hivescum-class

[final temple]

do you like drugs? cause we like drugs. scum is pure coke. we like pure coke. can you handle pure coke?

[candid flint]

yes, if you're encountering a level 30+ hivescum who is constantly on the ground, it isnt the class being bad (its the player)

and you will likely find them on the floor, on any character. they're just on the wrong difficulty mode

[faint fossil]

yesterday i got a scum running desperado that ran out of ammo in the first like 5 minutes, never used melee then died twice before leaving the game

https://tenor.com/view/bro-is-finished-cooked-finished-dog-closing-eyes-dog-with-eyes-closed-gif-8933440936102921947

[final temple]

hive floor inspection is a valuable service.

[faint fossil]

i don't like using desperado tho

[final temple]

as long as they don’t use vulture

[livid raven]

hivescum desperado never run out of ammo

[rough peak]

So they tried to recon vet without pickpocket

[livid raven]

unless they are dumb enough to run it without pickpocket

might aswell run martyrdom with no wounds at that point

also not switching to melee is the right choice

[rough peak]

Could be worse... could run marty with a knife >.>

[livid raven]

so true

[rough peak]

Which sadly is a worse choice, imo, than no bonus wounds and marty...

[zenith fern]

only reason why people say it is not good because they dont have the skills enough to play

Or want to deal the same damage of zealots

Little did they know

[livid raven]

it's imo the strongest class right now

it's going to get nerfed so hard

[zenith fern]

nah that is psyker still

but scum is one of the top tier

[fiery palm]

"Vulture's Mark is bad because if there's a Helbore vet on your team you will lose stacks"

[livid raven]

psyker wishes he could shoot his puny flame this fast

[rough peak]

If you want to see peak performance, here's Epic_Cole playing like someone who actually knows what tf they are doing(cuz he actually knows what tf he's doing lol) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0ad4laAflI

[livid raven]

yawn, this is not Mr E

[zenith fern]

mister e is the true saviour of darktide balance

[livid raven]

he's got a true

[fiery palm]

I use almost the same build he has here and it's really good

[zenith fern]

We need his ogryn rework suggestions

Make the rock kill carapace

[fiery palm]

Rent free lol

[narrow cosmos]

okay, big question, is this the type of class where you get intrisically infinite ammo? because i like dakka, and if this class gives me unlimited dakka im dumping cash

[zenith fern]

infinite ammo on desperado use

[rough peak]

Make the rock do 1 million damage to carapace, and 200 damage to everything else

[fiery palm]

Yes desperado and the pickpocket talent gives ammo on elite/special kill

[zenith fern]

Desperado can last forever if you land your shots and keep killing enemies with your ranged

[livid raven]

yes

desperado has infinite ammo and pickpocket recharges 20% of your ammo on elite kill if you have less than 21% ammo

[fiery palm]

It's just not "intrinsic" you have to build for it. But it's the most infinite ammo of all classes besides staff psyker ig

[livid raven]

which means not using melee at all is very much possible and actually good

[rough peak]

don't forget shock troop with lasguns on vet

[livid raven]

that's really only for helbore tho it's still very good for the others

[rough peak]

as the next closest thing, anyway

[fiery palm]

Yeah shock trooper lasvet would probably be #3 idkfa build

[narrow cosmos]

well yeah i assumed it wouldve been a build but like, no other class really has "Infinite ammo" and im not counting staff psyker 'cause thats not a gun

[final temple]

this is not infinite ammo either. more like easily replenished.

[rough peak]

It's "infinite" ammo... until the randos aimbot your elite/special kills

[livid raven]

me when two desperados

[narrow cosmos]

also is magdumping hordes viable hordeclear

[livid raven]

yes

[narrow cosmos]

goated

[rough peak]

Yeah, ironically

[zenith fern]

yes

[livid raven]

i suggest dual autoguns (think like shredder akimbo), shredder or Vraks IAG for it

[rough peak]

It feels so wrong to magdump a horde, after all the time I have done in darktide maining zealot in the past

[narrow cosmos]

well i used to main engineer in vermintide so magdumping into hordes is natural for me

[rough peak]

Eh the fast minigun on outcast doesn't vibe with me... the armor piercing one, tho? With that version I actually like the outcast

[zenith fern]

anything outside of carapace will shred

[livid raven]

really outside of crushers

[narrow cosmos]

oh i was a crackhead for the fast minigun, give me a speed pot and i can shred every boss in the game

[livid raven]

you still handle carapace ragers pretty well

[rough peak]

I disliked the outcast engineer career in vt2 until I used the armor piercing version of the career skill the 1st time

[narrow cosmos]

tbh the engineer was worth it just for the coghammer for me

fucking love the coghammer

[livid raven]

coghammer is pretty great

maybe the most versatile weapon in the game?

[narrow cosmos]

its such a stupid weapon 1 jump heavy attack and you can instakill chaos warriors

[outer granite]

I wonder if it would convert to omnissian axe in DT if they ever release an admech class

[narrow cosmos]

god i fucking hope so

i am a sucker for admech i want a class so bad

unironically my fav 40k faciton

[livid raven]

i really want their signature polearm

[rough peak]

coghammer + handgun/trollhammer + ap minigun... it still doesn't hit home as much as the coghammer + throwing axes slayer build, for me

Slayer is by far my favorite bardin career skill

[narrow cosmos]

slayer was my fav untill i started playing engineer

i used to pull off some insane shit on expeditions with slayer when i played it like, religiously

[rough peak]

Slayer's leap can get you up some dead drops, when you use it correctly. Not as easily as the battle wizard's teleport(since that can force you through invisible walls more easily)... but still

[narrow cosmos]

battle wizard is such a stupidly good career that i was never able to use properly

still cant

[rough peak]

Battle wizard is my favorite career on sienna soely due to the teleport

[narrow cosmos]

hate all sienna careers except necro

[rough peak]

everything else is just icing on the cake

[narrow cosmos]

i also used to be a MASSIVE grailknight player for a long time but then it just stopped hitting for me and i switched to engie

if i dont have a grailknight on my team for the quests i will tweak though

[rough peak]

the only thing I don't like about grail knight and warrior priest is there is no ranged weapon I can take on them... and like hell if I will ever trust randos/bots to kill specials <.<

[narrow cosmos]

bots are actually pretty good against specials its just.. randos are NOT to be trusted 😭

[rough peak]

I do like the sword and shield with the bret longsword, tho. Sword and shield with attack speed? Push attack spam to zoom

[rough peak]

They are decent at it. I am just extremely paranoid and have been disappointed SO many times in my 2k hours of vt2... that I really don't like taking only melee weapons. That's why I take throwing axes on slayer

I can randomly swap my primary on slayer, in the chaos wastes, as long as I have throwing axes

[narrow cosmos]

that is fair, ive gotten some pretty good solo legend-cataclysm clears while running warriorpriest and 3 ranged bot careers

[rough peak]

I don't doubt it at all. Grail knight and warrior priest are goated. Paranoia does not help you, tho, when playing those careers

paranoia + experience getting screwed*

[narrow cosmos]

it really doesent

one of the best ways of playing them is just being a dickhead and hardpushing anything

see a special behind a horde? just push it

it works out most of the time because the hordeclearing potential of those careers is just silly

[rough peak]

Got a new toy to screw around with while leveling this class up the rest of the way :3

[rough peak]

Eh... horde clear is not the thing I worry about the most... it doesn't matter how good you horde clear if you can't kill the specials

[narrow cosmos]

thats fair too yeah

[rough peak]

vt2 taught me the importance of prioritizing specials, especially disablers

[narrow cosmos]

well good thing the arbites exists in darktide so you can completely ignore them as they will never kill you

[rough peak]

If you don't get disabled... clutching is then like 1/2 the work then <.<'

[rough peak]

cough trappers COUGH COUGH COUGH

[lapis raft]

bombers ruin my day like nothing else on hive scum especially, on zealot i can mostly just walk stuff out :d

[narrow cosmos]

OKAY fine trappers but you can just muscle memory dodge their stupid ass net and its okay

[rough peak]

Muscle memory to dodge? You kidding? I hear a trapper my priorities are set in stone: Murder the stupid mfer

[narrow cosmos]

the annoying ones are like poxhounds that leap from the other side of the map thinking theyre fucking gutter runners or something

[rough peak]

Dodging is a last resort if you didn't murdicate it fast enough <.<'

poxhounds you can at least push fairly easily now

[narrow cosmos]

ehh my dog usually takes care of them for me

[rough peak]

I don't care if I have a hound or not, I'm prioritizing it. Trappers left unchecked = 1 trapper trapping 3 randos <.<

[narrow cosmos]

i mean i prioritize it, its just that my prioritization is marking it for my dog to rip its neck out

[rough peak]

tbh I really don't rely on the dog doing the stuff for me cuz then when I don't have the dog I am not somewhat reliant of having the help x.x

and I don't just mean on arby with that

[faint fossil]

pretty much

true gamer

[narrow cosmos]

eh its not like you become dependant on it, atleast for me, i just appreciate the extra paw when i have it

[rough peak]

not true gamer... true paranoid mfer who has 0 chill for disablers

[lapis raft]

you can def see how some arbites players are completely dependant on playing arbites even when they are actually playing arbites :d

0 thought behind their actions

[rough peak]

Well yeah, but, I'm not gonna take the chance of becoming more chill around disablers <.<

[final temple]

I mean. no thonk. just bonk.

[narrow cosmos]

i just like the murderpuppy frankly

[rough peak]

Murderpuppy is great and all, but, I like lone wolf arby a lot as well

free blitz regen

[manic wolf]

Ditch Inspiring for Pinning, trust

[rough peak]

I would, but, I'm leveling atm. It's my back-up for when shit goes south while not having a full build

[manic wolf]

Fairy muff

[rough peak]

I've also had inspiring come in clutch a lot on zealot, so it's like a comfy bonus for me

[manic wolf]

Scummer has functionally infinite dodges, you wont need it any longer when you get enough points to fill out the middle section of the tree, but ye i get that

[cursive zinc]

hehe think bonk

[fiery palm]

I don't think people realize Vulture's Dodge procs dodge talent like FLAB and Quick and Deadly

[cursive zinc]

Its funny to me hive scum has two infinite ammo methods in pick pocket / desperado while veteran (the ranged weapon class) has neither.

[lapis raft]

scum is too angry to run out of ammo obviously

[frigid wyvern]

my veteran looks fancy

[manic wolf]

Vet kinda does in practice, at least with las weapons, but yeah, they really over-did Scum's ammo economy and I fully expect impending nerfs to Pickpocket, Desperado and Vulture's Dodge

[fiery palm]

I think Vulture's will be fine people are under some kind of belief it's weak

[fast surge]

Who are these people

I've never met em

[cursive zinc]

PIckpocket just needs to be worked into the keystone perks. I'm not against infinite ammo builds, but only the idea that I can go down the tox chem key stone and still pick up pick pocket for like 3 perk points is kind of silly.

[manic wolf]

Yeah no.. there are some casual players who don't test stuff theirselves and go offa whatever their favourite sloptuber says, but anyone who has a decent bit of experience thinks being immune to 80% of the game for a full match is gamebreaking

[low harbor]

vet hasn't been a ranged class for like 2y now

[lapis raft]

probably people who just stand still and shoot and then get surprised when melee enemies can actually attack you :d

[cursive zinc]

lalala I can't hear you precious

[fiery palm]

I guess it might be a stretch to call redditors "people", point taken

[manic wolf]

Infinite ammo is fine in a vacuum, but it needs an internal cooldown and more specific circumstances to proc; IE; once every 20/30s and only from melee kills

[main trellis]

Not on a keystone; desperado subnode - this will fix the problem of ‚no matter what build you go for you spam needle with pickpocket’

[lapis raft]

well the problem is also with being able to spam whatever while actually playing desperado builds

but if it was up only during desperado might be fine

even though i like requiring melee kill more

[manic wolf]

Yah, it would work if only active during Desperado, but melee kills would be better

It just needs some limiters strapped on

[cursive zinc]

My biggest gripe about never really trying to play ranged builds is due to ammo constraints, I never truly feel like I can just gun down hordes. Oh, one horde call used up all the ammo, now what. Which is probably for the best.

[manic wolf]

I dont think infinite ammo is quite as problematic as immunity to ranged damage and permanent dodge state tho

[main trellis]

Its a range build… being able to use range all the time on a range build is in all ends alright
What isn’t is that every build (melee, support) can have infinite ammo & abuse needle pistol cause toxin dot adm is busted

[lapis raft]

actually if it worked only during desperado it would be actually almost useless right

[compact depot]

really dont want FS to nerf scum

[lapis raft]

because then it would proc exactly once during hat time

[compact depot]

way too fun

[tranquil fjord]

imo pickpocket should be an addition to vulture's but is constrained to melee kills

[lapis raft]

as you cant even spend reserves during desperado

[manic wolf]

And you know... being immune to most of the game, all game.

[cursive zinc]

At the end of the day, one can just sell it as DLC power creep and justify its existence I suppose. Kind of how Vermintide turned out. The base game stuff was more than plenty powerful if you played well, but new players could pick up the DLC stuff and do things.

[manic wolf]

Ranged immunity and Vulture's Dodge both need to hit the headsman's dock

[main trellis]

It will happen eventually; arby got some key talents nerfed too

[lapis raft]

i mean even vet has clear conditions behind the las ammo sustain, it just needs actual conditions

not just click this get infinite ammo

as thats stupid regardless of what build are you playing

[manic wolf]

Tbh the only major nerf Arb took was the dog-bleed shennanigans. The rest of the changes were more like small adjustments as opposed to outright nerfs

[final temple]

ammo economy is the issue. and the simplest fix is to reduce the stacks of toxins applied with the needler.

[lapis raft]

yea mk6 needler applying like 4 and mk2 2 would be good change, or 3/2

for balancing needler

[manic wolf]

AoE Needlegun needs buffed tho

[low harbor]

arb nerfs were pretty minor

[main trellis]

Nah; toxin amount is usually 1, 2 on crit/headshot or smth; the adm & time between ticks in dmg need to be tuned down

[manic wolf]

Mostly the ADMs

[compact depot]

fun = nerf

classic FS

[compact oyster]

very minor

[manic wolf]

No, Fun = there being a challenge.

If something is so busted it removes the challenge, that isnt fun, thats a problem

[main trellis]

looks at dog

[compact oyster]

you mean a broken interaction?

[lapis raft]

i dont think they need to touch toxin adm at all

its supposed to be strong against stuff

just the application is way too easy

[main trellis]

No; hasan dog quantity

[lapis raft]

with shivs and needler

[cursive zinc]

Fun = player powerful --> player no longer feel challenged --> game no longer feel fun --> ogryn leave game

[compact oyster]

if coated weaponry needs to be changed to weakspot crit its gonna be something

[frigid wyvern]

bahhhh that aint no karking needler

[final temple]

make taking down a crusher with toxin cost several magazines. that way you preserve the value of pickpocket but the opportunity cost for scum changes

[manic wolf]

The DoT damage graph for toxin would certain indicate that it needs to be toned back just a bit. Maybe totally linear damage scaling is a tad too much ya know

[low harbor]

that talent kinda just worthless tbh

[main trellis]

Its gonna be a buff and it will be busted; don’t

[compact oyster]

also most likely the coated weaponry shiv interaction is pretty intended

[main trellis]

[pulsar aspen]

Whyever did they increase the cooldown of Shock Mines so much tho?

[low harbor]

it's well deserved

[manic wolf]

Becuase they turn the game off lol

[main trellis]

Overused

[compact oyster]

i mean

free DOT

[frigid wyvern]

https://tenor.com/view/benjammins-needler-halo-bring-it-bring-it-on-gif-933514005217268599

[pulsar aspen]

@main trellis Ah you mean just like Castigator?

[manic wolf]

Its like having Zealot Chorus, but you get to continue doing Arb DPS instead of being taken out of the fight lul

[frigid wyvern]

this is a needler

[final temple]

I remember before that you basically slapped down a mine EVERY spawn.

[low harbor]

1 stack on crit still does very little, even if u crit every hit, on the best crit weapons, the crit atks inherently just kill things better than the tox dot will

not to mention hypercrit being a thing

[lapis raft]

idk not having useless dot actually feels pretty nice for once where it can be majority of your damage and you can build around it instead of being another terribly balanced one you "fix" by clicking uncanny

[manic wolf]

Don't get me wrong, I'm happy with it being a strong DoT, but its a little bit too good at the moment. Take 10% off the top, it'll still be pretty disgusting, but it wont be absurd

[lapis raft]

psyker havinch bunch of dot stuff thats completely useless without uncanny is also like incredibly dumb

and flesh tearer and stuff actively locking in your other blessing is also horrible balance

[low harbor]

the only big outlier for chemtox is needle pistol but I think it's a very easy fix
just change the stacks applied on hit (reduce stacks for bodyhits, same stacks on weakspot/crit)

[pulsar aspen]

That would only slow it down tho, the end result is the same

[lapis raft]

i think if you nerfed the application and made getting to max stacks actually hard then it would be fine

i think you should be rewarded for getting max stacks

[main trellis]

I would try 0.6 adm vs cara & 1.0 vs flak for starters; see how it works then

[lapis raft]

other dots not having linear scaling with stacks is kinda nonsense imo they just cant balance them properly i guess even though every other game can do that its not that hard

[low harbor]

the end result is that weakspot/crit hits matter more, as opposed to current instance where u can just blind hipfire and kill fast

[manic wolf]

Both of those solutions would probably work, its just about tempering it a bit rather than nuking it

[pulsar aspen]

The end result is that the toxins themselves are unchanged in your proposed change

[low harbor]

yea, they don't rly need big changes tbh

[pulsar aspen]

A dot with 0.9 adm to carapace is .. questionable

[low harbor]

maybe carapace adm but that's it

[lapis raft]

yea this totally wouldnt be bypassed by every shiv build already having 40% uncanny xd

[low harbor]

but then again until uncanny gets obliterated, adm nerf for dot doesn't matter that much

[main trellis]

Ye but its 1 weapon & you’d had to run the blessing & not smth else which will by proxy nerf shivs too which are stupid too

[pulsar aspen]

Shouldn't Uncanny Strike work only for the weapon which has said blessing and not for everything?

[low harbor]

this has been said for years

[pulsar aspen]

This is not a statement, but a question.

[main trellis]

Inb4 they nerf uncanny and its gonna be a glorious day

[lapis raft]

yea so you lock toxin builds to 2 weapons you for sure improved the game with that change

[main trellis]

[low harbor]

this has been said to FS for years

[pulsar aspen]

I see.

[main trellis]

Ye; its dmg is the problem and as i said; for starters

[pulsar aspen]

@main trellis I am sure it would be accompanied by a lot of angry veterans and psykers.

[compact oyster]

maybe there will be a blessing rebalance in the future

[main trellis]

Psykers only tbh

[pulsar aspen]

[compact oyster]

but hopefully new weapons first admech then and then blessings

[main trellis]

I hope… with all the tooltip fixes cause soo many are wrong in what they state

[low harbor]

this has been asked for years

[low harbor]

will never happen

[cursive zinc]

I don't think I have ever played a game that didnt' require an actively maintained in-depth mechanics guru in the community due to weird bug and other weird / hard to foresee interactions.

[low harbor]

because the correct tooltips read like aneurysm

[lapis raft]

correct tooltips can read just fine

[low harbor]

"Per enemy killed within 12.5m by ranged weapon's ranged attack, gain +5 / 5.5 / 6 / 6.5% global strength for 3.5s (up to 5 stacks) while ranged weapon is in hand. "

[cursive zinc]

Even then its like finesse = headshot + crits while what is dmg, melee dmg, str, and pwr? They always confuse me.

[pulsar aspen]

Reads a bit like a Codex

[main trellis]

I know huffing hopium is dangerous but drinking depresso is also bad
Have some faith

[low harbor]

almost every blessing with conditions like that will have to specify "ranged weapon's ranged attack"

because yes, it has to be a ranged attack from the ranged weapon

[lapis raft]

you can just have separate keyword explanation under, see poe

20 times more complex game and the tooltips actually tell you exactly what stuff does

[cursive zinc]

In BG3, press T to see the highlighted word, press again and 4 layers deep still confused.

[low harbor]

see my guide for info, I explained all of these

[final temple]

best times is when the layers start circling

[pulsar aspen]

In a weird way, Fatshark emulates exactly how things would be in 40K. No one really understands anything, but it somehow works

[lapis raft]

yea this is also option, there are many ways to actually give info in tooltips

[compact oyster]

darktide isnt going to have tooltip explenations like an arpg or crpg

[lapis raft]

someone just has to give a shit about writing them

fs clearly doesnt at all tho so probs not gonna change :d

[main trellis]

Darktide takes a massive cake tho in that department
Never played a game with such obscurity in its power tools as this… and not in a good way

[cursive zinc]

Someone needs to get paid to give a shit

[cursive zinc]

Feels more descriptive about mechanics than monster hunter xD

[pulsar aspen]

There you have the problem, it costs money

[lapis raft]

this is stuff that interns can do, at least making the wordings unified for start even when they lack info

[final temple]

there are literally code interpreters that can write tooltips for you as long as your related syntax is consistent.

[pulsar aspen]

Maybe the related syntax is not consistent?

[final temple]

of course not. but THAT an intern could fix indeed

[cursive zinc]

Just be really specific about what you need done.

[lapis raft]

even most arpgs do not really do this and instead write nonsense on tooltips

its mostly just specific to the people actually caring about the tooltips not genres

[compact oyster]

charge up now increases damage on charged attacks

[low harbor]

looking at you rogue trader

[pulsar aspen]

[compact oyster]

doesnt mention that it increases damage by 5%

[compact oyster]

i feel like rogue trader does a good enough job of explaining

[livid raven]

it does

[low harbor]

how does a 22~26 dmg attack actually get calculated to do 1284~1452

[livid raven]

multipliers

[pulsar aspen]

modifiers and multipliers

[compact oyster]

and crits

[low harbor]

they never specified which ones are multiplied and which ones aren't and what the multiplicative brackets are

[livid raven]

brother you made the build

[compact oyster]

actualy you can see that in the combat log

you can see all of the talents and buffs that increased said attack

[cursive zinc]

You need to be hopping backwards to build momentum, then inpact them with an unintended impact damage mechanic like in divinity original sin packing an entire crate of 999 kg of material, then chucking it someone to instant kill a boss

[compact oyster]

even versus armor and dodge reduction

[low harbor]

I can write smth like this for DT and show how every type of dmg bonus gets applied

I have no idea how RT calculates that

[compact oyster]

youve seen the combat log right?

[lapis raft]

i did this kinda for some stuff i was working on when bored, not a single line of actual tooltip description written :d

[compact oyster]

you can click on said damage number to see the damage calculation

[cursive zinc]

If every game had that, troubleshooting would be insanely easy. Why is this bug going haywire?

[compact oyster]

pillars of eternity also has a combat log which shows damage calculation very very indepth

[lapis raft]

only if :d

[low harbor]

cool

[pulsar aspen]

@compact oyster Damn, Tazarra really got burned there.

[compact oyster]

not my screenshot

[pulsar aspen]

She still got burned hard

[compact oyster]

pillars of eternity has my fav one because it uses a d100 system for rolls

[pulsar aspen]

Also, why do have the suspicion that this is Kibellah's doing?

[compact oyster]

it might be the death warden

[cursive zinc]

Anything interesting to be done with rampage/adernaline middle tree? It seems the least discussed. No 1shot thunder hammer kind of builds I take it?

[compact oyster]

its just pure melee

[pulsar aspen]

Why -would- it have to be a 1shot thunder hammer kind of build and why does it need to be compared to that?

[compact oyster]

i like to run it with needle pistol and crowbar

[pulsar aspen]

When said build is already a meme.

[cursive zinc]

It makes it interesting and unique!

[cursive zinc]

I forgot about crowbar

[pulsar aspen]

If you think so, go ahead.

[lapis raft]

rampage/adrenaline is like the most straightforward setup you just hold left click stuff dies :d also a lot of your damage there is actually from attack speed so its not like it encourages you to do other stuff with it

[cursive zinc]

Sounds like no interesting interactions with certain weapon specials, blessings, etc. then oh, well.

[pulsar aspen]

You can make Devil's Claw stagger Crushers out of overheads.

[compact oyster]

rampage does have downtime where your stamina is reduced to 0 and has slower regen

[cursive zinc]

From the weapon special I take it?

[pulsar aspen]

No, with everything set-up, you just spam Light Attacks.

[cursive zinc]

🤔 Sounds like maybe you could stagger that set-up with any weapon

[pulsar aspen]

Not every weapon has Hammerblow

[cursive zinc]

Is there something that uses the 0 stamina?

[low harbor]

TLDR
u can hit higher highs than power sword, but also much lower lows

[compact oyster]

no

[pulsar aspen]

@cursive zinc @main trellis 👈 Devils Claw on Hive Scum

[compact oyster]

its just the character being exhausted when rampage runs out

[cursive zinc]

Does that require some power/str bonus on top of the impact bonuses?

[pulsar aspen]

I am not the expert on this, @main trellis is. He conceived that build.

[vocal saffron]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a09d208b-e66c-4233-90a2-723d8e789fa7/faywit-the-felinids-flensing-foray

My silly lil dclaw build

If u want 2 peep it

Might want 2 take shivs though in h40

W rotten armor

Without it's fun

With... ur widdling away at crushers

[main trellis]

For more consistency yes

[main trellis]

Could be slightly better

But its quite nice

[cursive zinc]

I've not considered doing chem toxin crit hits on the middle route yet. With all of the crit bonuses possible that sounds like a fun time.

[vocal saffron]

Thanks pookie

I just thought the chem toxin stuff was funny

Esp w the lethal prox punc interaction w the blinding grenade and the chem toxin stuff on the right

Been experimenting with it

[main trellis]

it is

[main trellis]

increases radius by 2m

[vocal saffron]

Nobody tell roundfish

[main trellis]

they know; crusher benefits from LP too

[main trellis]

https://cdn.steamusercontent.com/ugc/12190913571589629599/EF96530496F093F257F904337436685BB1EF21DF/

[cursive zinc]

I never realized hive scum had combat blade. Chem toxin, crits, bleed stacks, the zealot meme can live again!

[iron patrol]

what are the odds of melk roulette paying out with a +3 stamina curio

[main trellis]

just as low as with other max roll curio stats

exept wounds; thats always +1

[candid flint]

from me, when hivescum dropped:

61k melk bucks down the drain

1x 21% hp curio

1x 17% toughness curio

3x 3 stam curios

[iron patrol]

im committing death in the name of the emperor then

[candid flint]

make sure your stam curios are item level 410 or greater

[iron patrol]

thats fuckin 120k melk bucks and ZERO 3 STAM CURIOS

[candid flint]

if it is 400 and says 3 stam, it is a lie

it is 2 stam

[brittle sierra]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a077d553-91e8-46ba-98db-89673f567985/porfessional-fent-dealer?utm_medium=website&utm_source=gameslantern&utm_campaign=share_button

[main trellis]

thats unlucky

[candid flint]

yeah

i had 41k melkbucks, but asked for an extra 20k from my fatshark stimmy check

hoping that would cover me

[main trellis]

i managed to squeeze within ~30k for every curio i needed

[candid flint]

(it did not, for my goal)

[flat lotus]

oh are we posting builds

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a0b577d0-f91d-490d-8fc0-94de07858170/big-shooty-fun-time

this is my tried and true setup

i like to use blackouts in auric but in havoc i will use boom bringer bc of rotten armor.

[naive holly]

does relentless strikes on the tac axe only affect the current target or after stacks does it apply globally

nvm just tested in the psykanium it's only per target sad

[lapis raft]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a0b69951-2015-43e9-b67a-7596406cec1c/stimm-needles i am doing mostly this atm even though i dont love it that much but needler too op so

[naive holly]

kinda wish it'd specify

the trait descriptions are oddly vague a lot of the time

[rough peak]

The blackout blitz feels kind of nice with the 3 stacks of chem toxin on blitz explosion

Stagger + aoe damage

[livid raven]

it is

pretty overshadowed by the other two obscene options imo

but still very good in a vacuum

i like it on rampage builds

[fiery palm]

Have you tried the Vraks? (the blue infantry autogun)

[flat lotus]

No but I've been wanting to check it out

I've heard about people popping off with it as desperado scum though

[limber cradle]

It does a lot of damage but severely cuts mobility

DAPs but it works better at range but you can't bob and weave as hard

[flat lotus]

pretty much that yeah

i've kept to the autopistols because i like the mobility

[limber cradle]

I prefer DAPs tbh

[cursive zinc]

Shivs don't have that innate crit chance right?

[limber cradle]

If i want to run Vraks I'll just play Vet

[lapis raft]

12.5

so they do

[limber cradle]

Sounds correct to me

[cursive zinc]

sigh nothing unique about the combat blade

[clever fjord]

Speed

And the good uncanny strike on a knocd

[crude matrix]

[fallen void]

whats the best custom stimm combination

for a melee build

[final temple]

full CDR and either stamina/attack speed or strength/crit/finesse

[worn yoke]

full cdr with the melee cd node or just pure cd?

[final temple]

whichever you prefer both is viable

[worn yoke]

tyty

trying to refine this adren rampage build

[final temple]

oh with adrenaline? I would say only CDR

[worn yoke]

oh word

[final temple]

I am contractually obliged to point out that adrenaline is dogshit in comparison to chemical dependency and needs a buff.

[reef spoke]

Every stack applies an additional Adrenaline buff instead

[worn yoke]

oh i know

i just wanted to give it some love

[final temple]

not gonna kinkshame you

but

eww brotha

ewww

[iron patrol]

you are voiding any kills from it though, they dont contribute to anything no?

[worn yoke]

https://tenor.com/view/brushing-monkey-groom-grooming-brush-gif-5314861

[reef spoke]

It counts for Sample Collector so you get stim back quickly

[iron patrol]

5% toughness replenish per sec tho

[cursive zinc]

I've been wondering how high can you get single critical hits with hyper-critical going the melee route. I am not sure if elites like maulers coutn as human sized

[bronze glade]

they do

and no, adrenaline is very good

claiming that it's dogshit is delusional

[iron patrol]

adrenaline fucks

[bronze glade]

the result of one too many stims

[reef spoke]

Na it's totally weak and should definitely be buffed

Just like Revolver and Psyker

[iron patrol]

oh yeah its ass actually

you right

[cursive zinc]

Does finesse stack with hyper critical?

[bronze glade]

fatshart's not going to fall for that

this isn't psyker

[iron patrol]

if the crit damage x2 kills it works

[reef spoke]

If you mean Finesse damage, it does synergize as it's basically doubling your crit damage which Finesse affects

[iron patrol]

if it affects the crits damage it affects hypercritical

[reef spoke]

Fatshark hates us :c

[iron patrol]

although hyperviolence is such a better option its not even funny

[cursive zinc]

Alright, no more uncanny strike. Riposte and Precognition it be XD

[worn yoke]

i think adren is fine but i think the modifiers need to be better

half of them feel like band aids

[iron patrol]

mixed horde? doesnt matter this shiv deals 48k damage in a swing right now and your goofy ass carapace armor will NOT save you from the wrath of tetanus

[cursive zinc]

The more I learn about this class the more busted it feels

[iron patrol]

they should make the scum fart aura effect thing flare up faster imo, i hate seeing my vets toss krak nades at a already dead crusher that hasnt started glowing green yet

[bronze glade]

yeah it's kinda boring

[lapis raft]

adrenaline having 5 modifiers and 4 of them being tax nodes looks very half-finished for sure :d

[bronze glade]

you should not be dropping uncanny

[iron patrol]

its the only class where irl buffs actually have meaningful impact on your ingame performance to a degree where its worth using them

[bronze glade]

it's a ridiculously strong blessing even when nerfed

[worn yoke]

like 2 of them try to fix how you stakc it

[lapis raft]

not as unfinished as the toughness branch on stimms but its certainly up there

[iron patrol]

besides the extended duration to 20 and 5% regen the rest are useless and should be skipped

[bronze glade]

nah the stack on kill one is very good too

[lapis raft]

i mean most ppl click adrenaline smiter so i wouldnt say they are useless

[bronze glade]

you stack so much faster

[iron patrol]

you dont need to stack so much faster

[lapis raft]

adrenaline assassin certainly is complete meme tho

[iron patrol]

its fucking free as fuck without the conditional stack nodes to begin with

[bronze glade]

takes a while on slow weapons

if you drop the effect

[lapis raft]

but like idk whats up with 4 of them being tax nodes

and why is there even so many

[bronze glade]

so no, it's absolutely worth it

[cursive zinc]

I guess in hindsight it works with hyper-critical pretty well because it lowers the threshold for armored enemies better to instant die than precognition

[iron patrol]

okay yeah i can see it useful on rashad n shit i guess

[lapis raft]

so odd

[bronze glade]

yeah like mauler heads

i usually take 20s and smiter

toughness regen is ok but i'm usually running 9 stam anyway so 5% of a very low value isn't that impactful lol

[iron patrol]

helps a lot with shooters

the 30% over 3 seconds talent is 10% per second, makes it a 15% per second

[lapis raft]

any kind of constant chip damage prevention is pretty good

[iron patrol]

its enough to let me forego gunner resist entirely

[bronze glade]

i know why people prioritize it, i just don't attribute much value to that node personally

[bronze glade]

i... would not do that

[lapis raft]

i run triple gunner resist :d

[iron patrol]

you have cracked dodges and slides, the stray 4 bullets get negated and you shank the gunner cluster

shit actually got me discovering new ways to traverse in combat

[faint fossil]

man running a support scum and getting a team that actually goes ape shit when you drop buffs destroys missions

[iron patrol]

the extended dodges are actually enough to get the good slide cooldown back up so you can just jitter upto any amount of gunners at any distance

scum is a class for actual maniacs

well

rampage scum

[faint fossil]

me going into the crusher pack with a crowbar and a lot of faith that im not gonna get hit once

only for a mauler to sneak up and kill me

[iron patrol]

shivs are so fucking good

[faint fossil]

or nearly kill me

[iron patrol]

tox is so good

hell i cant even be snuck up on

blinders are so cheap my ass made it a reflex to insta look down and toss a blinder at my feet the second i feel a snag

shiv throws are zealot knives on crack

and you get the single target death sentence dealer of a needle gun

[final temple]

Apostasy in the church of boom is unacceptable. up your bum!

[worn yoke]

what perks do you guys get on the rashad

[bronze glade]

unarmored cara

[worn yoke]

no unyielding?

[bronze glade]

need to hit the scab bruiser one-shot breakpoint

[worn yoke]

i see

[bronze glade]

which i don't believe you can get without unarmored

[worn yoke]

reasonable

headtaker bm i presume for blessings

[bronze glade]

yeh

[unreal stirrup]

you don't need it on scum

just run sweetspot

you can already do it at like 2-3 stack of headtaker + sweetspot + adrenaline

on scum cara + unyielding on caxe tbh

caxe + needler kill bosses so fast it not even funny

[iron patrol]

fr sweet spot was made for specifically bruiser breakpoints

has to be

no other explanation

[unreal stirrup]

yeah because its the only bp it hit lol

[iron patrol]

that shit does nothin else

[unreal stirrup]

also gunner light on crit

[iron patrol]

do crit breakpoints even matter if the crit itself isnt guaranteed though?

[unreal stirrup]

yes

hypercrit + crit stim + float

you can easily get like 50% crit chance

[iron patrol]

you can get to 70 iirc

[cursive zinc]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/build-editor?id=a0b9e3da-f165-4373-aaf1-55f8342c43cb
Enough for Maulers heads?

[narrow cosmos]

are dual stubguns any good?

[unreal stirrup]

this is what i run on h40

[zenith fern]

sometimes up to 80

[unreal stirrup]

not very good

[zenith fern]

They are fine

Not too amazing

[narrow cosmos]

unfortunate

[unreal stirrup]

yeah its cool but not very viable

[zenith fern]

only viable up to auric

[unreal stirrup]

anything work in auric its not a very high bar lol

[junior dune]

from my limited experience it seems like there’s very little the dual stubs do that the dual uzis can’t also do, and the dual uzis are better at mowing down groups

[zenith fern]

because they are two different guns

https://tenor.com/view/paul-allen-willem-dafoe-patrick-bateman-american-psycho-chad-uv-uk-ondi-gif-27368842

[cursive zinc]

I am curious how many people end up there compraed to havok.

[iron patrol]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a0b3b6e1-0efc-405f-b5ab-a535f21258a3/tweaker-of-tertium
this is what i run lmao

ran through h40 without downs

shit just works

[unreal stirrup]

auric used to be even easier but now after bound by dutu its decently difficult

nothing compare to havoc though

I wish there h40 without the modifier

[junior dune]

I very rarely remember to switch to Lean flavored bonesaw during combat. Is it worth trying to get better at this or am I good sticking to Mtn Dew flavor?

[unreal stirrup]

that the only reason to go into lean

[iron patrol]

lean is good for armor dew good for maniac iirc?

i dont really use the bonesaw, too slow and unimpacting animations

[junior dune]

lean adds brittleness and mtn dew is DoT

[iron patrol]

i also love the peak shark wording on this specifically

[junior dune]

+25% distance and 50% longer i-frames?

[iron patrol]

then why did they not word it like this

[junior dune]

[iron patrol]

they had the presence of mind to write them out for the stim but not for the talent?

is there like, a vagueness skaven in the office lunging at devs keyboards when they get up to get a coffee to add these descriptions

[unreal stirrup]

too much word for tiktok brain

[main trellis]

thats very simple

[iron patrol]

+25% dodge distance
+50% dodge duration

[main trellis]

ye that sounds better

[iron patrol]

it isnt even tiktokified smh

[unreal stirrup]

I thought you were talking about the second one lol

because the latter is more detailed

[flat mist]

This isn’t any better

[unreal stirrup]

this one actually tell you the full information

[junior dune]

why is hive scum squishy? do you actually have less HP than other classes, or less toughness, or what?

[unreal stirrup]

rare fatshark w

desperado moment

[junior dune]

I mean yeah

[flat mist]

Does it? Because nimble doesn’t give dodge recovery speed or movement speed

What actually is the overlap between what nimble is intended to do and Fervor

[junior dune]

What’s the actual numerical disadvantage between scum and other classes? Or is it something else?

[limber cradle]

Less toughness

They have vet hp iirc

You have 90 gazillion ways to get toughness back tho

And a few ways of ignoring damage in general

[unreal stirrup]

I mean iirc nimble does also give dodge speed but yeah

[unreal stirrup]

aka spam dodge because dodge linger is broken atm

I can't wait until all scum main explode when it finally get fixed

[flat mist]

Scum has fuck all ways to recover toughness tbh

[limber cradle]

Spam dodge, desp, vultures. A lot of flat out damage resistance with rampage, HCB, and chem dep iirc

[dull meadow]

simple, i run 3 stamina curious on my rampage scum to get max attack speed

[junior dune]

there’s always stims

[unreal stirrup]

I mean they don't have a lot but the one they do have is very ood

[limber cradle]

The ways they have to recover it are stupidly good tho

[flat mist]

I agree

[limber cradle]

There's also new pathing

So you're gonna end up taking supplementary ways

[mystic rain]

whats the best build?

for hivescum

[limber cradle]

Idk man you figure it out

[flat mist]

I think scum has 4 toughness genning blue nodes? All goated though

[unreal stirrup]

win

[limber cradle]

Precision violence is crazy tbh

[dull meadow]

what was that again

[flat mist]

5*

[dull meadow]

i havent looked at the traits in like 10 hours

[unreal stirrup]

yeah

[mystic rain]

quite helpful thank you

[unreal stirrup]

but it doesn't proc per enemy hit iirc

[flat mist]

The toughness on melee killing a toxed enemy is solidly mid

[limber cradle]

There's a bunch of insanely good builds for scum depending on what you want to do

[unreal stirrup]

unlike smt like arby force of will which give you 10% for each poxwalker you slightly graze

[mystic rain]

what if i want to melee

[flat mist]

Psyker and arby genning 10 full toughness bars a second at peak lel

[unreal stirrup]

actual best toughness replenishment in the entire game node

[woeful hill]

Pick melee talents

[mystic rain]

waow

[unreal stirrup]

yeah like desperado

[junior dune]

what are the most fun non-exclusive weapons to run on hive scum?

i’ve heard Taxe is good

[limber cradle]

Personal taste

TAxe is probably mine tho

[woeful hill]

Fun is subjective so there is no measurement

[junior dune]

i’ve only been using hive scum weapons so far for the mastery

[woeful hill]

Try them all out

[limber cradle]

Yeah

[woeful hill]

Taxe and Dclaw have been my fav

[limber cradle]

A lot of people like HSword

DClaw is fun on scum cause its the one class that makes it viable

I think vraks is the dead opposite of fun on scum but a lot of people like it

¯_(ツ)_/¯

Class just works man

[junior dune]

i’ve never been a big Hsword fan on other classes

[mystic rain]

is the bonesaw good as like a primary?

[junior dune]

will check out Dclaw tho

[unreal stirrup]

I run dclaw on desperado build

[flat mist]

Really torture yourself and run a vigilant autogun

[bronze glade]

That’s a lot of conditions to hit but valid pick

[unreal stirrup]

what conditional

💀

they active all the time during horde

otherwise yeah sure

[bronze glade]

Yeah just the ones you listed out

And spending one extra talent point

[unreal stirrup]

which are perma active

[bronze glade]

They’re conditional, which means they’re not

And there’s a good argument to not spend an extra talent

[junior dune]

Which mark of the needle gun do you guys use? Or do you even use the AoE mode?

[bronze glade]

But like I said it’s a valid approach

[unreal stirrup]

it isn't "lot of conditional" just because it just active in combat pretty much automatically

[bronze glade]

Which includes spending an extra point and is still dependent on battle conditions even if they’re easy requirements

[icy scaffold]

MKII if you’re running it as your main weapon, mk6 as a melee backup

[flat mist]

What are you not wanting to take? Sweet spot?

[unreal stirrup]

this is what i run on caxe

1 point free if you don't use blinder

you can't NOT fit it in a build lol

[low harbor]

It’s actually ok now

[dim moth]

those guns haven't been bad since they got buffed a while back

[obsidian ibex]

They're all right

[dim moth]

funny quirk about the 3 shot burst one is that it's actually infinite ammo on veteran

since it gets 6 shots back per specialist/elite kill from scavenger aura

[obsidian ibex]

Yeah

[dim moth]

and it does wild damage

[flat mist]

They just require the ability to aim

[obsidian ibex]

It isn't great dmg though

[flat mist]

Feels bad man

[rough peak]

It helps clear some bs, at the very least

[low harbor]

But that’s almost every gun

[bronze glade]

Yup

[idle ocean]

Fellas do I just do uprising to get my 100 games done?

[bronze glade]

It’s an ok talent

[idle ocean]

I’m at 50

[bronze glade]

But HAVING to take it?

Eh

[flat mist]

It’s relative

And I was just being self deprecating

[dim moth]

adequate damage

[limber cradle]

Why does it have like

The elysium ak set up

[dim moth]

you're asking too many questions

[rough peak]

This reminds me of how 10% weakspot damage on the thammer was enough for a damnation 1 shot, back before the zealot tree got overhauled... without the 10% weakspot on top of 25% unyielding it had 800 something hp left <.<

[dim moth]

though actually I did hear weapon customization is broken and somehow makes you do more damage in solo instances

[rough peak]

616 hp left

[dim moth]

so let me go actually turn that off

[rough peak]

[mystic rain]

wow unlocked vigilant autogun im gonna use that so much

[limber cradle]

Yk

It occurs to me the entire point of a burst fire was to shoot before you felt the recoil

Its 40k it doesn't matter

[mystic rain]

hmm

if im using bonesaw do i get chem nades or boom bringer

[rough peak]

Yes(this post was made by a rocket addict)

[candid flare]

On fully automatic weapons burstfire is the best way to control recoil.
Burst fire setting is just a macro

[rough peak]

[dim moth]

still not that bad honestly

[rough peak]

... Wow, weapon customization doubled your damage the 1st time?

[dim moth]

yeah for SOME unknowable reason it massively increases your damage in solo instances

I could not tell you why, and they couldn't either

[unreal stirrup]

this also doesn't work irl unless the gun fire fast enough lol

[rough peak]

Good to know

[limber cradle]

Burst fire normally has a higher rof attached to it

Or had

[unreal stirrup]

nah

[limber cradle]

It's been kinda phased out over the years

[unreal stirrup]

only if the gun specifically designed for it

[rancid coral]

Yes I mentioned this, people in the modded discord confirmed it heh

[warm dust]

for the hive scum friend i have this for you

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W5hqBefHG1k

[rancid coral]

Apparently because they started using custom damage stuff?

Idk why but ye

[dim moth]

doesn't affect the REAL goat of damage though

[worn yoke]

rashad wants hyperviolence right

[dim moth]

ya boy the combat shotgun

[worn yoke]

oh also for heavy sword rampage gaming

what are the perks and blessings

[rancid coral]

I use combat shotgun the most on vet nowadays

[worn yoke]

i assume headtaker and deathblow

unyielding flak?

[rough peak]

for the heavy sword afaik it's headtaker + deathblow on the blessings

[rough peak]

Meanwhile, when you look at a rando's heavy sword: first target is dumped, the perks are block efficiency and crit damage, and the blessings are wrath + savage sweep

[worn yoke]

https://tenor.com/view/death-the-kid-exam-fail-soul-eater-gif-24968158

[charred bronze]

memories of early 2000s industrial clubs

[rough peak]

Oh and they are using the revolver exclusively instead of using the heavy sword at all cuz why use a melee when you have gun: rando logic™

I've probably seen randos try using the zarona revolver for horde clear at some point in my darktide time, I just more than likely forgot for my own sanity

[dim moth]

it's really good at it until it runs out of ammo :)

[rough peak]

At least the crusher might die when they shoot it... meanwhile, the recon vet with no sources of rending/brittleness:

[dim moth]

people are so goddamn scared to just melee crushers

feels like I see some idiot who just spends all their time/ammo shooting them every game

that idiot is also usually using a dueling sword

and refuses to melee anything bigger than a poxwalker

[limber cradle]

The plasma voc ds vet in question

[rough peak]

People are scared to melee a lot of things... I bet some of those bad recon vets are so used to getting slaughtered by hordes they gaslit themselves into only using the gun on the hordes because of fear

[dim moth]

I only use the recon lasgun to shoot hordes because I know damn well that it's actually pretty fuckin' good at it

[cursive zinc]

Takes forever to get used to melee.

[unreal stirrup]

sedition gamer united

[dim moth]

Or well the Mk XIV is

The other two are...not

[rough peak]

If you know what you're doing instead of shooting the super dense horde that is literally on top of you*

[dim moth]

And those are the ones you see people using

[dim moth]

nah I be shootin' there too

[rough peak]

Yes, but, you also know what you're doing unlike the rando recon vets <.<

[unreal stirrup]

you know shit is hard when the recon vet run the torrent mark

😔

[dim moth]

the fuckin' shotguns are more accurate and reliable than that thing

[unreal stirrup]

yeah it doesn't kill shit

[dim moth]

and now that I saw fuckin' Mister E's window licker video where he compared autoguns to lasguns and they used that recon lasgun as an example for it being better over range 💀

[rough peak]

Does my autopistol shooting stuff 30-40m away kill stuff better? I mean the regular autopistol <.<

[dim moth]

Yes actually

[rough peak]

The sad thing is I already knew the answer to that, I just didn't think back at all the times I was sniping stuff with the autopistol like a maniac...

[unreal stirrup]

mister e

😔

[rough peak]

Granted dance of death on zealot pretty much triples how far you can shoot with it

but even without that up I was sniping stuff

[dim moth]

that video really annoyed me so it's stuck in my head

[lapis raft]

dont you run the torrent mark usually for infernus? thats why i clicked it on psyker at least

[unreal stirrup]

I had his channel blocked

[unique spire]

I don't like Mister E

Because he is friends with Tanner

[unreal stirrup]

is this fr

[rough peak]

You see... I avoid darktide youtubers... except Epic_Cole cuz I know he actually knows his shit >.>'

[unreal stirrup]

i remember tanner shitting on mister e for getting on official fatshark video lol

[unique spire]

Yeah he made some build shorts where Tanner appears on it

[unique spire]

Remember, Tanner is banned from this server

[unreal stirrup]

he's also banned in warframe server

[rough peak]

Also remember: his followers love showing up and crashing out here x.x

[unique spire]

I remember this one dude on Ogryn chat saying that Tanner was the one who came up with the ogryn rework ideas

He kept insisting until he got banned

[rough peak]

That's where I'd say something like "Sure thing, bud... and I'm a magical fairy princess..."

wasn't there a joke a while back where people were joking that "tanner saved ogryn" or something like that? Not seriously thinking that, just joking around

[unique spire]

Make it like that one KCD2 scene where this random dude keeps making fun of Hans

[rancid coral]

"but overhead scary"

The realest most dangerous melee elite is dreg ragers and no one can change my mind

[flat mist]

Tanner was definitely saying that

[warm dust]

that why i share these music for a hive scum gaming

[dim moth]

yeah

[unreal stirrup]

overhead can be scary when you're in closed space tbh

[dim moth]

fuckin' flying 5 meters with their melee attack it completely ignores your dodge, now you're stunned

[unique spire]

Some of his fans were saying that

[dim moth]

and oh hey stunned you can't dodge the next hit or the rest of the horde

[rancid coral]

Unlike VT2 your dodges have iframes here

[unique spire]

Genuinely

[novel oracle]

It was a ragebait joke

[dim moth]

and now you're DEAD

[unreal stirrup]

im sure overhead count as aoe so dodging doesn't help

[rough peak]

Well yeah, that's his fans. His fans are gonna say a lot of stuff, especially if he probably thinks it x.x

[rancid coral]

It does funnily enough

I've dodged a bunch of overheads in place

[flat mist]

Something something satire indistinguisable from reality

[mystic rain]

damn bonesaw goes crazy

[rancid coral]

When cornered, just cuz I timed the Dodge correctly

[rough peak]

Oh, hi Cole. I was just talking shit about y- I mean... saying how u know your shit <.<'

[mystic rain]

62 MOBLITY just give me the best one man

[worn yoke]

for a rampage chem dependcy build

is ruffian or anarchist more valuable as an aura

[zealous ravine]

i cant believe new zealand saved ogryn

[smoky mica]

the only way you can save ogryn is to take down reddit's servers permantently

[zealous ravine]

the only way to save ogryn is giving them plasteel knuckles

[flint granite]

And YouTube

[pallid quail]

id be down even if it didnt save ogryn

[smoky mica]

this is why ive always liked u boge

[zealous ravine]

we can kill reddit but r/weeviltime must stay up

nooo not the reddit mold

holy hell reddit silver

[low harbor]

They don’t

Just like VT2, dodges don’t have i-frames in DT

[eager reef]

They do if you play scum

[woeful hill]

No, they dont

[eager reef]

We literally have a node that grants us infinite I frames to melee

[woeful hill]

Vulture dodge?

if so, thats just count_as_dodge_vs_melee/ranged

you can still take damage with it

[eager reef]

Looks like I frames to me

Close enough

[worn yoke]

dodging has iframes? sounds like a souls like

[limber cradle]

Try to use it like true iframes and you'll learn.

[woeful hill]

It does not

I can link a few places if you want to read about how dodges work

but its not Iframes

[worn yoke]

is it partial then?

[woeful hill]

no

in a very summarized summery. enemies "lose track of you"

and miss

[worn yoke]

does it make your hitbox smaller then

oh

[limber cradle]

Doesn't work for aoes either iirc

[hot edge]

Go dodge in fire and you will find out

[woeful hill]

it does

you can spot dodge crusher overheads

[eager reef]

No it moves it elsewhere

[limber cradle]

If they're targeting you iirc

[woeful hill]

yeah only if they are looking at you

[limber cradle]

If they aren't lol

[woeful hill]

you cant dodge teammate attacks

[eager reef]

Unrelated but I hate teammate attacks triggering the backstbab sfx

[worn yoke]

do we have like a list btw of which melees want hyperviolence vs critical is it more nuanced than that

[eager reef]

Got me jumping at shadows wondering if the stims are getting to me

[worn yoke]

like shiv being critical is a no brainer ofc

[vocal saffron]

Dodge feels like iframes

Like a lot of enemies you can dodge through their swings of theyre for another person

Some enemies you cant though

Like sword captains

And Rinda Slopnak

[worn yoke]

is the alt fire for rashad ever used

[vocal saffron]

I never use it

[worn yoke]

twist my axe in a whimsical way

[eager reef]

I use it bc it amuses me

[vocal saffron]

I think you can stagger crushers with a headshot w it

But you should be staggering crushers with headshot heavies anyways

[worn yoke]

oh could it be used to stagger ragers then

oh word

[vocal saffron]

Yeah

[worn yoke]

dude the rashad heavy animation is so fucking funny

why does he pull it so far back

[rancid coral]

then why was I able to dodge enemies in place?

[vocal saffron]

Look at it from someone else's perspective

[dim moth]

miss MOST of the time

[vocal saffron]

Think it breaks tracking enough that theyre effectively iframes

Not literally but effectively

[dim moth]

dreg ragers are the biggest offender to having to clarify "most of the time" imo

[vocal saffron]

You can spot dodge crusher overheads

[dim moth]

genuinely feels like they completely ignore dodges 7 times out of 10

[vocal saffron]

Except the standing ones

I want to say it feels like if a melee enemy is dodged in a certain window the game just flags or whatever for lack of a better term their attack to miss you regardless of perceived hitboxes

[worn yoke]

for 2026 can fat shark remove tox bombers

[vocal saffron]

Because if your right pinkie toe so much as grazes a slope they can 180 and hit you

Happened to meow last night in a havoc

[low harbor]

not how it works, dodges just flat out don't have i-frames

[low harbor]

dodge disables enemies' attacks' tracking

[eager reef]

I know, but spreading misinformation amuses me.

[charred bronze]

I think their combo resets tracking very quickly is all

[eager reef]

https://tenor.com/view/green-explosion-skaven-gif-9272053709133071409

[rancid coral]

Well yeah I know that I do play VT2

but how could I avoid crushers overheads while basically dodging against a wall (no movement)

[low harbor]

if dodges had i-frames in this game u'd be able to dodge through fire without ever getting damaged

[rancid coral]

I mean

Didn't they just made the iframes from melee now apply to ranged

[low harbor]

no

[rancid coral]

and that's why you can essentially dodge bullets infinitely

[low harbor]

again, they're not i-frames

[rancid coral]

(not fire, but bullets)

[low harbor]

dodge linger used to only work vs melee
now (as an experiment) works vs ranged

dodge linger is not i-frame

it's the same thing as "disabling enemy tracking"

[charred bronze]

it's a little broken, but it also makes gunners less oppressive. Maybe with an adjustment to linger times they'll keep it

[hot edge]

Spam dodge in nurgle puke, if there are iframes then you shouldnt take corruption damage, but you do

[rancid coral]

Literally dodged the overhead in place

[dim moth]

god I fucking hope not

[rancid coral]

that hitbox 100% hit me, yet it didn't hit me because I dodged (you can see the dodge counter go down)

[dim moth]

any amount of linger affecting ranged enemies is too much imo

[low harbor]

no, u did move

just weird game detection ig

[rancid coral]

omg 2 millimeters

NOT outside the hitbox

[low harbor]

but dodges don't have i-frames

[rancid coral]

That hitbox 100% hit me

[drifting heron]

Then why can't you dodge a burster

[rancid coral]

because it only applies to melee

[low harbor]

vror unfortunately ur just wrong here

[drifting heron]

Then why can you dodge bullets

[rancid coral]

originally it used to only disable tracking for a little but now since this dumb "experimental change" they made

you can actually perma spam dodge and bullets will not hit you

[rancid coral]

gets video proof

"you're wrong"

[drifting heron]

Yeah because they gave it linger vs ranged

[rancid coral]

man

[drifting heron]

Your proof isn't right

[rancid coral]

I'm stating you have iframes against melee

initial iframes at least

they don't stay forever ofc

[drifting heron]

Try and do that same thing versus an attack targeting a teammate

[woeful hill]

lol

[low harbor]

no, not how it works

[drifting heron]

We should just pull code i swear

[rancid coral]

then why can I dodge enemy attacks in place aaaa

[low harbor]

weird game detection

but no i-frames

[rancid coral]

well that's a weird way to put it then

I've been dodging enemy attacks in place since I started playing this game

[echo python]

just counts-as-dodging frames

[low harbor]

but u still are wrong here

[drifting heron]

The most conclusive way you can test this is attempting to spot dodge an overhead targeting a teammate

Do that

[dim moth]

you can 100% dodge normal attacks without moving

overheads no

and even on the overhead you can see dodge talents trigger because it's their "explosion" hitbox that hits you not the melee attack part of it

[charred bronze]

The number of times I've been trapped or hit while dodging into an obstacle in live play, suggests that there are no i-frames.

[dim moth]

unless this is solo server jank which...it could be

it'd be fuckin' stupid but it's possible

[rancid coral]

tbf trapper is a different beast

it's not lag compensated, the net doesn't care about if you're dodging or not, it only matters if you dodged before it fired so the trap itself misses you

[dim moth]

trappers ignore dodges straight up

[rancid coral]

yea

[dim moth]

if the net hits you you are netted

even if you are dodging, or invincinble, or anything

[charred bronze]

overheads too, though

[rancid coral]

idk I've avoided 5000000000 overheads

by just doing what tox scum showed

during game

[charred bronze]

though that's happened less often since I'm usually more aware of my positioning when crushers are about. Assuming they didn't like, drop silently from the ceiling

[dim moth]

I've never had that work for me against overheads personally but eh

it's most noticable when people were gaslighting me about chaos spawn having counterplay

by suggesting you can just corner yourself and dodge the overhead slam

which doesn't work

[rancid coral]

ofc it has counterplay just equip DS and spam parry /j

[charred bronze]

what kind of counterplay?

[rancid coral]

The best tip I got from fighting chaos spawn is that they do the grab attack every 10s

(I think it was 10s)

andholy moly that helped me so much

[charred bronze]

if it's on an internal cooldown/timer and isn't reactive to positioning, that changes a lot of how I'll fight the bastards

[rancid coral]

it's global I think

They'll always attempt to do the grab attack

if it's on cooldown, then they'll do another attack

but once the cooldown is over, the next attack will 100% be the grab

[charred bronze]

most reliable method of dodging the grab? Backwards if you got space? The grab seems to be a sweeping attack that ignores side dodges?

[rancid coral]

dodge to the right

the hitbox of the grab goes from right to left, so if you dodge right the moment the dodge linger finishes, the hitbox will be on your left side

meaning it can't grab you

[rancid coral]

^

I hate that this is not explained more clearly

but once it clicks, you can pretty much bully them

(alongside the internal 10s cooldown for grab attempts)

[dire badge]

Me pinning the chaos spawn against the wall after dodging the grab and kissing them passionately

[edgy saddle]

Ngl im not sure how to build for stim supply

[mighty belfry]

What do you wanna do with it?

[fast gust]

The best way to dodge it is VoC spam

🫡

[rancid coral]

Praying for FS to nerf the base cooldown to 45s and for Duty and Honour to 60s

(and remove the downsides of revive shout xdd)

[mighty belfry]

To be real, I don't even think the base version needs a nerf at all.

[drifting heron]

Yeah

[rancid coral]

True

[drifting heron]

Its just a stagger blast

45s for duty and honor is enough

[rancid coral]

45s is too little I'd say

for duty and honour

but it's better than 30s for sure

[mighty belfry]

Duty and Honour? At this point I don't even think golden toughness should be in the game.

[drifting heron]

Make duty and honor tdr

Shrimple

Its literally that shrimple

[mighty belfry]

It's clear that Fatshark can't really balance the game around its existence

[rancid coral]

I don't hate gold toughness in itself

I do hate that it blocks overheads, snipers and bursters

that shit should NOT do that

[fast gust]

Piss toughness was a mistake like giving ds to zealot

[rancid coral]

Victor Saltzpyre hater detected

[brittle sierra]

"yo scum, gimmie some cooldown!"

[fast gust]

Ds and our beloved rapier and lock ain't the same

[lapis raft]

its funny that revive shout has +50% cd but broken golden toughness nothing :d

[fast gust]

DS is an abomination

[rancid coral]

It is to ME, it's the only POINTY HEAVY weapon I have!!!

[brittle sierra]

Still trying to figure out for my crate build to take CDR or crit 🤔