veteran-class

[bold sierra]

I meant inf autogun

woops

[gritty mural]

with the infantry lasgun ammo buffs I guess you'll never run out of ammo if you have survivalist but when was running out of ammo ever a problem with the lasgun...

[bold sierra]

Agripana Inf Autogun with death spitter + 50% cleave (which zealot also has and now vet as well) will be very nice to cleave through trash horde in H40

[gilded wraith]

Cool, I like the recoil on that one.

[somber axle]

it's probably to make it more attractive for expeditions

[hollow ibex]

that's still only 3 cleave

[somber axle]

assuming ammo is harder to find outside of the sanctuaries they mentioned

[tall torrent]

4.17

[hollow ibex]

good but not exactly super game changing

[gilded wraith]

I've got an 80/62 on my zealot... Sadly not my vet.

[gritty mural]

Infantry lasgun would be cool to use if end game content wasn't armor spam designed to challenge overtuned weapons such as the dueling sword

[silver patrol]

also add strength multipliers

[tall torrent]

2.1 * (1+0.065x5) * 1.5

[hollow ibex]

oh what the fuck

oh rightw ith strength mult

[gilded wraith]

What's the cleave on slug special?

[tall torrent]

13~14m

with double rending picks it's close

but not actually reliable still

u'd need presumably 15m+ since that's where it ends the dmg falloff

and also, getting double rending on vet tree is cursed

it's just not worth going for

[bold sierra]

I mean yeah, not Flamer/Plasma type cleave, but AT LEAST for Zealot, I'm able to reliable kill shooters as well with inf autogun, while also able to deal with horde decently reliably, especially with Blazing Piety crits for inf autogun. I think with Vet with how reliable you can proc crits, I think there'll be some nice builds for it.

[bold sierra]

yeah it was probably 15m, cuz I tagged once and it was 15m I think. It was probably just the tagging. But yeah like I said it's not the most reliable, and I dont really build FOR it xD

[bold sierra]

and I have been able to out ranged-kills with agripana infantry autogun against vet plasma be4 in H40 believe it or not (many times, but it depends on how they play), the extra cleave for agripana inf autogun does go pretty nicely

tho admittedly, most of the times I didnt need to tho.

[bold sierra]

that being said tho, still curious on how you only got 1900sth dmg be4

[tall torrent]

didn't have CITA

[bold sierra]

15% rending increased that much? damn

[tall torrent]

it has very low flak ADM at base

[tame lodge]

3 cleave iirc
Doesn't matter
Manstopper makes it infinite, if you CRIT that is

[bold sierra]

yeah i know it'd increase but by like 400-500 after that surprises me, I actually did start to think it was somehow wrong.

[bold sierra]

I think it'll help out the blue shotgun's special

the cleave wide shot one

and the fire one too it should

[tame lodge]

Once again, refer to the Manstopper comment

But also true

They have like 4.5 cleave

[bold sierra]

yeah manstopper is silly, i think I kinda followed up off the mark a bit there

[void dragon]

you folks believe that the new Inf lasguns will have a place? or the recon lasguns are still better in every way?

[bold sierra]

I already use a bunch of it i H40, all I see are Ws, so yes I do think so

it'll be A LOT more ammo-efficient than recon, and it'll be a lot more reliable at headshots cuz hitbox increase

and that unyielding dmg+, very nice

[void dragon]

how did you run it? im thinking on making it without the shocktrooper but want to know what is used on the weapon itself

[tall torrent]

It’ll be better than before
But prob not as good as vig auto

[bold sierra]

I played just about everything with it in Havoc, VoC, Exec Stance, all the keystones, differne tmelees with

I got a number of videos made with it

personally I prefer it wayyy over vig auto, but to people's own

[tall torrent]

Vig auto is just better breakpoints

Doesn’t need MF to hit 1 burst kills

So u can run it on a conventionally strong hybrid setup and achieve the same results

[bold sierra]

yeah I dont run MF these days at all, mostly wp specialist, but yeah.

it's just a number of things which make me prefer ilas more than vig

well to be specific, i prefer ilas more on vet, and vig more on zealot

[void dragon]

I'm thinking on making a support oriented build with it, using the extra ammo to take the less amount while using Focus target and other buffs to help a team the most from distance, but I wonder how much it would need Shock trooper

Also wondering if the infernus blessing could work with teh mk2b

[bold sierra]

I actually dont use shocktrooper for ilas, yes you do get less ammo efficiency but ilas alone has really dang good ammo eco anyway, so it's not super necessary

[tall torrent]

efficiency + opening salvo on IX could be the way

[cunning haven]

plz help me decide

[last marten]

left

[cunning haven]

i like the grenades 🙂

[tame lodge]

I'd say left because you can mix match black with anything and it'll look good

[bold sierra]

I also do use infernus quite frequently, altho I've starting opting out for Ghost, cuz the ranged immunity does go pretyt hard, but infernus + ilas's current decent unyieding adm does make it a pretty decetn boss damage dealer, not the best but you can help your team out vs monsters quite a bit.

and it does help out killing some elites too without spending an extra shot here and there

[hollow ibex]

infernus on ilas is a choice...

[bold sierra]

a choice which I have opted out, like I said

[void dragon]

you take head hunter?

[bold sierra]

it's not that bad really, it does add up dmg for boss

[bold sierra]

yep

[hollow ibex]

it's pretty bad

[bold sierra]

not great, but damage is damage

but I prefer GHost these days

and probably will opt in Efficiency too

Headhunter + Efficiency next patch will be VERY good

[void dragon]

i feel that Target down + deadshot would help it trigger quite often for damage while keeping a good ammo efficient hip fire gun

[void dragon]

how is the new Efficiency work? now it only works on ONE shot from the guns

[bold sierra]

it can, but typically not super worth, cuz the stam drain from deadshot can be the difference between life and death for vet, when u need to block or push

I'll say deadshot should be used if you got the stam-regen keystone nodes

but ofc it's not impossible to make it work without

[void dragon]

its manage of stamina, and taking target down fits for the support theme to give toughness to the team all time

[bold sierra]

well it basically make you spend less ammo per shot per x sec

[bold sierra]

yeah if ur tryna go for support and not headon fight, you can go target down, deadshot and infernus, helps with boss dmg and elite breakpoints here and there

focus target with stam-regen on kill should be pretyt decent to keep your stam 0>

[bold sierra]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cPsZ6te-vf0&t=6s here's a vid of mine running inf lasgun with exec stance + focus target in H40.

I'd even say, you dont even really need deadshot for infernus

usually monsters leave their heads pretty bare, and only need a few crits to get full fire stacks anyway

[bold sierra]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToopVtdWGTE an older video but still relevant (until next update that is), somewhat more basic, VoC + Marksman Focus.

giga boss dmg

[void dragon]

i see infernus more reliable to fight stuff like maulers and the plasma gunners, since you only need a rapid flick of the ADS to stack fire

[bold sierra]

it can save you a shot or two for sure, IF you are able to keep track of it

at least for me, in H40, things can be really hectic for you to keep track of that and make use of it fully

but it does help here and there.

[bold sierra]

probably not what ur looking for, but here's another one I ran in H40, the classic Exec Stance ilas setup lol, w/ Marksman's Focus. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3bcDPlsVRs

you can run a lot of different setups with ilas and can make it work pretty well

and I'm not even that good of a shot...I have a hard time with headshots, and hoping next patch the hitbox increase on the ilas will help with it xD

ilas is that gun if you're amazing with your aim and headshots, it's bloody amazing, cuz of its great sustain.

[livid sphinx]

I guess vet will be the best class for the new mode since its much more open

[tame lodge]

Never had any trouble dealing with open area anyways

Independent of the class

But that's just me

I'm goated like that

[pseudo fiber]

Good start.

[void dragon]

@bold sierra i think i have something nice to use with the inf lasgun when the 17th come, time will tell if i move from my stance of using the superior inf lasgun (Helbore mk5) to use the new stuff, thanks for the pointers mate

[final locust]

curious

they add anything cool recently?

[void dragon]

they just showcase a lot of stuff that will come the 17th with the new mode and a lot of changes for all classes

[final locust]

nice

[final locust]

Any new weapons or cosmetcis for vet?

[void dragon]

no, but there will be many weapon adjustments, perk wise i think vet is the less affected

cosmetics is something Obesefish still keep us in the dark

[turbid ibex]

yes

new cosmetics that is

from penances

[final locust]

All I want

is some even cooler cadian stuff I can spend my money on

a helmet with the mask and the little orange visor thing would be cool

[final locust]

ty for letting me know

[tall torrent]

It’s in the shop

Right now

[tidal fox]

are their specific details that they gave about weapon changes?

or is it vague

I'm a bit lazy to check

[tall torrent]

Details no

But we do know the general changes

[tidal fox]

such as

[tall torrent]

Plasma changes

Infantry lasgun changes

[tidal fox]

uhoh

[tall torrent]

Etc

[tidal fox]

are they nerfing or buffing plasma

or we dont know

[void dragon]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQT0Sjg0u2g

[tall torrent]

Adjustment

Plasma we actually have details for

Hipfire cleave reduced from 55.125 to 18 (nerf)
Charge shot ammo cost reduced from 5-9 to 1-8 (buff)
Wield timescale reduced from 1 to 0.85 (nerf)

[tidal fox]

oof the cleave is taking a hit

how bad is that actually

cause the cleave is a big reason plasma is so cracked

I personally rarely use charge shot though

[tall torrent]

18 cleave is still huge

[void dragon]

the charge shot will have its cleave still?

[tall torrent]

Still 105

[tidal fox]

that's a pretty big drop tho but I am not familiar with the math so I'm assuming it'll still be good for mixed horde sniping

[tall torrent]

So I think the intended change is for u to use min-charge shots

Because they do more damage than hipfire

[void dragon]

wonderful, finally we can use the charged shots like the Emperor planed

[tall torrent]

And with the ammo cost reduction they might have pretty good damage/ammo efficiency

[tidal fox]

hmm is the min charge shot quicker than hipfire?

or is it slower by a bit

[tall torrent]

It depends on what the min ammo spend for charge shot is

[tall torrent]

Slower

[tall torrent]

Currently the number is 7

Next update it might be 3 or 4

[tidal fox]

unfortunate

im a sucker for quick snipes so I might still be falling for the hipfire trap

[tall torrent]

There’s no trap

Hipfire still super strong

[tidal fox]

ye but the ammo

how much ammo does hiupfiure use?

[tall torrent]

3

Unchanged

[tidal fox]

ye that's pretty hungry

especially cause im usually the only guy sniping specialists

but then again that's just a solo queue issue

definitely excited tho cause I do want other vet guns to actually be good

[tall torrent]

Plasma change is not a big nerf

They went really conservative with this

[tidal fox]

I dont think it was too strong tbh it's just that the other guns are pretty crap in comparison

[void dragon]

it was VERY strong

the changes will make it more fair than impact its overall performance

[tidal fox]

it is pretty strong actually ill admit

but it's not tooooo bad

just compared against other stuff it looks outrageously good

[tall torrent]

It’s too strong

Esp since 1.9 made vet tree better

[tidal fox]

are they doing anything with vet talent tree or no

or do we not kno

[tall torrent]

We do know

Just watch the vid above lol

[tidal fox]

yeah youre right ill just do that lmao

[tidal fox]

ooooo the shout change on vet

that one is crazy

[void dragon]

Will make you need to judge when it's a moment to give your team lots of defensive buffs instead of just spamming it

[tidal fox]

the subtalents do remain mutually exclusive still yeah?

if so that's gonna be a hard pick

but I've begun to hate having to be a supporter for my team these days

probably not gonna care much for it but it's still a good change imo

[void dragon]

the piss toughness and the revive arent mutually exclusive, you can take both live

[tidal fox]

ok that is actually a pretty big buff then

gives vet more clutch potential

which I like

[hollow ibex]

heads up-- revive shout sucks ass

[livid sphinx]

Wait we have patch notes now???

[tall torrent]

it's good change

[tall torrent]

no, see vid above

[tidal fox]

when the shout radius is reduced yeah

but this has a 10 sec cooldown increase and the radius stays the same

pretty huge if you ask me

[livid sphinx]

Oh okay

[manic umbra]

How big of the deal is the reduced time scale?

[tall torrent]

if I understood it correctly, it should be ~18% slower draw time

not a big deal, you would run one motion with it anyway

[livid sphinx]

Oh wow. RIP plasma

Oh well it was a good run

[tall torrent]

lol no

[livid sphinx]

I dont understand the buff on the infantry lasgun

[void dragon]

overdramatic much

[manic umbra]

Ngl still seems like it’ll be the best

[livid sphinx]

Why do they need to increase ammo capacity on it when ammo was never a problem for infantry lasgun lol

[manic umbra]

Not really that bad of a nerf

but curious to see how much of a cleave nerf it is

[hollow ibex]

unfortunately still not good. the entire point of shout is to keep your teammates alive with piss toughness. the CD increase really hurts that.

[manic umbra]

but we get a + cleave node to compensate

[livid sphinx]

I do wonder how the new range cleave perk will affect the plasma secondary

[hollow ibex]

bet it's not noticeable in most situations

[livid sphinx]

since he said that plasma secondary will still have infinite cleave

Maybe the secondary will be the new thing to spam instead of the primary

except now people will have to actually manage the heat

[tall torrent]

18 cleave is still massive

[tidal fox]

eh, not that big of a deal just needs more management

[warm swallow]

What perks do i want on helbore?

[hybrid plover]

ten secs really isn't the end of the world

it's significantly better than how it currently works

[tidal fox]

yeah now that you give piss toughness AND there's no radius reduction in the revive it is literally game saving

[hollow ibex]

50s ult cd

what is this

infil?

[livid sphinx]

I'm happy they're actually nerfing shout massively

[tidal fox]

it's just 10 seconds bro

[hollow ibex]

10s is a long ass time in a game like this

[livid sphinx]

10 seconds is 1/3

of the original one

[hollow ibex]

like infil cd was terrible

and that was 45s lol

[tidal fox]

ok havoc is probabyl gonna take a hit with shout usage

but aside from that

general buff

[livid sphinx]

Yeah that's the only downside

[hybrid plover]

but infiltrate itself isn't actually great

[tidal fox]

ong who run infiltrate in the big 26 💀

[livid sphinx]

Vet is gonna get butchered in havoc

[hollow ibex]

infil itself is fine

[hybrid plover]

nah

[hollow ibex]

it's mostly the cd that was the issue

[tidal fox]

executioner stance buff tho

[hollow ibex]

and teammate griefing

[tidal fox]

he'll be aight

[livid sphinx]

I've always preferred executioner anyway

Which the update will buff

I think im pregnant after I read that

[tidal fox]

NINE second exe stance

that is pretty insane

[livid sphinx]

Plus you get the additional toughness regen from the last major update

[tidal fox]

I already keep exe stance refreshed for like a solid minute

having it on for 9 seconds is gonna make it even more valuable

[livid sphinx]

I cant even die whenever I'm on exe stance and now its 9 seconds

So like you are practically invulnerable except against pox and trappers

[hybrid plover]

also wait

50?

uh

are you sure about that?

[hollow ibex]

idk it's not like i saw patch notes

[hybrid plover]

there's a gosh darn video

Revive shout has literally no downside

It's full on gone. But shout base CD was increased to 40s

The only technical downside is that you need a talent point for it

[hollow ibex]

well sorry i'm not scouring griftube for every scrap of news on this

[hollow ibex]

i thought it still increases cd

[hybrid plover]

It does not

The downsides are gone.

The only effect is that you revive downed players. That's it.

[tidal fox]

what is the current cd on shout?

[hybrid plover]

40s

[willow rain]

I don't take it personally

[hybrid plover]

Which, honestly.

I kinda don't like.

[tidal fox]

I thought it was 30? gotta be tweakin

[hybrid plover]

OH WAIT

[tidal fox]

if so this is a MASSIVE buff

[hybrid plover]

it's 30

currently

[tidal fox]

ok yeah

ok

it's reasonable

[hybrid plover]

40s after change

Which

[willow rain]

Real shit, why does taking a second charge of infiltrate come with a downside but zealots get a second rush for free

[tidal fox]

10 sec increase for reviving teammates in addition to gold toughness sounds like a good deal

[hybrid plover]

Honestly, I was hoping they'd keep shout CD the same

[livid sphinx]

Because infiltrate is for griefing

Kappa

[tidal fox]

ragebait talent

[hybrid plover]

But golden toughness node increases cooldown

[hollow ibex]

i see

[willow rain]

I'm not playing havoc so I'ma keep doing krak infiltrates cuz it's funny

[tidal fox]

massive?

https://tenor.com/view/ninja-fortnite-reaction-ninja-low-taper-fade-gif-1784137995500051652

[livid sphinx]

Oh jesus. I just realized this is the last 3 days until the plasma gets bent over

[tame lodge]

Ah yes

"bent over"

https://tenor.com/view/pfft-trying-not-to-laugh-laughing-holding-laugh-covering-laugh-gif-10899551814881068905

[void dragon]

people SERIOUSLY think this changes will make Plasma garbo

disgraceful

[tame lodge]

The extra wielding time might sting a little at first

[void dragon]

that one is probably an odd change, true

[tame lodge]

But basically it's just an M2 buff lol

[void dragon]

is not even like m1 is now terrible

[livid sphinx]

The video said that the cleave on m1 will be nerfed to death

[tame lodge]

18 is too high to be considered dead

[void dragon]

yes it will be stupid strong instead of stupid broken beyond understanding

is there any other weapon with that much cleave?

[livid sphinx]

I'm assuming that the primary way to use plasma will be to spam m2 but now you actually have to manage the heat to not explode

[tame lodge]

Nothing changed about m1

Except cleave

You can just spam M1 still

[livid sphinx]

Ifninite cleave is a huge part of m1

[narrow frost]

its not infinite

[tame lodge]

It wasn't even infinite

[livid sphinx]

You know what I mean

[tame lodge]

Ranged wise no
Except infinite cleave ranged

Anyways

No damage nerf mentioned

So M1 breakpoints will still remain the same

And you'll still be able to insta kill 5 dreg ragers

[livid sphinx]

Yeah true. And it will be godlike in the new mode too

[tame lodge]

If anything this is just an M2 buff

And as someone that tried M2 builds in the past

I welcome it

[livid sphinx]

I've always thought the plasma gun was meant to be played with m2 but then they fucked it up

I mean even during launch everyone thought m2 was the way to play the plasma

[deep bone]

I am very happy about the Exe stance buff

Always welcome

Infantry las got some nice buffs

Will be intriguing to try out with the new efficiency blessing change aswell

I already very rarely run out of ammo with ILAS Exe Stance so I guess infinite ammo is cool lol

https://tenor.com/view/mgs2-solid-snake-metal-gear-solid2-metal-gear-solid-mgs-gif-27578347

Gonna have to start running the bandana

MK.IIb will be quite fun to try

[livid sphinx]

Not even not doing the reload animation cancel on the plasma can fuck up exe stance anymore

[hollow ibex]

"ah yes, let's give the infinite ammo weapon more infiniter ammo" - fatshart

[deep bone]

Indeed

Brilliant

Greatest thing to happen since the invention of bread

The other buffs it got were rather epic tho

Less recoil on the IIb

And making it easier to hit targets

Will make the gun a bit less jarring to use in a panic

Gonna replace my Vigilant Autogun on my Exe stance build now

[tall torrent]

is this bait

[hybrid plover]

i think so

[livid sphinx]

Ever heard of hyperbole?

[hybrid plover]

No.

[slow sky]

theres people who think this will actually kill plasma gun so

unironically

we cant really tell

[amber vortex]

Know what this won't kill?

THE CHAINSWORD

[calm prairie]

cant kill whats already dead

[hybrid plover]

like people who think the pickpocket change will kill ranged scum

just a lot of crazy talk

[tall torrent]

if pickpocket got a long CD on top of being melee activation, prob

I think it needs like a 40s+ CD on top tbh

[gentle lake]

is heavy laspistol a good idea on vet

[dry cloak]

by heavy you mean heaviest infatry lasgun?

[thorn lark]

https://tenor.com/view/what-is-dead-may-never-die-game-of-thrones-intense-theon-greyjoy-gif-14193294

[gentle lake]

what is the nerf for plas

[dry cloak]

less cleave on left click

but charging up uses less ammo

[gentle lake]

oh thats kinda cool

[slow sky]

100 cleave down to 18 on left click
right click ammo cost from 5-9 to 1-8 based on charge
15% slower draw time

[gentle lake]

oh so right click is ok?

[dry cloak]

always was

it was simply overshadowed by spamming light attacks

[sharp epoch]

dam theyre nerfing vet hard

[dry cloak]

no

they arent

[sharp epoch]

im pretty sure 90% of vets run plasma and shout

[dry cloak]

let them cry

[sharp epoch]

and theyre shafting those pretty hard

[dry cloak]

plasma is more of a power shift

less cleave on m1 but m2 eats less ammo

shout nerf was due long ago

[sharp epoch]

shouts been getting nerfs like every big patch i think its been worse than its other class counter parts since they nerfed tac awareness

bubble and chorus were way better

[sharp epoch]

its straight up a nerf the less ammo is really not remotely the same as losing 90 cleave

[toxic reef]

shout is/was just an easy slot

fire and forget

bubble and chorus ate way too much DPS in comparison

like melee vet wants shout

[sharp epoch]

i think its just vets other abilities are trash like exe stance adds no dps its mainly for its toughness regen

if melee vet had chorus/bubble theyd take those over shout

[toxic reef]

exec stance is hardly trash, it def adds DPS but only for range

and idk if I would want to spend 10 secs locked in to chorus as vet

I barely want to on zealot as is

bubble would ofc not make any sense on vet

[sharp epoch]

You can probably make a thing that would fit vet aesthetics similar to bubble like some shield device, but I'd prefer a bubble to current shout

[dry cloak]

exe stance add fuck ton of dps on proper weapons

like vigis

helbores

sap

[toxic reef]

any precision weapon ye

in tandem with MMF

I do like infiltrate buff for the sole reason that it works great on shredder builds as is

since if you underhand throw you don't break stealth

[sharp epoch]

you probably dont play havoc do you

[toxic reef]

I do h40 with vet

[dry cloak]

havoc is a state of mind

[toxic reef]

not with shredders

just standard PS plasma vet

[sharp epoch]

I think people are gonna stop playing vet for havoc tbh the skill floor is being raised

[dry cloak]

except they wont

builds will cahnge simple as

[toxic reef]

I mean I could prob just run the same build

like shout is a bit less often, fine

I will still snipe specials with plasma, don't need inf cleave for that

[sharp epoch]

Plasma would probably be less viable too with no cleave its less ammo efficient

[toxic reef]

I mean it'll only change wallbangs prob

I'm not using plasma to kill conga lines really

and inf to 18 is still the highest cleave of any ranged option

[livid sphinx]

Hopefully they also weaken the heat build up on m2

[dry cloak]

charged up plasma has more cleave still

[toxic reef]

heat build is good tho

[dry cloak]

remember that

[toxic reef]

ye you can prob afford to do small charges now

[dry cloak]

from 5-9 to 1-8

[sly orchid]

The cleave reduction is only on m1 shots

[toxic reef]

the swap time is gonna hurt tho

[dry cloak]

one motion stock go up

[toxic reef]

I mean you run that already

[sharp epoch]

Oh yeah the function thats very clunky and adds another second ontop of the delayed shot

but gunlugger ogryn will be fun hopefully havoc viable

[dry cloak]

it wont be

[toxic reef]

yeah it's almost always taunt

tho charge can be clutch at times

[dry cloak]

charge will get stocks up

[toxic reef]

I just wish it was easier to control the length of it

[dry cloak]

stagger unstaggerables

[sharp epoch]

Charge is actually good for those armor type modifiers

[toxic reef]

I mean it will still stop on monstrosities right?

what are the new targets staggered

[dry cloak]

the buffed ones from corrupted stimms

[sharp epoch]

Dont you just press S and it stops?

[toxic reef]

ah ok

ye ig but it feels a bit wonky

[tall torrent]

it'll be fine

18 cleave is still way too much tbh

[sharp epoch]

for the size of the projectile it really wasnt that impactful

[tall torrent]

I'd have nerfed it to 6.5 or 6

18 is still very high

m2 change could be rly good if the new min ammo cost for charge shot is as low as I think

[errant bear]

It is a nerf because 40% strength can be only had when firing m1

[tall torrent]

blaze away is not even the best pick on plasma

[dry cloak]

idk i dont use plasma

[toxic reef]

rising heat and gets hot is standard on plasma

which doesn't care if you use charged or not

[errant bear]

Rising heat is just 20% strength tho

[sharp epoch]

I really dont like how clunky m2 is too they should removed the animation if its going to be part of its kit

[toxic reef]

not being able to overheat down yourself is so free anyway

[tall torrent]

if the m2 min ammo cost is as low as I think
basically they're making it so min-charge shots are actually worth going for since they hit 42~50% harder than m1, but cost 1 extra ammo and have a bit longer precharge delay

but that "hitting ~50% harder in 1 shot" actually changes breakpoints

[dry cloak]

gone from 5-9 to 1-8

for charge

[tall torrent]

yes ik

but again this is not actually telling what the new min cost is

[dry cloak]

rest might now

[tall torrent]

because u can't actually fire charged at 5 ammo

the current gun's lowest possible charge shot ammo cost is 7

[dry cloak]

lets assume its the current minimum for the sake of convo

[tall torrent]

which I'm guessing is somewhere around 50% ish charge lvl

because m1 is coded as 52.5% charge lvl

I'm also assuming that, m2's charge lvl is nonlinear scale

[sly orchid]

Make plasma gun randomly explode

[tall torrent]

if the post-buff version uses 4 or less ammo for charged minimum

then charge min is actually relevant

[errant bear]

Also math is not mathing with gets hot plasma does not have great crit scaling I think 40% strength is better than 10% crit chance and dmg

[tall torrent]

gets hot is up to 50% crit chance and 50% crit dmg

lol

[toxic reef]

FS strikes again with their wordings

[errant bear]

Huh?

[tall torrent]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3367063781

[silver patrol]

welcome to fatshark

[tall torrent]

On reaching 19% heat, and per 18% heat above, gain +4 / 6 / 8 / 10% ranged crit damage and +5.5 / 7 / 8.5 / 10% global crit chance (up to 5 stacks) while ranged weapon is in hand.

[errant bear]

That is interesting

[silver patrol]

there is a similar psyker blessing

if you read it as is, it's garbage

[toxic reef]

whenever it says scales, just assumes it means additive stacks

I usually run WS for plasma as well so you get 100% crit on first shot regardless of heat level and then you can just build up heat if you need to shoot more than once

[tall torrent]

and, if ur wondering why rising heat over blaze away
it's better to have more reliable 1 taps on important enemies for a gun with not that ammo in spare for magdumping

[toxic reef]

yeah it's usually only reapers eating a lot of shots

[tall torrent]

reaper is just 2hs

however

min-charge m2 being ~50% more dmg than m1

means u can reach reaper 1hs in h40 on stance, with other dmg buffs active, on crit hs

without unyielding dmg perk btw

[toxic reef]

huh, I always felt like they were 3 shots in h40

is it final toll?

or ig I didn't have all buffs always

and ig I'm not stance either

[tall torrent]

[toxic reef]

ye I think it's just when I'm already shooting other stuff and then target the reapers

[tall torrent]

efficiency on inf las IX next update might be peak

just did the maths

on current mag size (108), u can fire 36 shots with IX

with post-buff efficiency, that would be 54 shots (50% more) if u fire as fast as possible
idk what new mag size is but it's bigger than current

[errant bear]

I am one shotting them with my build

[toxic reef]

ok

[mystic pilot]

Huh so they've nerfed voice of command a bit by increasing cooldown from 30 to 40 seconds. But only in death had its drawbacks removed.

Oh wow no more infinity cleave on plasma normal shot. And the shark thinks the infantry lasgun's situation is poor ammo capacity???

[cunning haven]

it needs more ammo. it will always need more ammo

will withering fire +50% ranged cleave be any good?

[fickle narwhal]

is there any trick to reload faster the plasma gun?

[silver patrol]

you can cancel a part of the reload animation if you sprint or such

but it's not that muhc

[errant bear]

The moment you see the knob turning it's already reloaded

You can switch to your melee and fight what's in front of you

[fickle narwhal]

i see thanks!

[olive halo]

is the power sword a weapon that benefits from crit builds?

or are skill points better invested elsewhere?

[errant bear]

Not when I last checked

It does not have great scaling for crits

[olive halo]

alright, thank you

[silver patrol]

It's quite average at them

[formal ice]

Anything benefits from crits

[dry cloak]

But not equally

[formal ice]

But it still benefits

How much it benefits doesn't change anything

[dry cloak]

both statements are tru

[frank mantle]

FINALLY VETGODS WILL SHINE

NO MORE MELEESHITTERS

ENTER

THE RANGEDCHAD

[dry cloak]

what?

[frank mantle]

WE GO OUTSIDE TERTIUM

OPEN SPACE REQUIRES PEW PEW AND LESS HACK AND SLASH

MAKING OUR VETERANCY INDISPENSABLE

WE

ARE

SO

BACK

[dry cloak]

pal

every other class also has guns

[frank mantle]

cope

vet only runs soon

[dry cloak]

pfff dont be silly

[frank mantle]

meds

now

[frank mantle]

meds, now.

[last marten]

survivalist stacks with veterans default aura?

[tame lodge]

Fym finally son?

Ranged vet has been around already

[last marten]

i always assumed the ammo return rounded up

[tame lodge]

I'm calling you observation biased and I'm not elaborating further 🫵

I don't remember if it stacks

But I do know it rounds down

But don't worry, they save the numerals after the dot

Imagine you get 1.33 ammo back

You get 1 ammo and save .33

Next time you get 1 ammo and save another .33 so now you have .66 saved

Once the decimals hit 1 you gain 2 ammo

[last marten]

i love how well this is explained in game

[tame lodge]

[sharp epoch]

did range vet even get a buff except lasgun ammo 😭

[somber axle]

Exe Stance buffs

Baseline up to 6 sec, 9 sec with the Ogryn talent node

[tame lodge]

It wasn't needed but we ain't complaining

[somber axle]

Voice of Command nerfed with a minor buff to the revive talent node (30 sec CD -> 40 sec CD but the increased CD on picking revive shout was removed)

[tame lodge]

Gold toughness still 10?

[somber axle]

I don't think there were any other changes to VoC listed from what I remember

[tame lodge]

Ok so no biggie

[fickle narwhal]

what do you think it's better for clearing hordes?¿

[somber axle]

Oh also they're removing Get Back in the Fight to swap it with a node that gives +50% ranged cleave instead

[last marten]

power sword

[somber axle]

Power Sword and it isn't even close

[atomic void]

CANON DE PLASMA

[tame lodge]

Power Sword infinitely

[atomic void]

did u mean ESPADA DE ENERGIA

[fickle narwhal]

are those the better bleesing for the power sword?

[tame lodge]

No no
I meant Espada de energia

[fickle narwhal]

[somber axle]

Power Cycler and either Brutal Momentum or Sunder iirc?

[tame lodge]

Yeah Power Cycler + Brutal Momentum or Sunder

[somber axle]

But Power Cycler is the most important

[fickle narwhal]

thanks!

[tame lodge]

You're currently running Power Cycler and Sunder

[fickle narwhal]

what enemies should i pick for power sword buff damage? flak armoreds and crusher maybe?

[tame lodge]

Unyielding/Flak/Carapace

[floral hearth]

wasn't cleave targets the dumpstat for PS? considering special attack already had maximum cleave

[vestal lotus]

I live for the Crusher

I love the Crusher

[mystic pilot]

not just the CD penalty but the radius penalty too

[hollow ibex]

yeah cleave targets is dump

[south spindle]

Infil buffs could be interesting

[turbid ibex]

i doubt they will be enough but its better than nothing

i still wish the move speed buff lingered like the damage buff does at least

[unreal totem]

shout bug

[unreal totem]

I shouted right when the plague ogryn hit me

the shout didn't come out but the game thought it did

and bugged

[tough nova]

Shout seems like there's some input problem or sumthin. Sometimes I use it and it goes gray but the ability doesnt activate.

[trail ore]

aint using that shit for the next hour

[void dragon]

how the VoC enjoyers see the CD nerf

someone know how are the Heavy sword changes? how much is the rending from the special? can it finally kill a crusher in less than 3 buisness days?

[silver patrol]

10% brittleness irrc

so good try, but better luck next time

[void dragon]

it is first and most a horde cutter weapon, but if it can let you box crushers without taking the best years of your life it will be a good win

[tame lodge]

Apparently they are going for Bladed Momentum enabling type of deal

[dreamy vortex]

I love no pics in gen chat

I love sending shit here instead

[amber vortex]

I know, right?

[flat nexus]

Quite nice actually

very retro

[dreamy vortex]

Yeah they're tuff

They also have Mecha Godzilla, Ghidorah, and Shin Godzilla

[dreamy vortex]

Shin Godzilla actually had 2 designs

One is purple and the other is red

They also got these inverted versions where the black and other color are swapped

I think I actually like this more than black being the main color

At least for this specific one

[flat nexus]

In different colours, I could see that

[fickle narwhal]

is there anywhere to look for the vet buffs/nerfs?

[quiet lark]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQT0Sjg0u2g

i'm not sure if there's a write up with the changes

[fickle narwhal]

thanks!

[quiet lark]

np :3

[dense belfry]

I want to use Dueling sword, but it's not very good at horde clearing.
My friend wants me to use Power sword instead, but i want to keep DS for it's better Single Target damage.

What would you recommend?

[narrow frost]

Psword has better single target then DS

[dense belfry]

Much slower, though.

[narrow frost]

if you want horde clear try double barrel

[narrow frost]

in what way?

movement or time to kill?

[dense belfry]

I don't like having to power up my sword every 3 swings.

[narrow frost]

fair

most dont

[dense belfry]

Time to kill isn't fast enough for me. And there WILL be situations where u don't have a krak yet.

[silver patrol]

but it has less time to kill

[narrow frost]

Psword has the best ttk for everything

if used properly

[dapper coyote]

https://youtu.be/63Y_v5s5-KY

He hath commeth to grant us a masterpiece!

[narrow frost]

but its annoying to use with its 3 hit then charge

[fading girder]

what about the chainsword (im new-sih to the game and have little idea about gooding a good build lmao)

[dapper coyote]

Praise the emperor for such video!

[silver patrol]

down in the pits of hell

[fading girder]

aw 🙁 not meta then

[calm prairie]

unfortunately not

[narrow frost]

Use all the different weapons, see what you like. Since you are new/leveling it doesnt matter

[dapper coyote]

Lacked in armor piercing sadly

[narrow frost]

save materials by using the random weapon at the end of the mission

to experiment

[dapper coyote]

Despite it says versatile, it aint

[dense belfry]

Issue is that It's a very unwieldy weapon and i'm just sick of using it.
I want some gameplay variety, really.

[narrow frost]

as I said before, its all fine

what are looking for then

[turbid ibex]

chainsword is aight for hordes but as soon as any carapace shows up youre fucked

[dapper coyote]

Im using pfal because we have relic blade at home

[silver patrol]

relic butter knife

[fading girder]

i've leveled to 30 on vet just idk what good build is with the perk tree
i mainly use boltpistol and chainsword or combat shotgun and chainsword

[dense belfry]

Horde clear option for DS.

[narrow frost]

double barrel

[dense belfry]

Fr?

[narrow frost]

yes

[dapper coyote]

Yes

[silver patrol]

with weapon specialist

[turbid ibex]

check pinned guide for builds

[fading girder]

cheers

[dense belfry]

Build uses DS and FT for boss damage.

[turbid ibex]

DB needs weapon specialist for the guaranteed crit so it can horde clear

[silver patrol]

and to avoid that shitass reload

[turbid ibex]

true

[silver patrol]

but yeah the idea is you kill like 3 guys with melee, switch to the shotgun with manstopper, destroy an horde, switch to melee and repeat

[somber axle]

oh yeah I forgot about revive shout's radius penalty but that's true too

[silver patrol]

node so bad they are now forcing you to take it?

[mystic pilot]

?

what node are you referring to?

[silver patrol]

the revive shout

[mystic pilot]

no they removed the penalty

before if you took it, you had to take an extra 10 second cooldown and a radius reduction

[silver patrol]

oh about time

well they increased cd of the shout baseline

[mystic pilot]

so when the new update is live, it'll be no penalties at all

yeah 40 seconds from 30

so if I took VoC, I have a choice between extra toughness & staggering enemies and reviving

[silver patrol]

Can't you take both

Oh misread

[cunning haven]

i wish i could have the one on the right but black and with grenades 😔

[mystic pilot]

I like my "extra" power packs for my gun 😛

[cunning haven]

give me a pack so i dont need magazines for my recon lasgun 🙏

[calm prairie]

next rotation for another 1200 darkbucks

[dry cloak]

aquilas mate

aquilas

[calm prairie]

no

[clear mist]

so i have been useing the revolver alot and now i wanted to try a new gun (that is not plasma) anyone has anything thay coude recommend?

[turbid ibex]

helbore

check sniper build on pins

also has a double barrel build

[clear mist]

sniper build you say that sounds fun wil give it a try thanks alot ^^

[turbid ibex]

just dont forget to melee enemies that get too close

it might be a sniper build but it'll still be about 25% melee gameplay unless you have extremely cracked players for frontliners

[clear mist]

that sounds like it wil fit me since i tend to stay in the back and pick off specials

[warm swallow]

Is psword any good?

[hollow ibex]

no

it's literally the best melee in the game

[warm swallow]

Damn

[hollow ibex]

calling it just good is a bit unfair

[warm swallow]

Idk ive been using knife since launch

Just got one from gift with 60 mobility

[hollow ibex]

knife def mogs PS in terms of mobility, but PS is unbeatable in damage output

[warm swallow]

What blessing and perks

Also does mark matter or just preference

[hollow ibex]

6 is objectively superior

carayielding and brumentum/sunder + power cycle 4

[warm swallow]

Sweet thank you

[hollow ibex]

it's not the easiest weapon to use

make sure to block cancel charges

which you can only do on the 6

once you learn the weapon it's godly tho

[warm swallow]

Icic

[turbid ibex]

power sword dumps cleave targets, not mobility

[hollow ibex]

mob is ok as a dump

but yeah replace with cleave targets later

if you have resources

[warm swallow]

Oh really?

[turbid ibex]

barely any difference in cleave numbers between 60 and 80% and mobility is like the one weakness power sword has

[narrow frost]

<@&735928989146939404> another account got hacked

[tired ember]

thanks for the ping!

[sharp epoch]

I think mobillity should factor in how good a weapon is and ps mobility is dogshit

[serene bough]

Mobility balances psword

[hollow ibex]

mobility is already factored in 😉

[sharp epoch]

I haven't seen a h40 solo with psword lets just say that

[hybrid plover]

That's not a good metric of whether a weapon is good or not at all

Because solos are not the normal way to play this game as is.

[sharp epoch]

the best metric is winrate playing at peak performance which a weapon that can win a h40 solo should be at the top of

[hybrid plover]

That's a horrible take, ngl

Because by that metric, knife is singlehandedly the best weapon in the entire game because you can just cheese the entire run

[last marten]

running past all the enemies with knife heavy

[sharp epoch]

what would the best metric be? dps?

[hybrid plover]

But we know. That's not how the game will actually play out in actual practice

[last marten]

my favorite metric is joy and happiness

[sharp epoch]

have you seen killing floor 2 strats, its all about mobillity if youre too slow you get fried by undodgeable hits

[hollow ibex]

why would there just be one single metric?

[hybrid plover]

Is this killing floor 2?

Lmao

[hollow ibex]

melee weapons especially are expected to perform multiple roles

[sharp epoch]

It's a horde shooter its pretty similar

[last marten]

fatshark buff the ogryn shield

[hybrid plover]

What are we doing here bringing up a completely different game?

[hollow ibex]

it's not even a tide game bro 😭

[hybrid plover]

Come on.

[undone grove]

OK I haven't played in like a year why are we putting long numbers in our names

[hybrid plover]

I don't even like power sword but I cannot ignore how abrasively powerful it is and the mobility is simply a balance check to make sure it's not ridiculously busted

Also

Numbers are friend codes

[last marten]

my fatshark id

[undone grove]

power sword
is powerful
doesn't like it

[hybrid plover]

Because I think it's boring.

[undone grove]

well design the interestingsword

[hybrid plover]

The relic blade is right there.

[hollow ibex]

i think psword is actually a pretty interesting weapon

[warm gulch]

power falcion better imo

[hollow ibex]

requires a decent amount of practice to use

but obscenely powerful once you learn it

[warm gulch]

true

[hybrid plover]

I think it's just the lack of variation in the moveset for me

It's one note to me

[tame lodge]

Yeah
Remember the Fatshark logic
Powerful = boring
Fun = weak

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/get-rotated-get-rotated-idiot-rotate-rotation-shark-gif-24511062

[serene bough]

I was baffled when I learned sharks love to be rotated

[mighty python]

How's this infiltrate build looking? This is gonna be for expeditions, and the weapons I plan to run are the combat blade and recon lasgun

[tall torrent]

why so many talents in the middle

[mighty python]

That segment is similar to my main build but its got two extra talents in there for stealth combat: covert operative and serrated blade

[brave acorn]

You should be taking the toughness node on the right at least

[tall torrent]

u shud only get serrated blade if u go knife

field improv + covert operative both dropped

[mighty python]

I literally said I am lol

[tall torrent]

go middle, get 25 toughness + 20% ogryn/monster dmg

[tall torrent]

yea, so drop the unnecessary stuff

[mighty python]

Gotcha

[tall torrent]

u also don't need close quarters killzone

[sonic kayak]

IMO I actually enjoy rapidly switching to the PSword, turning it on, ganking some asshole who thinks he can get the drop on me, and then back to shooting

Plays perfectly into the hybrid playstyle that is Vet

[hollow ibex]

i don't mind it but i know a lot of people hate it lol

[sonic kayak]

It has a unique identity to it that perfectly fits Vet

[sonic kayak]

I don't mind you

[serene bough]

I do dislike hitting the power button every 3 swings on the sword

But falchion dmg too doodoo to use in place of it

[hollow ibex]

falch damage isn't that bad

it's the bad moveset, lack of stagger and long downtime that are the issues

naturally none of that was addressed in the buff

[frigid kite]

Pardon me, but can anybody tell me the Dump Stat on Helbore and Plasma Gun?

[hollow ibex]

stab for helbore

@tired egret for plasma

[feral jetty]

is that account litearally just for that name

[hollow ibex]

tho you can dump charge if you can't get a good plasma roll

[hollow ibex]

yeah some chad

[feral jetty]

holy moly

[hollow ibex]

sacrificed his account for this

[feral jetty]

based

[tame lodge]

I wonder who that Chad is

[hollow ibex]

yeah no clue

i assume it's an alt

[frigid kite]

wtb Favoriting as soon as you purchase a grey

[mighty python]

How's this looking now?

[tall torrent]

it's ok

[mighty python]

Ty

[frigid kite]

so close!

i mean... on one lol

[hollow ibex]

i spent 2.5m and never got a perfect

just a 70/70 lol

[mighty python]

Melted this daemonhost

[torpid grotto]

Amazing 🔥

[orchid nova]

Hot take

Reduce Voice of Command CD to 18~25s

Then make the gold hp talent increase it to 40s

And probably have the revive also increase it to 40s but not stack, both just set to 40

It'd be really funny to just not run either and have shout constantly spamming

[hybrid plover]

This is not a hot take

I think this is a completely valid take actually

Golden toughness should debuff cooldown

[hollow ibex]

yeah i wouldn't mind a shorter cd for no gold toughness

could actually be interesting

[hybrid plover]

it would actually make not running gold toughness worth doing

and that's kind of why they decided to nerf shout as hard as they have to begin with

it's not about shout itself

it's the golden toughness they're trying to keep in check

when the solution to that issue is so ridiculously simple and they keep missing the mark

[slow spade]

yeah VoC is basically a guaranteed 2 point cost now

at this point just slap Duty and Honor as a built-in upgrade

[turbid ibex]

shout at a base of 25s cooldown, each subnode gives it an extra 10s of cooldown, give it more subnodes for more buff options you can give to allies

[mighty python]

Best blessing to pair with uncanny strike on a combat knife?

[turbid ibex]

like one node that gives strength/damage to allies in coherency and another that gives move speed and removes weapon movement speed penalties

[turbid ibex]

flesh tearer iirc

[mighty python]

Ty

Are weakpoint hits always guaranteed crits or nah

[turbid ibex]

no

[mighty python]

Gotcha, ty

What about the best blessing to pair with infernus on the recon lasgun?

[turbid ibex]

dumdum

[mighty python]

Ty

[turbid ibex]

recon pretty much always runs dumdum deathspitter

[hollow ibex]

dumdum + infernus

[turbid ibex]

infernus

idk why the fuck i said deathspitter

[mighty python]

Lol no worries

Thx guys

[hybrid plover]

nah revive can stay without a downside i think

golden toughness however

nuke that shit

[turbid ibex]

i mean yeah unless they gave it some other upside

like idk

uhhh reviving someone with shout cures one wound of corruption but they cant be shout revived again unless theyre manually revived at least once?

[hybrid plover]

i am not anticipating obesefish to code something like that

[turbid ibex]

me neither

its just that 25s cooldown for insta revive anyone in a 9 meter radius feels like it could be a bit too good idk

[tall torrent]

I am somewhat excited for infiltrate buff ngl

I remembered that

this is the 1 ult on vet that u genuinely don't care abt subnodes for

[hybrid plover]

yeah but you have to understand, that node only gets value if someone does actually go down

and that's if you can actually reach them, which sometimes won't be able to happen

[turbid ibex]

eh fair enough ig

i just want more teambuff nodes for shout

[tall torrent]

and it's the same 40s CD as the other vet ult that also gives u back full toughness

[hybrid plover]

also lingering 30% damage for 8s now

thats

actually fairly significant

[turbid ibex]

its 20% uptime now instead of just slightly over 10%

huge

[hybrid plover]

kinda means melee vet may actually have a new go to

since shout's nerfed

[tall torrent]

it's gud dmg but vet CDR still worst of all classes

[tall torrent]

yea, stance

for the stun & slowdown immune

[hybrid plover]

that's not new at all

:(

[turbid ibex]

what even is slowdowns

[hollow ibex]

like standing on fire hazard

[turbid ibex]

i see

[hollow ibex]

idr what else there is

oh BON sludge

[mighty python]

The forbidden tapioca pudding

[hybrid plover]

i absolutely hate this

thanks

[mighty python]

https://tenor.com/view/lerolero-itswill-do-this-dance-cat-hands-dance-gif-15634157831569175603

[gilded wraith]

It should really extend dodge slides.

[tame lodge]

Uh

BoN goo already removes friction

Aka

Hold slide on goo

https://tenor.com/view/cop-cop-slide-cop-falling-off-slide-cop-flying-off-slide-gif-1653893110919650229

[gilded wraith]

Learn something new every day.

[turbid ibex]

what about hold slide on bad

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/michael-jackson-gif-18075574

[tall torrent]

No

[tall torrent]

When you get hit by a melee atk, your move speed is reduced

It’s very easy to get snowballed into taking multiple hits because of this

[hollow ibex]

oh it doesn't affect that?

lame

[tall torrent]

Slowdown is specifically melee attacks slowing u down

It is quite useful to be immune to it

[hollow ibex]

i guess hazard slowdown is a different slowdown

which of course is very clearly explained in the game

[gentle lake]

Wait wtf

[tame lodge]

@gilded wraith

[gentle lake]

[tame lodge]

do not slide on the goo

https://tenor.com/view/1984-gif-19260546

[gentle lake]

Thats liquid corruption mf

[tame lodge]

spicy drink

[mighty python]

Slip and slide!!

[errant carbon]

Now I'm imagining a Tzeentch monster that spews wacky fluid that messes with physics in random ways, like the different paints from Portal 2 (except more so)

[last marten]

😹

wtf im doing thsi from now on

[dry cloak]

this is your weakpoint

[tight cave]

i saw that people got insane dps from recon lasgun, i already get that the ammo for it never ends but i currently dont know how can i kill carapaced enemies

[blazing jetty]

Take Iron Will

[dry cloak]

how old are the videos rem player

[lean basin]

it's that impactful?

[tight cave]

maybe i should upgrade infernus perk or i miss something?

[dry cloak]

YES

[lean basin]

alright then

[tight cave]

videos of what

[dry cloak]

Videos of darktide on yt

with recon lasgun

and from who

[lean basin]

should I maybe swap superiority complex to the +15 toughness above iron will?

[tight cave]

oh i didnt based on them, i tried to look for builds on website and not videos

[blazing jetty]

Onslaught talent is a must if you want to kill carapace with recon

[dry cloak]

yup

and even then you shouldnt shoot crushers

[tight cave]

https://tenor.com/view/writing-notes-checklist-spongebob-squarepants-gif-16129592

onslaught?

got it

thx

[lean basin]

oh yeah nah I am staying far away from them lmao

I have a boltgun, I'm going to use it

[dry cloak]

not you pal

jade

[lean basin]

oh, oops

[dry cloak]

you should'nt

[tight cave]

oh daaaamn, i dont got enought talent points to make the build work

[lean basin]

I shouldn't?
chainsword is that good against them?

[dry cloak]

YES

[lean basin]

[dry cloak]

there are few weapon on vet that allow for ranged crusher deletion

[tight cave]

lvl 23 vet, maybe bolter or plasma gun build are better for me in this case?

[lean basin]

gotcha

[dry cloak]

why do you think that

[dry cloak]

also kraks exist

[toxic reef]

you don't need to optimize too much until you're 30

[tight cave]

cant get onslaught without sacrificing infinite lasgun ammo and crits

[dry cloak]

chord is serviceable

[toxic reef]

just get by until then and start working towards better stuff after that

[blazing jetty]

Level up more then

[lean basin]

I should swap to them
I was on frags just because I was trying to get some penances done to then never touch them again

[dry cloak]

you ahve 7 perkpoints to be earned

[dry cloak]

pal. if you are using recon lasgun you shoul be using kraks

[toxic reef]

just run kraks and use melee for now

[tight cave]

i use them

they are good

[dry cloak]

then you dont need to shoot crushers with recon lasgun

at that you SHOULD'NT shoot crushers

[tight cave]

i got the grenade regen and grender perk

[dry cloak]

very good

[tight cave]

but the issue is that i cant deal damage to karnak bosses, im currently trying to move on missions. Maybe i should just pick random ones and get some levels? On other classes i could kill them without any problem, and suddenly i have them on vet

i could do something with bolter, but reload is just comically long and i cant get the bolter to be more viable on my stage

[dry cloak]

eh

let me help you

you have 30 minutes now?

[tight cave]

is plasma gun still viable? As i remember it was killed multiple times for past 4 years or so

[dry cloak]

WHAT?

where you get this info? your ass?

[dry cloak]

pal i want to help you with the twins

[tight cave]

like join or give me some advice?

[dry cloak]

join

i asked you do you have 30 minutes now