psyker-class

[gray island]

Toughness for me king

[wise pecan]

Unless you mean Lucius lasgun?

[west galleon]

Scout lasgun

[idle shuttle]

should I orange this?

dont see much on brittleness

[wise pecan]

I wouldn’t, but they’re your mats

[tidal adder]

So how does the axe build work?

[wise pecan]

Peril block, spam shove attack

[tight saddle]

Spam push attack and go to sleep.

[vestal rose]

push stab
push stab
push stab
push stab
zap a mutant
push stab

[idle shuttle]

you mean push swing?

[tidal adder]

But they break my block when they hit me even with peril block

[tight saddle]

Not if you're spamming push attack, nothing can hit you.

[raw breach]

Ehh I guess the other options wouldn't really help a Gun Psyker now that I think about it. You open with BB then switch to gun so it wouldn't generate a warp charge or count as a warp attack...

[wise pecan]

Make sure you’re not already at 95% peril first

[tidal adder]

Yeah but then anyone can do it

[weary idol]

and you aren't exactly killing many things with a warp attack

[tidal adder]

I was at 0

[wise pecan]

Then it must’ve hit you during your swing animation

[tight saddle]

It uses your peril before stamina, so you do you should still block.

[runic hornet]

Yeah, you can still get hit while spamming pushattacks if you provoke a running attack

[raw breach]

vs Staff Psyker, that would at least be viable to count as a warp attack

[runic hornet]

and it comes in while you're doing the swing

[tidal adder]

Im pretty sure i blocked it i just got ccd

[runic hornet]

Protip for pushattack spam is to actually stand perfectly still, walk around at most, don't use dodges.

ACtually, that's a protip period.

[tidal adder]

Ill have to test it more

[vestal rose]

I feel like occasionally I get my stamina broken even though I'm just holding peril block (with low peril)
probably server issues or something

[runic hornet]

Using unnecessary dodges just because you want to go faster has a nasty habit of provoking running attacks.

Which will then force you to dodge more.

[wise pecan]

I’ve never experienced that myself

[raw breach]

certain overhead swings aren't blockable

[runic hornet]

It adds complxity against trash mobs you don't need. Especially since you've already decided to pushattack spam to keep it brainless.

[tidal adder]

My mouse is acting up too maybe thats the issue

[vestal rose]

does daemonhost have those kinds of swings?

[tight saddle]

Imagine if this game had spear trash mobs like VT does lol. So many more people would be dying in melee if they already struggle with hordes.

[sick kindle]

Chaos Warrior Crushers and Storm Vermin Maulers.

[runic hornet]

Daemonhost swing swing, SWING, the final hit pierces block I think

[wise pecan]

Daemonhosts are fuckers, I think they do have one that stuns you

[sick kindle]

Actually no the maulers use the same set as the headsman

[runic hornet]

imagine release Winds of Magic gor spears

[sick kindle]

That'd be more accurate

[runic hornet]

fucking gor spears

god, I'm still traumatized

[vestal rose]

I know trying to block a crusher overhead is a Bad Idea lol
I've tanked daemonhost standing still just fine several times, is the thing. Feels inconsistent, but the lil guy's a bit too hyperactive for me to spot if it's on a consistent kind of attack

[tight saddle]

lmfao what a time

[runic hornet]

they're fair now but they weren't, for so long

[raw breach]

Imagine they gave Psyker's Bret Force Longsword

[tight saddle]

THAT'S MY DREAM

[tidal adder]

Whats that

[runic hornet]

@vestal rose I tried activequell->swap to melee

[raw breach]

Grail Knight's Bretonnian Longsword from Verrmintide 2

[runic hornet]

You're not seeing it start passive quelling sooner, what you're seeing is that hte active quell has a very werid little bit of "inertia" where evne after you stop active quelling, it active-quells for a little longer.

It works that way even without swapping.

It's still 2 seconds before the passive quelling rate kicks in.

[runic hornet]

I just want TH to have antiarmor heavies

Like VT2's 2H hammer

god, TH feels so fucking anemic when you can't anti-armor bonk crushers

[vestal rose]

no you're totally right
guess I'm dumb

[idle shuttle]

whats the fookin

time on decimator...?

whats the difference here

headhunter just worse

[runic hornet]

From what I tested

Decimator works on the same conditions as Shred

[idle shuttle]

which are?

[runic hornet]

1. you can't stop swinging, if you pushattack it drops decimator
2. you can't miss, if you miss a attack it drops decimator

[slate star]

Hi, what are good combinations of curios for T4-5?

[idle shuttle]

oh thats fucked

on the push attack

[runic hornet]

So either you're going full-bore into a horde or a boss or an ogyrn or something, or you drop decimator

But in return its reward is higher

Headtaker works while sliding around killing riflemen who have scattered

[idle shuttle]

if my axe is out its cause I need to block some shit

otherwise id be zapping

[runic hornet]

And yeah decimator does not play well with antax pushattack spam

[slate star]

I've red that the meta is all toughness on all curios, is it true?

[wise pecan]

You definitely want at least one +wounds, just for wiggle room imo, but other than that it’s a toss-up between health and toughness

[raw breach]

When I was in meat grinder testing shred on my axe i was able to stack the crit bonus with chain light attacks then chain push attack for about 10s and was getting constant crits, then it was like the buff fell off

[bleak tulip]

so as long as all you do is press LMB it retains it no matter the time gap? wacky

[idle shuttle]

never stop prepssing LMB sounds great for sedition

difficulty

[tight saddle]

Only once you can properly avoid nearly all melee damage and bombers. Then shooters are the biggest threat, but health is a good substitute for learning and covering your mistakes.

[mild canopy]

didnt see a surge staff in shop in my last 20h of playtime, emperor please bless me

[runic hornet]

mostly
When you're good at the game, biggest risk is from riflemen and gunners who basically tax your toughness with little counterplay

[idle shuttle]

meta: 1 health, 1 wound, 1 tough curious

[gray island]

surge staff is a trap dont fall for it

[sick kindle]

One more run and I can bring a decent purple purge staff to orange. I'm happy about it

[tight saddle]

pass on wound

[mild canopy]

only staff i like except void

[runic hornet]

Most people agree: 2 toughness curios +1 wound if you think your team can rez you,3 toughness curios if you don't think your team can rez you

[gray island]

actually meta 3 wound and all toughness/corruption bonuses

[tight saddle]

if you lose a Damnation it's never really because you were missing a wound, something else happened in the run.

[runic hornet]

A lot of people subscribe to "if one player goes down the team is done" on damnation, which I frankly don't believe in. The better your group is at knowing how to recover, the more likely it is they can pull a revive

[gray island]

3 wound then Self destruct to horde clear wlike a chad

[tight saddle]

The problem with wounds is that you should build to prevent going down, not expecting to go down.

[runic hornet]

especially if your players are good, they won't go down in shitty positions like in the open. If they get grabbed by a mutant even they'll make sure that the nagle is such taht they get carried into cover

[bleak tulip]

I just dont wanna be half health after getting picked up should I go down

[gray island]

all these psykers not even using a core psyker utility

[wise pecan]

This is a fair point, losses tend to be because people get downed (from specials or simply being overwhelmed) rather than because someone died from too much corruption

[runic hornet]

The difference is that you stand up at 66% HP rather than 50%, which is already most of the value of an HP curio
And you can fully stand up a SECOND time, for another 33% beyond that

[bleak tulip]

expect not to take damage then and dont take any curios, same mentality

situations can be recovered, damnation isnt cata

[runic hornet]

Also, sometimes you can get rescued but you're basically guaranteed to die again.

[gray island]

how do you know if you dont have one

[runic hornet]

Sometimes you get rescued literally in bomber fire

[weary idol]

I run +1 wound so that I don't get corrupted to death from poxwalkers/hounds easily

[runic hornet]

Eh, hounds don't really corrupt you much

Poxwalkers shouldn't be hitting you hard enough to noticeably corrupt you in between medicaes

[weary idol]

yeah sure, individually

[gray island]

they corrupt more than they do damage

[weary idol]

but hounds are everywhere

[mild canopy]

i do, just didnt get any in shop in my last 20h of game time

[bleak tulip]

I thought wound doesnt help with corruption gain, its a max health % no?

[runic hornet]

No, what happens is that the hound pounces you and then all the other sources of damage delete you

the hound really doesn't get a chance to chew on you for more than a few seconds

[weary idol]

50% with 3 wounds is only 1 wound down

[bleak tulip]

certainly doesnt help with grim corruption

[weary idol]

if I had 2 wounds I would be death on next down

[bleak tulip]

fair enough

[sick kindle]

The MK IV DS is literally the reincarnation of Saltz rapier

[orchid nest]

grim corruption is flat health amount

[weary idol]

the MKV has the actual stab attacks though

[vestal rose]

If resistance to grimoire corruption worked like you expect it to I'd be much happier taking toughness

[orchid nest]

then ticking of course

[gray island]

i just run seperate curios when im running grims

[wise pecan]

Doesn’t grim resistance literally do nothing? Except for just the ticking?

[orchid nest]

yeah basically

[hoary warren]

when is the update dropping for the crafting system

[wise pecan]

Nobody knows

[hoary warren]

i cry

i have no idea what else to do in this game

[gray island]

honestly

[wise pecan]

I’ve just been playing for fun and collecting valuable blessings when I see em

[vestal rose]

Purge the heretic rank 5 penance

[slate star]

Thx for advices, I think I'll start +2 wounds and toughness and will replace one +1 wound to toughness when will be better )

[hoary warren]

did all of the penances

[gray island]

i respect this

[wise pecan]

I guarantee you haven’t done all of em

[worthy wasp]

So wait

[hoary warren]

i guarentee you i have lol

[worthy wasp]

Ppl have decided between Toughness and HP?

[wise pecan]

Maybe all the class penances

[gray island]

Spoodles done 150 missions as every class

I can confirm it

[hoary warren]

WELL NOTTHAT ONE LOL

[wise pecan]

When we said all the penances, we meant all the penances :P

[gray island]

I've done all the penances

except not all of them

[hoary warren]

thats litteraly like 2,000 hours to finish that

so have fun lol

[wise pecan]

Better get to work :P

[supple skiff]

250 give or take

[gray island]

maybe for 1 class

i guesws you could do the gross thing and speedrun through like T1s and T2

[hoary warren]

this is my bb

[idle bay]

To avoid getting burned out playing psyker is started to level up 4-th operative...

[gray island]

damn 384 FS wtf

[idle bay]

384??? Burn the witch!

[hoary warren]

idk how i got that tbh

[idle bay]

Best i have is 380 and i thought it's maximum 🙂

[hoary warren]

400 is maximum

if you get god rolls

less then 1% chance of it showing up in shop

[slate star]

*Emperor roll

[idle bay]

With RNG this game have it will 400 in base stats and 2 perks that works against each other like i have on my axe 🙂

[gray island]

*God Emperor

[slate star]

I smell Cult...

[frigid zenith]

That 384 is a bug, add up the numbers yourself, its a 380.

[hoary warren]

400 is max with bugs 😉

[frigid zenith]

380 is hard cap, I think if it says 400, its still just 380.

Its like they capped the actual mods but didn't cap the roll itself.

[hoary warren]

i saw on reddit someone thats had a 608 surge staff and i was so confused lol

[sick kindle]

Is warp nexus crap for the purge?

Because I'm not sure how to feel about hadron at the moment

[hoary warren]

no idea dont use that staff

i dont use it*

[frigid zenith]

Depends on what the crit damage function is on the burn.

If it crits is the entire burn DoT crit as well?

or does it just crit that one tick.

If it's the entire burn then it's probably worth it.

If not, I would want terrifying barrage.

[sick kindle]

Yeah I'm not happy about it

Seriously, look at the table

[kindred edge]

Is this worth nabbing from Melk?

[frigid zenith]

Stagger is better with primary fire I think.

[frigid zenith]

eh, not really the mods I would be looking for on a psyker.

[kindred edge]

Yeah, that was kinda my thought. Like, it seems pretty alright but not what I need.

[sick kindle]

Block cost reduction, because excessive overkill is funny

[frigid zenith]

block cost and ability timers.

[wise pecan]

I mean it’s no block efficiency, but gunners are still annoying

[sick kindle]

Toughness reduction would be nice but I'm pretty sure it's a myth

[frigid zenith]

If gunners end up screwing with you a lot I'd just run a FS with deflect.

[kindred edge]

Melk has literally never offered me a staff. Stingy bastard.

And I've never seen a FS with deflect either.

[frigid zenith]

but you should really be focusing on positioning.

[wise pecan]

This is contingent upon getting a FS with deflect

[frigid zenith]

Indeed.

[sick kindle]

If trading ever comes out, you can have my spare.

[wise pecan]

Really you just gotta get good at positioning

[frigid zenith]

By happenstance we can also target elite with BB then duck behind a wall to finish it.

positioning and battlefield awareness is > everything else.

[ebon jolt]

Would be dependent on what other blessings are available for the purge staff. If Surge or Soul Blaze can be re-blessed onto a purge staff I think Warp Nexus would be really good. Otherwise it's pretty meh.

[wise pecan]

Damage resist vs gunners is great on the non-psyker classes imo, because ogryn has no cover, vet has to be out of cover to shoot them, and zealot is probably getting shot cause they’re mid-charge

But psyker doesn’t really have an excuse

[uneven sparrow]

Bursting from cover is intense, it’s a sign you’re doing more work than your team lol

[frigid zenith]

It's situational really.

[ebon jolt]

You're a better person than I. I'm hording all of mine so I can create a tier 4 deflector when crafting is out.

[frigid zenith]

On damnnation if you have 5 gunners all shooting at you through some stairs and the vet can't get to them but you can peak and get a target that's you're job to handle.

[wise pecan]

I would agree, but I think it might be disingenuous to call it hording when I only have one lol

[sick kindle]

For a handmedown it has potential

You're going to be sucking in a lil more warp juice than normal but serviceable

[boreal sun]

hello my psyker friends

i was going to put this in general

but I want to make sure a psyker gets it

JC7VW-XHG3G-F36DY-49K9X-QXP9Z - one month free of xbox gamepass

if you are not a psyker, do not redeem

emperor will smite

[ebon jolt]

Just have to get some block efficiency curios. I only have 1 so I'm feeling the heat still but they help.

[frigid zenith]

His lips are missing though.

[boreal sun]

Does warp resistance count towards blocking with that talent?

[sick kindle]

This is my actual FS

When I'm not having more fun with MK IV DS, anyway

[boreal sun]

unintended bug for sure

but force sword has unlimited dodges

[sick kindle]

But why would they take the time to write 'unlimited' in the stat screen?

[boreal sun]

they did not write unlimited

probably autofills from weapon stats

[boreal sun]

that's the way I would do it anyway

[sick kindle]

Literally the cursor, my man

[wise pecan]

I don’t think so, considering that they actually took the time to write “infinite” in the dodge stats

[frigid zenith]

lol

[wise pecan]

Why would they program it to auto fill “unlimited” if they didn’t intend for any weapons to be unlimited though

[boreal sun]

Force Sword
Dodge - 0 (unlimited)
Damage - 300
etc

for testing purposes

but no other weapon has that stat

also what skin is that

that's a cool looking skin

[tight saddle]

and no other class can have that weapon as well

[wise pecan]

Looks like baseline

[tight saddle]

just how power sword has (near) unlimited cleave

[boreal sun]

baseline has a white handle?

[wise pecan]

Might be the blue camo

[sick kindle]

The one you get in the shop for ordo dockets

The uh, green one that isn't firewastes. Forgot the name

[wise pecan]

Oh yeah it’s the blue camo

[sick kindle]

Yeah when you play on higher difficulties you get way more dockets than you can possibiy hold onto even when outbuying everything in the shop

[lethal rain]

What time is the patch today?

[sick kindle]

So I just get skins

[wise pecan]

Nobody knows if there even is a patch today

[boreal sun]

suppose to be a patch

[wise pecan]

Community update is today, patch is just this week

Patch might be with the community update

Might not

[lethal rain]

ahh okay

thanks

[wise pecan]

We don’t know

[ebon jolt]

Yes I assume so. It works multiplicatively. So if you have 20% block efficiency then the peril resist applies to the peril being generated by the remaining 80%. Challenge is generating warp charges if using your force sword often.

[boreal sun]

assuming if you care about warp charges.

[wise pecan]

4% from all kills, 10% to bb

Keeps charges up pretty easily

[runic hornet]

Yeah, and the alternatives on those lines are honestly pretty weak

[wise pecan]

I think the 4% one has some competition

[ebon jolt]

You don't think 15% CDR for elite kill is worth it?

10% to bb by itself doesn't seem like enough.

[wise pecan]

15% CDR is pretty huge, especially if you’re trying to get pick n mix and have a cooperative vet

[runic hornet]

I've found it's consistently jank. People blow their Fs to wipe the pod and then it's just cleanup.

Even on damnation it only shines when people pull badly.

And the #1 difference between a good 4-stack and a shitty quickplay group is the pacing of pulls

[primal aurora]

Isn't it when F needed the most?

[runic hornet]

You bite off exactly as much as you can chew and no more.

If you need the CDR from having killed the enemy already, something more fundamentally wrong has happened.

[sick kindle]

Worth crafting up, do you think? The blue that is. Nexus is BARF but that stat split is looking pretty spicy.

[runic hornet]

No, because people use their Fs proactively.

And then things are dead.

[wise pecan]

Consider: sometimes you (collectively) use your F(s) and things are still alive

Because lots of things spawn

[hoary warren]

Ayo just curious with this question, I have an Amd Ryzen 7 3800x with a Amd Radeon Rx 5700. What should my frames be like? I feel like i shouldnt be struggling to run this game

[runic hornet]

Veteran maintains counterfire, ogyrn is already in position, zealot has killed the thing he crit... psyker is the only one with a more "defensive" ult and tbh I find myself using it with 30-3 proactively more and more. You don't need an ult for a safe rez if you popped it in the air and then BB'd the bulwarks down yourself.

[sick kindle]

The game runs like dogwater. The 'get more FPS tricks are just' 'Use DLSS/Super Resolution'

Which basically makes the game run internally at a lower resolution

[runic hornet]

But that's just it. They don't. Elites don't, anyway. Elites pull from the area and the better you know the maps the less likely it is you overpull by accident and then a second elite squad comes through a door into your ass.

[hoary warren]

ive tried that it doesnt help so f me right

[sick kindle]

This is probably one of the worst if not the worst optimized game I have ever played

And I've played a lot of things that run like shit

[wise pecan]

We evidently have not been playing the same game

[runic hornet]

Again; the better and more knowledgable your group is with pulling pace, the less likely it is that you overpull

And pulling is VERY controllable.

[primal aurora]

There is Callisto protocol, so Darktide can't be worst anymore

[runic hornet]

There are some specific zones like... the cryonic rods mission? It is EXTREMELY easy to double or even triple pull because the levels are stacked vertically on top of each other and you go from the bottom to the top

[sick kindle]

I miss my baby butter smooth frames in VT2

[runic hornet]

So you'll be fighting one pulll, then the second AND third pulls door into your ass

[sick kindle]

😭

[runic hornet]

very bad time.

[sick kindle]

Triple digits all the time, even in cata hordes.

Now it's 'Oh I sure hope I keep 60'

[primal aurora]

welcome to the future, where only suffering lies

[wise pecan]

I will say though, unless you’re on mics, you really can’t coordinate very well, especially in quick play, which takes perfect pulls off the table, which makes the prospect of quickly recharging F’s more valuable

[runic hornet]

The only units the director creates out of thin air are trash and specials. Elites are always pre-seeded intot hemission

Unless I've missed something

[sick kindle]

I would do unspeakable things for Chat Block in this game.

For those who don't know what that is, you bring your guard up while your text chat/menu is active

It was in VT2 and the QoL from that was godly

[wise pecan]

Oh yeah that really oughtta be in here

[runic hornet]

Just like I rate wounds higher for groups that are stronger and wipe less when just one person goes down, I rate elite CDR on kill less for groups that are better. If you're quickplaying there's pretty decent argument for it, I agree.

[wise pecan]

Fair, although some skills have really long cooldowns, like the ogryn charge

Shit takes forever to be available again, meanwhile vet’s has recharged before it’s even ended lol

[glacial abyss]

https://tenor.com/view/broodwich-aqua-teen-hunger-force-master-shake-gif-25321632

[cyan notch]

ive seen crushers appearing out of thin air

[wise pecan]

I feel like ragers and maulers can also get spawned to fill out hordes, but that might just be the team aggroing em

[runic hornet]

were they in the distance and ahead? The game doesn't render all units

[cyan notch]

like right in my face

5m away

[runic hornet]

I know that if I get a bad rescue spawn, my body won't have enemies on top of it until my team comes closer, and then an entire elite squad will appear on top of my body

[lone niche]

Pop-in is so heavily documented at this point in videos, streams and posts that it's turned into memes with Creed hiding specials and poxwalkers behind your gun on the screen, even just the front page of the subreddit is littered with them like https://www.reddit.com/r/DarkTide/comments/zhlugj/the_emperor_knows_youre_a_sharpshooter_in_another/

[tranquil fiber]

High Intensive + Spire (Alternative Desert Map ) mobs spawn randomly all over the Favelas part of the map - getting like 6-8 Ogryns at a time

madness

[dusky lantern]

woooo praise RNGzus

who needs mobility anyways on a FS

loool

[runic hornet]

And again those are trash mobs

Not elites

I have never seen maulers and ragers spawn, they always pull
Sometimes they pull with a random spawn horde because a random spawn horde that spawns ahead of you pulls the elites with it

but then when you walk forward after that horde, the map is conspicuosly completely empty

[boreal wave]

I've seen them crop up occasionally but it's not them that bother me so much. Most of the specials I care about have an audio cue. The trash mobs just get a free hit and it's annoying at best, dangerous at worst.

[runic hornet]

pop-ins for trash are also notably fixed to specific map locations. Some of these locations are dumb as hell, though.

trash and specials

Like, I understand why there is a spawn location here, for people bunkering in the finale elevator+medicae area, and for people in the room before. But come on, units should not spawn here when I'm literally on top of it. https://medal.tv/games/warhammer-40000-darktide/clips/JVt1h43JuI4C7/d1337uyUzpRr?invite=cr-MSw4MjYsNDg2MDU3NTUs

[patent steeple]

i mean the amount of trash mobs on heresy is insane compared to malice, and i myself am used to playing malice so it will take time for me to get into the heresy-completion mindset.

[primal aurora]

heresy is bugged

[patent steeple]

in what way? does it spawn more enemies than it should?

[runic hornet]

people have said heresy is locked at hi-intensity spawn rates

some people said it got hotfixed

[primal aurora]

press TAB during heresy mission, you will see it has hi-intensity spawn modifier

[runic hornet]

And people have said that is merely a display error, and the mission spawns the appropriate number of mobs unless it was actually listed as hi-intensity when you first entered

Having played intensity heresy, I can definitely say it feels COMPLETELY different than a non-hi-intensity heresy

[boreal wave]

I figured that if it did, it was just part of the difficulty curve.

[supple skiff]

just ran a low intensity heresy with just bots

bots all down within 2 minutes lmao

[runic hornet]

bots can't handle ranged mobs at all, yeah

and heresy spawns more of them that do more damage to a critical mass

bots just explode

[supple skiff]

waste of a damn loading screen

[patent steeple]

i have played only one non-low-intensity heresy so far and it was much more larger in mob count than the 2 low-intensity heresies i did with a LFG group.

[supple skiff]

would have hoped they lasted long enough for players to connect, no such luck

[boreal wave]

They're more reliable than Alpha and Beta from Aliens Fireteam, at least. Makes me happy.

[runic hornet]

Just wait in the spawn area. Go make a sandwich if you need to.

[solemn barn]

Hmmm i dunno bout that

[tight saddle]

Oof just had one of the worst damnation runs in a while, it's not usually that bad. They even ignored VC.

[subtle flame]

Did the pugilist staff always have fire on the primary attack? Or did it use to be the blast?

[tight saddle]

Orange ammo Vet "Hey get this large ammo pack" skips
"there's an Ammo crate here" skips
"I'm putting down a med kit for you guys" skip
"med station still has charges" skips
"demon host here" all three run in (demonhost didn't wipe us but did kill 2)
"take cover here -marks spot" goes out and gets downed
"sniper careful" gets sniped
"elites behind us" I had to solo them all while they played hide and see with ambient mobs"
"tagged threats" ignored
and many many more incidents like that

[boreal wave]

I started playing late in the beta. Always had that flaming handwave thing for me

[cyan notch]

https://youtu.be/hq4rHuhBpcs

this is just one area

[flint plover]

🥲

[worthy wasp]

Yo

[flint plover]

I hate hunting for deflector

[worthy wasp]

I've ranted about there being a bunch of dumbass zealots before

But

The group of ppl that take the cake for biggest dumbasses in the community

Are "melee veterans"

[late crater]

What time time is this update supposed to come out?

[solemn barn]

lot of vet hate in here

[tidal adder]

Bold of you to assume you have the rights to give that cake away

[flint plover]

i always find it really funny when people call out entire classes for being dumbasses when it's really just people that are stupid

[tight saddle]

better than my run just now that never used his melee and died to hordes lmfao

[cyan notch]

yea anyone can be dumb

[worthy wasp]

Nah but something about Zealot attracts the dumbasses.

Not saying all Zealots are dumbasses, but most dumbasses are Zealots

[tidal adder]

One word away from racism

[flint plover]

i've actually seen more stupid psykers and vets than zealots

[worthy wasp]

Running into t5s thinking this is dynasty warriors screeching "I GOT 97 RESIST BRO" as their battle cry

[tidal adder]

You should listen to some music

[flint plover]

though bad knife zealots give me a headache

[tight saddle]

Have you not been in the Psyker channel often? Psyker attracts people roleplaying being smart.

[worthy wasp]

Getting caught alone a mile away from the group by a dog

[runic hornet]

That to me seems like a "fail to render in pre-seeded enemies" moment. every glitch I've seen in this exact location spawns the full squad in as soon as people drop down and walk forward.

Which, if it didn't ; that entire area would be mysteriously barren of any enemies at all, which wouldn't make a damn lick of sense in heresy+.

[solemn barn]

done everything on vet, starting pysker, guess im naive

[tidal adder]

Its spelled C L E V E R

[worthy wasp]

Then the ogryn runs out to save em and dies too

[runic hornet]

Same issue as elites not being spawned on top of dead teammates who need to be rescued - just, with an even jankier trigger.

[worthy wasp]

The thing is

What is the worst thing a dumbass psyker is gonna do?

Spam surge staff at a horde then die hiding behind another player?

[runic hornet]

dumbass psyker literally explodes 3 times todeath

[worthy wasp]

Ye

[tidal adder]

The same thing you described the vet did

[runic hornet]

overpulls by BBing shit in the distance while you're busy

[worthy wasp]

Most times I see Psykers die they are close to team

[runic hornet]

same crime as vet

[worthy wasp]

But when Zealots die

[tight saddle]

Melee vet isn't the issue though, a good player on Power Sword can fulfill one of the roles just fine. It's a bad player going melee only that will suck ass.

[worthy wasp]

They are across the country

U right

Not all melee vets are dumbasses

[tight saddle]

Zealots going out ahead of the team and handling shooter groups is perfectly fine. It's when a bad zealot does it and gets pounced that's the issue. Doing it is not wrong if they can handle it, it's doing it when they can't handle it that's wrong.

[runic hornet]

zealots think they need to tie up rifle squads, the problem is when they charge a rifle squad in between elite pulls, it pulls a second elite squad behind the first and now it's a shit situatin

[tidal adder]

Whos dumber though, the ogryn who tried to revive him or him?

[runic hornet]

Zealots going out ahead of the team and handling shooter groups is perfectly fine.
It's really not, it's a MASSIVE risk.

[worthy wasp]

Both tbqh

[runic hornet]

#1 cause of wipes is double or even triple elite pulls and "I have to engage the riflemen" mentality rather than pulling and falling back to LOS the rifles results in this

[worthy wasp]

Idk, why break coherency

[tidal adder]

Id argue its the simple: splitting up

[worthy wasp]

How to beat t5 consistently:

1. Stick together
2. Have functioning eyes and ears

[runic hornet]

Nah, if you do it as a squad then you all fucking die too

Because you just sandwiched yourself between two elite pulls which is like 8+ ogyrns on damnation

and the rifles

[tidal adder]

If you do it as a team you probably have a godlike tream play

[runic hornet]

maybe a second rifles+shotgun squad behind the second elite pull for good measure

[tight saddle]

Yeah, with a reward, and if it's a good player. It's also unfair to use a hypothetical that only benefits your argument when there are many other hypotheticals where it does work perfectly fine. Running ahead alone is situational and has benefits in certain scenarios and bigger risks in others, I'd trust a good zealot to know when it is okay to do it and not. But dismissing running ahead solo as a whole is silly if you're already set to only use hypotheticals that make it look stupid.

[runic hornet]

Aka the dreaded quadruple pull

[worthy wasp]

And zealot players be like "yo dawg I am a true warrior of the 3 kingdoms"

Then die

[runic hornet]

I'd trust a good zealot to know when it is okay to do it and not.

it's literally never okay
because the game literaly won't spawn in the elites on time, often

[candid hawk]

on my vet i literally tell people to chill in cover and cover myy back while i shoot shooters lol

[tight saddle]

It's been fine in many of my solo runs when we get a crackhead zealot doing it just fine.

[candid hawk]

counter fire + 75% damage reduction to toughness against ranged makes it ba breeze with a kantrael

[tight saddle]

You can tell if someone is good or not very early into the mission and you can play around it.

[runic hornet]

You break off to charge "the ranged backline", on higher difficulty the chances of you not pulling melee elites and maybe a second shooter squad and causing a full wipe even if you can fall back safely are unacceptably high

[tight saddle]

If I see the zealot with us can handle himself in a lot of hazardous situations I can be at ease and stop prioritizing helping them and focus on other more important threats.

[runic hornet]

Because here's the thing, you can activate a second elite squad

it does logic things

[worthy wasp]

Ye but what does running ahead accomplish? Are you saying groups cant handle groups of rifles w/o a zealot charging in going full Leeroy Jenkins?

[runic hornet]

it realizes that the distance to the party is too long

[tight saddle]

It happens all the time in Damnation solo quickplay and works perfectly fine.

[runic hornet]

and then it walks through a door and spawns behind the rest of the party

lol, lmao

Zealot going forward put the "backline" into an elite sandwich

that's fucked up

[tidal adder]

Its funny that leavings someone to ide actually saved more of my runs than it ruined

[runic hornet]

down-tanking is legit

[tight saddle]

No, it depends on our randomly matched group in solo quickplay where we had no control over our team composition and loadouts, in situations where it's beneficial then yes a Zealot doing that is perfectly okay.

If they know how to do it.

[worthy wasp]

Zealot be like "gonna charge ahead and place myself in a shitty position so when/if I die no one can revive me safely"

[runic hornet]

I'm asserting there is no "know how to do it"

You go forward and if there are elites in that part of the map you just fucking aggroed them, gg

[tight saddle]

Go bring that topic up in the Zealot channel and see what they have to say.

[runic hornet]

I live in there

[valid ridge]

Psyker buff, copy paste sienna's careers onto him lel

[runic hornet]

yolo charging especially from knife zealots is the #1 memed topic

[coral valve]

yolo charging is my bread and butter

[runic hornet]

"Guys I have a 97% DR crit build so I have to keep in melee no matter what, so if I get shot Ihave to run forward into them"

"guys, why are you all dead, why are you so bad"

And the answer is

[tight saddle]

There's a difference between a shitty player yolo charging and a good zealot charging in at the correct times.

[runic hornet]

The zealot fuckingkilled teh team

[fleet osprey]

ok i use kinetic deflection for first time against targets, i should be dead 5 times over

[umbral field]

if yolo charging is wrong i don't want to be right

[worthy wasp]

Zealot be like "gonna charge ahead and kill this group of rifles 2 seconds sooner than they would have died if we had another class instead of a zealot"

[runic hornet]

by going forward and activating elites

[tight saddle]

You are only arguing from the perspective of the worst case scenarion.

[runic hornet]

elites that teleported backwards and killed the party

It's worst case and extremely common

[fleet osprey]

on another note, FATSHARK I NEED A NEW FORCE SWORD

[tight saddle]

You have already set the conversation to fail from the get-go.

[worthy wasp]

Whats the worst case scenario of 4 players sticking together and pushing as a team?

[tight saddle]

They suck and die

obviously

[coral valve]

yolo charging is how I beat assasination on malice at 8 minutes so :^)

[solemn barn]

poxbomb

[runic hornet]

Get dogged or door-burstered

Die anyway

unlucky

Not half as common though

[tight saddle]

worst care scenario is they suck and die, see how an argument like this is stupid?

[valid ridge]

I mean darktide's spawning system is very flawed. That an the fact everyone can sprint and spread out so much in the first place.

[worthy wasp]

Ye, so the win con of 4 ppl pushing together is "dont be shit"

Whereas wincon of 4 ppl with a zealot is "hope if zealot is a dumbass we are good enough to carry his dumbass"

[valid ridge]

Oh, and enemies being further away in large open areas 🤔

[runic hornet]

Seriously. Elite squads are seeded into the map. The further you run forward, the more you activate. Hence, running forward in a dicey situation, through one elite pod into rifles behind them, is rolling the dice on another elite squad. If there's more elites in that part of the map, you just activated them, and you often can't even physically see htme. And then you die.

It's simple.

Imagine you are a cymbal clapping monkey

[sick kindle]

https://streamable.com/hqaiio I like to call this clip 'Excessive Force Authorized'. Alternative title; Tell me you're a WHC main without telling me you're a WHC main.

[runic hornet]

You wake up enemies who are standing around on the map

If the cymbal clapping monkey runs forward and activates more stuff, you will have a bad day

[tight saddle]

you really never played with a good zealot and it shows, go get a good Zealot from the Zealot channel to play with you to show you otherwise. I've played with some of them and they run around like crackheads alone handling so much shit alone

[tawny swallow]

whc?

[fleet osprey]

what is the emperor trying to tell me with the purple axe im given

[violet fossil]

Chop the heretics into mincemeat

[valid ridge]

To be fair, it would be nice if zealot didn't have to run around like a crackhead to get into melee constantly 🤔

[worthy wasp]

Nah, its just that the dumbass ones outnumber the good ones 1000:1 and even then I'd take a good Vet/Psyker over a good Zealot any day of the week

[coral valve]

Relatable, I love to go into ranged squads so they stop shooting

[valid ridge]

but ranged enemies doing ranged enemy things in a giant, open map.

[fleet osprey]

its times like this i want to be azealot

[primal aurora]

that you are a hack

[runic hornet]

The correct procedure is:

activate enemies
pull back
THEN leap forward

When you do this you can split up and do stuff and go nuts

[violet fossil]

Just be an everything main like me :^)

[valid ridge]

If the maps wouldn't have so many huge open spaces, then people could stay together way more easily.

[runic hornet]

If you push forward into unactviated parts of the map you roll the dice on "oops"

[worthy wasp]

This man gets it

[runic hornet]

And it's completely unnecessary

[tight saddle]

you don't get a choice in solo quickplay is the thing. If we're talking organized premade groups then no shit, nothing matters there and you can do anything with any class

[runic hornet]

Do you get away with it? sometimes

But why risk it.

[sick kindle]

Witch Hunter Captain. It's a class from Vermintide 2, one of the popular weapons was a rapier that functions identical to the sword I was using in the clip.

[coral valve]

Risk is fun

[fleet osprey]

dueling swords?

[worthy wasp]

Ye, and in solo quickplay Zealots are the ppl most likely to fk everything up

[runic hornet]

Why play russian roulette when you can just opt not to play

[fleet osprey]

truama staff and heavy axe lets go

[runic hornet]

I disagree, for me it's usually bored vets and psykers

[tawny swallow]

oh right yeah vermintide I know that

[runic hornet]

Vets will have counterifre activated and will be shooting every yellow

a gunner will suppress them

[worthy wasp]

Ppl watch youtube and be like "yo dawg, chill out. I got 97% dr."

[runic hornet]

they'll take cover

And then shoot at the only yellow thing they can see which isn't suppressing them, which is an entirely new and unactivated squad

[valid ridge]

Tbf could also just wait on darktide a couple months, continue to play VT2 until they sort some gameplay issues out. Like making people running very far ahead get grabbed by the ghostly hand of invisible market economics.

[worthy wasp]

Dont get me wrong, there are some real shitty Psykers and Vets

[tight saddle]

no, they're not, it's all random for each player. Some people experience Psykers being the worst, some people experience Vets being the worst, some people experience Ogryns being the worst, some people experience Zealots being the worst. For me it's most Vets are terrible and my Zealots are usually doing well, but my experience is not the same as your experience.

[runic hornet]

Psykers have a similar addicitino to "I'm bored, I need maximum DPS uptime, let me use a bB on an unactivated bulwark in the far distance"

[violet fossil]

just kill the new squad

[runic hornet]

AT least when the zealot overpulls you have some inkling that it's going to happen a least a few seconds in advance

[worthy wasp]

Ye I see a ton of Psykers that spam Surge staff into hordes

[runic hornet]

WHen the vet/psyker overpulls it sneaks up on you

[worthy wasp]

Total shitters

[valid ridge]

Warp charges are a bad mechanic.

[fresh reef]

I do this regularly

[worthy wasp]

But those Psykers arent killing the group by playing like shit

[coral valve]

The only times I actually get somewhat irritated with vets, zealots, ogryns and whatnot. Is when they have a mechanic to let them revive safely, but choose not to and dies instead

[fresh reef]

Yike

[valid ridge]

It encourages psykers to do dumb stuff, and feels needlessly punishing when you loose them all. So idk why it exists in its current state.

In VT2 you just cast stuff until you're a at high 'peril' aka overcharge, and then you'd have your stacks for a bit.

[runic hornet]

Also a lot of people don't check every hallway

[worthy wasp]

A dumb psyker spamming surge at hordes is easier to carry than leeroy jenkins pulling everything on the map

[runic hornet]

I can't count the number of times someone pulled ahead without checking the side hallway

It's not for loot, it's for making sure there isn't an entier elite armored squad with 4 ogyrns and 4 ragers having a rave in the broom closet

Scan every side hallway and ping elites if you come across them

[valid ridge]

But also for loot*

[tight saddle]

If it helps there are situations when you can create artificial funnels in a Horde to ease the pressure in-betwee perma CCing other threats. When you surge 2 of the 3 left, middle, or right side of a horde you stun them creating a temporary wall that'll cause them to funnel. You can do that while insta canceling between your other CC role.

It's a niche situation but when the situation calls for it it's surprisingly effective.

But yeah, horde surge spammers are funny af to watch

[runic hornet]

Because elites NEVER spawn alone, so if you ping just 1 elite in a side hallway that should telll the whole squad "Hey, we have a situation here"

[worthy wasp]

I'd rather the noob be dead/blown up than actively sabotaging the group with their 0 iq

[fresh reef]

Just run AB build so getting charges is not even remotely an issue 👍

[coral valve]

Long story short, use your nades when reviving

[valid ridge]

I mean not many people know about spawn mechanics yet.

[light prairie]

Is this a good purgatos staff? I'm not sure which stats I should be focusing on for this wep

[coral valve]

it's pretty good, warp resistance is a little 😦 but other than that, top tier

[shut thorn]

It's not a terrible idea when preventing explo via cancel, ganted I personally switch to antax

[runic hornet]

counterpoint, I would rather CC the horde while also doing effective damage with my melee weapon
mk1 claw or antax with surge staff, when you don't need to surge you have a more effective horde clearer
You don't need DS mobility or even force sword elite-popping when you have surge staff to cover those roles

But arguably if someone did take DS or FS with surge staff, they might hoenstly be better of surge spamming into horde than trying to use that

[worthy wasp]

But fs/ds + surge is legit garbo

[light prairie]

Yeah... I was wondering whether that would make the staff bad to use or not. I have the perk that gives me warp resistance per warp stack tho so idk if it'll counteract that

[sick kindle]

You can't take my zoomies from me, only Fatshark gets to do that

[river crest]

Any particular reason not to use surge on horde? Presuming you're backlining and there's nothing higher priority. Should you just wait and conserve peril?

[runic hornet]

https://medal.tv/games/warhammer-40000-darktide/clips/KS0bX9HJ4GCJF/d1337WgadhdT?invite=cr-MSxYRmosNDg2MDU3NTUs I will also never stop making fun of people who bring bad-at-horde melees with a bad-at-horde ranged

[tight saddle]

The example I used was in-between handling threats you needed to CC with the staff already.

[worthy wasp]

Better off in the front controlling the horde with push attacks

[tight saddle]

A melee weapon would be used in a different scenario.

[runic hornet]

damage against unarmored and infested is abysmal and only hits 2 targets for said abysmal damage anyway (targets 3-8 take virtually 0 damage)

[coral valve]

It'll help for sure. I'm not entirely sure how this will affect how many RMBs you can do back to back, however the main stats you wanna focus on is cloud radius and burn

[shut thorn]

lmao how long did that actually take

[runic hornet]

Now if there's ragers coming through that horde, or ogyrns, or even specials, then yes, please shock it

[light prairie]

Ohhh, so like the flamer for zealot? Got it, thanks chief ^^

[runic hornet]

also, melee scabs with flak armor straight up melt to surge staff, so any pull with mele scabs is legit to surge

[sick kindle]

The MK IV also says 'The empreror protects' and it has the symbol of the holy inquisition. And I love me a weapon that just looks clean, neat and a refined killing machine.

[runic hornet]

but using surge staff on pure horde is either "I don't know my damage numbers and don't realize that surge staff deals almost no damage to unarmored/infested", or it's "I brought knife/FS/DS and my horde clear is so bad that this is probably a more useful role for me"

[shut thorn]

Warp resistance is just a noob barrier rn

[runic hornet]

the clip is sped up x2

[cyan notch]

force sword is decent horde control and clear

[worthy wasp]

Doesnt pair well with surge

[light prairie]

Dafuq, how do you do that

[deft fiber]

Max base is 380, you can look for that. Than closer than better. And then just take a look on stats distribution. Imho quell speed is what you can sacrifice at first. But you know, you are not pushed into optimisation and whatever. Like nearly any can be played in high difficulties depending on you and your teammates. So your gear is just an nice addition.

[light prairie]

Is it like, M1, R, M1, R, M1, R?

[shut thorn]

its in the name

[shut thorn]

m1 is pointless on a lot of staves

[runic hornet]

Staffs actually scale extremely hard with most of their base stat bars, more so than their perks or blessings

[shut thorn]

trauma benefits from m1, thats abt it

[tight saddle]

You can do it faster than that even without a macro if you have comfortable keybinds.

[runic hornet]

A staff with bad quell speed, or charge rate, is fucked up

[sick kindle]

Literally looks like something an officer would use.

[shut thorn]

not my vid and ik

[light prairie]

Ohhhh, thanks

[tight saddle]

You can even speed up your macro.

oh

[runic hornet]

Nah, trauma wants to be 380 with a minor hit to warp resistance
Every stat matters on it

[coral valve]

Purg m1 staggers better than rmb, so it has uses

[cyan notch]

u telling me that if u had a knife/fs/ds youd rather shock a bunch of adds 6 times and not kill them as opposed to using your melee?

[sick kindle]

Just taking a small moment to appreciate the hell out of the art team. Not particularly relevant to meta, but DAMN

[shut thorn]

I'm talking about the left click bolt on it, you don't need to use it on other staves due to cancels

[runic hornet]

The weird "shocked horde acts as a wall" mechanic was mentioned earlier

[fresh reef]

True and based

[cyan notch]

ok but u cant even control who you shock

[tight saddle]

you can always meme with it and machine gun it lmfao

[dusky lantern]

gotta join the church of knife/purge

[runic hornet]

There's also the fact that I think that any person who goes FS/DS/knife + surge is probably doing some shit they read off of a guide

[lucid mortar]

I just noticed that light attack and heavy attack dmg numbers on a melee weapon are influenced by other bars besides Damage. Specifically First Target, does crit also have this influence?

[runic hornet]

And I inherently don't trust them to not die like a bitch in melee

[sick kindle]

Literally the clip though.

[tight saddle]

or maybe they're just enjoying the loadout and having no problems in Damnation?

[shut thorn]

you can machinegun with void m2 macro at abt same speed w/ more dmg

[river crest]

A bit harder to react to sudden threats if you're wading in on the front though. Not that there aren't times to help with horde clear but sometimes you want to be on overwatch i feel

[tight saddle]

You don't need a "proper" loadout in Damnation

[fresh reef]

This is my biggest grip with surge personally. Purg and Trauma can easily stagger hounds last second, surge cannot. Sure you can stun mutants but only if they're alone and you have ample time to react, in which case just dodge

[cyan notch]

yea thats just silly

[shut thorn]

Unless you're hitting flak armor where m1 on void does more for some weird reason

[frigid zenith]

You can machine gun surge m2 just like the others.

Hordes fall over.

[runic hornet]

not if your team is carrying your ass through stuff, sure
we once tried to meme damnation with 4 knives
it didn't end well

it didn't end well at all

[cyan notch]

skill issue

[shut thorn]

dmg is significantly lower

[frigid zenith]

Sure, there is a dmg trade for CC.

[runic hornet]

the 4 knife run went so bad we went 4 power swords the next run and it was buttery smooth lmao

[shut thorn]

(also not mine)

[runic hornet]

to be fair, veteran doesn't really have a proper hordeclearing ranged
And no, the recon lasgun isn't even close to good enough

even with 4 vet passives you will run out of ammo in like 2 hordes

[frigid zenith]

You can hard carry a lot of situations with surge. Takes pressure off the entire team letting them do more damage overall than if you were to just go void or something.

[runic hornet]

if you are the sole source of horde clear because everyone else has knives

[cyan notch]

where are you going with this

[devout flume]

What do people recommend for the level 25 feat

[tight saddle]

they are not carrying you, I've done Damnation high intensity with 2 Psykers using grey combat knifes and shit rolled lasguns with 2 bots. Just use your tools properly. Sure that run took long, but we weren't at risk of losing. The issue is when people make mistakes in the heat of the battle, where they choose the wrong option at the wrong time and it cascades into a wipe. The loadout had very little to do with that, because even when you're faced with a situation that your loadouts don't handle well you can still overcome it by making correct choices knowing your limitations

[mint heart]

So much trash talk love it

[tight saddle]

you guys act like Damnation is hard lol

[sick kindle]

But how else can I stroke my ego and feel like I'm better than other people? 😢

[runic hornet]

Oh i see we've reached this part of the argument

ez block

[shut thorn]

damnation is pretty easy if your teammates have two functioning eyes

[dusky lantern]

failed step 1, gg

[runic hornet]

yeah,and not overpulling

[potent echo]

if your team cant fight 2 maulers without taking damage, probably play on malice

[runic hornet]

again, overpulling is the biggest run killer

[sick kindle]

If it's recurring with multiple people of different backgrounds, you might want to consider that it's your take that's bad, not theirs.

[wanton cove]

It is for many people

[worthy wasp]

Tru, tbqh if more ppl were decent at the game the actual complaint would be

"Game 2 ez. When do we get t6?"

Because ppl with braincells that stick together curbstomp t5 with ease

[tight saddle]

watch me on my alts fuck everything up though lmfao

[runic hornet]

and it's less obvious than "I made a mistake, got hit, and died"

[shut thorn]

ok maybe 1 functional eye is enough

[devout flume]

Can anyone make a recommendation regarding the level 25 feat?

[runic hornet]

Look, I did my time in the VT2 cata3 modded mines

[worthy wasp]

1. Stick together

2. Have atleast 1 eye and 1 ear that function adequately

3. ggez

Ppl get lost at step 1

[potent echo]

the 3rd row for general use

[runic hornet]

I'm not going to stroke my dick and pretend like "wow, cata is soooo easy, you guys just suck"

[cyan notch]

kinetic flayer

[deft fiber]

Depends on your build. Bot most basic choice -- BB on hit.

[wanton cove]

You deleted that message with perfect timing so all I saw was the cursed part lmao

[shut thorn]

Might not even need an ear

[hoary hamlet]

depends on loadout and playstyle. 6 stacks if you BB a lot, Free BB if you play Surge or Purg and don't BB too often

[shut thorn]

You can use closed captions

[potent echo]

cata is a cakewalk compare to a gunner squad in damnation

[worthy wasp]

Cata/Cata3/modded vt2 is signif ahead of t5 dt in terms of diff

[runic hornet]

people who can even clear cata period like 50% of the time are already in the total playerbase's top 1% if not even more stratified

[worthy wasp]

IMO

[sick kindle]

Having fun > Meta. Meta isn't mandatory, it just makes clears easier. It's okay to use things that aren't the optimal choice. I've beaten damnation with shit rolled greens for laughs. Literally DS and Purgatus is what I do for high intensity.

[devout flume]

Thanks for suggestions

[runic hornet]

DS+purgatus is a goated loadout though

[sick kindle]

IDEK what planet you live on where difficulty is the only value in playing to you. Let people have fun.

[runic hornet]

DS mobility enables purgatus shenanigans

[tight saddle]

It is, but it's because they need to gather more information on how this game works and use it properly. Them not knowing how the combat system works in this game and how to use it properly is what makes it hard for them. If they haven't yet and are working to improve and end up in my damnation run idc if we wipe or not as long as they were using their preferred loadout and were trying their best. and having fun

[runic hornet]

it's literally a perfect loadout

you're talking about it like it's a meme one

[wanton cove]

Yeahhh like I don't think the majority of the playerbase finds Damnation easy lol xD

[worthy wasp]

T5 is easy tho, just stick together

But sticking together is hard

[shut thorn]

Speaking of which, might need to make a proper psyker guide instead of the bs floating on youtube

[valid ridge]

Tbh damnation can be pretty boring sometimes but because of crusher spam, and if you don't have the right weapon, crushers are really slow to kill.

[runic hornet]

gotta make sure the ranged don't overpull at the same time yo

just because you're holding hands doesn't mean the vet can't aggro 3 extra squads on you in that one part of the desert map

or on the cryonic rods level

[tight saddle]

No they don't, but the people doing Damnation are not those people to begin with.

[potent echo]

its more than that though, 3 mutants spawn and your team doesnt know how to dodge.
or a burster spawns and ppl shoot it instead of pushing

[valid ridge]

Especially if your ranged is hordeclear, none of the melees are particularly. "Delete this crusher now." they all take some time to do it.

[shut thorn]

Mandatory vet ammo egghunt

[tight saddle]

Damnation is hard for majority of the total population, Damnation isn't hard for the people who regularly do Damnation.

[runic hornet]

lol, the vet ammo hunt

and then they both run into elite squads

neither of them pings

both of them die

[cyan notch]

well you said if u have ds/fs/knife + surge vs a pure horde you might as well use surge which i find extremely silly

[hoary hamlet]

I love how when it's "talk time" T5 is easy when in game most of you can't even backline properly in t4

[potent echo]

they leave the game and give you 2 bots

[shut thorn]

I don't like playing pubs because of vets who run off nowhere and then complain

[remote tusk]

Riding a bike isnt hard for people who ride bikes

[runic hornet]

I'm saying it's not quite as pronounced of a suboptimal play versus real melee weapon

[potent echo]

most of who?

[tight saddle]

correct

[worthy wasp]

This game legit does not give you icons for hardly anything like VT2 does. You dont know what buffs are active. Perks/Blessings dont show that they are active.

There is one thing that is represented in the UI though, Coherency. And 90% of the mfers that play this game struggle in t4/5 because they are scared of the number 4

[cyan notch]

they are real melee weapons

[runic hornet]

look, I need my tubes

[hoary hamlet]

most of the playerbase. Or you're trying to convince me this server only hosts the cream of the crop?

[unkempt juniper]

They just whip out the surge staff and let the team do the actual work

[sick kindle]

I'm of the opinion that the number 4 should only BUFF you for participating, not nerfing you when you're not.

[runic hornet]

it takes 900 of these bad boys to roll for a second blessing okay

[potent echo]

idk you are talking to people who arent here

[magic burrow]

isn't there a coherency buff icon

[sick kindle]

Darktide requires you to play much more closely knit than VT2 and it's a pain in my ass for PUGs

[runic hornet]

I just want dogs to be fixed.

Once dogs are fixed I will become ungovernable

[worthy wasp]

I'm of the opinion ppl that break coherency should insta-explode and there should be a massive banner that covers their screen saying "stick with team moron"

[runic hornet]

as it stands I can hit them with a stsaff m1, literally hear them whine and fall back, and a half second later as I run up to them they pounce me

the fuck is up with that

[shut thorn]

he dont bite

[cyan notch]

i am already "ungovernable"

[potent echo]

their refractory period on damnation is really low

[cyan notch]

#builtdifferent

[hoary hamlet]

what about when the team is the moron pushing on while you cover the back

[wanton cove]

refractory period? what dis

[sick kindle]

Coherency isn't teamwork. It's co-dependence.

[shut thorn]

why are u backlining as psyker anyhow

[sick kindle]

It's detrimental to playing quickplay with randoms and unless you're utilizing it constantly, you're throwing.

[worthy wasp]

Then its easy to carry 3 morons that stick together than it is to carry 3 morons at opposite ends of the map

[runic hornet]

you don't need to cover the back if specials aren't up
Which you can know by audio cues
If horde spawns, it will do so with a massive sound cue, and THEN you can walk backward to verify that it's not behind you, or if it is behind you, tell the team about it

[sick kindle]

There is a difference between contributing to your team and being co-dependent on it

[potent echo]

i see online people say that damnation takes 50mins to clear is this true

ive never had a game go past 40mins

[runic hornet]

50 is excssive

[worthy wasp]

Hell nah

[solemn barn]

30mins rough

[raw breach]

Did they hotfix Melk's shop? It used to only have 4 items, right? but now it has a second orange item, 5 items total

[unkempt juniper]

On some maps it can be but that's still slow on the long ones

[potent echo]

it was the most normal thing in the world i saw it in fatshark's latest youtube video in the comments

[runic hornet]

40-45 for a SLOG damnation high intensity but that's rare, usualyl you wipe beforehand if your party has to go that slow

[cyan notch]

yea i noticed that too

[tight saddle]

The examples used in the past 2 hours are so annoying, it's been mostly absolutes in perfect condition hypotheticals with no room for any variance, which is the complete opposite of how this game works.

[hoary hamlet]

I talking about people ignoring mobs entirely because they don't look around. You don't have to cover the back but you can't decide when mobs keep spawning behind you wither

[uneven sparrow]

Psyker

[valid ridge]

But what if 4 knife zealots without a flamer >:)

[unkempt juniper]

The one in the excise vault where you carry the tubes to the vacuum transporter is the longest I think

[runic hornet]

the thing about damnation running that long is that if it's going at that pace, you are probably going to just wipe

[hoary hamlet]

My point was entirely that sticking together isn't enough as you ppl make it to be

[potent echo]

Psyker

[worthy wasp]

Sticking together signif raises your chances if winning

[runic hornet]

i would describe that as a slog

[shut thorn]

ive always went first if im solo psyker and done fine, like whats the point of backlining, if you have antax you're immune to melee dmg, if you have fs w deflector you're p resistant for a very long while against anything ranged, there's sliding ontop of that

[unkempt juniper]

Obviously you have to know how to play the rest of the game but if you don't also stick together you will fail most damnation runs

[runic hornet]

technically doable
probably failure
A pain in the ass and not fun regardless of result

it's okay to spread out between pulls

optimal, even

[worthy wasp]

Ye, just look for the #4 on the coherency icon

[hoary hamlet]

Obviously

[worthy wasp]

If its not 4

[runic hornet]

Gotta find those medkits and ammo and grenades

[worthy wasp]

Make it 4

[runic hornet]

But the moment 1 player finds anything you have to snap back together

[potent echo]

if its 3 ragers 1 player should be able to take care of it, if not...

[valid ridge]

I've mostly already had my fun with this game for now anyways. I'm seriously missing proper crafting, sub-classes, and the option to have a comfy store where I don't feel like trying out another class is pain with the store being the only consistent, good source for weapons, even basic ones v-v

[runic hornet]

the moment one player pulls, two players go to asssit him, and the third decides to spend 10 seconds going for "the last box", is the moment two disablers strike, dogs happen because lol dogs, and it's a wipe

[magic burrow]

If I see three ragers and Im by myself I panic press F to pay respects to my soon to be dead body

[valid ridge]

Having to check that every hour be like.

[worthy wasp]

Psyker is awesome pug class because its incredibly versatile. Can fill any role and carry even the biggest of tards to victory town so long as they stick together

[storm stone]

sounds like heresy

[sick kindle]

Clutching happens way less often in this game because of the crippling dependence on that buff. When someone goes down it's usually a stacking domino effect. The threshold of pressure you can handle alone is so much fucking lower than in VT2 with a combination of much, much lower melee blocking potential and ranged units. None of your personal stats are nerfed in that game if you're not in some arbitrary distance away from your team mates like in this one.

[shut thorn]

also, @worthy wasp ty for teaching me abt antax like 12 days ago

[runic hornet]

I stan trauma for quickplay if you can get a good one

Trauma, for when you need to stumble ragers but you can't trust your shit team to actually kill trash

[potent echo]

if you use a forcesword, just push 2 onto the ground, sword zap the last one, repeat

[sick kindle]

Not to mention most of the builds in this game are half-baked kits that just make handling EVERY aspect of the enemy like you can in VT2, and there's a lot of potential well rounded builds.

[potent echo]

if you use a surge staff ayylmao

[valid ridge]

Also because the game throws far more enemies and specials at you compared to VT2

[runic hornet]

I don't know about that one

[valid ridge]

If someone goes down, you're lacking some very important killing power.

[runic hornet]

"more enemies"?

[potent echo]

cata vt2 has ALOT more specials

[shut thorn]

more poxwalkers, sure, more specials, no.

[runic hornet]

VT2 hordes are way thicker I think

and more specials

However, there are no gunlines

[valid ridge]

VT2 hordes look chonky but it's less units overall compared to a sea of poxwalkers.

[unkempt juniper]

the gunlines are what really fucks you up in damnation

[runic hornet]

and specials basically all are glass cannons, as oposed to muties, and even mere bombers/trappers are a thousand times tankier than vt2 specials

[potent echo]

like 2 leeches, 1 assassin, 1 hookrat, 2 gasbombers

[unkempt juniper]

a single shooter can do most of your health from across the map in half a second

[tight saddle]

It's to make up for potential shooters I believe. If we had VT think hordes shooters would be an even bigger nightmare.

[runic hornet]

Actually I know what it is

VT2 has stormvermin

[fleet osprey]

probably the gunlines are to replace horde density

[magic burrow]

IMO surge staff is overrated. yeah sure, you lockdown elites and stuff all day erry day, but the real danger in this game to me seems getting overwhelmed by a horde, and a surge staff just doesnt really do well in those situations

[violet fossil]

Yeah I was thinking the same thing. Ratbois are a lot bigger than poxwalkers/groaners

[runic hornet]

Darktide doesn't have stormvermin, but it DOES have gunlines

[worthy wasp]

I played Spear+Shield FK and Flail WHC.

[unkempt juniper]

i had a game last night where shooters could shoot through the cieling down onto us and it wiped the team in about 10 seconds

[valid ridge]

Yeah I hate that part so much

Tanky specials ruin build variety to a degree.

[worthy wasp]

Flail WHC felt so good to play in vt2

[shut thorn]

Our staff stuff is prob gonna be fixed next patch

[storm stone]

this why i use surge staff...i zap all the gunners so the zealot can saw them in half without worry, crowd control is king if you have peeps with damage with you

[valid ridge]

Because now you need that special weapon with the right modifiers

[tight saddle]

I've had that happen with gunners, I couldn't even zap them with surge.

[runic hornet]

Tanky specials are why Back4Blood felt like shit to play

you were advertised a game where you mowed down zombies and felt like a badass

[cyan notch]

let me guess that stupid desert map

[runic hornet]

Once you got past baby difficulty in B4B you were magdumping into walking tanks the entire match

[unkempt juniper]

yuuuup

[runic hornet]

It felt awful

[valid ridge]

Muties on damnation with a weapon not meant for single target is just pain

[unkempt juniper]

it was the desert map

[tight saddle]

The one and only lmao

[storm stone]

ugh, desert map

[tight saddle]

That map is so bugged

[potent echo]

an experience b4b player would just tell you shoot the red spots

[storm stone]

sometimes can't even pick up half the stuff in boxes and scripts lol

[worthy wasp]

Ye Antax MkV and Tac Axe dunk on muties.

Legit just ani-cancel to surge, ani-cancel to axe, then dunk on muti

[tardy flower]

B4B felt like shit because of the zombies spawning 4" away from you just because you weren't looking at the empty corner you were backing into

[runic hornet]

oh no, you spend the whole game shooting red spots
sometimes the red spots are covered in black armor because FUCK you, that's why
And if you don't shoot the red spots you'd instantly get mollywopped anyway

[valid ridge]

Tbh before making any horde shooter, just load up L4D2 for a week or two, then develop :^)

[soft prawn]

charger takes like 4-5 brain bursts to kill on Damnation

[worthy wasp]

Axe + Surge legit feels like anti-everything provided you are good at positioning

[shut thorn]

why use bb tho

[potent echo]

you shouldnt use bb on mutants on damnation

[soft prawn]

I didnt have lightning staff and my teammates died before me so I was trying to revive them

[valid ridge]

Since whilst overall fair, some of the decisions with specials in this game are just ???

[runic hornet]

faster to kill with a decent melee weapon, and honestly what melee weapon isn't good at single targets

[potent echo]

hit them with melee

[runic hornet]

Like I'm struggling to think, every wepaon I can think of has a good one-target combo

[storm stone]

lololol...the emprah didn't protec

[runic hornet]

even if it's just block canceling heavy1

[tight saddle]

Lmfao I've seen that happen often enough

[unkempt juniper]

fun fact: mutants take bonus dmg from melee.

[valid ridge]

Like I can get deamonhosts killing the nerd that aggrod it, but why do other players have to suffer for it too if they don't just abandon the player and move on three rooms, hopefully without a horde slowing them down lel

[unkempt juniper]

you're supposed to wail on them.

[worthy wasp]

Just tank the daemonhost, ez

[potent echo]

their design is for you to melee them instead of shoot them

[valid ridge]

Sadly not enough imo.

[unkempt juniper]

if someone pisses off a daemonhost and the team isn't ready i just run as far backwards as i can

[valid ridge]

Some melees really struggle to kill them.

[runic hornet]

even the mk1 sword has a decent single target damage spamming its lights

[unkempt juniper]

usually it won't aggro on me

[green cypress]

Didn't know that ty

[worthy wasp]

I've legit killed specials/dealt with hordes while tanking DHs in t5

[shut thorn]

the victim just has to hold m2 and occasionally press spacebar

[valid ridge]

lights will also kill muties pretty fast since they're not armored anyways.

[storm stone]

i will say, when playing evisc using zealot there is no more fun thing than firing up the chainsaw and cutting a mutant in half as it runs by toward teammate

[jaunty atlas]

hello esteemed spark'eads, i'm trying to level your most level class and i must say... i struggle. i use force sword and forcestaff because you know ... psyker. and i have a shit horde clear, shit mono, BB looks cool but is slow af .. there's something i missed ?

[runic hornet]

What weapon is not "good at single targets"?

[valid ridge]

And yes their head is a weakspot

[kindred delta]

Tried that, I keep getting swarmed by ogryns and stuff, and snipers

[runic hornet]

DS is, knife is, FS 100% is because of special, chain weapons are good

[jaunty atlas]

peril does not scale dmg up or something ?

[unkempt juniper]

purge staff

[shut thorn]

what staff

[runic hornet]

correction, melee weapon

what melee weapon is "not good at single targets"

[jaunty atlas]

trauma force

[potent echo]

heavy sword

[runic hornet]

heavy sword has strikedown heavies, it's good enough

[unkempt juniper]

catachan knives are kinda lackluster at single target dmg esp compared to axes, but they're serviceable

[potent echo]

not all of them

[runic hornet]

I say this as a heavy sword conossieur

[valid ridge]

I don't care, I'd just rather have them behave more similarly to witches in l4d2

[worthy wasp]

Some are SIGNIFICANTLY better than others tho, and TTK (time to kill) can be uber important.

Like, Chainsword/FS/Antax mkv/DS MkV completely dunk on muties

[runic hornet]

No, it is all of them.

[tight saddle]

there's a tech to do 1000+ dps on surge, but it's too fucking annoying to do that it's not worth it

[runic hornet]

Every heavy sword has a strikedown heavy1

[shut thorn]

use it for staggering enemies, outside of that either get a diff staff or get used to using antax mk v

[worthy wasp]

Antax MkV can kill a mutant in 4 light attacks to the dome

[potent echo]

i remember using one with strikedown on 2 instead of 1

probably remembering wrong

[runic hornet]

there are two different swords with strikedown heavy1<->heavy2
both slashes are s trikedown, even though one is a horizontal and one is a vertical

[worthy wasp]

Dueling Sword MkV ez 2k+ dps vs muties too

[jaunty atlas]

staggering is ok but i kill with what ? i'll try to get an antax when i can ty

[valid ridge]

MK5 kinda is just king in the bracket for axes.

[runic hornet]

Despite the angles, the attacks have idneetical hit stats

[dusky lantern]

You can't tell me this doesn't look like jet li

[potent echo]

understandable

[solemn barn]

perfection

[green cypress]

Nice try posting two photos of Jet Li

[jaunty atlas]

oh sorry antax is not a staff, it's an axe. got it thanks

[shut thorn]

psykers can melee push for basically as long as they want, get used to melee on psyker, trauma is used for rabid dog removal and making crushers dance funny, if you're gonna use trauma get antax mk v or a force sword with deflector on it

[potent echo]

duellingsword works fine too

[shut thorn]

rip dmg

[potent echo]

you want the mkV

[jaunty atlas]

ok ok perfect thanks, and if i want to use a staff and kill stuff ? because honestly ... i could use an axe and agripinaa mk1 but i would just be a crappy vet, that's a bit sad

[shut thorn]

surge = special cc, trauma = stagger cc, void = hybrid weird dmg thing, purg = horde clear

[mystic dirge]

Purge does some amazing stagger with left click too

[jaunty atlas]

wow ok thank you, i'll try all of that 🙂 i guess i'll go with void when i can

[shut thorn]

antax mk v = hordes cannot kill you unless you intentionally try to get killed
force sword w deflector = 1# revive tool/survive surprise 5x gunner bad positioning

ds = go fast
combat knife = funny anims and dmg

[potent echo]

what do you guys think is good for FS 2nd blessing?

[shut thorn]

i dont use tac axe so don't know how it works rlly

[potent echo]

most of them seem really meh

[shut thorn]

slaughterer is 2# blessing for fs

[potent echo]

slaughterer seems really unbalanced compared to the other blessings

[shut thorn]

deflector>slaughterer>whatever else

[potent echo]

you have like 2-5% extra power scaling with peril

[remote tusk]

Antax axe + surge staff is nuts. What other combos do you guys use on damnation? Not trying to get back into the endless 'my stick is best' debate, just wanna see what different loadouts you guys are experimenting with

[potent echo]

or like 2 soulblaze stacks per crit

like why

[magic burrow]

chainsword is great in assassination missions

that special attack just chews up the boss

[potent echo]

im FS/purge enjoyer

[shut thorn]

revolver and mk iv dueling sword, trust me )))))))))

[jaunty atlas]

the psyker has access to chain swords ? oO

[magic burrow]

maybe its called differently. The one handed version.

[potent echo]

yea 1h chainsword

[jaunty atlas]

nice !

[potent echo]

||but just use the forcesword||

[lusty fulcrum]

your build, void+mV, dueling+purg, trying to see if I can make force sword+lasgun viable but havent figured it out yet

[shut thorn]

but srsly i run antax and surge or fs/antax and void

dont like purg, trauma aiming is too annoying to bother w

[potent echo]

trauma is fun if you are raining down hell from an elevated position

[tight saddle]

someone queue into Damnation, me and this random have been waiting 10mins for it to fill

[runic hornet]

trauma is good
Trauma is literally a stronger Ogyrn rumbler grenade and everyone loves that weapon, yet they shit on trauma

[potent echo]

not so fun the other way round

[cyan notch]

ill use trauma more when they fix it

[runic hornet]

Disclaimer: trauma is only good if nearly every stat except warp resistance is @ 80%

[cyan notch]

terrible aiming tho

[runic hornet]

even one bad stat among the other 4 ruins the entire weapon

[potent echo]

nothing wrong with aiming except if you are trying to hit something higher than you

then its really funky

[shut thorn]

??? I'm not saying it's shit, it's just performing subpar rn because it's damage is quite literally like half or less than what it should be doing, it's great at staggering stuff

[runic hornet]

people keep saying this

It does its listed damage in the range

What's the problem

[cyan notch]

ah yes because 69% quell speed will ruin the entire weapon

[shut thorn]

The devs have already confirmed it's doing less than it should be doing*

[runic hornet]

You want 80% quell speed for those instances when you need to get to 0% perils in a jiffy between pulls while the next is running to you
the difference between 80 and 70% quell speed to get from 100-0 is weird

[potent echo]

did they? i only see hearsay on this discord

[runic hornet]

I'm sincerely curious as to what the problem is, because again, it behaves in the range exactly as I expect

It has a listed damage value at full charge, and it hits for that listed value

I hit the 400 HP poxwalker breakpoint in the range and I do so in damnation ingame too

[tawny maple]

Could you link us a message from devs? It's a first time I see this said

[cyan notch]

why do you always say "perils" instead of peril

[runic hornet]

is it maybe a blast radius issue? the blast is smaller/falloff begins at a shorter distance than intended?

[cyan notch]

also thats besides the point a non 80% quell speed does not "ruin the weapon"

[shut thorn]

same boat, I don't personally use it but the dudes here who do keep saying it

[runic hornet]

Because I can believe that, sometimes I'm sure enemies are well within the pie plate and when I pop it half the enemies just stagger out of it

they die to pieplate #2 just fine but...

[bronze pulsar]

There’s multiple perils when one delves into the warp

[tranquil fiber]

google:
https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/trauma-staff-doing-less-damage-than-indicated/66838

[cyan notch]

80% damages roll

[tawny maple]

Cool. When they fix it I might use the staff then.

[runic hornet]

Oh, huh, I have literally never looked at the table

my staff has 378 damage listed and it does exactly 378 in the plate.

[tranquil fiber]

yeah a lot of people don't xD

quite a few weapons that don't line up

sadly

[runic hornet]

Yet that staff has a 74% damage roll, "secondary action 374", and yet the table lists a whole lot f numbers that are way bigger than 374

[shut thorn]

ty, typing on phone is a pain

[tranquil fiber]

no worries

gots uu

[potent echo]

i suppose its the number before some hidden multipliers come into effect

[runic hornet]

(for the record, the staff breaks 400 damage with the force weapon->increased damage from higher perils feat)

[tranquil fiber]

in the beta the 8% to elites was doing 80% damage xD

[runic hornet]

If I take that passive off my pieplates hit for the listed number, exactly

If trauma is actually supposed to do the table numbers, then it's actually busted

because rumbler grenades only deal 300 to flak and 200-250 to infested, even less to unarmored

[tranquil fiber]

Trauma also has the bug where you blow up at 80% like Surge did

[shut thorn]

I remember trauma deleting stuff in closed beta

[runic hornet]

Yet that table claims it should be dealing upwards of 500?!

[tranquil fiber]

so thats something to also consider

[runic hornet]

Not anymore, I would've noticed that

[orchid nest]

I know right lmao it would be incredible with those table numbers

[runic hornet]

i've been using trauma @ >90% perils every single time

[potent echo]

i was only playing malice on closed beta yall actually grinded to damnation

[cyan notch]

my 80% damages role trauma only does 447 when its supposed to do 760

[runic hornet]

i agree that the number doesn't line up with the table, but how much does it do on your damage bar

because my damage bar says 378

[shut thorn]

700

[tranquil fiber]

Its a hard bug to recreate.
I had it happen last week to a fault, that when I was revived it blew me up again

its been reported though

[shut thorn]

trauma is highest dps for psyker

except its broken

[runic hornet]

if I take off my feats and hit a target not affected by my staff's perks (flak) i hit for that listed number exactly

and the flak targets take the bonus damage I would expect, +20%

[remote tusk]

trauma staff should live up to its name soon

[cyan notch]

my damages number shows 380

[tranquil fiber]

I think you're on the money that something is happening with the calculations

[shut thorn]

it does, the people using it have a traumatic arm injury that makes them aim weird

[worthy wasp]

Oh wow, so Trauma is low key the best staff

[runic hornet]

The aim is... mostly... just like corus/conflag from vt2

[worthy wasp]

But its bugged

[runic hornet]

but there's a weird thing where at range, it actually lifts up off of the ground instead of going as far as it can on the ground

[shut thorn]

It has always been, I remember noticing the dmg stuff on day 1 of release too on how its technically better than void but the dmg is fucked or smth

[runic hornet]

so you can't use it at the edge of your range, or else the explosion happens in midair and does jack for damage

[teal cargo]

Idk you would still generate a ton of peril

[tranquil fiber]

Yeah, its not working as intended but Void, Purge and Trauma should be our main horde clear

[runic hornet]

I refuse to believe those table numbers are intended

[potent echo]

is that how you can get headshots with the staff lol

[teal cargo]

and the edges do very little dmg

[shut thorn]

they are

[runic hornet]

because again, rumbler grenades only do like 150-200 to trash, or 300 to flak

[shut thorn]

trauma has range limitiations and takes awhile to charge up

[runic hornet]

Vet frags are even worse

[teal cargo]

Table numbers are intended

[shut thorn]

trauma has a no dmg window on m2

[tranquil fiber]

though Trauma when it is addressed can likely be a good specials / elite clear

[teal cargo]

Because you only doong that dmg in the center

[runic hornet]

It has to charge, but the explosion is instant

No waiting like with rumbler or vet frags

[teal cargo]

but it cost a ton of peril

[potent echo]

are the table numbers intended actually

[shut thorn]

yes

[runic hornet]

and if you count in rumble reloads, or literally the animation of having to pull the pin and fully draw back on frags, it's honestly comparable

[teal cargo]

I think they are

[potent echo]

inb4 the bug fix is to lower the table numbers instead

[shut thorn]

why do you think the peril cost is so high

[runic hornet]

500+ damage on full charge is cracked

[shut thorn]

Or why it has capped range

[runic hornet]

Capped range is exactly how VT2 conflag and corus worked

[shut thorn]

time to delete the staff then

[potent echo]

i wish i have a personal line to magnuson

[teal cargo]

Conflag had a DoT to go with it

[shut thorn]

uhh?

[tranquil fiber]

[shut thorn]

Void regularly does around 500??

[teal cargo]

And Conflag was mostly abused for the DoT