zealot-class

[tidal berry]

uncompressed asset time

[carmine falcon]

was playing it recently with friends but they stopped playing cause they're LAME

[tidal berry]

I miss the times where gamedevs included those 4K textures as a separate DLC

[fleet zealot]

i just wanna test poe2 and dt on my new rig

[carmine falcon]

dont think its a case of 4k textures
the game just has shitton of maps

[tidal berry]

half of the game size bloat is there for like %0.1 of the market

[fleet zealot]

internet so slow i might not be able to and the rbg lights don't turn off lol

[tidal berry]

most games use gigantic uncompressed textures

[placid fiber]

Yep, 1 shots both chaos spawns and plague ogryns with 6 marty stacks. That means it will most obviously 1 shot malice monsters lol

[fleet zealot]

at least it looks clean asf tho, lgbt lighting

[tidal berry]

ig baldurs gate is not doing any favours either its like 150 gbs

[fleet zealot]

bg3 is massive but yes

[placid fiber]

Sadge... only this far with only 3 marty stacks to heresy plague ogryns... 😦

[carmine falcon]

true for other games yeah
also needlessly uncompressed audio

[fleet zealot]

there is actual content and effort there but we all miss 4k texture free-LC

[placid fiber]

1 shot them with 5 marty stacks, but, not with 4 >.>'

[tidal berry]

Idk gaming as a whole was more exciting when we were hyped for gameplay innovations rather than whatever new graphics gimmick is there that year

[tidal berry]

even indie games are like ''oh yeah we took the popular thing you already like and put a different make-up on it''

[carmine falcon]

nah bro this year is STACKED with quality games

[placid fiber]

1 shots them with 1 headtaker and sustained stack and 4 marty buffs tho, gonna check if it requires 2 headtaker and sustained with 3 marty stacks as well >.>

[tidal berry]

the amount of vampire survivor clones and roguelikes in the indie market and %99 of them are just a repeat of what you already experienced

and for a while we had slay the spire clones too

[carmine falcon]

this is not the year to doompost we're not even 2 months in and we got multiple quality vidya with more to come

[placid fiber]

nope, it required 4 headtaker and sustained stacks x.x

[fleet zealot]

ehh, some cna have unique spins

holocure, halls of torment, being 2 good ones imo, vampire survivors itself got too convoluted and easter egg chasing till now 99% of the game is behind easter egg hunting

[tidal berry]

yeeeeaaaa... I mean.. I'm sure some do. But most don't

[fleet zealot]

also like, what innovations in gameplay are you looking for

[placid fiber]

Oh that reminds me... I need to see if I can 1 shot damnation plague ogryns with perfectionist shroudfield, 6 marty stacks, 25% unyielding damage, purge the unclean, 20% backstab damage, and 10% weakspot damage >.>

[violet hornet]

yall ever used the arrow keys on the mission board? I forget that's a thing

[tidal berry]

I feel like its also the fault of gamers too cause they'll be like

''omg why game devs don't take risks anymore what happened to all the original ideas''

tries new game

''wtf I hate it kill it with fire''

[naive stirrup]

fake gamers will do that yes

[tidal berry]

thats like most gamers I feel like

[fleet zealot]

i think we plateaued ngl

[carmine falcon]

people dont want new
they want the same old but looks shinier
dynasty warriors origin is a fantstic game but a bunch of nerds are just mad that its not the same as the previous 10 fkn games that came before it

[violet hornet]

Stagnated more like

[tidal berry]

play CoD/Fifa/minecraft for 15 years, then make a ''video essay'' about why games aren't fun anymore

[fleet zealot]

like, the biggest innovations is just, mixing systems from different genres, why try reinventing the wheel it's already been done a million times

[carmine falcon]

meanwhile im overwhelemed with games to play but wasting most of my time on hordselop

[placid fiber]

Holy fuck: 10% weakspot damage actually makes you reach the damnation plague ogryn 1 shot breakpoint without any headtaker/sustained assault stacks... @remote lark 10% weakspot damage gave me enough damage to 1 shot a damnation plague ogryn! (with 6 marty stacks)

[fleet zealot]

not saying companies shouldn't try to innovate, i just think we are on that upper end of possibilities that aren't, mixing 2 innovations in one game xd

[placid fiber]

I was 100% sure 10% weakspot damage wouldn't be enough

[fleet zealot]

we had vr, turns out that just makes people sick if you try to innovate too much and ends up breaking equipment

[tidal berry]

I just don't agree with that

[fleet zealot]

we got fancy tactile gloves, they are fragile and people prefer mkb and controllers

[carmine falcon]

its hard to truly innovate because 1- too many things are being made 2- games cost too much to make and u wanna minimize risks

[placid fiber]

This is without 10% weakspot damage

[north sedge]

what a magical, imaginary time

[violet hornet]

VR is also awful to game with for long periods of time because of the extra weight on your face / head

[fleet zealot]

like when i was a kid there was the whole THINGS OF THE FUTURE and it was the laser keyboard

[tidal berry]

you too could experience it if you were a dinosaur, like me.. aeugh.

[placid fiber]

lol I can't believe 10% weakspot damage gives a breakpoint for damnation plague ogryns lol

[fleet zealot]

and no one fucking uses a laser projected keyboard now lol.

[violet hornet]

not to mention stepping away for a moment or paying attention to your surroundings requires removing the thing which is far more effort than simply looking away from a traditional gaming setup

[north sedge]

I'm old, people have always gone nuts for graphics

[fleet zealot]

plush ur not a dinosaur, there has always been a graphic fidelity chase

[fleet zealot]

i played vr games but my ceiling was low

busted my knuckles on the ceiling

[violet hornet]

Having the most floorspace for VR would require setting up in my basement and I don't want to do that lol, the ceiling is low down there too

[tidal berry]

some people always did but no they weren't rly the majority all the time

[fleet zealot]

yes they were, fidelity has pushed gaming constantly

[north sedge]

No you're living in a fantasy land

[violet hornet]

I remember playing crysis 1 on a CRT

[fleet zealot]

it's plush lol

[carmine falcon]

i think they were, AAA companies just made more "Fresh" stuff back then
graphics leap from pre ps1 to ps1 and ps1 to ps2 and ps2 to ps3 were BIG selling pooints

[fleet zealot]

the graphic leaps are the same technically, but it's less noticeable

as we get better and better, the 2x better graphics becomes less and less noticable

[tidal berry]

Sure if you say so it must be true lmao

[carmine falcon]

my point is it was always something both companies and gaymers cared about lmao
this timeline were everyone only wanted to innovate and not push graphics doesnt exist

[fleet zealot]

plush you are confusing having a reasonable opinion with the majority

https://tenor.com/view/blazing-saddles-gene-wilder-morons-cleavon-little-gif-12334435

[tidal berry]

I'm not confusing anything dude, you two are just having a meltdown over me stating my opinion of how I experienced gaming in my childhood

[fleet zealot]

"meltdown" okay plush, if you say you are a dino why don't you go have some prune juice and sit down LOL

[carmine falcon]

is that meltdown with us in the room

[fleet zealot]

and you didn't claim it was your opinion, you claimed it was the majority's opinion

[north sedge]

You're basically doing this but about gaming, it's nonsense

[tidal berry]

Honestly I was in the mood for a good faith argument about this but you two aren't interested in having one so whats the point

[violet relic]

having and wanting better graphics have been a thing since the 80s……

[fleet zealot]

LOL now plush is going to be salty and play the victim

[tidal berry]

its just about proving you're right rather than having a good talk with someone, I get it, I was there, I too was as mentally unstable as you are right now.

[fleet zealot]

it's peak

[tidal berry]

It will get better, I don't blame it on you, dw

[placid fiber]

idk about you guys, but, I think my autopistol has too much mobility...

[fleet zealot]

you think having a good talk is just to, let you walk all over us and not contradict or correct you in anyways 🤔

[carmine falcon]

calling others mentally unstable is very mature behavior

[fleet zealot]

we can go pull up some old gaming magazines if you want

[tidal berry]

See to have a conversation you need to have enough patience to let the other party talk

[clever swan]

what's going on in this thread

[fleet zealot]

it's a chatroom LMAO

[carmine falcon]

idk im waiting for my food to heat up then ill boot up darktide

[fleet zealot]

talking about the gaming industry and history, plush had a take, people disagreed respectfully, plush started weirdly projecting

[copper hawk]

LMFAO

[violet hornet]

get into match, play for 30 seconds, immediately notice m1 macro psyker, spend 5 minutes reporting online. great gameplay loop

[copper hawk]

I am going w freeze 2 death in MY OWN ROOM !!!! FUCK TEXAS !!!!!

[fleet zealot]

explodes ur power grid with my mind

[carmine falcon]

kid named heating system:

[fleet zealot]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-explode-cat-meme-kitten-cat-explode-gif-13959925379531485808

[tidal berry]

yeah ok lmao

anytime I open my mouth you just say something along the lines of ''its plush''

[fleet zealot]

https://discordapp.com/channels/727074276724965407/1046913589614747719/1339766880570839081 you started to get sarcastic and weird first and we responded in kind bro, it's not that serious

[tidal berry]

you've done this about, 5 or 6 times, and still pretend you don't have issues with me

[fleet zealot]

yes, you have a repeat of behavior that is such a cycle it breaks through my memory loss brain

[carmine falcon]

https://tenor.com/view/jarvis-ragebait-this-guy-iron-man-tony-stark-gif-3966857531535969686

[fleet zealot]

i don't even have to be apart of it, you do it when i'm not here to

[clever swan]

graphics have always been important for gaming, it is true. hard to imagine a time when gamers didnt yearn for a more realistic representation except maybe the last 15 years

[tidal berry]

and last time what was it? That I'm ''whining'' cause I dared to have an opinion of fatshark you don't endorse

[fleet zealot]

i'm not going to get offended if i'm posting ferrets or simping for mk4 chaxe and someone goes "that's ell"

[copper hawk]

I like kingdom come deliverance 2

[fleet zealot]

the opinion in question "fatshark is purposefully ignoring bugs and mocking the playerbase" btw

what a jabroni

[clever swan]

better graphics allows for greater complexity in many ways, not just graphical, too. you cant have any gameplay systems related to dynamic destruction if you dont have any dynamic destruction, for example

[copper hawk]

Fatshark has started work on a new game ,,

[tidal berry]

You can either look at a game like say, half-life 2 and soy pog at graphics or you can see it as revolutions in game world physics that it was, but your perception of past doesn't make it a reality just like how mine doesn't. You can either be an adult or have a conversation about it or you can say reasonable adult and not a whinging children thing like:

''YOU'RE LIVING IN DREAMLAND''

''Its just plush lol''

[carmine falcon]

holyshit darktide 2

[fleet zealot]

yee, and it's just layers on layers. i think we have less true dynamic destruction just for how taxing it is when have better graphics

[copper hawk]

Better stop that vehicle !!

[frozen kernel]

This is the way™

Miss the short period where they’d get ding dong’d in that very match

[fleet zealot]

hl2 was revolutionary on many fronts, including visuals, but that doesn't prove the majority of gamers didn't care about graphics

[heady rapids]

fight fight fight fight fight fight

[copper hawk]

They should make more gamez like Kingdom Come Deliverance 2 ,

[light badge]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1046913589614747719/1287161017205526608/s3OnVwp.gif

[carmine falcon]

i think half life 2 was both and more and its why it's iconic af
it literally had state of the art graphics alongside fantastic physics and great usage of world building to tell it's story ect

[fleet zealot]

i remember the era of crysis being the OMG NEW THING

[fleet zealot]

and physics, the physics were groundbreaking!

[clever swan]

my understanding is that half life 2 was lauded for its great graphics. one of the most iconic early looks at the game was comparing old gman's face with new gman

[fleet zealot]

and valve always does great art direction even if they aren't the most raw fidelity

[clever swan]

when i was a kid pre-HL2 release the graphics were a big deal to me, idk about everyone else's view back then tho

[carmine falcon]

deus ex would be a better example of a game innovating GAMEPLAY cause it looked like absolute ass even on release but did great innovation in the ""immserive" sim stuff

[fleet zealot]

when i got skyrim as a kid for christmas, i thought it was more realistic than real life for a time,

[fleet zealot]

yee, good example

[north sedge]

https://tenor.com/view/savingprivateryan-ww2-old-soldier-matt-damon-gif-4203998

[carmine falcon]

but yeah anyway
last year was stacked with game
2023 was pretty decent
this year is looking disgusting with how many games imma be dropping 60 on
we eating

[clever swan]

ive been buying all the new games i buy from cd key websites and i regret nothing

[carmine falcon]

hot take if u cant find any game that tickles your pickles in the 2025 lineup then u might look for a new hobby cause there's promising stuff for every genre

[heady rapids]

we eating ice soup with these prices

[fleet zealot]

i ain't buying new games

[carmine falcon]

i literally did not order once this month to justify dropping money on pirate yakuza
i have a job but im just stingy

[fleet zealot]

maybe veilguard on sale, i do owe it to my elf gal inquisitor

[frozen kernel]

Both of these things are true, and neither statement makes the other any less true

HL2 was very much fucking “pog grafix” at the time. That water was revolutionary, but simultaneously so was the active physics system and facial animation

Not swinging on you, just wanted to give my 2 cents. I will now retreat to my foxhole

[heady rapids]

i need to get elden ring and metal gear delta 🫃

[fleet zealot]

i have the chat equivalent of a loaded gun on my clipboard LOL

[heady rapids]

although idk probably someone from my steam family will buy them before I do

[clever swan]

it's on sale on epic right now for $36. or apparently on a cdkey website for $23.17~

[fleet zealot]

welp, it will have to wait

a few months, this pc is going to set me back to ice soup era. maybe fall or winter sale

[tidal berry]

It had those, it also did run really well on toasters despite that. I had a pretty terrible outdated computer and played half life 2 just fine. I think other games I had along with it were stuff like halo 1-2, hitman games, need for speed, counter strike, red alert, command and conquer, warcraft 3 etc.. Gaming was a hobby for kids and nerds and you just wouldn't start a conversation about most of those games based on graphics cause it kinda just... didn't fucking matter besides selling the vibe of the game. When you're a kid your imagination sorta fills the gaps anyway.

[north sedge]

mh wilds for me, unsure what else is out this year actually

[clever swan]

i must buy stellar blade

for the uh...hair graphics

[fleet zealot]

that's because valve usually made their games to be graphically flexible, more than other developers

[carmine falcon]

optimization was just better back then especially source engine games that run great
issue nowdays is not evne graphics tbh, its optimization and games running so poorly to the point where it hinders gameplay

[tidal berry]

yeah the water still looks great, I've experimented with a few games where water reflections and such are ray traced and still don't look as good to my eyes while being like, probably 20-30 times more intensive on the computer.

[fleet zealot]

you could turn a lot of stuff down, hell i had a 1999 office pc work for tf2 using special launch commands and settings

[carmine falcon]

also i played all of what u mentioned and i was soypogging over graphics as much as gameplay and vibes and all that
some of them looked like real life to me

[fleet zealot]

there is an interesting thing with that, i forgot what the phenomena is called but basically, what gamers find realistic vs what is actually realistic can vary greatly

[tidal berry]

yeah I remember thinking the 1999 half life looked very realistic, in like, 2004. It wasn't because of the textures it was because of certain details like say, explosions causing gibs or great emphasis on sound design, it was more about the vibe of the game than something mundane like reflections or texture quality

[clever swan]

raytraced reflections arent mundane, they're pog

[tidal berry]

they are in cyberpunk

kinda look ugly and fizzy and bad in many other games, its clear hardware is just not there yet for mass adoption

and even if hardware allows the dev still has to make sure it looks good cause clearly you can't just throw it in a game and expect magic

[clever swan]

raytracing right now is what we'll know as like, ultra low settings 20 years from now

[north sedge]

alan wake 2 looks incredible as well

[tidal berry]

yeah most likely, it will probably be the default rendering method by then

[carmine falcon]

you're basically just describing art direction which is still thriving today idk man
if anything games now look waaaaay more varied than the fkn "army brown artstyle" look that plagued gaming around 15 years ago or so

[fleet zealot]

what you don't want ue5 game with all the fancy gimmicks only to look like ass anyways

[hard nexus]

i miss it

[fleet zealot]

gritty, realistic, hardcore shooter man

[heady rapids]

Holy shit I hated that era of gaming, whoever popularized putting filters over everything should be hanged
Worse than skyrim horse armor

[tidal berry]

I played quake II not too long ago, doesn't get more brown than that I think

[carmine falcon]

look at last year's goty nominiess
final fantasy rebirth, methaphor, wukong, astro bot
all of them look very distinct and different with varied art styles
even the graphics whoring one (wukong) has amazing art and stuff like this at the end of chapters
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENCnH7mbUjk

[clever swan]

Black Myth Wukong the goat of 2024

[carmine falcon]

machmo dudes gaming era was funny af ngl
every game had a gruff bearded dude and looked brown and involved cover shooting

[fleet zealot]

ehh i still like, nitpick bmw

[tidal berry]

Idk I don't rly give a flying f about game awards, maybe the games chosen are good maybe not

but it really smells like corpo self congratz circling and I do not like that

[fleet zealot]

their anti woke stance for streaming was weird and they did cut out a good amount of the myth itself

[carmine falcon]

i just mentioned those games cause they were highlighted by both gamers and critics

[tidal berry]

Idk who highlights wukong, chinese?

[clever swan]

mostly, probably, yeah

[carmine falcon]

the devs did say stupid shit and the cut content is a shame but the game has more than enough quality and soul put into it

[carmine falcon]

people who like good games

[fleet zealot]

but then again, wukong is such a widespread character it really is nitpicking to go "well they didn't use all the myth" I don't know it enough to follow through but it seems they removed or diminished a lot of the female characters in the story

also, gameplay wise it looked good, but not ground breaking, interesting tho

[carmine falcon]

that was just nonsense lol
the story in the game is a sequel to the og myth so its fully original and they featured as many female humans as males
most of the cast were literal beasts

the entire culture war shit surrounding it was pure cringe and both sides should dig a ditch, light it up and jump

[north sedge]

you have to admit it's pretty funny that literally nothing would have been said if they hadn't been like "plz no woke stuff while streaming the monkey game"

[clever swan]

i dont know anything about bmw cuz i dont want to spoil it. i should buy it but it's sorta expensive, but it should be worth it so...idk...

[sterile basalt]

BM wukong is not entirely lore accurate to JTTW
but it's very heavily based on it that around 90% of its settings and themes can be found directly in JTTW

[carmine falcon]

china gotta china

[tidal berry]

I wouldn't know what those are, I live in dreamland remember?

[midnight ermine]

Man teammates don't pay attention in this game

[north sedge]

they also only made this demand of twitch streamers, none of this was said to reviewers

[tidal berry]

anti-woke crowd needs the drama, they very desperately want another gamergate

[sterile basalt]

there were some people that critiqued the game's dialogue for some characters being OOC but they're either
"directly quoted by JTTW" or done so well it makes sense for these characters and the overall story's theme

[carmine falcon]

i mean they were involved in a bigger shitshow that was very very stupid but im not gonna mention it here lol

[tidal berry]

did the developers said this

[carmine falcon]

but anyway i mentioend the game as an example of a game with muh realism but also unique art alongside 3 other heavily stylized games

[fleet zealot]

not the devs themselves but yes

the company did, so people put lgbt and feminist in their twitch tags

cause the best way to get someone to do something is to tell them not to do that thing

[tidal berry]

sounds like I truly missed out on goty material indeed

[fleet zealot]

ALSO lmao did anyone see the anti-woke game awards, they gave an award to nightmare kart

and when Lilith, obviously told them to shove it, they tried review bombing the free game

[tidal berry]

you mean the same guys that declared space marine 2 as woke?

[sterile basalt]

a lot of things would have been said regardless, this just exacerbated it

[clever swan]

black myth wukong goat #1 of all time

[fleet zealot]

i believe so, the anti woke spreadsheet guy was involved

[carmine falcon]

im trying to ignore grifter content as much as humanely possible wtf why did they make their own award

[tidal berry]

as I said they need some kind of drama to survive, they literally make money off of it on social media

[sterile basalt]

but to be fair
BM wukong is REALLY WOKE in its story's themes
(fighting for freedom against a bureaucratic evil so deep rooted in society it’s no longer considered evil despite its many wrongdoings)

u can't get much more "woke" than that

[fleet zealot]

no nightmare kart is a very woke game, or at least the creator is

https://tenor.com/view/trans-disappear-bunlith-peace-fade-gif-6207100341962384367

[carmine falcon]

you think the average meathead trying to drag this game into petty internet shit understood a single line of the story?

[sterile basalt]

it's a shame that u need a ton of external knowledge to fully understand its story but it truly is one of the best written stories in gaming

[carmine falcon]

they just went HEH CHINA SO BASED, WEST MAKE WOKE, CHINA MAKES MONKE

[clever swan]

china so based....

[carmine falcon]

i watched hours of content on the og book before playing thne hours of content on both after lol it was so intresting
i'd be lying if i said i understood everything while playing but i got the gist of it

[sterile basalt]

there're some good story breakdown videos on YT but they're mostly in Chinese and don't have subtitles

[clever swan]

can you even truly understand it all if you dont know chinese?

[sterile basalt]

yea u can

[fleet zealot]

god damn it bunlith

i can't even post the original tweet, also wtf did snipping tool do to the crop, excuse me?

[sterile basalt]

I think BM Wukong's strongest chapters (story wise) are chapters 3, 4 and 5
2 is also excellent but not as sharp of a contrast because as a player who's first experiencing it, by the time u get to chapter 2 u don't rly know what is going on

[oak lance]

anyone available to help a zealot get flesh wound penance?

[sterile basalt]

but u will understand the fucked up things yellowbrow does in chapter 3 because not a single sane person wants to stay in pagoda realm longer than they need to

[carmine falcon]

chapter 3 and 5 had the best post chapter animations
true ending animation is so so good too

[sterile basalt]

chapter 3 had some pacing issues gameplay-wise
but its conflict is much more philosophical

being the longest chapter u also get to experience a lot of it

[sterile stone]

https://tenor.com/view/welcome-supprise-helldivers-helldivers-2-that's-nice-nice-gif-16523774879035659317

[carmine falcon]

i had pacing issues due to no map (they added it later lmao) and the level design being too weird for its own good sometimes

[sterile basalt]

yellowbrow's teachings are in the polar opposite to tathagata and he still considers him to be in the right because celestial court and buddhist realm in the black myth universe are all playing corrupt bureaucratic politic games

[slate haven]

Yo coming back to the game what’s the best relic blade build

[carmine falcon]

wukong's golden crown is literally a sympol of him being borderline enslaved to the court no matter what too
themes of rebelling against tyranny is all over the story but they went over people's heads because hehe monke flip

[carmine falcon]

run the one in the pins it shreds everything

[fleet zealot]

yeag

[tidal berry]

that give me vibes of like ppl unironically thinking super earth or the imperium are good guys

But 40K is largely misery porn anyway so who rly cares about story in that besides larping

[heady rapids]

Idk what's worse tbh, thinking that super earth is good or sympathising with bugs or bot

[clever swan]

are the bugs and bots not just being mercilessly killed or are they asking for it

[tidal berry]

Idk it was pretty easy to hate the bugs and bots on release

[carmine falcon]

hehe buddy, there are no good guys, only lesser evil
insert how he felt after saying that gif

https://tenor.com/view/albert-nikolas-ninja-turle-smart-smart-meme-gif-783010203213010943

[fleet zealot]

bugs are purposefully planted by the governemnt and experimented on because they literally make super oil as a waste product

[clever swan]

so sympathizing with the bugs makes sense

[fleet zealot]

bots are a part of a faction that were cyborgs and robots being used as slave labor and gained sentience

to some degree, tho they do have an overseeing "hivemind"

[clever swan]

damn...i sympathize with the bugs AND bots.......

[tidal berry]

splitting bots into subfactions was a cool idea, I was hoping they'd experiment with that more

[fleet zealot]

uhh the aliens idk, i'm not an hd2 expert

[undone pewter]

Old cyborgs sympathy makes sense new bots are quite bloodthirsty but that's the point the game is super earth reaping what they sewed

[heady rapids]

yeah idk man I kinda don't want to get blended into fuel

[undone pewter]

Peaceful aliens that wanted cooperation and then super earth said they had weapons of mass destruction genocided them and took all their tech

[clever swan]

smh genociding the quickly changing robot faction results in violent robots being made. how could this happen

[fleet zealot]

also, bugs are planted on rebelling planets

[tidal berry]

somewhat certain the bots still have human brains in them

[heady rapids]

the solution is to genocide them even further

[fleet zealot]

so super earth will get oil and the anti democratic humans will die.

[clever swan]

so basically super earth is america and therefore bad

[wind dagger]

a core component of fascism is manfucaturing victimhood, that's how we get people that are pro-police state and oppose basic human rights that are also rage against the machine fans

[spare talon]

hello?? based department??

[fleet zealot]

some do iirc,

basically, bots is a range of automatons, cyborgs, androids, etc.

[clever swan]

weapons of mass destruction
oil
"democracy"
america pattern detected

[carmine falcon]

both warhammer and helldivers portray the main "protagonist" faction as obviously bad but also make them cool as fuck so its easy for people to ignore any messaging and just spam FOR DA EMBRAH FOR SUPAHEARTH

[heady rapids]

proud to be a humanity fan

[fleet zealot]

but you can see it very easily, you can find bug planets with people shot to death, by super earth

[undone pewter]

Now the illuminate are driven entirely by revenge and want to actively wipe out the human race.

I wonder why the peaceful civilization is like this now.

Also the bugs produce Element 710.

Which is oil upside down lmfaoooo

[carmine falcon]

like yeah man i know the imperium is in the dark age but man those power armors look sick af....

[fleet zealot]

it's very on the nose.

[heady rapids]

you reminded me of that one cato sicarius meme

[misty ravine]

President Super Bush started the GWOT (Galactic War On Terminids) for the E-710 companies profits

[undone pewter]

The difference between the imperium and super earth is there's just evil shit in 40k. They didn't cause all the evil shit some of it is just there.

All the problems in helldivers are directly because of super earth.

[tidal berry]

about as plain as it gets, not like 40k is any different

[wind dagger]

using clothing/appealing to vanity as a propaganda tool is also very common so it makes sense. like have you ever seen a NATOwave edit lol

[tidal berry]

Even playing space marine 2 its about as 40k slop as it gets it still makes it clear how fucking miserable being part of imperium is

[carmine falcon]

yeah that's what im saying
so many people miss out on the messaging or choose to actively ignore it cause the imperium propaganda worked

[wind dagger]

there's a part in sm2 where you defile an entire tomb looking for essentially AA batteries

[carmine falcon]

like yeah look at zealot, a literal brainwashed dumbass who thinks a rotting corpse gave him free reing to "purge and clean" all none believers but they got mad drip and do epic motivating shit and charge headfirst....

[heady rapids]

well that rotting corpse performs actual miracles even while being "dead" so you're kinda wrong there

also the only other alternative is tau I guess which is also brainwashing galore
unless I want to grow a third arm or a second ballsack
or get flayed

[carmine falcon]

my knowledge is not very good but from what i gathered, the emperor would NOT approve of being blindly worshipped like that
correct if im wrong tho my "knowledge" is youtube videos

[violet hornet]

is hab drayko out of rotation right now? feel like I haven't seen it in a while

[tidal berry]

for DT zealots its either a facade or delusion to cope with reality in a lot of cases

they're.. rejects for a reason too

[wind dagger]

you are correct, the fate of the imperium is basically the emperor's own personal hell

[heady rapids]

he wouldn't but it's a fairly stupid tactic
cost him half his legions cause he didn't want to be worshipped and burned monarchia

[misty ravine]

Questioning the lavish lifestyle of Archbishop Whoever

[heady rapids]

it is

[carmine falcon]

some of agitator's dialogue implies that they're putting on a front but zealots in general and the faction they're based on are religious fanatics on roids and those are very very very dangerous

[tidal berry]

Yea DT zealots are downright nice compared the whats implied elsewhere, agitator is just putting on a front because what else can you do in their position

[misty ravine]

At least one Agitator line hints that he trades in information like Loose Cannon trades in contraband

[carmine falcon]

which zealot persoanlity is the one that enjoyed burning heretics again, like actually burned random people cause they suspected them lmfao

[tawny walrus]

avast ye blaggards

[wind dagger]

honestly it would make a lot of sense for many people in the minostorum to be faking it until they make it, it's actually remarkably common for priests IRL to lose their faith but they remain within the church for various reasons

[misty ravine]

Fanatic probably. Agitator is more likely to have done it just to silence them because they know too much. Judge would at most do so out of an abundance of caution (as he saw it)

[heady rapids]

idk if the regular run-of-the-mill guy in the imperium knows that emperor is very much real and is an actual god tho

or would they actually think that it's propaganda

[carmine falcon]

judge is somehow putting on an act (the theatrical voice and manner of speech) but also feels like an actual blind fanatic who does actual fanatic things
brother straight up skipped trial process and positioned himself as judge jury and executioner

[heady rapids]

information is very scarce in 40k, esp for someone not being of high enough rank

[tawny walrus]

Which personality has the dialogue with the Ogryn where the Ogryn says Sah over and over? That zealot seems like a level headed dude unless heresy is mentioned

[tidal berry]

barry 63

[misty ravine]

Joe Menial probably believes in the Emperor even if he privately thinks much/most of the Ecclesiarchy are fraudulent

[heady rapids]

then again, what alternatives do you even have
tau is like the only lesser evil that actually accepts humans
unless you're into nihilism then go nurgle

[wind dagger]

an overwhelming number of the imperium's subjects can't even read or write, i doubt they're talking about theology or even thinking/speaking about the emperor beyond a normal blessing or curse like we say god bless or god dammit

[carmine falcon]

judge tells one of the ogryn personalities that they would consider them as family or something lmao
not close family but family still
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSmUmJ-ShGc

[heady rapids]

zealot chat goes slaanesh

[mighty root]

I wonder if fatshark will make a church crusade game

[misty ravine]

Shocker

[tidal berry]

nah darktide card game on UE5

take it or leave it

[mighty root]

[tidal berry]

honestly the better question to ask is how will fatshark convince people to buy whatever they put out next

[mighty root]

Ue5 isn’t bad

[tidal berry]

they don't exactly have a good track record with releasing games in a good state or even being honest about what it will be like

so they need to come out with something solid out of the gate or they're kinda cooked

[heady rapids]

they don't need to convince anyone
fatshark fans buy their games knowing that they eventually become good

[mighty root]

People still be rocking the 1060 and say why am I getting 12 fps

[carmine falcon]

damn if you do damn if you don't yada yada

[wind dagger]

interrex

[heady rapids]

https://tenor.com/view/oh-no-cat-shocked-shocked-face-gasp-gif-16088185

[tawny walrus]

Fatshark game = me swing weapon against hordes of baddies.

[mighty root]

I love the aesthetics of church crusade

[heady rapids]

fatshark game? I'm already sold
two copies please

[misty ravine]

You'd think basic literacy and arithmetic would be needed to make them effective workers on any industrialized world, even if they were just factory menials. Isn't that why it was implemented IRL during the height of the industrial revolution?

[tawny walrus]

Are you talking about Trench Crusade?

[wind dagger]

no it is definitely true that optimization has become an afterthought for the vast majority of games, it feeds into the accelerated releases in the GPU market

[mighty root]

Oh yeah opps

[heady rapids]

if you have a skull they'll find a job for you don't worry

[mighty root]

I’m silly

[carmine falcon]

true but something something dramatized satire something exaggerated grimdork something something commentary on how humans are replaceable and mean nothing

[mighty root]

Real unoptimized games are a problem that they push on gpus to “upscale” and “optimize”

[tidal berry]

Doesn't rly matter the games look blurry and ugly, fool's errand to buy money on latest hardware

[mighty root]

Just wait till you see what I’m building

[tawny walrus]

Is it a house?

[mighty root]

Friggin 1000 dollar msi 870x godlike motherboard

[wind dagger]

there's a remarkable amount of labor in 40k that they do by hand that we've automated because in 40k machines are a precious resource. you don't really need to know how to read or write to mind an algae pool on an agri-world or something like that

we also have this issue irl where despite the availability of technology people are paradoxically becoming less technologically and scientifically literate and in some places just straight up less literate

[mighty root]

I’m building a whole new rig

[tidal berry]

You can't fix the TAA vaseline filter by throwing money at it, I'm sorry

[fleet zealot]

FERRETS IN SPACE (FERRETS ARE CANON TO 40k)

[tidal berry]

Actually you somewhat can, thats untrue

[tawny walrus]

Also don't need to be literate to light the candles on the flight deck

[mighty root]

I’d like a 5090 but the moment they are in stock the disappear

[tidal berry]

I'd say if you really have overkill money, go for something like a 4K OLED or start supersampling games with an overkill GPU which is the ancient way of doing AA but its what you gotta do when MSAA is no longer used

[mighty root]

It was the gpu I was gonna use for this build

[tidal berry]

don't think you even need a 5090, 4090 is good enough

[mighty root]

Atm I got a 4080 super

[tidal berry]

And it will be good enough for years to come

[tidal berry]

Also fine, like, seriously, its fine. You don't need a new card.

[fleet zealot]

but hwat if i want 8k ultra gigafart graphics in 5 years ?

[mighty root]

Real im just thinking about upgrading everything else and sticking with what i have

[tidal berry]

I'd look at monitor, maybe oleds

[wind dagger]

i think a lot of people that are currently in their late 20s/30s really take for granted how many skills they had to learn growing up during the technology boom that newer people don't. just in order to survive on the internet in the early 00s you had to learn how to research, how to identify good information and discard the bad, etc

[heady rapids]

just force dlaa into every game lol

[carmine falcon]

this is the type stuff i find super fascinating about 40k, they went backwards so hard they have tech less advanced than our own lmao
tho not sure if that's on purpose or because 40k was written 1 billion years ago and probably suffers from what i call "Cyberpunk syndrome" where writers dont really know how tech wil advance and think turning the internet into a physical cyberspace is some deep shit

[tidal berry]

I'm an AMD peasant, can't

[wind dagger]

it's a deliberate choice, there's a whole subgenre of fiction called retrofuturism

[mighty root]

I’m scared of screen burn and the monitor I’m looking at is a 360 fps g sync ultimate 1440 monitor

[heady rapids]

if tech advances then imperium wins and we can't sell plastic anymore
comprende?

[tidal berry]

I do usually render UE games at 4K and then FSR will take 1080P as the starting resolution, got pretty decent results with that method

4K is high enough of a resolution that when downscaled it will look really crisp regardless

[carmine falcon]

retrofuturism def applies
also the whole "fighting with swords and shields in fkn space" vibe
medival times but in space

[mighty root]

I can’t stand ghosting and 360 fps will fix dat

[tidal berry]

it won't if its at a monitor level or has to do with TAA

[fleet zealot]

what about retroferretism

[mighty root]

And g sync

[wind dagger]

unpopular opinion by i think the entirety of the cyberpunk genre is trash. i heard so many people jerk off neuromancer and the whole thing is steeped in mccarthy-era propaganda

[carmine falcon]

just make age of sigmar 2 elecric bogoloo

[tidal berry]

OLEDs are good because its the most blur free 4K experience money can get you

[wind dagger]

like actually reading that book made all of the grotesque racism in shit like shadowrun make a lot of sense

[mighty root]

Atm I have a poopy amd monitor which is fine but me want g sync

[tidal berry]

I don't rly think g-sync matters to a high end pc

[mighty root]

The more I hear the more I yearn

[tidal berry]

I've experienced it thanks to a friend, had a 2K 360 samsung oled, it was just built different

[carmine falcon]

i like a lot of it aesthetically and on a theamtic level but also a lot of it is written by people who literally did not even experience the tech they're writing about and it becomes borderline magic mcguffin shit sometimes
stuff like bladerunner, cyberpunk ttrpg, 2077, ghost in the shell ect are a lot better than stuff that inspired them imo

[tidal berry]

usually high res monitors are slow and not very good, but oleds I approve of, it reminds me of almost like, CRT levels of smooth

[fleet zealot]

nah cyberpunk is great, fallout is the worst setting.

[mighty root]

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/rgvTPJ @tidal berry this is the build I’m working on atm I already have the motherboard

[carmine falcon]

although im not sure what parts were too gross, a lot of cyberpunk worlds are fucked up by design and they are portrayed as places u DO NOT wanna be in
high tech, low life

[misty ravine]

Agri worlds yes, but the majority live on hive worlds and most if not all of those seem industrialized. My impression is that the AdMech has a monopoly on anything sophisticated and they don't share it out for a variety of reasons (including being unable to replicate the fanciest stuff, or even understand the operating principles) but a lot of industry isn't under direct AdMech purview and just about any world is capable of producing roughly WW2 level stuff. There is every incentive to make production numbers go up and industrialization helps with that, a lot

[fleet zealot]

just too many people on both sides who only played the video game and never did any of the ttrpg stuff

[heady rapids]

I like the 'restore the society' part of the fallout setting but the majority want piss water

[tidal berry]

650$ for that monitor is pretty decent deal

[fleet zealot]

there is also shadowrun, tech and magic

[tidal berry]

here asus ones are like 1000$ but samsung offers QD-OLEDs of similar spec for 600$

I would have gotten one but I spent all my spare cash on uh.. pills.

[mighty root]

Yeah oled is what I’d love but I’m terrified of screen burn in it happened to my last one

[carmine falcon]

oled screen burn is an one issue on modern panels

[mighty root]

[heady rapids]

I'm gonna be burning in skibidi toilet into your screen while you're asleep

[mighty root]

That was an 1200 dollar paper weight that lasted a month

[tidal berry]

It really shouldn't be but I feel like some models are probably cheaping out on cooling to make the models thinner or something

[mighty root]

Luckily I had warranty

That’s the thing is cutting corners

[tidal berry]

I think it might be worthwhile to wait for newer models in that case

[mighty root]

Yeah atm I’m sticking with isp

[tidal berry]

the thing is there aren't rly any premium high end monitors anymore besides oled here

like once you go up to that price range its pretty much all oled or monitors that were made 2-3 years ago

[wind dagger]

it depends on what layer of a hive you live on. people on the upper levels are very metropolitan, can read/write and use a lot of common technology eisenhorn and gaunt's ghosts have a lot of scenes where people interact with hivers and they seem relatively educated and obviously if you're one of the billions of administratum adepts that stare at a terminal all day you're probably more educated than even they are, but there are also passages where they talk about how menials just learn how to do things by rote rather than actually understanding what they're doing/reading

[heady rapids]

internet service provider

[hexed igloo]

I have a monitor I bought for $60 about 8 years ago. It still works, 0 burn in, whatever

[tidal berry]

you can get burn-in on LCDs too if you torture them enough

[mighty root]

[carmine falcon]

https://tenor.com/view/not-a-sigma-sorry-you-are-not-a-sigma-sorry-you're-not-a-sigma-you-aren't-a-sigma-you-are-not-sigma-gif-337838532227751572

[mighty root]

When is the 9950x3d coming out?

[clever swan]

get the 9950x3d

yes

[tidal berry]

why not just get 9800x3d

[carmine falcon]

98003dx is already overkill why even bother lmfao

[tidal berry]

whats the difference for a gamer more cores won't benefit you, it won't even perform any better

[clever swan]

not wrong but having 8 cores to completely dedicate to gaming is nice

[tidal berry]

it can also hurt fps by causiing scheduler issues

[wind dagger]

i think one thing that you're not really factoring in is the fact that the imperium doesn't really care much about efficiency beyond "as long as it gets done". life is cheap and education is an investment - there are even lines in darktide where they talk about how workers are easily replaced and machines aren't so they'll just throw people into the manufactorum until they meet their quota

[tidal berry]

if the game spreads the load between the two core groups your performance is kinda cooked

[mighty root]

Ok real I do like my SoundCloud and streaming

Plush is our tech priest

[wind dagger]

this cpu is practically futureproof, there's no reason to get anything else

[tidal berry]

Idk maybe you can use a software or something to eliminate that problem, but just know windows isn't perfect at assigning right cores to the right tasks

[mighty root]

I hate windows

[clever swan]

the way i think about it is like this: you can make all your programs use cores 0-15

and have your high tier games use 16-31 OR 0-31 depending

and with 16-31 the games should run slightly better than with 0-15

[tidal berry]

I have a 7800X3D, not gonna upgrade over the %8-10 difference, worthless

if you have a X3D CPU you have like, probably zero reason to upgrade

[mighty root]

I’ve unironically been thinking about getting another gpu it keep it in its own gay baby jail

[wind dagger]

i was using an oldgen intel before this so i could justify the purchase, wound up making an entirely new rig

[tidal berry]

Speaking of, I'm just about to try and see how bad monhun wilds runs on my pc

[wind dagger]

what gpu do you have

[tidal berry]

6800XT, saved from a cryptobro, for about 200$-ish I think?

[mighty root]

He’s cooked

That thing is about to fly

[tidal berry]

Its been trucking along fine

[mighty root]

Reminder never buy zotac

[carmine falcon]

im on a 5900x not sure if i wanna invest in a whole ass new mobo and cpu lol
i know 78003dx is a big uplift but i'd rather replace my fkn 3070ti with its gimped vram first

[tidal berry]

3070ti, thats rough, I was offered one of those by that miner at the time, refused outright lmao

[heady rapids]

hey you take that back I had a zotac 670 oc

[wind dagger]

that should be fine, i played mhw on a 3070ti and it ran fine

[mighty root]

A x3d is good

[carmine falcon]

the gpu is literal comedy
actual good specs and everything literally held back by vram

[wind dagger]

it dropped below 60 in some places but otherwise it was ok

[tidal berry]

thats reassuring, techbros on yt make it sound like this game is impossible to play

[carmine falcon]

its not impossible to play it just runs like absolute shit

[mighty root]

Mmmm the cheapest parts know to man

[wind dagger]

oh wait, you said wilds not world didn't you

[clever swan]

just wait until AM5 is over and get AM6. then from there you can get the AM6's best thing down the line

[carmine falcon]

i was thinking sell my pc and upgrade while it has resale value but too much effort

[heady rapids]

and yet we'll still have people playing on their 1060.....

[misty ravine]

I guess what I'm saying is that efficiency helps it get done—one's tenure as Planetary Governor for example may depend directly on how many camshaft lobes for Chimera engines Hive Whatsit can churn out

[wind dagger]

i think with that cpu you should be able to run it but in some places it will probably struggle

[mighty root]

If it were me I’d invest in it the 7800x3d would be a good one with 32 gigs of 6400 ddr5 ram and a good Samsung ssd

And a good motherboard that’ll support the ram

[tidal berry]

6400 is a gamble, it may not run

[carmine falcon]

gpu first for me
tired of running out of vram

[mighty root]

Ngl the 4060 ti is good

[clever swan]

with neural texture compression it might be possible that vram issues will disappear

but that's also exactly what nvidia wants us to think

[tidal berry]

you might unironically have better chance running 8000 stable than 6400 because the latter tries to run on a 1:1

I'm not saying it can't, just keep in mind ram is always a gamble

[mighty root]

I had 8400 in my new build lol

[carmine falcon]

im eyeing a 4070tisuper on a good price (yeah that's an actual name)

[mighty root]

Get a 4080 it has the same problems as the 3070 to

[tidal berry]

sometimes its actually easier to boot with 8000 I kid you not, but 6400 might be faster, its complicated

[mighty root]

Evil ram

[carmine falcon]

16gb is plenty on the 4070tisuperbabajifornite

[tidal berry]

To ppl that just wanna run stable system on the cheap but without sacrificing too much I recommend something cheap and easy like 6000 CL30, either do 2x24 or 2x16, don't do 4 sticks, that'd be my advice

[clever swan]

the 4070 ti super is what the 4070 ti should have always been. fucking nvidia

[carmine falcon]

wait for the 5070tisuperfornitebabaji to be the true 5070

[mighty root]

How much difference in games is CL 30 than 40?

[tidal berry]

I'm waiting for AMD cards so I can look at it and decide I'll keep my 6800XT anyway

[misty ravine]

But yes a lot depends on who's writing that part of 40k, are they trying to (literally) Make It Make Sense, or have they gone full grimderp, or somewhere in between

[carmine falcon]

i hope amd actually makes something good this gen and doesn't just try to undercut nvidia again

[tidal berry]

depends on the game rly, for X3D generally not a lot since they're often overkill on ram performance anyway

but the kit that has higher CL might have other timings tightened up, don't get too hung up on CL alone

[mighty root]

X3D is so ridiculous

[clever swan]

they arent going to make anything good this gen

[tidal berry]

if they had anything good it would have been out by now

[clever swan]

the 9070 xt might have a good price though, unknown at this time

[tidal berry]

I bet FSR4 doesn't even exist yet and they're panicking

[north sedge]

Fsr4 had demos at ces

[tidal berry]

Also monhun wilds has been doing shaders for a while now

[carmine falcon]

fs4 had positive demos that had people scratching their heads on why amd is radio silent

[tidal berry]

And FSR3 was out with two games that nobody ever cared for, doesn't matter in reality it took a year for it to start popping in games people actually play

[mighty root]

I feel like nivida will not be a company soon with how many shares they lost

[carmine falcon]

nah they'd win

[mighty root]

I honestly think that the 50 series was there last effort to get money

[clever swan]

they'll be fine

[mighty root]

I wonder how good quadro cards are for gaming

[tidal berry]

I don't think so, they just dgaf about gamers anymore

[carmine falcon]

nvidia is not going away lmao
the stocks they lost were hyper inflated anyway
they are still the defacto leader in their respective field

[mighty root]

Mmmm ai slop

I love slop! And cashews

[tidal berry]

it sells, and if it stops selling they can then cater to gamers, except they already dominate that market so why should they try?

[carmine falcon]

mfw 5000 gen is literally 4000 but with ai package

[tidal berry]

you spit at your customers and they still buy your product why bother trying? Thats where they at

[mighty root]

Ok real

What do we think about intels new cards

[clever swan]

the rtx 5000 series isnt a new nanometerage so it really isnt a big deal at all

[fleet zealot]

first it was crypto

and then it was crypto, now it's AI. millions 5000 series must be sacrificed for shitty soulless "art"

[mighty root]

I remember intel said that one of there cards are better than a 4090

[fleet zealot]

i heard the intel cards were good value

[mighty root]

They are

[fleet zealot]

but they weren't on any PCs i saw while shopping, so 🤷‍♂️

[mighty root]

Idk if they are any good

[fleet zealot]

hope they catch on if they are good value tho, we need more of that

[mighty root]

Honestly if I’m looking for a pc I’m looking at the cpu, ram, and gpu

[past sierra]

preassembled pc are always a scam

[mighty root]

Building your own is so easy

Especially with some motherboards they tell you what to do and give you like 4 holes to put stuff in

[past sierra]

yup
i built many
and also way cheaper and more powerful

preassembled pc are a scam because they put low quality items and charge for the double if not more

[clever swan]

good price but they're not very strong and have some problems that other gpus dont have

[mighty root]

https://tenor.com/view/morgan-freeman-true-morgan-freeman-true-nodding-gif-13973817878387504960

[past sierra]

[tawdry leaf]

yeah i wish i knew this sooner. spent 4000 dollars on my pc a bit after covid. they gave me a fucking zotac 3090ti and coolermaster fans 😭

[mighty root]

@fleet zealot my gigabyte motherboard gave me the most simple step by step guide on how to build it

[carmine falcon]

4000 on a prebuilt wtf

[clever swan]

it's not the worst idea ever if, for example, there are no GPUs in stock except through a prebuilt and/or if it's on sale/coupon somehow

[mighty root]

Zotac I am vomit

[past sierra]

😅
rip
for the same amount you could got a very better nice pc

[fleet zealot]

people on their way i should feel scammed for my pc cause i didn't want to wait one gazilion years for a gpu

[mighty root]

I hate zotac

[carmine falcon]

premade PCs can be good IF its a service that lets u pick and choose parts from multiple offers and offer actual building and maintaince service

[past sierra]

wait, not same amount
even less lol
like 2k max

[tawdry leaf]

nah, at the time it was top of the line in terms what gpus, cpus, ram, etc was available

[dull finch]

Lets put slomo to 1 minute here

[tawdry leaf]

also not true, prices were fucked from covid still

[past sierra]

heavily scalped
but fair

[fleet zealot]

i have had only 2 people in this chat offer me reasonable "build it yourself lists" and all of them came up costing more when you include fans and the case and everything else you need lol

[past sierra]

they took advantage of the situation yea by scalping despite the scarce resources with semi conductors

[mighty root]

Tbh a 20 series isn’t bad or anything above it I’d try to research and put parts together on a budget

[fleet zealot]

i don't wnat to go from 1070 to 20 series

[past sierra]

mostly was because sellers were selling gpus at higher price because high demand

[fleet zealot]

i want to run path of exile 2 well and in a nice quality, and be future proofed for years to come

[carmine falcon]

something went wrong here cause it should be costing less if done right
when i bought my PC i spent weeks researching each part i want and each price and i concluded that buying parts 1 by 1 is much much cheaper but more time consuming and requires u to build

[mighty root]

The 4060 ti will be a massive upgrade then

[past sierra]

and there were low gpu in term of numbers due to the situation
thats why price was up
but the 3090 now is just a 1080 gtx

[fleet zealot]

it's not a 4060ti, i paid the bit extra and got a 4070 super

[past sierra]

[tawdry leaf]

to be honest, even if i waited for the 40 series to drop, given prices then i wouldnt have had much success. this is considering i wanted the best gpu money could basically buy

[mighty root]

On yeah

[tawdry leaf]

in the end even looking now the 5090s will be outrageously overpriced

[mighty root]

Uh get a 7800x3d then @fleet zealot

[fleet zealot]

I ALREADY HAVE THE PC FYRE

[carmine falcon]

top of the line is always overpriced
or at least that's the trend since Titan cards

[mighty root]

[fleet zealot]

this is what i'm talking about

[mighty root]

The mold pc

Evil fungus

[carmine falcon]

damn you're balling

[fleet zealot]

i can't mention i got a prebuilt i'll be nailed to the cross

[fleet zealot]

oh not really, i went through a lot of shopping and deal hunting. the best deal was out of stock at costco

[carmine falcon]

as long as it works out for u who tf cares lmao

[past sierra]

maybe if they cant control the situation with scalpers
baseline price for new gpu at least was good, but obv aib models will cost more

[clever swan]

the downtrodden prebuilt havers...

[carmine falcon]

(performance wise)

[fleet zealot]

oh i thought you meant money wise

[clever swan]

what prebuilt did you buy? can you find its stats online?

[carmine falcon]

nah i remember u saying you were tight on $$$

[fleet zealot]

it was the same 1399$ as the costco one but it comes with 16gb less ram but has the extra slots and 1tb less ssd, but has room for me to put more

[tawdry leaf]

one of my friends was trying to get a 5090. they had every tab open on newegg, nvidsia, amazon, bhphoto, bestbuy, etc. as soon as the 5090 dropped it became sold out in less than a second. scalpers really do have a special place in hell

[fleet zealot]

oh yea i'll be tight for months but that's okay i can game and shit

[past sierra]

intel i7 6700k

[tawdry leaf]

uhhh skytech iirc. they fucked me, dont buy prebuilts from them (actually dont buy from them at all)

[carmine falcon]

its not just scalpers
nvidia botched the launch and released very limited stock and bad drivers

[violet hornet]

https://tenor.com/view/helldivers-helldivers-2-automaton-speech-bubble-gif-15185842439205075057

[fleet zealot]

i hope people who scalp children card games especially

[mighty root]

This happened to me, they have bots that auto buy them

[fleet zealot]

just fucking, straight down to the bottom.

[clever swan]

there are new drivers now so maybe they fixed the driver issues

[tawdry leaf]

im about to start fighting fire with fire and make a bot once the fucking 50 series relaunches or something man 😭

[fleet zealot]

why tf you a grown ass man buying all the pokemon cards that you ain't even going to use.

[clever swan]

join the zotac community and prove yourself and get in the sweepstakes or whatever they have

[tawdry leaf]

investment reasons

[past sierra]

cause they couldnt produce them in large quantity due to the scarce resources with semi conductors back then

[mighty root]

Do you love your cheap corner cut Chinese slop?

[clever swan]

yes.....

[fleet zealot]

see i hate this mentality

[carmine falcon]

they did it again a month ago

[violet hornet]

I don't have a zotac, but they've come a long way. They were cheap shit almost a decade ago

[fleet zealot]

games can be made for fun, I hate the first person who went "what if you can make money while playing game" STFU I DON'T WANT ANOTHER JOB

[mighty root]

I mean I suppose a 4090 is still a 4090 even if it’s zotac

[tawdry leaf]

dw i hate it too. its one thing investing in old money or coins or something not used as an external hobby (atleast in popularity, given i collect old money/coins for investment) but its another investing in a fucking card game

[violet hornet]

Like anker, they've kinda become a more quality decent product after years of being shit

[clever swan]

zotac is supposed to be bad, it's low priced

[tawdry leaf]

zotac isnt... they arent bad, theyre okay

[fleet zealot]

i love it when the companies fight back but they rarely do so, but when they do and all the scalpers and shit heads flip out when the tcg makers flood the market so shit isn't as valuable anymore

[past sierra]

manufacturer can have some downsides and pros
but yea

[clever swan]

yeah i dont even think they're bad. they're probably just mid or something. ive never had em tho

[violet hornet]

go tell the people in the nvidia discord zotac is shit

[mighty root]

@past sierra @tidal berry isn’t the 40 series getting that Blackwell update?

[fleet zealot]

https://www.costco.com/ibuypower-slatemesh-8-gaming-desktop---14th-gen-intel-core-i9-14900f---nvidia-geforce-rtx-4070-super---windows-11---32gb-ram---2tb-ssd.product.4000291940.html this is what i was planning to get

[clever swan]

out of stock because the universe hates good things..

[mighty root]

Like the upscaling the 50 has?

[fleet zealot]

but the dude i talked with, friend of the family who worked there in electronics, they aren't getting more till school is out for the summer

[tawdry leaf]

the biggest thing with zotac cards is cooling. they dont have as good cooling as something like a MSI, ASUS, gigabyte, etc. if you can get adequate cooling for them, its generally fine. i have an AIO and like 6 fans so

[fleet zealot]

yea, completely out of stock.

[past sierra]

scam

[fleet zealot]

so i went shopping, checked a bunch of stores, chatted with staff members

[mighty root]

Intel I am vomit

[clever swan]

4070 super + a 14900f for $1400 isnt bad is it? like, isnt the 4070 super like 650 and the 14900f + mobo is like 600 too?

[fleet zealot]

tell me how, do it, it's fucking costco dude, they don't scam

[mighty root]

I would have asked if i could take the gpu out and leave

[past sierra]

yup lol

[fleet zealot]

they give me 2 years part lifetime service and will do all the support work on your behalf they are fucking guard dogs, they take away the biggest weakness prebuilts have

[mighty root]

Well that’s not bad then

[tawdry leaf]

i have an i9-12900KS. which i also bought shortly after the covid gpu crisis. my entire rig besides my AIO (which is now corsair) is like 2-3 years old now

[past sierra]

intel doing bad cpus
overheating and providing less power
amd for the same heat consume less watts and its better

[fleet zealot]

oh wow you'll be glad that one wasn't in stock, got one from best buy, different brand, same price, 16 less gbs of ram, 1tb less ssd, and an amd processor for all you intel haters

[violet hornet]

you are not tech savvy enough to have these kinds of opinions lmao

[clever swan]

that is true but they're still good if they dont fuck up in that way. just undervolt and reduce clocks a bit, probably

[fleet zealot]

but it has the slots open to expand the ram and ssd space so, i'll live for now

[mighty root]

I know enough to not use intel

[fleet zealot]

AMD Ryzen 7 7700 8-Core Processor this is my processor

[mighty root]

I want a pc not a campfire

[tawdry leaf]

dont use intel rn. get an amd cpu as of rn

[fleet zealot]

hey, that is a great feature for cold montana winters, easily heats my room from below freezing to a nice comfy 40f

[violet hornet]

children trying to convince me intel is bad

[tawdry leaf]

@remote lark whats your pc specs again?

[carmine falcon]

good cpu for the price
you got a nice machine mate

[mighty root]

But really the X3D is better for games it’s why I like amd

[clever swan]

$1400 for a 4070 super and a 7700x with 16gb of ram and 1 TB of nvme?

[carmine falcon]

no point in arguing over if the build is worth or not he already bought it
could have been worse

[fleet zealot]

thanks, wish it was the other one, idc about the hoes getting mad at intel and best buy made me shell out an extra 175$ for their protection plan but whatever tho

[tawdry leaf]

they arent i just really wouldnt recommend intel for a little longer even if theyve fixed the instability issues

[fleet zealot]

at least now I can plug and play.

[violet hornet]

buying AMD in general is nice to give intel competition but it's not like intel is bad

[fleet zealot]

okay i will say, my old pc intel cpu absolutely carried my rig for the time,

[mighty root]

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/rgvTPJ @past sierra This is what I’m building I already have the motherboard

[tawdry leaf]

also because intel cpus right now are having memory corruption issues

[fleet zealot]

but it has been a decade, things could have changed

[violet hornet]

They're still king of single core performance and we haven't seen what their new line of shit can do with proper drivers

[carmine falcon]

i stopped following intel news ever since their cpus were melting
i just see no reason to buy intel when ryzen is rock solid af

[mighty root]

Keeping my 4080 super though

[fleet zealot]

love how the pc building meta is... amd cpu, but not amd gpu, get nvidia gpu

except maybe now intel might have a great value gpu.

and ram is just a mystery

[carmine falcon]

intel was toe to toe with amd but last 2 gens have been having issues left right and center, also intel doesnt have an answer to amd's 3dx tech

[mighty root]

My school friend almost burnt down his house because of a intel caught fire

[fleet zealot]

oh that's one other thing, i will say i may have lost value on, only ddr4 ram in this machine

[tawdry leaf]

whats the current situation with intels gpus? i havent really looked into it

[past sierra]

good
id play with 4k maybe with that build but i guess 1440p good one as well

[fleet zealot]

costco one i did confirm it would have had 32gbs of ddr5, but i really, really was trying to find the best deal

and montana gaming PC stock SUCKS. i went to wal-mart they were charging like 1,200$ for a 3050

[mighty root]

Cheap and ok? I think?

[tidal berry]

Idk, don't rly keep tabs on nvidia cards anymore

[carmine falcon]

very good budget/value options with decent upscaling

[mighty root]

I’ve not heard anything about them

[past sierra]

when it comes to ram you gotta see also the CAS latency timings and all

[tidal berry]

Trying monhun beta rn

[mighty root]

Oh I thought it was getting that uoscaling stuff the 50 had

[past sierra]

real monhun died after mh4u

[tawdry leaf]

theyve taken a good footholder in the marketplace id bet, intels shifting from good cpus to good gpus

[tidal berry]

Idk my first time playing these games, am consoomer

[past sierra]

i see

[mighty root]

Would you recommend a different ram than the one I have chosen?

[fleet zealot]

my god my internet

[past sierra]

yea i dont think are a problem

[fleet zealot]

is going to cock block me so hard why do i have to be moved every god damn year.

alright going to go to bed and let things download overnight,

[mighty root]

https://tenor.com/view/glorpflex-glorp-flex-flexing-cat-gif-237031439715906425

[fleet zealot]

where is my rgb controller

i need to turn off all my lights

I LOVE BLOATWARE

I LOVE WIN11 AND THEN PERIPHERAL BLOATWARE

Headset wants software, my wifi dongle wants software, my mouse wants software, This is madness

my rgblgbt wants software

[clever swan]

from what i see online it seems like 6000 cl 30 is pog and after like 6400 the fclk probably cant match it so it might lose performance since you'll have to reduce the fclk or you'll be unstable and crash sometimes

[fleet zealot]

all my lights are off

[fleet zealot]

so cool and nice when it's not brightly shining actually

going to see how the screen matching setting works tho,if it doesn't freak out during games

[tidal berry]

Thats what I got, it just works ez

[reef plaza]

Any outfits for zealot that make them look like a Kommissar

Asking for my zealot main friend

[fleet zealot]

more of a veteran thing

i would recomnend they just play like, mid path veteran for shout then swing to the weapon specialist keystone for a commisar/zealotish experience

[tidal berry]

anyway, monhun actually runs pretty ok, I'm not a fan of the framegen though, how do I turn this off

[tidal berry]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/286574006348546048/1064196804742225971/D37B817C-4FE9-4CF0-A48B-3F8C55F88D73.gif

[past sierra]

in the settings
where you change the graphics settings

[clever swan]

try to get 6400 cl32 and if the fclk is unstable at (whatever it's at for 6400) then just underclock the ram to 6350 (and match the fclk) or some shit until it works lol

[tidal berry]

oh my god it was right there under upscaling the entire time, wow I am blind af

[mighty root]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/877778238162731078/1283192473593577563/ezgif-5-5aa3b832f3.gif

[clever swan]

also you dont necessarily want more than 2 sticks of ram. not sure how much this matters though, probably very slightly if at all

[tidal berry]

It does if you're pushing high speeds since more sticks is more load on memory controller

[mighty root]

I thought about that I was just planning on going all out with this build

[tidal berry]

like say a system can do 6400 max with 2 sticks, it might not do that anymore with 4 sticks

[clever swan]

you'll be fine with 48 gigabytes of ram im pretty sure. that's already a bit a lot

[tidal berry]

36 is already more than what most people have

dont think u need more than 48 as a basic user

sometimes more is less

but Idk at 6000 you could probably make 4 sticks work fine, I never tried, but its likely it will just work

[clever swan]

saves money and gets you a bit more performance. maybe with the saved apparently 260 dollars you can buy a bunch of pog fans for your case

[mighty root]

Can the 9800x3d keep up the 2 kits of 48 gigs of 8400?

CPUs are the only thing I can’t grasp

[clever swan]

i dont think the fclk stands any chance, that's why they say it doesnt matter going over 6400 because that's around the fclk's limit

i dont really know how it works either tho :)

[mighty root]

How I look at my ram obliterating my cpu

And I hit it wif rock

[fleet zealot]

FIGURED OUT WHY My inbuilt wifi wasn't good

i had to screw on these antennas on the back

[mighty root]

Get you a Ethernet cable

[fleet zealot]

I'd have to run it through 3 hallways

[mighty root]

Weak

[fleet zealot]

a living room, and a kitchen/dining room, no thanks

11.1 MBs LETS GO

and it's going higher

15 MBs peak okay now i feel bettter

[clever swan]

https://tenor.com/view/can-we-get-much-higher-the-one-piece-is-real-whitebeard-gif-26587931

[spare talon]

do i play taxe psyker, taxe zealot, or shovel recon vet

[fleet zealot]

shovel vet, mk1 especially

[mighty root]

Scared me a second

[spare talon]

what other marks even exist?

[clever swan]

it would be tenor's fault not mine

[fleet zealot]

i like the one folding one that has the same moveset besides special

[spare talon]

now youre just making stuff up

that doesnt exist
theres only 1 vet shovel
the mk1

[fleet zealot]

ur made up, ur all figments of my fractured psyche

[stable cypress]

shovel psyker

[spare talon]

i would commit unspeakable acts for mk1 shovel on zealot

[mighty root]

Use mk4 dclaw with revolver

[stable cypress]

same

I want to dig holes in heresy for the god emperor

[spare talon]

[mighty root]

Holy carry

[ornate bone]

William, the foe

[nimble fiber]

no

William, the friend

[hexed igloo]

Me when I have to spend $90 on a proprietary ethernet cable for marginally better internet because Elon musk decided not to use a normal fuckng ethernet port

[delicate shadow]

same

[remote lark]

ryzen 9 5900x
3080
64gb ddr4
4tb m.2

built it a few years ago myself in the Azza Regis case

[tawdry leaf]

i thought you had a 4080.. huh

[remote lark]

naw i built it i think wehn the 4080 was rlly new and also scalping was pretty bad

prices were insane; my build cost me about 3k

[tawdry leaf]

scalping has been bad since like covid ngl

[spare talon]

when will they finally let us

[remote lark]

just play tutorial

[misty ravine]

Shovel is a totally inappropriate weapon for a class that looks like a hobo with most cosmetics

[fiery ingot]

So is duelling sword you could say

[delicate shadow]

psyker has like...2 cosmetics that make aesthetic sense with duelling sword and that's it

[misty ravine]

I would say without sarcasm. Dueling sword is much too fancy for Vet too, unless you were wearing some kind of premium cosmetic for a hoity-toity officer

[remote lark]

it fits zealots personality

lmfaoo

[twin wagon]

[fiery ingot]

I'm not joking either but also not complaining: I would like to understand why they gave vet and zealot ds to begin with

[delicate shadow]

I mean, there's no real reason to have it siloed to psyker specifically

[misty ravine]

Add "new" content without actually having to make new content (or drip-feed the stuff that's already made any faster than necessary)

[twin wagon]

https://tenor.com/view/tf2-soldier-team-fortress-2-soldier-tf2-beta-trailer-tf2-beta-soldier-gif-9350415498134172135

[fiery ingot]

Fair enough. At the very least i'm very happy with the relic blade

[delicate shadow]

like you can't open up force weapons to non-psyker but there's no reason zeal and vet shouldn't actually have access to DS, much like there's no reason zealot shouldn't have access to recon las

[misty ravine]

Zealot Power Sword when

[delicate shadow]

a 1h relic blade would be cool

[visual stream]

Make 1h relic blade the most complex combo list in the game ez

[delicate shadow]

every swing with randomly change loops and you have to adjust on the fly, surely this will be loved

[visual stream]

and charged vs. uncharged has entirely different movesets

[delicate shadow]

now we're cookin'

[fiery ingot]

I think the initial idea was to give some class identity with the weapon restrictions and maybe with the newer weapons release they decided to open up some choices, that would be my guess

[delicate shadow]

that's what the captain gets for not using the crusher combos

[visual stream]

Psyker mixing soulblaze and fire stacks when they finally get flamer

Veteran using flamer better than zealot because 8 billion flat damage bonus talents

[twin wagon]

Recon gunkers already mix both

[visual stream]

Yeah but like yucky style

[spare talon]

i posted this run to youtube, it was me running fgs and plasma with every perk and blessing, of every tier, on both weapons and all 3 curios then steamrolling havoc 40 solo

the first comment was "build?"

[twin wagon]

[spare talon]

the title literally plainly stated that the run was cheating

[delicate shadow]

yea like the weapons siloing was defo an identity thing, powersword/plasma vet, force weapons on psyker, eviscerators on zealot

things like shovel and dueling sword make less sense to have siloed though imo

[misty ravine]

Makes me wonder about Vet getting Flamer actually, my Guardsmen had a lot of those on tabletop back in the day

[fiery ingot]

Most likely. I like the changes tho. More options means more reasons to keep playing the game for me 🫃

[twin wagon]

And harder balance, I wonder how fs will nerf ds mk4

[fleet zealot]

Buff mk2 and mk5

[twin wagon]

Power creep.

[visual stream]

Fatshark undercover agent spotted

[fleet zealot]

Make them so powerful mk4 looks weak in comparison

[delicate shadow]

I mean the balance is actually pretty easy ngl, it's just a matter of Fatshark actually like...doing it

[spare talon]

DIE

[fleet zealot]

Big chaxe lobby has taken over darktide

[spare talon]

mk5 is already in a good spot and mk2 is nearly as bad as ds4 due to having better clear and a stab

[fiery ingot]

Whats about the mk4 that makes it particularly op?

[delicate shadow]

realistically DS4 has needed nerfs for ages and it should've been nerfed even when it was psyker exclusive

[fleet zealot]

Easy asf and consistent high dps and high burst heavy spam

[remote lark]

why hasn't it been?

[fleet zealot]

Some of the best dodges short of mk5 ds

[median steeple]

People asking for nerfs when every patch is just this

[delicate shadow]

I don't know 🙂

[spare dome]

what 300% crit headshot scaling does to a mfer

[spare talon]

exclusively stab heavies, which have enough finesse damage outright to basically one shot almost every elite, insane boss damage, in addition to the movement profile and stagger special of all DS

[fleet zealot]

Psyker players drag down winrates. See them randomly buffing smite by 50% even tho smite was already a great option

[spare talon]

literally why bother playing the game when you can just click once and the thing dies

[fleet zealot]

It was likely because the 2 builds at the time were smite vent ep or smite shield warp charges

[fiery ingot]

Heh its like the revolver all over again back in the days

[twin wagon]

Literally why kill anything when you can still run past it

[fleet zealot]

Except you’d have people go smite shield ep, which is worse

Low shield uptime, low damage, holding down smite on bosses

[fiery ingot]

Ngl i hate beating up afk enemies. But it does come as a crutch and life savior in havocs

[fleet zealot]

The only way i can rationalize why it got buffed is bad psyker players tricking fatshark’s statistic viewer

And same reason ds4 didn’t get nerfed, ds4 on psyker probably performed about the same as evi or shovel

[delicate shadow]

anyway looking forward to when we can get one of these

[fleet zealot]

In terms of winrate on psykers

[delicate shadow]

that would be a hilarious indictment of psyker players if so

[twin wagon]

No, it was clearly Hank, Hank got smite buffed

[fleet zealot]

It’s always has been lol psyker is the most spoiled class

they get the glass cannon community treatment but they are unkillable if you are playing with function brain cells

[delicate shadow]

I am kinda baffled how people think psyker gets crumpled in melee when you've got infinite dodges and perilous combustion does half the work for you

[fleet zealot]

Best cdr node in the game that’s shared with your team

[fleet zealot]

Holding smite i can’t block and i spammed all my dodges so i get bonked 😔

[delicate shadow]

like Zealot gets (rightly imo) called a busted crutch class but let's be real here, vet and psyker are up there in the same bracket

[remote lark]

infinite dodgs?

[fleet zealot]

Zealot is strong but besides IoD it isn’t busted

[spare talon]

well they no longer have infinite dodges anymore (nerfed into oblivion)

[remote lark]

HAHAHAHA

[misty ravine]

Ogryn confirmed for underpowered

[fleet zealot]

Not oblivion force swords still have great dodges

[spare talon]

sarcastic

[lusty turtle]

naaaaa

[fleet zealot]

Isn’t as busted* we are much closer to ogryn then we are psyker or vet

[delicate shadow]

well Ogryn I think is actually fine power level wise, his tree just has dogshit design

[fleet zealot]

We have the same dogshit tree issue as ogryn where it makes no sense and doesn’t follow their talent tree philosophy

[spare talon]

second wind
enduring faith
fotf and chorus in their entirety
scourge and SA being single talents
TWBS
until/HV
duellist

[fleet zealot]

Twbs busted okay cole 2024 called they want your opinion back

[twin wagon]

Ogryn should get something other than barely better base stats for his dodge recovery

Exchanging skill based damage mit for passive mit sucks

[remote lark]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[delicate shadow]

like Ogryns absolutely can and will plow through any given content so long as they're not stupid

[spare talon]

ogryns tree makes sense in terms of concept
it just kinda sucks in execution

[fleet zealot]

Zealot does not have branch identity, it is all over the place and there isn’t an all left/all right/all middle build that new players can pick up and do good enough with

[lusty turtle]

Middle tree shoulda been hybrid

[misty ravine]

Shouty Madman vs Shouty Madman vs Shouty Madman (Quiet)

[remote lark]

no class in the agme carries as consistenlty as zealot due to its until death and INSANE tdr/toughness gen

[spare talon]

zealots tree structure tho makes no sense whatsoever
why is scourge on the complete opposite side of all the crit talents
why is martyrdom, the keystone that requires you to be at low health, paired with the ability that prevents chip damage (with an abysmal cdr option)
why are gun talents just scattered
why is bleed for the emp not in middle with martyrdom

[delicate shadow]

like genuinely the whole thing about power levels between classes is kind of overblown, Ogryn arguably is the most flawed in terms of design because he's very feast or famine but when Ogryn is feasting they're just as busted as any other class

[fleet zealot]

Why are the ranged options not lined up for a hybrid branch?

[remote lark]

i'd argue zealot is better than veteran

[lusty turtle]

Fnp lugger that knows ammo pmanagement sweep

[median steeple]

lmao nah both are busted but vet is just better rn

[misty ravine]

Martyrdom talents mentioned
I will say once again that Bleed for the Emperor and Restoring Faith each being 4 points deep in different trees, neither of which lead to Second Wind, is diabolical

[fleet zealot]

Why is martyrdom have ranged buffs in it’s path when it’s the only keystone that doesn’t buff ranged in anyway

[delicate shadow]

zealot tree is flawed because the structure is all over the place but the main meta™️ build is ridiculously stable and strong in pretty much all situations

[twin wagon]

Why are all the options before cleanse aura tax nodes

Why is loner this bad

[median steeple]

the only thing that zealot has over vet is that they actually have 3 keystones lmao (and UD but yeah)

[spare talon]

these are all issues that zealot has in their skill tree design, but zealots actual capabilities because of the talents they have is still stupidly good

[fleet zealot]

U lose your laughing privileges

[remote lark]

[fleet zealot]

Veteran has a build that is just better hybrid zealot

[remote lark]

[lusty turtle]

Zealot os the strongest class in the game bar none

[fleet zealot]

Better nade, better ammo economy, more consistent damage

[misty ravine]

Also idk what it is but despite having nearly as many levels in Psyker and Vet as Zealot, I can almost never hard-carry and clutch out a game as well as on Zealot

[twin wagon]

I disagree, psword is a budget relic blade, so even if allegedly veteran melee can get as good as zealot, weapon wise you still won't compete

[remote lark]

I know.
Psyker has better killing potential, but zealot is just better.

[delicate shadow]

the main thing zealot has up on Vet and Psyker is zealot is way better in a solo scenario

which is actually huge

[spare talon]

i was losing my mind when talking to cica because that exact point is what im getting at
regardless what is happening whatsoever
zealot will be doing perfectly fine (more than excelling, even) with no issues, which cannot be said for any other class regardless how broken things like situational awareness, confirmed kill, iron will, etc are

[fleet zealot]

No zealot only does it’s thing well, it can’t hybrid out like vet, go insane with no limits on psyker, idk ogryn needs the weak stuff buffed

[remote lark]

peet you play in malice

[lusty turtle]

Zealot being melee oriented makes missplays punishing, but it has the ability to recover from anything, even dying, for free

[delicate shadow]

actually it's not free the game costs $49.99

[median steeple]

https://tenor.com/view/free-lazy-town-robbie-rotten-ice-cream-gif-14366251

[misty ravine]

I guess part of the problem is that when I play Vet I end up going one of two ways:

• Fuck Off And Let Me Shoot Already
• Dollar Store Zealot

[remote lark]

saying hybrid vet is "a better zealot" is the most insane take i think you've ever made

[spare talon]

zealot is literally the least punished for misplays tho

[twin wagon]

So many people crutching on zealot will surely have no impact like SoT had in vt2

[delicate shadow]

rip the goat 😔

[median steeple]

Yeah cause vet really only has 2 keystones since the left one (I forgot the name) is just not worth the points

[lusty turtle]

It doesnt need to hybrid out

Zealouts toughness econ and dmg uptime is insane, and literally none of it requires any skill or special conditions to proc

[misty ravine]

_"You run Martyrdom because you judged the risk to be worth the reward.

I run Martyrdom because I can make it look like taking damage from stupid things was part of my plan.

We are not the same."_

[fleet zealot]

I’d take a bit of zealot nerfs for our bad nodes to be buffed and moved around so traveling is more creative and choice rather than a must

[remote lark]

i can drop 1.3k kills a games on psyker on average
but on zealot my winrate is MUCH higher despite only dropping 900-1k because of just how fucking safe of a class it is, it's ridiculous

[lusty turtle]

Duelist being on dodge is just free 100% uptime critical weakspot dmg on a class with viable 80% crit chance

[delicate shadow]

people dying while using martyrdom will never cease to confuse me, the keystone makes you borderline immortal

[remote lark]

me when zealot can just get 70% tdr for existing

[fleet zealot]

Imo in a tide game, it does, these are combined careers and every vt2 character had a ranged focused career

[misty ravine]

Barrel Cringe or Pox Burster Cringe IME

[median steeple]

Honestly it's complacency for the most part

[twin wagon]

https://tenor.com/view/open-tf2-demo-demoman-j-jyghc-uber-bomb-gif-3321172551575282134

[lusty turtle]

Same with left side piety giving up 25% dr and toughness gen on all kills

[spare talon]

@lusty turtle @delicate shadow the #1 thing that would get me to be willing to play martyrdom is martyrs purpose being +1% cdr per 1% hp missing (so 99% at the absolute max, but typically around 75-90%ish)
this would require the locking of the cdr talents, and ideally additional node choices around there

[delicate shadow]

yea in those cases it's fine, like shit happens and eating barrels is part of a balanced diet (and if you're playing in a premade if you're not getting barreled at least once a session idk get a more fun premade)

[fleet zealot]

especially with a game that has more emphasis on range, make IJ side the ranged and assassin type side, make blazing piety side the crit focus, idk about middle there needs to be a lot of work

[remote lark]

left piety and enduring faith which piety just gives you full uptime on on almost any weapon, is something like 63% tdr with huge uptime

[lusty turtle]

I literally never play marty i dont think its fun

[fleet zealot]

But yea; i will die on the hill that all the non psyker classes deserve 1 build that is either hybrid or gun focused at least

[delicate shadow]

ehhh I like the concept but I'm really not ok with CDR talents providing any more than ~33%ish effective cdr

[remote lark]

class identity

[spare talon]

me neither
if im running a finesse weapon, piety is right there since crits are so strong
if im not, then ij is right there for dodge distance and atk speed without wound investment

[fleet zealot]

My thing, give a 3rd lock out option for shroudfield that makes ranged weapons not break stealth

[spare talon]

martyrdom despite big numbers is the worst of both worlds imo

[delicate shadow]

ideally on zealot the hybrid oriented nodes get some buffs and/or more generally superfluous nodes get replaced. Dance of Death I think is an amazing hybrid node, for example

[fleet zealot]

Yes that is class identity since vt2. Ranger Vet, waystalker, huntsman and bounty hunter were all different classes

[spare talon]

it can always be in reference to the state of the other nodes
like +1% for 2% missing hp, so roughly 40ish% (30s abilities having 8-10 seconds shaved off at peak performance)

[fleet zealot]

We have the nodes in the wrong places for a proper hybrid zealot that would be a fun alternative

[remote lark]

this is not vt2

alot of zealots tree needs to be reworked so its not dog though... like the stuff above stun ande and beacon? AWFUL.

[fleet zealot]

Yea it’s dt, even more ranged focus. Not like zealots aren’t known for bolters and flamers

[spare talon]

cdr is extremely unbalanced right now, but thats how it is across the board for all classes and their options for it and idk how far that can be toned back either individually or across the board without a review bomb

[remote lark]

rework piety to give less crit but more cdmg so you can't rlly get 100% uptime on invoc, shorten invoc cd

[delicate shadow]

yeah I mean, this game will never get out of the powercreep funk if abilities stay as spammable as they are

especially if piss toughness is gonna keep working how it does

[remote lark]

but with blessings like shred even taht wouldn't do alot

[fleet zealot]

Oh yea what else are zealots known for, autopistols, plasma pistols, infernal pistols

[delicate shadow]

god I want a zealot melta

[spare talon]

crit blessings, inherent crits, and even forced scourge still exist

piety should have had the cdr as part of the keystone tbh

[twin wagon]

Outside of Ogryn, veteran cr is where I'd like to see everyone tbh

[fleet zealot]

Not vt2, zealot doesn’t need a hybrid/ranged build /j

[twin wagon]

We had a hybrid zealot for quite a bit

[fleet zealot]

We really don’t, we got 2/3 of our keystones affecting range but not martyrdom even tho the middle has ranged talents, dance of death and anoint.

Duelist is both melee and ranged

[spare talon]

but either way, +1% cdr for 1-2% hp missing is something that i personally want so i have new builds to try, but also because it shouldnt have ever been the way it works right now, ever

[fleet zealot]

The other ones basically aren’t taken

[delicate shadow]

mehhh I find I can run a "hybrid" zealot just fine if I'm using an agri brauto, zealot gameplay in general means I'm gonna be mostly in melee regardless tho

[spare talon]

also it would finally give us justification to lock the cdr talents so people stop taking BOTH THE FUCKING CRIT CDR AND BACKSTAB CDR WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE

[fleet zealot]

We must run crit with every weapon

[spare talon]

that whole idea is something im really wanting to push if they ever let us take a swing at zealots tree

[fleet zealot]

Crit chain axe, crit chain axe, crit chain axe

[spare talon]

MP being usable, cdr talent lock, more than 1 normal talent pathing at cdr branch to keystone

[delicate shadow]

it'd be nice to do something that isn't just nerfing for a change, granted the nerfs are needed

[stable cypress]

nah lets just nerf chastise again and call it a day for all of 2025

[fleet zealot]

Tbf chastise needed that nerf

Tho i would prefer if they broke up fotf into some extension nodes

[spare talon]

they ruined the game
i cant kill crusher packs with throwing knives alone anymore
literally unplayable

[delicate shadow]

yeah, that's what I mean tho, all of zeal's nerfs were very much needed but it'd be cool to do some actually proper rebalancing and reworking

[fleet zealot]

For all my talk of ranged/hybrid i do not think 100% rending is healthy

[spare talon]

lets take a page out of vermintide 2, double of the same weapon slot

give gunluggers 2 guns and no melee

[fiery ingot]

[stable cypress]

give them no weapons and 12 rocks

[midnight ermine]

Man ragers got a lot of health for how many of them spawn at once

[fiery ingot]

Power fists reskinned into friendly rocks

[spare talon]

every rock kill makes the rock explode, sending equally damaging shrapnel pebbles in all directions sharp enough to cut through enemies with 10 cleave per pebble

[twin wagon]

Rocksplode

[stable cypress]

And shrapnel instantly detonates barrels, flamers and poxbursters

[remote lark]

@delicate shadow invoc should increase buff duration instead of provide cdr

so it'll still be useful on keeping piety/enduring/ij/until death uptime, but it wont be broken any more

[delicate shadow]

eh I'd really just opt for nerfing the value down, the way it works currently is fine the numbers are just too inflated

[long oasis]

Let me pick up and throw ratlings like a football

so they can get into stabbing range against the enemy

[twin wagon]

Inbound community tantrum

[spare talon]

150-125% would be acceptable and (hopefully) wouldnt cause a meltdown

[delicate shadow]

it is kinda nuts how a large segment of the community will try to hold balancing hostage but won't employ that same energy to literally anything constructive

I guess one could say this about gamers generally

[twin wagon]

Helldivers really harmed the balance discussion further

[misty ravine]

The discussion is so damaged that Armory has been reduced to arguing with random idiots whether or not the hardest difficulty in the game should actually be difficult.

[violet relic]

but that was justified for helldivers. the balancing was pretty terrible

[twin wagon]

Yeah and thanks to that the hardest difficulty in helldivers can be done with 1 hand, while with the other you farm in WoW

[violet relic]

oh youre one of those people

[twin wagon]

I believe the hardest difficulty in a coop game, should not only require cooperation in decent degrees, but also it should exclude some players from it, for the sake of been well difficult and engaging, a challenge that makes you and your team think and resolve problems in a fast pace

If I wanted to just enjoy a game to turn my brain off with friends, I'd have the many other difficulties

[misty ravine]

"What do you mean it's unhealthy for the game if the Recoilless Rifle can one-shot literally every enemy and you can destroy a Stratagem Jammer from 50m away with a secondary? Do you hate fun?"

[delicate shadow]

Helldivers balancing was done poorly but the problem is the "lesson" people took from that is they can hold any sort of nerfing hostage, regardless of if those nerfs would improve the game

and going in the direction of "only buff" isn't actually reasonable for a game that's trying to have some sort of challenge factor to it

hell even in roguelikes where imbalanced overpowered stuff is an intended part of the design, you still need to have weaker shit and a degree of challenge generated by the randomness of pickups/upgrades

[misty ravine]

My personal favorite is when someone who's told to turn down the difficulty if they find things too hard states that they outright refuse to do so because the lower difficulties are an absolute snooze fest, and they never manage to connect the dots

[remote lark]

"I only do auric maelstrom"

plays game with them
2k damage taken

[wind dagger]

the fact is that no matter what people say they just don't want hard games. i think sm2 is another good example. it took me like a day of playing the game to find the rhythm again and now unless i do something fantastically stupid absolute difficulty feels like a breeze

[remote lark]

https://tenor.com/view/king-king-baldwin-king-baldwin-4-rikoamv-riko-amv-gif-8479237540916603760

[twin wagon]

"Nerf auric to be fair"

[wind dagger]

arrowhead capitulating to the whining mob was a huge L for the culture tbh

[twin wagon]

"Give us a button mash to escape disablers"
"Stop nerfing us"

[wind dagger]

sm2 is pretty funny though, there are so many ways to just get literally all of your health back now when before you either played around bulwark's banner or losing hp was a permanent mistake until you found medicae

now most classes either have crazy self-healing, can res another person to full hp or they generate contested health so fast they never actually lose anything

[remote lark]

does lethal prox increase stun nade aoe

[twin wagon]

Playerbase reflects the changes too, no one is staying long term, which is an ongoing issue with hd2, massive wave like shifts in the playerbase that requires updates to keep interest, OFTEN

[wind dagger]

more importantly does it proc the bleed from puncture

[remote lark]

no

[twin wagon]

[remote lark]

they also patched its crusher interaction

[twin wagon]

Destroying balance and eliminating challenge in the end is NEVER justified

[remote lark]

[wind dagger]

don't take lip from someone that made their steam account in 2020

[twin wagon]

we gatekeep creation dates now?

[lusty wren]

Thats crazy

[violet relic]

sorry i would like my coop horde shooter to be a horde shooter and not a kite around and never fight anything. yeah theres problems with the current balance but compared to waht it was before the major balance changes its ten folds better

[obsidian prairie]

Medals cap has pretty permanently destroyed my interest

I’d like to experience the new content without devoting myself to the game or paying extra on top of 70$

[violet relic]

bro you cannot be serious. you that terminally online?

[lusty wren]

whut

[wind dagger]

you could literally sit in one spot and kill an entire bug breach even before they started their buffwaves. the game was never hard except for the early days of release where you'd get like ten BTs with glitched heads spilling out of a single breach (which was absurd)

[violet relic]

before the 60 day plan the main and most effective way to deal with dif 9 and 10 was to kite (run around) every battle while barely engaging with the enemies.

[twin wagon]

If your other 4 teamates shot, you never had to kite.

Often just needed 2 with some strats, just needed to buff some of the worse performing ones and the karking team reload to encourage more teamplay...not everything and nerfing enemies to be pushovers

[lusty wren]

Oh Helldivers I thought you were talking about Darktide

[obsidian prairie]

Team reloads are so much worse than hd1

[wind dagger]

the only thing about d10 that was even a little annoying before the 60d plan was impalers. if you didn't scatter like roaches and played with your group you didn't even need to move while spawn-killing everything in a breach

[violet relic]

yeah youre right when it comes to the lower difs my man. its evident you didnt spend mu7ch time on the higher difs. theres no point in thsi argument when the player numbers dont lie. remind me what was the peak concurrent players before the buffs? (hint it was about 10k-20k) the player number rn at 12 am is 37k on steam and about 10k ish on ps. at the end of the day numbers dont lie

[obsidian prairie]

They are actually better for some weapons because of how they work in sustained fire (Autocannon for example) but the unbound player distance and really janky player coupling makes it super hard to use

[wind dagger]

i solo'd d10 while you were begging for arrowhead to make your flamer better

[twin wagon]

Now I can solo entire breaches or reinforcement calls by my own while my other 3 teammates are having a loot party.

This should never be the state of a cooperative experience, no cooperation required, no challenge, barely any thinking.

[lusty wren]

this is like saying doing Solo in Darktide makes you good

[violet relic]

so did i my man. still doesnt change jack shit

[twin wagon]

"Solo" or solo, where you actually kill things?

[misty ravine]

Peak concurrent fell back to EoF levels until the Illuminate and Killzone crossover were added, that was the biggest boost to player count, and with a longer duration, because it had an actual major content drop

[violet relic]

sucks you dont like the game anymore but at the end of the day the player numbers literally do not lie

[twin wagon]

And here we go.

Steam and their own numbers confirm the game CYCLES a lot of players but doesn't retain them long term, the moment AH can't sustain this update cycle, it'll collapse.

It's a casual game completely antithetic to hd1 that can be swepped if a competitor appears with more shiny, a game that is fun to play once in a while and that's it, which is the last thing I expected after hd1

[fleet zealot]

It’s a fun casual game

It’s extremely accessible compared to DT

But it’s also 0 fun for me to play solo or with pubs, meanwhile i can solo queue DT any difficulty any mode

[obsidian prairie]

You just get eaten by bullshit solo

[lusty wren]

I hop back on ocassionally but the grind for Medals kinda kills it for me tbh compared to what you do in Darktide for Penances (not including the kill 2500 while having 1000 stacks of [blank])