veteran-class

[static radish]

sorry forgot to mention

[hybrid plover]

Well, question. What melee are you using?

[static radish]

powerfalchion or shobel

[hybrid plover]

Shovel is a good one.
Power falchion

Eh...

[static radish]

why dont people like it?

[hybrid plover]

Clunky moveswt

No stagger

[static radish]

i like it

[hybrid plover]

I'd say maybe, as a suggestion, try something a lil more mobile if you wanna see if you can make ws work

Like tac axe or knife.

If I'll be real, knife is probably the best weapon for that setup

Since it gives you the mobility to make up for double barrel not having the greatest range

[static radish]

gotcha

i wonder what else i can use with infiltrate

[hybrid plover]

And uncanny is just busted for carapace which is the main thing double barrel really struggles against.

[static radish]

well

forgetting the double barrel

what guns do you recomend for infiltrate?

[hybrid plover]

Tbh, anything really "works". It depends on what you want to try and do with infiltrate

[static radish]

gotcha

[hollow wave]

Dump stat for power falchion?

[austere mica]

Mobility

[hollow ibex]

power falchion

[hollow wave]

Lol.

Thanks.

[austere mica]

Don't listen to the cutlass haters it's fun

[thin geyser]

is power falchion good? I haven't had much success, but I suck at veteran

[hollow ibex]

it's very mid

[hollow wave]

I think zealot gets it too?

[hollow ibex]

i agree it's fun

but it's very mid

[hollow wave]

I just want to try it.

[hollow ibex]

it's a vet exclusive

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1046912126746374274/1422251612688355411/50CA021.MP4?ex=68fba288&is=68fa5108&hm=ebc463528bfa834a5a5894b1643ed82c3eef22c05dfc16622fd8e7e245280044&

you see shit like this

and think it's good

it's not

[austere mica]

Zealot gets Relic Blade, which while playing identically, is better in every way besides speed

[hollow wave]

Lol.

[thin geyser]

relic blade also sounds cooler

[hollow wave]

But zealot doesn't get as Krieg of an outfit...

[thin geyser]

truth nuke

[hollow ibex]

if power falch got 20% more damage, had the heavy attack speeds increased by 10-20%, got actual stagger, and has its unpowered attack damage increased by 100%

it would be good

assuming the current dogshit blessing pool stays

[tame lodge]

Mediocre

Wish it was better

But alas

Waiting 10 months for it

To be

So

So

So mid

[umbral scaffold]

Thank you again for sending me that brauto build earlier, btw. I appreciate it.

That said, how to you feel about IAG’s? A much better road to take?

[gentle lake]

Can anyone share a good vet build

something with an auto gun and either powersword or flachion

[tall torrent]

it's only better in stagger

[gentle lake]

Has weapon specialist been buffed at all

[unreal nova]

Technically.

[umbral scaffold]

I haven’t ran WS yet, but I just messed around with a Brauto build that had a couple extra talent points so I threw 2 into it and will try tonight

[unreal nova]

A subnode is now baseline, I think.

Then the rest got compressed.

[umbral scaffold]

And if you find a good build for infantry auto gun, by all means share, cause I’m looking to mess around with one too!

[unreal nova]

I just ran my recon build without shocktrooper lul for the Vraks.

[hallow drift]

No sunder/10

[dapper coyote]

Chat

The new event ammo buff

Gave me 1.2k rnds for my vraks

Vraks iag

Thats more ammo than a tanker's MG (1k rnd belts)

[unreal nova]

Only? I had 1.4k+

[dapper coyote]

Yea, i keep magdumping lmao

So i didn't see the full rnd count

[unreal nova]

I was also magdumping, lul.

[dapper coyote]

And not stat maxxed

Sad

Its literally shooter's heaven, lmao

Here's 1k+ bullet

Go fucking nuts

[unreal nova]

4 vets, all guns.

Only pull out melee for shields and pushing.

[dapper coyote]

I wonder if the ogryns having fun

With their dual stubbers

My Cshotgun green also had 200+rnds lmao

With 17 rounds in the 10 rnd tube mag

[unreal nova]

Likely, every oggy seems to destroy in games I join.

[dapper coyote]

An ogryn spawns, BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM

[unreal nova]

The fact that this is passive vs selfish stimms means...

[dapper coyote]

They're enjoying the gauntlet grenade launchers right now

[unreal nova]

Any gun tbh.

[latent mountain]

Guys

Im trying to rp a vet cowboy

[paper salmon]

You can't anymore

they nerfed the build

no more 6 shot

[latent mountain]

Noooooooooo

[paper salmon]

It's now 7 shot

[latent mountain]

O

is the sawed off shotty still good

[paper salmon]

yes, it still can be a magical 3 shot

[latent mountain]

Yesssss

[distant mural]

Revolver is fun on vet give it a try

Go for the 5 shot with the propper sights

[distant mural]

You can still go handcannon and crucian roulette

[slow sky]

i nearly matched the damage of a macro psyker in havoc

thats crazy

[unreal nova]

That's HERESY.

6 shot revolvers reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[hollow ibex]

7 shot

🔥

https://tenor.com/view/now-old-man-the-future-is-now-old-man-gif-9677657

[grand perch]

Where is your god now

[dapper coyote]

Nagant revolver and some other rare revolver CAN go for 7 rnds

This beauty of a rare revolver

[latent mountain]

Yeah that thing is 🔥🔥🔥

[distant mural]

Nagant was rare too because it sealed its chamber making it more silent then other revolvers with a supressor

[dapper coyote]

Its still dope as fuck

[unreal nova]

It's the joke about the classic western movie/show 6 shot shooter.

[distant mural]

It is i think its the only revolver with that mechanism

Also double action

[dapper coyote]

There's other few sealed revolvers

But its rare and few

[gray steppe]

Knock knock.

[hollow ibex]

ok lock and load is pretty silly. notice something wrong with this picture?

besides the 7 shot revolver lol

[tender pasture]

Nagant also had notoriously dogshit trigger because of that mechanism, basically made the SA trigger the weight of other DAs, and the DA trigger was like twice others at ~10kg

Still cool as hell, just pays for it in usability

And modern revolvers with present metallurgical prowess max out at like ~8 rounds for 357, though there's weird shit like 10 round 22LR revolvers

[dry cloak]

Double ammo

And the white skull

[olive halo]

And the power falchion being used

[grand perch]

And my axe

[tropic halo]

the ammo?

you like playing the daily buff so thats about what i am guessing

[meager echo]

I change my mind, I hate venting shriek psyker now.

Fucking useless

getting map like chasm station doing objective without bubble waste so much time.

fuck your optimal dps

[dense river]

Whats the best place for finding builds? Like say I want a bolt sniper type build but the youtube videos are old/I cant find a good one but I am too dumb to figure it out on my own?

So basically a build showcase type thing

[mortal aspen]

GamesLantern has builds.
But if you want good builds, ask here

[dense river]

Oh wow games lantern has a lot of info

Thanks for telling me about them, huge help specially since they have a lot of stats and numbers I struggle to find on my own : )

[tender pasture]

Gameslantern's median build is kinda rubbish

But it's a decent place to start, and your experience can inform your choices very nicely too

[dim escarp]

whats the best horde clearing gun?

[willow prairie]

never start with gameslantern builds

they're extremely bad

[mortal aspen]

they're good enough for Auric

[dry cloak]

on vet? id say zarona shotgun or double barrel shotgun

[dim escarp]

ok so i bought the right gun then

[silver patrol]

gameslantern vet builds aren't so bad

arbites, on the other hand

like, this is the most popular vet build on gameslantern, pretty ok imo ( i don't like focus target myself)

this is arbites' and it's so bad

[toxic reef]

yeah I only go focus target on my shredder spam build, because it's the only real useful keystone on it

tho I am debating just going without a keystone, I always forget I have it and waste it

[unreal nova]

I use WS. Because it works with bistol.

Which you should have if shredder 'nade build.

[toxic reef]

I do

I'm WS on almost all my builds already lol

[unreal nova]

Throw a frag with knoife out, insta 10 stacks.

Shoot something dead.

[toxic reef]

oh it does count like that

[unreal nova]

Yeah.

You can test it.

Heck, if you do a silly and throw when gun out, you get said gun kill stack as well.

But pointless, lul.

[toxic reef]

yeah I'll test some things out

[unreal nova]

BTW, Skirmisher damage buff works on the bleed.

It worked even before the buff.

Just harder to upkeep.

[toxic reef]

oh ok then it's def worth it

[azure narwhal]

For "top trees" they are horrendous, gameslantern is nice for sharing with each other but most builds are insanely bad

[tall torrent]

this is atrocious

[silver patrol]

i think it's fine as a starting point

[tall torrent]

it really isn't

skipping the entire bottom right branch
skipping both +25 toughness grey nodes
taking Get Back in the Fight
choosing 10% TDR over stamina regen delay grey node on left, and taking killzone for some reason

[silver patrol]

you should add rending strikes too since it's plasma gun build

[tall torrent]

then yea

a bunch of bad choices

on the class with a tree that's basically the illusion of choice

[fair shale]

Tbf I do understand the logic in taking KZ

If you just look at 15% more damage without thinking about bps its pretty cool

[tall torrent]

there isn't

when he also skipped the ENTIRE bottom right section

[fair shale]

Oh is this

In here rn?

[tall torrent]

@fair shale

[fair shale]

No comment

[pseudo fiber]

No right side tree stuff dang

[silver patrol]

prob not planning to enter melee any time soon, by the build

[marsh condor]

For sneaky Veteran, what melee weapon should I use?

[unreal nova]

Skirmisher is all damage.

[silver patrol]

yeah i know

[serene bough]

Its a fundamental skill to the game, so even if you prefer a ranged playstyle you should grab at least upto desperado

But skirmisher, tac awareness, 25+ toughness, and the other one that gives damage on critical hit are extremely useful

[calm shard]

ZERO right tree investment is deranged

kneecapping your melee damage so hard for no reason

and for what

ammo and killzone?

really?

[silver patrol]

yeah i got that the first 5 times

[calm shard]

a 6th time is necessary for clarity

[silver patrol]

uh no, stop pinging me

[calm shard]

melee will be planning to enter you

[unreal nova]

7th. Unless you play only malice tops.

[silver patrol]

i think it was an old build before the talent rework and he just remade it with the new talents

[unreal nova]

Which doesn't really work tbh.

[static radish]

idk

thinking of switching my vet from professional to cut-throat

gotta look at the infiltrate lines tho

[tall torrent]

Cutthroat sounds whiny

Unless u use specific helmets that modify voice

Best one is scion helmet

[static radish]

i got that krieg one

[tall torrent]

Krieg gas mask is just muffled effect

[slow spade]

Melee is a dump stat

[fair shale]

Scion voice changer is like

Particularly deep

[static radish]

i kinda like the "CLOSE! KILL! AND DO IT AGAIN!"

[fair shale]

I like the actual VA work on Cadian

You can feel the spitle dripping rage of them coming out of the VA, at least on male

[slow spade]

Indeed, feels like he still hates c:

[unreal nova]

Female is like... too quiet.

Also rare enough.

[fair shale]

Female doesnt feel like she has the seething rage of someone who watched their entire purpose in life shatter beneath their feet

[unreal nova]

Would you like a bottle of Cadian sand?

[fair shale]

Me? No, hate the planet.

Hate the cadians too lmfao

But I really appreciate the authenticity to character and setting male cadian va has

[unreal nova]

Heh.

I just like LC. Both are totally sleeping with everyone else.

[fair shale]

LC is my favorite vet by virtue of neither being cadian nor milquetoast

[unreal nova]

XD

[slow spade]

If my Cadian isn't a step from Khorne worship, it's not my Cadian UwU

[unreal nova]

XD

I rather see things more of smut and debauchery... and a little change never hurts, right?

[distant plaza]

does anyone have a guide to the single target/horde clear combo's for the power falchion?

[shy raft]

I like cadian, because we are cosplaying withh al other cosmetics

with cadian? can wear cadian shit

[fair shale]

It genuinely pisses me off how much shit has cadia written on it

Elysian style helmets? Cadia stands

Actually fuck off

[sudden cedar]

One could think the entire Imperial Guard is just Cadians.

[unreal nova]

Isn't that what ppl think? Cos they are the most bog standard vet?

[sudden cedar]

Yes.

They are the most know faction within the Imperial Guard because of all the stuff that was written with Cadians and about Cadia.

[fair shale]

Cadias premier export before, yk, shattering was soldiers

[sudden cedar]

Closely followed by the Deathkorps of Krieg.

[fair shale]

The armor cadians wear has also been around forever

[sudden cedar]

Because of all the gasmasks and shovel memes and the whole thing with sacrificing themselves for the Emperor.

[fair shale]

"Cadian" style armor being worn during the heresy

[unreal nova]

Lemmings in Vet form.

[sudden cedar]

Painting an entirely different picture of what the general philosophy of that is about.

[fair shale]

Krieg might have the single most god awful fan interpretation in the setting

As a faction

[sudden cedar]

Probably.

[umbral scaffold]

Idk how I got long bomb but I just kept spamming grenades 💀

[fair shale]

Congrats

[unreal nova]

Lemmings. Lul.

[sudden cedar]

So the Guard is essentially just Cadians and Kriegsmen, one could think.

[umbral scaffold]

I don’t feel accomplished, I still need to get 100 specialist kills while in ranged stance 😔

[fair shale]

And on very rare occasion when GW wants to bless me with a good regi, Catachans

[umbral scaffold]

then I can rework my build and spam krak grenades like a lunatic

[sudden cedar]

There are many more interesting Guard Regiments or points of origin.

[fair shale]

Huge fan of Catachans and Chem Dogs

[unreal nova]

The actually fun guys that can solo.

[sudden cedar]

Like Elysian Drop Troopers, Valhallan Ice Warriors, Mordian Iron Guard, Armageddon Steel Legions, Savlar Chem Dogs... [takes a breath]

[fair shale]

I love D-99

[sudden cedar]

Catachan Jungle Fighters, Tallarn Desert Raiders and many more.

But no, its all just Cadians and Kriegsmen.

[umbral scaffold]

they haven’t added any Catachan outfits yet have they?

[fair shale]

They did at some point

[sudden cedar]

There are Armageddon Ork Hunters Outfits

[fair shale]

Nah, forever ago

Like 3rd rotation in shop forever ago

[umbral scaffold]

hopefully at some point they’ll add Armageddon, Krieg, and Catachan to the homeworlds.

I’m sure others will come to like Valhalla

[sudden cedar]

Continuing the list.. Attilan Rough Riders, Vostroyan Firstborn, Praetorian Guard, Harakoni Warhawks, Drookian Fen Guard, Maccabian Janissaries, Brimlock Dragoons..

[fair shale]

Yk who i like

Jopall Indentured Servants

Or "Indentured Squadrons"

[slow spade]

I'm still coping for Maccabians :c

[fair shale]

Macabians dont even really exist outside the FFG game iirc

[unreal nova]

Tanith Ghosts as per @final crystal Larken spamming me all the time?

[fair shale]

They hardly count as a full regi tbf

Tanith First and Only are like

A group of people lmfao

A squad

[sudden cedar]

The Tanith First and Only

What you think of is Gaunt's Ghosts

[unreal nova]

I dunno. I just know I got that drilled in in sense.

[sudden cedar]

Lord Militant General Ibram Gaunt

[unreal nova]

He just wants camocloaks and long las.

I just want actual Catachans.

[fair shale]

The best you'll get is a muscle suit cosplay

[final crystal]

Thems fightin' words mate.

[fair shale]

To refer to a dead regiment as what they are?

Sure

[final crystal]

Best stealth regiment in the guard.

[fair shale]

Sure

All like

15 of em

[final crystal]

I mean, 15 books about them so, load more than Rambo wannabes

[serene bough]

15 named characters is better than a nameless army to be fair

This is 40k afterall

[fair shale]

Sure

But calling them a regiment?

Theyre not even a platoon lol

[tranquil spear]

Would anyone be willing to help me out with the "Just a Flesh Wound" penance ?

[buoyant aurora]

Why do the psykers on Havoc get upset when a Vet uses exec stance instead of Voice of Command? 🤔
It's a fun one IMO

[fair shale]

The same reason people get upset when psyker uses that isnt bubble over anything else

Over reliance on previously formed defensive metas

[slow spade]

People also not realizing the value of things dying faster

Just low IQ teammates don't worry about it

[unreal nova]

More like, when psyker uses anything but bubble.

[unreal nova]

Thing is, the First and Only is a regiment? The ghosts are a squad in it? At least from a quick look up.

[fair shale]

Yeah, thats what i meant

[fair shale]

GGs are the surviving members of TFaO iirc

Hence why the regiment is the "First and Only"

[unreal nova]

Oh. But generally, dead or not, still a regiment.

[fair shale]

Kinda?

They're special, normally when a regi is depleted it gets mashed into another one

Names merged or not

TFaO are moreso "Gaunt's Ghosts"

Which is a 12 book series where more of them keep dying

I think it is tbh more books now

[unreal nova]

Thing is, wasn't the topic about better regiments than Cadians?

Or well, more... exciting, unique, something something.

[fair shale]

Sure, im just saying >20 odd dudes does not a regiment make

[unreal nova]

Actually, looking it up more... 3rd Edition has rules for a regiment of them. Well, TFaO.

[fair shale]

Tbf

3rd has a lot of regi rules

Regiments only lost rules as time went on

Until 10e came and now regis are boiled down to special units you mishmash together

[unreal nova]

Oh. And the idea is still that a lost regiment is still a regiment.

[buoyant aurora]

Sounds about right xD

[fair shale]

Do you genuinely care this much about about a throwaway statement about 20 guys

[buoyant aurora]

It's just funny when they unfold in the chat then just alt+f4

[unreal nova]

I'm autistic. I might not care as much about said regiment itself, but I do care about the general idea.

[fair shale]

Alright, cause I do not.

[calm shard]

they're a warhammer fan that throwaway statement could be the only lore their guys get for years

[fair shale]

Nah GGs get books

More than most regiments

More than most SM chapters

[calm shard]

oh wait it's about Gaunt's Goobers

nevermind

[fair shale]

They have 16 rn, spanning 1999 to 2021

[calm shard]

The Ultramarines of the Imperial Guard do not get special treatment

[slow spade]

Yeah just a shame there's no backfill in Havocs :c

[calm shard]

Havoc 40 players should be able to queue to backfill leavers in havoc games

you've completed the hardest havoc level, go backfill and see how good you really are and if you can turn around hopeless situations

[fair shale]

Didn't vet the team hard enough for solid mental, you now have a 3 man

Suffer

Tbh I love when people ragequit crescendo events and you don't lose

And they just have to wait 15 minutes to requeue cause the bot played better than they did, saved you, and now the mission is back on

[slow spade]

True it is funny

[slow spade]

Honestly, clutching a game is the biggest dopamine hit imo

Would be really cool

[unreal nova]

Eh, Had an Arby dip after stealing the medicae and going down. Chaos and Syllo carried the rest of that run.

[calm shard]

I have once had a team of 3 ragequit in like mid havocs

While I was playing Psyker and I didn't die

So I just...got to a bit of forbidden spot on the map

And just

alt tabbed and did other things for several hours

Just to make 3 people stay queue banned for quitting a salvagable situation

[fair shale]

Lmfao deserved

[static radish]

good

[buoyant aurora]

You deserve extra rations!

[calm shard]

Though I will say as someone who uses solo mod to find out of bounds locations for funsies

There are a surprising amount of locations that you can't normally get to that enemies still have pathing in

[buoyant aurora]

Agreed, but sadly they are getting patched day by day

[calm shard]

There are some they haven't that most certainly should be but I have no idea how to report that kinda thing

[hollow ibex]

Yah thought it was because of lock and load glitching lol

[buoyant aurora]

The corner bug still exists but it's not as wild as it was in Vermintide and it's not fixed sooo

[dapper coyote]

Is heavy vigil AG good?

Im exploring sniper builds here

[calm shard]

I think all the vigilants are some tier of good right now

[static radish]

so

lads

[calm shard]

I've been too hopelessly addicted to combat shotguns to try them

[static radish]

with a stealth bomb build

what melee do you recomend?

[dapper coyote]

Hehe they're good and fun

[static radish]

i was thinking either shovel with uncanny

or knoife

[frank basin]

Guys, hype train

[buoyant aurora]

Knoif is defo more fun

[tall torrent]

Clutch is more fun than solo

[static radish]

old news, next

[calm shard]

hype train? bro it already left the station

[frank basin]

i was late?

[static radish]

tiny bit

sowwy

also knoife mk 3 or 6?

[tame lodge]

6

Simply put

[fair shale]

6 is the second mark right?

[tame lodge]

Push Attack is the highest dps available while also having some visible form of horde clearing

[static radish]

gotcha

[tame lodge]

And mk6 pa is 10% faster than mk3

[static radish]

said form is through heavy attack right?

[tame lodge]

You can H1 H2 L3 then loop heavy light

Or spam pa

Or go pa H2 L3 then loop heavy light

[trim badger]

The only downside is how much stamina that consumes

[dapper coyote]

I wonder if 🅱️ ISTOLs increase explosive radius also effected Arbites Shock mines?

[static radish]

whats another good blessing for it besides uncanny?

executor?

[trim badger]

For zealot?

[static radish]

veteran

[tame lodge]

Usually Riposte or precognition

[trim badger]

Mercy killer!!!!

(if you have the bleeding talent)

[tame lodge]

Executor is like 4th choice

Or 5th

[static radish]

oh yeah i do

[tall torrent]

Not a real downside comparatively cuz mk3’s highest single target dps is also push atk spam

[trim badger]

Then why not enjoying that sweet extra 60% weakspot dmg

[fair shale]

I use Mercy Killer+Uncanny on knives and Trench+Serrated in tree personally

[trim badger]

For free!!!

[static radish]

yeah yeah true

[tall torrent]

Cuz it’s not as good as flesh tearer

[trim badger]

We're talking about vet

[tall torrent]

Yea

[trim badger]

Wha

[tall torrent]

It is not as good as flesh tearer

[hybrid plover]

Yes. It's not as good as flesh tearer.

[static radish]

what's flesh tearer?

[trim badger]

But it helps me kill things a lot quicker for free

[tall torrent]

8 bleed stack on melee crit atk

[trim badger]

No need of crits

[static radish]

hm

[hybrid plover]

Flesh tearer does that more consistently than you realize

Especially with serrated.

Flesh isn't that good without it actually

[tall torrent]

Flesh is good on its own

And much more reliable with serrated

If ur gonna cringe max by playing knife and taking uncanny u might as well do it the whole way through

[fair shale]

Its less cringey than any variation of DS Im ngl

Not by much tho

[trim badger]

I feel I can kill elites in H40 a lot quicker with mercy killer

Than with flesh tearer

(vet ofc)

[hybrid plover]

I don't honestly.

Like it helps. But not as much as I'd like for a blessing slot and the horde clear is noticeably worse.

[trim badger]

Ngl I never valued horde clearing that much, especially since every little shit psyker is running flame staff

[hybrid plover]

And what happens when that psyker dies?

[trim badger]

Well I just abuse the fact vet has so much damage horde dies quickly anyways

Or the mobility knife has too

[unreal nova]

Only impact 'nades.

[dapper coyote]

Ahhhh

Bugger

It would be funny to see the tazer mine gets bigger

[unreal nova]

I bistol on Arby as well so... XD

[hybrid plover]

That depends on the setup tbh

Like if you're running shredders, I suppose there's an argument there but with kraks or smokes, I'd want the more generalist option. And in that case, flesh is just a better choice.

[static radish]

how do people fucking dodge backwards?

what the hell

seeing this one dude on youtube

how

[unreal nova]

Dodge in place.

Always dodge.

It's a setting.

I forget where.

[hybrid plover]

Inputs I think

[static radish]

sorry no

"slide

thats it

[tame lodge]

Dodge slide

[meager echo]

dodge then hold crouch

[narrow widget]

dodge backwards and hit slide while in the middle of it

[static radish]

that simple?

damn

[meager echo]

U might want to hold crouch a little longer if you are not used to it. Some weapon with bad dodge like plasma gun can't slide if you let go of crouch button too early.

[unreal nova]

Yes. It's just harder to do on controller.

[formal ice]

Veterans, whats your political opinion about the Mechanicus taking over the Imperium and killing off The Emperor

[hybrid plover]

It be like that.

[trim badger]

? Wdym

[formal ice]

It be like what

[trim badger]

Like just... Hold S and

Press the Dodge key?

[formal ice]

Read what he said afterwards

Lazy

[trim badger]

Very

Well I'd assume that's just, Dodge backwards, 180°, slide and then look back in the original direction

[tame lodge]

Good but bad

[trim badger]

Waos

[formal ice]

So you are in or not

[tame lodge]

All in on nothing

[formal ice]

So no then

We will have to kill you on one of thoses machines that perfectly remove your human skin

[tame lodge]

Red robes are top tier mechanics but damn they have a shit ton of unnecessary rites

They take the power

And the empire slows down another 40k years

[static radish]

nah t'was a slide i just am a dumb fuck who cant properly write lol

[formal ice]

Why you want Skitarii as the next class

Fatshark doesn't do dwarves anymore

[dapper coyote]

Maybe new stuff would be FINALLY added by the mechanicum

[narrow widget]

now that we have a 6th class announced when are we getting a 7th

[dapper coyote]

Hey, here's new lasgun that isn't shit!

[formal ice]

Before the 6th getting a new cosmetic

[narrow widget]

vet 4 when

vet 4: the prequel

[cunning haven]

does weapon specialist help recon lasgun?

[grand perch]

yeah

the guaranteed crit basically doesnt matter but its 10 seconds of 20% extra RoF

if you can spare the point take it

[tame lodge]

Bordering meme territory

[cunning haven]

better than focus target or marksman?

i dont feel like focus target helps that much

[calm shard]

marksman does by far the least for recon las

[sharp epoch]

mmf only increases finesse but recon has almost no finesse multiplier so ft is better

[calm shard]

it just does not have very high crit damage

FT benefits recon's base damage (which is not much either), but most importantly will boost the burn damage

[static radish]

ok no

im so bad

couldn't stay alive for more than 5 secs on damnation if i was actively engaging ranged enemies

i bet a bot would be more useful

[cunning haven]

i dont notice any difference with ROF in psykanium

[grand perch]

you need melee stacks from WS

[cunning haven]

yeah i tried that, unless my perception just bad

[static radish]

man

i wish i knew any good infiltrate builds

i know my stealth bomb

thats it

[calm shard]

pretty sure that's because infiltrate builds peak at "okay"

[hollow ibex]

stealth bomber is the only good infil build

[static radish]

sadly

[static radish]

yeah

hmm

kraks dont make much sense with infil

[hollow ibex]

could be funny for a boss nuking build

but it'd def be a meme

[static radish]

because you'd normally chuck em not underhand and that ends inf

its a possiblity

smoke bombs are anti synergy (kinda)

and shredders well....might as well just go stealth bomb

actually

since the damage boost persists after 30 secs

ill give krak a try

and not take the tinkerer perk

hmm not worth it actually

[calm shard]

can't kill crusher because infiltrate still on its 45 second cooldown

sad

[static radish]

yeah

ill just do some "basic bitch" infiltrate build

see how it goes

maybe focus on melee and whip out revolver when i wanna just pop a distant threat

[hollow ibex]

that works too though you'd prob still be taking shredders anyway lol

[static radish]

yeah

i am

i should do a challenge where like

"only using guns i get through mission reward drops"

actually...yeah sure

[cunning haven]

exec stance with born leader vs VoC with Duty and Honor?

[hollow ibex]

exec stance with demo team ✅

[cunning haven]

but of course. i will never drop demo team

but i can also take born leader with exec

i kinda like it but the fov is a real pain. i tunnel vision too much as is

[mortal aspen]

there's a mod that fixes that (c)

https://www.nexusmods.com/warhammer40kdarktide/mods/91

[hollow ibex]

modders making the game actually playable

[static radish]

also

good lord im so bad at this game

[tame lodge]

If you say so

[static radish]

i do

[hollow ibex]

skill issue

[static radish]

i can barely do anything for 1 minute on veteran without miserably dying

[static radish]

true

[olive halo]

bros I gotta ask, what is the playstyle with psword 6?

light spam? heavy spam?

[tame lodge]

Always charged light spam

Single target is charged push attack light light

[olive halo]

gotcha

I see ppl saying to run sunder though, doesnt that only affect heavy charged attacks?

[tame lodge]

The cleave part affects all powered attacks
The extra 20% damage only the heavies

[tall torrent]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/664591642967408640/1430083555605610506/54A988B55506C581625FC1A14DFE215DF542619B.mov?ex=68fc7119&is=68fb1f99&hm=a7568d001e82a8faf1bc4c54e3c16586ac6b9b260502de458741628347f2b62b&

[elder fiber]

you don't pick sunder for heavies, you pick it to bypass armor slide vs elite mobs

[olive halo]

gotcha

[olive halo]

ah that makes sense now

[olive halo]

damn that video makes it look goated

when I played it felt so slow and clunky that I assumed I must have been missing something important

[midnight wyvern]

its the best melee in the game so ofc it looks goated

[olive halo]

yeah but when I was using it I kept thinking "why am I using this when I gotta charge it every 2-3 seconds, when I could just bring smth different and have more uptime stabbing"

idk it just doesn't feel good, like if I recorded my gameplay shit looks like an entire different game apart from graphics

[midnight wyvern]

[serene bough]

Weapon specialist def helps it

I mean, it's already the best

[midnight wyvern]

it'd help you get used to it

[serene bough]

But that crisp feeling youre looking for is probably bc youre missing WS in your build

[midnight wyvern]

more forgiving with WS/TFD but you don't need either

[olive halo]

fair enough but having to swap guns means even more button inputs 😭

I did take trench fighter drill

[serene bough]

TFD is enough until youre ready to accept WS into your life

[olive halo]

I already have another build that uses ws

[serene bough]

Its annoying to constantly have to turn on every 3 swings but it'll give you the highest DPS

[olive halo]

but Im taking spearhead bolter on this one so I dont want to weapon swap either

[hollow ibex]

Definitely take something else if you run WS

[olive halo]

my other ws build was chain sword and zarona revolver

quite fun and it meant I didn't have to wait for surgical to charge either

all my homies hate waiting for surgical

[static radish]

i dont get it

on every other class i do semi decently on damnation

on vet i just suck

[olive halo]

probs just the change in gameplay style

pick an easier build with simpler weapons and roll with that till you get the hang of things

[serene bough]

Lately ive been playing terribly

Perhaps I am officially washed

I need to pick simpler playstyles myself

[orchid hemlock]

I have a theory

The reason why people struggle with Vet is because in all of the other classes, they were unintentionally letting their teammates deal with the specialists 😈

[static radish]

its not specialists that kill me

its common fodder or the ocassinal big fucker

[static radish]

like what?

i tried everything

from exec stance to shout and even landed on my fav skill that is inf

[serene bough]

VoC will net you the most utility and ease of use

But you ultimately need to just practice

[static radish]

the only build i actually managed to win damantion with was a stance one

just pop it when there's a bunch of ranged enemies, shoot em, and then kill the fodder with melee

[olive halo]

my first vet build was ds4, infantry autogun

voice of command

[static radish]

ds4?

[olive halo]

duelling sword mk4

I built mine like this

(the red is a visual mod, its a yellow weapon)

[static radish]

sigh here it comes "i dont care who the inquisition sends after me i am not using the dueling sword"

[olive halo]

ok so you want something at a higher skill level then

[static radish]

well with those blessings might as well just use the knoife

[static radish]

i just dont like the dueling sword, dont ask me why

[olive halo]

nah knife's short range makes it harder to use imo

[static radish]

maybe

how about shovel?

also has uncanny

[olive halo]

this is the shovel im using

[sharp epoch]

uncanny is better than skullcrusher

[olive halo]

I was using it in an exe stance build with graia vigilant autogun

[trim badger]

In my personal opinion mobility > cleave for mk4

[olive halo]

for armor yeah, but it seemed to do fine for me like this so I kept it

[static radish]

as in heavy attacks?

[trim badger]

And for vet I'd recommend Thrust/Relentless Strikes over Precog

[static radish]

i just test and at least for lights the range is the same

[unreal nova]

Nope. 2 shots crushers either way.

[olive halo]

aint no way knife and ds have the same range

[unreal nova]

One will be better when horded though.

[static radish]

well, tiny tiny bit more

on lights? yeah it is

i pinged a crusher 4 meters knife stops, ds? 4.5 or some

actually no

he was moving

same fucking range on lights

[sharp epoch]

uncanny is busted with frags and bleed its not for the armor

[static radish]

on heavies yeah the dueling sword has 4 while knife has 3

honestly?

i dont see the point in dueling sword with this info

unless it attacks faster?

[olive halo]

I just tried it, the knife barely reaches 3m and ds barely reached 4m

[static radish]

light attacks?

[olive halo]

yeah

mk3 knife and mk4 ds

[static radish]

well to me at the edge of 3m almost 4 the knife works

i am using mk6

which i think is the best one

even then

mk3 knife still works for me at the edge of 3

depends on how the dude is positioned

[olive halo]

I checked the mk6 and its range is a little longer yeah, but standing in the same place swapping weapons without moving

[dapper coyote]

The more i play the events the more that i see which classes are more likely to nab the rations rather than destroy the cans

||its ogryns ||

[cunning haven]

wow, thanks

[olive halo]

unfortunately you have to use the mk6 knife to get similar range though which is counterintuitive in itself

[unreal nova]

Only the ones with 2 brain cells destroy.

[olive halo]

go for the shovel, its also pretty damn good

I used chainaxe too and it was really fun but ppl dont recommend it

[unreal nova]

Thing is, Mk6 is still better than mk 3.

[static radish]

with heavies or lights?

if heavies yeah

if lights then p much same

[south copper]

Man how do y’all get yourselves to play the other classes? All them feel worse than vet imo (though I don’t have arbitrator)

[static radish]

then again...why would you be worring about 1-2 m of distance between enemies

they'll clobber you the same

[olive halo]

it's just easier horde clear?

tbh I avoided using the knife at all on vet, I used it only on zealot

[south copper]

Knife mid shovel good

[olive halo]

chainaxe and chainsword are both really good options too if you dont wanna use the shovel

[unreal nova]

It does more DPS all round.

Assuming you mean mk 6 vs mk 3.

[olive halo]

yeah sorry karien normally I agree with your opinions but I cant recommend the mk6 to anyone in good faith, its goofy

[unreal nova]

I tested.

[static radish]

oh well i guess cleave is a thing that matters yeh (totally didnt forget)

[unreal nova]

mk 6, 1 crit. 3003 DPS.

mk 3, also 1 crit, 2666DPS.

[static radish]

oh he's talkign bout knoife vs mk4 duel sword

[olive halo]

yeah no I'm aware it has more dps

[unreal nova]

All weakspots.

[static radish]

oh

[olive halo]

but its just horrible to use imo

[static radish]

sorry i didnt read the thing above

[olive halo]

swapped between mk3 and 6 a lot when I was doing the knife mastery on zealot and I gotta say using the mk6 was a struggle

mk3 made it fun

[unreal nova]

That's ZEALOT.

[olive halo]

but idk how the conversation derailed like this, we were talking about the shovel 😭

[unreal nova]

The one class that uses mk 3 on one build.

We are talking VET here.

[olive halo]

I mentioned before zealot

not first time

[tame lodge]

I just have fun with other classes
Except Arby's because they are mid

[unreal nova]

Shovel is war between the marks.

[tame lodge]

The dog is cool

[olive halo]

I liked the mk7 for the shovel

[unreal nova]

Mk7 is the worst imo.

[olive halo]

nice middleground so I can bring whichever secondary I liked

[unreal nova]

You go 1 if you want a nice hordeclear stick.

You go mk 3 if you wanna bonk crushers.

[south copper]

I enjoy vet more because he can do the most at range. Like I hate playing Ogryn the most cuz he’s a big easy target and his ranged weapons are all clunky and bad, so if I don’t have a teammate playing vet that can snipe gunners and stuff I just get melted and can’t do anything

On vet I just whip out plasma, tap the trigger a couple times, and no more ranged enemies

[olive halo]

mk 1 means I'd have to bring a heavy secondary which is ok I guess

mk 3 is pretty similar to mk 7 though

[static radish]

i love my mk1 shovel

BONK

[unreal nova]

mk 3 is faster if you wanna meme with.

The extra time between the hit to pullout sucks.

[static radish]

tho fr....what are the meaningful diferences between dueling sword and knife?

range? cleave? attackspeed? dps?

[south copper]

Thrust

[static radish]

explain

[olive halo]

attack pattern being big one

[unreal nova]

DS4 basically is the better knoife... It was for Psykers only.

[static radish]

why is it better tho?

[unreal nova]

Knoife does 1 thing better, and that's hordes.

[south copper]

Dueling sword can one shot crushers with a single charged attack

[static radish]

with the right setup yeah

[south copper]

That’s why it’s better

Gets thrust+uncanny and can just nuke things

[unreal nova]

And that also assumes you use mk 6.

mk 3 is bad for hordes unless you cheat with mods.

[static radish]

thrust is a blessing?

[south copper]

Yup

[calm shard]

mk3 what now

[south copper]

I run it on my shovel too

[orchid hemlock]

Sigh

[south copper]

Shovel also gets uncanny+thrust and I honestly like it better than dueling sword

[static radish]

gotcha gotcha

[static radish]

what?

[south copper]

The class just has the best melee weapon and the best ranged weapon it’s like why play anything else lol

[orchid hemlock]

Yeah Very is cracked ATM, so the only thing I can think of is fundamentally you are not abusing what Vet is the best at, which is killing specialists literally as they spawn

[unreal nova]

It just doesn't have the damage anymore with the buff to everything HP imo.

More luck based to one shot with it.

[orchid hemlock]

It's not about dying to them, it's about giving you and the team breathing room

[unreal nova]

Or two shot.

[south copper]

I still hit crushers for ~90% of their hp on havoc which is good enough for me, plus the horde clear is significantly better than dueling sword

[sharp epoch]

are you talking about pysker

[south copper]

No vet

The only class I like playing

After a couple missions with anything else I have to come back to vet to cleanse

[static radish]

ok well i try to get em the team does do it faster than me

[unreal nova]

I'm just wondering if powersword would do it better.

[orchid hemlock]

Are there other vets on your team?

[static radish]

no

there werent

[sharp epoch]

but psyker has the best ranged weapons and arguably the best melee

[static radish]

2 zealots 1 psyker

[orchid hemlock]

Then that shouldn't be possible unless it's a skill diff

[tame lodge]

6k per hit
Effectively 2 shotting 9k hp crusher

[south copper]

It does, but I still personally prefer shovel

The power sword push attack instakill combo is fun though

[static radish]

i died 5 times i said fuck it and left, a bot would to a better job

[south copper]

Psyker doesn’t have plasma or shovel

[static radish]

i've been saying that its a major fuckign skill diff this entire time, me and everyone else

i just dont play this game well i guess

ill stick to heresy or something

[unreal nova]

I basically never use it properly so... heh.

[sharp epoch]

plasma is not as good as infinite wide cleave like flamer and purgatus

[tame lodge]

The hard stuck diff 😭

[south copper]

It feels better to me 🤷‍♂️

[static radish]

k

[south copper]

There’s a million ways to kill stuff up close in this game

[orchid hemlock]

I'm still trying to figure out the problem though, because you seem to not struggle on the other classes

So I'm wondering if it is a Mandela effect

[static radish]

what

[south copper]

Meanwhile the most annoying enemies outside of bursters are gunners imo

[hybrid plover]

Bombers

[static radish]

oh i think im good when im actually not?

[unreal nova]

Achlys, right?

[static radish]

thats not the mandella effect

i think so

[south copper]

Well…yea

Either way

Plasma kills ranged enemies best

It has infinite range and can hit through some walls

Fire is nice yea but like, I have a melee weapon. It’s kinda redundant

[hybrid plover]

Infinite cleave is nothing to scoff at

[calm shard]

plasma more like PISSma

[hybrid plover]

It's not redundant at all

[calm shard]

helbore 4 all day

and combat shotgun lately

[orchid hemlock]

What I'm saying is that maybe you have an assumption that you did "well" but it could have simply been a perception you did well due to other factors, like better teammates or better luck with the modifiers

[static radish]

welp

i just suck then

[south copper]

But then the psyker gets melted by gunners and dies and leaves. Vet doesn’t have that problem

[orchid hemlock]

Perhaps you understand Vet fine, you just are experiencing bad games

[unreal nova]

RNG as well.

Some runs, you get less bs.

[orchid hemlock]

No that's not what I'm saying, I think you are just beating yourself on Vet when it could be other factors

[unreal nova]

Others... Hi there 5 trappers in a row.,

[static radish]

man this whole shit brought my mood down 6 feet fucking under

[south copper]

Combat shotgun is kinda nice. Been trying it myself

[unreal nova]

Bonus, they are ALL silent.

[sharp epoch]

Psyker really has all the tools to survive gunners, better than vet at least

[hybrid plover]

A good psyker is virtually untouchable by guns because of EE

[orchid hemlock]

https://www.nexusmods.com/warhammer40kdarktide/mods/384

[hybrid plover]

Which purgatus synergizes entirely with

[sharp epoch]

bubble, EE, and forceblocking not to mention a few

[calm shard]

just

https://imgur.com/a/M9IBRJV

bop

[south copper]

Well good psykers are few and far between seeing as I’ve ran into basically 0 lol

Vet is also just easier to play

[unreal nova]

What the kark did you link me?)

[orchid hemlock]

If it makes you feel better, 99% of Vet players are like abysmally bad

[orchid hemlock]

Mod

[hybrid plover]

I. Would not say vet is easier to play.

[static radish]

idk, zealot marty is pretty easy to just swing and pull out the pistol for ranged bullshit
psyker is easy because "haha fire"
arby......actually no clue (only one where i unclocked auric) ill just say dog
ogryn...big guy buncha damage buncha resistance with the middle keystone

[unreal nova]

No, before.

[unreal nova]

Also, i don't mod.

[orchid hemlock]

Was something else on my clipboard

[calm shard]

arby easy because they have ogryn tankiness and stagger but do not get shot

dog build you can kinda let dog do things automatically

[sharp epoch]

Depends how you play vet, DS plasma is easy af because you just shoot and m1 melee and have so much dodge distance

[calm shard]

but that's not really super effective

[south copper]

We literally have on demand nigh invincibility.

Genuinely I played vet as my first class and have problems playing the others because they all feel worse to play

[orchid hemlock]

Vet is basically the best specialist killer in the game

[hybrid plover]

With toughness. In a game where several things don't give a shit about.

[orchid hemlock]

That's the "gameplay" 😈

[orchid hemlock]

Nah Vet was on a horrible state before this patch

[faint beacon]

I’m guessing we’re going to ignore psyker

[sharp epoch]

I think EO arb can compete with vet

[orchid hemlock]

When your VOC is down you had no answers to deal with meat walls

[hybrid plover]

Vet right now is ironically the closest thing to a glass cannon in this game with the rework actually.

[faint beacon]

The king of pure bullshit and win buttons

[south copper]

Well I didn’t play before this patch lol

[calm shard]

hell yeah dog micro time

[unreal nova]

Vet was literally the worst class...

[calm shard]

yeah "glass" sure buddy

[unreal nova]

You had one thing, Shout.

And technically plasma.

[hybrid plover]

Because it has no means of pure damage resistance unlike every other class.

[orchid hemlock]

Even now tbh you don't have cushion like before, but you do soo much melee damage that it doesn't really matter anymore

[sharp epoch]

Or be boring and run a dog whistle mod which does that for you 100% efficiently

[faint beacon]

If I even see Psyker and glass in the same sentence Istfg

[calm shard]

not what I'm talking about with dog micro

[orchid hemlock]

But the thing is that VOC being down is still a problem in current vet

[meager echo]

Don't play eo arbi, play lone wolf + btl. Braindead build, perma stun everything.

[calm shard]

Unless dog whistle makes your dog instantly leave pounced targets

[unreal nova]

+9 stam memes.

[calm shard]

I don't know since I don't use it

[south copper]

I don’t really notice it. I just swing my shovel and have constant toughness regen

[hybrid plover]

It has amazing toughness retention and toughness damage resistance, but when that's no longer available, they're more fragile than any class in the game without question.

[orchid hemlock]

VOC is now worse

[faint beacon]

Just a dream hands down making psyker tankier than vet is crazy

[orchid hemlock]

So that isn't what made Vet strong is what I am saying

[sharp epoch]

You can manually micro it but even when your not focusing on macro it will still pounce elites just 24/7

[south copper]

It isn’t the main thing making vet strong but it’s one of the things, I will say

[calm shard]

I...yeah that's default dog behavior

[hybrid plover]

Vet is not strong because of their survivability. They're strong because of their mixture of crazy dps potential and team utility.

[orchid hemlock]

No I'm saying that what made strong from the patch, had nothing to do with VOC

[sharp epoch]

Default dog behavior pounces elites/specials targeting you only

[south copper]

Well either way I personally find vet to be the best of the classes. I don’t like anything else

[calm shard]

oooo

I see what youmean

[wanton swift]

hell yeah

[calm shard]

Still much weaker than manually controlling dog but I get what you're saying

[sharp epoch]

You started this patch? I mean you haven't got the chance to see other classes fully then

[south copper]

Psyker is alright. Ogryn and zealot mega suck, arb is expensive

[hybrid plover]

Gotta understand the rhythm of the other classes

[hollow ibex]

ogryn is braindead strong

[south copper]

I’ve maxed 2 other classes

[hybrid plover]

Cuz psyker is completely broken

[south copper]

Until a gunner shows up

[meager echo]

ogryn is not as strong after patch. He's tanky but his dmg is not so crazy now.

[hollow ibex]

?

you protect yourself as you would any other class

slide, dodge, use cover

not rocket science

[hollow ibex]

what did they nerf besides bully club LMB spam?

[meager echo]

ogryn range is worse than other class, can't shoot back at gunners

[sharp epoch]

I mean you can go glugger runbler ogryn, but yeah the taunt meta ogryn doesnt do as much dps even before the patch

[calm shard]

rok

[dry cloak]

have you heard of heavy stubber?

[hollow ibex]

https://tenor.com/view/oh-no-oh-no-anyway-gif-18887547

[south copper]

Yea my main problem is that Ogryn fucking sucks at dealing with ranged enemies

[sharp epoch]

heavy stubber is actually decent for havoc gunners

[faint beacon]

Psyker has become hands down the class to trivialize any difficulty and I think that’s fucking crazy

[calm shard]

I would HAPPILY DISAGREE

[south copper]

I don’t have that problem on vet

I just pull out plasma

[static radish]

weird

[hollow ibex]

finally, psyker is where FS wants it to be

[calm shard]

I had a gunlugger ogryn with rumbler in my havoc 40 that I did a few days ago

[static radish]

vet the most played class in the game right?

[hybrid plover]

Fatshark not beating the favorite class allegations

[meager echo]

I have 150+ special kills on my vet in havoc run.
Anything lower than that is unplayable for me. It's un enjoyable

[calm shard]

You are out of your goddamn mind if you think Ogryn has bad damage all of a sudden

[static radish]

that zealot 💀

[sharp epoch]

Yes, but I'm not sure if that's true at higher difficulties

[meager echo]

and btw I don't shoot gunners in havoc

i throw smoke and melee them

[hybrid plover]

I see more vets than anything

[south copper]

Well I’ve gotten 0 psykers of that caliber in my games then lol. They tend to be the class that dies most up through auric

[faint beacon]

Took them 2 years to do anything with Vet and Zealot

[hybrid plover]

I've seen more double vet than vet zealot setups lately

[static radish]

i was gonna say the oposite i barely see vets, more zealots and psykers

[hollow ibex]

psyker players tend to be shit, which is prob why FS keeps buffing it

[hybrid plover]

In havoc at least

[hollow ibex]

but if you get any half decent one

they just turn the game off

[south copper]

That’s true for the lower difficulties

In auric it’s mostly vets and arbs

[calm shard]

10 million more scrier's+DD buffs

Nobody's playing it it must be bad!

[sharp epoch]

I think it's because people want a ogryn and psyker at least then the rest is filler thats how I build my team

[hollow ibex]

no assail buffs, literally unplayable

[red robin]

Is grenade tinkerer worth it on smokes?

[calm shard]

yeah it doubles your duration why wouldn't it be

[hybrid plover]

Its quite nice. But you do have a lot to compete with that node.

[south copper]

I’ve heard from the guy to get the first true survivor that one of the best team comps, if not the best, is double vet double psyker

[sharp epoch]

tinkerer doubles the uptime so its worth it

[red robin]

It’s 15 to 30 seconds right?

[sharp epoch]

better than grenadier at least

[spark helm]

I've had more oblivious vets and zealots than anything else. Most ogryn and arbites on an average day crumble when everyone else goes down and psykers as either one of the best in lobby or floundering.

[red robin]

Also what’s optimal smoke grenade application?

[hollow ibex]

vet bubble

[faint beacon]

Ranged unit spam

[hollow ibex]

toss it where you're going to be

[faint beacon]

Making it harder for a BON to puke at a distance

[spark helm]

Covering yourself for melee, setting up smoke to shoot more freely when you don't have cover, etc.

[meager echo]

Ogryn just need to press taunt, hold elite for psyker to burn them and he's done his job.

[south copper]

Playing auric, I like vet teammates the best

[red robin]

Do ya just toss it to act as cover? Or just toss it by ya feet, like generally between you and line of fire?

[faint beacon]

Forcing ranged units to exit a foxhole

[faint beacon]

^ people forget this application

[spark helm]

It's up to you. There's no one true way to use them.

[south copper]

I just krak

[sharp epoch]

I think easiest way to use it is as a bubble like psyker you can either throw it where you want to go or where you want to hold

[red robin]

Does this permeate past walls?

What melee and ranged do well with smokes?

[faint beacon]

Unfortunately no

[red robin]

It’s so over

[sharp epoch]

also yeah this is right

[meager echo]

Just use smoke like bubble, don't overthinking lol.

[faint beacon]

Seeing it’s utility you need something to compliment horde clear and something for elites

[faint beacon]

15 if you don’t take Tinkerer 30 if you do

[red robin]

Is grenadier useful to take over the other two options

[spark helm]

You can use it cover an approach, flush out and disorient shooters, isolate pockets of hordes in melee from incoming gunfire against you, support a revive.

[hybrid plover]

Knife double barrel smoke build my beloved

[spark helm]

You can take all three if you like

[sharp epoch]

Grenadiers the best paired with shredder frags, kraks and smoke dont benefit as much

[spark helm]

No. Smoke does for spreading a wider area and less nades used in the first place. But how often one wants to roll on that is up to them

[red robin]

I kinda find the uptime fun with smokes, but that’s just me not conserving anything

[hybrid plover]

You really don't need grenadier for smokes

Especially with demo team

[red robin]

Ooooo

[sharp epoch]

It's just a point you don't have to waste 🤷‍♂️

[red robin]

Demo team is what I’m saying

[spark helm]

If you're getting lucky enough off of your killstreaks from demolition team that liberal use is fine but not necessary. It's a matter of whether or not you want to be doubling down

[red robin]

Grenadier is the other thing I’m being dumb abt

Mix up

[hybrid plover]

Hell demo team actually makes tinkerer debatable too.

[red robin]

Demo team I meant

[sharp epoch]

Demo team is basically mandatory on havoc+

[meager echo]

the other two nodes next to demo team is ass anyway so you don't really have a choice.

[sharp epoch]

or malestrom+

[hybrid plover]

I don't run tinkerer on my knife db build

[spark helm]

I like tinkerer for shooter builds but smoke last a nice while already

[red robin]

Don’t need those extra 15s if the encounter is rushed down and wiped out

[spark helm]

Again. Up to you if you want to double down like that.

If you don't want grenadier or tinkerer that's two free points so whatever else is more attractive to you just go for it.

[hybrid plover]

Which if you're running that setup, and running it well, you're possibly more deadly than a purg psyker on a good day

[sharp epoch]

It's a lot more work for the same or worse result it feels like

[hybrid plover]

Double barrel's horde clear is a lot more immediate

Inferno psykers still have to wait for those stacks to build up, they just build up to crazy values

[tribal dawn]

Just realized FS posted a video for the 10 years

Yessir.

Good work boys.

[sharp epoch]

I'm suprised vet beat out psyker there