hivescum-class

[manic wolf]

I wouldnt say its useless, but its not a fantastic pick

[tender marten]

way more people are using it than not, i assure you

because +1 dodge on range is more shit

and if youre doing melee pathing, thats the efficient route

[worn portal]

i try to avoid melee, but i keep a chainaxe for crushers

[amber sundial]

Both choices are the same cost

you either go extra dodge or untouchable

[tender marten]

terium welcome > butterfly > untouchable

[manic wolf]

Now I have a conundrum...

[amber sundial]

You aren’t taking precision violence on a melee build?

[worn portal]

blitz pouch for extra chem bomb? I know its super good and all

[manic wolf]

Do I take Wrath on the Chainsword and enjoy double stacking cleave due to the bonus in the tree, or do I take Shred and enjoy DoTs everywhere and more consistent bonus damage from another part of the tree 🤔

[worn portal]

but worth a talent point?

[unkempt salmon]

17% Toughness Curios don't exist

Kill me now

[rose flax]

What does this even do? Also it works while crouch dodging too

[rose flax]

They do

[north plank]

I noticed class populations regulated remarkably quickly this time around

[spark gyro]

Ayo, didn't we use to have a mod that showed ammo crate charges?

[analog hazel]

it's better than loose formation as a pathway to sample collector so I usually take it no matter what build I'm doing

[bronze glade]

all the people getting filtered lol

[manic wolf]

Because Scum is a skill-check and people arent passing it

[spark gyro]

I'm only finding one that has a bunch of other stuff I don't want

[amber sundial]

Threat is how likely you are to be targeted

[tender marten]

threat is a blackbox but the less 'threat' you generate the less likely an enemy will target you for its next attack

[bronze glade]

https://tenor.com/view/the-road-to-el-dorado-both-both-is-good-gif-8304204

[surreal spire]

whats the diff between the two needle gun marks? and is yellow or purp chem better?

[manic wolf]

No, not both because Rampage D:

[unkempt salmon]

I gamba and I gamba and I haven't gotten one since Arbites came out

[analog hazel]

one does aoe damage for the alt fire, the other's alt fire makes enemies explode

[mighty belfry]

nah even in games with no hive scum, poxbursters are still bugged the hell out

[worn portal]

is loose formation worth getting thing?

[bronze glade]

on mk xii at least having both is very helpful

[rose flax]

Ah, so the equivalent of how dodging works then, just not always?

[mighty belfry]

they are absolutely not working as intended right now

[manic wolf]

Im usin the other one, I prefer the moveset from days of old

[bronze glade]

i'd prob take shred then

[rose flax]

Very rare, just like +3 stamina

[spark gyro]

What's happening with poxbursters?

[mighty belfry]

inconsistent blast radiuses, throwing themselves from way further than they're supposed to be, unable to be pushed more frequently, bugged sound cues

[rose flax]

Bugged

[analog hazel]

they learned stealth

[mighty belfry]

there's something seriously wrong with them right now

[rose flax]

Lol

[spark gyro]

Elaborate or perish 🔫

[unkempt salmon]

+3 Stam are waaay more common in my experience

[mighty belfry]

I just did

[restive vortex]

i know hive scum can build a lot of crit, is hyper critical worth it?

[bronze glade]

if it wasn't bugged as fuck, yes

[carmine estuary]

Yes

[tender marten]

nah dodging is you actively avoiding an attack. threat determines who an enemy attacks next and its based on shit like proximity, damage output, whether you're already targeting it, etc.

[rose flax]

I love pushing them and they don't explode
Truly Sisyphus moment

[carmine estuary]

Regardless it's still worth it

[mighty belfry]

Poxburster maelstroms feel nearly impossible right now because they're behaving so inconsistently

[bronze glade]

right now taking it will get you killed.

[bronze glade]

it disables all on-kill proc effects

so it will absolutely get you killed

[spark gyro]

SALTZPYRE BURSTER

[rose flax]

But dodging is breaking an enemies tracking

[amber sundial]

Exactly what I was thinking. 😭

[manic wolf]

Yeah, leaning towards that, the bonus damage from local toxin DoTs is pretty huge

[carmine estuary]

You don't use on kill effects in exchange for oneshot potentials + tox dots

[tender marten]

yes. threat isnt tracking though

[grave venture]

https://tenor.com/view/saltzpyre-eyebrow-raise-vermintide-gif-24052002

[rose flax]

Still is, all it breaks is precision violence

[spark gyro]

I need to suffer more I guess, they seem their normal level of wonky so far

[bronze glade]

yeah and chord's whole gimmick is no finesse dropoff

[amber sundial]

Losing precision violence for a whole game isn’t worth hyper critical

[mighty belfry]

it's not happening all the time

[bronze glade]

ok hope you're not running blinders, and precision violence

[mighty belfry]

but it's happening enough that I'm noticing it

[spark gyro]

I remember them having instances of not jumping at the closest player for a while now

[carmine estuary]

Of course not lmao

[rose flax]

Adrenaline frenzy:

[manic wolf]

I would argue it really doesnt matter on a Desperado build, in fact it might even be better to have more consistent one shots on anything you actually have to melee, but yeah its not ideal thats even a thing

[broken moss]

im only getting like 70 diamantine a mission. what can i do to like, triple that? lol

[mighty belfry]

I had a congo line of poxbursters in a maelstrom and the one furthest behind decided to pounce instead of any of the others which blew up like 10 of them and sent me into the warp

it's really annoying

[analog hazel]

play higher difficulties lol

[broken moss]

its damnation

[rose flax]

Yeah I swear plasteel and everything is much lower, I'm on damnation lol

[analog hazel]

damn

[amber sundial]

Brainwash your teammates to loot

[carmine estuary]

Just go for ooze pool and shivs + crit build. Take the toughness talents middle tree and you're dandy

[bronze glade]

you're not taking what is arguably the best blitz, and one of the best toughness regen talents?

[unkempt salmon]

Btw, to any of the Build People, is Vulture's Dodge worth taking if I'm using dual pistols or is it only really good for autoguns/uzis?

[carmine estuary]

Blinders ... best blitz?

[bronze glade]

it's good

[broken moss]

chem nade

surely

[spark gyro]

Oh, found the crate mod

[mighty belfry]

disagree

[rose flax]

It's the equivalent of a push from a melee weapon

[bronze glade]

yes

[spark gyro]

I searched health, medipack, ammo crate and all that, but it was ration pack

Normalize putting weird names on shit

[mighty belfry]

Chem nades are hella overrated

[manic wolf]

Blackouts > Chem Nade

[broken moss]

do so. dont change facts lol

[unkempt salmon]

Even with the stub pistols' rate of fire?

[manic wolf]

You can make them crit, like make them crit a lot

[bronze glade]

oh stubpis. i think it's still good

esp since stubpis are finesse weapons

[rose flax]

It's about Killin, not how many you kill

[mighty belfry]

They're basically a better immolation grenade, Which is nice but it doesn't really do much for Hive Scum in terms of synergy

[amber sundial]

they do have crit boost all though bugged rn

[bronze glade]

lol bruh that's bugged too?

[amber sundial]

sadly yea

[mighty belfry]

Blackouts cover a base that Hive Scum seriously suffers in, that being that they don't have a lot of stagger

And overall allows them to be far more aggressive, which Hive Scum thrives upon.

[worn portal]

im running meme shotgun so i got that atm ll

[manic wolf]

Yup, Blackouts give you control, can still apply Tox DoT and regen themselves. They're kinda non-negotiable best blitz

[bronze glade]

regenerating, instant stagger with 5 charges and the potential to make it a horde clear weapon

[mighty belfry]

And with chem node, they're also a very good offensive option.

[rose flax]

It also serves as crowd control especially if you don't have anything to do that

[last kelp]

Melk decided to not give me another +3 stam curio today and instead just took all my Melk Coin™

[bronze glade]

i mean don't get me wrong i really like chem nades too

but i think blackouts are a bit better

[spark gyro]

Blackout nades are goated

[analog hazel]

stagger is not a worthwhile trade off when the other option literally melts nearly every enemy in the game in 5 seconds

[last kelp]

blackout with tox is pretty goated indeed

[carmine estuary]

Also you don't need precision violence. Tis but a scratch and burst of energy provides you with all you need. Just in case you make a mistake. Everything else can be dodged with shivs

[rose flax]

Pocket toxins:

[spark gyro]

Fast and easy stagger, big amount stored, can proc toxin

[broken moss]

hive scum has plenty of synergy around toxified enemies

less so for staggered enemies

[mighty belfry]

Blackouts can do that with Pocket Toxin

[bronze glade]

i mean sure man, you do you

[manic wolf]

Right, but you might only get to use them 6 times a match. You get like 30 or more Blackouts and they can save runs way more often than Chem Grenades do

[broken moss]

but regardless of synergy, chem nades just fuck everything for ungodly amounts of time

[novel oracle]

ive had plenty of lobbies as the only scum and never take this node
bursters havent stoped doing stupid shit
specials havent stopped making no noise

[spark gyro]

Soft CC is like super goated

[mighty belfry]

And you have to fight over nade pick ups with chem nades.

So efficiency is also a major concern.

[last kelp]

Its more that blackouts can get you out of a pinch really easily, are instantly thrown instead of requiring you to switch to and lob, are renewable and can still stack tox for bonuses

[broken moss]

i can stagger a small group of enemies for a few seconds, or just kill a massive pile of them for what feels like the duration of the fight. 🤔 hmmm

[spark gyro]

I remember that sometimes I'd just "waste" a revolver shot on a dude's chest to interrupt him without any actual intention of a killing blow

[bronze glade]

cursted talent

[mighty belfry]

You can do that, with pocket toxin

Andd they regen

[spark gyro]

Blackout regen makes it a silly item

[mighty belfry]

So you can do that, numerous times. Way more than chem nades.

[manic wolf]

The higher enemy density goes, the more valuable a control option becomes, thats just how the game works

[spark gyro]

Blitz regen is a silly mechanic that I'm 50/50 on

[last kelp]

And what do you do when you are cornered by several ragers and that 3 seconds it takes to switch to and lob gets you killed

[mighty belfry]

Chem nades are good but they just don't hold up utility wise.

[bronze glade]

it actually takes a while for chem nades to kill ogryn packs

[broken moss]

pop rampage and floor all of them

[spark gyro]

As a psyker main, I've always liked blitz being treated as a situational tool that you generally have available when necessary

[broken moss]

or of im a gun build, just shoot the hell out of em

[last kelp]

the decay consumes

[spark gyro]

I never liked limited blitzes where I play hide and seek with the grenade pickup for 10 minutes

[broken moss]

running auric maelstroms i dont suffer these issues

[mighty belfry]

Well I

[manic wolf]

This^ And Scummer has a metric shitload of damage anyway, so having area denial is kinda just whatever when you're trading out the ability to control actually run-ending threats

[mighty belfry]

Will be enjoying my near limitless stun grenades over here.

[rose flax]

What do you guys think would happen if hive scum was allowed dueiling swords/rapier?

[mighty belfry]

Stop

Don't even utter that notion.

[spark gyro]

Rampage dueling sword

[broken moss]

thats really all it comes down to. people want the regen option

[last kelp]

I would stop playing the class

[amber sundial]

Hive scum doesn’t have the honor to use a dueling sword

[rose flax]

The 3 hive scums:

[spark gyro]

I still find it funny that the so-called "outlaw" is the closest scum gets to a patriot

It reminds me of the savant psyker

[manic wolf]

Nah, thats the cherry on the cake, the real benifit is being able to control large groups of armour tens of times a match

[last kelp]

Speak for yourself mucker, I got plenty of honour... probably... I just aint some poncy spire side SNOB

[broken moss]

its really not "large groups" though. thats the thing.

[mighty belfry]

Plus, it's almost a tad anti-synergetic

[spark gyro]

Bro pulled the m-word

[obsidian crown]

Unless they have final toll modifier in havoc

[broken moss]

its a rather small aoe in my experience

[manic wolf]

Yeah you keep telling yourself that pal, we know where you came from

[last kelp]

yeah, the carnival you mug

[analog hazel]

dueling sword isn't really necessary when a decent shiv crit build can nuke a horde of crushers in frankly comical time

[rose flax]

Mmmmmmm

Meta

[manic wolf]

Its not a big AoE, but its big enough, funnel them into a group and flatten them all

[limber cradle]

Whoa whoa whoa you can't be saying mucka with a hard r man that's fucked up

[mighty belfry]

Because Hive Scum love to move around and Chem Nades are all about locking an area down.

[manic wolf]

Upper spires born ass

[broken moss]

thats another thing, its a lot harder to swathe headshots when things are scattered on the floor

[amber sundial]

Look at that mucka, born into wealth and luxury?

[last kelp]

I don't think you know what that word means

[carmine estuary]

Just shoot them with the needles. They should be dead by the time they reach you

[broken moss]

ive actually been taking the talent off my rampage because of it

[mighty belfry]

Literally just throw two Blackouts in a horde and out of nowhere over a 100 of them are just immediately dead

[broken moss]

id rather leave them standing so i can do damage

[manic wolf]

Yeah, you can do that also, but not always possible

[last kelp]

Yeah sure thing, let me know how your rations taste later.

[carmine estuary]

When is that not possible?

[manic wolf]

Yeah.. Pocket Toxin is uhh.. quite absurd

[manic wolf]

When they all pop out of a spawn door ten feet away

[broken moss]

literally does no damage

[mighty belfry]

WHAT

[broken moss]

the stun nades?

[mighty belfry]

homie do you know what pocket toxin does???

[odd jetty]

Is it just me or is the bone saw thing kinda poopoo

[manic wolf]

Yeah no... Pocket toxin is crazy fuckin strong

[inner void]

Is there any difference between the two Mks of Needle Pistol...?

[analog hazel]

"can a perisher borrow some corpse starch?" Now how is a perisher gonna borrow some corpse starch? Perisher you gonna give it back?

[limber cradle]

@trim wind its happening again

[mighty belfry]

I feel like you've missed a huge part of why Blackouts are so good right now.

[limber cradle]

Its very good but you gotta spec into it

[rose flax]

https://tenor.com/view/i'm-okay-haha-you-clowns-i'm-fine-i'm-alright-adult-swim-gif-14344154263603215252

[broken moss]

3 stacks really aint that much

[manic wolf]

I dont like it, but people seem to be able to do work with it

[obsidian crown]

Guy you’re arguing with thinks hive scum desperado still needs ammo pickup even with pickpocket. Lost cause.

[spark gyro]

Gamers and gooners

[broken moss]

i guess for trash

[mighty belfry]

Ain't absolutely no flippin' way

[broken moss]

but id never use those for trash anyways

[inner void]

Bone Saw can apply tons of debuff brittleness stacks to things with armour, or anything at all really

[last kelp]

Chem nade users will see a blackout user stunning an entire horde of ragers before they die to Pocket Toxin and proclaim "that mucker can nary afford any damage"

[mighty belfry]

JUST THROW ANOTHER

THEY REGEN

[manic wolf]

Lololol

[spark gyro]

CC in this game is largely about the need to kick shit on its arse outweighing the need to have an easy weakspot hit

[mighty belfry]

Holy cow

[rose flax]

I feel like I'm missing something but what's the point of that mode unless your trying to be supportive? The tox stacks do more damage even on carapace

[inner void]

I had that same attitude until I mucked around with it in the Meat Grinder

[spark gyro]

It's true, for example, that a firing reaper is easier to headshot because it stands still, but it's also true that a suppressed reaper is not firing at me and I can close the gap if necessary

[manic wolf]

CC being important in a horde game? Who woulda fuckin guessed it

[carmine estuary]

I don't run pocket sand but this feels like you never actually tested it or seen it lol

[obsidian crown]

I swap between boomstick or blackout (just for utility) depending on my mood tbh on desperado

[broken moss]

sittin in meat grinder right now, one nade with the 3 stacks of toxin doesnt even do half the hp of a plasma gunner

[last kelp]

Yeah no apparently the brittleness does outdo tox on TTK

[mighty belfry]

oh my goodness

[amber sundial]

You see that’s the beauty of corpse starch, it’s the gift that keeps on giving. Ignore where your friend went they’re just on vacation

[inner void]

If you have Needle Pistol you can swap to it very quickly and have both Brittleness and the chem tox damage

[unkempt salmon]

Alright, how's this set-up looking? All three Curios are the same configuration

[mighty belfry]

yeah this is actually a lost cause

[spark gyro]

bad

[broken moss]

does basically nothing to carapace

[spark gyro]

now lemme check for real

[limber cradle]

Homie is playing darktide like I played Pokémon games at 12, all damage, no util

[rose flax]

I tested it lol damnation difficulty, dps is higher with just tox
Even in game
Maybe it's just my build

[carmine estuary]

"Strongest dot in game is useless lads"

[obsidian crown]

I even posted a no ammo pickup Mael scoreboard and he wouldn’t listen

[spark gyro]

Devil's claw is the patrician taste

10/10

[inner void]

I've been doing two hits with purple and then a needle shot

[broken moss]

nobody said its useless. but if ur not running tox elsewhere to keep the stacks up, theres no point running that

[inner void]

the tox DOT does more damage with the purple going

[broken moss]

ok so now were getting into a very specific build

[mighty belfry]

you have, five of them. FIVE OF THEM. THAT REGEN.

[broken moss]

if you are fully synergized into tox, go for it

[mighty belfry]

JUST THROW TWO OF THEM

OTL

[limber cradle]

I unironically take tox crits and pocket tox on any given build, shits too good to pass up.

[glad latch]

The entire arby/ogryn class in a nutshell.

[analog hazel]

and you need to use all five to get anywhere close to the effectiveness of a single chem

[obsidian crown]

I would run blackout even without them just for utility alone on desperado. Very useful if you’re getting body blocked somehow accidentally.

[inner void]

also with Bone Saw, the Hit Mass -60% blessing is more significant than it sounds

[jolly coral]

what perks are broken again?

[last kelp]

Well six by default if you are going down the chem tree for pocket tox unless you are a WEIRDY that takes the coherency radius

[limber cradle]

I agree, tbh I simply always have the spare points for it consider it better value than a lot of options.

[rose flax]

Maybe it does, but slower unless you used something else to apply chem since switching modes takes so long and feels inconvenient/awkward

I can you show you my build if you want

[inner void]

Swapping to Needle Pistol is very fast

[rose flax]

Modes

[mighty belfry]

I don't take Extra Pouches

[broken moss]

too many points to justify for me

[last kelp]

The only downside to blackouts is that kills from dots dont proc their regen, thats about it

[analog hazel]

at least we can all agree that boom bringer sucks balls right

[obsidian crown]

My build doesn’t have points for it but can see it being good on others. But yeah it’s a useful CC tool. I swap between it and rocket depending on mood.

[inner void]

Yeah if you're doing both modes with the bone saw in the same fight, that's lossy

[carmine estuary]

I agree here

[broken moss]

unless im already on that side

[glad latch]

Ya, needs buffs.

[last kelp]

unfortunately, yes

[broken moss]

ive got like 6 builds going for scumbag right now

3 are lookin promising

but only 1 uses tox

[inner void]

Is there any difference between the two Mks of the needler? I asked but I didn't see if anyone replied

[broken moss]

alt fire

[last kelp]

theres two needler mks?

[limber cradle]

I'm running this atm tbh, with macs and shivs

[glad latch]

Increase base ammo by 1, double the blast radius and monster damage and the boombringer might be good.

[rose flax]

Ohh so your specifically talking about using another source of toxic and not just the bonesaw?
I've just been using the bonesaw most of the time lol

[inner void]

apparently...

[broken moss]

one makes shit explode and is nearly useless, the other spreads tox

[last kelp]

what the fuck

[inner void]

Well, you have tox on crit, blinders with tox, tox nades, needler

many options

[obsidian crown]

I pathed more into bottom left for more dmg on macs tbh personally

[limber cradle]

Tbh I want to like the damage nodes and theyre defo not bad but I prefer the extra tox util to unload damage.

[last kelp]

holy fuck have I been using the wrong mk for needler this WHOLE time?

[obsidian crown]

Yeah just preference.

[rose flax]

I meant without using the bonesaw specifically, since you mentioned using needle pistol

[broken moss]

the primary is why you use it anyways

and thats the same for both

[inner void]

What I like about the bone saw is spamming purple while others kill the boss very quickly

[limber cradle]

Agreed, tree is hard to go wrong with outside the obviously bugged out options.

[broken moss]

secondary is kinda wasteful

[mighty belfry]

secondary on mk2 is very good for proccing toxin mania and renewal

the more toxed enemies around, the better

[inner void]

Yeah there's no way I'm shooting trash enemies with a tox needler

[broken moss]

basically

[bronze glade]

too much work for me but that's the best use of it imo

i just run mk6

[broken moss]

if u went full bore into it and made a desperado build i guess but that just seems like trolling

[mighty belfry]

why would you ever run a desparado build with needle pistol

[inner void]

Yeah mine is also on VI.
Don't fix what ain't broke I guess

[broken moss]

ammo economy

[analog hazel]

I don't bring blackouts to my shiv build cause I get a whole lot of use out of stabbin weak spots and it's a harder to do that when every enemy is on the floor wriggling around
and I have the ability to ration my chem nades for emergencies in fights because I naturally have so many dodges and apply so many tox stacks on every enemy that they die in a couple seconds and I barely get hit

[split shore]

I feel like I lose brain cells when I play Scum

[broken moss]

only way to make that a primary weapon

[mighty belfry]

...

[limber cradle]

Just let it go Shovel

[broken moss]

did i suggest you do it?

relax dude

[analog hazel]

needler desperado is insane work

[obsidian crown]

Don’t need desperado to run pickpocket on it

[limber cradle]

Yeah

Yeah it is

[manic wolf]

Ok, based, but also, try Chainsword 😄 Also super fun and a throwback to days of old

[last kelp]

I am going to make a desperado needle build

[obsidian crown]

This guy is a clown through and through

[broken moss]

why would you run anything BUT desperado if youre maining a ranged weapon?

[obsidian crown]

I’m just gonna reblock. Waste of energy

[rare stirrup]

It's not, mk6 has the better primary

[inner void]

Needler Blessings-wise, I have been enjoying Stripped Down & Run n Gun

[broken moss]

oh this douchebag again

[manic wolf]

Hotshot is the sleeper pick for Needlegun 😄

[broken moss]

forgot about you

[bronze glade]

how much cleave does needler even get

baseline

the cleave's pretty bad

[spark gyro]

Does it even have cleave?

[bronze glade]

i think it's like 2

[broken moss]

i think it only hits one on pierce

[bronze glade]

or 1.5

[mighty belfry]

I can't use hotshot, because I have actually cleaved through hordes to hit poxbursters that then blow up after

[obsidian crown]

Hard to take someone seriously when they say HS desperately needs ammo pickups even with pickpocket. Lost me there.

[spark gyro]

me tbh

[mighty belfry]

Entirely by mistake

[analog hazel]

I would only take desperado if I'm using dual autos, shredder pistol or an autogun
I feel like high fire rate is integral to getting value out of that ability

[worn portal]

omg this martyr zealot in training

[mighty belfry]

Trying to shot other specialists in the midst

[manic wolf]

not a huge amount, but with Hotshot you can cleave a dreg bruiser and all the other trash except the flak dudes, but the point is on blue mode, you can aim at heads in a crowd and you will end up spreading more tox with less needles

[spark gyro]

I had the brilliant idea to needle a poxburster because I didn't know how slowly it'd actually die

[worn portal]

dying more than the crackheads in my game

[broken moss]

nobody cared to have you bro.

[spark gyro]

So the fuck had time to get 2 of his friends on me

And I gathered all 3 for a push

Guess who died of toxin

[broken moss]

just block and be done with it

[limber cradle]

Nah I like desynch even if i think they're lying to me about Forceful ShMaul

[mighty belfry]

Mmm whatcha ssaaaayyyyyyy

[obsidian crown]

Oh turns out

I took a long break from the game

[spark gyro]

shmaul

[mighty belfry]

Mm that you only meant well?

[spark gyro]

shmield

shistol

[obsidian crown]

I didn’t realize they buffed crushers in h40

[spark gyro]

shmuck

[limber cradle]

Lmfao, that makes a lot of sense

[trim wind]

https://tenor.com/view/bill-hader-eating-popcorn-keith-morrison-dateline-snl-gif-25666169

[mighty belfry]

They buffed crushers, in general.

[obsidian crown]

I was powering through them in old h40

But yeah

[limber cradle]

Nah old Havoc i believe you

New havoc i was like ???

[spark gyro]

Wasn't our resident femboy responsible for the crusher rework?

[inner void]

of course you did

[spark gyro]

"Sterling, which of them"

[trim wind]

no

[spark gyro]

I mean

idk

[limber cradle]

Which one

[trim wind]

it was the legendary crabathan

[obsidian crown]

Yeah but h35-40 is where it’s like super noticeable but yeah

[mighty belfry]

I love Rotten Armor!!!!

[inner void]

I'm so pretty

[spark gyro]

Anyway, soon as I hit 30 I'm making a knife blackout build

[rare stirrup]

Who up hiving on they scum rn

[spark gyro]

scoomer

[obsidian crown]

Waiting on a friend to finish his exams

[analog hazel]

I was in a damnation game earlier with my scum and I got grabbed by a mutie, thrown to another mutie, then thrown into a burster that knocked me into a second burster

I love getting CC locked and tbh I have no idea how I lived

[obsidian crown]

Then we’re gonna do havoc 40’s with hive scum

Just chilling in aurics for the time being

[spark gyro]

Auric is definitely the place for a calming gameplay

[near vapor]

passed around

[obsidian crown]

Been trying a 0 dmg taken run and was super close until the last 5 minutes, teammates shot 3 barrels on me, 53 dmg taken

[inner void]

Here is the 🔑 to your Malar

[obsidian crown]

https://tenor.com/view/me-when-i-see-my-class-gif-15768348532634343334

[spark gyro]

I think I ended a run on the single digit once

I was like "damn, I'm on FIRE today"

And then I was

[manic wolf]

Bro I hate being spawned into in-progress missions next to poxbursters ¬.¬

[obsidian crown]

Lemme find the run

[near vapor]

you sir have won the internet

[inner void]

You're immune to damage for a while after spawning in

[spark gyro]

Inheriting the corruption from the bot

Wrong ping

Stop talking

[manic wolf]

Well I pretty much immediately died, so evidently not for very long

[inner void]

I think it's 5 seconds

[spark gyro]

ahem
Inheriting corruption from the bot

[obsidian crown]

This was the run

[analog hazel]

shoutout to the strange creature in my mourningstar lobby just now who was talking about banning people from the game????

[spark gyro]

so true

[mighty belfry]

what did those people do

[mint fable]

Almost 100% Hive Scum

Finally finished that annoying chemical dependency

[ebon badge]

which IAG mk reckon go hardest for desperado?

[inner void]

I just did the Toughness healing one

[spark gyro]

I brought the DC1 for the heavy attack stimm one and then I was like "yo, this kinda fire"

Still meh on carapace tho, takes a while

[lucid raptor]

is scoreboard fixed

[obsidian crown]

Was fixed day 1

They had a fix for it in modding discord

[lucid raptor]

alas i am not in the modding discord

unfortunate

[obsidian crown]

Heard numericUI is now fixed

Didn’t confirm, didn’t play today. Took a break

[main wagon]

Oh shit there is an update

Thanks for the heads up

[flint granite]

melee damage or crit aura better overall?

[lucid raptor]

official scoreboard not fixed yet

[main wagon]

Also I forgot to download Barrels mod and now I can properly direct my anger at my buddy

[flint granite]

10% is a lot

[obsidian crown]

Fix is in modding discord

I can post it here if it’s allowed

[lucid raptor]

can you inv me

[cedar cairn]

Anyone know if Fact Acting Stimms counts towards Shared Benefits

[broken moss]

if they stand in the ability

[vital tendon]

is sustained fire any good?

[lucid raptor]

you can stack a lotta crit with this class its kinda either/or

[broken moss]

why wouldnt it? its specifically for that ability

[flint granite]

ty

[obsidian crown]

Don’t see an invite option unfortunately

[cedar cairn]

Idk, why would HyperCritical break like three other talents

[lucid raptor]

rip im sure i can find it somewhere

[obsidian crown]

#1079236663840100453 message

Maybe this’ll get you the link

[spark gyro]

shatfark

[near vapor]

maybe this week...

[lucid raptor]

found one after some short googling but the link is appreciated ty

[obsidian crown]

Fix is there. No problem

[lucid raptor]

saves me searching

[halcyon adder]

how do i trigger the normal ass stub pistol reload animation, is it rare or do i need to hit some threshold

[patent bone]

I may have scummed too much last night

[vital tendon]

is sustained fire any good?

[patent bone]

For dual stubs, yes

[vital tendon]

thanks

ive been using but cant tell

[broken moss]

cant speak on if its broken or not. i thought you were asking about the logic behind the interaction

[flint granite]

best stim crate setup? I wanna make this penance less painful

cooldown and strength right

[limber cradle]

Which version of it?

Tbh I was throwing that mf thing down in elevators and door gates

You WILL stand in the buff aura I WILL get penance prog

[flint granite]

truuuuuuuuuuu

[near vapor]

sybay

[worn portal]

is maxed out chems good for that 4th stck?

[limber cradle]

You talking about drug addiction keystone?

[broken moss]

but what does hyper critical break?

[worn portal]

ya

[limber cradle]

Precision violence and it doesnt work with hyper violence

[limber cradle]

Imo 4th stack isnt as worth it but I dont use that keystone a lot

[limber cradle]

Neat, didnt know we had that in one block

[analog hazel]

genuinely no idea i think bro was just tweaking

[bronze glade]

i think it fucks with all on-kill effects

so blinder regen too

there's prob others

[mint fable]

I think I played enough Hive Scum

I want to feel tanky again

[steel briar]

🗣️ You'll have to play the tithe rat class then.

[near vapor]

Kuli: Yes, if the Cartel Special is already on cooldown when Stimm Supply is activated, only the base effect will be spread (corruption immunity & heal). The Cartel Special has to be off cooldown for Stimm Supply to spread its buff effects.

GRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH

[narrow dagger]

oh shi

i was using the real deal

and spreading fakes

feels bad man

[patent bone]

TITHE RAT?!?

[barren pebble]

i feel like stim supply has to have been like, the very final thing they implemented for the class

it has so many weird interactions not to mention the panic patched keystone interaction

[trim wind]

The keystone mainly i think

[near vapor]

completed my 100 arbitrator missions completed penance

I am now FREE

[barren pebble]

the keystone was like... i dunno how they didnt catch that in testing i caught that the first time i looked at the two skills and was dissapointed it was already disabled

like no tester just went down right tree? has to have been a late addition or edit

[rare stirrup]

"Testing?"

[barren pebble]

believe it or not they do test this game

[rare stirrup]

I don't actually

I mean you said it yourself

[narrow dagger]

wish they test the errors too

[rare stirrup]

Or at the very least there's some serious issues with communication between testers and devs

[manic wolf]

My game keeps locking up.. is this a problem this patch? Never done it before this one

[narrow dagger]

i think its a you issue

im good

[broken moss]

thats so weird. like sometimes youll see an interaction and it just looks like it would have conflicts but theres no reason that should

[manic wolf]

Joy. Will reboot it an see if that fixes it

[narrow dagger]

you can fix it faster than fatshark lol

[manic wolf]

Out of memory issue still seems to be a problem so maybe related to that

[broken moss]

ironically, i used to have a ton of issues with the game freezing and/or crashing before the patch and its been pretty stable lately

[manic wolf]

Ahh, its reset my worker threads setting, thats probably it

[rare stirrup]

There's a memory leak

[narrow dagger]

what are you using for that option

[manic wolf]

Last mission was a fucking shitshow, locking up in bomber puddles, in front of trappers, the lot

[near vapor]

yea its unfortunate

[manic wolf]

Im now using 7, which is what i had before, but for some reason it was set to 13

[near vapor]

hyper crit and prec violence would go NUTS

but alas

not today 😔

[narrow dagger]

im using my cpu's core count as that option

its the most stable with that

[unkempt tide]

wait

[manic wolf]

It wouldnt actually because Hypercritical would'nt stack Hyperviolence

[narrow dagger]

i can recommend that

[unkempt tide]

did they fix rotten armor just to take it outta rotation?

??????

[near vapor]

prec

[manic wolf]

It just reduces enemy HP to zero if you crit for more than half its HP, there is no overflow damage

[manic wolf]

Ohh, myb

I misread

[broken moss]

hopefully they fix it. theres a few other things ive heard going on with bugs like that killing nodes. and then theres the whole "hammer of judgement" thing, that the node just simply doesnt work for arbites. keeping track of fatshark bugs is a full time job.

[manic wolf]

Yup, thats why ive dropped it to 7, 8 core CPU, so gives it a little wiggle room

[narrow dagger]

nah i paid for all of em im using all of em

[rare stirrup]

Yeah, I wish they would employ someone for that job

[broken moss]

facts

[rose flax]

does ruffian aura in darktide from hive scum affect bleed/tox damage?

[manic wolf]

Mine gets run hard enough on games like Stalker2, I dont need to abuse it further

[rare stirrup]

No

[manic wolf]

Its melee damage, so it shouldnt

[near vapor]

pretty sure kuli and other testers report all the time

[narrow dagger]

undervolt it

[manic wolf]

Cannot, is laptop

[rustic axle]

i find it so funny that the only weapon ive been having a hard time getting a good roll for is the bonesaw, i have peak rolls of every other dlc weapon

[narrow dagger]

it shall endure in the name of emperor

[near vapor]

its just that, either the complexity or their own dev pace makes it really slow

[narrow dagger]

sad

[rose flax]

Just was wondering since you know, fat shark

Thanks

[near vapor]

and they're about to have their obligated vacation soon...

[manic wolf]

Its machine spirit is stronk tho, deffo won the sillicone lottery with it

[rustic axle]

meanwhile, meanwhile, there's ANOTHER SHIV GODROLL IN MY SHOP OH MY GOD

[narrow dagger]

ahh intel?

[manic wolf]

Intel CPU yes

[narrow dagger]

feel you man

[manic wolf]

I bought it during Covid an its run everything ive thrown at it over the years with relatively good performance, sometimes i have to play on lower settings, but that aint a problem really

[sturdy marsh]

Do y'all like the mk 2 or 6 needle better? I like the spreading toxin, but I heard the 2 gives more toxin per shot

[narrow dagger]

i didnt even bother with changing its mark

[manic wolf]

Spreading toxin is better imo because if you're running needle pistol its probably on a melee build and thusly you mostly use it to thin out hordes

[narrow dagger]

whatever that servitor gave me

[analog hazel]

damnation specimens truly amaze me im just trying to get to auric already on my scum and this guy decided to activate an atonement shrine while 2 people were dead and halfway across the map waiting to get rescued

[glacial gyro]

how in the god damn

[rare stirrup]

It's cumulative

[warm ivy]

yeah that's not how percentages work, but oh well

[narrow dagger]

i just installed stimm cd showing mod

its too good

why didnt they add that feature idk man

[rose flax]

Ah , so does ararchist make more sense to take with shivs?

[spark gyro]

Fatshark once again leaving a lackluster UI for modders to fix

[halcyon adder]

https://medal.tv/games/warhammer-40000-darktide/clips/lFaWqxqfhgVpUK9gx?invite=cr-MSwxYmYsNjY5MDkzMzM&v=34

[narrow dagger]

yup im not missing my dependency stacks anymore

[rare stirrup]

Vanilla UI is pretty bad overall

[near vapor]

you could say the same of features already implemented in VT2 not implemented in DT

works in mysterious ways

[manic wolf]

If you're using them to apply tox stacks, most probably, but they'd still benifit from the melee damage, but crit chance is always super valuable

[near vapor]

Sweden..

[narrow dagger]

theyre slowly adding them

dodge bar added

only that

[rare stirrup]

https://tenor.com/view/bleak-it's-bleak-shaking-head-its-bleak-black-and-white-gif-9592734580409210082

[narrow dagger]

.d

[analog hazel]

crit shivs are an absolute menace

[manic wolf]

I dont know how others feel, but for me, Shivs are the best of Scummer's melee unique melees

[near vapor]

what is blud thinking

[narrow dagger]

s word😭

[manic wolf]

Ofc some of the other arsenal is stronger, but shivs are pretty fuckin gud

[analog hazel]

shivs + crit build + coated weaponry = annihilates every non-monstrosity enemy in the game in seconds

[narrow dagger]

i like all of em

different use scenarios

[manic wolf]

Thats cool, I wish I could gel with the saw and 'bar more

[tardy citrus]

guys

https://tenor.com/view/gato-withrock-gif-27341353

[narrow dagger]

crowbar is the horde eater

[tardy citrus]

the needle pistol fucks

giga heretic ass

[narrow dagger]

saw is armor pen

[analog hazel]

yuuuup

[rare stirrup]

yourer mom

[narrow dagger]

shivs are both but not the best at em

[rare stirrup]

Gottem

[manic wolf]

Bursters are fine, nothing to see here, please disperse

[analog hazel]

crowbar is not a horde eater that thing sucks balls against more than like 10 enemies at a time

[tardy citrus]

saw does fine with horde once you get moving

[near vapor]

what da fuck just happened

[narrow dagger]

worst take

[novel oracle]

what lol

[manic wolf]

Of the unique weapons for sure, though I find myself playing TacAxe and Chainsword for melee-centric setups. I should go back an give 'bar another shot

[narrow dagger]

def do that

[limber cradle]

So like is there an actual statistical best dump for needle pistol or is it genuinely anything but ammo

[broken moss]

people gonna tell u to spec into cleave

[tardy citrus]

i'm really enjoying the saw and needle pistol rn

[tardy citrus]

damage is the dump

[narrow dagger]

its the best weapon of class for dealing with hordes

[analog hazel]

shivs do this exact same thing faster and without even needing you to use rampage

[near vapor]

i dump mob

[novel oracle]

no they dont???

[near vapor]

saw?

https://tenor.com/view/saw-gerrera-andor-crazy-saw-gif-2676523781363347074

[rose flax]

Knife shivs are supposed to be for crowds control due to heavy but, it's actually better than cork screw due to attack speed(especially removing that awkward delay between light 1 and 2), heavy 1 is great for ragers, and push attack + heavy is great at damage to armor

It's literally just the kerlilian dual daggers but with a sweep heavy

[tardy citrus]

mobility is good for needle if you take the blessing that makes you immune to ranged past % of stam

[manic wolf]

I got really put-off it because its beaky mode gets stuck on all kinda bullshit even if you're clearly aiming at a special or elite

[limber cradle]

I fundamentally can't do that

[tardy citrus]

trust and try it

[narrow dagger]

dont heavy with beak unless its 1 or 2 enemies

[brittle sierra]

Me when I spread misinformation 😈

[manic wolf]

Yup, spiral shiv is most certainly the best

[tardy citrus]

it's like with the flamer how you dump dmg on it too

bc it's a dot

[manic wolf]

They also look the coolest

[tardy citrus]

toxin is the same thing

[rose flax]

No seriously all that stat affects is the initial damage

Not dot

[limber cradle]

Ik

[tardy citrus]

dump the damage and profit on the mobilitty

[rose flax]

But perks and everything else does

[tardy citrus]

it suits scum perfectly

[manic wolf]

Yeee, its just super sad that half the weapon's moveset is kinda DoA

[limber cradle]

So like dump anything I want besides mobi and ammo

[narrow dagger]

just spam l with can opener blessing

[tardy citrus]

lemme get on rq

ill show you mine

[limber cradle]

Im only asking cause I have a Stopping Power dumped one rn

Brunt sold it to me, 450 rated

[analog hazel]

• dodge once, get insane crit chance
• swing shivs wildly
• everything gets a bunch of stacks of tox and dies in 2 seconds

[glacial gyro]

stopping power is fine to dump too

[tardy citrus]

this is goated roll

you def want tthe ammo

[narrow dagger]

dont dodge just take a good swing with heavy then beat them to death

with bar

[narrow dagger]

and bro shivs dont have that much cleave withou rampage

[novel oracle]

you can build crowbar to do this too actually with just a little less crit chance but cleaving and applying toxin to way more enemies per swing

[analog hazel]

skill issue

[tardy citrus]

not a perfect distribution by any means and im still upping its mastery but this kills p much everything lol

[glacial gyro]

forgot to bless it

[tardy citrus]

stripped down is actually insane

on scum

[near vapor]

run and gun my beloved

[narrow dagger]

i usually dont take toxin node with crowbar is it good

[novel oracle]

i dont either

my crowbar build is in the pins

[narrow dagger]

if you oneshot them you dont have to poison them lol

crowbar supremacy

[near vapor]

https://tenor.com/view/gordon-freeman-half-life-half-life-2-smoke-smoking-gif-10286882637165944395

[tardy citrus]

needle is just so good in general

hard not to use it

[novel oracle]

i take crit toxin on shivs/knife/taxe

[tardy citrus]

good horde management AND insane single target

[limber cradle]

Tbh my favorite ranged weapon on scum is still the straight pistols cause of how stylish they are.

[tardy citrus]

stub pistols are fire yeah

[analog hazel]

shivs also swing over twice as fast and do a much better job at recovering toughness than the crowbar can
have fun dying in 2 hits because it takes you 3 seconds to charge a half decent swing with your metal pole

[glacial gyro]

I prefer ghost due to it giving you time to line up headshots on a gunner pack

[narrow dagger]

get better

[tardy citrus]

gunner pack i just alternate firing mode and unload

they all get splashed aand die

[lost token]

Anyone a solid foothold on dump stats for scum class weapons? About to log in briefly.

[narrow dagger]

crowbar is a harder to use weapon does not means its weak

it means you are bad

[near vapor]

mob

[supple torrent]

pretty much the same as you'd expect

dump mobility.

[tardy citrus]

damage dump on needle, mobility on stubs and autopistols

[lost token]

Unsurprising but I like having a bit of a clue.

[limber cradle]

Back to farming diamantine I go

[tardy citrus]

godspeed

[analog hazel]

crowbar can do the same stuff as shivs but its slower it is absolutely categorically just a worse melee weapon

[limber cradle]

Thank you.

[narrow dagger]

can stagger deals with horde better

[lost token]

Is needle in the same situation as flamer in terms of why damage is a dump stat to consider?

[tardy citrus]

somewhat poor myself atm

[glacial gyro]

the splash does like nothing though

[broken moss]

i dump stability on needle. i dont have issues hitting things

[tardy citrus]

it inflicts the toxin

[novel oracle]

you said it can do what i showed above without needing to be in rampage
which is simply not true lmfao

[tardy citrus]

yes

[near vapor]

twin is brokie

[narrow dagger]

do not try bothering with the guy dude

[limber cradle]

I remade every single character I had about 2 months ago and just have not restocked since.

[tardy citrus]

fr fr

[near vapor]

gotta start putting the numbers brah

[glacial gyro]

I am testing it in the meat grinder as we speak, and it does not

[tardy citrus]

im broke sah

[narrow dagger]

i think its bait but if its not its worse😭

[tardy citrus]

it does for me??

[lost token]

Hands are busy. You got any confirmed info on that? I can check the kuli guide soonish.

[tardy citrus]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBLEWMsBRsQ

[near vapor]

YOU NEED THESE

[glacial gyro]

everything around the target just takes a little damage

[near vapor]

https://tenor.com/view/my-mom-is-kinda-homeless-ishowspeed-speeding-please-speed-i-need-this-ishowspeed-trying-not-to-laugh-gif-16620227105127147208

please scum I need this..

[narrow dagger]

NO I DONT SIR

[bronze glade]

at least it isn't mr. E youtube titles ig

[manic wolf]

If you're gonna listen to anyone in here at the moment, it should be Cole. If he's telling you something, its factual.

[tardy citrus]

sorry i should've said you don't need to be as accurate with the alt fire

[lost token]

Ah that reginald guy. I check his stuff out every now and again while getting up to speed on things then inevitably just don't focus on him.

If the information is useful and relevant with the times, i just reference it, confirm then move on.

[bronze glade]

i played with crowbar quite a bit, found it very painful

[manic wolf]

Reggie is a good lad, tests stuff proper thorough like

[limber cradle]

I like crowbar but think it kinda needs to be built around.

[narrow dagger]

mr e got a video named melee scum is hard. he changed it before it was melee scum is weak. my dude go play stimm supply or go play chorus zel if you cant do it😭

[near vapor]

crowbar just needs some number tweaking

[somber frigate]

It sure would be cool if multi-hitting attacks of the chainsaw axe procced multiple hits for Rampage Boiling Blood hehe

[near vapor]

otherwise its in a spot similar to the vet shovel

quick agile weapon

[broken moss]

wrong mark

[lost token]

Seems to. There's plenty about tide games that i forget or don't care to remember then i just do the rest myself. Might copy some builds here and there or make adjustments to my wants for a build as desired.

[glacial gyro]

what

holy shit it has marks

I didnt even check

[broken moss]

needler has 2 marks

i didnt think so either. found that out the hard way

the 1st mark is dogshit

imo

[narrow dagger]

it really requires some significant brain usage

try learning it

its fun to use weapon

[bronze glade]

you mean rampage adren

wow much brain usage

very complicated

[tardy citrus]

tbh i've found more success with melee tthan ranged on scum lol

[broken moss]

mash left click and watch shit fly everywhere

[tardy citrus]

i just rampage and stimm up and become a whirlwind of death

[glacial gyro]

As in, the top one? Because that's the 'propagate the toxin' mark

[broken moss]

the first one you get when you first roll on it

icr which one they give u

[tardy citrus]

im rolling with mk2 atm

fuck i mean

[narrow dagger]

without rampage what do you do

[tardy citrus]

the VI

[narrow dagger]

needs more usage than shivs at least

[bronze glade]

i take another weapon

[broken moss]

the 2 i think is the proper one

[glacial gyro]

Is that alt fire the only difference?

[broken moss]

yes

[bronze glade]

look at me. i'm the rager now.

[narrow dagger]

i meant it as cooldown

[tardy citrus]

what's the difference between them?

[bronze glade]

the primary fires are slightly different too

[tardy citrus]

ahhh

[knotty grotto]

holy shit, i forgot theres another shivs mark

[bronze glade]

mk6 has a better primary fire

[bronze glade]

mk3 is mostly for the memes

[broken moss]

tried to find a difference and found none. same damage ticks

[knotty grotto]

oh rip

[bronze glade]

only on weakspot and crit hit apparently

[near vapor]

wrongful statement

[bronze glade]

i didn't say it was bad

[near vapor]

still wrong

[bronze glade]

it's a meme weapon

and that's why i like it

[tardy citrus]

if it's true that the Mk2 provides 1 stack of toxin to nearby enemies, would that not be more useful in most scenarios?

[near vapor]

i genuinely think the mk3 is better

[mighty belfry]

is mk3 the slashy one

[near vapor]

push attack > heavy faster

than H1 > H2 looping

[mighty belfry]

because i actually like mk3 better

[bronze glade]

no way, mk1 has better ST dps

[mighty belfry]

lights are noticebly faster

[bronze glade]

the PA is pathetic

basically a wasted move

the heavy is ok

[near vapor]

the mk1 has the same push attack > heavy moveset

[mighty belfry]

and push attack light light and push attack heavy is not bad single target at all

[near vapor]

the difference between the 2 is really just the heavies

[knotty grotto]

also im lost why does crowbar need adrenaline instead of chempendancy?

[mighty belfry]

adrenaline just pumps more damage and attack speed overall

[novel oracle]

but this does significantly more dps

[near vapor]

also hyper crit fix when

[novel oracle]

its not even close

[knotty grotto]

oh so BIS for rampage?, or not necessarily?

[near vapor]

fair but its still slower

[novel oracle]

cuz chem dep is poopoo

[broken moss]

yea i think i saw diff crit #s but thought i may have been trippin. overall not enough difference to be "wow"ing over

[knotty grotto]

oh fr? damn

[novel oracle]

barely

[narrow dagger]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-side-eye-gif-5016118126108679217

[knotty grotto]

regi leading my toaster brain capacity astray

[bronze glade]

heavy spam is better on mk1

the PA is pathetic like i said

and you can avoid using it on the mk1

[near vapor]

spamming push attack > heavy is fine

[bronze glade]

it's way worse

yes fine, if you want to lose 30-50% of your single target dps against carapace

[novel oracle]

and against everything

[near vapor]

its not a problem

[novel oracle]

its like half the dps against everything

[bronze glade]

why use the objectively worse ST combo

[near vapor]

because youre still faster anyways with a push attack > heavy against everything else

[bronze glade]

no you're not

[novel oracle]

youre 5% faster at landing 50% worse hits

[narrow dagger]

anyways dudes nighty night.

[near vapor]

sweep heavies clears out human elites quicker

[bronze glade]

the PA is really weak

[near vapor]

both have literally the same PA > heavy

[lavish forge]

Okay Ive changed my yune

Hive ganger is so fun

[near vapor]

though I havent tested if they have differing damage values

[novel oracle]

its the same on both

[near vapor]

ok good to know

[bronze glade]

yes, but the entire point is to not use that combo on mk1

because you get a way better ST combo on mk1

(heavy spam)

[near vapor]

well still slower

also just slower for my liking

[rustic axle]

oh come on it has two marks?

i thought it only had one

[bronze glade]

sometimes you gotta go slower to kill things faster
-confucius

[novel oracle]

it gives 30-40% cooldown reduction (not rate, and they dont play too nicely with each other, as in one kinda reduces the effect of the other in terms of the final cooldown result), on the class that has 2 abilities where their cooldowns are even able to regen (their active uptime), and the other abilities cooldown doesnt even matter cuz the bottleneck is the stim for the crate, and the stim can instantly regen the crate too
the only other effects are 15%-20% crit chance and tdr, both in their own nodes, and pushing that 20% requires your stim to be so uninvested that its peepeepoopoo
youre also heavily sacrificing the other stuff from the other keystones for this extremely mid at best cooldown reduction and good but a little low for a keystone stats

[rustic axle]

anyway im watching one of my teammates blatantly outperform my autopisols with the infantry auto, im a bit sad

[limber cradle]

mission froze and aborted but i got to see the blinder mid air

[sturdy marsh]

I'm finally getting around to trying taxe on my scum. I have a stimm supply build, would it be worth it to put shred/bromentum. So I can can trigger the tox on crit more. Or should I just stick with head taker/bromentum

[rustic axle]

is the infatry autogun really better than the dual smgs

[novel oracle]

not for desperado tbh

[little pivot]

with optimal (I dont want to say max) investment Ive been able to use Chem Dependency + 50% Cooldown Regen + 12% Ability Regen from Curios to get Desperado down to ~18 seconds cd

[limber cradle]

i like it less cause no run and gun

[manic wolf]

Depends imo, if you're using Hyperviolence, stick with Headtaker, if not, try with Shred. Idk if Shred is gonna be a good pick for your overall damage, but for proccing it'll be good

[foggy path]

Is hypercritical broken on ranged?

[novel oracle]

or you could have 80% of desperado outside of desperado with vultures mark
and get the 15% crit chance for your guns
and more damage
and movement speed too

[novel oracle]

it isnt meant to work on ranged

[manic wolf]

An you will ofc benifit more often from the talent that gives you more damage with tox'd enemies around

[little pivot]

Im not saying its good or bad, just what Ive found

[novel oracle]

fair

[supple torrent]

iirc hypercrit only works on melee.

[little pivot]

kinda wish I could get it to like 10 seconds

I took every possible option to lower its cooldown

unless theres some kinda weapon blessing(s) Im missing which I doubt

[novel oracle]

are you considering seers presence

[little pivot]

thematically I love the idea of being addicted to stims and spamming them

but there seems to be little practical use for it atm

[little pivot]

I am not

[sinful matrix]

Do hive scum stims stack with each other?

[sturdy marsh]

And I'll get more cdr on my stimms. Which renews my ability. That's what I was thinking anyway

[little pivot]

Im thinking of my build in a vacuum

[foggy path]

Damn that sucks

[sinful matrix]

Though it'd probably be dumb to use scum crate explicitly for CDR

[novel oracle]

yes

[halcyon adder]

the explosive mode on the needle pistol looks useless

[novel oracle]

the one on the mk6 is

not the mk2 cuz that spreads toxin

[manic wolf]

I do recommend if you wanna abuse critstacking on Scum, this is a better option than TacAxe

[sinful matrix]

But Seer's Prescene+Another Scum with Crate CDR would get it lower

But. . . again, why Scum Crate for CDR lmao

[novel oracle]

ngl i disagree cuz bm is just so busted with hyper violence

[tender marten]

taxe also has built in crit so

[little pivot]

I assumed my stim + an allies stim doing the same thing wouldnt stack

[tender marten]

its not like shred chord is that much further ahead of the taxe

[manic wolf]

I would have thought BM/HT would be better for that no? Hence why recommending to put Shred on Chainsword over TacAxe

[tender marten]

they really gotta drop bromentum lol

[sturdy marsh]

I'll try that next. I just love the taxe and I haven't used it yet on scum.

[novel oracle]

oh you mean specifically as much crit as possible

ig

[supple torrent]

Been running this and it feels fine. Extra TDR and CDR grants a bit of safety if I get caught. It also works on melee as well so it helps for armor.

[rustic axle]

damn now im actually tempted to switch out my dual autopistols for an infantry autogun

[manic wolf]

An tbh, even on Chainsword Hyperviolece goes pretty hard, an you dont get BM or any real eqivilent on that so you're not losing out on a damage multiplier

[supple torrent]

If stim is down.

[sinful matrix]

I still like the Orestes Chainaxe more than chainsword

[novel oracle]

@little pivot if you take a melee/ranged conditional and have seers presence its down to 11ish seconds

[sinful matrix]

One less dodge, and a little bit worse dodge distance but the raw killing power is comfy

[little pivot]

whats the conditional? I knwo seers is an ally psyker

[manic wolf]

Chainaxe deffo hits hard, but I adore the speed an moveset of the OG Chainsword

[novel oracle]

if you have someone else give you an additional conditional cdr via a crate its 7.5

[little pivot]

oh you mean the 75% cdr from stim

[sinful matrix]

Kinda neat to have so many melee weapons that are competitive with each other

[manic wolf]

I wish more weapons were like the OG Shovel and Chainsword tbh, they have such variation in thier movesets an do so much in so many situations

[sinful matrix]

At least its not "Dueling Sword or bust" on HS

[novel oracle]

it bumps you from 50% flat to 100% if you keep the effect up

[little pivot]

I personally tried testing those in the Psykanium and saw no notable difference between those 2 and the +25% one

[manic wolf]

Yeah, thats a fuckin huge bonus to the class, more or less every weapon is viable an its not a one-horse race

[little pivot]

or if there was it was so minimal I wouldve prefered the consistency

[knotty grotto]

ah so im assuming this is why you relegate the cdr to the stim for all your builds? got it. thanks for explaining!

[novel oracle]

because 50% and 100% is the difference between 2/3rds of an ability to 1/2 of an ability

[spark gyro]

I tried stimm crate and it went horribly

I'm heading back to rampage and the big funnies

[novel oracle]

200% would be 1/3rd
youd need the % to get exponentially bigger to see reasonable gains

[little pivot]

Im simply saying I didnt see a major difference and I was timing it

[novel oracle]

yeah the effect is very slim

when you stack all that cooldown stuff tho

if youre a killy build in a realistic situation i think those nodes are better tho

[little pivot]

Id rather shoot up a stim and go afk and get X seconds back vs having to shoot up/melee up a crap ton of enemies for a few seconds back extra

[mighty belfry]

i'm finding an appreciation for adrenaline frenzy tbh

[novel oracle]

it also helps that i play havoc a lot so its very rare that im ever not fighting everything

[sinful matrix]

Yeah, i was gonna say.

[little pivot]

thats fair Im not on havoc

[sinful matrix]

Anything that's X on Kill scales with difficulty

[little pivot]

I just dont like conditionals if I have a choice

[novel oracle]

i do see the value on the passive one
but i see my self meeting the conditions often enough during the effect

[sinful matrix]

Hard to utilize in damnation, and then gets easier from there because horde density just keeps going up/time in between goes down

[broken moss]

we are 100% certain the perks on the needler dont affect the toxin damage right?

like +% to carapce

[novel oracle]

basically
the stim has such a long cooldown for the other effects that i dont see it really being that useful long terms outside of just being a burst of cdr to get you back into those abilities when you need it
if you were using chem dep, you sometimes wouldnt even get that choice of when to use it regardless what you built it for cuz you just have to use it to maintain stacks

[woeful trellis]

every needler scum i've seen in havoc is running carapace unyielding

[broken moss]

yea but ppl dont know

everything ive seen about tox is that its a flat amount and cant really be changed

[woeful trellis]

if only there were some way to test it out

[sinful matrix]

It's not like it's hard to test

[little pivot]

if I could get 5 kills asap and have it for 5 seconds that would be one thing lol

[woeful trellis]

like some kind of practice match where we could see the damage of each tick

[hexed lava]

reliable stim cd for stim decency 60s duration but 4 stackable node?

[little pivot]

https://tenor.com/view/the-universe-tim-and-eric-mind-blown-mind-blown-meme-mind-explosion-mind-explosion-meme-gif-18002878

[novel oracle]

youd need one thats less than 45s, due to the stim lasting 15s and not recovering during that time

[broken moss]

i just dont feel like bouncing back and forth between hadron and meat grinder when a simple question will suffice

[little pivot]

unless you grab Sample Collector

[arctic grove]

I could be wrong but when you take a strength/rending stim and then shoot the needler I’ve noticed some bigger numbers. I think strength affects its dot damage

[novel oracle]

they do, as long as your holding the gun
all weapon perks apply to all outgoing damage, as long as you have the weapon in your hand

[supple torrent]

Once you get to max stacks of chem dep you only need to refresh it once every 120-180 seconds tough. I feel like I never have to time it anymore cus I always have to use my stims during that duration

[little pivot]

if on pc theres also a mod that lets you create/test weapons while solo

[broken moss]

i do think rending may have effect cuz their armor is effectively DR

[little pivot]

no need to farm to try things out

[novel oracle]

i think sample collector is poopoo ngl

[broken moss]

like i can be in meat grinder and use the crafting station?

which mod?

[little pivot]

more like create a ghost weapon with maxed out blessings etc

[arctic grove]

I’m honestly trying to find a way to make the combat shotgun/ double barrel good on scum

[novel oracle]

like you take it with chem dep but its not reliable for long term stack management

[broken moss]

i have one that lets me go to meat grinder from the start screen and also lets me use crafting, but for whatever reason anything i craft there doesnt actually show up as the new iteration until i actually enter the game proper

[broken moss]

better than nothing

ill try it if you drop it

[little pivot]

dmd you

[little pivot]

so youd just use 3 stacks of chem depend?

[supple torrent]

I run 50% without the "+5 stimm duration" node and its easy to keep up 4 stacks. You could go a little higher and be fine.

[manic wolf]

Cole I got a question... the talent that buffs base damage when in proximity to Tox Dotted enemies... does that increase the damage of the DoTs themselves?

[novel oracle]

yes

[manic wolf]

🤔 Oh really now?

Well then

[novel oracle]

you think im running the keystone altogether?

[little pivot]

Youd = You WOULD

.>

[novel oracle]

personally yeah

[astral dust]

I can’t see any difference between the two needle pistols marks…

[novel oracle]

just save the point there

[novel oracle]

its also a BASE damage bonus

which is different than a damage bonus

[broken moss]

damn. got me excited i could throw a reload speed perk on it lol

[spark gyro]

Base damage is the cinema version

[broken moss]

BUT

that also kinda opens things up

cuz typically i swap to it, dump it, then swap back to melee

so maybe its not that crucial

[novel oracle]

(damage dealt * basedmg%) * (dmg% + dmg%) * (pwr% + pwr%)

its yet another thing thats multiplicitive

[broken moss]

but ONLY if im actually holding the weapon, and not swapped over to my melee?

[novel oracle]

so it does more for you thank you expect for relevent things like melee attacks and stuff

[broken moss]

if thats the case im dumping for stam efficiency and reload speed

[copper crag]

Their lower "blue" option supposedly does something different

[little pivot]

so if Im doing Desperado

why would I want dual pistols vs dual smgs vs something else?

outside of like... fire rate they dont seem super different to me

[spark gyro]

Does scum always get the same ship animation?

[mighty belfry]

Okay yeah maybe I looked past Adrenaline Frenzy a little too hard

[tardy citrus]

ngl gang scum might not be perfect but this class is a BANGER

[mighty belfry]

I didn't realize you can get stacks during the frenzy and cycle it.

[tardy citrus]

LOOKIN LIKE A FREAK

[mighty belfry]

Actually really strong when you're pushing the aggro hard.

[supple torrent]

The two ragers about to insta-refresh my adrenaline frenzy

[manic wolf]

Iiinteresting... Im gonna mess around with it a bit more

[tardy citrus]

https://tenor.com/view/the-boys-william-butcher-billy-butcher-psycho-smile-maniac-smile-gif-431153079723397674

[manic wolf]

Though I have noticed another problem with Chem Dependancy

[mighty belfry]

And 5% toughness regen is quite nice for this class

[novel oracle]

yeah i consider it a mandatory pair with crit toxin

and that puts you next to blitz chem

[manic wolf]

Yeah for sure, which is super useful

Though I have noticed Chem Dependacy's crit bonus is not actually working

[mighty belfry]

Or replenishment more specifically

[little pivot]

does Vultures Dodge require Vultures Mark stacks or no?

[novel oracle]

no

[little pivot]

hmmmmmmge

[manic wolf]

Nope, never mind, im a moron and had the wrong node equipped 😅

[mighty belfry]

Vulture's Dodge just works

[novel oracle]

are you seeing the gamebreak yet

[mighty belfry]

It's really dumb

[limber cradle]

Why would I ever not want to kill things better and move faster

Thats like

[mighty belfry]

Idk how they didn't realize that node was gonna be a problem lmao

[limber cradle]

What i seek out on every build

[little pivot]

my next question becomes what weapon to do this with