veteran-class

[torpid sundial]

afaik it only works if the enemy is full hp and hasnt taken damage from any other source including your own DoT or whatever

its so stupid

lmao

[tame lodge]

Your own cleave damage distribution messes with the proc condition

If your teammates look at the enemy direction you lose proc condition

[primal zealot]

wtf

[tame lodge]

Yeah

The enemy has to be at 100% of his HP when you 1 shot it

If you can already 1 shot it so Decapitator ain't doing much for breakpoints

If you can't 1 shot it
Decapitator is dead blessing

[azure narwhal]

You can turn it off in darktide interface settings. PerilFX intensity

[slender elm]

oh

let me look at that

[tame lodge]

It's really unfortunate because 120% finesse is really juicy

https://tenor.com/view/thirsty-spongebob-i-dont-need-it-sweat-gif-5031443

[slender elm]

nice

i can turn it all the way down

yey

[unreal nova]

Btw, for additional info, that also turns down certain effects like zealot's crit keystone when active. Doesn't do shit for the stim supply effect or stim use for those though.

I had a harder time noticing when I was in crit mode setting it to like 15% lul.

[slender elm]

i mean, they are very distracting anyway and im used to checking my buff bar...

like, i used to raid ff14 and its like, lmao buttons and icons on half the screen

all the while getting blasted by vfx

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIEPzH6zsgg

[unreal nova]

Ah, telling you just in case. Considering it's labelled like it only affects psyker peril lul.

[slender elm]

all of them are fucking distracting

so whatever lel

[lyric path]

fuck this takes me back

The Bozjan Southern Front

[mystic pilot]

Bloodletter blessing? So you can still use chains word for horde clear and do something to armored enemies.

[slender elm]

just take yer damn psword and go -_-

stacking bleed isnt even that good on crushers without rending

[azure narwhal]

Not necessarily just for crushers, it's basically just a good tool for finishing a job you're too busy to deal with. Same reason you take puncture on bistol.

But i personally take shred and wrath an chsword

Chain weapons have good crit scaling

[slender elm]

yeah but you aint expecting to shoot a crusher like twice and then expect him to die

[azure narwhal]

Do not underestimate bleed stacks

[slender elm]

i dislike the puny special on chainsword

also dont bleed stacks wear off

[azure narwhal]

Of course, otherwise it would be OP

But it's easy asf to stack

You don't have to let it play out yknow

You can special for a bit

Dodge out of it

Go do smth else

Repeat

That is, if you use bloodletter

If on shred you're just fishing for those sweet crit specials

That actually do damage

[slender elm]

spending stam and a dodge just to do some bleed doesnt sound good to me

[azure narwhal]

The most easily obtainable resources known to man

Also doesn't consume stam to just special attack something

All you gotta do is dodge out of the special

[slender elm]

im not sold on bloodletter ngl

that and i just run krak if i have difficulty dealing with armor

[azure narwhal]

Then use shred n wrath

Kraks won't carry you everywhere

If you're not familiar with the mechanics of your weapons and how to buildcraft them

Relying on kraks will only cement bad habits

What will you do against rotten armour

[surreal sentinel]

Chainaxe>>>>Chainsword.

[slender elm]

well im not currently running krak

im just using chainaxe

[azure narwhal]

All chain weapons are peak

Evisc is my favourite

[surreal sentinel]

Indeed.

[polar rain]

I need to grab the evisc onto my zealot ive been hearing a lot of good things about it

[surreal sentinel]

My Veteran build is a pseudo-Doomguy build. Plasma Gun, Mk. XII Chainaxe, Krak Grenades, and Infiltrate.

[azure narwhal]

It's pretty peak and all keystones work well with it

[azure narwhal]

Nice. You can run WS double barrel to really doomguy it up

[surreal sentinel]

I would, but I just like the Plasma Gun too much to let go.

[azure narwhal]

Lol understandable

I've been loving focus target plasma lately

[surreal sentinel]

You aim at target and then it's no longer there.

[west dirge]

How are you guys liking the power sword? It feels so clunky to use even with block cancelling.

No doubt its good though, just feels so bad to use compared to ds or dagger or even shovel tbh

[lyric star]

yeah it's extremely strong but I hate using it

[distant plaza]

i'm not good with it, loathe using it
i'd rather be using other weapons tbh -_-

[tough nova]

I share these sentiments. Obviously very effective but boring as fuck.

[tame lodge]

It's literally the best generalist melee in the game

That's how we are liking it

We 100% understand that it can be annoying to use

But it is what it is

[west dirge]

Understandable

[lyric star]

most matches I loosen the valve on my copium canisters and use the power falchion instead

[sonic kayak]

It's clunky but the tradeoff is that it's an immense strong melee, even without Trench Fighter or WS, that can deal with mixed hordes, armor, and bosses fairly quickly

Before the Crusher buff it used to kill Crushers in one combo

Even up to like... Havoc 38

[sonic kayak]

Favorite Zealot weapon

I use it even in Havoc, I love the feeling of dueling with it

[quick shell]

it can be a bit clunky but it's pretty much the strongest melee in the game

It's one of my favourite weapons so I enjoy it

[distant mural]

You can still one shot crushers with evis.

[jolly sparrow]

Heavy evisc is my love forever, feels so nice to use and not completely useless against armored foes

[jolly sparrow]

How

[distant mural]

The charge ability and a rev will one shot a crusher

And stealth prolly too.

[jolly sparrow]

Oh

[distant mural]

But i dont play atealth

[jolly sparrow]

Im martyrdom zealot

[distant mural]

Yeah you can still use the charge with martyrdom.

[jolly sparrow]

Yeah but I also use preach

[distant mural]

I prefer it over book anyway more fun.

With eviscerator atleast

[jolly sparrow]

For me book is great, I like helping my team

[distant mural]

Try the charge with eviscerator youll prolly love it.

[jolly sparrow]

I sure I would book just does it for me

Charge is too selfish imop

[distant mural]

https://tenor.com/view/preach-gif-25534417

[jolly sparrow]

I want to be a helper

[distant mural]

Nah its not selfish.

Killing stuff is usefull too.

You might have a veteran with shout in the team allready or smth

[jolly sparrow]

Yeah but killing stuff won't make your team invulnerable while stunning all enemies in the area, creating space and giving time

Sometimes there's too much stuff in the moment and creating that small window to regroup can do wonders

[dapper bison]

best full auto gun?

[hollow ibex]

prob vraks IAG

[tame lodge]

Vraks5

[frigid rover]

laspistol with an auto switch :)

[dapper bison]

ty

[frigid rover]

ive fallen in love with laspistol lately

[mystic pilot]

shovel and laspistol is so mobile

[frigid rover]

so slick! so mobile! and the ads isnt garbage which is nice.

unlike ~95% of sights in this game

[sonic kayak]

Yes but they've changed the way sawing works, PSword remains the same

[distant mural]

Can relic blade 1 shot?

[sonic kayak]

Probably

It can boss nuke

[distant mural]

Im not sure

I mean so can evis

Without the use of shroudfield

[sonic kayak]

Yeah but you can 2-3 tap bosses in Havoc lol

Evis has good boss damage but not that easily

[distant mural]

Yeah i mean a lot of wapons can do that with shroudfield

[sonic kayak]

But the RB has no trade off

[distant mural]

Whats the evis tradeoff?

It has both excellent horde clear and single target dmg

[sonic kayak]

You need setup to get it off the ground and IMO needs Perfect Strike to deal with mixed hordes

[distant mural]

Nah

Wrath and shred

[azure narwhal]

Perfect strike dogs on wrath

Any day of the week

[sonic kayak]

not for Havoc

[distant mural]

Ehh

[azure narwhal]

You can literally cut through crushers and maulers

It is widely known knowledge

[distant mural]

Iill just ine shot it anyway

[azure narwhal]

Past h30 wrath evisc falls off in utility

[distant mural]

Yeah sure nothing beats the relic blade.

[sonic kayak]

Well.. it's very hard to lol

You can block cancel the run attack

[azure narwhal]

I mean, we're talkin evisc but sure

[distant mural]

We were mainly conparing the two

[jolly sparrow]

Yeah I reckon when there's too much armor he can't shred through much, what about heavy evisc

[sonic kayak]

I personally don't like the RB that much tbh, I'm an evis guy

With that bring said, RB is easier to run with less setup

[azure narwhal]

Evisc is just a short way to say heavy evisc so uhh.. same weapon

Chsword doesnt have perfect strike

If thats what you mean

[jolly sparrow]

Whats perfect strike

[distant mural]

Blessing

[azure narwhal]

Blessing that allows you to ignore hitmass on crit

[sonic kayak]

Also if you're running Perfect Strike, then you can combo with Bloodthirsty, which is more clunky

(It's not bad, just tedious)

[azure narwhal]

Yeah, then again tbh its not worth the loss of shred. Crit specials do just as well, and piety + scourge + shred + innate crit reach south of 80% crit iirc

Which is a fair gamble

[sonic kayak]

Idk man, you might like Bloodthirsty

Guaranteed PS is pretty nice

[azure narwhal]

I, in fact, do not

[sonic kayak]

[azure narwhal]

Kekw

[sonic kayak]

I used to run Shred but I think I've been converted

[azure narwhal]

I mean, thats fair

Its still an accepted evisc blessing

[sonic kayak]

Activate a light, chew a trash mob, and now you have a guaranteed crit

[tame lodge]

No rager group stagger

[distant mural]

True

[sonic kayak]

Crit hits stagger ragers, but I don't remember if that's only Auric and if it applies to scabs

[tame lodge]

Group

[jolly sparrow]

What does hitmass do

[distant mural]

You can stagger a single one but not multiple

Yeah

[sonic kayak]

In a PS swing?

[distant mural]

Evis

[sonic kayak]

I know, but assuming we're using PS

[distant mural]

Idk

[sonic kayak]

(Perfect Strike)

[distant mural]

It might

[quick shell]

hitmass is how hard it is to cleave an enemy

[distant mural]

Havent ised it in a while

[quick shell]

ergo ignoring hitmass means u cleave more

[jolly sparrow]

Okay thanks, what is precision damage?

Cuz there's weakpoint damage and then precision damage

[distant mural]

Honestly no clue

[sonic kayak]

Crit lights will stagger but I don't know if it's only Dregs, and if that threshold is met in Havoc

[sonic kayak]

What's the context? Where do you see this?

[distant mural]

Dt has so many confusing damage terms

[jolly sparrow]

Its just wep mastery giving some "precision damage"

[umbral scaffold]

If memory doesn't fail me, ignoring hitmass still won't ignore the target cap for damage

[jolly sparrow]

Melee weapon mastery upgrade

[umbral scaffold]

I'm not sure how it works for the stagger and effects like bleed on attack tho

[sonic kayak]

[distant mural]

Weakpoint is damage on weakpoints.

No clue what precision is tho

[umbral scaffold]

I remember it because back in the blue eviscerator's launch people were mentioning cleave as a dump stat due to the lights only being able to damage like 4 enemies or so

Something could've changed between all the way back and now, of course

[sonic kayak]

They removed the cleave cap

For all chain weapons

[distant mural]

https://tenor.com/view/dancing-happy-dance-praise-break-scoot-around-the-rosey-gif-7077314785910770857

[sonic kayak]

Except the Mk 4 chaxe apparently

[distant mural]

Yeah

Heresy

To treat whs most iconic weapons like that

Truly disgracefull

Like out of all weapons

Why does this have a cleave cap

Not the knife tho

Or the toothpick

[sonic kayak]

Or the RB

[distant mural]

It has a cleave cap?!?

[umbral scaffold]

The knife is uhhh the uhhh

It just slides around a lot

True true

[distant mural]

Ik the knife still wont cleave a lot but its still weird to me that it has no cap while the most cleavy weapon in wh does

[narrow yacht]

so what weapon would be the best to try and do "marked for death" with?

[distant mural]

Spearhead boltgun

Or hellbore

Anything big dmg precise and single shot.

[narrow yacht]

spearhead has a secondary action that's not just the bash?

[distant mural]

Its just aiming

[dapper bison]

is running no keystone on vet a normal / havoc 40 thing?

[distant mural]

Special is what u think of

[hollow ibex]

no

[dapper bison]

ty

[hollow ibex]

there's little reason to go no keystone now imo

[narrow yacht]

oh yea that makes sense i did get those 2 confused

[dapper bison]

just witness a vet with that in havoc T-T, not even field improve

[distant mural]

Yeah just hit 4 headshots in a row basically while aiming.

[narrow yacht]

does it need to be 4 different enemies or can i just dump 4 shots into a single crusher's head and get it?

[distant mural]

I think it can be the same as long as you hit.

It might be easyer to just kill 4 gunners in a row tho with volley fire.

[fresh nimbus]

Has anyone else felt like...suppression is affecting the Vet or am I just getting some weird server instability while ADSing

[jolly sparrow]

I don't even understand what suppression does

I don't feel any difference

If im being shot at or not

[hollow ibex]

vet has innate suppression immunity

that's why

[fresh nimbus]

^

[jolly sparrow]

Well even not on vet

Does it work like in vermintide?

[fresh nimbus]

I mainly feel it due to the weapon I'm using. You wouldn't feel it on like a recon lasgun or something with a large projectile

But trying to ADS a bolter is already iffy cause of the recoil

I'm only asking cause I know some stuff is going on due to snipers and trappers tagging me through walls, lag on inputs here or there, not getting the backstab sound when being attacked, etc. But I also noticed my aim as of late has been randomly thrown off more than usual so I was just curious.

[narrow yacht]

multiple times today when i switch weapons to push a burster or hound the game un switches my weapon as soon as i hold right click and that never really happens to me, could definitely be a server instability issue

[fresh nimbus]

Yes that has happened often to me to the last couple of days.

I'll go to swap and instead pull out my bolter and shoot it...which is great for bursters. And just last game i went to do a push and it just...didn't push for no apparent reason.

I'm just glad I'm not crazy. Bad at the game I can handle, crazy is another thing lol

[umbral scaffold]

Field improve is such a weird thing for vets to not have nowadays

[hollow ibex]

not really

serrated blade is a valid pick too

ultimately it's just picking between the less shit tax node

[umbral scaffold]

I would suggest:

• Recoil Fix https://www.nexusmods.com/warhammer40kdarktide/mods/430
• Crosshair Remap https://www.nexusmods.com/warhammer40kdarktide/mods/253

Unless they fixed bolter's recoil, which I wouldn't know because I don't play unmodded

Crosshair remap allows you to slap a crosshair on ADS, which can have times when the weapon's sights doesn't match the shot's direction, such as dodging

[umbral scaffold]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-magic-spell-gif-2056698596529947774

[orchid hemlock]

Nah, field improv is pretty useless in normal games

Well not useless

[umbral scaffold]

I'm a big fan of the fast healing, corruption cleansing and grenade refill

Specially when it works for the team's deployables and not only your own

[orchid hemlock]

But the value of it is determined by how much people are using those extras

[quick shell]

field improv is a generally low value node yeah

it has use

but it sees use like once or twice a game

[orchid hemlock]

Corruption is sorta non existent except in chem toxin modifiers

[quick shell]

if you could skip it you kinda would

[quick shell]

unless on havoc

in which case it's fairly common

even then

field improv isnt a reliable counter

u want a crate scum or a beacon zealot

[orchid hemlock]

And grenade refill is sorta determined by who you have in your team and if they are using them effectively

[quick shell]

yeah

vet sort of rarely cares

their grenades are all somewhat low impact and they regenerate them, themselves, at a pretty good rate

[orchid hemlock]

The only classes I can think of that would like grenade refill anyways is Ogryn and Scum

[umbral scaffold]

These things open space for riskier plays and resource dumps

[quick shell]

yeah that's basically it

Arbite with shock mines and dog might care, but if ur using shock mines, why are u running dog

[azure narwhal]

Tbf it's still quite good QoL and even and can be an offenensive tool (shredder/krak spam), or ogryns/scum spam that's not difficult at all to grab. You'd just path down into serrated blade, which let's be real, not a lot of weapons ever care for. It's just some extra DoT with exceptions ofc

[orchid hemlock]

Assuming your team actually is aware of doing that is a big if

[umbral scaffold]

I can understand people skipping everything like crazy in the auric matches I play because people kinda just got used to not depend on consumables, but at some point they start treating the consumables like some kind of hindrance and it's weird

[quick shell]

i mean yeah it's a forced tax node

[orchid hemlock]

More damage is better than no damage

But all 3 choices are bad anyways

[quick shell]

the issue is

if ur reliant on consumables that much

in havoc

ur fucked

because there are not enough resources for every wave in havoc

[orchid hemlock]

Some weapons like the bleed more than others, but it's always more damage

[umbral scaffold]

It's not about being reliant, it's about having tools and using them

[azure narwhal]

Yeah but the game isn't just how much damage you can pump out simulator, because that assumes you and the team are playing perfectly

It's the same with zealot's revive

Sure, it's a tax for elite dmg

[orchid hemlock]

That's an argument against supply then

Because it's only value comes from using the Regen of the nades effectively

[azure narwhal]

But revive speed is good

[umbral scaffold]

I won't stop functioning without a red stimm, but I know I'll deal more damage with it and will use it in a situation where I think the risks could be diminished by using it

[distant plaza]

ever have a hive scum do the equivalent of mag dump with their bazooka on a pox walker horde
and just tear through a field improv'd ammo crate four times in less than 30 seconds?
never taking that node again >.> would prefer the little bleed stacks instead if i have to pay a tax node

[quick shell]

that has nothing to do with the node

[umbral scaffold]

Same thing when I find a yellow stimm on my stealth vet: recharging my toughness refills and aggro drops is not something I can't play without, but I know how to make good use of it

[azure narwhal]

That's an argument in support of it, i'm saying that some passive form of support is good, especially when it's so easy to grab

[quick shell]

well

u need either a low impact damage boost

or a low impact support boost

[azure narwhal]

Ppl gonna get burstered, gonna take corruption chip, etc

[quick shell]

and it's really just whatever u prefer

[umbral scaffold]

A lot of people just practice the same meta over and over and I find it neat to squeeze value out of the things I have

[orchid hemlock]

Also I question its value in havoc too

Since in havoc you may need to use the crate twice due to the ammo debuff, so using it just to replenish grenades is detrimental to your team

[quick shell]

yeah u want it for ammo not nades

the nades are just a bonus

[orchid hemlock]

Its much more valuable for the corruption removal at that point to prevent deaths

[hybrid plover]

Just run tac axe so you can use both

[umbral scaffold]

Stuff like using assail to stagger ragers and save darts in a tough spot, smite to knockdown because I can follow up with damage, infiltrate to reposition against a rager crowd, FOTF to simply interrupt an enemy without really having the immediate intention of killing them... the game has plenty of stuff that works outside of the more obvious intention

[azure narwhal]

I feel like the only mf who like taxe better than caxe

[umbral scaffold]

It's a bar fight game

[azure narwhal]

I intend to keep it that way

[umbral scaffold]

Fatshark likes giving you chairs

[orchid hemlock]

"meta" in Darktide isn't nearly as structured as people try to make it in social media

[hybrid plover]

It's one of the very few melee you genuinely don't need trench fighter for

[azure narwhal]

Yep

Lowk

[hybrid plover]

So you're free to go field and serrated if you wish.

[azure narwhal]

I like it better in general

Lol

Moveset, looks, all of it

[umbral scaffold]

It's not, but you'd be hard-pressed to post a build and not find people criticizing at least something, like how I play without iron will and immediately set off alarms in people's heads

[hybrid plover]

Okay. To be fair.

[azure narwhal]

LMAO

[hybrid plover]

Iron Will is uh

[umbral scaffold]

Sure, I'm not no-lifing havoc and honestly don't care for it

[orchid hemlock]

Uh 💀

[calm prairie]

yeah because iron will is a no brainer to take

[orchid hemlock]

Yeah that is trolling ngl

[hybrid plover]

It's that talent.

[orchid hemlock]

Don't you HAVE to take it now 💀

[azure narwhal]

OK WAIT 1 SEC

[umbral scaffold]

It's by being that talent that I don't care for it

[azure narwhal]

THIS IS LIKE THAT ONE CLIP

[hollow ibex]

bros doing a hive scum roleplay with his vet

[azure narwhal]

I JUST GOT BULLIED FOR BEING GAY

YEAH ITS ABOUT TO HAPPEN AGAIN

[umbral scaffold]

I also don't take force of will on arbites because of the sheer brain-off gameplay it creates

[calm prairie]

not quite but almost, you COULD just take trench fighter or elite damage

idk why you would

[orchid hemlock]

No like you HAVE To take the talent to get thru the tree now

[calm prairie]

yeah you don’t

[umbral scaffold]

[calm prairie]

oh my days

[umbral scaffold]

I'll keep doing funny shit and nobody can stop me

[calm prairie]

there certainly will be stopping but not by your fellow players

[umbral scaffold]

I have been making a point to play melee vet and melee psyker since the times talents were still 3 choices in a column

[calm prairie]

since friendly fire isn’t a factor

[narrow frost]

friendly fire?

ah

kk

[calm prairie]

yeah I wrote that and it made sense to me then I read it

[umbral scaffold]

I might not have the best knowledge of the game's code, breakpoints and other minmaxing stuff, but I have been practicing the unorthodox shit for quite a while

[azure narwhal]

I see you're having a hell of a time expressing yourself with the new names

[umbral scaffold]

My whole drive is making it work

[calm prairie]

you don’t need to do all that to realize iron will is 100x the value of that movement speed node you’re taking

[azure narwhal]

Ya earned it

[hollow ibex]

https://tenor.com/view/stop-it-get-some-help-gif-15058124

[umbral scaffold]

I don't care about iron will's value, or rather I don't take it because I know of its value

[narrow frost]

yes

[umbral scaffold]

I want the rush of not having it and the feeling of succeeding without it

I like how it pushes me to improvisation

[hybrid plover]

"No, you don't understand. I like CBT more than anyone."

[calm prairie]

that is certainly a choice to make

[umbral scaffold]

I mean, I guess, but I seriously consider iron will to be overkill

The flabbergasted reactions people have just make me happier about not taking it

It was the same kind of thing people would say about playing melee psyker in the past

I did and got pretty decent at it

[hybrid plover]

Melee psyker was low-key good though.

Even before all the buffs.

Like I get what you're saying here but I don't think it's quite the same thing either.

[umbral scaffold]

Melee psyker helped me with a lot of fundamentals, since I wasn't inherently a tanky-ass mf and my survivability against ranged attacks was directly tied to attacking stuff

I learned how to play like a rabid animal with psyker

[distant plaza]

inb4 play with zero talent points invested

[hollow ibex]

the real og melee psykers are the ones playing melee psyker before FGS came out

[umbral scaffold]

It's about people underestimating something without quite getting where it's coming from

[hollow ibex]

i don't think people are underestimating iron will tho?

[umbral scaffold]

They aren't

[hybrid plover]

Thing is, and this is not even coming from a meta perspective.

[umbral scaffold]

I'm talking about underestimating how people can play without it

[hollow ibex]

you can

[hybrid plover]

I do not see what could really be worth trading something as significant as Iron Will for.

[umbral scaffold]

It's the same reactions of "oh no, how can the player do this"

[hollow ibex]

but why would you besides enjoying CBT

[calm prairie]

I mean you can load into a match with 0 talents invested and your starter white weapons

that’s a challenge run

[umbral scaffold]

5% movement speed

[hollow ibex]

yea just do that

[umbral scaffold]

I know I said I take iron will partially for the rush of not having it, but that's the problem I'm talking about: iron will is an extra that people can work just fine without

[calm prairie]

well yeah the whole tree is

people do auric maelstrom with no talents and white weapons for fun you can find it on youtube

[umbral scaffold]

Goes back what I said about people not understanding something and still wanting to voice against it

[calm prairie]

I think it is understood perfectly that people want to use a stronger build so they take iron will

[umbral scaffold]

I know you won't get it and the exaggerated analogies are part of it, but I like talking about it anyway

[hollow ibex]

i mean it's also just annoying pathing around iron will

it's literally in the middle of the tree

[umbral scaffold]

By that logic, we could just do a knife special run because everything else is "extra", but it's obviously not what I'm talking about

[calm prairie]

that conflicts with the last thing you said here

[umbral scaffold]

I'm more annoyed by taking iron will

[umbral scaffold]

The only conflict is you not understanding it

I can try to explain it, but it's also up to you to try to understand it

[calm prairie]

uh no I understand what you’re saying I just think it’s silly, especially since you’re just dismissing opposing viewpoints as ignorant

[umbral scaffold]

It's not about opposing views being ignorant, what the hell?

[hollow ibex]

quite frankly idc that you don't take iron will

but i don't want to hear it

it's one of those kinks you should keep to yourself

[calm prairie]

this

[distant plaza]

i take marksman's focus and never use my ranged weapon
like a good zealot

[umbral scaffold]

I understand why people take iron will, I obviously recognize it's a great talent, but I've already explained why I take it

[umbral scaffold]

Because you are ignorant

You take things I said and turn them into an exaggerated comparison

By calling iron will an "extra", I clearly am not trying to say that everything else is an extra and that we can just do extremes like playing the game without any of those extras

And, as I already mentioned, I simply consider iron will to be overkill for what I'm doing

And, as I already mentioned, I play on auric and have no concerns about havoc 40, so I can't really speak on that part

And, as I already mentioned, you're ignorant.

[calm prairie]

whatever you say

[umbral scaffold]

Everyone else is fine, I just kinda don't like you in specific right now

Anyway:

[mystic pilot]

look like veteran bomber build is what I have to get for that Infiltrate penance when I want to do it

[quasi jasper]

How to be less squishy? I can get lots of damage out and can kill everything, but once I get swarmed Im downed rather quickly. Im trying to block and dodge and Ive increased my health, but I feel like im doing something wrong when it comes to melee. Any tips?

[narrow frost]

toughness stack and dont get hit

toughness only has toughness damage reduction

[quasi jasper]

So prioritize toughness over health. I suppose that makes more sense.

[narrow frost]

also have multiple sources of toughness regen to make sure you keep your TDR

[mystic pilot]

have a good horde weapon

you dont need just one thing, but many things to avoid being swarmed under

[dry cloak]

Shredders help

[quasi jasper]

Ive been experimenting. So far the heavy sword does pretty well. I haven't tried the mace yet

[dry cloak]

Heavy sword has good hordeclesr

Shock maul has vey good stagger

[mystic pilot]

did you do pushes when blocking, Goat?

[dry cloak]

Quite good hordecleat

[quasi jasper]

Yes.

[dry cloak]

But it wont kill fast

But wont fail you

[mystic pilot]

its mainly to stagger them so you do more damage or give you time to switch to something or yeet grenade

[quasi jasper]

Back to the toughness thing, if having better toughness and toughness regen works better than having more health, what is the advantage of increasing health?

And I've been running the shredder grenade with grenade regen

[hollow ibex]

some of the most dangerous enemies in the game bypass toughness

[distant plaza]

are you familiar with your chosen melee weapons horde clear combos?

[quasi jasper]

I was totally unaware of that

[dry cloak]

This

[quasi jasper]

Please tell me more?

[mystic pilot]

its in the guide

for heavy sword

[distant plaza]

you mentioned heavy sword so:

[hollow ibex]

game doesn't tell you of course

[distant plaza]

source: the pinned guide

[dry cloak]

For heavy sword. Speaking from experience. Lightspam for trash. Heavy spam for mixed

[quasi jasper]

This makes so much sense

[dry cloak]

Mk9 hs🤮

I fucking hate it

[mystic pilot]

just make sure you're looking at the right Mark

[dry cloak]

Moveset does not work for me

[quasi jasper]

Oh they changed among models. Wonderful..

[mystic pilot]

yeah also different performance

Helbore has three marks

[distant plaza]

if you're not aware, you can freely switch between unlocked marks

[mystic pilot]

and each are different

one is faster but less damage, one is middle ground and one is slower but more powerful

[umbral scaffold]

It's heartwarming to watch someone being fatsharked

[quasi jasper]

Who'd have thought that playing a Warhammer game would require so much memorization... [sarcasm]..

[mystic pilot]

usually switching marks require you to reach a certain level in mastery for that weapon

[quasi jasper]

This is helpful. Thanks peeps!

[mystic pilot]

but yeah check the guide

it will also give you down lows on the marks differences for each weapon

heavy laspistol has only two marks but one is faster shooting and the other is a bit slower but a bit more damaging per shot. The first mark is just better because....faster

also different magazine counts

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/pfft-trying-not-to-laugh-laughing-holding-laugh-covering-laugh-gif-10899551814881068905

[umbral scaffold]

And different ammo per shot

I have no idea why they went with that system for laser weapons, but I guess they wanted to simulate battery usage?

[mystic pilot]

I mean they could had just fixed the "battery pack" capacity at same amount for all las guns but they didnt

[distant plaza]

i'm kind of surprised there isn't a mod out there that converts the las guns ammo usage into shot counts

unless...can numeric ui do that? 👀

[tall torrent]

wouldn't work well because ammo gains are based on ammo

and would lead to decimals a lot

[quick shell]

how tightly packed do they need to be for this

[spice osprey]

big fuckass watermark

[calm shard]

kill whoever that is spamming pings

[quick shell]

the oggy

he was good

but yeah

annoying

[umbral scaffold]

STEELSERIES MOMENTS

DOT GEEGEE

I hope you guys threw the ogryn out of the airlock later

I am a ping chad

I try to kill the important thing

If I don't, I ping it

Most things die before the ping because I am an unflinching death machine

[quaint valve]

Is the consensus to run 3 toughness curios now?

[quasi jasper]

I run ability cooldown...

[quaint valve]

I mean for the main stat

[hollow ibex]

1 of each except wounds

3 toughness will make you very vulnerable to enemies that bypass toughness

[tame lodge]

Just get 200 HP and invest in whatever after

[unreal nova]

So, technically 2 toughness, 1 hp would work.

[hollow ibex]

i did run that for a while too

but i find having one stam to be preferable

[slender elm]

what

is there even a warhammer game that doesnt need braincells

[tame lodge]

I think

I think that's the joke

[unreal nova]

Think it depends on weapon choices.

[hollow ibex]

i run one stam on all my builds now

[unreal nova]

I mostly do because knoife lul.

[umbral scaffold]

I path to the stamina delay node

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/waow-based-wow-thinking-doodle-gif-12262272166408784207

[crisp cloak]

What is actually the use case of the plasma gun? Is it for groups? For big targets? It seems really popular but whenever I’m using it it feels underwhelming

[tame lodge]

M1 spam elites specialist hunter

[crisp cloak]

Oh so you aren’t even supposed to charge it

[tame lodge]

Yeah

Also don't shoot Crushers

[calm shard]

gunners and specialists

[crisp cloak]

But if it’s just for specialists wouldn’t the helbore be nearly as efficient while having way more handling

[calm shard]

plasma gun pierces more enemies than helbore does, doesn't take as long to draw, and isn't as heavily reliant on left tree investment

[crisp cloak]

Wait plasma gun has faster draw?

Maybe I will have to try it some more

[hollow ibex]

plasma draw is pretty fast, for whatever reason

[opal plover]

it also shoots a truck sized bullet with 100 cleave

so it's really easy to snipe a trapper or bomber through a lot of mass

[narrow widget]

the bolter in question

NVM I just read the context

don't shoot the crushers

[opal plover]

something like the bolt pistol or the hellbore will struggle to snipe a trapper through a crusher clown car train

[calm shard]

you shouldn't be shooting crushers with a bolter either on most builds

[opal plover]

you can spam the m1 down a hallway to do some ok damage aganist a bunch of mixed stuff as well

[narrow widget]

ok but that's not as fun

[tame lodge]

Plasma and Helby do compete with each other

If you want to be dedicated marksman then Helbore

If you want quick delete that direction then plasma

[sage oriole]

what is the best unga bunga melee weapon for vet

[tall torrent]

Power sword VI

[sage oriole]

activate every time?

what perks, flack and maniac?

[tall torrent]

Check pinned guide

[tall torrent]

Always

[sage oriole]

i said perks tho

[tall torrent]

Yea it’s in the pinned guide

[sage oriole]

i see it talk about blessings

[tall torrent]

It has perks

[sage oriole]

oh, unyielding and carapace? thought itw as for horde clear

[orchid hemlock]

it's for everything

[sage oriole]

ok. I desperately need my havoc diamontine drop

[hollow ibex]

tbh

[sage oriole]

using purply atm lol

[hollow ibex]

for unga bunga weapon rashad's prob better

even if PS is stronger

PS isn't the easiest weapon to play

[distant plaza]

anything but power sword

[frigid rover]

plasma
quick
what

[hollow ibex]

the draw is quick

[fresh nimbus]

Omg the server stuff is driving me crazy. I love pulling out my melee for my boltgun to come out instead or the push not engaging lol.

[hollow ibex]

https://www.nexusmods.com/warhammer40kdarktide/mods/331

this can help

though it's not 100%

[fresh nimbus]

You know it's l33t gaming when you need a mod to make weapon swap work properly

W40k bethesda

[quasi jasper]

Todd Howard would be proud

[sage oriole]

mmmm yes tac axe - i like this unga bunga

[sage vector]

is chainsword/spearhead(boltgun) a good combo for vet??

[sage oriole]

chainsword aint great in general

[sage vector]

what would you recommend??

[sage oriole]

if you want hack and slash, tac axe

[sage vector]

okay thanks!

[fresh nimbus]

I use chainsword and boltgun...its...fun but it hurts

The chainsword is usable but seems just under par when a horde (especially mixed) is putting your face in. And the special is usable exceedingly sparingly. The Boltgun is good it's just so unwieldy unless you have a rocking team. Most of my deaths are usually from 1 or 2 chaff coming up behind me and two shotting me in the back while I'm special clearing and an unwieldy weapon doubles down on that annoyance.

[bold sierra]

I use chainsword pretty decently often with Bolter in Havoc 40s. Chainsword/bolter IS great for vet. Of course chainsword isn't going to win the best horde-cleary melee or crusher-killer, but it is a CHAIN MELEE and chain melees are insane for Captain/LT shield, and it being chainsword has a pretty decent horde-clear capabilities.

it fills in the niche for Captain/LT shield-shredding while also good at general horde stuff with good mobility. Bloodletter can be nice for Maniacs and dmg-stacking on boss too, and damaging Capt/LT through their shield.

[bold sierra]

chain melees are the best at Capt/LT shield-shredding tho, very useful in Havocs, tho I suppose if you don't play Havocs then it's whatever i guess, but Chain melees with Bloodletter are generally not bad at dmg-stacking on bosses. Chainsword does have a nice spot in terms of Havoc.

that said, it'd still be nice if FS buff chain melees a bit more, at least for chainsword, in the future

[sage oriole]

ya havoc is captain fest

[fresh nimbus]

I mean for bosses but that's what I mean by sparingly.

It's usuable, not horrible, but feels a bit under par at times is all.

Though dodging a charger then ripping him always feels nice.

I really wish the special was just, "Rev Up - All attacks have bleed for 10 seconds" though that would likely be op as all hell

[bold sierra]

it's not going to beat Power Sword in terms of Crusher-killing, general horde-clear and stuff, but it IS superior to deal with Captains and LTs, Powersword is a dang drag to go through Captain/LT shield. Also, it does have good mobility compared to PS.

[fresh nimbus]

Agreed

[bold sierra]

I wish it applies brittleness by default, or rending with the rev specials tbh

[fresh nimbus]

That would be great too

The special is awesome looking snd feeling...just doesn't match the momentum of the rest of the game.

[bold sierra]

1 brittleness stack per rev dmg instance would be balanced imo

[bold sierra]

it's AMAZING for specific situations tho

w/ Bloodletter, it is pretty nice vs Ragers with I'll say, rev for 1 tick, dodge away, bleed out Rager

[quasi jasper]

Power sword or heavy sword for horde clearing?

[bold sierra]

Power sword is better IF you can handle basically having concrete blocks for shoes.

[quasi jasper]

Elaborate? Power sword is slower?

[bold sierra]

probably the melee with the lowest mobility stats for Veteran + when you activate the special you're more or less ANCHORED for a split second, especially with Mk6, Mk3's not too bad.

less dodges and low dodge distance, lower stamina

[quasi jasper]

That makes sense. I tried the devil claw for a while because it seemed faster, but I could only operate against the horde. Plus, I never parry

[fresh nimbus]

New idea, the power chainsword. Every tooth has a power field. The heretics are doomed.

[bold sierra]

played Vet shovel + doublebarrel with weapon specialist in H40 just now...gotta admit, it is pretty fucking good.

[hollow ibex]

DB going hard 🔥

[sage vector]

okay thanks for all the information!

[urban blade]

I miss this aspect of the using the chainsword the most lool

[split folio]

Aight Braced Autogun or Infantry Autogun?

For general use

[bold sierra]

infantry autogun

[split folio]

Y tho

[narrow widget]

brauto 🥀 🥀

[bold sierra]

you can aim and pick off targets from afar reliably, have VERY good crit and headshot multiplier, good reliable blessings

[narrow widget]

fuck ahh gun can't even aim properly 🥀

[slender elm]

im jsut running ilas...

[split folio]

Wait what’s the difference between Vraks pattern and Agrippina pattern InfAutoguns?

Wait is it just an even more overblown Columnus

HOLY CRAP

BRACED AUTOGUN WHO

VRAKS-PATTERN INFAUTOGUN MY BELOVED

[slender elm]

?...

[split folio]

Wait… but what about Vraks-pattern BRAutogun?

[slender elm]

they're bodyshot guns

[split folio]

Nvm BRAutogun is still shit no matter the pattern

[slender elm]

not sure what you're looking for

[split folio]

Oh no I was just making notes on the effects of different patterns of certain autoguns

[slender elm]

merely a choice between shooting faster or slower for br auto

[sharp epoch]

I feel like it kinda is the same role as inferno psyker but less utility

[bold sierra]

lowkey yeah, here's a lost game I had an hour ago lol

[lyric path]

fucking hell the sheer amount of blood, enemy corpses, pollution and dead mechs rimworld this is

[dense kite]

I gotta say, the power falchion is probably my favourite melee in the game

[lyric path]

pretty awesome melee just needs a buff really

[dry cloak]

what mods

[dry cloak]

base is good

[tepid otter]

But.. hear me out. Shovel

[dry cloak]

just a small pick me up

[dry cloak]

recently completed VQE ancients and VQE deadlife playthrough

[calm shard]

I dunno man a power weapon needing rending to just be okay into crushers is kinda not good

and it has low stagger

[crude wind]

got a build?

[tepid otter]

That skeleton perk tree people are sharing doesnt deviate much from almost any vet build i noticed

[fair shale]

Cause all of vets good perks sit in bottom right for the most part

Vet might as well have a "the build" currently

[tepid otter]

what mark people use on the DB

[calm shard]

and here my dumb ass is going left and middle

smh

still take reciprocity tho

this isn't really a zealot scenario

just because you only play "The Build™" does not mean that veteran only has that one build

[fair shale]

I like FT but tbh I don't think it's very good

[calm shard]

I don't use FT I use MMF

infinite toughness regen exe stance

[fair shale]

You said middle mf

[calm shard]

I said left and middle

I've been dropping Desperado and Skirmisher from my usuals for rending/bring it down since they're being more consistent for me on most wepaons

I just forget to use skirmisher, and I'm only meleeing trash enemies that desperado ain't super useful for anyways

[fair shale]

Rending only matters on some weapons ime

Combat and Vigi

Being prime examples

[fair shale]

Sorry, idk, don't run it

[lyric path]

VOC is a crutch

[bold sierra]

man I dont even take the 10% rending for that, it kinda doesnt make that big of a differene anyway, I just spam the push-follow L1 until Crusher dies.

PSabre having good mobility really helps a lot. Played it with infantry lasgun and exec stance with smokes a while back and got 2nd dmg in H40

[fair shale]

use what makes you happy

if you're h40ing with ilas and PFalc youre better than most people here

[bold sierra]

i lowkey do think ilas is pretty underated tho lol, tho it does require more effort

[calm shard]

I think it's pretty correctly rated

It is ultimately just a direct downgrade to helbore/laspistol of your choosing

Which isn't like bad

But why take it intentionally?

[fair shale]

Because they like it

Oh my god you arent using the busted helbore? Perish the thought.

[calm shard]

well also the laspistol which is functionally the same gun

[bold sierra]

1. Ghost blessing
2. it has higher fire rate than Helbore and doesn't require charging, while still 1-2shotting Gunners from afar
3. has very good ammo economy, I dont even take Shocktrooper with it lol
4. has inverted dmg-fallout like Helbore, which laspistol doesn't have so it's good for ranged-picking

But also yeah, mostly cuz I like it too

also laspistol's ammo economy is kinda meh, it has better dps I agree but, yeah it kinda burns through ammo and suffer at longer ranges

[silver patrol]

very nice, now lets see its damage against elites

[calm shard]

makes up for it with higher base crit xd

it has less ammo but it also consumes no ammo more often

[fair shale]

I genuinely respect the fuck outta people who use what they like

[bold sierra]

yeah but you more or less need to take Shocktrooper with it, while I usually don't need to with ilas, saving 2 point slots

[bold sierra]

has pretty good maniac dmg, believe it or not I use it a lot for Dreg Ragers, kill them in like 3 shots lol, and at range, kills Gunners in 2-3 headshots. Lots of ammo help with letting you pick off basic shooters too without feeling like you're wasting ammo for trash

[calm shard]

oh no I'm taking MMF anyways might as well grab shocktrooper

yeah Ilas has absurdly high maniac damage'

p sure Mk VII can still one shot havoc 40 dreg ragers

[quick shell]

Hey that’s me only the weapons I like are the good ones so I just can’t stop winning

Made a vet originally to use p sword and plasma so that’s what I use

[bold sierra]

yeah I more or less take either Focus Target or WSpecialist, mind you I have played Ilas with MMF before, it works really well too, but I find more value from the other 2 keystones for it. Works better on laspistol tho cuz you're mostly close-ranging anyway

[quick shell]

I mean ilas can kill crushers with mmf

[fair shale]

Basic bitch taste

[quick shell]

Plasma guns are fucking cool

So are power weapons

[fair shale]

My favorite vet gun to this day is the agri IAG

[bold sierra]

here's my build for it, curioses are 20%hp 20%hp 17%toughness

[sudden cedar]

Why so much HP, if i may ask?

[bold sierra]

bring my HP above 100 so I dont die from poxburster lol

[sudden cedar]

I see, in that case, one HP Curio should be enough.

[bold sierra]

believe it or not, it gets tough from ppl exploding them

[bold sierra]

yeah but I like to have a bit of leeway I suppose, I do change it out sometimes...having a bit extra HP helps surviving flamer and bombers a bit better

I also got 40% flamer resist in there

[sudden cedar]

For what difficulty is that meant to be?

[bold sierra]

Havoc 40

[sudden cedar]

Do you have problems with Gunners shooting you down?

[bold sierra]

actually no...tho it MIGHT have sth to do with dodging bug currently but no, psyker bubble was sufficient enough. Here's the game I had with it

[sudden cedar]

Ah.. the Bubble, i see why you'd not take Gunner Resistance.

[bold sierra]

oh I do have gunner resist

[sudden cedar]

I usually play without it because it is not necessary.

[bold sierra]

in all 3 curioses

[sudden cedar]

Ooooh so you stack, i see.

[bold sierra]

I just also have 2 20%flamer resist

yeah

[sudden cedar]

You can remove one of those Gunner Resistance, because you don't get 60%, more like 48%.

[bold sierra]

I still get shot at by Gunners, but nothing some dodging and positioning wont help lol

[sudden cedar]

(here we go again)

[bold sierra]

wha

[sudden cedar]

Yes.

[bold sierra]

no kidding?

wow

[sudden cedar]

Nope, truth.

[fair shale]

Let me find the message

[bold sierra]

wow

[sudden cedar]

[bold sierra]

WHAT

bruh

[vivid agate]

So about the Zarona Combat Shotgun, is it worth it over the Agripina?

[fair shale]

Ime no mainly cause the slug is that good

[vivid agate]

Thats how i'm inclined to think

[primal zealot]

i love math class in arby chat. always a fun time

[fair shale]

Thats ainz math tbf

[bold sierra]

i mean it's still better than 2 20% resist by like 12%, no xD?

[vivid agate]

But sometimes someone have an obscure information that gives at least a gimmick

[fair shale]

I think it's worth running 3 personally

[sharp epoch]

3 revive speed curios is the best imo

[bold sierra]

yeah I run it on zealot, the amount of absolute solo clutch revives I have had with it...

OOO Boi

[sharp epoch]

next I like toughness or sprint efficiency

good with scum too

[bold sierra]

i'm surprised we dont see more scum with rocket launchers...it's lowkey like THE BEST blitz for scum honestly, it basically trivializes Heinous Rituals lol, and got that immediate clutch potential that chem nades dont have

[vivid agate]

Without revive speed you cant revive while being targeted by a near mutant/sniper

[bold sierra]

also rocket launcher is great for revives

[fair shale]

My default is 3x toughness, 3x revive speed, 3x gunner resist

[vivid agate]

Nah, Chem Grenades are THE most stupid blitz in the game

[sharp epoch]

yup its the best blitz base, the windup/pullout time is kinda bad if you're packed in tight though

[sharp epoch]

yeah its probably one of the most impactful perks you can take for curios

[bold sierra]

in theory, if the big boi enemies stand in the puddle long enough, but usually it ain't the case, kinda does nothing to bosses too, especially captains/LTs cuz their shield block the chems (unlike bleed/fire). Rocket launcher just got better immediate effects and utilities. It's more or less 4 ogryn frag bombs lol

[primal zealot]

its way more than 4

[bold sierra]

the amount of times my buddy of mine who plays scum has saved the game from clowncars of Crushers and Ragers by blasting a rocket, or one-shotting a Ritual at like 99% is peak. Whereas Crushers and Ragers would just walk right pass the chem nade puddle. But each has their own uses no doubt

[bold sierra]

im talking about the rockets

[primal zealot]

yea its way more than 4 nukes

[vivid agate]

Frag bomb doesn't hold a candle to the Launcher

[primal zealot]

its a huge middle finger to ogryns

[vivid agate]

Does frag bomb even kill crushers anymore?

[primal zealot]

it never did

[silver patrol]

yeah

it's really bad for what it's supposed be the biggest boom

[vivid agate]

XD

[primal zealot]

its been comically underpowered forever

and still the only good ogryn grenade cus the box is completely useless

[silver patrol]

nah box is great relatively speaking

[sharp epoch]

i think box is pretty good

[vivid agate]

At least the box is also a rock

[silver patrol]

all three suck

but i'd rather have rocks or the box

[bold sierra]

tbf lol, Hive Scum is by design more in-tuned with their blitzes than other classes, kinda like how chem nades are basically just more or less better immo nades (except for having elss unyield dmg and not being able to dmg Capt/LTs through shield).

Right now rocks are kinda Ogryn's most useful blitz, for mutants

[primal zealot]

if a whole box full of grenades cant even take our a few maulers its shit

its a box of gas station firecrackers

[silver patrol]

yes

[bold sierra]

it can apply burn stacks with that one talent, so it probably can, or at least almost.

[primal zealot]

tbf fartshart cant stand the idea of ogryn having anything good

[vivid agate]

At least the rock kill mutants and are infinite, anything that delete mutants is a plus

[vivid agate]

"Did i catch you wantig to be shit?"

[primal zealot]

at the cost of an enormous point tax lmao

[sharp epoch]

Rocks not one shotting specials in the body feels kinda bad even if it kills muties

[bold sierra]

I already play Grenadir Gaunlet with Point Black Barrage with burn stacks, dealing like way more dmg than Psyker's fire staff, so it's not that bad for me xD

[primal zealot]

even so the aoe of the individual grenades is so small its unlikely to put a meaningful number of stacks on anything

[bold sierra]

Grenadier Gaunlet's AoE isn't really that bad, it's wayyy bigger than how tight-knitted most hordes are anyway

does add up to with Point Blank Barrage's burn stacks

and with Lucky Bullets yummers

[vivid agate]

Well at a certain point the five billion enemyes have to occupy the same square, so

[bold sierra]

yes

[vivid agate]

enemyes lmao

Back on the shotgun talk, is it true that The Zarona ADS has an increased minimum pellet count and higher finesse?

[vivid agate]

Whatever they were smoking when adjusting these numbers I want it far away from me

[silver patrol]

this is why payday 2 is better

a single pellet hits? the entire wrath of god falls on the enemy

[vivid agate]

As it should be

[silver patrol]

and just like in real life, there is no difference in damage between one pellet and 10 pellets hitting the same enemy

[calm shard]

I could take a single shotgun pellet and die

[vivid agate]

Well kinda

But worse of all

The combat shotguns sounds like a plastic toy

[tame lodge]

I could take 18 pellets at point blank distance and survive

https://tenor.com/view/eggs-egg-built-different-im-built-different-smash-gif-27648548

[charred halo]

which recon las is the best with stance

[dry cloak]

6c

[calm shard]

XIV

[dry cloak]

yeah

[calm shard]

highest base damage so it benefits the most from exe's damage boost

[dry cloak]

i can see that

[calm shard]

also has cleave

fires slow enough to function with deadshot+MMF for infinite ammo

[livid sphinx]

Do people use competitive urge?

[acoustic cape]

Sup guys, picking up again my old vet, I was wondering what's good currently other than the plasma ?

Any fun mobile and pewpew build that's still good ? Did the infantry autogun get nerfed since a year or ?

[azure narwhal]

Infantry autogun is still very good. You can run around with vraks. Though there's plenty of good choices now with all the keystones being fairly strong. Mmf helbore, inf autogun, combat shotgun, focus target recon, weapon specialist zarona revolver, double barrel, etc...

You get the point more or less

As for current build skeletons i suggest your refer to the top pinned guide so you get a general idea

[acoustic cape]

👍 thanks

[azure narwhal]

Welcome

[distant plaza]

sounds like a scam

[faint beacon]

<@&735928989146939404>

[quasi jasper]

I love the infantry autogun because it can penetrate armor and put damage on anything. I am however frantically looking for ammo drops around every corner.

I was running recon lasgun for the DPS but I couldn't do anything to the armored big guys. Before that I was doing the helbore but I found it was too slow.

Or perhaps Im wrong? Has anyone had success using the infantry lasgun or the recon lasgun on armored enemies?

[azure narwhal]

Neither recon or infantry autogun are weapons which are used against carapace. You can try to do so with onslaught and general rending sources vet has to offer however, you will end up wasting many talents on trying to force a weapon to do something it does not do well in the first place. Solution? Melee. And realistically, you'll only have to worry about doing so with crushers, anyhow, since do not forget, maulers/plasma gunners have flak bodies, scab ragers have flak heads.

As for ammo economy

It's not much outside the realm of doing more damage and aiming for heads when you can, so you shoot less. This is why you take marksman's focus keystone on inf autogun and focus target kystone on recon

Plus uh, recon can shoot forever with shock trooper, so this is more for infantry autogun's case

[mystic pilot]

If your weapon can't heavy armor. KRAK GRENADE!

[tough nova]

Armor is a weakness of those ranged weapons so take a melee weapon or kraks to offset that weakness.

[mystic pilot]

https://tenor.com/view/the-simpsons-throw-grenade-explode-gif-10217204

[tough nova]

With the grenade on elite kill talent you are pretty flush with nades.

[mystic pilot]

plus kraks have an "automatic armor seeking" ability

soo fun to see it in the practice shooting range bouncing from target to target for the heaviest armored one

[narrow widget]

melee the armored enemies

[tall torrent]

bring an anti-Carapace-capable melee weapon

[native hamlet]

is serrated blade good for power sword? i feel like you would usually wipe what's infront of you before the bleed could do something notable

[narrow widget]

power cycler sunder or brumentum

[willow siren]

@faint beacon sell me a vigi autogun build

[tall torrent]

With sunder, against large groups of elites, it’s ok

Because it’s damage that ignores cleave distribution

[faint beacon]

Give me 2 hours I’m off work

What keystone though

[willow siren]

fair

i dont actually have a huge preference. i'm fine with all 3

that said the pace of weapon spec is probably my favorite

and you get value from a single point

[faint beacon]

You’d probably prefer Columnus III then

Crit String + Uptime of crits etc

[dry cloak]

imo vigis work better with mmf

but you know the guns better than i do

[faint beacon]

Well yes seeing they want finesse

[tall torrent]

U can just take the havoc build in the pinned guide

[faint beacon]

But you can still use the other keystones and they still very much do their job

[dry cloak]

yup

[willow siren]

oh right vet has a guide now

see last tiem i sersiously played it only ogryns had a guide worth anything

[tall torrent]

The “havoc” build in there is really just a generalist setup

[willow siren]

all in all i want to paly less scum. after doing my 100 games penance on it i've decided that class is 100% the easiest class to do well on baring psyker and it's bullshit

(but i dont like psyker at all so who cares

so i've one point left to decide on taking: exhil takedown, nade tinkerer or rending strikes

[quasi jasper]

Made tinkerer

[willow siren]

obj the correct choice if i dont want to grief my team

[hollow ibex]

unless you're taking smoke

[quasi jasper]

I want the stealth build to work. Trouble is, my key inputs can only be so fast.

[willow siren]

nah trust, i need that double duration

[tall torrent]

What’s ur overall tree looking like

[willow siren]

i was looking over the sniper build

[tall torrent]

That one is made specifically for helbore

And laspistol ig if u go pure ranged

[quasi jasper]

Sniper build so slow

If they added a bolt action rifle, then I think sniper build would be better

[hollow ibex]

mk5 with weight of fire is basically an ilas but not shit

and mk4 uses uncharged shots most of the time anyway

[tall torrent]

Nah u just partial charge

[hollow ibex]

yeah yeah that's what i meant

[turbid ibex]

Partially uncharged shots

[tall torrent]

It still uses the charged attack template

[hollow ibex]

actually fully uncharged shots might work with MMF

[tall torrent]

Not worth

[hollow ibex]

i prefer Mk V anyway

[tall torrent]

Mk IV’s quick shots have worse damage than the other two’s

[hollow ibex]

rip

[tall torrent]

It’s actually a different atk template

[mystic pilot]

Maniac
Unyielding
Flak

which two on Infantry lasgun, Mk VII

[dry cloak]

helbore mk5

[mystic pilot]

didnt say helbore. I said infantry lasgun

[dry cloak]

helbore mk5 is the best ilas

also pins

and the guide

[serene bough]

flak+maniac

[tough nova]

I finally got around to reading your guide and wanted to thank you for putting this together. Extremely comprehensive must have taken forever. ❤️

[hollow ibex]

i think path has been working on this one for more than a year

[mystic pilot]

the list was COPIED from the guide

it list three but not which two to take

[tall torrent]

[serene bough]

you choose between higher dmg vs muties/ragers or bulwarks/reapers

[mystic pilot]

thank you

[serene bough]

ragers and muties imo more meaningful

[mystic pilot]

I always krak Bulkwarks, surest way to one shot them

[serene bough]

yeah its mostly just for reapers

but ifyoure running ghost they're not a threat anyways

[tall torrent]

I'll be adding other human classes to it as well

[quick shell]

that's literally what helbore does

[mystic pilot]

yep the bolt action version of the lasgun

slower firing but hit harder than infantry lasgun

[quick shell]

yeah there's no real difference between having to charge vs having to pull the bolt each time, outside of, having to charge you can shoot early if you need to

[quasi jasper]

Fair enough

[mystic pilot]

The only trick is learning which ones can be taken out by an uncharged shot (weakspot hits if you can do that) and which ones need partial or full charged shots

And that does vary by mark hah!

[sharp epoch]

one you can make it ready to fire on a moments notice the other you gotta charge it before you can use it

[quick shell]

true

a longlas or laslock wouldnt really fit into the game though

[mortal horizon]

can anyone give me the 'meta' h40 vet build right now? (using plasma most likely)

i havent redone my trees since they forced reset us

[wraith locust]

2 points for whatever you like

[quasi jasper]

How did you get a screenshot of the entire tree like that?

[hollow ibex]

gameslantern

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/build-editor

[quasi jasper]

Ah.

[quick shell]

1 because tinkerer

[quasi jasper]

Huh. My build is pretty far removed from the current meta

[wraith locust]

true, tinkerer is quite good and i take it

[quick shell]

tinkerer is mandatory for kraks

[wraith locust]

yes, but he might not be taking kraks

[quick shell]

i feel like if ur taking plasma

u want kraks

[wraith locust]

i do personally

but idk what he was taking so i just added the bare minimum

nade was meant to be interchangeable

[steep flower]

No field improv

[quasi jasper]

How/why is the Shout so powerful? Haven't tried it so I dont quite understand

[quick shell]

it's just easy to use and good utilty and survivability

[quasi jasper]

Hrm

[wraith locust]

yellow toughness

is very strong

[quasi jasper]

Hrmmm.

[sonic kayak]

Not even just the golden toughness, the stagger is good

Frees people from grabs

Interrupts attacks

Unless you're dealing with Final Toll

[thorny egret]

low cooldown as well

can use it all the time

[hollow ibex]

ledge bosses

VOC is basically a get out of jail free card

in a really bad situation? just press F and you win.

[sonic kayak]

🤝

[quasi jasper]

Frees people from grabs..?! OK, I need to try this

[sonic kayak]

Dogs, Mutants, Chaos Spawns

You can Interrupt trappers before they fire their nets too

[quasi jasper]

Including self? Like can I press F when I get grabbed?

[sonic kayak]

Oh, no

[wraith locust]

just press f if you think you're about to

[sonic kayak]

But time it properly and you can interrupt them before they grab

[quasi jasper]

Sounds like it makes horde clearing real easy

[sonic kayak]

If you hold F down you can see the radius

[wraith locust]

it does but it can also become a crutch

clearing a horde without taking any hp dmg is pretty important to be able to do

[quasi jasper]

I pay vet cus I want to shoot things, so Ive always gone with executioner stance. But melee vet is starting to sound appealing

[sonic kayak]

If you can't hold your own in melee, VoC won't do that much more for you

Melee vet is immensely strong

[quasi jasper]

How does it compare to melee zealot? At game release Zealot was the hit things and run class

[steep flower]

I pay vet
Mencenaries huh?

[quasi jasper]

Oh, didnt see the typo

[sonic kayak]

Vet has pure damage, Zealot is all situational (bleeding, critical, backstabbing, etc)

[quasi jasper]

Interesting...

[sonic kayak]

Definitely give it a whirl

It's just more game skill to learn, that you can use for other classes

[mint remnant]

that smoke grenade penance is staring at me...

I'm not sure I've ever seen a veteran using smokes in-game

[sonic kayak]

Smokes are good and the penance is easy

[mint remnant]

are they?

[sonic kayak]

Absolutely

[mint remnant]

I feel like I'd rather just throw a frag to kill the enemies instead of temporarily preventing them from seeing me

[sonic kayak]

Well, that is usually the better case

But in higher density moments, like playing Havoc, smokes can help a lot

They turn off shooters, dogs, and trappers/flamers need to walk up to you to attack

Shooty Twin ends up doing nothing but throw mines with smokes

[mint remnant]

this just occurred to me but do smokes pair well with executioner stance? because you can use the ult to highlight enemies through the smoke?

[sonic kayak]

Preference IMO

I use them on my main build with VoC

I'd say there's merit to that though

[mint remnant]

I may give it a try

[sonic kayak]

They're basically bubbles that don't get destroyed

As for the smoke penance, you just chuck a bunch of them into enemy hordes

Use the nade regen talents

[mint remnant]

yeah

[sonic kayak]

Doesn't have to be shooters btw

You can chuck them into poxwalker hordes

[quasi jasper]

Smokescreen with recon las rifle. Hrm...

[wraith locust]

smokers are good if everyone has the mod

[tall torrent]

Check pinned guide

[mint remnant]

oh word?

[quick shell]

bro forgot marty exists

[quick shell]

the issue is, that's the dangerous part of rodin

[sonic kayak]

I didn't forget situational

[quick shell]

the gunshots are really ultimately inconsequential, the problem is he will cover the ENTIRE map in it