hivescum-class

[compact maple]

PB . Light , Heavy

[astral canyon]

Peanut butter?

Dont mind if i take some

[tender marten]

Yes.

[compact maple]

push block

[tender marten]

why would i block peanut butter

[winter tusk]

Bonesaw and crowbar are both fine they just need built into

[astral canyon]

Trueeeeee

[tender marten]

yea both those weapons were 100% balanced around your tree more than they were to be standalone 'good'

which makes total sense since theyre class unique

[compact maple]

agreed

[bronze glade]

except for the part where we have access to weapons

that aren't balanced around adren/rampage lol

[tender marten]

yea but still

theyre fun and unique

[bronze glade]

cbar and saw are ass for different reasons

at least shivs are good

one redeeming spot in the HIV unique melee arsenal

[lapis raft]

its probs pretty hard to fuck up knife copy paste with strong lights :d

[compact maple]

HIV build

[winter tusk]

Crowbar is fine it just needs the lock in animation basically removed

Get rid of the risk and 2 shotting crushers is fine

[lapis raft]

they could just give saw better mobility and maybe 1 more toxin stack on hit and would be good too

[compact maple]

shits too satisfying tho

[worn yoke]

mk7 for taxe right

[bronze glade]

ah yes the weapon with 1/3rd the horde clear speed of rashad 😭

[compact maple]

Crowbar would get a pass if it had a little more single target damage

[lapis raft]

just play chainaxe if you are playing crowbar instead

[bronze glade]

honestly that's quite true

[winter tusk]

Idk the sweeps seem fine for clearing, takes like 1 hit for poxwalkers

[bronze glade]

the horde clear speed is actually pathetic

[winter tusk]

I havent had much issue

[bronze glade]

Doesn’t change the facts

[compact maple]

One of those weapons where I feel it would break if it got buffed imo.

[winter tusk]

Its fine except for the risk from the animation

[bronze glade]

It’s a weapon designed to not be op

Because Adren Rampage

Is a thing

[winter tusk]

Evis used to literally kill 1 enemy at a time

Its fine lol

[bronze glade]

Problem is, HIV also gets weapons that aren’t subject to the balancing restrictions that cbar got

Soooo

[winter tusk]

Yes fatshark likes knives to be ungodly broken, this has been well established

[compact maple]

You would think chain weapons would be the strongest in a game like this

[lapis raft]

stabby stab good

[winter tusk]

Evis is also broken atm

They buffed the shit out of chain weapons a while back

[lavish bronze]

I would say broken but in the best state in years

[winter tusk]

Oh yeah its very good, too good

But we're not gonna worry about balance, crushers will just have 10k hp eventually

[marsh plover]

why is that?

[livid raven]

it doesn't do much

it's mostly the accuracy increase but it's not as important as damage

[rancid coral]

Already a thing in Havoc xddddd

[winter tusk]

FUCK balance

NUMBERS ONLY GO UP WOOOO

[rancid coral]

Rotten Armour crushers with 9750 HP:

[craggy jasper]

How's everyone setting up their stimms with stimm supply?

[faint fossil]

my ass is a ogryn main so when im playing ogryn i wish i was as fast as scum yet when im playing scum i wish i was as tanky as ogryn

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/794801623036854302/1165501685792251924/crumple.gif

[lusty lichen]

Burn damage should affect the rotten armour enemies more.

[faint fossil]

idk why i put as fast as ogryn when ogryn is a fatass

[craggy jasper]

gotta go fast

[lavish bronze]

Burn damage should bypass armour

[fallen void]

dude the rampage exhaustion mechanic pmo so much

[azure mist]

Well here's a useless fun fact for you Scum

https://medal.tv/games/warhammer-40000-darktide/clips/lOuen8QWJLxieHut6?invite=cr-MSx6ZDIsMTA3NDAxNTcz&v=3

Blackout's work with BP Puncture

use this information with- whatever the hell you want to do

[fallen void]

me when im trying to avoid being put in a hydraulic press by 7 crushers but my hive scum sprains her ankle

[zenith fern]

for the sweet of one stack

[azure mist]

https://medal.tv/games/warhammer-40000-darktide/clips/lOum0BLHqD1UUEswI?invite=cr-MSxDWlIsMTA3NDAxNTcz&v=9

There's also this

but its timing sensitive cause the clip shows it will waste a shiv if done early

[rough peak]

Good to know

[mighty belfry]

I set up for full damage for my melee supply build.

With crit chance.

[rough peak]

100k hp crushers when?

[dire badge]

can i get brutalize penance with the 2 second chem pack

[rustic zinc]

I wish there was a mod that just announced my Stimm's effects once at the start of any run where I have Stimm Supply.

I mean better yet would be if baseline Darktide could clearly communicate those effects without requiring I memorize icon art (so that when others run Stimm Supply I can get a sense for what stimm they're running too)

[winter tusk]

Guys im so bad I need duelling sword on arbitrator

[mystic rain]

whats the dump stat on dual autopistols?

[worn canopy]

This is hive scum

[worn canopy]

Collateral

Wait…

[winter tusk]

Its arbitrator, he uses break the line in the clip

[worn canopy]

Does it has mobility?

[mystic rain]

i ask that and i get a 61 collat and 79 stopping

[worn yoke]

collat and mobility are both fine but collat is better

[mystic rain]

i mean, its like 3 vs 4 shots against a mauler right?

[worn yoke]

it practically changes nothing from 60 to 80 except very niche things

[worn canopy]

Autopistol is a smg

[mystic rain]

collat better to dump or better to keep?

[worn yoke]

to dump

[worn canopy]

that sound like dual stub pistol

[worn yoke]

80 collat lets you proc pinning fire against like 2 more enemies and thats really it

[final temple]

both stubs and autos have collateral as dumpstat yeah

[tranquil fjord]

the fuck

hes using the bad mark too

[winter tusk]

5 might be better for havoc since it clears better but still has decent single target

[tranquil fjord]

wouldnt it get 7 dodges

well, if the person took that one talent

[fallen void]

i like killing

[charred oriole]

Hivescum should get an autogun with a drum magazine

[winter tusk]

Imagine fatshark adding weapons

Nice to dream

[rough peak]

We're still huffing dat copium over a melta gun

https://tenor.com/view/copium-cat-gif-27161395

[winter tusk]

Lot of weapons they do add just end up being overall booty crack anyway

Power falchion, shock mauls

[rough peak]

I tested the needle gun against a malice crusher when I unlocked it cuz I was curious what it did to crushers in general... 3 shots on the mk6 one killed it

idk how good that is tbh

but when I saw the dot not stopping I had to do a double take <.<

I was gonna test it against a heresy and damnation one... but I had to go shopping

I honestly didn't expect the dot to do as much as it did <.<

This was the 1st one I got, I upgraded it to blue cuz I could

[dim moth]

should do the same since needle pistols stats literally do not matter

[rough peak]

wtf it actually 3 shotted a damnation crusher

I thought it would take 5 or 6 shots <.<

wtf is this gun

4 on non-crit body shots

[sonic pumice]

So what's the agreement on the value of using desperado build with shredded pistol instead of the dual Uzis? Is it meant to be different build styles or one is just better than the other?

[velvet plinth]

Is the dlc worth buying

[tropic crag]

i saw someone say the chainaxes horde clear speed is pathetic and i think they just aren't using the cleave nodes

[fiery palm]

My view is if you're gonna go for damage use the Vraks. The Shredder brings some interesting value to the table with its stagger

So it's like Vraks for damage and Shredder for runny shooty with the DAPs being in the middle

[tropic crag]

its probably my favorite class now for the melee aspect of it, it depends on what you're looking for tho, its a fairly punishing but also very strong class that has some fun and unique things but not everyone is gonna like it

[velvet plinth]

What's the play style like

[final temple]

like a squishy zealot that needs to dodge to survive

[velvet plinth]

Fun

[final temple]

it is.

you fee untouchable. until you get touched.

[velvet plinth]

What's the stims like

[final temple]

on demand buffs customized to your needs.

[velvet plinth]

Worth using my 20 dollar gift card for?

[tropic crag]

its like if you brought the slayers design philosophy over to darktide... so basically it just makes some trade offs by losing some things that would be "normal" on other classes to gain the power to make every weapon perform at a top teir level

[final temple]

no. buy booze and hookers for that.

[velvet plinth]

I'm getting this game off gamepass

[velvet plinth]

It's a Xbox gift card

[final temple]

buy cheap booze and hookers for that

[velvet plinth]

You're assuming that they'd want it

[fiery palm]

Just be warned the leveling process is painful. It's great once you have a full talent tree and properly specd gear but until then it's straight cbt

[rough peak]

Okay I am seeing the thing that this gun doesn't do... namely triggering the 30% reload speed on close ranged kill and toughness from ranged kills/ranged elite kills <.<

[velvet plinth]

Okie

[final temple]

if they don’t want it, what else would you spend it on? 😉

[velvet plinth]

The dlc

Or the game itself

[final temple]

there you go.

[velvet plinth]

I'm getting it off gamepass

I have to wait for the rare good Xbox sale

[tropic crag]

i think getting the base game as your own first would be better than the dlc if you're still fairly new (like under 200 hours)

[velvet plinth]

Over that

Just had gamepass before the price surge so

Thankfully the games on core so I'm switching

[tropic crag]

i would still say get the base game if you're over 150 because at that point you're renting something you should own

it probably becomes more reasonable to get the base game

[velvet plinth]

True

So wait for the once a year amazon sale

Thanks

[tropic crag]

maybe, unless you think you'll have another bit of money when that comes around

like the class is very good but personally i think getting the bast game should be the first step but also... i've not really used many of those streaming services for games

[velvet plinth]

I don't usually spend my money on games but maybe I'll get lucky with another card

[tropic crag]

at least not in a long time, so maybe they are better than they used to be like 11 years ago lol

[velvet plinth]

I was given the arbiter dlc otherwise I would have already switched to steam

Thanks for the wisdom

[tropic crag]

yeah that puts you in a bit of a hard place because it raises the price of "buying it" on your own... honeslty if you do get the scum you'll probably have fun, if you're already cool with doing the streaming thing then just keep doing it

[winter tusk]

If you have the option to play this game on mouse and key you shouldn't even look at a controller

[tropic crag]

hope you're able to navigate it

[velvet plinth]

Thanks

[frigid sluice]

What are the combos for the mkvii heavy sword

[candid flint]

if i want to punish my friends when playing this game

i plug in the controller

plaything this game on controller is a fate worse than death

[winter tusk]

https://tenor.com/view/carry-bugs-bunny-gif-26995728

[candid flint]

i do give massive props to the 10% of controller players who can keep up with pc players though

[winter tusk]

More like 0.10%

[rough peak]

idk how good this talent is, but, it feels great with the crowbar

[mighty belfry]

One of the best talents on the tree tbh

[rough peak]

So, uh, do the on kill blessings on the needle gun not work with the dot? I noticed glory hunter doesn't work(I had it on this one I have and it isn't giving me toughness in the meat grinder)

[mighty belfry]

Nope.

Has to be the actual needle.

[rough peak]

That's kinda bs, but, I guess it doesn't surprise me since the talents didn't work with the dot either

[mighty belfry]

Meaning those blessings are nonfunctional essentially.

[rough peak]

Glad I figured that out sooner rather than later

I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess the toughness from elite/special kills from vulture's mark doesn't work with the dot either

[tropic crag]

i like the "weakspot hits give you poor mans vulture dodge" on the needle gun on melee builds tbh

but yeah i don't play enough VM to know how those interact

[rough peak]

With on kill blessings not working on it the only blessings I think I'd take are Ghost, Desperado, Stripped Down, or Run and Gun...

[tropic crag]

yeah i use ghost and run and gun myself but those are basically your options

which is fine because the gun is like... really strong out of the box with no blessings

[rough peak]

Those were the 2 I probably would have gone with, with the alternative being ghost + desperado for crits giving more toxin stacks :/

I don't exactly trust stripped down

[tropic crag]

yeah the extra crits actually aren't bad at all i just didn't think they were needed so i went with run and gun for comfort

[mint epoch]

use the cleave blessing on needler, shoot a climbing horde with the alt fire into few different targets and it´ll blow up the entire chunk of them

[rough peak]

Stripped Down is kind of redundant with the desperado career skill, anyway

[mint epoch]

run and gun is nifty cuz it makes hipfiring easier

i know i don´t have time to ADS with that thing a lot of the time

[rough peak]

That's why I have sticky hands, atm, while leveling

easier shots

[tropic crag]

i don't use the alt fire enough on the needle gun, it feels like cheating

[winter tusk]

I have sticky hands because they're unwashed

[mint epoch]

cheating? against heretics? someone summon the inquisition on this man for complaining about doing righteous work

[rough peak]

My 1st go with the needle gun was with the crowbar, so I completely forgot that the alt fire had aoe

[tropic crag]

cheating... myself out of the fun of a propa bash

[mint epoch]

well the good news is that there is always more heretics to kill

[rough peak]

It's like taking the dueling sword on zealot into a regular damnation run... You're cheating the heretics out of the chance of potentially maybe(if you were to severely fuck up, that is) hurting you a tiny bit

[mint epoch]

i´m a simple man, i see heretics, i mass murder heretics

[rough peak]

Yeah, but, if you do it with the dueling sword you're not mass murdering them... you're using baby toys to corral them

[tropic crag]

a cocktail umbrella is a deadly weapon in the hands of the rejects

[rough peak]

Honestly it wouldn't surprise me if that was more powerful than the dclaw, on a zealot

[tropic crag]

you stab it into a poxie and then open the tiny paper umbrella part and the poxie just explodes

[mint epoch]

we just need a pencil skin for shivs

[rough peak]

I will say... I really missed my dual autopistols on the run I did with the needle gun... going full auto on some hapless heretic is a lot of fun

The not getting punished for spamming the gun use with pickpocket feels really weird to me, since I'm so used to using my gun as a side arm instead of a main weapon

[mint epoch]

hive scum is imperium of mankinds answer to the question of "is it enuff dakka?"

[winter tusk]

should be ogryn or vet but hivescum balance go brrrr

[tropic crag]

i don't think it should be vet, in all the stories of the guard they aren't shooting infinite ammo, its always "try to kill as many of them before they get to us and start doing the same but worse" and the heroes were born from when the ammo ran out

oggy can't count high enough for that much dakka

scum are just darktides slayers at this point but with ranged and melee weapons

[limber cradle]

Its insane to think any class should have infinite ammo tbh

[dim moth]

vet does have infinite ammo tho

just only with las weapons

I have no idea why people are just forgetting shock trooper exists to pretend pickpocket is the only infinite ammo in this game

[winter tusk]

by fatshark las weapons are almost all doodoo

but*

[dim moth]

helbore can 2 shot havoc 40 crushers

laspistol one shot headshots everything smaller than a mauler

recon lasgun

[winter tusk]

https://tenor.com/view/shocked-face-shock-surprised-surprise-monkey-gif-16328898

[dim moth]

infantry lasgun is like mid tho

[winter tusk]

yes theres 2 good las weapons

[dim moth]

3

[winter tusk]

3 if you count one of the pistols

[limber cradle]

Ive actually gone through mission with recon las and never stopped firing once tbh

[dim moth]

all of them are good except for infantry lasguns

[rough peak]

I didn't forget about shock trooper... it's just that pickpocket is a little bit less luck based(or rather a different type of luck... luck that you'll get the kill instead of luck that you'll get the crit)

[winter tusk]

https://tenor.com/view/the-universe-tim-and-eric-mind-blown-mind-blown-meme-mind-explosion-mind-explosion-meme-gif-18002878

[dim moth]

yeah I literally started picking it up again to get the footage and numbers to prove my point that pickpocket is not the reason gun scum is overpowered

gun scum is overpowered because they can ignore game mechanics which lets them play stupidly aggressively with their high mobility

and it just means their weakness of being squishy doesn't matter because they can't be hit by anything thanks to vulture's dodge and desperado

[winter tusk]

i love immunity to all creation

[tropic crag]

and with an excessive amount of damage amps

[dim moth]

gun scum actually has significantly less damage than veteran does

implying both are on gun builds

[tropic crag]

yeah but considering the safety the damage amps on gun scum are still excessive

[dim moth]

a scum with a max damage stimm active using iag is slightly less damage than an exe MMF vet shooting the same enemy also with iag

except the gun scum cannot deal melee damage, and that build for veteran still has their melee essentials

lmao

[tropic crag]

yeah the biggest problem is vultures dodge/ the currently bugged dodges making things easier/ and tox damage to an extent

[tropic crag]

hypercrit does fine on gun scum to make melee good tbh

and its 1 node

[dim moth]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1046912126746374274/1455106126465994782/Warhammer_40000_Darktide_2025.12.29_-_01.51.53.27.mp4?ex=69557eef&is=69542d6f&hm=27f151f04ef9eb418f887b5828c8374ae49137acb4eb47ec979cdb24c90baf80& and also helbore lmao

[winter tusk]

good thing scum doesn't have a big rocket it can just pull out and clear the screen with

melee is essential

[mint epoch]

it´s not the gun, it´s cuz the player is named John Warhammer

[tropic crag]

in a more practical setting i've seen helbores do fine like body shotting crushers in a panic (i don't use them i've just seen it)

[limber cradle]

Imma be deadass that sight is somehow worse than the irons

[dim moth]

I disagree

[limber cradle]

I mean you use it

So I'd hope so

[dim moth]

if they hadn't made the Mk IV irons worse I would not have bothered putting a different one on them

[limber cradle]

Is just

Chunky

Blocks too much vision for me

[dim moth]

it's a helbore them having fucky sights is part of the balancing factor

[winter tusk]

lets just make it bad to balance it instead

[plucky nymph]

If ogryns could use dual stubs, would they hold it with one finger and one thumb like a stim, with pinkie out?

[winter tusk]

they couldnt get their finger in the trigger guard

[limber cradle]

Tbh I don't mind their stock irons

At least last time I looked

[bronze glade]

they're not bad now

[winter tusk]

pretty sure they finally changed the base ones at some point

[bronze glade]

they used to be really bad

[dim moth]

imo Mk Iv irons were made substantially worse

it had the best irons before the change

[limber cradle]

At worst they were always just pistol irons to me.

[bronze glade]

oh i didn't notice, prob because i use mk v

[light phoenix]

Does dodging count for the talent that reduces Threat on Sprint?

[tropic crag]

dodging successfully resets the timer but doesnt proc it or add stacks to my understanding

and successful dodge usually means you have to be getting attacked and not just dodging nothing

[winter tusk]

Weird, i just realized you can hold a heavy on the helbore bayonet pretty much indefinitely

[tropic crag]

so dodging can keep it active but not proc it

[final temple]

believe it or not, I actually prefer playing on controller. but I have a custom mapping.

[tropic crag]

i would die without being able to spin as much as i do tbh

[final temple]

custom response curve makes me 360. it’s more setup than just dialing in the dpi but it works out the same.

that said, PLEASE FS, give us custom controller mapping

[tropic crag]

its more like how rapidly i flick around, i play games on super high sens now adays since a hand injury so like... even if set up right i don't see a controller ever copying the terrible amount of twitches i'll do without be uncontrollable

[rancid coral]

For the record, there is a bug on customizable weaponry

that will make it deal more dmg in psykanium xdd

(and solo play)

[tropic crag]

i've still seen people using the helbore just fine at least, and using it to gib crushers (not usually one shot)

[dim moth]

I will blame for this

[rancid coral]

xddddd

You shouldn't blame fatshark for using mods!!!

[tropic crag]

lol i'm sure like over half the stability complaints are from mod use and that makes it hard to tell which ones are real problems and which ones are self created problems

i miss the old white list of mods they have for vt2

it made figuring out stuff like this easier because FS was looking at all the mods on that list

[trim wind]

its just weapon customization that is fucky really, otherwise some change fs made ages ago made memory run out

for anything else

[rough peak]

gotta say... wasting some rockets to nuke some hapless elites/specials will probably never not be funny to me

[tropic crag]

every time i run the RPG i forgot i'm using it because i mostly use pocket sand... so i'll constantly nuke like 3 ragers or something

because i think i have pocket sand

[rough peak]

I like it cause it gives me a way to do some quick monster damage

and nuke crushers as well >.>

[rancid coral]

rocket good against rotten armour

[rough peak]

the 20% strength from my stim helps it to do more monster damage, on top of what it already does, as well

So, uh, is the dump stat on the needle gun damage? I'm almost 100% sure it is, but, I thought I'd ask

[tropic crag]

i dumped stopping power personally... but yeah damage works

[rough peak]

either would work I guess... it's not like the damage the projectile itself does will ever consistently kill anything :\

outside of maybe uprising

[tropic crag]

yeah, i honestly just rolled until one with either at 60 came up

and stopping power got the lucky spin

you could probably tank any of the stats and not notice it alot... ammo would be the most noticable and its not a huge change tho

the needle pistol just is what it is lol

[rough peak]

... out of all the melee weapons on the hivescum... the knife is the least tempting to me. I don't really like the knife, tho. I'd just take the shivs if I was gonna take a knife

[tropic crag]

yeah normal knife is most boring, but i think thats true for every class

[rough peak]

sure the push attack dps would be pretty legit on the hive scum, but, I don't really care about that

[tropic crag]

not when there are so many other fun options

i'll probably make a knife build one day soonish tho just to try it... i've really liked every melee i've made on scum even meme builds

[rough peak]

I've used the knife on zealot, I just prefer other weapons. I like my melee to have some degree of cleave, which is probably where the knife falls off for me as a player

[winter tusk]

6 is fine for me in auric, using piety

[astral canyon]

what about 5

[winter tusk]

Knives help a lot if you use push attack a lot. If you can use special attack punch and light 1 after even better. Just combo those two, throw a heavy in.

Crushers go byebye

https://tenor.com/view/sopranos-phil-leotardo-gif-15496729393949628351

I havent used the normal combat knives on scum yet, theyre probably pretty insane if the shiv builds are any indication

[final temple]

anything but ammo or mobility is dump and even mobility is more personal choice.

[foggy phoenix]

The shivs seem to be better at everything other than movement

[near mauve]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZl4bDz71jM this man hasnt died in like 8 hours

[winter tusk]

1shotting 2 crushers at a time with shivs is definitely broken. I can only imagine rampage and adrenaline are able make pretty much anything ridiculous.

[foggy phoenix]

Knives on scum seem wasteful.

Whatever good the saw and crowbar was supposed to have, it all went to the shivs

Same way whatever the dual ranged weapons were suposed to have all went to the needle gun

[tropic crag]

bone saw is a super safe and high damage build tbh

crowbar is good if you like it lol

like bonesaw builds are just straight up comfy all rounders

[foggy phoenix]

If I wanted DoT spam, the needle gun exists with pickpocket giving unlimited ammo

As a melee weapon, you'd end up risking yourself longer than if the fight would have ended sooner with a higher base damage output

[tropic crag]

don't let perfect be the enemy of good, you'll lose out on many of the joys of life

also the overhead isn't even hard to weave in and not die and the nice thing about the bonesaw over the chainaxe is that you don't HAVE to latch, you can just smack them so many times

and i mean... you one shot maulers and like 2 shot crushers

so its not low damage

[foggy phoenix]

I still don't understand what they did with the crowbar

[tropic crag]

its trying to be a jack of all trades weapon but with a gimmick special... that always turns out either really bad or so op they nerf it like the shovels

[foggy phoenix]

Could just give scum a shovel and put the crowbar out of its misery

Shovel with either hyper crit or violence would be amazing

[tropic crag]

but yeah bonesaw is kind of really really good for melee focused builds... like yeah you can spam pick pocket needle gun "better" but thats true of all melee weapons compared to scum ranged and ranged in this game is boring

[foggy phoenix]

Could just use the shivs for melee builds.

[tropic crag]

again if you let perfect be the enemy of good then you'll miss out on alot of the joys of life

we're playing a game

so fun is a biiiig factor

[foggy phoenix]

When the game stops demoting me from random screwups from havoc, I'll gladly accept such sagely advice.

[tropic crag]

shivs aren't that much fun tbh, they are mostly spam weapons, weapons like the chaxe and the bonesaw have more to them

[tropic crag]

your weapon choice on scum will not win or lose you the game in havoc... like the scum can make alot of weird things work... so like prio fun so you get better with the tools you pick

[foggy phoenix]

But until I reach clearance 40, anything suboptimal should be recognized as such.

[tropic crag]

honestly if swapping from shivs to bonesaw of all things would cause a loss then its not the weapon thats the problem, the margin shouldn't be that narrow

because you'd be swapping to a higher survivablity build with only a little less dps

so if thats causing a loss then worrying about minute optimal stuff shouldn't be your focus

[foggy phoenix]

The social aspect of "getting accepted into a party" is also another factor.

[tropic crag]

people who judge less tend to get better teams so its a self filtering thing

[foggy phoenix]

Another is the fact that I predominantly play in the HK server for ping reasons, when I don't even speak the language.

[tropic crag]

lol that is fair

[foggy phoenix]

How do you evaluate a stranger

Other than the things they equip

And the talents they pick

One you can't even communicate with

[tropic crag]

you don't tbh, i just trust people will know more or less what they're doing and enter things in good faith, 10 years in this series has taught me that the best players run the most whack stuff like 50% fo the time

[foggy phoenix]

I have to keep a tab with google translate so I can paste screenshots of conversations for clarity.

[final temple]

people who bar you from their group over such miniscule differences in build are usually unreliable in their actual performance.

[tropic crag]

my havoc teams in NA never really talk that much outside of maybe a couple of things here or there... and gg or "try again?" after a loss

so probably server differences there

[tropic crag]

i'm 100% reliable, i'll almost always have one death to dodging off a cliff or dodging into a wall trying (and failing) to dodge and overhead

[foggy phoenix]

With mods, there's literally a way to assess someone's playtime with a class from the levels they play. A veteran with over a thousand levels screwing around might get a pass, but when the majority of players are only about a hundred or two on average, you can't quite make a distinguishment.

[tropic crag]

and all of that is a waste of time tbh, you'll find people with sub 500 hours who are better than people with thousands of hours simply because they've been playing the tide series since vt1

like worrying that much won't actually get you more wins, it just wastes more time

and some people pick the game up quick

[foggy phoenix]

I'll keep judging books by their cover.

[tropic crag]

i just treat everyone the same, i treat you like you can at least function, then if i notice you popping off or struggling in a match i'll adjust my own playstyle

i try to play with the cats, not herd them

[tulip magnet]

Why do people gatekeep havoc 22? 😭 I'm havoc 20 rn what more do you want

[tropic crag]

because bad players don't understand this game is more of a player skill game than a stats game

and bad players are more likely to pass blame off on their team instead of owning up to the parts they played in it

so they get judgy lol

[foggy phoenix]

Funnily enough, there's a scoreboard mod for self (and team) assessment.

[tropic crag]

and most people get confused on what those numbers mean tbh

[tulip magnet]

I hate that people made a scoreboard mod

[tropic crag]

when actually judging peformance

[foggy phoenix]

Of course, whatever shows up on the scoreboard is subject to interpretation.

But the fact that the numbers are there leaves room for evaluation.

[tropic crag]

not even, its almost a garuntee that the person with the mod will be playing differently than a person without the mod, without the mod someone will only do the work they need to do or want to do, someone with the mod will always over perform because they are aware of the numbers

[foggy phoenix]

Because leaving people blind without a factual basis will just make blaming the team easier.

[tulip magnet]

Coop team game. You don't need a scoreboard to know if your team is ass

winning is all that matters

[tropic crag]

the reality is the good players will move more freely and act more calmly and thats not always shown by the numbers

because sometimes the 100% correct play is to basically play safety net for your team, that could lead to you saving the game multiple times... but your stats are going to be very low

[foggy phoenix]

How would one somehow carry the team and somehow have low stats?

[tropic crag]

its the other way around, its why you see so many new players without the mod being so sorry for being bad

[tropic crag]

the fact that you don't understand this is telling

[foggy phoenix]

I'm uh... Convinced by your all-so-altruistic "good players just are" argument. Truly.

No, really. How does one "carry the game" and somehow have low stats on the scoreboard?

[tropic crag]

i don't use the mod, every loss i have i blame myself because there is no world in which i should be falling over outside of the more absurd bs that can happen... but i do mess up alot and half the time i mess up once we lose the game so i can tell its me thats keeping us going without a scoreboard

[brittle sierra]

Finding work in America

[tropic crag]

playing safety net, if the people doing most of the work get caught out in some way and die then a person playing safety net and focusing on that (and basically playing cleanup) can keep the team running smoothly and actually stop bad situations from turning into instant losses

the times i mess up and we don't wipe either someone else is carrying so i'm playing insurance or someone was playing backup for me and picks me up instantly because they saved resources to save me

those people carried when they picked me back up

and same when i picked back up others

[foggy phoenix]

You realize even tanking, including blocking, damage taken, stations/crates used and staggering enemies are also included in a scoreboard, right?

So I ask again- How does one "carry the team" and not have evidence of that burden on the scoreboard?

[tropic crag]

yes, playing backstop sometimes means standing around depending on the games modifiers... obviously in h40 the stats would be alot higher but still low compared to the rest of the team

[foggy phoenix]

You can literally chalk it up to the class/build, which may have a lower damage potential compared to the rest.

[candid flint]

I've had many games where I was the ""safety net man"" and still did very, very good damage. 1st place. 2nd place. 3rd place, with 500-800k dmg. You can be, and do both

[tropic crag]

by being the one who stopped a loss by turning it into a win

[tropic crag]

so you think.. that choosing to stand and only play react to a team of 3 that is killing it already is.... a stat based thing

because i'm lazy at this game, i'll only work as hard as my team makes me... if 3 people are tearing it up, i'll just make sure they're comfy man... how is that build based?

i play this game to relax man, i'm not gonna sweat until i'm made to

[foggy phoenix]

I'm saying you can make generalizations of the expected performance of a player based on the class they play and role they have taken.

[tropic crag]

yeah and that means you'll deny people like me , so you'll be cutting out some of the best players because they chose to be lazy when others chose to over work

[woeful trellis]

tauntgryn will look pretty bad compared to inferno psyker since (iirc) every tiny enemy that gets tagged by inferno counts as a stagger

[foggy phoenix]

Deny you on what grounds?

[woeful trellis]

but having a good tauntgryn makes h40 a walk in the park

[candid flint]

do you know what true level you are? what titles or borders have you unlocked?

like if you have true survivor, or havoc 40 title unlocked, or twins hard mode profile banner thingy

im not going to pass over you

[tropic crag]

yes, and for my skill level i'm low on most of those things because i've been playing these games for 10 years so i don't play them as every day as i used to

[candid flint]

but if you have none of those, yes i am. and i cant be blamed for that

[candid flint]

even if your true level was, low, if you had true survivor or whatever the havoc 40 title is called (i forgot atm) your pickrate should be decent

[foggy phoenix]

^

[candid flint]

if you do not have those, ofc you will be rejected

[woeful trellis]

true survivor was also much easier to get in season 1 than it is now

cuz if you were killed from full without being downed you didn't lose eligibility

it's how i got mine

[tropic crag]

i don't get denied like that often tbh even with my meme builds, i'm just saying that when i make parties i just accept everyone with names i like being first to get in

[candid flint]

even with my 3k hours, if i didnt display my havoc 40 title ect. i would expect to be rejected, and wouldnt blame people for rejecting me

because how else are they to measure me

[tropic crag]

oh i go in without any title, or sometimes a jokey really easy title

[foggy phoenix]

Cookie cutter builds are boring, but they at least tell people who can inspect you that you know what you're doing, and what your role is.

[tropic crag]

but usually i never use titles because i forget to set them

[candid flint]

then your rejection in these cases is 100% self inflicted

i will reject you, and feel no remorse, because you didnt make the effort to atleast show what you are capable of

[tropic crag]

which is overly dumb and gatekeepy lol, i dealt with the same in vt2, there wasn't very many slayers better than me at one point but people HATED letting me into groups because of how i presented myself in game

[candid flint]

is it really that dumb of me to prefer someone who looks more capable?????

[light phoenix]

Hello

How to build Bonesaw for a melee Rampage build?

[tropic crag]

i assume people trying to look capable are making up for something tbh

[foggy phoenix]

Interacting with the party finder to find people to play the hardest mode the game has to offer with
Some guy with a meme build shows up in your invite telling you to give him a chance, as you're staring at the last demotion chance for that clearance rank.
wdyd

[candid flint]

is it really that dumb of an employer to ignore the applicant with an empty resume, and wait for someone with a filled out complete resume????

[tropic crag]

like thats how i view it when i see peopl ein game

[candid flint]

is it gatekeepy of that employer?

[tropic crag]

thats not the same at all and its actually dumb to compare the two situations when you step back and look at them and the dynamics at play

you are not the other players employer, you are their peer

[candid flint]

dont argue the semantics

i know you can see the point i am trying to make

[foggy phoenix]

I don't know about you, but when people are playing on the highest difficulty, people are kind of expecting indicators that whoever they invite to the party won't be a liability.

[tropic crag]

what right to i have to sit here and judge my peers in that way and pretend like they own me anything more than i own them

[tropic crag]

yeah and i disagree with it on a fundemental level lol

[candid flint]

in a high difficulty game mode, i am not an asshole for being choosy about my companions. i am an asshole if interact with potential companions poorly, and call them names, shit on them ect.

[foggy phoenix]

A rudimentary scoreboard should be implemented in darktide like it was in vt

[tropic crag]

and arguing semantics would be me pointing out that this isn't semantics at all, semantics is arguing over the meaning of words and not the context of an idea

[candid flint]

but for just trying to pick the best companions? that is not gatekeepy. that is just trying to win in a difficult gamemode

there is a difference

[foggy phoenix]

A difficult game mode with consequences for failure

I'll rest on my laurels when I finally get clearance 40

Then I can do all the havoc I want and not give a shit about demotions

[dim moth]

there is no way to do this beyond checking if someones build follows a vague semblance of sanity

[tropic crag]

i would actually consider you an asshole because people need to be bad in that environment before getting used to it, so i would be glad that you denied me which is how this all started and i said "its a self filtering thing" lol

[dim moth]

too many people have been carried to their true survivor titles now

[limber cradle]

There is genuinely no indicator

[tropic crag]

AND CARRIED TO H40 BY FRIENDS AND STUFF

[limber cradle]

I'm at the point where I trust true survivors less.

[dim moth]

I would like to be carried to h40 so that I can PLAY THE FUCKING GAME MODE at least

[foggy phoenix]

True Level and Inspect from Party Finder the best QoL mods for havoc

[limber cradle]

They always die first time

[candid flint]

i dont even have true survivor, and i have seen so many with it perpetually stuck on the floor

[tulip magnet]

I think they intentionally didn't do a scoreboard because it invites toxicity

[dim moth]

yeah and then add a ranked system that punishes you for failure

[foggy phoenix]

Fine. Make scoreboard exclusive to havocs then

[dim moth]

inviting the most toxic atmosphere imaginable

[tropic crag]

out of every 50 people with fancy titles i see 45 of them hit the ground before me... the other 5 are like... great battle buddies for the mission, true fun

[tulip magnet]

Punishes? Bro you only need to win 1 in every like 6 missions to rank up

[limber cradle]

3

Be accurate at least

[tropic crag]

honestly... i have like... 30k hours or more in pvp games with ranked systems... and this one is super not punishing

[foggy phoenix]

Where is this mythical land of 6 losses

[tropic crag]

yeah its less than 6

[tulip magnet]

no, because you don't need to win 1 in 3 to rank up consistenty

[limber cradle]

Its punishing enough that people demand certain loadouts tbf

[tulip magnet]

you can lose rank and go up again

[tropic crag]

i think those people are wanting a rank they dont' deserve and blaming others

[foggy phoenix]

From complete strangers, no less.

[dim moth]

and some of those loadouts they demand are actively weak but compensate for shit play

[foggy phoenix]

And in my case, from ones you can't communicate with since they have a different language.

[dim moth]

please for the love of god stop using chorus

[foggy phoenix]

It raises the floor for performance, at least.

[tropic crag]

right? you bring in something that fucking sparkles when played by a good player and people will call you trash on sight

[final temple]

No amount of stats can guarantee individual performance. Nothing replaces experience with the individual players and the team comp

[foggy phoenix]

Even if the scum plays like absolute dogshit, tox nades and needle pistol + pickpocket is still a reliable way to deal with anything short of a shielded boss

[tropic crag]

chorus feels so bad... its like... ok thanks for the vet shout i guess i'll kill these guys for you

[dim moth]

vet shout but without the good stagger, and it makes you down a teammate for 5 seconds before it gives you a damage boost

Awesome!

[tropic crag]

i HATE those sorts of players that crutch their way up, because they will ALWAYS let you down if you make a single mistake and its on them to help you

[dim moth]

also on a class that is 100% reliant on their ability to do good damage

[foggy phoenix]

Given how havoc works, the first engagements before the medicae is often the fastest and best indicator for whether or not you'll even make it through to the end.

Unless the game throws like, 4 bosses at you

And a hexbound in a corner, for good measure.

[dim moth]

gloriana moment

[tropic crag]

for me its usually things are fine till me and the other good person mess up at the same time, if there are no other good people and its just me on h40 we'll struggle bus for a bit then die

[foggy phoenix]

I LOVE GRINDING HAVOC RANKS I LOVE GRINDING HAVOC RANKS I LOVE GRINDING HAVOC RANKS I LOVE GRINDING HAVOC RANKS I LOVE GRINDING HAVOC RANKS I LOVE GRINDING HAVOC RANKS I LOVE GRINDING HAVOC RANKS I LOVE GRINDING HAVOC RANKS I LOVE GRINDING HAVOC RANKS I LOVE GRINDING HAVOC RANKS I LOVE GRINDING HAVOC RANKS I LOVE GRINDING HAVOC RANKS I LOVE GRINDING HAVOC RANKS

[tropic crag]

honestly if you don't have fun grinding the havoks then just play aurics

they are relaxed

as a break

[foggy phoenix]

But really, some runs, you just get your teeth kicked in with the Twins, some bosses and rotten armor packs thrown at you at the same time

The director may not just want you to win that particular time.

[rough peak]

Anyone else find it a bit weird how the dual autopistols do more damage per shot than the normal autopistol?

[limber cradle]

The director feels absolutely insane rn tbh

No consistency

[tropic crag]

that even can happen in aurics tbh with bad trappers spawns and stuff now adays

[dim moth]

I also find it a little strange how the dual autopistols are one of if not the only automatic ranged weapon in the game to not have a crit string

[foggy phoenix]

How about the fact the dual uzis have more believable ammo sizes for their magazines

[dim moth]

https://fximgur.com/a/IHT0r76

[rough peak]

I guess that could be the "sacrifce" you get for having 2... I guess on top of a bit under half for the close maniac adm and a bit less for the close unyielding adm

[foggy phoenix]

Maelstroms, you mean. Aurics shouldn't give much trouble given that the director is literally mandated to give you breathing room, compared to havocs

[limber cradle]

Most maelstroms atp for me are zzz unless the other 3 team members are actually awful

Havoc is rot armor spam tho

And i hate running forced loadouts for it

[foggy phoenix]

I just don't play maelstroms with shit modifiers

[limber cradle]

Its the only thing I play outside havoc for my own amusement

[foggy phoenix]

If it says extra bursters and barrels, and/or waves of mutants, I ain't touching it

Otherwise, anything else is fair game

Because I haven't felt as much fear as I did, playing Gloriana with literally every barrel spawn being present, and a literal conga line of bursters showing up every minute

[dim moth]

It used to be SO nice but then no it has to apply to melee now too

So only the absolute best carapace killing melees in the game can do anything

Awesome

Thanks Fatshark really cool

[limber cradle]

Rot armor isn't even hard you just spam tox or kraks

Its a mental endurance check

But my god it makes missions unfun cause loadout check

[foggy phoenix]

I like to think this move was intended to popularize scum and their needle pistol spam

[dim moth]

incidentally also a braincell check for anybody on the team with a bolter

[tropic crag]

i kind of like it because i like when things aren't killed fast but yeah it can be a slog if you play it too much too often

[foggy phoenix]

Rotten armor gave scum a job a psyker otherwise would've been called for.

[limber cradle]

I hate rot armor blight cause I run needler box

I hate using box

I hate using needler

[rough peak]

Oh, the dual autopistols at least don't get the extra stagger while bracing them like the normal autopistol does(cause it totally makes sense that bracing the weapon makes it stagger more...)

[limber cradle]

So now I just play a different game lmfao

[dim moth]

coincidentally the exact thing I run all the time lmao

[foggy phoenix]

2 weeks since they returned rotten armor mod to havoc

[tropic crag]

run rampage adren lol

[foggy phoenix]

And I'm confident my sanity is being eroded

[limber cradle]

If you like it more power to you but this loadout actually bores me so badly I want to play a different game

[rough peak]

At least you probably have more extra sanity to erode than I do

[tropic crag]

this is why using optimal stuff isn't worth the more struggle you avoid by just playing what you like... losing with something you find engaging is better than winning like its a job you're trying to excel at

[rough peak]

[idle ore]

its your group lol

you can choose or deny anyone you want

[foggy phoenix]

One day, I'll retire from havoc and do nothing but aurics

Then I'll finally do things like using the crowbar unironically

[idle ore]

if you rlly want qp with "no judgement" just post your 40 and then accept the first 3 ppl that apply

[limber cradle]

Rot armor is a hard loadout check

[limber cradle]

I do ts when I wait 15 minutes and no one shows up lmfao

[tropic crag]

i generally do this when i host yeah

[idle ore]

what server?

[limber cradle]

NAE

[idle ore]

hmm

thats unlucky

[limber cradle]

I agree

[tropic crag]

yeah but its not as limited as just the one build... like you can still do ok with only a bit more struggle with the other near meta builds

[foggy phoenix]

Oops, no kraks
Oops, no penetrating flames
Oops, no psyker
Oops, no grenadier gauntlet
Oops, no bolter

Time to backtrack and hope there's enough map to retreat back into

[limber cradle]

It isn't, but i don't really like many things that are good for "oops all carapace"

[foggy phoenix]

And, more recently, oops, no tox scum

[tropic crag]

i feel like scum has more options than other classes tbh... besides like oggys who also have alot of options for carapace moments

[foggy phoenix]

Gauntlet and Branx Pick. Nothing else.

Rumbler, if I'm feeling like an ammo hog

[tropic crag]

like all of scums blitz options are good against carapace swarms, and a good chunk of the weapons also do fine enough to work

[limber cradle]

Blackouts are only good if you path right which i tbh don't normally do

[foggy phoenix]

Now that I think about it- I don't think I've seen a single rumbler ogryn in the past 2 weeks.

[tropic crag]

most of their melee can kill and cc at the same time so the time to kill i is less... yeah theres more reliance on being actually good but they can work, with more struggle like i said

[limber cradle]

I don't like the other nades cause no regen

[foggy phoenix]

Everyone's gone gren gauntlet for the special

[limber cradle]

The scum ranged weapon for RA is needler

Needler feels awful to use imo

If it's blight spreads too

You want to run box

[dim moth]

The yhave been a PLAGUE on my games

[tropic crag]

as long as you get the tox node yeah thats when they are good with carapace

but you're making the build so you'd know if it needed that to help fill the hole

[limber cradle]

As I literally just said

I do not path right normally

[foggy phoenix]

Not in the HK server, they ain't.

Rumbler carpet bombers unite

[mystic rain]

whats considered the "meta" build?

[candid flint]

where hk server??? i have hk mk23, sp5 and usp

?? ? ?? ????? ??

[foggy phoenix]

Hong Kong.

[tropic crag]

i like the needle gun but i would hate to use it as a main weapon, i'll use it to put one needle into a bunch of crushers sometimes (not the aoe alt fire) to soften them up before slamming into them

[candid flint]

(ik i was jk)

[limber cradle]

Melee feels bad on box ime

Which i take

Because of blight

[tropic crag]

i've been enjoying the box melee when i've tested it but honestly you could just not try to cheese the blight... which sucks but is doable

[limber cradle]

For the nth time I'll just play a diff game until havoc modifiers don't suck ass

[tropic crag]

its honestly why i don't let havoc become my main mode, i don't want to deal with my main way of playing swapping that much, i treat it as a silly side mode

[foggy phoenix]

The rotten armor modifiers will continue until morale improves.

[tropic crag]

like stadium in overwatch lol

its just a silly side mode

[limber cradle]

Okay, and when you find auric maels genuinely boring what else do you do

[foggy phoenix]

Auric maelstroms aren't boring so long as the map has a bottomless cliff and all the barrel spawns active

[tropic crag]

then you find a different game, every time i find auric boring that means i'm bored of the game in general so i step back for some time and work on other games, its why i've been able to play these games for like a decade

without breaks in general i don't think anyone can keep enjoying a tide game

[limber cradle]

I find auric maels boring because irregardless of class they don't threaten me

[idle ore]

auric is boring

the maelstrom with more bosses is the only fun one

[limber cradle]

I play havoc because it's where the game has actual risk of death

[idle ore]

^

[limber cradle]

The event in auric was pretty goddamn fun tbh

[foggy phoenix]

Going back to auric after nonstop havoc was like... Where's the horde?

[limber cradle]

The shrines

[idle ore]

yea the shrines were sick

[limber cradle]

Yeah, this

[tropic crag]

i don't play to be threatened, i play it for the same reason i played l4d so much, to goof around and just relax to something comfy... like havoc doesn't threaten me it just cheats

which is why i treat it as the silly mode

[limber cradle]

Okay, I don't do that.

[foggy phoenix]

There was such a noticeable gap between hordes that I was wondering if I was even in the correct difficulty

[limber cradle]

My sense of fun comes from being challenged

Its why I do not play hd2

[tropic crag]

every once in a while in auric the hordes will feel... double or something in the more recent patches, normal auric players will drop like flies to them, but its just once in a while

[tropic crag]

yeah hd2 is like an easy version of edf now adays lol

i don't play hd2 as much as darktide but i'll dabble in it

[foggy phoenix]

No flying anime girls in questionable uniforms, though

[limber cradle]

And rot armor doesn't feel like a real challenge

It feels like artificial difficulty

Where you are incentivized to bring certain weapons or get fucked

I think it's comical the thammer can't even one shot RA Crushers when you get high enough and that's the only gimmick that thing has going for it

[foggy phoenix]

I have a love/hate relationship with Thammers

[limber cradle]

I hate that thing lmfao

[foggy phoenix]

On one hand

Haha funni bonk instakill

On the other hand

[dusty solstice]

do you guys use 75s stims with stim supply + chemical dependency?

[foggy phoenix]

Oh shit, he survived the swing
He surived the swiiiiiiing

[foggy phoenix]

Ye.

[limber cradle]

If i am also using sample collector, yes

[tropic crag]

yeah if you have sample collector it works fine because samp collector gives alot of cd

[dusty solstice]

would it be better over vultures mark?

[foggy phoenix]

You can stim yourself + use the supply crate for get 2 stacks of chem dep

[dusty solstice]

if im trying for ranged shenanigans

[foggy phoenix]

VM only benefits ranged weapons in general.
Chem dep works on all builds and all weapons, and gives you both damage reduction and CD reduction

And uh

Flat crit chance bonuses

Chem dep is what makes scum such crit spammers

[tropic crag]

honestly even without chem dep you can spam more crits than everyone except melee pysker, so they kind of start at a high baselevel

[foggy phoenix]

50% crit chance is more or less what you'll be experiencing with max stacks of chem dep, going even higher with talents and weapon blessings

[tropic crag]

and with how much you swing in this game 50% might as well be 100% in terms of you just knowing you're gonna crit regularly

[foggy phoenix]

Given that half your hits with any weapon will be crits, there's a lot of synergy with either hyper crit/hyper violence.

[dusty solstice]

i dont think i have enough points to fit all of that with a ranged build >_<

[foggy phoenix]

Nah. You do.

[tropic crag]

you probably get similar uptime of those sorts of things but with less actuall crit rate with adren and crit built into the build if you don't feel like remembering to upkeep the chem dep

[foggy phoenix]

If I'm not suffering a rotten armor modifier, I just run a desp build with chem dep

[tropic crag]

but you'll miss out on some of the perks

like the corruption clearing and stuff

if you pair box with chem dep i mean

[foggy phoenix]

The CD reduction from chem dep + curio combat ability reductions means that after you use desperado, the cooldown goes from like

60

To 34s

And that's unlimited ammo every half minute between desp uses

And you'll be criting with half the bullets you shoot

[tropic crag]

gun builds are never fun for me

[foggy phoenix]

If you're running stimm supply with chem dep as a ranged build, that works too. Bare minimum is taking pickpocket.

[tropic crag]

i feel like box and chem dep work better as melee since you'll be in a better place to spread the box love but like... maybe i'm too bonk brain coded

[foggy phoenix]

Needle pistol + pickpocket on stimm supply build pretty much annihilates crusher packs

[tropic crag]

so does 2 tox pocket sands if your teams like half awake so the scum has options

i just felt like going ranged on box loses value on the team buffs

which isn't major

but its still something

[light phoenix]

How so, may I ask?

[tight musk]

Toxin damage is strong against carapace, needle gun is all toxin, pickpocket gives it effectively infinite ammo.

[tropic crag]

you just kind of stack your chem dep stacks and use the aoe against them

and the crit makes stacks stack faster

like even without any buffs the needle gun can do that but you'll run out of ammo in havoc trying to do it against every pack without pickpocket

[light phoenix]

Aoe? The special fire mode of Needlegun?

[tropic crag]

yeah on the mark that isn't the default

the default marks aoe is just a cc but the other one spreads tox

[light phoenix]

I still get confused which mark is which

[tropic crag]

checking now because i forgot which one i have on since i don't use the alt fire that much myself

the mk2 is the poison spread one

[tight musk]

Mk II spreads love, MK VI makes boom. The boom is pretty weak, but Mk VI adds more stacks on crits and headshots in both modes.

[tropic crag]

i keep wanting to test the boom more on melee builds because maybe it has some ok uses

[tight musk]

If you only want to use the yellow mode, Mk VI is better.

[zenith fern]

If you are already using a melee build, you might wanna go straight to single target mark

If your melee can deal with hordes enough

[tropic crag]

yeah i just meant actually trying to use the cc to replace the times i would use blinders... but like... not really

i was trying to think of use cases for the cc aoe out of boredom more than anything

unlike the bonesaws alt mode i can see maybe getting a small amount of use out of the cc aoe... maybe

[rough peak]

Hm... do you guys think this would be enough to give the mk3/mk6 knife the ability to cleave some hordlings? I saw a mear perfect knife and got it just cuz I could. I am not too keen on using it due to the low cleave, tho...

[tight musk]

Also both marks can spread 1 stack of toxin in an AoE if you shoot the ground near enemies in blue mode, but that won't apply the special effects of the blue mode (explosion/tox spread).

[rough peak]

It's like 3 cleave, or whatever, on the knife's lights iirc

[glad latch]

iirc with the shivs it lets you cleave like 1 extra poxwalker, probably same for the single knife.

[compact depot]

how can i tell my stim cd

[rough peak]

iirc you can't see the cd remaining without a mod, otherwise the stimm lab tab says the cd

[rough peak]

Here's the mod's link, in case you wanted to get it https://www.nexusmods.com/warhammer40kdarktide/mods/653

[astral canyon]

You can see it

Its just really hard to tell

[zenith fern]

I don't use it on my combat knives builds and still deals enough hordes

[rough peak]

Ty for the correction

[astral canyon]

Mear

[rough peak]

Didn't remember <.<'

[zenith fern]

I forgot which knife mark is that the heavies are wide sweeps and push attacks are stabs

[glad latch]

That mod should be in the basegame tbh. It's basically impossible to see the cooldown otherwise.

[woeful hill]

6

[zenith fern]

But you can mix heavies and lights for hordes

[zenith fern]

I don't think I am not gonna drop Mk6 knife, it is too good for scum and I prefer it more over mk3

[spiral horizon]

Mk67

[rough peak]

A couple points short for some people, but, I'll take it

[zealous ravine]

https://tenor.com/view/rabbit-bunny-bnuuy-gas-leak-meme-gif-8252508646824824494

[rough peak]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1046914150363844779/1334710158525202443/99vpAu6.gif

Take that!

ngl I am too much of a scrub to pull that off, myself

[zealous ravine]

https://tenor.com/view/scary-terrifying-horror-bunny-roomba-gif-3761752394286498185

[limber cradle]

Am I flying too close to the sun rn(shivs+macs)

Stimm looks like this

[winter tusk]

https://tenor.com/view/eric-andre-let-me-out-gif-18252480

[candid flint]

https://tenor.com/view/fallout-fuck-fucked-get-fucked-fallout-new-vegas-gif-568499856954385743

[tight rock]

Vraks autogun or Dual Autos, similar but which is better

[limber cradle]

Use both, make your own decision

Vraks is better at range

Macs are better with mobility

After using vraks I still prefer macs

After using macs some people prefer vraks

[tight rock]

I have used both, I like vraks more for general stuff but seems worse for the melee elites

[candid flint]

I prefer dual autos

[zenith fern]

More on just armored ones

Maulers are fine by shooting in the chest but good luck with scab ragers

[tight rock]

yeah...

[zenith fern]

"Yeah yeah yeah EAT IT!"
scab ragers eating bullets for breakfast

[bronze glade]

just hit the head

[azure scroll]

For stimm while using shivs, I can't decide between the Crit and Rending.

[flat lotus]

queue into auric maelstrom
vet in party looks at hive scum build
"yikes..."
instantly leaves
i look to see what was so bad

[gaunt onyx]

i usually take the rendinf for crushers

[gaunt onyx]

rending backstab is good right?

[flat lotus]

backstab.

just use uncanny.

[gaunt onyx]

im like life, i find a way

crushers and rager i could easily dodge behind.... others idk

im still trying to figure out how to build the hive scum honestly

[fast surge]

I'd stay just to laugh when the guy goes down and insta leaves

[gaunt onyx]

and ive only JUST started using the shivs

[flat lotus]

That's actually what just happened

how prophetic

[fast surge]

[flat lotus]

I like Uncanny/Riposte on the shivs.

Some people use precog instead of riposte though.

[gaunt onyx]

thanks for the recommendation, i will use later

[flat lotus]

everytime i see bleed builds i immediately think of that fucking flesh tearer/lacerate gif

[flat lotus]

there it is

[gaunt onyx]

bleed is super nice

[flat lotus]

sometimes.

sometimes.

[gaunt onyx]

hey, let me enjoy it when i can :3

[trim wind]

My work lives on

[woeful hill]

it lives

[flat lotus]

thx for making my favorite meme

[flat lotus]

if i see bleed knife vet i will contemplate leaving

[brittle sierra]

you know what

as a psyker it makes sense

😈

[gaunt onyx]

what if they are just him though

[flat lotus]

dont care

[gaunt onyx]

plus i havent used knive yet

actually used it once

[flat lotus]

bleed ogryn fine though

[gaunt onyx]

my buddy who plays zealot likes it

[flat lotus]

they are foolish

[ripe seal]

despite having nearly the same reload speed, the reload on the dual stubs feels so much worse than on hte single shredder

[tropic crag]

this feels super whatever for auric, they can kill the bulwarks

[gaunt onyx]

to use the combat knife?

[mighty belfry]

bleed knife vet is real though

[flat lotus]

they died in the first two minutes and quit

[tropic crag]

judge them off that then not the whack build lol

[mighty belfry]

flesh tearer uncanny go hard with serrated

[flat lotus]

both is good

[tropic crag]

i keep wanting to try backstab builds for the memes tbh

bleed meme is too good to be that funny and that was the last meme i tried

[ripe seal]

backstab builds are fun but scum only gets 1 skill to enable them to get backstabs and its finnicky

[gaunt onyx]

idk how back stab even works, like 90 percent of the time it doesnt even proc

when it does, its fucking amazing

[tropic crag]

nimble is kind of enough to keep rotating behind tbh, the extended dodge means you can just keep going behind them

[tropic crag]

and its probably got a weird hitbox but i've not tested it

[gaunt onyx]

ah if you ever wanna test, the meat grinder is a nice relaxed place

unlike what the name implies

[flat lotus]

I LOADED INTO A SECOND MATCH

FUCKING PROPHETIC

thats so funny

[tropic crag]

lol i run a meme bleed build that works really well tbh, but it required a good amount of fiddling to get it to have an answer to everything and alot of weird combo tech

[ripe seal]

why not just run bleed on crit, vet can get pretty good base crit rate for it

[tropic crag]

but i just run bleed and bleed on my meme build

i see people dip on my games when i run it and then we just win

[gaunt onyx]

recon lazer is peak

[tropic crag]

they are probably doing both but on vet its weird to do that with the knife because like... you want heads on knife i think

[gaunt onyx]

bro actually might not use the knive

[tropic crag]

yeah it might just be a like couple times a mission thing

[ripe seal]

i've doing that on my desperado build, use crit on bleed and rending so I have a tool to deal with crusher armor

about 50% crit with butterfly active just stacks up a nice amount of bleed and the free rending means no having to deal with sawing like I was doing before

[tropic crag]

lol that might be their logic if they mostly use their gun

[ripe seal]

fire on crit does a decent amount to help but the knife is a nice back up weapon with the dodges too, unless you're going for a push attack the second best weapon I can think of defensively would be a devil claw with parry spamming

i've gotten good luck against crusher and rager hordes that way

[burnt vapor]

on the shivs whats a good dump stat

[limber cradle]

Mobility

[burnt vapor]

okie dokie

[flat lotus]

Truth nuke

[gaunt onyx]

yeah, kinda what i was thinking. since my partner plays veteran with plasma gun

[ripe seal]

Plasma gun is alot of fun but you can’t really fully use it day to day for everything like you can desperado or the recon with stormtrooper

I miss using the plasma gun, I haven’t used it in ages since I maxed it out forever ago and want to level up other guns

[main wagon]

I just have to stop playing plasmoid because it starts to feel dirty after a couple games

On the bright side every time I start to feel icky I just swap to another class, and continue until all weeklies are done

Then watch it all go down the toilet as Melk gives my Scum wound and health curios

[shy blaze]

hey, hivescum can put poison with melee atk or smthing ? or just the grenade ?

[fast surge]

Yes you can get toxin on Crits I believe

And bonesaw has toxin

[shy blaze]

do i need to use a specific talent for that ?

[fast surge]

Yes

[shy blaze]

im leveling my hivescum

wich one ?

[fast surge]

It's called coated weaponry, near bottom right

[shy blaze]

what are called poison build on hivescum ?

[fast surge]

You can check the pins, cole has a bonesaw build which uses the rampage ability and adrenaline keystone

[ripe seal]

all of the stuff that synergies with poison is in the bottom right side of the tree

[dim moth]

I hope they buff it to the stratosphere so I can become inferno psyker 2

[shy blaze]

owkayyy ty !

[ripe seal]

the cleaver does actually feel nice for hordes with the light-heavy chain but pretty much every talent that benefits from poison cares about them having any amount of poison

[tulip magnet]

Captain shields may be my most hated mechanic

such a fun-killer

[flat lotus]

honest to god would prefer them to have way more health over the shield system

[ripe seal]

rampage against captains is actually pretty fun since you get to farm it forever against them, melee shred through the shield way better than gunfire so it just turns into a face roll beatdown

but yeah, it makes them so much more annoying compared to the other bosses, even if they have a built in self stun

[zenith fern]

Don't be killjoy, be a killer

[zenith fern]

The shield pulses and bursts should just sent scum flying across the room

[ripe seal]

yeah, both having to break it over and over and the pulse on break sucks

[zenith fern]

I think that yesterday I was fighting captain as the shield popped, you know he gets staggered on his knees and when I activated rampage on that frame he just gets thrown and falls to the floor

That made me think an idea if that is how it works everytime

[ripe seal]

the shout effect on rampage should have the same stagger effect as veteran but with half the range

[zenith fern]

Yes

[shy blaze]

i do,nt understand a talent '' practiced deployment '', i cant pick up stims to reset the timer, because i got my special stim ?

[zenith fern]

Just kinda did not expected to stack to the captain if that is what actually happened

[ripe seal]

when you stim comes off cooldown, the crate goes off cooldown to

so it doesn't matter if there was 1 second left on the cooldown or 60, the moment your stim refreshes, your crate refreshes too

i think the staggers from the shouts outside of zealot and maybe ogryn don't reapply until their current stagger ends, but being able to chain that makes sense

[zenith fern]

Very balanced ability

[shy blaze]

but i got 75 sec cd

[zenith fern]

Now if you have a 30+ seconds stimm, that's where it becomes more fun

[zenith fern]

What's your stimm?

[ripe seal]

thanks to sample collector, your should be cooling down your stim faster than the crate naturally goes on cooldown

[zenith fern]

75s is quite too long if you are to utilize the crate

[shy blaze]

cant send screen bvut im at last one on crit bonus ( up right )

[zenith fern]

That goes up to 75s? Did not remember being like that

[ripe seal]

yeah it can be a problem, with good horde clera and big enough waves you can make it work but I have had trouble before where my stim doesn't get off cooldown until my stack of dependancy wears off when runninghte node for mroe stacks but reduced duration, going down from 4 stacks to 3 its not a problem, but when I go from 1 stacks to 0 it beccomes a pain

yeah, 75 with all points used

I think every 15 points is an extra 30 seconds since the base cooldown is what, 15 seconds?

[zenith fern]

I really go as far of having 30-40 seconds cd stimm for crate and most of melee builds

[shy blaze]

im not max lvl for now maybe thats why ?

[ripe seal]

something I liked doing with running it is maxing out 1 tree and doing everything but the final level of the toughness in hte top left, that final node isn't worth bothering with at all and it gives a noticable different in cooldown

[zenith fern]

You might be using too much of the points, I have started playing scum no stimm and honestly scum still as strong if not stronger without it if you are skilled

[shy blaze]

so when my special stimm reset, it also reset my box, right ? my capacity

[woeful hill]

Yes

if you take the talent

[grand jewel]

you can also place the crate with the stim on cooldown and still get the effects by walking out of it and back into it

[shy blaze]

okii and what the surgeon bone weapon do with his special atk ? turning in purple but do not damage over time, what does it do ?

[ripe seal]

i feel like you're always better off taking the upgrade that makes it run out quicker but the stim effect lingers, as long as you stay inside the crate hte entire time you get the full duration but you get to be mobile, which is good since the crate range is pretty small

it applies brittleness, so you and everyone else get better rending

[shy blaze]

and what is trending ? XD sorry

[ripe seal]

armor piercing pretty much

[shy blaze]

ooowxh oki

thanks a lot !

[ripe seal]

if your weapon does 100 damage but it has 50% penetration against flak, it'll only do 50% damage, but if you add 25% rending, it'll have 75% damage against flak so it'd be doing 75 damage

[zenith fern]

I usually do go as far of these paths for my builds, sometimes really only Strength/Spur 3

[ripe seal]

buffing rending only buffs your armor penetration, while applying brittle buffs the armor penetration from all attacks from anyone

[shy blaze]

trying to make a full toxic dot build hehe

[shy blaze]

ooooh okay

[zenith fern]

Rending will also only gonna apply to enemies starting at maniac up to unyielding

[ripe seal]

i feel like you probably want to stick with the poison and only swap to the brittle against something big like a crusher if your teammates are attacking them so they do more damage

[zenith fern]

I might be up to something

[tight musk]

I feel like this could use the "-threat when sprinting" talent, don't remember what it's called.

[fast surge]

Rending backstab is cringo

[zenith fern]

but funny meme

[true bear]

Anyone got a new player build?

[prime violet]

If you're new try this

[tight musk]

That was my build when I first played scum, highly recommend.

Really good for the first mission you play.

[flat mist]

There’s about 8 talents you’re taking that will add less damage than the other rampage node

[rough peak]

idk, that's a pretty advanced build for a newbie like myself... I only have almost 2.5k hours in darktide, how am I supposed to handle a build this complicated?!

[zenith fern]

https://tenor.com/view/shh-cats-gif-14317670277085954258

People dont know this is a meme build

[rough peak]

I took 1 look at the knife and figured that out, after you said something

ruthless backstab? What is this, a shroudfield build?!

[zenith fern]

Surprise I was doing a VEG3 and the rending stacks did a funny boss damage on the back

like 20% from a normal boss

[rough peak]

Not bad, for a non-zealot in 1 hit without a blitz use

While leveling I've been popping a 20% strength stim and using the rocket for monsters, just cuz I lack any real dedicated sort of build so far

Nuking monsters with the rocket is funny to me

[balmy radish]

i take rather the normal knife then shivs

[rough peak]

For me it's the opposite... but that's cause I am not especially a fan of the knife, cuz of the low cleave

the shivs at are kind of the same, tho

[balmy radish]

mk6 variant with cleave increase from kills

[rough peak]

Funny you should say that since the mk6 is the one I prefer for the knife

and not even cause of the higher potential dps of push attack spam(since the mk6's push attack is slightly faster) <.<

I've never been a fan of the mk3 knife

It just isn't my kind of weapon

[grand jewel]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/993501379463225425/1453404938767040624/image0.gif

[rough peak]

Gottem

[tulip magnet]

Truth, I ran this on my first mission, and a slight deviation of it for the first few levels. Works pretty good

[grand jewel]

with love ❤️

[rough peak]

U should have posted this gif afterwards as well(to really drive it home, and for the lulz)

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1046914150363844779/1406988061509681285/image0.gif

[grand jewel]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-cute-cat-fluffy-cuddly-sleepy-kitty-gif-19927899

[balmy radish]

i like the heavy cleave attacks

[drifting heron]

"Cleave"

6.5

[rough peak]

6.5 is more than... what is it, 3 for the lights on both marks on the sweeping ones?

[drifting heron]

Doesn't matter cause the falloff makes all of it useless

[rough peak]

Maybe, but, it makes me feel better about my life choices cuz it doesn't stop on the 2nd poxwalker

[flat mist]

embrace chaos

[rough peak]

Tried that, the barrel did not love me back

[flat mist]

yeah but there is no greater joy than a triple kill with a barrel

(clutch time)

[rough peak]

Gloriana simulator:

[gaunt onyx]

https://tenor.com/view/masive-skill-issue-skill-issue-yakudza-gif-14004060172467418456

[balmy radish]

i mean heavy cause it is the sharge attacks

[dire badge]

Can I get brutalize penance with the two second chempack build? The one where I have to kill 3k enemies with heavy attacks whole under cartel special

[lavish bronze]

1k

and yes you can iirc

[rough peak]

... I've only taken rampage like 1-3 times on malice runs, yet I've somehow gotten the 60k damage penance while it was up? It says I've only had rampage active for 64 seconds... I'm guessing the rockets I shot must've counted for the damage on that penance

Weird

I love the rocket blitz

[flat mist]

Damage is damage

[vocal saffron]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1099449403514814565/1313935170989985832/freeze.gif

[flat mist]

Man stimm supply spam is so fun. Have stimm on cd > crate > stimm crate > crate > crate > stimm crate repeat

Popping like 5 off per minute with almost permanent stimm buff up

[rough peak]

Yeah that was funny when I did that for 45 stimm supply uses penance. Got it done like 2/3rds of the way through the 1st run

[flat mist]

It’s very funny with a shriek psyker just watching them spam their cd every 6-10s

[rough peak]

I know I need to use the other 2 blitz options eventually, but, nuking monsters/a random special/elite with the rocket cause fuck that elite/special in particular is so much fun

[final temple]

the church of the boom welcomes thee

[rough peak]

1st time I chose the blitz I became a devoted member... I'm gonna try the upgraded blinder nades, but, I already miss the rockets and I haven't even started a run yet

[mild phoenix]

What does viscosity mean for the stimm? does it just increase the cooldown?

[tired prairie]

Correct. The more points you spend in the stimm lab and the further away from the centre, the longer the cooldown time of the Hive Scum’s stimm

[mild phoenix]

Ah i see thanks

[faint fossil]

hello crackheads does anyone know if the stim supply skill works for this penance?

[zenith fern]

yes

[faint fossil]

thanks

[narrow dagger]

devils claw is actually good huh

with rampage

[lapis raft]

i swear these arbites players im playing with today share single braincell

[dire badge]

does bonesaw yellow toxin count towards chem toxin talents

[lapis raft]

truly a class for the smartest people

[lapis raft]

yes

[dire badge]

thanks papi

[zenith fern]

Yes, the yellow is chem tox and as for purple is brittleness

[clever fjord]

what are the combos for bonesaw

It feels so cumbersome and unrewarding to me

[dire badge]

most of them are, they dont understand the beuty of the eprfectblock build

[echo python]

Push-attack -> heavy -> heavy for hordeclear is what I usually do, but I don't use the bs that often

[dire badge]

blessings on chainaxe?

[lapis raft]

double str uuh what are the names, headtaker slaughterer i think?

yea

[dire badge]

gotchu ty

[narrow cosmos]

hi coming here just to ask the players themselves since i've seen alot of talk about this class without any real conclusive verdict, is the hive scum good or just overhyped?

[rough peak]

iirc it's headtaker + slaughterer for the mk4 and the mk12 can be headtaker + slaughterer(and you can replace 1 of them with thrust, at least on zealot)

[clever fjord]

Is it hyped? I thought a lot of people dissed on it?

it's okay, It's also very fun

[dire badge]

thge fantasy is complete dogshit they could of made so many better choices. The class itself is fun af

[narrow cosmos]

eh, i've seen people hype it because its very cool (yknow, akimbos and shit) but some other players say its not good

[lapis raft]

i def havent seen anyoen hype it, quite the opposite

[faint fossil]

i like it a lot, still won't replace my main ogryn but its for sure my secondary main now

[livid raven]

underhyped

[candid flint]

goods in the hands of a good player, bad in the hands of a bad player

kinda like every other class, but disparity can be more severe

[livid raven]

youtuber grifters and the class actually being dogtrash early on in levels gave people the wrong idea and rightly so

[faint fossil]

when you get a bad hivescum it really is a BAD hivescum

like its the squishiest class so they either spend their time on the floor or wasting resources

[faint fossil]

class was horrendous to level up

it felt so shit