically

[near mauve]

now i have to readjust muscle memeory to stop going full defense mode after rampage ends

[cursive mica]

Do it anyways

[near mauve]

oh its obvious they probably found out that most people were eating shit after it ends

[manic wolf]

Rampage's debuff had an effect on how I played for like the first day I used it, then I was just like "oh, you actually don't have to care about this"

[modest sorrel]

See thats the fun part... I know already

[split fiber]

it's never been more peak than it is now

[balmy radish]

i hope they shange two of the keystones

[modest sorrel]

By any means I hated rampage before so ill actually use that on a build today, over the chem stash

[unreal stirrup]

scum got buffed real

[balmy radish]

more toxins on your nades

[unreal stirrup]

you could alway offset like all but 1 downside with stamina stim

[modest sorrel]

I mean i guess thats fair, not even an issue now though

[balmy radish]

i think adrenalin frenzy needs a change

[manic wolf]

Lule, no changes to Desperado, VD or Shitpocket. Fatshark really terrified of reviewbombs huh

[balmy radish]

i though they would reduce the cap of Pickpocket to only 10-15% or make it meele only

[manic wolf]

Rumor mill says there are changes in the works for it, just surprised it didnt make it into this patch

Either way, ranged Scum needs its shins broken

[balmy radish]

and what is vd?

[manic wolf]

Vulture's Dodge. Puts you in dodge state for 1s on crit

[balmy radish]

... eh is unreliable

[manic wolf]

Between that and Desperado's ranged immunity it results in you being effectively immune to 80% of the game over the course of a match

Not healthy for balance, not healthy for the playerbase's skill level

[near mauve]

they simply dont do any major nerfs

they did fairly simple nerfs on ogryn and people cried about how he's the worst class now

[ripe harness]

leave the heavy nerfs in a non comp pve game to arrowhead

[manic wolf]

Feels like it an that why the endgame is "oh have some more Carapace"

[near mauve]

this game needs a LOT of heavy nerfs

[manic wolf]

Yeah... no it really does

[ripe harness]

nah

fun better

[near mauve]

yuh

[ripe harness]

[near mauve]

u can still have fun without being god

[manic wolf]

Apparently not according to this current generation of gamers

[muted pivot]

Always did lmao, just needed to play safe after rampage wears off

[ripe harness]

this generation of gamers

im fuckin 30

[muted pivot]

So divisive lol

[near mauve]

hd2 somehow traumatized millions of people and made them think nerfs = automatically bad

[manic wolf]

Missed the point entirely I see

Indeed, turddivers fucked up the mentality of so many people

[muted pivot]

See also every mmo ever

I remember the normalisation being put into WoW back in vanilla around 1.5 or something

The tears lmao

[near mauve]

anyway the new hd2 stuff looks fun

[modest sorrel]

How many other abilities in this game tank your survivability after use? Like this doesnt seem that drastic of a change

[near mauve]

tbh it was barely noticeable

[rancid coral]

Waos scum getting mega buffed xddddd

[manic wolf]

Not many abilities provide the power bump Rampage does either

[near mauve]

i kinda liked the theme of turning into a literal blender then cooling off for a mere 6 seconds

[manic wolf]

Tbh this change just lowers the skill ceiling required for Rampage, which is a bit shit, but it is what it is

[rancid coral]

They should've made it take 50% stamina

Not just nothing

[near mauve]

it never had a skill ceiling to begin with

u press a button and suddenly u deal 100000000000000 dmg

it was just cool theme wise

[rancid coral]

I'm more worried about cheapshots buff

[amber sundial]

hive scum buff real

[manic wolf]

I mean, yes, but also no. As you can see people are celebrating this change, because more than likely, they were getting thier shit pushed in by using it

[rancid coral]

Gun builds getting more degenerate

When they already were the most degenerate part of hive scum

[manic wolf]

Yeah, that was certainly a choice. We'll have to see how that pans out

[dull dagger]

How does braced autogun feel on hive scum?

[manic wolf]

Same as it feels on every class; decidedly meh

[near mauve]

i really enjoy playing withg desprado players i can go make food hang out with the boys call my mom and say hi and come back to the win screen

[rancid coral]

Of course they give hive scum str nodes but they don't do the same for Zealot...

Where's my backstab/weakspot str node fatshark

[neon fern]

scum buffs

thx god that class was way too weak

[astral canyon]

Scuffs

[neon fern]

couldn't kill anything

thx fatshark!!

[compact oyster]

its only for melee stuff

[manic wolf]

"All glass, no cannon"

[modest sorrel]

Can't wait to hit stuff better, love me pve horde game

[manic wolf]

RPG applying 6 stacks of tox with Pocket Tox..

Another "novel" decision

[near mauve]

applying stacks to dead things

[noble latch]

im so suprised they got rid of exhaustion

[manic wolf]

Well, applying stacks to bosses, because yeah... everything else just does a die

[noble latch]

thats crazy to me

[manic wolf]

Yeah im kinda surprised by that too

[spark gyro]

I guess it's technically a buff

[manic wolf]

Fatshark has been spending time on reddit

[spark gyro]

People would probably question blackout and rocket launcher applying the same stacks if only chem was changed, methinks

[manic wolf]

Noone noticed it being the same before and noone had any complaints about it

It was only ever taken with Blackouts anyway, and even then, not all the time

[dull dagger]

3 quick plays into the train map back to back what is going on.

[manic wolf]

turn off campaign missions in server menu

then you wont QP into that abysmal dogshit

[unreal stirrup]

needler buff because they needed it

[unreal stirrup]

pocket toxin get technically buffed ok the 2 blitz that doesn't benefit much from it

[spark gyro]

so true

[muted pivot]

Without the subnode, Scrier's Gaze was considered risky

[unreal stirrup]

fym risky

[manic wolf]

Scriers... "risky" lmao

Aight

[muted pivot]

With the subnode it's free damage yeah

And it counting as a venting save too

[manic wolf]

Kill all psykers

[dull dagger]

People don't like that map?

[manic wolf]

The map is mid at best, but QPing into it means lowered spawns because its gonna be people running through the campaign mission tree, not the actual map

[dull dagger]

Any other maps that blocks?

Cause I like that new one in the trenches.

[uncut falcon]

It's also a common way to cheese auric exemplar as the mission is so short, so it shows up super commonly in quickplay

[dull dagger]

Interesting.

[manic wolf]

It doesnt block any maps, it just removes campaign missions from the QP roster. You will just QP into normal missions, IE; whats on the board, or ones that started before a board flip

[dull dagger]

Ah, I see.

[unreal stirrup]

rolling steel h40 when

[noble latch]

pretty sure backfill is still broken, so quickplay only joins you into missions on the board

as soon as they leave the board, backfill gets turned off

has been this way since the mission board rework

like 6 months

no idea why its taking so long to fix

[manic wolf]

Ahh interesting, wasnt aware of that. Still, no watered down campaign missions

[noble latch]

yeah they can get boring sometimes

[manic wolf]

Probably doesnt effect enough people to warrant the time spent

[noble latch]

its funny they give the same amount of dockets and xp as regular missions too

[noble latch]

it affects everyone

[manic wolf]

They're so fuckin boring tho

[noble latch]

so many missions get left with bots

that just die over and over

and no one ever replaces them

[manic wolf]

Nah I more meant that your average puglets are probably gonna wipe in the first couple rooms without a full team or whenever people leave, so its largely inconsequential in that case

[noble latch]

oh i see

[muted pivot]

Don't worry blunts, we're more than capable of doing that to ourselves

[manic wolf]

Good, hurry it up

Otherwise you will get the barrel

[iron patrol]

holy shit

[arctic imp]

Why are people complaining about the changes?

A chem grenade NERF(people kept asking for that)

A rampage buff(it clearly needed it)

Top left branch reworked(it also very clearly needed it)

[iron patrol]

who the fuck is complaining

[arctic imp]

On the actual forum and even on reddit, I see a lot of complaints about it being P2W which of course is just stupid

[near mauve]

rampage didnt a need a buff but okie

[manic wolf]

Chem grenade was buffed by proxy. Rampage just got overbuffed and the stim branch is whatever, that should have been changed

[arctic imp]

…. nobody uses it

[manic wolf]

Bruh

[near mauve]

i see it plenty

[dire badge]

You're not serious

[arctic imp]

First of all I barely see scum, and if i do? they are a stim crate scum

[near mauve]

what diff

[iron patrol]

top left was just stupid, rampage no exhaust is nice and i guess it was the only ability that left you worse off afterwards so aleast its in line with other abilities now

[worthy jewel]

Ngl I didnt even know about it until after a week of playing rampage scum, dodge and left click spam worked fine regardless of my stam

[arctic imp]

but that’s what I mean. The exhaustion removal is a smallest buff they could have given it, but I bet it’ll feel so much better to use now

[worthy jewel]

Pretty sure id done havoc 40 on him before I even noticed my stamina was depleted after rampage, I never block

[manic wolf]

Yeah, basically. If you were competant it was a non-issue. This change is just to make it more palettable for those who would get rolled by the downtime

[arctic imp]

So 90% of players

[iron patrol]

i just dont have to stop running for like, 5 seconds now, as tempo in a h40? massive, regular gameplay? nothing changes really

[manic wolf]

Essentially its just reducing the skill-floor, which is not good given this was the one class that required you to have a handful of functioning neurons to play

[arctic imp]

It’s such a small change though.

[manic wolf]

At least if we don't count Desperado, thats exceptionally braindead

[arctic imp]

Definitely, I expected a desperado nerf/pickpocket adjustment

[manic wolf]

We all did.

[iron patrol]

scum already has cracked out distance on dodges you ideally never block on scum unless its to parry

[manic wolf]

Block, no, but pushing was still relevant

[worthy jewel]

Idk how anyone can think the class is bad tbh, best nades in the game, vet shout cc and toughness refill, free stims on a low cd and infinite ammo all in the same build

[arctic imp]

Out of all the abilities though, I have always seen rampage be talked about the worst. Hence why it’s really not surprising to me that they tried a light handed touch

[worthy jewel]

Rampage was by far my favourite from day 1 but im a melee player born and bred

[manic wolf]

I have never seen anyone mention Rampage being the worst...

[arctic imp]

I always do

[iron patrol]

i mean, thats why i ran blinders, free vet shout in a can for when my rampage ends 40 seconds later

[manic wolf]

Where? Reddit?

[manic wolf]

Yeah, thats why they're good. On demand CC on the class that doesnt have much CC

[arctic imp]

Yes exactly, which lowers the value of the opinion but it still means that people feel a certain way even if you wouldn’t agree. It’s also different if you’re a good player—most people aren’t good like that

[dire badge]

You play high havocs? I see em all the time. Hell I'm one of em

[arctic imp]

Of course I do, but I scum so I usually take that slot and Im a crate user

[manic wolf]

That is not the place to look for opinions regarding what is good and what isnt. Reddit gamers are infamous for having below-average skill levels

[arctic imp]

probably because that’s the general pop man, and there’s more of them than us

[worthy jewel]

I only use crate with 15s stimm cd for tox pools or gas otherwise it's rampage all the way

[manic wolf]

Good > Average > Bad > Redditor

[modest sorrel]

I only use stim crate big fan of that side of the tree

Tried rampage on launch, hated it, now I consider using it

[arctic imp]

Me too, I have builds for all of it but honestly my least fun has always been rampage. Mostly because I want to use crowbar with it but it feels bad to me

[worthy jewel]

Rampage shivs and needle pistol, creative build

[dire badge]

Then how can you say you mostly ee stim scum if you're taking the slot

[worthy jewel]

Rampage feels to be more of a carry class

Wheras stimm supply is more support based

[manic wolf]

Ironically, thats the best ability to get what little performance is avaliable out of the Crowbar

[arctic imp]

Because I don’t just main scum. I play arbites. And even the scum I see then, are crate scum OR their ability usage is so bad they don’t do much of anything noticeable with either their desperado or rampage

[worthy jewel]

Full offense stim and rampage let's me get to downed teammates and pick them up sometimes on h40, everytime on any other difficulty

[iron patrol]

rampage is to occupy the spot of the zealot, crate to occupy the slot of ogryn/psyker and desperado for vet

[dire badge]

Fair, even in high havocs o see that shit and psykers blowing themselves up too

[worthy jewel]

With chem nades to let me pick the boys up and not get swarmed

[arctic imp]

Crowbar just isn’t it, which is unfortunate because it’s thematically very fun to use and FEELS right even if it won’t perform

[manic wolf]

Its a cool concept, yes, but it has a hilarious number of problems

[worthy jewel]

Ye that's a good way to put it

A non-book zealot

Rampage is messi build

[iron patrol]

if you get revive speed on all 3 curios you can toss a blinder at your downed teammate and pick them up before the heretics recover lmao

[manic wolf]

Yeah it do be like that, Blackouts <> RPG >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Fish-tins

[arctic imp]

So let me get this straight though, chem nades with pocket toxin… is that gonna be a viable thing now?

[worthy jewel]

I feel like you really dont need it

[iron patrol]

i mean, it still kills shit

[manic wolf]

Its still probably not gonna see much play amongst the higher end of players

[iron patrol]

was 3 stacks enough to kill poxwalkers? i forgot

pocket toxin blinders to clear chaff around you better still work

[manic wolf]

Chem grenades are area denial, they've very poor being used pro-actively, they're highly limited and people won't feed you grenade pickups when you run them like they will when you have RPG

[arctic imp]

I don’t expect it to, Chem can already clear. But it may have small use in high havocs against rotten armor because of how many stacks it adds on initial pop. I can’t see needing the extra toxin anywhere else, everything dies fast

[worthy jewel]

I haven't had this experience with chem nades at all

The area denial is still huge compared to any of the other non refillable nades on the other classes

[arctic imp]

You’re saying chem grenade DOESNT clear like rpg? Because I would agree except a chem grenade can wipe

[worthy jewel]

But i haven't played in a couple weeks

[arctic imp]

It may not be instant. but it’s very clearly damage.

[manic wolf]

RPG can wipe Crusher and Bulwark walls on demand, and Blackouts offer instant, on demand CC, both of these things are assets that the class is not inherently already good at. Chem nades, whilst strong in thier niche, are effectively just defensive tools, they don't do anything that Scum isnt already good at and don't deliver the same ability when it comes to making pushes

[iron patrol]

im too down bad for blitzes that arent dependant on grenade pickups to replenish so i never really used boom or fishcans

[worthy jewel]

No i mean the people won't feed you them and theyre not as good as the others, into rotten armour having it tick down all the enemies pouring in and being up for so long is huge still

[manic wolf]

Boomer is essentially unlimited because by running it, you instantly gain grenade priority and you will be fed refills by the team constantly

[worthy jewel]

Especially when rampage shout ccing them into your own stink pools

I never once didnt have grenade prio even with chem nades

[rotund agate]

not guaranteed to happen in auric QP, I know from experience

[iron patrol]

yeah but at the same time, the 2 vets running kraks are already dealing with the walls

[arctic imp]

I see your point, but I’d give you the same reason you gave earlier—a good player can use that extended period of 15 seconds to lock an area down(as in even if you’re pushing into a need-to-be-cleared room, which is offensive) while an rpg only offers a moment of respite if you’re doing high havocs. There’s always more around the corner

[manic wolf]

No probably not, but Auric QP is a very mixed bag, you either get good people who can't be bothered with Havoc, or most of the time, you get the equivilent of Heresy players

[dull dagger]

Tell that to the people I match with in aurics. 🙁

[iron patrol]

scum always has grenade prio when you consider the dodge speed and infinite stamina you will be at the pickup before anyone else lmao

[arctic imp]

that’s if people care about your grenade priority. And then you’ll feel a little left out when the vet with his printing machine does all of what you expected to do with your rpg

[manic wolf]

RPG blows Kraks out the water in terms of performance

[arctic imp]

But vet’s are practically never ending

You need a box as a scum

[dull dagger]

Resource priority with randoms is "run to the same crate as your teammate and blindly mash E to vacuum whatever is there, regardless of if you need it or not".

[manic wolf]

Kraks are good, and they're free, but the RPG is capable of dealing with an infintely larger amount of bullshit, hence why a good team will force them down your neck

[worthy jewel]

Also true I wasn't exactly waiting for permission

[arctic imp]

A good team will throw all grenades at scum period because their blitz are so good. Chem grenade may not offer immediate respite, but it absolutely will after only a moment or two and for longer than rpg

[manic wolf]

Nah, they might with fish tins, but they will with RPG

[arctic imp]

it isn’t a get out of jail free card like rpg, but it’s close

[manic wolf]

Im not saying fish tins are bad btw, I'm just saying they lack the utility the other two options provide, which puts them back substantially

[arctic imp]

FISH TINS

FISH IN A CAN

[manic wolf]

They have the Shock-mine issue

[dull dagger]

I don't need respite I need the horde of bulwarks and crushers dead ASAP. The psyker will kill everything else anyway.

[iron patrol]

this is why i use blinders, i am not playing darktide i am playing doom and if i stutter i WILL die

[worthy jewel]

I felt the aoe of the rockets was too small for shit like h40 rotten armour

[manic wolf]

Only Shock mines regen if you forgo the dog, Surstrommings dont

[arctic imp]

Shock mine is still the best though

[worthy jewel]

I'd rather chip all of them down

Than kill a few

[arctic imp]

Arbites take that like their life is dependent on it—I use dog of course but I recognize shock mines value

[manic wolf]

No.. Impact grenades are best. Again, same deal, you can use them pro-actively, they're relevant all the time. Area denial is only relevant when you need area denial

[pseudo latch]

so

hive scum got buffed again

absolute cinema

[dull dagger]

The best grenade is the one you have with you.

[arctic imp]

The problem is it’s not prolonged activation. If you wanted to lock an area down, you need to use many. Not good when your printing machine on arbites isn’t like vet’s

[iron patrol]

what do we think of this :3

[pseudo latch]

holy shit dawg omggggggggggg

[pseudo latch]

im not sure why you would use needle with vulture

[arctic imp]

for fun

[iron patrol]

fentmaxxing

[manic wolf]

In the case of other classes, I'm more inclined to agree, however in the case of Arb and Scum, less so because Arb already has on-demand, borderline instant regen on area-denial because of BTL and Scum is already on par with Psyker when it comes to keeping a dense mixed horde in check

[idle ocean]

OMG rampage no longer gimps you when it runs out

Hitler dead type shit

[arctic imp]

A regular horde, sure. But a mixed horde? Scum doesn’t have easy access to stagger for that(outside of rampage ) hence why one of their blitz is a CC tool

[zenith pagoda]

Huge rampage buff

[iron patrol]

i will no longer get greedy mid-approach to a gunner cluster and die because i ran out of all stamina 2 steps before reaching and end up jumping instead of doing a slide stab

[dull dagger]

Speaking of which, I need a cracked rampage build.

[iron patrol]

adrenaline, every dodge perk and hyperviolence with extra weakspot damage on the bottom left with 3x3 stam curios and stam on all your weapons

swing fast, eat ass, shank heretics to death

[arctic imp]

I think it’s just my playstyle. I prefer the chem grenade and it does everything I need it too. I might try running pocket toxin with it just to see if i notice any more “nuke on throw” behavior. At the very least it’s interesting that they’d make the perks interact, even if it isn’t rpg 2.0

[manic wolf]

Indeed. Blackouts offer something to cover the classes weakness. Which is why they're always relevant, and vs an armour wall, RPG just straight up removes the problem from this plane of existence. Scum is already crazily capable in melee and most of the time you don't need to be spamming Blackouts into mixed hordes because Hyperviolence is a thing. However, when you do need CC, you have the option for it.
Fish tins kill horde, but Scum is already capable of that without them, hence why they're inherently less valuable outside of area-denial scenarios compared to the other options

If you like them, sure, by all means use them, I'm not gonna fault you for it, but the other options are just kinda better

[pseudo latch]

is nimble significantly different with the changes?

[arctic imp]

Chem grenades value is locking an area down while you’re busy. Havoc 40, infinite mobs and you have multiple bosses. Chuck a tox grenade at a choke and let the bosses come in. you only have to deal with them. rpg can’t do that

[iron patrol]

fish tins lose value as area denial when you remember scum can position themselves facing a chokepoint and spam m1 to act as a woodchipper

[manic wolf]

It can tho... if you have a lot of enemies in a choke, they literally all just vanish with RPG and odds are you've nuked a big lump of the bosses' HP aswell..

[zenith pagoda]

"Fixed an issue where damage from Needle Pistol Toxins didn’t trigger effects from the Hive Scum Talents ‘Speedloader’ and ‘Vulture’s Mark’."

[arctic imp]

the mobs never end though. And while you’re shooting the rpg you aren’t helping kill the boss

[manic wolf]

Particularly if you have an Arb on the team who has a weapon with SC and they're running the stagger on headshot node

[iron patrol]

needler desperado builds are real now

[manic wolf]

I think you underestimate just how much work the RPG is capable of

[arctic imp]

honestly, when I use it sometimes it does amazing things and half the time it doesn’t kill everything it very obviously should have

[manic wolf]

Largely inconsequential as Needler is most likely gonna get hit int future

Or rather, Toxin is probably gonna get hit at somepoint, and by proxy, the Needler gets nerfed

[arctic imp]

That would be disappointing. You’re already saying chem grenade is the worst blitz

[iron patrol]

wdym they gonna dilude our fent supply

[manic wolf]

Its the worst (and still not outright bad) because of the utility the other choices have. Its not a bad blitz, it just doesnt do a lot to cover what the class isnt already good at

[manic wolf]

Its the only DoT with its lowest ADM being 0.9 and it has linear scaling all the way up to max stacks

[arctic imp]

I can’t see them touching toxin, but maybe limiting our access to the amount. Fewer chem grenades. lower needler ammo(a big change once pickpocket gets what’s coming)

[manic wolf]

See above

None of the other DoT effects work like this

[iron patrol]

how would pickpocket even get changed

[arctic imp]

That’s not exactly balance breaking. If they made it to be unique they may want it to be that way

[manic wolf]

They all taper off in damage gains as you reach higher stack counts and none of them do full damage vs all but one armour type

[zenith pagoda]

Channelling aggression will be amazing on shivs rampage

[limber cradle]

You ever play vt2?

[manic wolf]

Only on melee kills, internal cooldown, lesser amount of ammo gained back on proc, there are multitudes of avenues they could take

[arctic imp]

they’re taking our guns away?

[limber cradle]

My thought is just making it salvaged ammunition ngl

[iron patrol]

oh

[dull dagger]

How's this? I dunno what perks/blessing I need for taxe, or stimm lab. https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a10c2b62-8688-48e7-b7ad-f13d1b913fe1/rampage-3

[limber cradle]

Thats iirc one of the lines of code that leaked

[arctic imp]

you leave my tox alone—it is by far the funnest way to play scum for me and they just fixed our biggest gripe—shitty top left branch is GONE

[iron patrol]

swap these two, you have infinite stamine as scum you dont need this

[manic wolf]

Toxin will still be ridiculously good, even with tweaks. It just needs to be toned down a smidge. Not a massive nerf, just bring it in line with the other status' a little bit

[iron patrol]

swap smiter and unbound

[arctic imp]

I firmly believe there are stronger more abusive mechanics in the game than having a ton of tox to throw down. I don’t think that’s nearly as priority as trying to fix pickpocket or changing the fact that vet’s have infinite grenades

[limber forge]

uhhhhh

rampage buffs?

[manic wolf]

Scum was very obviously rushed out the door for Xmas money and they have a number of things they need to roll back a bit

[limber forge]

👀

[arctic imp]

NERF VETERAN

oh when’s the new class coming out

[dull dagger]

https://tenor.com/view/angry-pee-mario-gif-25550392

[manic wolf]

Vet having infinite grenades is whatever. They're good, but they're not absurd. Would much rather see gold toughness get shit on if im honest

[astral canyon]

they said second content update

[astral canyon]

it already did

[manic wolf]

Also why does Exe make the dude actually invincible

[arctic imp]

THATS THE EMPERORS toughness to you

It’s the fact that they’re infinite. Kraks are so good for hard targets you don’t want to spend the time killing

[astral canyon]

tbh vet's grenades feel like theyre balanced around them being "infinite"

[manic wolf]

Yesnt. They're good against one, or two if you have twinned blast. They're not even remotely close to the RPG when it comes to armour busting outside the fact you get one back every 60s

[arctic imp]

but it does mean that as scum I don’t have to compete for grenade pickups

[astral canyon]

yeah thats why rpg and chem bombs get to be so strong

they have 0 replenishment outside of pickups

well that and dlc privilege

[dull dagger]

If I kill more than like 3 enemies with a single krak randoms will actually type in chat. If a hive scum kills 6 bullwarks with an RPG, it's Tuesday.

[manic wolf]

Indeed

And only 6?

[arctic imp]

Yeah rpg sucks

[manic wolf]

Pfft, you could kill like 20 of them

[arctic imp]

Take the bait 👀

🪤

[astral canyon]

how about i give you bait

🎣

[dull dagger]

Nah it blows
-# people up.

[manic wolf]

Anyway, lets be real. The thing that really need to get its knees broken on Scum is Ranged Scum

[arctic imp]

I just want to be the toxin god

[astral canyon]

https://youtu.be/cTT3RBUe8fI?si=Tl-MJi1CY0-ccz8n

[arctic imp]

It’s the strongest aspect and is an easy 1 million dmg for free

[astral canyon]

ngl this video is what pushed me to actually buy scum

[dull dagger]

https://tenor.com/view/festus-warhammer-total-war-nurgle-chaos-gif-26599528

[manic wolf]

Guys, call Rannick, I found the Nurgle worshipper

[dense hollow]

ive gotten back to playing darktide again after going through other games and yeah i wouldn't miss ranged scum at all

[arctic imp]

ITS CHEM TOXIN GUYS

CHEM

TOXIN

[dense hollow]

nothing about it is interesting to me

[manic wolf]

Noone would. Its Purgatus Psyker with a drug addict skin slapped on it

[dense hollow]

activating a button to turn off mechanics is a turn off

[dire badge]

Replace range scum with agile scum where you can walk jump and do flips and jump on enemies

[arctic imp]

Should a scum be doing more dmg than a good always-be-flaming psyker?

[dire badge]

Yeah cus it takes more skill and more risk

[dull dagger]

I wish I could switch fire modes on the needler mid-reload / slide.

[manic wolf]

Melee Scum can outdamage Purgatus Psyker, but its not about the damage is about access to that damage. As Birdman eluded to, both Psyker and Ranged Scum kinda just turn off large portions of the game, which is not healthy

[iron patrol]

desperado now makes you hit the griddy tertium style, its basically reskinned book but yeah

[arctic imp]

You don’t like bubble I take it

[manic wolf]

I dont know really, Bubble is hard to quantify when infinite cleave compounds its strength significantly

[iron patrol]

i hate bubble

[vapid jungle]

Oh yea we tough now boiz

[iron patrol]

double shield uptop

[arctic imp]

I Love bubble 🍒

[manic wolf]

The avaliabilty of bubble I see as a problem

[arctic imp]

Whole team of psykers making bubbles 😏

[manic wolf]

But really a lot of it just comes down to a lot of Psyker's kit being massively overtuned

[arctic imp]

He’s got warp magic

[iron patrol]

i love running headpop with double shield so i can make evil hand moves to obliterate crusher hordes

dont have to flashbang myself with purgatus

plus having on demand reactionary fuck off barrier to parry pogryn charges feel funny

[halcyon adder]

‘Rampage!’ no longer makes the player “exhausted” after use, the ability now simply ends.
🙏 🙏 🙏

[iron patrol]

the scums got actual food so they arent getting a blood sugar crash after physical activity

perks of working for the inquisition

[unreal stirrup]

me when the "become better martydom zealot button" get to be risk free with low cd

[arctic imp]

Oh come on don’t go so far

[vapid jungle]

Rampage is nuts

[arctic imp]

It not martyrdom silly

[vapid jungle]

The duration threshold change and no fatigue are yummy changes we eating

[unreal stirrup]

also channeled aggression apply without having to be 15s or more duration left

[pseudo latch]

has gun hive scum gotten better?

cheap shots looks aboiut the same

[dense hollow]

gun hive scum does not need to get any better

[limber cradle]

Minorly cause minor unload buff

[pseudo latch]

what is the hive scum gun build look like anyway

[iron patrol]

gun scum stays the same

[manic wolf]

It looks like that dried dogshit you passed on your way home

[iron patrol]

this was a buff to rampage scum

cause after the fucking reversion to the range dodge changes it kinda sucked

[manic wolf]

Shall I tell him chat?

Im gonna tell him

[astral canyon]

no?

[manic wolf]

Skill issue

[iron patrol]

before this you could fucking crab dodge your way into a infinite cluster of gunners and reapers, after you get mowed down for trying

[astral canyon]

just slide

use blackouts

cover

anything

just because that got fixed doesnt mean melee was dead

[iron patrol]

thats not the main point though, before that you were basically immune to ranged fire in melee combat and could ignore the random ranged fire hailing around while juggling a horde

[astral canyon]

which was way too strong

[zealous ravine]

hive scum has gotten resistance to inquisition fent

[livid raven]

This is a buff for anyone using nimble

[iron patrol]

every scum then

[livid raven]

Not mine

[pseudo latch]

what was the bug?

im not really understanding here

[livid raven]

You basically had the dodge invuln frames apply to ranged attacks

[pseudo latch]

ah i see

[zealous ravine]

payday 2 dodge build

[pseudo latch]

now you're slightly more vulnerable to ranged attacks on scum?

since you can't dodge bullets anymore

[zealous ravine]

you gotta slide instead

[livid raven]

On everyone yes

[astral canyon]

you can but you dont get lingering i-frames after the dodge if i understand correctly

[iron patrol]

scums dodge extensions meant you had no downtime in dodge duration if you played right so you were just immune to ranged fire

[livid raven]

This applied to everyone except ogryn

Nimble now gives you invuln frames against ranged attacks

[iron patrol]

my god wait

they added it to nimble

[livid raven]

They made nimble a balanced version of the bugged dodge we had

[astral canyon]

im pretty sure it wasnt bugged

just an experimental change that didnt work out

[iron patrol]

it was a unintended change cause dodging was not working against ranged fire

[zealous ravine]

a little miracle done by the emperor for the most faithful of soldiers

[iron patrol]

so they just made it work as if its a melee attack ish

[manic wolf]

Lets not forget they fucked up player hitboxes that patch, so it might well have been to cover that vs ranged

[livid raven]

It was an unintended change because dodging worked against ranged fire in a way it wasn't supposed to

[astral canyon]

bro drop the tinfoil hat

[manic wolf]

This is Fatshark mate, cover up one screwup with another screwup is right in line with thier MO 😄

[iron patrol]

first of i made it out of plasteel foil thank you very much

[calm aurora]

ok maybe channeling aggression is a bit overtuned

[iron patrol]

try with pulverizing strikes too

[winged bay]

Scum dodge linger node now works differently from the other ones. Psyker/arbi node still doesn't give ranged linger

[manic wolf]

Goblin scored a 2.7 mil the other day before this buff

[calm aurora]

[manic wolf]

Scum hitting the 3mill boundary now, real

[muted heath]

fatshark fatshark FATSHARK FATSHARK FATSHARK fatshark.....

[livid raven]

Now they only have to buff pickpocket

[calm aurora]

I was using that

[manic wolf]

Its largely inconsequential, I wouldnt worry about it

[muted heath]

10 initial on chem grenade. Why the most on that one? Why not more on boom bringer?

[winged bay]

Because it goes to 6 anyway

[pseudo latch]

poor ogryn lol

[winged bay]

Has to be more than that to be of any use

[astral canyon]

boom bringer already kills almost everything immediately

[livid raven]

Because it's already a shit node for chem grenade

[manic wolf]

Well the only one that really benifits from Pocket Tox is Blackouts. Everything is dead with RPG and Surstromming isnt gonna gain much from extra stacks because everything that walks through it is dead or close to dead

[astral canyon]

iirc the only use for pocket toxin on boom is rotten armor

[astral canyon]

10 stacks does mean the stuff on the initial explosion area dies quicker

[manic wolf]

Sure, but it kills most things anyway. It still suffers from the same problems it natively has due to its nature

[winged bay]

You can throw multiple grenades to go 20+ but that's almost irrelevant

[manic wolf]

Chem nades could apply 100 stacks of toxin and they'd still be worse than Blackouts in practical terms

Like this change is meaningless

[livid raven]

Another rocket buff

[winged bay]

Yeah well I'm never going to run blackouts

[muted heath]

The sky is falling hell is on earth

[manic wolf]

Technically, but its not like it makes any difference

[livid raven]

It's true

It just makes sense as a change

[manic wolf]

It does make sense yeah

Though its still a bit of a weird one, coz for all the problems Scum has, I dont think I ever saw anyone mention about Pocket Tox applying the same number of stacks on every blitz

[bronze glade]

Where desperado buffs

[iron patrol]

using pocket tox with fishcans feels like a waste lmao

[astral canyon]

idk ive seen plenty of people talk about how the node might as well have been a blackout exclusive

[manic wolf]

Well thats true, yeah, but stack count changes arent going to effect that

[dense hollow]

you cant put chem toxin on enemies that are dead

[iron patrol]

halved the kill requirements for blackout, halved the count of blackouts and it applies 6 tox

that would be so much better than what? applying 6 tox to a already dead crusher with boom?

[manic wolf]

It would be of more use on the RPG than on the Surstromming tbh

At least you'll kill more things, in theory with RPG if you take PT, but in practice, probably not often

It just works as an AoE extension on RPG for all intents and purposes, which is of little practical use

[astral canyon]

ig its to kill whatever survives the outer blast

[manic wolf]

Yeah, though mostly you're not shooting it in open spaces, so its of limited practical value

The theory is sound, but how much said theory holds up in missions is up for debate

[livid raven]

What's the explosion radius in the chems

[astral canyon]

at least 4

[manic wolf]

4-6m i would guess, don't know the numbers, but its not very big

[compact oyster]

exhaustion needs to be added back

[iron patrol]

scums get to eat proper rations and get their bloodsugar back up

[limber cradle]

i will accept it if SG gets nerfed

[iron patrol]

unless you wanna go up and tell em to get back to starving it wont come back

[jaunty coral]

so how we feeling about these scum changes? Mostly buffs LOL class is already insanely strong imo. Im not sure how i feel seeing rpg buffed (sorta, no one takes the toxin node intentionally with it anyway i dont think)

Rampage no longer has fallout/come down, among other stuff.

What about this Nimble change vs melee? technically a nerf? will it be noticeable, can anyone explain like im 5?

[compact oyster]

add exhaustion to scriers gaze

no warp attacks for 10 seconds when it runs out

[zealous ravine]

scriers gaze now increases attack speed

[muted heath]

what

[muted heath]

really?

[zealous ravine]

500 more buffs soon

[manic wolf]

Nimble change is a buff, RPG/Fish tins buff with Pocket Toxin is largely irrelevant and Rampage debuff probably shouldnt have happened

[astral canyon]

doesnt it alrady do that?

couldve sworn it did

[manic wolf]

No, they'er taking the piss because Scriers getting buffed has become a meme at this point

[muted heath]

ogryn get nerfs on rumbler so build diversity can go down so psyker can get another buff

[zealous ravine]

its true we should nerf rumbler so lets buff inferno staff

[manic wolf]

@jaunty coral The real winner is Cheap Shots most probably out of all the changes tbh

[bronze glade]

rampage getting buffed

[dull dagger]

What's my play here? I think the sniper got me, which I was trying to dodge but failed I guess. I tried running to my team when I realised nobody was helping me deal with the enemies, but couldn't make it across with all that shit going on.

[bronze glade]

can't make this shit up

[manic wolf]

Its now gone from totally useless to maybe pretty good

[bronze glade]

devs don't play their own game

prob using chatgpt for balance

[manic wolf]

Spreadsheet balancing

[zealous ravine]

devs busy playing highguard

i mean peakguard

[manic wolf]

Concord 2.0

[pseudo latch]

how good is the adrenaline scum

[manic wolf]

Very

[pseudo latch]

never see it used as much compared to chem dependancy even on melee builds

[bronze glade]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1444017590748975125/1447448646168739880/31F6591.MP4?ex=698c0919&is=698ab799&hm=511de97f826badec15c9b399cd7a957df37e40215f334180250776dec4499eec&

idk man

it def needed buffs

[dull dagger]

https://tenor.com/view/bad-acting-fighting-punching-gif-25489194

[bronze glade]

https://tenor.com/view/random-bullshit-go-moon-knight-random-random-bullshit-gif-25725102

[manic wolf]

PoV; the Vet watching the Scum play shivs

[pseudo latch]

a little excessive lmao

but awesome

[dull dagger]

Which bless/perks for taxe rampage.

[pseudo latch]

watching you kill the bulwark largely by collateral m1 spam is very funny

[manic wolf]

General pick is Headtaker/BrutalMomentum

Though personally I have moved away from that for a different setup

[jaunty coral]

you think this is the best setup for h40 play, rather than toughness stacking (2x tough, 1x stam) with one 5% hp (to avoid burster 1 shots). Ill try it out ive been running 2x toughness

[calm aurora]

rez ally the last 2

[gilded acorn]

anyone getting eviscerated by gunners now? played yesterday didn't lose more than a quarter health entire mission on auric maelstrom and havoc, after i downloaded the update, with the same build i can't even go into a fight without getting shredded immediately lol

[jaunty coral]

damn im already struggling on point spend for my builds, seems like a solid talent just not sure i have room for it lol

[jaunty coral]

Maybe im not understanding it, they changed bonus dodge window to multiplicative, which wont be as effective against melee?

im not sure im even understanding - what do tehey mean 'changed from +25% to +0.15s - so its a flat number now? What was the time equivilent of the 25% before?

Dodge Speed bonus changed from +25% to +0.15s.

[manic wolf]

It just means its not going to make you untouchable in melee, i wouldnt worry about it

[jaunty coral]

hah, i def at times felt untouchable if i dodged right, but others you just get deleted when suddenly pinned. Damn, wonder if i will notice a difference in my saftey in h40

[unreal stirrup]

auric smh

[rose flax]

"Any 'Toughness Regeneration' buffs have been swapped for 'Toughness Replenishment' (the original buff was only active while in coherency outside of combat."

So coherency Regen stopping in melee when enemy takes slot is confirmed not to be a bug?

[compact oyster]

Thats always been a thing

[amber sundial]

Just one of the several reasons why it sucks

anyways, does the replenishment nodes affect the 5% toughness per second node of the stim?

[zenith pagoda]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a10c32ba-84f7-4d82-89de-7b0fc52648b9/legs-breaker-20

With the rampage buff I've made a hybrid ranged/melee build

[near relic]

Me, someone ignorant of Scum builds and metas: were the changes today an overall buff? They seem like a buff. Removing exhaust from Rampage, if nothing else, seems really significant.

I imagine they had telemetry showing Rampage as the least picked and/or highest death rate combat ability. Ignoring that people in melee are more likely to die regardless of their ability.

[upbeat gyro]

Chem dependancy would be more universal with 15% crit for both ranged and melee

If you wanna go hybrid route

Both Shivs and Vraks like crits

[zenith pagoda]

Too expensive if I want pickpocket too

[jaunty coral]

i had gotten so used to the 'come down' on rampage, it didn't give me much problems. Once in a while it would end when i was still going HAM in melee and get me in trouble, but it was def able to be played around.

However, im not sure it was 'fun' to have a 'oh shit im weak now and might die' mode for 6 seconds every time the ability ends. Im kind of on board of them removing the mechanic, it just wasnt really an enjoyable/engaging part of the loop to either A) play safe for a few seconds or B) you forgot and die because of it

[zenith pagoda]

Mainly it's just a gun build, but the IAG cant handle crushers or scab captains, so rampage shivs handle that

I got the power and crit chance stim for when I go in with shivs

[upbeat gyro]

Yeah seems fun, though Desperado will be missed

[neat delta]

Well

Looking through the comments for the scum buff

Im glad im not the only one a bit peeved with rampage exhaustion being gone lmao

[upbeat gyro]

Could have been just tuned down instead of removal

[flat mist]

I think old nimble scaled with the dodge stats of your weapon

New one doesnt

[upbeat gyro]

I rarely even noticed it

[flat mist]

But im not sure

[neat delta]

Possibly yeah its pretty lazy

Like

It needs a downside like that

You can get a aoe stagger at the very beginning

And geta aoe stagger at the end

[heady trellis]

Why would rampage be the only ability with a downside like that though?

[neat delta]

With no cost

[upbeat gyro]

Desperado downside, locks pickpocket for 10s?

[flat mist]

They just needed to tune down the stamina debuffs from rampage ending

It was too brutal

[neat delta]

Cuz I think its kinda cool and makes sense for scum to be exhausted after the adrenaline wears off

I liked that

[flat mist]

Ill miss old rampage too

Now it seems flavourless

[neat delta]

Like this is a speed demon class that doesn't wear armor

[neat delta]

:/ yeah dude it blows

[fast wind]

I think it'd be cool if rampage boosted your movement speed during too then when you get the exhaust you really feel it but during you're able to get to people to kill them without the use of a speed stim

[neat delta]

scum enters full mania
fucking kills everyone
passes out

I like imagining that playing scum

[jaunty coral]

shivs with uncanny and no rampage can handle them fine too, if you wanted to run desperado to be more 'gun build'

[astral canyon]

maybe because +75% melee strength, +20% attack speed, +25% damage reduction, +50% cleave, vet shout's stagger aoe (which it does twice) and can have its duration extended for a pretty long time prob deserves some kinda downside

[jaunty coral]

oof, so as a knife enjoyer im going to feel a difference? damn

[flat mist]

Just make the stamina regen k only a 50% debuff or something

[heady trellis]

I get that. I personally found it a bit annoying when it runs out in combat. Besides, scriers gaze exists. If they wanted to have such a downside for rampage apply it to all abilities.

[jaunty coral]

ya, seem like a buff to me overall, pretty good ones too. With a small nerf on dodges with some melee weapons

[flat mist]

It was too brutal to not be able to block anything for ages, thats the only way i ever died from it

[neat delta]

They need to rework desperado to make it actually fun

[flat mist]

gotta reiterate that im not sure. Dodges are complicated

[neat delta]

Wait i should play before making statements like that

[near relic]

Fascinating. Scum was already absurdly strong. I can only imagine that the class's performance is inconsistent across difficulties, and this is an example of boosting the lower end of the playerbase while hypercharging the upper end.

[flat mist]

Yes make it a second melee ability

[neat delta]

Make it melee and ranged viable

[astral canyon]

i like desperado but thats mostly because i use it as a means of rushing towards ranged priority targets and killing them

[neat delta]

Yeah that's flat out ranged immunity

Nothings really earned

[astral canyon]

kinda like a run n gun version of exestance ig

[neat delta]

It shouldn't be immunity it should be resistance

Maybe buffed dodges to make dodging ranged easier?

So you're actually required to engage rather than just make ranged enemies irrelevant

[heady trellis]

If you make it resistance I feel like it becomes too much like exe stance. Imo to make it more interesting it needs to be more different from exe stance.

[blissful gull]

is the toughness stimm branch actually good now?

[neat delta]

Or make scum even faster

So they can close distance

That would be interesting

[astral canyon]

thats already what i use it for

you can do that with current desperado

+20% sprint speed is big

[neat delta]

Oh it does? I need to play with it more then

Always wanted to make a revolver scum but im lazy as sin

[astral canyon]

plus movement speed from vulture's mark if you have that

[astral canyon]

idk if revolver works well for desperado

[fast wind]

desperado is ridiculous because of the ranged immunity and no stamina use on sprint

[astral canyon]

staminaless sprint is pretty chill tbh

[flat mist]

It's definitely strong but idk if ill run it outside of stimm supply

50% replenishment is insane by itself before you even consider the extra toughness and DR

But its so fleeting

It'd help facetank fight some bosses tho lol

[livid raven]

i just don't think a 15 seconds defensive buff is comparable to a 15 seconds power or attack speed or cdr buff

[flat mist]

Exactly

[bronze glade]

And idk. The infinite ammo maybe??

[fast wind]

even without that it's strong as hell I mean those are bonuses

[heady trellis]

I feel like it might have some good use on the stim crate.

[livid raven]

you aren't wrong

[flat mist]

Stimm crate definitely

[livid raven]

it might be pretty good there

[heady trellis]

Gives toughness already

[flat mist]

Your team is now omegatough

[livid raven]

did they fix the stim crate bug btw

[heady trellis]

Add some replenishment and DR and it could be good support

[bronze glade]

Dead ability if they did

[flat mist]

And stimm crate has a much higher uptime than stimm