cuz I started witcher3 and then FFW released
#veteran-class
tall torrent
sly orchid
aha
tall torrent
I don't got that much time or energy to play all these games
tame lodge
60 hours of SM2 is already ok
sly orchid
my goat getting old :(
tame lodge
I say as I have 60 hours of sm2
tall torrent
my goat getting old :(
someone's gotta update the guide for DT
past junco
someone's gotta update the guide for DT
good luck making a new guide for these new changes
faint beacon
I’ve been doing nothing but playing COD Zombies and Deadlock
I’m basically burnt out on Darktide
tall torrent
good luck making a new guide for these new changes
why would I need to make a new one
narrow frost
new guide? he's just updating it
faint beacon
Till this update drops
narrow frost
they literally list the numbers, so it wont take that long
past junco
why would I need to make a new one
sorry update the one you made
faint beacon
they literally list the numbers, so it wont take that long
Ainz I ever send you that Deadlock Metro clip that I reference at random
narrow frost
no
narrow widget
cuz I started witcher3 and then FFW released
how is the witcher 3
I tried to play witcher 1 and then got bored lmao
tall torrent
how is the witcher 3
combat is meh
story is better than most other story RPGs (but is this really a high bar to pass?)
progression system is fun
world is cool
dreamy spade
Fatshark nerfing ogryn AGAIN
faint beacon
It’s not even a NERF
they changed it to full rending to melee rending
What it should’ve been
dreamy spade
... Hence a nerf
faint beacon
Me when a feature is removed that wasn’t intended
dreamy spade
Was it a nerf or not?
faint beacon
Chat can we get 50 Ogryn buffs please
turbid ibex
its still effectively a nerf
faint beacon
No because it literally doesn’t effect the Opportunist shield playstyle at all lmao
dreamy spade
...
sly orchid
OGRYN DOESNT EVEN FUCKING GET UNCANNY STRIKE
tall torrent
Chat can we get 50 Ogryn buffs please
u shud try far far west
turbid ibex
No because it literally doesn’t effect the Opportunist shield playstyle at all l...
doesnt benefit bleed anymore
dreamy spade
No because it literally doesn’t effect the Opportunist shield playstyle at all l...
You've obviously never played ogyrn
faint beacon
Doesnt really matter?
turbid ibex
u shud try far far west
faint beacon
If you have to abuse Rending Bleed to kill carapace when in the same fucking patch notes they’re being adjusted
Idk what to say other than skill issue
sly orchid
If you have to abuse Rending Bleed to kill carapace when in the same fucking pat...
karsolas special light heavy
faint beacon
Literally
turbid ibex
If you have to abuse Rending Bleed to kill carapace when in the same fucking pat...
rending on bleed does more than just carapace
faint beacon
It’s not that deep
dreamy spade
If you have to abuse Rending Bleed to kill carapace when in the same fucking pat...
You didn't even know that existed for ogryn so stfu lol
tall torrent
OGRYN LITERALLY HAS INNATE CARAPACE DAMAGE
which is also not gud outside pickaxes btw
sly orchid
dont care
dreamy spade
No because it literally doesn’t effect the Opportunist shield playstyle at all l...
.
hollow ibex
so i guess FS just confirmed they assumed every psyker abuses the uncanny + SB interaction
what a fucking joke
arctic ridge
For the bottom-right side of the tree,
how well in top-high Havoc does Power Sword compare / compete with the Duelling Sword regarding proc'ing & executing the talents?
past junco
so i guess FS just confirmed they assumed every psyker abuses the uncanny + SB i...
A compensation
tall torrent
so i guess FS just confirmed they assumed every psyker abuses the uncanny + SB i...
it's honestly very fair
I too would assume psykers to abuse mechanics more than they actually do
sly orchid
quickpaw is now WELL aware what people think of inferno staff lmao
faint beacon
.
If you’re playing it to abuse that I think you’re mentally cooked instead of playing it for the actual Rending on Stagger
faint beacon
quickpaw is now WELL aware what people think of inferno staff lmao
That it’s batshit broken?
past junco
did pysker have rending on their staffs or something?
turbid ibex
did pysker have rending on their staffs or something?
uncanny strikes melee
faint beacon
did pysker have rending on their staffs or something?
Build up rending with melee
tall torrent
If you’re playing it to abuse that I think you’re mentally cooked instead of pla...
tbh I don't think opportunist being global rending was bad
faint beacon
Puff inferno
tall torrent
because u did have to have stagger (as well as actually meaningful stagger duration) to enable it
faint beacon
Nuke entire hordes
tall torrent
and in fatshark tradition most melee weapons are ass at stagger
sly orchid
https://klipy.com/gifs/hanabi-hsr
hollow ibex
it's honestly very fair
I too would assume psykers to abuse mechanics more than ...
fine to assume, but why compensate for it lol
past junco
Build up rending with melee
no shit aye? so you build it up then you use it on the staff
sly orchid
That it’s batshit broken?
yeah
hollow ibex
smh
faint beacon
Shield is pretty consistent at staggering
It’s only bosses it struggles with which I mean that’s a fucking given
They’re monstros
tall torrent
fine to assume, but why compensate for it lol
would it really be a fatshark balancing pass if it didn't involve buffing psyker in some inexplicable way
pseudo fiber
quickpaw is now WELL aware what people think of inferno staff lmao
he's replied here, the forums and reddit now they 100% get it
faint beacon
Chat can we please get 500 Ogryn nerfs
tame lodge
tall torrent
quickpaw is now WELL aware what people think of inferno staff lmao
it shouldn't just be inferno, it shud be psyker in general
witchhunting is actually so based in 40k I totally get why they do it
sly orchid
it shouldn't just be inferno, it shud be psyker in general
i had a psyker teammate that used a melee soulblaze build and dude was fucking shit up
i should replicate it myself
faint beacon
All seriousness it’s not that doom and gloom cause Ogryn is still ludicrously tanky and still hits hard as hell
sly orchid
All seriousness it’s not that doom and gloom cause Ogryn is still ludicrously ta...
ogryn literally cant die
faint beacon
One nerf isn’t going to kill the class that’s what I don’t understand
And will literally never understand
sly orchid
people underestimate 50% DR on dodge a massive amount
tall torrent
One nerf isn’t going to kill the class that’s what I don’t understand
nah I can make that happen
faint beacon
Hell I’m shocked Veterans aren’t pissing themselves over the Krak nerf
tall torrent
nerf psyker toughness from 125 to 50 (so that they start with 5 toughness in havoc)
faint beacon
Hell I’m shocked Veterans aren’t pissing themselves over the Krak nerf
Probably because it’s genuinely needed
past junco
Hell I’m shocked Veterans aren’t pissing themselves over the Krak nerf
I mean I sort am?
pseudo fiber
plus demo team
faint beacon
Yeah not even mentioning that
Like it’s not even that huge of a nerf but still needed cause of the overall scaling back of carapace
tame lodge
One nerf isn’t going to kill the class that’s what I don’t understand
True
It doesn't kill what's already dead
[hyperbole]
tall torrent
because gotta buff psyker in the update
tame lodge
The voices told me zealot gets an Iconic next patch
past junco
I think vet tree needs other changes
man so many things need changes and not just veteran
tall torrent
man so many things need changes and not just veteran
yea
I think most of this balancing pass are gud tho
faint beacon
True
It doesn't kill what's already dead
Ogryn players when they have to dodge and gain %50 DR tomorrow
tall torrent
Ogryn players when they have to dodge and gain %50 DR tomorrow
I think it's actually 40% (x60%)
but yes that dodge DR is seriously op
faint beacon
It’s still pretty crazy how much it gives
tame lodge
Ogryn players when they have to dodge and gain %50 DR tomorrow
Notice how you're not talking about the guns
#noticing
Oh yeah
sly orchid
It’s still pretty crazy how much it gives
your so fucking tanky its unreal
on ogryn with the dodge DR consistently i was last man standing
faint beacon
on ogryn with the dodge DR consistently i was last man standing
Class is weak though so point rejected
You’re an idiot and should die
sly orchid
mo&krill yourself
faint beacon
The slight tweaks to the Twinks were alright but they’re just shy of being actually solid
tame lodge
Also the voices told me zealot gets an Iconic soon
past junco
I think most of this balancing pass are gud tho
To be honest man I don't believe so; it seems like a minor fix to a bigger problem.
tame lodge
Because of the dodge DR on ogryn
sly orchid
dodge DR on ogryn also nukes all of your talent DR LOL
tall torrent
To be honest man I don't believe so; it seems like a minor fix to a bigger probl...
a lot of small/medium changes at the same time generally will add up to be bigger than they appear
fair shale
Was there a funky balance patch or something
faint beacon
To be honest man I don't believe so; it seems like a minor fix to a bigger probl...
Carapace has been a huge issue for ages honestly
sly orchid
Was there a funky balance patch or something
balance patch next week
nuked uncanny strike
tall torrent
Was there a funky balance patch or something
oui
PSYKER BUFFED
sly orchid
30% less crushers
past junco
Carapace has been a huge issue for ages honestly
dont get me started with carapace, so many havok 30 runs lost because of that issue XD
fair shale
oui
PSYKER BUFFED
You deadass rn?
sly orchid
rotten armor override is now infested
tall torrent
You deadass rn?
yea why would I lie
sly orchid
and theyre looking at shield enemies later
fair shale
yea why would I lie
For fun, I do it sometimes
past junco
a lot of small/medium changes at the same time generally will add up to be bigge...
fair enough, I guess I'll just have to wait and play to see where this goes
faint beacon
and theyre looking at shield enemies later
Been fucking BEGGING THEM
fair shale
Why uh, why are they buffing psyker
tame lodge
Was there a funky balance patch or something
tame lodge
We got a preview
tall torrent
Why uh, why are they buffing psyker
because fatshark balancing pass must always include psyker buff otherwise code wouldn't run (this is the me lying part)
faint beacon
Putting carapace on their exposed limbs is a fucking crime bro
fair shale
Make Bulwarks similar to Rotshields
Rotshields don't get spammed like bulwarks
sly orchid
replace them with stormvermin maulers that have a shield with a health bar and can be staggered in melee out of their shield instead of resseting to neutral when you hit the shield
fair shale
because fatshark balancing pass must always include psyker buff otherwise code w...
I believe that tbh
faint beacon
Cause now you have to play a JRPG to fight them
fair shale
What are they buffing on psyker
tall torrent
What are they buffing on psyker
inferno
tall torrent
fair shale
You mean the single most spammed psyker weapon that trivializes everything if you know what you're doing?
tame lodge
Obscurus too
fair shale
They're buffing that?
sly orchid
yes
fair shale
@fatshark what the fuck guys
void dragon
They're buffing that?
They did nerfed uncanny strike (thank the Emperor) but yeah
fair shale
Is all Uncanny just Shivs uncanny now?
tall torrent
You mean the single most spammed psyker weapon that trivializes everything if yo...
yea exactly
fair shale
Sometimes this company makes me feel insane
faint beacon
Is all Uncanny just Shivs uncanny now?
Yesn’t
sly orchid
@fatshark what the fuck guys
quickpaw responded on the discord the reddit and forums about the inferno staff buff
faint beacon
They’re changing uncanny to brittleness
pseudo fiber
Is all Uncanny just Shivs uncanny now?
uncanny is brittleness
sly orchid
believe me he is WELL informed
tame lodge
Oh they also nerfed rotten armor
So now it's Inferno meta for rotten armor
(Nothing changed)
faint beacon
No longer rending
fair shale
uncanny is brittleness
Ew
tall torrent
believe me he is WELL informed
no
he's not informed well enough
because psyker as a whole needs nerfs
fair shale
Oh they also nerfed rotten armor
So now it's Inferno meta for rotten armor
(No...
Yeah lmfao, always was ime
tall torrent
not just inferno
faint beacon
And only works like Veteran onslaught with how they worded it @fair shale
fair shale
So uncanny dead?
faint beacon
Aka commit to one enemy to actually apply debuff
fair shale
That's like beyond nerfed ngl
tall torrent
And only works like Veteran onslaught with how they worded it <@1449127385466142...
no because unlike onslaught
post-nerf uncanny is still good (and too good)
fair shale
Gotcha
fair shale
They do anything to scum?
faint beacon
Unlike Shartslaught
tall torrent
They do anything to scum?
less rockets
fair shale
Reasonable
desert viper
not sure if this was answered already but here goes
do the shovel changes, on paper, sound good?
will it suffer with canny being changed?
fair shale
440 to 350
Also reasonable
desert viper
ill take mid over worse man
tall torrent
do the shovel changes, on paper, sound good?
void dragon
no u max 40% brit in 2 weakspot hits
Is DS gaming now fair and balanced and honest and humble?
faint beacon
do the shovel changes, on paper, sound good?
Sounds overall better basically
tall torrent
Is DS gaming now fair and balanced and honest and humble?
no, of course
faint beacon
Just lots of ADM changes which might make the shovel a bit better
But we shall wait and see
sly orchid
dueling sword already had good carapace ADM
desert viper
Is DS gaming now fair and balanced and honest and humble?
they kept their dodges and mobility
nothing humble bout it
void dragon
no, of course
desert viper
Sounds overall better basically
yay
desert viper
cant tell if you hate shovel statistics
but i get it tbh
i dont wanna do statistics for things i dont like using
tall torrent
cant tell if you hate shovel statistics
it's the most overhyped melee in the game
even more so than falchion
desert viper
I would sincerely say that goes to chainsword
but shovel is close to it indeed
many people like to be a soldier with a shovel
even if
it struggles doing much of anything
fair shale
it's the most overhyped melee in the game
Byproduct of krieg association
desert viper
i blame battlefield actually
tall torrent
u have to gaslight urself to think shovel is good basically
turbid ibex
bottlefield
faint beacon
I mean it’s a fucking sapper shovel it’s notorious for being utilized as both a weapon and tool
tough nova
Its just a bad weapon propped up by two of the best blessings in the game
Hence the page worth of value adjustments
tall torrent
I mean it’s a fucking sapper shovel it’s notorious for being utilized as both a ...
yea but the real life sapper shovels are like 2handed and actually with sharp edge that's usable as a blade
DT shovel is 1handed and basically blunt
faint beacon
When I think of Sapper Shovel I don’t think Krieg memes I think actual WW1 trench warfare
desert viper
same
faint beacon
DT shovel is 1handed and basically blunt
See this is DT so they’ll naturally make it incorrect
desert viper
DT shovel is 1handed and basically blunt
hopefully these changes mean something to it?
tall torrent
hopefully these changes mean something to it?
no it's staying mid at best
sly orchid
See this is DT so they’ll naturally make it incorrect
shovel being an axe in the files
faint beacon
Never ceases to upset me
Like if Vet is just going to be the “Axe” class just give us a Breacher Axe or 2H shovel and I’ll be satisfied
tall torrent
Like if Vet is just going to be the “Axe” class just give us a Breacher Axe or 2...
too bad hive scum mogs vet at using combat axe
round mango
Shovel is the weapon that my low IQ brain understands on vet
faint beacon
too bad hive scum mogs vet at using combat axe
Unfortunate truth
round mango
Well DS too but I feel like a wimp using it
desert viper
doesnt hivescum also mog with tac axe
faint beacon
Tbh they Mog a lot of classes in melee
desert viper
or is psyker still up
tall torrent
doesnt hivescum also mog with tac axe
yea
faint beacon
doesnt hivescum also mog with tac axe
Yeah I mean they’re like
tall torrent
or is psyker still up
psyker is rly just force sword and FGS
tall torrent
because those 2 were tuned specifically for psyker before other classes got more dmg bonuses
FGS is perhaps the worst designed melee in the game
desert viper
oh? i havent heard this yet
tall torrent
which is fair given it's designed for psykers
desert viper
how come?
tall torrent
oh? i havent heard this yet
it's subpar at being a sword
sly orchid
toxin has the highest damage of any DOT
desert viper
it's subpar at being a sword
oh yeah
its ability carries it for me
i just generally love greatswords, relic blade is my child, but fgs hardly feels the same. in a very bad way
tall torrent
none of psyker exclusive melee weapons were designed with any semblance of real melee complexity
tall torrent
which is fair to assume for psykers
turbid ibex
Ethical Psyker
more ethical*
faint beacon
Ethical and Psyker are basically opposites
turbid ibex
which is not a high bar
tame lodge
Erm
In terms of morality
A criminal like gangster isn't ethical
faint beacon
True
tame lodge
faint beacon
Rather a criminal than a witch…
tame lodge
Welp let's see how the show goes
tame lodge
It's the Arbites Shock mine incident again
tawny badger
veteran stock crash of 5/2026
tall torrent
it's fine
tawny badger
fug
I mean I guess this isn't too big of a change for veteran since Rending Strikes but man
shovel buffs tho 🤤
who eggplant reacted me..............
void dragon
nothing humble bout it
They should become humble once ObeseFish gets the balls to cut it's legs as it deserves (aka never)
round mango
🍆 is my favorite fruit
tall torrent
shovel buffs tho 🤤
yea no
elfin glacier
that 90s krak grenade nerf
tall torrent
that 90s krak grenade nerf
it's fine
distant plaza
demo team untouched so...
elfin glacier
true that carapase armor doesnt spawn that often so it doesnt feel like a big deal
tame lodge
It's fine unless you're stuck in the 500 kraks penance
elfin glacier
Sapper Shovels is meta now right?
tame lodge
elfin glacier
Sapper Shovels > power sword? RIGHT?!
distant plaza
always has been
tall torrent
Sapper Shovels > power sword? RIGHT?!
in a different lifetime maybe
not this one tho
dreamy spade
What's the opinion on laspistol vs ilg on vet?
round mango
Sapper Shovels > power sword? RIGHT?!
Always has been 😏
tall torrent
What's the opinion on laspistol vs ilg on vet?
laspistol better usually
dreamy spade
I see it has a higher finesse but both are good
dreamy spade
If you can hit the headshots with deadly accurate it pops off
tame lodge
It's the plague of like
3 weapons
That I cared to learn about
Low flak
In the flak enemies game
thorn lark
Embrace low flak
void dragon
@tall torrent is any of the infantry lasguns or the vigilant auto guns worth using on Zealot?
tall torrent
<@366562874039992331> is any of the infantry lasguns or the vigilant auto guns w...
not enough dmg
void dragon
Damnit, wanted to make a zealot using an assault rifle that wasn't the Vraks
tame lodge
Due to the ghost blessing they have a niche build
But
You are not suppression immune on zealot
Good luck keeping it steady
faint beacon
Vigils and ILGs suffer from Suppression
Vet gets away with it cause of built in immunity as a perk
To think I actually adjusted to how it would wobble all over the place like a fucking Invincible Edit on Vigils before Determined was made to be an innate perk on Vet
tame lodge
This is the equivalent to developing sea legs
faint beacon
https://tenor.com/view/%D0%BD%D0%B5%D1%83%D1%8F%D0%B7%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%BC%D1%8B%D0...
Thank you, you get it
I literally managed to get adjusted to how fucking wobbly it would be under suppression and I would still beam enemies
stone zealot
sly orchid
Epic battle fantasy
Peak mentioned
serene bough
Its good to see uncanny strikes getting nerfed
Am I misreading something or was soulblaze buffed
tall torrent
Yes
serene bough
Why 
quiet lark
because in their mind it's weak now that you can't benefit from uncanny amping the dot
tall torrent
Why <:Sitgryn:1016269420638765107>
Because FS can’t make a balance patch without at least a psyker buff, otherwise their code wouldn’t run
It would just runtime error
tame lodge
Remember when havoc came out then the year rolled over and ended up breaking it?
It was because they didn't buff psyker back then
serene bough
Maybe their code and servers are attached to a literal psyker at FS HQ
thorn lark
What happened? I was busy cooking
tall torrent
What happened? I was busy cooking
PSYKER BUFFED
dreamy spade
In the guide it says ghost can proc dodge talents but I'm not seeing this?
fast shale
Oi from the new update that is coming, vet will no longer be able to amp the bleed from frags with unccany, right?
tame lodge
Yeah
tame lodge
Fold shovel is looking at me funny now
Because in theory I could stack 2 uncanny really fast with it
thorn lark
So bleed is the great loser from what I am reading, no ?
tall torrent
In the guide it says ghost can proc dodge talents but I'm not seeing this?
against which enemies
gunners?
dreamy spade
Nah I thought it would proc on weakspot hit, turns out you need to be shot at afterwards aswell
quiet lark
Nah I thought it would proc on weakspot hit, turns out you need to be shot at af...
ya cos u need the dodge to go off to trigger the dodge talent
tall torrent
Nah I thought it would proc on weakspot hit, turns out you need to be shot at af...
well u do need to dodge smth for activating those talents
just being in a dodge state is not enough
copper vector
Damm how big is the Uncanny nerf
I was running shredders with it recently
Is the shovel better now overall despite the loss of the interaction?
stuck prairie
burp
tame lodge
Damm how big is the Uncanny nerf
I was running shredders with it recently
Is the...
The projection is that it'll be mid still
pseudo fiber
@tall torrent
tame lodge
This is trigger
Specially made for me
They played you
To get to me
I will not fall for it
pseudo fiber
I will not fall for it
silver patrol
will anyone think of the poor combat axe
hollow ibex
Only if they also buff poor psyker too 🥺
pseudo fiber
Only if they also buff poor psyker too 🥺
Scriers could use a buff
tame lodge
Fatshark seeing all the metric to combat Axe
And seeing their player base talking shit about it
thorn lark
I wish they reworked the achlys
crisp oak
think the shovel adm increases are going to make it better or worse with the uncanny strike nerfs?
silver patrol
Uncanny is getting killed?
silver patrol
Wow, it sounds like ass
hearty panther
really what's getting killed is the interaction between dots and rending
the weapons themselves will still be quite good with the change to brittleness
crisp oak
really what's getting killed is the interaction between dots and rending
this is the true tragedy for me
hybrid plover
It's not a slap on the wrist but it's not killing the blessing either.
silver patrol
I mean
hearty panther
but you will no longer be able/allowed to toss out two frag grenades and hit five heads and suddenly melt entire crowds
elfin glacier
so this is really a nerf to dot damage
crisp oak
my bleed shovel was caught in the crossfire
silver patrol
You also lose half of the adm
hybrid plover
You also lose half of the adm
For a lot of weapons that have uncanny, that's honestly a nothing burger
silver patrol
And you start from 0 on each target
hearty panther
You also lose half of the adm
most weapons were not using anywhere near even half of uncanny's hypothetical output
hybrid plover
At most, you'll actually have to consider using heavies a lot more for full damage to carapace
hearty panther
so 40% brittleness is pretty damn fair and it is also a benefit to the entire team
hybrid plover
And you can't just go to the next target and benefit immediately
They have to be hit with the stacks
I honestly enjoy this change.
Uncanny isn't going to be the "why wouldn't you use this" kind of blessing anymore
proud parrot
did they nerf bleed?
crisp oak
This also comes with them lowering carapace spawn rates
hybrid plover
did they nerf bleed?
They nerfed Uncanny's interaction with bleed
crisp oak
including rotten armor
fast shale
<@366562874039992331>
Reddit mfs really are this dense
hybrid plover
including rotten armor
Funny because this change means literally nothing for new rotten armor lol
proud parrot
also why they hittin my kracks
hybrid plover
After all this time, they finally did the thing everyone was saying they should do and changed their armor type to infestsd
silver patrol
Deserved
proud parrot
like they just killed them
fast shale
90 secs krak :c
crisp oak
yup
hybrid plover
well I mean its less affected
No it straight up wouldn't do anything for infested rotten
proud parrot
now everyones just gonna go back to shredder grenades
hybrid plover
Brittleness/rending doesn't affect unarmored or infested values at all.
crisp oak
No it straight up wouldn't do anything for infested rotten
but by making it infested, dots do more damage
so 
hearty panther
now everyones just gonna go back to shredder grenades
not really cause again dot changes
fast shale
90 sec krak nade
hybrid plover
But yeah the dots themselves will be better.
hearty panther
secondly it's just nerfing your stockpile quantity, you'll still have shitloads of kraks because of Demo Team
true bison
What melee good for hordes besides power sword because I hate the power sword
silver patrol
Shovel
hearty panther
shovel, tacaxe
hybrid plover
now everyones just gonna go back to shredder grenades
Shredders aren't gonna be able to nuke armor squads like before.
pseudo fiber
now everyones just gonna go back to shredder grenades
Not really demo will keep up with havoc density easy
silver patrol
Yeah shredder ate shit
tame lodge
also why they hittin my kracks
Allegedly less targets to use it on
fast shale
secondly it's just nerfing your stockpile quantity, you'll still have shitloads ...
Oh right, fair fair, we will also use em less often cause less crushers soo umm we will see
true bison
I love the shovel
proud parrot
why is my text red
silver patrol
Discord is shitting itself
hybrid plover
Shovel, tax axe 7, Rashad combat axe, combat knife are all good options
Though.
Next week is gonna shake things up a bit.
proud parrot
i feel like stuff gets nerfed too often when havoc is so difficult
crisp oak
could also run the heavy sword
hollow ibex
nah shit doesn't get nerfed often enough
and they try to balance the nerfs
across the board
when there are blatantly outperformers
pseudo fiber
Tooooo many player nerfs I want your darktide
hollow ibex
so outperformers stay as outperformers
hybrid plover
i feel like stuff gets nerfed too often when havoc is so difficult
Read the patch notes and say that again 
proud parrot
what the less crushers
hollow ibex
Nerfing the heretics 😭
tame lodge
i feel like stuff gets nerfed too often when havoc is so difficult
But like
Isn't havoc supposed to be difficult
That's why I'm confused
hybrid plover
This is the start of them trying to reel back the power creep that's been plaguing the game.
hybrid plover
Uncanny has needed a nerf for a long time now.
Because now there are actually other options to consider using.
proud parrot
the higher levels of havoc can be insane
hybrid plover
And it isn't just a cheat code to let you kill masses of armor anymore.
hybrid plover
the higher levels of havoc can be insane
I'm aware.
sly orchid
Brittleness also brings a new kind of playstyle on its own
hybrid plover
That's why they specifically hit the spawn rate change harder in Havoc.
It's a readjustment to the game.
silver patrol
Brittleness on its way to be completely irrelevant as it always is:
tame lodge
Brittleness also brings a new kind of playstyle on its own
Yeah
sly orchid
45% less crushers in rotten armor
tame lodge
I'm already planning on shooting carapace with ilas
hybrid plover
Brittleness on its way to be completely irrelevant as it always is:
It's gonna be more relevant tbh
tame lodge
If I see a teammate with uncanny
proud parrot
honestly most of the time ive lost in havoc cause captain and 3 bosses spawn
hybrid plover
The main reason why brittleness was so undervalued is because you already have a crazy amount of rending that invalidates what brittleness can provide
proud parrot
so waht there is 45 percent less crushers in havoc now?
sly orchid
so waht there is 45 percent less crushers in havoc now?
30% less crushers overall
hybrid plover
Now that it's only brittleness, the value of it is gonna show a lot more now since different sources of brittleness also stack with one another.
sly orchid
15% less ogryns in rotten armor
An additional ~15% on average reduction in Ogryn Crushers, Bulwarks and Reapers
Actually im wrong
hybrid plover
15% less ogryns in rotten armor
I think the 15% is just generally for havoc
sly orchid
A global 15% less ogryns in havoc
hybrid plover
And they also adjusted rotten armor spawns on top of that change.
So nearly half of the spawns you'd typically get.
sly orchid
So 45% less crushers which is very sizeable
hybrid plover
That's a really big change to enemy density.
sly orchid
Scab ragers might take the place of crushers
hybrid plover
And it's a good change.
We need more adjustments for individual enemies to be more imposing in their own right so they don't have to be spammed constantly.
sly orchid
Imagine scab ragers now have a carapace core for DOT
silver patrol
is anyone ever afraid of scab ragers
hybrid plover
Um. The average player?
silver patrol
really
hybrid plover
We may not have issues with scab ragers.
silver patrol
they are much weaker than dreg ragers imo
hybrid plover
That is not indicative of everyone. 
Oh no dreg ragers are arguably worse.
That doesn't mean people don't have issues with scab ragers.
This recent event has taught me that well enough.
silver patrol
scab ragers are this combination of somewhat squishy while also moving in slow motion
tame lodge
is anyone ever afraid of scab ragers
Kind of
hybrid plover
scab ragers are this combination of somewhat squishy while also moving in slow m...
Its the carapace.
sly orchid
That doesn't mean people don't have issues with scab ragers.
Scab ragers are worse this event taught me
tame lodge
I hate them eating my cleave
hybrid plover
You can't really CC them
sly orchid
Hit the carapace chest and no cleave
hybrid plover
Like dregs.
tame lodge
10 mass too
silver patrol
they have flak chest, no?
tame lodge
Carapace
hybrid plover
they have flak chest, no?
Oh you are late late.
tame lodge
But flak core
hybrid plover
That got changed a while ago.
silver patrol
full carapace?
hybrid plover
They have carapace covering pretty much everywhere but their heads.
silver patrol
is that flak then
hybrid plover
But they're coded to be considered flak armored for base damage + DoT purposes
Yeah
Head flak
Everything else carapace.
silver patrol
actually nvm, i was thinking of mauler for the armor
but yeah they are pretty squishy with headshots
tall torrent
so this is really a nerf to dot damage
yes but no because uncanny being brittleness allows u to still buff DOT dmg
tame lodge
Because of this body-core difference
Explosions understand them as carapace
Dots understand them as flak
tall torrent
so 40% brittleness is pretty damn fair and it is also a benefit to the entire te...
nah it's still too good
hybrid plover
They are. But you can't really handle multiple of them as effectively.
tame lodge
It's not thunderous
Nor onslaught
Therefore good
Not as good as can opener
But still good
hybrid plover
Unless you have something meant to do that without interacting with cleave
feral stratus
Wait, do explosions and DOT take different parts for the dmg calculations?
tall torrent
They have carapace covering pretty much everywhere but their heads.
no, just torso
feral stratus
I always assumed it was core for both of them
tall torrent
Wait, do explosions and DOT take different parts for the dmg calculations?
yes
explosion is center mass
DOT is base
so for example
hybrid plover
no, just torso
Oh woops
tall torrent
reaper is unyielding base + unyielding center mass + flak torso
hybrid plover
I mean i never really even consider arms or legs
tall torrent
so both explosion and DOT work vs unyielding
turbid ibex
yes but no because uncanny being brittleness allows u to still buff DOT dmg
it does let you buff DoT but you actually have to apply it to each enemy
tall torrent
whereas scab rager is flak base + carapace center mass + carapace torso
so DOT counts as vs flak but explosion counts as vs carapace for scab rager
tall torrent
it does let you buff DoT but you actually have to apply it to each enemy
yea, so flesh tearer uncanny still the way to go on knife for vet (and zealot tbh)
hybrid plover
yes but no because uncanny being brittleness allows u to still buff DOT dmg
The buff is there but only the enemy you're specifically attacking is affected by it cuz of brittleness function
That's a genuinely big hit to DoT interaction
midnight totem
Krak grenade regn nerf seems a bit heavy. 75 second would have been fine
90 second seens to necessitate having that second regen node
hybrid plover
You can't just stack uncanny and drop shredders and nuke crushers anymore
Don't get me wrong
tall torrent
90 second seens to necessitate having that second regen node
well u shud hav it anyway so it's fine
hybrid plover
40% brittleness is great. And the value of that is gonna show more now.
But its a pretty meaningful change in practice.
Now if they just don't buff inferno
tall torrent
ya just not enough of a nerf, it'll still be meta on every weapon that has it
hearty panther
im fine with that tbh
also idk about every
ill have to play and see but i might be ditching it on deimos
hybrid plover
ya just not enough of a nerf, it'll still be meta on every weapon that has it
Eh?
I mean honestly precog looks like a pretty appealing option for getting a surge of burst damage
midnight totem
well u shud hav it anyway so it's fine
Ah I usually do have it, but it would be nice to be able to run the pick up allies faster node instead and not feel bad about not having more grenades
hybrid plover
Thing about this change is that uncanny isn't a universal buff while you have your weapon out anymore
tall torrent
Eh?
I mean honestly precog looks like a pretty appealing option for getting a s...
2s duration is unfortunate
I think I'd rather go mercy killer if I wanted the finesse on vet
hybrid plover
You have to actively apply the stacks now.
hollow ibex
it's 20% per hit?
hearty panther
maximum british? my word
tall torrent
8 stacks per weakspot hit
midnight totem
I like Executor, that may be part of my new build
tall torrent
and u go up to 16 stacks
so yes 20% per hit, maxed in 2 hits
still too good
on shiv I think it's 4 stacks per hit, 4 hits to max
but still very good tbh
hollow ibex
8 stacks per weakspot hit
oof
midnight totem
But lacerate is still pretty strong
tall torrent
but I could see going haymaker or executor over uncanny on shivs after patch
as for the others, nah
uncanny still too good
except MAYBE force sword
midnight totem
Probably still lacerate and uncanny for knives?
tall torrent
but that's just cuz force sword has unbelievably stacked blessing lineup (superiority, slaughterer, riposte, etc)
tall torrent
Probably still lacerate and uncanny for knives?
no, flesh tearer + uncanny for knife on vet/zealot
tame lodge
I refuse to believe that
hybrid plover
Is actually not terrible in some instance
midnight totem
Which is the one that bleeds on crit and Which is the one that bleeds on body
tame lodge
tall torrent
Which is the one that bleeds on crit and Which is the one that bleeds on body
flesh tearer is crit
tame lodge
Which is the one that bleeds on crit and Which is the one that bleeds on body
Flesh Tearer is crit
Lacerate is body
turbid ibex
Which is the one that bleeds on crit and Which is the one that bleeds on body
flesh tearer and lacerate respectively
tame lodge
Is actually not terrible in some instance
In the instance where you purposely play knife wrong
But we are not here to talk about that
hybrid plover
I will be over here enjoying my lacerate knife on psyker ty
tall torrent
I would be surprised if admech didn’t get plasma gun tbh
midnight totem
I hope its not a straight skitarri, and more of a adept admech for versatility
tame lodge
the question is will it be as effective on it as on vet
This does make me realize that vet is like the only consistent damage class
Every other is on some temporary buffs bullshit
So I wonder if next class is temporary buffs or consistent
turbid ibex
i mean
3 of vet's most important damage talents are all duration based
skirmisher, exploit and agile
heavy rover
skirmisher, exploit and agile
i just realized I don't run any of those 
tame lodge
i just realized I don't run any of those <:KEKW_ogryn:1022077188322906163>
At least skirm dawg
heavy rover
https://tenor.com/view/byuntear-sad-sad-cat-cat-meme-gif-12065013016370441684
dawg the furthest I've gone on the weapon specialist tree is 15% melee damage
distant plaza
40% brittleness in two hits, great for helping out your teams recon vet shoot crushers with
heavy rover
make sure they're using deadshot on recon too
tall torrent
i just realized I don't run any of those <:KEKW_ogryn:1022077188322906163>
joever
tame lodge
40% brittleness in two hits, great for helping out your teams recon vet shoot cr...
I will literally be plinking with iLas any crusher my uncanny Strike teammate will be fighting
heavy rover
oh my god you're right, ilas viability against carapace
dreamy spade
I would be surprised if admech didn’t get plasma gun tbh
Powersword on admech? 
tall torrent
Powersword on admech? <:pogryn:961977701533614130>
transonic sword yea
powersword_p3
dreamy spade
I hope it works the same way
tall torrent
I hope it works the same way
prob won't
dreamy spade
dreamy spade
What about a power whip
sharp epoch
another vet nerf yay
dreamy spade
They gave krak nade the shock mine treatment
slow spade
can't believe they increased crusher spawns UwU
every time they "reduce" elite spawns it's as if they doubled it
"oh don't worry we reduced crusher spawns to compensate for the increased hp"
unreal nova
every time they "reduce" elite spawns it's as if they doubled it
You mean quadrupled?
gilded wraith
To compensate for the uncanny change we're buffing burn and soulblaze. Also, screw bleed DoT builds we really just don't care.
gilded wraith
Can't fool me, you're just campaigning to be a beta tester 
serene yacht
The sleeper Bleed build rises; weapon specialist shock maul vet w/skullcrusher, and haymaker to stagger, so everything takes big skullcrusher bleeds
tame lodge
Can't fool me, you're just campaigning to be a beta tester <:thumbsup_ogryn:1063...
nah
fatshark knows what they are doing
slow sky
The sleeper Bleed build rises; weapon specialist shock maul vet w/skullcrusher, ...
Haymaker to stagger??
What??
tame lodge
theres no need for any testing
serene yacht
isn't there a stagger blessing called that?
serene yacht
oh hammerblow
slow sky
Oh so just
Avg shock maul build
serene yacht
pretty much lol
slow sky
Can also do the same thing with shovel too, which has a better base profile for most things and is getting buffed too
Could do a stagger blessing or something else like decimator for more raw damage and cleave which allows it to spread bleed better, considering it attacks much faster and has more cleave baseline too, so it gets better use out of serrated
gilded wraith
The sleeper Bleed build rises; weapon specialist shock maul vet w/skullcrusher, ...
Honestly wanted to try and odd chaxe shredder build. Sadly opportunist took some flak as well.
slow sky
Honestly wanted to try and odd chaxe shredder build. Sadly opportunist took som...
It did but it's better for the health of the game overall
tall torrent
Honestly wanted to try and odd chaxe shredder build. Sadly opportunist took som...
it's actually pretty nice, slaughterer is global strength so it helps explosions & bleed DOT
they still haven't fixed chainaxe XII bug of being unable to refresh stance with sticky atks tho
gilded wraith
I think slaughter opportunist was the blessing combination that intrigued me.
tall torrent
opportunist doesn't matter that much for chainaxe tbh
it has fairly good ADMs across the board
gilded wraith
For a shredder spammer with Lethal Proximity bolt.
Did desparado HS catch any nerfs? (Fingers crossed)
tall torrent
Did desparado HS catch any nerfs? (Fingers crossed)
lol
tame lodge
whats a good build for hive supplier maxxing
Pause
Lemme rephrase that
What's a build for supplier maxxing
narrow widget
Haymaker to stagger??
Tekken move names frfr
unreal nova
To compensate for the uncanny change we're buffing burn and soulblaze. Also, sc...
Which is annoying when bleed needed uncanny the most.
sharp epoch
wdym shovel got buffed
with uncanny nerf so it probably balances out or its worse
but im more talking about the krak
willow prairie
I feel like uncanny nerf to brittleness is like too much lmao
keep it shiv level at 40% instead
reading the comment in the post is funny lmak
people still think taxe is bad
caxe bad
another one said right side vet bad
istg these people do not play this fucking game
hollow ibex
they prob just regurgitate what mr. e tells them
slow spade
na they right, right side Vet is bad and needs more damage UwU
willow prairie
time like this make me want to gatekeep the game
tall torrent
I feel like uncanny nerf to brittleness is like too much lmao
it's still too good
tall torrent
dollar store thunderous
what
willow prairie
combat blade nerf
tall torrent
u max brittleness in 2 hits
willow prairie
😔
tame lodge
drowsy perch
with uncanny nerf so it probably balances out or its worse
uncanny strike was nerfed?
looks the same t me
quiet lark
uncanny strike was nerfed?
update's not live yet, they made an announcement with upcoming balance changes
drowsy perch
fucked up
shovels gonna be ass
and i just started using it agian
wow yeah holy shit
uncanny strike is gonna be hot shit now
hybrid plover
It's not
It just isn't going to be the obvious option anymore.
40% brittleness with a quick application like that is still good.
tame lodge
shovels gonna be ass
desert viper
I'm happy I get to apply brittleness for my team now
drowsy perch
It just isn't going to be the obvious option anymore.
idk brittle is kinda shit on melee compared to the other talents you can have
unless its a weapon with high cleave so it can hit multiple armored enemies
single target is garbo in high diff
unless its damage
tame lodge
hybrid plover
idk brittle is kinda shit on melee compared to the other talents you can have
It's literally rending but in debuff form
drowsy perch
like the only thing keeping shovel useable in high diff was rending
drowsy perch
It's literally rending but in debuff form
and its still worse than what you could get with rending
desert viper
not at all what
drowsy perch
and its also just worse in general
desert viper
where do you get these numbers from moth
tame lodge
like the only thing keeping shovel useable in high diff was rending
It's ok
Shovel was always trash anyways
drowsy perch
you would have rending against all enemies
tame lodge
Not a single thing lost
hybrid plover
That doesn't mean it isn't gonna be a good choice.
drowsy perch
instead of applying brittle to 1 enemy
hybrid plover
It just isn't going to be abrasively overpowered like it has been for years now.
drowsy perch
It's ok
Shovel was always trash anyways
its even worse now
tame lodge
Nah it didn't change
drowsy perch
shovel is not op??
tame lodge
Trash tier
drowsy perch
this is about shovel
idc about the uncanny change
the rending was the only thing keeping shovel good
now its gonna be hot shit in high diff
because u no longer have high rending against all enemies
tame lodge
It was always shit dawh
tame lodge
It didn't change shit about it
drowsy perch
at a time
tame lodge
Still shit
drowsy perch
It didn't change shit about it
its absolutely worse
desert viper
this is insane prejudice honestly
hybrid plover
because u no longer have high rending against all enemies
Crushers were the only real big benefit to using Uncanny on shovel
drowsy perch
Crushers were the only real big benefit to using Uncanny on shovel
and maulers, and ragers
and literally anyone with armor
drowsy perch
bro im blocking u ur being annoying as shit
tame lodge
I'll be here all day regardless
That's a lie actually
Imma sleep in like
2 hours
hybrid plover
Shovel already has decent flak adms as is. And those are actually getting buffed across the board too. Whether it will be enough remains to be seen but
I feel like there's too much "This is gonna be shit" without actually trying the things out and making a conclusion from there.
desert viper
I agree
drowsy perch
I feel like there's too much "This is gonna be shit" without actually trying the...
im a brittleness hater unless its a fast blunt weapon (eg clubs)
its kinda fucking garbage if its on a weapon meant for killing
and not debuffing
willow prairie
It's literally rending but in debuff form
yeah except lower cap + can't stack unless another unique brittleness
tame lodge
Welp shovel wasn't made for killing
willow prairie
also shovel need uncanny for thing like bleed dot too
tame lodge
So it'll be good on shovel
drowsy perch
its kinda fucking garbage if its on a weapon meant for killing
and this again
drowsy perch
in the past yeah
hybrid plover
You've used shivs, right?
willow prairie
yeah except shiv have like 60% against flak on light
for heavy its 61% against cara
you're getting near 100% adm against flak + cara
drowsy perch
shovel was already not great at armor especially in crowds
willow prairie
for something like shovel which have literally zero cara adm it matter
drowsy perch
shovel was already not great at armor especially in crowds
like it needed the rending
shovel with brittleness is complete ass because why the fuck would you ever
thats like knife with brittleness
just take bleed or some shit
willow prairie
shovel attack fast enough for stacking to not be an issue
drowsy perch
or the actual killing blessings
willow prairie
the issue is the value is 40%
willow prairie
problem is not application but value on shovel
tame lodge
Shovel is meant for staggering anyways
Hammerblow
Skullcrusher
Poor cleave damage distribution
Cleave damage distribution cap
Bad breakpoints
Special capable of staggering everything
hybrid plover
yeah except shiv have like 60% against flak on light
Shovel currently has .75 on Flak. If anything, the main thing is that you're not gonna get as big of a rending overflow buff anymore. My point is that I don't think this is really going to affect shovel as much as the change to Uncanny would imply.
willow prairie
Shovel currently has .75 on Flak. If anything, the main thing is that you're not...
I'm talking about cara
tame lodge
Trauma
hybrid plover
I'm talking about cara
You literally mentioned Flak in the message I just responded to
willow prairie
But the point is 40% uncanny on shiv perfectly make it possible to get 100 adm on light for horde clear and heavy for cara
tame lodge
Special capable of staggering everything
Bosses not included
hybrid plover
But the point is 40% uncanny on shiv perfectly make it possible to get 100 adm o...
Yes. And it does the same for flak on shovel.
willow prairie
the problem with shovel is cara adm
hybrid plover
Oh my god
willow prairie
it was usable before but noe 40% is not enough
tame lodge
Quite literally everything about it
tame lodge
Cleave damage distribution cap
.
tame lodge
Poor cleave damage distribution
.
willow prairie
that the entire point of why i bring up 40% in the first place
tame lodge
Bad breakpoints
.
drowsy perch
Shovel currently has .75 on Flak. If anything, the main thing is that you're not...
its going to massively affect shovel
shovel is genuinely hot garbage against ANY armor
40% brittle is fucking nothingburger
since again, shovel is meant for killing
drowsy perch
like ill have to get a video when US is changed but i just tested it with and without the rending
genuinely fucking unuseable
without rending
tame lodge
Shouldn't it just have good Adms to begin with?
Maybe because it's not made for killing
drowsy perch
took like 15 seconds to get a mauler to 25%
silver patrol
lol
tidal fox
since again, shovel is meant for killing
where are we getting this from
silver patrol
well it's a shovel, it's not meant for killing, it's not meant as a weapon either
tidal fox
I think he means like it's meant for horde clear and quickly eradicating pests
tidal fox
well it's a shovel, it's not meant for killing, it's not meant as a weapon eithe...
true...
willow prairie
I mean idek what "shovel meant for killing" means tbh
it's just higui
mfs saying dumb shit like shovel not mean for killing or taxe bad
or ds good at horde clear
hybrid plover
well it's a shovel, it's not meant for killing, it's not meant as a weapon eithe...
tbf, that particular kind of shovel is meant to be used as a weapon
tidal fox
or ds good at horde clear
silver patrol
what makes you think that
tame lodge
Now that's just a lie by Cy
toxic reef
dont forget the overuse of that gif
willow prairie
stop ragebaiting
tame lodge
Why are you lying cy
willow prairie
joybait me
tame lodge
Cy I literally never said it good for clearing hordes
hybrid plover
what makes you think that
It's a military grade sapper shovel. They're meant to be multipurpose in that regard.
silver patrol
i mean, they are meant to dig or for utility
it's like using a swiss knife to stab
like yeah, it works, but that's not the primary use
tidal fox
i mean, they are meant to dig or for utility
I would say a military grade sapper shovel is more needed for digging than combat
so it's not mostly meant for killing
tame lodge
Military grade
tidal fox
technically
tidal fox
Mass produced
all of the imperium
slow sky
shovel is genuinely hot garbage against ANY armor
Its getting significant armor buffs and baseline armor damage to compensate
hybrid plover
like yeah, it works, but that's not the primary use
Not the primary, but they're usually pretty sharp to be used for that purpose in a pinch.
silver patrol
is it really significant armor buffs tho
slow sky
And 40% brittleness is a lot
tame lodge
all of the imperium
tidal fox
Its getting significant armor buffs and baseline armor damage to compensate
I hope it makes it half decent I like the shovel moveset
hybrid plover
Its getting significant armor buffs and baseline armor damage to compensate
Ty Cole
Since that part seems to be getting glanced over.
slow sky
is it really significant armor buffs tho
The lights go from 0 to 0.2 already
The push attack is going from 0.25 to 0.35 (that puts it on the same adm as taxe lights, which are considered good at armor
tame lodge
No cddc removal?
tidal fox
if the melee weapon cannot eradicate a crusher in 5 seconds max it should not be used without kraks
desert viper
Since that part seems to be getting glanced over.
yeah because uncanny strike is so unhealthy ppl can't imagine a weapon without it
tame lodge
silver patrol
aren't taxe lights "good" against armor because of their speed and finesse
hybrid plover
yeah because uncanny strike is so unhealthy ppl can't imagine a weapon without i...
If anything, this truly proves that uncanny needs a fucking hammer put to it so weapons don't have to be designed with it in mind
silver patrol
despite most of the damage getting filtered
slow sky
If you add newcanny to it, you get nearly the same damage you got before, which was respectable
slow sky
aren't taxe lights "good" against armor because of their speed and finesse
Guess what the PA has a lot of
Finesse
silver patrol
but not speed
slow sky
If you forgo uncanny (or the other blessing slot) you can pop on skullcrusher
Stab push overhead
Big damage
silver patrol
also does it have a lot of finesse
willow prairie
aren't taxe lights "good" against armor because of their speed and finesse
also crit
slow sky
also does it have a lot of finesse
Yes
hybrid plover
also does it have a lot of finesse
It does
silver patrol
because i only see 1.5 at most
slow sky
Its why take a swing is actually a really good blessing considering its condition
drowsy perch
Its getting significant armor buffs and baseline armor damage to compensate
tf u mean significant they buffed it literally by 0.05-0.2