psyker-class

[lethal plover]

the auto-quell is there, so you just need to manage peril better.

[solar loom]

Yea, the deflector perk is the main thing I want

[weary wasp]

No, you do it for funny perk combinations

[lethal plover]

it's not too hard to manage peril, just a bit more cumbersome

[cold oasis]

The fuck are you guys going on about, the force sword is op as fuck

[ruby merlin]

@mild lotus I mean what's the point of it though, deflector sucks on damnation, means you mispositioned already. Axe is way more versatile.

[solar loom]

Can I stack up block efficiency?

[bleak sonnet]

i would argue this makes deflector more useful.. everyone misplays and in damn that means u die unless u habe deflector

[ruby merlin]

Even if you have 50% you will melt.

[lethal plover]

has anyone tested how this works for peril block?

[cold oasis]

With the Peril block talent you have a Ogryn Shield with the ability to perma stun everything around you for free

[hardy lily]

I manage peril by pulling my dueling sword out and doing work, not sitting behind a wall calling my psychiatrist because my ex dmed me

[bleak tulip]

been told it works with it

[lethal plover]

I would imagine it works but with fatshark code who knows

[clear heath]

Honestly i just like force sword for the shove range

[ruby merlin]

@bleak sonnet Not really useful when one mob can break your block on damnation in seconds. So if you do misposition into a firing squad you die anyway.

Would much rather prefer the axe or dueling sword personally.

[orchid nest]

the issue generally isn't that you are having a problem managing the peril it's that they are using it for toughness with quietitude and having more powerful blocking

[bleak sonnet]

you typically arent using it into full volleys

just as a momentary crutch

i also run axe and prefer it, but fs will be better for the majority of players

everyone mispositions

[ruby merlin]

I'd still much rather prefer the axe, way more dps, more stagger, brutal momentum gives it awesome cleave etc.

[lethal plover]

that can be both true, and that it is useful
Being robust to mistakes and surprises, is good.

[weary wasp]

i dont see a reason to stand and hold block on force sword when you have the best push in game

maybe minus shield

[hardy lily]

Dueling sword lets you get up in ranged enemy guts and fuck them up

Before they even shoot

[clear heath]

I just block when i'm down toughness and i need peril buildup for quietude

[lethal plover]

just don't over-estimate yourself and get away from team like zealots

[hoary badge]

Am I missing something on having +1 stamina on a range weapon?

[ruby karma]

What about the Catachan swords?

[ruby merlin]

Yeah dueling sword and axe fill kinda the same niche, with the sword being slightly faster and more fashionable, but lower dps.

[bleak sonnet]

i just shoot them 😳

[cold oasis]

Btw, spamming the first part of the push on the Force Sword is pretty much an infinite Zealot stun grenade

[bold flint]

this squad really couldnt find a reason that we lost other than me being level 10

[hardy lily]

I'm faster than zealots lol

[nocturne stream]

Until you're on damnation and there's 30+ ranged removing your toughness in 1 hit

[late gull]

The fashion is the most important, ofc

[weary wasp]

somewhere a knife zealot with 80 mobility is laughing his ass off

[bleak sonnet]

idk havent used them much

[ruby merlin]

@late gull XD yeah, either way, I expect the first true solo on damnation (maybe endless too) to be surge + dueling sword or axe.

[hardy lily]

You haven't used the mk II dueling sword light attack slides if you think knife is faster

[lethal plover]

the zealots have some leeway in how they play with toughness and health regen

[ruby merlin]

Does anyone know of any streamer trying a true solo btw?

Would be neat to see how those runs are going.

[bleak sonnet]

knife can do the same slide tech but better due to increased mobility stat weight

[lethal plover]

either j_sat or chocob will do it first, make your bets

[bleak sonnet]

most ppl dont do it tho

not worth the effort

[ruby merlin]

@lethal plover Yeah I've been checking J_sat, but they haven't been on twitch for a bit.

[hardy lily]

Knife has nerfed sprint speed, dueling sword gets double modifier

[cyan notch]

how are you gonna true solo with bots

[hardy lily]

It slides faster 100%

[late gull]

MK11 is my go-to. It can't kill anything to save its life (or mine, for that matter), but it quells fast enough to block for days

[clear heath]

get friends to jump off a cliff

[ruby merlin]

@cyan notch Go with friends x3, get them to jump off the map, easy.

[late gull]

*2

[lethal plover]

you tried heavy attack when sliding?

[hardy lily]

Yes

[sterile sable]

is heavy + slide actually faster movement?

[lethal plover]

yep

[bleak sonnet]

on some weps

[hardy lily]

Depends on the weapon

[lethal plover]

weird boost

I don't need that much tech in normal play but who knows

[hardy lily]

Axe boost is weird, like mk V you want to light-heavy alternate to get most speed

[mild lotus]

once saw a guy clutch a game thanks to that

[ruby merlin]

Yeah I hope they put out harder difficulties soon, have space hulks/chaos wastes type things etc. Would be fun to see the best players do tournaments again.

[lethal plover]

maybe when people start actually playing damnation in mass lol

so hard to find queues

[mild lotus]

t4 is such a step above t3 that it rebutted me from attempting t5 til I have gear that suits me

[lethal plover]

still I hope it's not just a case of bigger stats for the next difficulty
imagine needing 10 BB to kill a dog

[ruby merlin]

@mild lotus Heresy is easy to pug though, you can do it from level 20 and hard carry pretty consistently.

[bright cipher]

heresy and damnation are a smaller gap than malice and heresy

[lethal plover]

^

[ruby merlin]

Don't need gear

[lethal plover]

weird progression

[mild lotus]

the thing is we can't know before hand

[ruby merlin]

just run an antax axe (grey gear will do) and a surge staff if you want to carry.

[mild lotus]

so I took the safe approach

[mild lotus]

yeah, not using any axe anytime soon

[ruby merlin]

It's always better to try a mode where you do run the risk of dying.

[lethal plover]

but basically because to clear heresy comfortably you need near max level, and from max level there isn't much to increase, so between heresy and damnation it's not so big

[mild lotus]

nor will I use the surge

[ruby merlin]

Use the dueling sword then

[bleak sonnet]

theres honestly 0 reason to run t5 sadly

[ruby merlin]

It's just for fun

[analog juniper]

why are you guys horny for this axe? lol

[bleak sonnet]

yeah for sure

[ruby merlin]

@mild lotus you can run anything on heresy tbh, it's super easy

[mild lotus]

I do already

[ruby merlin]

@analog juniper It has amazing attack patterns and the best push attack in the game.

[lethal plover]

fun is the reason why I run t5 and not chase after penances

[bleak sonnet]

what's easy for u might not be easy for them lol

[bright cipher]

damnation is basically heresy with less room in between threats to breathe

[mild lotus]

I said I'm not trying t5 until I have gear that suits me

[weary wasp]

so much like with cataclysm

[bright cipher]

the game basically turns into a mythic+ dungeon clear

where execution and consistency become king

[bleak sonnet]

t5 = hold w, press attack

[hardy lily]

I don't even know about antax push attack, I just use it because it hits damage thresholds

And the swings ofc

[ruby merlin]

In beta I think people were clearing damnation endless horde at level 18 or something.

[bright cipher]

t. dead and waiting for revive

[hardy lily]

I mean I've seen level 15s do Damnation so no surprise...

[lethal plover]

it's skill issue yeah

[wet gust]

I lost a game near the last event because a dumbass wanted to kill the Demon Host even if the other 3 of us tell him NO

[lethal plover]

I saw early risers plenty in pre-order beta
but from launch date mostly people are max or near max

[weary wasp]

while i can easily run t4 on zealot and attempted a flesh wound penance with pugs a several times (with no success because fuck whomever made it), the psyker with no good gear is performing way poorly in the same games

but thats probably because zealot has such an easy time of clearing enemy shooter pockets at t4

[bleak sonnet]

u using axe?

[weary wasp]

psy? sword with no deflection, frankly my psy weapons are utter shit

[bleak sonnet]

use axe Xdddd

[bright cipher]

people stop meassuring the strength of classes by dps alone

[weary wasp]

so i opted out to run t3 till better gear

[bright cipher]

its so narrow minded

hot take

[lethal plover]

Peek would run out of a job

[hardy lily]

Fuck axe get bitches make money dueling sword

[bright cipher]

dps on psyker doesnt matter

can you disable threats before they dmg ur team?

yes

can you hold off and dispatch a horde?

yes

[lethal plover]

what do you mean enemies don't wait for me to orderly apply DPS to them ? What game is this?

[weary wasp]

well you cant disable shit if you cant kill things faster than they kill your team

lmao

[bright cipher]

can you create situations for your dps to efficiently take out targets without being in any danger?

yes

[bright cipher]

surge staff

[hardy lily]

Can dueling sword massacre hordes like Power Sword? No, nothing can, because it needs a lot of nerfs

[bright cipher]

psyker is a cc god

no one else has so much crowd control with nearly perfect uptime

[mild lotus]

I never tried VT chaos wastes mode, were the levels new maps created for the gamemode or were they just reused assets from before?

[bleak sonnet]

best cc is death

[lethal plover]

you are about to hear alex talk about how surge < guns

[weary wasp]

flamer zealot

[bleak sonnet]

anything > surge bro

[weary wasp]

and that

[hardy lily]

Yeah I hate flamer and purgatus

[lethal plover]

horde clearing is different from crowd control. weird but true

[bleak sonnet]

ill take a lvl15 with a brain over a lvl30 max ilevel surgebot

any clear

[bright cipher]

this

horde clear is a non issue

if your builds key point is horde clear its a shit build

[lethal plover]

eh

[bright cipher]

because on a good team everyone can horde clear

[lethal plover]

I wouldn't go that far

[bright cipher]

everyone can and should

what else do you bring to the table tho

[bleak sonnet]

on a good team everyone can and will be doing everything, while you cc mobs and pretend you're contributing anything meaningful

just kill shit with ur team

its better

[hardy lily]

Ogryn horde clear is a joke without cleaver

[lethal plover]

do you consider vet power sword to be horde clearing?

[bright cipher]

sir you use a gun on psyker and larp as a vet without any of the vet traits

[mild lotus]

who doesn't?

[bright cipher]

you clearly have lost the thread

[untold scaffold]

anyone like the mk4 voidstrike ?

[nocturne stream]

It's the best melee weapon in the game and yeah clears hordes like butter

[bright cipher]

yeah

[hardy lily]

Too many

[untold scaffold]

i think tis very satisfying to shoot a massive bolt through hordes

[bleak sonnet]

i run every weapon

[bright cipher]

power sword kind of does it all rn

[bleak sonnet]

i am not racist

[cold oasis]

I mean, infinite cleave that oneshots pretty much any melee enemy in the game

seems a good horde weapon

[nocturne stream]

If you get the blessing that extends the powered state it's hilariously broken

[lethal plover]

I think there is a distinction between what a power sword does and flamer does.
If you have to put it on a spectrum, flamer clears hordes faster and more safely. which means team can pay attention to other threats more quickly

[hardy lily]

I am extremely prejudiced against force sword and heavy sword, may the emperor smite them down

[bleak sonnet]

heavy sword is so sad

i love the moveset but its so low smg

dmg

[bright cipher]

people also forget flamer suffers from the same issue purgatus does

it doesnt reliably stagger/stun larger lads

[cold oasis]

Flamer is muchbetter than the purgatus, at least it stacks the dot damage

[bright cipher]

while 1 uncharged shot of surge hard stuns everything except monsters

[hardy lily]

How does flamer clear hordes faster? Power Sword with power cycling just keeps swinging until everything dies

[lethal plover]

and it doesn't reach gunmen from light years away, but that's not its role
5 main threats are : zombie horde, trash shooters, surprise specials, ranged specials, armored elites

[cold oasis]

Not faster but safer

[lethal plover]

also boss

[bright cipher]

yes

flamer very much has its place

[cold oasis]

I mean, in the end, if you're running a surge staff, any elite is pretty much chain stunned

[bright cipher]

if i could build a team comp id take an ogryn with a shield, zealot with a flamer, vet with a power sword and a good lasgun and a psyker with surge

[cold oasis]

So a flamer helps killing hordes you can't deal with

[hardy lily]

Yeah a trash can, need something to burn the trash with

[cold oasis]

Force Sword>Ogryn Shield, there i said it

[hardy lily]

Everything>those two weapons

[bright cipher]

ogryn shield instantly trivializes all monsters

[nocturne stream]

4 vet power sword beats anything lul

[cold oasis]

Monsters are not really a problem com'on

[lethal plover]

nothing is a threat in isolation. when game decides to combine them that you can't just keep surging. for instance, if you have to melee, you're not surging.

[hardy lily]

Plague Ogryn is a fucking joke

[nocturne stream]

You take one hit which is negated by toughness

sweep 10 kills with sword and get it back

[cyan echo]

I tried the power sword yesterday, it is absolutely insane

[cold oasis]

Sure, but at the same time there are 3 more people in the team?

[hardy lily]

Mister spits on the ground is a bitch because higher difficulties melt your damn hp

[lethal plover]

of course, if they are still alive or are not busy, or trapped, or dead

[ornate hamlet]

I think the most difficult thing I had to face in Damnation was two crushers, two reapers, two Bulwarks, a couple gunners and a boss.

[cold oasis]

And that's why you keep on' surging

[hardy lily]

Plague Ogryn is just a normal Ogryn that's taller with more HP

[bitter orbit]

Chain sword> force sword

[hardy lily]

Agree

[cold oasis]

I believe people do not know that you can chain stun everything with Force Sword

[ornate hamlet]

In what way is it better?

[lethal plover]

I fell out of love with it. It's not good for dodging or staying alive the way peril block is.

[cold oasis]

I should probably make a video of it.

[hardy lily]

Everything but blocking bullets

[ornate hamlet]

Talking to me?

[bitter orbit]

Better horde clearing more damage, better super, no peril

[hardy lily]

Yep

[ornate hamlet]

Sure, it is better cleave, not gonna argue that.

[cold oasis]

The first push part of the force sword (when you just clutch your first) it's a 180° stun around you. You can spam that.

[ornate hamlet]

But Force sword is best singletarget

[nocturne stream]

wut

[weary wasp]

hard copium
try doing a proper block cancel chain rather than spam lmb

[bitter orbit]

Axe is

[ornate hamlet]

Why would a Psyker worry about a cleave blade if he has a cleave staff?

[hardy lily]

Better cleave, better special, passive quell, only loses push and bullet shield

[lethal plover]

better super
gonna have a button for that

[hardy lily]

Because not all staves cleave lol

[nocturne stream]

it cleaves everything for insane damage. how is it a single target weapon

[weary wasp]

cleave on 1 light 1 heavy on force sword is insane

[bitter orbit]

Shush peasant

[bold flint]

i join a game and the first thing i see is the ass of a daemonhost

[hidden leaf]

peasant.lol

[ornate hamlet]

Why would you equip a double single target weapon?

[cold oasis]

I mean, let's be real, the damage of the Force Sword is garbage

[ornate hamlet]

Rather, two single target weapons?

[bold flint]

these two weirdo psykers were right in front of a daemonhost

[cold oasis]

but the utility it gives you is worth it

[ornate hamlet]

It isn't.

Special attack + Heavy attack is huge dmg.

[hardy lily]

Force Sword special does less damage than Chainsword special lol

[cold oasis]

When do you ever special attack the fuck è_è

[weary wasp]

2k damage on mutant with special

[bitter orbit]

I agree but the axe is better for damage single target

Force sword super is ok at best

[ornate hamlet]

A mutant? Try it on a crusher or a reaper.

[lethal plover]

wait are we talking about axe or chainsword?

[cold oasis]

Just use a surge

[thick surge]

imo the force sword special is useless since you can just BB for single target damage anyway

[nocturne stream]

Like ok it doesn't beat single target dps but man if there is more than 1 target it wins all day everyday

[lethal plover]

did you just switch from chainsword to axe

[bitter orbit]

We are talking shit a about force sword

[ornate hamlet]

This is by design.

[thick surge]

the only thing going for forcesword is the push and deflector traits imo

[cold oasis]

^^^^^^^^^

[ornate hamlet]

A psyker wouldn't use a melee to cleave.

[bitter orbit]

That's it lmaoo bingo

[lethal plover]

doesn't sound like you're very serious if you switch goalposts midway

[weary wasp]

two shot for both if i recall, give me a sec to confirm

[cold oasis]

Those two things are quite literally worth it taking over any other weapons

[ornate hamlet]

Now I gotta get on my psyker and look...

[hardy lily]

...a psyker wouldn't use a melee to cleave. Because you're sitting behind a wall quelling instead of meleeing LOL

[bitter orbit]

Force sword needs a buff to beat other melee for psyker tbh

[lethal plover]

the only thing
it's not how many things. It's how important the thing is. Like I just need one move from axe.

[bitter orbit]

Damage buff

[thick surge]

until your team sucks and you need to carry the horde and everything else too

[ornate hamlet]

No, because if you're worth half your weight as a psyker, you're clearing horde with staff

[tacit delta]

there's plenty of times a psyker cleaves wym

[cyan echo]

Clearing horde with Surge? 🤡

[tacit delta]

staff in damnation doesn't last long enough for horde + specials, you gotta pull out that melee weapon sometimes

[mellow crescent]

one of them is faster

[ornate hamlet]

I don't use surge 🤓

[hardy lily]

Surge kills unarmored so well guys

[cold oasis]

Hard disagree, it's safer for your team to just keep surging any elites that get close

[bright cipher]

this is by far the best take youve dropped

[lethal plover]

if you can sit behind in the backline, you're not in any danger and it's almost boringly easy
it's when there is no backline that the game begins

[bright cipher]

surge shot, slide in with axe, swing, swing, swing, push shove, slide away, repeat

[lethal plover]

the final test is when you're the last guy alive

[late gull]

So, is surge the best staff?

[cold oasis]

Pretty much?

[bright cipher]

if youre serious about higher difficulties yes

[hardy lily]

Exactly, quelling is bitch mode, you only use bitch mode for rare occasions

[cold oasis]

They are all great, but the utility on 4+ to instantly stun firing squads is probably uncomparable

[cyan echo]

I was sold on Voidstrike, but after some Damnation runs i'm leaning towards Surge again

[ornate hamlet]

So, checked, Force Sword takes 75% of a Crusher's health with heavy attack and special in one hit. Can chainsword do that?

[cold oasis]

The only reason to not run Surge on 4+ is if there's another psyker in the team already running it

[late gull]

/goes to shop to look for one/

Have literally never used it

[cold oasis]

If you're on 3, honestly all of them are great

[thick surge]

in VT2 the best setups for each class were those which allowed any single good player to carry the entire team. Basically a combination of good elite killing and horde clear. I don't see why this game is anything different.

[lethal plover]

well, that is the question.
everything has a role to play, you just pick the role you like. If someone can kill the gunmen (vet with lasgun), you can spec into other things

[cold oasis]

Small enemies firing squad

[tacit delta]

what difficulty

[ornate hamlet]

Welp Force Sword Wins.

[analog juniper]

you haven't played 4 Surge staff on heresy or damnation have you?

UNLIMITED POWER

[cold oasis]

I play only Surge staff on 5 xd

Still, having two Surge on a team is shit

since they tend to aim the same stuff

[hardy lily]

I kinda hate Flamers, they make me confused about enemy flames

[lethal plover]

5 things: zombie horde, trash shooters, surprise specials, ranged specials, armored elites.
Which build does 5? closest is axe surge but I can't think of others

[cold oasis]

I like a Voidstrike as a second Psyker to clear hordes

[clear heath]

I've had double surge staff in damnation before and it wasn't as bad as i thought it'd be. Still not ideal but it works

[cold oasis]

Force Sword+Surge is all you need

You just act as a CC bot for your team

[ornate hamlet]

Or purgatus.

[lethal plover]

vt2 does not the amount of ranged enemies we now have

[weary wasp]

heresy. 2 shots for crusher 3 for reaper, one push attack at either to put them on their ass

[cold oasis]

Purgatus is garbage on heresy/damnation, you can't do shit against Ranged Minions

[ornate hamlet]

I was on Damnation

[ornate hamlet]

That's cute you think so.

[lethal plover]

well, look like you are gonna have to disagree with people who don't like force sword

[cold oasis]

People who don't like the force sword are trying to use it as a DPS tool

[weary wasp]

make it 3 then, but the push is easy control

[cold oasis]

Then i get why it sucks

[thick surge]

The irony is that psyker kinda lacks a set that does all 5. in VT2 ranged wasn't really needed, but in this game you absolutely have to deal with ranged too

[analog juniper]

imagine not liking force sword

[lethal plover]

axe surge

[ornate hamlet]

At 3 everything works pretty well. There's less edge in the competition.

[weary wasp]

3 attacks as in

for damnation

[thick surge]

Closest for sure. You need good mobility to manage horde and specials and something to deal with ranged

[cyan echo]

Axe + Surge does feel really good to run, i just miss the deflection

You can suppress ranged with the primary fire of surge

[sterile sable]

blessing on axe?

[cold oasis]

just chain stun all of em

[lethal plover]

mobility
do I have to post again the video where I stand still to clear horde

[frigid marten]

Deflection need to be a psyker passive

[cold oasis]

Unless they're the basic yellow gunners, the damage is good

[frigid marten]

Or someting all force melee have

[thick surge]

can you do that with ranged enemies and specials mixed in?

[tacit delta]

yes, only cuz I wanna watch it sounds cool

[lethal plover]

now you're talking. yeah you have to deal with dogs and mutants

[analog juniper]

there are several perks in the skill trees that should simply be on once you unlock them on almost all classes

[ornate hamlet]

My setup is,
Mobility: Duelist Sword/Sprinting Purgatus
Horde: Purgatus
Ranged: Close distance by taking back routes or cover. If they're close enough that this doesn't work, Engage with ability and then just cleave with purgatus.

[cold oasis]

All i want is for 90% of the Psyker passives not be utter fucking garbage

[tacit delta]

what axe is that?

[clear heath]

idk, vet doesn't really feel like it has a bunch of holes in it's kit without the skill tree.

[lethal plover]

mk5 antax

[tacit delta]

oh okay, the one I use rn

[bright cipher]

That block push is legit the width of a football goal

[thick surge]

imagine with full stam regen curios

[lethal plover]

psykers sure don't need stamina

[cold oasis]

now try the Force Sword push

[bright cipher]

Ye

[bright cipher]

It's not nearly as wide

It also builds peril

[cyan echo]

you can still use the block+attack on antaxe if you're out of stamina right?

[cold oasis]

Do not finish the push

Just the first part

[lethal plover]

if they replace force sword push push with an actual swipe that would be ideal

[hexed wedge]

I just want the psyker to have more of the "cannon" in "glass cannon"

[cold oasis]

It's 180°

[bright cipher]

Atrax shove is wider that the width of your vision

[thick surge]

then you can switch the peril block talent to the ranged damage mitigation one and run +toughness curios too. Should give you much better safety with ranged

[cold oasis]

The Force Sword push is made of two things: a 180° stun and a 90(more or less) push that uses Peril

You only spam the first part of it

[bright cipher]

It's not, because I tried using it for cliffhanger penance and I got pretty salty finding that out

[weary wasp]

thats a push attack. peril cost for push was patched out unless game pass

[lethal plover]

the reason here is that no stamina bar can be bigger than your peril reserve

[cold oasis]

It's still there, only on the push part and not the stun part

[lethal plover]

it's also very thematic

other people waste stamina, you use magic to compensate

[bright cipher]

Delerik speaks the truth

Clearly someone that actually plays the game

Unlike Alex and Mikhail

[signal turret]

@bleak sonnet Were you the gun wielding Psyker I just cleared that Damnation run with, be honest lol

[clear heath]

How much stamina is the peril bar equivalent to for the purposes of peril block?

[lethal plover]

well don't get too heated

[cold oasis]

... like 6? 8?

[signal turret]

For me, like 20 lol

[ruby merlin]

Way way more

[cold oasis]

A boss attack on Damnation gives you like 40% peril

[lethal plover]

I wouldn't know @clear heath

[ruby merlin]

You can perma block a daemonhost with peril

assuming you don't run a force sword

[signal turret]

This, I was tanking the Plague Ogryn like it was a regular mob

[cold oasis]

Thank fuck Delerik a video of what i'm talking

[uncut hamlet]

That doesn't sound right

Oh without force sword

Yea maybe

[ruby merlin]

Yes, force sword has shitty passive quell

that sucks when you have to perma block

[worthy wasp]

I remember when everyone was shitting on your for using the antax mkv launch day instead of force sword. I'm glad I listened to you man, been preaching the good word

[signal turret]

Can confirm, ive been converted to the church of MK V Axe

[ruby merlin]

Yeah, people just zone in to one thing rather than testing everything for some reason. Dueling swords are neat too! But harder to use correctly IMO.

[uncut hamlet]

Ngl ever since I discovered fire psyker

[signal turret]

Today ive retired my FS

[lethal plover]

I call dibs

[uncut hamlet]

I've never changed

[cold oasis]

What i'm talking about the Stun of Force Sword, is what Derik is doing in the first two seconds of the video

[ruby merlin]

@lethal plover haha it would be about the time I first started using the axe, was on day 2 of the preorder beta.

[uncut hamlet]

I'm really hoping fs rebalance fs

I want my space stick

To be decent at least

[clear heath]

I think force sword is fine

[ruby merlin]

Force would would be better if a) passive quell is the same as the axe, b) instead of the second part of the push being a push, it was a horizontal swipe.

[cold oasis]

FS is great the fuck

[thick surge]

give forcesword better cleave or a good cleave trait and it becomes good

[clear heath]

deflector gives it a unique use and the push having crazy range is really nice

[signal turret]

The horde clear on the FS is so ass. You can make it work but comparing the sweatyness of me using FS vs MK V Axe its incomparable

[uncut hamlet]

It seems to be overshadowed by

Not force swords

[worthy wasp]

I totally understand the skeptics, I was one as well

[weary wasp]

but it already has a great cleave on light to heavy. what

[uncut hamlet]

You know what has better horde clear than an axe? Fire

[lethal plover]

force sword can stun a group.
but actually killing the group requires a bit more care. especially if there are ragers mixed within. axe swing takes care of trash and ragers too

[uncut hamlet]

Warp fire specifically

[cold oasis]

You know how you do horde clearing with Force Sword? You stun the horde over and over for your other 3 teammates.

[signal turret]

If I catch a Psyker using Purg in T5 im initiating the votekick lol

[ruby merlin]

Or... you just clear it all yourself using the axe.

[cyan echo]

tfw you're the last man standing and there's a horde

[ruby merlin]

I'd rather use the catachan sword than the force sword tbh lol. Antax axe is the best IMO, followed by the various dueling swords, then the catachan sword, the chainsword.

[cold oasis]

You just keep spamming your infinite dodge+stun?

And go ress people?

[uncut hamlet]

I've cleared T5 pretty easily with fire idk what you're on about

[ruby merlin]

Yep

And passive quell is faster

so I gain more toughness with the axe

[cold oasis]

Honestly, if you have to go for a full solo run sure, the Sword is garbage

[signal turret]

Rather just have a Zealot using a flamer. Surge is so much better for T5 its not something id even debate

[cold oasis]

But this is a team game

[ruby merlin]

I mean that's the whole point, true solo is the highest skill test

[thick surge]

mk5 dueling sword is actually now the best variant since last patch. Mobility and defenses now stack when they previously didn't

[ruby merlin]

and you can carry way harder with the axe

[lethal plover]

axe psyker tanking on frontline
So lore-accurate

this game is hilarious

[uncut hamlet]

I don't like surge. Feels like shit to use

[clear heath]

I'm always happy to have a purg user on my team because it's easy to support with so i can trust that they have my back.
Not like they could miss a big sweep of fire

[signal turret]

Axe Psyker tanking future Plague Marine boss while the Ogryn is in back spamming his gauntlet

[worthy wasp]

Idk, the catachan with the vertical slashes is def far superior to the horizontal one. And it performs v closely with Chain Sword... which seems v similar to FS but trade out the utility of Force Sword for passive quell

[signal turret]

We've peaked

[thick surge]

catachan can roll ignore enemy hitmass blessings. It has far superior horde clear

[clear heath]

Surge and Purg users can't possibly screw up, so i'll always be happy to have them

[lethal plover]

while zealot deals bleed damage and zips around with an empty magazine gun

[ruby merlin]

I would consider trying the force sword again if they make the passive quell on it as strong as the axe tbh.

[idle bay]

So what Axe are we talking about ?

[ornate hamlet]

Me too.

[ruby merlin]

@thick surge Yep, Antax Mkv combat axe can roll that too.

@idle bay Antax MkV Combat axe, probably the best melee weapon (arguably) for psyker.

If you see a true solo damnation on endless, it'll probably be the psyker with that axe.

[idle bay]

Thanks! I should have few of them from Gifts.....

[ruby merlin]

You want to roll brutal momentum on it if possible.

Tbh darktide feels so much easier than vermintide for some reason.

[lethal plover]

this all reminds me of Elden Ring where we figured out the most busted weapons early on (dual spears)

it's the axe

[ruby merlin]

Probably because of the toughness mechanic

[thick surge]

it can roll devastating strike too I think, but brutal momentum is what you want for sure

[signal turret]

Can confirm, my Brutal Momentum axe beheads 5 dregs at a time on Damnation

[ruby merlin]

Yep, it's awesome

[cyan echo]

absolutely, i feel you just have the mobility and tools to deal with anything

[signal turret]

compared to sweaty dodge slide spam block shove FS near 1-by-1

[weary wasp]

more like because we are not limited to gear builds that are basically +5 crit and speed lmao

[cyan echo]

while in Vermintide i always felt like i was fighting with a lot of arbitrary limitations

[ruby merlin]

@weary wasp Also on vt2 we can't just spam push lol

[lethal plover]

are you saying this before or after you learn busted builds in darktide lol

[ruby merlin]

Even before

I was doing random shit on zealot and it was still way easier.

[worthy wasp]

Because dt has innate 360 block

[lethal plover]

I would say the ranged enemies make things way trickier to solo

[thick surge]

imo DT is way more difficult since you can't solo carry the same way like in VT2

[worthy wasp]

360 block for everyone is nutty

[ruby merlin]

Yeah solo it feels harder, but vt2 team play is harder than dt teamplay.

[lethal plover]

one single gunman, from whatever the fuck corner away, can zap away your entire toughness, like wtf

[cold oasis]

And that's why Surge is king

[ruby merlin]

Also I main shade which is pretty squishy 😛

[worthy wasp]

Spear + shield foot knight bby

[tacit delta]

I'm confused on how that could be possible, but I didn't play VT2

care to explain?

[clear heath]

vt2 doesn't have coherency

[ruby merlin]

@tacit delta No toughness regen mechanic in vt2 on shade, gotta hit headshots or kills for temp HP

And no infinite push

you run out of stam, you can't push

[cold oasis]

... the fuck are you guys going on about

[lethal plover]

it's a very different game

[cold oasis]

Are you guys forgetting about random enemy ranged that deal 100+ thoughness a volley?

[lethal plover]

just the idea of no friendly fire is different

[ruby merlin]

You can LoS that pretty easily.

Darktide you want LoS, VT2 you want to fight in the open.

so you don't run out of room to kite

[lethal plover]

kiting is funny but once you get a hang of it, I think one game is enough

[clear heath]

In darktide, you have gain toughness just for being with your team.
In VT2, your team hurts you.
It's easy to see why teamplay helps more in darktide

[weary wasp]

not taking 300 damage in the back from a quickbow elf feels weird

[ruby merlin]

Yeah imagine if your zealot could just zap your toughness by aiming their flamer at you lol.

[potent lotus]

not dealing 300 damage in the back of a saltzpyre feels weird

[ruby merlin]

Or ogryns eating full bolter bursts

Also voidstaff nuking your team XD

[mellow crescent]

hagbane says hello

[thick surge]

moonfire bow stagger still gives me nightmares

[lethal plover]

the greater emphasis on range
made these changes necessary
toughness regen is to deal with the fact that without it the enemy gunmen would be unbearable

same for friendly fire

[potent lotus]

make surge staff also target your allies

[lethal plover]

I do like the idea that Ogryn would be master of melee but seriously need help against gunmen

[ruby merlin]

Yeah that would be hilarious lol

[brave vale]

what do you have as ur sefcondary for ur tank build

[static plover]

I definettely wouldn't want to be hit by this thing

[lethal plover]

axe surge

but you can try other combos and tell us how it works

[brave vale]

what the fuck does the defense stat do?

[lethal plover]

see j_sat video

[cyan echo]

Trauma + Combat Blade, ultimate psyker build

[clear heath]

Just inspect the weapon and click the stat

[cold oasis]

you can just press Tab on the team and mouse over it

[clear heath]

it will tell you everything it does

[gilded hatch]

what does these blessings mean?

[thick surge]

ignore enemy hitmass is basically infinite cleave

[lethal plover]

power is some magic stat, contributes to everything but not clearly

vermintide shit probably

[mellow crescent]

see j_sat video

[nocturne stream]

I wonder how high they were when they thought brutal momentum was an ok blessing to put alongside 1-5% crit based on peril lol

def going to get a nerf

[gilded hatch]

that is really godlike on my combat axe

and decimator?

[thick surge]

it's like the best blessing on every single weapon that can roll it

[gilded hatch]

i dont know what 'on hit' means and how it stacks

[lethal plover]

doesn't talk about Power

[mellow crescent]

Isn't it in some of the equations he shows?

[lethal plover]

not Power

[mellow crescent]

yeah its magic stat

you're right

[thick surge]

I really wish we get to change our character's height eventually. I made my psyker a midget but medium height is where it's at as I miss a lot of headshot with dueling sword now

I always hated playing bardyn

[clear heath]

I wanna make my vet a bit taller too

[mellow crescent]

ha
I always jumped with bardin to get headshots on tall enemies

[lethal plover]

lol

[nocturne stream]

that's a grudgin

[clear heath]

I do that with ogryn enemies

[lethal plover]

enjoy carpal tunnel

[weary wasp]

there is a video on yt comparing the heights, and apparently its minimal difference for your view

[thick surge]

that minimal difference is a lot in practice. I usually want to swing left click slightly below the center of the screen, but now I have to keep it slightly over the center

[cyan echo]

I felt a big difference between min height and max height

[thick surge]

it's really difficult for my muscle memory to adjust

[bright cipher]

i made my dude somewhere between max height and medium height

and its pretty good

headshots are about head level

melee is not an issue

[cyan echo]

what im not sure about is if your hitbox is affected by height

like if you're max height, do you get less cover in partial cover?

[potent lotus]

bring back Bardin height

[weary wasp]

it is affected

[near wyvern]

The biggest difference are the metallic shields that have the little opening, pick too high or too short and you can't shoot through the opening while using it as a cover

Also with the tallest height you are able to shoot over some boxes but the enemies can hit you as well.

It's a two way thing

[bright cipher]

slightly above average chads we win again

[lethal plover]

truly ppl will minmax everything

now I am reminded of the fact that every player in older FPS like UT and CSGO has the same height

[nocturne stream]

Oddjob mains will rise. But not high

[potent lotus]

I don't remember what game, might've been scum but people made female characters for the sole reason of them having a slightly smaller hitbox so

[bright cipher]

for a reason

[little compass]

What do you think is the best staff for t4/t5? If I use the surge staff I am extremely team dependent. And unfortunately that often doesn't work so well.

[weary wasp]

that reminds me of that one competitive fps where people would pick primarily female character because it had a smaller hitbox

[young summit]

hm, Darktide seems to consistently crash my video driver if im using nvidia broadcast/rtx voice.

[clear heath]

nvidia broadcast works fine with mine

[shrewd estuary]

I mean for t4 the purge works fine for me, still working on getting blessings and gear for t5 though

Though, I have been swaping between dueling sword and the axe I love both

[young summit]

keeps crashing with "Faulting application name: AUDIODG.EXE, version: 10.0.19041.1865, time stamp: 0x61fdcc50
Faulting module name: NvAudioEffects.dll,"

[pine topaz]

update your sound card drivers?

[fallow meadow]

What do you all pick for T5 skill. All of them don't seem that useful.

[little compass]

Ya but often ppl die at t4 and I'm the last one standig and surge is a problem at that point

[clear heath]

just stop them from dying

[shrewd estuary]

I stand by I like the purgatus

[shrewd estuary]

also maybe see if somone in techinal suport can help you?

[pine topaz]

This is allowing me to clear shooters very easily

in t4

[young summit]

seems to be related to logitechs g ubs implementation of rtx voice. easy solution for that is to uninstall ghub so goodbye logitech softwar

[shrewd estuary]

ooff

[clear heath]

i find surge to be fine with randoms. Surge lacks damage sure, but most people run damage builds anyways. All you really need to do is spam lightning at your team so they stay alive

basically just babysit

[shrewd estuary]

I just dont like surge it doesnt feel right to me

[clear heath]

Fair enough. It's boring for a lot of people

[young summit]

surge is great, but super boring 😅

[clear heath]

You don't even need to aim

[shrewd estuary]

I dont even find it great

I find it decent?

Just boring though

[fallow meadow]

Everyone got their feel, just pick what you think is working.

[shrewd estuary]

at least with purgatus I get the satisfaction of fire

[young summit]

suge is just spam left button and dont evn bother to aim 😦

[shrewd estuary]

Though...I havnt gotten a decent blessing on a single one

[young summit]

ill never be able t oswap away from my blue ball of doom staff, it has both the peril weakspot and faster charge blessings

[clear heath]

If it feels really boring and unsatisfying, i don't think any blessing will fix that for you

[gilded hatch]

the third one. BB is essential on T5 if you ask me. You need to snipe the high value specials and elites to help your team

[young summit]

its silly how spammable it is, and how fast you can spam it.

and it still stuns decently even on low charge.

[cyan notch]

kills you if you go over 100% tho

[shrewd estuary]

I enjoy the second one with the purge staff

[cyan notch]

pretty lame

[shrewd estuary]

I dooo love that one when I feel like burning things alive thats my next fav

[magic hull]

PURGAT

is more fun than other staffs

[devout belfry]

The veteran already killed them all.

[gilded hatch]

that is not my experience though. but they help true

[vestal cradle]

whats the warp upkeep thingie for the penance

300sec one

[shrewd estuary]

a vet with a bolt gun or plasma that is good with it is great at killing specials and elites

[vocal agate]

You have a bad veteran xD

[devout belfry]

A single lasgun headshot when they're ulting does more dmg than a bb

[gilded hatch]

since i share the tag hotkey with the primariry action hotkey (left click), i use bb to spot very far away specials/elites and kill them instant

the veteran does not even spot them

[young summit]

fires faster and can be spammed witout detonating as well :>

[gilded hatch]

they are already dead

[clear heath]

the vet can just ult to see them

[devout belfry]

I didn't know you could overlap binds.

[clear heath]

Yeah tag on mouse 1 is really nice

[vestal cradle]

how do you do the warp battery penance?

[shrewd estuary]

..i had a fun run with 2 vets and a ogryn

[gilded hatch]

true, psyker can also do that if you overlap binds with tag and primariry action (left click)

[vocal agate]

Like half of specials need more than one BB to kill on heresy+

[shrewd estuary]

The vets killed every elite non stop me and the ogryn took care of the hords

[devout belfry]

BB dmg is just too low for me to care. It only one shots like 3 enemies on 4/5.

[gilded hatch]

true

[vestal cradle]

.

[devout belfry]

With the homies.

[gilded hatch]

that is why i run a heavy bb build

killing most elites before they reach team is very strong

veteran has issues with the bulwark

[devout belfry]

It's still incredibly inefficient.

[gilded hatch]

bulwark is the most danagerous elite

[clear heath]

bulwarks are why i run surge

surge makes them move their shield away

[shrewd estuary]

is it? I have seen those insta wiped by a decent vet with a bolter on 4+

[gilded hatch]

i just dont agree. during battle it is inefficient, yet. If you can kill elites very far way, it is efficient

[vestal cradle]

i don't get it

[gilded hatch]

on bulwarks, bb is probably best choice

[devout belfry]

Just run surge or trauma to do your anti bulwark job lol

[granite rain]

I'd like it I'd brain burst had different cast times and peril costs based on what its targeting. Poxwalker basically instant for instance. Sniper very quick. Crushers have the current max time

[gilded hatch]

surg eis good against bulwark too

i prefer to kill them instead of stunning

[shrewd estuary]

I tend to pop a bb on a bulwark and the rest of the team kills it before the second could be cast

even with the buff to it from the final tree

[devout belfry]

Your veteran can see the elites and kill them in a single click instantly. They can click like 20 times without reloading.

Even with the cast time reduction from our 30 talent magically being up 24/7 and if bb didn't generate peril we would still not be as good at that job.

[clear heath]

Yeah but surge is easier if there's multiple enemies.
I do sometimes bb a bulwark if i'm completely safe and far away tho

[gilded hatch]

you can add me on steam. you play veteran i play psyker. we can play only the starting area. let's see who kills faster

[vocal agate]

This, if you have no veterans on team sure, do whatever, if you have two bolter veterans on team you can literally just watch how the kill everything before you are finished casting BB 😄

[devout belfry]

Kills what faster? A randomly spawning elite? Do you realize how dumb this is?

1v1 me kek

[gilded hatch]

yes, if ranger does his ability he is faster. but i spam my ability

[clear heath]

Vets can keep their skill permanently up

look at their level 30 feat

[vocal agate]

I will do more damage with my lvl 15 veteran than on psyker I have a 100 hours on.

[clear heath]

it's a duration reset

[mild canopy]

do you guys prefer wounds curio or toughness curio?

[gilded hatch]

you can add me on steam

[devout belfry]

This isn't even an argument. The numbers don't lie.

[shrewd estuary]

Toughness and health curio honestly

[devout belfry]

You're arguing 1 is larger than 2.

It's absurd.

[naive pasture]

so im trying to do the malleus monstrum any like idea or strat on how to do this realistically ?

[shrewd estuary]

the wound one is nice on t4 and up though

[devout belfry]

And currently your counter argument is your dad can beat our dad up.

[gilded hatch]

it may sound absurd to you. you can add me on steam, we can test out

[shrewd estuary]

But I only keep it for that

[naive pasture]

maybe this wasnt the place or time to ask

[devout belfry]

Just take a clip in the meat grinder on damnation.

[clear heath]

You can literally just test in psykanium and time it.

[gilded hatch]

who wants to join a T5 game with me as veteran? Wants to see who kills more specials and elites

[vocal agate]

get a shield ogryn to agro daemonhost and kill it

[devout belfry]

If only we had a score screen.

[gilded hatch]

in the meat grinder veteran is faster, i agree

[naive pasture]

thats not a bad idea

[gilded hatch]

but i am talking about in map situation

[shrewd estuary]

^

[naive pasture]

ty @vocal agate

[shrewd estuary]

what that guy just said, make sure whoever has agro though knows to block and doge

[clear heath]

If a vet really tried to outkill you, they would killsteal all your brian burst targets.
You already know they can do this accidentally

[devout belfry]

What is happening in map that makes bb work?

[shrewd estuary]

I can do it on my psyker

[bright cipher]

it takes 4-5 to kill big boys with BB on damnation, thats like 10 seconds wasted doing nothing else

[shrewd estuary]

provided dps is enough to keep me alive has accidently agroed one with a brain burst when a vet killed my target

[devout belfry]

It takes like 3 to kill most elites or specials lol

Even the dog takes 2

[gilded hatch]

most enemies spawn far away on certain maps or behind stuff. psyker bb can deal with them easiliy. veteran needs a perfect shot for it

[gilded hatch]

i know. but you start attacking earlier

[devout belfry]

Psyker has trouble targeting enemies behind railings lol

[devout belfry]

Their ult still highlights them.

[clear heath]

tfw a fence with a bunch of holes in it covers the enemy's chest so you can't target their brain

[gilded hatch]

if you target your bb a bit above a horde, you often focus on a special or elite. why? They are often taller than normal enemies

[granite rain]

Or fences. Forget cadian pylons just get some wired fencing Dyson sphere around the eye of terror 😂

[shrewd estuary]

sammmmmee

[frigid frigate]

I have gotten guns

[shrewd estuary]

I never get stuff I want

[gilded hatch]

you are all right. just my experience i kill way faster

[devout belfry]

That magic doesn't work on railing and mesh walls.

[frigid frigate]

For the last weeks

[gilded hatch]

You can add me to steam

[frigid frigate]

it's

So

Annoying

[shrewd estuary]

Wish there was a thing where you could make prefrences to even general weapon types to show

where your more likly to get something from the catagory

[devout belfry]

Pay to rotate the shop?

[gilded hatch]

i am streaming at strike team 100

[devout belfry]

I have all this useless currency.

[gilded hatch]

somebody wants to join as veteran and play t5?

[frigid frigate]

No that's stupid because we'd still keep getting shit weapons

[crude kettle]

Trying for the Up Close and Personal Penance, but now flamethrower counts as ranged? did a flamethrower + melee run but didnt get it

[analog juniper]

@devout belfry ayo, my brain burst is better than BASTION 22 COMBAT STANCE, fight me

[gilded hatch]

since the official release it seems they lowered the power level of normal shop, and increased the powerlevel of the weekly shop. But this could be my bias

[frigid frigate]

It's been all over the place and I've been continually getting guns instead of staves and even when I do get staves they have shit rolls and power points.

[shrewd estuary]

Lol, tell me about it

[gilded hatch]

If someone wants to see a masterclass how to use bb, you can watch my live stream on strike team 100

[analog juniper]

your bloodstream must be 90% copium

[devout belfry]

You're trying too hard my guy. Just save a clip of something impressive.

[gilded hatch]

I would like an experienced veteran joins me

[bright cipher]

this is either a bot account or a troll account

[gilded hatch]

i am a bot

😄

[clear heath]

go bug the vet chat about it
i'm too lazy to leave my bed

[devout belfry]

Yeah. I ain't adding anyone on steam without a pfp

[slow raven]

mystery box seems to give the best items for me, highest base rating and more orange than missions

[bright cipher]

fuck paying 2,5k for select items, we gamba in this bitch

[shrewd estuary]

I got all useless stuff out of the mystery box last time

[leaden needle]

https://i.imgur.com/MH5lpOo.png guys which is better idk how important crit is on surge

[bright cipher]

i got

guns...

[white copper]

Is Darktide really going down the P2HF path?

[frigid frigate]

Ranged weak spot isn't good on Surge.

[devout belfry]

There isn't anything to pay for lol

[analog juniper]

This is like the other guy last week who said Psyker isnt bad, you just have to use a gun and not use BB at all

[clear heath]

I'd prefer the quell speed personally

[shrewd estuary]

Sammme

[leaden needle]

thats what i was thinking thanks

just didnt know if no crit was huge blunder

[gilded hatch]

you can add me on steam and we can compare skill if you want

i think a lto of people use bb wrong

[analog juniper]

I'm not going to add you

[devout belfry]

On damnation you don't have time to BB. It has such low dps it's a joke. You're on stagger duty 24/7.

[analog juniper]

might get copium poisoning

[gilded hatch]

salty people that don't want to stand for their salt. boring

[leaden needle]

bb is good for helping clear out range mobs if they locked you down you can help out

[gilded hatch]

if you claim something, you should be able to stand for it. you don't

[leaden needle]

it does have uses

[analog juniper]

it has its uses but it isnt VERY useful later on

[gilded hatch]

If you state bb is bad, let me show it. And we can evaluate after

[gilded hatch]

sniping specials it is really great. especially with the level 15 talent

[analog juniper]

also, I dont need to prove anything to you, I play the game and have a brain

[devout belfry]

You have so far admitted the numbers are in our favor. A controlled experiment on the psychanium is in our favor.

But because we won't watch or play damnation with you - you're right?

[gilded hatch]

i agree in a controlled experiment you are correct about bb vs veteran. I said many times in a map it is different

[leaden needle]

bb's problem is it just doesnt scale well to deal with armoured elites and specials in higher difficulty when a bolter can 1 shot anything

[gilded hatch]

I am a full time researcher. If you want also some teaching about experiments, you can also text me

[leaden needle]

but it isnt totally useless it has more uses than just that

[clear heath]

What's different about an actual map? We're just comparing kill times anyways

[devout belfry]

Can you explain why?

[gilded hatch]

mixed hordes, different spawn locations and barriers of sight

[devout belfry]

If you had los to start a bb he could have shot it once to do more than 1.4x the dps

[analog juniper]

I mean I have this and the crit is very weird, sometimes you crit for 1.2k across the screen, other times you crit for 6, or 600 damage. Tbh surge should have the crit chance increased

[gilded hatch]

see my last answer

[gilded hatch]

I agree in psykanium you are correct. I just think on T5 on most maps, it is way different. If you want to see prove, you can add me on steam

[devout belfry]

These things affect you just as much. It's why one person disperses the garbage.

[gilded hatch]

Psykanium is not representative for a real time play. It is only good for experimenting individual break points

[worthy wasp]

I want a good dueling sword, gonna be honest I've not given it a fair shot

[gilded hatch]

not really. Mixed hordes i can solve by bb a bit higher than the horde. Most specials and elites are taler. And i also tag enemies in hordes with double hotkeying with left click

[clear heath]

I feel like you're just noticing the kills more because BB is a bigger burst so it's more likely to steal a kill when someone else has done 90% of the damage

[devout belfry]

On damnation you're basically on permanent stagger duty. What are you brain bursting? I mean - sure occasionally you'll clear a sniper.

[worthy wasp]

Odd considering I've tested all melees but the dueling sword

[gilded hatch]

Spawn locations favor bb because often the enemies are moving. BB is not effected by that by much, only needs a microsecond of touch.

No cast delay. Veteran has cast delay

[analog juniper]

Like I can see why people use it for the 2km dodge range and auto quell, but I dont like it at all. The special attack only staggers ragers

[bright cipher]

id honestly keep the current one until you get a 350-360 base surge staff

[analog juniper]

and doesnt do much dmg either

[clear heath]

Vet just needs to cast once and their skill stays up for most of the fight. Who cares about cast delay?

[devout belfry]

Cast delay?

[analog juniper]

maybe I'm just addicted to the big damage on the force sword

[gilded hatch]

cast delay is the time between attack and reaching target

[devout belfry]

The las is instant.

It is hitscan.

[clear heath]

Oh that. What weapon are you even talking about?

[gilded hatch]

las is instant, i agree

[devout belfry]

Are you talking about the helbore or something?

That shit is ass.

[gilded hatch]

boltgun

[devout belfry]

Lol

[sterile sable]

dude is trolling

[clear heath]

Oh, i was assuming mg12 lasgun

[worthy wasp]

Do all Dueling Swords have the same moveset?

[devout belfry]

Like every other vet lol

[gilded hatch]

@devout belfry you want to try out with me. You play vet and me psyker?

[devout belfry]

Someone give this dude your shovels. He wants a deeper hole.

[gilded hatch]

That is my last statement. You are just repeating yourself. I want to prove

[bleak tulip]

I am like 99% sure bolter is also hitscan but okay

[small egret]

Did I get good rolls siblings?

[analog juniper]

ok lets be clear, ANY gun aside from a flamer is better than brainburst

[hot ice]

this good?

low finesse tho

[gilded hatch]

bb is way different than any gun

[analog juniper]

wack quell speed but otherwise pretty good

[gilded hatch]

a lot of noobs here i guess.

[analog juniper]

lmao

[devout belfry]

Without a score screen I'm sure you'll just say the two guys you bb'd were "totally a million or more".

[worthy wasp]

Wait plz help...

Do all dueling swords have same moveset?

[devout belfry]

No. Different combos.

[analog juniper]

I'm not 100% sure, but I think so

[gilded hatch]

We just play for five minutes. i record the footage and we count the specials/elite hit

[worthy wasp]

Oh shit, so I have to buy em all

[hot ice]

mk2 have the swing/cleave on 2nd or 1st heavy'

forgot which

[shrewd estuary]

I am jelly

[devout belfry]

I only use the one that's all thrusts.

[small egret]

Slightly varying movesets, like instead of a slash in one moveset it's a stab

[earnest rapids]

I know the circlejerk is "lol BB bad" but it is actually useful in some scenarios, if you have the space to BB something you should generally do so, especially against bulwarks

[mild lotus]

Bb has its use in t5 as it one shots gunners, shotgunners, trappers and snipers while also staggering + removing a good chunk of the hp bar of most other mobs. It won't beat a vet's dps but we all know that there's a lot to pay attention to in a real mission and your teammates might be busy dealing with another threat else where, leaving you to cover their back and sides by clearing or holding off what they can't deal with rn or that they didn't see yet. That as well as getting fleeing enemies is where bb shines.

[devout belfry]

It has its uses.

Of course.

[gilded hatch]

a lot of psykers overuse bb and use it on low value targets that is bad

[devout belfry]

But its dps is staggeringly low on t5 compared to other offerings.

[worthy wasp]

Fuckkk I gotta buy em all then

[bleak tulip]

how insightful, you must have been here for the last 3 weeks as well to come to that conclusion

[gilded hatch]

true, but you can cast it from far way very reliable

[quartz barn]

You use bb on low targets to get/keep your stacks up what

[gilded hatch]

i dont understand your comment

[devout belfry]

The stability trait plus the combat stance removes all away. You simply click.

[mellow crescent]

BB is damage :nogryn:
BB is utility :yesgryn:

[devout belfry]

Two body shots are a bb.

[gilded hatch]

on some builds that is efficient. not worth it if you ask me

[analog juniper]

Oh yeah, but like this guy specifically was saying BB is better than or even comparable to BASTION 22 COMBAT STANCE

[mild lotus]

It's not a matter of dps, else Ogryn would be the best class in the game with its machine gun.

[hoary hamlet]

Not saying BB is Op but are we evaluating it under the assumption of 6 stacks and Barrage? Cuz that's how it's used

[south monolith]

Dps is relative to the current enemies on the map versus how your dps is applied

[gilded hatch]

BB is not a dmage tool. more ulitity / sniping

it also stagger a little bit the specials

[bleak tulip]

yeh uh, no shit

[devout belfry]

It should stagger all of them.

[mild lotus]

a whole lot you mean, it basically trivialises bulwarks

[gilded hatch]

bulwarks are also staggered by bb, although short

[mild lotus]

dealing with bulwarks without any psyker in the team becomes extremely tiresome

[gilded hatch]

most people use surge against bulwarks

[devout belfry]

On damnation where there are like 3 fucking bulwarks in a mosh of random crap I'll just use my lightning.

[analog juniper]

Bolter and Plasma gun users are like: what bulwark? a shield? what's that?

[grave crag]

SO TRUE

[hoary hamlet]

ngl plasma gun users are useless for most of the time

[gilded hatch]

in battle surge staff is best against bulwarks. if you know the spawn locations and know how to dodge, i think bb is more effective with level 15 and level 30 talents

[south monolith]

Vets can always grenade a few bulwarks if they are together

[devout belfry]

But you look so cool.

[mild lotus]

if you want to go on the topic of dps, surge staff really isn't a strong contender to the top dps place

[analog juniper]

to be fair the gun is ultra clunky, almost like they dont want you to use the weapon

[devout belfry]

We're here for cc. Let's be honest.

[mild lotus]

No, not really

[bleak tulip]

implying its even on that list

[south monolith]

Cc is an option but not the only option

[mild lotus]

being a stagger bot isn't of my interests and I have fair results when I try to deal with mobs by killing them rather than push them around while I wait for someone to deal with them in my place

[devout belfry]

Someone about to proselytize the mk5 axe build?

[mild lotus]

FSword to my last breath

[bleak tulip]

the old low effort post

[devout belfry]

Yes sibling.

[digital chasm]

I heard there is someone dissing on vets here?

[mild lotus]

deleting maulers and ragers and mutants is my thing

[bleak tulip]

vets smell bad and whine too much

[clear heath]

pmsag says he can out kill vets with BB only

[analog juniper]

@worthy wasp MkV and MkIV have different combos on the duelling. triple poke vs dual poke and strikedown

[devout belfry]

Lol, because fatshark knows their own classes. See Vermintide.

[south monolith]

I mean psyker is effective against elites

[clear heath]

he was sitting in vc waiting for someone to challenge him

go get him

[digital chasm]

nah

been in vc all day already

wiht my bf

[devout belfry]

Pmsag, without moving goalposts, said brain burst was better at anti elites then a veteran.

[digital chasm]

as in all elites?

[bleak tulip]

I guess part of his challenge is playing on malice

[digital chasm]

Same with you lot

[bleak tulip]

[bleak tulip]

tru

[devout belfry]

The more we pried the less answers we got.

[mild lotus]

at least, we don't irl

[digital chasm]

if its the Carapace elites then yea

[bright cipher]

i think before anyone can put out an opinion on high end gameplay they need to provide a video of a domination clear where theyre not getting carried

[digital chasm]

psyker would outdo vet

[devout belfry]

I feel like some players haven't tried veteran with mk12 las. Why does it have so much ammo? Why is the base dmg so high?

[digital chasm]

unless the vet is using bolter

[bright cipher]

then you get a role "authorized opinion haver"

before you prove that youre a "certified malice player"

[digital chasm]

The top guns for vet are bolter, plasma and XII

[clear heath]

Keep in mind he said just BB.
Not the weapons. Just brain burst

[digital chasm]

all amazing for elite clearing

[south monolith]

Shotgun actually claps too

[digital chasm]

XII and bolter can wipe the floor with elites before psyker even gets to begin charging BB

[hoary hamlet]

plasma is bad. Bolter with reload talents is overpowered

[devout belfry]

I struggle to imagine a psyker even with all their tools out performing a veteran at elite acquisition and termination.

[digital chasm]

Plasma is good

[mild lotus]

the only elite that poses some kind of a difficulty killing is the crusher

[analog juniper]

Does someone really have to have video evidence to show the Vet combat stance and 99% of guns are better at killing specials/elites than brainburst?

[hoary hamlet]

nope

[mild lotus]

all the others are easy to kill with most guns

[digital chasm]

i arnt having the dumb bolter v plasma arugment in the fuckin psyker chat

[hoary hamlet]

so stop

[analog juniper]

Plasma can be ok-ish but it's mostly bad

you need someone else with a normal gun

on the team

[polar gulch]

there's no argument, it's just a fact BB sucks

[south monolith]

It has niche uses like every blitz ability

[digital chasm]

But overall the XII is the best for vet and besides Carapace armor it kills elites too fast for BB To even get a chance to proc

[bright cipher]

no no i was refering to people in this channel talking about what a good psyker build is, weapons, traits, playstyle etc

[twilit comet]

Question for you all: what's the relationship between finding high base rated gear (eg 350-380) and max level. I'm at 30 but base gear level is mostly around 310' for me. Just need more time for it to keep climbing up or is it all just chance at this point?

[bright cipher]

its common knowledge vet is the best class

[grave crag]

THEN PRE CARGE

[mild lotus]

by the time the psyker will be done casting one(1) bb, the bastion 22 combat stance will have run out and 5 people will have died

[grave crag]

BB

[devout belfry]

See I think some people see that and hear "completely useless never even press G".

Of course it has a place occasionally.

But it's just ass for the most part.

[digital chasm]

what difficulty was this guy talking about?

[clear heath]

damnation

[devout belfry]

Damnation.

[bleak tulip]

and just constantly be insanely high on peril? be even slower

[clear heath]

where it takes 3 brain bursts to kill anything

[bright cipher]

seems to be just random, check the shop and 350s will come around, i did notice you find a high base grey more often than a high base green or blue

[digital chasm]

then vet 99% of the time would will kill more elites

unless that vet is braindead

[candid hawk]

I feel like brain burst could use a 20% damage increase at the minimum

[analog juniper]

cant even oneshot a dog, smh

[mild lotus]

pre charging loses its uses as soon as bursters aren't a one bb kill

[bright cipher]

man out here spending 15 seconds per bulwark to kill him with BB in damnation raids

[digital chasm]

I think its safe to say this psyker been seeing too many visions

[mild lotus]

if the team isn't too slow, one bb open its guard for an easy kill

[digital chasm]

needs the

[worthy wasp]

4.5 secs with ult to be fair

[gilded hatch]

you already show us that you cannot imagine psyker can outperform veteran.

[bright cipher]

so does one uncharged surge burst along with 4 other enemies and keeps them exposed for longer

[devout belfry]

Yeah. But there are quicker ways to do this lol

[clear heath]

oh he's back

[bleak tulip]

aand even this is mostly so the vet saves ammo/ can unload the bolter into the bulwark, not the shield

[mild lotus]

losing 90% of my dps capability just to stagger elites to death isn't my thing

[digital chasm]

Commissar needs to visit him

[gilded hatch]

yeah, you too 😄

In between games

[devout belfry]

I mean - we bring amazing cc and revive potential. And a nice dmg buff for the veteran if he stands next to us 😂

[bleak tulip]

man im sad I gotta go this is some real popcorn moments here

[worthy wasp]

Bruh, psykers really do have the best coherency

[digital chasm]

I do wish psyker was better at heresy and higher

[devout belfry]

If it stacked on ourselves we could rock a coven.

[worthy wasp]

Wtf

[gilded hatch]

Today i had a psyker only team (only randoms) on T5

[clear heath]

Psyker does some cool things.
Outdpsing vet with brain burst is not one of them

[gilded hatch]

Nobody died

[worthy wasp]

Dunkin donuts all over t5s

[hoary hamlet]

tbf it's Vet who should be worse

[digital chasm]

and? that doesnt really prove anything

[gilded hatch]

just bb all the specials and elite, you notice T5 is easy

[worthy wasp]

Psyker is legit the strongest overall class in the game

[digital chasm]

it just says you had good teamwork

[gilded hatch]

if you are with four psyker, you can bb all specials/elite before they reach you

[worthy wasp]

Vet is better vs elites obvi

[mild lotus]

Are we playing the same game?

[gilded hatch]

psyker has issues with survivability, that is true

[mild lotus]

vet is the real all rounder of the game

[gilded hatch]

probably not the best class. Vet probably is

[bright cipher]

psyker is a melee to medium range focused cc machine that turns any horde even with combined with special and elites into a cakewalk with an axe and a surge staff

[worthy wasp]

What the actual fuck

[devout belfry]

In a world where toughness is important.

[bright cipher]

to throw all that away and roleplay as ranged dps

is a joke in and of itself

[worthy wasp]

Bruh I legitimately pull and tank Daemonhosts

[clear heath]

Psyker with surge is incredibly safe and also makes everyone else incredibly safe

[worthy wasp]

On t5

[bright cipher]

because vet does that but better

[mild lotus]

no, it clearly isn't as soon as you bother using anything else than the surge staff

[gilded hatch]

psyker has the highest damage potential but vet is better overall

[clear heath]

?????

[hoary hamlet]

vet is actually overpowered so I wouldn't make too many comparisons. Classes have different jobs anyway

[digital chasm]

@worthy wasp I need what you are smoking

[devout belfry]

Psyker does not have the highest damage potential lol

[bright cipher]

as soon as u stop playing on malice voidstrike stops 1 shotting horde trash and purgatus is a worse surge

[worthy wasp]

I need to show yall my t5 psyker gameplay

[mild lotus]

are we playing the same game?

my void staff one shots trash easy

everyday of the week

[digital chasm]

@clear heath

[gilded hatch]

i am voidstrike main. You dont voidstrike on T5 for the damage, but for the head shots and stagger

[mild lotus]

even in t5

[digital chasm]

this is a lot

[loud violet]

I found a lasgun

[gilded hatch]

voidstrike without headshots is kinda useless on t5

[bright cipher]

youre a BB main my guy say less

[shrewd estuary]

nice

[meager locust]

I know it ain't a psyker trait but I did think of something that could be made nice with this veteran trait, if the gained 'grenade' for Psykers was a extra Warp charge stack free of charge akin to other classes getting nades

[clear heath]

Chat huffing some copium today

[mild lotus]

cool stats

[digital chasm]

I just use Dakkatran and dagger man, i arnt the best vet to handle this

[gilded hatch]

not really bb main. i switch a lot among weapons. Before battle i bb, during battle i voidstaff the reaming horde and combat axe to quel and survive

each weapon has a different scenario. psyker can do that well

[digital chasm]

and the better ones are gone rn

[mild lotus]

Wait a minute, are you even aiming at the horde trashs' heads when using void staff? Because that's what you should do. No wonder you don't one shot trash mobs if you don't, past t3.

[loud violet]

I'm leveling a zealot on the side and it makes me feel like brainburst & talents tied to it is a waste of space

[bright cipher]

good take

[gilded hatch]

if you jump or shoot from a bit higher angle, it actually works. if you want i can show you how to use voidstaff

it seems you dont know

[worthy wasp]

I legit never hit the quell button either

Just weapon swap

[mild lotus]

What? I specifically said I do